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(ossasepia) diana_coman: pretty much as trinque says, the question there is what justifies 2 places instead of 1 for the same thing.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: and for another thing, even more importantly, the question is whether it's the correct thing to do, not whether someone finds it too much or too little; the point re backups was not because of the difficulty of backing up files on disk too, lol
(ossasepia) diana_coman: for one thing that sort of "justification" is a slippery slope (when and what exactly and by whom is to be deemed "too much"?)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: billymg: it's not at all (nor can it ever be) about whether it's "too much to ask" or not, ugh.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: the trouble with having the flags/options/configs/whatevers on disk instead of in db is that you have to further back those up separately.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-04-08#1023938 - heh, files are just db-on-disk and "config data" is still...data.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-04-08#1023954 - perhaps/possibly some custom php functions otherwise but that's about it indeed; (my theme is exactly that, the css + a custom function).
(ossasepia) diana_coman: dorion: what's your view on this secret documentation anyway? (see the thread above)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: other than that sure, I can see the usual game with idiots going "oh, but it's public info"; in which case, sure let them see what they can do with the "public info" on their own, that sort of "clients" are going to keep being more trouble than it's worth it as far as I'm concerned; then again, if you want those...
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: tbh I'd say the benefit is first of all that you can point to it and clearly say "here it is, first time, made by JWRD"; which goes away the moment someone else publishes the paper they got from you, you know?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: but other than that, ~any "must-be-kept-private" is a significant cost the way I see it and one that needs to be *justified* well to consider taking it on; sure, maybe that's just me, can be.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: I don't know how well you get/are aware of eulora&smg otherwise but in any case, if you want to look at it for this sort of question, what you'd need to look at is ~what's the private part, what are the reasons given for keeping it private and how narrowly/widely is it cut out of the rest otherwise
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: lol, you are still after the benefits, ok.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: sure, you can also sell whatever printed copies/nicely set/certified-by-jwrd copies I suppose, not like it's forbidden or not possible (ie re your buying music even if available otherwise for free) but again, there as with the training, you are selling that additional part & guarantee, not the "recipe"
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: that's pretty much how it looks to me, yes.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: more to the point the question is what are you selling there exactly? because if you imagine that you are selling the recipe aka the text, the "intellectual property" or similar, then a. you don't have anything worth selling b. you'll play that leeks-for-the-lawyer game.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: I mean I get the restlessness but ...
(ossasepia) diana_coman: BingoBoingo: I'd have thought Sundays were supposedly the most nothing-happens-days even at best at times, no?
(ossasepia) diana_coman still read that "so long as you can boil faster than the leeks"
(agriculturalsupremacy) diana_coman: lolz, no, mp made it up.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: I'd have thought it obvious too, but the question didn't seem to care about it, lolz.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: BingoBoingo: do I understand correctly that you'd rather drop that plan & review stuff as it's not of much use to you?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: did you figure out if all that data collection thing is of much interest to you or not?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: dorion: the above is supposedly of equal interest to you too.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: what, you make them sign papers and then chase the leak or what?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://younghands.club/2020/04/06/jfw-plan-week-of-6-apr-2020/#comment-625 - jfw, that's at least an interesting question; as usual though, I'd say the evaluation starts not from imagined benefits but from very real and concrete costs (of keeping it private); for one thing, if I understand correctly that you do make that available to your clients, then how exactly are you going to keep it private ?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: billymg: makes sense; perhaps trinque might want to weigh in on this too; from my point of view atm I don't have anything specifically against it.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: well, shitgnomes since March last year in there at least so dunno about the getting was good but whatevers; I guess I'll just upload then whatever I conveniently find and that will be that.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: do you have a full list of all archives ? because if I spend the time to add them there, it makes exactly 0 sense to put only those 2 that happened to be difficult to find atm.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: billymg: since you are the one most familiar with the whole mp-wp codebase, my question is simply if you consider that the best place for it rather than simply a convenient place, that's pretty much it so far.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: or at least not atm
