#trilema | 2016-12-26

← 2016-12-25 | 2016-12-27 → ↓

pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: i guess too busy making lasagna and quiche (like rest of tmsr!). homemade nanaimo bars too.

pete_dushenski: http://www.foodnetwork.ca/shows/great-canadian-cookbook/blog/history-of-nanaimo-bars/ << pretty sure this is a specifically canadian delicacy

pete_dushenski: they're often either too sweet or too buttery but can be made to be quite tasty by savvy bakers.

pete_dushenski is also spending holiday time shopping for boxen on which to run eulora because mac hack is more hassle than it's worth.

pete_dushenski: this is only partially disappointing because i) no one ever said macs were computers anyways, and ii) who doesn't like new toys ?

pete_dushenski: holy fuck are they cheap too. boxes that were $8k a decade ago are now cad$100. basically free.

pete_dushenski: https://bnktothefuture.com/pitches/bitstamp << shitstamp now at $700k/$1.6mn crowdscamming round valuing twocansandstring(tm) at... $81mn

pete_dushenski: naturally, the deal is being sweetened : ""All those who invest in Bitstamp on the BnkToTheFuture platform before midnight 1 January (UTC -12) can now get 12 months of anti-dilution protection on their investment!"

pete_dushenski to submit to food coma

gabriel_laddel_p: 0.o http://www.gaussian.com/g_prod/gv5b.htm

gabriel_laddel_p: http://depth-first.com/articles/2011/10/12/sixty-four-free-chemistry-databases/

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/04932FC1ACFE99163FD79A411203C1F1AC165455C084E904D53E7FCDFD25075F << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 9435...9903 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '177.234.6.53 (ssh-rsa key from 177.234.6.53 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (Unknown MX CHH)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/CB5B1D827EB358F0F3729E032D7CB87D3EB7925BA5FCABFF044D56049D522969 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 9435...9903 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '177.234.2.141 (ssh-rsa key from 177.234.2.141 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (Unknown MX CHH)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/8A7228C2E48B65D9EE71CE8DB1B75FFE930507D56D82427E63D2AAEBE4D861FA << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 9435...9903 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '177.234.2.171 (ssh-rsa key from 177.234.2.171 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (Unknown MX CHH)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/F2CF15C86AB9208CBAFAF70C693E355F370A099512477D393A2A91F2CC050993 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 9435...9903 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '177.234.16.45 (ssh-rsa key from 177.234.16.45 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (Unknown MX CHH)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/4D378BAD01D73CD2FD529220969D6C281D90346F095AE86877ED4AFE868932B3 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 9435...9903 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '177.234.0.33 (ssh-rsa key from 177.234.0.33 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (Unknown MX CHH)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/B8B57C5F1BF98E9F5867F51264E3E2C8496B2C3535035C974E8CBA411DCAE019 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 2125...1951 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '5.172.155.140 (ssh-rsa key from 5.172.155.140 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (canary.ashbysoft.co.uk. GB)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/A77D6586C944EA2F8BF996CF3DC332D6D33F2427C580FE939989A62A138E7376 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 9435...9903 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '177.234.16.177 (ssh-rsa key from 177.234.16.177 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (Unknown MX CHH)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/3C547879EB8BEF6913685CF454B6838C672E76BF3A08B6AD369EFF88F7A19F18 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 2530...5181 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '188.252.69.242 (ssh-rsa key from 188.252.69.242 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (host242-188-252-69.limes.com.pl. PL)

shinohai: wow

mircea_popescu: dat 8ball eh

mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-26#1590742 << and in typical fashion of the utterly imbecile "average joe", the idiots wish to opine about the viability of mpex, where no issuer EVER diluted, and say nice things about pure and simple scams with free dilution a la twocan exchange.

a111: Logged on 2016-12-26 06:07 pete_dushenski: naturally, the deal is being sweetened : ""All those who invest in Bitstamp on the BnkToTheFuture platform before midnight 1 January (UTC -12) can now get 12 months of anti-dilution protection on their investment!"

mircea_popescu: then they wonder why the barriers in front of them are only going up. because seriously, who could POSSIBLY not want anything to do with idiots this idiotic. who! who!

mircea_popescu: sigh,

mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-26#1590744 << what about it ? (it should perhaps be pointed out that at the scale involved, "visualising" is not necessarily a meaningful concept, not all the processes make any sense visually.)

