Hide Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2015-04-28 | 2015-04-30 → ↓
mircea_popescu: where does it break btcalpha ?
williamdunne: I'm assuming btcalpha is parsing the API in its current state
williamdunne: So if it were changed so that it uses valid json
williamdunne: It would break
williamdunne: Unless its using the DB files
mircea_popescu: doubt it tbh.
mircea_popescu: exactly.
assbot: BABA BOSSU DELA MEDIAS 2014 DE MUIE LA FRAIERI - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JzAjPb )
williamdunne: Either way though, could use some valid json
asciilifeform: re: 'Tumblr dot TXT' >> would be interesting to learn how it was censored
asciilifeform: (notice, archive copy, original is long vanished)
mircea_popescu: can has original url ?
danielpbarron: original is long vanished << today vanished
danielpbarron: would be interesting to learn how it was censored << lots of people all clicking "this account is offensive"
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'm a bit soaked in ETOH trying to protect my liver from cutaneous triclopyr exposure earlier today, not sure how to extract from Google clutches
BingoBoingo is kind of aware BingoBoingo is not a broadleaf weed, but still taking post exposure prophylaxis against strange chemicals
assbot: BREVES  |  Prison avec sursis pour la décompilation illicite du code de Skype  | Legalis.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1JzBBtp )
mircea_popescu: some dude in caen got sent to jail for publishing a reverse-engineered version of skype
BingoBoingo: Really?
mircea_popescu: 6 months in prison (suspended) and 3500 euro fine
mircea_popescu: this not really qntra is it ?
mircea_popescu: court even rejected unliquidated damages.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Because the target was MS-limb Skype and the impact makes a contrast to the "American Approach" could be a qntra
mircea_popescu: well, that
mircea_popescu: 's all that's in there. what the guy actually reversed (of note) was the rc4 compression, and what really got them boiling is that he published it on his blog.
BingoBoingo: Eh, everybody's fucked that RC4 slut.
mircea_popescu: it's really... marginal in all respects.
BingoBoingo: How many people have been punished for it?
BingoBoingo: A hook is: what really got them boiling is that he published it on his blog.
mircea_popescu: well...punished. his lawyer prolly cost more.
mircea_popescu: but sure, if you wanna go into that
BingoBoingo: I'm afraid to touch translations of the French language, but a certain subset of my WoT seems comfortable enough I'd publish their writeups on a Frog story
BingoBoingo: If this were a derp seemingly so treated in an Arizona court I would be all over this
BingoBoingo: Like Candida on a BBW
BingoBoingo: Doesn't pretty much every linux Distro try to at least pretend to the PGP signed sherezade?
mircea_popescu: first one i've seen today.
BingoBoingo: Nah, I'm not talking the "essential" "accessories" the distros themselves try to put up a PGP front
BingoBoingo: Even if it means actual vitals are missing and unsigned
mircea_popescu: i gues epel counts as a distro
BingoBoingo: The *buttu derps kinda set the bar low on what counts as a "distro"
assbot: Bug 54651 – mod_remoteip ends up trusting IPs that it doesn't check ... ( http://bit.ly/1PVuV9L )
mircea_popescu: note that nothing actually works in a number of different ways
assbot: The Rogue Feminist • "Tho" is AAVE just to let you know ... ( http://bit.ly/1PVvqR6 )
BingoBoingo: Who could have known that "The Catcher in the Rye" was about computing and JD Salinger was a time machine victim exponsed to Ubuntu
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3678 @ 0.00028616 = 1.0525 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: dude... "aave" is NOT a thing. it used to be.
mircea_popescu: and tho is about as common as nosejobs.
danielpbarron: !ud headmate
danielpbarron: ;;ud headmate
gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=HeadMate | Apr 7, 2013 ... Headmate. A term thrown around mostly by people on tumblr. People who haven' t seen the sun in long enough begin to hallucinate vividly, ...
danielpbarron: used in a sentence: "I guess im in a polyamorous relationship since me and lelonia are both dating but I dont really feel like Im dating her&plus shes a headmate"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8242 @ 0.00030166 = 2.4863 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: !up mixdio
mircea_popescu: so basically it's alienation driven dissociation ?
Adlai: the second UD definition seems much more accurate:
Adlai: "Some people can claim different ethnicities or sexualities, thus allowing them to join an autonomous caucus (for instance queer or women’s) that they were not otherwise entitled to join"
assbot: Social Justice Newspeak Explained, Headmates ... ( http://bit.ly/1HXNBoc )
BingoBoingo: Oh shit, this new Marvel movie is actually smart. Perfect allegory for psot-Silk-Road Bitcoin.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7150 @ 0.00030895 = 2.209 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: James Spader plays an evil robot on point, and... Disney spent 4 Josh Hamiltons or 1 Coinbase on a film.
mircea_popescu: disney can afford it
BingoBoingo: Seriously good Bitcoin allegory though. I will have to sober watch and blog up.
trinque: Adlai: I assume you have now slept off your drunkeness; I meanwhile have found my own
Adlai sips coffee and blinks
trinque: tell you what; this country is a shitty place, but I have the good fortune to have met a handful of americans worth knowing
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14799 @ 0.00030895 = 4.5722 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5210 @ 0.00030895 = 1.6096 BTC [+]
Adlai: !up gabriel_laddel
gabriel_laddel: Thank you.
Adlai: no thank YOU
gabriel_laddel: 1. A WoT host has been mentioned a few times in the logs - MP's new hosts (abusehosting.ru) accept bitcoin. It is probably easier to get them into the WoT than to start a new hosting company, which (understandably) no one wants to do. See also: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-03-2014#565389
assbot: Logged on 18-03-2014 14:54:45; nubbins`: "hey guys i'd like to open a sandwich shop, is there any place i can buy deli meats in bulk?"
gabriel_laddel: 2. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=28-04-2015#1114502 << Vocabulary note: code and data reduce to "information".
assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 21:47:49; trinque: unix's "everything is a file" is a poor man's "everything is data"
assbot: Logged on 21-04-2015 19:23:08; mircea_popescu: Pierre_Rochard you know the very notion that someone thinks themselves gay and jewish... it's like... the quadriplegic swimmer or something. the 98 yo beauty queen
assbot: Dana International - Tel Aviv Pride Parade 2014 דנה אינטרנשיונל במצעד הגאווה - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1KsIMBb )
gabriel_laddel: 4. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=28-04-2015#1114416 << Auotools is 150k LoC. Might as well just require SBCL at that point.
assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 20:56:45; ascii_field: i'd be open to a purely gnumake-based thing instead of the sh
gabriel_laddel: 5. <mircea_popescu> kinda why i'm discovering all i really like off unix these days is like... curl. grep. << http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/posts/old-age-and-treachery.html
assbot: The Treacherous Optimization ... ( http://bit.ly/1KsIMBd )
assbot: Armed Korean Merchants Protect Stores - 1992 LA Riots - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1KsIMBj )
gabriel_laddel: 韓流 ftw.
Adlai splurts coffee all over irc too
Adlai: gabriel_laddel: at the very least, sending those in with a few-second delay would let assbot annotate the logs in a more readable manner
Adlai: she can't spam faster than the speed of flood
gabriel_laddel: ll try harder next time.
gabriel_laddel: 7. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-04-2015#1113989 << When I change the argument list, rename a procedure, use an unnamed reference why are the holes not marked or filled? Why must I manually declare my local variables and functions? Can't the current top level expression be searched for occurrences then factored out on a keystroke? Why must I balance strings, whatever the level of nesting or escaping? Can th
assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 17:16:36; mircea_popescu: think about it. why the fuck should the code have to know about this. and if it does have to know about this, why aren't ALL the code references affected by any of such a change cross-indexed somewhere ?
gabriel_laddel: is not be handled automatically? Why isn't there grammer/spellchecking for my comments? If I modify a package or system definition at runtime, shouldn't I be prompted to write that change to the defining expression? Why must I optimize my programs and add type annotations? Can't test data be used to add typing annotations in an automated manner? Can't this information inform modifications of the program's fundamenta
gabriel_laddel: l data structures to those appropriate for the information being pushed through it? If the type information exists, shouldn't it inform auto-completion? Shouldn't I be able to query over the type signature, known return types and lambda list of all procedures?
gabriel_laddel: Why isn't all this information part of the version control toolchain? I can't query over all commits to find those that changed `some-function'..? WHAT THE FUCK IS HTTP? All I want to do is expose a procedure to a network - how is this more difficult than selecting a list of procedures which are then exposed?
Adlai isn't sure "harder" is the right dimension
Adlai: Why must I manually declare my local variables << scoping
Adlai: automagic scoping goes wrong once you start messing with eg closures
gabriel_laddel: Nah - say I have this expression: (+ (x 4) k (x 4))
Adlai: contrived example is contrived
gabriel_laddel: I should be able to have a cursor on either one of the (x 4) and hit a keystroke to extract it into a let binding
gabriel_laddel: Just trying to point MP at something
Adlai: you mean turning that into (let ((y (x 4))) (+ y k y)) ?
gabriel_laddel: ^ anyway, all of the above are simple if you adknowledge that you've got to operate on an AST
gabriel_laddel: if you don't you'll be fucked, because generating syntatically correct code means AST manipulations
gabriel_laddel: in lisp easy peasy pie
gabriel_laddel: in ALGOL
gabriel_laddel: clang's AST crud is >100k LoC
gabriel_laddel: I'll note that I wrote a prototype for the RPC described above - ran into an issue with TCP or the library I was using it from. Messages were disappearing in flight.
gabriel_laddel: 8. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=27-04-2015#1113452 << Masamune is based on funtoo, which is gentoo without SystemD.
assbot: Logged on 27-04-2015 23:07:20; mircea_popescu: i'd settle for a well documented and judiciously defaulted gentoo.
gabriel_laddel: If someone would like to make themselves useful and move us that much closer to a source-only #-assets distribution, a CL interface to portage is desperately needed.
Adlai hasn't yet recovered from elisp overdose
gabriel_laddel: Adlai: you're piping data back and forth from CL to elisp or...?
gabriel_laddel: Portage has a USE flag (what is that? Idk, some nonsense abstraction) for docs so you can tell it to build all docs, but it gets caught in cyclic dependencies atm.
