Hide Idle (>14 d.) Chans
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asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: unrelated - recent re-read, recommended to you specifically - 'the design of the unix operating system', m. j. bach.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Will put in on the list.
BingoBoingo still reeling over last week's discovery that of all distros Linux Mint appears as though it will be a systemd holdout.
asciilifeform: best holdout/distro is no distro
asciilifeform: home cooking.
asciilifeform: 'gentoo' is sufficiently malleable, presently, to fill the role.
BingoBoingo: Right, Linux Mint still comes with so many bolt ons and opaque Ubuntu heart.
asciilifeform: creeping poetteringisms in all known distro, however.
asciilifeform: e.g., 'dbus'.
assbot: Comment la neige a permis l'arrestation d'un cultivateur de weed... (De /Torped00) http://t.co/zGp3XbDSEf
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: wallowing with the eagles, soaring with the pigs, eh
cazalla: punkman, took me a moment
danielpbarron: it's a Bible channel / not usually that kind of conversation in there
BingoBoingo: Wallowing with the Eagles is the best wallowing.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 97 @ 0.06998999 = 6.789 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: so apparently there exists a real estate firm in ba called "asses propriedades"
mircea_popescu: "hello, yeah, i'd like to rent an ass. can i live in it ?"
BingoBoingo: Have any pogo people run the ArmV build with a preloaded blockchain (i.e. minimal initial sync before current)?
thestringpuller: "yo homie we major"
thestringpuller: BingoBoingo: what'd you think of the game?
thestringpuller: Can't believe all action in 4th quarter.
thestringpuller: also when did Kurt Warner become old?
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: Bullshit ending. Also I really want a 30 foot golden mechanical tiger to ride for when the times come.
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: Kurt Warner's always been old.
BingoBoingo: Even when he was on the Rams he was old having bagged groceries and played NFL Europe.
BingoBoingo very disappoint the game didn't end with Whitey getting Lynched
assbot: Hacking on the Satoshi Codebase | Hacker News ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztMAxF )
thestringpuller: Kurt Warner went hard in 2000
thestringpuller: Rams vs Titans was a great game.
thestringpuller: iirc it almost went into OT
BingoBoingo: Indeed. Would have been nice to see Seattle win on the ground and close the book on the Air Assault era that ushered in
BingoBoingo: It did almost do that
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 175750 @ 0.00036135 = 63.5073 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 115224 @ 0.0003655 = 42.1144 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 80300 @ 0.00036806 = 29.5552 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: 'In the interest of the reference implementation being a robust solution that requires minimal trust of its peers the header's only approach favored by the Vessenes' foundation's forks' developers.' <<< wat?
asciilifeform failed to parse this sentence
BingoBoingo: how about: In the interest of the reference implementation being a robust solution that requires minimal trust of its peers, the header's only approach favored by the Vessenes' foundation's forks' developers is being passed over in favor of actual solutions.
cazalla: asciilifeform, ya need a few beers, reads ok here, had a few beers though
BingoBoingo: cazalla: I tried to fix the parsing. Sentence needed a subject among other things.
adlai: header's?
adlai: like, the header only had one approach, so this approach was the header's only approach?
mircea_popescu: stickler's
adlai: ye's
BingoBoingo: Sentence refactored again
adlai: it's fucking underlined in blue, how does it not jump out to you
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 81372 @ 0.00036973 = 30.0857 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: I am blind to the things I write.
assbot: Abracadabra - Steve Millers Band (Lyrics) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztOWfR )
adlai: actually if we go full anal, strunk & white specifically mentions that the plural of a singular ending in s includes an additional apostrophe+s, so it'd be « Vessenes's »
asciilifeform was taught this formula
BingoBoingo: Vessenes is not a singular
BingoBoingo: Y. Pestis does not occur in the singular
mircea_popescu: vesseneii & winklevii
mircea_popescu: actually i suppose it could be winkleix by now
mircea_popescu: they're way past the 8th "launch"of their whatever it is.
BingoBoingo: Winkelgox
mircea_popescu: wynona ryder's somehow going to end up mixed in all this isn't she.
BingoBoingo: Is she still a thing?
mircea_popescu: don't thingify women!
BingoBoingo: She thingified shoplifting
mircea_popescu: she just liberated some items from an oppressive representative hierarchical inventory system.
mircea_popescu: that's not even objective!
BingoBoingo: Right, and it lead to Obama
mircea_popescu: hm. no lead obama, now that'd probably help the environment.
BingoBoingo: And you know where they mine lead? Ozarkistan.
mircea_popescu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ge9Ou3-YyqU << this is perhaps the oddest set for a pop song.
assbot: Brian Hyland "Itsy Bitsy Teenie Weenie Yellow Polka Dot Bikini" - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztPuTa )
mircea_popescu: i suppose they did more solid ice in the 60s than previously thought.
BingoBoingo: Totally. And then Nixon killed the Chemistry hobby.
assbot: Mating Grounds: Geoffrey Miller and Tucker Max Copy Danger & Play and Hilarity Ensues - Danger & Play ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztPUbY )
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1927 @ 0.00095462 = 1.8396 BTC [-] {7}
BingoBoingo: !up BigBitz
assbot: Tucker Max Is Lying - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztR5s7 )
assbot: Logged on 29-01-2015 04:14:19; asciilifeform: they 'which room'
mircea_popescu: this guy is supposedly a big deal internet marketing thing. why the fuck does he live in half a kitchinette separated by a pressedboard pane from the other half ?
mircea_popescu: or wtf is going on in there ?
asciilifeform: that's 'roosh'
asciilifeform: (a 'moldbugsphere' blogger, iirc)
asciilifeform: not a mega-business-king
mircea_popescu: well afaik he identifies as a capt'n of the whole "how to get laid" thing.
asciilifeform confesses that he was never a regular reader of herr roosh
mircea_popescu: but yes, the general idea is that these are people who trasnform the culture and are well read and etc.
mircea_popescu: i suppose i misunderstand power on top of everything else. and ows did things.
asciilifeform: although his colleague, 'heartiste', once referred to yours truly as 'the moldbug of computer science'
asciilifeform: wasn't sure if this was a plus or minus
mircea_popescu: Daryush Valizadeh,[1] (born June 14, 1979)[2] also known as Roosh V and Roosh Vorek, is an American[3] writer, pick-up artist[4][5] and self-styled "love tourist"[6] of Iranian and Armenian descent,[7] known for his writings on seduction and antifeminism.
mircea_popescu: that's a pretty epic name, valizadeh.
mircea_popescu: "dditionally, Roosh has self-published 14 books, most of which offer advice to men on how to sleep with women in specific countries."
mircea_popescu: come on. 14 books ?!
mircea_popescu: o hey, made the splc kill list.
asciilifeform: not so hard.
asciilifeform: they had a period of adding 'moldy' folks
hanbot: <assbot> Tucker Max Is Lying << dude clinton should've been made emperor stead of impeached. clearly this is the sort of shit they're interested in.
cazalla: self-published as in hey, i uploaded my shit to amazon, i'm an author now
asciilifeform: i even remember a surreal thread, somewhere obscure, where people were pissed at not having been selected yet
mircea_popescu: lmao he never wrote about... hungary ? romania ? czech republic ? wtf is wrong with this guy lmao
mircea_popescu: yeah, go have random sex in iceland.
mircea_popescu: hanbot well somehow it turns out you can't be an emperor on the support of 20something us boys.
mircea_popescu: "Bang Ukraine: How to Have Sex With Ukrainian Girls In Ukraine (2012)"
mircea_popescu: uh... i dunno, go to any of the campuses, pick a girl and take her out to lunch ?
hanbot: oh, right.
mircea_popescu: worked in 1995. worked in 1997. worked in... 2002 iirc.
mircea_popescu: "Roosh's Argentina Compendium: Pickup Tips, City Guides, And Stories (2011) "
asciilifeform still has trouble picturing anyone for whom the book - specifically - makes the difference
mircea_popescu: holy shit, there's three different bars within ten blocks of where you live, you can just go there and LOOK at a girl.
mircea_popescu: she'll come right over, and if you speak spanish it's somethinjg like 500 pesos
mircea_popescu: about 30 bux.
mircea_popescu: otherwise whatever, pay her a hundred.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this is not the objective for the 'pickup' folks
mircea_popescu: s/ten blocks of where you live/ten blocks of where I live/
mircea_popescu: but anyway
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform but the book costs as much ?
mircea_popescu: i guess the time to read it dun count.
mircea_popescu: sad fact of the matter is, any book costs me about a dollar a page or thereabouts.
assbot: Logged on 19-01-2014 19:38:32; asciilifeform: as a boy, i read about an 18th c. book, 'Triple Power over the Forces of Hell'
cazalla: haha this guy played a bit too much road rash, it's almost a copy/pasta of coming off your bike in that game http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d92_1422724643 around 0:40
assbot: LiveLeak.com - Biker Goes Airborne ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztS0Zx )
mircea_popescu: "Tucker Max was a hero of mine. I discovered his writing at the age of eighteen, and idolized his literary persona for the next five years. His descent into mediocrity has been painful for me to watch.
mircea_popescu: Most would say that Tucker Max was nothing more than a brief flash-in-the-pan, a pony whose only trick was vulgar frat boy humour. But the reality is that Tucker Max’s stories were more than just entertainment: They articulated a new male identity that was unapologetically masculine and intellectual."
mircea_popescu: this is what you get from "no child left behind"
mircea_popescu: fucking bush.
asciilifeform: in the philosophy of the 'pickup' folks, you don't grade as 'l33t' if you pay the whore
asciilifeform: have to score 'on your merits'
mircea_popescu: so what, if you have money it's not your money ?
assbot: Last 3 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/3PDX1DS.txt )
mircea_popescu: why the fuck WOULDNT you pay the woman. this is beyond me. i am not discussing a whore here. forget that part. i go out, and notice a girl sitting down. i chat her up, she comes with me and i fuck her. turns out she's 17, she's a virgin, and she's never even THOUGHT of doing anything like this, in her life.
asciilifeform: afaik they don't have a position on money per se, except that it can be used to travel to faraway lands where the great satan has not perverted womankind
mircea_popescu: but kids experiment and she's a kid and she's experimented.
mircea_popescu: and now the idea is, i can't buy her a car.
mircea_popescu: why the fuck not ?
mircea_popescu: has she not earned it ?
asciilifeform: why not
mircea_popescu: brave kid, why shoudn't she have good stuff ?
asciilifeform: afaik the pickup folks have no position on which, if any, car, boeing, planet, one should buy -after-
mircea_popescu: if i don't buy her a car and some fat and bald goofball buys his "daughter" whom his wife had with the plumber the car
mircea_popescu: and he's not even fucking her!
mircea_popescu: what sort of society are we building here!
asciilifeform: the car, as i understand, has to come -after-, or you fished with dynamite - and any idiot with a stick of dynamite can then be a 'great fisherman'
asciilifeform: and such feats of fish-catching are not of interest to the serious scholars.
asciilifeform: sumthinglikethat
mircea_popescu: so working out is okay ?
mircea_popescu: can you wash ?
mircea_popescu: anyone aged 20 and clean can get laid, is that fair ?
asciilifeform: aha. the books actually take the trouble to mention both
mircea_popescu: why those and not this ?
mircea_popescu: is being tall accepted ? or also fishing with dynamite ?
asciilifeform: except for the obvious implication that - why is the reader reading?
asciilifeform: in the words of tlp, 'if you're reading it, it's for you'
mircea_popescu: very feminist/socialist this you know ? "more brownie points for being a tranny than for bein a white male". "why ?" "uhmmm... because we're stupid" "ah ok"
asciilifeform did not invent this particular flavour of crackpottery, but has seen a good sampling thereof
mircea_popescu: so money, which someone CAN get , is right off. but being tall, which someone CAN NOT get, and is certainly more on the button than money when hitting on a woman, is ok.
asciilifeform regards 'pickup' literature as a very low kind of sc4mz0ry, like shady cancer cures pitched to the desperately ill
mircea_popescu: plenty of stuff is quite reasonable - wash, stay in shape etc.
asciilifeform: don't need book, for this
mircea_popescu: but it's quite clearly something done by the poor for the poor, this.
mircea_popescu: and im not altogether convinced the poor should get laid all that much.
asciilifeform: book is supposed to help you 'cheat' by summoning devils ^H^H^H^H^H^H psy-programming
mircea_popescu: oh don't tell me it's resurecting that neurocrap
asciilifeform: it started, iirc, there.
mircea_popescu: wtf was it called, narrowly missed becoming a grant bezzle
asciilifeform: neuro-linguistic-programming
punkman: david deangelo
asciilifeform: i think it was
punkman: that's it
asciilifeform: a sort of rebranded hypnosis/mesmerism
mircea_popescu: exact fucking equivalent of the "expert systems" failed msword&excel-based approach to hard ai
asciilifeform: one of the facts known to all dedicated students of 'psychoceramics' (study of crackpots! what else, lol) is that genuinely new idiocies are invented quite infrequently
mircea_popescu: hm, i guess the actual practice evolved under selective pressure more towards the cold calling / stage magician thing
asciilifeform: most are rebrandings of something earlier.
mircea_popescu: but i mean intelelctualy, the theory behind it
asciilifeform: but being tall, which someone CAN NOT get, <<<< ahahha. soviet science winz again. had a process for -actually- growing taller.
asciilifeform: they break yer legs and stretch in a specially made frame.
asciilifeform: 1+ yr of wheelchair.
asciilifeform: i'm told that american kidz with more money than sense, still travel to russia to get this.
mircea_popescu: actually i'm being whispered in ear that a) it's called manosphere now, and b) the central point is that women lie a lot and guys hafta be confident.
mircea_popescu: i guess also not need a book for.
asciilifeform: more of less 1 sentence summary of the sane parts ^
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform my intel is great at summaries. it... has to be.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: understand, -everybody- wants a wunderwaffen.
assbot: Logged on 22-04-2014 12:51:23; asciilifeform: phun phact: as a student, i once seriously planned to build a pocket gas chromatographer, to pick up gurlz. how!? to do this - exercise for alert reader.
mircea_popescu: i missed that line. what, see if they're ovulating ? drunk ?
asciilifeform: (see rest of that thread)
asciilifeform: no, did not actually do this!
mircea_popescu: dude really, it's very easy to pick up girls. tell her what to do. if she does it, fine. if she doesn't, there's more.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43747 @ 0.00036498 = 15.9668 BTC [-] {2}
asciilifeform: dude really, it is very easy to fly. just bend your arms into an effective lift surface, right angle of attack, and fart really hard.
asciilifeform: use suit jacket as ailerons.
mircea_popescu: i am not going to end up writing about this. apparently it's well covered.
assbot: Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2AHKGZD.txt )
mircea_popescu: gotcha bb!
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I think the spoiler improves it.
asciilifeform: incidentally, anyone ever wonder what kind of brain damage is necessary to think that someone will sell you a book on how to win the ultimate zero-sum game?
asciilifeform: (well, rather, sell you a book that's worth something)
mircea_popescu: which is the zero sum game ?
asciilifeform: 'pikup'
mircea_popescu: you're not about to tell me that mammal reproduction is a zero sum game
mircea_popescu: holy hell...
mircea_popescu: listen! HEDGEHOGS DO IT.
BingoBoingo kind of wants fMRI for investigating this brain damage at some point. Maybe it can live in the belly of 30 foot golden mechanical tiger.
asciilifeform: as envisioned by the practicants!
punkman: is there a "paleo pickup" branch? "work out a lot so you can actually pick them up and walk off with them"
asciilifeform: they posit that the marks should become long-term orbiters of the operator, somehow
mircea_popescu: they do ?
asciilifeform: in at least one text
mircea_popescu: i thought the idea was to always get rid of them, which is why they keep getting shitty sex
asciilifeform: no, in some schools of thought, one is supposed to emplace them in orbits
mircea_popescu: (one has to have shitty sex to imagine literotica is a good description of sexuality and the really really important part about a great piece of ass is her bra size)
punkman: asciilifeform: no, in some schools of thought, one is supposed to emplace them in orbits << the not-harem
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so like... keep slavegirls ?
mircea_popescu: punkman tell ?
assbot: Are Forced Injections the New Taser? « Total Criminal Defense ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztTYZS )
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: the old taser.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: sop in ussr
mircea_popescu: dude the land of the free....
