asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: bog-slow.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: it's been tried, 'cl as script lang', bog slow cuz bringing it up ( cl on x86 is moar or less halfbaked lispm emulator ) takes time.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: the folx who 'i went to 7 countries! i.e. ate 'bigmac' in 7 diff. mcdonaldsen' ? that's exactly it.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: while we sit on unix, we will inevitably 'bake whoknowswhat loli'
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: this isn't even false. the illusion, however, is that 'c links natively, write c proggy' is some kinda improvement.
asciilifeform: first gotta fully describe the atrocity, so as it is not repeated in future. mp_en_viaje recall that shoemaker-era defunkt public toilet in timis 3 blocks from 'kaufland' ?
asciilifeform: those, are cuz 0 standardized abi on linux . so instead various horrors where gcc is invoked, a small c proggy is shat out in realtime, built, then jumped into.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: why which ? why open sockets by talking to linux ? i agree, the Right Thing would be a cltron that drives nic directly etc.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: 'foreign function interface', i.e. mechanism for calling unixisms (socket, fileism, mmapism, etc)
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: i thought the mega-virtue of oklahomistan is where it is largely empty
asciilifeform: nfi how one might come upon this notion ( want to eat projectile , but not wake up neighbours ? ) but e.g. arbalest entirely adequate to go through left temple and out of right, is ~fiddybux.
asciilifeform: let's illustrate. 'umi yukaba', jp naval anthem, '37 and on. 'if i go to sea / i shall be a washed up corpse. / if i go to the mountains / a corpse i shall be in the grass / but as i die for the emperor / i will have no regret ' roughly.
asciilifeform: well no, that's the funny bit, the angle of 'hey cannon fodder, wanna die honourably for emperor?' angle was muchly in place already then.
asciilifeform: iirc mp_en_viaje knows how to strip the electron shell from the latter and make bromine trifluoride neh
asciilifeform: ( come to think of it, i dun recall at any point mp_en_viaje travelogue where 'this-here country has a++ bsdm!' -- this ever even existed ? )
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: what was it like in the old days ?
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-04#1911171 << how wouldja disambiguate ? ( ...pick random ? ...prompt ? )
asciilifeform: Mocky: re vpatches -- as i understand, the contemplated structure is a linear chain, and 'siblings' could only occur in event of schisms/civil war , rather than as a regular thing
asciilifeform: nobody makes'em jump in the thing , lol, they go in on own steam
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: what are you using for modem, lol, the remains of the killed stealth bomber in belgrad ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu demoed this with mpex aeons ago
asciilifeform: e.g. http://trilema.com/gns/mp etc
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-03#1910992 << there's a simple , if ugly , pill for giving heathens working links -- http://a.working.box.with.gateway/mocky etc
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: how's serbia ? does http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-01#1868233 still stand ?
asciilifeform waves to mp_en_viaje
asciilifeform: lol, wai would they 'yield'. usg prints moola by the gigatonne, gives'em just like gives to microshit. a++ 'biznismodel'. aand nao finally banned competing chinese router ( which, lulzily, is mostly indistinguishable from cisco in any way that matters )
asciilifeform: 'you wanna park auto on the grounds ? get rubber stamp there'
asciilifeform: oh hey mircea_popescu was this the same fella who later was found dead on street, and the anatomists found no reason why, 'simply tired of living' ?
asciilifeform: and 'tutoring halls' run by 'assoc for women in kompyooting' ( to help 'diversity' , i.e. folx who can't pass the (massively watered down in past 2 decades ) curriculum
asciilifeform: oh apropos, luvvly lulz : in asciilifeform's old uni, they had 'grand opening' of massive 9story glass monster for 'comp sci dept' . guess what inside ? carpentry, sewing shops!
