Hide Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2014-03-30 | 2014-04-01 → ↓
bitcoinpete: never a dull moment
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12267 @ 0.00095132 = 11.6698 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.62105 = 1.2421 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.62016666 = 3.721 BTC [-] {2}
jayk_: http://imgur.com/gallery/NgX75
ozbot: Smartass kid test answers - Imgur
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 25 @ 0.61479598 = 15.3699 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.0560001 = 0.112 BTC [-]
MisterE: yea glad I jumped out yesterday despite booking minor loss
MisterE: I'll coin up by getting in lower now
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12500 @ 0.00094827 = 11.8534 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20572 @ 0.00094771 = 19.4963 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17378 @ 0.00094418 = 16.408 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20725 @ 0.00095157 = 19.7213 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 7 @ 0.61 = 4.27 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.605 = 1.815 BTC [-]
benkay: pankkake: what was dotcoin's operation that did the forced buyback list their 'asset'?
benkay: on what 'exchange' did dotcoin issue the paper he later did the forced buyback on?
pankkake: I don't know much besides https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=361852.0 and him doing an IPO every other week
pankkake: not sure it always cryptostocks, maybe sometimes direct
benkay: ;;gettrust bitcoinpete
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user benkay to user bitcoinpete: Level 1: 1, Level 2: 1 via 1 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=benkay&dest=bitcoinpete | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=bitcoinpete | Rated since: Fri Mar 28 09:14:47 2014
bitcoinpete: ;;ident bitcoinpete
gribble: Nick 'bitcoinpete', with hostmask 'bitcoinpete!~bitcoinpe@S01060016cbc6cced.ed.shawcable.net', is identified as user 'bitcoinpete', with GPG key id 165749929F9A6BDD, key fingerprint E6625CC14638C4CA404694E9165749929F9A6BDD, and bitcoin address None
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11037 @ 0.00095263 = 10.5142 BTC [+]
MisterE: ;;ident MisterE
gribble: Nick 'MisterE', with hostmask 'MisterE!~MisterE@unaffiliated/mistere', is not identified.
MisterE: I should make a join command to ident
benkay: ident party
benkay: join command MisterE ?
MisterE: Server connection commands is a better term... My client can perform functions when connecting to a network like i have it set up to auth with some bots that control channel access so I dont have to mess with it each time I connect.
MisterE: I could do something like that with gribble
kakobrekla: ;;later tell mike_c spam got in your blogs comments
gribble: The operation succeeded.
MisterE: /quote PRIVMSG is a great thing
kakobrekla: i want to take the credit :D
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1672 @ 0.00094418 = 1.5787 BTC [-]
MisterE: damn that spam is always triggering please moderate...
MisterE: hate that
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.0009429 = 6.1289 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9500 @ 0.00094337 = 8.962 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15850 @ 0.00094265 = 14.941 BTC [-] {3}
benkay: dunno MisterE automating gpg sounds like a recipe for disaster
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.10144642 = 0.2029 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21300 @ 0.0009425 = 20.0753 BTC [-] {2}
MisterE: yea just the auth request part
MisterE: I just need a prompt to do it each day really
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4931 @ 0.00094337 = 4.6518 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19650 @ 0.00094512 = 18.5716 BTC [+] {2}
benkay: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 439.79, Best ask: 440.34, Bid-ask spread: 0.55000, Last trade: 439.79, 24 hour volume: 36193.72912515, 24 hour low: 436.0, 24 hour high: 489.87, 24 hour vwap: 456.659521246
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 442.64, vol: 36210.30507710 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 450.44, vol: 36884.49387 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 443.7999, vol: 36343.85160144 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 456.69, vol: 169.3328953 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 436.83164, vol: 6226.31680000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 447.0, vol: 35.89071301 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 508.824, vol: 221.6968638 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)
BingoBoingo: ;;more
gribble: 445.318033737
benkay: helluva power law on the volume
benkay: bitstamp 36k
benkay: o wait this is not sorted by vol
benkay: nanotube: what would be the implications of sorting gribble market output by exchange volume?
benkay: ;;later tell mircea_popescu what would be the implications of sorting gribble market output by exchange volume?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
benkay: horrible idea?
BingoBoingo: benkay: Prolly not a bad one
benkay: i've probly had worse
kakobrekla: kraken whole 35btc worth eh.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14700 @ 0.00094899 = 13.9502 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 923 @ 0.00094955 = 0.8764 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: kakobrekla: I'll take one of those wiki logins, plz
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.056 = 0.336 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7632 @ 0.00095483 = 7.2873 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 8 @ 0.5910375 = 4.7283 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05737336 = 0.1147 BTC [+] {2}
moiety_: kakobrekla: a wiki? :D if you want me to proof it periodically, or anything else, send me a log in too :)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.10144642 BTC [-]
moiety_: lol @ "too honest for a sgady logo"
moiety_: shady*
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.590003 = 3.54 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: sure, pm
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16850 @ 0.00095108 = 16.0257 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 99 @ 0.00603211 = 0.5972 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17500 @ 0.00095074 = 16.638 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20100 @ 0.00094565 = 19.0076 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.62613079 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 18 @ 0.10144642 = 1.826 BTC [-]
Namworld: okay, seriously... I'm not registering, NYtime, to view an article
Namworld: All those news link block reading till you register. It's free, so why even ask for registration.
antephialtic: interesting to see the neo&bee scam finally implode
antephialtic: though I think this will be bad for BTC stocks in general - this was a fairly elaborate scam, and many will probably not trust btc denominated investments for a long time
kakobrekla: just FYI
ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings
kakobrekla: so, first.
antephialtic: I didn't invest, even if it wasn't a scam, it was a pretty bad business plan
antephialtic: since 99% of their accounts were denominated in euros, they were hugely exposed to the price of BTC
antephialtic: investing in neo was basically a highly leveraged bet on the price of BTC itself, with the risks completely outweighing any possible benefits - assuming the business was completely legitimate
antephialtic: which, seemingly is not the case
kakobrekla: the brick and mortar trick is still something new in btcland
antephialtic: lesson: people are stupid
antephialtic: and bitcoin seems to attract people that are exceptionally stupid.
kakobrekla: interestingly enough the conviction 2 years ago was exactly the opposite
antephialtic: yeah, well all those people sold at $1200 to the new batch of morons
kakobrekla: i didnt
Namworld: That's not okay, kakobrekla. You should have sold all at $1200 to rebuy later.
Namworld: "Hindsight and time-machine required"
kakobrekla: too much counter party risk
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10227 @ 0.00094987 = 9.7143 BTC [+]
VanCleef: kakobrekla you blew it
VanCleef: could have easily doubled up by now
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11150 @ 0.00094905 = 10.5819 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10550 @ 0.00094885 = 10.0104 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3750 @ 0.00095209 = 3.5703 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30037 @ 0.00094885 = 28.5006 BTC [-] {2}
cazalla: Bitcoin price above $1000 before April - damn, did i get this bet wrong
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17900 @ 0.00094645 = 16.9415 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6625 @ 0.00094552 = 6.2641 BTC [-]
random_cat: some hours remain :D
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16152 @ 0.0009447 = 15.2588 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13318 @ 0.00094474 = 12.582 BTC [+] {2}
moiety: <Namworld> "Hindsight and time-machine required" << lolol where can i get these?!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21950 @ 0.00094898 = 20.8301 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.04688799 = 0.1407 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 446.0, Best ask: 447.8, Bid-ask spread: 1.80000, Last trade: 446.0, 24 hour volume: 34451.88813870, 24 hour low: 436.0, 24 hour high: 486.7, 24 hour vwap: 454.386601264
assbot: Just-Dice stat: 15022 BTC profit, 31.8k BTC invested, 949.66 mio bets, 5.12 mio BTC wagered
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15805 @ 0.00095156 = 15.0394 BTC [+] {2}
ThickAsThieves: While CEO Danny Brewster is out of the country and has not made an official statement on the events, he denied anything untoward about his actions.
ThickAsThieves: “My silence is for a very valid and personal reason, all the rumors that are flying about are false and couldn’t be further from the truth. I haven’t moved from Cyprus or anything of the kind I am TEMPORARILY out of the country resolving some big issues that were made much worse by people stating incorrect facts in a public forum.”
ThickAsThieves: this statement is odd "What’s even stranger is that LMB Holdings’ shares are not traded via Havelock Investments, only Neo & Bee’s."
ThickAsThieves: considering the prospectus says: "LMB Holdings Share Structure
ThickAsThieves: Public investors currently hold 5,042,638 LMB Holdings shares (31.5164875% of the profits), whilst LMB Subsidiaries Limited (UK) shall hold 10,957,362 shares 68.4835125% of the profits), for a total of 16,000,000 LMB Holdings virtual shares, which represent 100% of the global profits of the LMB Subsidiaries Limited (UK)."
ThickAsThieves: kako, it was me that suggested the wiki and categories, thx for making it
ThickAsThieves: cool to see the b-a site growing
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17700 @ 0.00094936 = 16.8037 BTC [-]
ozbot: Long Term Update: at support | Bitcoin Trading Signals
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11800 @ 0.00094936 = 11.2024 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7250 @ 0.00094936 = 6.8829 BTC [-]
dirt_: I thought it was odd too. Mixing personal/business, and blaming a public forum? what, bitcointalk?
dexX7: <Ukyo> Anyone awake with ukyo.loan shares? << related to neo? ;)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.607994 = 1.216 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.59200003 = 1.184 BTC [-]
the20year2: Could be
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 9 @ 0.590003 = 5.31 BTC [-]
the20year2: so this neobee thing has to do with ukto?
dexX7: it's only a very, very wild theory
ThickAsThieves: did Ukyo elaborate?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 18 @ 0.59000055 = 10.62 BTC [-] {4}
dexX7: <whitty> me ukyo
dexX7: <Ukyo> whitty: give me a min. jsut doing some testing
dexX7: that's all
ThickAsThieves: oh he's probly just making a claims page
ThickAsThieves: maybe paying divs?]
dexX7: the quote was from yesterday btw
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22152 @ 0.00095199 = 21.0885 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8493 @ 0.00094936 = 8.0629 BTC [-]
dirt_: Do you think neobee situation will last all week/longer?
artifexd: ;;later tell bitcoinpete If you're going to have "IRC Nicknames" in the title, maybe discuss them in the post proper instead of just the footnotes?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
dexX7: dirt_: i think no one knows at this point
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2150 @ 0.00095149 = 2.0457 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06402556 = 0.1281 BTC [-] {2}
andreas_: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 460.08, Best ask: 462.0, Bid-ask spread: 1.92000, Last trade: 460.02, 24 hour volume: 34256.39991395, 24 hour low: 436.0, 24 hour high: 486.7, 24 hour vwap: 453.455374355
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06060102 = 0.1818 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06060102 = 0.1818 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell benkay what do you mean ?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: nubbins` you're deluding yourself. whether there's a fee for participation or not, the defendant's risking something participating.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51628 @ 0.00095246 = 49.1736 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 534 @ 0.00586962 = 3.1344 BTC [-] {10}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9700 @ 0.00095443 = 9.258 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.06270222 = 0.4389 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: so what's the neobee announcement ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 8 @ 0.06270999 = 0.5017 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: the20year1 it's all a question of who do you want to deal with. to me, forum trust means exactly zero. to the forum, wel... they don't even know whjat the wot is, they're barely discovering chan logs these days.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.06270998 = 0.3763 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: and before you make the kneejerk decision that you'd rather go where the people are, let me remind you that this is bitcoin, and that nonsense already took you to bf once, and then to havelock.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34922 @ 0.00095347 = 33.2971 BTC [-]
mike_c: kakobrekla: thanks, spam cleansed.
mircea_popescu: nubbins`: i don't think borrowing and repaying is a particularly good way of building trust. < it's awful really, more likely to diminish the trust of the rater than to improve that of the rate'ed.
ThickAsThieves: the borrow 1btc for a week thing is silly
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla it's how you manage muppets, a la bitcointalk forum crowd.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves well, it rules out dank.
ThickAsThieves: it opens up those lenders to be targets too
artifexd: What is "dank"?
mircea_popescu: generally the corollary of freedom is that well... you gotta stay vigilant. which explains why freedom is so deeply umpopular.
mircea_popescu: artifexd o you missed a lot of fun.
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
mircea_popescu: hm, bitcoinpete's adventure is quite important : everyone with a WoT account : make sure you turn enforce on with nickserv.
mircea_popescu: otherwise you're just contributing tools to scammers.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo this should actually be in your manual. it's an absolute imperative, you can
wywialm: and what is a good way of building trust then?
mircea_popescu: 't have wot accts w/o enforce.
mircea_popescu: wywialm if you idle here and read, good ways present themselves.
mircea_popescu: often someone needs something done or there's an idea you can help with etc.
mircea_popescu: you know, just like in any society.
artifexd: I was here. Lurking. Watching it live. I just stayed silent because I had nothing useful to add. I did miss the "dank bank" comment.
mircea_popescu: jayk can't believe asshole teacher had the guts to x that answer.
mircea_popescu: artifexd i know about you. i was talking to him tho :p
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16400 @ 0.00095334 = 15.6348 BTC [-] {3}
ozbot: Euro zone inflation drops to lowest since 2009
mircea_popescu: check out how well europe is doing :D
mircea_popescu: bwahahaha
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'll address this deficiency
mircea_popescu: so putin threatens to fuck them up with the energy, quickly the propaganda brigade is out there with preparatory statements
mircea_popescu: "oh, it may be the case everything will be more expensive in the future, perhaps, BUT!! don't worry about it, you read last month all about how low inflation is!"
mircea_popescu: http://i.imgur.com/TRJRSgf.jpg << ahaha this is beyond cute.
VanCleef: speaking of media propaganda the funnest ones i seen was yesterday or the day before, but all american media groups were saying putin called obama about ukraine because putin is weak and looking for an exit
VanCleef: was like wtf?
mircea_popescu: terribly weak, i bet. didn't they pretty much take over and end of story ?
ThickAsThieves: how do you enable 'enforce' of nicks? i'm registered in nickserv, is that how?
mircea_popescu: joecool now that's pretty cool! i had forgotten all about ;;events
artifexd: /msg nickserv set enforce on
mircea_popescu: lol he just missed his reg window
Mats_cd03: balls
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
Mats_cd03: i need wot rating to edit the wiki :(
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 459.5, Best ask: 462.04, Bid-ask spread: 2.54000, Last trade: 462.04, 24 hour volume: 32552.45101504, 24 hour low: 436.0, 24 hour high: 486.7, 24 hour vwap: 452.77957586
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 ask kakobrekla
ThickAsThieves: didnt mp rate you?
ThickAsThieves: oh it was mattc
ThickAsThieves: nickserv enforce does what exactly, forces you to ident with nickserv on login?
mircea_popescu: within 30 seconds
mircea_popescu: NickServ- This nickname is registered. Please choose a different nickname, or identify via /msg NickServ identify <password>.
mircea_popescu: like that.
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell benkay it was btctc if memory serves.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
ThickAsThieves: "The euro zone is far from the deflation that Japan suffered from the early 1990s"
ThickAsThieves: deflation is suffering?
ThickAsThieves: i guess it would affect debtors
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell antephialtic the sort of people who take their information from btctalk and etc are better off not investing in btc stocks yet anyway.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves you recall the minimal theft argument ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: theft 'hormesis' ?
ThickAsThieves: i do not
mircea_popescu: aite lemme find it
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.10144642 = 0.2029 BTC [-] {2}
ThickAsThieves: i can however see how an institutionally inflationary economy going deflationary could be painful
mike_c: well, the biggest debtor in the land is the govt. they aren't going to let things get deflationary.
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
ThickAsThieves: ok i remember now
mircea_popescu: so now, a cogent argument can be brought that japan was wrecked by its deflation years.
mircea_popescu: they survived ww2 and hiroshima as a traditional society.
mircea_popescu: all that is gone now. the reason ?
mircea_popescu: well japanese kids didn't start raping their mothers
mircea_popescu: but they did stop having sex altogether.
mircea_popescu: in the end the effect is the same. japan as you know it is about as relevant to world affairs as the hitite empire.
