Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans

← 2015-02-13 | 2015-02-15 →
herbijudlestoids: i am really enjoying my freebsd hobby project, gives me opportunity to implement so many things that i have let go past because i didnt need it for work
herbijudlestoids: so far: squid, ldap, kerberos, djbdns, postfix, and today i finished setting up nginx and getting "A" score on the qualys ssl test
assbot: nbs-system/naxsi · GitHub ... ( )
ben_vulpes: well that was quite the refactor
ben_vulpes: i went heads down, next thing i know you asshats have crapped out 800 loglines
ben_vulpes: and an herbijudlestoids!
herbijudlestoids: hullo mr fox
ben_vulpes: ;;ident herbijudlestoids
gribble: Nick 'herbijudlestoids', with hostmask 'herbijudlestoids!', is not identified.
herbijudlestoids: i just identified with you bastard bot
ben_vulpes: !gettrust assbot herbijudlestoids
assbot: Trust relationship from user assbot to user herbijudlestoids: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | |
ben_vulpes: ;;gettrust assbot herbijudlestoids
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user herbijudlestoids: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: | WoT data: | Rated since: Fri Feb 14 01:33:49 2014
herbijudlestoids: ;;ident herbijudlestoids
gribble: Nick 'herbijudlestoids', with hostmask 'herbijudlestoids!', is identified as user 'herbijudlestoids', with GPG key id CA8F764D7A6DC051, key fingerprint 7BFEED118C1BD7FA160C7780CA8F764D7A6DC051, and bitcoin address None
herbijudlestoids: yeah. damn u.
ben_vulpes: ok ok
herbijudlestoids: i guess i should stop using my home computer to connect here and start using this freebsd node
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform << this you'll appreciate. grep for "Doctor_Why_Bother"
assbot: Does Anyone Read "The Last Psychiatrist"? - Straight Dope Message Board ... ( )
ben_vulpes: !up Vexual
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> srsly, whoever asked that, read the damn thing << for those blessedly uncontaminated with "c machine" constructs, it's hard to tell where the "c++" leaves off and the "boost" begins. it's clear that it's used in every for loop (c++ doesn't have iteration constructs?!), but the question if you didn't read closely enough was "why bother?" not "should one?"
decimation: mircea_popescu: that's a lulzy exchange. the doctor_why_bother guy is a living example of 'he misses the forest for the tiny sapling'
mircea_popescu: more generally, of dunning-kruger
mircea_popescu: people thinkg that effect only shows up in idiots, and so not in them. which of course is the very point.
mircea_popescu: but in fact, the moderately stupid are just as handicapped understanding why they aren't smarter as very smart people are, understanding THE SAME THING (ie, why they aren't smarter).
ben_vulpes: <Adlai> it's funny/sad how parenting reverses over time << oh this is great news you mean i have to take care of both ends? great.
decimation: it's like watching a cripple trip on a bump, adjacent to which is a sign that says "attention cripples: do not trip on this bump"
mircea_popescu: your average doobie, with a mediocre college degree and an ESL culture mostly geared towards ingested summaries is perfectly unable to decode metaphor or recognise complex enough patterns and fill in the gaps. this to him is frustrating, and the frustration is predictably resolved by lashing out (hey, it's the guy fault for using rferences i have to google and math i don't grok!11). in no way better than a clinical mor
mircea_popescu: on angry at people who can write.
thestringpuller: mod6: ben_vulpes it got past the wedge
mircea_popescu: for that matter, my "which of course is the very point" above is also "not very clear", in the sense that if one isn't particularly bright, the recursion of "what dk says is that people think they're better than they are" is not immediately glob'd into the expression.
mircea_popescu: for that matter, if one doesn't have the culture to know that glob's a verb, the above is also "a very bad argument" .and so on.
asciilifeform: decimation: 'macrofab' << i worked through an entire board.
asciilifeform: decimation: it's a piece of shit
asciilifeform: decimation: loses xy coords for -all- parts
decimation: asciilifeform: lol thanks for jumping on that
decimation: but ascii, it's in 'beta'
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes : take the bright side of life. "not liking kids is not a valid reason to not have any - you'll be stuck with some anyway."
asciilifeform: decimation: and demands weird gerber layers that i haven't got
asciilifeform: what a fucking waste of hour
asciilifeform: cranked through all the parts substitutions crap
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform stop wasting your hours! you're a process man, you belong to s.nsa now!
decimation: my understanding is that you are required to manually place the parts
thestringpuller: "blocks" : 164713
decimation: in a 'mechanical turk' fashion
asciilifeform: (for what? rng. small board, nothing secret therein. yes, motherfucker has my gerbers now)
asciilifeform: decimation: semi-automatic turk
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: it gets worse. some even work for me.
decimation: asciilifeform: did you use eagle?
decimation: I might try kicad to see what it does
asciilifeform: did try it
asciilifeform: and even took a month last year - learned geda
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes so do mine. but at least a) i actually fuck them and b) i don't take them without a significant prior investment from other people.
decimation: there's another similar vendor << supposedly they actually deliever
assbot: CircuitHub ... ( )
asciilifeform: geda is great in every way except for being terminally buggy and the fill polygons fell apart
asciilifeform: kikad is unusable on linux (on every box i own) - gui redraw bug
decimation: asciilifeform: I find kicad amusing - when you go to download they have a little description begging not to download the 'old stable' version
asciilifeform: and, even were this fixed, its autorouter is dumb as rocks
ben_vulpes: sage words
ben_vulpes: next career
mircea_popescu: decimation why not ?
asciilifeform: decimation: circuithub << wait, lol!!! >> 'In order to upload your first project, please create or link a Dropbox account.'
decimation: because apparently all their new 'features' are in the new 'unstable testing' version
decimation: asciilifeform: hehe yeah I wondered when you were to walk into that
decimation: they promise that they won't mistreat your data
asciilifeform: i assume they will all 'mistreat the data'
asciilifeform: but why force user to use turd service ?
decimation: I guess because they can't write an http uploader that works?
asciilifeform even more disappointed than expected to be
decimation: asciilifeform, what do you expect from 'hardware startup' chumpatronics?
asciilifeform does not expect to find one of these things that works for any reasonable value of 'works', because the economics of it are not, to put it very gently, favourable
decimation: supposedly the macrolabs people 'make the economics work' by queuing up all the jobs onto a giant panel
asciilifeform: i could live, for example, with an outfit that would crap out the board and place just the passives (then i xray the damn thing here. and place the actives personally)
decimation: I'm not sure how they 'make it up on volume' if they have to hand place parts on the whole thing
asciilifeform: but i could also live with a pill that propels me on morning commute by enabling me to fart ponies
decimation: pony-farts would be a fairly good way of navigating the dc traffic jams
decimation: apparently the page is dead
asciilifeform: !s a horse splashes
assbot: 0 results for 'a horse splashes' :
asciilifeform: ;;google a horse splashes
gribble: Haldane, On Being the Right Size: <>; .. a man is broken, a horse splashes - Physics Forums: <>; On Being The Right Size (Hollywood edition). | The Inverse Square ...: < (1 more message)
asciilifeform: 'You can drop a mouse down a thousand-yard mine shaft; and, on arriving at the bottom, it gets a slight shock and walks away, provided that the ground is fairly soft. A rat is killed, a man is broken, a horse splashes.'
mircea_popescu: great quote
asciilifeform: famous essay
asciilifeform: decimation: -everybody- queues the jobs into conveyor-width panels.
asciilifeform: decimation: the boojum lies in the nre costs, typically (largely paste stencils, but not only)
asciilifeform: decimation: also there is no small amount of actual human labour involved in the process.
decimation: I suspect they are using one of those 'ink jet' solder paste printers
asciilifeform: decimation: those trade nre for a vastly higher cost per board
asciilifeform: the nozzles (disposable, golden toilet) clog, etc.
asciilifeform: and crap slowly.
asciilifeform: somebody has to watch it go
decimation: asciilifeform: if they are truly able to deliver at the prices they quote on the 'demo', it seems likely that they are 'debt funding'
decimation: the macrolabs people
asciilifeform: circuithub ?
asciilifeform: nah, i think i figured it out
asciilifeform: assuming the thing isn't simply a blackhole for money,
asciilifeform: (actually ships something)
asciilifeform: they make up the difference by nickel'n'diming the chump for the 'out of house' parts
ben_vulpes: <herbijudlestoids> [] deployment tools, config mgmt, automated service discovery etc << /me is tres jelly
asciilifeform: e.g., $1.50 to place each 15c resistor they refused to stock
decimation: yes, I couldn't find any mention of the costs of 'non-house' parts
asciilifeform: ^ yes, per unit
asciilifeform: clever chumpamatic
asciilifeform: decimation: you have to crap in an actual project to learn the costs
decimation: nor a catalog of parts that 'can be had for a price'
asciilifeform: it lets you fidget with the selections
decimation: ah, I will upload something and see what I can do
asciilifeform: their selection is, i'd say, rather spotty
asciilifeform: e.g., no 47K 0805 resistor of any grade
decimation: yes their house passive selection is very limited
decimation: and their non-passive even more so
asciilifeform: as for actives, virtually none to be had.