asciilifeform: ( it is in principle possible to make such a thing, but no one afaik has attempted , and i cannot immediately think re how to approach )
asciilifeform: this entirely troo. in south sovok we had both hemp and poppies growing wild, neither was smoked by ~anyone
asciilifeform: i.e. wine is not directly analogous product, where complex mixture
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-02#1910631 << i defo aint expert on subj, but what means 'not very good' coca ? afaik there is exactly 1 active organic in it -- 'not good' is simply when less ? oughta still be worth sumthing neh
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-02#1910633 << there's actually not 1 but 2 'standard os' available in piz ( 'rk' and 'dulap' tarballs ) but both are stone age gentoos, they are obsoleted by cuntoo (when the latter is pronounced baked, but really even nao, it is impossible to e.g. 'emerge' packages on the vintage gentoo, the upstream package repos went full tard year ago )
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-02#1910612 << if it's an older lappy, can do what i did with 'x60' ( stuff in 'atheros' mpci card ) , these -- worked
asciilifeform: granted , rk worx fine for 'traditional' soft, e.g. mp's wp ; but let's say 'tmsr dns' or other adatronic proggy becomes part of typical use, then wat.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: indeed , this is the de-facto piz standard for x86 . on acct of cost , availability, and asciilifeform-approved vintage of subcomponents
asciilifeform: it is actually the snsa spare , BingoBoingo and asciilifeform were leasing it out to hanbot at colo rate , with mp's permission.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: i am not aware of hanbot lodging a complaint re ~the iron~ ( plz point to log if missed )
asciilifeform: imho 1 of the more interesting examples of 'well-run cult'
asciilifeform: i.e. not simply 'living time capsule.' i have nfi how they keep up the e.g. 'pnoje yes, tv nope' etc biz.
asciilifeform: iguess usg accomplished ~sumthing~, lol, nao they can stink about 'spooled onto tank treads' for 30 yrs like they do over cn
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-01#1910415 << diana_coman would dulap-style box suffice ? there is one. ( mp_en_viaje pointed out downthread, same 1 as hanbot worked on )
asciilifeform: !Q later tell mp_en_viaje http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/AoJ53/?raw=true << asciilifeform's attempt, after you went, ftr.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: afaik not really similar, was moar of a kindergarten 'point an' laff at the monkey'
asciilifeform: if mp_en_viaje was in there i missed it tho
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: not sure where i got the notion. dun seem to have any corresponding knob in reality, aha
asciilifeform: in unrelated noose, asciilifeform when found http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-22#1909217 took half hr to compile an' leave it churning on a dev board. in week+ nao, did not fall down. which means possibly worth reading and genesising when asciilifeform or someone else has free hand.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: how's old europistan ?
asciilifeform waves to mp_en_viaje
asciilifeform: it aint as if 'oh this clump of transistors dissolved , i'ma simply guess what may've been there' is a viable algo.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-30#1910209 << this is a solvable problem -- given a) lang that actually supports modularization ( ada & common lisp, afaik, being the only such currently ) ; b) mandatorily compact system soft (i.e. specifically opposed to mil+ loc of liquishit c) generous public whippings for 'the dancers who are hindered by own arse'
asciilifeform: dun ping from swampistan or from dulap
asciilifeform: ( wandered in by happenstance, while on other biz. 'wanna turn the knobs? we put housefly as sampler' 'canhaz per hr' d00d digs, disgorges rate )
asciilifeform: it aint even so hard to implement ~on pc~ -- poor madman terry davis, ~had it~ . ( asciilifeform happens to think that davis read his www, but at this pt only beelzebub knows, whether read or came to the obv notion on own steam.. )
asciilifeform: you turn on the mains, thing compiles the coupla MB of sores kept in nonvolatile. this -- runs. you go an' change a line, it recompiles that section, at same time as the cache refreshes.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-27#1910094 << quite the opposite. it's how microshit/crapple world was made possible to begin with -- what with os etc being multi-GB of binariola. whereas suppose 'os' consisted of coupla kb of hand-entered hex bootstrap + whatever-sized bag of source, and kept 'compileade' strictly in cache ram...