a111: Logged on 2016-12-26 08:44 gabriel_laddel_p: 0.o http://www.gaussian.com/g_prod/gv5b.htm

mircea_popescu: and in other great fence news, http://68.media.tumblr.com/84691d46a821b7caeaad28352f05878a/tumblr_obyaswxJoV1s3k2n4o1_1280.jpg

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/45F8DFEE99404FC105C9786E8FFAAC2C1CEABFE51D06CB125AFE7AF4442D4CC2 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 1520...0417 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '82.44.7.112 (ssh-rsa key from 82.44.7.112 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (112.7-44-82.static.virginmediabusiness.co.uk. GB)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/B8B57C5F1BF98E9F5867F51264E3E2C8496B2C3535035C974E8CBA411DCAE019 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 1357...8833 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '5.172.155.140 (ssh-rsa key from 5.172.155.140 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (canary.ashbysoft.co.uk. GB)

mircea_popescu: in other news, holy shit the white house interiors are an abomination. there's flea markets more tastefully arranged by the process of randomly unloading vans what the fuck.

mircea_popescu: and in other lulz : jonathan pollard, a guy who stole and sold (to israle, and to others) all sorts of holies of the usg (including the nsa's utterly ridiculous 5k page manual on "how to conduct signals intelligence" - no part of which is actually useful in practice much like satoshi's bitcoin miner code is not used by any actual bitcoin miners) was released in 2015 (with much gnashing of teeth, because back whgen he was conv

mircea_popescu: icted, life imprisonment meant 30 years).

mircea_popescu: the usgians of course don't want him to be released, so they have this parole thing where he can't leave the us "for five years" and "can't use internet or give interviews" etc. the stance was challenged a few months ago on the correct basis that "nothing he stole or could have stolen 30 years ago is still secret today". nevertheless clapper chose to perjure himself by swearing for the judge that on the contrary, the usg actu

mircea_popescu: ally has secret information.

mircea_popescu: the judge ate it, of course, but let it be pointed out this is so fucking ridiculous as to defy any reason. there is NO information privy to the USG that is secret from the world, except by case of obscurity.

Framedragger: is there a tmsr keyserver, in the sense of one being able to link to a gpg fingerprint known to WoT, as a permalink?

Framedragger: i mean, a way to request full public key, with some stable/deterministic permalink url format.

Framedragger: (would be useful)

mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/REBTl/?raw=true

mircea_popescu: Framedragger phuctor's best we got atm.

ben_vulpes: trinque: ^^

ben_vulpes: Framedragger: there is

ben_vulpes: !!key trinque

deedbot: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/r/6Q6TW/?raw=true

ben_vulpes: but it is not httptronic

mircea_popescu: and it's not deterministic url.

mircea_popescu imagined everyone knows about that owing to his constant usage.

BingoBoingo: ty

deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/12/btc38-does-buterin-inspired-rollback-after-api-keys-compromised/ << Qntra - BTC38 Does Buterin Inspired "Rollback" After API Keys Compromised

shinohai: BingoBoingo: the text is the same as the article I submitted earlier?

BingoBoingo: AH, fuck too many pastes!

BingoBoingo though it was weird mp would submit altcoin followup

deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/12/the-honorable-royce-c-lamberth-of-the-us-district-court-of-washington-dc-declares-end-of-united-states-sovereignity-for-representing-a-moral-depravity-that-knows-no-bounds-having-no-place-in-civilis/ << Qntra - The Honorable Royce C. Lamberth of the US District Court of Washington DC declares end of United States sovereignity for representing a moral depravity that knows no bounds, having no place in civilised society and deservi

mircea_popescu: win.

phf: ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=veh i renamed it, because right now all patches live in a global namespace. i'm not yte sure if i want to change that

phf: it follows the existing naming convention of thing-genesis with "genesis" reserved for trb

mircea_popescu: incidentally, patches currently can be arbitrarily renamed with no visible effects is it ?

Framedragger: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20161226/#111 << k, thanks. not altogether bad.

scriba: Logged on 2016-12-26: [18:24:39] <mircea_popescu> Framedragger phuctor's best we got atm.