ThickAsThieves: i wonder if their penises will evolve to clits over time if it keeps up
mike_c: japan gets first crack at karpeles, that's gotta be worth something.
mircea_popescu: they won't make it. just be replaced with some sort of short stocky chinese.
mircea_popescu: i really dislike that type, too. and especially their women.
mircea_popescu: o look, the breakfast pancake is now moving around on two olives!
asciilifeform: they could always grow another yukio mishima, this time with a brain, and go productively geopolitically apeshit
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform mishima had a brain imo.
mircea_popescu: they didn't have teh... i dunno how to call it, the endometrium say.
asciilifeform: now this is probably true. sort of how limonov could not have possibly succeeded
mircea_popescu: right. a man is a zygote,
mircea_popescu: society around him needs to support la revolucion or else... no revolucion.
mircea_popescu: note how well guevara did in chad or w/e
asciilifeform: even the fellow mishima put in charge as 'kaisyaku' failed to do the job (cleanly chop off his head)
mircea_popescu: and i assure you had mishima had a better candidate available, he'd have picked that one.
mircea_popescu: you know ?
asciilifeform: 'can't mold bullet from shit'
VanCleef: what if you freeze it?
mircea_popescu: wouldn't one be worried once his tits are better than the girl's ?
mircea_popescu: VanCleef and you shoot it with a freezefull explosion ?
VanCleef: geez that would be horrible, shitting in a bullet type casing and freezing it and then firing it into someone
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06103288 = 0.1221 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: VanCleef: frozen bullet never worked - because 'pv = nrt'
mircea_popescu: friction melts it.
asciilifeform: not the friction. the gas compression in front of it.
VanCleef: let a man dream damn it
asciilifeform: same as for re-entry from orbit
Mats_cd03: id poo in a shell for you
asciilifeform: or your refrigerator
mircea_popescu: also that.
VanCleef: i was at a party and shat in someones bong once
novusordo: cover the shit with a layer of epoxy
mircea_popescu: epoxy in a bong ?!
novusordo: i was still talking about the bullet
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
Mats_cd03: wtf?
asciilifeform: soviet tale - one drunken idiot tells another, 'i was at this party, and this guy must've been a serious contraband hero, he's loaded - i stumbled around, looking for the throne, and found a little bathroom with golden toilet!' - other: 'fucktard, so it was you who took a shit in the saxophone!'
mircea_popescu: contraband hero huh ? like guitar hero, except the 80s
asciilifeform: (translation mine)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06103288 = 0.1831 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: the brick and mortar trick is still something new in btcland << hardly. mtgox had them, bitcoin foundation had them (before running of to the uk at any rate)
mircea_popescu: dirt_ it's really not weird at all. exactly by the book how these things unfold.
ozbot: Global warming dials up our risks, UN report says
mircea_popescu: chetty you know how this global warming soup sounds to me ? like since the 90s govt was hoping for an alien invasion to blame everything on, and by now they've finally decided that's not happening so going with plan b
mircea_popescu: i guess it's better than plan c, "the daisies did it, man!"
chetty: yeah - a bit confusing how they manage that with no warming the last 15 or so years
mircea_popescu: that's why they didn't go ahead and pretend it was the aliens.
mircea_popescu: Temperature : 44 C/ 111 F (Normal) Temperature Sensor Status : Normal
asciilifeform: it won't surprise me to see 'international komyoonity' airstrikes on uppity third-worlders who won't play ball and deindustrialize. 'punishment for pollution'.
mircea_popescu: see ? 44 c is now "normal" :D
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's not happening.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06402546 = 0.3201 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: there's no "international community" any more than the bitcointalk folks are "the bitcoin community"
mircea_popescu: all that bullshit died in syria.
asciilifeform: the arsonist who torched syria has a box full of matches left.
mircea_popescu: not really.
asciilifeform: they might be a little wet. but i'd be surprised if he doesn't try everything potentially flammable to see what can be burned next.
mircea_popescu: the way this game works is you get one new match once you successfully use the previous.
chetty: I'm sure they will keep trying
mircea_popescu: trying doesn't even count in dating
mircea_popescu: what, world politics ? forget it.
asciilifeform: if this were so, it would've ended with vietnam.
mircea_popescu: it had ended with vietnam.
mircea_popescu: but then cccp collapsed and the us figured its ww2 v2.0
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 43 @ 0.00584171 = 0.2512 BTC [+]
ozbot: History of U.S. Military Interventions since 1890
mircea_popescu: should the recent steps in china's attempts to democratize and capitalize (ie, the opening of bank deposits to risk) explode badly and end china, then the us may figure hey, v3.0!
mircea_popescu: this is possible, but perhaps improbable.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform note the prominent absence of stuff 75-90
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0612 = 0.306 BTC [-]
ozbot: [ActiveMining] Official Shareholder Discussion Thread [Moderated]
mircea_popescu: did they find the real pankkake yet ?
ThickAsThieves: they cant afford to
pankkake: this is so sad… the few shareholders that still had a brain are all over it
pankkake: not even asking how much it cost
mircea_popescu: whoa check this shit out : Posted from Bitcointa.lk - #wDqzUbLiYxa3zutm
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 74 @ 0.00583943 = 0.4321 BTC [-] {2}
Duffer1: turns out the slaughters are proudly reselling hashfast boards/chips as fast hash mining gear
pankkake: it almost seems like it was paid by the ukyo shares
pankkake: and they will likely forget the claims of lost coins on mtgox
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 325 @ 0.00583369 = 1.8959 BTC [-]
pankkake: there are multiple reports of refunds by check (and only that way) with misspellings and missing signatures
pankkake: seriously…
Neil: Geez. I've written the beginnings of a bitcoin network node. It downloads and validates all 293400 block headers in 16.544 seconds.
Neil: Not the block bodies, of course.
mircea_popescu: ;;seen cedivad
gribble: cedivad was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 5 days, 1 hour, 56 minutes, and 5 seconds ago: <cedivad> Mats_cd03: lol; +1
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell cedivad is that you with bitcointa.lk ?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: Neil that's pretty good.
mircea_popescu: afaik benkay never got that far :D
Neil: mircea_popescu: Yeah; was initially connecting to a US node; it took 2 minutes. Looked up a Japan node and it just screams.
Duffer1: they botched their own board dev, scrapped their own 48/55/28nm projects, lost 500 coins on gox, outright stole (and admitted to stealing) shares from at least two shareholders, and lied about everything so far
mircea_popescu: Duffer1 sounds like a solid AAAA+ bitcoin corp
mircea_popescu: not like those fly-by-night ventures.
Duffer1: amazing company!
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
Neil: It's a little over 23 MB of data I think
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21500 @ 0.00095166 = 20.4607 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: anyway, mpoe-pr is moving to bitcointa.lk
ozbot: Author’s Jarring Claim: The Stock Market Is ‘Rigged’ | Video | TheBlaze.com
VanCleef: why doesn't hshe hang out on irc?
VanCleef: make it less of a sausage party
mircea_popescu: to do what ?
pankkake: .lk lets you "follow" users. cool
pankkake: just need a way to import my watchlist now
VanCleef: a. make it less of a sausage party b. provide some insight on bitcoin securities in real time
mircea_popescu: pankkake i seriously suggest everyone move.
mircea_popescu: thermos & co flea circus needs to end.
VanCleef: agreed
VanCleef: i hate thermos
mircea_popescu: VanCleef she's not better informed than i am you know. she'd just say, "what mp said" all the time.
pankkake: a bunch of mods are scum too (sorry davout!)
VanCleef: fair enough
VanCleef: is she your gf?
pankkake: I'm still thinking of doing a 4chan-for-bitcoin but I have other better things to do!
mircea_popescu: up until yest we had this gentleman agreement of sorts that they don't delete the girl's posts and i look the other way on the endless stupid shit they did.
pankkake: (or other worse things to do I can't avoid)
mircea_popescu: yesterday that line was broken, and with it... there goes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.064025 = 0.1921 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: pankkake so do a 4chan, whaty
mircea_popescu: i ran a chan forever, you can have the backup
pankkake: there are some open source projects for that apparently
mircea_popescu: i meant data-wise
mircea_popescu: be nicely seeded with a bunch of good porn, not the shit ozpot spits out
mircea_popescu: maybe even write a proper .bait command.
pankkake: I still wonder how .bait works
mircea_popescu: pulls for tumblr i imagine
pankkake: yes, but I can't guess if it looks for tags or whatever, nor which
mircea_popescu: yea me either.
mircea_popescu: ;;rated cevidad
gribble: You have not yet rated user cevidad
pankkake: anyway, I just wonder how it would turn out when there are no nicknames. maybe everyone will be accused of being MP
ThickAsThieves: some big brains on that girl
mircea_popescu: pankkake so it'd be different from now how ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9999 @ 0.00095149 = 9.5139 BTC [-]
pankkake: eheh :)
pankkake: by the way, romain put up some new pics: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=344219.40 (NSFW)
mircea_popescu: incidentally, here's a fun story : the original pythagoreans all claimed all their discoveries were made by... pythagora.
mircea_popescu: which was kinda funny seeing how the guy had been dead for a while.
mircea_popescu: all through modernity this was recounted as a "look how monastically humble those folks were" sort of tale
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8294 @ 0.00095139 = 7.8908 BTC [-] {3}
pankkake: reminds me of the communist dictators
mircea_popescu: but looking at bitcointalk, im realising it may have been the converse : to your average monkey of 500bc, anyone with a brain probably looked like the sockpuppet of the one guy with a brain
mircea_popescu: so they just accused any greek mathematician of "being pythagora"
mircea_popescu: and it stuck.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19787 @ 0.00094997 = 18.7971 BTC [-] {2}
ThickAsThieves: anyone happen to know the way to look up a UK business license, ive done it before but now i cant recall how
mircea_popescu: ;;google look up a UK business license
gribble: Licence Finder - GOV.UK: <https://www.gov.uk/licence-finder>; Get information about a company - GOV.UK: <https://www.gov.uk/get-information-about-a-company>; Companies House: <http://www.companieshouse.gov.uk/>
VanCleef: so obamacare website ws a complete fail today
mircea_popescu lords it over ThickAsThieves
ozbot: Obamacare Website Fails as Deadline Arrives - NBC News
ThickAsThieves: ah that's the one
ozbot: Companies House WebCheck
ThickAsThieves: i ignored it at first cuz home page was spammy looking
ThickAsThieves: "Free" being a red flag i might be too sensitive to
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 140 @ 0.00539816 = 0.7557 BTC [-] {11}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 46 @ 0.0052222 = 0.2402 BTC [-]
nubbins`: mircea_popescu: what's a defendant risking by participating? his trust rating? that's on the line whether he participates or not!
VanCleef: jesus fucking christ how many threads does active mining need
mircea_popescu: nubbins` the judgement, whatever it may be.
ThickAsThieves: one for each whim of each shareholder VanCleef
ThickAsThieves: probly needs its own forum
VanCleef: lol yeh
VanCleef: activeminingtalk.org
ozbot: The following accounts are operated by MPEx exchange and affiliates to discredit their competition.
Apocalyptic: "to discredit their competition." // they are already doing a fine job themselves
mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic this is really crop of the season stuff.
mircea_popescu: the EXACT same crap was being peddled by all the people upset that mpoe-pr closed down glbse two years ago.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 45 @ 0.0052222 = 0.235 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: they're still around, grumbling. fortunately, they have no btc to show, so it's mostly a vocal exercise.
asciilifeform: i confess that i wonder when i too will be featured on the 'secret soldier-shills of satanix mpex' lists the lamers are so fond of now.
Apocalyptic: asciilifeform, you would have to post at bitcointroll for that to happen
jayk: hmm
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the reptillian brain is driven by visual cues. so, once you're visible.
nubbins`: so he's risking a negative judgment, and this is the reason to pull the plug on the whole thing? O_O
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 20 @ 0.005201 = 0.104 BTC [-]
nubbins`: Hannibal ante portas!
mircea_popescu: nubbins` if he doesn't trust the court to fairly apportion the fees, he has no reason to trust the court with a farthing.
nubbins`: no, YOU don't trust the court to fairly apportion the fees
mircea_popescu: many things in bitcoin are an all or nothing proposition, which is why it's so important to always pick either and stick to it.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 150 @ 0.0051278 = 0.7692 BTC [-] {9}
mircea_popescu: i dun see why exactly you imagine this is personal in any sense. the court as it was failed to do so, that's objective not subjective.
jayk: the irs needed to stay out of bitcoin
jayk punches them
jayk: :\
nubbins`: sure, but the whole thing i was getting at is that the fee structure was flawed from the start, which is why the experiment failed
mircea_popescu: this would seem to be your pet theory, yes.
nubbins`: i have yet to see anything to the contrary aside from some hand-waving about absolutes and subjectivity
Mats_cd03: luls
ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings | Page 223 | Bitcointa.lk
mircea_popescu: "maybe danny is becoming danielle"
mircea_popescu: epic shit.
mircea_popescu: nubbins` you don't have to see "anything to the contrary"
mircea_popescu: that's not how arguments work.
pankkake: ah, she had the list!
nubbins`: man has a round hole, a square peg, and a round peg
nubbins`: square peg doesn't fit, so the hole is flawed
mircea_popescu: you familiar with the fallacy known as false dilemma ?
nubbins`: is it where people dance around addressing an issue? :D
mircea_popescu: (aka fallacy of exhaustive hypotheses)
mircea_popescu: no, it's where someone proposes he knows all the alternatives, which happen to be two, of which one happens to be something that didn't work in the past and the other happens to be his pet theory.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 266 @ 0.00500488 = 1.3313 BTC [-] {3}
nubbins`: i'm not proposing i know all the alternatives, i'm simply proposing one alternative that avoids the pitfalls of the first failure
mircea_popescu: one alternative you claim avoids the pitfals you identify.
nubbins`: consider the statement suitably modified
mircea_popescu: well, i see not problem with it, but it ain't convincing me.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.592 BTC [+]
nubbins`: shame to let such a cute baby starve
mircea_popescu: cute babies starve all teh time, it's the way you feed freedom.
assbot: Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. (http://dpaste.com/1766230/plain/)
bitcoinpete: Although some of you've read my latest blog post, I'm going to leave it here quietly for those who haven't:
nubbins`: ehhh, for someone who goes on about the sham fiat courts so much, i'm more than a bit surprised you gave up on the idea after the first bump in the road
ozbot: Biting Into The WoT Elephant (And IRC Nicknames) | When Bitcoin Met Pete
nubbins`: but hey, it's your dime
mircea_popescu: twasnt a bump in the road, twas a major chasm.
mircea_popescu: i just got better flir vision than you'd expect.
nubbins`: heaven forbid you build a bridge
mircea_popescu: whole thing's rotten.
chetty: the time will come to feed that baby nubbins` , but not yet.
benkay: wd Neil, can you share your source?
nubbins`: chetty: well, we're both sidestepping the issue that nobody in btc space is nearly competent enough to serve as a judge of any sort
mircea_popescu: no, i'm not sidestepping it lmao.
mircea_popescu: it's the fucking problem. citizen judgeship works if your citizenry consists of slave owning educated people
mircea_popescu: not web denizens
chetty: there are competent judges, but they can't be bothered
nubbins`: well i mean "open call for judges" certainly isn't the way to find 'em
mircea_popescu: the latter argues against the former. what competence of the lazy is this ?!
mircea_popescu: nubbins` why not ?
chetty: no lazy, busy
mircea_popescu: ahahaha she's buying neobee shares with aurora coins ok ok
nubbins`: mircea_popescu: because you get applications from -assets neckbeards & wizards who want to crawl up your bum
nubbins`: fun fact, this is not the place where the best and brightest hang out
nubbins`: far, far from it
mircea_popescu: nubbins` maybe, but that has nothing to do : if it's not open it's stacked.
Apocalyptic: nubbins`, what's that place ?
asciilifeform: meta-nsa.
mircea_popescu: the solution is to MAKE the best and brightest hang here.
nubbins`: it's certainly worked so far ;p
nubbins`: almost as well as putting up a lonely blog post worked at fetching judges
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16700 @ 0.00094939 = 15.8548 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: y so bitter nubsy
nubbins`: something stuck in my craw, nothing personal
nubbins`: this isn't the field of dreams -- you have to do more than build it for people to come
mircea_popescu: weren't you starving babies fifty lines up ?
nubbins`: about the same time you were dancing around straight answers, yep ;D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06121101 = 0.1224 BTC [-]
nubbins`: now, i've gotta get to the post office before this 30cm of freezing rain shows up
mircea_popescu: Of the crooked eyes of humanity no straight answer was ever perceived.
nubbins`: have a chew on the fact that rarely in history has "the best thing" ever ended up at the top of the pile purely on its own merits
nubbins`: unfair as it is, c'est ca
ozbot: Attempt to deposit fake bonds in Vatican bank
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.06121034 = 0.3673 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: so am i getting this straight, teh forum is accusing me of backhandedly and undergroundedly manipulating everything while petting my cat and rolling my evil mustachios
mircea_popescu: whereas irc is accusing me of daydreamingly waiting for things to just happen ?
mircea_popescu: i want a trophy for this.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4068 @ 0.00094936 = 3.862 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: 'why does physicist need a wife and a mistress? so that he can tell one that he is with the other, while he runs off to the lab to get some actual work in.'