asciilifeform: or, take the retardation common to all current pc os -- the explicit juggling of compiled binaries ( really compiled bins ought not to be directly handled by operator, but exist in same sense as disk cache , system as visible to user oughta consist 100% of source, and sectionally rebuilt when changed )
asciilifeform: bvt: as for c, i described in the prev. mp thread re the subj, it can certainly ~exist~ as a zoological specimen on sane iron, as it did on bolix. sorta how you can put cobol on yer box nao if you feel like it.,
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: iirc they switched to 'let's hijack vz embassies abroad' algo
asciilifeform: lol i recall mp_en_viaje's bogota piece
asciilifeform: i half-expected 1 or other would be trotted out when 'moor's law' dead. but turned out to be cheaper to simply tell konsoomer to suck it.
asciilifeform: it's the champ, to date, of 'clock at any cost'
asciilifeform: ( i.e. mp_en_viaje is not the 1st to notice the absurdity of plugging a 2kg, 200watt eater into pc mobo )
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: ever ~drop~ box with gpu mounted, lol
asciilifeform: it's why you pump air through the thing like vacuum cleaner neh
asciilifeform: no melted caps, simply won't draw on 4096x4096 3d glass display at 200fps or what's the latest wankfad.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: very similar, how else. asciilifeform's observation was that even 'nvidia, but 50x slower cuz on fpga matrix, still suffices for reasonable gaming' , more like.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: lacking even photograph, i cannot pontificate in further detail re nvidia. but also do not automatically conclude on acct of 'faster than amd's' that it were hand-sewn.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: erry die from z80 up has 'large rectangular' , them's the cache srams.
asciilifeform: it is entirely not the case that 'no one' hand-massages. but the items with 3bil+ transistors, it is rather impractical proposition to do this for.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: if you ever get hold of a die shot, it is possible to distinguish with naked eye, when 'compiled from rtl' and when 'hand-massage' . practical example of the former : https://s.zeptobars.com/baikal-Si.jpg
asciilifeform: nao i did not walk in and see it used. but would be surprised to learn that it wasn't, the temptation is irresistible , on acct of sheer heft of the risk in the biz
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i know for a fact that they do.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: you'd be surprised at 99% of what gets baked as 'asic'
asciilifeform: this is sorta the basic idea in e.g. ffa -- 'what's the simplest mechanism that will actually suffice'
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i did short walk through the linked www, believe or not, d00d in fact typed up some of the ancient docs into humanlike text
asciilifeform: an' competing for 'customers'
asciilifeform: 1) attend clintonarvard 2) return to orcistan as 'appointee' 3) feather miaminest for 20y 4) decamp, profit!1
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: 1st i saw the link to that thing, went 'eh, fossil', then went and ~read~, and 'wtf, where do i buy a chip with even half the doc of this'
asciilifeform: gcc per se has no biz 'continuing indefinitely' ( as mp_en_viaje already noted )
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: re 'gcc ladder', the orig boojum was the 'catch-22' where a musl gcc can only be built w/ another musl gcc , and the only working specimen trinque was able to find in the wild, was a gcc6
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: see further downthread, expanded on this.
asciilifeform: funnily enuff, BingoBoingostan installed facewank. they dun stamp anyffin at all.
asciilifeform: were short on ink for passport stamps or wat
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: a 'couldn't' is worth 9000 'wouldn'ts' eh
asciilifeform: ( 1 'downer' -- apparently 'cells' drawn by hand, and then arranged by simple proggy , 'gred' -- but its sores not given in the doc )
asciilifeform would luvvv to read 'ffa-style' incarnation of such a work, where the chip is 'built up' from empty space in ~hour-long chunks. but prolly this won't exist until asciilifeform writes 1..
asciilifeform: ^ and before mp asks, yes it's combo of manual typewriter and ink pen, and no it won't in a million years ocr, other than by meat ( and is largely schematics / waveforms anyway )
asciilifeform: i.e. what you'd want is to 'self-host' (on iron built for the purpose) a lang where a c, ada, etc. compiler is 3000 ln.
asciilifeform: c is a pretty sad lang to write anyffin complicated in, ~especially~ a compiler (and c compiler is no exception)
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-23#1909527 << currently i suspect that tcc & similar is a mirage; and that an actual serious solution would moar resemble the bolix approach, where you have a proper lisp and a ~compact~ + readable c-to-lisp ~in~ it for use with legacy crapola while-needed
asciilifeform: i dun expect to ever get hands on a complete elbrus-2 or etc.
