Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans

← 2015-02-04 | 2015-02-06 →
mircea_popescu: adlai what about the profiler ?
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 04:48:10; mircea_popescu: You can see the compiled assembly code for any just typed in function
Vexual: all business
mircea_popescu: well obviously profilers exist. just, people seem sorta shy to put the bytestream in your face so.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: adlai is correct, any decent modern commonlisp gives you asm/disasm
asciilifeform: sbcl doesn't even -include- an interpreter.
asciilifeform: (and doesn't need one)
mircea_popescu: i never said otherwise!
asciilifeform: * (disassemble '(lambda (x) (+ x 3)))
asciilifeform: ; disassembly for (LAMBDA (X))
asciilifeform: ; 059DF529: 488B55F8 MOV RDX, [RBP-8] ; no-arg-parsing entry point
asciilifeform: ; 2D: BF06000000 MOV EDI, 6
asciilifeform: ; 32: 4C8D1C25E0010020 LEA R11, [#x200001E0] ; GENERIC-+
asciilifeform: ; 3A: 41FFD3 CALL R11
asciilifeform: ; 3D: 480F42E3 CMOVB RSP, RBX
asciilifeform: ; 41: 488BE5 MOV RSP, RBP
asciilifeform: ; 44: F8 CLC
asciilifeform: ; 45: 5D POP RBP
asciilifeform: ; 46: C3 RET
asciilifeform: ; 47: CC0A BREAK 10 ; error trap
asciilifeform: ; 49: 02 BYTE #X02
asciilifeform: ; 4A: 18 BYTE #X18 ; INVALID-ARG-COUNT-ERROR
asciilifeform: ; 4B: 54 BYTE #X54 ; RCX
asciilifeform: ^ example
asciilifeform: (amd64, for the very unalert reader)
decimation: lol @ vexual
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 112120 @ 0.00037463 = 42.0035 BTC [-] {2}
Vexual: such interjection
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that asm code breaks on https << unknown instruction
asciilifeform: Vexual wins again.
mircea_popescu: incidentally this is a shitty asm!
asciilifeform: * (defun foo (x) (declare (fixnum x)) (declare (optimize (speed 3) (safety 0))) (+ x 3))
asciilifeform: * (disassemble 'foo)
asciilifeform: ; disassembly for FOO
asciilifeform: ; 059E2CC2: 488D4203 LEA RAX, [RDX+3] ; no-arg-parsing entry point
asciilifeform: ; C6: 486BD002 IMUL RDX, RAX, 2
asciilifeform: ; CA: 710E JNO L0
asciilifeform: ; CC: 488BD0 MOV RDX, RAX
asciilifeform: ; CF: 4C8D1C25D0050020 LEA R11, [#x200005D0] ; ALLOC-SIGNED-BIGNUM-IN-RDX
asciilifeform: ; D7: 41FFD3 CALL R11
asciilifeform: ; DA: L0: 488BE5 MOV RSP, RBP
asciilifeform: ; DD: F8 CLC
asciilifeform: ; DE: 5D POP RBP
asciilifeform: ; DF: C3 RET
asciilifeform: ^ here we've pulled the safety out.
ben_vulpes: groovy jams Vexual
asciilifeform: this gives us around 80-95% of 'c' speed
asciilifeform: (in typical case)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 1) it's a disasm 2) you won't see what you're almost certainly expecting to see (add rax, 3...) , because lispy memory architecture is still in use
mircea_popescu: moar like the evil one's used to
asciilifeform: i won't say this is the world's best illustration, but it took no more than half a minute to generate.
asciilifeform: perhaps adlai would care to offer a neater one.
Vexual: thanks ben_vulpes
ben_vulpes: !gettrust assbot Vexual
assbot: Vexual is not registered in WoT.
ben_vulpes: ;;gettrust assbot Vexual
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user Vexual: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: | WoT data: | Rated since: never
Vexual: fuck off cnt
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69580 @ 0.0003735 = 25.9881 BTC [-]
ben_vulpes: first citizen of -assets
ben_vulpes: up yours, buddhi
decimation: I am retiring gentlemen, have a good evening
decimation: !down decimation
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the original point wasn't that there don't exist profilers, but that it's rare for a language to put the bytecode in the programmer's face, and especially for a new and (at least in my perception) hip one.
mircea_popescu: you'd normally expect the opposite
asciilifeform: lol, 'java' barfed bytecode routinely (on debug)
asciilifeform: !up gabriel_laddel
mircea_popescu: wasn't this improved out of it ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: was
mircea_popescu: kinda my point.
ben_vulpes: good evening gabriel_laddel!
gabriel_laddel: regarding the preceding discussion on asm, common lisp vs. julia vs. C, the book Let over Lambda is quite good and discusses these and related issues in-depth.
mircea_popescu: an' tbh it wasn't much more than a passing remark anyway, so we've made more of it than its frail back can carry
asciilifeform read 'let over lambda', was not terribly thrilled
gabriel_laddel: ben_vulpes: Hello. How is life treating you?
asciilifeform: that book had possibly the spammiest jacket, for reasonably sane subject matter, of any crackpot self-pub work ever printed.
asciilifeform blows dust off LOL
asciilifeform: 'only the top percentile of programmers... if you can understand this book, you are in the top...'
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: lol. The idea of a closure doesn't need to be stretched out across several chapters, but e.g., the cl-ppcre chapter is good for the non-lisper to read.
ben_vulpes: gabriel_laddel: i yet yearn for the day i dual boot os x and a lispy gentoo
gabriel_laddel: ben_vulpes: I'm currently counting lines of algol and fixing up the dashboard
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: sbcl runs entirely without problem on mac os
ben_vulpes resists temptation to troll alf
ben_vulpes: i know, i know.
gabriel_laddel: ben_vulpes: can you run gentoo on your macbook?
ben_vulpes: but that which gabriel_laddel described was a damned siren song for a boy who grew up on os x.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 176250 @ 0.00038187 = 67.3046 BTC [+] {3}
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: laugh, but that's actually what i used mine for
asciilifeform blows dust off 'macbook air'
Vexual: powerpc?
ben_vulpes: gabriel_laddel: for a gentoo like what you describe, i'd go through the headaches of dual booting.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: why not sbcl on gentoo?
asciilifeform: on strange iron?
ben_vulpes: forgive me, but is it all not strange?
ben_vulpes: i'm entirely naive to quirks of the underlying chips.
asciilifeform: anyone even has suspend-to-ram working on linux-on-apple ?
asciilifeform: the demented 'broadcom' wireless nics?
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: okay okay!
ben_vulpes: what do you mean by "strange iron", though?
asciilifeform: actually for all i know, they might
asciilifeform: it was long ago that i last tried.
asciilifeform: strange iron being, say, that very same 'air' (circa '09)
asciilifeform: as in 'that which few have gentood before'
Vexual: yah mean safari?
ben_vulpes: is the point to run sbcl on "strange iron"?
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i somehow got the impression that you were considering gentoo-on-applehw
gabriel_laddel: that is what he's considering.
ben_vulpes: myeah, but i think i missed a leap in your reasoning.
Vexual: do tell
asciilifeform: describing the gotchas from the last time i personally tried this.
asciilifeform: not necessarily current.
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> ben_vulpes: sbcl runs entirely without problem on mac os << so as to say "why bother with gentoo?"?
asciilifeform: in case ben_vulpes wants to play with it on one of his existing stock macs
ben_vulpes: i'm using sbcl for stump, now that we mention it
mod6: ok all, not getting much of anywhere with debugging.
asciilifeform: on what?
asciilifeform: (stump on mac?!?)
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: :D
asciilifeform: this actually works as expected ?
ben_vulpes: why so amuse?
ben_vulpes: "as expected"
asciilifeform: or only within a running x11
ben_vulpes: !up Vexual
ben_vulpes: mas tracks sil vous plait Vexual
Vexual: oui
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: only within x11
Vexual: yah long bit
asciilifeform: ah then
asciilifeform was about to be surprised
mod6: i've basically run and break when nBestHeight=167999 and then go from there, but not turning anything meaningful up yet. however, i'm sure i'm not sure how to dig into these vectors properly yet.
ben_vulpes: why would one bother with the native cruftery?
mod6: i'll carry on tomorrow. im like X_X at this point.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i can't help but wonder how many folks carry around 'mac' as just a unix box with a very peculiar set of window decorations
mircea_popescu: here asciilifeform : "I never read the proclamations of generals before battle, the speeches of Führers and prime ministers, the solidarity songs of public schools and left-wing political parties, national anthems, Temperance tracts, papal encyclicals and sermons against gambling and contraception, without seeming to hear in the background a chorus of raspberries from all the millions of common men to whom these high
mircea_popescu: sentiments make no appeal. Nevertheless the high sentiments always win in the end, leaders who offer blood, toil, tears and sweat always get more out of their followers than those who offer safety and a good time. When it comes to the pinch, human beings are heroic. Women face childbed and the scrubbing brush, revolutionaries keep their mouths shut in the torture chamber, battleships go down with their guns still firin
mircea_popescu: g when their decks are awash. It is only that the other element in man, the lazy, cowardly, debt-bilking adulterer who is inside all of us, can never be suppressed altogether and needs a hearing occasionally."
asciilifeform: guessing - quite a few
mircea_popescu: a damned sight more optimistic than you, this pessimist
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i did burn in excess of two days attempting to get either a firefox or chrome to connect to x under os x
ben_vulpes: net result?
ben_vulpes: total failure.
ben_vulpes: Vexual: stale.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes the idea with the native cruftery is, he found a reliable way to wedge the bitcoind at a certain heright which just so happens to be the checkpoint
Vexual: penis you
mircea_popescu: but no one else ever ehard of this, and so we wish to see his block
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i'll have to compile it meself, apparently.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i assume you built them for x11
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: where did you get them?!
ben_vulpes: mno, i am a nixy pleb
Vexual: liar
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: actually this very wedge (though differing tx id) has been documented in the past. see last night's log.
ben_vulpes: while it must surprise everyone here, the fact that i am a process man who's only barely grasped the basics of *nix operation bears trotting out on a *regular* basis apparently
mircea_popescu: well is it the same ?
asciilifeform: but afaik no one posted a meaningful dumped block
mod6: how can i do that?
mod6: need guidence
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: if you were trying to get $proggy built for apple's gui to draw on an x11 instance, i regret to inform you that this won't work...
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: your lessons come too late, sir!
ben_vulpes: instead, instruct me on the arcane art of dumping specific blocks from a bitcoind 0.5.3
Vexual: 053 becomes a thing
mircea_popescu: if the worst comes to worst diff blk00x.dat pre and post
mircea_popescu: also blkindex.dat
ben_vulpes: tips on running for precisely a single block?
mircea_popescu: there should also be a bdb based method but it probably would take longer to untangle
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes have a logwatcher trigger ? renice everyything ?
mod6: during debugging, i did see something that mentioned "blk%04d.dat" when looking at the txout.scriptPubKey vector:
assbot: dpaste: 1E4QQ9A ... ( )
mod6: think that's the one to check?
mircea_popescu: mod6 they become full at 2gb
mircea_popescu: whichever's not 2gb is the one you're working on
mod6: (This was from inside where it does VerifySignature())
mircea_popescu: anyway, that's all for me. nighty!
mod6: looks like 'i've only got 1: blk0001.dat, 985Mb
mod6: anyway, thanks guise.
Vexual: stil drink peroni
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> chick's so drastically ugly tho... << pretty indicative of the tail to which us brass has access
ben_vulpes: maaaaaas, Vexual
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50620 @ 0.0003758 = 19.023 BTC [-] {2}
Vexual: ja neber descibe
assbot: Argentina's president Cristina Kirchner attacked for 'racist' Chinese joke | World news | The Guardian ... ( )
punkman: I setup a node yesterday, stuck on 168000 today
ben_vulpes: thanks for the repro, punkman
punkman: (on debian wheezy, rev_bump patch)
ben_vulpes: would you be a dear and sync an unmolested 0.5.3?
ben_vulpes: with a known-good blocksource?
ben_vulpes: !up Vexual
phillipsjk: I don't think 0.5.3 supports bootstrap.dat, but I could be wrong.
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: what does bootstrap.dat have to do with anything?
BingoBoingo: Everyone who wanted qntra to have a category page now lives
assbot: Categories | ... ( )
ben_vulpes: oh, d'ja hack the whoopies BingoBoingo?
punkman: ben_vulpes: what's a known-good blocksource?
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> [] a) what chicks and b) what pay. << i can speak to the chicks
ben_vulpes: the pay, not so much
asciilifeform: << of historical interest, re: fdr and u.s. brass
assbot: The Willie D ... ( )
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: Nah, hand listed at least for now. Over the next month or two will work on making categories more useful for browsing since mike_c wanted it so
ben_vulpes: punkman: using addnode= to add a node from which to pull the blocks
punkman: ben_vulpes: I had one of BingoBoingo's nodes plus dnsseed
asciilifeform: 'the new state-of-the-art destroyer, her ambitious captain and seemingly fumbling crew were placed under arrest and sent to Bermuda for trial. it was the first time in the history of the United States Navy that an entire ship and her company had been arrested. The William D. Porter was surrounded by Marines when it docked in Bermuda and was held there for several days as the closed-session inquiry attempted to find out what ha
asciilifeform: d happened.'
assbot: Bok van Blerk - Land van Melk en Heuning (AMPTELIKE HD MUSIEK VIDEO) - YouTube ... ( )
trinque: asciilifeform: I once finished gentoo quest on a two-generations-back macbook pro
trinque laments his misspent youth
asciilifeform: trinque: finished in the sense of there not remaining a single peripheral that could be described as not entirely working to spec ?
asciilifeform: even, e.g., power management ?
trinque: yep
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes ^
trinque: I still have the kernel config somewheres
trinque: that said fuck that shit; I'm sure there's an easier machine to deal with
trinque: and that is decidedly not anything lenovo's squeezed out recently
ben_vulpes: oh asciilifeform that's a great story
asciilifeform: trinque: ever found the 'easier machine' ?
punkman: jurov: guess we'll end up with this << I had one of these. It doesn't have wifi or built-in NAND, has SATA, can run off battery. Doesn't need binary blobs if you don't care about GPU.
assbot: A10-OLinuXino-LIME - Open Source Hardware Board ... ( )
trinque: asciilifeform: nah, tis but the rambling of an addict who will never find his fix
punkman: but also it died the other day, and no warranty
asciilifeform: punkman: unfortunately - expensive. and no chassis/powersupply
trinque: -or- when the hell do I get a dataflowputer
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 129202 @ 0.00036638 = 47.337 BTC [-] {2}
trinque: I was thinking my love of relational databases (view composition, etc) would map to that model pretty well
trinque: there's this idea of streaming queries that's been kicked around a bit
trinque: sounds sort of like what I read on loper
asciilifeform: when you plug a lamp into a mains socket, is that also a 'streaming query' ?
ben_vulpes: every night these koans
ben_vulpes: every night my tiny brain
trinque: zen stick's good for ya, haha
trinque: asciilifeform: yes, the power has been declared to be, then the lamp may make use of that fact as it does
trinque: vs say asking "hm, at this point in time are there electrons moving in this wire?" *plug* "Yes." *unplug*
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform> when you plug a lamp into a mains socket, is that also a 'streaming query' ? << For some kinds of lamp sure.
asciilifeform: except that this is an astonishingly abstruse model for what the lamp/socket do.
trinque: select * from qntra; -- streaming version would give me new articles that occur after the query was begun
asciilifeform: that nobody in his right mind would normally suggest.
asciilifeform: why, then, suggest it for a computer program?
trinque: why suggest relational modeling?
trinque: lots of reasons treated by smarter guys than myself
asciilifeform: 'streaming query'
trinque: "new shit came to light"
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: What of lamps that monitor/diagnose issues with mains power, totally a query.
asciilifeform: what of airplane propelled via pilot's farts.
trinque: BingoBoingo: or say I only read when the light is on
trinque: the reactive model of just firing up reading when there's some light to do it by is nice
ben_vulpes: <Vexual> [] 'hoes and money and violence an polotx << legendary
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> what of airplane propelled via pilot's farts. << If pilot is gassy enough why not? Optimize diet for flight.
asciilifeform: or let's have water polling bottle on what shape to be.
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> [] trinque actually they'll fight you, too. more than one woman got scared shitless of flocks of geese << this one time i was eating a burrito on the waterfront
ben_vulpes: idling by my bicycle
ben_vulpes: doing nothing of import, minding my own business
ben_vulpes: goose *catches my eye*!
phillipsjk: DeathAndTaxes on bitcoin talk made a detailed post explaining why the 1MB block size in not good for anything other than inter-bank transfers: He estimetes 2-4 TPS basked on the last million transactions
assbot: Permanently keeping the 1MB (anti-spam) restriction is a great idea ... ... ( )
ben_vulpes: i shit you not it makes eye contact
ben_vulpes: and then proceeeds to march over to intimidate me
trinque: ben_vulpes: "bitch!" spans many species, lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 212700 @ 0.00036541 = 77.7227 BTC [-] {4}
phillipsjk: !gettrust Deathandtaxes
assbot: Deathandtaxes is not registered in WoT.
asciilifeform: exercise for student: when you wake up, think of six entirely factually-correct - but disastrously intellectually-crippling - models for some commonplace thing or other.
ben_vulpes: now i can't quite beat the thing senseless with my helmet as, well, ussa
phillipsjk: s/basked/based
ben_vulpes: conclusion of story left for reader
trinque: asciilifeform: I'll do it while wiping my paper with ass
assbot: Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( )
ben_vulpes: and lo, i am logged.
ben_vulpes: my toy bitcoinds, wedged.
asciilifeform off to indent a bed.
ben_vulpes: my girl, somnulent.
trinque: my booze, gone
ben_vulpes: mine is not!
ben_vulpes: although i have no fags left
ben_vulpes elbows trinque
ben_vulpes: smokes, let's go!
trinque: ben_vulpes: I'm deedbottin
trinque: to-night!
ben_vulpes: get it done!
trinque: let me get the thing to publish once and I'll see if you're still up for a cig
ben_vulpes: go go go
ben_vulpes: i've got...
ben_vulpes: a glass of tinto left?
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> or let's have water polling bottle on what shape to be. <<Water is perfect for polling bottle of its volume
BingoBoingo: <ben_vulpes> now i can't quite beat the thing senseless with my helmet as, well, ussa << disappeared into sack?
trinque: BingoBoingo: he'd be arrested for... fowl molestation
BingoBoingo: trinque: I mean bird disappears into his sack, not his sack disappeared into bird for a bit.
assbot: Change The Bank By Importing StartUp Culture | Fintech by Bernard Lunn ... ( )
trinque: ben_vulpes: hah yes let the banks imitate the fucking valley
trinque: please do
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16989 @ 0.00037081 = 6.2997 BTC [+]
punkman: damn, 200mb debug.log
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: the last million transactions are probably by volume idiocy spawned by wallets that inhibit address reuse
ben_vulpes: !gettrust phillipsjk
assbot: Trust relationship from user ben_vulpes to user phillipsjk: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | |
ben_vulpes: from namworld?
ben_vulpes: are you fucking kidding me?
punkman: ben_vulpes, I'm working on "1-click" deploy/build/run/log ansible playbook
phillipsjk: ;;later tell mircea_popescu I sincerely hope the 1MB line in the sand is not simply a power-trip.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: who are you anyways?
phillipsjk: ben_vulpes, got imported from gribble. I trade with him
ben_vulpes: yeah no clearly i can read that much
phillipsjk: *traded
ben_vulpes: no need to summarize your *one* rating for me.
assbot: Resume for James Phillips ... ( )
ben_vulpes: absolutely none of this qualifies you to have an opinion about block size.
phillipsjk: Not even my 2 year electronic program or running a node for a year?
ben_vulpes: no, not at all.
ben_vulpes: ./bitcoind -datadir=my_butt/ -daemon
ben_vulpes: no more than merely existing gives you a say in how the world works.
trinque: b-b-but my pulse!
ben_vulpes: back to the deeds, you
ben_vulpes: don't make me finish this bottle aone, trinque
ben_vulpes: ;;gettrust assbot muxne
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user muxne: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 1 via 3 connections. Graph: | WoT data: | Rated since: Sun Jun 22 00:11:14 2014
trinque: :( sad thought
ben_vulpes: !gettrust assbot muxne
assbot: muxne is not registered in WoT.
ben_vulpes: kakobrekla:
ben_vulpes: i know you don't like the guy, but nuking his record?
punkman: ^ no gpg key
punkman: !up Vexual
ben_vulpes: ah ha
phillipsjk: Well, if I ever get my Money Service Business registered, I will let you know.
ben_vulpes: you're not registering shit
phillipsjk has not worke on that in like 75 days months
ben_vulpes: the mind boggles.
ben_vulpes: why'd i think that a thing you've dropped for 2.5 months would ever see any action?