ThickAsThieves: to be fair, ive only ever accussed you of being stubborn and having an acceptably deviant sexual disposition
ThickAsThieves: spelling*
mircea_popescu: TROPHY!!!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18219 @ 0.00095425 = 17.3855 BTC [+] {2}
ThickAsThieves: you havent issued a trophy process
ThickAsThieves: how can we give you a trophy
ThickAsThieves: lazy fuck
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1081 @ 0.000955 = 1.0324 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06100001 = 0.122 BTC [-]
ozbot: Satoshi donated to Dorian fundraiser : Bitcoin
ThickAsThieves: satoshi's a cheap mofo
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 2.45430027 BTC to 4`887 shares, 50221 satoshi per share
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] [PAID] 4.44000000 BTC to 40`000 shares, 11100 satoshi per share
mircea_popescu: awww sucks
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.10144642 BTC [-]
ozbot: C-word: The Oxford English Dictionary adds several adjectival forms of cunt, including cunted and cu
mircea_popescu: cunty ?!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.0464 = 0.1856 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] [PAID] 5.00000000 BTC to 50`000 shares, 10000 satoshi per share
BingoBoingo: Well...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10139 @ 0.000955 = 9.6827 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: "cunt-bitten" ? like moonstricken ?
BingoBoingo: Well cunt is the new moon. ATC is headed to the Cunt.
ozbot: Coinbase Apps
ThickAsThieves: they haz app store now
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves pretty sure that's not actually satoshi
ThickAsThieves: mp, question/advice-seeking: for someone wanting to take an "idea" and turn it into a respectable business plan, or at minimum, some sort of white paper spelling out all the pieces, what would be the best way to approach it? the default would be a stream of conciousness writing process to where you can work from what you make to categorize and sort it all, polishing it over and over
ThickAsThieves: through iteration, but surely you have insight on the matter.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 500 @ 0.0075 = 3.75 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: maybe you have a trilema link that applies?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17100 @ 0.00095518 = 16.3336 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves well no, a business plan is a commerce thing. you just need to fill in the specified spots.
ThickAsThieves: so working from a template is sufficient
mircea_popescu: you familiar with the apostolic five w's ?
mircea_popescu: i thought you were in journalism ?
ThickAsThieves: who what when where how?
mircea_popescu: who what yes
mircea_popescu: some pope came up with the rule that all reports must be built on this structure
mircea_popescu: sometime in 600ad
ThickAsThieves: i was a layout guy at the paper, thrown into editing some cuz i was not so dumb
kow: high school newspaper
mircea_popescu: thinking may be an unstructured process, like say dreaming
ThickAsThieves: daily rag actually
mircea_popescu: or it can be a structured process. most industry and a good chunk of science, plus engineering (which includes good reporting and good police investigative work) is structured by this principle.
mircea_popescu: this isn't a template, but a structure
mircea_popescu: (the difference is the same as between the rules of static forces on one hand and the facade of a house on the other)
mircea_popescu: (and before anyone lays into me, i'm not really claiming dreaming is unstructured, lay off)
ThickAsThieves: that wiki link wasnt quite applicable
chetty: ThickAsThieves, helps a lot if you have person to bounce ideas around with
ThickAsThieves: what i'm truly setting out to do, is determine whether two of my ideas can really work
mircea_popescu: indeed. and what the bouncer usually has to say is "sucks because what, or sucks because how" etc
ThickAsThieves: one idea would be much easier to map out, the other less so, but i feel the process would force true determination
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves well you'll never know if an idea can or can not *really* work. you should aim to get them / see if they can be gotten to the point where qualified people want to find out if they can work.
ThickAsThieves: i want to convince myself of such
mircea_popescu: no business plan is a proposition of becoming rich.
ThickAsThieves: before trying to convince others
ThickAsThieves: not even about being rich necessarily
mircea_popescu: all business plans are a delineation of something which may or may not be worth finding out if it woirks.
mircea_popescu: they're no different from grants, really.
ThickAsThieves: maybe i should enlist my wife then
ThickAsThieves: she gets grants all the time
mircea_popescu: she can't hurt anything
mircea_popescu: maybe she'll even end up taking you seriously
mircea_popescu: once she actually groks wtf it is.
ThickAsThieves: that is quite possible
ThickAsThieves: just got an email that RENT SPO is on
ThickAsThieves: they did indeed conduct it as i guessed
ThickAsThieves: halted the normal market, and opened the Buy IPO page to only buy new shares
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 8 @ 0.015945 = 0.1276 BTC [+]
ozbot: Bitcoin Address 1N2f642sbgCMbNtXFajz9XDACDFnFzdXzV
Mats_cd03: ThickAsThieves: RS second round?
ThickAsThieves: what's that dexx7?
ThickAsThieves: Mats, 3rd or 4th round by my count
dexX7: bc.i seems to be broken again.. a wallet with negative balance
ThickAsThieves: are you sure it's not just a dumb display method?
ThickAsThieves: like there are doublespends unconfirmed and affecting total
ThickAsThieves: or the like
dexX7: i never saw something like this
ThickAsThieves: seems to be a hevaily used addy
dexX7: true
Apocalyptic: bc.i has been broken for some time
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12995 @ 0.0009553 = 12.4141 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12807 @ 0.00095104 = 12.18 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: lol pretty lulzy.
mircea_popescu: just means the "total available" figure is broken really.
pLambert: anybody want to guess odds that NEOBEE produces a financial statement within the next week?
mircea_popescu: i don't see anything substantially wrong with your 1.4%
pLambert: heh, you saw that?
mircea_popescu: twas in tje digests
pLambert: At least I have my MPEx based investments to offset all the losses from other places :/
mircea_popescu: lmao what have i become ;/
ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings | Page 224 | Bitcointa.lk
mircea_popescu: she's really sticking it to them isn't she
mircea_popescu: tho perhaps i should say him. that thread's basically reduced to one guy spazzing out and a bunch of people milking him for lulz.
pLambert: you better be careful or they are going to hire her out from under you ... or not
mircea_popescu: funny, they don't want to splurge 30 on a mpex reg, but they do want to spend 35 on the mpoe-pr.
mircea_popescu: which, from all the reviews i've read so far, is really very bad and useless pr doing me a huge disservice.
pLambert: I think they only offered 3, she said she wouldn't do it for 35
benkay: !t h rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00666000 / 0.00729929 / 0.00750000 (861 shares, 6.28468898 BTC), 7D: 0.00525030 / 0.00635969 / 0.00750000 (5354 shares, 34.04980275 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.00566124 / 0.00900001 (46815 shares, 265.03101440 BTC)
ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings | Page 224 | Bitcointa.lk
mircea_popescu: looks like there were two people or something.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4000 @ 0.00094936 = 3.7974 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: the forum has become beyond useless
novusordo: the only thing I use the forum for nowadays is following updates from friedcat and the trezor fellows
novusordo: and even then I just have automatic alerts to let me know when they post stuff
mircea_popescu: i use it as a sort of daytime sitcom
ThickAsThieves: i cant gather that kind of joy from it
pankkake: well yes it's the "martin" jurov talked about
mircea_popescu: the unpaid invoices part seemed novel.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves and why not ?
benkay: "Modern media exacerbate the challenge of sorting reality from orchestrated perception." http://www.farnamstreetblog.com/2014/03/stanley-mcchrystal-my-share-of-the-task/
ThickAsThieves: for the same reason i cant enjoy Rush Limbaugh i think
mircea_popescu: which one is that
ThickAsThieves: the pill-popping conservative radio sensatinalist
ThickAsThieves: it's just embarassing i the thougth of people taking it seriously compounds that
mircea_popescu: " Limbaugh is among the highest paid people in U.S. media, signing a contract in 2008 for $400 million through 2016.["
ThickAsThieves: yeah the liberals listen to gawk, the idiots listen to fistpump
asciilifeform: wait, the american zhirinovsky ?!
mircea_popescu: lol he actually fistpumps ?
ThickAsThieves: i just mean they want their ignorance validated
asciilifeform: (or would that be glenn beck)
ThickAsThieves: and nourished
ThickAsThieves: yeah glenn beck is worse probly
ThickAsThieves: when i read the forums i cant help but think some % is accepting these people as reality
mircea_popescu: does he say anything specific other than obama is bad and the country is going to shit ?
ThickAsThieves: whatever gets the pickup-driving racists to feel good (and buy gold), he says
jurov: that's lulzy, martin/forensick uses bitcoin burza avatar too
mircea_popescu: both of these being fairly uncontroversial and apparently the entire bag of tricks of us conservative pundits
ThickAsThieves: trolling itself is something ive never quite been able to fully digest
mircea_popescu: you're probably too old.
ThickAsThieves: i also dislike april fool's day fwiw
ThickAsThieves: get off my lawn!
mircea_popescu: i don't recall the last time someone gathered the guts to try and play a trick on me,
mircea_popescu: but i do recall what i did to them.
ozbot: Edison Echoed as U.S. Court Looks at Software Patents - Businessweek
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10680 @ 0.00095381 = 10.1867 BTC [+] {2}
ThickAsThieves: u dot s dot?
mircea_popescu: "Software makers led by Microsoft Corp. (MSFT:US) say overly strict limits would reduce incentives to develop cutting-edge programs that detect when a car airbag should deploy or let people alter photographs."
mircea_popescu: ahahaha so much lol packed in one sentence
ThickAsThieves: ack it hurts
ThickAsThieves: who let the people photochop!?
ThickAsThieves: let my peepho go!
ThickAsThieves: meanwhile MS is the definition of photo-editing jokes
ThickAsThieves: MS Paint
mircea_popescu: i tell you, really good sentence.
ThickAsThieves: parody v reality aint looking so good for reality
mircea_popescu: “Switch just two people— the battalion commander and command sergeant major—from the best battalion with those of the worst, and within ninety days the relative effectiveness of the battalions will have switched as well,” I’d say. I still believe I was correct.
novusordo: [KS]: i've seen that, I have my own script I wrote before that came around that sends me a text message when he posts
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 30 @ 0.0075 = 0.225 BTC [+]
novusordo: it's nice because i can just use it for any forum member
asciilifeform: 'f Edison were alive today, he would be writing his inventions in software.' << multilayer trololol
mircea_popescu: if elvis were alive today, his name'd be fiona and he'd be doing my laundry.
novusordo: are there any good historical sources of mpex data besides @MPEX1 on twitter? i'm not finding much for historical volume
ThickAsThieves: as long as he'll still sing at weddings!
ThickAsThieves: novusordo, i think coinflow.co still works
mircea_popescu: also this chan, and iirc kakobrekla was selling the whole history db
asciilifeform: afaik the man invented exactly two things - phonograph and... patent trolling
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform indeed.
mircea_popescu: so he'd be writing his inventions... in flash.
novusordo: ThickAsThieves: it seems to stop for most assets in october of 2013 for me... not sure why
asciilifeform: although...
asciilifeform: ;;google paleophone
novusordo: i'm looking for historical data that I can crunch
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 36 @ 0.06068899 = 2.1848 BTC [-] {8}
ThickAsThieves: buy it from kako
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.0561 = 0.1122 BTC [-]
novusordo: oh, the socket seems to have what i'm looking for
novusordo: didn't see it before
novusordo: herp
mircea_popescu: probably more adequate for high volume processing too.
jurov: novusordo, because live.coinbr started in october 2013. afaik socked uses there data, too
jurov: *these historical data
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.10144642 = 0.2029 BTC [-]
jurov: for surrent data, it hace dedicated mpex interface
jurov: amazing no one collected them before
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
asciilifeform: from the loltron:
ozbot: As Cash Use Drops, Do Crime Rates Follow? - Businessweek
mircea_popescu: on pravda today : "Does socialism increase the welfare of the worker ?"
asciilifeform: ;;google the cause and cure of earthquakes
gribble: The Cause and Cure of Earthquakes - General Board of Global ...: <http://new.gbgm-umc.org/umhistory/wesley/sermons/129/>; Charles Wesley on 'The cause and cure of earthquakes ...: <http://methodistthinker.com/2011/03/14/charles-wesley-cause-and-cure-of-earthquakes/>; Charles Wesley, "The Cause and Cure of Earthquakes" 1750: (1 more message)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 20000 @ 0.0001201 = 2.402 BTC [-] {12}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 26 @ 0.0075 = 0.195 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9600 @ 0.00095237 = 9.1428 BTC [-]
thestringpuller: ;;google site:trilema.com mpoe march 2014
gribble: MPOE, February 2014 Statement pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/2014/mpoe-february-2014-statement/>; MPOE, January 2014 Statement pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/2014/mpoe-january-2014-statement/>; MPEx pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/category/mpex/>
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 20 @ 0.0075 = 0.15 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: "Within 30 minutes, I was able to gather 400 unique email addresses, distinctively associated with Bitcoins"
mircea_popescu: excellent opportunity for coinbase to display some pr.
ThickAsThieves: "Cuomo Gives Tesla (TSLA) A New York Direct-Sell Pass"
novusordo: i'm having a hard time understanding what 'username' and 'pass' I'm supposed to supply the mpex socket with...
ThickAsThieves: the one you purchased
novusordo: oh, that's what you meant by "buy it from kako" i assume
ThickAsThieves: you contact him, pay, then he creates access account
ThickAsThieves: "New regulation requires all cars to have rear-view cameras by 2018"
ThickAsThieves: When will eyes be required on the back of my head to walk?
asciilifeform: 'new regulation requires all cars to have arseview cameras by 2028'
kanzure: backwards google glass
novusordo: surely that means all NEW cars, right?
kanzure: someone should run one of the mtgox email address dumps through that coinbase api endpoint
mircea_popescu: kanzure generally s/someone/i/
kanzure: yeah i should do it
mircea_popescu: a generally available index of "idiots involved in Bitcoin" is a good thing.
kanzure: i'm sure it's going to be the same users
kanzure: yes
mircea_popescu: it'd hurt the idiots, but their pain and suffering is required to build greatness.
kanzure: it wont hurt them any more than they've already hurt themselves
mircea_popescu: exactly.
kanzure: remember, they intentionally signed up to coinbase
kanzure: and even mtgox
mircea_popescu: but it's not ok to let them suffer in silence and privacy.,
mircea_popescu: they must be displayed for the general public, so the general public may learn that idiocy has consequences.
mircea_popescu: *painful* consequences.
kanzure: i dunno about that. that's more thought than i'm willing to put into it.
mircea_popescu: there's also that.
asciilifeform: what'd be the punishment here? more load for their spam filters?
mircea_popescu: public ridicule
kanzure: being phished for the rest of eternity
mircea_popescu: "you claim to be a human being, but you are actually subhuman, because look :"
kanzure: basically everyone in that 2011 mtgox dump is target for phishing
kanzure: and if they signed up to coinbase, it's doubly so
mircea_popescu: kanzure how exactly did you form this opinion on coinbase ?
asciilifeform: phish neither picks your pockets nor breaks yer bones, unless one is stupid
kanzure: mircea_popescu: huh?
mircea_popescu: "and if they signed up to coinbase, it's doubly so"
kanzure: mircea_popescu: i mean they are a target for phishing if they also signed up for coinbase
asciilifeform: for what it's worth, i had (empty) accounts on both.
kanzure: mircea_popescu: because they have trouble discriminating between good bitcoin ideas and poor bitcoin ideas ("hand over bitcoins to a third-party")
asciilifeform oils spam filter
kanzure: asciilifeform: that's worth at least something..
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform amusingly, i had accounts on neither, but that doesn't prevent people from trying to phish and etc
kanzure: oh have you gotten phishing emails targeted to you?
kanzure: that's curious
mircea_popescu: i think there must exist somewhere people doing email spiderin by hgand
Mats_cd03: attacking a form without a rate limit... how has coinbase gone this long with this problem?
mircea_popescu: kanzure i was just writing about one as ThickAsThieves posted that link
ThickAsThieves: probly multi-part teams, with one guy assigned to high-value targets
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 cuz nobody srsly cares about em ?