asciilifeform: ( which makes approx same amt of sense as all other attempts to create 'unwet water', but i have nfi what the psychology is )
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i suspect they are attempts to 'build own miami', in the spirit of http://btcbase.org/log/2019-03-17#1903015
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: when sovok folded , usa market was awash in grade-a 'museum' small arms , for pennies
asciilifeform: lol actually the item from concan doyle's 'the empty house'
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: the 'snip out timestamp nonsense from gcc' thing has been itching since '15
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: was built to be debugged, it their 1st (and last) piece of in-house silicon
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: not entirely arbitrary, there was a ~massive~ increase in bulk + documented wtf's at 5.0
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i've deliberately not gone beyond 'read papers in hammock' stage for bolixism, on acct of this.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: at least month -- there's a heavy piece i haven't even started yet -- keccak
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: it still gotta be eaten & characterized, if to be used.
asciilifeform: an' you, mp_en_viaje ?
asciilifeform: ohai mp_en_viaje !
asciilifeform: here of course also 'sun and wind'. but + also swamp.
asciilifeform: PeterL: why wouldja want to run the pump on gas?!
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: here's an old asciilifeform crackpottery : why exactly can't one buy clothes dryer that runs on vacuum pump, instead of heater.
asciilifeform: PeterL: the sks comment was re mp's budapest 'changing of the guard' photo
asciilifeform: has anyone attempted to build the whole orchestra on ave1's gcc ?
asciilifeform really must dust off the old notes and try this with own hands; the presence of gcc5 in the build bothers asciilifeform not only from 'practical' but from thompsonistic pov
asciilifeform: mumps is merely unpleasant, not usually crippling
asciilifeform: via BingoBoingo's link, moar epidemi-lulz -- measles apparently nao is a thing in BingoBoingostan
asciilifeform believer in 'proggy may not be the spec' dictum. in the arithmetic chs, however, there is no spec beyond e.g. 'multiply these two numbers in constant spacetime', which has simple unambiguous meaning.
asciilifeform: fwiw i suspect that not only the diagrams, but the text, is optional : it aint a very complicated proggy, and patient reader could in principle grasp it w/out a cribsheet
asciilifeform: possibly there's a deeper 'meta' point in this thread, i.e. that the final stage of fitting a mechanism in-head, is when you rewrite it with own hands, in the notation of ~your~ choice, so that the orig author's arbitrary conventions (and it is impossible to write anyffin nontrivial w/out ~some~ personal convention) dun rub the skin off yer feet.
asciilifeform: i'll add, however, that ffa does not use byte-addressing or bit-addressing, if you were to build a machine where either is in whatever direction, and write a (standard-compliant) ada for it, ffa will work same way.
asciilifeform: i'ma add this to the http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-12#1908374 file, btw : if there existed actual programmatic diagram tool, who wants mirrored could simply push button an' flip. ( as it is, thing is 100% laboriously -- as in months of fiddling -- hand-drawn )
asciilifeform: the historical meaning ( and iirc diana_coman pointed this out in the piece ) is simply from how european writes a number, left to right, e.g. 10, bin 1010 >> 1 is 101 (5) , the motion being to the right
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: at this pt i'm not even convinced that there ~is~, or could be, a 'chinese strategy', or 'they want..' -- these folx have not developed a with-what to want , whole edifice reduces to individual party-appointed directors' desire for miami
asciilifeform: if mp_en_viaje has the spare cycles, asciilifeform is quite curious to learn how exactly the chinese chip folx are 'leaving money on table'
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: lol howdja guess?!111
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: precedent, too. recall 'wtc mosque'.
