Hide Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2014-06-10 | 2014-06-12 → ↓
BingoBoingo: Indeed. My new alias is Tater Totz
BingoBoingo: Fuck me
BingoBoingo: I suck
BingoBoingo: Oh, someone else is using the nick Tater Totz
BingoBoingo: This... must really suck for them...
asciilifeform doesn't get the reference - or really want to
justusranvier: BingoBoingo: She is ok
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: The reference is merely to the pseudo source of carbo hydrates.
BingoBoingo: justusranvier: That is great.
justusranvier: Suppose I should tweet a follow up
BingoBoingo: Dogs are too much better than us to suffer much
assbot: I'm a big Matt Carpenter fan. But, for Pete's sake, swing the bat! /hashtag/stlcards?src=hash
justusranvier: I am rather fond of them but I wouldn't go so far as to say "better than us".
BingoBoingo: justusranvier: Name a single person other people would knwo who inheres the property of being innocent...
assbot: She's doing much better than a few days ago. http://t.co/0DRu2ae1qD
assbot: It's not everyday you get a letter from the NSA. :-) /hashtag/FOIA?src=hash http://t.co/nmXYFpF8CS
BingoBoingo: Thank you justusranvier
assbot: On The Superiority of Monarchy (or, adnotations to Why the Worst Get on Top) pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: mp proudly presents.
BingoBoingo: That is some hella timing
BingoBoingo: Also, I am probably never refering to canonical's product ever again as anything but nigbuntu. Even Windows is almost better.
mircea_popescu: but why nig ?
BingoBoingo: Because in dutch "nig" and "ignorant" resolve to the same root word.
mircea_popescu: mike_c: i do :) i should clean up some of my scripts and publish them sometime.. << prolly.
BingoBoingo: Also, seriously, nothing was logging system faults. I share some blame for not ensuring this, but... Who the fuck did I expect to do this.
BingoBoingo: Lazy ass watermelon eating Mark Shuttleworth.
mircea_popescu: hm, syslog ?
BingoBoingo: Makes me hope there is NEVER a new Rhodesia.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Firefox crashed opening a cryptome link.
mircea_popescu: that's not likely a kernel errror
asciilifeform: if all (even userland) crashes were exploitable - we'd all be rich
asciilifeform: (or just very sad)
BingoBoingo: I assumed all crashes were logged, but I was too niggardly to make sure.
BingoBoingo: Now I'm connected to IRC through a pile of lies.
assbot: Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/186BRM9.txt )
asciilifeform: ratio of crashes to useful (exploitable) crashes is roughly like kimberlite to diamond.
BingoBoingo: Explain those minerals in Eve terms...
BingoBoingo: Also... I'm glad I never turn the Ultra 5 off
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: volcanic rock, found in za
mircea_popescu: davout: do i read this one correctly or is euronext valued somewhere around a fifth of whatsapp << if you believe the numbers, yes.
BingoBoingo: Za mean nothing now that South africa has the abreviation. Where did the great Rhodesia go???
mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust nkuttler
gribble: Currently authenticated from hostmask nkuttler!~nkuttler@unaffiliated/nkuttler. Trust relationship from user mircea_popescu to user nkuttler: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 2 via 4 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=mircea_popescu&dest=nkuttler | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=nkuttler | Rated since: Mon Apr 8 17:12:48 2013
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: incidentally you can still get '.su'
BingoBoingo: Wake me up when I can get .nig
BingoBoingo: SHort for shuttleworth
asciilifeform: wonder who will have '.us' a decade hence
BingoBoingo: Never since Adrian IV has someone squandered prominence as much as Shuttlecock has.
mircea_popescu: !up joesmoe
mircea_popescu: to auto-voice you need to a) identify with gribble. you don't need gpg for this, tho gpg works. you can also identify with your btc address ; b) be in assbot's l2 trust.
mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust assbot joesmoe
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user joesmoe: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=joesmoe | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=joesmoe | Rated since: Tue Mar 12 17:07:21 2013
mircea_popescu: you currently are not, which is why assbot isn't upping you.
joecool: ;;gettrust assbot joecool
gribble: Currently authenticated from hostmask joecool!~joecool@no-sources/joecool. Trust relationship from user assbot to user joecool: Level 1: 1, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=joecool | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=joecool | Rated since: Thu Apr 28 14:23:15 2011
BingoBoingo: Through this mess of VM's I'll also say the portale's original Mobo is dead. Fuck you '12 BIOS update.
mircea_popescu: punkman: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=634283.0 << holy shit that 2nd post reads like yahoo answers
assbot: Where i can sell my business plans and ideas about bitcoin and its dev?
mircea_popescu: they've created their own community alright.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu's post: führerprinzip, it works. preaching to choir?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform im justannoyed that people like mises and hayek, ultimate fucking socialists, are represented as some sort of anti-socialism.
mircea_popescu: fucking bullshit, collectivists arguing with each other as to the proper way to the gallows, pretending like it's a world.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: incidentally, ~= 'единоначалие'. how do you say 'führerprinzip' in english? 'steve jobs' ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i don't think these are the same tbh.
asciilifeform: if they were, there'd be no need to learn languages
mircea_popescu: there's this very active, latin approach to leadership that i object to.
mircea_popescu: your leader is not fucking here to tell you what to do.
asciilifeform: i like to call it 'playing civ-1'
mircea_popescu: it's exhausting.
asciilifeform: stalin was never more frustrated and ineffective than when he played civ1
mircea_popescu: what, on the early years of the front?
asciilifeform: there, and occasionally at home
BingoBoingo: My favorite part of C machines is their capacity for deception.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: cant they make it any longer << lmao
mircea_popescu: jurov: bitcoin is registered trademark nao << always has been. by... mtgox. bcause... "it;'s better someone with bitcoin's interests at heart have the tm than someone random"
mircea_popescu: now it will be bought for pennies in a court auction, and you will ALL have to be on my pissing on patents submarine, willy-nilly.
mircea_popescu: well, the dorks that made bitcoin* stuff, at any rate.
asciilifeform: cue the 'we live in submarine' song
mircea_popescu: drawingthesun: I shudder to think what people have said about ActiveMining here << lol fluffypony who's she ?
mircea_popescu: !up drawingthesun
BingoBoingo: It is truly amazing what happens when you walk a disgraced judge's steps backwards a few steps.
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
mircea_popescu: pankkake: French hair salons love word plays in their names. it's ridiculous << the lumbar yard!
BingoBoingo: I know I've played chess here a few times. In the interim have batter cess players found their way here?
BingoBoingo: moiety???
mircea_popescu: ;;seen moiety
gribble: moiety was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 6 days, 12 hours, 19 minutes, and 38 seconds ago: <moiety> ok moving time, see yous later!
mircea_popescu: wonder what happened to her
BingoBoingo: Prolly Phone blindness
asciilifeform: finally bought manul ?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Manul won't counter my Pirc defense with an Austrian attack so boring...
asciilifeform: (phun phact. last i checked, you can legally own and keep any animal you wish in a moscow apartment.)
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Same holds in Missouri.
asciilifeform: there's a clip somewhere of a happy owner of siberian lynx in a little flat there.
asciilifeform: 8th floor.
BingoBoingo: Missouri is the only US state that keeps the promise.
asciilifeform: (new meaning for tired old 'longcat is long')
decimation: mircea_popescu - your intro to the Hayek post calls to mind Mr. Moldbug's point about "chronic kinglessness"
decimation: most of the west would be unable to pass the test of being willing to happily die for the wishes of a particular man or set of men
asciilifeform: decimation: carlyle, evola, ..., ..., limonov, moldy... if one were to spit out all the folks who complained about kinglessness, freenode will boot you for flooding
decimation: yeah, when you think clearly about the nature of soveriegnty, it becomes obvious
[]bot: Bet created: "Yankees to get most all-star selections" http://bitbet.us/bet/895/
decimation: also, modern china, singapore, dubai, etc show that "totalitarianism" (lack of collectivism?) is hardly a barrier to economic development
asciilifeform: 'All cannot play the king, and a host of leaders is no wise thing. Let us have but the one leader, the one true king...' - homer's iliad, part ii
asciilifeform: decimation: the subject of democracy as a successful parasite on wealthy nations was beaten to death by countless people.
asciilifeform: before mr. m touched it
asciilifeform: somehow he gets credited with it by the reddit folks, sorta like tim leary getting credit for lsd
asciilifeform: (most americans seem to think that leary discovered it)
decimation: yeah that's a good point. I guess the reason I "credit" him is because he was the one who brought me out of my ignorance on the subject
BingoBoingo actually had a grad class that spent a few weeks on the Leary papers.