asciilifeform: in short, i am presently at a loss as to what this is good for, how, and why...
decimation: it will be interesting to see if this 'service' continues to exist for a period of time, and if so, how it matures
thestringpuller: decimation: isn't there a super speeder law in VA and MD because people drive so terribly in DC?
asciilifeform: as i understand, it is severely antieconomic and cannot really go anywhere
decimation: thestringpuller: in VA if you are speeding 15 mph over the limit it can be considered 'wreckless'
asciilifeform: that alone would not doom it - consider the world of usg - but the onesie-pcb-assembly business doesn't have the makings of a mass popu-chumpatron
asciilifeform: reckless?
decimation: yeah reckless
decimation: I guess wreckless would be safe driving :)
decimation: asciilifeform: I think they have the nub of a good idea, having all the steps in manufacturing clearly brought out in one spot
decimation: the execution might not be there though
ben_vulpes: i got a reckless driving charge one time.
ben_vulpes: ticket was officially for 60 in a 30.
decimation: ben_vulpes: did they try to send you to jail?
ben_vulpes: iirc, i hit 70.
ben_vulpes: lol in portland?
decimation: you guys have a loud n' proud bisexual governor now
ben_vulpes: there's always something silly happening in the backwaters
decimation: < mircea_popescu apparently amex was too fucktarded to keep costco as a client
assbot: Logged on 04-01-2015 22:07:08; mircea_popescu: decimation: re: costco & amex << I suspect amex gives costco a deal (pays them) to force a large percentage of the upper-crust customer-base to have an amex card in their wallet << pretty much how that racket goes yes.
decimation: < mircea_popescu apparently amex was too fucktarded to keep costco as a client
assbot: Logged on 04-01-2015 22:07:08; mircea_popescu: decimation: re: costco & amex << I suspect amex gives costco a deal (pays them) to force a large percentage of the upper-crust customer-base to have an amex card in their wallet << pretty much how that racket goes yes.
assbot: AmEx shares plunge as Costco dumps its credit cards - Fortune ... ( )
decimation: sorry for the dup
assbot: Telescopic contact lenses let you zoom in on demand - tech - 13 February 2015 - New Scientist ... ( )
punkman: << I was more wondering how much cruft we'll need for that.
assbot: Logged on 14-02-2015 00:20:24; BingoBoingo: punkman: if we replace openssl with libressl or whatever, how do we verify all the buggy data generated by 7 different openssl versions? << For the time being... empirically. There a set with six year's worth a data to test against by syncing.
punkman: could just keep the checkpoint stuff though, and not verify all the ecdsa signatures.
punkman: (I'll mention again that if you let VerifySignature run on all tx's, it blows up much sooner than block 168000)
mircea_popescu: decimation ouch, amex kinda set to go out of biz huh.
mircea_popescu: the obvious effect of "keynesian" money pumping is bubbles, but that's not the worst effect.
mircea_popescu: the worst effect is that everything forms monopolies. in a physics intuitive approach, what QE does is basically increase the superficial tension. this forces bubbles to merge.
mircea_popescu: in another perspective, qe is an abdication of monetarty sovereignty. sovereignity is a fixed sum, so it just moves in other parts of the system - monopolies form.
mircea_popescu: but in any case, however you explain it on the "micro" basis : competition and central control are mutually contradictory. much like anabolic and catabolic processes.
decimation: yes, the us today is more-or-less dominated by centralized megabusiness
decimation: because 'must grow big to get a seat at the table where they hand out bezzlars'
punkman: decimation: just the US?
decimation: punkman: aren't you in france?
decimation: the eu has their own version
mircea_popescu: decimation it's not even that, it's just... the *meaning* of money changes.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Amex is fine. They partnered with Walmart for poor people ATM cards
mircea_popescu: they're getting bought out
decimation: the 'meaning of money' seems to have a scale from 'tool to settle private debts' to 'note from stalin'
asciilifeform: old hat. east india company ran as much on the latter as the former
assbot: AmEx Grip on Wealthy Consumers Seen Slipping as Rivals Take Bite - Bloomberg Business ... ( )
decimation: "Chief Executive Officer Ken Chenault, 63, has introduced new products aimed at younger and less-affluent customers as AmEx seeks to broaden its appeal. The lender is working with companies including Uber Technologies Inc. and Apple Inc. to expand mobile payments, and courted Americans who lack access to traditional banks with products like its Bluebird prepaid card, offered at Wal-Mart Stores Inc."
asciilifeform: decimation: this is a pretty standard dynamic of 'leningrad siege, no coal, let's burn the sofa'
decimation: wtf, when did it ever make sense as a creditor to make enemies with those who had money in order to court those who don't?
decimation: yeah it seems that way
asciilifeform: they cash in their 'brand' for chump massification
asciilifeform: (what is the 'added value' of a prepay spamcard with 'amex' logo? solely the psychological tie with 'rich')
decimation: kinda like how 'hp' now brands chumper printer cartridges, instead of quality reliable test equipment
asciilifeform: decimation: hp's been branding chumpcartridges since '90s
mircea_popescu: decimation the ones who "don't" are more valuable as bezzle access. the ones who "do" really don't.
asciilifeform: that's not the news, but that they stopped doing anything else. like the illusory growth of a corpse's beard
mircea_popescu: ie, boa was "too big to fail" because it held a lot of mortgages of people WHO COULDNT PAY FOR THEM.
mircea_popescu: meanwhile jpm was NOT tbtf, because it held a lot of money from people who had money, so it could you knoiw, just steal that,
mircea_popescu: so it didn't need govt money.
mircea_popescu: it quickly becomes perverse, the game of "let's have government in the market"
decimation: yeah there is no escape
mircea_popescu: by now a "we hold 100mn chumps, who pay us 0, give us usd" is a better revenue source than "we have 1mn people paying us 1k a year each"
mircea_popescu: as proven by, for instance, whatsdumb.
decimation: a dark force dissolves every economic decision into a sjw forum
mircea_popescu: well this is the problem, you know ? once you decide to try nuclear detonations in your livingroom you can no longer have "fresh milk"
asciilifeform: folks stupid enough to try (1) will proceed to (2)
asciilifeform: like clockwork.
BingoBoingo: Strontium makes bones strong and genes novel
assbot: Last 8 lines bashed and pending review. ( )
BingoBoingo: !up Vexual
Vexual: ;;laserkittens
gribble: ุ ₍˄.͡˳̫.˄₎ ุ ┌━ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ *pew*
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: isn't it odd that engl. doesn't (afaik) have a word for блат - that other capital that u.s. economy actually runs on today, as discussed above
mircea_popescu: blat ? ahahaha
asciilifeform: (roughly might translate as 'pull' or 'crown concession' but not quite)
mircea_popescu: it's a quite respectable romanian word.
mircea_popescu: ;;google ce inseamna sa faci un blat ?
gribble: Reţetă blat de pizza | RETETE | prajituri | mancare | BarbatLaCratita: <>; Cum se face aluatul de pizza pufos, crocant? | Pofta Buna!: <>; Pizza Traditionala Italiana | Retete culinare Laura Adamache: < (1 more message)
asciilifeform: call it 'fapital' perhaps
asciilifeform: or crapital
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's more or less universal in the slavic and bordering cultures, afaik. and other orcish nations (cn) have own word that is closely analogous
mircea_popescu: (in romanian it means, literally, the dough part of a pizza or a cake)
asciilifeform: 'guanxi' in cn, iirc
Vexual: Whaa?