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Usually here they wait until the hospital. Traditional mixture here is B-52 comprised of Benadryl, 5 mg haloperidol, 2 mg ativan.
asciilifeform: психушка!
punkman: mircea_popescu: they had some acronym for it. long term multiple relationship something
punkman: so multiple girlfriends, but you can't have them at the same time
mircea_popescu: punkman why not ?!
punkman: because it's "hard"
mircea_popescu: no its not lmao.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: needs floor space.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: like machining.
mircea_popescu: a) chicks love each other, unless brainwashed otherwise and b) where the fuck is that article brb
assbot: The Lifestyle of Having Multiple Girlfriends ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztU9UV )
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> mircea_popescu: like machining. << mill cut Bastard file takes minimal space
assbot: Intre doo nu te ploo pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztUgzR )
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: that'd be the machinist's equivalent of a 'fleshlight'
BingoBoingo: "Jungle Conditions"
mircea_popescu: anyway, the quote i wanted "A treia observatie este ca-i falsa teoria conform careia a te iubi cu doua fete e dificil din motive de anduranta fizica, adica tu abia rezisti s-o multumesti pe una, ce te faci cind is doua ?!" and from there on, "Ei bine, cu doua fete prezente, dornice si rabolite ambele segmente se extind cacascavalu' pane, si nu se mai dau dom'le duse. Chiar glumeam ca-i distractia pulii situatia, vrea s
mircea_popescu: a se bage putin si-aici, putin si-acolo, si-n gaurica asta ce-i, da-n gaurica aia cumu-i, si nu se mai lasa odata convinsa ca vrea sa incerce din toate ca plodu-n magazinu' de inghetati."
mircea_popescu: i guess ima have to make this english.
assbot: MLTR: Multiple Long Term Relationships - tips!!! | PUA FORUMS ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztUo2x )
asciilifeform: 238389.
punkman: mircea_popescu: dude really, it's very easy to pick up girls. tell her what to do. if she does it, fine. if she doesn't, there's more. << I should "self-publish" that on Amazon
mircea_popescu: "The third point is that the theory by which loving two girls is difficult for cause of limited physical endurance, which is to say you can barely satisfy one, what the fuck to do with two is entirely false.
mircea_popescu: I know not of others, but of myself I can testify of how testy things go. In any sexual act by which I mean copulation, there's present two segments. The first, from onset until I feel I can ejaculate if I wish to, an the second from there on, which is to say until whether I wish to or not, it's coming out. Depending on various factors, such as if I'm tired, or not well acquainted with the miss and I'm shocked by how g
mircea_popescu: ood she looks etc, the second segment may compress even to a quarter inute and such, but otherwise it's generally equal to the first, half hour, an hour, whatever.
mircea_popescu: Well, with two girls present, eager and widely spread both segments expand like grilled cheese, and won't get gone already! We were even laughing at the cock's amusement, it wants a little in there, and a little in here, but what's in this little hole, how's it like in that one, it just woudn't give up because it kept wanting to try stuff like the kid in the icecream store."
asciilifeform: punkman: see guide to flying, same thread.
BingoBoingo: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 341592 | Current Difficulty: 4.127287389469702E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 342719 | Next Difficulty In: 1127 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 12 hours, 19 minutes, and 12 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 45096160710.8 | Estimated Percent Change: 9.26344
punkman: asciilifeform: what's missing from the recipe?
punkman: looks very adequate to me
asciilifeform: punkman: nothing whatsoever. the recipe is complete, total, perfect.
asciilifeform: now get thee to the airstrip.
mircea_popescu: don't add useless in there!
assbot: Things I Won't Touch (1). In the Pipeline: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CoLQ0g )
cazalla: mircea_popescu> and im not altogether convinced the poor should get laid all that much. <<< isn't that all the poor do? what else are ya gonna do but fuck
mircea_popescu: cazalla that'd be the problem.
mircea_popescu: not for the retarded reasons of "omg they're making babies" or stupid like that.
cazalla: i got laid far more when i had next to nothing and lived at home with my parents
mircea_popescu: the problem is that if you running around in a circle yields you 10 dopamine bitcoins per hour, and actually reading the logs yields you 1 dopamine bitcoin per hour increasing by 10% every subsequent hour,
mircea_popescu: you're going to end up on the forum.
mircea_popescu: poor people have this very massive twin headed disadvantage where a) they start from a very low basis, hence the 1 bitcoin and b) they start surrounded by morons, so nobody to tell them about the importance of %s
mircea_popescu: fucking less when you're poor is a great plan. you'll get bored, which makes you question your environment, and perhaps even find better shit to do.
asciilifeform: what's next, suggest doing less dope when poor? less drink? lol
mircea_popescu: and generally, cutting down on everything you enjoy whenever you don't like where you are generally is a splendid plan.
mircea_popescu: so fundamentally good even most animals know and apply it.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform quite.
asciilifeform adjusts hair shirt
mircea_popescu: simply that : whenever you don't like where you are, do less of everything you like and more of everything that's hard.
asciilifeform: simulated annealing...
BingoBoingo: perhaps even actual annealing
assbot: The Selling of the Avocado - The Atlantic ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztVJGz )
cazalla: nz grows nice avocados
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo california's really going to shit for produce isnt it
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Haven't been there myself to check but most produce here seems to come from Chile, Peru, and Mexico
BingoBoingo: Or if in season it comes locally.
mircea_popescu: california used to be a huge vegetable and so forth producer
mircea_popescu: fed about half the us i nthe 70s
BingoBoingo: Right, but then came the water troubles
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43100 @ 0.0003598 = 15.5074 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: Far more farms locally doing the produce thing though. Might be that California priced itself out.
BingoBoingo: Could be the california wine thing's expanded into land that used to be produce? Could be any number of things, but... They just don't own the produce section like they used to.
mircea_popescu: here's a well known open secret : wine is not a market.
mircea_popescu: europe is sitting on a lake of wine the size of wisconsin.
assbot: Wines & Vines - Wine Industry Data Center ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztWHlZ )
BingoBoingo: American wine mostly consists of Gallo et al and people who want to own wineries jsut because
mircea_popescu: i guess it's the puritan thing to do. can't buy the girl her own car, but you can have her over at your exclusive winery resort / dude farm for aweek.
punkman: and your shit wine costs you $2k a bottle
mircea_popescu: so she can bring a bunch of dudes over and then you can text her abvout how she shouldn't instagram black cock stretching her out
cazalla: BingoBoingo, a bunch of aussies found that one out the hard way.. ass droppped out of the aussie grape market
mircea_popescu: and you can be called out by gawker and lose your team for half a billion
mircea_popescu: which will buy more wineries.
mircea_popescu: punkman meanwhile fine bordeaux can readily be had for 50 euros a bottle./
BingoBoingo: Pretty much how it works.
punkman: mircea_popescu: and local wine costs about 2-3eur a liter
mircea_popescu: generally yeah. bout what it is in romania, italy and every other producing country.
punkman: and since I'm a barbarian, I even buy it in a box
mircea_popescu: and i think it's fine and i also drink it, so there's that.
mircea_popescu: meh, i stick to bottles.
BingoBoingo: Local (Illinois/Missouri) can run $7-15 a bottle. Not particularly good, but more flavor than Gallo
mircea_popescu: but yes, recas (timisoara's pocket winery) has plenty of passable wines from 15 lei.
punkman: about wine lake: " Plan Bordeaux: an initiative introduced in 2005 by ONIVINS, the French vintners association, designed to reduce France's wine glut and improve sales. Part of the plan is to uproot 17,000 hectares of the 124,000 hectares of vineyards in Bordeaux."
punkman: why don't they make some room for cows that taste good
BingoBoingo: ^Another California problem. Wasting land on Cows that would be fine in Wisconsin, and promoting "California Cheese"
punkman: france exports a lot of cow. I've yet to buy one that's fit for something other than stew
punkman: I did have some steak of Uruguay the other day, was excellent.
cazalla: they grow nice cows here on king island, cost a bit extra but tasty so ya know, prob best steak in australia, least from what i've purchased
cazalla: and being from tasmania, gotta be good
punkman: so when someone wants to buy some live cows from latin america, do you have to airmail it?
assbot: Livestock carrier - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1ztYyr6 )
mircea_popescu: you airmail it by asciilifeform method.
mircea_popescu: they do produce methane.
punkman: cow-rocket does sound faster
mircea_popescu: plus with any luck it arrives cooked.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 105950 @ 0.00036099 = 38.2469 BTC [+]
punkman: if you are the Sultan of Oman, you can apparently airmail even 200 cows at once. http://modernfarmer.com/2014/01/ship-cow/
assbot: How to Ship a Cow - Modern Farmer ... ( http://bit.ly/1D4BKki )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56500 @ 0.00036292 = 20.505 BTC [+] {2}
punkman: offline arm-box decided to die, hmm
punkman: maybe time to get a pogo
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15200 @ 0.00036732 = 5.5833 BTC [+]
assbot: Lawyer Arrested For Doing Her Job | Above the Law ... ( http://bit.ly/1K2kMVG )
mircea_popescu: this shit's pretty epic.
mircea_popescu: " A veteran Assistant Public Defender in San Francisco, Jami Tillotson, was in a courtroom when she learned that another of her clients was being questioned in the hallway by a platoon of officers led by a plainclothes officer, Sergeant Inspector Brian Stansbury. When Tillotson intervened to point out that the police can’t go around questioning a guy that they know to be represented outside the presence of his lawyer
mircea_popescu: , she was arrested.
mircea_popescu: For “resisting arrest,” even though her response to being threatened with arrest was “please do,” followed by immediate submission. If “please do” has become the new standard for resisting, we can set the Doomsday clock to 1 minute to 1984."
mircea_popescu: video included.
mircea_popescu: "And, of course, witnesses report that Inspector Stansbury did go ahead and ask questions after the guy’s lawyer gets led away. There’s the subtlety of the job right there: do something that won’t raise the ire of a court to get a foot in the door, use that to intimidate, then get the target to start volunteering information in a vain effort to make the intimidation end. Standard procedure. Tillotson knew what wa
mircea_popescu: s going down and got chained to a wall for an hour for her efforts.
mircea_popescu: That’s right, she got chained to a wall."
mircea_popescu: shooting policemen on sight is supposed to appear as a morally dubious choice ?
mircea_popescu: i dunno, i really can't get all excited when various poor people do it. i can see exactly why.
assbot: My Start-up Made 200k In Its First Two Months...And I'm Embarrassed | Tucker Max | LinkedIn ... ( http://bit.ly/1CRiIgT )
mircea_popescu: Melissa "You're an entrepreneur, right?"
mircea_popescu: Tucker "Yeah, of course."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 101644 @ 0.0003596 = 36.5512 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12466 @ 0.0003593 = 4.479 BTC [-]
punkman: book in a box!!!1!11
punkman: ah ok ghostwriting 2.0
mircea_popescu: stupidest thing i ever heard. as if the hard part about getting someone to translate romanian trilema is "how to package the articles in querstion". that's the big deal, whether to save them as .jpg or .xls
punkman: tucker's biography is gonna be way more funny than his stories
mircea_popescu: depends if he writes it.
mircea_popescu: i'd like to see silverman do it tbh.
punkman: he will ghostwrite it with his own two hands
assbot: Logged on 02-02-2015 07:51:40; punkman: france exports a lot of cow. I've yet to buy one that's fit for something other than stew
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 84950 @ 0.00036808 = 31.2684 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10792 @ 0.00036973 = 3.9901 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25110 @ 0.00037002 = 9.2912 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 226484 @ 0.00035897 = 81.301 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21316 @ 0.00035676 = 7.6047 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22334 @ 0.00035885 = 8.0146 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 141239 @ 0.00034992 = 49.4224 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 107450 @ 0.00035175 = 37.7955 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 72650 @ 0.00034558 = 25.1064 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 155500 @ 0.00037072 = 57.647 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59784 @ 0.00035527 = 21.2395 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41672 @ 0.00034366 = 14.321 BTC [-]
assbot: National Oil Bargaining Talks Break Down: USW Calls for Work Stoppage at Nine Oil Refineries, Plants | United Steelworkers ... ( http://bit.ly/1yu8ezf )
mats: this is gonna be good
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 155723 @ 0.00037547 = 58.4693 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51503 @ 0.00037883 = 19.5109 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 140900 @ 0.00038016 = 53.5645 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22184 @ 0.00038016 = 8.4335 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10906 @ 0.00038015 = 4.1459 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44300 @ 0.0003806 = 16.8606 BTC [+] {3}
jurov: thestringpuller: lol ryanxcharles, bitcoin should be written in node.js ?? you aware of this? http://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/comments/2u7ddq/the_real_reason_ryan_charles_was_fired_from/
assbot: The real reason Ryan Charles was fired from reddit: he spent the entire duration of his employment working on a port of bitcoin core to Javascript. : Buttcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1z6Hzri )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60047 @ 0.00038134 = 22.8983 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 68000 @ 0.00037104 = 25.2307 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: wot_and_reputation [bitcoin assets wiki] ... ( http://bit.ly/16lkStn )
mats: !up the_scourge
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 11 @ 0.09700913 = 1.0671 BTC [-] {3}
mats: !up the_scourge
mats: found a dude thats read mp and loper
punkman: ddos'd?
mats: i doubt it
mats: i'm in agony
mats: i ate an entire package of seitan, like 14oz of it, after i came back from the gym last night
mats: huge mistake... i don't think my stomach can process ~100 grams of protein
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2033 @ 0.00094998 = 1.9313 BTC [+] {6}
fluffypony: how the hell is Gray's Anatomy still going
fluffypony: surely everyone has died
fluffypony: 11 seasons, damn
thestringpuller: i could say same about dr. who
fluffypony: eugh yeah, that too
thestringpuller: mats: d00d. eat as much fiber as possible.
thestringpuller: You'll poop it out easier.
thestringpuller: I used to do the same thing as a kid.
assbot: Bonafide Raises $850k for Bitcoin Reputation System ... ( http://bit.ly/16ajsRr )
thestringpuller: this sounds like a terrible product davout
thestringpuller: "Rather than attempt to get individuals and firms to sign up for the website and ask for their reputations to be validated, Bonafide uses publicly available information — data from social networks and Bitcoin networks — to report on people and companies in the Bitcoin industry." << why not just do this stuff yourself?
thestringpuller: additionally isn't the point of reputation peer based to begin with?
davout: yep
davout: wait a couple of months and some derp will come up with a btcjam variation built on top of it
jurov: !t m f.mpif
assbot: [MPEX:F.MPIF] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: / / ( shares, BTC), 30D: 0.0002 / 0.00020482 / 0.000205 (21190 shares, 4.34 BTC)
mircea_popescu: teh consumers have come to expect, davout
jurov: !mpif
assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021368 B (Total: 467.27 B). Delta: -1.93 B. Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.000205 BTC [+]
mats: mixing social networks and bitcoin networks? isn't that what keybase does?
thestringpuller: how come btcjam hasn't gotten shut down MTGox style?
davout: because they honor withdrawals i guess?
thestringpuller: mats: that's onename.io
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller because they never actually got that much mainstream exposure.
mircea_popescu: they're mostly like reddit, a bunch of losers with nothing better on their plate hoping to get money "somehow"
kakobrekla: <assbot> Bonafide Raises $850k for Bitcoin Reputation System . < whats wrong with asswot nao?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 55050 @ 0.00038134 = 20.9928 BTC [+]
kakobrekla: oh oh i see
kakobrekla: no css
davout: kakobrekla: user has to keyboard
PeterL: thestringpuller: "Bonafide uses publicly available information — data from social networks and Bitcoin networks — to report on people and companies in the Bitcoin industry." << why not just do this stuff yourself? << makes sense to compile various WoTs, gribbleWot and AssWoT are slowly diverging, it would be nice to have one place to look at both
PeterL: not saying I trust them, but the idea has merit
thestringpuller: it's not a true reputation system just and aggregator
PeterL: right
thestringpuller: and as you said how can you trust the information aggregated unless you vet it yourself
thestringpuller: so it kinda defeats the purpose?