Vexual: what are you actually trying to do?
ben_vulpes: Vexual: tunes, let's go
phillipsjk: Buy and sell BItcoin following the *letter* of the law. I am passive-aggressive that way.
assbot: Black Sails OST - The Golden Vanity (feat Doug Lacy) - YouTube ... ( )
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: the san-serif headers are kinda..bleh
Vexual: that got elanors tits? punkman?
punkman: no tits
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: well pipe down, read logs, learn something and then start derping about "power trips"
Vexual: ross about to get sentenced
ben_vulpes: bitcoin is a rare, scarce, unpollutable thing unlike everything else under the domain of the fiat tyrants.
ben_vulpes: the 1mb line is about preserving that scarcity in the face of all who'd turn gold into paper in Schwabe accounts and make your dollar into ninety cents tomorrow.
ben_vulpes: even though all i can ever aspire to own in terms of vehicle is that crown jewel in the plastic bezzle crown (the honda element), i yet recognize those valuable scarce and uncounterfeitable things like bitcoin and well-husbanded women.
phillipsjk: The problem is with 1MB blocks, Bitcoin will only be used for inter-bank settlements. Either that, or remain a niche. We are talking less than 1 million users world-wide.
ben_vulpes: you've made no argument as to this 1e6 number.
danielpbarron: how is that even a problem?
phillipsjk: Death and taxes made a table.
trinque: /markov
ben_vulpes: dpaste it
Vexual: penis
ben_vulpes: i know no death and taxes
ben_vulpes: forum posts carry no weight here.
ben_vulpes: a table lol do mine eyes deceive me
ben_vulpes: trinque: i pour!
Vexual: look at my codebus dls
trinque: I'm at like 37% of rsync'ing leveldb turds up to the server
trinque: ben_vulpes: better just finish that yerself
ben_vulpes: bwahaha
danielpbarron: it's not that banks are bad; it's that fiat is bad. A bitcoin bank could work well. A service that holds bitcoin for you and lets you spend it with a debit card or something
ben_vulpes: danielpbarron: anyone who could hold bitcoin (in the sense of actually controlling their keys, robustly) should trivially be able to wield either credit cards or local fiat
phillipsjk: Quadruple the numbers for 8TPS
assbot: Snippet #302180 ... ( )
trinque: phillipsjk: dem stats is not the fucking point
trinque: what TPS will the network do if it fails entirely?
ben_vulpes: no no no no no
trinque: or hell, let me run trinquecoin from my laptop; I'll be the whole network
phillipsjk: well, that would be about 0.
trinque: and I'll do a goddamn million tps
ben_vulpes: bitcoin is a store of value and a way to move money around without governmental interference.
ben_vulpes: it is not visa, ffs.
ben_vulpes: it is not mastercard.
ben_vulpes: it is not even swift.
ben_vulpes: if you touch bitcoin, you are going up against the fiat state. end of story.
trinque: GOLD.
trinque: get your forklift
phillipsjk: How many transaction per decade do you expect people to need?
danielpbarron: i feel like this confusion phillipsjk is having would be easily resolved by reading the log for 6 months or so :p
ben_vulpes: danielpbarron: right?
ben_vulpes: too bad he insists on waltzing in here and telling us about how the proletariat must transact in bitcoin several times per year.
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: proles will be lucky to buy a fraction of a bitcoin once per decade.
phillipsjk: The top 1% will be lucky to buy Bitcoin once per decade.
danielpbarron: stock up
punkman: phillipsjk: the proposal is not to have 1MB block forever and ever
ben_vulpes: <trinque> get your forklift << not a bad analogy. preserving private keys is tough.
trinque: ben_vulpes: requires equipment and *taps noggin*
trinque: all sorts of other financial instruments can be derived from bitcoin once the thing itself is safe
trinque: right now it's nowhere near safe
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: the vast majority of people run winblowz and use iOS devices. are we to count them in our set of people who might use bitcoin someday?
trinque: you want to build your visa? build it on bitcoin, but don't systemd the thing and decide it must have a visa built in
ben_vulpes: trinque: tell me about it.
ben_vulpes: at this point, i'm seriously entertaining the notion that phillipsjk is 3 phillipinos frantically composing sentences that sort-of make sense in english
phillipsjk: ben_vulpes, I have always assumed that if Bitcoin users commonly used Windows or IOS, we will learn that some major company had an "insider" push BItcoin stealing malware. (I think I mentioned that within my first 10 Bitcointalk posts.)
ben_vulpes: anyways, block limit ain't going anywhere. it diddles important scarcity characteristics, and the system isn't even in steady-state yet.
danielpbarron: are we supposed to have read your post history on some forum while you have not read the history here?
phillipsjk: Well, I guess I have to read logs to learn your "roadmap"
punkman: debug.log snippet for my node stuck on 168000:
punkman: looks same as mod6's
ben_vulpes: ERROR: ConnectInputs() : 2c2314f353 VerifySignature failed << that's familiar
phillipsjk: danielpbarron, not really, no.
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: what roadmap
ben_vulpes: bitcoin is.
ben_vulpes: and it ain't changing.
punkman: did anyone try running phoundation's 0.6 ?
phillipsjk: It has and will change. The 1MB block limit was introduced to stop spam. You seem to be more militant than luke-Jr who called Bitcoin gambling sites spam. You appear to call all "trivial" transactions spam.
punkman: phillipsjk: the 1MB limit is not to stop spam
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: the 1MB limit is not to stop spam.
fluffypony: phillipsjk: the 1MB limit is not to stop spam.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 196400 @ 0.00036017 = 70.7374 BTC [-] {2}
phillipsjk: <ben_vulpes> anyways, block limit ain't going anywhere. it diddles important scarcity characteristics, and the system isn't even in steady-state yet.
ben_vulpes: yes, i said that.
punkman: not just scarcity, slower block propagation can be disastrous
trinque: dude the average block size has to be what, 250kb right now?
ben_vulpes: the 1MB limit is actually in place because of block propagation chaos.
ben_vulpes: once upon a time, blocks were of unbounded size
ben_vulpes: propagation of blocks over the network was at that time...weird.
ben_vulpes: today, 3 mining consortiums might find a block within just a few minute of each other
phillipsjk: I always cringe when lusers on the forum brags some alt has faster "confirmation" times.
phillipsjk: That is the primary reason I am wary of Monero actually. 1 minute block|
phillipsjk: Well, thanks for the chat.
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: you're aware that monero's an experiment, right?
phillipsjk: So is Bitcoin.
punkman: So is earth.
phillipsjk: Currently Bitcoin is testing whether a secure, networked application is even possible.
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: ya well bitcoin monetized, and monero hasn't yet and likely won't so that's the kind of comment that paints you as entirely ignorant of the domain.
ben_vulpes: no, it's possible.
ben_vulpes: the sigs hash.
ben_vulpes: the blocks chain.
ben_vulpes: the experiment succeded.
ben_vulpes: scuse me, monero is a "hobby".
ben_vulpes: there is no "testing" of bitcoin.
trinque: will my btcd still fart transactions at other nodes if I haven't finished syncing the blockchain?
ben_vulpes: the notion that the bitcoin protocol needs testing is pure FUD, from the enemies of hard crypto.
ben_vulpes: trinque: TIAS
ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: where did you get that key, anyways? did you buy it?
trinque: ben_vulpes: wat
punkman: trinque: if you can build the transaction elsewhere
ben_vulpes: Try It And See
trinque: ben_vulpes: no way sounds lame
ben_vulpes: Welcome to BITCOIN
phillipsjk: No, back in 2009, my ISP said that they reserve the right to "inject ads in the browser". I have been singing my e-mail ever since.
ben_vulpes: trinque: i'd hope so.
ben_vulpes: i singed my butthole with a particularly firey fart the other night
trinque: lol
ben_vulpes: back in 99 Vexual was my isp and we only communicated with caesars cipher
BingoBoingo: <phillipsjk> It has and will change. The 1MB block limit was introduced to stop spam. You seem to be more militant than luke-Jr who called Bitcoin gambling sites spam. You appear to call all "trivial" transactions spam. << His definition of spam is both more complex and stupider than that
punkman: "let's block fee paying transactions, yay!"
phillipsjk: BingoBoingo, for some strange reason, I don't doubt you.
ben_vulpes: the point that i'm making (for the clinically slow) is that the odds of a key from...2013 just showing up and having anything pointful to say, especially when citing bitcointalk as proof or substantiation of anything are...low.
ben_vulpes: especially when that key simply parrots that which is only said by those who wish to wreck the scarcity and value of core bitcoin economics.
ben_vulpes: ;;ident phillipsjk
gribble: Nick 'phillipsjk', with hostmask 'phillipsjk!~james@unaffiliated/phillipsjk', is not identified.
ben_vulpes: oh well clearly fuck right off then.
danielpbarron: !v assbot:danielpbarron.rate.phillipsjk.-1:162b44943bc0180c83a6648fa5aaaa3cbbeb78a4506a70bcbddccf8766452878
assbot: Successfully added a rating of -1 for phillipsjk with note: get back to me in six months
danielpbarron: !v assbot:danielpbarron.rate.ben_vulpes.1:d92e6c6794ef16570291b960cfc1f164b7e1dd41eb85d812c2ecfe1b9f870592
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 1 for ben_vulpes with note: a *real* bitcoin dev
ben_vulpes: oh gosh don't do that danielpbarron
ben_vulpes: you'll bring der furer down on me and i'm trying to get to ars in the spring
ben_vulpes: how is this phillipsjk voiced again?
phillipsjk: I authe with assbot, not gribble.
phillipsjk: !down
phillipsjk: !down phillipsjk
ben_vulpes: no, you're not even identified.
ben_vulpes: mm oh
punkman: ;;ident ben_vulpes
gribble: Nick 'ben_vulpes', with hostmask 'ben_vulpes!~ben_vulpe@unaffiliated/benkay', is not identified.
ben_vulpes: *sigh*
ben_vulpes: ;;ident ben_vulpes
gribble: Nick 'ben_vulpes', with hostmask 'ben_vulpes!~ben_vulpe@unaffiliated/benkay', is not identified.
ben_vulpes: ;;eauth ben_vulpes
gribble: Request successful for user ben_vulpes, hostmask ben_vulpes!~ben_vulpe@unaffiliated/benkay. Get your encrypted OTP from
punkman: we don't really do that anymore
ben_vulpes: ;;everify freenode:#bitcoin-otc:c04e17d42f4139a1cf13c592cf1722b9116798c9122e99590d8dedff
gribble: You are now authenticated for user ben_vulpes with key 2AFA1A9FD2D031DA
ben_vulpes: punkman: no, but it makes a point.
ben_vulpes: my tooling works.
punkman: add-key?
ben_vulpes: yeah, what is this add-key?
trinque: doo eeeet
trinque: something's not talking to something *crawls back under car*
ben_vulpes: !s testing in production
assbot: 19 results for 'testing in production' :
trinque: add-key adds your public key to the bot's keyring
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 148200 @ 0.00037334 = 55.329 BTC [+] {3}
trinque: ben_vulpes: nah works in pm
trinque: I think that's a setting
trinque: anyhow add-key adds your key *if* you're in assbot's L1 or L2
danielpbarron: doesn't the bot know your key if it knows you're in the l2?
trinque: add-deed noms a gpg signed document and queues it for timestamping
trinque: danielpbarron: you give it your key; it checks the web api, adds the key to the keyring if you're in l1/l2
trinque: as per spec
trinque: and only eats docs with signatures it can verify
ben_vulpes: that's going to have to work in-channel, trinque
trinque: ben_vulpes: duh
ben_vulpes: ALL I HAVE IS DUH
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 97330 @ 0.00038368 = 37.3436 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42136 @ 0.00038734 = 16.321 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: !up deedbot-
punkman: lol
deedbot-: imported: FC66C0C5D98C42A1D4A98B6B42F9985AFAB953C4
trinque: deerrrrppp
deedbot-: accepted: 1
assbot: Last 17 lines bashed and pending review. ( )
ben_vulpes: is the flatfile host up yet?
trinque: I'm fiddling with the publisher
ben_vulpes: dat unstyled text
ben_vulpes: turns me on
trinque: probably will have no css
ben_vulpes: no css is best css
ben_vulpes: mebbe a tidy little dinosaur in the footer
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31019 @ 0.00038861 = 12.0543 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 19493 @ 0.00096996 = 18.9074 BTC [+] {11}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2000 @ 0.0009705 = 1.941 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Frames Janco - No Sleep [Prod. by SouthWest] - YouTube ... ( )
punkman: !up Vexual
punkman: !up deedbot-
Vexual: didnt james franco cut his arm of for sport?
BingoBoingo: Bioshock is real life
assbot: Confirmation That Photosynthesizing Sea Slugs Steal Genes From Algae ... ( )
Vexual: bioshokc pron is a thing
Vexual: forget bix
assbot: Hazel - Dayglo [OFFICIAL VIDEO] - YouTube ... ( )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34900 @ 0.00038861 = 13.5625 BTC [+]
assbot: BADBADNOTGOOD & Ghostface Killah - Ray Gun ft. DOOM (Official Video) - YouTube ... ( )
danielpbarron: height=185126
punkman: danielpbarron: with orphanage burner?
danielpbarron: not sure
danielpbarron: that's the one ascii compiled and hosted
danielpbarron: i hope i'm close to getting it compiled myself
danielpbarron: !s pogo
assbot: 78 results for 'pogo' :
danielpbarron: Vexual, ^
punkman: danielpbarron: this one? "bitcoin-armv5-bastard includes the 'orphanage burner'"
Vexual: ill be loadinging up m old eeepc
danielpbarron: oh i forgot he made two of them
Vexual: maybe if it owrks
Vexual: ive obly got one?
Vexual: luckily the book doesnt nessitate anything in particular
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 87790 @ 0.00038861 = 34.1161 BTC [+]
assbot: Jay Electronica - Eternal Sunshine (The Pledge) (Full 15-minute version) - YouTube ... ( )
assbot: | A new basis for open, distributed, real-time communication ... ( )
punkman: artifexd, maybe some relevant ideas for gossipd in that spec
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 134500 @ 0.00036454 = 49.0306 BTC [-] {3}
punkman: "if you are Anthem member, or if you were an Anthem member, you've been doxxed... and quite comprehensively. And you were doxxed nearly two months ago. Or maybe not, because Anthem goes out of its way to NOT tell you when this occurred. If you were affected here's how they will notify you:"
punkman: "We continue working to identify the members who are impacted. We will begin to mail letters to impacted members in the coming weeks."
fluffypony: what's Anthem?
fluffypony: (scuse my ignorance)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42700 @ 0.00038861 = 16.5936 BTC [+]
punkman: fluffypony: some insurance company
fluffypony: ah ok
assbot: Impostors bilk Omaha's Scoular Co. out of $17.2 million - Money ... ( )
punkman: scammer pretended to be the CEO, told employee to plz send monies to china: "For the last months we have been working, in coordination and under the supervision of the SEC, on acquiring a Chinese company. ... This is very sensitive, so please only communicate with me through this email, in order for us not to infringe SEC regulations."
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 06:53:48; ben_vulpes: i know you don't like the guy, but nuking his record?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 156200 @ 0.00038899 = 60.7602 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 5802 @ 0.00095 = 5.5119 BTC [-] {8}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1145 @ 0.00094837 = 1.0859 BTC [-] {4}
cazalla: from a ransomware news piece.. "Once their files are returned, the Niedermayers plan to have their hard drive professionally wiped, and will change their IP address."
fluffypony: I'm going to offer professional wiping services
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 183550 @ 0.00039151 = 71.8617 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 156572 @ 0.0003924 = 61.4389 BTC [+]
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 06:52:46; trinque: b-b-but my pulse!
kakobrekla: enjoyable logs tonite.
kakobrekla: they basically claim random ftw, which is lulzy
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66250 @ 0.00038908 = 25.7766 BTC [-]
thestringpuller: can coinbase and bitpay die already?
thestringpuller: << has deathandtaxes argument been discussed et?
jurov: adlai: if you have problems opening exchange account, maybe we can do it together. but i'm not touching btc-e or buttstamp
jurov: we can use paymium or maybe coinmate.. but dunno if it works with smaller volume
jurov: perhaps i can look into kraken
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39650 @ 0.00038908 = 15.427 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 102900 @ 0.0003877 = 39.8943 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16682 @ 0.00038366 = 6.4002 BTC [-]
PeterL: PeterL: is back up now
assbot: #bitcoin-assets blog posts ... ( )
lobbes: woo, finally got my VPS up and running. Now I just have to teach myself the basics of linux (Debian 7). So far I know how to view my current directory. Next step: running a node!
lobbes: plenty of comedy gold (tm) to follow
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 108650 @ 0.00038366 = 41.6847 BTC [-]
thestringpuller: PeterL: is scoopbot fetching again :P
PeterL: should be, I just restarted it a minute ago
PeterL: I'm not sure why he stops, but it seems to get fixed if I restart
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 101371 @ 0.00038759 = 39.2904 BTC [+] {2}
mike_c: PeterL: nice! i missed having that page.
asciilifeform: 282547.
mircea_popescu: like 5k over a day ?
jurov: insanity. this recipe properly downloads and checksums a gpg key for epel repository, and then happily uses another one
assbot: saltstack-formulas/epel-formula · GitHub ... ( )
jurov: like, no one looked at it before?
mircea_popescu: jurov o.O ?!
asciilifeform: Many Eyes (TM) !11!
PeterL: well now somebody found it, many eyes worked
mircea_popescu: i dunno of any "profession" "industree" etc ever in history of mankind to be so fucking... i don't even know. inconsistent ? mixed ?
mircea_popescu: not even medicine. not even religion.
mircea_popescu: PeterL i hope for the sake of your soul that you're being kako-level sarcastic.
PeterL: the profession of prostitute includes alot of fucking ...
jurov: PeterL: yes I found it..after half year
jurov: er.. one and half year
PeterL: I think I forgot my sarcasm tag somewhere
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28768 @ 0.00038366 = 11.0371 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: sarcasm tag's one history!
jurov: #devops at one's own peril
mircea_popescu: computers are evil, there's no two ways about it.
assbot: Swingers club adds councilwoman's picture to website ... ( )
punkman: swinger's club next to christian school campus, synergy!
mircea_popescu: "christisn school campus" wtf is that even
mircea_popescu: place for a bunch of derps to go and be all weird and pretend it's jesus' fault amirite.
assbot: Goodpasture Christian School | "Building confidence, intellectual growth, and spiritual strength." ... ( )
mircea_popescu: motherfucker. the cheek.
mircea_popescu: haha check out the almost-mscomic font.
punkman: running a node with this line removed: . works so far
assbot: Satoshi ... ( )
mircea_popescu: To see the cast list for Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat scroll down to the bottom of the page and click on the attatchment.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91900 @ 0.00038267 = 35.1674 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: !up Rippleflip_
mircea_popescu: !up BigBitz
mircea_popescu: i up noobs anyway ya know.