(ossasepia) diana_coman: billymg: aha, I rather suspect it will; but I admit that I'm only vaguely aware of the whole mpwp codebase, can't be of much help there
(ossasepia) diana_coman: billymg: do you have any sort of rough map of the mp-wp codebase otherwise?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: I had this summary and info quite clearly saying I even had them, lolz; not that anyone ever read it I suppose; will possibly add the whole set there at some point.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: yeah, it seems I have them
(ossasepia) diana_coman: probably; I'll have a look.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: did you find all those archives for gnat?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: I am not necessarily (or not yet, lol) against wp-plugins altogether but I don't yet know exactly in what way is that different
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-04-06#1023817 - billymg, the question is exactly what's the reason for having plugins as separate things to start with; (I get the original idea plug various things here and all that but meanwhile practice looks very different from that hallucination of a plan)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: since you say it didn't work in here either and I think it should work based on my rating.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ave1: could it be perhaps that you tried !!up in here without giving the channel name?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: it is a pain indeed.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!up #ossasepia ave1
(ossasepia) diana_coman: trinque: why didn't it work for me to !!up him here though? http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-04-06#1023781
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ave1: please do; and generally, do come around and talk
(ossasepia) diana_coman: I need to go now for a while, I'll be back later.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: yeah, something seems wrong there; will wait and see what trinque says (after the party,lol); meanwhile anyway you have voice and otherwise ping me if chanserv misbehaves/you get disconnected and I'll voice you again.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ave1: I voiced you via chanserv directly
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!up ossasepia ave1
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ave1: you should be able to voice yourself in here.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!gettrust ave1
(ossasepia) diana_coman: dorion: what happened to you?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: so you are; ave1 did you try to !!up here and it didn't work?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!reputation ave1
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ave1: here it's in my wot but I'd have thought you were, hm
(trinque) diana_coman: happy birthday trinque !
(ossasepia) diana_coman will be back tomorrow.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: iirc there was previously a successful attempt at feeding it to self but I don't recall any write-up specifically on this,hm; maybe it's mentioned in the logs...
(ossasepia) diana_coman: trinque: dunno if those compilation notes are of any help at all.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: lobbes: if there's something you wanted to discuss today, better now/earlier (or tomorrow at 7pm) as today I won't be around for long.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ... *should* be limitations clearly stated too)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: so all that sort of thing should also be written at analysis report time, even if just as such - potential problems/unknown & unchecked issues; for that specific issue I suppose you could in principle look at intervals and all that but it's certainly overkill atm so yeah, write it down as "limitation" and otherwise live with it for this data set, nothing to do about it; (and no, nothing is ever perfect either, so there ...
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: basically approach the data like everything else - NOT trusting it, quite the opposite, assuming it's rubbish mostly so trying to find counterevidence for any "finding" it might throw at you; for one thing, given enough data, you can "find" anything if you only...try hard enough (hence the classical lies, big lies and statistics, too)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: and that's why usually you'd want to have more than just one measure for any thing - ideally anything you conclude relies on some triangulation of data (among other reasons to stand at least a chance of *noticing* discrepancies)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: in principle you'd figure out what errors through a combination of methods including at the very least: known issues due to your code/collection method; potential/known issues due to environment (such as the one you noticed, in principle); those observed through initial random sampling and at later stages when there's any anomaly/not fitting
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ... the cleanup would be to make all channel names lower case or something ie to avoid this sort of error; do make any cleanings via scripts too so you can reproduce and otherwise on a copy of the data...
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: well, in practice (like with a lot of things), it can end up with a few iterations too because yes, you'll need to first have at least a look around just to figure out what you have in there but otherwise there might still be problems you notice later - at which point there's no choice than to go back, cleanup, run the stuff again; hence why ...make scripts for whatever analysis you do; specifically for the example you gave, ...