PeterL: gives you a place to start though
PeterL: and I also don't see why they need 850k to make said system?
thestringpuller: ^-that too
PeterL: somebody wants to "invest in bitcoin companies", but has more money than sense?
thestringpuller: its a trend that's gone the way of the sitcom by now it seems
PeterL: they probably won't even think to include GribbleWot and AssWoT in their agregator
thestringpuller: "I have great idea". Next "YCombinator-it". Raise seed funding. Run out of money. Ask mommy daddy for more. Rinse repeat.
kakobrekla: ofc not, nobody even uses irc anymore
PeterL: they end up with no money, where did it all go? who is winning from this chumpatron?
thestringpuller: asswot only requires IRC to leave reputations
assbot: Taking things apart - Trammell Hudson's Projects ... ( http://bit.ly/1zN18eU )
thestringpuller: you could probably abstract the IRC part of asswot with a stand alone client
kakobrekla: wtf is that 'balance' doing there?
kakobrekla: in bezzle format even
mircea_popescu: <kakobrekla> no css << to quote myself, you're thinking actual dollars, someone saved. these however are not that, they're fictitious dollars yellen printed.
mircea_popescu: not in any sense comparable.
mike_c: oh my. everything being tracked in that product shot is from web wallets.
mircea_popescu: <PeterL> not saying I trust them, but the idea has merit << the idea has merit in your eyes on the unwarranted assumption that it is being implementred by people in the wot.
kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> not in any sense comparable. < doesnt matter as long as someone else doesnt care
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller> it's not a true reputation system just and aggregator << actually, it's a repackaging of an ancient idea in the words du jour. tucker max also made a "itsuptoyou" website that was essentially... yet another (meanwhile failed) blog.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla so then don't care and it won't matter ? :)
PeterL: well, yes, it only works if done right. (kinda goes without saying)
kakobrekla: lol not i!
mircea_popescu: PeterL but the thing is you're not saying and they're not working :)
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla oic.
mircea_popescu: PeterL kinda like how murican marriages work too.
mircea_popescu: anyway, it needs 850k so people can be paying rents, mortgages and college debt in california.
mircea_popescu: has exactly nothing to do with anything else.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: this is the entire point of ycombinator
thestringpuller: you have "good idea" that really is bad but seems "interesting" so get paid to live while working on it
thestringpuller: cause you aren't employable otherwise
mircea_popescu: nah. you get paid so you can spend a little of your own money ON TOP.
PeterL: although, I don't see how it could make any money?
mircea_popescu: PeterL but it making money is not the point. the idea isn't for -god forbid- some inept cocklets ending up with control of the means of production./
mircea_popescu: the idea is to keep the battery chickens distracted, and their attention firmly focused on the state.
thestringpuller: the interesting phenomenon of the homeless entrepreneur in the bay area. more each year.
mircea_popescu: so they don't form relationships either.
mircea_popescu: control of capital and control of relationships. that's exactly why we're about bitcoin and about the wot.
thestringpuller: so given SF's economy is pretty much ponzi (floating on start up money) does the entire place become oakland 2.0 when it all falls apart?
mircea_popescu: PeterL you have to understand, 99% of the circulating material is just that. they get fed hay, they shit it out, it goes on the pasture, which makes more hay. the people live off the wool produced, which is a side effect.
PeterL: thestringpuller: maybe it would be worse?
mircea_popescu: the homeostasis is otherwise build out of circulating materials that get endlessly recyucled.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller it can't become oakland, because these are whiny white nerds.
mircea_popescu: they have no fundamental culture, like black dudes do have. they don't even know how to like without facebook.
PeterL: maybe Oakland takes over SF and kicks out (or enslaves) the whiney white guys?
mircea_popescu: no, it will become manchester in 1990.
mircea_popescu: hm i guess that doesn't really mean so much.
mircea_popescu: well... everyone seen trainspotting ? that's where it's headed. those kids.
thestringpuller: ^- hah aids and heroin
mircea_popescu: pretty much. and dead babies.
mircea_popescu: dead babies who died of being hungry for a month while nobody noticed.
mircea_popescu: and that fucking gray.
PeterL: BingoBoingo: Half a yard from the end zone and Captain Nigger tosses an interception. Bullshit ending to the game. << I liked the end, and I thought the play could have worked, both players had their hands on the ball, defensive guy just wanted it more
PeterL: BingoBoingo:Indeed. Would have been nice to see Seattle win on the ground and close the book on the Air Assault era that ushered in << Ground game worked for MSU in the Cotton Bowl, overcame Baylor setting air records.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla by the way, if you feel like spending a year doing it, i'm pretty sure many/most ba projects COULD be shopped for bay area investment.
mircea_popescu: you'll have to go there, and you'll have to meet people. i'll back you, if you want to do it.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 179100 @ 0.00036867 = 66.0288 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: holy shit this is still going /
mircea_popescu: lol qntra ended up with some buyside out of the deal too.
mircea_popescu: someone tell mr moneybags there aren't even half that many shares in circulation lolz.
asciilifeform: rip, carl djerassi.
assbot: Carl Djerassi, Chemist Behind Birth-Control Pill, Dies at 91 - Bloomberg Business ... ( http://bit.ly/1K3DQCW )
mircea_popescu: his white pill did more for the red pill than any blue pillers wish to admit.
asciilifeform: how many pushers of whatever political 'pill' can write one coherent paragraph re: what djerassi did.
mircea_popescu: to quote hanbot, "you know had i not met you i don't think i ever would have realized how well anthropology and sadism go together."
asciilifeform: 245870, incidentally.
mircea_popescu: not bad.
PeterL: "The Nuclear Sciences Division within the Energy and Environment Directorate is seeking a Senior Plutonium Chemist. The candidate must have research experience and expertise in chemistry and processing of macro quantities of plutonium." << Too bad this doesn't fit my background ...
asciilifeform: unfortunately the timing of that experiment will soon be ruined, it is running on a gigantic portable that will be going into a knapsack in a few min.
mircea_popescu: PeterL apply anyway.
mircea_popescu: word around the terrorist campfire is, the usg is really running short on talent.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what you're moving again ?
asciilifeform: bastard node
asciilifeform: it'll be down for about ~1h each leg of trip.
asciilifeform: putting this here for anyone who actually gives a damn re: the numbers, timing.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform tradecraft, he lives in places 3 months at a time
asciilifeform: lol it's a portable
asciilifeform: not moving in the sense of changing address
asciilifeform: but i do occasionally leave the house
asciilifeform: (see s.nsa broadcast!)
asciilifeform: 'bonafide' corp << the 'pretend #b-a doesn't exist, never existed, wouldn't matter if did exit' stratagem chugs along.
mircea_popescu: certainly not to ba's detriment :D
mircea_popescu: what would any disease want more than for the host to claim it's perfctly healthy ?
PeterL: That was me the past couple days: I'm fine, I'm fine, I'll get better, I'm hacking up gobs of bloody phlegm I guess I'll go to the doctor
mircea_popescu: bronchitis ?
PeterL: strep throat
mircea_popescu: ("no, pulmonar oedema")
mircea_popescu: mats: this is gonna be good <<< it's pretty threatening, shell has really no interest to refine further, at least for the next three months.
mircea_popescu: most toothless stoppage ever, but it does take a bite out of obama.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26416 @ 0.00036362 = 9.6054 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 138400 @ 0.000372 = 51.4848 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86100 @ 0.00036077 = 31.0623 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: "The anti-fork crowd mostly consists of a small minority of ego-maniacal, 1% wannabees who want to keep Bitcoin as a niche market for elitist whales because it suits their vested interests. "
mircea_popescu: so much brainwarp. man i love bitcoin.
thestringpuller: where was that posted?
thestringpuller: or tardtalk?
ben_vulpes: hola pumperos
thestringpuller: who u callin a pumpero?
jurov: thestringpuller calm down, just some niggers
thestringpuller: "That's our word jurov you have no business using it!" lol (family guy reference)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 108982 @ 0.00038174 = 41.6028 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 156498 @ 0.00035996 = 56.333 BTC [-] {2}
ben_vulpes: re grape market << what are the best plants to farm for turning solar energy into sugar?
ben_vulpes wants to own an alcohol farm
ben_vulpes: and none of these fancy "wine" thingies - that's an opaque and stupid market to sell into full of branding and other crap.
trinque: oooh! now there's a timeless business
ben_vulpes: etoh, baby. something i put in a furnace and get real fuckin hot.
ben_vulpes: something i can douse gunshot wounds in.
ben_vulpes: something i can drink.
thestringpuller: ben_vulpes you want to fucking distill?
thestringpuller: just make some fucking beer mr. hipster
thestringpuller: isn't moonshining rather dangerous
ben_vulpes: can't burn beer
punkman: you can distill grapes, plus they are useful for other things
kakobrekla: then you will want to do schnapps (plums) or whiskey/bourbon
kakobrekla: i think plums are your best bet here
jurov: depends on climate, most fruits would do
trinque: plums can handle the pacific nw
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 108518 @ 0.00038203 = 41.4571 BTC [+] {2}
mats: !up the_scourge
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3732 @ 0.00038245 = 1.4273 BTC [+]
the_scourge: trinque: also gravenstein apples are VERY adept in the pacific NW all the way up to cape scott
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1420 @ 0.00095934 = 1.3623 BTC [+] {7}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70150 @ 0.00036754 = 25.7829 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2000 @ 0.00096961 = 1.9392 BTC [+] {4}
trinque: kakobrekla: used that one in high school :)
kakobrekla: tru hax0r
trinque: heh no, but many a quake match
PeterL: thestringpuller:isn't moonshining rather dangerous << If you know what you are doing and have the right safety measures in place it is not really dangerous
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 405558 @ 0.00038143 = 154.692 BTC [+] {3}
coderwill: trinque: ah, a fellow quake player - nice to meet you :bows:
trinque: coderwill: shamefully it has been years
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18842 @ 0.00038565 = 7.2664 BTC [+]
coderwill: trinque: same
coderwill: trinque: but years ago, i must admit that i played so much that my eyes would tear as if i were crying or something
coderwill: trinque: was all in to clans, etc. hehe
mats: !up the_scourge
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 99685 @ 0.00038587 = 38.4655 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32550 @ 0.00036754 = 11.9634 BTC [-]
jurov: looky it works
thestringpuller: cazalla & BingoBoingo?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46246 @ 0.00038604 = 17.8528 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22704 @ 0.00038806 = 8.8105 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: * ben_vulpes wants to own an alcohol farm << Rye, prolly cheaper to just buy by the ton
trinque: thestringpuller: seems the precedent being established is "if you're in bitcoin, you may not defend yourself in court"
assbot: Preet Bharara and Dratel Battle Over Defense Witness (Plain Text of Filings) | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1uRA2fe )
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: ^
ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo: but what about when it *can't* be bought?
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: Make friends? Have farm, build storage for bought rye and use your land for cash crops.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10130 @ 0.00038814 = 3.9319 BTC [+]
assbot: Bitcoin Elite to Gather on Secret Island for Bilderberg-Style Retreat ... ( http://bit.ly/1uRApXj )
jurov: announce: qntra shares credited to coinbr users who requested it
BingoBoingo: Ty jurov
thestringpuller: MP stole GLBSE's idea
TomServo: Well thank goodness for that. Someone might've taken it seriously otherwise.
jurov: "Another example is that some CEOs fear to attack known scams in public because..." lol so they will attack them privately?
danielpbarron: they put all the people who are banned from bitcoin in one convenient list
danielpbarron: although I don't see derpopolus on the list
jurov: they won't resist parading and making press statements... can qntra send anyone?
thestringpuller: i'd go if they didn't still lynch negroes
assbot: Exploiting the Robocaller Gap - Global Guerrillas ... ( http://bit.ly/1uRCyCa )
thestringpuller: mod6: dat feeling hearing Jeezy's verse on the Hustlin' remix
BingoBoingo: <jurov> they won't resist parading and making press statements... can qntra send anyone? << Maybe we'll get invites next time?
assbot: Judge Forrest on defense's proposed /hashtag/Bitcoin?src=hash expert: "The court has no idea what Mr. Antonopoulos' qualifications are." /hashtag/SilkRoadTrial?src=hash
mircea_popescu: <ben_vulpes> and none of these fancy "wine" thingies << corn.
mircea_popescu: "Changing the fees to be higher for Bitcoin, is going against what people like to say are some of the best things about Bitcoin, it's like changing what Bitcoin is."
mircea_popescu: "bitcoin is what derps like to say it is"
asciilifeform: conference << does it include silverware, to wear on head?
mircea_popescu: jurov they pay qntra to attend. once they actually get some money together and can afford being in the actual press.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo except this isn't a democracy.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Of course, I'm highlighting the "meta-wrong"
BingoBoingo: However long Obama's USSA persists they will imagine such things
mircea_popescu: well actually, that's nothing. i await with eagerness to see what the next democrat is going to promise.
mircea_popescu: i mean, they gotta keep raising it.
trinque: basic income
mircea_popescu: how much ?
trinque: that's the motherload right there
mircea_popescu: it has to be at least 900
trinque: hell everyone should make 50k/yr
trinque: why don't they just come harvest blood from me directly
asciilifeform: lol, why not 50 trillion
trinque: asciilifeform: the "right to happiness"
trinque: the pursuit is inhumane
asciilifeform: not like it costs so much more to print the word 'trillion' on bill
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 286200 @ 0.00037014 = 105.9341 BTC [-] {3}
thestringpuller: "It's called Moronitor because it tracks users who repeatedly use the same address." << re: Bonafide
mircea_popescu: pity bill clinton's no longer in office
mircea_popescu: he could have made the bill-ion
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> not like it costs so much more to print the word 'trillion' on bill << We might have to run that past nubbins'
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller speaking of the bona fide, i got some pics earlier
thestringpuller: hooray for MP's porn
thestringpuller: i mean bona fide pics.
assbot: Bitcoin 20MB Fork ... ( http://bit.ly/1uREHxO )
mircea_popescu: "dude, you don't get to escalate me. go use the proper venues the proper way or shove it."
assbot: Judge Forrest on defense's proposed /hashtag/Bitcoin?src=hash expert: "The court has no idea what Mr. Antonopoulos' qualifications are." /hashtag/SilkRoadTrial?src=hash
trinque: mircea_popescu: re: earlier rant about linux permissions, -w does not in fact mean -w if you're root
trinque: chattr -i does
trinque: fucking madness, bronze-age punishments for lying please
mircea_popescu: "BUT YOU ARE SECURING TRANSACTIONS WORTH SOMETHING LIKE 2,000 TIMES MORE VALUABLE THAN TODAY'S TRANSACTIONS" << check out allcaps usgavin thinking bitcoi nin terms of "usd value"
ben_vulpes: naw bru
ben_vulpes: we're securing bitcoin transactions
ben_vulpes: what's a dollar?
ben_vulpes: source?
assbot: Bitcoin 20MB Fork ... ( http://bit.ly/16nbVjj )
mircea_popescu: that peter r shill is back in there with his nonsensical golfclub "statistics",
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: Undeadopolus still looking for brainz to munch on...
mircea_popescu: it's been killed in teh logs, but obviously shills don't read.
mircea_popescu: (MP standing for Mircea Popescu.. - dam he must be so thrilled having the 'basic' bitcoin renamed after him XD) << no, actually, i'd rather it just be called bitcoin. which is what it is.
mircea_popescu: saying no to idiots is hardly enough merit to rename things, we'll end up with weekly renamings if this is how things work.
mircea_popescu: "Also, I used to read their logs on IRC, and there was a guy called 'pankkake' (also in btctalk) who seems to have vanished. I think its because they disagreed regarding the fork thing, so if anyone could share the light on his views, that'd be interesting too since I used to value his thoughts." <<< wasn't that over the systemd fork of linux !?
TomServo: That was my impression. Almost certain is was pre-fork talk also.
mircea_popescu: "I'd suggest you go research existing high-value-payment networks and see what typical fees are for multi-million dollar transactions. FEDWIRE is running at 6 transactions per second, average transaction value over $6million, with fees per transaction UNDER ONE DOLLAR.
mircea_popescu: Why? Because if you are giving somebody one million dollars for something, you almost certainly have built up real-world trust, and probably have a longstanding relationship, signed contracts, etc etc."
mircea_popescu: basically, one less explored point of usgavin's interest with the fork is to cripple the politically revolutionary side of bitcoin. obviously if bitcoin can't be bitcoin then the replacement of plain contracts with gpg-contracts will at least be hindered.
mircea_popescu: as if that's how the world works, old men get what they want for wanting it.
mircea_popescu: what is this, new england ?!
thestringpuller: the patriots did win the superbowl
thestringpuller: to BingoBoingo's dismay
thestringpuller was born in Hartford.
danielpbarron didn't bother watching
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: It isn't that they won. It was how they won. Fucking worthless ending spoiled all of the fun that came before... except for the gold 30 foot tall mechanical tiger.
thestringpuller: BingoBoingo you sound like the announcers
thestringpuller: Srsly tho. Up until Halftime the game was neck and neck. Two evenly matched teams.