BigBitz: mircea_popescu opportunity of a lifetime coming up.
Rippleflip_: i have been forwarded here from #bitcoin-otc
Rippleflip_: we run and and are possibly selling these services
PeterL: who is we?
mircea_popescu: ripp, lef and lip
BigBitz: 1250BTC. Cheap.
chetty: how does one person typing use 'we' unless of course its a royal we
Rippleflip_: is valued at 2000 BTC
Rippleflip_: sorry chetty for my language
mircea_popescu: market-valued.
mircea_popescu: you know, kinda different story.
Rippleflip_: yes, i see.
mircea_popescu: so what do these do, exactly ? some sort of coin flip thing ?
Rippleflip_: yes. gambling.
BigBitz: mircea_popescu gambling for Stellar and Ripple.
mircea_popescu: and limited to ripple and "stellar", ie, two dead scamcoins ?
Rippleflip_: we have much indonesian speaking players
Rippleflip_: mircea_popescu: yes.
BigBitz: scamcoin 101.
BigBitz: pump. dump. run.
mircea_popescu: that's cool, but wh ydo you think the site's worth something in bitcoin ? neither ripple nor stellars are worth anything in bitcoin
mircea_popescu: how about 1250 ripples ? or 1250 stellars ?
Rippleflip_: mircea_popescu: we're open to offers but 1,250 BTC sounds reasonable to us.
mircea_popescu: let me guess, it would roughly repay what you think the valuable value of your time spent on it so far
mircea_popescu: plus perhaps a little something for the missus ?
BigBitz: Rippleflip_ I did offer 25 Doge.
Rippleflip_: mircea_popescu: i don't know. we set the price on the low end compared to other gambling site valuations
Rippleflip_: has been played significantly less than ours, yet it's valued at 2000
jurov: Rippleflip_: the valuations include the bankroll. but you are keeping the bankroll i presume
mircea_popescu: how do you figure significantly less ?!
jurov: and selling only code/domain
PeterL: do you have a report on monthly income produced over the past year?
Rippleflip_: jurov: the bankrolls we have are quite small
Rippleflip_: mircea_popescu: wagers per time
Rippleflip_: or just wagers.
mircea_popescu: nonono. wagers-time.
Rippleflip_: do your research please
assbot: Last 10 lines bashed and pending review. ( )
mircea_popescu: if someone puts 1 btc for 1 year on bitbet, and someone puts 1000 ripples for 10 seconds on your site,
mircea_popescu: you got 10k ripple seconds and bitbet got 31536000 bitcoin-seconds
Rippleflip_: mircea_popescu: i meant itself has been wagering more in 6 months than for example, bitbet all-time
mircea_popescu: see above.
punkman: 8million STR total profit = 134 BTC
mircea_popescu: ah now i see his logic. so
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 2000 / 21340 * 134
gribble: 12.5585754452
mircea_popescu: that's whence the 1250 comes from
mircea_popescu: can you even sell 10mn "stellar" without ruining the market permanently ?
mircea_popescu: where does it even trade these days ?
Rippleflip_: i assume it is possible.
thestringpuller: so why is this channel only boppin' when a nigga gotta put in work?
punkman: 3,595,158,975 stellars available now
BigBitz: 'assume' do your research, please.
Rippleflip_: at least. and inside network
mircea_popescu: well of coruse you'd assume, no doub on that socre.
thestringpuller: and not when you know I'm in a meeting trying to kill time.
mircea_popescu: oh inside network ?! nobody i know would touch it. inside of what ? got its own wot ?
Rippleflip_: mircea_popescu: you have to verify everything,, there is no point if i tell you
Rippleflip_: for serious inquiries please email us.
mircea_popescu: is stellar xmr ?
Rippleflip_: or pm here, both work.
BigBitz: selling 10M STR would destroy their market.
mircea_popescu: a no str
mircea_popescu: STR0.0000165463.358-2.88Stellar
mircea_popescu: STR0.003871110.080+0.10Stellar
mircea_popescu: so according to poloniex, 10 cents worth of stellar (at 0.004) and 64 bitcoins' worth of same (at 0.00whatever) sold in the past what is this, day ?
Rippleflip_: looks like that
mircea_popescu: seems it only exists to trade xmr this thing, since styill spends 90% of the page listing the xmr market. weird.
assbot: Poloniex - Bitcoin/Cryptocurrency Exchange ... ( )
mircea_popescu: fluffypony is this poloniex thing your folks' ?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: no
mircea_popescu: where is the official place to trade monero ?
fluffypony: that has the most liquidity
fluffypony: hitbtc is most probably a scam so I'd avoid that
mircea_popescu: "24hr Volume: 646.141 BTC / 195.554 XMR / 2838.69 XUSD" nuts.
mircea_popescu: if this liquidity is natural i'll eat my hat. for one thing, the people interested in alts are interested in alts specifically because they're bitcoin poor. to propose to me that they are 100x more likely to trade btc than usd seems beyond counterintuitive.
fluffypony: there's a shitload of liquidity in alts
fluffypony: because it's a circle of scams
fluffypony: scammers scamming scammers
mircea_popescu: well, web people love that "hyip" thing
fluffypony: they make hundreds of BTC on one scam, then lose half of it to another scam the next day
fluffypony: yeah they do
fluffypony: that's why PoS is a "thing"
fluffypony: the new altcoin PoS scam is "hyperinflation"
fluffypony: they had MMXIV with 2014% staking
mircea_popescu: kinda what the web even exists these days. for people like mako to be all fucking weird (they call it "altrusitic" of course - )
assbot: The Institute for Cultural Diplomacy and Wikipedia | copyrighteous ... ( )
fluffypony: and now some 10 000% staking coin
mircea_popescu: and for other people to be all like "I MAKE MONEY WHILE YOIU SLEEP!!11"
mircea_popescu: what is this staking ?
fluffypony: you basically just have to have the wallet open
fluffypony: and then your coins add to the "stake weight"
mircea_popescu: wow, realsolid's idea ?
fluffypony: so no mining, just wallets "staking" and earning "interest" for it
fluffypony: no, PeerCoin
mircea_popescu: nah, this was solidcoin
fluffypony: Sunny King or whatever his name is
mircea_popescu: if you look, throughout 2011/12 some mentally deficient dank clone spent his time producing prose (not so different from the gavincoin crapolade) professionally explaining how bitcoin is obsolete
mircea_popescu: and now solidcoin is here to stay!!1
mircea_popescu: then artforz found it had a hole, and then it changed to having 12 magic nodes with 10 mn "unspendable" coins each
mircea_popescu: which then got spent.
fluffypony: ok not sure about SolidCoin, but PeerCoin's whitepaper is from August 2012
fluffypony: it may have been influenced by ideas RealScammer had
mircea_popescu: pretty sure realsolid was the first altscammer.
fluffypony: PPCoin wasn't meant to be a scam
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: freicoin is PoS
fluffypony: I think King and Nadal genuinely wanted to find an alternative to PoS
fluffypony: agh, to PoW I mean
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75308 @ 0.00039026 = 29.3897 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Do YOU want RealSolid to be lead developer( of solidcoin)? ... ( )
mircea_popescu: well there's a difference between wanting and trying things out you know. i also want to find a cure for cancer, but i'm not going around feeding people pills.
the_scourge: fluffypony: there was a post about possible PoS vulnerabilities written by Vitalik. for what his opinion is worth
fluffypony: the_scourge: PoS is not a terrible idea, it just doesn't work
the_scourge: fluffypony: you may very well be right. what are the top reasons why not?
fluffypony: the_scourge: Vitalik's approach to solving anything is to layer complexity on top, his Delegated PoS thing is just ugh
the_scourge: 'cause reasons like 'keeping it anonymous AND democratic' don't fly for me anymore. butterin is worried about democracy or whatever, i'm past that point
mircea_popescu: this is pretty much the "us academia" solution to everything. "make it more complicated, people won't notice"
the_scourge: the freicoin solution is shockingly simple. my mind appreciates that :D
thestringpuller: Is ethereum not dead yet?
fluffypony: the_scourge: Poelstra's write-up is normally my go-to when PoS comes up in convo:
the_scourge: put a fork in it
mircea_popescu: pretty much born out of their poverty years, each academic spent some time going "well if i think of it really complicatedly, i won't be so hungry anymore and those won't really be cockroaches"
the_scourge: fluffypony: thanks
fluffypony: he updates it regularly
mircea_popescu: he upgrades a pdf regularly ?
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: this reminds me of conversation we had of Grad students being pimped out.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller you'll have to link a logline.
Rippleflip_: PeterL: no. it's also worth nothing if we make it. potential buyer has to do the research. we can of course give you data
thestringpuller: Yay markov chains!
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: yeah, he has it in git if you want to step back to previous versions
fluffypony: 6.4 is the section where he rips PoS a new one
PeterL: Rippleflip_: what's worth nothing?
mircea_popescu: you know the guy ?
Rippleflip_: PeterL: the info we give to you.
PeterL: where else would info come from?
Rippleflip_: PeterL: it is all 100% verifiable from public ledger
Rippleflip_: the ledger.
the_scourge: fluffypony: is apoelstra his github account?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: he's attached to the Monero Research Lab as one of the MRL Friends, so he's participated in some of the Schnorr signature multi-sig discussions we've had
Rippleflip_: well, a bit over 20000 unique players, over 1,5 million usd wagered (possibly over 2 million with bitcoin value being higher in the past)
fluffypony: the_scourge: yes
the_scourge: fluffypony: i'm intruiged by his ideas and would like to subscribe to his newsletter
Rippleflip_: been operating with the same engine for over 1.5 years
assbot: apoelstra (Andrew Poelstra) · GitHub ... ( )
mircea_popescu: srsly, "Textual enumeration of incentives related to Bitcoin software." ?!
fluffypony: the_scourge: he doesn't have a newsletter
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell kanzure saw your enumeration incentives thing. lolz were had.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
the_scourge: fuck another canadian expat. we are fucking awesome
mircea_popescu: Rippleflip_ you know, the only moral here is that spending 1.5 years outside of the wot essentially cost you 1250 btc
mircea_popescu: or w/e chance at that you might have built over the 1.5 years in question.
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: is that incentives whitepaper actualy kanzure ?
mircea_popescu: the_scourge i would imagine so, and if not i'll soon find out.
mircea_popescu: !up Rippleflip_
Rippleflip_: thanks
Rippleflip_: mircea_popescu: we will of course use escrow with the buyer
Rippleflip_: so i do not see it essential to being in the WoT
mircea_popescu: heh mkay.
Rippleflip_: #bitcoin-otc laughed at the pricing of 1,250. is it really too much?
mircea_popescu: fluffypony got a link to the actual github in question ?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: I already told him that when he joined -otc nearly two hours ago
Rippleflip_: fluffypony: told me what?
the_scourge is reading whitepapers but would like to pause and say that maybe alf is right, intelligence and creativity are orthoganal to complexity
mircea_popescu: Rippleflip_ to put it plainly : someone who does not see being in wot as esential can not possible have yet done anything whatsoever worth any amount at all, in crypto.
Rippleflip_: mircea_popescu: i do have wot...
mircea_popescu: !gettrust Rippleflip_
assbot: Rippleflip_ is not registered in WoT.
Rippleflip_: look without _
fluffypony: !gettrust Rippleflip
assbot: Rippleflip is not registered in WoT.
fluffypony: guess not
Rippleflip: try DaleC
thestringpuller: !gettrust DaleC
assbot: Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user DaleC: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | |
thestringpuller: !gettrust assbot DaleC
assbot: Trust relationship from user assbot to user DaleC: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | |
fluffypony: !gettrust DaleC
assbot: Trust relationship from user fluffypony to user DaleC: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | |
mircea_popescu: ;;google Tim Swanson
gribble: No, you don't have something to say on the topic. pe Trilema - Un ...: <>; The thorny problem of violence, or the miracle of the talking ass. pe ...: <>; The witch hunt pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: (1 more message)
fluffypony: sorry Daley
mircea_popescu: Rippleflip tom swanson famously argued the same stuff, from perhaps a better position than you'll find yourself in.
mircea_popescu: actually was it tim. yeah it was tim.
Rippleflip: alright
Rippleflip: anyway, over 1 year in wot already :)
mircea_popescu: so now : take that website, give it away or whatever, go to read the logs for the next year or so.
mircea_popescu: after which, come back, do something useful with your time, that'll actually be worth money.
Rippleflip: thanks for your advice.
mircea_popescu: cheerios.
thestringpuller: he didn't even charge you Rippleflip
thestringpuller: What a nice guy!
the_scourge: would this be a good time to talk about how the mud pie fallacy is VERY apropos :)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 106086 @ 0.0003924 = 41.6281 BTC [+]
the_scourge: i actually wish there was a marxist around to make it. at this very instant. < speaking of making things insanely complex
fluffypony: lol the_scourge
mircea_popescu: the_scourge myeah. << romanians have the same problem, if it helps anything.
assbot: Capitalism si naivitate. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( )
mircea_popescu: in any case it indicates it's a fallacy older than feudalism.
the_scourge: well it's true. my dad was smart enough to say shit like 'it doesn't matter how hard your working if the thing you're working on is useless', and yet today the highest academics actually think that this universal gnon rule can be broken because they invented more complexity?
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: will google translate do that justice?
mircea_popescu: it is more a function of people being removed from the means of production than anything. no living thing will ever accept its pointlessness. as such, cargo cults and mud pies everywhere.
mircea_popescu: the_scourge from experience, not even human translation by billingual hands do my prose justice.
mircea_popescu: i mostly link it to torture people.
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: mission accomplished. i'm going back to reading that whitepaper
mircea_popescu: fluffypony srsly, got a link to the whitepaper's github ? guy's tree's gnarly.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: I've pinged him to ask where it is
mircea_popescu: !gettrust assbot BigBitz
assbot: Trust relationship from user assbot to user BigBitz: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 3 via 3 connections. | |
mircea_popescu: !up BigBitz
mircea_popescu: you know how to voice ?
BigBitz: Yeah.
BigBitz: I just don't have my key on this terminal.
BigBitz: I am authed with gribble :)
BigBitz: ;;ident
gribble: Nick 'BigBitz', with hostmask 'BigBitz!~BigBitz@unaffiliated/bigbitz', is identified as user 'BigBitz', with GPG key id AB6B34E4289B7F96, key fingerprint E6D96C3A035A057AD9DD8A9DAB6B34E4289B7F96, and bitcoin address 1BigBitzyouKT2eVYvHbRUNMkCp9bvAvSu
mircea_popescu: kk jus checking.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: it's at git://
fluffypony: so no pretty github interface, but git works fine
mircea_popescu: curl: (1) Protocol git not supported or disabled in libcurl
mircea_popescu: a kind soul with git installed pls dpaste that shit sometime ty.
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: nix-env -i git-all
the_scourge: "Finally, it should be mentioned that developer-signed blocks are known in the PoS community as
the_scourge: checkpoints. This is a very misleading name because it is already used to describe an anti-denial-of-
the_scourge: service measure of Bitcoin’s peer-to-peer network; Bitcoin’s checkpoints have nothing whatsoever
the_scourge: to do with consensus."
the_scourge: erg sorry for multi line but this does not explain why peercoin's checkpoints won't work. we should call them something else if the word is causing a problem in discussing it
fluffypony: the_scourge: because with Bitcoin checkpoints are optional, and won't be needed eventually. with PeerCoin they will always be needed (for pure PoS).
fluffypony: otherwise they're open to stake-grinding attacks the minute they take them away
fluffypony: whereas with Bitcoin if you remove the checkpoints nobody has enough hashing power to be able to rewrite history back several thousand blocks
fluffypony: or wherever the last checkpoint was
mircea_popescu: in other words : in bitcoin checkpoints exist mostly because the protocol is strong, and the power rangers are trying to leech strength to prop their own shitty code.
mircea_popescu: in ppcoin they exist because the protocol is very weak, even weaker than the code,
mircea_popescu: and the local power rangers are trying to prop both by fiat.
mircea_popescu: (ie, their own trust)
the_scourge: at some point, the checkpoints in ppcoin won't be needed
punkman: when it's dead?
the_scourge: 'cause the coin-days of legitimate holders will far exceed whatever a grinder could possibly come up with
the_scourge: i don't see very much difference between that and PoW blockchains which have vulnerabilities early on, and can't be truly invulnerable until legitimate mining is consuming 51% of the earth's electricity
the_scourge: until that point, it's still just probability
mircea_popescu: you're committing the shaman mistake. that is to say, the mistake to believe categories in your mind have objective substance.
the_scourge: ppcoin is more of an agorist/WoT effort to get past that post. more activity, more coin-days, more legitimate: less chance of a grinding attack. until that point, you're hoping that the highly improbable does't happen. how is that different?
mircea_popescu: there's no such thing as a "legitimate holder"
the_scourge: WoT is proof that there is 'legitimate holder', n'est pas?
mircea_popescu: it's a post hoc determination, and for this reason can not be used in any phenomena discussion.
mircea_popescu: the difference from the wot is actually quite instructive. in the wot, one is at the liberty to consider history, but in no sense required to do so. in your model, one automatically is held to consider history. it's true that they both to some degree rely on the continuation fallacy,
mircea_popescu: however once that's automatic everything changes. which is why the wot can not be automated.
the_scourge: automated can mean 2 things: 1. reduce the roteness, man the hard things easy 2. skynet
the_scourge: and considering i'm a NRx'er, i'm pretty sure i'm for the former and against the latter
the_scourge: *an NRx'er
mircea_popescu: i dunno what most of these are.
the_scourge: NRx is just shorthand for neoreaction
mircea_popescu: like shorthand for "yarvin's readership" ?
the_scourge: but basically, post-libertarianism. therefore bitcoin is designed with the wrong assumptions about society. it's designed by progressives. every person in the world born after 1805 is a progressive, more or less
the_scourge: i think it's a misconception that yarvin started NRx or even is/was a leader in any way. he's a good writer. he is NRx, yes
mircea_popescu: can youstick to one nonsequitur per paragraph, instead of one per sentence.
mircea_popescu: nobody can chase an explosion of rabbits.
the_scourge: please point them out, i'll not say a word in the meantime
mircea_popescu: so let's leave aside the "therefore" bitcoin this and that, as i dun have the energy. instead, re "nrx" : i have little doubt that there are some kids in the us that thought the one repackaging of stuff they ran across is somehow more significant than all the repackagings they don't know, and definitely more significant than the originals. and that they need a name and so on. this exercise in nominalism does not instit
mircea_popescu: ute them as important, contrary to the tenets of the us religion of marketing.
mircea_popescu: so i'm not too inclined to see any of these lables as anything more than "ignorant kids from the us web". be it "nrx" or "neoreaction" or etc.
mircea_popescu: now, that make any sense ?
mircea_popescu: ok. this much given, it can never be denied that the repackager of any one is, for all purposes, the 'leader'.
mircea_popescu: the entire thing having no further substance past repackaging, obviously the coca cola company is the coca cola thing, and yarvin is the "nrx" thing.
mircea_popescu: that much make sense ?
the_scourge: uh, about my first yes, i should have said i understood where you're coming from, but i'm not sure you're observations are at all correct. on the second yes, you're very much wrong
the_scourge: *second ... checkpoint :)
mircea_popescu: so then on the 2nd, "no, you're very much wrong"
assbot: The World’s Email Encryption Software Relies on One Guy, Who is Going Broke - ProPublica ... ( )
mircea_popescu: fluffypony reheheheally.
fluffypony: thought it might be slightly relevant
mircea_popescu: fuck him, after gpg2 i'm happy to hear.