(ossasepia) diana_coman: spyked: and now I am already asking for a change to that feed, lolz: would you add to it the feed for billymg.com, please?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: that is more filtering of data than cleaning and yes, if needed, sure; on top of that, there might be borked/bogus data - you don't really want that counted as the rest since well, rubbish in, rubbish out
(ossasepia) diana_coman: billymg: and feel free to discuss any of it in here if it's any help, ofc.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: esp the trim sounds wonderful to me!
(ossasepia) diana_coman: billymg: glad to hear it!
(ossasepia) diana_coman: billymg: no worries; what's your plan re mpwp?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: oh hey, looks good, billymg !
(ossasepia) diana_coman: trinque: ah, cool; np.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: trinque: fwiw at least some ratings from 4days ago haven't yet made it on wot.deedbot
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: np; fwiw in principle getting it from deedbot is preferable to getting it from your site but anyways.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: well, next time you find yourself worrying, make the sign instead!
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: yeah, people; birds are innocent in this (and rather too busy to stare)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: badges too, I suppose;
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: neah, should be made properly, with a big arrow: worry HERE.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: fwiw I'm quite enjoying the sudden almost ~total quiet (feels like countryside all of a sudden) + all the chirping birds coming over, can't even complain really; had fun discussing the plague in public too (company noted "they are looking at you"; noted back that "well, from 2m what else could they do anyway?"
(ossasepia) diana_coman: lots of way more interesting (and enjoyable for that matter) things to do than worrying.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: see, troll them with apparent stockpiles ?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: now that's a question each gets to answer for themselves; how would I know what makes most sense for you? for all I know - buy yourself caviar with it better; or bitcoin, sure; or smoke it, what.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ah, so it *does* the public worry (with the screaming); the printing well, finally found a reason for it, but anyways.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: "come here to worry together" ,lolz
(ossasepia) diana_coman: then again, it's a very cheap "Doing Something About It" too, so possibly why so easily chosen really; (see, the government could also just worry about it in public - it might even be more useful, setting up worry-points for interested people)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: but yeah, no point nor need nor anything really to worry, it's a sort of ...blockage only.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: ahaha, now that's something to protect against rather than worry about, lolz
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: why worry anyway?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: re "what analysis", start with the main question and then identify a set of concrete measures that are relevant; talk/ask for feedback on a draft of such list if you aren't sure, not a big issue.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: so you will need to actually look at your collection process and at at least some randomly sampled data in more detail
(ossasepia) diana_coman: note that you might still need to do some data cleaning first though, that is usually pre-analysis anyway
(ossasepia) diana_coman: data analysis is a tricky one to define generically like that but at this stage it's really a very basic thing, mainly calculating a set of basic stats that can provide some information relevant to the question that started the whole thing: where and how much activity is there
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: context is indeed how and what data was collected from where and under what specific conditions/constraints/known issues.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: lobbes: what's your plan with the mp-wp log/bot anyway? and in general actually, are you back to saltmine-eating-my-time-wut-can-do?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-03-30#1023308 - dorion, there's no comment that can possibly take 1 week of being worked on, seriously now.
