#trilema | 2014-12-27

assbot: FBI — High-Frequency Trader Indicted for Manipulating Commodities Futures Markets in First Federal Prosecution for Spoofing ... ( http://bit.ly/1CNG34t )

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 74502 @ 0.00065397 = 48.7221 BTC [-] {2}

Adlai: "It was illegal for traders to place orders in the form of “bids” to buy or “offers” to sell a futures contract with the intent to cancel the bid or offer before execution." <- wat

ben_vulpes: watch out Adlai, you're in their crosshairs now.

Adlai: scalpl executes approximately 0.1% of the orders it places, i guess i'm fucked

ben_vulpes: the notion that an order once placed must live on until filled is pretty lulzy

ben_vulpes: although it's right in line with the bitcoin 'no backsies' ethos.

Adlai: a saner approach (and probably what the relevant laws actually say, rather than this trite simplification) is that some amount of time has to elapse between placement and cancellation, perhaps measured on the "volume clock"

cazalla: short logs this morning

ben_vulpes: the wallets notion is actually dangerous to noob minds. how is anyone ever supposed to get a decent comprehensive understanding of bitcoin if it's behavior is wrapped up in this pernicious notion of wallets?

ben_vulpes: it makes some amount of sense in a pre blockchain explorer world i suppose: 'how is one supposed to know what transactions are available for spending?' 'listunspent, oh noob'.

joecool: o hey one of my sites apparently was ddos'ing trilema

ben_vulpes: Adlai: http://trilema.com/2012/mpex-and-the-hft-problem/

assbot: MPEx and the HFT problem pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/16WeuZx )

kakobrekla: >Maybe MPEx should offer end-to-end quantum access to the engine, enabling users to submit orders with precisely defined wavefunction, instead of pretending above behavior is a bug and trying to fix it in vain or rationalize it backwardly. < lol

joecool: so is there a new sploit in the wild doing reflection attacks with wordpress? we got a pingback from trilema but we don't have it showing up in our logs (and we don't show up in the ones trilema posted)

thestringpuller: lol joecool!!!!!

thestringpuller: wow first name I see when logging in

thestringpuller: and I had dreams about snoopy and his theme song

joecool: well it's not like i haven't been around here before, you know?

thestringpuller: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZLxB8Xm4Ak

thestringpuller: yea but I had an intense dream about snoopy and vince guaraldi, and then the second I log in your name is the first one i see on the stack

joecool: its fate yo

assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1475 @ 0.00118999 = 1.7552 BTC [+] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22900 @ 0.0006535 = 14.9652 BTC [-] {2}

thestringpuller: ;;later tell chetty https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-pTCrgbc433k/VJsu-k48pSI/AAAAAAAAXIQ/mTHXZ4fpDBY/w500-h268-no/anigif.gif << blender got an upgrade

gribble: The operation succeeded.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27800 @ 0.00066643 = 18.5268 BTC [+] {4}

kakobrekla: https://twitter.com/Bitcoin_Stocks/status/548908520070844416

assbot: https://t.co/Ous275BdJ1 is now online! NEWEST bitcoin HYIP! Already $20USD invested in less than 2 hours of launch! /hashtag/hyip?src=hash /hashtag/bitcoin?src=hash /hashtag/invest?src=hash

kakobrekla: oyeah.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35650 @ 0.00066938 = 23.8634 BTC [+] {3}

Azelphur: can I reply to that with the wikipedia article explaining that a HYIP is a ponzi scheme

Azelphur: I want to so badly.

Azelphur: I did it, I'm curious to see how mad whoever it is gets. :P

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33024 @ 0.00067033 = 22.137 BTC [+] {2}

thestringpuller: The P in that acronymy stands for Ponzie though...

thestringpuller: Ponzi, been watching too much happy days with the Fonzie.

thestringpuller: ;;ud hyip

gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=HYIP | The word "hyip" is the bastard child of the words hip and yip. Usually repeated twice in quick succession, the pitch of your voice should match the level of your ...

kakobrekla: !up zerouncool

zerouncool: hello

zerouncool: fre ups now?

kakobrekla: nah, that be 5$

kakobrekla: jeez i wasnt serious.

kakobrekla: !up diatonic

mircea_popescu: incidentally asciilifeform does http://trilema.com/2014/come-see-me-dream-math/ bring anything to mind ?

assbot: Come see me dream math. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1D0XWdj )

mircea_popescu: on the topic of "can irrational numbers that are powers of rational numbers be written out as polynomes with rational parameters"

ben_vulpes: good day, mircea_popescu

mircea_popescu: how goes!