Adlai: tried to read masamune code
gabriel_laddel: I should commit
gabriel_laddel: Anyways, if someone were to move portage to CLOS detecting cycles is easy, hence we can have all the documentation we ever wanted
gabriel_laddel: I should note that masamune installs
gabriel_laddel: something went wrong with imaxima and gnuplot in portage - it only works on one of my machines now
gabriel_laddel: ^ http://dev.gentoo.org/~zmedico/portage/doc/ this is probably a good place to start for portage -> CL
assbot: Portage Documentation ... ( http://bit.ly/1QI1HfK )
gabriel_laddel: basically all one needs is
gabriel_laddel: emerge -s maxima ;; searches maxima
gabriel_laddel: equery y maxima ;; shows available versions of maxima
gabriel_laddel: emerge info maxima ;; get all information
gabriel_laddel: Another useful thing someone could do is to figure out how we would go about generating a canonical hardware -> driver mapping
assbot: masamune/util.lisp at master · gabriel-laddel/masamune · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1QI2uNY )
trinque: "I can't query over all commits" << man I yell about wanting to query the state of everything constantly
gabriel_laddel: ^ this contains information about how to get a list of all hardware - the kernel can determine hardware -> driver mappings somehow. Find, document.
gabriel_laddel: trinque: one can trivially query over ASTs
gabriel_laddel: regarding comprehensible computing - an observation, sbcl vs. GCC
gabriel_laddel: ~398k LoC vs. >14 million
gabriel_laddel: SBCL has a %6 C core for GC stuff
trinque: grammar : AST :: schema : rows
gabriel_laddel: trinque: I don't know how to read that.
gabriel_laddel: one could tear out all windows crud from SBCL, and replace the C crud with some clever assembler hacks in a manner similar to what I've been told T did.
gabriel_laddel: anyways...
assbot: History of T ... ( http://bit.ly/1QI3tgZ )
Adlai: trinque: make them all equal! tables of cons cells! cdr-coded self-joins!
trinque: Adlai: when does relational algebra get its "cycle"
Adlai: three bushels of hax
gabriel_laddel: Adlai: tables of cons cells?
trinque: fwiw the best relational system is probably yet to be built, and is probably made of lisp
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 00:40:05; Adlai: trinque: what, you want a table with two columns, CAR and CDR?
gabriel_laddel: !s reflections on trusting trust
assbot: 3 results for 'reflections on trusting trust' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=reflections+on+trusting+trust
gabriel_laddel: Adlai: I saw that - but wtf
trinque: it's just lists of lists after all, with something which guards inserts/updates into it
Adlai is trollinque
trinque: you lispfolk can rip the relational database from my dead hands
gabriel_laddel: trinque: ummm
trinque: it's fine for pulling levers on my database, but that's it
gabriel_laddel: trinque: one can just query over ASTs
gabriel_laddel: like, say that I want to find all javascript functions with 3 arguments
trinque: you can have an invalid AST in lisp, in terms of your grammar; no one stops you from making any pile of cons cells
trinque: if I represent a grammar in SQL tables you cannot fuck it up
trinque: any atomic alteration of the state of it cannot be wrong
trinque: I can bitch slap your mistakes with constraints and the very structure of my schema
trinque: that is what I love about it
Adlai: this is starting to sound like unfeature #4
Adlai: put more constructively: does your constraint grammer allow for extending itself?
trinque: sure, but specifically how
gabriel_laddel: ^ ding ding ding
trinque: nah hold on
gabriel_laddel: as for the js ast
trinque: what's meant by that
gabriel_laddel: (filter (lambda (l) (and (eq :function (car l)) (= 3 (length (nth 2 l))))) (js-ast #P"~/somejsfile.js"))
trinque: of course one can alter schema at will
Adlai: can you stick some row into some table of constraint specifications, which lets future-you insert previously-invalid rows
trinque: I don't know why people act like relational databases are cast in iron
trinque: Adlai: writable system catalog released by my old employer https://github.com/aquametalabs/pg_meta
assbot: aquametalabs/pg_meta · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1QI56eK )
trinque: so yeah, you can just insert into that and alter the database arbitrarily
trinque: so one of the projects I built with that is a schema generator given some ebnf representation of a grammar
trinque: along with automatic to-string for the ASTs
trinque: so you can metaprogram like a motherfucker in an rdbms
trinque: SQL is just a terrible syntax.
gabriel_laddel: yeah that sounds like a lot of work
trinque: no, not really
trinque: SQL's a highly functional language, easy to think about
trinque: it's just operating on sets
gabriel_laddel: "automatic to-string for the ASTs"
gabriel_laddel: ^ sounds like a bitch - but I'm lazy...
Adlai: sounds like a defmethod print-object
trinque: gabriel_laddel: it's just a join between the tables that represent the grammar and the AST tables
trinque: so you can pull lexer tokens out of the former for example that aren't in the AST itself
gabriel_laddel: holy fuck no
trinque: !up gabriel_laddel
gabriel_laddel: trinque: you're just learning CL, right?
gabriel_laddel: or, like, looking at it now?
trinque: I'm surprised you find the relational model controversial.
trinque: I don't see how it's incompatible at all with lisp.
Adlai: what's wrong with extending code-is-data to another data format?
gabriel_laddel: I don't find it controversial at all
gabriel_laddel: I find the parsing to be a gigantic PITA
Adlai: (beyond the hours forever lost turning into weeks you'll never get back)
Adlai: I'm not sure there's any parsing involved
trinque: so give me the enforcement of logical structure in lisp
trinque: that is what I want.
Adlai: this seems to be more "store the AST in a db rather than text"
gabriel_laddel: ;; later tell EllieAsksWhy 'proxies'
gribble: The operation succeeded.
gabriel_laddel: trinque: I understand what you're talking about.
gabriel_laddel: Adlai: he is/was storing lexing and grammer information.
trinque: tool for representing business rules, piles of data, and trying to make money, please.
Adlai always found "business logic" reminiscent of "military logic" in the necessity of distinguishing it from plain simple old "logic"
trinque: I think it's code for "not mine but his"
Adlai: or "who me, write my own code? nah"
Adlai: "fetch me your trainedest monkeys!"
gabriel_laddel: I'd like to clarify that what I'm finding appaling here is the huge amount of effort spent generating syntatically correct strings.
trinque: that's not the purpose of it at all.
gabriel_laddel: Sure, even in sexprs you have a 'grammer' you might want to check
gabriel_laddel: the purpose isn't what I'm horrified by
trinque: how in lips could you take the ast of a view against one table
trinque: consider the ast of an operation to change the table
trinque: and derive the view that will apply to the new table
trinque: even if you pivoted one into two
trinque: being able to reflect and consider things as sets, not the tree, is valuable
trinque: lips, lol
gabriel_laddel: I have to check that I know what these terms mean before I respond. one sec
Adlai: back in the old days, there was no asdf:load-system... everything consisted of passing magic dispatch tokens to asdf:operate
Adlai: people became lazy... everything changed once the bitrot nation attacked
Adlai: ultimately, rdbms magic does NOT fits in heads
trinque: it's not magic at all
trinque: it's set logic
gabriel_laddel: trinque: could you rephrase "take the ast of a view against one table"
trinque: which amounts to an iteration over one or more lists with an if statement
Adlai: you can't "cat fixup >> database.sql"
trinque: other such logic, producing a result
gabriel_laddel: btw, one can trivially deal with sexpr 'ASTs' as sets
trinque: gabriel_laddel: asumming the AST is represented as a set of tables with foreign key relationships, each table representing a production rule in the grammar
gabriel_laddel: hahahahahahahhaa
gabriel_laddel: oh my fucking god
trinque: you have a childish way of speaking
gabriel_laddel is a child :/
trinque: well grow the fuck up, and discuss ideas like a man.
gabriel_laddel: kk, I'm not going anywhere
trinque: if I discovered a way to do something lispy in a non-lisp environment, do you think this'd be the first time I've done this?
gabriel_laddel: trinque: done what exactly?
trinque: so like, why do you think we put ASTs in the database?
trinque: no reason?
gabriel_laddel: I've no idea why you did, but am assuming you've got some reason why
trinque: so then from what position do you proclaim lisp?
gabriel_laddel: because it is inescapable
gabriel_laddel: well, s-expressions are at least
trinque: I'm not seeing the incompatibility of the things
gabriel_laddel: "lisp", like "lispy" is an ill-defined idea.
trinque: list of lists
trinque: there you go, now fucking iterate over two of them and filter by respective conditional expressions
trinque: pop the result into one new list
trinque: now worry about schema at appropriate places and you've got relational algebra
trinque: doesn't need a fucking postgresql
gabriel_laddel: everything is a "list of lists" or a "tree" when you get down to it (in the compiler - though yes, you can go directly stack machine).
trinque: certainly
gabriel_laddel: but sexprs are nice because they're easy to parse.
gabriel_laddel: anyone /can/ add meta-programming to whatever language they want.
gabriel_laddel: but you'll end up like paul phillips
gabriel_laddel: because parsing is a terribly boring (and totally unnecessary) task.
gabriel_laddel: btw, I'm still putting together a model of what exactly it is you've done so that I can discuss this with you using your vocabulary...
gabriel_laddel: "how in lips could you take the ast of a view against one table" << This ends up being just hacking at sexprs with the full language at your disposal.
gabriel_laddel: you might get a "relational algebra"
trinque: and if one of your hacks fucks up the logic of what it is to be a "whatever's in that list" ?
trinque: the idea is that your lisp code is always right, hence the data is right
trinque: whereas I assume everything's hell and hopefully the database will keep it all coherent
trinque: because a printer could fellate itself or linux could grow cancer and fill a disk
trinque: the database if told as much as is known about the data you want to represent, wont let you fuck it up
gabriel_laddel: I can do the same thing if I want.
gabriel_laddel: you just end up writing a predicate to see that the information you're manipulating is (every #'string ...) or whatever
trinque: which amounts to building a database in to your thing, yeah?
gabriel_laddel: Well, the lines get blurry.
gabriel_laddel: But yes.
gabriel_laddel: ;; google symbolics Statice
gribble: Statice (Symbolics) - Symbolics Lisp Machine Museum: <http://smbx.org/statice-symbolics/>; Symbolics Assets Bought - Symbolics Lisp Machine Museum: <http://smbx.org/symbolics-assets-bought/>; Statice Flower Meaning & Symbolism | Statice Facts - Teleflora.com: <http://www.teleflora.com/about-flowers/statice.asp>
gabriel_laddel: So, in your model of computing you get to work with incomplete languages in the "data model" and when generating "views". While this does provide defaults, when hacking lisp you always have the full language at your disposal.
BingoBoingo: Quick question... There's no macguffin the plot can use to out BTC BTC is there...
gabriel_laddel: Also, you don't have to parse anything, or have "generator rules" or whatever, which cuts out a lot of the complexity that you get when doing something like what you've done.
BingoBoingo still wonders about the search for a singular #b-a distribution when x86 sucks as much as it does...
gabriel_laddel: it is on the way
gabriel_laddel: I just spent 2 days fucking with mozilla
trinque: !up gabriel_laddel
gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: Making it production ready is going to take some time, but as is, it is better than any other distro I've used.
BingoBoingo: <trinque> if I represent a grammar in SQL tables you cannot fuck it up << You want to throw a stake down on that???
gabriel_laddel: Having the same keybindings for the web browser + editor gets me all hot and bothered.
gabriel_laddel: If I could just get a working shared kill ring...
gabriel_laddel *shivers*
trinque: yeah, if you represent anything correctly in relational tables you wont have false statements *according to your system*
trinque: you could totally be wrong
trinque: just not incoherent
trinque: this assurance that the data means anything is why databases were created.
BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: Not dissing the project, just questioning the target.
gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: question away.
gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: diss away too.
BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: Dunno how useful I can be. Drunk on vodka trying to protect my vital fluids from triclopyr. Watched a Disney movie...
BingoBoingo: trinque: The problem with taking any extant, deployabru RDBMS is that unsanitzed inputs could throw out rm -rf /
BingoBoingo: Hopefully the DB doesn't have the rights for it to run, but...
gabriel_laddel: I'm simply of the opinion that our current platform (irc) is too barbaric and doesn't force enough shared context upon us to do anything interesting. Any sort of shared vision or whatever gets watered down into discussions like the above.
gabriel_laddel: Without a shared language the logs will end up in endless cycles of the above.
BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: What makes you sure we have a shared platform, or that individuals here choose platforms for themselves singularly?
BingoBoingo: I doubt severely shared languages are a thing
gabriel_laddel: perhaps that was phrased poorly.
gabriel_laddel: The preceding discussion was largely myself and trinque learning the others vocabulary.
trinque: I think the guy just means talking in person it is much easier to understand what's meant by the other.
trinque: yeah that
gabriel_laddel: I don't think "in person" has much to do with it.
gabriel_laddel: right now I can't draw you a 3D picture you can just open up, modify and send back to me
trinque: well then that's something true of any attempt to communicate
gabriel_laddel: compiler, dependencies blah blah blah
trinque: sure, big bottleneck there still
trinque: it's going to piss you off when I say we were attaching widgets to the various tables of our ASTs
trinque: this is what you're talking about right?
trinque: you want to send me data directly in some more meaningful structure
BingoBoingo: trinque: Baudot is the penultimate encoding
gabriel_laddel: "I need the ability to publish a unit of research as an interactive program containing all information used to draw my conclusions. It shall be entirely and trivially modifiable, extensible, and if reproducing the research is possible on this machine, running the program shall be a single click or procedure call away. WYSIWYG tools shall be included and fashioned from the precepts of geometry. Thus, if the supplied
gabriel_laddel: graphics routines are inadequate, I can fall back on an 'api' independent of man. Lessons, as a refinement of research, shall offer the same capabilities. Networking (e.g., sharing these programs or crafting interactions between them) shall be trivial. No single authority shall dictate what is an isn't appropriate to publish. This is not to be enforced by social machinery which promises to promote and cherish scient
gabriel_laddel: ific inquiry, but as a consequence of a comprehensible, expressive design that empowers the individual. "
gabriel_laddel: ^ trinque
BingoBoingo: <trinque> sure, big bottleneck there still << Irony of ironies, bottleneck is the part of the bottle that broke such that poison exposure happened
gabriel_laddel: trinque: related - pastebin.com/AdTXnKT6
BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: Couldn't a Perl OS do that? Works for make baby?
gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: die
BingoBoingo: Or AppleBasic?
BingoBoingo: 6502 emulates on nearly everything...
assbot: DNA/Frank The Vandal ... ( http://bit.ly/1zcsgnS )
gabriel_laddel: ^ many thanks to stas for pointing me to that via his blog
trinque: gabriel_laddel: I'm headed towards bed; I'll read this tomorrow.
trinque: !rate gabriel_laddel 2 ...then I expect an operating system.
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/bbb73859c2d2f57f
BingoBoingo just watched Disney produced "evil robot fiction" was surprised at the parts that weren't shitty
trinque: !v assbot:trinque.rate.gabriel_laddel.2:ebce74b8458b0e2934062e26da0b155a3b93e00ae745213213525f777b4d25c3
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 2 for gabriel_laddel with note: ...then I expect an operating system.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5800 @ 0.00029619 = 1.7179 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11505 @ 0.0002903 = 3.3399 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5795 @ 0.00028616 = 1.6583 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9830 @ 0.00029619 = 2.9115 BTC [+]
davout: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115283 <<< ugh. this whole story is such a pile of braindamage
davout: basically the guy is being hung because the reverse-engineering wasn't made with the intent of creating something interoperable with skype, which is permitted under french law
punkman: davout, how did they figure that intent
davout: punkman: because he blogged about it and didn't keep it for himself, because of what he declared to the cops about making stuff to block skype, replicate its functionality without the backdoors
davout: ;;calc 67067452/25000
gribble: 2682.69808
davout: so apparently this neucoin thing sold for 2.7kBTC worth of their, ahem, "coin"
punkman: I had to get some paperwork from the police station today. old lady there looks at my ID, which is old and handwritten, and says "hey, I made this ID back in the day"
punkman: also, cab driver: "check out the hottie over there" *honks* "oh shit that was my cousin. damn she lost a lot of weight"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9000 @ 0.00028666 = 2.5799 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7700 @ 0.00028666 = 2.2073 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13950 @ 0.00029619 = 4.1319 BTC [+]
assbot: Python without an operating system [LWN.net] ... ( http://bit.ly/1zcUdMc )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16550 @ 0.00028521 = 4.7202 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: The core problem is that C programmers think they can get away with doing much less than the Common Lisp programmer causes the computer to do. But this is actually wrong. Getting C programmers to understand that they cause the computer to do less than minimum is intractable. They would not /use/ C if they understood this point, so if you actually cause them to understand it in the course of a discussion, you will only
mircea_popescu: make them miserable and hate their lives. People are pretty good at detecting that this is a likely outcome of thinking, and it takes conscious effort to brace yourself and get through such experiences. Most people are not willing even to /listen/ to arguments or information that could threaten their comfortable view of their own existence, much less think about it, so when you cannot answer a C programmer's "arguments
mircea_popescu: " that his way of life is just great the way it is, it is a pretty good sign that you let him set the agenda once he realized that his way of life was under threat. Since you have nothing to defend, your self-preservation instinct will not activate hitherto unused parts of your brain to come up with reasons and rationalizations for what you have done, you will not be aware that you have been taken for a ride before it
mircea_popescu: is over and you "lost".
mircea_popescu: the fucking quotes don't belong there.
mircea_popescu: what you _have_ in point of fact ACTUALLY LOST is the ability to live in a world where things actually work,
mircea_popescu: as opposed to "well it mostly works" "you just have to..." "hey it works on MY system" etc.
mircea_popescu: and yesterday's discussion re http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-04-2015#1113989 is a magnificent example of the exact problem.
assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 17:16:36; mircea_popescu: think about it. why the fuck should the code have to know about this. and if it does have to know about this, why aren't ALL the code references affected by any of such a change cross-indexed somewhere ?
jurov: that world did never exist
mircea_popescu: !up lolz
mircea_popescu: jurov so is your argument something like "oh look how cute, mp found a socialism HE CAN BELIEVE IN!!1" ?
jurov: it§s easiest to believe in the past that is now lost
mircea_popescu: i was ftr not proposing this was a thing at any point in the past.
jurov: i don't get you then at all
mircea_popescu: the problem here is that we're regressing to the past (srsly, the varnish adventure is so reminiscent of "dos utilities" scene it bleeds) but with much more powerful tools and with much more societal dependency on them.
mircea_popescu: it is, if you wish, like if bitcoin were to take over and everyone depended on it in 2065, but then for some reason people started moving back to 0.5.3 codebase.
mircea_popescu: it might have been ok for 50 years ago, when the most damage that it could do was someone losing his retarded tripod poems
mircea_popescu: it has a decent chance at simply ending the world, now.
jurov: so you want to have progress, after all\
mircea_popescu: hm... i think the ddos might still be on. that lolz dude left exactly 246 s after i voiced him.
mircea_popescu: jurov i just want shit that works.
mircea_popescu: IF i am going to allow these retarded kids out of their basements and into society, they HAVE TO spiff up their act.
mircea_popescu: i guess this could be progress. it could also be normalization. whatever it is...
jurov: basically, it's like roads were replaced every few years (bevcause we can and it's cheap) so that cars would need constatnt upgrades and modifications
jurov: you come and ask for car that damn works in this situation
jurov: impossible.
mircea_popescu: but the "changes" just stopped. moore law is dead.
mircea_popescu: i am at the forefront of people who noticed, and demand changes.
mircea_popescu: you know, thought leadership.
jurov: moore is not the only game in town. network bandwidth is still going up.
jurov: if that hits the ceiling,too, maybe then.
mircea_popescu: bandwidth alone is not really that type of change tho. and it stopped going up also, esp in the us.
mircea_popescu: actually the forecasts are that 2020 bw will be less than 2015 was.
mats: ouch, TWTR falls 15%
mircea_popescu: wasn't it 19% ?
mats: might be 19% pre market
mats: o nvm it fell below 20% at some point
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4228 @ 0.00029619 = 1.2523 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: lol i go to bed, gabriel_laddel comes online. avoiding unpleasant convos yo ? :D
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel: 1. A WoT host has been mentioned a few times in the logs - MP's new hosts << yeah i had sent teh guy an invite. all it takes is for him to actually show up etc.
jurov: i expect at least one round of redoing all the world if the derps succeed enforcing SSL everywhere
mircea_popescu: how would they succeed that ? i'm not doing it.
mircea_popescu: redefining "everywhere" != succeeding at ssl everywhere.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10350 @ 0.00028444 = 2.944 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: currently for instance, cpanel forums require ssl, and so i'm not visiting them. i don't generally visit sites that don't have a http version.
assbot: An iPad glitch grounded several dozen American Airlines planes – Quartz ... ( http://bit.ly/1DAZhp9 )
mats: lol
mircea_popescu: but what do they need the ipads for ?!
davout: mircea_popescu: it's actually pretty useful to get rid of tons of paper
mircea_popescu: iirc you can't even save a file on it.
mircea_popescu: unrelatedly : Upupa epops might be the best latin name ever.
jurov: or ipv6, you can ignore it, but it may mean you'll be unable to find working code that does not have the bits you hate
punkman: related, I watched a cab driver fashion a cooling system for his lenovo tablet/gps thing because it'd overheat and shut down
mircea_popescu: jurov that's ok, i'm unable to find working code anyway.
punkman: but airline pilots relying on ipad for flight plan? wtf
mircea_popescu: we're a species of idiots.
punkman: I dun wanna fly anymore
assbot: Dana International - Tel Aviv Pride Parade 2014 דנה אינטרנשיונל במצעד הגאווה - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1DB0f4J )
mircea_popescu: hey Adlai do you get down on knee ?
mircea_popescu: "i used to be a pop star but then i took a down to the knee"
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115372 << well, the prepared statements in a notepad / pasted later model is no good!
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:28:06; gabriel_laddel: ll try harder next time.
mircea_popescu: I confidently crow to anyone who would listen, those foolish enough to enter my office. And my girlfriend too, who's contractually obligated to pay attention to everything I say. << see, i think i know the kind of contract he's talking/dreaming about. in re http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-04-2015#1114812
assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 23:15:21; *: ben_vulpes rolls eyes
mircea_popescu: "And, as everyone knows, the best way to get amazing results is to set arbitrary goals without any basis for believing they can be reached. So I set out to search faster than grep by thirty percent." << damned straight. it's exactly how i manage. especially those... contractually obligated, shall we say.
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7739 @ 0.00028444 = 2.2013 BTC [-]
chetty: And my girlfriend too, who's contractually obligated to pay attention to everything I say./// that is so sad
Adlai: mircea_popescu: what?
assbot: Yahoo! Chat - A Eulogy ... ( http://bit.ly/1JApwnR )
mircea_popescu: chetty hey, attention is scarce!
mircea_popescu: Adlai random link in log.
Adlai doesn't need to watch youtube, that shit goes down all around all year long
mircea_popescu: must suck to live in a rural area.
