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Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans


mircea_popescu: copypaste i wonder what the mixed content thing is
copypaste: It works now
copypaste: Mixed content means mixed HTTP/HTTPS
copypaste: It's a new thing added by browser vendors
copypaste: They don't allow HTTP content on HTTPS pages anymore.
decimation: ssl everywhere!
mircea_popescu: ah mkay. anyway, server load was throughout < .2 so i dun think that'll be a problem.
copypaste: Great!
mircea_popescu: and i intend to keep the mix more or less varied so.
mircea_popescu: prolly a buncha people send more banners once they wake up/catch up with the log.
decimation: ^the fact that this is even possible demonstrates the laugh-ability of pki
mircea_popescu: decimation you don't understand how teh world works!
mircea_popescu: "Bitcoin is a jewish conspiracy so these guys are shills, probably working for JIDF."
mircea_popescu: word.
cazalla: lol
cazalla: bit obvious that one was mine but would do better in a pol thread
copypaste: you could open a service like a-ads
BingoBoingo: !s Van Ads
assbot: 33 results for 'Van Ads' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=Van+Ads
mircea_popescu: i nearly did a while back, but meh.
mircea_popescu: well, 20k impressions served so far, notbad.jpg
copypaste: !rate mircea_popescu 2 Graced 8chan with the presence of his ads
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/4efef792fbd75716
cazalla: from ben garrison's new book lol https://8ch.net/pol/src/1431570130032.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1cyLvxq )
copypaste: !v assbot:copypaste.rate.mircea_popescu.2:f09d7cfdf4c180ab010f2c613430f01942fd618289ebc028950b5093135046c2
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 2 for mircea_popescu with note: Graced 8chan with the presence of his ads
mircea_popescu: what is brittle bone disease ?
copypaste: osteogenesis imperfecta is the medical name
mircea_popescu: oh the collagen thing ?
copypaste: yes
mircea_popescu: sucks.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 127250 @ 0.00026684 = 33.9554 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: https://8ch.net/b/res/2684297.html#q2684968 << bwahahaha.
assbot: /b/ - new ads? ... ( http://bit.ly/1Jfy2rn )
mircea_popescu: little grasshopper...
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1131778 << if we're going in the direction of 'cuckold miners,' i'm not sure why anyone imagines any of it is attributable with any certainty in any direction whatsoever
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 03:33:20; mircea_popescu: but they're barely a player.
mircea_popescu: this part of the tradecraft is all puffs of smoke alf. exactly the opposite of engineering
mircea_popescu: practically speaking mysticism
BingoBoingo: Oh shit http://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/comments/35wtcp/trilema_ads_on_8chan/
assbot: Trilema Ads on 8chan : Buttcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1Jfyk1e )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: which smoke ?
copypaste: BingoBoingo: Now two people think I am Mircea.
mircea_popescu: just saying, puffs ofsmoke. they move deterministically, and you know they're there, but WHAT are they ?
BingoBoingo: copypaste: Or shills
mircea_popescu: copypaste people think everyone's me. at some point they thought i was a chick.
copypaste: Because of MPOE_PR?
mircea_popescu: yeah.
decimation: http://www.econtalk.org/archives/2015/04/leonard_wong_on.html < "This study found that many Army officers, after repeated exposure to the overwhelming demands and the associated need to put their honor on the line to verify compliance, have become ethically numb."
assbot: " + soundfiledesc + " ... ( http://bit.ly/1JfyzcF )
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo any idea what the fedora thing is ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: It's a neckbeard thing.
mircea_popescu: is neckbeard anything other than libertard for "bad" ?
BingoBoingo: It's a kind of bad, an aspie flavor
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it is a specific character, in their imagination, quite akin to the nazi Jud Süß
mircea_popescu: orly ?
asciilifeform: aha but with a minus sign.
mircea_popescu: decimation i think soldiers kinda get numb anyway.
cazalla: this pretty much sums up the fedora thing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmzaalWYqRo
assbot: fedorable_parkour.mp4 - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1Jfz72d )
decimation: mircea_popescu: in this particular case, the guy claims that usg levies so many 'requirements' on its employees that no human could possibly fulfill them
mircea_popescu: this would not surprise me.
decimation: so everyone lies, pretending to achieve 100% compliance
mircea_popescu: sorta like taxes.
decimation: some young officers - tought from entry that lying is very bad - find the real working of usg to be shocking
mircea_popescu:  Good signature from Fredrick Brennan <admin@8chan.co>. Verify this message yourself << check out this shit, a gpg-ready chan
mircea_popescu: " API for reports for board owners [allows you to have an IRC bot tell you when you have reports"
mircea_popescu: dude... this shit has come a very long way.
mircea_popescu ran a romanian chan years ago.
asciilifeform: what is, in this context, a 'chan' ?
decimation: apparently a bbs
asciilifeform: generic term for www forum ?
copypaste: Indeed mircea_popescu. I hacked the codebase considerably
copypaste: https://github.com/ctrlcctrlv/infinity
assbot: ctrlcctrlv/infinity · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1cyOHJp )
mircea_popescu: a, you did a bunch of work there ?
mircea_popescu: but this at start was a futaba or what ?
copypaste: Yeah. It was really basic when I started.
copypaste: It started as Tinyboard.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform in this context, a chan is a type of forum, used most famously by 2/4chan
copypaste: I wrote the catalog ( https://8ch.net/b/catalog.html ), a lot of the javascript (desktop notifications etc), all the board creaetion feaetures, etc
assbot: b - Catalog ... ( http://bit.ly/1cyOPIU )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what are the defining characteristics of this type ?
decimation: but no drug wars game
copypaste: There's a lot if you go back in my commit history, heh...
asciilifeform: or do they all descend from same proggy ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform a lightweight structure, specific cli style commands and a requirement to start threads by embedding a picture. they're purely cosmetic, it's just a sort of forum ubuntu, if you take vbulletin to be windows.
mircea_popescu: they i think all descend from the same thing (aka, futaba) reimplemented x times
asciilifeform: ah
mircea_popescu: and it all runs in php!
mircea_popescu: which is probably the cutting-edgest application php ever knew.
decimation: ^ one wonders why nobody bothered to write something like this in pure c, given the performance demands
mircea_popescu: i doubt there's actually that much of an edge to be had, unless one goes all the way to mold it into nginx
mircea_popescu: have a chaninx
decimation: yeah, good point, would have to re-create the whole stack of shit
mircea_popescu: exactly.
asciilifeform: decimation: the result of c in the hands of imbeciles is generally microshitesque
decimation: which would be like engineering a sand castle with a toothpick (to paraphrase ascii)
copypaste: more fans on the videogames board: https://8ch.net/v/res/3744246.html
assbot: /v/ - What is this ad? ... ( http://bit.ly/1cyPI49 )
copypaste: you're quite popular mircea_popescu :D
mircea_popescu: i am ?
copypaste: Very few ads get threads made about them.
trinque: decimation: friend of mine wrote a 4chan scraper in c here -> waifu.xyz
trinque: ah crap it's down
trinque: see that's why you don't do it in C
mircea_popescu: lmao
mircea_popescu: how bad do they suck btw ? graphically i mean
copypaste: The tit one is good. I bet you get some clients from 8chan.
mircea_popescu: should be interesting.
decimation: scraper is much easier than writing the server stack. as yarvin put it "An Internet server is, above all, a massive fortified castle in alien zombie territory. The men who man these castles are men indeed, quick in emacs and hairy of neck."