Vexual: Ascii you're picking up Chinese?
asciilifeform: Vexual: one unavoidably picks up various things, like the strontium from earlier thread
Vexual: So many dialects in China.
asciilifeform: ^ the incident itself is quite famous, but i somehow escaped knowing that the detailed reversing of the bug was made public
asciilifeform: likewise mentioned is the fact that the bug was deliberately set to overlap with freq. of a local tv station.
asciilifeform: (sacrifice range, gain - the obvious)
Vexual: Lol
asciilifeform: the typewriter case is interesting, from a history of usg point of view, because it appears to be the turning point for nsa
asciilifeform: that is, when their present direction was decided on.
asciilifeform: (turned, that is, from traditional signal-gathering to sabotage, cribbed, yes, from ru)
mircea_popescu: sabotage ? looks more like judy.
mircea_popescu: as in, punch and judy
mircea_popescu: the principal job of the nsa since about the 2010s is to be publicly and outrageously humiliated.
asciilifeform: if there is evidence of usg crafting functioning but diddled parts for a mass-produced machine, slipping'em in, etc. prior to this cribbing, i for one do not know of it
asciilifeform: a 'f-student' who cribs what he sees as 'good idea' becomes immediately obsessed with it
asciilifeform: to the point of utter laughability
asciilifeform: (and yes, 'crypto ag' - nsa shill - sold diddled cipher machines for half a century and (!) counting. not counting shams-by-design here, only surreptitiously-modified products)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42250 @ 0.00042369 = 17.9009 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 19 @ 0.09396842 = 1.7854 BTC [-] {4}
cazalla: This, however, is very much the result of choices in the design of the system: anyone may create a bitcoin address at a whim, as long as it is unique. But the Bitcoin Foundation—the organization that has authority over the bitcoin protocol—could change that. Before creating a new address, users could be forced to authenticate with a trusted organization. This organization would securely store information about identities, and this infor
cazalla: mation could be revealed to law-enforcement agencies only when a request for access is legally approved.
assbot: Two major problems with bitcoin, and how to solve them ... ( )
ben_vulpes: people may definitively lose interest, eh?
ben_vulpes: mhmsure.
cazalla: what a bunch of fags And from 2001 to 2011, there were 3,177 veterans diagnosed with gender identity disorder according to the Veterans Affairs Department, while overall it is estimated than one in 11,000 male babies and one in 30,000 female babies are born with the disorder, according to the Veterans Health Administration.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17250 @ 0.00043311 = 7.4711 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9400 @ 0.00043311 = 4.0712 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3973 @ 0.00043311 = 1.7207 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15700 @ 0.00043311 = 6.7998 BTC [+]
assbot: Smart Homes Often Dumb, Never Simple - Slashdot ... ( )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19859 @ 0.00042011 = 8.343 BTC [-] {2}
cazalla: so the telco here has a campaign where they will publish your texts on their billboard above one of their stores..
BingoBoingo: lol at the billboard
Adlai: ;;later tell mircea_popescu << how much is "a few", and how open are you to considering more frequent compensation?
assbot: Logged on 07-02-2015 17:57:05; mircea_popescu: nah, first timers get a few % of the profit, and at the end of a whole year.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
BingoBoingo: Adlai: When I was enlisted it was 10% of profit from the first year and negotiable beyond that after having lived a year. Market I traded lost its trade worthiness sooner than the one year though.
Adlai: ty
BingoBoingo: It's posted on Trilema somewhere
Adlai: one issue i'm thinking about right now is whether this is really the kind of investment mpif is after: the last two days have generated an (unrealized) loss, despite the overall portfolio valuation jumping by ~$50 per bot
BingoBoingo: Well bookeeping is almost certainly going to be BTC denominated
Adlai: right, that's why it's showing up as an unrealized loss, rather than a realized gain
Adlai already bookkeeps in btc, but he lets the bot mostly do as it sees fit, which means it travels across the entire range of all-in-btc to all-in-fiat, should the market take it there
Adlai: of course, this behavior is controllable
BingoBoingo: Sync'd up to late January 2013
Adlai: oh lol, you were market making Altcoin, so no wonder it lost tradeability :P
Adlai: my long-term (years/decades) plan for scalpl, assuming i don't lose interest by then, is commodities, since i'm hoping by that point "forex" becomes a quaint anachronism
Adlai: but meanwhile btc/fiat's volume makes a great sandbox
Adlai: although i guess that's more due to s/ume/atility/
Adlai: "The latter is structured so that no withdrawals are possible at the manager’s initiative" << oh hello, this sounds familiar!
BingoBoingo: Netted a small profit on the RON, and a loss on ATC when the alternative revealed it self to be potentially unbounded costs to keep the thing alive through mining
Adlai: which is why i'm sticking to government-mined altcoins
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6867 @ 0.0004143 = 2.845 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18092 @ 0.0004228 = 7.6493 BTC [+] {2}
danielpbarron: i like amex because they gave me a card without me giving them my slave id number, although i suspect they just looked it up from some database
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46400 @ 0.00043203 = 20.0462 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: scoopbot -fetch
thestringpuller: why isn't it working?
assbot: Notes on Building Bitcoin-qt on OpenBSD | Bingo Blog ... ( )
thestringpuller: yea scoopbot ain't workibg PeterL
thestringpuller: good morning mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: this shit's seriously a lot mopre trouble than it's worth.
danielpbarron: so uh.. it comes as little suprise to me that my pogo using a solid state drive is significantly faster than the one using a regular laptop hard drive
mircea_popescu: it just won't last as long.
danielpbarron: i suspected harddrive read/write was the bottleneck back when i was building my first full node
danielpbarron: also, i have sucessully re-installed the OS on one of them multiple times; it is possible to screw up the install and recover from it without any major disassembly required
danielpbarron: you can just put a blank flash drive in the top usb port with an empty directory 'revert' and the thing boots up factory default
danielpbarron: and if it sees such a drive, it won't try to boot from the attached sata drive; so you can then fdisk as needed
mircea_popescu: pretty great find this
mircea_popescu: ;;seen trinque
gribble: trinque was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 18 hours, 58 minutes, and 25 seconds ago: <trinque> mod6: lots of chatter about "can't find -lgcc_s" on teh googles
mircea_popescu: im gonna have to make another div payment set without a deed registrar aren't i.
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell trinque YO! deedbot!
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: Using Mike Hearn's Bitcoin XT instead of Bitcoin Core as full node took just a couple of minutes. : Bitcoin ... ( )
BingoBoingo: Only advertises offering 2 new unfeatures
mircea_popescu: "It seems to be a way to extend and patch thee Bitcoin network without waiting on slow Bitcoin Core improvements."
mircea_popescu: it seems there's some worms more eager than some others in the government biscuit.
BingoBoingo: ;;later tell ben_vulpes mod6 for when you get to porting maybe some notes might be useful
assbot: Notes on Building Bitcoin-qt on OpenBSD | Bingo Blog ... ( )
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: cazalla: more lulzy shit at << all these biogas precursors are in for a rude awakening. at some point they'll discover that while I have the power to make something a problem by calling it a problem, they do not (any more).
assbot: Canadian Business - Your source for market news, investing, technology, economy and Canadian industry ... ( )
mircea_popescu: boy that'll suck.
assbot: ButterNubber comments on Using Mike Hearn's Bitcoin XT instead of Bitcoin Core as full node took just a couple of minutes. ... ( )
BingoBoingo: The point of this project is to provide a full node that has an explicit goal of supporting the needs of SPV app developers, as well as a place to try out more experimental changes in general. Through the course of 2013 I feel that the upstream Bitcoin Core project has become a relatively unpredictable place and I no longer feel sure that we can improve SPV mode or even that they will continue to support it at all. Bitcoin XT will
assbot: Google Discussiegroepen ... ( )
BingoBoingo: Bitcoin Core upredictable, Let's make it more so
mircea_popescu: you don't understand how the world works.
thestringpuller: you are just oppressing my wood chipper rights!
thestringpuller: !l m s.qntr
assbot: Last trade for S.QNTR on MPEX was at 0.00025459 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: !t m s.qntr
assbot: [MPEX:S.QNTR] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.00021897 / 0.00023047 / 0.00026 (22881 shares, 5.27 BTC), 30D: 0.000174 / 0.00022151 / 0.00026 (28655 shares, 6.35 BTC)
assbot: PsuedoNode Proxy Fools Bitcoin Full Node Incentive Program | ... ( )
mircea_popescu: lol awww.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo invite basil00 over eh.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Dunno him, thestringpuller wrote that up and sourced it
thestringpuller: all i have is his github and reddit usernames
thestringpuller: i can send him pm in reddit
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: you can just put a blank flash drive in the top usb port with an empty directory 'revert' and the thing boots up factory default << this is not a feature of the machine, but of the modified 'uboot' installed by the script you used.
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: what's more, this is guaranteed not to happen on the final box, because we'll actually use the 128M eeprom for the os.
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: (your setup - doesn't)
danielpbarron: ah, i had a feeling that was the case
danielpbarron: i hope you guys aren't relying solely on me to achieve those ends; a lot of this is totally new territory for me
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: pseudonode << mega-lol! >> 'Otherwise, if PseudoNode can connect to at least some good nodes (default 2), then will PseudoNode will acts just like a normal node and contributes network bandwidth.' << 'contributes bandwidth' !?!?!?
asciilifeform: eats - yes
asciilifeform: contributes ?