BingoBoingo: I might be qualified to be such.
danielpbarron: i just noticed, the foundation's bitcoind still uses irc?
thestringpuller: I missed the "exciting part" as I drove home. No radio station was giving highlights.
BingoBoingo: The problem was Seattle decided to play with their food in order to burn the clock. Like the villain taunting instead of driving the knife deeper.
punkman: bitcoin RI compiled without errors on linux mint btw
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2266 @ 0.00096989 = 2.1978 BTC [-]
punkman: anyone wanna give me a node IP I can connect to for testing?
danielpbarron: does it have to be of the same version?
danielpbarron: my ip is a full node
mircea_popescu: probably better if not the same version, actually.
danielpbarron: point at me, i'm running 0.7.2 here
TomServo: danielpbarron: as I understand, with upnp being clipped IRC was the remaining node discovery mechanism
TomServo: Someeone please correct me if I'm mistaken.
punkman: and dnsseed
danielpbarron: acutally i'm not at "full" at the moment; playing a little catchup from the last crash
mircea_popescu: "Or would you prefer to introduce sliding scale fee structure (higher tx amount - higher fee)?"
mircea_popescu: AHAHAHAHAHAHA
mircea_popescu: fuck you jesus christ.
mircea_popescu: the one thing poor people will NOT give up except with their life is "you got money gimme"
mircea_popescu: how about all txn under 1 BTC are excised 99 bitcents fee because fuck you, go be poor in massachussetts ?
mircea_popescu: and all txn over 1k are free because fuck you that side doo.
mircea_popescu: "one of the unique and beneficial attributes of btc is you can send someone a 50 cent tip or a million dollars for almost nothing in transaction fees
mircea_popescu: i think it would be a big mistake to put higher fees on higher tx amounts and i would vote against it ,raise the block size if necessary and prune the blockchain is a better idea imo
mircea_popescu: everyone doesnt need the last 6-7 years of history ,there must be some way to let new users download the most recent portion without the previous 6 years or just the headers instead of every entire block etc
mircea_popescu: its already a 33GB download ,imagine that increasing exponentially ,nobodys going to download it all when it exceeds 100GB but i suppose we could all use "lite wallets " etc but that would also weaken the network if most people were using multibit etc"
mircea_popescu: the shit in that thread... i gotta stop reading.
BingoBoingo: The "nobody will buy a hard drive" people are the worst. The problem isn't the hard drive.
danielpbarron: height=173849 << my pogo running "bastard"
mircea_popescu: you got that to comp[ile too ?
mircea_popescu: going pretty good there danielpbarron
danielpbarron: not yet
mircea_popescu: just using stan's binaries /
asciilifeform: just build the damn thing. not that hard to do
asciilifeform: all you need is a reasonable linux
punkman: asciilifeform: the dnsseed-snip is for the portatronic branch right?
mircea_popescu: let the guy go at his pace yo
danielpbarron: yeah that's the hang up; i'm about to reformat my laptop
danielpbarron: leaving ubuntu never to return
asciilifeform: dnsseed snip should work for -any-, as it only concerns net.cpp
trinque: danielpbarron: where you headed? openbsd?
danielpbarron: not yet at least
mircea_popescu: punkman: you can distill grapes, plus they are useful for other things << great anal beads
mircea_popescu: if you're out of olives.
trinque: gentoo's fucked imo; everything depends on everything. I look at it the wrong way and suddenly I've got avahi-daemon or some other madness installed
danielpbarron: someone said mint worked, maybe i'll try that
trinque: they moved a bunch of useflags into their own vars too, I noticed. because that was necessary
trinque: danielpbarron: mint is based on ubuntu isn't it?
asciilifeform: trinque: gentoo is as good as operator. you can excise the crud permanently and from everything running.
danielpbarron: ok never mind :p
danielpbarron: i installed gentoo once before
trinque: asciilifeform: sure, I'm hacking back the kudzu with use flags
trinque: would rather they were all off to start
trinque: think I'm down to 115 or so packages in world
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: https://i.imgur.com/n9Th4q5.jpg <<< ahhh sweet highschool....
BingoBoingo: <danielpbarron> someone said mint worked, maybe i'll try that << Systemd free, but... better venue for introducing microsoft refugees to not MS. Not really next step to get better at *nix
mircea_popescu: PeterL: If you know what you are doing << most of rural transylvania still makes its own moonshine. most still operators spend the three days it takes entirely drunk.
mircea_popescu: on fumes.
cazalla: did they solve global warming or something? it's summer yet this is day 4 of putting the heating on each morning
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: Oh people are now ripping off MP's conference format << lmao buncha wanna-bes. what fucking elite ?
mircea_popescu: cazalla it's alternatively warm.
mircea_popescu: they're just being inclusive to all climates while working with technology to resolve the problems of the future.
BingoBoingo: It's the middle of winter and I fetched mail jacketless without feeling a chill. Scam weather.
mircea_popescu: "Organized by Bruce Fenton of the Bitcoin Association and Atlantic Financial, participants in the first annual Satoshi Roundtable include top executives from companies such as Blockchain, BitGo, BitPesa, Chain, ChangeTip, Coinapult and MegaBigPower, as well as noted VCs in the space such as Erik Voorhees and Roger Ver."
mircea_popescu: mkay, so yeah, fenton trying to buy credibility.
mircea_popescu: yo fenton, miss tits what's her name didn't manage, and she had the tits. this is not how you do it, seriously, pretending like you matter works in whoredom, not in finance.
mircea_popescu: i know they told you there's no difference. they lied.
cazalla: fenton is a baller, he changedtipped me $2
BingoBoingo: scoopbot -fetch
cazalla: should prob write up an article that fenton tips racist, women hating men
mircea_popescu: jurov: "Another example is that some CEOs fear to attack known scams in public because..." lol so they will attack them privately? << they have a serious strategic problem : employees are normally decent, intelligent human beings they're raping.
mircea_popescu: then those people want to express their outrage. sometimes they do. then they get letters from the idiot "management" about how THIS IS NOT OUR CORPORATE CULTURE
mircea_popescu: which is true, it isn't. the us is built on a corporate culture of empty pretense and outright fraud. course they tend to stick together.
mircea_popescu: then those people lose morale and start coming to me with the stories, which hurts "everyone", which is to say : the scammers ; their friends.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: some CEO's don't always rape their employees
mircea_popescu: im sure some rubber chicken on a beach will solve all this!
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller yeah, some don't always.
mircea_popescu: viagra wears off.
thestringpuller: some CEO's just slowly kill company like virus
thestringpuller: like the nVidia d00d
thestringpuller: troll style
thestringpuller: kinda like Michael Scott from the Office just not as dimwitted.
cazalla: anyway, this elite retreat was announced weeks ago, clearly it didn't get much traction so they called up coindesk to promote it
mircea_popescu: there's a pretty fucking bad film about three stooges that conspire to kill their bosses.
mircea_popescu: the film's unwatchable except for a kevin spacey monologue
mircea_popescu: "fuck you, sit down and work more."
cazalla: https://twitter.com/brucefenton/status/558819102861819904 1 comment on reddit, obv they didn't get the validation they were seeking the first time around
assbot: Satoshi Roundtable is coming soon... http://t.co/5IdMdX025t
thestringpuller: And Jennifer Anniston sexual harrassing her assistant.
thestringpuller: Cause who would really care?
mircea_popescu: o that's who the old broad was ?
mircea_popescu: wow, all those chick flicks really age a body.
mircea_popescu: almost like politics.
thestringpuller: And you know 11 years on Friends
mircea_popescu: cazalla send him a link to logs ?
mircea_popescu: maybe he figures it the fuck out eventually.
thestringpuller: cazalla: now that's a story if you can confirm...
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller: i'd go if they didn't still lynch negroes << who does ?!
thestringpuller: the jews
thestringpuller stares at ben_vulpes
mircea_popescu: heh. so bring a girl, and go "don't lynch me, take her instead" then run.
thestringpuller: omg i'd get lynched harder if I showed up /w white girl
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: Bring Marshawn Lynch, and Lynch them back
mircea_popescu: show up with a blue one then, mess with everyone's head.
thestringpuller: "Who let this nigger in here with one of our womenz?!?!?"
danielpbarron: that's asking a "Lot"
mircea_popescu: the "lynch me harder" thing is lulzy tho.
mircea_popescu: just exactly what do you think this lynching business is :D
mircea_popescu: are you a lynch virgin, thestringpuller ?
mircea_popescu: assbot: Exploiting the Robocaller Gap - Global Guerrillas << speaking of this ben_vulpes, how about a site where people can get bitcoin for reading messages on the screen, then autodial them into say 5k different emergency zones across the us.
mircea_popescu: stress test the system, as it were. see what happens when there's i dunno, 500k pps ddos, but not from wordpress to me.
mircea_popescu: backwards.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: one of my ancestors was lynched in mississipi so the family isn't a lynch virgin
mircea_popescu: o srsly ?
thestringpuller: but i myself am
mircea_popescu: how do you feel about that ? i got a few ancestors that were killed by teh turks and teh russians.
mircea_popescu: oddly enough, i dislike just the russians.
thestringpuller: well given my family is on exponential curve in wealth (only a generation ago we were in the projects), i'd say the karma is coming back around
mircea_popescu: heh. most everyone in romania was in teh projects coupla decades ago
mircea_popescu: where's that pic
assbot: Piinea amara a baietasilor de cartier pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/16nowD5 )
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: how were they killed by the turks and russians?
thestringpuller: ah yea. i remember coming accross that pic on trilema (random page of the front page thing)
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller well, romania as a sovereign nation was mostly constructed around this event where the czar declared war on the turks on the fumes of imagining himself like the germans, and buying the british propaganda about the "dead man of europe". the turks were the origina lrhodesia.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 72800 @ 0.00037173 = 27.0619 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: anyway, the turks mowed them down, and so the commanding officer sent the romanian kind a "plz save us telegram'. so the romanian army moved in, beat back the turks, took some impossible redoubts, lost like a third of the men and that was that.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15800 @ 0.00037392 = 5.9079 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: Ah. Okay so 1800's at somepoint?
mircea_popescu: then later in ww2, romanian army went all the way to stalingrad, raping and pillaging with the germans, then got beaten back, went over to like, prague, and then after the war there was all that "sociailism" thingee/
mircea_popescu: 1880s yea
thestringpuller: yea about same time great great great g-pa was lynched and thrown into swamp
mircea_popescu: ;;google The Romanian War of Independence
gribble: Romanian War of Independence - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romanian_War_of_Independence>; Romanian War of Independence - Simple English Wikipedia, the ...: <http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romanian_War_of_Independence>; Russo-Turkish War (1877–78) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo- (1 more message)
mircea_popescu: (one of the rare cases when a romanian was supreme commander of the russian troops in any war theater)
thestringpuller: brb gonna read up on this. mircea_popescu always educatin mah simple mind
thestringpuller: and doesn't charge (yet)
mircea_popescu: there was also a case in ww1 when the romanian general was put in command of all the german units and so on.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 105500 @ 0.00037664 = 39.7355 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: !up the_scourge
trinque: poor felipelalli, so much IP in da logs
the_scourge: oh cheers
the_scourge: sorry i didn't realize that was actually echoing
felipelalli: trinque: thank you! :) Internet in Brazil is not easy. I am installing a new one, it arrives 14 Feb.
assbot: Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2N9HZ5E.txt )
PeterL: you are replacing the internet?
felipelalli: ahahha
felipelalli: my cable, yes.
mircea_popescu: i know i want a new internet too. who knew dilma got it
trinque: felipelalli: if you beg the gods in #freenode they'll cloak you
felipelalli: trinque: thanks. I'll try it.
the_scourge: do you have to prove need now? needs-based systems are a sign of the apocalypse :)
mircea_popescu: it's how sex works...
the_scourge: mircea_popescu: that's the opposite of how sex works
mircea_popescu: so "i have all this love to give" vs "i need to get laid" ?
the_scourge: sex is 100% merit. it's the one thing that can't be made needs-based even temporarily
the_scourge: um "i need to get laid" doesn't mean fuck all
mircea_popescu: if sex were merit based how do you explain masturbation ?
trinque goes to tell the welfare queens and trailer whores what sex is
the_scourge: you could try asking your local cultural equality office of liberty to see if they can make it needs based.... get some equalisation fucks for the really needy
mircea_popescu: actually, prostitution is legal here.
the_scourge: ok, still mertis based
the_scourge: unless romania is doing better on the equalisation front than.... everywhere else
PeterL: asciilifeform: are we supposed to be suprised by the result?
mircea_popescu: here = argentina.
asciilifeform: PeterL: i for one am a little surprised that -any- of them work
PeterL: any idea when these were last updated?
asciilifeform: PeterL: the phoundation's git does not appear to have the hardcoded seeds any longer. when they were thrown out? no idea
the_scourge: asciilifeform: do you always name your filehandles like that, or only in python
asciilifeform: the_scourge: only in python
PeterL: having hardcoded seeds is, in my opnion, a silly way of doing things
trinque: eat and shit are entirely appropriate names there
trinque: lol
the_scourge: btw any chance that the first HLL cpu will support python? i know that's heresy but the library support is better than lispscheme
trinque: the_scourge: how dare you
asciilifeform: PeterL: having hardcoded seeds is, in my opnion, a silly way of doing things << what do you suggest as an alternative? how is the proggy to know what exists anywhere without a hardcoded something or other
felipelalli: now I am cloaked. Thanks trinque for the tip.
trinque: felipelalli: no problem; looks good over here
the_scourge: felipelalli: did you have to prove need?
felipelalli: the_scourge: no.
asciilifeform: the_scourge: if you want to port fortran or cobol to it, who can stop you. if you expect the design to somehow accomodate your perversion - sorry
PeterL: asciilifeform: could you have a separate seed config file?
the_scourge: cool so neither needs based nor merit. simple universal. to thsoe who ask. fn is democracy :)
the_scourge: asciilifeform: you're the one coding in python
asciilifeform: PeterL: separate config is in the works. but i did have the thought that ought to see what ought to go in it first
trinque wishes he could watch asciilifeform slap the_scourge in person
mircea_popescu: yeah srsly.
trinque: bow to your sensei!
mircea_popescu: !down the_scourge
asciilifeform: the_scourge: i occasionally use it as a healthier, low-tar substitute for perl
mircea_popescu: giving voice to anyone that asks has its disadvantages.