Adlai: bahaha "may the bits of your hard disk be sorted by value"
mircea_popescu: that yahoo thing tho... this is EXACTLY what yahoo was. even had to ban "shit" and "shithead" separately.
assbot: Go Bloviations (Optional Reading) ... ( http://bit.ly/1JAq5Oz )
Adlai: ah yes that terrible swear word, Tangobh
mircea_popescu: that's prolly put i nthere special for shooting down ben_vulpes dating attempts in kindergarten.
mircea_popescu: "Put another way, grep sells out its worst case (lots of partial matches) to make the best case (few partial matches) go faster. How treacherous! As this realization dawns on me, the room seemed to grow dim and slip sideways. I look up at the Ultimate Unix Geek, spinning slowly in his padded chair, and I hear his cackle "old age and treachery...", and in his flickering CRT there is a face reflected, but it's my ex girl
mircea_popescu: friend, and the last thing I see before I black out is a patch of yellow cheese powder inside her long tangled beard."
mircea_popescu: epic. i didn't evne know anyone knew :D
mircea_popescu: anyway, not that any of the retards involved in such considerations have the skill or werewithal to get it, but : this is a fine example of privilege in computing.
mircea_popescu: how did "worst case" interest group get to lose 70% so that "best case" interest group can gain 6% ? clearly this was enforced by an opressive, chauvinistic patriarchy which, to bother an irigarayism, "favours the speed of light over other speeds that are much more important to us".
mircea_popescu: and the case of optimized grep is the first and the last word on the matter of "you can not have democratic computing anymore than democratic anything else in this world. it's either good or democratic, pick one."
mircea_popescu: fact remains that raping the poor raw so that the rich can have it slightly better is not only the traditional way to do things back when things were still being done, but actually ~the correct way~.
mircea_popescu: and here comes the doozy : the correct way ~for everyone~!
mircea_popescu: grep is ~overall~ faster for this optimization, or in other words : the downtrodden are downtrodden for a reason. step on their faces!
asciilifeform notices that mircea_popescu is approaching own level of 'software must die'
mircea_popescu: no, not software. if i wake up to find that slavegirl shat the bed, i'm not going "shit must die"
mircea_popescu: i'm going "you're on the cross young lady!"
mircea_popescu: and you dun wanna be on the cross.
asciilifeform: does this actually happen ?
mircea_popescu: the shitting ?
mircea_popescu: the excruciation however, yes. i think you even saw one of the crosses.
asciilifeform: yeah i couldn't help but wonder if some hobby of slavegirls renders them anally incontinent
asciilifeform: as for the whipping posts, those are sop
mircea_popescu: eh that's a myth. anal sex helps continence, doth not reduce it.
davout: asciilifeform: gross
davout: can't unthink
davout: "some hobby of slavegirls renders them anally incontinent"
mircea_popescu: actually... some hobby of WIVES doth render them anally incontinent
davout: do elaborate
mircea_popescu: but it's brief and blessfully resolves in the hospital.
davout: ah
davout: ic
mircea_popescu: most kids are born with shit in their eyes.
mircea_popescu: davout is all "wtf this doesn't exist. oh THAT. myeah ok, it exists."
mircea_popescu: apparently you CAN unthink ? :D
davout: heh, already heard about it, although thankfully that's not something i've witnessed
asciilifeform: iirc at one point it was fashionable to give the mothers enemas
mircea_popescu: welcome to beartraps & caltrops day on bitcoin-assets. i'll be your lovely host, with the mostly incontinent Sharon Cohen serving as my co-something or the other.
mircea_popescu: or at least, until hse takes a down to the knee.
mircea_popescu: Adlai btw, is ariel sharon totally a girl's name only to my ear ? or is it kinda lulzy in teh medinat too ?
asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> the problem here is that we're regressing to the past (srsly, the varnish adventure is so reminiscent of "dos utilities" scene it bleeds) but with much more powerful tools and with much more societal dependency on them. << lamport's article on brokenness+helplessness leading to return to 'voodoo' methods (electronic homeopathy, sympathetic magic, all the way to prayer healing)
mircea_popescu has witnessed prayer healing in student quarters.
asciilifeform: works (as other placebocin) on people much better than on machines.
mircea_popescu: "omaigawd i have to finish this by tomorrow because i had three weeks to do it but i was busy until tonight!!111"
Adlai: more common as a girl's name, but it's found as both
mircea_popescu: Adlai but i mean... is it lulzy ?
mircea_popescu: or notrly observable
Adlai: i'd say it's lulzier that the guy just has two first names
Adlai: never trust a man with no last name
mircea_popescu: this, btw, is a sign of being a gypsy in romania
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8500 @ 0.00029134 = 2.4764 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: <Adlai> never trust a man with no last name << there's a fella in '80s theoretical comp sci, worked on parallel systems iirc, who was known as simply 'arvind'
mircea_popescu: (mostly through historical accident : gypsy women used as whores throughout middle ages, ended up with kids without actual parentage, got "soft" father's name as it were)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i thought modern gypsy has a euro-style plausible first+last for camouflage
mircea_popescu: i have nfi what modern gypsy even is.
mircea_popescu: like modern homosexual.
asciilifeform: sovietized ?
mircea_popescu: mmm... no, colonized. invaded by the tumbler, twitter etc hordes.
asciilifeform: (or prevented from migrating and living with pigs by some other demented ruler)
mircea_popescu: you know, like computing.
asciilifeform: not that computing wasn't invaded, but this is rather like the popular ru explanation for fall of ussr
asciilifeform: 'cia saboteurs'
Adlai: "Arvind Mithal (usually referred to as just Arvind)" well we solved that mystery
asciilifeform: Adlai is a winner
mircea_popescu: i knew there was a reason i liked him
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's not saboteurs, it's kids looking for a special identity.
mircea_popescu: "it's not a bullet, it's fumaric acid"
asciilifeform: i'm fairly convinced that these were and are an opportunistic infection
asciilifeform: computing collapsed under own weight.
mircea_popescu: "can i please have the bullet then ?" "uhhh... but we don't make those anymore ? too expensive."
mircea_popescu: nah, imo it's septicemia not aids.
HeySteve: hola
HeySteve: haven't been here for ages, how is everyone?
assbot: Logged on 14-04-2015 14:26:51; *: mats is busy working through "The Misbehavior of Markets"
HeySteve: mircea_popescu, do you have an opinion on Uruguay as a place to live?
mircea_popescu: not terribru
Adlai: "Taaki and his sister once broke into an old hotel, stole the bibles from every room, doused them with cleaning fluid, set them on fire, and threw them down a well to see how deep it went. For that, their father never punished them."
mircea_popescu: mmmmmkay ?
Adlai: this is quite a bizarre level of mischief
HeySteve: the homeless hacker
assbot: Beauty Of Sex ... ( http://bit.ly/1beha6h )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6897 @ 0.00029068 = 2.0048 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1bejYjS )
scoopbot_revived: News! The downtrodden are downtrodden for a reason. Step on their faces! URL: http://trilema.com/2015/the-downtrodden-are-downtrodden-for-a-reason-step-on-their-faces/
assbot: The downtrodden are downtrodden for a reason. Step on their faces! on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1bekiPw )
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla might be an idea if assbot ignores scoopbot_revived
kakobrekla: i thought they would be friends but ok
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel "why are the holes not marked or filled?" << ftr this is not what i was contemplating. what I was contemplating is, why the fuck don't defaults pop up. bring back the fucking paperclip, put it the ONE place where it makes fucking sense. "hey john, I see you changed FuckOff() from bool to int. This function is called 82 places in 22 files. Would you like me to a) check all places where it's called and rep
mircea_popescu: ort what I can figure out about the context ? b) iterate you through all locations ? c) change it back ? d) run a trace see what happens ?"
mircea_popescu: the computer's job is NOT to be the fucking master, and make its own decisions a la windows. the computer's job is NOT to be a solipsistic retarded geek and just do its own thing like anal children do.
mircea_popescu: the computer's job is to be a most humbly abject slave, perpetually and consumatedly on its knees following you around, with the dedication and unwavering insistence no dog can summon.
Adlai: aha, the good old C-c C-w C-c
mircea_popescu: Adlai yeah, for that matter emacs does something very close to this, bar one fatal fucking flaw : pull. it should really be push.
mircea_popescu: i don't need to fucking remember to ask it. i can walk away from the terminal if i need some space.
mircea_popescu: i want it to complain to the dev about every.single.problem. EVERY SINGLE PROBLEM. and it must be as a fucking clickbox, in his face.
mircea_popescu: none of this "i'll fix the details later, i'm in the middle of doing sexy work now". fuck you and fuck your "ideas".
mircea_popescu: last time anyone "in computing" had an idea the year prefix was still 1.
davout: mircea_popescu kakobrekla mebbe make scoopbot_revived not mention the title and let assbot handle it?
Adlai isn't sure there was a year prefix in those days
mircea_popescu: just dump teh link ?
mircea_popescu: eh, let it be decentralized.
davout: mircea_popescu: sounds like each would do a small and simple job unix philosophy
mircea_popescu: this trivial problem just blew my stack.
mircea_popescu: i confess i have nfi which is the correct approach.
davout: sounds better to remove code from scoopbot rather than add some conditional logic to assbot
mircea_popescu steps away slowly and in terror, letting the parties involved decide.
kakobrekla: the thing is that fucking conditional code is already in place as well
kakobrekla: for some other bots
davout: just my two cents
mircea_popescu: i would definitely read the essay discussing the merits of either side. i just realised i actually don't grok this shit.
Adlai: seems parsimonious that in a channel where a bot announces link titles, there's no need to supply them yourself
davout: because then what happens when scoopbot_revived is replaced by scoopbot_x or whatever
kakobrekla: davout you mean again
mircea_popescu: what happens if assbot dies ? we must lose scoopbot titling too ?
davout: assbot never diez
mircea_popescu: decentralisation contrary to parsimony
mircea_popescu: fancy that.
davout: i'm really too lazy to argue further, i just tend to remove code instead of adding more whenever i can get what i want either of those ways
mircea_popescu: no, i can definitely see your point.
mircea_popescu: what bothers me is that i see no way to either dismiss it, or pick it.
davout: my point?
mircea_popescu: "take it out of scoopbot instead"
davout: I KNOW! LET'S REWRITE SCOOPBOT IN COMMON LISP!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11100 @ 0.00029619 = 3.2877 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel "Why isn't there grammer/spellchecking for my comments? " << this i can readily answer. because I am what's called "a creator of language", which is to say one of those people who, through his usage, ENACTS the rules all amateur users of language MUST follow, as a mark of their linguistic inferiority. like fucking shakespeare.
mircea_popescu: and consequently the notion of "spellchecker" is undefined for me.
mircea_popescu: it has nothing to check against, i gotta do it by hand.
mircea_popescu: (and yes editors, which trilema doth employ, send the corrections with "did you mean to X" half the fucking time)
davout: ;;calc 70138217/25000
gribble: 2805.52868
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10234 @ 0.00029627 = 3.032 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115386 << dawg, go make a web server i can use, who's keeping you!!11
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:30:19; gabriel_laddel: Just trying to point MP at something
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115395 << fancy that! and i spent eight hours massaging apache and varnish into wortking together, only to discover that about 10% of the time, IP fields were reliably replaced with random data form the session.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:33:47; gabriel_laddel: I'll note that I wrote a prototype for the RPC described above - ran into an issue with TCP or the library I was using it from. Messages were disappearing in flight.