trinque: nah the whole site's C
mircea_popescu: techniocally speaking apache is c too
trinque: it's a site that scrapes 4chan for webms and archives them
decimation: sure
mircea_popescu: or was, at some point. before glibc
trinque: he wrote the http thinger, all that
trinque: guy likes abusing himself with 'write it in c' quests
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-05-2015#1131123 eh, mebbe we make it to 130ish
assbot: Logged on 13-05-2015 22:27:31; asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: within 100 years, we will -all- be as deadly as pirate...
mircea_popescu: people do, even today.
asciilifeform: eh but how deadly are they at 120.
mircea_popescu: cixi was okay. so was stalin
asciilifeform: stalin at 120, roommate with hitler in buenos aires ?
mircea_popescu: lol. no, stalin at right before he was about to get beria
asciilifeform: 74
mircea_popescu: but technologee!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 34 @ 0.139 = 4.726 BTC [+]
trinque: "I don't think you can raid b-a anon" << lol!
trinque: says latest guy in /b/
mircea_popescu: http://dpaste.com/216NK1W << check out the story of bots. so assbot checks the link. bitly bot checks it too two seconds later. google ? twenty seconds later.
assbot: dpaste: 216NK1W ... ( http://bit.ly/1A1AAaL )
mircea_popescu: EMERGENCY!111 b-a has posted a link to things!!1
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 173309 @ 0.00027257 = 47.2388 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: https://encyclopediadramatica.se/Ben_Garrison
assbot: Ben Garrison - Encyclopedia Dramatica ... ( http://bit.ly/1A1ByUd )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 160363 @ 0.00027278 = 43.7438 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 142137 @ 0.00027423 = 38.9782 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40200 @ 0.00026519 = 10.6606 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42700 @ 0.00027451 = 11.7216 BTC [+] {2}
punkman: "The linux futex_wait call has been broken for about a year (in upstream since 3.14, around Jan 2014), and has just recently been fixed (in upstream 3.18, around October 2014). More importantly this breakage seems to have been back ported into major distros (e.g. into RHEL 6.6 and its cousins, released in October 2014), and the fix for it has only recently been back ported (e.g. RHEL 6.6.z and cousins have the fix)."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 239432 @ 0.00027461 = 65.7504 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 232509 @ 0.0002752 = 63.9865 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41412 @ 0.00027693 = 11.4682 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: !up toddf
mircea_popescu: davout btw, isn't your paymiumthing an exchange ?
mircea_popescu: https://memorygapdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/shrine_of_statists.jpg heh, not bad that ben garrison
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1FfIbT9 )
mircea_popescu: https://memorygapdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/authority_man.jpg well worked at any rate.
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1FfIflN )
mircea_popescu: https://memorygapdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/al_gore_climate_change-2.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1H4FErE )
cazalla: shame those ones are edits of his originals
trinque: lol
trinque: https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-IftYhBRLllk/VVAMl45O1SI/AAAAAAAAA38/myDSGzElEPg/s1600/m00t_ceo_of_troll.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1H4G1Cx )
trinque: http://garrisongraphics.blogspot.com/
assbot: Ben Garrison ... ( http://bit.ly/1H4G2qc )
mircea_popescu: cazalla you know i vaguely recall this entire butthurt thing @internet trolls
cazalla: yeah i think i mentioned his work with OHPI (online hate prevention institute) like a year back
mircea_popescu: http://garrisongraphics.blogspot.com.ar/2015/04/8chan.html
assbot: Ben Garrison: 8chan ... ( http://bit.ly/1FfIPA2 )
mircea_popescu: heh
cazalla: the shit is so pervasive that you can't find his originals half the time lol
mircea_popescu: seems a great compliment.
mircea_popescu: o copypaste can i also has argentina! seeing how i live there atm.
copypaste: Yes, you can. That board is in Spanish though so you might want to use a different page, or not.
copypaste: I saw your article about McDonalds printing money there, very funny. I'm partial to Colombia as far as Latin American countries go personally though.
mircea_popescu: im half considering it. you ever been ?
copypaste: Yep
mircea_popescu: not really much like what people imagine.
copypaste: You could probably run a nice Bitcoin arbitrage out of Argentina if you did it right.
copypaste: They have some crazy currency controls
mircea_popescu: i can't be arsed. they're too poor and too retarded.
cazalla: so AFP got back to me.. those pics i shared earlier are legit (yet the newsarticle shows an mp5 lol) and AFP tells me that they never sent the guns despite press release saying they did a controlled delivery and guns were seized
mircea_popescu: aha...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62129 @ 0.00026023 = 16.1678 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: "A students' union officer who is employed to promote diversity at a London university has reportedly asked white people and men not to attend an anti-racism protest meeting.
mircea_popescu: Bahar Mustafa, the welfare and diversity officer at Goldsmiths Students' Union, told students that the union meeting was only open to "BME Women" - females of black and ethnic minorities."
mircea_popescu: sounds legit
cazalla: seen her? she's white as
mircea_popescu: lulzy to me.
mircea_popescu: honestly i watch the news from anglosphere today like i watched the news from biafra twenty years ago, as a child.
mircea_popescu: a mixture of glee and excitement at the outlandishness of it.
mircea_popescu: (biafra was a part of nigeria during civil war. famine and nutty shit)
cazalla: yeah never heard of jello biafra or anything like that before that.. o.0
cazalla: but yeah, heard of it before and it being short lived
mircea_popescu: i suspect it defined "africa" for half a century.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 185250 @ 0.00026023 = 48.2076 BTC [-]
jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1131450 but the boobs must be right in the middle!
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 01:37:03; mircea_popescu: danielpbarron and since we're doing future references : you don't want a 20% of empty sky and cut calves.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 118100 @ 0.00027693 = 32.7054 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [FN] [F.MPIF] 20000 @ 0.000207 = 4.14 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 195672 @ 0.00027694 = 54.1894 BTC [+] {2}
kakobrekla: ;;later tell mircea_popescu how about using mikes dynamic banners for that?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 243717 @ 0.00027844 = 67.8606 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86060 @ 0.0002798 = 24.0796 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 140332 @ 0.00027823 = 39.0446 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 356866 @ 0.00026736 = 95.4117 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 154950 @ 0.00028139 = 43.6014 BTC [+] {2}
davout: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1131946 <<< yes
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 06:15:47; mircea_popescu: davout btw, isn't your paymiumthing an exchange ?
mats: https://lkml.org/lkml/2015/5/13/739
assbot: LKML: "Jason A. Donenfeld": [PATCH 0/4] ozwpan: Four remote packet-of-death vulnerabilities ... ( http://bit.ly/1FaaxwI )
asciilifeform: mats: wtf, who ever even used that thing
asciilifeform: mega-snore.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1131941 << very typical.