ben_vulpes: well enough well enough

ben_vulpes: discovered that 0.5.3 doesn't have the create/sign raw transaction facilities :(

ben_vulpes: *or* importprivkey

ben_vulpes: what else

ben_vulpes: oh yeah the moviefication of the pynchon novel inherent vice releases next week.

ben_vulpes: unrelated but exciting

mircea_popescu: nah those were added later

mircea_popescu tries to remember when

mircea_popescu: prolly 6.branch

mircea_popescu: importprivkey is trivial tho, just not supported by the gui or w/e

mircea_popescu: people had been building "wallet tools" as a bundle in parallel which eventually got merged into bitcoind sometime around early 2012

mircea_popescu: prolly would have been better if they actually became an independent project and continued separately, but beggars/

ben_vulpes: i'm of the opinion that facilities for btc handling beyond creating and signing raw transactions are entirely unnecessary.

mircea_popescu: so you keep your btc total in head ?

ben_vulpes: not fundation policy by any stretch of the imagination, just my opinion at this point in time.

ben_vulpes: yeah, why not? or check any of the myriad blockchain explorers.

ben_vulpes: put it in a spreadsheet oslt

mircea_popescu: it gets iffy.

mircea_popescu: at the very least you need a safe enumerator of pubkeys.

mircea_popescu: once you do that, might as well do some accounting.

mircea_popescu: once you do that, idiocy like bitcoind does with "accounts" and whatnot is a tempting step away

ben_vulpes: that's what i've seen in practice.

ben_vulpes: plus the whole "sendto" paradigm provides the opportunity for downright nefarious behavior like sending change to random addresses.

ben_vulpes: anyways we're talking reference implementation, not wallet for noobs.

mircea_popescu: why is sending change to random addresses nefarious ?

mircea_popescu: more aptly put, if that's nefarious why do we even think bitcoin makes sense.

ben_vulpes: sorry, i'm being unclear.

ben_vulpes: the wallet model provides cover for the "no address reuse" hooliganry.

ben_vulpes: the implicit "pull new key out of keypool (creating new keypair if keypool is exhausted), send all spare coins beyond the explicitly specified mining fee to this new keypair" routine.

ben_vulpes: maybe i'm getting cranky, but the "specify all important outputs, remainder is for the miners" behavior of transaction processing should never have been papered over.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4242 @ 0.00067036 = 2.8437 BTC [+]

mircea_popescu: im not so sure that predictable behaviour is actually ideal.

mircea_popescu: what's wrong with "create 6 new addresses, split change on any tx among these 6, usingthe same number of nonzero digits as the payment"

mircea_popescu: so a 3.7566 payment out of a 3.9 btc balance becomes 3.7566 0.0992 etc

ben_vulpes: sure that's sensible.

ben_vulpes: someone could even write a script that takes an input, a config file, and a desired output to cook up the desired transaction.

ben_vulpes: which then gets signed by bitcoin, given the relevant privkey.

mircea_popescu: yeah, the address count could be user-configured

mircea_popescu: too many unsafe on weak entropy systems. then again, whith a good entropy source, 256 or 65536 could be the default.

mircea_popescu: with a 64k list one would have the following problem : the tree of following transactions 4 bits removed is... 64bit.

mircea_popescu: 4 bits removed = 4 steps removed

ben_vulpes: anyways the point i'm trying to make is that desired wallet behavior is entirely orthogonal to a thing that "bitcoinates".

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4649 @ 0.00065979 = 3.0674 BTC [-]

ben_vulpes: the fewer things that are included in the notion of bitcoinating, the easier it'll be for nubbins` to print and asciilifeform to read.

mircea_popescu: no argument.

joecool: mircea_popescu: hey, one of my sites got a pingback from trilema on christmas saying it was affected by the pingback ddos, is this still an issue in current wordpress? xmlrpc looks substantially rewritten since we initially worked around this

mircea_popescu: joecool it is yes.

mircea_popescu: lemme find you the ref

mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2014/o-hai-let-me-wanna-be/#comment-110801

assbot: O hai let me wanna-be! pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1vBnlp4 )

mircea_popescu: be so kind to leave a comment once you fix it, it'll encourage other people to do the same i believe.

joecool: mircea_popescu: thanks, we'll make a post directing to the information too

mircea_popescu: fixing teh interwebs, one inept hole at a time!