decimation: but there is no doubt that it is ancient complaint
asciilifeform: pity he couldn't stop at popularizing and had to mix in assorted crud.
asciilifeform: when we make monkey noises at moldbug, have to remember, the man perhaps should not be held responsible for his audience
mircea_popescu: decimation how;s that one go ?
asciilifeform: 'you go to war with the enemy you had, not the enemy you wish you had' - or how'd that go.
decimation: the complaint about the degenerate nature of democracy (and its various aliases)?
mircea_popescu: the irony being that democracy works fine... here.
mircea_popescu: among people who comprehend the nature of freedom, so to speak.
mircea_popescu: which is notreally distinct from the nature of sovereignity.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2000 @ 0.00006623 = 0.1325 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: There are geographic anamalies that break democracies and republics, the premier example of which is Illinois.
asciilifeform: incidentally, old russian folk phrase for a fool, 'без царя в голове' - literally, 'without a king in his head' is useful & applicable
asciilifeform: sovereignty starts 'at home'
mircea_popescu: pretty much
asciilifeform: some american or other wrote about 'femtoeconomics' - keeping order in your own brain, i think it was
asciilifeform: perhaps similar concept
decimation: my brain recalls moldbug's discussion of cis vs. trans democracy
asciilifeform: mr mold sometimes reminds me of a kid, given a chess set but with no notion of the game, treating the pieces as a curious kind of marble / blunt or pointed weapon.
decimation: yeah, he has mastered that "alien" form of thinking
BingoBoingo: WTF is cs vs. trans. SHould be dex vs. levo...
decimation: well, I don't think he's an expert chemist...
asciilifeform: obligatory:
assbot: Why is there Anti-Intellectualism?
BingoBoingo: That isn't expert shit, that is learning things rotate shit.
asciilifeform: 'It is useful, however, to distinguish between tinkering and creativity...'
asciilifeform: '...The tragedy of our society is not that so many people outgrow their childlike curiosity, but that so few do. The adult equivalent of childlike curiosity is channel surfing and the ten-second sound bite.'
mircea_popescu: not a bad observation.
mircea_popescu: too many kids running around, raising kids of their own
decimation: asciilifeform, that's a brilliant essay, thanks for the link.
decimation: It strikes me that curiousity is a feature of genetic expression
[]bot: Bet created: "EUR/USD rate to close on or above 1.40 before 2015" http://bitbet.us/bet/896/
BingoBoingo: !up Ukyo
mircea_popescu: decimation indeed it is.
mircea_popescu: that's also why it continues to exist after havingkilled numerous cats
[]bot: Bet created: "S.MG profitable in 2014" http://bitbet.us/bet/897/
BingoBoingo: %ticker
atcbot: [X-BT] Bid: 143 Ask: 260 Last Price: 143 24h-Vol: 4k High: 144 Low: 143 VWAP: 143
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.0243847 = 0.1219 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: "Sub-Saharan Africans never discovered Madagascar. Madagascar was settled initially by sailors from Indonesia"
mircea_popescu: perhaps some reparations are in order.
mircea_popescu: Africans never discovered nearby islands like the Cape Verde archipelago.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5400 @ 0.00085347 = 4.6087 BTC [-]
assbot: Why is there Anti-Intellectualism?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 250 @ 0.00085347 = 0.2134 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 9 @ 0.07035599 = 0.6332 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.06988 = 0.6988 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.0700002 = 0.28 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 800 @ 0.00085609 = 0.6849 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 22 @ 0.07 = 1.54 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11100 @ 0.00085609 = 9.5026 BTC [+]
dub: is buttpay having issues anyone is aware of?
dub: namecheap can't take my coinz
fluffypony: dub: I made a BTC payment to NameCheap yesterday
fluffypony: what's it doing?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.07 = 0.49 BTC [-]
dub: not happneing, they have acknowledged a problem
assbot: Namecheap Status » [Updated] BitCoin Connectivity Issues
fluffypony: that's annoying
dub: indeed
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 11 @ 0.02890909 = 0.318 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Who needs air? (Better Quality) - YouTube
decimation: for those innocent of the subject, here's a video that gives a taste of the Chinese dominance of the electronics market: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBtRJc-z05k
assbot: Electronics shops in Hua Qiang Bei, Shenzhen, China - YouTube
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3300 @ 0.00085639 = 2.8261 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 80 @ 0.01801326 = 1.4411 BTC [-] {9}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 68 @ 0.02439593 = 1.6589 BTC [+] {5}
davout: good morning
fluffypony: morningz
Naphex: morning
davout: ;;later tell mircea_popescu liked the hayek commentary a lot!
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 20 @ 0.0299 = 0.598 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.251 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.254 = 1.27 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.255 = 1.275 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.25888887 = 0.5178 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.2608 = 1.304 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Firefox 30 Available, Firebug 2.0 Released - Slashdot
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 650 @ 0.00085609 = 0.5565 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2100 @ 0.00085442 = 1.7943 BTC [-]
davout: kakobrekla: isn't that a little unclear? -> http://bitbet.us/bet/897/s-mg-profitable-in-2014/
assbot: BitBet - S.MG profitable in 2014 :: 0.06 B (60%) on Yes, 0.04 B (40%) on No | closing in 4 months 4 weeks | weight: 99`875 (100`000 to 1)
pankkake: "If the most optimistic predictions for am's performance come true, I will be able to cover my losses from virtually every other garbage scheme I bought into, plus some." bitcointalk, still looking at a bailout
davout: as in, it can have revenue but still be unprofitable due to expenses
pankkake: s/at/for/
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 17 @ 0.0299999 = 0.51 BTC [+]
chetty: It’s hard to deny just how poorly Chicago’s public schools are performing when it hits you in the face. Such is the case with Paul Robeson High School’s 2014 prom theme: “This is Are Story.”
pankkake: :o thanks obama!
Mats_cd03: they meant to do it, i promise
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 122 @ 0.01800022 = 2.196 BTC [-] {3}
chetty: pankkake, to be fair Obama hasn't been around long enough to ruin the HS kids
dub: but blame africa
pankkake: but he's from Chicago right?
chetty: well he didn't go to HS there, but if he did that might explain a lot
Mats_cd03: barely
dub: its a story about pirates
assbot: Analysis of Radio Frequency Identification (RFID) Chip Prevalence in 3 Discrete United States Populations – WIT
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.261 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7761 @ 0.00085426 = 6.6299 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0693002 = 0.1386 BTC [-] {2}
dub: I'd like to know whats on the chip
dub: one of our american brothers should dump one
chetty: shouldnt be that hard to get a filling replaced and check it out
dub: should be able to just scan it
fluffypony: that is awesome
dub IPO's the Personal Faraday Cage
assbot: Struttergear: Strutter Bubble - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.0698 = 0.698 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 7 @ 0.029999 = 0.21 BTC [-]
assbot: Home - LACNIC
assbot: Bitcoin Betting Kicks Off for Brazil World Cup
pankkake: no bitbet either
assbot: Struttergear: Strutter Bubble - YouTube
kakobrekla: ;;later tell mircea_popescu <davout> kakobrekla: isn't that a little unclear? -> http://bitbet.us/bet/897/s-mg-profitable-in-2014/
assbot: BitBet - S.MG profitable in 2014 :: 0.06 B (60%) on Yes, 0.04 B (40%) on No | closing in 4 months 4 weeks | weight: 99`823 (100`000 to 1)
gribble: The operation succeeded.
dub: davout: handome coke sniper is the best
dub: hansom*
davout: watching
davout: dub: amazing
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11150 @ 0.00085444 = 9.527 BTC [+] {3}
Mats_cd03: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 630.0, Best ask: 632.07, Bid-ask spread: 2.07000, Last trade: 631.89, 24 hour volume: 7078.38017203, 24 hour low: 627.12, 24 hour high: 654.13, 24 hour vwap: 649.944906232
Mats_cd03: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 305253 | Current Difficulty: 1.1756551916903952E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 306431 | Next Difficulty In: 1178 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 20 hours, 28 minutes, and 48 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 12243694772.6 | Estimated Percent Change: 4.14359
kakobrekla: !up weenfan
kakobrekla: how stupid is this.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 12 @ 0.029999 = 0.36 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0699 = 0.3495 BTC [+]
assbot: weenfan +v failed; L1: 0, L2: 0
kakobrekla: !up weenfan
kakobrekla: !up SomeoneWeird
kakobrekla: welcome!