mircea_popescu: we're like brothers off the same mother over here. and check out how variant the fathers!
mircea_popescu: i suppose we should go beat her up, stupid fucking whore.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:35:59; gabriel_laddel: Portage has a USE flag (what is that? Idk, some nonsense abstraction) for docs so you can tell it to build all docs, but it gets caught in cyclic dependencies atm.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12400 @ 0.00029677 = 3.6799 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> the computer's job is NOT to be the fucking master, and make its own decisions a la windows. the computer's job is NOT to be a solipsistic retarded geek and just do its own thing like anal children do ... the computer's job is to be a most humbly abject slave, perpetually and consumatedly on its knees following you around, with the dedication and unwavering insistence no dog can summon << obligatory http://ww
asciilifeform: w.loper-os.org/?p=284
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115422 << this, i will point out, is in no way related to any inherent property of either (unless you mean lisp is inherently going to fail), but simply a function of context. had the linux kernel been implemented in sclb, and had the past 20 years been spent with scbl being "the cool language", you'd be having zhe pronouns and assorted idiocy to the tune of > 10 mn lines
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:42:58; gabriel_laddel: ~398k LoC vs. >14 million
mircea_popescu: in scbl, and c would be what c was in the 70s. ie, coupla hundred k's.
asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> it has nothing to check against, i gotta do it by hand. << you can edit the dict you know
mircea_popescu: except my usage is np
mircea_popescu: there isn't a way to write a program that can import a dict and fix my grammar.
asciilifeform: grammar no
mircea_popescu: and if I write the dict, there isn't a way to write a program that can import it at all.
asciilifeform: orthograph yes
mircea_popescu: trilema is filled with examples : i spell this the french way this time for stylistic reasons. what now ?
mircea_popescu: what do you do if i say differance once ?
asciilifeform: limited use case for orthograph checker - pick up turds that are solely from finger slippage
mircea_popescu: this spellchecker underlines it. nevertheless... différance
mircea_popescu: but that does not actually do the job does it.
asciilifeform confesses to being largely innocent of auto language checking paraphernalia
asciilifeform uses own meat
mircea_popescu: metoo. but i also know why.
mircea_popescu: deliberately innocent.
asciilifeform: well yes deliberately
asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> ... and had the past 20 years been spent with scbl being "the cool language", you'd be having zhe pronouns and assorted idiocy to the tune of > 10 mn lines << the whole 'k00l d00dz' phenomenon begins from broken systems, though there is a feedback loop
asciilifeform: when there is -nothing- for an idiot kid to do - the damage isn't done.
assbot: What the WoT is for, how it works and how to use it. on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ink4TS )
asciilifeform: but when there is plethora of loose ends and misfeatures - plenty
mircea_popescu: the incentives are badly alligned, and the habit of beating children (a subcase of, oppressing the oppressed FOR THE REASON that they're already oppressed) went out
mircea_popescu: but THIS is what the utility of that ancient "horror' and "unexplainable ancient cruelty" was : it kept this very significant problem of badly alligned incentives in check.
asciilifeform: as pictured in, e.g., mircea_popescu's article 'art of punishment' (ro?)
mircea_popescu: i think i translated it.
mircea_popescu: in any case : the mechanism im contemplating is this
mircea_popescu: a) idiot interacts with system ; b) idiot forms malformed internal representation of system ; c) sane person has no incentive to fix b) ; d) system evolves ~always~ to match its representations.
mircea_popescu: this is unresolvable, except if one actually and deliberately enacts the positive feedback loop of "torture those in pain, beat those with welts on their body" etc.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu forgot e) sane person adds kludge to enable some semblance of civilization to function, creating schizoid split and opening would that bleeds complexity
asciilifeform: *opening wound
mircea_popescu: if this mechanism is correct, then it follows that yes, the only reason gabriel_laddel thinks much of scbl is that no one else does.
mircea_popescu: much like how this place is readable PRECISELY because it's not facebook or w/e.
mircea_popescu: which has been an early theoretical proposition which we've so far been verifying.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6303 @ 0.00029781 = 1.8771 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: in any case, it is perfectly wrong to imagine scbl has the magical quality of magical quality (and then move on once the horde shows it trivially breaks). for one thing, c was a very intellectually respectable thing, back when i was a kid.
mircea_popescu: of course, that was before C#
jurov: yea, it was respectable when compiler was less clever than programmer
mircea_popescu: i wonder if that's what it was.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform load average: 0.00, 0.01, 0.01 << what sort of great moment is this!
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> [13:23] that's prolly put i nthere special for shooting down ben_vulpes dating attempts in kindergarten. << i dun get it
mircea_popescu: tango ? yahoo chat ? 80s ?
ben_vulpes: nope still not computing
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: great moment shall come on me lunch break.
mircea_popescu: the string "tango" was for ununderstood reasons banned on a very popular (among the females) chat application of the 80s, at a time you'rew supposed to have been in kindergarten.
asciilifeform promises to wake up mircea_popescu for great moment(tm)
mircea_popescu: it is humorously posited that this is the very explanation : they were trying to crimp your style specifically.
mircea_popescu: "you're supposed to have been", jesus who the fuck came up with english grammar. "o i know, we'll save on predicative modes!!1"
ben_vulpes: finding tango partners online is like 1/1000000th as good a use of time as finding bdsm partners
mircea_popescu: everything worked better on yahoo chat
mircea_popescu: heck, even md5!
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> [00:54] how the everliving fuck is cpanel used with anything other than php/static wwwtron << fwiw asciilifeform i went through a very similar saga on a very similar popescuian box. i just thought that "this was how things were supposed to be" and labored in silence.
mircea_popescu: didja get anywhere ?
ben_vulpes: probably how you derp around the machine shop
ben_vulpes: yeah, the thing ran, and well if you recall.
mircea_popescu: aha. well that puts you ahead of alf :D
mircea_popescu: at any rate, THIS is why i ask people "well, can you do it on a cpanel box" well before.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115501 << this distinction only exists as a manifestation of the speaker's cluelessness, otherwise military logic is perfectly logical.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:01:08; *: Adlai always found "business logic" reminiscent of "military logic" in the necessity of distinguishing it from plain simple old "logic"
mircea_popescu: in the c way of logic.
mircea_popescu: ie, "you go design a better army and a better war over there with your wooden horse, toy sword and military costume, while we're gonna beat these assholes over here"
mircea_popescu: paulgraham.com fucking autoreloads itself wtf spammy idiocy is this.
mircea_popescu: "Confirmation can be tricky depending on what you mean by it. It’s trivially true but most people understand it to be interrupting confirmation. Which is egregiously … reprehensible. Despicable even."
mircea_popescu: ahahaha.
mircea_popescu: fuck you and click the boxen, "creative" boi
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7500 @ 0.00029923 = 2.2442 BTC [+]
davout: mircea_popescu: s/différance/différence/
mircea_popescu: that being, amusingly enough, exactly the point.
davout: ah that was on purpose frenchified english
mircea_popescu: mno. it works in french too.
mircea_popescu: the reason "différance" exists is (in the context of our discussion) exactly to show that the spellchecker problem is np
davout: from what I find it's a neologism from jacques derrida
mircea_popescu: it's a production of derrida working on husserl, yes.
mircea_popescu: (this may be a polichinelle's secret for which everyone here just happens to be polichinelle, but : the history of discussion, problems and criticism of languages as approached by IT types almost exactly mirrors a very similar effort in teh humanities)
mircea_popescu: that either side is generally ignorant of the equivalencies is nothing short of hysterical, but hey. "specialisation drives performance", i'm told.
assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1dsYrWg )
mats: special appearance by brendafdez
BingoBoingo: "The hardest part was often reaching Fernández and Castiglione. “I had to call Brenda four times today,” she said with a smile." << lol
mod6: asciilifeform: I'm just trying to put together the monthy address; In one to three sentences cna you help me summarize what is going on with glibc/libnss?
mod6: !up asciilifeform
mod6: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: danke mod6
mod6: np
jurov: mod6 i can explain, too. to support different configurations for DNS/users/whatever resolving without glibc recompilation and without interprocess communication
jurov: the libnss was done as binary plugin to glibc
jurov: and whole mechanism is non-optional
mod6: ok maybe that's the part I was missing - how libnss is somehow tied to glibc.
jurov: thus truly statical compilation of glibc is impossbile
mod6: so libnss is dynamically compiled and built/linked to glibc, and can not be avoided?
ascii_field: !s libnss
assbot: 7 results for 'libnss' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=libnss
jurov: (and btw, it's different from mozilla's libnss)
mircea_popescu: ~whether one even uses libnss or not~!
ascii_field: or is log still b0rk3d
ascii_field: and no, nothing to do with the mozilla one
mod6: it's not broke from the web-perspective. i've just read so much stuff that I've confused myself.
jurov: iirc alf avoided it somehow, while throwing out all DNS stuff, too
mod6: is that releated to his patch that removes the dns stuff?
ascii_field: jurov: the dependency vanishes if you remove -all- instances of host lookup
ascii_field: the patch, note, did not remove all (there is a 'what is my ip' thing in there )
ascii_field: note, written prior to the discovery of the libnss thing
mod6: ok, so that helps us going forward then.
mod6: yup, noted.
mod6: we were on track at that point to try to cut a milestone. but just about that time is when we hit the tx validation problem in 168`000 ; I think your patch just got lost in the shuffle.
mod6: :/
mod6: Anyway, going forward, we've got something to work around this issue. So, thanks for that.
mod6: <+ascii_field> the patch, note, did not remove all (there is a 'what is my ip' thing in there ) << ah, i recall. ok and this is what initiated the conversation about SHA256 addy's as opposd to dotted quads right?
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> ~whether one even uses libnss or not~! << so even if we didn't even call "whatsMyIP()" or w/e it is, this would still be a dingleberry attached to glibc.
mod6: ?
mod6: Anyway, thanks guise. I think that helps me clear a few things up.
ascii_field: mod6: go build 'helloworld' and see if it stays depended
ascii_field: (it doesn't)
mircea_popescu: mod6 what i mean is, for as long as you use any sort of function touched, whether you yourself use any of the libnss "functionality" or not, its gonna be there
ascii_field: mircea_popescu has it
mod6: ok got it.
mircea_popescu: you can't go "oh i don't use libnss anyway". you probably are.
mod6: <+jurov> the libnss was done as binary plugin to glibc << so there is no possible way to just build glibc by hand and not include libnss? or there are basically so many things that use libnss that even if you did, stuff wouldn't work anyway?
jurov: i haven't explored it to that depth
mircea_popescu: mod6 building glibcc "by hand" is not the trivial taks you make it out.
mircea_popescu: piles of crud in there.
assbot: The Fetlife Meatlist - Volume VII on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtdHCF )
mod6: im sure it's not. just was sort of thinking about it in some context of "roll your own environment"
mircea_popescu: yeah but then you end up with something that works for you
mircea_popescu: and then... x person says this doesn't work. what now ?
mod6: and only on your machine.
mod6: ok right.
mircea_popescu: i mean i am all for a cannonical b-a stack
mod6: since this discussion, im gonna go back and re-read these logs.
mircea_popescu: but it can't be started from the glibc i don't think. that's the middle.
mod6: sure.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115595 << is your complaint the lack of koolaid in this place ?!