(ossasepia) diana_coman will be back later
(ossasepia) diana_coman: well, requests for changes are indeed unlikely to come all that often but it's still at best a workaround than a solution and moreover, a rather poor one in that it basically banks on the idea of .. little use of the bot? lolz; not like I mind the operator-maintained version but I'd have thought you rather mind it, tbh; anyways, no rush or anything.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: anyway, might require some more thinking, I guess.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: aha, as I was typing ^
(ossasepia) diana_coman: spyked: but is the feed-in-chan a separate/anomaly thing currently, then? basically it needs a sort of alias #ossasepia = diana_coman
(ossasepia) diana_coman: hm; you mean that currently bot provides feed to anyone asking *in the channel where they are asking* while this requires a change of "maintain list of who can change feeds in where"
(ossasepia) diana_coman: spyked: so is the pm if you think of it; it's still in the pm "chan", no?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: spyked: isn't it the *same* command though?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: squinting a bit I can kind of see it as a sort of wot too if you take it by location but it doesn't come naturally to me because uhm, what's poor location to do really.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: spyked: hm, I guess I saw it more as a sort of multi-feeds per user; ie not as much that "diana_coman is owner of #ossasepia" but that diana_coman has a feed in pm and another feed in #ossasepia (and possibly whatever, yet another feed in #nosuchchan etc)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-04-03#1023598 - possibly it's enough to have one person able to do that rather than a whole wot really; otherwise sure, it could work similarly to voice-wot, basically a feeds-wot but it seems overkill to me.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: I don't think there's all that much to it to delve really, no worries.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: spyked: thank you!
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ofc I forgot one, how else, argh.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: and trinque.org
(ossasepia) diana_coman: spyked: lol, meanwhile I just made the full list
(ossasepia) diana_coman: spyked: can I have in #o the article feeds for: younghands.club; ossasepia.com; bingology.net; dorion-mode.com; fixpoint.welshcomputing.com; krankendenken.com; ztkfg.com; trilema.com; thewhet.net; bimbo.club; ave1.org; bvt-trace.net; thetarpit.org
(ossasepia) diana_coman: hm, spyked is there a way to get from feedbot the list of feeds for the chan rather than my own?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: mhm? I was comparing your stated options, not some generics like that, lol; and yes, the pasting in that case sounds more like a workaround than a solution.
(trinque) diana_coman: re bots - when/if they are in sync, they have the exact same numbers for all lines so in principle any links can be ported easily from one to another; but it is a very fragile thing for sure and no, I don't like it at all either.
(trinque) diana_coman: trinque: confirmed all fine, balance shows as expected, thank you.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-04-02#1023561 - you know, *this* is how it predictably goes in reality each time when "oh, it's better to NOT stick to weekly/shorter interval"; but up to you really.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-04-01#1023557 - bvt fixed that in his work (it uses patches/.. so tab-completable) but at any rate, still easier to fix it (or even workaround it if must) than to go full x11, huh.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: (that being said, the full process outlined there is based on a republic existing.)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: and you know, comment & ask there if anything's not clear, it's the primary source anyway.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: I suppose the V answerarium might be useful here.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: or how you are trying to do it
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: my "full use of V" above means - at all junctures aim to work *with* V rather than avoiding/sidelining it and if that creates some apparent problem/trouble, then discuss and weigh it seriously because chances are that the problem is not with V but with what you are trying to do and "doesn't fit"
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: I doubt it's possible to know ALL in advance, because some things will surely become clear only with use; even so far things evolved gradually, e.g. manifest file
(ossasepia) diana_coman: (at which point I realise that I ended up the V-champion too, good god).