PeterL: asciilifeform: PeterL: the phoundation's git does not appear to have the hardcoded seeds any longer. when they were thrown out? no idea << did you figure out what they were replaced with?
mircea_popescu: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/97/Metternich-Wappen_Sm.png << an interesting case of central government driven inflation.
mircea_popescu: if the king can pay nobles for their service in "heraldics" he will do so. and issue and issue and issue until there's more crowns than the estucheon can hold.
mircea_popescu: escutcheon*
jurov: BingoBoingo: "bezzel economy" -> "bezzle economy"
jurov: i was asking about linking to definition too, but
jurov: ;;google bezzle economy
gribble: Bitcoin Falls Victim to Galbraith's “Bezzle” - The New Yorker: <http://www.newyorker.com/news/john-cassidy/bitcoin-falls-victim-to-galbraiths-bezzle>; Agenda: Essential Task of Unwinding the Bezzle - WSJ: <http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424127887324469304578140891938671684>; The Global Bezzle – whence it came, where it went and why it ...: <http://crookedtimber.org/2013/11/21 (1 more message)
assbot: bitcoin/README.md at 7b879d3493e5b51c60522f71657941bd62e29334 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/16nyGDO )
jurov: it shown me trilema immediately after that
asciilifeform: ^ it still has hardcoded seeds
BingoBoingo: jurov: FXD THX
mircea_popescu: crooked timber is a good blog btw
PeterL: How about putting seeds in a separate file (Foundation can host a copy that is updated periodically), and add user settable options for whether to download the updated file on program start and from where?
asciilifeform: separate file << was the plan already
PeterL: and mechanism for updating it?
mircea_popescu: no autodownloads.
asciilifeform: i imagine ben_vulpes et al will post pgp-signed lists of working nodes now and again
PeterL: so manual download
mircea_popescu: sure, that';s the general idea, have all the magic strings in a file somewhere.
asciilifeform: understand that node only needs to find 1 working node on the list, to spin up
mike_c: PeterL: this mechanism already exists. bitcoin-seeder
mike_c: dns-based
assbot: The Global Bezzle – whence it came, where it went and why it matters (repost from 2011) — Crooked Timber ... ( http://bit.ly/16nCmVW )
asciilifeform: dns-based << i nominated it for death
mircea_popescu: this, in particular, is a good discussion of macroeconomics, something you rarely see in english
mircea_popescu: mike_c a mechanism made by someone not in wot doesn't really exist.
asciilifeform: dns is not only a thin and centralized neck to squeeze, it is controlled almost entirely by usg
mike_c: heh, so people are going to download this file by IP address?
mircea_popescu: ip addresses seems to be the manner to connect via tcp/ip neh ?
mike_c: neh! i like names. but i get it.
asciilifeform: so people are going to download this file by IP address << can come straight from the fuhrer's arsehole, so long as it's signed by genuine foundation
mircea_popescu: well do you also like ghosts /
mircea_popescu: i gotta find this quote of myself, not enough self fellatio today.
mircea_popescu: "In general I have found so far that the best results in computer security are achieved not by those who are most competent at securing a system, but by those who are backed by management most inclined to simplify their task. "
mike_c: i'm going to get this node list into my mini-node how?
mike_c: this actually begs the question, how the hell is this thing finding any nodes right now? brb. code grep.
mircea_popescu: it's a sad story.
mike_c: unsigned int pnSeed[] =
mike_c: 0x959bd347, 0xf8de42b2, 0x73bc0518, 0xea6edc50, 0x21b00a4d, 0xc725b43d, 0xd665464d, 0x1a2a770e,
mike_c: oh.
trinque: the language needs to be patched such that wisdom and simplicity are more closely connected
mike_c: hence ascii's list of "only 6 of these are still alive"
mike_c: well, this is clearly best solution :D
mircea_popescu: also first and biggest.
asciilifeform: and, much as it is intriguing that so many nodes still hang out on irc bitcoin-xx channel, that thing doesn't belong in the RI
asciilifeform: but we can't zap both it and the dns seeder (already submitted zap for the latter) without a fresh list of seeds
PeterL: we plan to rip out irc?
mircea_popescu: on a principal consideration ?
mircea_popescu: irc should probably stay because a) it doesn't actualy do anything atm and b) it will be an easy upgrade to gossipd
asciilifeform: the irc thing is a chokepoint. in my head it counts as 1 hardcoded node, really
mircea_popescu: which will make bitcoin full nodes a much saner thing altogether.
asciilifeform: think about it. isomorphic.
mircea_popescu: and remove a lot of dumbass pressure off the blockchain. ("want to talk to people ? talk through the node process not through the tx process)
asciilifeform: actually, given that most of the hard seeds are dead, the irc mechanism is the primary bootstrap.
mircea_popescu: speaking of which, how's it going artifexd ?
mircea_popescu: and speaking of how's it going yo trinque ! what happened there ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i thought the node's own memory was the primary bootstrap ?
asciilifeform: when 0.5.3 switches on, it looks for some nodes
asciilifeform: mine (with dns seds nixed) ends up finding them on irc.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11809 @ 0.00038814 = 4.5835 BTC [+]
trinque: mircea_popescu: with deedbot? got hit with a bunch of irl work
asciilifeform: anybody who can sit down between me & the ircd, can feed in arbitrary crap
trinque: however it's nearly done
mircea_popescu: trinque ok, but it was nearly done like a week ago too ?
PeterL: could you add an option to input an ip address for seed? so start it by typing "bitcoin --seed my.fri.ends.ip"
asciilifeform: PeterL: iirc, that's already in there
mike_c: hopefully addnode didn't get nixed
PeterL: oh, ok, nevermind then
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform maybe this seed-from-file mod is more stringently needed than i thought ? mod6 ? ben_vulpes ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's a critical moving part (on warmup only, really)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: think about it
mircea_popescu: well i haven't run a stock node in years, so.
mircea_popescu: mine just keep dbs of other nodes.
mike_c: it already seeds from file (bitcoin.conf), just need to fill the file.
trinque: mircea_popescu: granted. plenty of fires since then, which are out
mircea_popescu: trinque so what's almost done ? this week ? tomorrow ?
asciilifeform: mike_c: iirc you can only offer one seed in the conf as of 0.5.3 ?
mike_c: ah
mike_c: this is an odd time warp, where my knowledge is not outdated, but actually is too far in the future. it's weird :)
assbot: Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/3R9Y3SG.txt )
mircea_popescu: "you haven't happened yet"
asciilifeform: phoundation's bitcoind does keep a cache of known nodes, it appears. but still uses dns seeds and hardcoded ip list for initial warmup.
mircea_popescu: !give me the cockblocking BingoBoingo trophy!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform nothing quite like a camel with dolphin skin.
punkman: with -connect=ADDRESS it doesn't use built-in seeds
BingoBoingo: http://dpaste.com/3R9Y3SG.txt << mircea_popescu Still made it through. IRC lag makes you think you win these trophies.
asciilifeform: -connect=ADDRESS limits you to that node and only it, alive or dead
BingoBoingo: -addnode offers multiple potential ips to add
BingoBoingo: to lsit
mircea_popescu: punkman asciilifeform yeah that's more intended for proxy chaining them iirc
punkman: you can do multiple -connect
trinque: mircea_popescu: my evening is free to hack on it; the "keep it running" part got a lot of attention, which may have expanded scope past "a few scripts"
mike_c: asciilifeform: BOOST_FOREACH(string strAddr, mapMultiArgs["-addnode"])
mike_c: ^ seems evidence it takes more than one?
BingoBoingo: punkman: No you get one -connect, -connect is exclusive. -addnode populates address list
asciilifeform: mike_c: that's 0.5.3 ?!
trinque: mircea_popescu: each part of it runs separately, different user, in a different linux container, etc
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: The future.
trinque: if one part shouldn't talk to another, it doesn't
mircea_popescu: trinque don't make it larger than your head.
mircea_popescu: "Show your face. Those who know what you look like can verify that it's actually you, and not a sockpuppet trolling us all."
mircea_popescu: dude these fucktards. LEARN PGP!!1eleventyfivethousand cocks in your mother's dumb mouth.
punkman: "BOOST_FOREACH(string strAddr, mapMultiArgs["-connect"])"
punkman: not exclusive
asciilifeform: punkman is correct. alert reader award.
punkman: so no need for irc or built-in, just have them in the bitcoin.conf
mike_c: yes, well, still makes plug-n-play nodebox more difficult.
asciilifeform: mike_c: how?
punkman: maybe have a list of dnsseeds with signed node lists baked in the source
mike_c: I guess not. just step N is download list of nodes.
asciilifeform: so we ship, e.g., the pogos, with titanic list of nodes. some of which we own and operate.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57800 @ 0.00038863 = 22.4628 BTC [+] {2}
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> assbot: Exploiting the Robocaller Gap - Global Guerrillas << speaking of this ben_vulpes, how about a site where people can get bitcoin for reading messages on the screen, then autodial them into say 5k different emergency zones across the us. << sounds great
mircea_popescu: in the words of one of the numerous us generals remembered for losing a war, "the unknowns that we know about, we name terrorism. the unknowns we don't know about, we predend don't exist. that and the state department is how we spend a trillion for the priviledge of spending another trillion."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 96100 @ 0.00038935 = 37.4165 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes demanding to be gassed by gestapo ahead of schedule, lol
ben_vulpes: deserves a post
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: twould also be interesting to see the same test against the modern codebase
ben_vulpes: i gotta meeting in like...2m
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: deserves a post << see thread here first
assbot: Bitcoin 20MB Fork ... ( http://bit.ly/1K4Xz5k )
BingoBoingo: ^ RE: Mr Fenton
mircea_popescu: "Of course many ISPs block out outgoing 8333 by default . Why do you think we see all these threads where people complain that they are getting only 8 incoming connections on their bitcoin QT wallet? Why do we average less than 7k nodes worldwide at any given time?"
mircea_popescu: culprit found.
mircea_popescu: "I've noticed certain repeating characteristic in the writing of many members of this forum: they construct grammatically correct sentences but absolutely disregard the underlying semantics: incoming vs. outgoing, local vs. remote, source vs. destination, etc. Here in regards to TCP/IP ports, but I observed that in regards to pretty much any technical issue."
mircea_popescu: actually 2112 has a very good point.
mircea_popescu: it was highlighted by intel about two weeks ago, and we're generally tracing it to philippines "top quality" content farms working for a number of (mostly ct and wash based) pr firms.
mircea_popescu: wasn't goping to say anything, but since it's public now..
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42000 @ 0.00038569 = 16.199 BTC [-]
assbot: Bitcoin 20MB Fork ... ( http://bit.ly/1K4Z6Z2 )
BingoBoingo: Well, not THE forum, but a forum
mircea_popescu: in any case, the pogo plugs will be quite welcome. the network's been suffering for a long time,
mircea_popescu: like the ents or something.
asciilifeform: Tech Email:domainadmin@fdvt.com << lol!
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu> like the ents or something. << Where did all of the nodewives go?
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> Tech Email:domainadmin@fdvt.com << lol! << See someone got the Fenton lulz
BingoBoingo: Professional Stoogesultant
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you know that's just a general support email, and the connection between fenton and fdvt is about the same as between reddit feminist incel and starbucks
mircea_popescu: ie, purely aspirational ?
asciilifeform: why is it in the satoshiroundtable.org 'whois' then ?
assbot: Access Restricted ... ( http://bit.ly/16nNqlZ )
mircea_popescu: myeah...
mircea_popescu: topdollar.commegawealth.commutualfundcenter.com atlanticfinancial.comcapitalgain.com etc.
mircea_popescu: ie, buncha spamsites and whatever.
asciilifeform: this fella clearly read 'spam like a pro in twenty-one hours' !
mircea_popescu: lol fentonfoundation.com
asciilifeform: if he stuffed the 'fvdt' contact in his own domain reg fraudulently, what's it take to get the registration judged & pulled ?
mircea_popescu: why does it have to be fraudulently ?
asciilifeform: theoretically - if registrar won't pull, we can regard the shilling as a proven fact
mircea_popescu: Fleetwood Digital Video Technology Corp is not like... haliburton or something.
asciilifeform: one way or the other
mircea_popescu: it's a smallish business, think in terms of roger ver's used laptops shop
asciilifeform: eh, sure. small business that does no-one-knows-what, for usg only
mircea_popescu: eh get out. i control so many I don't know all of em by name
mircea_popescu: basically they're one of the what, 100k or so small tech-ish corps that live off the usg dole.
mircea_popescu: not exactly unconnected, for sure, but never invited to a fundraiser either, unless it's for the state capitol and they couldn't fill the seats.
asciilifeform: i do happen to know something about those. usually they exist as a little flea on the back of a larger flea, sometimes three or four fleas in a circuit
mircea_popescu: "Cabletica, ICE, Kolbi, Claro, Moviestar all need to be called and asked to open this port." << at least the last two are cheap mobile providers in argentina.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform quite exactly.
mircea_popescu: you get the picture.
asciilifeform: it would be not entirely uninteresting, to learn his host flea.
mircea_popescu: local mass politics from what i've seen so far.
mircea_popescu: until i learn better... shrug.
asciilifeform: also i am unaware of any extant isp outside of iran blocking an -outgoing- port other than 25
mircea_popescu: stop reading that thing you'll give yourself earbleeds.
asciilifeform: on the other hand - every cellular isp in usa (that i've tried) blocks -all- incoming connections
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 110250 @ 0.00036889 = 40.6701 BTC [-] {2}
asciilifeform: 252649.
assbot: Changed pronouns for correctness and inclusivity · ee93202 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1K53vLJ )
asciilifeform: 'bikinibabe' ?! trololol.
mircea_popescu: hahaha wut
mircea_popescu: if i find out there's some fucktarded 50something collegiate "professor" setting up the idiot chickies in her class to doing this...
asciilifeform: which one of you jokers is 'bikinibabe'. confess.
mircea_popescu: it's prolly sa actually.
asciilifeform: whoever is doing is - brilliant 'shit test' - will the idiots merge? turns out, yes! they will.
PeterL: "inform the master he or she can" << really, it should be "inform the master or mistress he or she can", right?
mircea_popescu: someting awful. this old comedy board that for a while was the core of radical libertardism in the us.
assbot: Douglas Hofstadter - Person Paper on Purity in Language ... ( http://bit.ly/1K54yv3 )
asciilifeform: he actually caught a good bit of shit for this number
PeterL: actually, they should remove all references to "master", because it makes us thing about slavery, so bad, mkay?
asciilifeform: PeterL: that was one of the first engineering terms to get liberast attention, actually
mircea_popescu: i dunno who him is.
mircea_popescu: anyway, it'll be hard to do away with master seeing how that's what i am. best do away with husband, replace with cuckold ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: doug h is sui generis. can't really place him in a genre. he wrote a number of tomes for folks who like mathematics (in particular, logic and theory of computation), languages, translation. he is also a fairly good translator of ru->eng, even rhyme-preserving pushkin. blew my mind.
mircea_popescu: my inculture is vast.
asciilifeform: dh is best known as an american/eng author, but iirc his native lang is fr. on account of peculiar upbringing. and he knows plenty of others.
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu thanks for the notes on that last article
asciilifeform: http://www.physixfan.com/wp-content/files/GEBen.pdf << l33t w4r3z, hofstadter's best known work.
mircea_popescu: which one ?!
pete_dushenski: jooz and stereotypes: i cleaned up the log quotes and took another hack at the romanian
asciilifeform: GEB is really a book for intelligent children, or perhaps for adults who are n00bs to the whole thinking business. it's a fun, not serious, sort of book.
mircea_popescu: link me again ?
asciilifeform: in print nonstop since '79, iirc.
mircea_popescu: pete i meant.
assbot: Jooz and stereotypes. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1K56l3c )
pete_dushenski: and for the german-speakers, this article just sent me a trackback: http://bitcoinblog.de/2015/02/02/der-kommende-blockchain-burgerkrieg/
assbot: Der kommende Blockchain-Bürgerkrieg | BitcoinBlog.de - das Blog für Bitcoin und andere virtuelle Währungen ... ( http://bit.ly/1K56FPp )
pete_dushenski: the article has a poll at the bottom
pete_dushenski: lulzy 13-5 results thus far in favour of block size, including my vote for nein!
pete_dushenski: *in favour of increasing block size
mircea_popescu: yeah, website polls is how moot ended up time man of the century
mircea_popescu: lol "Zum einen ist da Davout aus Frankreich"
mircea_popescu: hey davout check it out, germanz think teh frenchies are einen.