fluffypony: kakobrekla: what's stupid?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 7 @ 0.029 = 0.203 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 13 @ 0.0244 = 0.3172 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 20 @ 0.0701255 = 1.4025 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.07039137 = 0.7039 BTC [+]
assbot: The Argentine bond saga, made simple : SCOTUSblog
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 20 @ 0.0299 = 0.598 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4600 @ 0.00085349 = 3.9261 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 8 @ 0.0244 = 0.1952 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 104 @ 0.00429979 = 0.4472 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: there was talk a few yrs ago (russian) regarding a mesh net built on modern radio hardware in mexican mountains. supposedly destroyed (via agenture methods, no fancy tech) << built by the mexican mafia, was it.
mircea_popescu: benkay the totality of russian personnel residing on foreign soil would be the residentura. the subset doing interesting stuff out of them (such as, not the ambassador's personal homebred imported cocksucker - in most places you have to import women as they don't grow locally babes tall enough, blonde enough, fair skinned enough, lithe enough etc etc etc) would be the... agentura.
mircea_popescu: but since we're on it : agentura.ru :D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.0694053 = 0.4164 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13500 @ 0.00085495 = 11.5418 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: (mostly andrei soldatov, a much more interesting fellow than mossberg, imo)
mircea_popescu: and speaking of mossberg : a google on re/code does NOT pop up the wikipedia page on the top 10 results, like for absolutely any other word with a wikipedia entry.
mircea_popescu: nevertheless, it DOES pop a right panel with a summary of mossberg's wikipedia page.
mircea_popescu: someone should put the time into researching the matter, it seems clear to me by now google is entirely manual, they have no algo left at all.
mircea_popescu: basically the 400bn mkt cap company is in its entirety a hundred people trying to maintain a web directory, and we're back to the early 90s over here.
mircea_popescu: diametric: use truecrypt. hehehehe << lol ok. that was worth it :D
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: BingoBoingo has an odd penchant for eating byproducts of combusting strange << it's seriously not that healthy.
mircea_popescu: i didn't eat the pork fried on the bible/coran/etc for the record.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: gentoo is arguably a 'bad life decision' - like the folks who insist on bicycle for commuting << im interested to hear more of the latter part, do tell ?
mircea_popescu: dub: ff crashed because ff << more specifically, because mozilla co STILL can't make a half decent garbage collector, so they constantly leak memory. yes, even version 69 or w/e they're up to by now.
mircea_popescu: this has fundamental causes in the original training of the people involved with the code, which is why you don't want to learn to computer on bullshit fashionable languages.
pankkake: their garbage collector is better each version, but they add more garbage each version
mircea_popescu: you gotta learn to computer on a language everyone despises, that'll keep you from thinking too much of fucking languages.
mircea_popescu: pankkake haha you have a way with words mr.
mircea_popescu: ok, here's another thing. asciilifeform: there are not (and probably cannot be) 'good' autorouter, but there are plenty of terrible ones. << intuitively it seems to me there should be good autoruters. why not ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: gentoo is a source-only distro, where you get to twiddle compiler flags, wait a week for newly-provisioned machine to compile the universe, and - most annoyingly - suffer in the innermost circle of 'dependency hell' where you have to tear up the entire world to build xxxx
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the latter part. bycicling
mircea_popescu: i know why gentoo sucks :D
asciilifeform: (on account of xxxx depending on yyy which cannot be built with old version of xxxx around, etc. - sometimes 50 packages long 'chain')
asciilifeform: picture the folks who ride 50km on bicycle in each direction every day
mircea_popescu: but why would it have to be 50km ?
asciilifeform: because usa
mircea_popescu: but that's because non-cycle.
mircea_popescu: in a town designed for walking everyone else does fine.
asciilifeform: obviously true
mircea_popescu: in a town designed for driving nothing ever works.
asciilifeform: also true
mircea_popescu: (yet another fundamentally wrong design decision that sits at the core of the us' failure, and can't be fixed)
asciilifeform: seems to me there should be good autoruters. why not << 'travelling salesman problem'
mircea_popescu: let's start with what autorouter does. it fills in routes you didn't make yourself ?
asciilifeform: correct
asciilifeform: some proggys even try to place components
asciilifeform: (this, afaik, never works)
mircea_popescu: ok so now... the number of possible connections is finite.
mircea_popescu: what's the problem with bruteforcing it ?
asciilifeform: finite human lifespan...
mircea_popescu: maybe that's what i'm not getting. how many routes are there on an average board ? thousands ?
asciilifeform peeks at autorouter window mournfully
asciilifeform: thousands.
asciilifeform: but understand, it isn't enough to merely connect things
mircea_popescu: so then what in the fuck. you take an infinite lifespan to try out 10k options on a computer ?
asciilifeform: gotta obey various rules (minimal clearances between various kinds of objects; minimized path lengths; avoid vias like the plague in high-frequency signals; etc)
asciilifeform: sometimes N or more paths have to be of the same length (to 0.1 mm or so) and you end with 'meanders' (look at the bottom side of stick of sdram)
asciilifeform: on top of this, the tracks, vias, components - occupy space
asciilifeform: a via occupies space on all N layers of a board
asciilifeform: (unless it doesn't. called 'blind' via)
asciilifeform: ^ expensive
mircea_popescu: i still think this should be a solvable problem.
mircea_popescu is quite naive.
asciilifeform: in practice, it is solvable - in the sense that man applies 'muscle grease' and board gets routed. eventually.
asciilifeform: and the machine's contribution is substantial
asciilifeform: (no one but children, afaik, uses cad without autorouter entirely)
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: Introduce religion and then bugs become "canon" << they've been trying to do that to bitcoin for a coupla years by now.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i actually added this to the list of things to do when im old and retired.
mircea_popescu: no fucking way this doesn't have a good solution
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: MB of... .bat script << the origin of batshit.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: things to do << fundamentally we're all making a mistake, of solving salesman problem on von neumann engine. instead,
assbot: #bitcoin-assets log
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform my intuition is that the machine couldhave evolving bias. like you know, a virgin girl trying to fuck you.
mircea_popescu: "like this ?
mircea_popescu: "how about this ?
mircea_popescu: "is this any good ?"
asciilifeform: (variation on the famous puzzle-joke where mathematicians were given piles of sticks to sort. they puttered around with algorithms - and then janitor comes, and simply stands the sticks up on table, picking them off longest first...)
mircea_popescu: something like that
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: Rabite's purpose is not correctness, security, or anything else understandable.... Rabit is soley for the lulz << lulz is quite understandable, if not machine-understandable. the trick most people claiming to be "only in for the lulz" do is copied directly from that ancient trick of the socialist, "in it only for the soviets" : they oft use it to cover their own (usually intellecual) laziness
mircea_popescu: with the infantile expectation that no one might figure it out, and should someone figure it out they'd necessarily be easy to laugh down, "because lulz"
davout: "BingoBoingo: Introduce religion and then bugs become "canon" << they've been trying to do that to bitcoin for a coupla years by now." <<< which is one of the reason specifying the protocol was deemed 'too hard'
mircea_popescu: obviously it doesn't work that way, but "obviously" doesn't work for your average screentanned neckbeard because obviously depends on social experience
mircea_popescu: davout indeed. the dirty little open secret here is that if you don't specify it openly, mp will specify it closedly and then beat you over the head every time you deviate
mircea_popescu: and you'll be painfully wrong and he'll be lulzily right each time he does it
mircea_popescu: and now you've engineered humiliatory failure for yourself.
mircea_popescu: but, like the above, not something the screentanned neckbeard can figure out on his own. (same reason)
davout: everyone's trying to be as cool as the openssl folks
mircea_popescu: and plenty are succeeding lol
davout: so, what do you think about the wording of the "s.mg profitable in 2014" bet ?
mircea_popescu: i gotthe gribble but not there in the log so dunno context yet.
mircea_popescu: what's th problem with it ?
davout: the resolution says it has to have "revenue", the title says it has to be "profitable"
davout: i'm saying it can have revenue without being profitable
mircea_popescu: ah that. well, if all else fails the bitbet backstop is that titles are informative, bets are descriptive
mircea_popescu: much like you know, newspaperarticles
davout: ok, so by this logic i just have to make a donation to s.mg to have it have "revenue", and the bet resolves to 'yes'
mircea_popescu: how would you make adonation to s.mg ?