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:33:16; gabriel_laddel: I'm simply of the opinion that our current platform (irc) is too barbaric and doesn't force enough shared context upon us to do anything interesting. Any sort of shared vision or whatever gets watered down into discussions like the above.
mircea_popescu: there's a balance to be had between "shared context" and "mass hysteria". a meeting of autonomous minds is one of the very best ways to achieve that balance.
mircea_popescu: barbaric, perhaps, but kingly for sure, this irc.
mircea_popescu: so love thy cycles, for they are a supreme good.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115605 << because you don't have a blog. get a blog.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:36:13; gabriel_laddel: why?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28411 @ 0.00029941 = 8.5065 BTC [+] {3}
mod6: !up ascii_field
mod6: haha, is that a reverse-stocks of somesort?
mircea_popescu: well... plenty of subjects are actually rather cooperative, which makes the instruments more... ergonomic.
mod6: ah, i see.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:38:32; gabriel_laddel: "I need the ability to publish a unit of research as an interactive program containing all information used to draw my conclusions. It shall be entirely and trivially modifiable, extensible, and if reproducing the research is possible on this machine, running the program shall be a single click or procedure call away. WYSIWYG tools shall be included and fashioned from the precepts of geometry. Thus,
mircea_popescu: this is EXACTLY what a blog is.
trinque: I was drunk enough to deal with him at the time :D
trinque: mircea_popescu: yes html does sort of what he's talking about
mircea_popescu: not "html". blogs specifically.
mircea_popescu: i have the fucking body of research all published, which is why i can always link
trinque: indeed
mircea_popescu: he's sitting over there going "hmm.... i would need something like a tube... but with fins on it... yeah that's right, two large fins..."
mircea_popescu: derp. ITS CALLED A PLANE!
trinque: this is the guy working on a distro?
mircea_popescu: why not ?
trinque: "tits or gtfo" as far as that goes
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9200 @ 0.00029732 = 2.7353 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: obviously what's blinding him to this is the expectations that machines could process it. this trivially can never be the case.
mircea_popescu: "Attend our Remote coding school for as little as $2,780." omfg wtf.
assbot: Eurex - Euro-Bund Futures ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgQl8g )
mats: euro debt having a bad day
assbot: Eurex - Euro-Bobl Futures ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgQvfG )
mircea_popescu: "The studious will note that this is a completely solved problem that no machine learning algorithm will be able to approximate anytime soon." i'm sorry...what ? solved how ?
mircea_popescu: and why the fuck am i referencing pastebins.
mircea_popescu: mats yeh eurozone is benefiting from "russian sanctions"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 1000 @ 0.0016007 = 1.6007 BTC [-]
mats: got ma popcorn ready
mircea_popescu: " When the "people" of earth finally get the message that brainpower is the limiting regent in life they'll soon start to change their tune - or find themselves living in a ~leper colony/africa." << this is not how things work
mircea_popescu: "when water stops being wet it'll suddenly seek dryness". sure. wut ?
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:40:59; assbot: DNA/Frank The Vandal ... ( http://bit.ly/1zcsgnS )
vhost-: Adlai: haha
mircea_popescu 's dislike of Douglas Adams slowly solidifies.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6000 @ 0.0002962 = 1.7772 BTC [-]
williamdunne: ;;later tell kakobrekla would it be possible for w.b-a.link/some/parameters to return valid JSON?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 10:25:18; punkman: also, cab driver: "check out the hottie over there" *honks* "oh shit that was my cousin. damn she lost a lot of weight"
mircea_popescu: # history | grep -c "reboot"
mircea_popescu: check out the windows developer over here.
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: motherfucking rc.local doesn't run on boot in this ver of rathead
mircea_popescu: must be the cpanel.
ascii_field: lsdpanel
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3629 @ 0.00029631 = 1.0753 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 1000 @ 0.00169179 = 1.6918 BTC [+] {9}
assbot: WordPress Zero Day Vulnerability - Hacking Dude Hacking Dude ... ( http://bit.ly/1P76N1H )
jurov: williamdunne: you mean w.b-a.link/trust/some/else/json? yes that could return {} instead of "no data"
williamdunne: jurov: Yeah that'd work perfectly
williamdunne: Basically some way to get json on the trust between two people
trinque: ascii_field: ouch
jurov: williamdunne: but in cases where ther is data, it works
williamdunne: Oh wow
williamdunne: Missed that one
williamdunne: !up scooptest
assbot: Scoop Test — Lego Under the Giant's Feet ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtBkLw )
williamdunne: !up scooptest
danielpbarron: !up mhagelstrom
scooptest: The Fetlife Meatlist - Volume VII http://trilema.com/feed/rss/
scooptest: The downtrodden are downtrodden for a reason. Step on their faces! http://trilema.com/feed/rss/
mircea_popescu: "The vulnerability affects the WordPress versions 3.9.3, 4.1.1, 4.1.2, and the latest WordPress version 4.2."
scooptest: The sad story of me sniffing varnish http://trilema.com/feed/rss/
mircea_popescu: 2.x immune.
williamdunne: Welp, thats not ideal
mircea_popescu: "Moreover, Pynnonen reported the vulnerability to the WordPress team but they “refused all communication attempts” he made since November 2014." heh
assbot: Fox 10 And Friends - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtCCWD )
mircea_popescu: "no ddos possible
ascii_field: l0l guess who else isn't affected.
ascii_field: (for same reason as mircea_popescu)
mircea_popescu: mmmyeah.
mhagelstrom: I guess I can talk now
mircea_popescu: see, the exact thing happening in bitcoin, where the power rangers fell off the curve, happened long ago to wordpress.
mircea_popescu: the notion that their "latest" is used or relevant is teh lulz.
mircea_popescu: mhagelstrom and who might you be ?
jurov: !up ascii_field
scoopbot_revived: News! Tsinghua University Creates a "Digital Assets Research Initiative" URL: http://qntra.net/2015/04/tsinghua-university-creates-a-digital-assets-research-initiative/
assbot: Tsinghua University Creates a "Digital Assets Research Initiative" | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtDSJk )
mircea_popescu: mhagelstrom PGP: 548A 84F8 60CF E0AB EA11 A2BA 4D34 0126 F402 0636 ?
davout: BingoBoingo: s/heals/heels/
mhagelstrom: mircea_popescu yes that is me
mircea_popescu: aite, go register it with assbot
BingoBoingo: dammit, fxd
mhagelstrom: mircea_popescu that is my public key
assbot: El misterio de una chica que estuvo 16 horas desaparecida ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtGI0W )
mircea_popescu: ascii_field load average: 0.40, 0.54, 0.30 what speed is that ?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu has nothing better to do ?
mircea_popescu: shuddup i'm sysadmining :D
mircea_popescu is really curious what gcd over rsa keys actually looks like in terms of resource consumption.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu is also invited to read the src
ascii_field: which happens to be sitting there
mircea_popescu: apparently i just got rebooted outta da box!
ascii_field presently trying to discover why the fucker runs from anywhere -other- than crontab
mircea_popescu: anyway, off to eat, will flyplow with this more later.
ascii_field: and 'internal server error' otherwise
ascii_field thinks he discovered reason
ascii_field: when phuctor coldboots it regens the product over the moduli
ascii_field: (which is kept in ram at all times)
ascii_field: this locks db
ascii_field: or hm, apparently not
ascii_field discovers that he was not this retarded when having written the thing
mircea_popescu: you know ~why~ it's kinda exciting to watch this, right ?
ascii_field: found idiocy, will describe later if anyone gives a shit
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4550 @ 0.00030068 = 1.3681 BTC [+]
davout: scoopbot_revived: totally news yo
mod6: heheh
davout doesn't quite get why ascii_field is so deep in cpanhell
mod6: did they hassle you about the meat?
ascii_field: davout: was
davout: mod6: nope, should have brought moar back
mod6: nice
davout: ascii_field: so you're done or you switched to something else?
ascii_field: davout: mircea_popescu had the box decrufted
ascii_field: davout: just now i took a moment to set up on that box, and ran into a few boojums
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
jurov: not so long ago, i have found alf a box, he declined. now he has to take whetever there is.
ascii_field: jurov wanted me to pay money, l0l
mircea_popescu: omfg its a great box what!
jurov: s.nsa is not your money
ascii_field: jurov: i don't deal in monotonic guaranteed trips to penury
mats: lol
mats: such drama
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7409 @ 0.00030068 = 2.2277 BTC [-]
ascii_field: anyway it works...
jurov: i invested 100BTC into s.nsa.. to see penury mentioned in relation to ordinary business expenses?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: i haven't moved the domain yet
mircea_popescu: jurov he really doesnt wanna spend moneyz.
jurov: i'm at loss of words.
ascii_field: jurov: i'll refresh memory for ancient thread. mircea_popescu has it - i refuse to add recurring expenses when there is no revenue.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field i meant just the churning, is it going ?
ascii_field: this is what 'monotonic trip to the basement' means
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: it will churn if you submit a new key or req retest of an existing key
assbot: Scoop Testr — Lego Under the Giant's Feet ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtNC6t )
ascii_field: as specced
mircea_popescu: jurov i can see it, can't go out of business by not spending.
jurov: so shut up and eat cpanel
mircea_popescu: it;s just a plain centos dood.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8697 @ 0.00029613 = 2.5754 BTC [-]
ascii_field: jurov: l0l that was last night's thing. today we have normal box. which i just finished setting up.
ascii_field: correctly.
mircea_popescu: i'll go through the correct centos and poke fun at engineer later.
ascii_field: anyway it works. time to move the dns
jurov: williamdunne: scoopbot_revived is not cloaked
williamdunne: jurov: Never has been
mircea_popescu: williamdunne yo ugettingflooded ?
williamdunne: Nope, not yet anyway
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: dns switched over, will propagate eventually
ascii_field: happy phuctoring, fellas.
mircea_popescu: so mebbe i dun understand something, but wasn't it going to process the however many gb archive ?
jurov: what was the url?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: when i pump it in!
mircea_popescu: o you plan todo over http ?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: yes, as a kind of torture test. anyone should be able to do this
ascii_field: without talking to me
mircea_popescu: i imagined it's just gonna get done locally for expediency. but hey, tests are great.
ascii_field: i'm about to switch off the old one
mircea_popescu: anyway, THATs why i kept asking.
ascii_field: aaaaahahahaha
mircea_popescu: well... that and ... other reasons.
ascii_field: woah 535 day uptime.
assbot: Submit a GPG Public Key | Phuctor ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwS1g5 )
ascii_field: except not propagated yet
jurov: i see archive.today (195.211.154.159), that's the old one?
mircea_popescu: ;; ANSWER SECTION:
mircea_popescu: nosuchlabs.com.1800INA195.211.154.159
gribble: Error: "ANSWER" is not a valid command.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6676 @ 0.00029616 = 1.9772 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: welcome to the year not being 2005 anymore, ya know ?
mircea_popescu: dns propagation's a minute nowadays.
ascii_field: l0l wut
ascii_field prepares voodoo curse for 'namecheap'
jurov: heh
mircea_popescu: yeah srsly someone should make a decent registrar
mircea_popescu: o wait, we're obsoleting dns huh. nm.