BingoBoingo: http://qntra.net/2014/12/bitcoin-bowl-recap-nc-state-wins-34-27/#comment-4965

assbot: Bitcoin Bowl Recap: NC State Wins (34-27) | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1BdOkLb )

cazalla: you and your smarmy comments BingoBoingo

BingoBoingo: I know. I learned comments from kakobrekla. By this time next year my soul may too become slanderous.

BingoBoingo: !up b00lcrap

BingoBoingo: Hello b00lcrap

mircea_popescu: lol he is pretty good with comments huh

b00lcrap: hello

b00lcrap: good day gentlemen

b00lcrap: Mr.P how is life in the southern hemisphere

decimation: ;;isitdown log.bitcoin-assets.com

gribble: log.bitcoin-assets.com is up

decimation: not for me

b00lcrap: hello BingoBango

kakobrekla: decimation its up here

decimation: log1 works fine

kakobrekla: dik.

decimation: I do get response, it's just slow

decimation: maybe some pipe filled up somewhere

kakobrekla: looks like someone from bitwin discovered bitbet comments and figured out the math

kakobrekla: dang.

BingoBoingo: Maybe increment to 38?

b00lcrap: can u tell me why someone hates bitcoin-assets so much they wish to ddos whoever joins?

decimation: b00lcrap: it's a mystery

mircea_popescu: tons of people living on welfare out there.

mircea_popescu: this means they don't have to make sense, or even consider their actions.

b00lcrap: is that why there is so much black people crime in america

BingoBoingo: b00lcrap: Don't forget methed up white people and hardworking shades of brown in between.

decimation: I'm not sure welfare is the proximate cause for black violence

decimation: witness west africa

b00lcrap: this is ture

mircea_popescu: well there's a jump, from ddosing to black violence.

mircea_popescu: what is this!

b00lcrap: you know i was watching the notebook last night and i thought wow, people were so civilized in the 50's. then i thought what culture changing event could have possibly happened to cause all of this fuckedupness.

b00lcrap: then i realized, it was the integration that happened in the 60s

b00lcrap: im feeling pretty racist

cazalla: you need to check that white privilege b00lcrap

b00lcrap: lol

b00lcrap: im not saying all black people are like that ofc not

cazalla: i think i'll take my own privilege down the bottlo and get another bottle of sambuca seeing all is quiet on the news front and BingoBoingo has taken to trolling the readers

b00lcrap: well i guess i kind of did just say they destroyed america.

decimation: b00lcrap: black people didn't destroy america, the cultural marxists who infantilized blacks and waged war on regular working people did

b00lcrap: hold on your words are too big let me google that before i respond

decimation: the 'long march through the institutions' - ever hierarchy was ripped down and replaced with a communist bureaucracy

BingoBoingo: cazalla: Not the readers, just certain sorts of commenters.

b00lcrap: does anyone here

b00lcrap: even live in the states?

b00lcrap: i mean

b00lcrap: america.

BingoBoingo: Nominally.

mircea_popescu thinks decimation pretty much has it

mircea_popescu: it is, after all, easier this way.

b00lcrap: hey mircea_popescu i was curious about something, does santa still ride a sliegh down there ?

mircea_popescu: where ?

b00lcrap: in the southern hemisphere where its summer ( mostly )

mircea_popescu: oh. they were preparing the weirdest nativity scenes earlier, with like palsm and camels and shit.

BingoBoingo: I thought in the Southern Hemisphere they just got all Krampus and no Santa

b00lcrap: lol

b00lcrap: well camels makes sense i suppose

mircea_popescu: anyways, im off for now, have fun good people!

b00lcrap: enjoy.

b00lcrap: i just learned about krampujs last week

b00lcrap: from american dad

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17300 @ 0.00065503 = 11.332 BTC [-]

BingoBoingo: Ah.

joecool: learned about zwarte piet from the -otc channel the other day

BingoBoingo: !up b00lcrap

b00lcrap: black peter rofl.

b00lcrap: thats hillarious

BingoBoingo: In the event I father children that I stay around to raise, "Red Sleigh Down" is going to be the official Jesus/Santa story relayed to them.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13253 @ 0.00067036 = 8.8843 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2597 @ 0.00067113 = 1.7429 BTC [+]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48600 @ 0.00065452 = 31.8097 BTC [-] {4}

assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2194 @ 0.00118511 = 2.6001 BTC [-] {8}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 97800 @ 0.00064822 = 63.3959 BTC [-] {3}

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