mircea_popescu: (and if the bet was worded otherwise, this would havbe been true. if you can make a hundred billion dollar donation to berkshire you can currently win the berkshire bet too)
davout: by sending it money, assuming there's some sort of service rolled-out by end 2014, if not it can't really have revenue or be profitable, but in this case the bet title might as well be reworded to "s.mg open for business" or something like that
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Would you venture to guess at which post of my blog might pass the Mircea OpenBSD one in the next few months? << something with cats in it. or depending on whaty you mean by pass.
davout: just saying the resolution condition should be rewritten, which shouldn't be much of an issue since there are only house bets for now
mircea_popescu: i don't think that ever happened to date.
davout: said the virgin
mircea_popescu: moreover, you're saying it, but you're not backing it up.
davout: howso ?
mircea_popescu: lol. you ask me how so you've failed to make a case ? by failing to make a case lol.
mircea_popescu: howso you think you did make it, is more the question.
davout: what part of "the title isn't consistent with the bet resolution condition" do you disagree with?
mircea_popescu: the part where that matters.
mircea_popescu: consider perhaps a better example : we go into a japanese restaurant together, where we're given sticks to eat with.
mircea_popescu: these aren't equal length.
kakobrekla: how do you sort them?
mircea_popescu: when pointed out to the manager, he explains that while they mostly try to make it the same length, being two different items obviously they can never in fact be equal length, for quantum reasons
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3400 @ 0.00085315 = 2.9007 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: and so for any case, the backstop is that the larger stick's length is defined as the pair's equal length
mike_c: what? that's ridiculous. the shorter stick should be the pair's equal length.
davout: well, i get how that can be clarified, all i'm saying is that it can't really hurt to make them consistent, especially when no one else has bet yet
mircea_popescu: obviously mike_c runs the rival FUD japanese restaurant across the street
mircea_popescu: where not only they sleep with their horses in the bed, but also all house numbers are even
mircea_popescu: like slovenly sluts.
davout: and also that the bet doesn't make that much sense if to resolve to yes s.mg only has to report an incoming money transfer > 0
kakobrekla: he likes to use that word.
mircea_popescu: davout well let's do these one at a time huh ?
mircea_popescu: it can't really hurt to make them consistent, before they're made. but the entire model (not just of bitbet, for that matter) rests on absolutes, and the proposal of improving this bet runs into the absolute that it's already published,
mircea_popescu: and so it'll go nowhere.
mircea_popescu: and as to how much sense a bet makes... who the fuck cares outside of the people betting on it.
mike_c: bibet has stooped to making clarifying comments before. this may be appropriate in this case.
mircea_popescu: imo bs shakespeare tony awards bets don't make any sense
mircea_popescu: mike_c yeah but i prefer to make it buried in here.
mircea_popescu: gotta give fluffypony's platform a living after all.
davout: granted, but following your logic, if the title doesn't matter wrt the bet resolution there's no problem changing it :-)
mircea_popescu: only because you abusively equate distinct things.
fluffypony: what did I miss
mircea_popescu: the absolute isn't a conditional absolute, ie, "the bet won't changed except for parts we can get away with"
mircea_popescu: now if only the us congress spent their morning today reading this log instead of absolutely anything they've been doing,
mircea_popescu: the us might have a chance of being properly administered for a day.
mike_c: davout: you can easily fix this by asking the question in the comments.
mircea_popescu: mike_c fud #2 for you today, suggesting the choice of venue is upon the plaintiff! WHO EVER HEARD OF THIS
davout: the way i understand what you say is that the bet title is merely a convenience, it has no value with regards to resolution, so by changing the title you're not really changing the bet itself, much like you could change the css around it or whatever
mircea_popescu: davout sure, but the way you understand things has little bearing
mircea_popescu: this isn't some sort of diplomatic negotiation where you can make oral notes on your signing of the treaty
mircea_popescu: "germany understands this peace treaty as a carte blanche to fuck all your womenz"
davout: hm
mircea_popescu: the way it was said was that in any dispute between the two, the body carries.
davout: i'm not saying there's an ambiguity in the bet resolution, it's perfectly clear if the body supersedes the title
mircea_popescu: yeah but you're trying to equivocate between "in any dispute between the two, the body carries" and "by changing the title you're not really changing the bet itself, much like you could change the css around it or whatever"
mircea_popescu: these are not the same, really. for instance, the title is indexed.
mircea_popescu: as far as bitbet is concerned, the string of english words that is the title NOW MEANS the string of english words that is the body.
mircea_popescu: much like if you made an alias.
mircea_popescu: that's the meaning of the japanese sticks story : not that you can throw out one stick
mircea_popescu: but that whatever you may think your measurement shows,
mircea_popescu: the shorter stick IS ACTUALLY as long as the longer one.
davout: yes, i got all that :-)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 800 @ 0.00085432 = 0.6835 BTC [+]
davout: let's move on to the second part
davout: wait
mircea_popescu: i wonder how many people reading the logs just got a legal & philosophical education.
mircea_popescu: what was the second part lessee
davout: the way the resolution is worded can be reduced to : "bet resolves to yes if at some point during 2014, it is possible to send money to an address owned by s.mg"
davout: because that would count as revenue
mircea_popescu: well then it also has to report it.
mircea_popescu: or perhaps it could report revenue nobody sent as btc
mircea_popescu: such as for instance i dunno, blizzard gets scared and pays us 50 bux to not run wow out of business
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.070003 = 0.28 BTC [+]
davout: that would count as revenue
davout: making the bet resolve to yes
davout: even if there are 500 BTC expenses to cover leading to a loss
davout: so the bet resolution could be rewritten as "yes if s.mg receives at least one satoshi in 2014"
chetty: you know it is fascinating how much this convo sounds like this 'issue':http://www.scotusblog.com/2014/06/the-argentine-bond-saga-made-simple/#more-212867
mircea_popescu: davout except satoshi is misleading, itcould receive a goat.
davout: win
davout: BUT IT WOULD HAVE TO REPORT IT TOO
chetty: If someone gives me a goat I will never tell
mircea_popescu: davout sure.
mike_c: goat embezzlement!
mircea_popescu: chetty lmao
davout: it also has implications wrt to the bet resolution time
davout: the bet can actually resolve as soon as s.mg is open for business
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 20 @ 0.0699 = 1.398 BTC [-]
pankkake: http://bitbet.us/propositions/ is too small, I can't see older rejects
assbot: BitBet Propositions
pankkake: or you should remove the pure spam
mircea_popescu: or you could check daily.
mircea_popescu: or add a rule "whenever the last bet on page is not in my list of read bets, halve the checking interval"
mike_c: isn't there an rss?
mike_c: ah, not for proposed
mircea_popescu: now that may be a good idea
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla, proposed bets rss ?
pankkake: I did check yesterday
pankkake: there was just too much bets (and spam) in a short timeframe
pankkake: well, alternatively I can submit it for the third time :D
mircea_popescu: chetty "Or, the Court might ask the Obama administration for its views on pari passu"
mircea_popescu: since when the motherfucking hells does the administration have a say in this!
mircea_popescu: jesus republic of the soviets they got going over there. go ask lenin whydontcha
mircea_popescu: pankkake prolly rss is the best solution
pankkake: why not remove the "fsdfdf" bets? they make up 80% of the page
kakobrekla: pankkake if you are looking for the reason i can look it up
pankkake: it's a bitcoin-central vs. kraken volume bet
kakobrekla: this one : This bet resolves has Yes if Bitcoin-Central has a 30d BTC/EUR trading volume higher than Kraken's, at any point before 2015, as computed by http://bitcoincharts.com/markets/
assbot: Bitcoin Charts / Markets
kakobrekla: reason: Not going to check two pages every day to make sure; come up with a better resolution source if possible.
pankkake: unfortunately there isn't, as neither exchanges publish a 30d volume
davout: kakobrekla: dun worry, i'll tell you a couple in advance which day i'll push dogecoin volume to bitcoin charts
davout: *couple of days
kakobrekla: btw when are you going to connect to rtbtc again
davout: prolly sthg i'll work on during the summer
mircea_popescu: pankkake this sort of bet is problematic, because what the fuck's the submitter to do.
mircea_popescu: im thinking a solution going forward would be "claim bets", ie, bets that resolve one way unless proof to the contrary is presented in the comments.
pankkake: yeah, for the CNY volume bet I actually wrote a script to watch the result
mircea_popescu: the problem with this, of course, is that it gives a monetary incentive to make comments, at which point the result will be a flood of nonsense
pankkake: then quickly archive.is the page
mircea_popescu: (ie, someone who's not won loses nothing by making a spurious claim he has. this then taxes mod time, and the more complex the claim the better for the claimant)
mircea_popescu: one of those subjects being thought about.
pankkake: though for a 30d volume bet, you should see it coming
mircea_popescu: pankkake unless one exchange is offline for a little bit.
pankkake: no but I mean you have to care only if they are reasonably close, which isn't the case at all now
mircea_popescu: suppose each does 10 btc a day on average.
mircea_popescu: suppose one day there's a panic, which takes one offline but not the other, which now dows 500 btc
mircea_popescu: have you seen it coming ?
mircea_popescu: surely if they both were online both'd have done 500 btc, keeping their parity
mircea_popescu: but they weren't.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SHA] 4 @ 0.042 = 0.168 BTC
mircea_popescu: "Particular difficulties ensue if the rules are not simple multiples of each other, and when vias must traverse between layers with different rules."