(ossasepia) diana_coman: this grafting thing is anyway not fully clear even to me and I'm not even sure it IS a thing anyway; but at any rate, my main point is to make full use of V precisely because it forces things in the clear and that is gold.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: I meant a script to add that line (presumably if you have a huge tree, you might want to)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: well yes, I'm not suggesting to change existing V, no, lolz.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: tbh I can even see this done via script, not like a big pain in itself; basically V does not introduce trouble - it only makes it harder to ignore the trouble that there IS in fact, heh; as long as things are kept neat and tidy, there's very little additional cost that is imposed by v itself, come to think of it.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: genesis is a vpatch on an empty dir, no?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: admiteddly my concept of grafting is not fully formed but what I had in mind would be along the lines of genesis + whatever number of vpatches on top; as long as those touch only their own stuff, "grafting" it is a matter of going from empty predecessor for genesis to non-empty predecessor; I suppose the manifest file is the one that would force regrind in that it has to propagate though.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: for another thing, you can make a point of a minimal set and if that is indeed so, then naturally the branching will happen *on top* of it but still, I don't see how would it even be possible for it to not happen
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: for one thing I think your option C *anyway* happens, it's only less visible atm (~everyone has exactly that on their own computer and moreover, on different computers, no?)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: come to think of it - for as long as there are those stable interfaces, wouldn't it work perfectly fine anyway for maintainers to keep if they so wish the thing as a separate tree and otherwise simply "graft" their genesis on your tree at whatever point? ie the cost of a "regrind" might not even be all that big perhaps? (I'm not fully clear on the details so whether/if/in what case this is possible as such or not)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: it's I suppose a stark (and apparently unexpected) part of the point of V - *own* the damned thing.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: anyways, no rush, do ponder, do ask & talk, it's all for the best.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: well yes, it is a change, certainly, but uhm, what's the point of recreating open source only with some V inconvenience or what, lol
(ossasepia) diana_coman: in the process finding both people you want in the loop and otherwise those you don't want in the loop; benefits all around.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: but yes, if you don't want the branches to diverge, you run around and keep everyone in the loop (at least everyone you *want* in the loop)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: I don't get that "the system fragments"; it's code and it's there; anyone can take it, change something and it "fragments", no?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: but a. you *talk to them* so that they are aware of how great and needed the change you make is for their branch too, right? so: b. if they ignore it because it's not worth it then...it's not worth it, you know? c. if they ignore it because they are idiots/lazy/not maintaining that branch anymore, then they are not worth the trouble and so what
(ossasepia) diana_coman: I suppose there might be a cost perceived on you too there, ie "now I change this and then ~all maintainers will be mad at me for having to regrind" ?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ... specifically because it makes *sense* to talk closely to maintainers, what)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: possibly the trouble there is that you are mixing maintainers (ie public vpatches for whatever they are using) with private users (whose whatever they are using you can't see); and you seem to prefer to avoid having to interact too much with maintainers because you perceive it as a cost on them, such interaction; but I think the benefits far outweigh the costs (and not only because of "won't add shit to have more to regrind" but ...
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: quite in the eye of the beholder and moreover note that it can change + your "more active" evaluation might return something other than someone else's anyway (maybe you don't even consider x,y,z maintainers etc)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: so then I don't get what was the question/trouble
(ossasepia) diana_coman: and sure, maintain stable interfaces in your distro, why not
(ossasepia) diana_coman: I'm not saying anywhere that you should actively prevent it or anything; people can do whatever they want, stab themselves in the eye as many times as it takes, what.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: sure they can, but a. why would you *want* to not get it under V b. why is that your concern to start with ie what people might do on their own machine?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: do you mean there that people can run code without getting it under V?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: or whatever, "main branch".
(ossasepia) diana_coman: and moreover, what is the exact distinction you see between "trunk" and "branch" to start with?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: how do you see it so that it's "not necessary"?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: tbh I think it's precisely a benefit, not a problem; ie making it clear that bringing in all dead cats one found in the street just because "cute/might meaow better" has a cost + setting that cost precisely on the one bringing them in.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: there is a cost to branching, certainly; what's the problem with that again though?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: yes, they need to do exactly that; so what?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: essentially each user maintains their own OS anyway; they can choose to just follow the "branch" of someone (be it yours, it's still a branch) or make their own or whatevers
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: if someone wants gcc6 (or whatevers), that someone can branch your OS tree wherever to add the thing; and then they can maintain that branch, what's the problem exactly?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: comment in modq
(trinque) diana_coman: trinque: thanks, I'll try it again a bit later
(ossasepia) diana_coman: bvt: no worries; and let me know if there's any other weird you notice!
