Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2022-03-31 | 2022-04-02 → ↓
signpost: echoes forward and backward. biblical.
signpost: humans only do so many things.
signpost trying to find the line where he tells me that an "mp" doesn't build, it burns down.
signpost: world was plenty burned down by the time he fell out of his mother.
signpost reads old logs often; wild how one's mind keeps indices.
phf: signpost: i don't, there's all kinds of cringy things there. like me throwing shade at kremlin on that same page. i've met him since and he's a cool dude.
signpost: eh, it all happened. go ask my crazy ex-girlfriends what an idiot I was at 22 while you're at it.
phf: also that's 2016, everyone is peak cocksure :D
signpost: mhm, I recall plenty of Very Authoritative Voice coming out of me.
signpost: has its place in time.
verisimilitude: So signpost is twenty-eight years old?
signpost: no, separate thought.
verisimilitude: Alright, as figured.
signpost mid 30s
verisimilitude: That's good to know.
signpost: verisimilitude: regarding seeing mp "for what he was", the machine was the thing worth building in my mind, not worshipping the loudest guy present.
signpost: phf: so you met putin, re: kremlin?
signpost: I'm really curious to hear about this, if so
signpost: oh, that's some dude on IRC.
phf: that's well beyond my reach
crtdaydreams once met the guy who owned nick "Trump" on fleanoad
phf: alright, i'm off for the night
signpost: see ya.
scoopbot: New article on trinque: Deadlock
vex is happy to read that phf is thriving, also saddened to read of Claudia
vex: i think i might've unerestimated alf's capacity for kindness, and I've been moved, emotionally
mangol: my sympathy on the passing of Claudia, as well. it sounds like you took exceptionally good care of her.
crtdaydreams: so I have been attempting to get mp-wp working w/ nginx on freebsd.
crtdaydreams: I've installed php5.6.13 from source --with-fpm and a few other useful bits and bobs
crtdaydreams: problem I'm finding is that running a short test script <?php var_export($_SERVER)?> does not result in expected output
crtdaydreams: infact does not result in output.
crtdaydreams: \/var/log/php-fpm.log turns up nuthin' after init, yet everything in nginx.conf checks out, can make paste if interested
crtdaydreams: must be php :/
crtdaydreams: hiya vex
vex: idk wordpress
vex: believe it or not, i'm not a 16 yo gal
mangol: in other potential pest hacks, the political stability of the DNS has given me concern lately
mangol: some kind of parallel DNS has to be built so it's there when the official one collapses
mangol: DNS over Pest seems doable
mangol: in non-Pest hacks, i designed a very simple client-server protocol to get static data using either a hash or a pathname. wrote a server and client for it.
mangol: there are a few neat applications one can layer on top of this, most obviously file transfer, RSS-style feeds, web browsing, and mirroring of whole websites
mangol: could even do version control on top of it (every pathname points to a hash, so a pathname can be like a git branch that points to a tree of blobs)
mangol: i'd be happy if someone wants to experiment with serving their website or other files over it
mangol: current server/client are in scheme. i can do CL, python, C on request
dulapbot: Logged on 2021-10-05 00:28:32 asciilifeform: hope there indeed is 'mass dns outage' and that it's fucking permanent.
asciilifeform: what's needed is http over pest, where can fetch e.g. http://localhost:1337/asciilifeform/loper-os.org and it'll work for so long as asciilifeform is in yer l_n (for some n)
asciilifeform: ty crtdaydreams, vex
phf: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-04-01#1091924 << i have it running on openbsd w/ recent php-7.3, mysqli and httpd
dulapbot: Logged on 2022-04-01 04:40:09 crtdaydreams: so I have been attempting to get mp-wp working w/ nginx on freebsd.
phf: there's a handful of php-isms i had to update, and i'm using some random guys mysql<->mysqli compatability layer that i just dropped in without much reflection. but it works.
phf: unfortunately my version of wp is a bespoke tgz that mp sent me that predates the mp-wp v project
shinohai: Oh hello phf, where are you blogging from these days?
phf: shinohai: i'm not :) i've been using republican stack for projects
phf: like, house affairs are managed through an internal instance
phf: which by the way works great. can upload receipts, travel photos, plan things. easy to inject entries with an external process..