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ok im cured. this and the oxide gate problems, i can see it now.
mircea_popescu: "The earliest types of EDA routers were "manual routers" -- the drafter clicked a mouse on the endpoint of each line segment of each net. Modern PCB design software typically provides "interactive routers" -- the drafter selects a pad and clicks a few places to give the EDA tool an idea of where to go, and the EDA tool tries to place wires as close to that path as possible without violating DRC." << my naive bias thing
mircea_popescu: actually well implemented etc.
assbot: Intraday Momentum: The First Half-Hour Return Predicts the Last Half-Hour Return by Lei Gao, Yufeng Han, Guofu Zhou :: SSRN
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 20 @ 0.0299 = 0.598 BTC [+] {2}
mike_c: it's amazing how many great links come through this channel without any need for up/down voting systems.
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
benkay: <decimation> yeah no doubt, but those people probably could be identified and treated with various medical devices // my favorite of these is made my a local shop (designed in germany, though). it sits on your nervous system and listens to your heartbeat, supplying it's own 'carrier wave' when necessary to entrain the signal that nominally keeps things beating in time.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SHA] 3 @ 0.042 = 0.126 BTC
benkay: i almost took a job making fixtures for them before i knew how little i enjoyed shop support at big shops.
benkay: * asciilifeform doesn't own airplane, will probably have to settle for slipping in his bath with a cocked nailgun // are the 'suicides' humorously staged yet?
mircea_popescu: !down mike_c
mircea_popescu: no up/down indeed :D
mike_c: well there is that.
mircea_popescu: benkay afaik heart beats on its own localised nervous system
mircea_popescu: not going through the spine
benkay: one of the subnets.
benkay: installation was a pain
benkay: :D
mircea_popescu: so this is the day of the longlog huh
benkay: for me at least.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: Also, did anyone else here have reason to learn Ubuntu 12.04 ships without syslogd or rsyslog << is that even possible ?!
mircea_popescu: or you mean, "not turned on"
benkay: BingoBoingo: 'man logger'
mircea_popescu: they even had a special doohickey made so they could add it in the menus
mircea_popescu: a sort of gui log reader
mircea_popescu: or do you mean that ancient "rsyslogd was HUPed, type lightweight" bug they've had for ages ? did it eventually prevail upon them and so they just took logging right out of 12.04 ? :D
benkay: logging is hard
benkay: users don't care
benkay: give everyone a touchscreen
mircea_popescu: since now im looking into logs,
mircea_popescu: [UFW BLOCK] IN=eth1 OUT= SRC=208.94.26.148 DST=192.168.0.100 LEN=52 TOS=0x00 PREC=0x00 TTL=242 ID=65083 DF PROTO=TCP SPT=443 DPT=46252
mircea_popescu: ppls haxxing off 443 now ?
dignork: mircea_popescu: might be heartbleed probes
dignork: mircea_popescu: nop, sorry, it's SPT
assbot: Musings on Markets: Alibaba: A China Story with a profitable ending?
davout: root
davout: fail
dignork: davout: might be just weird NAT router
mircea_popescu: davout hm ?
mircea_popescu: decimation: the burea-tard who signed Obama's birth certificate died in a plane crash (survived the crash but "had irregular heart beat" after 60 minutes in the water) <<< that took a while.
mircea_popescu: someone'll prolly write a blockbuster in a little
davout: nvm, wrong window
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SHA] 10 @ 0.042 = 0.42 BTC
kakobrekla: it was his username and password, root and fail.
mircea_popescu: seems reasonable.
davout: kakobrekla: hahaha, actually the password is root too
Mats_cd03: i take credit for good links in this channel
mircea_popescu: i once broke into a network with the root-leaf combo
kakobrekla: now i take credit.
mircea_popescu: this is why you don't make wicca chicks sysadmins
Mats_cd03: ur dirty
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla that's not a good link, that's a bead link.
davout: such nsfw
kakobrekla: where dafuq do you work
mircea_popescu: yogurt factory.
benkay: !up blackwhite
kakobrekla: ah, they buy milk from us?
mircea_popescu: not from us, from usagi.
thestringpuller: can't have cookies without milk
mircea_popescu: !up mjr_
mircea_popescu: !up TheNewDeal
mircea_popescu: how's diff betting coming along
TheNewDeal: it's gonna be close
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 1.87487208 BTC to 8`766 shares, 21388 satoshi per share
TheNewDeal: we're actually losing some time this change, making the 3rd change iffy
TheNewDeal: more interested in the opec production news of the morn
Mats_cd03: thats not good news
TheNewDeal: what is?
mircea_popescu: russia is emerging as a major ally of the muslims, and its strategy to energetically isolate the west is starting to take shape.
TheNewDeal: west has lucked out with oil prospects of late
TheNewDeal: not sure how long it will help though
Mats_cd03: diff bet and opec news
TheNewDeal: both, I know
mircea_popescu: problem is
mircea_popescu: youy never know if the west is lying or not
TheNewDeal: I was hoping for the bitcoin network and the opec producers to ramp up production :D
Mats_cd03: iraq is going to lose a fourth city to the fictional caliphate
Mats_cd03: by the end of this year
TheNewDeal: mircea_popescu true, and oil prospects are always estimates
mircea_popescu: exactly.
mircea_popescu: i can't image a us policy of easy money not including easy reserves.
assbot: BMF has lost access to it's wallet [UnModerated]
fluffypony: "On the other hand it was expected that usagi will get confused and "loose" the wallet. In general he's so confused that he doesn't know if he's a she or she's a he."
fluffypony: I love forum catch-up days
Mats_cd03: losing mosul to militants is a death blow
mircea_popescu: i love olives
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 you know, iraq 2 mayt well turn out to be the largest intl mistake the us ever made
TheNewDeal: be back
mircea_popescu: especially through being the last.
pankkake: the USAgi?
fluffypony: hah hah
assbot: Expedia Will Accept Bitcoin for Hotel Bookings
mircea_popescu: funny btw, the us overthrew ukraine, the russian-backed syria overthrew iraq.
mircea_popescu: so far, check.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0711999 = 0.1424 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: the northern alliance was the best bet iraq ever had for any semblance of security
Mats_cd03: i wonder if the kurds have the stomach to breach doors and fight house to house
Mats_cd03: probably not
mircea_popescu: stomach they have
mircea_popescu: numbers they have not.
mircea_popescu: at any rate, back on the realpolitik map, i wonder just how defensible afghanistan is w/o iraq,
mircea_popescu: and once the withdrawal is complete by autumn i wonder just how safe any us interests in the midwest will ever be again.
mircea_popescu: proll best start dealing with venezuela.
TheNewDeal: mexico and canada as well
mircea_popescu: canada is a given, 52nd state, after uk
mircea_popescu: mexico looks iffy tho
chetty: its ok Mexico is currently moving to Arizona
TheNewDeal: mexico is 3rd to canada and saudi arabia
mircea_popescu: saudi arabia is in no way on the list.
assbot: U.S. Total Crude Oil and Products Imports
mircea_popescu: it's an ally of the us in thesense the tour guide of the fat tourist is an ally of his.
mircea_popescu: taking him to all the good fleecing spots.
mircea_popescu: i'll bet you the us won't be buying much oil from sa by the end of the decade.