mod6: :]
ascii_field: 'decent registrar' is like 'decent gasenwagen'
ascii_field: existing ones are 'decent' from perspective of usg et al.
jurov: just compile namecoin into libnss.so :DDDD
mircea_popescu: is .fuck taken anyway ? or .cunt ?
mircea_popescu: Submissions: 3930 Known Moduli: 6642
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: propagated on your end?
ascii_field: over here - no
mircea_popescu: ascii_field Click here (big!) << could be replaced with Click here (28588 digits) ?
mircea_popescu: ascii_field yes, its what i said above. and you're probably just caching locally.
mircea_popescu: dump the cache it'll respond correctly.
jurov: http://nosuchlabs.com/static/prod.txt would deserve some spiffy visualization...any mathematician with idea?
mircea_popescu: ya srsly.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: if you're reading the thing, you will notice there are two processes (one which actually does the work, 'werker'.)
ascii_field: finally propagated here
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15175 @ 0.00029562 = 4.486 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: well im sitting on top, so.
mircea_popescu: all ready over here :D
ascii_field: aha worx
ascii_field: next when i get a moment i'ma cook up a proper jinxed keypair
mircea_popescu: just dump the db in plox
ascii_field: because the 'under construction' thing is disgraceful
ascii_field: and naturally will dump db in
mircea_popescu: i wanna see if this'll actually work practically or not for the purpose.
mircea_popescu: Error: Was that really a GPG public key? Try again.
ascii_field: lol wut
mircea_popescu: ascii_field doesn't seem to work
ascii_field: dpaste plz
assbot: Public Key Server -- Get "0x454b0fc0bc07b87e " ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwWTSj )
assbot: Public Key Server -- Get "0x59c93f63549036bd " ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwWXkX )
mircea_popescu: must be teh cpanel
cazalla: anyone know what's going on here - http://dpaste.com/3D4ZXZR.txt
trinque: bad disk?
mircea_popescu: cazalla bad index
mircea_popescu: looks like typical bitcoind that was shut down suddenly
cazalla: been running fine for a while but now, same problems i had a few months back :\
assbot: ChainState DB uncorrupted itself · Issue #2785 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwXrHN )
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: some serious strange. those keys work on my local box's phuctor, identical sourceball
mircea_popescu: ascii_field prolly http posting fuckx them up
ascii_field: likewise http
ascii_field: running copy of the thing locally
mircea_popescu: differnet http stacks eh. you running centos locally ?
ascii_field: course not
mircea_popescu: what, you expect things to just work ?
mircea_popescu: the internet's not a truck, where yo ucan just dump stuff you know!
ascii_field begins to drool, like the flea-bitten characters in film 'city of lost children'
assbot: File:Series of Tubes - Senator Ted Stevens.ogg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwY5oI )
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: it doesn't eat any key, lol
ascii_field: motherfuckers.
mircea_popescu: yep won't even see mine
mircea_popescu: tho it's in db
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo what is that ?
mircea_popescu: ascii_field maybe if i install varnish ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: He's flipping the ball into the stands for the fans... Who aren't there because Baltimore, playing the game with an empty stadium because riots
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: l0l!
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo so this is by now completely insane.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: It truly is. Guy's probably just flipping the ball into the stands out of habit, but seriously in the middle of the day they can't have spectators because... riots?
BingoBoingo: Not actual riots, but just the fear of riots
assbot: The BDSM version of Facebook is under attack for ignoring women's safety concerns ... ( http://bit.ly/1ERUR4h )
ascii_field: 'zero length field name in format'
mircea_popescu: !rate Alana Massey -10 stupid whore.
assbot: Alana is not registered in WoT.
ascii_field: pythonism
ascii_field: incompatibility b/w 2.7 and 2.6
assbot: Life isn’t Gaussian. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwZY4K )
lobbes: !up_ascii_field
lobbes: !up ascii_field
mircea_popescu: in transgender = confused kids without supervision news, http://boards.420chan.org/cd/1.php
assbot: Transgender Discussion - 420chan ... ( http://bit.ly/1ERXEdH )
ascii_field: mircea_popescu et al: fixed.
ascii_field: ty mircea_popescu, for a very palpably faster box.
ascii_field: it is very spiffy.
mircea_popescu: shit this guy's fast
ascii_field: considering that previously, this thing wasn't even on a computer in the usual sense - this is a major step forward.
mircea_popescu: 015-04-29 15:54 (Queued, 2 Moduli Remaining - Refresh page to update.)
mircea_popescu: listen, seeing how it's using about 10% of what it could... throtle it ?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: if you read 'werker' - there is a polling knob
ascii_field: set, at present time, to 5s
ascii_field: why would we want to throttle the thing, again ?
ascii_field confused
mircea_popescu: well, there's no point in it having 2 items in queue while load is under 4 ish
assbot: dpr » udp and me ... ( http://bit.ly/1ERZVWl )
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: the way it works is that when polling interval elapses, it does everything in the queue
mircea_popescu: i guess that's spikey no ?
ascii_field: if folks were to put a million keys through this thing each day, every time a new planet with intelligent pgp-using aliens is contacted, i would probably tweak a few things, yes.
jurov: mircea prolly noticed lightbulbs dimming every 5s
ascii_field: i also love how mircea_popescu put this box in a war zone
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4755 @ 0.00028909 = 1.3746 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: gotta love those traditional wooden 'democratizers'
trinque: what is that, pepper-spray paintball?
trinque: or just paintball
ascii_field: painball
mircea_popescu: dude that police looks just like lego characters foretold.
ascii_field: the revolver-shotgun is finally out, apparently
trinque: ascii_field: rubber rounds in pic #5?
ascii_field: (pic19.jpg)
trinque: I'm not familiar with seeing cops holding those
ascii_field: the obligatory ziptie handcuffs (last photo.)
trinque: revolver shotgun likely fires tear gas canisters
assbot: Logged on 22-02-2015 19:30:55; asciilifeform: jurov: the zip tie and the effete executioner of the future are a match made in heaven. no need to watch the victim struggle, dance. zip - next.
trinque: stylish leather strap on those beatin'-sticks
ascii_field finds these scenes extra-lulzy on account of having walked on those streets
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 1000 @ 0.00180847 = 1.8085 BTC [+] {8}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 700 @ 0.0016191 = 1.1334 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: ascii_field: lol at the MRAP
jurov: !left
mircea_popescu: hm... butt should do something
ben_vulpes: !down
ben_vulpes: !down
ben_vulpes: !left
ben_vulpes: !right
assbot: Need a number of lines.
assbot: Need a number of lines.
jurov: !b 1e1000
assbot: Make it a positive integer.
BingoBoingo: !b 31337
assbot: Last 31337 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1ZP0YCV.txt )
mod6: !butt should just do like: (_8_)
mod6: or select a jpg from a random pool of hotbutts
assbot: 34 3lb Ham Slicer Vs The Wolf - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1IoA2wN )
mircea_popescu: apparently robot fights is a thing
mircea_popescu: anyone into this scene ?
mod6: ham slicer just waxed that thing
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 663 @ 0.0017814 = 1.1811 BTC [+] {8}
lobbes vaguely recalls some tv show from ~15 years ago depicting robot fights such as these
mircea_popescu: should be lots of fun now that silly-valley's come up with the police bot.
mircea_popescu: get some $5 dollar wedgers in there lol
pete_dushenski: lobbes was this 'the bots master' ? https://youtu.be/LLKYOSiW7U4
assbot: Bots Master Intro - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JTGiLm )
assbot: RC Fighting Robot Wars - Inertia XL v's Tilley's Revenge - 2013 Combat Robots UK Championships - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JTGESc )
lobbes: pete_dushenski: yes! that second one
pete_dushenski also remembers this show from childhood, watching it with brother and father.
pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115259 << i don't want to say i had anything to do with this, but...
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 03:45:05; decimation: lol http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-twitter-earns-20150429-story.html < "The company lost $162.4 million, compared with a loss of $132.4 million in the year-earlier quarter. Revenue jumped to $435.9 million from $250.5 million, but still fell far short of analysts' expectations of $463 million."
danielpbarron: it was called battle bots i think
pete_dushenski: losing my account and losing 20% of your share price just a month later? hmm, twitter, very hmm.
pete_dushenski: danielpbarron that was totally it.
pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115268 << fuck stltoday and their wapo-esque survey paywall.
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: Stahp using javascript everywhere
pete_dushenski: anyways, ferguson remains on low boil until further notice.
pete_dushenski: and reloading makes the stltoday page magically work.
pete_dushenski: because that makes sense.
pete_dushenski: "if you looks at our ads twice, we'll let you read the page once"
pete_dushenski: "or you can look at them once and fill out our survey"
pete_dushenski: "Police made at least five arrests for charges including burglary and flourishing a weapon." << flourishing! how poetic.
assbot: Sunny in Philadelphia, Mac and Dennis act British - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JTIXoh )
pete_dushenski: danielpbarron i do enjoy 'sunny'. the first 5 seasons were pretty fucking hilarious but i haven't kept up with it since then.
danielpbarron: it's one of my favorites to leave on in the background while doing other things
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11066 @ 0.00028881 = 3.196 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: Anyways the Post Dispatch was the first Pulitzer owned newspaper
pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo pulitzer winning ? how does a prize own a paper.
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: No, as in the historical person Pulitzer.
pete_dushenski: also '2015 winner' according to site
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19650 @ 0.00028754 = 5.6502 BTC [-] {2}
williamdunne: Scoop the fourth is now re-written. Will be moved to a server, rather than my laptop
williamdunne: At the moment doesn't support adding new feeds. That will come soon-ish
pete_dushenski: williamdunne want me to test it on contravex ?
williamdunne: That'd be ideal
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8350 @ 0.00028595 = 2.3877 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: scoopbot_revivied test | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1GGJLfV )
pete_dushenski: there we go.
williamdunne: Perfect
pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115874 << seems like the trilema editors should scan qntra articles too.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 14:42:28; mircea_popescu: (and yes editors, which trilema doth employ, send the corrections with "did you mean to X" half the fucking time)
pete_dushenski: i mean, a few of us here do it for fun, but surely we miss errors here and there.
williamdunne: w.b-a.link down.. lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9993 @ 0.00029333 = 2.9312 BTC [+]
pete_dushenski: hm. same here.
cazalla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115643 <<< from their website under "Strategic Advisors" Jackson Palmer and Brock Pierce lol
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 10:14:00; davout: so apparently this neucoin thing sold for 2.7kBTC worth of their, ahem, "coin"
pete_dushenski: on the plus side, they only pulled in 2700 btc, most of which was surely their own
pete_dushenski: this is down markedly from a year ago, when scams could still find 10,000+ btc
cazalla: still, not a bad effort compared to some other launches
cazalla: how much did that gems messaging app raise? BingoBoingo always goes on about it for some reason
cazalla: "hey cazalla, you should get gems yo, you earn gems for messaging"
BingoBoingo: cazalla: No idea
assbot: 58 results for 'gems' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=gems
cazalla: soz for the elbowing BingoBoingo but i saw more gems news on coinfire earlier :)
pete_dushenski: http://www.blockchainsummit.io << fuckin branson. derp harder, mate.
assbot: Block Chain Summit ... ( http://bit.ly/1GGNWZc )
pete_dushenski: just whatever you do, don't pgp up and wander in here.
pete_dushenski: because hosting nobodies on your private island is more fun!
pete_dushenski: oh look, bitgo dood, garzik, pierce, and silbert are all going.
mircea_popescu: "This post Formule de salut on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. concerning SEO provides clear thought for new SEO users that how to do Search engine optimization, therefore keep it up. Nice job
mircea_popescu: Asics sale"
cazalla: yeah, qntra has plenty of those and other variations mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: you must be good at seo.