fluffypony: omfg wikipedia is down
the_scourge: fluffypony: it is relevant. this is another sign that society will colapse and i and many others were TOTALLY misguided on many thing in the last days of the empire
fluffypony: err'one panci
fluffypony: *panic
the_scourge: well who didn't pay them
fluffypony: the_scourge: I think we're going to end up like the people in Wall-E
the_scourge raises hand < don't call me a prick, no one else did
the_scourge: fluffypony: never seen it, would idiocracy be a similar example?
the_scourge: la wik is up again
fluffypony: oh my
fluffypony: let me see if there's a snippet
assbot: Wall-E Fat People - YouTube ... ( )
assbot: Wall-E Script at IMSDb. ... ( )
assbot: Wall-E ... Social Media funny fat people - YouTube ... ( )
mircea_popescu: Warning: mysql_select_db() expects parameter 2 to be resource, boolean given in /home/imsdb/public_html/dbscon.php on line 5 << ahaha epic
the_scourge fires up tribler, i think mrs scourge would enjoy that one!
punkman: yarvin is the "nrx" thing. <- if not yarvin, who?
the_scourge: there are hundreds of writers. probably thousands like myself who haven't got a public profile.
the_scourge: do you want me to start rattling off urls?
mircea_popescu: by all means.
punkman: there is the LessWrong crowd, and the guy that left to make MoreRight
mircea_popescu: last time intel got the job to diagnose this (after princessnell brought it up) it turned out there's maybe a few dozen blogs, all dead.
punkman: but yarvin pretty much came up with the term "neoreactionary"
punkman: I'm sure there's a whole bunch of "writers" that saw "NRx" and thought "hey, Rx is the good stuff right"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 121189 @ 0.00039296 = 47.6224 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: actually it wouldn't surpriose me to find that's the process through which it was invented. all like nlp and shit, yarvin sat down and figured hey, this is going to positively attract the esl retards.
mircea_popescu: (where esl = english as a sole language)
fluffypony twitches every time he sees "nlp"
punkman: hey nlp is natural language processing, good stuff
fluffypony: hah hah
mircea_popescu: nlp is like, "the law of attaction", before it was dumbed down for daytime tv.
mircea_popescu: nlp/tloa
the_scourge: nick land, freenortherner, dalrock, sunshinemary,, anarchopapist, anomalyUK, cappy (captain capitalism) < all these have posts within the last week or less
mircea_popescu: there's something to be said for a society so dumb, even the scams have to be dumbed down lower and lower each generation.
punkman: the_scourge: well now it's "cool" to write about it
mircea_popescu: and the something that's to be said is : hory shit that puts isis, china and everyone else in a bad light
assbot: Harald Eia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( )
mircea_popescu: whoa that guy looks sXe
assbot: Spending all your time figuring out what kind of “-ism” you and your friends believe in so that you can call each other “whatever-ists” is no way to improve the world. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( )
pete_dushenski: some of your fellow nx'ers picked up on an article of mine
pete_dushenski: nick land kicked it off
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski the proposition that kids should (or want to) "improve the world" is untenable.
mircea_popescu: they are busy with much more suited tasks : picking a group and figuring the hierarchy.
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: are you ?
mike_c: but that title :D awesome.
mircea_popescu: mike_c that it is :D
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: lol i guess so
punkman: maybe "improve your world"
mircea_popescu: but it IS a perfectly valid if not the only available means for them to improve hteir world.
pete_dushenski: but from the perspective of reality-divorced idealists...
mircea_popescu: a while back they could also improve it by handing out at elbow of papa while papa worked
mircea_popescu: but now that's illegal.
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: mhm tis i
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski anyway, it's actually been in the logs.
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: well poseidon isn't wrong you are reactionary
assbot: 10 results for 'nrx' :
pete_dushenski: mike_c: ha ya i went for an mp-esque long one there
mircea_popescu: !s neoreaction
assbot: 9 results for 'neoreaction' :
punkman: !s moldbug
assbot: 103 results for 'moldbug' :
mircea_popescu: ah there we go, it's right, i forgot it indexes after a delay.
assbot: Logged on 05-05-2014 01:39:07; mircea_popescu: i also picked up "nrx" today
the_scourge: i agree with everyone's sentiment regarding hipsters trying to figure out what ism they are. as someone who's had to earn all his priviledge, i went to uni with such people but cannot relate to them much. however didn't we just tell mr BigBitz and partner that it doesn't matter how hard you work, if you're working on the wrong thing?
assbot: Spending all your time figuring out what kind of “-ism” you and your friends believe in so that you can call each other “whatever-ists” is no way to improve the world. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( )
mircea_popescu: the_scourge so how do these two come together in your reasoning there ?
mircea_popescu: !up BigBitz
the_scourge: right, so we know that working on a stupid protocol or technology is just wasting time. what about working within a social framework which is even more broken?
BigBitz: You told me, what?
BigBitz: the_scourge ... ?
mircea_popescu: the_scourge but you see the difference between working on and working within ?
the_scourge: BigBitz: sorry, was it your friend Rippleflip who was the proprietor of those sites
mircea_popescu: like, working on a mud pie is stupid, working in a badly designed house may or may not be stupid ?
BigBitz: my friend, lol.
BigBitz: No.
BigBitz: I have no idea who he is. I banned him from -otc originally.
BigBitz: don't associate me with him ;)
the_scourge: oh! ... i joined today at the point where you said "opportunity of a lifetime" < perhaps slightly /sarc ? :)
BigBitz: massively.
the_scourge: BigBitz: i won't, sorry!
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: i can see the difference
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell pete_dushenski if you got the guy's email by virtue of him commenting, and you don't mind, drop him a note saying i loathe blogspot, but if he has time drop by for a chat.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
the_scourge: i think "badly designed" might be giving too much credence
mircea_popescu: the_scourge the standing advice for all usians has been "get the fuck out of the us" for at least a year.
mircea_popescu: some people listen, most don't, which hey. sounds almost like irl.
mircea_popescu: the jews found themselves in a similar situation all through the 30s.
mircea_popescu: (and in this perspective, the holocaust is proper and well deserved fucking punishment. next time - listen better.)
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: good advice but as a non-USian who has spent 90% of his life outside the US and 100% of his adult life outside of N/A, and has lived in non-western places as well, i think there could be something said for living for a short while in california or new england
mircea_popescu: yeah, but in the 90s.
mircea_popescu: mebbe 00s.
the_scourge: why? the cracks weren't as obvious then
the_scourge: i lived in socal in mid-90s. i could see them, but they were not obvious
the_scourge: i think a teenager today would find them obvious.
mircea_popescu: kinda the proof that it's too late.
the_scourge: too late to prepare?
mircea_popescu: no, too late to bother visiting.
the_scourge: why would you go other than to see the cracks and be warned?
mircea_popescu: the only reason one'd ever go to either republic, would be to fuck college girls.
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: definitely. i'm answering one of his comments right now, as it so happens
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 15:41:29; punkman: running a node with this line removed: . works so far
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: you seem to have read some of nick land
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: a handful, sure
pete_dushenski: i think i referenced another one of his articles in the comments section of that first one
pete_dushenski: it wasn't half-bad
pete_dushenski: some strong points, some weaker ones
assbot: Spending all your time figuring out what kind of “-ism” you and your friends believe in so that you can call each other “whatever-ists” is no way to improve the world. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( )
the_scourge: lol but you quote moldbug as nick land!
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: ^ fix that quick!
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: lol read more closely
pete_dushenski: i said that it was nick's article
pete_dushenski: on his blog, not that he was the author of the points
pete_dushenski: nick calls it "his manifesto"
the_scourge: ok fine
the_scourge: what....
the_scourge: really?
pete_dushenski: "If there is a ‘we’ — this is what we believe." <<
pete_dushenski: if that's not a manifesto...
mircea_popescu: it seems to me this entire "we" whatever it is, if it had any sense whatever, would show up here.
mircea_popescu: it's unclear if we politically agree or not, but it is not yet in any sense clear we disagree to any degree, and more importantly, we have nuclear weapons.
mircea_popescu: they do not.
mircea_popescu: so in the sense western "intellectuals" migrated to russia in the 30s, they're stuck migrating here anyway.
assbot: On pretending “Googling” is still a thing that works any more than “USG” | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( )
the_scourge: oh yah he takes it as a manifesto. obviously my reaction would only be for those who are meticulously combing through UR, and haven't even bothered to have a gander at xenosystems yet
mircea_popescu: "What is this? The first*, the biggest** and the best*** IRC community." kakobrekla you sly* dog** you*** :D
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: this exactly. twas my comment about nrx not grokking economics, money, and the fundaments of power
kakobrekla: mircea_popescu see footnotes :p
mircea_popescu: night's still young
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla o i have :)
kakobrekla: a ok:)
mircea_popescu: "Say what?" < can this be "Say what? << Read this. Now."
assbot: #bitcoin-assets log ... ( )
the_scourge: the question is, have NRx found out that we actually live in a world where 'nuclear' weapons don't do anything? that's potentially one of the corellaries to the entire argument
mircea_popescu: mod6: looks like 'i've only got 1: blk0001.dat, 985Mb <<< heh how about that, first 168k blocks fit in 1gb, the next 168k blocks fit in 35 gb.
mircea_popescu: if the next 168k blocks fit in 1.25 tb we're so fucked...
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: i've read more xeno that ur, it so happens
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: and nuclear weapons most definitely do something
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> chick's so drastically ugly tho... << pretty indicative of the tail to which us brass has access << kinda my supposition yeah. kinda sad if true. the competition to be him is at least 100k to 1. the competition to be her ? it's like superunitary, 0.x to 1.
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: ah that explains my crossed wires
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski which is this xeno thing it seems familiar somehow
pete_dushenski: we're essentially assembled here to make sure wmds do something productive
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: Everyone who wanted qntra to have a category page << remove the <li>, separate them by ; instead ?
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: nick land's blog. what first put me on to "nrx" as per
assbot: Outside in - Involvements with reality » Blog Archive » Quote note (#144) ... ( )
mircea_popescu: oh now i know whence i know him, he linked to me a few times.
mircea_popescu: !s nick land
assbot: 4 results for 'nick land' :
pete_dushenski: not hugely surprising
pete_dushenski: that he STILL hasn't showed up here... is
mircea_popescu: Bitcoin address: 18YKtNeAy43kFVBzynHeusiaiiAa8pCZFP no less.
pete_dushenski: how long do people have to admire from a distance before talking to the pretty girl ?
pete_dushenski: particularly when the pretty girl is friendly and open to conversation like 20/24 hrs every day
assbot: Bitcoin Address 18YKtNeAy43kFVBzynHeusiaiiAa8pCZFP ... ( )
pete_dushenski: on a digital forum where you don't even need to fuss about body language
ben_vulpes: <kakobrekla> [] < did no such thing << my mistake, figured it out
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 06:53:48; ben_vulpes: i know you don't like the guy, but nuking his record?
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: because most don't quite understand the point. i kinda get the perceived problem (thanks to alf) but the solution, while cool, hasn't struck me as nuclear (yet)
ben_vulpes: anyways, good morning
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski you were on twatter right ?
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: yep
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: morning!
mircea_popescu: ask @Outsideness if he still has the priv key to that bitcoin addy ?
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: it does take a significant amount of interest in investing, monetary history, politics, to grasp
trinque: anybody know how to tell btcd to start from a previous block and re-generate the rest?
trinque: that fuss about orphan blocks in btcd's log the other day was a jacked drive, killed 3 ldb files out of 15k
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron <command-line>:0:0: warning: "_FORTIFY_SOURCE" redefined << that doesn't sound so good.
mircea_popescu: somehow running a duplicate along with the original or something ?
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: yah, i thought i had a modicum of those things and while i totally grasp it, my age + intution is doing this thing saying: it would never pan out like that anyways"
assbot: Hey /Outsideness, I'm curious: do you still have the private key for this address ?
danielpbarron: mircea_popescu, that's a compilation error
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: huh funny thing that intuition sometimes
pete_dushenski: mine told me the exact opposite
mircea_popescu: the_scourge the nuclear part is explained here :
assbot: Logged on 21-01-2015 23:53:56; mircea_popescu: jurov for what it's worth, here's my experience with bitcoin remittances : i sent btc to otc correspondents, ordered wires sent out to the hk account of my local agent, who has paid me dollars, in cash, in argentina. the entire process took less than what it takes to get a letter of credit, and significantly less than what international trade normally settles in.
danielpbarron: and it turns out there's an error before that one; currently trying to compile as root in case it's something i messed up with the cross compiler install
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: but i need to formulate my concerns. it's mostly to do with ... if you've succeeded in preserving a clean, elegant, un-pwnable bitcoind variant, then all the poser cyperpunks GTFO, leaving only a small minority of (VERY valuable BTC) who are then in a VERY phys-sec vulnerable position
the_scourge: but i need to write this out in a better way ^
the_scourge: reading link
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: ya the "phys-sec" thing is something i've heard about for years and years now
pete_dushenski: to which bitcoin responds: 1) deniability, and 2) fuck you
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski yeah. me too. specifically : here. most recently,
assbot: Logged on 31-01-2015 01:25:17; mircea_popescu: so no, when i'm talking about hanging each and every us bureaucrat, through a war crimes court, within our lifetime i am not being in any sense and to any degree metaphorical.
assbot: Georg Ritter von Flondor, and what his unhappy life can teach us pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( )
pete_dushenski: did the kings and aristocrats that nrx'ers so rose-tintedly adore stay under their sheets all day ?
mircea_popescu: anyway : the only people in a very untenable phys-sec position are the various bureaucrats, us or otherwise.
pete_dushenski: so why would we, their heirs ?
mircea_popescu: we'll be fine.
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: it's worth noting that most people "in bitcoin" tremble in fear a lot
the_scourge: reading
pete_dushenski: mostly because that's what they've always done
the_scourge: woah deja vue
pete_dushenski: this is where we flip the table and say, "now hold on just a minute. if we have the power, and we do, who should be scared of who now?"
the_scourge: i remember seeing that war crimes comment a LONG time ago
the_scourge: and i'm pretty sure i came in here to ask about it...
pete_dushenski: hang out here long enough and your fears about phys-sec (and most other things) slowly dissipate
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: 'the new state-of-the-art destroyer << is this the story that late bogart film was based on ? "mutiny on the bounty" i think it was called.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1700 @ 0.00096968 = 1.6485 BTC [+] {6}
mircea_popescu: the_scourge if you did log probably has the line somewhere.
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: what... how are we the heirs???
mircea_popescu: jews don't understand this heritage concept like normal people.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52100 @ 0.00039193 = 20.4196 BTC [-]
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: i suppose this is another admonition not to use "we"
the_scourge: ok hang on. are you REALLY saying that greed is more powerful and delusion (or religion)? because if you want to buy hitmen or hold the entire world ransom to a dirty bomb or nuclear warheads, you're going to 1. have to find really fucking greedy nuclear engineers and/or suicide bombers and/or military guys
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: when you plug a lamp into a mains socket, is that also a 'streaming query' ? << win :D
the_scourge: *that delusion or religion
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: lol so it would seem
mircea_popescu: the_scourge you don't understand how the world works :)
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: have you ever seen someone explode themselves to influence the course of history? i have, in person
the_scourge: it wasn't for bitcoin or fiat
mircea_popescu: this is not what's being discussed. you proceed from the naive locus where the bureaucrat somehow= the entire world.
the_scourge: an btw the progressive delusion is FAR more powerful that the allah delusion, it's more craft and more sublte
mircea_popescu: nothing can be further from the truth.
mircea_popescu: the only subhuman profession is bureaucracy.
mircea_popescu: there's no need to hold anyone hostage to enact a public gutting of government servants.
mircea_popescu: it's their natural fate.
the_scourge: dude i am arguing the exact opposite. the beueaucrat has NOT power whatsoever. that is the entire point
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: i'd say allah's been around longer so... lindy effect
mircea_popescu: cool. so they're getting it.
mircea_popescu: <mircea_popescu> anyway : the only people in a very untenable phys-sec position are the various bureaucrats, us or otherwise. <<
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26750 @ 0.00039193 = 10.4841 BTC [-]
the_scourge: right, but the religionists might defend them (or their right to a trial) to the death
mircea_popescu: see also the always popular
mircea_popescu: !s we know where you live
assbot: 4 results for 'we know where you live' :
mircea_popescu: sure sure, or else jesus might visit.
pete_dushenski: ...assuming "progressives" are in the french revolutionary vein
the_scourge: i don't understand waht that has to do with it
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: they all are
the_scourge: it's homogenous, this is provable
mircea_popescu: i guess then it will get proven.
mircea_popescu: anyway, tell gavin i'm off to eat.
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: all = modern only. rousseau didn't invent socialism
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: sure, i'll pick it up later, remember your question
the_scourge: all = the ones we have to worry about
pete_dushenski: perhaps, but not the only ones to learn from
pete_dushenski: and it's not clear to me that religionists are going to risk their necks for paper-pushers
the_scourge: wait, are you suggesting that socialism isn't part of The Cathedral?
pete_dushenski: tc being... ?
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: by religionists, i mean atheists
pete_dushenski: meh "atheists" are just as religious as the next
pete_dushenski: their alter is scientism
the_scourge: no, we need to end this conv.
the_scourge: because that's not what i mean at all.
the_scourge: er.. not end, just pause for a sec
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: if you read how dawkins got pwned, then you'll understand what i mean by religionists
pete_dushenski: dawkins got pwned ?
pete_dushenski is ignorant of this
the_scourge: actually to be honest you really need to the gentle introduction and take the red pill, do the original sources on the revolutionary war, then read the dawkins stuff, then 'open letter'
assbot: Unqualified Reservations: How Dawkins got pwned (part 1) ... ( )
chetty: so what ya'll think about the 'journalist' caught in the big lie? will it help people 'get it' about the news?
the_scourge: chetty: are you talking about CHris Kyle? ... i guess he is a 'journalist' lol
pete_dushenski: The God delusion is a parasitic meme because, being alien to reason, it does not serve the interests of the host. << utter nonsense
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: explain?
pete_dushenski: that's quite specifically what religion is for: coping, thus survival
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: you've obviously not aquainted yourself with NRx at all. if you chose to read a little and open your mind, it will hurt for several days
the_scourge: but yes, we have all been taught our whole lives that religion is for coping, atheists worship 'science', etc etc
the_scourge: trust me, those assertions seem like total nonsense to me now, even though i fully believed them as recently as 3 weeks ago
the_scourge was a total progressive. a libertarian, tory, ancap progressive
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: are you american?
pete_dushenski: whatever is was, it got you here right?
pete_dushenski: the_scourge: i'm in edmonton. and iirc you're in canada too
mike_c: <+the_scourge> trust me, those assertions seem like total nonsense to me now, even though i fully believed them as recently as 3 weeks ago << imagine what you'll whole heartedly believe a month from now!
the_scourge: mike_c: i'm starting to think that i've taken a pill which ran an end-run around #b-a ... not sure yet
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: oh yah cool BC is my stomping grounds but i worked in eddyville for a few summers
pete_dushenski: the summer's the time to be here :)
chetty: <the_scourge> chetty: are you talking about CHris Kyle? ... i guess he is a 'journalist' lol// no Brian Williams
trinque: +the_scourge | mike_c: i'm starting to think that i've taken a pill which ran an end-run around #b-a ... not sure yet << I came for the bitcoin, stayed for the mindfuck
chetty: <trinque> +the_scourge | mike_c: i'm starting to think that i've taken a pill which ran an end-run around #b-a ... not sure yet << I came for the bitcoin, stayed for the mindfuck// aren't they the same thing?
the_scourge: trinque: ok, having experienced both, i'm pretty sure old moldbug is a much better mindfuck
punkman: contemplation takes time
punkman: pill taking not encouraged
the_scourge: i agree the perspective here is refreshing and contrarian
the_scourge: but it only goes halfway
pete_dushenski: kinda soon to make that call neh?
ben_vulpes: hey so why did the hipster burn himself on his coffee?
lobbes: he drank it before it was cool
trinque: heyooo
mircea_popescu: anyway, where were we.
ben_vulpes: ka-zing
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: we were halfway...
the_scourge: pete_dushenski: probably, yes. i do like to hear things out. but i wish it was more prosaic in this case!
pete_dushenski: ah but then you'd miss out on the mosaic!
the_scourge: obviously not everyone in the world enjoys prose, otherwise everyone in the world would agree with modlbug that atheists worship equality, not science
mircea_popescu: the_scourge: wait, are you suggesting that socialism isn't part of The Cathedral? << a) "the cathedral" is about as solid a concept as moldbug's new os.
the_scourge does not want mosaics, he wants answers. diversity is for suckers
mircea_popescu: b) not really worth going into after that.
the_scourge: explain why the concept does not reflect reality
chetty: <the_scourge> obviously not everyone in the world enjoys prose, otherwise everyone in the world would agree with modlbug that atheists worship equality, not science// atheists worship not worshiping
the_scourge: er, please explain :)
mircea_popescu: im sorry, i don't do that. if you wish to use it, introduce it. as per
assbot: How to deal with pseudoscience ? pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( )
mircea_popescu: yarvin doesn't get an out of jail free card just because he is "with us", as opposed to whoever, golf club pattern proponent
mircea_popescu: they're just as much pseudo, the political motivation of pseudoscience makes not on wit of difference.