mangol: asciilifeform: that part of logs doesn't explain why DNS is evil, but i assume centralization and lack of crypto
mangol: for the record, i can't reach rt.com without tor. "EU" (which org specifically? who knows.) blocked it this month. not sure if only DNS or HTTP too
mangol: https://gab.com/rt is a reasonable summary
mangol: the technical lowdown on how the EU was able to ban a website in one day would make for interesting reading
billymg: phf: if you're willing to diff your version against the original tgz and share the patch i could manually create a vpatch for mp-wp that adds the php 7 compatibility
phf: billymg: yes
billymg: phf: do you know off the top of your head if the changes required for php7 compatibility break 5.6 compatibility?
phf: probably
billymg: ah, damn
billymg: i never really looked into this because i assumed php5.6 was one of those "from my cold dead hands" things
billymg: a hard requirement
phf: might be something to investigate either way. for example create_function has been removed, and it's an ugly hack anyway, but it looks like 5.3 already supported anonymous functions
phf: - $num_widgets = array_reduce( $sidebars_widgets, create_function( '$prev, $curr', 'return $prev+count($curr);' ), 0 );
phf: + $num_widgets = array_reduce( $sidebars_widgets, function($prev, $curr) { return $prev+count($curr); }, 0 );
phf:
phf: so above should continue to work
billymg: yeah, i can test it, see if it works on both
billymg: with the complete set of changes that is
phf: on the other hand class foo { foo() { ... }} has been replaced with class foo { __construct() { ... }} which will obviously require a compatability hack
phf: billymg: ^
billymg: phf: there are a few more after that one: http://billymg.com/mp-wp-vtree/
billymg: phf: a lot was lopped off in that last patch, details here
billymg bbl, errands
phf: jeez, it's a whole maternety ward of babies with that bath water
dulapbot: Logged on 2022-04-01 10:57:33 mangol: asciilifeform: that part of logs doesn't explain why DNS is evil, but i assume centralization and lack of crypto
signpost: mangol: the ambiguity of this reporting is entertaining.
signpost is to believe there aren't spy satellites watching overhead?
mangol: DNS is one more decentralized protocol everyone uses in a centralized fashion
mangol: signpost: probably ukr -> ru attack means usg -> ru attack. won't end at one fuel depot.
asciilifeform: iirc they've lobbed at least coupla shells over border before
asciilifeform: w/ modern cannon, this aint hard
asciilifeform: 'drive by'
mangol: asciilifeform: some news sites say so
mangol: is ru -> ru false flag out of the question?
asciilifeform: also of course can be 'own goal'
asciilifeform: mangol: if yer gonna falseflag, normally would shoot some meat rather than petro depot
asciilifeform: at least if in 'american style'
signpost: ru benefits, doesn't matter much to me who did it.
signpost: just pointing out both superpowers know; neither is proving it.
mangol: the first ukr false flag was empty kindergarten iirc
asciilifeform: signpost: hm how does ru win from burning own oil depot ?
asciilifeform: would make sense if 'omfg the heathen scum, let's flatten'em nao' but already flattening as quickly as can afford neh
mangol: exactly
signpost: I mean something more neutral. not saying russia did it.
signpost: I'm saying the only two sources of information who know what happened both are letting it be ambiguous.
mangol: i read the kindergarten false flag as the most cliche'd possible "putin is heartless monster" press fodder
phf: gaaaaze into the crystal ball to glimpse aaaanswers through the fog of waaaar
signpost: "Reported Ukrainian air raid doesn???t bode well for future negotiations, Moscow insists"
signpost: so that's the tone coming out of that side; maybe they walk away from negotiations later.
asciilifeform: the negotiations are a bag o'lulz
asciilifeform: from what they posted, at any rate
asciilifeform: near as can tell, entirely ceremonial
signpost: "we tried to talk to them"
asciilifeform: would think 8y of that would've been enuff
signpost continues to believe there's a deal to partition ukraine struck well before the war.
asciilifeform: ('minsk treaty' etc)
mangol: signpost: struck by whom?