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski errybody wannabe cartman.
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu and flirt with transgenderism!
assbot: Cartman's transgender toilet - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1GGQxCl )
mircea_popescu: i ha dno idea
pete_dushenski: season 17 or 18
pete_dushenski: newer shit.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 626 @ 0.00178791 = 1.1192 BTC [+] {8}
assbot: Pacioli ... ( http://bit.ly/1duInDJ )
Pierre_Rochard: click around, let me know if anything busts
Pierre_Rochard: (and any other feedback)
mircea_popescu: lol uncategorized everything!!11
mircea_popescu: what sort of an example are you setting for business people such as myself!@
Pierre_Rochard: haha, well, some random categorizations will be in the next iteration of the test data generation script
Pierre_Rochard: the core accounting part is stable at this point, the treasury part needs a major overhaul, and documentation / source code access will be in place before the next halving
mircea_popescu: it doesnt even say if its gaap or what
Pierre_Rochard: it’s definitely gaap at this point
Pierre_Rochard: in fact the database tables and query structures are as close to perfect accounting theory as you’ll get
Pierre_Rochard: but most of gaap is about how to book specific transactions (for example expense vs capitalize)
Pierre_Rochard: so it’s gaap if a good accountant is using pacioli, it’s some non-gaap thing otherwise
mircea_popescu: well... you see what im saying ?
Pierre_Rochard: I don’t… gaap or non-gaap depends 90% on the user, 10% on the software - the software is at 11%
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12222 @ 0.00029587 = 3.6161 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: Pierre_Rochard a large chunk of the utility here is education, seeing how a bunch of people are going to get involved in a sort of you know, de novo, revolutionary economic process.
mircea_popescu: so giving them stuff like - well documented drop lists ? huge win.
mircea_popescu: sorta funel the process of selection towards gaap/sanity
Pierre_Rochard: I see, completely agree
mircea_popescu: TON of work on yoru side
mircea_popescu: but the good sort of work, the sort that creates a barrier to entry.
Pierre_Rochard: started here, but definitely ton of work: http://rochard.org/pacioli/docs/Chart_of_Accounts
mircea_popescu: myeah. it WILL help if it leverages the power of html to literally funel people into sense.
mircea_popescu: "pick from here, then here then here".
Pierre_Rochard: that’s a great approach, I was stuck in the mindset of “I’m coding this for accountants”, rather than “I’m coding this to create accountants”
mircea_popescu: yep, you got it.
mircea_popescu: and even if the resulting "accountants" won't be very good by the way this is measured today (a "stickler" approach - great emphasis on detail)
mircea_popescu: if they have ~fundamental~ understanding as a result of interacting with your thing, you scored major points.
Pierre_Rochard: right, agreed
mircea_popescu: there's actually, how did that quote go...
mircea_popescu: "I have often felt that programming is an art form,
mircea_popescu: whose real value can only be appreciated
mircea_popescu: by another versed in the same arcane art;
mircea_popescu: there are lovely gems and brilliant coups
mircea_popescu: hidden from human view and admiration, sometimes forever,
mircea_popescu: by the very nature of the process."
mircea_popescu: applies to accounting just as well, except even fewer people know.
mircea_popescu: and i don't even mean it in the made-for-tv "tax dodge11!1!" sense.
mircea_popescu: i mean it in the bluntest "make sense of reality" sense.
Pierre_Rochard: indeed, though I think the gems will become apparent as pacioli becomes integrated with a wallet and the WoT. writing the core accounting part was necessary because of all the crufted OSS gnucash/openerp monoliths
Pierre_Rochard: the end goal is to have a currency -> payments -> accounting -> finance process that is well oiled and a joy to use
Pierre_Rochard: off to dinner
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31608 @ 0.00029841 = 9.4321 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9933 @ 0.00030179 = 2.9977 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26032 @ 0.00030474 = 7.933 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11050 @ 0.00031148 = 3.4419 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24633 @ 0.00030354 = 7.4771 BTC [-]
decimation: asciilifeform: more on ada: http://www.adacore.com/academia/universities/ < the list of us universities has a conspicuous absence of 'popular' tech schools
assbot: Universities | Academia | AdaCore ... ( http://bit.ly/1IpqUs2 )
decimation: this is a feature - not a bug - if we agree with the notion that anything that keeps the masses of cool kids away is a good thing
mircea_popescu: what'd be popular tech schools ?
mircea_popescu: like georgia tech or what
decimation: yeah, ivies, major land grant schools
decimation: there are a couple of those on the list, but mostly it's made up of small private schools and vocational schools
mircea_popescu: so more like mit ? that's notrly popular is it ?
decimation: well, mit is probably the most notable school in the list
mircea_popescu: or you mean popular as in, sought after. not as in, where commoners gather
decimation: yeah, sought after
decimation: I think mit actually has a significant percentage of high school valedictorians
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 2000 @ 0.00184061 = 3.6812 BTC [+] {14}
decimation: mircea_popescu: so have you been poking around centos or scientific linux?
decimation: I assumed based on your epel comment
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1000 @ 0.0016191 = 1.6191 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: ah, installed nginx, yeah
mircea_popescu: i guess this qualifies.
decimation: if you want something that can serve static pages https://www.unix4lyfe.org/darkhttpd/ < fits in head
mircea_popescu: nah, i run wordpress
assbot: Comments considered harmful: WordPress web hijack bug revealed • The Register ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ipu13c )
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 18:06:30; mircea_popescu: 2.x immune.
decimation: ah heh
mircea_popescu: not upgrading pays.
decimation: yes indeed. which is why most 'serious business' uses old redhat
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 700 @ 0.0016191 = 1.1334 BTC [-]
decimation: lol some guy was reading #b-a and has an anti-tcp agenda http://notcp.io/
assbot: The NoTCP Manifesto ... ( http://bit.ly/1IpwvhS )
mircea_popescu: wait, node.js is performant ?!
mircea_popescu: what is this, the future ?
mircea_popescu: "Chukka-booted footsteps" ahaha ok.
decimation: yeah I'm not sure if the guy is joking or not
mircea_popescu: hey various folks whose pgp keys i've signed at teh conference key signing party... you're supposed to also sign mine!
decimation: !up gabriel_laddel
gabriel_laddel: thank you
gabriel_laddel: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=29-04-2015#1115832 << We're discussing the same thing. If the program has "marked" all instances of $WHATEVER I can trivally add "Would you like me to a) check all places where it's called and report what I can figure out about the context ? b) iterate you through all locations ? c) change it back ? d) run a trace see what happens ?" on top of it.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 14:29:15; mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel "why are the holes not marked or filled?" << ftr this is not what i was contemplating. what I was contemplating is, why the fuck don't defaults pop up. bring back the fucking paperclip, put it the ONE place where it makes fucking sense. "hey john, I see you changed FuckOff() from bool to int. This function is called 82 places in 22 files. Would you like me to a) check all places where
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 14:31:02; Adlai: aha, the good old C-c C-w C-c
gabriel_laddel: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=29-04-2015#1115871 << If the "rules" of human language are formalized it becomes much easier to break them in interesting ways. One could use the output of a shannonizer to inform word choice for his story, enforcing that each word is followed by one of the top 10 least likely words in the whole of the language up to this point. I suspect that such a tale would be great fun to re
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 14:41:31; mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel "Why isn't there grammer/spellchecking for my comments? " << this i can readily answer. because I am what's called "a creator of language", which is to say one of those people who, through his usage, ENACTS the rules all amateur users of language MUST follow, as a mark of their linguistic inferiority. like fucking shakespeare.
gabriel_laddel: ad, as most people would immediately recoil in horror, seeing something so very different what they're used to.
gabriel_laddel: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=29-04-2015#1115889 << and I will point out that you're wrong. The simplicity of lisp vs. C is absolutely due to the inherrent properties of the respective artifacts. Seriously, MMM vs GC, parsing vs. not, no bignums vs. numerics - "abstractions push upward" (TM).
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 15:00:28; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115422 << this, i will point out, is in no way related to any inherent property of either (unless you mean lisp is inherently going to fail), but simply a function of context. had the linux kernel been implemented in sclb, and had the past 20 years been spent with scbl being "the cool language", you'd be having zhe pronouns and assorted idiocy to the tu
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 17:05:19; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115613 << dude srsly. GET A BLOG ALREADY.
assbot: SPOILER ALERT ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ipy0Nb )
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 17:12:02; mircea_popescu: and why the fuck am i referencing pastebins.
mircea_popescu: holy shit sherlock
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 620 @ 0.0016191 = 1.0038 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel natural languages are not formalizable.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 17:11:55; mircea_popescu: "The studious will note that this is a completely solved problem that no machine learning algorithm will be able to approximate anytime soon." i'm sorry...what ? solved how ?
gabriel_laddel: Erik Naggum disagreed
mircea_popescu: erik naggum was not a linguist.
gabriel_laddel: Lemme find the quote
gabriel_laddel: apart from this, I have written Emacs Lisp functions to make a statement into a question and vice versa, to join and split sentences (not quite as trivial as it sounds), to upgrade from singular to plural and vice versa, to change the person from second to third and vice versa, et cetera. significant parts of grammar is the way it is to maintain correspondence between numbers and persons and tenses and such, and sin
gabriel_laddel: ce this is mostly redundant, it can be also automated. this is stuff that takes just a bit of time to do, but when a whole paragraph of text needs to be changed from second person singular or from third person singular to third person plural, it's nice to do that with a couple keystrokes. it's also nice to see that the pronouns are easily traceable to their origins, and don't get messed up in several layers of refer
gabriel_laddel: ences. if my code can't figure it out, chances are so won't anybody else, at least not easily.
gabriel_laddel: ^ that is formalized enough for me.
mircea_popescu: "formalized enough" eh ?
gabriel_laddel: Would you agree that a shannonizer is a formalization?
mircea_popescu: i would agree that the counting horse is a remarkable horse,
mircea_popescu: but i won't agree he's a mathematician.
gabriel_laddel: wait what
mircea_popescu: a shannonizer is a formalisation, but not of natural language.
gabriel_laddel: I'll agree to that.
decimation: all models are wrong - some are useful
decimation: ^George Box
mircea_popescu: if a purpose is stated.
gabriel_laddel: wtf I can't find the source for that quote anymore
gabriel_laddel: anyways - full quote is available here: http://paste.lisp.org/display/147662
assbot: The Samuel Johnson Sound Bite Page: Apocrypha ... ( http://bit.ly/1IpzFlM )
mircea_popescu: "I have typed an average of 21.3 keystrokes per second" eh gtfo.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14150 @ 0.00029337 = 4.1512 BTC [-]
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