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 05:53:05; punkman: "The linux futex_wait call has been broken for about a year (in upstream since 3.14, around Jan 2014), and has just recently been fixed (in upstream 3.18, around October 2014). More importantly this breakage seems to have been back ported into major distros (e.g. into RHEL 6.6 and its cousins, released in October 2014), and the fix for it has only recently been back ported (e.g. RHEL 6.6.z and cousins
mats: asciilifeform: i was amused
williamdunne: ;;later tell mircea_popescu have you purchased ads on 8chan? I just saw a trilema ad asking to buy photos of my tits
gribble: The operation succeeded.
williamdunne: !s stoya
assbot: 36 results for 'stoya' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=stoya
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 88152 @ 0.00028258 = 24.91 BTC [+] {2}
jurov: williamdunne: yes he did. and you're human female?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 127900 @ 0.00028323 = 36.2251 BTC [+] {2}
williamdunne: jurov: I miss that qualification
jurov: here it says "I'm giving away 0.1BTC to any human female that.."
danielpbarron: !up MykelSilver
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 187817 @ 0.00028441 = 53.417 BTC [+] {2}
jurov: http://motherboard.vice.com/read/us-companies-are-throwing-a-fit-because-theyre-losing-control-over-the-internet lulzmine
assbot: US Companies Are Throwing a Fit Because They're Losing Control Over the Internet | Motherboard ... ( http://bit.ly/1cAqClu )
davout: williamdunne: re ads see log
danielpbarron: >> about how they've been treated unfairly by the International Corporation of Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN) << so not really "the internet" they're losing control over, but the stupid naming system
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32750 @ 0.00028161 = 9.2227 BTC [-]
jurov: you know anyone who really does not use the stupid naming system?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 143550 @ 0.00028656 = 41.1357 BTC [+]
danielpbarron: isn't that the goal in here eventually?
jurov: i don't remember any concrete proposal
danielpbarron: the gossipd thing
jurov: but there will certainly be some stupid naming system over it.
jurov: but if you really want to call me BBB0A99950037551F533850A677ABD62D0AEE7D7 ...
jurov: i hope gossipd spec has a part concerning this. otherwise it will be inevitably bolted on in some ugly haphazard fashion
mod6: In this case, wouldn't you just be called "Juraj Variny (jurov) <rini17@gmail.com>"
mod6: ?
jurov: hmm, that's true
ben_vulpes: there's also the urbit style naming convention for keys
jurov: but gpg pubkeys are not practical for replacing DNS. what if you want to tranfer the name?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 89648 @ 0.0002867 = 25.7021 BTC [+] {2}
ben_vulpes: this assumes the name has any import.
ben_vulpes: "namshub" et al have no import, are just mnemonic devices for remembering the keyids
ben_vulpes: "you wouldn't share a key!" (tm)
jurov: that's neat example for engineers' blind spot for naming
ben_vulpes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmZm8vNHBSU
assbot: Piracy it's a crime - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1FguW4v )
jurov: names have too long history of being bought, sold, stolen or counterfeited to neglect them such
ben_vulpes has a blind spot for derp problems in general
davout: jurov: the naming in gossipd is supposed to be local
ben_vulpes: /etc/hosts, basiclolly
davout: pretty much
jurov: so if, say i start doing coinbr support over gossipd, and i transfer it, have to ask everyone to update their /etc/hosts?
ben_vulpes: transfer what - your hosting key?
ben_vulpes: routing key?
jurov: anything! keys cannot be really transferred
jurov: new owner would want completely new keys
mod6: <+jurov> but gpg pubkeys are not practical for replacing DNS. what if you want to tranfer the name? << then there would be a deed detailing the transfer of the name to a new key fingerprint?
jurov: can't we just use namecoin?
jurov: to be sure everyone has the latest deeds
ben_vulpes: dns is dumb
ben_vulpes: global lookup mapping of names to servers is dumbbbb
ben_vulpes: http://www.razik.com/bikes/ << but this bike is sweet
assbot: Bikes | Razik.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1Fgw2gS )
mats: that price tag though
mod6: <+jurov> can't we just use namecoin? << yeah, I thought maybe this was addressed in the logs before...
mod6: !s namecoin
assbot: 166 results for 'namecoin' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=namecoin
mod6 looks
jurov: yes, no one takes it seriously
mod6: aight well, have to check later. bbs.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62300 @ 0.00028707 = 17.8845 BTC [+]
davout: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132055 <<< neither can reputation, so maybe it's actually a feature
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 16:39:24; jurov: anything! keys cannot be really transferred
jurov: that needs the notion that "all corporations die with their owner" to catch on
davout: ben_vulpes: you call that a bike? that's a bike http://moto-images.caradisiac.com/IMG/jpg/1/3/8/3/2/Suzuki_GSX-R_1000_2012_4.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1bSrAZH )
kakobrekla: jurov there have been such cases.
jurov: so?
jurov: i wrote "all"
davout: jurov: not all corporations have a single owner
davout: also if the transfer procedure is specified in the initial contract that shouldn't be a problem
ben_vulpes: davout: http://cdn.blessthisstuff.com/imagens/stuff/descricao_ryno_motors_scooter.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1bSrSjd )
davout: ben_vulpes: oh god
jurov: how does "initial contract" resolve the problem of transfer without previous owner retaining the key?
davout: you can specify the conditions under which you'd transfer the business to another key
jurov: such as? all copies of previous owner's gpg key to be provably destroyed?
jurov: :D
kakobrekla: such as failing to sign 'ping' in time?
ben_vulpes: !up ascii_field
davout: jurov: well no, owner 1 deedbots "o hey, i'm out, speak to owner 2 starting July 1st 2015, kthxbye"
davout: owner 2 has own key, problem solved
kakobrekla: and if owner 1 dead?
kakobrekla: or in captivity?
davout: well, i guess you're fuxxored unless there was a sensible plan in place
jurov: kakobrekla: but that's good idea for our keyserver. sign ping every month, otherwise keyserver publishes the key as dead
davout: jurov: what would be the point?
jurov: better than current "expiration date" mechanism
jurov: (which mp effectively obsoleted)
davout: how did he obsolete it? also key expiration and "dead" flag seem functionally quite different
ascii_field: wai wat
jurov: you usually don't know in advance when a key needs to expire or get invalidated
jurov: and when you try to use this "expiry date" stuff, your mpex account expires,too
jurov: whereby with this "dead" flag you issue non-expiring key and decide what happens and why
davout: you can always extend the expiration date of a key
davout: it's not set in stone
jurov: mpex does not honor that
davout: how do you know?
davout: mpex either speaks GPG or it doesn't
jurov: http://mpex.co/faq.html#18
jurov: i had one time exemption, had to change the key to non-expiring
davout: hmm, if it doesn't update keys you can start with a non expiring one and add the expiration date after opening your acct
ascii_field: something like deedbot for key expirations (and the presently nonexistent but direly necessary expire-for-new-signatures-only) is inevitable
danielpbarron: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: and yes, the only way to solve the expire-for-new-sigs problem is, likely, to require blockchain turd emission for every single sig, for such a key
danielpbarron: !up warptangent
danielpbarron: warptangent, who are you? (i see you have a key registered but no ratings yet)
danielpbarron: ah, monero guy?
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132033 << the cultural shift is not optional - 'do business with keys.'
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 16:10:00; jurov: but if you really want to call me BBB0A99950037551F533850A677ABD62D0AEE7D7 ...
ascii_field: key can say what it likes to be called, sure
ascii_field: but no one is to be -identified- for purposes of trust by his claimed name, rather than key
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132085 << the machine for transferring things from one key to another is called... blockchain
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 16:57:52; jurov: how does "initial contract" resolve the problem of transfer without previous owner retaining the key?