signpost: US and RU
mangol: all of ukr, not just donbass region as in minsk agreements?
phf: the venetians and the reptiloid branch of the illuminati
signpost: this guy with the shitposting
signpost: mangol: maybe just outside that huge pipeline they have running to romania.
phf: it's a lovely day in the alleghenies, grey and misty and snowing, so i'm in a good mood
phf: i mean if you're into that kind of weather
signpost: the forest up there is pretty.
signpost still missing the patchwork of new england towns just a bit further NE of you, since his last trip.
phf: i'm fond of the whole ridge from atlanta to albany, occasionally it's ok to venture out into the plains, but yeah, maybe a bit in pa, sc or nh.
phf: come to think of it the only legitimate reason to venture out is to make it to small towns on the atlantic
signpost grew up spending a lot of summers on the cape, or in the woods in maine.
signpost: fell in love with Portsmouth, NH recently, but will likely live somewhere with acres when I relocate.
phf: oh i didn't realize that you're from the green forests. one of the main reason we're not moving to tx/az: the desert is great and all but i need the moss and the horizontal rain and the occasional -2c -15c wind chill
signpost: my grandparents moved south from new england, but going back has always been a coming-home for me.
signpost: nothing compared to yurp, but as someone born in the wayward colonies, it's as historied as can be found.
phf: i've been meaning to come to tx and when i'm there hit you up, but maybe you can just let me know when you're in nh instead
signpost: yep either way, would be happy to say hello.
signpost: I will probably go again sometime in the current year, will let ya know.
phf: as far as history, east coast is really weird. there's a lot of usg developed "points of interests" with little plaques in english, chinese and braille. on the other hand the area where i live has churches built in 17xx, my friend's house is early 18th century, but it's all just there, not particularly historically preserved
phf: another couple has family property with a barn on it, that was built by indians >100yr old, but the family just used it as a barn, until it got old enough so they razed it and put a stock walmart generic barn instead
asciilifeform: phf: sounds moar interesting than most of washingtonistan. this was in pa ?
phf: asciilifeform: this is in maryland's panhandle, and a bit into somerset county in pa, i'm sure it's all over the place here
thimbronion: phf: I used to fly fish in western md. There was a great book about all the streams.
thimbronion: Even caught some fish.
asciilifeform hopes to do things like fishing again sumday, instead of 'vacationing' in 1 salt mine to catch up in other lol
thimbronion: asciilifeform: you should work for the government
asciilifeform: $ticker btc usd
busybot: Current BTC price in USD: $46496.75
asciilifeform: thimbronion: lol, where they pay like mcd
thimbronion: IMO best east coast forrests are in NC.
thimbronion: asciilifeform: yeah you pretend to work and they pretend to pay
asciilifeform: right, been there ( as 'contractor' ) , tightest belt years for asciilifeform to date
thimbronion: asciilifeform: after 3 years of government work I managed to save like $5000 living an a groundskeeper's basement lol
phf: asciilifeform: you still have to go to the office?
asciilifeform: 'collect these 7 rubber stamps in next 3days'
asciilifeform: phf: nope
asciilifeform: phf: current saltmines haven't even got working offices
asciilifeform: luckily
phf: you drive 2 hours east and the price of everything drops 2x. can even rent a uhaul to transport your electron microscope :>
asciilifeform: would have to run fiber there, neh
phf: no
asciilifeform: hm they finally discovered fiber in the wastelands ?
asciilifeform: in e.g. bmore still afaik nope
asciilifeform considered to move there coupla yrs ago, got quoted coupla 100k, 'we'd dig up street..'
phf: fiber is boring, i think you should setup a microwave rely tower.
asciilifeform pictures cost of gb net via tower
phf: most areas will be a hop or two from a state utility tower, which all run internet. but i guess you want /fiber/ fiber. what kind of d/u you get?
phf: ah, ok, i get slightly more than half of that
asciilifeform: asciilifeform's commercial toil moar sensitive to ping tho, rather than bw
asciilifeform: phf: you have own mw relay tower nao ?
asciilifeform knew a fella in wv who was building one, but he went into some kinda amish mode and not wrote in for long time, nfi whether built
phf: asciilifeform: joey hess by any chance?