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform that hofstadter fellow has a decent little sense of humour
pete_dushenski: It's quite obvious, for instance, that the chairwhite of the League of Black Voters is going to be a black, not a white. Nobody need think twice about it
pete_dushenski: lol chairwhite...
pete_dushenski shakes fist at scoopbot
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski it still sucks :D
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu then a dayjob keeper is me!
mircea_popescu: lemme tell you a joke.
mircea_popescu: if you ever meet a hungarian speaking foreign languages you just met a jew.
jurov: lol
pete_dushenski: i wonder what other peoples/nationalities this heuristic might apply to...
pete_dushenski: heuristic/funny
mircea_popescu: funnyristic.
pete_dushenski: aka stereotype ;/
BingoBoingo: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 341706 | Current Difficulty: 4.127287389469702E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 342719 | Next Difficulty In: 1013 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 6 days, 7 hours, 57 minutes, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 45251697037.7 | Estimated Percent Change: 9.64029
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu thanks for the translations :D
jurov: btw, are the pogosticks supposed to accept outside connections? if they're plugged into home routers then we need upnp then
jurov: and it was the first thing excised... it will ran as standalone daemon, i guess
jurov: *run
jurov: the upnpnp deamon, i mean
mircea_popescu: i doubt someone who has the werewithal to get the pogo going needs me to unpnp him
mats: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 237.8, Best ask: 238.94, Bid-ask spread: 1.14000, Last trade: 237.79, 24 hour volume: 15989.25963627, 24 hour low: 221.79, 24 hour high: 241.98, 24 hour vwap: 229.507388939
mircea_popescu: !up kobud
pete_dushenski: I think that in the old days where the financial system was not too developed, the only way to develop a new idea was to be born rich, to have resources and use them. Today and increasingly so to the extent the financial system works well, you can start a company, apply an idea, or even run large companies even if you are not born rich and don't have a lot of money.
pete_dushenski: ^today apparently = neobee
trinque: lol
pete_dushenski: and this is a good thing!
trinque: today as back then, you can bootstrap yourself so long as you're prepared to lay brick by hand for a half decade
pete_dushenski: unless the vc fairy sprinkles some dust on you while you're sleeping
pete_dushenski: then it really only takes a few minutes
thestringpuller: trinque hah; you are going to treat your robots like people?
mircea_popescu: it can work, sure.
pete_dushenski: and 11 year olds can give ted talks on how to fix the world
mircea_popescu: similarly, in the old days when you were born a maid, you were going to be a maid even if you were really pretty.
mircea_popescu: now you can also be a pop singer.
trinque: pete_dushenski: the vc fairy wanted 67% of my business
trinque: I told him to fuck off
pete_dushenski: that's an aggressive ask eh
mats: heh
mircea_popescu: it's not common to allow founders control in the financed vehicle, principally because founders usually fuck it up.
mircea_popescu: cases like spolski's are the exception.
mats: unconfirmed report of someone trying to root an ubuntu luser idli g herr
mats: agh, mobile. idling here.
mircea_popescu: how did it go ?
mats: guy went to sleep before i got more details, im going to put up a vulnerable box later and see what happens
mats: get a cloak, people
trinque: heh I wonder how many servers just got ssh'd into
assbot: Haha. "Please use the shared hairdryers only for the hair on your head. Thank you for your cooperation." http://t.co/49FIEB4iKo
mircea_popescu: trinque some ubuntu vuln reported or something ?
trinque: not to my knowledge
trinque: I tend to assume things like znc are riddled with holes
trinque: could be something along those lines
mircea_popescu: "The turn of the cultural left to Twitter is a reflection of its weakness on university campuses, not its strength. Today’s intra-left fights over cultural identity are not the birth pangs of a dangerous new radical left elite of cultural enforcers. They’re the product of anger and economic powerlessness, the unanticipated result of the hollowing out of humanities on university campuses, and the parlous state of in
mircea_popescu: tellectual journalism. "
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 5000 @ 0.00096956 = 4.8478 BTC [+] {5}
mircea_popescu: i tell you, within twenty years if that as much as having been interested in the left will be a hanging offense.
mircea_popescu: "This is in turn leading to an (unsustainable) proliferation of cultural commentary, some of it unreadable, but much of it sharp and interesting. Much of this commentary is understandably driven by spleen. Impoverished freelancers and adjunct intellectuals, scraping out a living from commuter teaching and dead end jobs, are angry when they look at the comfortable positions that a previous generation of humanities intel
mircea_popescu: lectuals had, and that they never will. They won’t ever have good jobs. They do have Twitter. But that’s nearly all that they do have or are likely to have any time soon."
mircea_popescu: that's quite right : nobody ovulating today will get as far as sara mccune.
mircea_popescu: even Leah McGrath Goodman's poverty will be relatively a high mark.
trinque: mats: this was the guy's issue?
mats: yeah
mircea_popescu: just a dos ?
trinque: way different than "rooted"
mats: looks p benign
asciilifeform: jurov: if they're plugged into home routers then we need upnp then << why????!? every home router ever made, even utter garbage, lets user open ports the normal way
asciilifeform: fuck upnp.
mircea_popescu: esp since... well... so dnsmasq will get killed by kernel
assbot: man I'm glad the systemd devs all have SSDs. http://t.co/92rGdSitBF
asciilifeform: not just for what it is, but for how it's implemented. (metric shit-ton of xml garbage, book-length standards doc)
mats: i need coffee
mircea_popescu: is dnsmasq even standard in ubuntu ?!
jurov: i have never seen anyone except myself opening ports the normal way
trinque: mircea_popescu: it's part of the awful libvirt wad
mircea_popescu: jurov that may be a function of social circle!
trinque: handles IPs and whatnot on the virtual networks
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: the only way to develop a new idea was to be born rich << or... take it. chingis khan style.
jurov: i won't contend that
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform in retrospect, the efforts of those shitgremlins to shoehorn xml into things are so lulzy.
mircea_popescu: it's dead anyway, but hey, well done guise, at least you went blind on code.
asciilifeform: root an ubuntu luser idli g herr << lol, time for honeypots
jurov: jus' saying i don't have anyone to give pogostick to.
mircea_popescu: the reports of mark twain's rooting seem grossly exaggerated.
jurov: people who know how to open ports either do have a node or can't be arsed to even for free
mircea_popescu: jurov you can just drop one in local library.
mircea_popescu: they will... never figure it out.
mircea_popescu: considering what it costs...
mircea_popescu: lol i have spinning disks.
mircea_popescu: for one thing, much easier to destroy.
asciilifeform also runs spinning disks
asciilifeform: i don't know any serious computer user who does not have a multitude of spinning disks at all times.
mircea_popescu: but then again it works out : we're not systemd devs.
jurov: if i do, then i'll add upnp anyway. just fyi.
asciilifeform: jurov: you know, upnp can run as a separate daemon
mircea_popescu: jurov not a crime. but you could also just 192.0.0.1 and typeadmin admin
asciilifeform: jurov: absolutely no reason to build it into bitcoind, ever
jurov: yes, as a separate daemon
asciilifeform: even if you absolutely need it somewhere (e.g., bitcoind as malware payload)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it occurs that at 4mb, nodes can be run as virii by now without problems
asciilifeform: 4mb on arm
mircea_popescu: especially since usgavin has made space double and bandwidth expand
asciilifeform: ~1.2 compressed
asciilifeform: the blockchain is the bulk of the footprint, quite obviously
mod6: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-February/000043.html << asciilifeform, thanks for this. this goes along with some of the trouble we've been seeing over the last 72 hours.
asciilifeform: the proggy itself has never been large in comparison
asciilifeform: mod6: trouble << do tell
mod6: in a wide variety of ways, and it's not consistant, we've been having issues getting past the last checkpoint block (more often than not): 168,000
mod6: one sec, i have a matrix for what we've tried.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform afaik windows doens't mind secret partitions.
mod6: we're still testing this out... but i/we haven't encoutered anything like this until just this past 72 hours:
mod6: we're interested to see if anyone running: v0.5.3 + patches {1, rm_rf_upnp, 2, 3, 4, & 6 (db_config) } runs into the same issues.
mod6: also, v0.5.3. + patches {1, rm_rf_upnp, 2, 3, 4, 6 & 7} (which includes the version update)
mircea_popescu: A Person Paper on Purity in Language << i don't grok wtf this is supposed to be.
mod6: we also note that if you do remove checkpoints, obv, this is no longer a problem.
mod6: but, its weird, because a week ago i ran a full sync of: v0.5.3 + {1, rm_rf_upnp, 2, 3, 4, 6} and sync'd just fine, as you can see in the matrix notes (was able to send/receive here: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=FSA9gxs8)
assbot: Pastebin.com Unknown Paste ID ... ( http://bit.ly/1AlM47Z )
mod6: and TomServo was able to run with the following config and just achieved full sync: v0.5.3 + {1, rm_rf_upnp, 2, 3, 4, 6, 7}
PeterL: what do the checkpoints do?
mod6: so, like we were saying, its not consistant. and perhaps we need to point directly at v0.5.3 nodes... not sure.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i don't grok wtf this is supposed to be << was written when the whole 'pronoun warrior' thing was brand new
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it is (i thought this was very obvious) a spoof on subject
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no but looky : "Perhaps this piece shocks you. It is meant to. The entire point of it is to use something that we find shocking as leverage to illustrate the fact that something that we usually close our eyes to is also very shocking. The most effective way I know to do so is to develop an extended analogy with something known as shocking and reprehensible. Racism is that thing, in this case. I am happy w
mircea_popescu: ith this piece, despite-but also because of-its shock value. I think it makes its point better than any factual article could. As a friend of mine said, "It makes you so uncomfortable that you can't ignore it." I admit that rereading it makes even me, the author, uncomfortable! Numerous friends have warned me that in publishing this piece I am taking a serious risk of earning myself a reputation as a terrible racist. I
mircea_popescu: guess I cannot truly believe that anyone would see this piece that way. To misperceive it this way would be like calling someone a vicious racist for telling other people "The word 'nigger' is extremely offensive." If allusions to racism, especially for the purpose of satirizing racism and its cousins, are confused with racism itself, then I think it is time to stop writing."
mircea_popescu: a) it does not shock me.
mircea_popescu: b) it is simply very bad writing.
mircea_popescu: there's nothing of depth in there, it;s just the usual libertard tedium.
mircea_popescu: and yes, women and men are structurally different, and will never be the same.
mircea_popescu: not in the way white men and black men are superficially different
mircea_popescu: but quite in the way your pony is not your dog.
mod6: PeterL: well, one thing they do, is prevent spam from bogus blocks from old timestamps: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/v0.5.3/src/main.cpp#L1442
assbot: bitcoin/main.cpp at v0.5.3 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1CoQMyA )
asciilifeform: mr h was trying, as a young academic in usa, to troll liberasts without being stoned to death immediately
mircea_popescu: he seems to be proposing the notion that saying she when i mean a cuntbearer is about as bad as inventing a special ble pronoun to denote a guy's color
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: and it reads as the usual tedium because it -was- same, with words swapped
mircea_popescu: well here's the thing : i don't happen to give a shit about the guy's color
mircea_popescu: but i'm not particularly interested to discuss anyone outside of their gender.
asciilifeform: at any rate it was a mega-troll in gringolandia
mircea_popescu: which is why english, latin and every other language has a gender pronoun and declension.
asciilifeform: if does not work outside - unsurprising
mircea_popescu: i guess anything can be a mega troll there.
asciilifeform: 'seinfeld effect' case.
mircea_popescu: such a dumb premise tho. "i will write very bad prose, which will prove to you that sensible is shocking!!!1"
asciilifeform: cuntbearer << can't help but imagine this as something like a cupbearer
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform kinda what's meant.
mircea_popescu: and somehow this gets conflated with marital status ? who the hell cares if the woman's "married" whatever that even means.
asciilifeform: mod6: not once have i seen the wedge at 168000
asciilifeform: with any of our 0.5.3 derivatives
mircea_popescu apologizes for all the spam in the more important discussion.
asciilifeform: the 'bastard' variant will wedge, however, for up to an hour (in my experiments)
asciilifeform: when it encounters a shit-feeder
mircea_popescu: mod6 i didn't see a 168000 exactly freeze either, ever
mod6: <+asciilifeform> mod6: not once have i seen the wedge at 168000 << us either, until 72 hours ago
asciilifeform: why no more than hour, i do not know - either good fortune, or their connection flakes out (see former), or ?
mod6: hmm.
asciilifeform: mod6: also note that the hardcoded seeds do not come into play unless irc fails
asciilifeform: (presently irc is there and enabled)
mod6: yeah, gotcha.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform if memory serves there'sa cutoff that severs unproductive connections after an hour.
asciilifeform: that'd be it then
asciilifeform: mod6: post your debug.log
asciilifeform: mod6: for the wedge
mod6: so if anyone else sees any wedging on a checkpoint block like the following, let me know right away, pm me if required: http://dpaste.com/1N3NPT9
assbot: dpaste: 1N3NPT9 ... ( http://bit.ly/1AlPffR )
mod6: asciilifeform: there is a snippit in the matrix one. not sure if I have a full one still.
mod6: i probably do, but I'm making a fresh sync now.
asciilifeform: aha found it
mod6: will have a fresh one in an hour or two
asciilifeform recites kakobrekla's sacramental 'did somebody molest the britneychain'
mod6: i was getting pretty paranoid at first.
mod6: had a tinfoil hat on and everything heheh
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41350 @ 0.00037014 = 15.3053 BTC [+]
mod6: got 100k blocks to go until i probably re-wedge @ 168k
mod6: one time i got wedged at like 27,5XX !?
mod6: this was on Saturday night.
mod6: but then i applied the rm_checkpoints patch and then it continued on np.
asciilifeform: mod6: make a copy of .bitcoin shortly prior to wedge
mod6: ok will do.
mod6: We wanted to collect as much data as possible before we let other know in #b-a. Hence the delay until now.
mod6: I wasn't fully sure that it wasn't our build script or something wonky screwing it up... but a hand-build showed the same result.
asciilifeform: not proclaiming a molested britneychain as proven fact yet, but if it had been, it would look rather much like this.
mod6: i've got mutiple good v0.5.3 chains saved, but ... just was regression testing to ensure full sync with the v0.5.3.1 patch before release sign & cut
mod6: lo and behold..
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform nah, i keep old nodes and old chains.
mircea_popescu: it must be some sort of local issue.
asciilifeform: mod6: this'd be why i objected to zapping the checkpoints thing wholesale. now, programmable checkpoints - by all means.
asciilifeform: config file - where they belong.
asciilifeform: just say no to hardcoded magic numb3rz.
mircea_popescu: code is not for data. data is not for code.
mod6: yeah. that's the new plan. all magic numbers in a config file.
mircea_popescu: mod6 wasn;t it the old plan ?!
mod6: or, at least, we'll start with that.
mod6: yeah, well, still is the plan i should say :)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: guess who also keeps vintage blockchain around
asciilifeform: and i doubt it's just 2 of us
mircea_popescu: i don't just "keep it around', it's what i actually use.
asciilifeform: all molestation of britneychain is necessarily localized phenomenon
asciilifeform uses, when uses anything at all
mircea_popescu: and yeah pretty sure we're not the onlyones. not by a longmargin.
asciilifeform keeps a number of editions going
mod6: hmm, but yeah, really /was/ weird that it was inconsistant.
mod6: i.e. TomServo having total success, and ben & I having weding problems.
mod6: and we were using same build scripts .. and me building by hand even once.
asciilifeform uses bitcoin as a scientific toy, curio, but if he had been firing it in anger for years as mircea_popescu had, would have finished own implementation eons ago
mircea_popescu: btw, since you were asking ( a while ago) : found the oldest src set, monday may 21st 2012
mircea_popescu: you still want it ?
asciilifeform: sign, post
asciilifeform: to jurov's turdatron, say
asciilifeform: as big fat gz
mircea_popescu: not big at all, 4 mb ish
asciilifeform: bombs away.
danielpbarron: height=176772 << no wedge here
mod6: what's your build?
asciilifeform: i'd love to know what blocks are in the molestation set.
danielpbarron: mod6, the one asciilifeform compiled
mod6: is it the portotronic?
danielpbarron: the bastard one
mod6: yeah, totally different beast
asciilifeform: is some joker trying to euchre in on satoshi's goodies.
asciilifeform: one diddled node at a time.
mod6: but danielpbarron: good to know tho. thx.
mod6: we must get this patched RI repeatable (and it was before a few days ago) before we can cut release.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so how doers this work, email to address, gz in attachment, clearsigned text as email body ?
asciilifeform: attach foo.gz and foo.gz.sig
asciilifeform: for all foos
asciilifeform: body of msg is a cleartext signed pgpgram
asciilifeform: that's it (unless jurov has some other weird constraint in there we haven't yet discovered)
asciilifeform: (x.y.sig is an ascii-armoured detached sig of the usual variety)
asciilifeform: mod6, danielpbarron: in case this wasn't clear, my armv5 build still has the checkpoints (other than orphanage burner, only the basic patches are in)
asciilifeform: this is kinda why i was reluctant to distribute binaries - i want everyone to know precisely what they're eating
asciilifeform: and this is quite impossible with binaries
asciilifeform: (it's hard enough with src)
mod6: yeah, i wanna re-iterate here, all of the wedging issues ben and I had were /with/ checkpoints included. if we apply the rm_checkpoints patch, no longer a problem.
punkman: just sent a patch to the list, wonder if it'll go through
danielpbarron: i'm just running that one while i figure the compile out
danielpbarron: i have 2 more units to try other things on
mod6: 130k...will stop @ 150 and backup .bitcoin/*
asciilifeform: punkman: looks like not
asciilifeform: punkman: generally works within a few sec. when works
mod6: well, but also, i like i was saying, it's inconsistant. because TomServo has checkpoints included and he got through the gauntlet, and I did as well lastweek before the version patch.
mircea_popescu: anyway, it's sent, jurov let me know what i fucked up
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: lol, yours eaten too
mircea_popescu: i probably didn't do it right.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i posted that earlier today. observe: if the hardseed list were actually used with any frequency, we would have noticed the scarcity of still-usable seeds therein ages ago
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: as it is, it's a fallback after dns (snipped in patch i proposed last night) and irc mechanizms.
mircea_popescu: except... i kept saying it and saying it since ages ago ?
asciilifeform: i assume mircea_popescu did similar experimet.
mircea_popescu: always handwaved away by teh power rangers, but hey, you don't end up at the bottom of my shitlist by being responsive and responsible.
asciilifeform: i'm a bit curious how their seed blob is generated
mircea_popescu: all the people who act all shocked when gavin & co can't get enough credit to write a hello world in basic fail to recognize about two years of history trying to gently nudge, then educate, then eventually beat the idiots into some sort of shape
asciilifeform: one interesting way would be, resources permitting, a massive ipv4 post scan for 8333...
mircea_popescu: what resources do you need ?
mike_c: probably just culled from bitcoin-seeder, no?
punkman: fiddy bucks for shoddan
mircea_popescu: there's only 4bn ips
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo dear glub man
asciilifeform: teases, lol
BingoBoingo: So many teases
mircea_popescu: punkman you got an account ?