(ossasepia) diana_coman: a new news, lolz
(ossasepia) diana_coman: fwiw I did *not* send anything so there's nothing I can lose so far, lol
(ossasepia) diana_coman: trinque: sure, no rush from my side; I simply wanted to make sure I have the money in there to be able to pay your invoice at the end of the week, nothing else.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ... yes, for your needs and basically when using keccak on bytes/octets without all the mess the "spec" made by talking of bits and not working solely with full octets, there's no need to go roundabouts like that and you can nuke the flipping around, as there's no need for it if you always work with full octets/bytes, indeed.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-03-30#1023358 - bvt, I looked at this, it's basically no-and-yes, lolz; specifically: no, it's not a discrepancy, in fact the confusion is caused precisely because I was a stickler for not changing the tests otherwise, if you look at the outputs and at the printing in the tests you'll notice that the print for ch15 basically does what that transform you nuked in ch16 does otherwise; but ...
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-03-30#1023364 - trinque , can you help me with this? I'm trying to make a deposit to deedbot so it's ready for the end of the week but a. from the help I couldn't tell if sum is in satoshi or btc b. given the format deedbot gives for the rest I assumed btc, sent the !!deposit, got a challenge, send the corresponding !!v and it stopped there - am I missing something/doing something wrong?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: you know, what can I say re "a box" like that ?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-03-30#1023426 - lobbes, how are those guys in Brasil in the end anyway? there were some reviews/articles you were supposedly writing on shinjiru and on those...
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: basically the cut(s) you propose would be patches /branches (if several cuts are really worth it) on that genesis, to my mind.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ... genesis *should* include *everything* there; sign it with "use" key rather than your key, sure; use it as *starting* point rather than anything else and so on; but I hardly see the point in what is basically an incomplete genesis.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2020-03-30#1023419 - a genesis of Gales sounds needed in any case, indeed; if you recall, there is some difference between genesis and other patches in that genesis may at times be huge since it says "here's this thing to start working on", while a patch says "here's this *change* to look at if it should be made or not"; quite a significant difference too and in practice I'd say it means that a ...
(trinque) diana_coman: so do you want the current logbots in here and do you plan to voice them automatically or not?
(trinque) diana_coman: trinque: ossabot wasn't voiced so it failed to cite spyked's referenced line earlier; I don't intend to voice it/make it voice manually and the way it currently works means that unvoiced bots will desync the logs (since each bot assumes it *did* cite the line itself)
(ossasepia) diana_coman will be back tomorrow.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: cruciform2: you'll need to reconnect with the nick on which you registered the key and then try !!up with deedbot for voice.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v 76EC35E7E4726FADE9C743B2D1097962734974B08E50572BAE9996C77BEAEC3C
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!key cruciform
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!key cruciform2
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!up #ossasepia cruciform2
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!up cruciform2
(ossasepia) diana_coman: cool; I'll devoice everyone in my L1 - you should be able to !!up yourselves with deedbot ; if it doesn't work, pm me or trinque about it.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!up #ossasepia whaack
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v 8B563FE59B238D8DB67B25EE0FCC24115A3410F9F20066C82CFEDA6A33CE57B7
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v 450FDF58A79F0E0F8AB24E37C17E2290A2A5020F67AFE2EBB2E16E3F371F7485
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v 74E4305E7192C5D4F5F35A78561E06BAC82BC3E57A7720FD0601DDCFAAC46CD7
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v 42BB18CFAE085DC03FF9281300B98B7EAE2DA1E0D59E039F90D8D04B1FE643DB
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v FE75EB2ACC47DCF96095BBD9CF0FA8474A65007CDA7E5053D144FE0AC605FDBB
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v 76D7198CCADC425E737787F10DF3C700DEC9C2745AC169738B7C0F4E82E13897
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v 7D80B521C556087BE61865CB0910E0A840067B8D4BAB0CA83120D1B80E0774F5
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v E9414DEFED0A2AA80DD732CE50DE604620EF3E49A03B5B1C43C31AF4145B101C
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v 621E34B6AFE6392B774281F1E24EF9CB88FF722BD08768C4DBB3D9C8849BA3F1
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v C93E46A4BFBBD70441EAD9CA4455ED4916B389F264202AD9F97F44452AE0A6EE
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v CB4F6F4C28A79BAB9CE9F2BDB02247F5840E99715254705845A795566847CD92
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v AE03414950ADF6DA2A35A1414D0327C510BD5F93E1BD23955D4D1F264791733A
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v FA3B5F37FDA09D4248FE872F3BD947CD53E585207BCF469D28E525311FB5C116
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!v C75833BF657BC1601C85A70403C2AE6C936FF27114BB2EFEA6C5C550F79D0246
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ahaha, I don't trust myself AT ALL !