asciilifeform did , repeatedly, write, and many yrs ago nao, that the 'reverse fpga' people are solving the wrong problem -- by the time they achieve anyffin, vendor simply replaces the design and laffs
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: knowing 0 aside from the product , i would say it is not correct to put wolf in the company of koch -- wolf actually did sumthing nontrivial and useful ( mapped out the ice40 matrix )
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: (as you can read further downthread) the misfortunate thing is that died before got anywhere near mature ice40 tool.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: 6mo old page. i think he already bent.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: re 'what happened there' , d00d seems to say his piggy went dry.
asciilifeform: walking across europistan isn't a mp_en_viaje-strictly activity because expensive. but because takes time.
asciilifeform: and pics are great, i suspect most of these 'everythings' i will only see if mp_en_viaje finds time to make a pic of'em.
asciilifeform: hey picture how crowded would be if erryone were somehow mp_en_viaje
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: 'where to walk to' is absolutely killer here in ameristan. asciilifeform walks erry day, but frustratingly in (however large) circles
asciilifeform: ohai mp_en_viaje
asciilifeform: 'MachineBitnessLog2' is prolly the most obv. example of this, it only comes into play in ch13
asciilifeform: tho i do suspect that i did introduce certain knobs before there was strictly a need to do so, solely on acct of imperfect plan ( recall, most of the proggy through ch10 or so, pre-existed the start of the human-readable series )
asciilifeform: diana_coman: i'm still stumped re where it was that i had 'most junior bits on the left' tho
asciilifeform: ( tho iirc there was an actual attempt to organize 1, they launched a crate or 2 of fist-sized beepbeeps into deliberately burns-in-coupla-months orbit )
asciilifeform: feeding 9000 poetterings is quite cheap, compared to cost of making even very modest 1980s-style irons.
asciilifeform: it's exactly the 'biz model' of mp's proverbial 'wall holders'.
asciilifeform: but if you want deterministic paths, currently yer stuck using the vendor shitware. ( what's worse, even on ye olde xilinx apparently it is impossible to write e.g. a working 200MHz+ dram controller from 1st principles, yer forced to use the vendor's shitware that actually knows the gate delays, to equalize the paths )
asciilifeform: as it stands, it is just about impossible, presently, to bake even very simple dram controller for ice40
asciilifeform: ( ~why~ went nowhere -- i do not presently know; it may be simply from lack of time , ~or~ could easily be because he does not in fact have the relevant gate-delay numbers . the published docs suggest the latter as possibility )
asciilifeform: he had plan to dig into the larger fpga from same vendor, and to improve the synth engine, but apparently went nowhere.
asciilifeform: evidently, the hero who knows how to turn work on sane kompyooting irons/softs into a self-sustaining economic item, is not yet born.
asciilifeform: currently looks like bvt is the champ ffa eater.
asciilifeform: ... which makes the hdd-like approach described in earlier thread even moar appealing -- dun have to laser'em out, can simply map the dead blocks, and tell autorouter not to use'em
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: oddly enuff in ro 100% asked for passport ( whether this is always, or simply cuz asciilifeform looked like rube -- nfi )
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: these iirc tend to be dug along side railroad right-of-way. in europistan, a++. in ameristan, on other hand..
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: is this 1st time you went there ? or did they fughet how to spatian since n-1 ?
asciilifeform: asciilifeform does not know hungarian, but was under impression that it was a full-featured lang with 20-sumthing cases etc
asciilifeform: and you, mp_en_viaje ?
asciilifeform waves to mp_en_viaje
asciilifeform: grr loox like we missed today's mp_en_viaje
asciilifeform: ( possibly he also had passage re how this is so that moderntards can have time to reddit instead of cutting stones. or possibly i dreamed this, and it was implicit.. )
asciilifeform: and what of mp_en_viaje's viajes ?
asciilifeform: ohai mp_en_viaje
asciilifeform: !Q later tell mp_en_viaje http://trilema.com/2019/pe-un-franc-poet/#selection-51.567-59.2 << malformed link
asciilifeform: presently , it aint even clear to asciilifeform that it is possible to produce a pc-iron lisp that isn't doomed to resemble that pile of shit, simply on acct of the hostility of the iron to any kind of sense
asciilifeform: then again when phf brought up 'hey didja look at the internals', and i did, barfed mightily; the notion of cleaning sbcl makes the gnat work look trivial in comparison, ~whole thing is a pile of gnarly x86 hackolade
asciilifeform: without it, ~impossible to bake the type of item contemplated in that thrd.