BingoBoingo: no contribution without verification
asciilifeform: the only thing it can do is add delay - and, potentially, diddle (you connect, thinking it was a node, but really this)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5949 @ 0.00042807 = 2.5466 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all
BingoBoingo: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 248.64, vol: 16328.91254348 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 245.993, vol: 16418.1363 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 248.8, vol: 60076.29357212 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 247.216263, vol: 273739.29310000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 245.0, vol: 32.86977983 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 235.82995, vol: 149.97156036 | Volume-weighted last average: 247.479467217
gribble: Current Blocks: 343467 | Current Difficulty: 4.44554159623438E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 344735 | Next Difficulty In: 1268 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 19 hours, 51 minutes, and 6 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 45854879064.3 | Estimated Percent Change: 3.14801
thestringpuller: scoopbot on da fritz
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8400 @ 0.0004143 = 3.4801 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26388 @ 0.00041305 = 10.8996 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: thinkst Thoughts...: If the NSA has been hacking everything, how has nobody seen them coming? ... ( )
asciilifeform: aha, 'nobody.'
assbot: Press Release | Visa Corporate | Visa Inc. ... ( )
asciilifeform: 'and the the word "implant" was almost never used in security circles' << usually called 'bug' (in the 'room is bugged' sense) outside of usg
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: "Thanks, but unfortunately it is already late in my part of the world. Perhaps send any questions via email and I'll try to respond in ~10hours (after sleep). Email:"
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: Really, just dropping a plaintext email address in IRC for spamzors to pick up?
thestringpuller: ~_~ never again
Adlai: bitcoin inflation subsidizes the operation of the world's most energy inefficient clock
Adlai: and it's quite imprecise, too
kakobrekla: clock is scam
kakobrekla: time is arbitrary
mircea_popescu: there's no way to express bitcoin in fiat terms. it's not "a clock", because the meaning of "a clock" does not carry in bitcoin. yes it divides time, but differently in fundamental ways.
mircea_popescu: "energy efficiency" is not a bitcoin consideration. all energy used for non-bitcoin stuff is wasted by definition, in the bitcoin paradigm.
mircea_popescu: etc etc.
mircea_popescu: heh. who even wants these new derpy tvs
mircea_popescu: i suppose the next step is, "participate in derpland has talent with your tv set!" and hopefully that'll relieve us of most of the current imbeciles online.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36119 @ 0.00039193 = 14.1561 BTC [-] {2}
Adlai: mircea_popescu: _all_ energy, or the delta between current mining energy use, and half the planet's total energy expenditure?
Adlai: the economics change once unutilized energy is insufficient to attack the network
mircea_popescu: unrelated datapoints. half energy available \being used to mine bitcoin makes bitcoin safe for humans (safe in the sense of, won't be overrun by the altcoin problem)
Adlai suspects; take everything he says with the usual shaker of salt
mircea_popescu: as far as bitcoin is concerned, there's no point to energy other than mining.
Adlai: signing transactions takes a bit of energy, and without fees from signed transactions, there's no point to mining
mircea_popescu: no point in mining FOR HUMANS.
mircea_popescu: gotta compartimentalize the povs.
Adlai: ok, i see
Adlai: still, i'm not sure that there's a rational incentive to add energy to mining activity once X% of the planet's energy expenditure is dedicated to mining
Adlai: i guess it would depend on the profitability, which starts getting outside the scope of bitcoin itself
mircea_popescu: is there a rational incentive to continue adding man-hours to women's studies ?
mircea_popescu: rational incentives don't enter into it. as far as derpy social studies types are concerned, all effort available should go into that.
mircea_popescu: the difference is that they enforce this through statal redistribution, which lives out of a hole in public choice theory,
Adlai finds himself again bringing up kahneman, who talks about "humans" vs "econs", the latter describing the rational agents of economic theory, which don't actually exist on this planet
mircea_popescu: whereas bitcoin enforces this through the nature of money.
mircea_popescu: which will crumble in contact with the other is kinda obvious.
mircea_popescu: o yes they do. the "humans" don't exist.
mircea_popescu: a whiteknight is not a person. it's a manifestation of particular pathologies empowered by particular economic imbalances.
mircea_popescu: these always revert to the mean.
Adlai: i guess we just have different definitions of the word "human". mine is preceded with a huge "only".
Adlai next cites his dog's vet's tatoo, or at least the one he remembers: "humanity is overrated"
mircea_popescu: it's simple : inasmuch as your definition of "human" difers from "econ", it doesn't exist.
mircea_popescu: just like whatever in your definition of "human" differs from human biology is not objective but metaphysical.
Adlai: dunno, it makes perfect sense to me that computers produced by an evolutionary process would be far from perfect
Adlai: so "econs" are these mythical perfectly rational agents, and "humans" are these neurological shitshows full of neuroses and emotions that rarely act rationally. sure, some humans act quite rationally, but they're the exception.
mircea_popescu: if this is how you redefine your humans, i will change "don't exist" to "don't matter".
Adlai: sure. mattering is like driving skill... most datapoints think they're on the opposite side of the curve
mircea_popescu: (ie, "can't carry meaning". just like the foregoing it's also logically necessary, no debate possible. it flows from what you're saying, which is essentially "humans are noise". sure. but noise doesn't really matter. like brownian motion.)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23300 @ 0.00040355 = 9.4027 BTC [+]
Adlai: dunno, nature can still matter, even if individual snowflakes in an avalanche or looters in a mob, could be removed without significantly affecting the whole. i choose the mob analogy purposefully, because these effects are rarely (ever?) constructive... construction seems to take either "superhuman" capacity (and effort), or enough time for differential reproductive fitness to do its thing
mircea_popescu: but that "nature" === "econ"
Adlai: <insufficient data for meaningful answer)
Adlai: i'm not convinced that "nature" as a whole can be considered an "econ"
mircea_popescu: just, 'no particular inclination to gaze upon chtulhu'
mircea_popescu: but review the definitions :)
Adlai: it's definitely something else, not "human" - but does it act in its own rational self interest? i'm not sure the concept of "self interest" is meaningful when you're talking about "nature"
Adlai: cf "the planet is fine, the people are fucked"
Adlai: i won't dispute that nature computes.
mircea_popescu: "the planet is fine, the people are fucked" is what people say when they can't digest the obvious "if you could understand more, you could understand more"
Adlai: do you know the source?
mircea_popescu: the planet is fine. "the people" are fine. you are stupid, and your friends ridiculous.
mircea_popescu: carlin neh ?
Adlai: it's carlin on environmentalism, yes
mircea_popescu: he doesn't mean the people = "the people". he means the people = your friends.
Adlai: the tl;dr is that "saving the environment" is silly because the environment exists with or without its "savers", and that the real meaning behind "saving the environment" is "keeping this environment as hospitable as possible to us"
Adlai has no friends
mircea_popescu: more like, "saving the environment" is just as silly as any one thing a bunch of useless, stupid and ignorant entities that only exist because nobody ground uncle sam into the ground yet could ever do.
Adlai: and now, for something completely different!
mircea_popescu: think "occupywallstreet" or "feminism" or w/e. "the luxor center for businessmen". these collections don't actually do anything, it's not unlike a coral discussing which way to undulate for saving the whales.
Adlai: when you designed mpex's 'quantum' matching engine, did you consider proposals of the "frequent batch auction" persuasion? i have no stake in this idea, just collecting opinions on it, as i form my own
mircea_popescu: very little about mpex has been publicly discussed.
Adlai: sure, but "frequent batch auction" has been published about a few times
mircea_popescu: good fer it i guess.
Adlai: the actual paper, if anybody is interested in more than a slideshow, is
Adlai: mircea_popescu: i'll take that as a "haven't heard/cared about it", which is still a datapoint
mircea_popescu: lol kay.
Adlai had heard the buzzword, hadn't bothered to actually read about it until now
mircea_popescu: maybe better take it as "this man won't give me for free stuff that people might get if they pay upwards of six figures in fees. my feeble attempts to defeat his defences through 9yo discoursive tactics are probably going to fare about as well as 9yos generally fare against multi million dollar concerns."
Adlai: it's an interesting idea, although i must say that - as i understand it without having read the entire paper - it's too deterministic for my tastes. i kinda like the idea of deliberately random behavior.
Adlai: lol kay.
mircea_popescu: !up ruin_dpbs_life
ruin_dpbs_life: danielpbarron: you're a dead man i'm going to fucking do whatever it takes to hurt you
ruin_dpbs_life: enjoy going to jail with your terror cel
ruin_dpbs_life: mircea_popescu: you do business wiht dpb i'll get the police in volved
mircea_popescu: which police is this ?
mircea_popescu: awww he got flooded did he ?!
danielpbarron: !rated xanthyos
assbot: You rated user xanthyos on 08-Oct-2014, with a rating of -5, and supplied these additional notes: met in '04; he depends on government subsidies and will side with the USG in order to maintain his leech lifestyle..