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132096 << enemy captures keyserver, publishes all keys as 'dead' l0l
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 17:06:45; jurov: kakobrekla: but that's good idea for our keyserver. sign ping every month, otherwise keyserver publishes the key as dead
jurov: there has to be only one keyserver?
ascii_field: jurov: however many
jurov: and this can be in blockchain, too
ascii_field: if there is a 'key is dead' token that one is relying on some third party to keep secret - it can be captured
jurov: what?
jurov: what third party?
ascii_field: jurov: referring to the 'dead man switch' thread from earlier
jurov: no recent pings seen in blockchain after $configurabletime = key dead
ascii_field: jurov: when it is dead, how do you prevent folks from signing with it 'backwards in time' backdated to before death ?
ascii_field: as i understand, the only way to do this is to require a blockchain 'ping' with -every- signature
jurov: must sign current merkle tree
jurov: stuff that cannot be predicted in advance
jurov: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: jurov: signing today's tree can be done tomorrow, no ?
jurov: only the tree's date is considered for purposes of dead man's switch, what's the problem with it?
ascii_field: jurov: for the purposes of establishing the time of a particular signature
ascii_field: say key 'died'
ascii_field: how to prevent folks from backdating signatures to when it was alive
jurov: how would it help them?
ascii_field: the whole point of 'expiring' a key is to prevent its use in the future
trinque: ascii_field something like deedbot for key expirations (and the presently nonexistent but direly necessary expire-for-new-signatures-only) is inevitable << could you use a specific message format with the deedbot- as is?
ascii_field: or rather, communicating authoritatively the statement that 'anyone using this key after this moment is an impostor'
trinque: I could also make changes to the thing to accomodate; maybe it rolls over all messages looking for particulars, produces some output every X
jurov: owner signed last merkle hash from a month ago, nothing seen from that key since
jurov: so the consensus is the key is dead
ascii_field: jurov: but what if someone 'unearths' a signature from last year that no one has seen before ?
kakobrekla: ping timeout
jurov: not valid anymore
ascii_field: then useless idiocy
jurov: "shoulda come sooner"
ascii_field: like today's expiration thing
ascii_field: i'm not expiring my signatures retroactively
ascii_field: and no sane person ever will
ascii_field: because it is retarded
ascii_field: but i also want to be able to upgrade keys
jurov: as i wrote, mirce deprecated upgrading keys
ascii_field: this is his greatest error and i'm not afraid to point at it
ascii_field: keys - must be upgradeable. sanely.
ascii_field: (the other thing is, he didn't forbid upgrading keys - simply happens to charge 30 btc for the service)
mats: SciPy talks announced http://scipy2015.scipy.org/ehome/115969/292868/?&
assbot: Accepted Talks & Posters ... ( http://bit.ly/1bSBf2n )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.QNTR] 3400 @ 0.00034038 = 1.1573 BTC [-] {2}
ben_vulpes: <jurov> mpex does not honor that << davout: i can confirm this
ben_vulpes: it's in the readme, you see.
davout: yup, wasn't sure of whether *proxies* updated keys as opposed to the engine, but i guess that yes, it's pretty plainly written
jurov: the engine did not even had time sync till 20 minute drift was discovered
jurov: mircea's ideal is a schrodinger's box apparently
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla they're the wrong size but yeah, that's the correct solution
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell mike_c hey mike! can you make the bitbet banners in 728x90 ?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: http://digitalmoneytimes.com/crypto-news/bitcoin-isp-soon-to-be-traded-on-mpex-bitcoin-securities-exchange/ << so who's JP Buntinx ?
assbot: Bitcoin ISP Soon To Be Traded on MPex Bitcoin Securities Exchange | Digital Money Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1HjuZyW )
Adlai: "Furthermore, Bitcoin ISP offers no shares servers"... right, mpex serves shares
scoopbot_revived: Williams Pleas Guilty to Debunking Polygraph Pseudoscience http://qntra.net/2015/05/williams-pleas-guilty-to-debunking-polygraph-pseudoscience/
mircea_popescu: Adlai hey, wouldja like to advertise your jdif blog on /pol/ ?
Adlai: pf, /pol/ is my jidf blog
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: as time goes by, i get more and more fascinated by the concept of "offended"
mircea_popescu: davout make a paymium banner then!
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132034 << the spec is that you can allocate whatever nicks you wish, LOCALLY.
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 16:14:04; jurov: i hope gossipd spec has a part concerning this. otherwise it will be inevitably bolted on in some ugly haphazard fashion
mircea_popescu: aka decentralized namespace.
mircea_popescu: or in other words, the solution to zooko's triangle is to use the local-global axe on the fucking knot. unique and secure names globally ; memorable locally.
mircea_popescu: (this is exactly how nature does it - as far as it's concerned the namespace is the genotype, as far as you're concerned you just use a nick for the fenotype)
mircea_popescu: spent millenia not even knowing there was a global namespace, perfectly happy.
kakobrekla: http://www.otcmarkets.com/stock/GBTC/quote
assbot: GBTC Bitcoin Investment Trust: Summary, Stock Quote & Trades for Bitcoin Investment Trust - OTCMarkets.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1EIyQyu )
kakobrekla: check it out, Common Stock - Each GBTC share represents ownership of approximately 0.1 bitcoin
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132066 << it was addressed. derps aren't here.
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 16:47:33; mod6: !s namecoin
kakobrekla: _approximatley_
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla that's how the new garrs and nefarios and gigavps and etc run the same old scam. "it COULD be 11btc each. YOU HAVE NO PROOF IT ISNT"
mircea_popescu: etc etc, 2012 all over again in a new tardstalk.
kakobrekla: > Each BIT share represented ownership of 0.1 bitcoins initially. The trust will not generate any income and regularly sells/distributes bitcoins to pay for its ongoing expenses. Therefore, the amount of bitcoin represented by each share gradually declines over time.
kakobrekla: hold till moon, err i mean zero.
mircea_popescu: right ?
scoopbot_revived: Nature vie avec jeune fille http://trilema.com/2015/nature-vie-avec-jeune-fille/
mircea_popescu: !rate silbert -1 Arrogantly ignorant twerp, de facto scammer through it.
assbot: silbert is not registered in WoT.
mircea_popescu: color me surprised.
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
ascii_field realized that one could, in principle, microfabricate logical circuits made of magnetic amplifiers (as seen in well-known 'сетунь' trinary computer)
ascii_field: no silicon, or doping thereof, required.
ascii_field: machine then is made entirely of classically conductive material.
ascii_field: (and insulators, such as air)
mircea_popescu: could this be printed ?
Adlai notes that JP "Morgan" Buntix left out the customer qualification criterion
mircea_popescu: (with modified printer, not plastic obv)
ascii_field: printed, etched, photolithographed, ...
ascii_field: stamped
ascii_field: lasered
ascii_field: pick favourite.