asciilifeform: ( who eats maybe half of what i do , and buys ~nuffin, but at same time does 9000 chores + 100% of food-crafting + mp-style 'here's a type of cake we haven't had yet' etc )
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-13#1908446 << i dun think i ever saw a crapple product which attempted
asciilifeform: Mocky: pretty sure mp described in great detail how his implementation worx
asciilifeform: or if it dun exist, what the everliving fuck has erryone claiming to be involved in 'computer graphics' been doing since 1970s ? aside from eating own shit.
asciilifeform: somehow in 1985 someone somewhere had comp that's an actual fucking tool for thought, and where could go p=and(x,y) q=or(x,p) r=and(p,q) and get a set of gates arranged in neat rows and with minimal-length non-intersecting wires between'em . and today not.
asciilifeform: 'oh very funny asciilifeform , you thought modern comp could be programmed to shit out logically-defined rectangles with readable text ?'
asciilifeform: it's a geometric device. and yes, can be explained in text, or in morse code, etc. but really belongs as a manipulable graphic, if you already fucking have a comp that displays these ( or wtf is it for, for lolcats ?! )
asciilifeform: and the notion is esp. outrageous when sitting next to a comp, which theoretically ought to make this a three minute job.
asciilifeform: meanwhile, in loathesome shitware : asciilifeform when woke up thought, 'i'ma quickly draw the gedanken-mechanism for mp' . went then 'with what ?' -- turns out, erry single didactic digital logic drawing thing, run in either java, or winliquishit, or is opensores linuxturd that builds but then displays blank page, or similar...
asciilifeform: this gets even lulzier tho -- each bit in a lut is there because it connects to a neighbour (e.g. in the 4bit example from earlier thread -- 4 neighbours ) . nao picture the galaxy of 'neighbours' for the 64bit item...
asciilifeform: ( picture, 1st fella to solve the exercises, gets prize, a sample fpga, lol )
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-11#1908303 << for folx w/out the spare cycles to read the orig horror -- classical nsaware , complete with 'null ciphers' , 'negotiations', etc lulz
asciilifeform: but currently no impetus.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: you wouldn't want to even consider baking unless ~very~ concrete idea of what (and simulated the thing)
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: this is prolly the #1 noob q of folx digging into subj. answr is yield, it is why 'pentium' isn't fist-sized
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: the sq.metrage of cell grows exponentially with bitness of lut
asciilifeform: if make smaller than 4, seems to be (empirically) losing idea, the propagation delays from many small cells eat you alive
asciilifeform: erry type of homogeneous fpga worx on same principle. you have cell, in the cell, a shift register. for simplest example take 17 bits. (will be clear why shortly)
asciilifeform: thinking about it, whole item is simple enuff that it'd fit in a coupla log lines. so i'ma throw in ftr :
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-11#1908219 << hard to picture what 'importance' was left after d00d was cornered into his mousetrap
asciilifeform recalls when the lowest plebe still got 56+kbaud , on land line. then 16kb on '1g', 8 (with lossy compression!) on '2g'. nao next crank of the ratchet.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: well-known scamola. there's a pseudo-nokia 'remake' on same shitware.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: many 'secret' hobos, who still can afford to run auto, and live in that
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: in ustarded cities, 5-10% of population is hobo. but Official Troof is that 0. hence various machinations to hide'em
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i have nfi what is point, but ~100% of park benches in large ameri-urban have'em
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: as i understand ( from mp_en_viaje's chronicles no less ) they do. but usually in arabistan, where they somehow like fat
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje : asciilifeform + pet still not recovered from doing this in '17!1111 nao errything tasteslikeshit
asciilifeform: lol picture if they somehow had to print the troof on the package. '10% mass brutto : coffee imported from zimbabwe ; 90% -- sawdust sweepings from sawmill in montgomery, alabama' etc
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: near as i can tell , ~nobody in north amer knows how to make edible soft cheese. hard -- some (at exorbitant price) yes
asciilifeform: how they do the import, i do not know to this day
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: the 1 in glass jar ?