Adlai was just discussing death threats yesterday... they are as effective against humans as they are ineffective against superhumans
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell ruin_dpbs_life Guilford, Connecticut << it's probably a decent idea to not go throwing around threats off your home ip.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
danielpbarron: he's also throwing them through his phone number
mircea_popescu: are you two ex lovers or something ?
danielpbarron: but we go way back
Adlai: i mean, if he's asking to get the police involved, don't they love responding to death threats?
Adlai: [for police values of "love"]
mircea_popescu: well technically this was more in the vein of horrible maiming and dismemberment threats.
mircea_popescu: lmao he got flooded. imagine the rage.
Adlai: dunno officer, "you're a dead man" seemed quite clear to me
mircea_popescu: o there's that too. well... it's a fair cop...
mircea_popescu: !up benjamindees
benjamindees: it's my understanding that you all are generally in favor of sidechains?
Adlai: yours would be a Miss Understanding.
benjamindees: so you are generally opposed to sidechains?
mircea_popescu: there's really no substitute for reading the logs.
Adlai: no, i feel rather ignorant of them. i understand the technical description in the paper, but haven't given it enough thought to be for or against. i can't speak for other people in this channel.
Adlai: !s sidechains
assbot: 22 results for 'sidechains' :
Adlai: benjamindees: ^
benjamindees: I'm asking more from a philosophical perspective.
xanthyos: to all USG people reading this log i am not antistatist or anti FIAT and i will turn states evidence on danielpbarron
xanthyos: i am only in bitcoin as a hobbyist poker player, i love obama
benjamindees: mircea_popescu, ain't nobody got time for that
xanthyos: please rate me down so i can't voice myself in this terrorist room anymore
mircea_popescu: then nobody ain't part of this.
Adlai: benjamindees: i just gave you the shortcut, i believe you misprounounced "thanks"
mircea_popescu: xanthyos but terrorism's nice. plus we have cookies.
xanthyos: i want no affiliation with mircea_popescu the slave holder
mircea_popescu: how about sedition ? are you in favour of sedition ?
mircea_popescu: !s donkeys camels
assbot: 3 results for 'donkeys camels' :
xanthyos: /rate xanthyos -1 never voice yourself in assets again
assbot: Logged on 09-02-2015 00:37:52; mircea_popescu: looky here : growing larger implies growing costs. this is a given. a larger bitcoin will somehow be paid for.
Adlai: !gettrust assbot xanthyos
assbot: Trust relationship from user assbot to user xanthyos: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 2 via 2 connections. | |
mircea_popescu: !rated xanthyos
assbot: You have not rated xanthyos.
Adlai: mircea_popescu: arguably, the main/relevant effect of 'sidechains' to date has been funnelling VC money into subsidizing full nodes... although i guess you don't trust full nodes run by those people... but you don't have to because bitcoin
assbot: Bitcoin prices, Bitcoin inflexibility pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( )
mircea_popescu: Yet another one of them is that consumers revolt, entrepreneurs intervene, before the end of 2015 there's about a thousand to a million different Bitcoin forks, each with its ten million-ish monetary base worth about a dollar, on global average. The size of the inter-Bitcoins market, the complexity and confusion ensuing makes pretty much everything unmanageable for the "ordinary person".
mircea_popescu: it's a bunch of fiat derps refusing to submit.
mircea_popescu: which is fine, they can struggle for as long as they can gather the energy.
Adlai: note that for the "real bitcoin", this just has the effect of further distinguishing it as such, if the current mess didn't do that well enough
mircea_popescu: good article, that, incidentally, in that it plainly discusses in 2013 things people imagine are "about the future" in 2015.
benjamindees: so, you're saying sidechains are better than alts
mircea_popescu: all screws are better than thumbtacks for the man holding a hammer.
benjamindees: "there are two avenues to pay for it." <-- I disagree with this, by the way. The third avenue is to pay for it with more transactions, since the major costs (mining) are fixed.
mircea_popescu: so your avenue to pay for your starbucks is a) give them some of your money ; b) borrow some money to give them or c) buy another soda ?
mircea_popescu: what is this, the cartoons ?
benjamindees: more transactions == growth in transaction volume == more fees, not just higher fees
Adlai: benjamindees: wait, let's back up a bit, if not for your then my sake. what's the point of sidechains? i don't think it's "paying for bitcoin mining"
Adlai thinks that federated sidechains are a great idea and cointip, bitbase, changepay, whatever they're called - should be using those, if they want transparency
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18400 @ 0.00040355 = 7.4253 BTC [+]
benjamindees: Adlai, I'm wondering what you all think about it. I was under the impression you were for the idea.
Adlai: again, federated sidechains - great idea. you want a ledger with centralized control but accessible to the public, that manipulates btc denominated assets? this is how.
benjamindees: I've seen a couple of people say similar things. It seemed natural that if you are for a 1MB limit, you would be for sidechains as an avenue for growth or at least to keep the alts at bay.
Adlai: (granted, it's a lot more work than just asking people to trust you)
Adlai: !s rai stones
assbot: 1 results for 'rai stones' :
mircea_popescu: benjamindees you're completely and utterly misrepresenting the discussion.
benjamindees: feel free to correct me
mircea_popescu: if you're doing this by accident, you'll stfu and go read. if you're doing it deliberately... well... you'll keep at it and we'll have our lulz and move on.
mircea_popescu: i do not correct you, you're not tim fucking swanson. you correct you.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1983 @ 0.00077099 = 1.5289 BTC [-]
benjamindees: I've read everything you linked so far. It seems mostly sarcastic, which I don't really follow since I don't read your logs anyways.
Adlai: benjamindees: << money doesn't have to be convenient to be useful, and there are zillions of ways to handle amounts that aren't worth the transaction cost of lugging the whole thing around; some ways are more transparent (like federated sidechains), and others less (like changetip). non-federated sidechains require changing bitcoin itself, so let's see real
assbot: Rai stones - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( )
Adlai: world use of the version that doesn't require a change before we talk about making changes - my 2¢
mircea_popescu: the notion that you may participate without understanding is like... well, what all comedy gold is made out of, i guess.
mircea_popescu: how did you get this idea, that if you don't follow something it's incumbent on me/the school/the world to fix it for you ?
mircea_popescu: go read shit until you get it.
Adlai: think of the sarcasm as a barrier of entry against butthurtion
Adlai: "but the energy, effort and resources which could have been expended on comfortably yielding and productively submitting" << lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6481 @ 0.00039004 = 2.5278 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: !up Birdman
Birdman: !down mircea_popescu
Birdman: just kiddin, sup
mircea_popescu: what's this, democracy ?
punkman: ruin_dpbs_life: danielpbarron: you're a dead man i'm going to fucking do whatever it takes to hurt you << lolwut
asciilifeform: i go out for just one hour to workshop, and what do you know, we have new surrender-monkeys ?
asciilifeform: how many? two?
punkman: just xanthyos I suppose
punkman: wasn't he the fellow with the broken dick?
asciilifeform: gavinandresen_ has quit (Client Quit) << lol! the real deal?
danielpbarron: punkman, yeh
punkman: danielpbarron: why the hardon for you?
asciilifeform: and did i miss some political wank or other? did they have a public impalement of heretics on the washington monument, and i missed this ?
danielpbarron: he has nothing better to do, and has apparently been obsessing about me
asciilifeform: why the surge of 'i love the fuhrer'
punkman: paranoia about losing benefits?
danielpbarron: yes; he gets checks from the state for being crazy
danielpbarron: he's never worked for a living in his life
asciilifeform: this does not automagically explain publicly creaming one's pants for usg
asciilifeform: plenty of folks get their daily bread from $sponsor while hating with exquisite hate
Adlai wonders what such a person's shrink would think if first hearing about bitcoin from such a patient
asciilifeform: related:
asciilifeform: 'The Russian author Eduard Limonov wrote of his experiences with poverty in America. To his joy, he discovered that he could supplement his cash earnings with public assistance. But he also quickly discovered that he had to keep this joy well hidden when showing up to collect his free money. It is a curious fact that in America public assistance is only made available to the miserable and the downtrodden, not to those who are
asciilifeform: in need of some free money but are otherwise perfectly content. Although it is just as possible to be poor and happy in America as anywhere else, here one must make a choice: to avoid any number of unpleasant situations, one must be careful to hide either the fact that one is poor, or the fact that one is happy. If free public money is to be obtained, then only the latter choice remains. It is another curious fact that vast nu
asciilifeform: mbers of Americans, both rich and poor, would regard Limonov's behavior as nothing short of despicable: a foreign author living in America on public assistance while also earning cash! It seems reasonable that the rich should feel that way; if the poor can't be made miserable, then what exactly is the point of being rich?'
danielpbarron: i'm not sure how much of it he sincerely believes, and how much is an attempt to get a rise out of me
asciilifeform: (orlov, who else)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46650 @ 0.00038643 = 18.027 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: * Adlai wonders what such a person's shrink would think if first hearing about bitcoin from such a patient << srsly.