Adlai: laser etched :)
mircea_popescu: ah lasered
Adlai: hand carved!
mircea_popescu: actually - lasered into a chunk of uranium, so that selected atoms turn into gas.
ascii_field: wat
decimation: ascii_field: did you see that ibm has licensed third parties to produce 'power8' servers?
decimation: I think tyan is coming out with a mobo soon
ascii_field: decimation: no, and can't imagine why i'd care
decimation: non-intel cpu
mircea_popescu: ascii_field you have a discrete cristalline lattice of U, selected nodes get energized to the point they split, creating Xe
ascii_field: still usg turdware
decimation: yeah, but possibly better designed
decimation: supposedly ibm open sourced the full specs
decimation: http://www.enterprisetech.com/2014/10/08/tyan-ships-first-non-ibm-power8-server/
assbot: Tyan Ships First Non-IBM Power8 Server ... ( http://bit.ly/1EIBfcz )
jurov: wat, etching with neutron beam?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: how do you propose to deliver neutrons selectively where you want it to pop ?
mircea_popescu: jurov ayup.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field well, tachyons for all i care.
ascii_field: U fissions either by itself, or not at all, or when neutronned at
mircea_popescu: ascii_field i don't propose how. i propose what.
mircea_popescu: division of labour!
ascii_field: otherwise we're flying airplane powered by my farts. (i can also 'propose what, not how' l0l)
mircea_popescu: lol
jurov: or build schodinger boxes (with trade engine instead of cat within)
jurov: iirc i have some pending withdrawal out of said box, mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: eh ?
ascii_field: http://www.pmillett.com/tubebooks/Books/mag_amp.pdf
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1EICtVd )
mircea_popescu: til mpex has withdrawals too
ascii_field: ^ ancient scan
ascii_field: basic idea is a transformer whose output varies, given as a second (or more) circuit gets to saturate (or not) its core.
ascii_field: -not-, pointedly, a relay - there is no mechanical motion or wear
jurov: interesting. but does it work at high freq?
ascii_field: no.
ascii_field: well, nothing approaching transistor
ascii_field: (which was created for a reason)
ascii_field: (magnetic amps long pre-date semiconductors. nazis used them in subs, rockets, for instance)
mircea_popescu: !up joshc
BingoBoingo: !up ascii_field
jurov: http://imgur.com/t11sbfh :)
assbot: Oh The Irony - Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1A40cDD )
mircea_popescu: hahaha
ascii_field: l0l
davout: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132200 <<< whiskey tango foxtrot, seriously
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 19:33:38; kakobrekla: > Each BIT share represented ownership of 0.1 bitcoins initially. The trust will not generate any income and regularly sells/distributes bitcoins to pay for its ongoing expenses. Therefore, the amount of bitcoin represented by each share gradually declines over time.
davout: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132185 <<< alrighty
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 19:23:06; mircea_popescu: davout make a paymium banner then!
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132093 << not the real problem. what if owner 1 then comes back, covertly.
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 17:03:34; kakobrekla: and if owner 1 dead?
kakobrekla: i dont belive in resurrection
davout: what if you incorrectly believe in death
mircea_popescu: owner 2 can always repudiate future signatures on the grounds that "it wasn't really me"
Adlai: !mpif
assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021367 B (Total: 467.26 B). Delta: -0.18 B. Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.000207 BTC [+]
Adlai: mircea_popescu: how'd you like to open another PC?
Adlai heard there's still coin burning holes in that pocket
mircea_popescu: i recall we discussed this and it closed.
Adlai is not talking about fiat trading
Adlai: although there is some common ground between fiat and what i'm talking about, which is: neither of them "exist"
Adlai: http://joinmarket.io/
assbot: JoinMarket Browser Interface ... ( http://bit.ly/1EIHXPE )
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132096 << nah
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 17:06:45; jurov: kakobrekla: but that's good idea for our keyserver. sign ping every month, otherwise keyserver publishes the key as dead
mircea_popescu: keys never expire. the meaning you give them may expire, and that's entirely your own personal problem. but otherwise, once found, the integers are there and can be multiplied.
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132108 << because it doesn't update keys.
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 17:13:44; davout: how do you know?
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132130 << the "key deadness" as somehow a part of the key itself, is not only conceptually ridiculous but practically unimplementable. forget it, it's about as relevant to gpg as "the gnu foundation"
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 18:03:07; ascii_field: if there is a 'key is dead' token that one is relying on some third party to keep secret - it can be captured
jurov: so, in 10 years 4096bit keys will stand in danger of cracking, what do you do? force everyone to pay 20-30btc again?
mircea_popescu: historical accident.
mircea_popescu: jurov absolutely.
ascii_field: one could picture a few 'cheats.' consider one: key, when promulgated, contains a large but finite set of values Q such that hash(hash(...(P)...) = Q, while P are retained as private. every signature must contain a unique Q from this set. when it is time to retire the key, you spend the remaining 'bullets' all at once.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field makes keys too big, doesn't actually offer anything other than the equivalent "at key promulgation, use it to sing a list of nonces, with understanding that statements w/io the nonce are void", let wot enforce this.
mircea_popescu: which in turn reduces to cargo-cultish supersecurity.
mircea_popescu: "oh, i encrypted this TWICE, it's much harder now!"
ascii_field: one cannot claim the same degree of 'hardness' for this as for the actual rsa, correct
mircea_popescu: there are some things that don't need fixing. what needs fixing re gpg is to use rsa throughout, rather than the current lulzatron.
ascii_field: but there -must- be a way to proclaim, with all the certainty that can be mustered, the fact that 'i signed with this before but -never intend to again-'
mircea_popescu: intentions need not be nor can they be part of signed matter.
ascii_field: and have this cemented in blockchain, on babylonian stone plinths, wherever
mircea_popescu: people have a way of coming to odds with their intentions
ascii_field: fuck'em
mircea_popescu: without human mediation, this is more of the "smart contracts" coolaid.
ascii_field: we have technology that can, with some certainty, prove that i did something at a certain moment in epoch time, plus or minus ten minutes
ascii_field: this plus rsa is good enough to sig-only-revoke.
ascii_field: (the tech is called bitcoin)
mircea_popescu: you have a comment field in the keys as they are now. put in there "This key not valid after block 175552"
ascii_field: merely suggesting a machine-readable standard for this, yes.
ascii_field: without the current idiotic retroactive cancellation of signatures
mircea_popescu: i do not belive machines should have any imperium over valid keys.
ascii_field: more of warning-light than imperium
mircea_popescu: it's what they say.
ascii_field: not that extant gpg honors expiration dates, to virtually everybody's great annoyance
ascii_field: *note that
mircea_popescu: i think the NOTION of expiration dates is broken.
mircea_popescu: you can't un-discover some integers in a certan mathematical relation.
ascii_field: it is only broken because it mixes abstraction-hardness levels, yes
ascii_field: remember the 'what colour are your bits' article.
mircea_popescu: right.
mircea_popescu: very much along the lines of that.
ascii_field: they cannot be undiscovered, yes. and don't have a baked-in temporal peg
mircea_popescu: so, the key is there. how do you COLOR it, that's your job.
ascii_field: pegging temporality requires some kind of agreement on mechanism
ascii_field: otherwise you get disputes and wankery where there should be 2+2 certainty.
mircea_popescu: there is necessarily not going to be 2+2 wankery.
mircea_popescu: i mean certainty
ascii_field: aha. but whatever approximation is physically possible, with clearly stated limits, ought to be achieved.
mircea_popescu: what are you, from the gui department ?
ascii_field: just as digital computer, theoretically, does not exist. but the approximation we use is 'almost same'
ascii_field: i'm from the shit that actually works within physical limits dept.
mircea_popescu: ah, but mind that there's no in principle reason a computer might not exist.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 177350 @ 0.00028593 = 50.7097 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132148 << a simple solution to this being, of course, just making a deed.
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 18:10:26; ascii_field: or rather, communicating authoritatively the statement that 'anyone using this key after this moment is an impostor'
trinque: and nobody's stopping anyone from signing some JSON or what have you
mircea_popescu: My new key is X, use of Y key past this point is unsupported. Signed by Y.
ascii_field: this oughta be machine-readable.
mircea_popescu: as per trinque above.
mircea_popescu: and it specifically should be 'unsupported'. For all you know a key ends up rediscovered five billion years later.
jurov: yeah, cthulhu appears and says you rediscovered his 5bn old key which he proclaimed expired long ago
mircea_popescu: lol
trinque: so you could publish some schema for representing this and arbitrarily other such statements into the deedbot
trinque: then make reference to that deed when you use that schema later down the way
trinque: to me these are actually the most interesting use cases of the thing
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132163 << eh, i deprecated upgrading keys like i deprecating getting new suits.