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: it ~doesn't, most of what's edible is flown in
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: they do!
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: funnily enuff, when i was in ro bought sample of erry tin claiming to contain sprat. then brought home and sampled. not 1 compares to the gost standard riga item.
asciilifeform reliably ends up replicating 'nazi uboat' wherever he lives. complete with bulkheads
asciilifeform: leaving aside the matter where asciilifeform's meat-training skill is approx on par with his mig pilotage skill -- mp_en_viaje would bust gut laffing if he knew how uniquely poor asciilifeform is set up for subj. e.g. as it is , i dun even have physical sq. metrage for a hypothetical #3 crew.
asciilifeform: when mp_en_viaje wrote that he trained these to do useful work, i believe. but it is a world-class feat, like kuklachev's famous housecat circus. i dunno that it's been replicated.
asciilifeform: PeterL: at one time (long before i found out about mp's uni ad flyers) i put up some ads there; guess what result ? ( buncha grad students begging to have their homework done , and offering such laffably small bakshish that it was not worth for asciilifeform to even turn key in car )
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: the flip side is that one can end up like asciilifeform , i.e. with dozen tonnes of ??? , from xray cabinet to that weird wrench one uses to swap water heater coils
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: did i visibly netsplit at your end ?
asciilifeform: tho this might make prop.delay calculation slightly trickier. possibly what you'd want instead is to connect only the 4 'compass' faces of 'subcube' to adjacent units.
asciilifeform: simple enuff tech, that it actually begins to seem 'boring', which makes it auto-interesting to asciilifeform ..
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: as a matter of fact i did. how do you suppose i knew what beam cone to use, lol
asciilifeform: the '80s-style 2d tile already gives you, e.g., simple means to bake arbitrarily-wide alu. for instance.
asciilifeform: but i was thinking moar along the lines of the simplest device that'd be of practical use, rather than 'futurisms'.
asciilifeform: ( i suspect mp_en_viaje knew this already, but even intel et al, 'cheat', when you buy a pentium-whatever with 'n cores', it really has 24 or whatnot, and only n working units , the others lasered out )
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: on anyffing at all, you get the 'only n % gotta work'
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: substrate gotta be a dopable insulator
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i dun presently know of an economical non-si substrate. was thinking strictly in the bounds of current commercial processes.
asciilifeform: it aint even like you can't buy a 30cm piece of si crystal. errybody does already, they simply cut it into 1cm^2 squares. simply costs.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: y'mean the faux-asics that were relabeled xilinxen lol
asciilifeform: simplest physical realization of this, would be to position eprom cells along a spiral. then can program via ordinary uv laser in konsoomer 'dvd-r'.
asciilifeform: ( before you laff -- sovok in fact did bake fpga. i have a sample. but it was mid-80s state of art, i.e. metallization-programmed )
asciilifeform: i suspect if sovok had lived another 2-3 yrs, there's be ddr-baked examples of this in my parts box.
asciilifeform: theoretically, this kinda thing is chemistry-insensitive, could bake it on any process available, denser 1 will simply give you moar cells.
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: routing is the typical eater of sq.metrage in fpga
asciilifeform: would simply need additional metal layer.
asciilifeform: d in series. ) simple enuff to simulate deterministically (and calculate propagation delays on paper..)