ThickAsThieves: he's the one working by hand
asciilifeform: to all spammers: the folks still using btc-related-whatevers on winblows are in dire need of your loving personal attention.
Mats_cd03: the next thing that poster is going to say in a week is, the password reset form doesnt have a rate limit either and oops, a quarter of the accounts have been looted cause an attacker bruteforced the idiots
kanzure: well they have rate limits on amount of bitcoin they can send at a time on coinbase because of how they claim their cold storage system works
Mats_cd03: yc needs better security experts on their staff
kanzure: so at minimum they have to pretend they have limits in order to not reveal that their cold storage sytsem isn't cold
ThickAsThieves: but jesus antonopoulis says it's sufficiently chilly
ThickAsThieves: or was that blockchain?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17700 @ 0.00094986 = 16.8125 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11541 @ 0.00094925 = 10.9553 BTC [-] {2}
nanotube: benkay: the implication would be that output would be sorted by volume? :)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 22 @ 0.0075 = 0.165 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 5080 @ 0.0075 = 38.1 BTC [+]
ozbot: Are Aircraft Carriers the New West Berlin?
Mats_cd03: interesting idea, there, about playing chicken with national security
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9650 @ 0.00094833 = 9.1514 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29650 @ 0.00094833 = 28.118 BTC [-]
ozbot: Spam and malware, let’s be cool together. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'he either buys a beer for whatever famished kid working in whatever poor quality “website design shop” to obtain credentials, or perhaps just simply is the famished kid in question' << sadder than that. the creds typically come from an idiot inside a given shop who bit a trojan hook himself.
mircea_popescu: also possible, yes.
mircea_popescu: in this case, i doubt the people working at the ro firm actually have access to the server tho
asciilifeform: spam behaves just like other 'multilevel' crapola, in that the objective is typically... to find more places to send spam from.
mircea_popescu: for reasons of sheer ineptitude
mircea_popescu: ie, managing excel is a demanding intellectual task.
asciilifeform: all one needs is to pwn one machine from which someone at least occasionally logs on to the box
mircea_popescu: but that's what im saying
mircea_popescu: the box was never logged into, ever.
mircea_popescu: look at that website.
nubbins`: i don't want my airbag to have the power to decide whether i'm allowed to alter photographs :(
mircea_popescu: it was made sometime in 200x, never to be touched again
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'For Science' (tm) post the sha of payload
mircea_popescu: nubbins` it's worse than that. the lolcats have the power to decide if your airbang opens
mircea_popescu: i can forward you the entire thing if you're curious
asciilifeform: lolcats decide if your... throttle opens.
asciilifeform: dollars to doughbuts, sha will suffice.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8250 @ 0.00094833 = 7.8237 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: heck, let me send you a list of this shit :D
Mats_cd03: i'll take a copy of the zip if you'd upload it
nubbins`: new regulation requires all cars to have under-the-nuts-view cameras by 2015
mircea_popescu: you can have a fwd, pm an email.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 291 @ 0.0075 = 2.1825 BTC [+]
ozbot: Looks like Darkwallet was a scam [x-post TheHub] : Bitcoin
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53650 @ 0.00094826 = 50.8741 BTC [-] {3}
ozbot: Report: RSA endowed crypto product with second NSA-influenced code | Ars Technica
asciilifeform: pankkake: seems like just more crap re: EC_DRBG
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.10144642 = 0.2029 BTC [-]
benkay: ThickAsThieves: software is hard. whocouldanode.
asciilifeform: benkay: software isn't hard. let's not go shopping.
benkay: man this is what i have to say to people who crowdfund software: http://iconicphotos.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/johnny-cash-finger-2.jpg?w=700
benkay: sure, it's never the actual software.
benkay: it's the estimation, constraints, fractal nature of coastline, overreaching ambitions, unmanaged expectations...
asciilifeform: ...and folks who don't even bother, and scamplan from beginning.
benkay: i want to ship a shitload of features! it's going to cost 500B.
asciilifeform: 'i promise to ship a shitload of xxxx. send me xxxB.'
benkay: another thing is, as i said to my colleague recently re a contractor: "ain't nobody motivated by money in the bank."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22700 @ 0.00095001 = 21.5652 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: now that's definitely a thing.
mircea_popescu: "There is an empirical problem with the debate over United States military strategy towards China: aircraft carriers are “dead,” but they can still be seen patrolling the Western Pacific."
benkay: this is very similar to the constant ongoing mining fiasco and how product tends to get delivered (in my extremely limited experience): "you ship a thing. it shows up on my door. if it works, 30 days later i send you a check. otherwise, get out of my face."
mircea_popescu: well obviously. the us can't quite afford to abandon the notion
mircea_popescu: benkay sounds a lot like a mp quote :D
benkay: this in fact is how we run our shop. we sit down, figure out what crazy ideas you have, how to make them into an actual thing, and then work on it at a predetermined rate for a period of time.
benkay: then we bill you.
benkay: "great artists steal"
benkay: fifteen days after the postmark date, we expect to see remuneration.
benkay: that's essentially net 45. think of the float you could be making on our backs!
mircea_popescu: lol myeah.
joecool: that's basically groupon's business model
joecool: except they don't do anything but hold the money for awhile and gamble before paying the merchants
mircea_popescu: more complicated than that. the groupon business model was basically to try and create a scale advantage on both ends.
mircea_popescu: specifically : supermarkets exist to scam consumers, because the supermarket is large, so it can tell any small farmer to stfu and get lost
mircea_popescu: and it can similarly tell any town dweller to stfu and starve.
mircea_popescu: this allows them to buy everything very cheap and sell it as expensive as they want.
mircea_popescu: this is sam walton's business idea, really.
the20year2: The reason they exist is because the consumers demanded year-round goods
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40100 @ 0.00095196 = 38.1736 BTC [+] {5}
mircea_popescu: many lines aren't amenable to the supermarket model, but groupon tried to bring them into the same economics.
mircea_popescu: had it succeeded to make it so "all the buyers are on groupon", it's model of "give us everything for free" would have worked on the merchants.
mircea_popescu: and vice-versa, of course.
joecool: it still works for some merchants that don't have access to their own in-house mailing list
joecool: to gain exposure, it's just not as big as hoped for
mircea_popescu: the20year2 moreover, that's phase 2 material. obviously the supermarket can train the clueless consumer in a number of ways to build a moat around itself.
mircea_popescu: but this recent "can't eat an apple with a spot" neurosis is not naturally occuring in human populations.
the20year2: Certainly is if the population is to continue to grow, if you continue on with less efficient methods of food delivery people starve
mircea_popescu: meanwhile, independent romanian farmers sell 5% milk for 0.5 lei, and 1.5% milk is on sale in the supermarkets for... 6 lei.
mircea_popescu: that's a 95% margin for the supermarket.
the20year2: Median supermarket margins in the US are 15%
mircea_popescu: the20year2 that data is corrupted, and milk is a fine example.
mircea_popescu: try and make a farm selling milk at cost +15% in say california.
mircea_popescu: (they recently had a case about how illegal all this is)
jurov: oh, we have better rackets
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 9 @ 0.06401564 = 0.5761 BTC [-]
jurov: billa moves unsold produce from austria here
jurov: and sells it here for higher price
jurov: every time i'm shopping in austria i must fight rage, everything is really fresher
mircea_popescu: i don't think i've ever bouight supermarket-anything
mircea_popescu: but it's fucking ridiculous that i have to maintain a private supply network in fucking 2014
mircea_popescu: you'd think it's 1984 all over again or some shit.
benkay: or 1300
benkay: your castle needs a supply chain
benkay: what's so novel about that?
benkay: the rest of us grub in the dirt for spuds.
benkay: doesn't sound so novel.
mircea_popescu: yes well for crying out loud.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 8000 @ 0.0075 = 60 BTC [+]
jurov: fortunately, farmers sell over internet now
benkay: vegetables in the mail for bitcoin
benkay: also stop spraying veggies with water
benkay: fucking stupid.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 14 @ 0.0075 = 0.105 BTC [+]
benkay: "fresh!"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.04600136 = 0.138 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.056 = 0.168 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.10144642 = 0.3043 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.046 = 0.184 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.056 = 0.224 BTC [+]
ozbot: Sequestration Will Hollow Our Military
mircea_popescu: "On alert, this tattered, morally compromised army was to clear post in under an hour, move to its defensive positions on the West German border with the Warsaw Pact, fight outnumbered five to one and win. Such odds were daunting."
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 4 @ 0.10144642 = 0.4058 BTC [-]
the20year2: your point?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.59083335 = 3.545 BTC [-] {4}
mircea_popescu: that the us army at no point past ww2 had a standing chance in europe.
the20year2: Very much correct, it was always assumed to go nuclear within 24hrs of the outbreak of conflict
mircea_popescu: yeah, that's what the planning mostly planned for.
mircea_popescu: anyway, just some retired something or the other harping about how expensive and hard it is.
the20year2: to secure europe from the evil russian bear?
benkay: blackwater will eventually own texas, much like the roman mercs ate the empire.
thestringpuller: no march MPOE statement?
pLambert: "In 1974, one could easily find company-sized organizations in U.S. Army Europe" wth does the US have so many troops in Europe?
the20year2: To prevent steamrolling of western europe from Wpac
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller since the option thing is ended ima report it end of month line normal assets.
jurov: thestringpuller MPOE is suspended
benkay: no options, no statement, thestringpuller. who cares, anyways? it's a scam under investigation by the SEC. doomed, I tell you (to enjoy the new scion TC!)
mircea_popescu: pLambert i suspect it was part of the marshall plan
pLambert: and a corrolary: why do we STILL have so many troops in Europe?
mircea_popescu: because yougotta pay to play.
mircea_popescu: if some guy in my neighbourhood decided to go around telling everyone he's the bestest there is, i'd also expect him to send a nubile young woman around for purposes with some frequency.
the20year2: benkay: what stock?
Mats_cd03: funny enough, some countries wont admit to liking having american troops on their soil
mircea_popescu: course not.
Mats_cd03: but they like having american money flowing into local economies
Mats_cd03: laugh
the20year2: arms exports/imports is a nice money maker
benkay: the20year2: logs, man. gotta read 'em. sometimes just like 20 lines back.
pLambert: this guy bitching about "sequestration", has the US defense budget actually gone down at all? I thought we were still spending more every year?
mircea_popescu: pLambert nop but he has a point. it went down very little overall but it cut very badly.
the20year2: guess i'm just not seeing it
the20year2: pLambert: yes, it's set to diminish by a decent amount due to iraq, afghanistan and drawdowns
benkay: in inflationary regime, static budgets are cuts, pLambert
the20year2: Granted, in my personal opinion (As controversial as it is), it's like every other government program, cutting things that are important, expanding things that buy votes
pLambert: And he thinks we should spend just as much, even though we are not actually fighting anybody?
the20year2: The budget is 600-650b, and they want to decrease it to around 500b
mircea_popescu: benkay wait, that's not your girl, is it ?
pLambert: grr, politics makes me angry
the20year2: By reducing manpower, officer corps, cutting basic programs, ect
mircea_popescu: pLambert his intuition is correct, in that the us has no economy, and no technical ability. cutting the army is like cutting its own throat.
benkay: mircea_popescu: naw man i like 'em effeminate and making dinner not deep in the server room.
the20year2: Which I have a problem with, when programs like LCS and the F35 are front and center taking up significant sums of money for low results
bounce: re minimum crime, how does upping the crime rate increase the incentive not to go into crime?
mircea_popescu: bounce take whores. if there's a whore on every corner and prices are low, is your pretty daughter more likely or less likely to start cutting class for to taking it up the tail ?
pLambert: is F35 the one which was designed to fight against russians and has never been used?
mircea_popescu: and by the latest reports couldn't fight against the russians even if it wanted to.
the20year2: The airplane that does nothing more than the plane we built in the early 90s for $200m/unit
bounce: dunno. "everyone's doing it, it's fun!" appears to be a powerful motivator.
mircea_popescu: but that's not the real edge. the guy selling it to her is more likely to not bother, is the real edge.
mircea_popescu: thinking the girl acts of her own volition is a little rich.
Mats_cd03: i rather appreciate whats being done with the f35 personally
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 how's that go ?
the20year2: compared to the f22/yf23?
mircea_popescu: benkay so maybe tell her about this marvelous wot thing we got ? liz i mean.
Mats_cd03: maybe in 30 years we'll be fielding Transformers models of Starscream
Mats_cd03: (yes i know starscream is an f-15)
bounce: whether it's her girlish friends pulling her in or a pimp looking for more meat to sell is a different mechanism but with the same effect; question then is which'll be stronger
jurov: i heard funny hypothesis that f35 is chinese inside job to bleed usg dry
Mats_cd03: well no i think the project is cool and i dont have a lot of problems with pouring R&D money into potentially useful technology
the20year2: corrupt politicians vying for money to their districts makes alot more sense
bounce: likewise, getting robbed often enough is a strong incentive to no longer run a shop (or at least not here, or maybe not a jeweller but a gunsmith, who knows)
Mats_cd03: even if its basically a laundry list of cool shit we want our super plane to have
the20year2: I'm curious what signfiicant tech the f35 produces that the f22/f35 didn't have
mircea_popescu: bounce and wide availability and a commodified market reduces the pull.
Mats_cd03: well, vtol for one
mircea_popescu: a vtol fighter jet ? srsly ?
Mats_cd03: or for that matter, svtol
mircea_popescu: why not make it submersible ?
bounce: it'll be inferior to the harrier, like as not.
Mats_cd03: that'd be awesome, we should do that next
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.04683348 = 0.1405 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05635341 = 0.1127 BTC [+] {2}
bounce: thunderbirds are go!
mircea_popescu: how about also making it cockshaped ?
Mats_cd03: balla balla
mircea_popescu: a submersible flying penis with missiles.
jurov: it should be able to to burrow, too
mircea_popescu: i would imagine that's how it lands.
bounce: yeah no, I don't think it's straight up incentive, or at least not as strong as implied as there's strong pull the other way too. eg gangs don't extinguish themselves
Mats_cd03: anyway, not all the f-35 series planes are the same
Mats_cd03: e.g. one (two?) isnt a fighter jet
bounce: f35 is a brilliant scam, actually. getting permission to deliver production planes when the prototype hasn't had its maiden flight
Mats_cd03: f-35 is useful for air to surface, whereas f-22 is designed for air to air
Mats_cd03: it has had its maiden flight... a long time ago
mircea_popescu: bounce it's a balance point. the whole idea is that stable situations are stable, and derivation from that mean is unstable.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05670783 = 0.1134 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: nothing much harder than that.
ozbot: First F-35B Vertical Takeoff Test | Military.com
bounce: oh I get the point that there'll be some equilibrium or other (pterry's vetinary letting the crime guild regulate the crime) but I don't think the equation is that simple
bounce: s/ary/ari/
Mats_cd03: is so majestic *tear
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.0568957 = 0.1138 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: bounce inasmuch as it's not even an equation.
mircea_popescu: but in general, the crime guild does much better a job of regulating crime than any other guild.
mircea_popescu: the usual problem is that there's no capable criminals to make a guild in the first place, nothing else.
bounce: alright, an inequality, and there's an epsilon, but sheesh.
jurov: wait, the VTO is only for short distance move?
bounce: leadership isn't easy to come by, no. random democratic and/or republican countries haven't managed it in a long time for the usual positions either
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19600 @ 0.0009498 = 18.6161 BTC [-] {2}
asciilifeform: 'keybase' is still alive!?
jurov: such fail. two heli blades would likely be lighter and more efficient
asciilifeform: what does it need to do, fly the 'full spectrum dominance' squid flag?
ThickAsThieves: MArck Cuban is a finance expert now?
ThickAsThieves: “The risk isn’t so much about the small investor,” Mr. Cuban said. “The risk is all these different high-frequency traders playing a game with their algorithms, trying to trick each other, to get in front of each other to make that trade.
ThickAsThieves: “And because we don’t know all the algorithms, because we don’t know the end factorial and all of the different ways they may interact, there are negative consequences that occur as a result. That introduces a market risk. That market risk has an unquantifiable cost. We saw it in one instance with the flash crash. We see it every day with little mini-flash crashes.”
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform liz is a naive chick.