phf: asciilifeform: i have an endpoint, and i'm renting a hop from state. just happen to have had a relay tower line of sight
asciilifeform: !w seen-anywhere b00lcrap
watchglass: asciilifeform: my valid commands are: src, uptime, help, probe, peers, version, poll
asciilifeform: !q seen-anywhere b00lcrap
dulapbot: b00lcrap last seen in #trilema on 2014-12-29 11:08:27: who is the mastermind behind this late 90s attack.
phf: the whole thing is very personal handshake, w md is a different state for sure. i guess they have plenty of farmers linked to their towers that it was "hi bill this is john, john this is phf he wants a relay"
asciilifeform wonders if these are built to work among selves, a la 'ricochet', when upstream link fails
asciilifeform: by all rights oughta
asciilifeform: theoretically ideal terrain for 'pest'
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-04-01#1092058 << asciilifeform has own rusty truck nao; is handy for his 'geological time' move into new pad
dulapbot: Logged on 2022-04-01 13:56:09 phf: you drive 2 hours east and the price of everything drops 2x. can even rent a uhaul to transport your electron microscope :>
asciilifeform: occasionally small pieces, lol, fall off. but so far nuffin from vital organs.
phf: is it an '85 ford f-150? :)
asciilifeform: the long bed sort
phf: you'll fit right in
asciilifeform: most sovok-flavoured auto asciilifeform ever rode in adult life
asciilifeform: hand-cranked windows etc
asciilifeform: cheap&angry
asciilifeform: even came w/ hitch ball.
asciilifeform lolled at the gymnastics req'd at the rust yard where bought it, where 'lolno, i dun want the payment plans' 'ok you gotta pay via spampal' 'let's find 1 that worx..'
asciilifeform: 'can by wire?' 'wat's a wire'
dulapbot: Logged on 2022-03-31 15:29:18 phf: also banking infrastructure is 20 years ahead of u.s. probably on par with chinese (i don't have personal knowledge, but that's the word). can do free micro transactions by counterparty's phone number/cc number/qr code/contract number. can e.g. buy street shavarma by doing a phone to phone transfer 150rub with no commission in real time. pretty much all the hole in the wall shops (electronics, horse equipment, hookah places, that's my
phf: cashier's check
asciilifeform: lol fella didnt know what that was either
asciilifeform: asciilifeform concluded 'no one pays with money here, evidently'
phf: sounds like maybe ethnic problem..
asciilifeform knows folx who ran into similar, apparently endemic in these parts. 'whattayamean you dun want the moneylender, how are we to make profit'
dulapbot: Logged on 2021-09-19 16:28:22 asciilifeform: but only <=508byte guaranteed not to frag.
verisimilitude: I ask, as this page seems to conflict a tad, by distinguishing between modules and destinations.
verisimilitude: I'm curious.
dulapbot: Logged on 2021-07-22 13:38:18 asciilifeform: gregory4: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc791#section-3.1
phf: asciilifeform: what odd native customs
asciilifeform: verisimilitude: empirically found that often enuff much larger packets will arrive w/out fragging. but the only 'guaranteed' unfragged mass planetwide seems to be 576 (incl. all headers)
asciilifeform: verisimilitude: per pest conception, you wanna be able to ensure unfraggedness even if pesting from moving truck and wardriving, which precludes 'clever' path mtu discovery etc
verisimilitude: ``All hosts must be prepared to accept datagrams of up to 576 octets (whether they arrive whole or in fragments).''
verisimilitude: I read this, but it's not actually a guarantee, which is unsettling.
verisimilitude: The only guarantee is sixty-eight octets, in the fragment section.
asciilifeform: verisimilitude: once you've turned off frag reassembly in os, if yer on a link where can't even carry 576 (where? if discovered one, plox to write in) will simply resemble dead connection.
asciilifeform not ran into such thing yet
verisimilitude: Of course, but it's odd.
asciilifeform: verisimilitude: doesn't mean it dun exist somewhere.
asciilifeform: maybe, somewhere , afghanistan, 'ip over dead goat'
verisimilitude: It's in the same style as ``Have a constant connection that doesn't go down for longer than fifteen minutes.'' with Pest.