Adlai: my first 'irl friend' who became a holder has remarked that the main (if not only) obstacle to holding is a social one; so anybody who has been marginalized their entire life (in this case, we were discussing religious minorities, but this equally applies to the 'functionally insane') is automatically more receptive than the mean
Adlai: well, ok, not anybody, those that have learned from being marginalized that 'society' isn't necessarily acting on any good reason
asciilifeform: that the main (if not only) obstacle to holding is a social one << wai, wat?! nobody has to know if you have btc
asciilifeform: unlike almost any other activity
Adlai: social, in the sense that you hold fiat because that's what everybody else holds
Adlai: hanging onto cash during times of trouble is rather similar to 'hodl'
punkman feels no need to talk about bitcoin with random people or meet local bitcoin holders
cazalla: way to butcher PseudoNode spelling
assbot: New Security Standard Announced at DevCore | ... ( )
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2362 @ 0.00073052 = 1.7255 BTC [-] {10}
cazalla: danielpbarron: he's never worked for a living in his life <<< maybe he can get a job as a postman because he never fails to deliver
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50750 @ 0.00038329 = 19.452 BTC [-] {2}
trinque: mircea_popescu: btcd chewed up a drive on me; that stream of "adding orphan block" was preceded by an input/output error barf
trinque: redid the thing with the bootstrap torrent on the server, and it's on mid december as of now
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 271 @ 0.00395513 = 1.0718 BTC [-]
trinque: kicked it up to a bigger ec2 instance; not exactly a mindboggling increase in the rate of munching blocks
mod6: <+thestringpuller> mod6: ben_vulpes it got past the wedge <+thestringpuller> "blocks" : 164713 << looks to me like you just hit a spot where it was slow, maybe a lot of disconnected blocks. this isn't the "wedge" block we were hitting. tx we had issues with (VerifiySignature) was in block 168,001. It's all in the logs.
thestringpuller: mod6: dyslexia and stuffs. not my best week :(
mod6: If you got past 168,001 without any erros reported in `./bitcoind getinfo` then you should be alright.
mod6: thestringpuller: np
thestringpuller: i don't think it will if its running 0.9.8 ssl
thestringpuller: it's also slow as molasses and they want to increase the size of these blocks?
mod6: well, remember, I've personally gotten past that block probably a dozen times with openssl 0.9.8o with config: v0.5.3 + patches { 1, rm_rf_upnp, 2, 3, 4, & 6 }
thestringpuller: oh whoa!
thestringpuller: it got past it
mod6: and recently, TomServo was able to fully sync the blockchain with config: v0.5.3 + patches + { 1, rm_rf_upnp, 2, 3, 4, 6 & 7 } AND with openssl v0.9.8o
mod6: so its totally inconsistant
thestringpuller: "blocks" : 180631
mod6: ok 180631 and no errors, looking good. see, it's inconsistant :)
thestringpuller: $ openssl version
thestringpuller: OpenSSL 0.9.8o 01 Jun 2010
thestringpuller: this is an older box.
mod6: you're on debian 7 right?
mod6: we're running on squeeze (deb 6)
thestringpuller: Ah. damn that was so long ago ~_~
mod6: you might be the first to be testing on deb7, not sure.
thestringpuller: if it gets current blockheight, i'll open up ports and run this as my full node instead of 0.8 version was tricked in to using.
mod6: thanks for testing. if you put together a pastebin of your findings: `./bitcoind getinfo` `openssl version -a`, etc. that would be helpful for our permutation matrix
thestringpuller: i'll wait until it either hits a wall or gets current.
mod6: ok thats awesome. although, i think what everyone has been running up to now is a dynamically linked version of the output binary. which shouldn't even be availab.e
thestringpuller: i didn't grok that sentence sorry
punkman: I compiled and run up to wedge on deb 7
mod6: when statically linking via the makefile.unix that's included with v0.5.3, I can't even get mine to compile correctly. So, I'll be spending a lot of time probably re-writing the entire makefile
thestringpuller: well this is from pl script v 0.0.8?
mod6: what sentence tsp?
mod6: yeah.
thestringpuller: oh dynamically linking vs static
mod6: it'll build, it'll build the `bitcoind` binary dyamically linked.
mod6: which we won't support.
thestringpuller: what's the benefit of static linking?
mod6: for the last 48 hours i've been working on trying to get it to build against static libs.
mod6: it will build all of the necessary things inside of the output binary, instead of leaving that stuff to call out to a seperate place
thestringpuller: okay i see. been a lot longer than I realize before really looking at C/C++ code. (although this i pretty much all boost which I guess alf pointed out)
mod6: makes for a larger output binary (by about 10mb) but is more safe incase someone were to do something nasty with a lib that is dynamically linked
mod6: well, w/e
thestringpuller: they have sentenced me to writing ruby for slave labor
mod6: aight. so yeah, stay tuned. as soon as I get anything working with static libs and static linking of the output object files from the bitcoin source base, I'll give an update.
thestringpuller: do you have specific usecase for inducing the wedge?
mod6: it probably will take a while.
thestringpuller: for if I wanted to test that.
mod6: thestringpuller: no.
mod6: it's inconsistant.
thestringpuller: "non-deterministic" lol
mod6: as you just proved, it'll make it past it sometimes, and sometimes not. im sure there is some sort of reason for this, but we dont know what it is at this time.
thestringpuller: life's great mysteries?
mod6: Naw.
mod6: We'll figure it out at somepoint. I think, for now the important thing is that we have a workaround.
mod6: There's a lot of moving parts in there, and deps. It's hard to put a finger on what exactly it is, right now. Especially since we are all using slightly different environments. Too many variable.s
mod6: Anyway, none of this really matters until we can get a statically linked build.
thestringpuller: cazalla: replied. awaiting moderation.
cazalla: thestringpuller, approved, but shouldn't you be working? :P
thestringpuller: on a saturday?
cazalla: i figured it for friday but look.. sunday morning
thestringpuller: dat time travel.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38500 @ 0.00038839 = 14.953 BTC [+] {2}
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: re: << is this why a lot of the US's rockets blew up during "apollo" or what not?
joecool: need to get trust in -assets, i look like the leader of a splinter faction on here lol
joecool: thestringpuller: is that only importing from gribble's wot when a new member joins the -assets wot?
thestringpuller: Nah its a static graph. And I need to redo one of the algorithms to only list those with L2 trust, a few pop up that shouldn't be there.
thestringpuller: eventually i plan to run cron job that pulls data from kako's api
BingoBoingo: !up Bagels7
mircea_popescu: !up wpalczynski
mircea_popescu: joecool lol maybe you're the head of the black jews.
joecool: *shrugs* stranger things have happened
assbot: New Security Standard Announced at DevCore | ... ( )
mircea_popescu: these people and their narcissistic delusions of self importance.
BingoBoingo: !up hegemoOn
Bagels7: Hi bingoboingo, im not even verified, and deleted my key and im on windows!
Bagels7: (its on another device)
Bagels7: why the up?
BingoBoingo: WHy not?
mircea_popescu: !up felipelalli
mircea_popescu: he can never ruin an uppetite. for even if he ruins one, he has another coming right after!
wpalczynski: what do you guys make of this btc rise? any new behind it?
assbot: BitBet - Bitcoin to surpass Berkshire as an investment :: 1121.15 B (20%) on Yes, 4393.47 B (80%) on No | closed 53 minutes ago ... ( )
mircea_popescu: note the dates.
wpalczynski: what are they talking about? how can one share be trading at 185k?
BingoBoingo: Oh, only 10 hearncoin nodes
TheNewDeal: ;;later tell TomServo I'm in town this evening, out tomorrow morn. Will be back thursday
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: are you new to all this, wpalczynski ?
wpalczynski: bitbet i am
mircea_popescu: no, finance.
wpalczynski: not new to finance
wpalczynski: ive just never seen a share of any company worth nearly that much
mircea_popescu: well, berkshire is kind-of famous for this reason. you never heard of it ?
wpalczynski: ive heard of some alleged scams associate with it
mircea_popescu: you have ?! like which ?
wpalczynski: is that reallyt what it trades at?
BingoBoingo: Japanese companies tend towards similarly high share prices because of a lack of splits
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo also the yen's kinda weak.
wpalczynski: cant really recall to be honest with you
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: That too
Bagels7: so i was reading, just gets me wound up sometimes
BingoBoingo: Which part?