Mats_cd03: jurov for some relative value of short, it doesnt go very far and i dont think you can carry much of a payload either
Mats_cd03: its certainly not as efficient as the chinook
bounce: if I'd wanted to be mean I'd point out that the space shuttle looked spiffy enough but didn't do a very good job of shuttling, n'mind at a suitably low price tag. not that hard to argue it set humanity's progress toward colonising space back a good score years or so.
Mats_cd03: (fastest fixed-wing craft in the army iirc due to two rotors)
bounce: the f35 is made of the same sort of undeliverium
mircea_popescu: bounce do argue.
asciilifeform: shitanium chassis, unobtainium semiconductors...
Mats_cd03: if murica didnt want politicians building airplanes, they shoudnt have elected politicians to build airplanes
bounce: where's that piece reporting on the incoming chief de mission that dug a bit and found fscktons of rot?
kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> kakobrekla: the brick and mortar trick is still something new in btcland << hardly. mtgox had them, bitcoin foundation had them (before running of to the uk at any rate) < perhaps, but thats is not the reason people fell for them
mircea_popescu: true, true.
mircea_popescu: as a selling point it's perhaps innovative. surely beats ken slaughter's garage.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17847 @ 0.00094786 = 16.9165 BTC [-] {2}
bounce: explains it better than I could. if reduced at absurdum it's inevitably too expensive to ever fly well, and it very much looks like lockheed martin deliberately aimed for that because a project that looks it'll succeed Real Soon Now but never really does is the ultimate goose with the golden eggs for the military industrial complex
mircea_popescu: bounce in the end this isn't such a very good argument.
kakobrekla: <ThickAsThieves> kako, it was me that suggested the wiki and categories, thx for making it < get to werk then!
mircea_popescu: Like the US garrison in West Berlin, aircraft carriers are relatively defenseless, but they have a separate function as a highly visible warning about US resolve. Today, a strategy of mobile “tripwires” is neither credible nor prudent, but it is worth studying because it may actually be implemented.
mircea_popescu: Specifically, our bargaining chip against Beijing is to make things uncomfortably apocalyptic. The point is less what the carrier can do and more what an attack on it promises—full retaliation, and a war that may quickly get out of hand. As ASPI analyst Harry White observed last month [11], “the idea is that anyone who attacks as valuable an asset as a US carrier should expect a significant response.” Internation
mircea_popescu: ally, a successful strike would deeply wound American prestige, especially if it went unanswered. Domestically, the deaths of six thousand crewmembers would generate almost unbearable political pressures for revenge. Our entries into WWII and the Global War on Terror were sparked by less.
mircea_popescu: this is basically... cruisin' for a bruisin'.
asciilifeform: 'It was he who invented
asciilifeform: _Leviathan_, America's first (and last) nuclear-powered land aircraft carrier.
asciilifeform: _Leviathan_ was the most successful commercial defense project ever; it ended
asciilifeform: up costing every man, woman and child in the United States over twenty grand.
asciilifeform: The idea of a land ship of that size may seem ridiculous now, but it was
asciilifeform: then the right project at the right time. Two big aircraft manufacturers were
asciilifeform: enthusiastic (carriers mean planes), so was a large nuclear ship-engine firm.
asciilifeform: The major ship-building and steel companies were behind it, as were several of
asciilifeform: the largest unions, then the senators and congressmen from every state where
asciilifeform: any subcontractors might fall.
asciilifeform: The _USS Leviathan_ would not be anything like an ordinary carrier. It
asciilifeform: would be a monster platform, some fifty miles across and equal in area to the
asciilifeform: state of Delaware. It would launch both missiles and planes of all types, and
asciilifeform: it would be capable of fast movement around the countryside.
asciilifeform: In the first design, _Leviathan_ was to run on wheels, thus promoting
asciilifeform: the interests of a large rubber company. But the number of tires required
asciilifeform: turned out to be 135 million, plus spares (a tire change would be needed every
asciilifeform: hundred yards). Unless a complete rubber factory were taken on board#one of
asciilifeform: the alternative suggestions#the entire ship would have to hover. Grumbling,
asciilifeform: the rubber company settled for a contract to provide the giant hovercraft
asciilifeform: skirt required.
asciilifeform: Both houses of Congress shoved through the necessary legislation. There
asciilifeform: were objections that _Leviathan_ would cost too much, would be a sitting duck,
asciilifeform: would devastate any land over which it happened to hover. But by now the Armywanted it as badly as any of the dozens of states, thousands of companies and
asciilifeform: millions of workers. The combined force of industrial, political, military and
asciilifeform: commercial arguments rolled the project over all opposition as one day
asciilifeform: _Leviathan_ itself would crush down anything in its path. One junior Senator
asciilifeform: who continued to oppose it was sent on a factfinding mission to Antarctica
asciilifeform: while the bill was railroaded through.
asciilifeform: From the start, there were problems called "teething troubles". The fans
asciilifeform: which were to lift the craft were at first too weak, then (redesigned) so
asciilifeform: powerful that they blew away the topsoil for miles around the craft, created
asciilifeform: dust storms and buried small towns in soildrifts. A computer company suggested
asciilifeform: expensive monitoring equipment to regulate each fan, but this never seemed to
asciilifeform: solve the topsoil problem. A chemical firm then went to work on a binding
asciilifeform: agent to hold the topsoil in place; _Leviathan_ would spray the stuff out
asciilifeform: before moving. After months of experimentation with expensive agents, they
asciilifeform: found the best to be ordinary water. The _Leviathan_ was now redesigned to
pLambert: ack, wth asciilifeform, use a link
asciilifeform: accommodate huge water tanks holding whole lakefuls of water. Even so, it
asciilifeform: would never be able to stray more than fifty miles from a major water source
asciilifeform: (though thousand-mile flexible pipelines were considered).
asciilifeform: Congress now began noticing how expensive _Leviathan_ was getting. Costs
asciilifeform: had doubled every six months: five more years like the first two, and the
asciilifeform: entire US gross national product would be spent on the land boat. Of course
asciilifeform: the project had too much momentum to cancel, but unless there were visible
asciilifeform: results, trimming would begin. Doddly went before a Congressional committee to
asciilifeform: argue eloquently for his monster. He pointed to valuable spin-offs: the
asciilifeform: Department of Agriculture now knew much more about binding topsoils. But
asciilifeform: secretly he was worried, as his diary showed:
asciilifeform: 'It was he who invented
asciilifeform: _Leviathan_, America's first (and last) nuclear-powered land aircraft carrier.
asciilifeform: _Leviathan_ was the most successful commercial defense project ever; it ended
asciilifeform: up costing every man, woman and child in the United States over twenty grand.
asciilifeform: The idea of a land ship of that size may seem ridiculous now, but it was
asciilifeform: then the right project at the right time. Two big aircraft manufacturers were
asciilifeform: enthusiastic (carriers mean planes), so was a large nuclear ship-engine firm.
asciilifeform: The major ship-building and steel companies were behind it, as were several of
asciilifeform: the largest unions, then the senators and congressmen from every state where
pLambert: oh shit, he is repeating the whole thing again
asciilifeform: any subcontractors might fall.
asciilifeform: The _USS Leviathan_ would not be anything like an ordinary carrier. It
jayk: oh dear
asciilifeform: would be a monster platform, some fifty miles across and equal in area to the
asciilifeform: state of Delaware. It would launch both missiles and planes of all types, and
asciilifeform: it would be capable of fast movement around the countryside.
asciilifeform: In the first design, _Leviathan_ was to run on wheels, thus promoting
asciilifeform: the interests of a large rubber company. But the number of tires required
asciilifeform: turned out to be 135 million, plus spares (a tire change would be needed every
jayk: my eyes cannot keep up with this shit
asciilifeform: hundred yards). Unless a complete rubber factory were taken on board#one of
asciilifeform: the alternative suggestions#the entire ship would have to hover. Grumbling,
asciilifeform: the rubber company settled for a contract to provide the giant hovercraft
asciilifeform: skirt required.
jayk screams
asciilifeform: Both houses of Congress shoved through the necessary legislation. There
asciilifeform: were objections that _Leviathan_ would cost too much, would be a sitting duck,
asciilifeform: would devastate any land over which it happened to hover. But by now the Armywanted it as badly as any of the dozens of states, thousands of companies and
asciilifeform: millions of workers. The combined force of industrial, political, military and
asciilifeform: commercial arguments rolled the project over all opposition as one day
asciilifeform: _Leviathan_ itself would crush down anything in its path. One junior Senator
asciilifeform: who continued to oppose it was sent on a factfinding mission to Antarctica
asciilifeform: while the bill was railroaded through.
asciilifeform: From the start, there were problems called "teething troubles". The fans
asciilifeform: which were to lift the craft were at first too weak, then (redesigned) so
asciilifeform: powerful that they blew away the topsoil for miles around the craft, created
asciilifeform: dust storms and buried small towns in soildrifts. A computer company suggested
asciilifeform: expensive monitoring equipment to regulate each fan, but this never seemed to
pLambert: guesses as to whether it will repeat a third time?
asciilifeform: solve the topsoil problem. A chemical firm then went to work on a binding
asciilifeform: agent to hold the topsoil in place; _Leviathan_ would spray the stuff out
asciilifeform: before moving. After months of experimentation with expensive agents, they
asciilifeform: found the best to be ordinary water. The _Leviathan_ was now redesigned to
asciilifeform: accommodate huge water tanks holding whole lakefuls of water. Even so, it
asciilifeform: would never be able to stray more than fifty miles from a major water source
asciilifeform: (though thousand-mile flexible pipelines were considered).
benkay: asciilifeform: would you pastebin?
Apocalyptic: asciilifeform, you should /part
asciilifeform: Congress now began noticing how expensive _Leviathan_ was getting. Costs
asciilifeform: had doubled every six months: five more years like the first two, and the
asciilifeform: entire US gross national product would be spent on the land boat. Of course
jayk: good riddance
Apocalyptic: benkay, I assume it wasn't an intentional paste
thestringpuller: benkay: stop being a hippie
jayk: lol
joecool: lawl asciilifeform just ruined some days
benkay: thestringpuller: go back to the ghetto
benkay: wb asciilifeform :)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform donation... -> 1B6NP9eb4RKy9tRrXYCJnNcenZkrt5Q2gb
asciilifeform: how much
ozbot: Fail The $400 Billion Military Jet That Can't Fly in Cloudy Weather | Alternet
mircea_popescu: afaik it was up to the malfeasant
bounce: a little perspective here, some tidbits there, add it together and the picture isn't pretty
bounce: can't recall if this is what I recalled, but it sounds familiar
ozbot: Bitcoin Transaction b649dbbd792cd03e6a472e53596877a08e41053a6078595ce712c37935445742
asciilifeform: mea culpa.
asciilifeform: 1btc for the motherland.
mircea_popescu: inb4 we discover haxxors got it.
asciilifeform: where do these go anyway
mircea_popescu: i would imagine to kako's beer fund
asciilifeform: should be good for a small barrel.
mircea_popescu: prolly pay for the wiki
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05738786 = 0.1148 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.04643898 = 0.1858 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05738786 = 0.1148 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 50 @ 0.00388001 = 0.194 BTC [+]
diametric: asciilifeform: what is that?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05738786 = 0.1148 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35250 @ 0.00095014 = 33.4924 BTC [+]
artifexd: What is the precedent for asciilifeform's donation? I don't see anything about it in http://trilema.com/2013/bitcoin-assets-rules-and-regulations/
mircea_popescu: artifexd i dunno, it's been illo tempore policy that people accidentally spamming or otherwise unintentionally misbehave contribute to the port fund
artifexd: Interesting
asciilifeform: unwritten tradition
bounce: re strangecoin, I get the feeling I can stop reading after this: ``Of course, when I give you a dollar for a burger that's not really a zero sum transaction, because otherwise we wouldn't be motivated to enter into the transaction in the first place.'' -- conflating currency-mediated transactions with barter
asciilifeform: strangecoin?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24500 @ 0.0009496 = 23.2652 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: digital interface: Strangecoin: a nonlinear currency
mircea_popescu: if people's understanding of cuisine are on par with their understanding of basic economy, suddenly food in the us is explained.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.05738786 = 0.1722 BTC [+] {2}
bounce: .oO( BurgerCoin )
mircea_popescu: so i wonder if teh numerous sikrit agents dutifully scraping this are also dutifully scraping my in-guild rift convos.
mircea_popescu: memo : teh in-game chat systems are often abused to move sikrits!
mircea_popescu: come one come all, i just kicked inactives and we're down to like 800 members nao. taking all comers.
bounce: so TISAC, then
mircea_popescu: ;;google tisac
gribble: TISAC | Home: <http://www.tisac.org/>; TISAC Handbook - Ravenscroft School: <http://www.ravenscroft.org/uploaded/Athletics_Docs/TISAC_Handbook.pdf>; TISAC | Thailand International Schools Activity Conference: <http://www.tisacthailand.org/>
bounce: ;;google (TINC)
gribble: tinc wiki: <http://www.tinc-vpn.org/>; download - Tinc: <http://www.tinc-vpn.org/download/>; Tinc (protocol) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinc_(protocol)>
bounce: nope. no easy google for you.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.045151 = 0.1355 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.05670683 = 0.1701 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.10144642 = 0.3043 BTC [-]
Duffer1: !t h rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00666000 / 0.00749925 / 0.00750000 (14052 shares, 105.37944000 BTC), 7D: 0.00525030 / 0.00718566 / 0.00750000 (18781 shares, 134.95392746 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.00607372 / 0.00900001 (60333 shares, 366.44601440 BTC)
benkay: now is that the old tranche or the new tranche, the20year1?
benkay: !l h rent
assbot: Last trade for RENT on HAVELOCK was at 0.0075 BTC [+]
benkay: or are they all the same now?
Mats_cd03: anyway, a final word regarding the f-35 vs f-22 conversation...
Mats_cd03: the two are meant to work together as envisioned by the usaf
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3617 @ 0.00095014 = 3.4367 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: so wait a damned second.
Mats_cd03: similarly to how the f-15 and -16 worked together in a mix of relative low and high tech
mircea_popescu: "someone" bought 105 btc worth of rent at 0.0075 today,
mircea_popescu: but the same someone didn't buy 30 btc worth of rent all week
mircea_popescu: in spite of it trading around 50ish for the entire interval ?
mircea_popescu: how's this stuff work ?
ThickAsThieves: magic, mostly
ThickAsThieves: same way it worked for btcgarden?
ThickAsThieves: buy your own shit, momentum!
Duffer1: wasn't rent trading halted during that period?
bounce: too bad for the US' alies then that the f22 is too advanced to be exported even to NATO partners
punkman1: how do you even IPO twice? sounds like an oxymoron
mircea_popescu: punkman1 2po
ThickAsThieves: this is the 3rd or 4th offering i think
bounce: Many PO
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05738997 = 0.1148 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: "Listen porky...
mircea_popescu: If Danny really wanted to scam people, he would have done that right after the IPO but he didn't. He went ahead and invested money in setting up the office, hiring staffers, media campaigns, buying POS devices, sending his hired staffers to conferences and so on.
mircea_popescu: He could have taken off with all the money right after the IPO but he didn't."
mircea_popescu: what IS the word there anyway, any pdfs yet ?
kakobrekla: pdfs? those you have to read. gimme flash.
bounce: can't you stuff flash in pdfs these days?
kakobrekla: dunno, prolly with a powerpoint plugin
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22098 @ 0.00094912 = 20.9737 BTC [-] {2}
bounce: actually acrobat supports way beyond what's decent for a pdf reader
benkay: acrobat a whore
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12150 @ 0.00095014 = 11.5442 BTC [+]
benkay: great tits on that one
benkay: man so i have this pm who'd love nothing more than to get my guys fired
benkay: we're expensive etc
ozbot: Square Market Accepts Bitcoin
benkay: sets us up for a deploy this afternoon
benkay: ten minutes before scheduled deploy
benkay: 'HOLD THE PHONES B I FORGOT TO INFORM ADMIN STAFF ABOUT DEPLOY WAIT WAIT WAIT'
benkay: mind you i've already sent the executive team the 'deploy briefing' email i'm in the habit of sending out before deploys...
benkay: in conclusion, i have determined that the PMs incompetence is undermining his malice.
benkay: either that or he's playing some crazy game i don't understand.
benkay: ('executive team')
benkay: *sigh*
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3993 @ 0.00095014 = 3.7939 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: blackwhite yeah was announced yest no ?
blackwhite: no we announced it today
mircea_popescu: i coulda sworn
Mats_cd03: that was stripe
mircea_popescu: it was. my bad.
blackwhite: yeah they are doing it in beta
benkay: for whom has accepting bitcoin been a big business booster?
benkay: ostock?
mircea_popescu: blackwhite so you actually working for square ?
blackwhite: TigerDirect
blackwhite: they claim they saved more than 10K in fees alone
benkay: it's like consumer 'any txn we can get' ------------------------ elite '1 tx of 5m every two or three months'
benkay: nobody making serious bank with it.
pankkake: so what? less fees less fraud, why would you not do it?
mircea_popescu: it may not make much sense for brick and mortar small businesses a la meze grill
mircea_popescu: however, for an online retailer ? lifeline.
mircea_popescu: just the fact that nobody can chargeback you and pp can't hold your wallet at ransom and that;s enough for anyone sane.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.10144642 BTC [-]
benkay: gotta have the business first tho. no sense in "its gonna work 'cause bitcoin"
pankkake: I spent a week trying to verify my "identity" with a french paypal-like
mircea_popescu: course gotta have the business first.
mircea_popescu: pankkake since bitcoin my response to any sort of such thing is lol.
mircea_popescu: and perhaps, if i feel in a good mood, "get in the wot"
mircea_popescu: but mostly, lol.
pankkake: since they did not read the text I was sending them, I ended up sending a goatse
pankkake: and did the order again, but with another payment method
ThickAsThieves: <blackwhite> no we announced it today /// you work for Square?