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: if you want a first principles argument for the existence of the cathedral, that has been given already. i'm not going to repeat it in an IRC channel. everyone knows where to find it, i'm just wondering why you in particular haven't looked at it
the_scourge: if it helps, let me vouch that it IS first principles and it is worthy of your time
the_scourge: brb, eating
mircea_popescu: well so then there the conversation ends. you are a believer in some strange notions that don't carry currency here.
mircea_popescu: not teh first, not teh last, nothing wrong with it.
mod6: <+punkman> running a node with this line removed: . works so far << check out this patch:
assbot: Satoshi ... ( )
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: ok it wasn't quite ready. it's not a strange notion what can be argued from first principles. i'm agreeing with your post
mircea_popescu: not like there's any rush. the logs stretch endlessly.
the_scourge: the part about the socialist professors and their books rings esp. true. what you fail to realize is that everything YOU believe falls into the same category (minus the stuff which can be argued from first principles)
the_scourge: it = supper
the_scourge: so what carries currency here does not matter. reality matters. that is it. we've been living in a suspension of reality for at least 300 years, so i'm not surprised that our conversation is missing each other
pete_dushenski grabs popcorn
mircea_popescu: well if what carries currency here doens't matter, why are you talking ?
mircea_popescu: dun waste your time, you don't have so much of it. go do something that matters somewhere where it does.
chetty: the_scourge, only 300?
the_scourge: chetty: no, that is a minimum figure
assbot: A Gentle Introduction to Unqualified Reservations — PDF | More Right ... ( )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45300 @ 0.00039333 = 17.8178 BTC [+]
the_scourge: < here you go. html, under the section titled "a gentle introduction"
assbot: Moldbuggery ... ( )
pete_dushenski: goodness gracious... what a dozen posts and 15,000 words each ?
ben_vulpes: pete_dushenski: you've yet to meet mr mold?
mircea_popescu: yeah, the guy was verbose.
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: nah i'm familiar with his work
pete_dushenski: have i read mold as exhaustively as asciilifeform ? no. have i read some ? yes
ben_vulpes: i remember some really long stony nights in college going through the works
pete_dushenski: reading the trilema pieces in his direction were a sufficient cure to reading more
mircea_popescu: anyway, that "how dawkins got pwned" thing reads to me like "unemployed grad was playing Plague Inc. on his ipad while dawkins was on tv"
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform's a sucker for punishment
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: russian, neh ? ;)
mircea_popescu: the similarities are shocking.
ben_vulpes: not only expects, but welcomes the stake.
ben_vulpes: "at long last, my expectations are fulfilled."
pete_dushenski: #calledit
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes actually i confess i do the same sort of obsessive rereading myself. tho perhaps not on orlov and yarvin
mircea_popescu: but then again...
mircea_popescu: he wants you to hang out here moar.
pete_dushenski: and work on 0.5.3!
ben_vulpes: myeah i want this too
mircea_popescu: "In the more recent past, the Allied victors eradicated militarist traditions in Germany and Japan through their control of the educational system." << lulzy. and of course, defeated japanese and german troops erradicated the same in the us and its allies by... also control of the educational system ?
mircea_popescu: "o no wait, that's what we wanted anyway" "like fuck you did"
pete_dushenski: moldbug?
pete_dushenski: i scanned that dawkins piece a bit more... there were more unfounded claims than i could take
pete_dushenski: so: in the trash
mircea_popescu: kinda the problem with this guy, he's writing a bizarre sort of fiction.
mircea_popescu: "For example, one common trope in various religious traditions is asceticism: the voluntary renunciation of material comforts. Since this tends to be much easier for those who start out wealthy and comfortable, it's an effective status marker."
pete_dushenski: "Christianity is simply a set of behavioral patterns that harm other human patterns in some respect and help in others. Catholic priesthood does, however, exhibit parasitic (viral) behavior on fatherhood."
mircea_popescu: fucking a. didn't this guy as retold by asciilifeform end up sucking cock because "gentleman" in his own opinion ?
pete_dushenski: too anti-religious for me
mircea_popescu: anyway, enough of this.
pete_dushenski: not like god-worship is sane, just that it works
pete_dushenski: Ukrainian Central bank raises overnight refinancing rate to 23% from 17.5%
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski: that's quite specifically what religion is for: coping, thus survival << that coping worked better pre industrial revolution that post.
mircea_popescu: on which score, orwell has an excellent quote
mircea_popescu: one sec to package it so it doesn't end up flooding log
pete_dushenski: modern technology is marvellous for coping
assbot: dpaste: 1T7Z9SG ... ( )
mircea_popescu: "Mr Upward would no doubt answer that a belief which was appropriate several centuries ago might be inappropriate and therefore stultifying now. But this does not get one much farther, because it assumes that in any age there will be ONE body of belief which is the current approximation to truth, and that the best literature of the time will be more or less in harmony with it. Actually no such uniformity has ever exist
mircea_popescu: ed. In seventeenth-century England, for instance, there was a religious and political cleavage which distinctly resembled the left-right antagonism of to-day. Looking back, most modern people would feel that the bourgeois-Puritan viewpoint was a better approximation to truth than the Catholic-feudal one. But it is certainly not the case that all or even a majority of the best writers of the time were puritans."
danielpbarron: ;;later tell asciilifeform any suggestions? this output is from your ->
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: as a great quote.
mircea_popescu: his general point is well taken : as whole groups, the burgeois-puritans were more on point than the feudal-catholics. however, (and he says it, but he hides it too because he does not want to confront it) : as elites, the catholics mashed the puritans into the ground.
mircea_popescu: because, then as now, socialism does not work.
mike_c: danielpbarron: looks like you are missing zlib, no?
mircea_popescu: nobody wants a plate of twelve "kinda-shitty" dishes when he could have an exquisite dish and eleven helpings of garbage, readily discarded.
danielpbarron: i guess there are some dependancies that most users are assumed to already have on their system, mike_c ?
danielpbarron: i thought maybe it was all contained in the three tarballs in distfiles/
mircea_popescu: if it isn't it must be!
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: "nobody" wise
pete_dushenski: this does not include those disposed towards "the starving kids in africa"
mike_c: danielpbarron: can you link me to it
mircea_popescu: well, nopbody capable of want.
mircea_popescu: obviously the garbage composter will take either just as happily, and so would the toilet.
danielpbarron: mike_c, to what?
mike_c: yeah
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: want of materials, yes
pete_dushenski: want of "rights" less so ;)
pete_dushenski: this is the railroad vs. freedom debate
pete_dushenski: "It seems therefore that for a creative writer possession of the 'truth' is less important than emotional sincerity." << well said
mircea_popescu: remarkably, wikipedia manages to write however many words on poe without mentioning the guy was batshit insane.
mircea_popescu: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: danke mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: doing ddos research ? :D
ascii_field: heavy industrial pipe here.
ascii_field: danielpbarron: it's all wrong
thestringpuller: oh hey ascii_field left his house
ascii_field: danielpbarron: no, it should -not- be using any libs installed on your box
danielpbarron: that's what i thought
ascii_field: not openssl, not bdb
ascii_field: and from your dump, it clearly is
ascii_field: check that 1) you actually built them 2) results went to the specified dir 3) envir vars got set to point there
ascii_field: one of 1, 2, 3 - is false.
mircea_popescu: 3 bering my guess
danielpbarron: will do; thank you for the insight
ascii_field: have it dump'em
ascii_field: the vars, that is
mircea_popescu: probably they're in the path, but not being defaulted to
mike_c: the export lines look ok..
ascii_field: other thing is
ascii_field: try building on a box that doesn't even -have- the libs
ascii_field: (installed the usual way)
ascii_field: that way - no confusion
mircea_popescu: well then it'll work, nothing to default to
ascii_field: no, then, assuming nothing changed, will croak
ascii_field: the locally built libs either 1) aren't there 2) aren't pointed to by the envir.
ascii_field: and here's another dead giveaway
ascii_field: the thing shouldn't ever be asking for zlib!
ascii_field: read
ascii_field: clearly marked, zlib is toggled off; and, in the comment, warns that recent 'boost' is braindamaged and demands it anyway
mircea_popescu: there's that.
ascii_field: hence, either 1) your build is trying to use a 'modern' boost
ascii_field: 2) your build isn't even happening with the patched (non-zlib) makefile
ascii_field: (you did patch, right?)
ascii_field: then (1)
ascii_field: tertium non datur
danielpbarron: but just to clarify, i'm supposed to patch with the portatronic thing after the chicken etc.. patches?
ascii_field: though technically shouldn't conflict with any of them
danielpbarron: and that all seems to work with no errors
danielpbarron: i think i tried the portatronic patch first and it didn't work
ascii_field: what was the output ?
danielpbarron: i don't recall and didn't save it
ascii_field: 'pikz or didnt happen'
danielpbarron: i can repeat for you
ascii_field: may be useful
assbot: The Willie D ... ( )
mircea_popescu: check out the meta-nsa at work !
ascii_field: << somehow missed this when it was on
assbot: MIT cuts ties with Walter Lewin after online harassment probe - The Tech ... ( )
ascii_field: ^ physics prof purged
mircea_popescu: "Institute revokes emeritus title, removes online courses of popular physics professor who starred in viral videos"
mircea_popescu: if i weren't so lazy i guess i'd organise a special cell to create these derpy "controversies" about every single intellectually productive us person and have the academia "sever ties" with them.
mircea_popescu: fortunately, i am lazy. also fortunately, it's a job that does itself.
ascii_field: what'd be the objective ?
ascii_field: that they defect? or simply denied to the enemy ?
mircea_popescu: well, the enemy proposes that relevancy is a matter of headcount.
mircea_popescu: so... it's a win-win move.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 128300 @ 0.00039338 = 50.4707 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: "With his wiry grayish-brown hair, his tortoiseshell glasses and his intensity, Professor Lewin is the iconic brilliant scientist … he is at once larger than life and totally accessible."
mircea_popescu: "which is great, unless he fucks someone"
the_scourge: excommunicate him! heretic! :) < it's galileo all over again
ascii_field: hey if j. watson can be lowered into pederasty, why not any other greybeard lecturer
mircea_popescu: "never interrupt the enemy when he's making a mistake". fortunately the internet makes so that "help him instead" remains undetectable.
ascii_field: it isn't like they have an alternative 'pepsi usa' which they can escape to and help it build death rays.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field the notion that there exists an ending for every character doesn't hold.
mircea_popescu: whether they have or they don't have a choice today, it makes little difference.
ascii_field: watson is a special case here (see his auction escapade, for instance) - but a garden-variety physics prof going 'on strike' means: taxicab
mircea_popescu: no it does not.
mircea_popescu: it could as well mean blog going "Fuck you, of course I fuck my students!"
mircea_popescu: i'd blogroll it.
ascii_field: and how does that fix the fella up with food & house ?
mircea_popescu: the "turn the other cheek" folk over there. the "if you as much as bother a hair of my beard I'll gouge your fucking eyes out with your own detached ribs" folk over here.
mircea_popescu: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: ty mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: why'd you expect one's finances to derive from one's politics ?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: actually just that. pointing out that virtually none of the people involved are 'free men' in the sense of having any kind of independent finance
mircea_popescu: neither were any of the men involved in, say, the end of the soviet union.
ascii_field: actually
mircea_popescu: quite more literally than is the case here, anyway.
ascii_field: one of the few genuinely valuable nuggets in orlov is his summary (for engl. folks) of how sov. supply chain had such abundant slack (no 'just in time' anywhere) that many folks had access to serious stashes of $good
mircea_popescu: they built that access.
ascii_field: e.g., if you worked at a paper factory in '91-93, you had a good chance of becoming de-facto owner of a hundred tonnes of paper - suddenly unobtainable in the usual way - and some pull.
mircea_popescu: and, actually, that slack, too.
mircea_popescu: do you know how much time and effort the central command spent trying to narrow it down ?
mircea_popescu: 90% of all available anything, towards the end of things.
ascii_field: except - orcs, so it was hopeless
the_scourge: doesn't our politics and philosophy entirely derive from our finances? it's pretty clear that a liberal is just a fascist with effective plumbing and sanitary solutions
mircea_popescu: it is not so clear.
mircea_popescu: for one thing, the fascists had better plumbing than the us does.
the_scourge: er, sorry i didn't mean to reference one specific form of fascism ... i should have used 'left' and 'right' instead
the_scourge: looking for citation right now....
mircea_popescu: the_scourge are you looking for the log bit about the spanish revolutionary right ?
ascii_field: !s answer lies in the sewers
assbot: 11 results for 'answer lies in the sewers' :
mircea_popescu: look at that, all alf :)
assbot: Smelly Environment Can Increase Homophobic, Politically Conservative Views According To Study ... ( )
assbot: All Politics Is Olfactory - ... ( )
the_scourge: sorry for the sources, i was struggling with my history grepping and resorted to ddg
the_scourge: ascii_field: yes, i believe it's the same effect
ascii_field: what effect ?
mircea_popescu: lol the_scourge you ever heard of one McCune ?
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: don't ring a bell
ascii_field: i must confess - despite having read every word of mr mold's UR (and got my fair fill of the author in his previous life, and likewise played in his hindley-milner mathemasturbatorium until could take it no more) - i am still no closer to grasping the_scourge's arguments
mircea_popescu: unsurprisingly. sara miller mccune is a reputed con woman that came up with the following scam : make up fake "peer reviewed" scientific journals, then charge variouis idiots that were stpid enough to try and carve careers out of "social studies" a few hundred dollars to publish their goop
the_scourge: ascii_field: i thought perhaps your 'answer lies in the sewers' paper was talking about the olfactory conservative/liberal thing, but upon reading it, it seems like it's talking about something else... spanish nobility dumping their worker's bodies in the sewers? am i close?
mircea_popescu: then charge for the amassed pseudoscience to be repeated in drivelly sources like the huffpo.
ascii_field: the_scourge did not actually read a word of it
mircea_popescu: this works splendidly well, on a certain crowd, creating "consensuses" and "progresses" and whatnot.
ascii_field: we now know.
mircea_popescu: also doesn't happen to carry currency here.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field well... chuka.
ascii_field: the_scourge: you are making a loud public fool of yourself, unnecessarily. friendly warning.
TheNewDeal: Anyone interested in a bitbet repurchase?
mircea_popescu: how's that work ?
mike_c: TheNewDeal: what are you holding?
TheNewDeal: It works like so. Purchaser sends btc
TheNewDeal: I pay out after receiving payment from bitbet
the_scourge: ascii_field: duly taken. i'm just trying to connect McCune to the articles i linked
TheNewDeal: I give a small premium on timeweight
mike_c: yeah, so what are you selling?
mircea_popescu: and on trust ? and interest ?
TheNewDeal: No interest
TheNewDeal: Yes trust
assbot: BitBet - BTC to rise vs USD in February :: 4.21 B (69%) on Yes, 1.89 B (31%) on No | closing in 2 weeks 6 days | weight: 90`871 (100`000 to 1) ... ( )
mircea_popescu kinda interested to see this model developped, but the fact that txns have to take a time, and a risk premium on top of what's actually bneing sold seems insurmontable
mike_c: it's been done before
TheNewDeal: I did it before, check out my otp page
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6250 @ 0.00039193 = 2.4496 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal but your holding is worth at the very most .189 BTC, and that if no has a 100% chance to win ?
mircea_popescu: mike_c TheNewDeal no dispute it can be done and has done. just, impediments, friction, that sort of consideration
TheNewDeal: Ill sell up to .75
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal what i mean is, the value of buying 1 btc from you rather than betting 1 btc is given by the weight differential
mircea_popescu: as weigh is at 90k, even should you hold all the no you can't expect to make more than .189
TheNewDeal: To me it doesnt matter the exact amount I make
ascii_field: '(S//REL NATO) We assess that any unclassified NATO network that is directly connected to the Internet should be considered potentially compromised, creating uncertainty regarding the confidentiality, integrity and continued availability of all data on that network.' << mega-lol
TheNewDeal: I saw the bet, it looked unbalanced, and then i bet
TheNewDeal: Im not saying you shouldnt just bet no
TheNewDeal: But you could bet no, and buy no from me
TheNewDeal: Why do yoy say I can expect to make .189?
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: done some reading on sarah miller mccune, very interesting. is that somehow connected to
assbot: PLOS ONE: Disgust and the Politics of Sex: Exposure to a Disgusting Odorant Increases Politically Conservative Views on Sex and Decreases Support for Gay Marriage ... ( )
mircea_popescu: if not in fact, in spirit.
TheNewDeal: The maximum i can make atm is 3.9
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: incidentally, the mccune thing is not in any way fundamentally different from the -rest- of mainstream academia
ascii_field: which is a pure rapefest from the standpoint of the phd coolies
mircea_popescu: ascii_field do they have classified networks directly connected is ther implication there ?!
mircea_popescu: ascii_field i just picked her name out of a bucket.
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: oh yah, i take every "finding" and "study" with a grain or shovelful of salt. so, well spoken
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal just trying to think through the valuations of this device. it's interesting.
TheNewDeal: Any who, if someone is interested or becomes more interested as time goes on, send me a gribble message
TheNewDeal: I usually just place a premium, like, 3% on the timeweight
TheNewDeal: So if purchaser paid me at 90k timeweight, I would payout at 90k*1.03
TheNewDeal: The specific premium and amount are what needs be negotiated
mircea_popescu: so basically the diff between betting and buying is 3% on one side, vs the risk premium on the other.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: asciilifeform> when you plug a lamp into a mains socket, is that also a 'streaming query' ? << For some kinds of lamp sure. << LAMP! geddit ? roflmao
assbot: This is the wrong way to do the Internet. Don’t worry, there’s also a right way. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( )
TomServo: !up ascii_field
pete_dushenski: ^stab at wp, pump for qntra
pete_dushenski: not wordpress, washington post
ascii_field: ty TomServo
mircea_popescu: "When I was in Sicily, I couldn't even get a frickin' wifi login at the McDonalds without an Italian passport *and* a local registered sim. "
mircea_popescu: this has got to be a joke
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: sop in cn
TheNewDeal: Mp, The largest difference is someone else being able to purchase a larger percentage sstake in the pool I am in
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal the most advantageous implications of the whole idea that i see probably have to do with privacy.