TheNewDeal: regardless of saudi, mexico is ~1/4 - 1/3 of the opec total
mircea_popescu: also a doomed hope. the cartels will sooner or later make continued oil exports dependent on continued opium imports
mircea_popescu: much in the manner of england colonising china
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 1000 @ 0.002 = 2 BTC
mircea_popescu: it'll work, too. mexico has a better chance of ruling the us than either democrat or republican party in ten years.
TheNewDeal: there is a booming mexican population within the us
mircea_popescu: colonisation usually works that way.
TheNewDeal: except when you infect the indigenous population with deadly diseases
mircea_popescu: i don't imagine biological shock is going to be much going forward
mircea_popescu: we've had flight for a centuryby now
TheNewDeal: I'm just saying it happened in mexico too
TheNewDeal: knocked out a bunch of mayans and others when the conquistadors came through
TheNewDeal: speaking of viruses and disease
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.0711999 = 0.2848 BTC [+]
TheNewDeal: I tried betting both sides to the MERS, not looking good now
mircea_popescu: "The day's developments mean Isis now has effective control over three cities, including Falluja and Ramadi in neighbouring Anbar. "
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0712 = 0.356 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: no, the day's developments mean that isis has now secured communication lines for its pincher of baghdad
TheNewDeal: what is Isis?
mircea_popescu: the syrian expeditionary army in iraq
TheNewDeal: Islamic State Isomething Ssomething?
mircea_popescu: Iraq's embattled government said it would arm civilians and ask the parliament to declare a state of emergency. << this is a splendid point in case. the us-allied iraq government is going to... arm the civillians.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SHA] 8 @ 0.042 = 0.336 BTC
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal "of iraq in syria"
mircea_popescu: This i don't fucking understand. if you're trying to leave mosul and there's some fuckwits holding a "checkpoint" in your way
Mats_cd03: mircea_popescu: arming civilians is really the only thing they can do. what, its not like the state can secure anything
mircea_popescu: the only rational, and the only moral action is to feed them their own entrails
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0712 = 0.356 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: then videotape it and post it on youtube, should any other fuckwits need training as to the importance of "holding checkpoints"
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 "arming civillians" strictly means, in this sense, "Taking these weapons the us gave us and giving it to the people they were trying to fight"
Mats_cd03: well yeah
mircea_popescu: what civillians ? "we're giving the n billions worth of material to al-quaeda. because fuck you, that's why"
benkay: <mircea_popescu> the only rational, and the only moral action is to feed them their own entrails // learned helplessness of the last rats to flee?
mircea_popescu: but i mean look at tyhe picture
mircea_popescu: cars where camels go, a bunch of redditards trying to pretend like they're playing WoW irl.
benkay: isn't this the kind of desert where one can simply drive around road obstructions?
benkay: !up cipi
mircea_popescu: i wonder how many of the fuckwits still have the lease papers in the glove compartment.
benkay: ;;gettrust cipi
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user benkay to user cipi: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=benkay&dest=cipi | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=cipi | Rated since: never
benkay: what's wrong with lease papers in the glove compartment?
mircea_popescu: benkay it's the sort of desert where a car doing less than 50 is a death trap.
mircea_popescu: benkay that nobody fucking owns title to anything anymore.
mircea_popescu: german serfs cca 1100 knew as much, "the day foreign armed men walk the province, all tax obligations are null and void"
thestringpuller: havelock is becoming the spam of IPOs
kakobrekla: !up CiPi
mircea_popescu: "The city fell like a plane without an engine," said a Mosul businessman << what's with these people and planes.
Mats_cd03: when there's blood on the streets...
Mats_cd03: steal a tv
mircea_popescu: you'd think they could have less humorous metaphores.
thestringpuller: it's like every fucking day I get a new email "IPO AVAILABLE!"
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller bitcoin available ? :D
benkay: !up samson_
Apocalyptic: thestringpuller, yeah havelol spam starting to be annoying
fluffypony: I eventually just blacklisted their domain
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 100 @ 0.00229947 = 0.2299 BTC [+]
fluffypony: so now I don't get any email from them
pankkake: you can unsuscribe from IPO announcements. did it months ago
mircea_popescu: but think ofall the opportunities!
Apocalyptic: opportunities!!1!
mircea_popescu: opporturdities
pankkake: opportnudetities
pankkake: no, that's on trilema
mircea_popescu: this almost sounds like an improvement
mircea_popescu: o boy i gotcher nao.
pankkake: give her something to eat, poor girl
mircea_popescu: and you know what it's gonna be, and yet you can't look away
benkay: of ffs
benkay: !down mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: da fuck is that even
mircea_popescu: like chest flap
Mats_cd03: fuck
mircea_popescu: i sold out to the usg!
benkay: stahp
kakobrekla sets mode +m #bitcoin-assets
mircea_popescu: that should be enough for a day huh ?
mircea_popescu: com back tomorrow, same time !!1
pankkake: didn't look at the last ones. usually I don't resist, but too much at a time
mircea_popescu: well the'll be in the log
mircea_popescu: waiting for you
mircea_popescu: being ugly and waiting. waiting and being ulgy.
benkay: makes one miss ozbot.
mircea_popescu: decimation: why would they be able to accomplish anything "evil" well? << a solid argument, except, why does a cat manage to break things so well when no cat has yet produced any thing ?
jurov: if everyone suspects the deaths being staged, then ofc they were not well accomplished
pankkake: I wish I knew how ozbot found the images
mircea_popescu: pankkake just went through some selected tumblrs
mircea_popescu: whats with all the black people ?
mircea_popescu: is obama racist or something ?
pankkake: my first thought was "this looks like a typical stock photo where minorities must be present otherwise you're racist. oh wait, who's this guy, i think i know him"
TheNewDeal: while I was going there, my school got caught photoshopping a black person into a photo
TheNewDeal: the black guy came out publicly stating he was not in the photo originally
pankkake: wow, so it was a photo of know people in the school? and they thought they could get away with it?
assbot: Microsoft's Ad In Poland Photoshops Black Man, But Keeps Asian Man, White Woman
TheNewDeal: actually, looks like it was before my time. http://www.snopes.com/college/admin/uwmadison.asp
TheNewDeal: pankkake niiice
mircea_popescu: davout: ;;later tell mircea_popescu liked the hayek commentary a lot! << thanks!
mircea_popescu: dub: but blame africa << everyone knows africans aren't pirates, they couldn't even discover madagascar.
mircea_popescu: it's the muslims that are the pirates.
assbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
TheNewDeal: updating the diff change estimate to 6.8%
mircea_popescu: why tyhe fuck do they continue to push all the derpage and try and pretend is entirely beyond me
mircea_popescu: roughly in the situation of a small african country trying to push this alt-geography where china doesn't exist
TheNewDeal: whats the sham betsite?
mircea_popescu: !up mgio
mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust assbot mgio
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user mgio: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=mgio | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=mgio | Rated since: never
mircea_popescu: you will need ti get in assbot's l2 to voice yourself.
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal i dunno, a bevy of pretenders
mircea_popescu: they change about quarterly
mircea_popescu: the pretense remains unchanged. "there's mpex, we don't talk about. the exchange we talk about is <Del>glbse<del>btct<del>bitcoin whatever<del>etc"
TheNewDeal: they the results of the proposition spam?
mircea_popescu: "there's bitbet, we don;'t talk about. the betting sites we talk about is <del>etc"
mircea_popescu: i have no idea
mircea_popescu: !up joesmoe
mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust assbot joesmoe
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user joesmoe: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=joesmoe | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=joesmoe | Rated since: Tue Mar 12 17:07:21 2013
joesmoe: i can't seem to get assbot to like me, its being a real ass
mircea_popescu: same goes to you that i said to mgio : unless you're in assbot l2's trust you can't up yourself.
joesmoe: ahhh
joesmoe: i'm suprised i'm not
joesmoe: i've done a few transactions on otc a while back
mircea_popescu: well, look at l1, talk to the people there.
mgio: i see
mgio: has anyone seen ukyo around recently?
mgio: thanks for the help
mircea_popescu: ;;seen Ukyo
gribble: Ukyo was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 9 weeks, 5 days, 16 hours, 25 minutes, and 44 seconds ago: <Ukyo> mgio_: ping
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SHA] 34 @ 0.042 = 1.428 BTC
mgio: not a good sign, oh well
Apocalyptic: he's here right now
joesmoe: lol
TheNewDeal: weird
mircea_popescu: mgio what's your interest anyway, if it's not secret ?