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 18:13:18; ascii_field: this is his greatest error and i'm not afraid to point at it
mircea_popescu: go into the shop get a new one made, what. you want to turn the old one in for a new one ?
mircea_popescu: what is this, the army ?
jurov: does the bank stops you from accessing your account when you get new suit?
BingoBoingo: It does if new suit includes ski mask
mircea_popescu: if it's any good, yes.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo btw, make some qntra banners ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Sure
mircea_popescu: ;;seen nubbins
gribble: nubbins was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 30 weeks, 1 day, 21 hours, 53 minutes, and 54 seconds ago: <nubbins> any messages, gribs?
mircea_popescu: ;;seen nubbins`
gribble: nubbins` was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 week, 0 days, 6 hours, 11 minutes, and 44 seconds ago: <nubbins`> bbl doing things
jurov: we're talking about upgrading gpg keys according to known protocol, not some ski masks
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell nubbins` yo nooblet, make a pink eyes banner ? :D
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: jurov we're talking about this situation where the total number of keys mpex charges for is = to the maximal number of keys ever used. that is not happening.
jurov: no it will inevitably be less
mircea_popescu: heh
mircea_popescu: ever used simultaneously*
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: used simultaneously ?
mircea_popescu: myeah.
ascii_field: this is... 7th time? we had the 'mpex discourages key upgrade' thread ?
mircea_popescu: if you can upgrade your key for free, you don't have to pay mpex, you can just find someone with a key they don't want to use anymore and they can "upgrade" theirs to yours.
mircea_popescu: mpex does not discourage anything. mpex charges, because mpex is a business.
ascii_field: aha, to upgrade key, mircea_popescu has to take a прогресс м-27м to orbit, and unscrew the old one, then retro-thruster and parachute capsule back to b-a
ascii_field: this costs approximately 30 btc.
mircea_popescu: keys are identities. identities have to qualify themselves. the qualification happens to be pay 30 btc.
mircea_popescu: i don't happen to care who your daddy is.
jurov: it's a racket yo
mircea_popescu: im that democratic.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu can charge 3000 btc if he likes, sure
mircea_popescu: but i do suspect i should increase it.
mircea_popescu: btc is way too cheap anyway.
mircea_popescu is off to ponder this idea.
ascii_field: aha too cheap. lusers like asciilifeform can almost afford 30
jurov: mp is the only one to qualify being on mpex, didn't you know?
ascii_field: it's his widget.
ascii_field: how many zeros to weld on to the price, his business
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 119500 @ 0.00028161 = 33.6524 BTC [-]
jurov: no, go on, annoy him
jurov: if he adds several zeros, perhaps coinbr will see some volume after all
ascii_field: or some competition, l0l
jurov: they'd have to hire knuth himself to squeeze something usable out of that atrocious api
ascii_field: jurov: i thought the gnarly api was part of the 'bozo filter' just as the price was
jurov: yes and building something over it is yet another level
jurov: i suspect boilers will have much better ROI than another honest broker
ascii_field: better roi until pop, aha
ascii_field: i'm kinda curious why mircea_popescu considers a new key signed with a previous key to not be a logical continuation of the same identity. (is it because of the impossibility of hard-guaranteed revocation, as discussed in previous thread?)
ascii_field: perhaps when he wakes up again, will tell
jurov: it's not set into stone, you know
ascii_field: ?
jurov: he's born into wrong time, prolly wants to build a pyramid
ben_vulpes: <ascii_field> well, nothing approaching transistor << what sorta frequencies *did* work?
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: a few khz
jurov: stone carving just are not upgraded
jurov: *carvings
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: i suspect this can be pushed up as the transformer cores are made smaller and coils themselves shorter (less inductive)
ben_vulpes: mhm
jurov: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_logic says 1MHz
assbot: Magnetic logic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1H5TudA )
ascii_field: in the miniature version i suggested, performance may well edge into overlap with the worst silicon
ascii_field: jurov: magnetic logic as described in the literature mostly 'cheated' by including a diode with each gate
ascii_field: (read scan from earlier to learn why)
davout: meanwhile, http://blog.bitcoinfoundation.org/ leads to a "The Free Trial is Over" stock page XD
assbot: Domain Error · Ghost ... ( http://bit.ly/1H5THgG )
ascii_field: in the hypothetical machine, we cannot have the diode.
ascii_field: waat
ben_vulpes: <jurov> they'd have to hire knuth himself to squeeze something usable out of that atrocious api << ah, it's not that bad, just write a parser for the variety-speaking ad-hoc blublang
ben_vulpes: ragel's sitting right over there, etc
jurov: ben_vulpes: if you followed my adventures, i have got parser for $30 from romanian student
ben_vulpes: (for the uninitiated: i'm being very sarcastic)
jurov: it was the rest that took half a year
ben_vulpes: do you do a stat before and after placing every order?
ben_vulpes: actually you know what?
ben_vulpes: i don't feel like loading the MPEx api into my head today.
ascii_field: funnily, i still have it in my head
jurov: ben_vulpes: no, that is not necessary :)
ascii_field: (from phree demo in late 2012)
jurov: but you still have the account?
ascii_field: no
ascii_field: it was a demo
jurov: but beta accounts are still fully functional!
jurov: i have one
ascii_field: it wasn't an early beta, it was a demo just for me
ascii_field: mircea_popescu even gave me a 1 btc to drive it with
jurov: l0l
ascii_field: which i later gave him back
ascii_field: (actually ~1.4 that it turned into)
ascii_field: that demo was actually my first contact with mircea_popescu
jurov: you did not keep 0.4 funbux?
ascii_field: (initially, just with hanbot)
ascii_field: jurov: nope. ( https://blockchain.info/address/1LBimqMN5ftYgfQthcrBpqPDpC4H3c2w7o )
assbot: Bitcoin Address 1LBimqMN5ftYgfQthcrBpqPDpC4H3c2w7o ... ( http://bit.ly/1H5UbU9 )
jurov: or you traded hanbot out of 0.4 funbux and then gave them to mircea instead?
jurov: :DDDD
ascii_field: l0l
ascii_field: (ancient post, where i described why did this: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1139 )
assbot: Loper OS » Bitcoin Adventures. ... ( http://bit.ly/1H5UhuQ )
jurov: yes i remember
ascii_field: but answer is no, it wasn't a proper beta account, it was a one-off demo that dissolved in ~month
jurov: 1up ascii_field
jurov: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: unrelated: http://gfycat.com/ImpracticalEducatedGraywolf
assbot: DirtyMasseur - Noelle Easton - Gfycat ... ( http://bit.ly/1H5VmD1 )
cazalla: much better than the grainy tumblr shit someone else links :)
BingoBoingo: http://gardenrant.com/2015/05/the-compostable-cup-trials.html << lol envirofraud
assbot: The Compostable Cup Trials | Garden Rant ... ( http://bit.ly/1bT5k1V )
decimation: re: pay 30 btc to upgrade mpex keys < does this mean that if you can crack an mpex key you get to use it?
decimation: so when 4096 bit keys become crackable - unlimited phree accounts?
cazalla: BingoBoingo, not cups but i vaguely remember about 25 years ago that they did a big song and dance about biodegradable plastic bags here down under and how they would be phased in and the old ones phased out, yet to this day they still carry on about plastic bags
cazalla: nice gardening blog btw, ty for link
BingoBoingo: cazalla: Ironically I stumbled into it looking for ways to kill certain unwelcome plants
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 152362 @ 0.00028427 = 43.3119 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64938 @ 0.0002838 = 18.4294 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75753 @ 0.00027199 = 20.6041 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 76605 @ 0.00026671 = 20.4313 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132454 << how could the answer possibly be anything other than yes ?