asciilifeform: you can go down longer than 15m, will simply need to restamp & resend what if anything you had queued
verisimilitude: I've heard of IP over avian carriers, but never IP over dead goats.
verisimilitude: Anyway, my question has been answered.
verisimilitude: I appreciate it.
asciilifeform: for non-ip transport (e.g. shortwave) can in principle use sumthing other than 508byte packets. but we aint there yet
asciilifeform: for 1 thing, won't need the header at all there
asciilifeform: given 'if you can decrypt it, it's addressed to you'
asciilifeform: role of ip header would be played by the fourier transform params on yer radio, there.
asciilifeform: ^ ultimate shape of 'adult' pest.
asciilifeform: 0 reason to send 'ignores' there, either (unless yer confident that nobody's standing in yer nearfield)
verisimilitude: That's a neat idea.
asciilifeform: verisimilitude: very old idea, kilometres of log re subj
asciilifeform: is the obv. logical conclusion of subj
verisimilitude: Part of why it has always ``rubbed me the wrong way'' is how I always think about the rare case where garbage passes through by sheer luck.
asciilifeform: verisimilitude: you & yer station will be flattened by several asteroids , likely, long before you get accidentally valid packet outta rng
asciilifeform: ( after having won coupla dozen national lotteries, lol )
verisimilitude: I probably have a higher chance of being randomly poisoned by my food, sure, but still.
asciilifeform: take yer pick, aha
asciilifeform: moar likely you'll decode valid packet and get flipped bits in own machine from alpha decay in the meat of the latter
asciilifeform: trying to plan for this is imho virtually pointless (tho in e.g. ffa in places in fact tried..)
asciilifeform: comp is a physical object rather than proverbial 'spherical horse' and this has inescapable implications
asciilifeform: (if this matters in yer application -- tandem'em)
asciilifeform in fact sees ecc events in machine log 1/2ce a yr.
asciilifeform: fewer of'em nao ever since finally retired 2007 mobo w/ seemingly endless procession of failing caps..
asciilifeform: 2011 replacement a++ champ so far.
dulapbot: Logged on 2021-11-28 10:20:55 asciilifeform: using 'kdpe-d16' mobo in torture room, would pay good money for 100% passive cooling for same but nodice
verisimilitude: Redundancy through multiple copies is the most reasonable solution, yes.
verisimilitude: Repetition is the closest we can get to perfection, here.
PeterL: or does tandem them imply putting in serial - by chance will get through one but won't get thorugh both?
asciilifeform: PeterL: 'tandem' i.e. the practice of multiple cpu (or entire machine) working against identical inputs, and the outputs pass through 1 or more comparators
asciilifeform: most folx will live & die w/out ever touching 1 of these ( oblig. ref to yest. thrd )
dulapbot: Logged on 2022-03-31 19:54:41 asciilifeform: supposing actual honest effort, rather than 'avionics flavour spray', that is
asciilifeform: at this pt, largely 'artifact of lost civilization'
verisimilitude: Think of space computers, PeterL.
asciilifeform: ohey sumbody's still doing april1's
asciilifeform: ( dijkstra: 'how many bugs shall we tolerate?! how many??' fella in back of crowd : '7!' )
dulapbot: (trilema) 2018-12-14 phf: asciilifeform: i worked on tandem for a bit (known by then as HP NonStop), i appreciated the architecture, but entire software stack was cobol
asciilifeform wonders whether these still sold somewhere
phf: although there was no reason for its use, mostly a "of course our computers are rad hardened, i've been running this business since jimmy carter got in office, and you never know what those russkies might be up to"
asciilifeform: hm thought the usual commercial reason for purchase of 'nonstop' was simply to swap out e.g. burned cpu, a la raid disks, w/out stopping machine
asciilifeform suspects that these days this is more often done barbarically, by 'db replication' on konsoomer shit irons
asciilifeform: not to mention is apparently considered ok for e.g. 'visa' to have multi-hour outages.