Framedragger: ben_vulpes what mp said; yeah it's useful, but knowable-beforehand http endpoint has its merits :)

mircea_popescu: note that because of alf's more complex hashing scheme you actually get closer to "permanent" urls than the imperial key servers can get.

trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-26#1590786 << merry festivus

a111: Logged on 2016-12-26 18:28 mircea_popescu: and it's not deterministic url.

trinque: !!key trinque

deedbot: http://wot.deedbot.org/FC66C0C5D98C42A1D4A98B6B42F9985AFAB953C4.asc

trinque: could as easily switch to asciilifeform's hashing scheme. is it described somewhere?

Framedragger: trinque: jeeee that's cool!!

Framedragger: trinque: yes it's described in holy code form here: http://siphnos.mkj.lt/datadrop/crap-from-scans-to-be-sorted/phuctor-fp.py

Framedragger: (this is alf's code, to be clear)

trinque: ty

Framedragger: (so, hash of modulus and concat(userstring, "; ") it seems)

trinque: asciilifeform: will this hash format be something meaningful once folks switch to using P for RSA ?

mircea_popescu: trinque o hey not bad

mircea_popescu: may be an idea to use the same scheme yes.

Framedragger: imho hash format makes sense - it's just modulus and arbitrary 'user' field. dunno if it's still wanted to just have e,N,comment but if so, comment could be userstring in terms of mapping fingerprints to new rsa format.

mircea_popescu: would work. moreover the scheme is flexible enough to allow for later extension

mircea_popescu: (if "userstring" is redefined to be for eg "a";"b" items nothing breaks.)

Framedragger: quite! i'd say it's flexible and elegant (in terms of minimal complexity) enough

Framedragger: in P, alf wants to have hashing func etc be defined within the key itself. but maybe all that is not relevant for the purposes of a universal fingerprint scheme.

Framedragger: (well, the scheme as proposed does use a particular hashing func (sha256), so that part is contestable i suppose.)

mircea_popescu: in principle the e, N part can be arbitrarily lengthy, with the semantizating convention that "e" represents "settings" and N represents "values". should be perfectly possible to describe any future key in these terms irrespective of cryptosystem.

Framedragger: right!

mircea_popescu: ie, if P uses 8 boolean flags and 31 one byte settings then e can be a 32 byte value

Framedragger: "contents and parameters for those contents"

Framedragger: (one more note, even if alf or sb protests use of particular hashing func for fingerprint scheme, the fact of the matter is that one does kind of require for a universal fingerprinting scheme to exist.)

Framedragger: kind of require the use of one*

jurov: have you considered using N alone as the ID? or it's impractically long?

Framedragger: alf did say that http://btcbase.org/log/2016-11-23#1572696 ...

a111: Logged on 2016-11-23 16:14 asciilifeform: 'key fingerprint' is a broken concept.

Framedragger: iirc 'user' field was needed as multiple different keys belonging to different users may have same N

Framedragger: but then again, perhaps in tmsr-semantics, it *is* the same key :)

jurov: there are some other semantics where it's considered different key?

jurov curious

Framedragger: well. for one, it's nice if you can distinguish between different keyholders, no? in the particular case of ssh-rsa keys, "which ip used this key?"

Framedragger: if fingerprint == N, it cannot distinguish between different referents, so to speak

Framedragger: all this while acknowledging that if you have same N, you have, *for practical purposes*, same key. but maybe i've messed it up in my head.

Framedragger: (so i don't know. maybe 'keyholder' is really not a property of a key. which i guess it isn't; so maybe i'm just generating noise)

jurov: and what are you actually building here? what is the cause? to make ornithological observations "this key was spotted at address X at time Y" or something?

jurov: you surely know at least this

jurov: i was thinking we're in keyserver context, not ^ this

Framedragger: original query re permalinks for WoT keys was a practical use case of being able to point someone to a key in WoT

Framedragger: contexts inevitably switched when 'fingerprinting scheme' discussion enters

Framedragger: but you're right, i suppose i have ornithology in mind here, which is not relevant. that's a separate thing, really. it's exactly an observation which shows an association (key <-> holder at some point in time).

jurov: I hope the answer to "two distinct people in wot having the same N" is clear.