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 22:53:19; decimation: re: pay 30 btc to upgrade mpex keys < does this mean that if you can crack an mpex key you get to use it?
williamdunne: !gettrust mjr
assbot: mjr is not registered in WoT.
williamdunne: !gettrust Josh_rossi
assbot: Trust relationship from user williamdunne to user Josh_rossi: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 1 via 1 connections. |http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/trust/?from=williamdunne&to=Josh_rossi | http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/user/Josh_rossi/
williamdunne: !rate josh_rossi 2 maecenas, finex
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/04c2c540beaf5070
williamdunne: !v assbot:williamdunne.rate.josh_rossi.2:9dafb7ad24b85513992ba08077a5a6ec34e3fc49dda883a79871ff4fb09cb711
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 2 for josh_rossi with note: maecenas, finex
asciilifeform: http://www.computer.org/csdl/proceedings/afips/1959/5055/00/50550028.pdf
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1B0dNqD )
asciilifeform: unsurprisingly, nothing i said today is actually new
asciilifeform: 'deposited magnetic films as logic elements.' (proceedings of the eastern joint computer conference, 1959. franck, marette, & parsegyan.)
asciilifeform: the key boojum missing from all of this work is: a likewise purely-magnetic means of arbitrarily altering the -interconnects- between elements.
asciilifeform: (then you get: 'fpga' which doesn't give a damn about radiation, can be fabricated with 1940s equipment, etc)
asciilifeform: http://www.computer.org/csdl/proceedings/afips/1959/5055/00/50550038.pdf << also interesting, re: 'microwave logic'
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1B0e8JY )
asciilifeform: (from same period)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu et al ^^
williamdunne: !s Josh_rossi
assbot: 47 results for 'Josh_rossi' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=Josh_rossi
asciilifeform: http://www.computer.org/csdl/proceedings/afips/index.html << interestingly, they stopped holding this conference in '87. which closely, if approximately, lines up with 'when computers stopped being interesting'
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1B0efVI )
asciilifeform: http://www.sri.com/work/timeline-innovation/timeline.php?timeline=computing-digital#&innovation=all-magnetic-logic-computer
assbot: SRI International ... ( http://bit.ly/1B0eWyj )
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --marker buttstamp
gribble: (ticker [--bid|--ask|--last|--high|--low|--avg|--vol] [--currency XXX] [--market <market>|all]) -- Return pretty-printed ticker. Default market is Bitfinex. If one of the result options is given, returns only that numeric result (useful for nesting in calculations). If '--currency XXX' option is given, returns ticker for that three-letter currency code. It is up to you to make sure (1 more message)
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market buttstamp
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 237.05, Best ask: 237.25, Bid-ask spread: 0.20000, Last trade: 237.24, 24 hour volume: 7543.17628662, 24 hour low: 232.22, 24 hour high: 239.7, 24 hour vwap: 236.767276015
asciilifeform: http://spectrum.ieee.org/geek-life/history/the-great-lightbulb-conspiracy << unrelated, historical interest
assbot: The Great Lightbulb Conspiracy - IEEE Spectrum ... ( http://bit.ly/1B0g3OD )
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I have a fixture which disagrees with CFLS. Since the bulbocaust my stock is depleting rapidly as bulbs that once lasted years only now last months
asciilifeform: outdoor?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Indoor, shares a circuit with a dimmer switch
asciilifeform: tried led 'bulb' ?
BingoBoingo: Not yet. May guve that a try if I pick up LEDs before this batch dies. Was considering LED bulbs for an outdoor fixture, but witing on outdoor fixture's bulb to die first because it hates human contact.
Namworld: Ok, it's been a while
Namworld: Hello everyone
trinque: hello Namworld
trinque: !up Asenath
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 260300 @ 0.0002806 = 73.0402 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: local l0ltr0n: last week, university of maryland proclaimed that it will charge higher tuition price to students majoring in business, engineering, and comp. sci.
asciilifeform: (no prizes for guessing why)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75400 @ 0.00028063 = 21.1595 BTC [+]
trinque: asciilifeform: you should give me a prize if I guess wrong
trinque: it's only fair
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52000 @ 0.00027719 = 14.4139 BTC [-]
cazalla: australia no longer safe for americans lol http://dpaste.com/3Z2FFHP.txt
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1bTpqsP )
decimation: asciilifeform: usg friendly 'liberal' majors are subsidized, of course
decimation: asciilifeform: apparently it's mp's position that an mpex seat is implicitly time limited
mircea_popescu: how goes Namworld
mircea_popescu: derp on trilema offers "military campaigns" as example of plans that worked (tm)
mircea_popescu: the crowdsourced internet, putting pro comics out of business since september 1993
williamdunne: riiighhhtttt
decimation: mircea_popescu: sure! bombing libya was an example of a brilliant plan to shepard the outbreak of love and democracy, not throwing matches at a barrel of petrol
williamdunne: A mouthful of freedom; http://38.media.tumblr.com/88b077e9cd05d5b539bfebc783d3627e/tumblr_n9tskosimG1r7e6duo2_400.gif
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1L5bYyt )
mircea_popescu: decimation yeah totally. meanwhile the brilliant plan tostop supporting israel has resulted in an israel that could no longerr pull off the halfweek war, thus the arabs are no longer affraid of it, thus saudi arabia has no further need for the us alliance, thus they're trashing it.
mircea_popescu: brilliant plan, brilliantly executed. meanwhile, the chinese go to putin's victory celebration, the us press derps about how the european heads of "states" missed the opportunity to be relevant.
mircea_popescu: obama holds an arab world summit, nobody goes, us press is all quiet on THAT score.
williamdunne: Haven't heard about that one, what should I be googling?
decimation: yeah that's a good point. apparently the arabs are not happy that the us intends to proxy iran instead of them
menahem: williamdunne ahh i love #b-a.. all the right reminders. :)
decimation: http://www.politico.com/story/2015/05/barack-obama-flubs-name-of-first-saudi-king-117945.html
assbot: Whoops: Obama flubs name of first Saudi king - Nick Gass - POLITICO ... ( http://bit.ly/1L5cEnM )
mircea_popescu: williamdunne http://nypost.com/2015/05/11/obamas-lonely-arab-summit/ say.
assbot: Obama’s lonely ‘Arab Summit’ | New York Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1L5cJHV )
mircea_popescu: or i guess www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-32694184
williamdunne: >Even the offer by Obama of a separate tete-a-tete in Washington could not persuade Saudi Arabia’s King Salman to attend what Riyadh sources describe as “a photo-op” aimed at hoodwinking the American public.
williamdunne: rekt
decimation: basically the us stole saudi arabia's oil from the british - which is the foundation of us power in the middle east for the past 70 years. obama apparently is ignorant of this history
trinque: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/14/world/middleeast/saudi-arabia-promises-to-match-iran-in-nuclear-capability.html?_r=0
assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1L5d9xT )
trinque: let 'em nuke each other
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32220 @ 0.00028063 = 9.0419 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56950 @ 0.00028456 = 16.2057 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: mats went to check out the courts article, seems there's quite a bit left to go before i can close & award it. http://trilema.com/2013/so-whos-running-the-courts-circus/#selection-317.0-325.66
assbot: So who's running the Courts circus ? on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1L5hSzT )
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=15-05-2015#1132514 << this appears to be an inescapable inference, yes
assbot: Logged on 15-05-2015 02:29:00; decimation: asciilifeform: apparently it's mp's position that an mpex seat is implicitly time limited
scoopbot_revived: New MPEx fee http://trilema.com/2015/new-mpex-fee/
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132398 << lol teh haet.