asciilifeform: not wholly unrelatedly, asciilifeform's semi-automated archaeology birthed a logworthy output recently. seems like in '80s there was an outfit, 'algotronix', that xilinx bought an' killed , to bury the product in patent liquishit. had entirely homogeneous fpga , made from identical ~200-transistor cells ( with simple north-south-east-west tile interconnects, and 1 flipflop inside, configged via 16bit shift register per cell, connecte
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-10#1907853 << i cannot resist to ask, where did mp_en_viaje spot this
asciilifeform: nor did i ever feel burning urge for 30MB/s on gsm -- who the hell pumps wares via a 'pay per MB' sim toy
asciilifeform: huawei's item was the champ, even worked (with a little perling) to send/receive voice calls (why to do this, is separate q, but it does work)
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i have nfi what the ' ~100kb init.sh (that ~requires root~) ' horror might be, the only ones i've ever used simply present as a hayes-style modem via usb (a la FG)
asciilifeform: ( or did mp_en_viaje drag a sovok-style satellite rig with him... might explain the 200kg lol )
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i confess , i assumed you were already connecting through a 'buy a local simcard' thing of 1 kind or another
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: boeing claims ada in 7xx series. but i have no means to verify .
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: re 'avionics people' -- tried as i might, found only the hole, but not the fossil. ( ~somebody~ pressed for the lang standard to have the http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1913#selection-349.0-1150.0 knobs. but who? and where used ? i do not know to this day )
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: rrright, but picture whole block o'flats fulla ~only~ these, nuffin else
asciilifeform: whether happened yet or not, it dun particularly concern us imho -- any moar than mp has to think, when dining on foie gras, about rats gnawing on a goose carcass that died over a junkyard somewhere
asciilifeform: ^ looked solid on surface, but must admit that asciilifeform did not attempt to put to use
asciilifeform: diana_coman: upstack to 'quasi-decent heathen adaists', 1 item from my notes is http://www.dmitry-kazakov.de/ada/components.htm
asciilifeform: near as i can tell, these folx simply sat down and 'wrote c++ in ada', is all there was to it.
asciilifeform: 1st major piece of 'example' asciilifeform tried to eat, actually was the bignumtron ~inside gnat~ , in '16. and quickly barfed.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: so far i've found that reading heathen ada examples ~cost~ me time, rather than saved, and put into my head things that later had to laboriously pump out. and the zip fella is no exception.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/patches/ffa_ch18_subroutines.kv/tree/ffa/ffacalc/ffa_calc.adb#L553 << for thread-completeness, illustration of matching such 'strings'
asciilifeform: the ada array-slice notation makes this work properly without substantial effort, simply through the type constraint logic .
asciilifeform: if all yer 'strings' come from the inside of a large, static string, can represent'em simply as tuples , as pictured in above
asciilifeform: re config txt parsers, i dun grasp why it would need heapism, rather than simple http://btcbase.org/patches/ffa_ch18_subroutines.kv/tree/ffa/ffacalc/ffa_calc.adb#L99 -style offsets into the read-only text
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: wat's a 'zumba' ?
asciilifeform: !!rate mp_en_viaje 1 by all appearances, mircea_popescu's mobile palace terminal
asciilifeform waves to mp_en_viaje & co
asciilifeform: OriansJ: plz know that if you're waiting for mp to wake up and repeat what he has prev. said, you will be quite disappointed. nobody repeats; and failure to address prev comments in the log, is the height of ill manners: can be forgiven a noob once or twice, but one gets with the program and starts using the log , or loses voice fast.
asciilifeform: OriansJ: if you answr mp's comments in today's log, tomorrow he can answer back, etc. this is typically how it worx here, rather than waiting always for folx all over planet to be awake simultaneously
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: dram ( at least such as sold as 'ddr3' and above ) is actually a scam, i.e. 'works unless the access pattern revisits $row 'too often' ) , this is moar of a shoddy konsoomer rubbish masquerading as deterministic component than an 'attack'
asciilifeform: cuz, elementarily, it would have to contain coupla 10k actual transistors inside, and impose their propagation delay on the output.
asciilifeform: fughetting for a moment fpga : consider ordinary transistor, or even diode. it is not physically possible to bake a 'secretly smart' transistor that does s/mp-pubkey/gavin-pubkey in hopes of being put in somebody's serial port 1 day, and for it to have same analogue characteristics as genuine diode (not even speaking of what it'd look like under microscope)
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: asciilifeform does not and at no point did posit a 'magical amulet' iron that somehow cures the effects of throwing in braindamaged softs
asciilifeform: sorta why asciilifeform separated fg into 3 individually-auditable components