ThickAsThieves: if so, props to Square for having you in here
ThickAsThieves: whether incidental or not
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves i originally asked him because i was going to give him a 1 if he can prove it, but seems he ignored it for some reason
ThickAsThieves: maybe he wasnt sposed to say so
blackwhite: hey yeah sorry
blackwhite: yes I work for Square
mircea_popescu: can you prove it ?
blackwhite: haha why should I prove it?
blackwhite: I don’t understand
ThickAsThieves: cuz we care
joecool: shoe on head
benkay: you've made a claim, blackwhite.
ThickAsThieves: if you care to say such things, what's wrong with proving it?
benkay: if you hadn't made a claim, that'd be a different story.
blackwhite: Just a curius question
mircea_popescu: yeah, "cuz we care" i guess.
benkay: but this zone is filled with scammers who won't substantiate their claims.
blackwhite: ahh ok
benkay: we're hostile to unsubstantiated claims.
joecool: blackwhite: a picture with shoe on head will suffice
blackwhite: i see
benkay: what is this we nonsense
benkay: I'm hostile to unsubstantiated claims.
pankkake: I didn't understand it that way
ThickAsThieves: we are a hive mind, in early stages
mircea_popescu: joecool lol whats with you and shoes
benkay: nope.jpg
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20950 @ 0.00094771 = 19.8545 BTC [-] {2}
benkay: just a motley collection of individuals, with individual tastes and preferences.
joecool: mircea_popescu: many of the girls you post in here lack shoes, i am trying to solve a shortage of shoes in pictures
ozbot: The Lost Boys (4/10) Movie CLIP - One of Us (1987) HD - YouTube
mircea_popescu: benkay you know you're my sock, why fight it
benkay: you guys want to hear something stupid?
pankkake: but all shoes aren't equal
benkay: i'd rather be hacking on a bitcoin thing and not getting paid right now.
benkay: instead
benkay: i'm staring at my email, billing by the quarter hour, waiting for someone to drop the ball hard enough for me to call off a deploy on my own.
pankkake: benkay: why not? unless you don't have enough to pay the bills
mircea_popescu: pankkake the girl won't approve.
benkay: relationships are important
pankkake: getting fired isn't hard either
benkay: not really a good idea to say 'fuck it' mid deploy conversation.
benkay: pankkake: it's also my shop.
pankkake: oh, right. not a thing I'd tell my parents either
benkay: oh ho ho up yours too
benkay: i don't know man. i think relationship with this client calls for a little subtlety
benkay: finesse
ThickAsThieves: deprogramming
ThickAsThieves: manipulation
benkay: yeah they definitely need less programming that's for sure
benkay: fewer tickets
Mats_cd03: hi this is dog
benkay: better tickets
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 50 @ 0.0075 = 0.375 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: i can verify i am dog with shoe on head
ThickAsThieves: the RENT is too damn high!
Mats_cd03: more data to follow
kakobrekla: lol tat
mod6: haha
artifexd: mircea_popescu "Take a picture with a shoe on your head" is a thing redditors use to prove that you are who you say you are.
benkay: artifexd: started with 419ers
kakobrekla: until bakewell changed it to a sock
artifexd: That doesn't surprise me in the least.
blackwhite: well my blog is http://www.000fff.org (black&White)
blackwhite: and my twitter handle is @hello_world
Jason: joecool in rl
mircea_popescu: artifexd much older than reddit. yes.
artifexd: knowyourmeme says it started in 2006. Wow
mircea_popescu: blackwhite send me email from your comp account, for instance.
mircea_popescu: artifexd im pretty sure it's pre dotcom.
Jason: blackwhite: i hear you're the squareup man?
blackwhite: i just work there
Jason: blackwhite: ah
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12600 @ 0.00095014 = 11.9718 BTC [+]
Jason: blackwhite: well, my account was banned in 2013 for being 'high risk'. when I contacted support, they simply didn't respond to me. luckily, all of this happened before I switched my entire business to Square (my account was several months old, though). had I of completely switched to Square before I was banned with no explanation, it would have probably ruined my business.
Jason: blackwhite: as I mentioned, support is ignoring me. do you have any suggestions?
Mats_cd03: lol.
ThickAsThieves: seems you figured it out Jason
ThickAsThieves: dont use Square
ThickAsThieves: btw this Square news, it's only for their online marketplace right?
ThickAsThieves: not the app
blackwhite: Sorry to hear that Jason
ThickAsThieves: why the half-measure?
Jason: i'd love to use Square. being an internet sales business, it'd benefit me greatly.
Jason: just, being banned with no explanation of what might have caused the ban and being unable to contact support? well... yeah.
Jason: that
blackwhite: Not sure why you can’t get through. Did you try twitter and phone?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12740 @ 0.00095014 = 12.1048 BTC [+]
Jason: er - that's a little concerning
Jason: blackwhite: as I remember it, in 2013 they didn't have phone support?
Jason: blackwhite: i did try twitter and my tweet (twat? whatever they call it) went ignored, too
blackwhite: I see.
Jason: blackwhite: of course I know i'm just picking on you, but hey - maybe you'd be able to give me some pointers.
blackwhite: yeah of course it
blackwhite: s totally fair you ask me
blackwhite: sorry I can’t be of bigger help.
Jason: i did and never got a response. i'll try again. maybe they changed stuff around
mircea_popescu: twat lol
Jason: blackwhite: can't initiate the email
Jason: blackwhite: Payment card processing permanently deactivated. Click to read Square's Seller Agreement
Jason: won't even let me email them. :p
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10200 @ 0.00095345 = 9.7252 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: Jason lol what did you exactly do ?
ThickAsThieves: probly SR vendor
Jason: mircea_popescu: not a clue
Jason: ThickAsThieves: nop
Jason: ThickAsThieves: did /nothing/ even questionable. tbh, i mainly used it for quick transfers between my bank accounts :P
ThickAsThieves: monbey laundering
ThickAsThieves: terrorist!
Jason: ThickAsThieves: that's what i'm trying to do. they won't tell me what i did for 'security reasons' :-p.
Jason: ThickAsThieves: oh. not trying to do /that/. it was transfers between my own bank accounts! ;)
ThickAsThieves: if we tell you, you will know how not to get caught next time
ThickAsThieves: terrorist.
Jason: you caught me.
Jason: :(
Jason: A++++++ support
ThickAsThieves: maybe now i can for for Homeland Security
Mats_cd03: hey now, we have enough us agencies watching this channel already
ThickAsThieves: i'm good at this
bounce: you'd like as not turn out overqualified
benkay: what, you're going to rep the DHS now ThickAsThieves ?
Jason: Mats_cd03: probably true
Jason: lol
ThickAsThieves: cant have terrorist like Jason using Square to launder money, now can we?
Jason: ThickAsThieves: guess i'll have to stick to bitcoin
Jason: argh
Jason: darn
bounce: there's too many agencies anyway. whatwasitagain, 1200-odd agencies with some sort of "terrism" link?
mircea_popescu: Jason url btw ?
Jason: mircea_popescu: for?
ThickAsThieves: round bitcoin, Square hole
Mats_cd03: irs, sec, fbi, dhs?
mircea_popescu: this shop of yours ?
Mats_cd03: maybe the cia uses -otc from time to time
bounce: why would they? they're running entire banks dedicated to laundring and everything else they instituted AML/KYC CYA BS elsewhere for.
Jason: mircea_popescu: doesn't work since i'm banned :-P
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12650 @ 0.0009539 = 12.0668 BTC [+] {2}
Mats_cd03: buying things from the paranoid, i imagine
mircea_popescu: Jason uh so you no longer have a shop now ?
Mats_cd03: 0days they cant ask the nsa for, perhaps
bounce: peddling tin foil hats? -- now that might be an interesting niche. tin foil hats for bitcoin.
Mats_cd03: (i'm pretty baked and wildly speculating here)
benkay: Mats_cd03: you druggie
bounce: they'd have their own contract with vupen and whoever else sells these
Mats_cd03: what are drugs
kakobrekla: wasnt this discussed like a day or two ago
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.063 = 0.315 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: we should add it to wiki.
bounce: "stuff you buy at the drugstore"
kakobrekla: also sausage department for nubbins.
kakobrekla: anyway, carry on.
Jason: mircea_popescu: i do, but i can't take it online yet
Mats_cd03: so you came to bitcoin-assets for square support
mircea_popescu: ahahah forum rules.
mircea_popescu: person 1 : "I personally don't believe that Neo&Bee is a scam, but very well said. Just becuase there is an easier way to steal money that the scammers passed up doesn't mean it's not a scam."
mircea_popescu: person 2 : "Good to head you think Neo is legit."
Namworld: Forum server if it had an AI: "Please, help, oh why!? Stop feeding me this type of data!"
mircea_popescu: we're lucky there's no hard ai.
mircea_popescu: "Even if Neo ends up failing and Cyprus central bankers win this battle, they've managed to change the world forever. The Bitcoin awareness in Cyprus will not go away even if Neo fails and that counts for something. I know I was part of that as an investor and helped build that to some extent. On the other hand MPEx will go down in history as the clown who badmouthed the competition and riding some donkey in Egypt."
mircea_popescu: it must suck to suck.
mircea_popescu: how the fuck is neobee competition o.o
Namworld: No idea
bounce: didn't get big enough before failing
kakobrekla: not a donkey is it.
Namworld: I stopped questioning why people say certain things long ago.
mircea_popescu: Namworld im not that advanced yet.
Namworld: I probably spew nonsense regularly too anyway. I just let it be unless I feel like debating the topic.
mircea_popescu: interesting argument tho, re "the awareness that won't go away".
mircea_popescu: i wonder to what degree things actually work that way.
Jason: Mats_cd03: i came to -assets to share my story of being randomly banned with no explanation and being completely denied support. had my business of been in full swing with square, it would be a rather large problem.
mike_c: it has some validity. marketing is repetition repetition..
mircea_popescu: Jason extremely difficult claims to verify you see.
mike_c: obviously neo&bee was not supposed to simply be an ad campaign for bitcoin.
mircea_popescu: mike_c yeah but what if the awareness they raised is "bitcoin is an undependable scamfest"
mircea_popescu: i guess we'll actually be deriving some benefit from the ineptly handled neobee shareholder piggybank,
mike_c: i don't think they got that far in penetrating the consumer consciousness.
mircea_popescu: in that we'll see if in 2015 or 2020 cypruss is above or below the norm
mike_c: but they have now heard of bitcoin, and next time it will be the second time.
mircea_popescu: there's also many cultural factors at play. for instance, in a culture which is fundamentally defeatist and patently insane, like romania's,
mircea_popescu: having failed is actually much better than having succeeded.
mike_c: i am not defending his retarded veiwpoint though. "it's ok because neo&bee ran ads".
bounce: so, what're you doing, failing by succeeding?
mike_c: mircea_popescu: same as silicon valley :)
mircea_popescu: bounce i have no idea. the entire national pantheon is basically neobee like scammors. ie, various rebels promising independence from x or y or z
mircea_popescu: then failing miserably but having ballads made about how cool they were
mircea_popescu: it's really not at all different from forum mentality.
Mats_cd03: a surprising number of national origin stories are basically that
mircea_popescu: i mean... guys like iancu jianu. ex road robber, caught, tried, sentenced to hang, saved by ancient rule that noble virginz may save a convicted felon by marrying him
bounce: well I s'pose that gave you a bit of a headstart "researching" the bitcoin zoo
mircea_popescu: became small time country landed gent.
Jason: mircea_popescu: hey - get me in touch with someone @ square and we'd figure it out! :)
Mats_cd03: except the scrub that barely made it is in fact the hero of old
Mats_cd03: (in the retelling)
bounce: what, there's still a vaguely functioning feudal system going on?
Mats_cd03: i guess you could say afghanistan and somalia were vaguely functioning feudal systems in the last few decade
Mats_cd03: ^decades
bounce: oh, that guy appears to've been dead for a good 150 years. oh well.
mircea_popescu: i suppose all of central asia is feudal
mircea_popescu: probably latin america slowly coming to modernism
mircea_popescu: bounce 1700s yeah
mircea_popescu: anyway. "cyprus central bankers" win this battle god help us.
mircea_popescu: that guy must be some sort of a plant.
mircea_popescu: pic relatively related.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3700 @ 0.00095418 = 3.5305 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22150 @ 0.0009544 = 21.14 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11100 @ 0.00095502 = 10.6007 BTC [+] {2}
only: any movie recommendations, folks?
antephialtic: genre?
only: drama?
pankkake: bitcoin: the movie
only: lol
Mats_cd03: inside man, stasiland, attack the block
Mats_cd03: the raid 2
kakobrekla: 'Dead man' is 1/3 drama.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 124 @ 0.0075 = 0.93 BTC [+]
kakobrekla: 'The limits of control' as well
only: kakobrekla: jarmusch fan? :)
kakobrekla: i wouldnt say a fan
only: thanks, 'the limits of control' it is
kakobrekla: imagine you went to a gallery when you watch it :)
tg2: ponzidoge round startign in 1m
tg2: watch the fireworks
tg2: address-wrapper
tg2: ponzidoge.com *
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.61791308 = 1.2358 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 55 @ 0.00576 = 0.3168 BTC [+] {2}
moiety: well hello sane people in here
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11900 @ 0.0009534 = 11.3455 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: 5.007 billion | Next Diff in 862 blocks | Estimated Change: 14.6559% in 5d 2h 33m 34s
moiety: lolol mircea_popescu business cat, Yorkshire version // also http://i.imgur.com/575U3WI.gif
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11700 @ 0.0009553 = 11.177 BTC [+]
TestingUnoDosTre: wow that mouse was good at acting
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.05738997 = 0.2296 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.0451525 = 0.1806 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.05738997 = 0.2296 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 4 @ 0.10144642 = 0.4058 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.0451 = 0.1353 BTC [-]
nubbins`: what's going on with log.b-a?
nubbins`: the order of the words is all fucked up
mircea_popescu: nubbins` what ?
mircea_popescu: ajhahaha
mike_c: log.b-a is doge now
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla lampelina broke it!!11
kakobrekla: seems fine here
nubbins`: now click a timestamp
mircea_popescu: "mircea_popescu: made cool ballads failing but miserably how then about having they were"
kakobrekla: must be ur browsers
nubbins`: it rearranges 'em, still wrong
mircea_popescu: sounds like someone's googletranslate me
mircea_popescu: "mircea_popescu: but were ballads about made miserably they then having cool how failing"
antephialtic: yeah, is this some kind of silly april fools joke? the log makes it look like this is #bitcoin-yoda
nubbins`: 23:21:29nubbins`:on what's log.b-a? going with
mike_c: obfuscation to prevent spying
nubbins`: 00:08:39asciilifeform:thinking modern of pc bounce: was i
nubbins`: ahahahah.