BingoBoingo: ;;ud glub
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: you actually want to see this done, and have not yet done it?
gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Glub&defid=4862930 | Tipping a narrow necked bottle of olive oil upside down in an attempt to pour a greater quantity which results in a "glub" sound as air fills the bottle replacing the  ...
asciilifeform surprised
asciilifeform: ud is wrong
asciilifeform: that's 'glug'
asciilifeform: ask any chemist!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform can i get some public/private separation here!
punkman: mircea_popescu: no
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it needs roughly same resources as a good spamatron
mircea_popescu: it doesn't really need as much.
decimation: so are there actually isps that filter port 8333 or was that just made up bullshit?
mircea_popescu: made up bs.
asciilifeform: decimation: i can't speak for the whole planet, but nothing i've used in usa filters incoming except in the sense of -all- incoming being denied by wireless providers
mircea_popescu: i mean, obviously, an idiot will exist for whatever idiocy. pretending that "transsexuals are hot now" is just trannie wet dreamin'.
asciilifeform: outgoing - port 25 typically dropped where i live
asciilifeform: on account of winblows/spam
asciilifeform: actually i must revise above. winblows 445 incoming is often zapped
asciilifeform: on account of idiots/smb
decimation: re: hedge funds & banks manipulating pr << one wonders if they are trying to jawbone bitcoin down in order to buy in, or kill?
assbot: robertdavidgraham/masscan · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1DyX2EU )
mircea_popescu: decimation the two aren't really distinct.
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah port 445 is amusing. I remember years ago when you could 'hack' by clicking 'show network neighborhood' on winblows
asciilifeform: decimation: esp. fun on defective WANs like cablemodem
decimation: I wonder if anyone has attempted to hack around with docsis at the physical layer
asciilifeform: decimation: answer's yes
asciilifeform: decimation: i'm aware of work re: 'uncapping' (cheat for bandwidth augment) but also proper pwnage of modems
asciilifeform: i can't say that i've kept up with the work on the subject
decimation: supposedly traffic on the wire is encrypted
decimation: but I don't know if the spec is open
asciilifeform: decimation: i haven't a clue, but generally a mass-produced gadget in usa -never- used proper public key crypto
assbot: CableLabs » Search Specifications Library ... ( http://bit.ly/1DyXpPL )
asciilifeform: if uses civilized rsa at all, it is with ludicrously shrunken key lengths
decimation: apparently docsis 3.1 uses 2048-bit rsa for the device, 4096 for the root ca
mircea_popescu: that is not bad ?
asciilifeform: aha so ssl-style sc4m
asciilifeform: decimation: i can't be arsed to wade through spec, but didja find who generates key?
asciilifeform: i.e. is it baked in at factory
asciilifeform: or crapped out on powerup
decimation: device key?
asciilifeform: and, what gets used as the block cipher ?
asciilifeform: (aes? what length)
asciilifeform: !up Vexual
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 106657 @ 0.00038332 = 40.8838 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 99203 @ 0.00039021 = 38.71 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: punkman: i specifically did not mean 'use publicly available site which may or may not actually scan in the way printed on the box, and may or may not censor or otherwise diddle shown results'
asciilifeform: fiddybucks or otherwise
asciilifeform: and once scanned, the logical next step is to query versions
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 185750 @ 0.00036981 = 68.6922 BTC [-] {3}
asciilifeform: and, if gargantuan pipes can be had, to query addr lists and then graph wizardry
asciilifeform: (e.g. find clusters, cliques, esp. ones with peculiar behaviour)
asciilifeform: for a less-than-gargantuan pipe, this scales down in the obvious statistical way.
mircea_popescu: aws is cheap enough.
asciilifeform: iirc, the latest phoundation edition is able to use ipv6
asciilifeform: but probably safe to ignore these
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not sure if aws will even put out raw packets
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: see the linked 'mass scan' readme.
asciilifeform: (it uses custom tcp stack)
asciilifeform: and prefers to diddle a physical NIC directly, even.
asciilifeform: can also scan the old-fashioned way but then add two or three zeros to time required.
asciilifeform: also it absolutely has to happen from outside usa, for reasons
asciilifeform: (or in usa, but not own box)
assbot: Our thoughts are also with the measles-ravaged country America. I hope we are screening them before they come to Africa.
BingoBoingo would not be surprised if traveler leaving US get quarentined for "Health Screenings" in the not to distant future.
BingoBoingo: If not already a thing.
Vexual: even if just to check if your dna is the same as when you arrived
asciilifeform: or what interesting antibodies you've come back with
Vexual: tru dat
asciilifeform: (for non-u.s. folks: the harshest searches are reserved for folks flying -in- at present)
punkman: asciilifeform: question is where to host massscan instance
asciilifeform: punkman: got a 10Gb/s pipe somewhere in asia ?
decimation: asciilifeform: docsis 3.1 uses aes-cbc 128-bit keys
asciilifeform: on physical (specifically not vps) machine
asciilifeform: decimation: ahahaha there we go
asciilifeform: toy crypto - it's not just a bad idea, it's the law! (TM)
decimation: ah "The CM MUST have two factory installed CM Device Certificates (and their associated private keys). The CM MUST have a CM Device Certificate installed that is issued from the new PKI. The CM MUST have a CM Device Certificate installed that is issued from the legacy PKI. The CM MUST have the same RSA public key in the CM Device Certificate as the RSA public key in the BPKM Attributes depending upon which CM Device Certificate is
decimation: used for authentication. The CM MUST use the CM Device Certificate issued from the new PKI when authenticating with a DOCSIS 3.1 or higher CMTS. The CM is to use the CM Device Certificate issued from the legacy PKI when authenticating with a DOCSIS 3.0 or older version of DOCSIS CMTS."
decimation: CM = "Cable Modem"
asciilifeform: -and- device keys generated in factory!
punkman: btw the patch that got lost in the tubes: http://dpaste.com/2EG2F1K.txt
punkman: removes cpumining functions
asciilifeform: punkman: lemme guess, snipped miner
asciilifeform: punkman: i actually must confess that i disagree
decimation: don't worry little consumer, your device uses 'military grade crypto'
asciilifeform: this is, recall, a -reference- implementation
decimation: we'll keep the keys though thanks
asciilifeform: punkman: hence ought to contain an example of miner.
asciilifeform: even if it is worthless in practice
decimation: lol "The CM MUST be able to process certificate serial number values containing 20 octets or fewer. The CM MUST accept certificates that have serial numbers that are negative or zero."
asciilifeform: but idea being, if dropped on alpha centauri with the RI, ought to be able to start using bitcoin immediately
asciilifeform: this means miner is in.
Vexual: japanese torrentboxes are abundant
decimation: asciilifeform: surely the miner need not be part of the same binary turdball?
asciilifeform: Vexual: has to be a *physical* box
asciilifeform: decimation: sure, can be outside
Vexual: im sure they are
asciilifeform: decimation: but imho it is unwise to throw away satoshi's miner so lightly
decimation: aye, the cpu mining code can come with
asciilifeform: satoshi's miner is valuable for the same reason as the rest of that piece of shit
punkman: asciilifeform: yeah I'm not sure it should be removed, the foundation shall decide. it was good for practice anyway
asciilifeform: i.e. it was written before bitcoin was valuable.
decimation: asciilifeform: in general, docsis is a "reference implementation" of usg crypto, complete with fips standards etc.
asciilifeform: decimation: surprised ?
Vexual: if youre making a node box, youd better have somewhere to plug in a miner
decimation: well, the amusing part is the key escrow
asciilifeform: Vexual: well, 'Get Work'
asciilifeform: decimation: the funny part isn't any of this, but that wtf is the point, isp has plaintext of your packets necessarily, anyway
asciilifeform: the escrow can have -only one- purpose - to let nice folks at usg forge packets as 'provably' from your house.
asciilifeform: !s toilet tank
assbot: 9 results for 'toilet tank' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=toilet+tank
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah presumably if they wanted the packets they would just squeeze the ip stack at the isp
asciilifeform: ergo it is for -writing- not reading.
asciilifeform: reading - already trivial
decimation: well, there's another agenda here too
decimation: cable companies don't want mickey mouse crypto to cause some kind of pr incident
asciilifeform: there is also the matter of guaranteeing that the equipment cannot be repurposed for any sane use
asciilifeform: e.g., abroad
decimation: your traffic is for the eyes of those who are authorized to have it
asciilifeform: ^ that comes from isp tap, no need for diddled modems
decimation: aye. but the problem with this system is that they have put all their eggs in the manufacturer's basket
decimation: who keeps that keylist?
asciilifeform: there's another aspect, also
asciilifeform: there is a tradition in usa of 'deniable' snooping
asciilifeform: where the tap is placed surprisingly close downstream to the 'last mile'
assbot: heartbleed in rust ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dz2WFT )
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> can also scan the old-fashioned way but then add two or three zeros to time required. << yes, but cheap enough :)
asciilifeform: decimation: i wonder if the device keys have even been 'phuctored' ever.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i'm not certain that a scan taking >year is worth much
mircea_popescu: eh fuck em, cloud speeds double every half year.
mircea_popescu: trivial on this basis to show it will be < 1 year
mircea_popescu: no matter what other numbers are involved.
mircea_popescu: don't lol mr, my work on this topic has been reviewed by internet csseconomists and other lolexperts. plus oleg leganza.
assbot: Logged on 28-08-2014 03:56:01; asciilifeform: there is also the tired, old, mundane 'there is a kilo of cocaine in your toilet tank' theorem.
asciilifeform: there is a whole not-very-well-hidden world of what one might call 'cardinal richelieu' ('...six words of the honest man!') infrastructure, waiting for command from usg to send 'd34th thr34tz!!!1111!!!' to some crowned head that are Provably!111! from your house, when the time comes
mircea_popescu: kinda why one should not waste time.
asciilifeform: !up Vexual
mircea_popescu: send'em while you still can.
asciilifeform: oh it'll send by itself, lol
asciilifeform: with finest grammar, from content farms in philippines
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform check out this funny happenstance : once bb dropped the philippines bomb ? 20 mb thread suddenly of no further interest, off first page etc.
mircea_popescu: the best part of tradecraft is that it is so god damned hard to do well.
asciilifeform: see also the reddit incident
asciilifeform: same deal, no?
mircea_popescu: it's just this font of lulz, like, hm... quintessentially american to me.
mircea_popescu: lemme dig up that woman.
assbot: Literara este grea pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dz528X )
asciilifeform wonders whether, if mircea_popescu offered a bounty, one of the flunkies would walk in with 'smoking gun' dirt
mircea_popescu: this was a simple woman who couldn't write, that infatuated herself with the notion that she can produce poetry
mircea_popescu: was a great amusement for a little bit
mircea_popescu: but she persevered. the exact manners in which she persevered are, to me, the best summary of the american spirit that can be had.
asciilifeform: i was expecting a reference to the maths girl
mircea_popescu: a) claimed that the poor arrangement / band / etc were the reason people "didn't like" her 2nd performance.
mircea_popescu: the move from "laughed their ass at me" to "didn't like" ? blaming the band ? here : http://trilema.com/2015/have-some-chocolate-cake/#comment-111925
assbot: Have some chocolate cake. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dz5gge )
mircea_popescu: but then, for it doesn't end there! then she confronted teh comedy goldminers by saying that "they each paid a quarter to see a fool, but she's been paid 50 bux and sees a roomfull of fools"
mircea_popescu: right ? TOTALLY TURNED IT ON THEM WITH HER WITS
mircea_popescu: but then!!11 for it has a c. then her husband , who you know, was hoping to be able to enjoy a drink in a bar without being laughed into the ground sometime before he dies completely forbade any further writings
mircea_popescu: under pain of beatings and so forth.
mircea_popescu: so she stopped writing ~poetry~. and instead wrote a miserable novel
mircea_popescu: about a farmer. who was in debt. who was married to a marry sue, whose published novel saves the farm.
mircea_popescu: it's this particular concoction of the forcible solipsism of crusoe with the narcissism of a fifteen year old boy that grew up alone among cows, with the desperation of a dying beggar on the dark side of the moon.
mircea_popescu: and if you look at the place's history... those wolves that ate boston... their teeth are still visible in the striations of the skins of these people.
asciilifeform: ^ usa in one page
assbot: Last 16 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2AWRM6H.txt )
decimation: decimation: i wonder if the device keys have even been 'phuctored' ever. << "CMs MUST store and maintain the CM Device Certificate RSA private/public key pairs. The CM MUST store the CM Device Certificate private keys in a manner that deters unauthorized disclosure and modification. Also, CMs SHOULD prevent debugger tools from reading the CM Device Certificate private key in production devices by restricting or blocking physical
decimation: access to memory containing this key."
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=934517.0 seems you've been superseded
assbot: Introducing new "the only official foundation of Bitcoin" [sign up as president] ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dz6wQr )
hanbot: <mircea_popescu> it's this particular concoction of the forcible solipsism of crusoe with the narcissism of a fifteen year old boy that grew up alone among cows, with the desperation of a dying beggar on the dark side of the moon. << ahahaha best review evar
mircea_popescu is kind-of surprised anyone agrees
mircea_popescu: i thought this was highly personal and entirely idiosyncratic a view
asciilifeform: 'We, the true "only official foundation of Bitcoin" declare ourselves the new leaders. Our main goal will be hookers and blow for everyone! Our main concern will be beer and Bitcoin of course. We will represent the bitcoin community from now on in the correct way to the outside world and all important people need to bow to us and bribe us to get a foot in the door. It will also be lucrative for the people in power to infiltrat
asciilifeform: e us so they can be the true leaders of the bitcoin community too.' << win
asciilifeform: 257458.
mircea_popescu: http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/316/303/2ae.jpg << for the record, satoshi also co-authored the original not-a-mary-sue
pete_dushenski: cazalla "negative media attention Bitcoin reguarly receives in the media" << regularly
BingoBoingo: !up Vexual
mircea_popescu: http://qntra.net/2015/02/ubs-groups-cio-wants-to-throw-bitcoin-under-the-buss/ << lol ubs wants a "blockchain technology" separated from bitcoin
assbot: UBS Group's CIO Wants To Throw Bitcoin Under The Buss | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dz8Xm4 )
mircea_popescu: there you go, who asked if to own or to burn ? to this.
asciilifeform: wasn't that an old idiocy ?
asciilifeform: at least a few months?
mircea_popescu: if ubs wasn't so very bankrupt, it'd even matter more.
asciilifeform: i distinctly recall hearing of it before
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform nobody lost his job as ubs cio by doing old idiocy
cazalla: asciilifeform, this one is new but UBS have mentioned it before
cazalla: pete_dushenski, ty
decimation: didn't some ubs guy jump out a window a few years ago
asciilifeform: famous street-pizza kitchen
decimation: I'm thinking of zurich insurance
Vexual: if anyone patents blockchain, its because fuck
Vexual: einstein would be sitting there, drunk as fuck in austria, thinking, "nah thats the same shit"
asciilifeform: let'em patent sky, earth, sea
asciilifeform: own arses.
mircea_popescu: ideally they patent the particular way in which they suck my cock.
mircea_popescu: so there's no confusion if i'm gettingserviced by oliver bussmann or by his mom.