TheNewDeal: I like that
bitstein: Bravo, pete_dushenski
mircea_popescu: it's a sort of ad hoc, informal sidechains for btc.
assbot: Map: The Most Common* Job In Every State : Planet Money : NPR ... ( )
TomServo: Waterfall update: One step closer to drying up. Down to 5,038.29 from 10,295.86 on 28-01-2015.
pete_dushenski: bitstein: thx, sorta low-hanging fruit but hey
assbot: Gallup Daily: U.S. Employment ... ( )
mircea_popescu: job not needed. they're doing their part being part of the greatest derpocracy in history.
mircea_popescu: should be a salary in that.
pete_dushenski: redditnotes!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 176850 @ 0.00039134 = 69.2085 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo "breeching the Silk Road" < breaching.
mircea_popescu: you breech a gun, you breach a maiden.
pete_dushenski: in your breeches
mircea_popescu: "One particularly interesting tidbit is that when information about parallel construction in a case leaks, a special "Taint Review Team" must consult with a judge to determine which evidence must be turned over to the defense. The Taint Review team is also responsible for insulating prosecutors from evidence that would reveal the application of parallel construction methods in a case."
mircea_popescu: this also suggests how the problem is to be attacked.
mircea_popescu: make prosecutors personally liable for the use of fraudulently produced "proofs".
mircea_popescu: each da jailed for contempt & disbarred is a step forward.
ascii_field: lol, what's next, policeman liable for strafing crowds ?
mircea_popescu: i doubt the system couldsurvive a dozen total years of jailtime on this score.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field i have with my own eyes seen men hang for that.
mircea_popescu: anything can come apart if correctly approached.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: these folks show every sign of intending to keep it all up until glassed.
mircea_popescu: appearances deceive.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30650 @ 0.00039371 = 12.0672 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: besides, what "these folks" in the general wish and what individual folks actually managed when confronted with a bloody club are quite divorced matters.
jurov: "You were tipped 0.11 XPM for your commit on Project saltstack-formulas/epel-formula. Please, log in and tell us your primecoin address to get it."
jurov: O.o o.O loool
mircea_popescu: that's an approach
mircea_popescu: are these the folks that checked and then ignored signatures yest ?
jurov: yes
mircea_popescu: do you feel what, amused ? insulted ?
jurov: amused
ascii_field: jurov: now to discover the payload!
mircea_popescu: i wonder if it's per line.
assbot: Force usage of verified gpg key by jurov · Pull Request #16 · saltstack-formulas/epel-formula · GitHub ... ( )
mircea_popescu: hm you did 22 lines right ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: Everyone who wanted qntra to have a category page << remove the <li>, separate them by ; instead ? << Work in progress. Things in the categories will be getting some better sorting.
mircea_popescu: it's actually 0.005 per line.
jurov: guess qntra pays better
mircea_popescu: inb4 "this github commit is worth 1k btc on a qntra size arithmetic"
mircea_popescu: i dun believe the web is starved of anything nearly as badly as it's starved of usable value points of comparison. neatly mirrors how those kids are starved for exemplary leadership irl.
mircea_popescu: a sad fate for a race with such well recorded history.
ascii_field: redhat patch << i can't help but think that this is a 'wait, there was dioxin in my cyanide pill!111!' situation.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field "fixed sexist pronouns in manual for use of the alcohol swab employed pre-lethal injection"
assbot: Likely why Twitter has been trying to get news out ahead of earnings: User growth was only 1.4%, the worst on record. /search?q=%24TWTR&src=ctag
mircea_popescu: "he problem isn't a limit in general but that 1MB is so low that under any meaningful adoption scenario it will push all individual users off the blockchain to rely on trusted third parties. In essence you will probably be priced out of the blockchain and the blockchain becomes yet another network you will never have direct (peer) access to, just like FedWire, SWIFT, and other private closed transfer networks. "
mircea_popescu: he forgot to add mpex in there.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 182100 @ 0.00039435 = 71.8111 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 06:30:52; phillipsjk: DeathAndTaxes on bitcoin talk made a detailed post explaining why the 1MB block size in not good for anything other than inter-bank transfers: He estimetes 2-4 TPS basked on the last million transactions
mircea_popescu: should be good.
pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo: if you or anyone else has any suggestions for sorting archive pages, it'd be sweet if contravex didn't only post one article at a time
pete_dushenski: i've tried a few angles without success thus far
assbot: The World’s Email Encryption Software Relies on One Guy, Who is Going Broke - ProPublica ... ( )
pete_dushenski: twas in the logs
mircea_popescu: jurov actually was on log.
the_scourge: bears repeating :)
pete_dushenski: speaking of bears, i'm hungry as one. laters
BingoBoingo: ;;later tell pete_dushenski Search for "Clean My Archives" if you consider using it be sure to read it. There isn't much to it.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: The Race to Replace Bitcoin | Observer ... ( )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 89500 @ 0.0003903 = 34.9319 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: "Ms. Kim has one of the all-time great LinkedIn profiles: Harvard, Cornell, Columbia Law, the Innocence Project, Shearman & Sterling, two other law jobs, founder or CEO at two start-ups and now a venture capitalist."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3000 @ 0.0003903 = 1.1709 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: "Ms. Kim’s next big idea was to drop hints to the world that Mr. McCaleb was Satoshi Nakamoto. According to one person who worked at Ripple Labs at the time, “Joyce was creating all kinds of rumors that Jed was Satoshi and Jed was happy to go along with it, smiling like the cat that ate the canary."
mod6: has anyone else seen the "G0D" magic number?
mod6: tail -500000 blk0001.dat | xxd | grep "G0D" | wc -l
mod6: 159025
BingoBoingo: "This all culminated in a showdown meeting in which the board and key investors sided with Mr. Larsen. It was a 5-1 vote to keep Mr. Larsen as CEO with Mr. McCaleb himself being the lone dissenter. Even Mr. McCaleb’s ally, Mr. Powell, voted to retain Mr. Larsen, as did Roger Ver, another McCaleb friend in the room."
BingoBoingo: mod6: Wait, Was it a bible verse that doesn't want to verify?
BingoBoingo: "After the vote, as would prove to be his habit when faced with a situation not to his liking, Mr. McCaleb simply disappeared. He and Ms. Kim went to Costa Rica to surf, then to Brazil. Even close friends at Ripple Labs had no idea where their mercurial founder was for months at a time."
mod6: na, just saw a bunch of those in there when looking through the hex of blk0001.dat, i think it's an OP_ script of some type maybe
BingoBoingo: "Meanwhile, Mr. McCaleb and Ms. Burzlaff negotiated a settlement for their children’s support, but his behavior toward his kids mirrored his departure from Ripple and, to some degree, every company he incubated. He fled the scene when things went south at eDonkey. At Mt. Gox, he actually claimed the company no longer had any of his coding DNA, even though he still owned 12 percent of the company and advised on an attempt to acqu
BingoBoingo: ire its assets."
the_scourge: i'm undecided as to wether such scams demonstrate a concerted smear attempt or are simply exposing the nasty nature of our 'corportate' culture
BingoBoingo: "Ms. Kim has an impressively broad resume, but it is not especially deep. Ms. Kim appears on Stellar legal documents and itswebsite as “secretary,” “executive director” and “member” (under its bylaws). Whatever her talents, they do not include leadership. Her legacy at SimpleHoney was a pair of false-start products, punctuated by a blog post titled “How to Build a Startup from a Beach.”"
BingoBoingo: the_scourge: It is the plague of people having no concept of history pretending they can haz bzns
the_scourge: the internet is sirz bitnit
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14350 @ 0.0003903 = 5.6008 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: "This circular process pinned an initial value on STRs. Stellar repaid the $3 million loan with 2 billion STRs. Based on the finite distribution of 100 billion STRs, the transaction implied the currency’s market cap was $150 million. (Its current market cap is about $17 million.)"
BingoBoingo: "Charlie Shrem, the Bitcoiner who is headed to prison and is very close to Mr. McCaleb and Mr. Karpeles and has done business with them, shared his suspicion that the Mt. Gox money actually disappeared much earlier than had been revealed: “I think he lost those coins early on. Like many years ago in the first hack.”"
ben_vulpes: the_scourge: shit doesn't even really count compared to actual impressive public market scamming like VGMC
danielpbarron: height=187521
assbot: Bit-error in Block 108009, Tx 23 ? ... ( )
the_scourge: ben_vulpes: wow that is some seriously seedy shit.... surely they didn't get anyone's money?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 136800 @ 0.0003903 = 53.393 BTC [-]
ben_vulpes: the_scourge: you really have to ask?
the_scourge: idk human stupidity surprises me to this day and probably will do well into the future
assbot: Texas boy suspended after bringing 'ring of power' to school - NY Daily News ... ( )
mircea_popescu: !up kanzure
mircea_popescu: hey there.
danielpbarron: ok so apparently the openssl make install was getting stuck on making documentation (apparently a known bug for the version ascii chose) and the fix is to use "make install_sw" instead of "make install"
assbot: Gerald Davis is wrong. Here's why. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( )
gribble: The operation succeeded.
trinque: ben_vulpes: everyone in texas has borderline personality disorder
jurov: border personality?
assbot: Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. ( )
trinque: jurov: haaaaw
scoopbot: New post on by cazalla:
cazalla: oops, forgot title
cazalla: the one time scoopbot fetches an article within seconds..
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron wow nice find
ben_vulpes: qntra's turning into quite the source these days
mircea_popescu: "The one great example is IBM, which faced disruption and existential threat from PCs in the early 1990s and emerged stronger and is still a thriving company. "
mircea_popescu: who the fuck is this imbecile.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: the last million transactions are probably by volume idiocy spawned by wallets that inhibit address reuse << at least half.
mircea_popescu: phillipsjk: Not even my 2 year electronic program or running a node for a year? <<< jesus god he's adorable. totally pwned ben_vulpes too, because the joo's a lazy reader. meanwhile in the linked cv ? "Objective. To find a day or night job in the Edmonton area."
mircea_popescu: !rated phillipsjk
assbot: You have not rated phillipsjk.
mircea_popescu: !rate phillipsjk 1 His simplicity is endearing.
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP:
mircea_popescu: !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.phillipsjk.1:4fc7cc9d4122a9dc2f24d42a0cec09a573a66f334b6631c311ab16c1b7bd82d4
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 1 for phillipsjk with note: His simplicity is endearing.
mircea_popescu: in other news : i've had your resume read by my hr, and that woman has read probably 15k by now.
mircea_popescu: "this is, without a doubt, the worst resume i have ever seen."
danielpbarron: ok.. i have a bitcoind binary file that i did myself! :D
danielpbarron: time for dinner.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46627 @ 0.0003903 = 18.1985 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: !up kanzure
kanzure: hello
mircea_popescu: hey, what does it say ?
kanzure: Searching for key with fingerprint: %d. This may take a few moments.\n Could not find your key. Check if your key is available on keyservers and try later.
mircea_popescu: %d srsly ?
kanzure: well i was going to write %f but then i realized i value my life
mircea_popescu: it'd help if i could actually check it ?
assbot: Public Key Server -- Get ``0x984f10cc77169fd2 '' ... ( )
assbot: Search results for '0x984f10cc77169fd2' ... ( )
kanzure: also, do you have any hints for how i can make the incentives paper more lolworthy?
mircea_popescu: wait it was a loleffort ?
mircea_popescu: i was totally boggled because wtf is this.
kanzure: hard to explain
kanzure: i was trying to do both sort of
kanzure: like, it is completely ridiculous that such a document is required
kanzure: however... it's required.
mircea_popescu: !register <full_gpg_keyid> << are youdoing the full thing ?
assbot: Nick mircea_popescu is already taken.
mircea_popescu: who can possibly require it ?
kanzure: no i mean it's required in the sense that apparently some of those issues are non-obvious to others
kanzure: quite literally some do not think that nodes can be malicious
mircea_popescu: <assbot> Searching for key with fingerprint: 6160E1CAC8A3C52966FD76998A736F0E2FB7B452. This may take a few moments.
mircea_popescu: <assbot> Key 2FB7B452 / "Mircea Popescu (Acest articol are apriori avantajul aliteralitatii alaturi.) <>" successfully imported.
kanzure: or have different implementations
mircea_popescu: this is how mine looked.
kanzure: "Nick kanzure is already taken."
kanzure: btw this used to work
felipelalli: cazalla BingoBoingo please talk about Italy in as pete_dushenski suggested! This is huge!
kanzure: i have made no changes
mircea_popescu: well kakobrekla might be able to help you.
kakobrekla: !gettrust assbot kanzure
assbot: Trust relationship from user assbot to user kanzure: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 2 via 2 connections. | |
kakobrekla: !up and !v
mircea_popescu: ah right.
mircea_popescu: kanzure ima devoice you now. say !up in private to assbot, decryot the otp then say !v
mircea_popescu: !down kanzure
mircea_popescu: see if this works
mircea_popescu: !up kanzure
mircea_popescu: <kanzure> "!up" is still giving me "Could not find your key. Check if your key is available on keyservers and try later.""
kanzure: "!v" is giving me "Need a decrypted verification string."
BingoBoingo: felipelalli: pete already wrote on itally for
kanzure: this is retarded
kanzure: can someone just give me assbot source code or something
kakobrekla: is key on keyserver ?
kanzure: we've been over this
felipelalli: BingoBoingo: I'm sorry, you guys are too fast. I saw just the last 3 articles.
mircea_popescu: kanzure well... nodes are hostile all teh time
felipelalli: And it was yesterday, I'm an idiot. Thanks.
kanzure: mircea_popescu: of course nodes are hostile... but this needs to be written down (apparently).
kanzure: part of it is that i don't trust anyone to keep the whole threat model in their head
kanzure: just seems unlikely
kanzure: and waiting for petertodd to start telling you to go fuck yourself is just a bad strategy
mircea_popescu: you know most of the lolz there are as to how incomplete it is
kanzure: ah...
kanzure: yeah i would estmate that it's no where near useful at the moment
kanzure: also does anyone know of a design for a planar engine? can be gas/steam/whatever. just needs to be manufactured in one step.
kakobrekla: your key was never imported
kakobrekla: how have you been over this
assbot: Banca d’Italia Ends AML/KYC For Bitcoin Businesses, Opts Out Of Economic Death | ... ( )
felipelalli: cazalla: thanks cazalla, I skipped unintentionally.
felipelalli: I was excited because my family is Italian and I have Italian passport.
kanzure: kakobrekla: how was i able to "!up" in the past?
kakobrekla: kanzure via old gribble auth.
kanzure: ah fascinating
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 128800 @ 0.00039625 = 51.037 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: !up kanzure
mircea_popescu: yeah the missing piece of your puzzlement here might be that gribble got forked
mircea_popescu: in any case, the notion of "writing down incentives" is a little silly.
mircea_popescu: incentives are always a contextual matter.
mircea_popescu: the idea that some sort of serious analysis can be based on that fails fundamentally, in that it tries to work on the basis of goals rather than from causes.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54917 @ 0.00039001 = 21.4182 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: !up Alina-malina
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10934 @ 0.00038334 = 4.1914 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34950 @ 0.00039753 = 13.8937 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: kanzure: planar engine?
kanzure: was not aware of gribble fork
kanzure: asciilifeform: hplusroadmap is discussing said concept
kanzure: asciilifeform: i'm thinking of something like
assbot: Scroll compressor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( )
asciilifeform: kanzure: tried plain old tesla turbine ?
asciilifeform: i don't think it gets any simpler than that
kanzure: wikipedia image does not make me think a tesla turbine is flat
asciilifeform: flat enough with one disk
kanzure: hm.
[]bot: Bet created: "TSLA above $265.00 at close of trading on 17-JUL-2015"
mircea_popescu: So Randi goes to Davos, never once asking why they would want her there? Convincing her demo of underproducing hyperconsumers that capitalism-- controlling capital-- is pointless and mean, but globalism-- doublespoken as "progress", "human rights", "everything is connected"-- that is a noble cause. Remember that the "culture" she thinks she speaks for, including those that hate her-- "the startup culture"-- is premis
asciilifeform: kanzure: from a cursory reading of the linked log, it appears that you want a photolithographable engine ?
mircea_popescu: ed on starting a business in order to sell the business to someone else. Of course the idea is to get rich-- which sounds like capitalism, if you're retarded, but observe the message that is being taught: that the necessary correlate to getting rich is to give all the capital to someone else. The power is traded for the fetish of power. That's not capitalism, it is madness, and apparently Davos and Randi think wom
mircea_popescu: en especially will heart it. It'll work for a handful of well publicized people pictured above the caption, "$100 billion! You could be next!"-- followed immediately by a story about how worthless the business turned out to be, so of course the goal for you is to sell out ASAP; but the vast majority who have aligned their psychology with this vector will pursue an impossible fantasy at the expense of their labor an
mircea_popescu: d their lives. If you don't believe me, believe Lori Gottlieb. This logic recommended to her to drop out of Stanford medical school to join, and now she's a relationship expert.
mircea_popescu: god i searched for that quote...
mircea_popescu: fucking lori gottlieb
asciilifeform: kanzure: answer's easy - stirling with liquid piston.
kanzure: asciilifeform: yes please. although other one-pass manufacturing processes will be considered.
asciilifeform: kanzure: you now have answer.
mircea_popescu: im perhaps slow, but what is "one pass mfg process" even mean ?!
kanzure: it means "don't spend 100 hours assembling tiny parts into a bigger device"
asciilifeform: i'm assuming it refers to anything akin to printing, stamping, etching
kanzure: correct
mircea_popescu: so it's really "printable engine" ?
asciilifeform: (etching is quite certainly not 'one pass' in any sense, but i can see how it might fit here)
kanzure: i would say "printable engine" except then i would hate myself
mircea_popescu: kanzure this nomenclature you use is very confusing for (admittedly,. old) people with actual manufacutring management experience. it sounds a lot like the earlier discussed lighbulb sql.
kanzure: well that's what you get when mechanical engineering departments spend more time teaching me fucking excel spreadsheets than, you know, engineering
kanzure: (i dropped out)
mircea_popescu: basically, the notion that all manufacturing processes can be divided into an arbitrary number of passes at a gain of productivity is the tenet of that business for a century now.
asciilifeform: kanzure: i may be able to give you more specific advice if you say what the engine is meant to drive.
kanzure: asciilifeform: at minimum i need a few tens of newtons of force... in general.
kanzure: but more would be nice
asciilifeform: and also precisely why it needs to be lithographically produced
kanzure: that's more the reason here
mircea_popescu: well inasmuch you can print a bottle and fill it with a gas, you can make a rocket that'll produce 10 newtons or more.
asciilifeform: force exerted on what ?
kanzure: nothing in particular, just generic actuators i guess
mircea_popescu: so, small ?
asciilifeform: there is no such thing as 'generic actuator'
kanzure: linear screw thread actuators are very useful at all sorts of sizes, but hard to manufacture (= require more steps and parts and manufacturing processes)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i moved on to that after building a generic jammer, in my childhood :D
asciilifeform: does the engine need to produce linear motion? turn a shaft? cycle more than once? more than a trillion times ?
kanzure: oh that doesn't matter, you can convert most forms of motion
mircea_popescu: by using parts lol
asciilifeform: !up kanzure
mircea_popescu: "Every time you hear the word globalism, you should hear three things: 1. wealth uncoupled from work product. 2. Lifestyle as a reflection of your personal self-worth. 3. You give up control of the capital, and by capital I mean you. "Do I still get paid?" Sure, but you have to promise to spend more than what we pay. "How will that work?" Don't worry, Visa will explain it all to you."
mircea_popescu: i'd like to pay for this guy to have babies.