joesmoe: mgio is NSA, tracking Ukyo down
mgio: ukyo.loan, he owes me a lot of money and it supposedily working on some projects to pay it back. wondering what the status is
mgio: I'm probably more patient than I should be
mircea_popescu: well what recourse other than patience do you have anyway.
mike_c: what's the other option?
mircea_popescu: beat you.
benkay: NONE THIS IS BITCOIN
benkay: the whole 'can you assbot' thing as test of technical ability is a neat filter to boot.
mgio: legal options, of course
mike_c: mircea_popescu: what do you think is the best judge of money supply? m2? m4?
benkay: ninjashogun's been harping at me again. anyone else catching his flak?
mike_c: yes
mike_c: wait for the part where he asks you how many bitcoin you have.
mgio: he lives in the US, as do I, and the terms of the loan are pretty straightforward
mircea_popescu: <mgio> legal options, of course << that didn't mwean anything.
mgio: only way to get out of it if he was to declare personal bankrupcy
mgio: in other words, sue him for the btc owed
mircea_popescu: mike_c what are you judging it for ?
benkay: !up AncientAliensBTC
mircea_popescu: !up AncientAliensBTC
benkay: oh this will be good
mircea_popescu: !sideways benkay
benkay: my btc come from aliens
TheNewDeal: ooooh goat's milk - so milky
benkay: i have an alien miner
benkay: in a pyramid
Apocalyptic: <benkay> oh this will be good <<
AncientAliensBTC: SN was clearly Aliens the tech is too good.
TheNewDeal: surpised I haven't heard speculation that satoshi was an alien.
benkay: yeah totally
benkay: satoshi nakamoto is ancient aliens
chetty: time traveler
benkay: its the only sensible option
benkay: nono der paradoxen
benkay: aliens makes sense tho
mike_c: mircea_popescu: hard to describe. i am trying to think about how many dollars there are, which is obviously a complicated topic.
Apocalyptic: AncientAliensBTC, hope you are Giorgio
benkay: <AncientAliensBTC> SN was clearly Aliens the tech is too good. // actually the thing is that the tech is so bad that only an agent entirely unfamiliar with cultural standards could have done it
mircea_popescu: mike_c ok, but dollars in what sense ?
mircea_popescu: it's always the case you can narrow and pin things down in a macro discussion, tho it's almost always the case people are reluctant to do so
mircea_popescu: functionally, deductively, somehow there's a way
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4100 @ 0.00085432 = 3.5027 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8180 @ 0.00085661 = 7.0071 BTC [+] {2}
AncientAliensBTC: More seriously though, anyone want to discuss the betting of both sides on BitBet? I'm curious about discussing the theory behind the results of the data dump.
mircea_popescu: you seen mike_c article ?
TheNewDeal: Someone found the truth Re:I am ... by cshark @slashdot http://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=4562153&cid=45709487
assbot: Bitcoin Inventor Satoshi Nakamoto Could Actually Be Group From Europe - Slashdot
mircea_popescu: ;;google btcalpha betting bitbet
gribble: Betting BitBet Both Ways - Btc Alpha: <http://www.btcalpha.com/blog/2014/betting-bitbet-both-ways/>; Btc Alpha - Analysis tools for bitcoin finance.: <http://www.btcalpha.com/>; When Does BitBet Money Come In? - Btc Alpha: <http://www.btcalpha.com/blog/2014/when-does-bitbet-money-come-in/>
mircea_popescu: it's a good site generally.
AncientAliensBTC: poured through trilema and btc alpha already :)
mike_c: mircea_popescu: well, i am trying to internalize money supply. like it seems m2 floats around 4x m1. the fed says m3 is meaningless, but others say it isn't. and i don't entirely understand m4 yet.
mike_c: i thought you might have some insight to measures worth understanding vs. ones that are just noise.
Apocalyptic: "the fed says m3 is meaningless" // is anything the fed says meaningfull ?
mircea_popescu: the fed is engaged in a doomed fight to maintain the financial relevancy of a dead industrial base.
mircea_popescu: m3 is only relevant if you wish to pierce through that veil
mike_c: anyone have any good book recommendations on the topic?
Apocalyptic: mike_c, do you distinguish between money supply and monetary base ?
mike_c: Apocalyptic: i am trying to :)
mircea_popescu: all the goodstuff i read on the paper were romanian cb white papers in the 80s and 90s
mircea_popescu: on thetopic*
mike_c: AncientAliensBTC: i see betting both sides of a bitbet as a bet on action. if the bet receives a lot of action, you should do well.
mircea_popescu: !up dexX7
mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust assbot dexX7
gribble: Currently authenticated from hostmask dexX7!~dexX7@unaffiliated/dexx7. Trust relationship from user assbot to user dexX7: Level 1: 1, Level 2: 2 via 2 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=dexX7 | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=dexX7 | Rated since: Wed Oct 16 20:01:25 2013
dexX7: thanks
dexX7: i think i can up myself
mircea_popescu: aha yeah you can.
mircea_popescu: whoever made the mp being wrong bitbet : i was all for it but the mods shot it down.
mircea_popescu: bitbet mods suck
pankkake: agreed
AncientAliensBTC: How does betting later affect my odds? Say I bet 1 BTC (as the site shows) with a 3.5 BTC payout. How much will I cash in on my early betting vs lose out to my position becoming more popular/dilute other side?
pankkake: and it's not mp being wrong, it's mp admits being wrong
kakobrekla: AncientAliensBTC someone made an app to simulate that i think
TheNewDeal: it's easy enough to calculate
TheNewDeal: ancientaliensbtc is it ok to assume no more bets will be made on the opposing side (more conservative) ?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: what was the bet?
assbot: BitBet Propositions
TheNewDeal: top one MP to admit being wrong in #b-a
mircea_popescu: <pankkake> and it's not mp being wrong, it's mp admits being wrong << no its not. i always admit it when i'm wrong, it's just im not wrong that often
TheNewDeal: would be interested to see what % of bitbet is made into private bets
TheNewDeal: or are they quite rare?
mircea_popescu: well they're private.
kakobrekla: actually they are public.
TheNewDeal: how so?
TheNewDeal: you can see it, but need a password to bet?
kakobrekla: cause transparency.
mike_c: have their been any?
TheNewDeal: not concerned as much with the why
kakobrekla: correct TheNewDeal
mike_c: *there
assbot: Last 12 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/3HF6ZMY.txt )
kakobrekla: mike_c yes, refused.
TheNewDeal: could I bet both sides at the beginning as well?
TheNewDeal: what!
kakobrekla: im trying to save on the btc addresses!
kakobrekla: you know they are finite, right.
mircea_popescu: no they're not
TheNewDeal: can't you reuse?
kakobrekla: depends
assbot: Blue Coat – Whats Your SSL Traffic Trying to Hide?
TheNewDeal: I have accidentally been requesting new addresses when betting the same side at a later time. Didn't realize you could just resend to same
kakobrekla: you can have it either way
TheNewDeal: but back to this private bet. You're saying I couldnt bet both sides at the beginning, then hand out the password to close group of people?
kakobrekla: you can take one side, wait for approval, bet the other side and then hand out the pass
TheNewDeal: same difference
mircea_popescu: !up alex_c
mircea_popescu: anyone interested in my salmon teriyaki recipe ?
TheNewDeal: perhaps. cooked in oven?
TheNewDeal: I'm not confident enough with my fish via grill skills
mircea_popescu: nah silverstone half-wok
dignork: benkay: http://www.bluecoat.com/company-blog/2013-05-09/what%E2%80%99s-your-ssl-traffic-trying-hide // i've seen similar hardware deployed by companies to monitor their employees traffic. Single point of failure. Awesome point to hack.
assbot: Blue Coat – Whats Your SSL Traffic Trying to Hide?