dulapbot: Logged on 2022-03-31 20:05:35 asciilifeform: but larger point, dun matter whether have 3 tandem cpu and provably correct avionics stack, or hemp ropes like wright brothers, if the failed society doesn't in fact need (or can afford) airplane in any kinda mass
phf: asciilifeform: seymour cray would be appauled!
asciilifeform: 'over9000 chickens instead of horse' aha
asciilifeform recalls when purportedly standard for us telephone grid was proverbial 'five nines' uptime
asciilifeform: ... for current shitpnoje wireless , is a visible to naked eye 'lolno'. but interestingly enuff asciilifeform's dc in fact delivered 'five nines' service in 2021. i.e. <6min of dead time in yr
billymg: http://logs.bitdash.io/asciilifeform/2022-04-01#1091980 << that's fair criticism. my plan, perhaps never articulated, was to re-add the few useful pieces that were removed
bitbot: Logged on 2022-04-01 16:05:04 phf: jeez, it's a whole maternety ward of babies with that bath water
billymg: tbh i sort of lost interest in it though. in its current state, "works for me", and polishing the mp-wp turd in general was miserable and thankless work. i can handle miserable, and don't mind thankless, but the two together killed my motivation
asciilifeform hasn't touched his kludged wp in yrs. w/ exception of billymg's fix for highlighter & css, and prior to that, the spam trap
billymg: the general sentiment seems to be, "ugh, i hate using this pos, but no alternative atm
phf: billymg: the first questionable step was to replace all the images with svgs, because we couldn't figure out how to attach binary to v patches
asciilifeform recalls signpost's binhex cure for this
asciilifeform: (where iirc binturds transformed into sh scripts which piss out the turd when run)
billymg: that was done in genesis, and botched originally
bitbot: (trilema) 2018-12-27 billymg: such as 'images/kubrickheader.jpg.svg'
phf: i think it was always possible, could even wire to vtools, trivially, just never was a decision. of course now can do whatever the fuck :)
asciilifeform: imho no win from baking binturd support into vtron directly
asciilifeform: whereas preserving hand-crankability of the patches is a win imho
billymg: for the purpose of icons, specifically, can use actual svg. don't need to encode png/jpg binaries
billymg: though in a later patch i think i removed all the icons anyway, so currently the only images are the theme screenshots (iirc)
asciilifeform: iirc signpost was embedding a boot sector into a genesis
asciilifeform: coupla month ago
verisimilitude: I think asciilifeform may care about seeing this.
signpost: asciilifeform: ended up going back to lilo and bin86, whereas before I needed to do this to include all the binwads in syslinux.
signpost: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=ov9C << current pentacle ingredients.
signpost recently grunted it into per-project trees vs giant genesis wad.
signpost: oughta be able to drop the existing vpatches of other projects into this, and only have to write a "pbuild" file for them, not also regrind patches.
asciilifeform: verisimilitude: lol commenter didn't read the schematics at all ( imagined there's an adc in there, for instance, or a microcontroller... )
asciilifeform: 'For better auditability, the RNG boards should have been simpler, with only the analog part of the RNG...' etc
asciilifeform: 'they should have used an ADC input of the microcontroller instead of using a RS-232 input...' << there's neither a microcontroller nor a rs232 input anywhere in fg...
asciilifeform: ( folx who read the schems know that the rng daughterboards in fact contain only the analogue part. 2x ea. )
verisimilitude: To be fair, Fuckgoats doesn't even have a CoC, so he probably didn't feel welcome to look.
asciilifeform: 'haven't read, but disapprove'(tm)(r)(hruschev)
signpost: "did he even ask the goats!?"
mangol: same story on several sites, apparently started from twitter screencaps
mangol: reich rag warned a week ago that "America and Europe Must Be Ready for Russian Biological or Chemical Attacks"
signpost: each side is so irredeemably full of shit, who can say
signpost: https://vitalik.ca/general/2022/04/01/maximalist.html << one hell of a "just kidding, but seriously" out of buterin today.
verisimilitude: I agree with such maximalism.
verisimilitude: The middling positions are generally worthless.
verisimilitude: I swear I was already planning to cut many seed oils out of my diet, and then I see so many others doing it.
signpost: later... "suck it, nerds! I used eth to accumulate btc!"
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