kanzure: i'm not sure if mircea_popescu is being serious about this
kanzure: since asciilifeform seems to understand i'll drop it
asciilifeform: kanzure: if you merely wish to drive a linear actuator, use an inchworm motor. if you need extraordinary force, use terfenol-d for the piezo stacks.
kanzure: a comb drive is approximately what i want
kanzure: except it doesn't work for large amounts of force
kanzure: or at "large" scale
asciilifeform: hell, mhd actuator
asciilifeform: as much force as you can sink heat.
asciilifeform: (do you need precision? you didn't say whether did or not)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i thought the inchworm's main application was precise movement
asciilifeform: mhd - no parts at all
mircea_popescu: rather than force.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: referring to mhd
kanzure: hm i have a magnetohydrodynamics person in hplusroadmap. i will pester him.
asciilifeform: where - little precision, arbitrary force
asciilifeform: if your working fluid is even slightly conductive - mhd.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: was that tlp ?
mircea_popescu: yes it was tlp.
kanzure: where should i look for evidence of large force magnetohydrodynamic actuators
asciilifeform: kanzure: your desk
mircea_popescu: anyway inchworm means piezo in my head for some reason.
asciilifeform: kanzure: 1) not hard to research the basic mechanics, it's primary school physics 2) not hard to build experimental concept
asciilifeform: with elementary equip.
assbot: High-thrust spiral motor : DigInfo - YouTube ... ( )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: inchworm drive is not necessarily implemented with piezos (though usually), nor is a piezo actuator necessarily built on inchworm principle.
kanzure: hm no
assbot: self-powered magnetohydrodynamic motor - YouTube ... ( )
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform granted. just one of those mental automatisms that never had a chance to run into a door before.
asciilifeform: kanzure: i think you just linked to a perpetuum mobile.
mircea_popescu: well youtube research has its advantages.
kanzure: a minute on youtube saves a decade in my lab
asciilifeform: a decade in the lab saves you a minute...
asciilifeform: (where? on #b-a, naturally.)
kanzure: right... nobody in their right mind should use youtube.. yet here i am.
asciilifeform: kanzure: is this engine search still connected with your microfluidics/high-throughput screening thing, or something new ?
kanzure: vaguely connected i suppose
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38793 @ 0.00039754 = 15.4218 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: kanzure seriously, if efficiency is not a concern (and i take it not to be since you never mentioned it yet), a succession of bottles is your best bet.
kanzure: having a flat/planar/single-pass-manufactured engine or actuator would be very useful for many reasons
kanzure: of bottles?
mircea_popescu: use precompressed gas, or combustion or w/e.
asciilifeform: kanzure: you should be able to fabricate a linear mhd actuator using ordinary etched copper pcb.
kanzure: fascinating
asciilifeform: or, alternatively, a liquid-pistol stirling engine using two sheets of glass and a garden-variety co2 laser engraver
asciilifeform: *piston
mircea_popescu: ok this is an idea! glass pane stirling heated by laser.
asciilifeform: neither has moving parts in the usual sense
kanzure: someone made a laser-pumped microfluidic device which was cute
mircea_popescu: what's a good working fluid ? (high absorbtion / high expansion with temp) ?
kanzure: also for cell lysis but w/e
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu has it. can apply heat wherever you want it (laser, or electrically - indium or similar conductive layer on the glass)
mircea_popescu: laser way cheaper.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: water works surprisingly well
mircea_popescu: i was thinking, it's probably something like mg permanganate water solution
kanzure: yeah but nobody is selling me a multi-kilowatt surface mount laser
asciilifeform: kanzure: 'ebay' is.
mircea_popescu: or w/e impurity works well for your wavelength
asciilifeform: kanzure: how many do you need ?
asciilifeform: (you don't need to mount the laser itself on the glass! fiber conduit)
mircea_popescu: laser is cheapest for many reasons
kanzure: ebay is selling surface mount lasers that do >1 kW? hrm /me looks again
kanzure: gah why did you send to me ebay
kanzure: how about alibaba
asciilifeform: if you need 1 - ebay
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform in fairness, he could probably get away even with duct taping resistors on the pane.
asciilifeform: 1mil+ - alibaba
kanzure: anyway this is not for micromotion
asciilifeform: then - for what ?
asciilifeform: kanzure: actual engineering usually happens with an objective
kanzure: why can't i just have lots of reusable motion devices? >:(
asciilifeform: we named how many? 6 ?
cazalla: <<< not qntra worthy but man drives his truck into court house, demands they submit to bitcoin lol
assbot: Man admits driving pickup truck into Calgary Courts Centre | Calgary Herald ... ( )
kanzure: let's say powering a conventional cnc machine maybe
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and therein lies your answer. or to quote the shockingly on point tlp, "Think seriously about what she (thinks she) wants: acceptance of her individuality-- by work. Not for her work product-- there is none; but for her individuality, by work.
BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: << OTR and ephemeral keys have use cases
assbot: It's great /JuliaAngwin got GPG donation love. Now OTR needs some too. It's much better crypto in many threat models
kanzure: or car... but it wont really ever be used in a car i hope..
mircea_popescu: First question: which work? Not the job you have, it's real, and it's boring. It is a future "career", the fantasy environment seen on TV dramas where all of life takes place.
mircea_popescu: Second question: why work? Men are not being taught to want their job to value them, in fact, men want as little to do with their jobs as possible. Randi and the globalism party bus are teaching women to want "careers"-- more precisely, to want to draw more of their identity from their careers."
asciilifeform: kanzure: this is a question i've put a great deal of thought in. what do you dislike re: existing actuators for cnc ?
mircea_popescu: cazalla sheit ? why not qntra worthy ?
kanzure: asciilifeform: i actually am very fond of linear screw actuators, but i would prefer something that can be manufactured using spatial light modulation with basically zero assembly steps.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo can the otr folks get pointed to the fact that a) openbsd got 20k and b) they'd better get their ass in here and start working up a track record ?
kanzure: mhd looks like it could work
asciilifeform: kanzure: zero assembly steps << hard to improve on mhd
asciilifeform: if you don't need much precision at all, 'muscle wire'
kanzure: i am also fond of things on the order of "resistive heating element + some surface" heh
cazalla: mircea_popescu, i dunno, i guess i'll look into it more and see who he is, really only had a laff and moved on
mircea_popescu: i like the principle, and the man deserves front page and his picture on the newspaper.
mircea_popescu: hopefully more people do exactly the same.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I wouldn't know where to start on that danielpbarron is having some sort of twitter conversation with Weev and just wanted to suggest there might be use cases for the OTR thing.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo me either, which is why i pester you about it :)
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: "because the joo's a lazy reader." << pardon?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: otr/'forward secrecy' is simply the practice of generating an ephemeral key for a particular conversation, which is to be discarded later
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes did you actually see the guy's cv ?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Indeed, sort of like gossipd.
mircea_popescu: holy shit, and that's all you had to say ?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: in the event one or the other participant is captured with his equipment, the ephemeral key is (presumably) gone.
mircea_popescu: i changed my mind, you're not lazy, you're the heart of tactfulness.
ben_vulpes: kinda what i was going for
mircea_popescu: i had no idea you're that smooth.
kanzure: asciilifeform: here are some things i was looking at yesterday
mircea_popescu: no wonder you get laid.
kanzure: asciilifeform: i have various parts laying around for homefab of microelectronics (on the order of a few hundred microns but whatever)
kanzure: planning on same system for microfluidics adventures
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes just keeps his tact quiet most of the time.
mircea_popescu: kanzure alf spent i dunno, a year or os ? trying to build essentially a pick n place / fab lab for cardano
kanzure: basically ghetto projector pointed down microscope tube
asciilifeform: kanzure: assuming you just want linear motion of fluids - you should be able to get what you want from a sheet of glass. etch with co2 laser or hf.
kanzure: have i ever ranted to you about my apt-get for hardware stuff
kanzure: hmm then i will pencil that in sometime
kanzure: basically i want hardware but i don't want to have to spend my life reading millions of pages of documentation
asciilifeform: kanzure: one could come to a worse fate than 'millions of pages of documentation'
asciilifeform: for one thing, documentation is not even available for the most interesting devices
kanzure: microelectronics vlsi doesn't require millions (well.. i mean.. not to make a single chip)
mircea_popescu: what'd that be, pages of documentation that double every year ?
asciilifeform: except as tiny dribbles of leak
ben_vulpes: << i didn't want to drive the kid away immediately
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 06:51:10; ben_vulpes: absolutely none of this qualifies you to have an opinion about block size.
kanzure: that's not what i mean
ben_vulpes: assuming he's not a plant, that is
asciilifeform: and reverse-engineered, at titanic sweat, data, years after said device is out of production
kanzure: if making anything always requires me to make impossible investments in time and energy then none of the fun stuff will get made
ben_vulpes: making anything always requires impossible investments of time and energy.
kanzure: that's only because we're idiots
ben_vulpes: impossible's more a function of available time/energy anyways. not an absolute thing.
mircea_popescu: no, it's because Ὁ βίος βραχύς, ἡ δὲ τέχνη μακρή, ὁ δὲ καιρὸς ὀξύς, ἡ δὲ πεῖρα σφαλερή, ἡ δὲ κρίσις χαλεπή.
kanzure: asciilifeform: pick and places are getting pretty cheap... though this one might still be out of my budget range:
assbot: Fuji CP-643 Chip Shooter 20 Head - Circuit Board Assembly - YouTube ... ( )
asciilifeform: kanzure: if you are trying to produce 5,000,000 units of xxx by next tuesday - that 'fuji' is your god and king, and pray to it
asciilifeform: kanzure: if 100 xxx, at home - then why?!?!!
kanzure: i wasn't claiming i was mass manufacturing anything like that at home
kanzure: blah
mircea_popescu: stop getting in the way of dreams and aspirations alfie
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> [] kanzure: tried plain old tesla turbine ? << talk about boyhood dreams
ben_vulpes: i built so much errata in pursuit of that thing
ben_vulpes: a fucking waste oil furnace
ben_vulpes: my own flash boiler
ben_vulpes: a reheater
kanzure: asciilifeform: also.. we should run a (human) selective breeding program for cryoresuscitation-compatibility.
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: what?!
mircea_popescu: i never was that cool as a boy.
asciilifeform: kanzure: try with smaller organism first ?
kanzure: of course
kanzure: way ahead of you
asciilifeform: kanzure: probably will have more luck with selective breeding for breathing vacuum
kanzure: well why bother with breathing at that point? what?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2100 @ 0.00097074 = 2.0386 BTC [+] {3}
decimation: lol that chip shooter is hardcore, but how many bezzlars?
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: weren't you killing people and building criminal empires then?
mircea_popescu: allegedly.
asciilifeform: kanzure: what would you be breeding? cell membranes resistant to ice?
mircea_popescu: but building furnaces ? that's like work.
asciilifeform: kanzure: biological 'antifreeze' as in certain frogs ?
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> [] flat enough with one disk << i did my own axle and used HD disks to get better boundary layer performance
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: neato
asciilifeform: i think nowadays folks normally build them out of hd platters
asciilifeform: they're nearly perfect for the job as they come
mircea_popescu: incidentally re teh cryo stuff, anyone seen hibernatus ?
ben_vulpes: never got the gas steam bearings to work tho
decimation: mircea_popescu: lol he goes on: "It's probably unnecessary to point out that this increase in lifestyle is built on the increased work product of whoever will do it for 30 cents an hour, and anyway it is a red herring. The real attraction for us isn't just the lifestyle, but that it systematizes-- it makes normal-- not ever wondering: how come we have more lifestyle when we didn't do more work? "
mircea_popescu: decimation the guy's exquisite chjoice of relevant subject matter, and the fearless approach has thoroughly impressed me.
decimation: yeah he makes alot of sense
ben_vulpes: i also kicked around a design for a nifty reciprocal engine where the piston was really just a magnet-bearing shuttle zipping back and forth through coils for insta-ac
mircea_popescu: " My face is in my hands and I wonder how anyone could be asked to raise a girl in such a world? Recently a female cardiologist with a "difficult" 10 year old daughter who had been well trained to want things but not control things asked me if I had read "the study in the New York Times"-- !?!?!?!?!?-- that said that people with the same surname, over generations, continued to achieve the same level of wealth, showing
mircea_popescu: "therefore" that genetic factors were more important than the home environment in determining social mobility, isn't that probably true? Having to do this sober I asked her, "But didn't you change your surname 11 years ago? Or are you betting she can just upgrade hers?" What else could I say? If you read it, it's for you?"
mircea_popescu: the divorcing of people's skills from their general ability to think, neatly mirroring the divorce between want and control, and for that matter between capital and power.
mircea_popescu: "how to support the welfare state ? oh, simply cut everyone in two and hide the halves"
mircea_popescu: sounds like fucking plato already.
decimation: re: 30 cents an hour: "At more than 100,000 people, that makes it the largest mass layoff at any U.S. corporation in at least 20 years."
assbot: Massive Worldwide Layoff Underway At IBM - IEEE Spectrum ... ( )
mircea_popescu: "you can probably extract some work out of the desperate movements of half people in the environment'
mircea_popescu: decimation from the very log of the very day :
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 23:51:15; mircea_popescu: "The one great example is IBM, which faced disruption and existential threat from PCs in the early 1990s and emerged stronger and is still a thriving company. "
ben_vulpes: oh yeah that idiot
ben_vulpes: fintech whatever whatever?
ben_vulpes: dunn something?
decimation: yeah it's thriving alright
BingoBoingo: decimation: Sure, keeps making more dollars for doing less things.
mircea_popescu: real estate company for the win.
decimation: as far as I can gather from employee comments, the 'thriving' at IBM basically consists of brokering indians to write shit code
mircea_popescu: but in the insane story of post-qe world, it makes it's own sort of sense.
BingoBoingo: IBM's probably one of the largest benefactors of fiat world inflation
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> mircea_popescu: water works surprisingly well << oh let us not get ben_vulpes started on the wonders of steam
mircea_popescu: trinque: you want to build your visa? build it on bitcoin, but don't systemd the thing and decide it must have a visa built in << that's not a bnad angle.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: "process man" << i guess more accurate than i ever thought
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes didja get on the part of teh log where the entire d&t think you were discussing with danielpbarron etc is dispelled ?
ben_vulpes: hmwat?
ben_vulpes: d and t?
assbot: Gerald Davis is wrong. Here's why. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( )
mircea_popescu: the post phillip guy was concerned with.
asciilifeform: ^ epic ps0t btw
decimation: re: IBM in the 90's < they didn't 'face disruption', they made one of the largest mistakes in business history
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 07:23:19; punkman: phillipsjk: the 1MB limit is not to stop spam
mircea_popescu: decimation but they made so many!
decimation: they had 30 years of usg/bezzlar computers locked up and were too retarded to market it
mircea_popescu: but no. i suspect that may be missing the point.
mircea_popescu: see, they had 30 years locked up, and AS A CONDITION OF THIS LOCK UP they couldn't market it.
mircea_popescu: because they had to spend their time instead discussing how young men should wear a tie.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes: phillipsjk: where did you get that key, anyways? did you buy it? << fwiw i believe teh guy's genuine.
mircea_popescu: trinque: will my btcd still fart transactions at other nodes if I haven't finished syncing the blockchain? << yes.
ben_vulpes: i don't believe anything
mircea_popescu: except some times.
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: the man's talking about btcd, not bitcoind
mod6: ok, i've dumped block 168000
mircea_popescu: o.O it's text ?!
ben_vulpes: nah, comes from andresens bag of snakes
mod6: haha
mircea_popescu: BLOCK 000000000000099e61ea72015e79632f216fe6cb33d7899acb35b75c8303b763 << it checks out.
ben_vulpes: whaddayamean, "checks out"
mircea_popescu: uhm. there's nothing actually wrong with this block.
mod6: and bag-o-snakes doesn't turn up 168,001 which makes sense, since it chokes on somethingthere
mod6: mircea_popescu: correct.
mod6: take a look at this other test i ran today with /just/ v0.5.3 basecode:
mircea_popescu: mod6 a remote possibility was that your problem somehow came from a bad block, tho i have/had no idea wtf that'd be
ben_vulpes: what was the story with a certain version of ssl breaking some kinds of btc signatures?
mod6: block 168,000 was accepted
mircea_popescu: which is why i asked for dump
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes most recent openssl which bitcoind imports decided to accept as valid padded sigs
mod6: something in block 168,001 makes it puke perhaps from that failed VerifySignature
mircea_popescu: mod6 yes but see, a 168`000 diddled block is a huge issue, because checkpoint.
mircea_popescu: a diddled 168`001 block, not even nearly so much.
mod6: maybe it's not a diddled 168,000 block
mircea_popescu: this doesn't seem to be in any way ungood.
mod6: maybe its 168,001 that's hosing us.
ben_vulpes: i think mp's implication is that 168001 is diddled
mircea_popescu: it's not, no.
mod6: well, im just trying to pin it down to where we go wrong.
mod6: i can still provide some sort of binary dump.
mod6: im just gathering data as best/quickly as i can
mircea_popescu: works mod6
mod6: you testing on your end?
mod6: nm.
mircea_popescu: well i've not got a wedged one
mod6: that's good!
mod6: which version, which patches?
trinque: mircea_popescu: yeh need the confirmation though to publish
trinque: that drive got destroyed in the process; blockchain on the server's now at like aug 2013
mircea_popescu: mod6 oh the mysterious mp stuff, most of which dates from 2012
mod6: oh, ok.
trinque: I guess I could just ask for the confirmations in the meantime
ben_vulpes: not cockchain!
trinque: ben_vulpes: I don't realy want to...
mircea_popescu: yeah don't drag that in .
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: 'process man' << 'Well a process man am I and I'm tellin' you no lie / I work and breathe among the fumes that tread across the sky...'
mod6: yeah, i mean, as recently as the 26th of january I was able to full sync and send/receive with: v053+patches { 1, rm_rf_upnp, 2, 3, 4, & 6 } and other people have gotten past it as well. so its not consistant as far as I can tell.
mircea_popescu: howling shit whay this log no ends!
mircea_popescu: i've been reading at it all day
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16200 @ 0.00039794 = 6.4466 BTC [+]
mod6: hmm. anyway, ok. anyway, that's pretty much the latest.
mod6: so I'll keep digging in the blk0001.dat file to see what I can find in there.
mod6: :]
mircea_popescu: "Once the attack was discovered, Anthem immediately made every effort to close the security vulnerability, contacted the FBI and began fully cooperating with their investigation. Anthem has also retained Mandiant, one of the world’s leading cybersecurity firms, to evaluate our systems and identify solutions based on the evolving landscape."
ben_vulpes: none of the portatronic builds are wedging like this, right?
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: danielpbarron's was, no ?
mircea_popescu: "dear sheep. we lost your mother. we paid off the government agent for a fix. the fix is in. fuck you."
mircea_popescu: not afaik ?
asciilifeform: 288888, incidentally.
ben_vulpes: danielpbarron: do you have a wedged portatron?
mircea_popescu: "From the Desk of Joseph R. Swedish President and CEO Anthem, Inc." << "we now act just like warrior forum scammers - it's the industree"
danielpbarron: mine didn't wedge
danielpbarron: height=188068
danielpbarron: it's the porta-tronic-bastard version
mircea_popescu: !rated lobbes
assbot: You have not rated lobbes.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: << reminds me of the time i've spent deep in the bowels of D1X and friends
assbot: The Chemical Worker's Song by Great Big Sea - YouTube ... ( )
danielpbarron: i will soon be testing a non-bastard one that i compiled myself
mircea_popescu: !rate lobbes 1 Well... he did teach himself how to view a directory...
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP:
mircea_popescu: omfg done! yay!
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: neato
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: for 'pogo' ?
danielpbarron: idk if it'll work yet but i have a bitcoind
danielpbarron: i had to change "make install" to "make install_sw" for the openssl compilation
danielpbarron: that fixed it.