Framedragger: with regards to keyserver, my use of them makes me biased in the sense of thinking of keys as necessarily having user IDs in them. "key has some particular holder". not really the case i guess :)

Framedragger: right.. "it's the same person, for our purposes."

jurov: to say it from another angle, you don't (and can't) have persons in the database. it's all just a key with some tags attached, not the other way around

Framedragger: thanks for clarifying... so then it's just the same key. and things like 'IP of this key' really is a separate matter. (it was put into gpg user field as a matter of convenience of course.) should have been obvious...

Framedragger: right!

Framedragger: i guess one may have a database of keys, as well as a table of signed-with-key nicknames which establish someone claiming a nickname for key? sort of gns. alternative scheme is to have any kind of aliasing be local, as per gossipd. less convenient for things like looking up nickname in wot.deedbot.org of course.

jurov: that's up to you how you normalize it. i see three levels - the public key itself (N), any additional information needed to verify signatures (e), and everything else

Framedragger: right, makes sense, and nice breakdown.

shinohai: !!trilema 838E50C4AE5BAB4067827E49C62FE266448F4691791B561A69425F5F85313FDF

shinohai: derp

shinohai: !!v 838E50C4AE5BAB4067827E49C62FE266448F4691791B561A69425F5F85313FDF

deedbot: shinohai updated rating of diana_coman from 1 to 2 << Eulora trades always fair and fortunate.

mircea_popescu: Framedragger you're going towards the republican dns / unified name registry thing

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/048B2ADC130913694F26D5D5F6806A4D3EB09C457CFEF2ABA6F2308E5F9D77CE << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 1792...6599 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '195.122.213.109 (ssh-rsa key from 195.122.213.109 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (mail.medialine-team.cz. CZ)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/4C069238F55B83EA0C0E4D794CEB2CEAC8CA65310C4307162E12EC92B1B50619 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 2413...5243 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '190.3.92.251 (ssh-rsa key from 190.3.92.251 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (mail.gbapro.com.ar. AR C)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/45F8DFEE99404FC105C9786E8FFAAC2C1CEABFE51D06CB125AFE7AF4442D4CC2 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 1688...6157 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '82.44.7.112 (ssh-rsa key from 82.44.7.112 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (112.7-44-82.static.virginmediabusiness.co.uk. GB)

mod6: evenin'

mircea_popescu: hola mod6

mod6: how goes?

mircea_popescu: great actually.

mod6: nice :]

mircea_popescu: hehe. how about mn ?

mod6: good! it warmed back up and we had a thunderstorm lastnight. crazy.

mircea_popescu: nice

mod6: just workin on these v changes

mod6: mainly anyway.

mircea_popescu: and in other teachable moments, http://68.media.tumblr.com/6ef391758bb0bd96c99fb35895f358a5/tumblr_nd1md1koxb1tgearyo1_1280.jpg

mod6: lol, that kid in the background is really happy to be there.

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/4C069238F55B83EA0C0E4D794CEB2CEAC8CA65310C4307162E12EC92B1B50619 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 1527...3287 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '190.3.92.251 (ssh-rsa key from 190.3.92.251 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (mail.gbapro.com.ar. AR C)

deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/048B2ADC130913694F26D5D5F6806A4D3EB09C457CFEF2ABA6F2308E5F9D77CE << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 1778...8673 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '195.122.213.109 (ssh-rsa key from 195.122.213.109 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (mail.medialine-team.cz. CZ)

ben_vulpes: ah, home sweet home

ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-26#1590731 << i think maybe back away slowly from ironclad lest it blow up in my face then

a111: Logged on 2016-12-26 03:54 phf: asciilifeform: http://www.method-combination.net/blog/archives/2014/12/29/ironclads-history.html in case you were wondering "how the fuck"

ben_vulpes: thank you phf

ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-26#1590795 << nifty, thank you again

a111: Logged on 2016-12-26 20:01 phf: ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=veh i renamed it, because right now all patches live in a global namespace. i'm not yte sure if i want to change that

ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-26#1590797 << aye, although per http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-25#1590640 you'll need to rename your seals as well

a111: Logged on 2016-12-26 20:22 mircea_popescu: incidentally, patches currently can be arbitrarily renamed with no visible effects is it ?

a111: Logged on 2016-12-25 21:49 ben_vulpes: it is a small but worth-noting difference between "put yer patches in this here directory, your signatures in this other, and your pubkeys in this third".

mircea_popescu: yes, of couars.

ben_vulpes: have we done "sha512sum will not omit filenames from output" yet?

mircea_popescu: mno.

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