BingoBoingo: !up Bagels7
Bagels7: how are there no "happy postop transsexuals"
mircea_popescu: dja know any ?
Bagels7: yeah but they call themselves women not transsexuals
mircea_popescu: anybody over 50 ?
Bagels7: yes, mainly them i had in mind
mircea_popescu: well, i guess maybe you're better connected in the group than me. i mostly know clinicians.
Bagels7: okay so i heard that there are some who lose their sex drive and become some sort of bitter bitch but they must have been the ones that were confused or coherced
mircea_popescu: because why ?
Bagels7: I never asked but I might assume they miss having a dick
mircea_popescu: well, i would imagine if they actually aim to be female they'd miss having a cunt more than having a dick.
assbot: Looks like over 80% of Bitcoin Foundation members are not allowed to vote in the current election - including several candidates & current board members. : Bitcoin ... ( )
mircea_popescu: lol any good drama ?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: lol!!
asciilifeform: 'Less than 20% of Bitcoin Foundation members will be eligible to vote due to a new requirement that members "activate" their accounts. Even if they are candidates, current board members, regularly participate in the foundation message boards or are actively involved with the foundation. Even those who just joined within the last month would not be able to vote unless they performed the additional step of "activating" accounts.'
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Just that Brian Goss disenfranchised all of those paying derple
assbot: Bg002h comments on Looks like over 80% of Bitcoin Foundation members are not allowed to vote in the current election - including several candidates & current board members. ... ( )
mircea_popescu: aww wait, bruce fenton complaining ?
BingoBoingo: INdeed
mircea_popescu: well, whadda they want, bitcoin scam foundation sold lifetime seats and ran out of money. of course it's not gonna honor them
mircea_popescu: it's like putting your dollars in a roth.
hanbot: i guess "unactivated" is the socially acceptable term for nonhuman. and here i thought it was the concept itself that bothered folks.
decimation: yeah I like the surprisingly reactionary 'election'
decimation: except for the part where they pass it off as a fair election
asciilifeform: having to rig the ballot (rather than the count) is almost iconically 'orc' inept
mircea_popescu: like unactivated virii ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the funniest part is the notion that anyone gives a shit what comes out of it.
asciilifeform: presumably the usg dept. of retardation or whatnot, which phunds the phoundation, cares.
decimation: plus some bums on reddit
mircea_popescu: it's more of a contest of possible scapegoats.
decimation: like the soviets, they probably are going to pick the guy who is 'least likely to surrender to the foundation'
assbot: Last 6 lines bashed and pending review. ( )
hanbot: mircea_popescu not inasfar as unactivated virii implies knowable potential
assbot: <i>Negroes and the Gun</i>: A Winchester “in every Black home” - The Washington Post ... ( )
assbot: Sadism is not an excuse to be awful! » Not Just Bitchy ... ( )
mircea_popescu: in other news, is why "safewords" are utter bs. really, "red" midstride ? not happening.
assbot: The Pervocracy: The Myth of the Boner Werewolf. ... ( )
asciilifeform: paging herr mocsny:
asciilifeform: 'Try this one on for size. A man and woman are together, making out, removing clothes, getting totally naked, engaging in foreplay with both partners active, the woman mounts the man and begins rubbing her stuff on his stuff, without penetration but obviously that’s the next step; and then she suddenly says “I’m uncomfortable doing this,” and turns completely cold. I’ve experienced this. I respected the “No” but
asciilifeform: I have to tell you it felt like an icy dagger being pounded straight into my heart. People tell me I’m pretty easy-going and in that situation I believed I proved it. But I really hope there aren’t too many women who make a habit of this. Because I don’t think men are biologically constructed to pass such tests reliably.'
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu ^
assbot: » Danimal Archive, part 2. ... ( )
mircea_popescu: it's just infantilism. girlie trying to test the limits of her world.
mircea_popescu: it's unhealthy for said world to just infinitely give way in all directions all the time. at least some of the time she has to come face flat against a stone wall.
mircea_popescu: for sanity, if nothing else.
asciilifeform: but in the corner of the room, a little red-white-and-blue weasel sits and whispers in her ear, 'we can move, remove, all the walls, in exchange for just a trifle'
BingoBoingo: And seriously spz safewords are a thing red is a horribru one. Now Balloon or "I'm not just sure, I'm HIV positive" might have some potential.
mircea_popescu: i think red is by far the widest used.
asciilifeform: know of any logical reason for this?
mircea_popescu: anyway, the whole construction's fucking irresponsible. for one thing, the subject's not in any position to evaluate anything. there are specific, well documented, well understood biological mechanisms that prevent a sane evaluation.
mircea_popescu: if you handling the cane can't tell when she;s had enough, her with the bruises and marks CERTAINLY can't.
BingoBoingo: Red is one of the worst imagineable for the purpose. It does nothing to break the context of the situation and fits in too many contexts appropirate to the situation. It's like a trailer park feeding trough using icecream as its safe word to get gluttons to leave.
mircea_popescu: not to mention the entire fucking point of the exercise is for the sub/slave to SUBMIT. not to constantly feed the red herring of "individual self determination"
mircea_popescu: not that i've actually met a woman seriously into bdsm that was all derpy with this atomic consent bs anyway.
mircea_popescu: it's mostly the avatar of teenagers that wish to pretend they're adults, and make up their parallel adult world to inhabit.
asciilifeform: and so read log; now, what's this i hear re: a 10mb statically-linked bitcoind ?!
asciilifeform: what arch ?
asciilifeform: somebody did something odd
mod6: yeah, im sure i did.
mod6: dynamically linked ~18mb, statically linked (that didn't work) ~28mb
mod6: that was on obsd. which subsequently coredumped on execute
mod6: so ~10mb /difference/
asciilifeform: << anyone here admits to being responsible for this ?
assbot: Encryption - Sasecurity Wiki ... ( )
mod6: im still wrestling with trying to compile bitcoind on linux with statically linked libs & objects.
asciilifeform: mod6: 'portatronic' will do it
asciilifeform: ought to work on any reasonable unix
asciilifeform: did you find otherwise ?
mod6: no, havnet tried it. ben is building it currently actually. thanks.
asciilifeform: i used that little script to build the armv5 bins
asciilifeform: (also posted to listserv a while ago)
BingoBoingo: mod6: Your appearance reminded me to update with the protocol.cpp #includes
assbot: Notes on Building Bitcoin-qt on OpenBSD | Bingo Blog ... ( )
BingoBoingo: !up jborkl
mod6: BingoBoingo: ah, yeah cool. :]
BingoBoingo: I also killed the block files and block index with my build today to test syncing again. Almost to 16801 again.
mod6: ok cool.
BingoBoingo: This run with a 4GB process RAM limit it hasn't crashed yet. Just crossed the 512 MB line around block 153000
mod6: *nod* i wanna say that mine usually blows up around like 200-230k or w/e
BingoBoingo: Well I'll report what happens when I get to March 2013 again
mod6: (always past the last checkpoint, but usually before 252450)
mod6: ok thanks BB
BingoBoingo: I was at late Feb 2013 though when I killed my stuff to sync again
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2681 @ 0.000755 = 2.0242 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: realize that the obscene memhunger is 99+% bastard blocks
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: don't take my word for it, either. 'valgrind.'
assbot: Online Document Sheds Light on Proposed Drone Rules - WSJ ... ( )
asciilifeform: (doesn't require any actual work to use, just run as described earlier in log)
decimation: "Federal regulators plan to propose rules that would limit commercial drone flights to below 500 feet, daytime hours and within sight of the operator, while also requiring operators to pass written exams, according to a federal document posted online Friday."
decimation: they've been 'working' on these rules for more than 4 years and this is what they come up with? the status quo?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I might give that a go next time
decimation: in case folks are unfamiliar, usg claims the air on 'your' land starting at 0 feet
asciilifeform: decimation: the actual law, as always, is 'not caught, not thief.'
asciilifeform: as with mircea_popescu's unlicense.
decimation: yeah as if people are going to pay usg to fly their 'aircraft' at 500 feet within sight of the operator
decimation: the whole point of the 'drone license' was that somehow drones would be able to fly farther
asciilifeform: the corollary to the 'first law,' 'not caught not thief' - is 'may as well hang for a sheep as a lamb'
asciilifeform: as in, if flying a pilotless machine from washington to new york is punishable with life at hard labour, the cargo may as well be cocaine
asciilifeform: or trotyl
asciilifeform: or whatever.