Vexual: lol
asciilifeform: 'the bus, mmm, broke down, mm. -we're- the bus now.' --- 'bangbus'
decimation: asciilifeform: re: 'drugs in toilet' << the simple version is 'ur bezzlars be our bezzlars now!' http://dailycaller.com/2015/01/23/gun-businesses-seek-ways-to-survive-while-denied-basic-business-services/
assbot: How The Federal Government Puts The Screws Into Gun Businesses | The Daily Caller ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dz9PHf )
decimation: "The House Oversight and Government Reform Committee released a report last month showing the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC) targeted gun dealers and other businesses like payday lenders and pawn shops as illegal operations, and pressured banks to halt dealing with these businesses. The administration’s program is now known as Operation Choke Point, which is run by the Departments of Justice and Treasury."
mircea_popescu: i can;t wait for when it's not about the block size but about the total bitcoins, and it's noit about "saving africa" but about saving ubs, and the howlers are not on the forum but on every tv screen,
mircea_popescu: telling them to get fucked THEN will be much lulzier.
mircea_popescu: decimation pity they don't have the backbone (and leadership) to start a cash only program, and publicly denounce banking as a scam.
mircea_popescu: then start shooting police officers coming to steal the cash.
mircea_popescu: make a steak out of the whole thing.
Vexual: ayo
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: see the old threads re: nontriviality of hooking up to cash world from scratch
decimation: usg ought to be careful with pushing this kind of shit, you don't want the little people to become confused about banking
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: e.g., everybody in the store would need to move to that planet
asciilifeform: and someone would still have to come up with electronic bezzlars to pay tax with - or the tax squads descend
mircea_popescu: the nontriviality there is a little ofsometing else. the thought process of "she's a total bitch, let me try and work with her nevertheless" is responsible for more unhappy marriages than any other thing.
Vexual: i like the art deco font, reminds me of a time i can't possibly remember
asciilifeform: well that's usg.
mircea_popescu: not the right approach. bitch talks back, she gets slapped. she starts crying, she gets beaten. she screams, she gets cut loose.
Vexual: and a days folding money might fit in the back pocket
mircea_popescu: government is the bitch. the slightest getting in your way must be met with disproportionately escalated response until it either dies or gives up.
mircea_popescu: this is how small government is both obtained and maintained, and this is how a country that actually works is preserved.
mircea_popescu: and fwiw a principle i studiously observed throughout my life and in all aspects so far. cop wants to bitch about tickets, his department can enjoy thirty eight different lawsuits.
mircea_popescu: and it goes from there.
decimation: in this metaphor, us citizens are henpecked betas?
asciilifeform: 'maintain small government' is like 'maintain small tumour.'
mircea_popescu: decimation quite.
Vexual: do you pay the tickets for your limo mp?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform more like "maintaining your penis in a state where it's enjoyable without ruining your life"
mircea_popescu: Vexual i dun limo.
Vexual: walking is good
decimation: the problem is that the vector usg uses is civilization-destroying. essentially "obey the law" becomes more of a farce until it becomes a laughing matter
asciilifeform: 'I can’t use Amazon, because they prohibit the majority of my products.' -- plenty of small-arms related junk on 'amazon'
mircea_popescu: shoot it.
asciilifeform: just not the boomsticks themselves (regulated)
asciilifeform: nor gunpowder.
mircea_popescu: the usg has no priviledged relationship with the law. it's a poor mockery thereof.
mircea_popescu: we've made more good law here in the past year than the us congress in the past decade.
asciilifeform: 'Karrasch also found he could not use the popular accounting software QuickBooks to pay receipts because of the nature of his business.' --- enjoy 'the cloud' !
mircea_popescu: wait. you could buy a kalash from karrasch ?!
decimation: '“Google could be doing business with firearms businesses. The thing is they won’t because of their stance [against firearms]. I can’t advertise on Google. I can’t advertise on Facebook. I can’t use Amazon, because they prohibit the majority of my products. I closed down that account over a year ago, and I still get notices from them, regardless of the emails I sent to them telling them that I’m not selling with them.”
BingoBoingo: kakobrekla: Win
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla ahahaha scammer cuts loose already introducing new scam ?
mircea_popescu: jesus these idiots.
mircea_popescu: this may be one of the first ones that has made a profit.
mircea_popescu: in a year or two
kakobrekla: quite amazing
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
BingoBoingo: "wrecking ball"
mircea_popescu: decimation see, this is the whine of an idiot.
mircea_popescu: he should start doing actually roi able advertising. create a festival. say in the place where they stole that guy's cattle grazing.
mircea_popescu: give people free ammo. sell guns for cash only.
mircea_popescu: make a point about how the enemy IS THE ENEMY
mircea_popescu: stop pussy-fucking-footing all around the broken, shattered remains of a thing that no longer exists.
asciilifeform: cash << guess who'll be waiting for the cash car on the interstate.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform << <mircea_popescu> then start shooting police officers coming to steal the cash.
mircea_popescu: what exactly are they gonna do ? feed you for the next 30 years ? big whoop.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: your advice makes the same amount of sense as solzhenitsyn's
asciilifeform: which is to say, a good bit of
asciilifeform: but who will take it.
mircea_popescu: i dun recall what that was ?
asciilifeform: !s solzhenitsyn axe
assbot: 8 results for 'solzhenitsyn axe' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=solzhenitsyn+axe
decimation: http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/surveillance-national-rifle-association-cars-license-plates/2015/01/28/id/621159/ << " The National Rifle Association is investigating reports that a leading federal agent proposed using license-plate readers to scan vehicles at gun shows as part of a gun-trafficking crackdown."
assbot: US Car-Spying Plans Included Parked at Gun Shows, WSJ Says ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dzcfpo )
mircea_popescu: people need to seriously stop worrying about imaginary hobgoblins.
mircea_popescu: so what's the problem, if half a million people shoot half a million cops, they're going to build you a special country club and keep you there with all your friends ?
Vexual: i log numberplaltes
asciilifeform: half a million people shoot half a million cops << lol
asciilifeform: are there even half a million in north a.
mircea_popescu: takes < 1 man year.
mircea_popescu: ie, less than the fucking effort to build the cardano.
asciilifeform: this is basically solzhenitsyn's theorem
Vexual: noone to call
asciilifeform: and the reason why 1 machinegunner can guard 500 prisoners
mircea_popescu: heh. people keep derping about the 1% but don't really want to be teh 1% eh ?
mircea_popescu: fine. just as long as we all stop pretending like this is "impossible" and we understand that it's quite possible, perfectly feasible and practically effective.
mircea_popescu: then it can be a "but i dun want to" and everyone can go home happy.
asciilifeform: 'The DEA has designed this program to assist with locating, identifying, and seizing bulk currency, guns, and other illicit contraband moving along the southwest border and throughout the United States.'
assbot: US Spying On Millions of Cars on Major Highways: Wall Street Journal ... ( http://bit.ly/1DzcRLO )
decimation: mircea_popescu: but you said the same plan would not have worked for Louis XVI
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: didja ever have a ru physics textbook with the jumping chinese example ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform fraid not. decimation quote me ?
asciilifeform: 'if the chinese were to jump from stools 1 metre heigh upon hearing the signal over the radio...'
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the rebellion thing is not a cowardice problem as such but actually a byzantine generals problem.
mircea_popescu: 'how many chinese women woud orgasm ' ?
assbot: Logged on 13-11-2014 05:34:16; mircea_popescu: decimation suppose you were king, and ordered the leningrad of paris. what then ?
asciilifeform: suicidal courage is but one solution to the byzantine generals conundrum
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform but the principal problem of the byznatines was their cowardice
asciilifeform: and not an especially effective solution
mircea_popescu: decimation you see the difference between being king and being, allegedly, a nation ?
asciilifeform: as it does not guarantee that the 'generals' march simultaneously or in any useful pattern at all
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform pattern is actually not required in insurection. determination only requisite ingredient, carries day.
asciilifeform: usa is a proverbial 'glass house'
mircea_popescu: decimation they're in fact the opposite sides of the same coin.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform everything ever seems one thing until it isn't. you know ?
asciilifeform: in which few, other than obvious idiots and easily controlled orcs, care to 'throw stones'
asciilifeform: how many folks in usa can survive a month w/out 'business as usual' (mains, fuel, water, just-in-time deliveries to local 'food' shops)
mircea_popescu: so then why so many peoples in the usa bitch!
asciilifeform: same reason a fella sitting on the stake 'bitches'
mircea_popescu: yeah well it gotta be one or the other.
asciilifeform: sitting on a sharpened pine tree fsckinghurts
mircea_popescu: because the aliens aren't about to land with platinum visas for everyone.
asciilifeform: who can disagree.
mircea_popescu: but i guess we can wait :D
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform anyway, to revisit this point : the byzantine generals problem is specifically and exactly mathematically formalised cowardice.
mircea_popescu: this is what cowardice is : the consideration of meta.
mircea_popescu: you see a nail go "don't hit me unless i actually go in the wall" ?
asciilifeform: so, let's take the malcontents of europe circa 1849.
mircea_popescu: fuck you, you're a nail. whether you drive or bend, you're getting hit.
cazalla: au beginning to cut interest rates today
asciilifeform: more courage would have made a difference ?
asciilifeform: or - coordination.
asciilifeform: and knowing what the hell they're doing
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you mean after the austrian monarch was deposed ? in a negotiated peace ?
mircea_popescu: everyone got paid in 1848.
assbot: XE.com - AUD/USD Chart ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dze1XE )
asciilifeform: '48 rather
mircea_popescu: cazalla may be good for exports :D
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform were you thinking 1907 ? i dun see the 1848 angle in any light.
cazalla: mircea_popescu, maybe, but i read demand for au minerals has tanked too
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: thinking of the mostly failed revolts in fr, elsewhere
decimation: the problem from the rebel's point of view - does his rebellion tend to empower gentlemen planters, or lenin, danton, and their ilk?
asciilifeform: ^ i would much like to see that mega-portscan happen. it is really the only sane way to generate a proper seedlist.
asciilifeform: random selection of nodes from whole planet.
asciilifeform: zap whatever compartments and cliques may have formed naturally (or unnaturally...) in the graph.
asciilifeform: or are we to believe that a protocol carried 100% in cleartext, on unique tcp port - is not being molested ?
asciilifeform: (proofofwork is not a magical pill against every conceivable form of molestation, only the immediately profitable forms)
asciilifeform: !up Vexual
asciilifeform: note that enemy has all the portscans he can ever wish for.
asciilifeform: enough to eat with arse.
asciilifeform: whereas normal people are stuck wondering how many public btc nodes, and afaik there is not a believable public number anywhere
asciilifeform: nor any believable public data on versions.
Vexual: no versions, only talk
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i do not grasp how one could see the 1848 revolts as failed.
mircea_popescu: decimation the error is to imagine lenin, dalton and gentlemen planters are some sort of ilk.
mircea_popescu: they're not.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how is a portscan sane ?
mircea_popescu: no, the sane way is wot signed seed list.
asciilifeform: well yes
asciilifeform: but derived how?
asciilifeform did not suggest that a node carry out the scan!
mircea_popescu: derived by "here is the ip of my pogo"
asciilifeform: but that it be performed, now and again, as a scientific enterprise
mircea_popescu: sure, but a scientific enterprise in no way related to generating seedlists.
asciilifeform: ip of my pogo << that'd mean having these identify selves to one another specifically
mircea_popescu: it's what deedbot is for, among other things
asciilifeform: and introduces a central point of choke
asciilifeform: (to whom, precisely, are they to speak?)
asciilifeform: say i were to prepare a crate of pogos today
asciilifeform: whence should they look for seeds ?
decimation: asciilifeform: looks like we are gonna have to invent our own dns :/
mircea_popescu: they should look for seeds in their config file.
asciilifeform: but what is to be found there ?
decimation: asciilifeform: blockchain telegraphy?
asciilifeform: i will not know where the contents of the crate will be plugged in
asciilifeform: decimation: that needs a blockchain!
asciilifeform: decimation: catch22
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not your job to know!
asciilifeform: well, when filling the crate, what is to be placed in the configs?
mircea_popescu: whosoever wants to run one looks at our list, or if not at whatever list he feels like.
mircea_popescu: nothing.
asciilifeform: so these are not working nodes out of the box.
asciilifeform: should have specified.
decimation: should the nodes ship with a 'cannon' blockchain?
Vexual: torrent of data
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes, they are working out of the box.
mircea_popescu: if you buy a coffee grinder it does not work out of the box unless pre-filled with beans ?!
asciilifeform: to backtrack, my earlier suggestion was to ship them with a basic list (a few hundred addrs)
asciilifeform: derived via port scan.
mircea_popescu: fuck democracy.
asciilifeform: i.e. random sampling of planet
asciilifeform: not for 'democracy' but for 'nothing-up-me-sleeve'
mircea_popescu: the fact that someone has a port open matters about as much as the fact someone scribbled something on github/wikipedia/we
asciilifeform: (term of art from crypto world)
asciilifeform: it's like collecting random sample of water from sewer
asciilifeform: sometimes - done
mircea_popescu: there is no burden that i can conceive where one's held to ship with prefilled config files.
mircea_popescu: irrespective of what the consumer may have come to expect.
asciilifeform: well then user has to fill it up.
mircea_popescu: uness you're shipping them to your mother, in which casse, put there w/e you want to put there.
mircea_popescu: of course.
asciilifeform: for some reason i thought we were still thinking in the 'gifts to gurlz at parties' train of thought
Vexual: most noders will ahve interetz
mircea_popescu: we were, yes.
mircea_popescu: so you expected to get gurls address and ship directly ?
asciilifeform is a firm student of 'the best machine is no machine' and like the solution of not even having a solution to the 'what seeds' thing
asciilifeform: however this leaves the 'what seeds' question open still.
mircea_popescu: the solution is perfectly there. here's the hole. here's a peg you may put in there. or else stick your own cock or a bottle of coke
asciilifeform: but there are 1000 holes, and one cock
mircea_popescu: why one cock again ?
assbot: Meta-metastasis, or how a dancing shark jumped the shark. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/16p47gY )
asciilifeform: well, perhaps not one, but... 7? (therealbitcoinfoundation)
pete_dushenski: did anyone else see right through the meta-sharks ?
asciilifeform: but presumably we aren't trying to build a closed parallel universe
asciilifeform: with only our nodes
pete_dushenski: and now dinner time, cheerio!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not specifically. we don't really care.
mircea_popescu: once bootstrapped nodes talk to nodes, what.
Vexual: dang
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: outside-world addrs will not spontaneously appear in a cliquegraph
mircea_popescu: vice-versa.
asciilifeform: so we sit, waiting for all-comers to plug in? sure.
mircea_popescu: clique appears in outside world.
mircea_popescu: that's the idea isn't it
asciilifeform: ^ werks
mircea_popescu: an actual backbone for the bitcoin txn
mircea_popescu: i don't see the letter dns servers perceive any need for putting my fucking ip in their list anywhere.
asciilifeform gets idea
mircea_popescu: it's lightweight, large and dependable. all the qualities the dns letters don't actually have.
mircea_popescu: well, they are dependable, but still.
asciilifeform: 'muhammed will not go to mountain, let mountain go to muhammed'
mod6: basically wedged at 168,000: just waiting for it to error out.
mircea_popescu: this is pretty fucking weird mod6
mod6: yeah. really weird.
Vexual: ascilifeform: you'll consult satoshi?
decimation: even if we want to start a backbone of little pogos, it won't be easy to keep track of ips
decimation: how many of pay for static ip services?
mircea_popescu: think about it : if it won't be easy to keep track of ips it follows it's no longer a chokepoint.
mircea_popescu: it really is better designed dns.
mircea_popescu: (also bear in mind these aren't really supposed to ever power down)
Vexual: duly noted
mircea_popescu: an' with that, i bid you a good night!
decimation: perhaps the node can walk jurov's turdatron for specially marked (and signed) emails
asciilifeform: decimation: turdatron is a central point of failure
mod6: this is strange, last like 5-6 times i got wedged at 168,000 it errored out pretty quickly (like the snippit in the matrix doc), but now, taking a good while...
trinque settles in for a few hours of deedbot hacking
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu has the right idea - deliberately underspecify the seed list
asciilifeform: those of us who choose to run public nodes - can
decimation: do nodes query other node's connections?
asciilifeform: decimation: as part of the traditional protocol, yes
decimation: ah, well that might work then
decimation: !down decimation
trinque: maybe when the deturdulation is all said and done, the act of programming against the thing can be improved as well
mod6: still no error?! wth
trinque: select id from transaction_output except select output_id from transaction_input
trinque: magic! the dream of the 70s!
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