moiety: bahahahahaha
mike_c: 1 2 3 4 5
moiety: dear oh fuck
nubbins`: mircea_popescu:fifty lines ? you babies up weren't starving
nubbins`: leel
moiety: almost got it there
mircea_popescu: lmao this all started with asciilifeform beerbucket
nubbins`: this is awesome
nubbins`: kakobrekla i much prefer it this way, don't fix it
mircea_popescu: these words of sorted randomly r they perhaps into sense coallesce through of sortage log method ?
moiety: i cant even go back to see that now mircea_popescu lol
mircea_popescu: maybe it's a method to fix my forum quotes.
mircea_popescu: i put stuff from the forum in here, read it destupidified in log
moiety: that forumite speak
KRS-One: HAWT!
mircea_popescu: (the teacher is the one without thge baby fat)
nubbins`: ^ yay
pankkake: this was deleted by a bitcointalk mod: http://pastebin.com/SvkANZjZ
pankkake: yet stalking people is ok, as another mod told me
tg2: davout is getting jealous
pankkake: scammy as fuck
tg2: pankkake, learn2sock
pankkake: learn2berelevant
ozbot: TROLLING 101 | SockPuppet Theatre
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7535 @ 0.00095303 = 7.1811 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32802 @ 0.00095344 = 31.2747 BTC [+] {4}
KRS-One: She indeed is ready for some lessons.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 120 @ 0.00388001 = 0.4656 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: pankkake odd.
pankkake: what's odd is how old the message is, too
pankkake: is there a list of moderators?
pankkake: I'd like to know who banned crumbs and kakobrekla too
mircea_popescu: not afaik.
mircea_popescu: just use the .lk thing and be done with it
pankkake: yeah, scammers prefer to be hidden
mircea_popescu: it'll autopost to the scampit.
mircea_popescu: there was some github
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20200 @ 0.0009473 = 19.1355 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 82198 @ 0.00094697 = 77.839 BTC [-] {6}
kakobrekla: i doubt anyone who should be reading is reading .lk
kakobrekla: so meh
mircea_popescu: it posts across tho
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla simple ban avoiding technique : make .lk account, link it to bitcointalk.org account
mircea_popescu: if .org acount is banned, make new one, link it again
kakobrekla: not much of a gain just using org directly with moar accounts
kakobrekla: gain over *
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15102 @ 0.00094639 = 14.2924 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: posts become undeleteable.
mircea_popescu: i guess they are anyway
mircea_popescu: but the political angle is important, that shit must die.
asciilifeform: gentlemen, lol! perhaps the log should stay like this
moiety: btctalk needs to become deleteable on the whole
mike_c: you are directly supporting bitcointalk by paying someone to create high quality posts there. seems contradictory.
tg2: lol, ltcponzi 700 ltc in 15 seconds
mircea_popescu: mike_c i am aware. won't last very long really.
mircea_popescu: was looking for a way out for a while. reducing .org to the status of a lousy scrapper of .lk seems perfect.
mike_c: that cesspool hardly needs killing. it's already a wasteland.
mike_c: i think it is admirable to try to provide a path out of there through mpoe-pr, but if they don't want it..
mircea_popescu: there are two separate problems here.
mircea_popescu: one is that people generally are stupid. this, we knew going in, not a problem.
mircea_popescu: the other is that theymos & co are scammers.
mircea_popescu: this needs resolving.
antephialtic: yes, I agree. Forum should have an entrance exam
mike_c: you can't have an entrance exam. everybody starts off stupid.
tg2: IQ test
antephialtic: it should include a study guide
tg2: 2 week course
tg2: $500
tg2: get crypto certified
mike_c: if you want to kill bitcointalk, you need to create a new forum. it will fill with retards eventually, but it would solve the second problem.
mircea_popescu: antephialtic the problem with any exam that doesn't also include a firing squad is that it creates a class of niggers.
mircea_popescu: mike_c .lk.
antephialtic: on basic principles of bitcoin. to eliminate people who aren't capable of learning, and to make sure that people who get in aren't asking the most basic of questions
mike_c: and it can't be on b-a :) bad juju
antephialtic: HUR DUR whats a change address DERP
asciilifeform: this actually reminds me of something fairly foolish that i almost did
asciilifeform: at one point, i worked on a 'destupidator' (actual working title) - sort of like a 'captcha', but based on the 'raven matrix' iq test.
cazalla: i dunno antephialtic, that seems a reasonable question to me for someone new to bitcoin
antephialtic: cazalla: that should be on the entrance exam
antephialtic: I'd rather have a forum for the 20% of competent people using bitcoin, than a wasteland for those unwilling or uncapable of learning
antephialtic: they are free to hang out on reddit
cazalla: how can they learn if they need to be learned to pass the exam prior to accessing the forum?
antephialtic: exam includes a study guide
asciilifeform: cazalla: exam for write-access
cazalla: all you really need to do is restrict post ability for 6-12 months
cazalla: oh ok, that makes sense then asciilifeform
antephialtic: no. I want smart/motivated individuals to be able to post right away
mike_c: you are describing b-a. study guide is the wiki.
antephialtic: b-a is great, but there is a lot of benefit to a threaded discussion format
pankkake: what about requiring referals?
asciilifeform: here's another crackpot idea. a very 'slow' mailing list, where it costs 1 btc to post. a few days later, you get it back on the sending addr - if you're nice.
asciilifeform: s/nice/intelligent
BCB: is Andreas M. Antonopoulos a core dev?
antephialtic: BCB: no, he's the glenn beck of bitcoin
antephialtic: or rather, the rush limbaugh
BCB: antephialtic: why is he writing "Mastering Bitcoin" for 0'Reily
mike_c: mircea_popescu: was that shorthand for "that's what i'm doing with .lk"? i don't think that works, because the high quality content you influence to go to .lk also ends up in their forum. it's not competition.
cazalla: he's not even a media contact to much butthurt for him
nubbins`: pankkake: referrals? sounds like goat's forum
nubbins`: someone name a movie
mircea_popescu: antephialtic there's a diference between clueless and stupid.
mircea_popescu: nubbins` all about eve.
nubbins`: is it as depressing as the bicycle thieves?
mircea_popescu: it's hollywood not italian new wave
nubbins`: good, 'cause that was a real downer
mircea_popescu: BCB bitcoin core devs are the folks at conformal.
antephialtic: mircea_popescu: the clueless are redeemable so long as they educate themselves. the stupid are not capable of contributing useless discussion and should be left to rot on reddit
mircea_popescu: mike_c yeah, it is actually.
mircea_popescu: nubbins` downer yeah. good film tho
nubbins`: agreed
antephialtic: mircea_popescu: have you messed around with conformal's btcd?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21400 @ 0.00095224 = 20.3779 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: maybe :p
ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings | Page 226 | Bitcointa.lk
mircea_popescu: mike_c looks like your wish may well be granted.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.04687499 = 0.2344 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.05560028 = 0.278 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.10144642 = 0.2029 BTC [-]
mike_c: lol. awesome response.
kakobrekla: kako sets the fashion trend
pankkake: "MPOE-PR perma-banned. His only option to get his account back is an appeal to theymos."
ozbot: Please remove this user from this forum.
tg2: lol
kakobrekla: he is not fucking around.
mircea_popescu: i guess we're going to tune in to .lk for further mpoe-pr posts.
ozbot: Please remove this user from this forum.
antephialtic: honestly speaking, mpoe-pr is pretty inflammatory, but speaks the truth
kakobrekla: i guess you all will be wearing shoelacesless shoes by t he conference.
antephialtic: unfortunate that the forum users fail to see that
tg2: yes IP bans are effective obv
mike_c: so someone creates a thread to get herp banned, and that dipshit bans mpoe-pr instead. classic forum.
tg2: why couldn't the otc/vouch system work for a forum?
tg2: you have to get invited by a member with positive rep
mircea_popescu: it's pretty much the system that sunk -otc into irrelevancy, so...
mircea_popescu: at least idiots are consistent.
nubbins`: tg2: that's what goat did with his forum
nubbins`: it's pretty dead there
mircea_popescu: goat has a wot now ?
tg2: the general public is pretty dumb
tg2: it never amazes me at the success of the most blatant scams
nubbins`: mircea_popescu: cryptocrypt.org
kakobrekla: cryptocryptcry
mircea_popescu: nubbins` a wot i mean.
mircea_popescu: anyway, i had a forum on the old polimedia domain, same principle, also pretty dead.
nubbins`: i was thinking in terms of "u wot m8"
tg2: maybe a simpler wot
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9498 @ 0.00095096 = 9.0322 BTC [-] {2}
nubbins`: anyway, membership in the forum is by invite only, and i think being rude gets you banned or something
tg2: we had a car enthousaist forum that had a "premium" section where members could pay and had to be invited to do so
tg2: it was pretty elite compared to the general scrubbery
tg2: sort of a one-way-glass type affair
mircea_popescu: honestly i don't see why .lk can't be used for exactly this purpose.
nubbins`: gigposters.com forums have a "premium membership" option for $20/year
nubbins`: you get access to a special subforum where people post plans for diy equipment
mike_c: 50 people posting on bitcointa.lk is not going to kill btctalk.org.
nubbins`: and if you ask too many questions without VIP, people shame you and stop answering ;(
mircea_popescu: mike_c depends which.
mircea_popescu: i personally don't think there's any value in the forum format, but hey.
mircea_popescu: some people seem to.
mike_c: 50 people posting exclusively on a forum could draw traffic, but i don't believe it works when the content is forwarded to the competition.
mike_c: it would be like if quora sent all their posts to yahoo answers.
mike_c: even that would be better, because at least quora wouldn't have all the shit. but bitcointa.lk does have all the shit too!
mike_c: it's like shit with a sprinkling of honey. i would bitbet this but it's not definable.
mircea_popescu: you don't HAVE to forward it.
mircea_popescu: you get all their shit copied over
mircea_popescu: and you can lol at it or w/e.
BingoBoingo: I really don't see the point of cross posting to the Thermos forum, if the aim is killing the pretense of its relevance
ThickAsThieves: Hey I'm gonna ban myself from the forum
ThickAsThieves: fuck that shit
ThickAsThieves: they have no good reason to ban people that are consistently right and alienated just because people wanna be delusional
asciilifeform: curious - am i the only one here who never posted to btct ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26150 @ 0.00094789 = 24.7873 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i never posted either.
asciilifeform: that makes 2...
artifexd: Liar
artifexd: I was shocked to find posts by you. Granted, they were a few years ago. But still...
mike_c: everybody starts a newbie (except ascii)
asciilifeform: mike_c: i'm here by accident, really.
mircea_popescu: lol selfban party
mircea_popescu: artifexd i dun think so.
ozbot: Latest posts of: Mircea Popescu
mircea_popescu: give it some ritual lmao
mircea_popescu: artifexd nop
pankkake clicks "like"
artifexd: As it is not provably you, I can only accept your word and sit back down, corrected and humble.
ThickAsThieves: well, so I got on my soapbox before saying fuck you, oh well
mike_c: i think he is just forgetting. this certainly sounds like him :) https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=37923;sa=showPosts
mircea_popescu: mike_c so do you.
mike_c: hah. perhaps in another year.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla your forum wordmixer gave mpoe-pr a small heart attack lol
ThickAsThieves: really without mpoe-pr and friends, what's left there anyway?
ThickAsThieves: "bitcoinmagazine.com wants to use your computer's location Allow Deny"
kakobrekla: hehe works as intended then :)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 10942 @ 0.00013798 = 1.5098 BTC [+] {8}
ozbot: Please remove this user from this forum. | Bitcointa.lk
mircea_popescu: lol maged trying to be the sly cat.
mircea_popescu: bwahahaha
mircea_popescu: is this guy actually gmaxwell or just similarly spineless ?
BingoBoingo: Maybe a bit of both?
mircea_popescu: can you be a bit of both ?
BingoBoingo: Well, maybe there is some simple minded psychotic disease passing through people who think they moderate important parts of bitcoin infrastructure that just suck. And this disease is spread through fucking gmaxwell
antephialtic: ?? why the hate for gmaxwell?
mircea_popescu: gmaxwell got laid ?!
mircea_popescu: impossibru
BingoBoingo: Well, maybe by Maged.
mircea_popescu: antephialtic not rly hate, but for the usual reason neckbeads fail to make it in human society.
mircea_popescu: he has those clammy qualities.
asciilifeform: neckbeard == fellow whom age has taught nothing?
antephialtic: ah, I have to admit I enjoy his opinions on cryptography related matters.
BingoBoingo: This stuff really pops up in most internet fora where the operators develop a pretense of importance and being cereal.
mircea_popescu: neckbeard = 30something male with poor hygiene, lack of socialisation and a monitor tan
mircea_popescu: antephialtic most neckbeards make excellent worhorses. doesn't mean anyone would want them i nthe house.
asciilifeform: richard stallman...?
antephialtic: a friend of mine works in the same building as stallman. says he does all kinds of weird shit in the office
mircea_popescu: i wouldn't go as far as rms.
mircea_popescu: guy's weird, but not desocialised.
antephialtic: but rms is a greybeard. a neckbeard who is respected widely for technical contributions
antephialtic: and has grown senile
mircea_popescu: well senility aside, there's more to it than that.
asciilifeform: rms is a special case. he used to be a fairly sociable creature before his motherland was burned to the ground.
mircea_popescu: there's a deep understanding of what humanity is all about, that someone as fucking weird as dostoievski could exhibit nevertheless
ozbot: [ANN] Litecoin [LTC] X11 hardfork at block 564,480 | Bitcointa.lk
pankkake: interesting experiment though - how could a hostile hardfork be received in bitcoin
mircea_popescu: old news tho neh ?
asciilifeform: i thought every alt was a 'hostile fork' ?
pankkake: of the code, not of the chain
antephialtic: I think forking the chain is interesting, would give a lot of incentive for miners and users to switch if the tech was actually better
antephialtic: dogecoin has intentionally forked at least once to switch the block reward algo
mircea_popescu: a hardfork is a major event, but definitely not impossible.
antephialtic: but with bitcoin it would be a lot more dangerous as many merchants would get scammed while their were still multiple viable forks
antephialtic: would be very damaging to trust unless it was done extremely carefully
mircea_popescu: Hardforking BTC and LTC to X11 would be pretty awesome.
mircea_popescu: And it would be a great way to stick it to the mega banker elite class who invested billions in Asic hardware.
mircea_popescu: Wtf is the point of crypto if a bank can simply mine all the coins themselves, the entire point of crypto was to get away from elitist bankers
mircea_popescu: then again theres that consideration.
mircea_popescu: "bitcoin is here to solve my own problems!!1"
mircea_popescu: antephialtic how exactly would the merchants be scammed ?
asciilifeform: if one is to do something, even something foolish, it ought to be done right. cellular automaton proof-of-work.
antephialtic: mircea_popescu: you send them coins while they are still on the old chain
antephialtic: while double spending on the new chain
mircea_popescu: a hard fork is a political event. they get the old chain coins they chose.
mircea_popescu: or the new chain coins they chose.
antephialtic: yes, but many merchants don't know much about how bitcoin works
mircea_popescu: since the fork will NEVER resolve, tyhere's no scamming.
antephialtic: yes, but bad for everyone if less merchants accept it because they lose trust in the tech
mircea_popescu: a war is a war.
mircea_popescu: when people go to war, they couldn't care less about foreign markets or whatever the fuck.
antephialtic: also, the chain with the asics will have much better network security than the new X11 chain, so many rational merchants would stay
mircea_popescu: Here’s are the reasons:
mircea_popescu: We have not come across a proof of work algorithm that is truly ASIC-proof and quick to verify. All alternatives will only delay the problem, and at a considerable cost.
mircea_popescu: guy figured it out, apparently.
mircea_popescu: antephialtic in the case of the litecoin fork, yes.
asciilifeform: didn't i post a perfectly usable counter-example?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform give them a decade. reading these logs is slow work.
antephialtic: asciilifeform: what are the characteristics of a cellular automaton PoW that make it resistant to an ASIC implementation?
asciilifeform: antephialtic: you can demand an arbitrarily-large 'playing field'
antephialtic: so memory hardness?
asciilifeform: antephialtic: correct. and, if you're clever, you can have difficulty ramp up to outpace any conceivable growth in vlsi density.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38200 @ 0.00094634 = 36.1502 BTC [-] {3}
asciilifeform: so hashers are stuck using external dram - or even disk, if you're sadist
antephialtic: hah. If you want to require disk, you can do proof-of-storage instead of PoW
asciilifeform: nsacoin.
asciilifeform: no thanks
antephialtic: sorry for the PDF
asciilifeform: the problem with any such experiment is that, ultimately, 'the race is to the swift.'