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 21:45:38; jurov: he's born into wrong time, prolly wants to build a pyramid
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132394 << not a question of "logical continuation". are children the "logical continuation" of their parents ? are they still required to pass the bacalaureat ?
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 21:44:05; ascii_field: i'm kinda curious why mircea_popescu considers a new key signed with a previous key to not be a logical continuation of the same identity. (is it because of the impossibility of hard-guaranteed revocation, as discussed in previous thread?)
williamdunne: >It was recently brought to my attention that yes, the MPEx fee for registering new accounts is still 30 BTC.
williamdunne: lawl
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132410 << SCANDAL!11 mod6 ? ben_vulpes ?
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 21:49:50; davout: meanwhile, http://blog.bitcoinfoundation.org/ leads to a "The Free Trial is Over" stock page XD
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this is ludicrous sophistry and you know it. if i sign key y with key x, it is proof that i hold key x. nothing to do with parents or children, no analogy here.
mircea_popescu: it's no such proof. it's proof that you are willing to allow the holder of key y to continue in your stead.
mircea_popescu: no requirement he be you.
decimation: meanwhile, hacker h will one day cuckold key y
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: so this is mainly to discourage reselling account ?
mircea_popescu: well in practice it seems it's mainly to drive people up the wall.
mircea_popescu: but anyway : it's not to anything. it's because.
asciilifeform is wondering what mpex seat will cost by the time he actually needs it
mircea_popescu: gotta keep lyfe interesting for people.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: incidentally, what is to keep it from costing X, where X is whatever s.nsa is worth at that time ?
mircea_popescu: lmao
mircea_popescu: !t m s.nsa
assbot: [MPEX:S.NSA] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: / / ( shares, BTC), 30D: 0.00009001 / 0.00009843 / 0.00009851 (121000 shares, 11.91 BTC)
williamdunne: asciilifeform: Wouldn't it serve the opposite purpose, and encourage account reselling?
asciilifeform: no relation to extant numbers. but serious question.
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 4737075 * 0.00009843
gribble: 466.27029225
mircea_popescu: omfg stop bitching privilege boy!
asciilifeform: regardless of what is bought and sold by s.nsa, i can't eat any of it unless i buy mpex ticket.
mircea_popescu: what is that, like 70% yours ?
asciilifeform: which presently costs about what my organs are worth
mircea_popescu: your organs are worth 10k ?
mircea_popescu: what do you take yourself for, a 16yo girl ?
williamdunne: asciilifeform: If you find a decent buyer, I'll give you 10% commission on a kidney.
mircea_popescu: no value in organs of old men!
asciilifeform: if correctly parcelled out and sold to americans, they could be worth 10k.
asciilifeform: but mainly taken in proverbial 'organs worth' sense of 'more money than i ever expect to touch at one time'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you recall the entire warrants business btw ?
asciilifeform: aha
mircea_popescu: that's what, another ~350 ish
mircea_popescu: better start saving!
asciilifeform: l0l saving.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52400 @ 0.00028599 = 14.9859 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: anyway, here's some rosy glasses for you :
mircea_popescu: suppose within the year cardano proves such a success s.nsa trades ~0.00020000 like s.bbet. at that point, your 70% share of the stock will be worth 663.1905 ; your warrants like another 663.1904. if btc is 1.2k at that point again, you're now worth a million and a half in benjies
mircea_popescu: ima make sure the mpex fee is 1.250 mn or so at that point :D
asciilifeform: which can turn into 0 when mircea_popescu resets the price of mpex ticket to equal 663.1905
asciilifeform: aha.
mircea_popescu: yeah but at least you had fun.
mircea_popescu: better than vegas eh.
williamdunne: Can't you access warrants and the similar through coinbr?
mircea_popescu: (i also fucked up the math, warrants only worth like 330)
asciilifeform: williamdunne: i will not use coinbr.
mircea_popescu: williamdunne of course he can.
asciilifeform: williamdunne: because wtf decay
mircea_popescu: he can access them via otc, for that matter, just sell em to someone. but it makes little sense before share goes over par.
asciilifeform: williamdunne: i couldn't use coinbr even if wanted to, because it would be a recurring btc cost and i have no btc-denominated income stream.
williamdunne: Ah ok, fair nuff
mircea_popescu: well... you could start polyamory-ing, and then getting a new girl each week and then tricking her into having her picture taken with weird numbers written on her chest.
mircea_popescu: .4 a month.
mircea_popescu: should cover coinbr
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i could also visit buenos aires via fart propulsion and wings made from garbage bags.
asciilifeform: just as theoretically possible.
mircea_popescu: what do you think this is, a gilliam movie ?
decimation: I donno, how much energy can you extract from one colon's gas?
asciilifeform: decimation: the same amount of girl pickup energy i have
decimation: heh
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so buy a club.
asciilifeform: l0l
mircea_popescu: (one of my favourite jokes long ago. because i knew this ugly obnoxious dude who was kinda rape-y, and also kept buying clubs, as in, bars with music.)
asciilifeform: 'do you believe in clubs for young people?' 'yes, but one ought to try kindness first'
williamdunne: !s cardano cost
assbot: 1 results for 'cardano cost' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=cardano+cost
mircea_popescu: "one fart-meter"
asciilifeform: williamdunne: cost will inescapably have to adjust to exchange rate at time of mass production
asciilifeform: williamdunne: component costs are denominated in usd and will likely be long after i'm dead
williamdunne: Thats fine, USD prices are k by me
mircea_popescu: give up meat, live longer!
williamdunne: !s cardano price
assbot: 1 results for 'cardano price' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=cardano+price
asciilifeform: give up live, meat longer
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132434 << yeah srsly, one of the best private chuckles for ... well, for some people
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 21:55:34; ascii_field: (actually ~1.4 that it turned into)
mircea_popescu: is that alf actually beats a lot of "professional" managers
asciilifeform: l0l
mircea_popescu: sorta informal "alf benchmark"
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: you do recall what it was i bought with it, aha?
mircea_popescu: notrly
asciilifeform: mpoe & dice
mircea_popescu: heh
decimation: what else is gonna bring in btc income
decimation: mining, gambling, 'financial services'
mircea_popescu: decimation i make some from trilema.
decimation: ah, selling content
decimation: no one believes that btc/usd is going to stay where it is for the long run
decimation: so who would fund a business in present btc/usd?
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-05-2015#1132451 << i was gonna bitch but then i saw the gif. that's a kickass gif.
assbot: Logged on 14-05-2015 22:30:12; cazalla: much better than the grainy tumblr shit someone else links :)

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