BingoBoingo: torglodiesel
BingoBoingo: *troglodiesel
decimation: maximal bureaucratic ass covering plus 'anarchotyranny'
decimation: ie 'anarchy for those who choose to thumb their nose at the law', tyranny for anyone who desires to comply
asciilifeform: decimation: nah, 'anarchotyranny' - useful term, commonly understood - is when certain useful idiots are permitted a free hand to terrorize designated victims
decimation: yeah usually the way the term is used, the 'anarchy' group is associated with privileged classes to whom the law does not practically apply
assbot: The Killer, the Reporter, and the Southern Poverty Law Center - Hit & Run : ... ( )
decimation: BingoBoingo: the splc is one of the official 'victim' group selectors
BingoBoingo: That it is
asciilifeform: << small l0l: the ru example is atrociously off
assbot: Ivy Style » Secret Society: NSA Recruiting Ads At Brown, 1968 ... ( )
decimation: asciilifeform: what does the ru version say?
asciilifeform: it's a dictionary gloss of the engl.
decimation: ah without conjugation?
mircea_popescu: troglodiesel lmao
assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( )
decimation: "“Going to Africa. Hope I don’t get AIDS. Just kidding. I’m white!”
decimation: She chuckled to herself as she pressed send on this last one, then wandered around Heathrow’s international terminal for half an hour, sporadically checking her phone. No one replied, which didn’t surprise her. She had only 170 Twitter followers."
decimation: "Sacco boarded the plane. It was an 11-hour flight, so she slept. When the plane landed in Cape Town and was taxiing on the runway, she turned on her phone. Right away, she got a text from someone she hadn’t spoken to since high school: “I’m so sorry to see what’s happening.” Sacco looked at it, baffled."
decimation: No rasis comment goes unpunished!!
mircea_popescu: what exactly "was happening" ?
decimation: well, it's our old friends at valleywag
decimation: "It’s possible that Sacco’s fate would have been different had an anonymous tip not led a writer named Sam Biddle to the offending tweet. Biddle was then the editor of Valleywag, Gawker Media’s tech-industry blog. He retweeted it to his 15,000 followers and eventually posted it on Valleywag, accompanied by the headline, “And Now, a Funny Holiday Joke From IAC’s P.R. Boss.”"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56200 @ 0.00039092 = 21.9697 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: so basically nothing.
decimation: right
decimation: then the author takes the occasion to rail against whippings and pillories from 200 years go
mircea_popescu: but good for the sheeple to find out that okcupid and tinder are owned by the same thing.
mircea_popescu: that also owns vimeo.
decimation: "The movement against public shaming had gained momentum in 1787, when Benjamin Rush, a physician in Philadelphia and a signer of the Declaration of Independence, wrote a paper calling for its demise — the stocks, the pillory, the whipping post, the lot. “Ignominy is universally acknowledged to be a worse punishment than death,” he wrote. “It would seem strange that ignominy should ever have been adopted as a milder punishment
decimation: than death, did we not know that the human mind seldom arrives at truth upon any subject till it has first reached the extremity of error.”"
mircea_popescu: (and apparently is no longer buddies with gawker media)
decimation: it neatly connects the libtards of 1776 with the libtards of today
mircea_popescu: now, the real journo story : how deep a discount did gawker offer on their advertising, who said no, why did they say no.
mircea_popescu: THIS is how these shits "happen".
decimation: and which new york jew now owns the whole thing?
mircea_popescu: "oh, IAC said our deeply discounted CPM is not worth paying for anyway because we don't have any actual relevancy / power online ??!?!?!"
mircea_popescu: "FINE PROVE IT TO THEM!!111"
decimation: mircea_popescu: there's no mention of this obvious motivation in the story
mircea_popescu: parallel construction is apparently a universal hobby. "tipsters" ? what tipsters. nobody fucking tips gawker.
decimation: 'six words from any 'honest man''
mircea_popescu: except it doesn't actually do anything. gawker is entirely myspace'd.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: re portotronic, what's the right thing to do with CROSS_PREFIX for non-arm builds? omit from script entirely?
mircea_popescu: its audience is idiots, and this is publicly known. so...
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: replace with your compiler
decimation: apparently it's enough for the new york times to get an independent op-ed
mircea_popescu: anyway, in vaguely related news, i'm preparing a pretty lulzy "outrage the feminists" thing for later.
mircea_popescu: should be interesting to see what comes of it.
mircea_popescu: decimation : "independent op ed" = "piece written for narcissist that we didn't have to pay'
decimation: actually, the whole thing smacks of doctor_why_bother
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: or, wait, yeah
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: you will have to strip out the dash and the $CROSS_PREFIX
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: aha. in the middle of it already.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: CFLAGS should read something like -I/usr/include ?
asciilifeform: use the expected values for your machine.
ben_vulpes: thanks for the patience, much of this is over my head. but what better way to contaminate my mind with the c toolchain than bitcoind
asciilifeform: also realize that the script is not a 'makefile' and will pointlessly repeat heavy work if rerun
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> use the expected values for your machine. << ahahaha "expected values" ahaha as if
asciilifeform: a good project might be to transform it into a makefile.
asciilifeform: i didn't feel like fighting gnumake's retardation re: treatment of envir. vars. and recursive invocations of self
asciilifeform: hence the bash script.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: contaminate my mind with the c toolchain << if it isn't a secret, what do you normally work with ?
asciilifeform: apple's compiler ?
ben_vulpes: clients
ben_vulpes: python, bash, clojure.
ben_vulpes: ruby as necessary to unfuck other people's mistakes.
ben_vulpes: go ibid
asciilifeform: so, whatever's brought ?
ben_vulpes: a pauper is i.
Adlai prefers "this is shit, let me do it in lisp"
Adlai: excellent way of screening clients
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: other people in the shop use the apple toolchain and the android toolchain. all i ever do with those is "turn the right nut" when it comes to "signing" binaries for apple/google and cutting builds.
ben_vulpes: the apple binary signing process is hilaribad.
ben_vulpes: "fix this issue with your keys?"
ben_vulpes: sure, why not.
ben_vulpes: they're not real keys, as far as i care.
trinque: I switced the deedbot blockchain to an ssd ebs volume
trinque: still slow as fuck
decimation: re: apple compilers < i wasted a few hours last week trying to get macports to build 'octave'
decimation: turns out gcc4.9 would not link properly with the osx standard c++ library
decimation: but clang would
asciilifeform: !s llvm
assbot: 27 results for 'llvm' :
asciilifeform: glue with broken glass.
ben_vulpes: decimation: i've wasted 3 days over the past two weeks trying to get a modern browser to boot into x11 for os x.
ben_vulpes: i've more or less given up at this point.
trinque: ben_vulpes: dual boot the gentoos
assbot: Metcraft Floor Mount Combo Lavatory Sink and Toilet Fixture Stainless Steel | eBay ... ( )
asciilifeform: ^ building own prison? just what you need.
ben_vulpes: looks bad for the back.
trinque watches atop -d... what the hell is btcd reading at a sustained 4mb/sec
trinque: what is ram for
trinque: and how does it need anything but the top of the blockchain
asciilifeform: trinque: it doesn't
assbot: Logged on 15-02-2015 02:25:58; asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: realize that the obscene memhunger is 99+% bastard blocks
decimation: asciilifeform: does the same company sell the sought-after toilet/kitchen sink combo?
BingoBoingo: decimation: In cell, that is kitchen sink
asciilifeform: if prison cells had kitchenettes - i'm quite certain they would.
decimation: of course, in comparison what what was suffered in ru's gulags, such an arrangement is quite luxurious
trinque: anyone have a high bandwidth node I can give to deedbot to speed his ass up?
trinque: *give its IP
assbot: my stack protector wasn't working ... ( )
ben_vulpes: a RagnarDanneskjol!
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: x86 is actually among the more lenient architectures for 'unaligned access'
ben_vulpes: all these old names popping up.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: but on all machines you're likely to meet, there is at the very least a performance penalty for them
BingoBoingo: Interesting
asciilifeform: if you sit and think for a minute about how the memory works, it becomes clear why.
decimation: more lolz < "Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D., Mass.), a member of the Banking Committee and an outspoken critic of the Fed’s oversight of big banks, said she does not support Mr. Paul’s proposed legislation [to force a complete audit of the fed], which she said could have “dangerous” implications for monetary policy."
assbot: Elizabeth Warren Won't Back Rand Paul's Audit the Fed Bill - Hit & Run : ... ( )
decimation: ^ this might actually be qntra worthy if someone puts the right spin on it
BingoBoingo: decimation: Are you volunteering? If not I can write something up
decimation: nah I don't think I can write good.
assbot: ... ( )
assbot: New agency to sniff out threats in cyberspace - The Washington Post ... ( )
mircea_popescu: !up Jrum
decimation: !up PinkPosixPXE
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