(ossasepia) diana_coman: !!gettrust diana_coman
(ossasepia) diana_coman: also, the help page still lists RSS - does deedbot still do/do you plan it to do rss as well?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: trinque: is the deposit amount in btc or in satoshis (ie float or int)?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: bvt: the spec was SUCH a pain with the bits/bytes and order that ~anything is possible; but I'll need to get back to it as it's been quite a while; I'll let you know.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: bvt: interesting, thank you; I'll have a look at it.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: and then some unemployed chefs to correct the transcription? lolz
(ossasepia) diana_coman: maybe I should even translate that illustration of nonsense through scientific method application, huh.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: jfw: heh, so ...genesis bach-werke-verzeichnis in the works?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: lol; allergies are not that ..healthy
(ossasepia) diana_coman: with perfect charts and everything else, it was quite some fun.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: basically an "analysis" of the ...length of titles on trilema.com , lolz
(ossasepia) diana_coman: hm, I had an example of doing exactly that, quite purposefully , hm
(ossasepia) diana_coman: and yes, you can do lots of nonsense with pretty charts, certainly
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: ahaha, poor graphs; they are not at fault there!
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: on a basic level understand that the whole point of systematic anything is precisely != pick a magic word at random as it might lead somewhere better than another, lol.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: data visualisation is a huge domain in itself but hm, basics first; and in any case, start with the original question and aim first to have and publish a *summary of the data*; that being said, do mind if /how much rubbish your collection process might have inserted,ahem; data quality is yet another part of it,lolz.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: now I realise that hm; are you even aware of different chart types and which ones are useful for showing/visualising what?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: I mean maybe, sure, maybe anything; if you have the right incantation, it might lead you to where discussions occur, certainly.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: I can't see any logic there.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: do some proper stats first of all; how many users per logged chan; how many of those said how many lines per interval etc; start with the basic question which was "how much activity is where"
(ossasepia) diana_coman: and no, discussion is not defined by "keywords", lol
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ahaha, it's most likely less a topic of discussion than one of news & automated stuff really
(ossasepia) diana_coman: are you planning to troll with "how many channels did coronavirus infect for lack of social-channel-isolation" or what?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: uhm, what's the focus on coronavirus now? lolz
(ossasepia) diana_coman: ah, I'll read it then and give it a spin; thanks!
(ossasepia) diana_coman: cool; I take it, it's quite the same set of commands so the help is still up to date, correct?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: trinque: is the wallet still with deedbot too?
(ossasepia) diana_coman: trinque: yeee!
(ossasepia) diana_coman: trinque: I did set the flags for deedbot with chanserv; do let me know if it didn't work/something else is needed.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: as a rule, raw data is raw data; if you do *any* filtering/cleaning/whatever, you can publish the result too but you need to clearly add to it the full description of what you did there.
(ossasepia) diana_coman: whaack: it's analysis, not excerpts you need to put in an article, lol; the raw data .sql/.csv (archived, sure or split if huge etc) but otherwise analysis with supporting charts or stats not excerpts (unless you are planning some even-more-time-consuming analysis but I seriously doubt that)
(ossasepia) diana_coman: anyways, I'll be back at the usual 7pm utc
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