asciilifeform: and the lamers aren't going to like who that turns out to be
asciilifeform: that is, even a hypothetical permanently 'asic-proof' algo rewards... botnets.
mircea_popescu: there is the problem. it's all trying to somehow build equality out of technology.
mircea_popescu: cryptocoins are here to bring inequality back to its proper size
mircea_popescu: not in any way reduce it.
asciilifeform: there's possible merit to the experiment if you have a specific enemy in mind, who Must Die (tm), rather than some foggy notion of 'equality'
antephialtic: I don't think cryptocoins will make the world any more egalitarian. Probably less so, as their widespread use would deny the state a lot of tax revenue
antephialtic: but I think that is inevitable, and if it is going to happen, I'd rather end up at the top instead of getting crushed in the transition
mircea_popescu: antephialtic but the whole argument behind scrypt,. and behind asic-resistence, and all that jazz is "other people than us have better resources and are being rewarded for this."
antephialtic: and to that I say, that's just how the world works
pankkake: so altcoins are socialism?
mircea_popescu: it's pure jealousy, and well... that's not part of the laws of nature.
antephialtic: even if he doesn't like the outcome
mircea_popescu: pankkake not altcoins, but teh people bitching about how other people are eating "their" share of the pie are.
asciilifeform: if you're willing to sign under 'i wish victory to botnet artists but not semiconductor makers', you can work with that.
pankkake: yeah, I've seen that in people praising Bernankoin without getting it
mircea_popescu: antephialtic seems just a rehash of older material really.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4700 @ 0.00094602 = 4.4463 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: "Austerity measures will have taken the route of unprecedented and radical decimation of the state - everything from state provided healthcare to coastguards to income support to education will be practically gone replaced with numerous forms of bitcoin based insurance."
mircea_popescu: this is what, trilema cca 2012.
antephialtic: mp: I wasn't reasing trilema in 2012 :)
antephialtic: pankkake: I think that is wishful thinking
mircea_popescu: idiot b;logger.com. was gonna leave the guy a reply, but a well.
asciilifeform: i'm genuinely curious if any of the 'alt workfunction' folks are going for something other than 'equality!11'
antephialtic: mp: talk to him on twitter, he's pretty active
antephialtic: @swardley
antephialtic: pankakke: the solution to fixing bitcoin is not to make it more complex. that just increases the inertia of having multiple compatible implementations
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27002 @ 0.00094491 = 25.5145 BTC [-] {3}
pankkake: antephialtic: that's why I said last two paragraphs ;)
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2012/bitcoin-and-the-poor/ < now you can read 2012 trilema antephialtic :p
ozbot: Bitcoin and the poor pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
ozbot: The politics of Bitcoin pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
KRS-One: .bait
KRS-One presses random buttons on ozbot.
Jezzz: .bait
Jezzz: .d
ozbot: 5.007 billion | Next Diff in 837 blocks | Estimated Change: 15.2493% in 4d 22h 8m 25s
antephialtic: mircea_popescu: the first post was quite good
antephialtic: will be interested to see you two fight it out on twitter. his opinions (on politics at least) seem to be the polar opposite of yours
antephialtic: I'm sure this will be quite entertaining to you as well: http://blog.gardeviance.org/2014/03/how-to-fix-bitcoin.html
antephialtic: his recipe for how the government could "fix" bitcoin
antephialtic: his thoughts: "Now, whilst some might welcome the reduction in the state caused by a loss of taxation, the state is THE key economic driver of innovation, prosperity and social mobility. The laissez faire economic system is an extreme mindset of some of the more ardent supporters of Freidmanism and the Chicago School. There is no basis for assuming a beneficial society can be created without the state and in all likelihood i
antephialtic: t'll lead to a future consolidation of wealth, extremely low levels of social mobility and weak economic performance compared to countries that use a more mixed method. From a competition viewpoint this is not a good position."
MisterE: when was the last time a government "fixed" anything?
MisterE: seriously?
antephialtic: well, inventing the ARPAnet was one kind of cool thing
MisterE: Like lawyers and consultants they thrive on problems not on solving them heh
MisterE: ok I'll concede arpanet :)
Duffer1: nasa
Duffer1: that's all i got..
asciilifeform: it seems odd, to say the least, to lump together projects done on embezzled government coin, and ones planned/ordered by bureaucrats.
Duffer1: oh highways
MisterE: well the were nice but are fallig apart now
asciilifeform: same for any idiot organization - see history of 'unix'
MisterE: those grades are the most vluable though
MisterE: can be repaved or whatever
mircea_popescu: ahahaha diablo 3 apparently still thinks it exists, made update, costs 40 bux
asciilifeform: just about every interesting technology attributed to a mega-organization was done on 'stolen time.'
antephialtic: regardless of your thoughts on welfare, with regards to science their are many avenues of basic research that cannot be justified from a pure ROI standpoint yet have long term benefits to technological advancement. Such as the development of pure mathematics, etcetra
antephialtic: hard to see how such pursuits would be funded without a system of universities (and thereby the state that funds it)
MisterE: I wish when government funded that kind of research the first priority was not always to weaponize it if possible
asciilifeform: mr. mold had a good tidbit on this:
asciilifeform: 'The basic problem is that the robber-barons of Silicon Valley, unlike their Victorian forebears, do not realize that, if they want all this science, they will actually have to pay for it - themselves. Instead, they look at their tax forms and think: I gave at the office. But they didn't. They gave to scientocracy. Now, they need to figure out how to patronize science - or there will be no science. Just scient
asciilifeform: ific Bondo, sanded to perfection and painted with meticulous care.'
MisterE: you need a state with a surplus to do that too
mircea_popescu: antephialtic if you think the welfare state did anything for the advancement of pure mathematics...
mircea_popescu: look up perelman sometime./
antephialtic: mircea_popescu: not the welfare state, but the state, certainly
mircea_popescu: not at all.
mircea_popescu: the state is everywhere and all the time a drawback.
MisterE: the other thing about the 'intangible benefits' of research and exploration is that it inspires and this is so very much lacking in todays youth. When we were walking on the moon people were amazed and wanted to be engineers, nothing like that now. The biggest value to come out of the Apollo project was the increased interest in science.
mircea_popescu: not that people can't rehash the ancient arguments re the importance of the church and present them de novo in favour of the state.
mircea_popescu: but they're as false today as they were in 1700.
mircea_popescu: MisterE hunger inspires.
mircea_popescu: not "science".
MisterE: hunger inspires looking for food, not looking toward the stars heh
mircea_popescu: so you think.
mircea_popescu: but what would you know of it ?
mircea_popescu: nothing really, all the overfed know of hunger is their terror.
MisterE: nothing other than being a space enthusiast
MisterE: this topic comes up regularly in #space
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i'll patronize science just fine.
mircea_popescu: what i dislike is a bunch of fucktards going around with money that isn't theirs, muddying things up.
mike_c: omg. the log is remapping pathways in my brain. it's making me dyslexic.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla you gotta fix that thing srsly.
mike_c: it is funny though :)
kakobrekla: eh, let the girl have a day off
mircea_popescu: i dunno what i'll do tomorro morning.
mircea_popescu: maybe discover who satoshi really is...
mircea_popescu: antephialtic well your friend won't irc and i'm not about to argue with anyone on twitter, so i guess that's that.
antephialtic: eh, too bad
MisterE: Blogging is one thing and quick tweets are easy too but defending your positions in real time is another animal many are not prepared for.
MisterE: I've always been an IMer so prefer it
mircea_popescu: this is true.
antephialtic: agreed. additionally Many do not prefer to enter a potentially compromising conversation when the medium is written
antephialtic: if things go badly, the evidence will be everlasting
kakobrekla: anyway, just add ?stopitkako if you really need a clean log nao.
mircea_popescu: wait was this for april fools' ?
mircea_popescu: well it is a cute joke lol
mircea_popescu: but thanks for the fix.
BingoBoingo: +2 Great troll
MisterE: oh yea, let the fooling begin!
mike_c: now do one on bitbet where all the weights flip!
ThickAsThieves: i enjoyed the garble, was a nice surprise reading logs on tablet
asciilifeform: is there really anyone left who doesn't understand that, if you're transmitting plaintext, 'the medium is written' always?
ThickAsThieves: these forum people now think my account was compromised
ThickAsThieves: this mentality is ...
ThickAsThieves: incurable
MisterE: lol just saw it great work kakobrekla :)
kakobrekla: thank you!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform people have peculiar interactions with the voices in their heads. it leads to fascinating conclusions.
ozbot: History and the Security of Property
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: recently i was reading some vintage dan mocsny (circa '91) and spotted szabo in the thread...
mircea_popescu: they got along ?
ThickAsThieves: jimmothy is disappointed in me
asciilifeform: more or less.
ozbot: Grupos de Google
antephialtic: a fool and his bitcoin are soon parted
asciilifeform: example of quality mocsny:
ozbot: Grupos de Google
mircea_popescu: da fuck is this google groups bs
asciilifeform: not my fault these bozos bought the world's only reasonably-complete usenet archive.
asciilifeform: ('dejanews')
mircea_popescu: le suck.
ThickAsThieves: new michael jackson album coming
ThickAsThieves: produced by timbland
ThickAsThieves: which means itll be great or horrible
ThickAsThieves: he does a pretty good job with timberlake'
ThickAsThieves: but i suspect the powers that be will pummel him into mediocrity
mircea_popescu: how is it a mj album
ThickAsThieves: unreleased tracks, redone music to be 'modernized'
MisterE: probably samples of unreleased studio stuff
pankkake: sounds fishy
ThickAsThieves: i'm surprised it took this long really
mircea_popescu: i wonder if this nonsense will become a trend.
decimation: guys someone who writes like dotcoin has hacked the log server and raped the logs!!!
ThickAsThieves: it's an old trend
mircea_popescu: decimation lol best 1 so far.
MisterE: indeed been around for a long time
ThickAsThieves: many posthumous albums come from the hip pop world
MisterE: 2Pac and BIG all had multiple albums after death
MisterE: but 2_ac had actually laid down the tracks in a premonition of his upcoming death he went on a recording binge
mircea_popescu: bounce check it out mang, you're now famous http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com/?quote=92
ThickAsThieves: nice quote
MisterE: Wonder if he recalls making it
ThickAsThieves: the past is the past, only time will tell
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15200 @ 0.00094463 = 14.3584 BTC [-]
cazalla: i wrote this song in 94'
artifexd: Oh. April Fools.
ozbot: Lithuania bans Russian TV station over 'lies'
mircea_popescu: lol wouldn't cn love to sell reddit.
pankkake: funny stuff, I was reading /r/thewalkingdead when they switched on the thing
diametric: mircea_popescu: reddit's not owned by cn anymore
diametric: as of august 2012 if I remember correctly
diametric: Though, CN's parent company still holds a significant portion of shares they're independently owned
mircea_popescu: still owned by advance
mircea_popescu: idun see much diff.
diametric: Maybe so, I vaguely remember at the time of it happening a lot of organization changes took place but its been a while now.
mircea_popescu: "Charlie Shrem, known for his alleged involvement in the Silk Road scandal, is in talks with US prosecutors for a plea bargain."
mircea_popescu: "According to a March 28th filing in Manhattan federal court, Assistant U.S. Attorney Serrin Turner has asked for the 24-year-old Shrem’s case to be postponed until April 28th."
antephialtic: AKA shrem is talking
asciilifeform: '“It couldn’t be stupider, and that’s why it’s brilliant,” he concluded.' << me brain dumped core.
antephialtic: and probably trying to incriminate others
MisterE: only reason to talk
antephialtic: well the other guy, BTCKing is definitely the bigger prize for the state since he was actually laundering SR money
antephialtic: Shrem was just being used, and too negligent to realize
MisterE: oh I thought BTCKing was done in
MisterE: the whole gaggle of them are retarded and deserve what they get
ThickAsThieves: shrem is 24?
ThickAsThieves: he looks closer to 42
antephialtic: its the natural jew hair
antephialtic: and the smoking of too many substances
mircea_popescu: he's in his 20s. thermos too. most of them are too young for this shit rly.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30811 @ 0.00094837 = 29.2202 BTC [+] {2}
decimation: asciilifeform: Wong would mock those who use microscopes as hammers; his sophistocated set only use bespoke polished turds
ThickAsThieves: hell i'm too young and too old for this
mircea_popescu: decimation you familiar with the bespoke fucksmith ?
ozbot: White Collar Fraud: Update on Bitcoin Money Laundering Case: Both Defendants Are Talking to the Feds
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48526 @ 0.00094378 = 45.7979 BTC [-] {5}
decimation: is that from oglaf?
decimation: Your link on trilema had me laughing for a few hours
mircea_popescu: yeah, they came up wirth it
mircea_popescu: now i can't see bespoke without thinking of it.
decimation: ANDREESSEN: One of the characteristics of a new idea is all the experts who came up in the old regime look at it and laugh...Almost exactly 300 years ago, a Scottish economist, ironically, named John Law basically invented at the time this crazy idea of paper currency or fiat currency. ... And every economist on the planet 300 years ago thought that he was a complete lunatic. And so I think this is just the story, the recurring story of how
decimation: progress happens.
decimation: Except, anyone who takes bitcoin seriously would also think that John Law is a lunatic
mircea_popescu: i dun think so for instance
mircea_popescu: the problem with paper money run by a government is exactly the same as the problem with a bitcoin run by government.
mircea_popescu: but it's not of the paper.
decimation: it sounds like trying to grasp both poles of a contradiction
mircea_popescu: how do you mean ?
chetty: keyword = government
decimation: it seems like it's not possible for bitcoin to be run by a government
decimation: assuming some level of permability in cross-border communications
mircea_popescu: im sure when law was writing it wasn't directly obvious that the thing'll end up as a welfare scam either.
decimation: that's a good point
mircea_popescu: that aside, obviously the technology is better, crypto chain > paper issuance.
mircea_popescu: but in the same sense the tech of a pistol is better than the tech of a sword.
mircea_popescu: nothing wrong with either of the two, up until they're being brandished by a thief.
decimation: if bitcoin is the new Venice, will not bitcoin also eventually form its own customs and laws, like Venice?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.6169998 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: and sink, like venice ?
decimation: probably
MisterE: at the time though paper was an technology upgrade to other mediums of exchange
mircea_popescu: anyway it's already forming its own customs and laws.
MisterE: so reasonable historically
mircea_popescu: MisterE the best part is this : at the time, if i told a proponent that "govt will just monopolize it" he'd just have loled at me. "what are you talking about, ANYONE CAN ISSUE PAPER"
mircea_popescu: well... at the time this was true.
MisterE: yea
mircea_popescu: it didn't last so long, and of course for "very good reasons" (tm)
decimation: that's a good poing
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 27 @ 0.10144642 = 2.7391 BTC [-]
MisterE: bitcoin comes with checks and balances built-in and can be upgraded
mircea_popescu: lol. so does paper.
decimation: meanwhile, the NY state regulator on bitcoin (from my link): LAWSKY: Yes, and I think my understanding and it was really from the day-two testimony when I asked that question again about programmable currency that that is one of the things that potentially you could have with the color coding. They also gave an example of a young person whose parents want to give them an allowance but want to make sure that it goes for certain things and not
decimation: other things.
mircea_popescu: you still gotta use them for them to work.
MisterE: heh in a way I guess
mircea_popescu: tech. 2000 years later, still not a silver bullet.
MisterE: there's no built-in check to the amount of fiat that can be created though
MisterE: so it's improving
mircea_popescu: MisterE in the same sense there's no built in check to the number of alt coins that can be created
MisterE: as fiat was an improvement over exchanging chickens and goats I guess
MisterE: true
mircea_popescu: fiat was not a replacement for barter
mircea_popescu: fiat grew out of goldsmith depositary receipts.
MisterE: I generally dont give alt coins much creedance but that may be a mistake
MisterE: no reason to say BTC will be the one that "wins"
mircea_popescu: but anyway, tis late. we'll continue... tomorrow. which is another day.
chetty: MisterE: bitcoin comes with checks and balances built-in and can be upgraded//like the US constitution
MisterE: yea problem there is no one has gotten of their ass and upgraded the constitution forever
decimation: http://www.york.ac.uk/depts/maths/histstat/chartism.pdf "Conclusive facts are inseperable from inconclusive except by a head that already understands and knows."
chetty: all good ideas get hijacked eventually. we just try to make best use of the window
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