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: what version of openssl ?
danielpbarron: same as yours in
asciilifeform: building on what platform ?
danielpbarron: the only thing i changed in that file is the make install thing
asciilifeform: odd, then
asciilifeform: should not have had to change anything.
asciilifeform: whatsoever.
danielpbarron: that's the assumption that was holding me back :p
danielpbarron: idk i probably messed something up somewhere
danielpbarron: this is the 2nd time i've sucessfully installed gentoo on something
asciilifeform: 66ebbad3c8ad98a07b486d39d0c3ae62b00133f8f2877cf8b97c461e7c7f40b29cf9c3cae82cf73a92dcf1daa63d33aa76c910fbcbe60158589fc7cb48f41e6d openssl-1.0.1g.tar.gz
asciilifeform: (sha512)
asciilifeform: what's yours ?
decimation: mircea_popescu: lol anthem is my health insurance
ben_vulpes: danielpbarron: that gets me two up on you
danielpbarron: i can't copy paste it easily right now, but it's the same as that asciilifeform
decimation: they said they would send a special email later when they "figure out" if I am affected or not
decimation: the bigger issue is the fact that you have to keep your social security number a 'secret'
danielpbarron: oh wait i have it hosted already
ben_vulpes: ssn secret is best secret
danielpbarron: ctrl+f openssl
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: read the makefile
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: 'install' is 'all install_docs install_sw'
asciilifeform: i take it you had the latex docs bug ?
asciilifeform: then safe to ignore.
mircea_popescu: decimation well... secret in the sense you're supposed to keep your genitals secret neh ?
decimation: in the us, if someone has your name, address, and ssn they can apply for 'credit' on your behalf
asciilifeform: and, depending on your credit rating, buy a 'boeing' with no questions asked.
decimation: similarly, they can present themselves to the local doctor as you and send you medical bills
asciilifeform: usg sees this as a civil service!
asciilifeform: i.e. if you refuse to sell yourself into debt slavery, someone is to do it for you.
decimation: somehow this is not the problem, it's the fact that derps can't keep the ssn 'secret' is the problem
asciilifeform: a... 24 bit? secret
asciilifeform: big fat secret.
decimation: asciilifeform: just as secret as your credit card number
decimation: and checking account number
asciilifeform: which is known to ten thousand waiters.
asciilifeform: checking << known to everyone you ever write a cheque to...
decimation: asciilifeform: the inevitable conclusion is that the banks/usg do not mind criminals making money off the fucktarded system
asciilifeform: the biggest criminal, usg, makes most of it.
decimation: it is certainly one way that wealth is is transferred to the 'deserving' - robin hood style
mircea_popescu: well, you may not believe this or like this, but... my banking depends on my gpg signature o.O
asciilifeform once worked with a nearly-penniless foreign postdoc whose departure from usa was hastened by some bureaucrat (who handled his papers) deciding to... buy a house in his name
asciilifeform: we all want to use mircea_popescu's bank of mars.
mircea_popescu: crazy huh.
asciilifeform: they caught the woman, eventually, and there was some penalty (a light one, iirc) but it did not send the creditors back to the holes they crawled out of
asciilifeform: and, having the option to be rid of this mess, he took it
decimation: asciilifeform: right, the banks don't give a shit because 1.) they generally don't get stuck with the bill and 2.) when they do, usg prints them up some bezzlars
asciilifeform: they also get best of both worlds if the victim is retarded, and saddles himself with the debt
asciilifeform: in any number of ways
asciilifeform: (in most u.s. states, paying even a penny - glues it to you permanently)
mircea_popescu: nah, only for five years iirc.
decimation: the whole system tends to inject bezzlars randomly throughout the 'real' economy
mircea_popescu: course if you "continue contact" it resets
asciilifeform: system tends to inject bezzlars randomly throughout the 'real' economy << at this point, this is not unlike worrying about the health effects of the embalming solution undertakers inject into their 'patients'
assbot: The World’s Email Encryption Software Relies on One Guy, Who is Going Broke - ProPublica ... ( )
asciilifeform: decimation: looks like that fella wins 'beggar of the year' ?
decimation: asciilifeform: look in the corner of his computer room - looks like a radio transmitter above his o-scope
asciilifeform: a number of common household tools in the photo
mircea_popescu: "What is Social Security Number (SSN) Randomization? The project is a forward looking initiative of the Social Security Administration (SSA) to help protect the integrity of the SSN by establishing a new randomized assignment methodology. SSN Randomization will also extend the longevity of the nine-digit SSN nationwide."
mircea_popescu: ahem. 9 digits are going to be sufficient for 300mn people ?
asciilifeform: a cheapo soldering station, etc.
asciilifeform: 'model m', with the inevitable pen clutter
decimation: mircea_popescu: it's a lulzy recycling program - in the past, us ssn's were assigned by geographical region
asciilifeform: afaik they still are ?
decimation: no that's the point of that 'randomization' program I think
asciilifeform: pointless distraction.
asciilifeform: the fiat world's refusal to use modern crypto exclusively is not a mistake, not an accident, not sloth
assbot: Social Security Number Randomization ... ( )
asciilifeform: it is a deliberate and planned act
asciilifeform: just like the failure-to-mention-mpex discussed in mircea_popescu's article
decimation: asciilifeform: the reason given against crypto is that the masses would reject a 'universal id' card
asciilifeform: forget universal anything-card
decimation: but I don't see why the government should have anything to do with verifying identity anyway
asciilifeform: just the notion that 'you are a key'
asciilifeform: not even necessarily one key
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15961 @ 0.0003885 = 6.2008 BTC [-]
decimation: why can't I go to the local costco and broker credit through them?
asciilifeform: but the notion that commercial identity can exist outside of a key - is a work of the beast.
decimation: asciilifeform: aye that's true
decimation: but you see in the usa, it is unthinkable that usg wouldn't issue keys
asciilifeform: naturally.
asciilifeform: it would be unthinkable for anyone other than usg to wipe arses, if this were practical.
asciilifeform: (for n00bs: << describes, among other things, the curious fact that within usg, only specially trained gnomes are permitted the privilege of generating keys, for use by all ranks from private to president)
assbot: Loper OS » A Country of Which Nothing is Known but the Name. ... ( )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24100 @ 0.00039713 = 9.5708 BTC [+] {2}
decimation: or similarly, it is unthinkable that a non-usg-approved-bank would issue credit or bank
asciilifeform: that was conclusively suppressed after u.s. civil war, iirc.
thestringpuller: the keymaker isn't entirely bad concept
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: for whom ?
decimation: ah, yes, the author of gpg is a ham
assbot: User:Dd9jn - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( )
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: for keymaker - a smashingly great concept.
thestringpuller: have you not seen the matrix?
thestringpuller: why would you not one smith who can make any key for any vessel?
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: you go and fuck your wife, but you mustn't slip it in directly - gotta put it in this little gnome fella first
asciilifeform: and he sticks his in the wife
asciilifeform: any other way - treasonous.
thestringpuller: from this standpoint yes
thestringpuller: but concept of keymaker "program" entity/individual who is skeleton key maker
mod6: lol pillow pants
thestringpuller: is extremely valuable
thestringpuller: unlock all the things
thestringpuller: mod6: has been watching too many mc hammer videos
asciilifeform: ;;ud pillow pants
gribble: | pillow pants. Pussy Troll. The parents place it in their daughter pussy. If a penis trys entering the pussy before the age of 21 then the Pussy Troll will bite it off.
mircea_popescu: so basically, by pulling a ssn out of my arse i have just about 1:2 odds of hitting someone
mircea_popescu: and what's better, since they are re=used, you needn't only worry about your own indiscretions, but those of people long dead
mircea_popescu: this sounds a lot like getting used skin to live in.
asciilifeform: and for all of fiddybucks, a name, mailing addr., work history, political party, to go with it.
asciilifeform: generally the credit agencies are somewhat better at tracking deaths than, e.g., the voter rolls
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i think this is the best proof possible that current usg does not expect to survive more than a few years into the future anyway.
asciilifeform: see above
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: this is probably how CIA makes assets these days
thestringpuller: or at least cover
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: it is a traditional algorithm for crafting fake people for official uses
asciilifeform: not even a secret of any kind
asciilifeform: (openly discussed in agency-authorized historical texts)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: usg does not care (or even encourages, see earlier 'house-buying' postdoc story) about a plebe impersonating another plebe.
asciilifeform: when some hobo successfully impersonates obama, or buffett - then.
assbot: Clerks 2- pillowpants - YouTube ... ( )
mircea_popescu: i doubt it's aware enough for something like this.
thestringpuller: good 'ol kevin smith
asciilifeform: who wants to be the first to buy a certified pre-owned (tm) ru nuke sub as mr buffett ?
assbot: Not so simple: U.S. spy agency trying to go mobile| Reuters ... ( )
decimation: "Generals and others have been known to become so frustrated with the existing devices that they switch to personal cellphones to conduct classified conversations, according to a former U.S. official."
decimation: apparently nobody in usg gives a shit
asciilifeform: the 'obamaphone' (not the one handed out to paupers, the other obamaphone) is well-known at this point
decimation: < ""There's no such thing as 'secure' any more," Debora Plunkett of the National Security Agency said on Thursday amid U.S. anger and embarrassment over disclosure of sensitive diplomatic cables by the web site WikiLeaks."
assbot: U.S. code-cracking agency works as if compromised| Technology| Reuters ... ( )
mircea_popescu: decimation they probably manifest that list of qualities which made "state' such a damning adjective in romanian.
mircea_popescu: to get an idea, picture blackberry today. in romanian it'd be "state ipad"
asciilifeform: decimation: that article has the beginnings of a glorious 'onion piece'
mircea_popescu: iirc in russian similarly.,
asciilifeform: 'of course we must assume that the adversary owns the network. this is why nukes must be expected to fly anywhere at all, .... ...'
asciilifeform: 'state ipad', but one nitpick, this presumes that somewhere there lives a 'normal' one.
mircea_popescu: no. just a... sexy one.
assbot: Why we should worry about domestic drones and how to bring them down ... ( )
mircea_popescu: people's disenchantment with their own wives isn't predicated on the theory that somewhere there's a sane woman waiting.
mircea_popescu: merely, younger, nakeder, eager-er.
asciilifeform: ^ recall mircea_popescu's 'nobody could have foreseen' article
decimation: asciilifeform: yes it's actually an extraordinary admission of usg's capitulation
decimation: "making things secure is hard, let's just give up"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform heh reuters has a yearlong delay off trilema huh.
asciilifeform: decimation: psyops to make plebes give up sooner.
decimation: eh, I'm not so sure. the implication of that would be that usg is extraordinarily competent
asciilifeform: [insert 'meta-nsa' thread here]
asciilifeform: 'A Homeland Security sensor deployed to spot — but not interfere with — drones flying above the Major League Baseball All-Star Game in Minneapolis last July “cost several hundred thousand dollars to operate for just that night,” reported the New York Times.'
asciilifeform falls down from lulz
asciilifeform: 'The Secret Service uses covert radio-frequency jammers inside a Chevrolet Suburban that travels with the president’s motorcade. These devices disable remotely triggered improvised bombs. But because they have to disable explosives set off by a potentially large number of frequencies, the jammers saturate a wide spectrum, occasionally interfering with cellphones nearby.' << this deserves an aside
asciilifeform: the particular apparatus involved is discussed in reasonably clear terms in textbooks
asciilifeform: e.g., r. poisel's 'communications electronic warfare systems'
asciilifeform: ^ not a bad place to start
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu ^ 'g3n3r1c j4mm3rz!'
mircea_popescu: um... wouldn't you just set the bomb to go off when the jammer goes by ?
mircea_popescu: what are these people, idiots ?
asciilifeform: what's actually inside? unsurprisingly, a catalogue of frequencies used by cellular, wireless housephones, toy cars, teledildoes...
asciilifeform: wouldn't you set off << a) no, because, e.g., toy car or phone has a discriminator - required bitstring (a la 'MAC address') that must match
asciilifeform: to avoid interference from neighbours' teledildoes
assbot: Philip Greenspun's Weblog » White House Security ... ( )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66000 @ 0.00038944 = 25.703 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: b) if set off, because receiver was built from shoebox, string and dead squirrel - this is meant to happen -before- the truck reaches the mine
decimation: not if the bomb is sufficiently large
asciilifeform: decimation: see also 'wasp'.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform but you make your own reception.
mircea_popescu: set it to go off whenever a large collection of radiodildoes, phones and toy cars goes over it
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: americans themselves have a specially custom rocket that does only this.
asciilifeform: and likewise most nations
decimation does not condone violence against any living thing
asciilifeform condones violence against chickens
asciilifeform and potatoes
mircea_popescu: i condone all violence that doesn't sit around waiting for my condonement.
mircea_popescu: wtf bs violence is this.
decimation: like your software license?
mircea_popescu: i guess so, huh.
asciilifeform: unlicense!
mircea_popescu: 'I don't want to join the bloody Army, I don't want to go unto the war; I want no more to roam, I'd rather stay at home, Living on the earnings of a whore.'
assbot: The Chinese Military Blasted a Private Drone With a Shotgun — War Is Boring — Medium ... ( )
asciilifeform: ^ related
asciilifeform: re: jammers:
asciilifeform: terrain tracking navigator is not such a hard problem.
asciilifeform: jam that.
mircea_popescu: duffel ?
decimation: re: ibm < of course the 100,000 person layoff comes after paying $1.3 bn to not make chips anymore
assbot: IBM sells chip business to GlobalFoundries for $1.5 billion (updated) | ExtremeTech ... ( )
decimation: which is of course its only possible route to relevance
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 3234 @ 0.00096158 = 3.1097 BTC [-] {8}
asciilifeform: !s ibm real estate
assbot: 2 results for 'ibm real estate' :
asciilifeform: how the mighty have fallen! and to think, ibm was once the sole source of jew list tabulators to nazis
decimation: asciilifeform: apparently real estate deals and indian shit-code are its core business now
decimation: kind like hp's core business is printer ink
asciilifeform: or texas instruments and the remaining pocket calculators
decimation: at least ti still makes chips
asciilifeform: 'makes'
asciilifeform: in asia.
decimation: well, yeah
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no but it makes them because "it controls the ip" or how did that line go/
mircea_popescu: nobody else could make ti pocket calculators for lack of ti chip documentation. leaving alone why anyone would want to, after ti paid for tha someone to build their plants.
asciilifeform: 1.5b for ibm's chip div. << state of maryland could have bought one and a half of these for the cost of road 200 (a recently built, money-losing toll road i frequent.)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: surprisingly, the calculators use very well-understood, ancient components
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: on account of the designs dating back to the mid '80s
asciilifeform: as i understand, they've introduced a few devices where this 'problem' is 'fixed'
asciilifeform: (an 'arm' cpu, fat ram, and... an emulator of the 1980s calcs)
mircea_popescu: myeah. obviously point meant as a general - and thus indefensible - jab >
asciilifeform: ^ these were mandatory (!? i know) in the school
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> ^ these were mandatory (!? i know) in the school << TI's survival is hinged to the "education standards" bezzel
decimation: asciilifeform: re: road 200 << I actually drove on this road a few times. it was pointlessly empty, as well as having a low speed limit (55 mph)
decimation: it was built as a favor to one of the wash dc land barons
asciilifeform: empty on account of outlandish tolls
asciilifeform: interestingly, speed limit could easily be enforced by the (photo-operated) toll machines - but isn't
asciilifeform: instead, there are 6 (?) policecars, in special '200' livery, at all times.
decimation: "The pact includes construction of a planned I-95 interchange with Contee Road near Maryland Route 198, and extension of Virginia Manor Road for access to the proposed 2,200-acre mixed-use development."
assbot: Agreement allows Konterra project to move forward - Maryland Politics - The Washington Post ... ( )
asciilifeform: spot checks, so nobody actually drives the limit
decimation: asciilifeform: it is my understanding that the toll machines are 'banned' from enforcing speed limit
asciilifeform: i bet mircea_popescu knows what the pupils -actually- did with those calculators.
decimation: heh I used to play that game on bbs's
asciilifeform: decimation: same dynamics as the management of hunting in game preserves.
decimation: < " O'Malley thanked the Konterra developers, Kingdon Gould Jr. and his son Caleb Gould, for cooperating to allow the state to move forward with the ICC plan without the costs of going to court to acquire the land."
assbot: ICC pieces fall into place for Konterra ... ( )
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: No, I had the TI-89, mostly the same except for form factor. I have no idea what that important looking rectangle is.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: from five minute's dig, seems like it was a rom.
mircea_popescu: "And yet somehow the ruling class decayed, lost its ability, its daring, finally even its ruthlessness, until a time came when stuffed shirts like Eden or Halifax could stand out as men of exceptional talent. As for Baldwin, one could not even dignify him with the name of stuffed shirt. He was simply a hole in the air. "
mircea_popescu: dude... this puts mpoe-pr to shame
mircea_popescu: "simply a hole in the air" !?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: toldya he was worth digging into
mircea_popescu: !up rodgort
[]bot: Bet created: "American Sniper wins Oscar for Best Picture"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61721 @ 0.0003888 = 23.9971 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: 89 was same "civillian" form factor as 83, On the 92 user accessible rom like that could be a thing.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i had several. see log
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: the original 'blue arrow keys' was best.
BingoBoingo: That it was. I wasn't a fan of the aesthetics of the redesign
asciilifeform: not just that
asciilifeform: the later grey blob, with the usb jack, also had... a boot time.
asciilifeform: (a second or so, but it much grated on the nerves)
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: << the 'plus module' from earlier. updated rom + eeprom (original -92 lacked eeprom)
assbot: TI-Planet | Voir l'image - Module TI-92 Plus ... ( )
cazalla: ah damn that was good ghetto bouillabaisse
asciilifeform: ^ all of them, i think
BingoBoingo: That is a collection
BingoBoingo: The 86 was a good looking computer
assbot: Review, Teardown: Apotop Wi-Copy (DW21) 5200mAh Power Bank | Gough's Tech Zone ... ( )
asciilifeform: but, unless i missed something, no info anywhere re: ram on the board.
asciilifeform: if anyone has one of these, please pop the cover and take a photo.
asciilifeform: of the side not shown, that is
asciilifeform: i like that the 802.11 card - comes off.
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: has the best toys
asciilifeform: ^ not mine
asciilifeform: all i have is this picture.
decimation: asciilifeform: I like the 5.2 amp hour battery
asciilifeform: peculiarly high price tag, but perhaps will fall to somewhere close to zero as they sit on the shelves.
decimation: what's the point of the battery?
decimation: backup for power failure?
asciilifeform: these are, i think, meant to be used with iPnohe
asciilifeform: which does not allow expansion of storage in the customary way
asciilifeform: (no slots)
asciilifeform: but luser gets to stuff sd card or usb drive into this gizmo, which serves up contents over http
decimation: lol that's silly
asciilifeform: silly or not, apparently there are at least half a dozen makers of just this.
decimation: but it would be useful for powering all kinds of interesting widgets
asciilifeform: i looked at several when hunting for node hardware
asciilifeform: none had any more than 32m of ram
decimation: asciilifeform: do you know what cpu it has? some arm variant?
asciilifeform: decimation: interestingly!
decimation: ah RTL8196D
decimation: mips64?
asciilifeform: for some reason sitting on the wireless daughterboard.
asciilifeform: 32, iirc
decimation: well the main cpu runs some kind of arm probably because it appears to run android
asciilifeform: there is a mips-android...
asciilifeform: (even x86, iirc.)
decimation: ah no the android software is running on a phone connected to the device, sorry for the confusion
decimation: huh I didn't realize google supported non-arm chips
decimation: actually that little device (wi-copy) would be a good buy just to harvest the parts
asciilifeform: not at the sticker price.
decimation: nah, but less than say $20-30
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