[]bot: Bet created: "FIFA World Cup 2014 total goals over 158" http://bitbet.us/bet/898/
Mats_cd03: fucking ssl
mircea_popescu: "Now you can have visibility into all the encrypted SSL traffic on your network—at extremely high performance—so you can inspect it, identify potentially nefarious activities, and feed the intelligence to an ecosystem of security application vendors—all through Blue Coat."
benkay: snake oil?
asciilifeform: ninjaspamz0r is back!? lol
dignork: mircea_popescu: well, they are actually lying, for this to work, they either have to ssl-strip, or plant corporate CA in all their system
mircea_popescu: the latter.
mircea_popescu: which increases the vulnerability of their "security" tremendously
pankkake: corporate CA is the usual trick
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5248 @ 0.00085751 = 4.5002 BTC [+] {2}
pankkake: can you even restrict CAs to tlds?
chetty: <mircea_popescu> anyone interested in my salmon teriyaki recipe ?// do tell
mircea_popescu: aite i'll photo document soonish
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 14 @ 0.0299 = 0.4186 BTC [+]
fluffypony: ;;later tell BingoBoingo if you haven't seen it, this is by far the best flopping attempt in recent history: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbmnhusvWTc
assbot: Amateur football at its best - YouTube
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SHA] 3 @ 0.042 = 0.126 BTC
fluffypony: something I said?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 341 @ 0.00038033 = 0.1297 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 13 @ 0.03 = 0.39 BTC [+] {3}
jurov: !t m f.mpif
assbot: [MPEX:F.MPIF] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.00021703 / 0.00021721 / 0.00021725 (5601 shares, 1.22 BTC), 30D: 0.00021536 / 0.00021709 / 0.00021726 (125310 shares, 27.20 BTC)
davout: pankkake: "can you even restrict CAs to tlds?" <<< wat?
pankkake: you could add a CA and have it validate only .mycompany
TheNewDeal: when did mpif start? was it april?
TheNewDeal: looks may
mike_c: started trading in may. it started operating a bit before that.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: 12.04 did indeed ship without rsyslog or syslogd, it can produce dmesg but the terminal is of course too short to display the whole thing.
mircea_popescu: so go back to 10.04
pankkake: shift+pageup?
pankkake: no logger? or does upstart have one, like systemd?
mircea_popescu: does it keep a journal for the hdd or dispensed with that too ?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: dmesg | less
assbot: Bitstamp Wins Best Virtual Currency Startup Award at The Europas
BingoBoingo: I really lacks all of the useful system tools. I'm afraid it might tell me I need to install cat if I try to use it now
mike_c: imagine if they had three cans
mircea_popescu: what's eruopas ?
kakobrekla: jupiters moon?
mircea_popescu: i guess.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.23211011 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.23211016 = 0.6963 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: I'm telling you with the diff bets you have to consider the externalities.
TheNewDeal: yes the network is quite variable over short term
davout: pankkake: ic
davout: mircea_popescu: lol
TheNewDeal: bingoboing I'm also looking at the short term history for comparison
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: I'm telling you that Datacenters in the summer aren't pretty. Mix that up with Knc's generally sloppy build quality...
assbot: Storm Damage Greatly Improves Name Of Tennessee Car Wash
TheNewDeal: April 29 - May 12 the difficulty increased 10.66 %. Blocks came through on average 542 seconds. To get 3 changes, we need to find blocks at an average of 554 seconds
kakobrekla: TheNewDeal you can always ddos some pools
TheNewDeal: I wouldn't dare attempt something along those lines
TheNewDeal: plus I'm hoping for yes
kakobrekla: <mike_c> imagine if they had three cans < imagine if they could do maff
TheNewDeal: we're nethashing at 89.9 PH, once we pass 91.1 we should be finding faster than 554 s/ block
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: that is a great name, I much prefer it over the original
BingoBoingo: It's always a good time at the Asstime Car wash
jurov: ass time is good time
mike_c: srsly BingoBoingo. those gawker sites are going to rot your brain.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: That's what the Vodka's for. It's a preservative.
jurov: BingoBoingo I gather you want to taxidermize yourself alive?
BingoBoingo: Slowly, hopefully it will take another century.
mike_c: kakobrekla: sometimes shit gets accidentally converted to floats :) maff is hard.
fluffypony: jurov: what's the problem with that?
fluffypony: I expect to be like a well-matured red wine by the time I die
fluffypony: rich and full of body
jurov: or rather 500 errors
jurov: !up belcher
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3450 @ 0.00085874 = 2.9627 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: The monkeyfish would make a great error message.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6700 @ 0.00085836 = 5.751 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Poll: What name would be best? - TCnext
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.01856559 = 0.13 BTC [-]
jurov: they forgot cyphermaid/cryptmaid
assbot: This Girl Didn't Make Her Point So Well - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 250 @ 0.06843266 = 17.1082 BTC [-] {19}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2050 @ 0.00006881 = 0.1411 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2952 @ 0.00005895 = 0.174 BTC [-] {8}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11310 @ 0.00085506 = 9.6707 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5664 @ 0.00085432 = 4.8389 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 669 @ 0.00036106 = 0.2415 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: Iraq city of Tikrit falls to ISIL fighters - Middle East - Al Jazeera English
Mats_cd03: opec should reconsider this morning's news
mike_c: bitbet: ISIL takes baghdad
BingoBoingo: Oh, a .net .split
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 4 @ 0.029 = 0.116 BTC [-]
assbot: Expresscoin Launches to Become Coinbase for the Unbanked - CoinDesk
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: coinbase for the unbanked << when do we get mazerati for the unmazeratied?
TheNewDeal: oooh dogecoin as well
TheNewDeal: I think the more avenues where btc/doge can be traded, the lower doge/btc will become
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Probably next week. I'll just need some fiberglass to duct tape to this lawnmower.
TheNewDeal: actually thats backwards
TheNewDeal: it will cost more doge to get one btc the more exchanges trade
benkay: mircea_popescu: i was under the impression the reds died out under a disease barrage from the early western explorers, far before the smallpox blankets.
assbot: With 'The Machine,' HP May Have Invented a New Kind of Computer - Businessweek
jborkl: <asciilifeform> It was a DDOS attack it went up to 750k kpbs for a few hours this morning then stopped
jborkl: not really sure why though, not like it would make any difference?
Mats_cd03: some trivia: a lord jeffrey is responsible for the biological warfare against the reds, and today he has a bustling college town as his namesake
benkay: top shelf old mate
jborkl: ;;tldr mircea_popescu I have a idea for the cherry truck, remind me next time
gribble: Error: "tldr" is not a valid command.
jborkl: damnit what is it again?
mike_c: later tell ?
Mats_cd03: wot wot
jborkl: ;;later tell mircea_popescu I have a idea for the cherry truck, remind me next time
gribble: The operation succeeded.
jborkl: thank you mike_c
assbot: Microsoft poised to take Web server crown from Apache The Register
mircea_popescu: benkay so ?
atcbot: 20k@265 20k@264 16k@260 | 49k@143 175k@142 34k@140
benkay: "Black population in Africa will become extinct under pressure from (legitimate) Chinese economic interest much in the way Red population in North America became extinct under pressure from (legitimate) European economic interest."
benkay: sounds like less of an economic pressure and more of an environmental pressure. new predators in the environment.
benkay: mircea_popescu:
mircea_popescu: it wasn't linguistic pressure
mircea_popescu: so it was economical
mircea_popescu: there's not a third.
[]bot: Bet created: "FIFA World Cup 2014: booking points over 3110" http://bitbet.us/bet/899/
benkay: gotcha.
benkay: politics or economics.
benkay: why economics over thermodynamics?
mircea_popescu: but i mean what's the difference
jborkl: I rarely go to the forums anymore, but I guess all the actm peeps finally figured out it was a scam?
benkay: i guess its just politics :D
mircea_popescu: jborkl nah.
mircea_popescu: !up Radi777
mike_c: !t h am1
assbot: [HAVELOCK:AM1] 1D: 0.23211010 / 0.24845358 / 0.26100000 (47 shares, 11.67731831 BTC), 7D: 0.19301000 / 0.26587505 / 0.32900000 (1160 shares, 308.41505284 BTC), 30D: 0.11000000 / 0.29371218 / 0.50990000 (4694 shares, 1378.68495324 BTC)
Radi777: hey guys :)
BingoBoingo: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 305315 | Current Difficulty: 1.1756551916903952E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 306431 | Next Difficulty In: 1116 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 18 hours, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 12282280955.1 | Estimated Percent Change: 4.4718
jborkl: I tried reading the actm thread and gave up,
Mats_cd03: brain hemorrhaging?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 47 @ 0.0245 = 1.1515 BTC [-]
[]bot: Bet created: "FIFA World Cup 2014: total red cards 18 or more" http://bitbet.us/bet/900/
[]bot: Bet created: "FIFA World Cup 2014: goal in under 10 mins" http://bitbet.us/bet/901/
assbot: Warren Buffett's $30 Billion Wager on Clean Energy Is One of His Safest Bets Yet | Motherboard
fluffypony: someone should just tell him about BitBet
jurov: is either side of that bitbet safe?
[]bot: Bet created: "FIFA World Cup 2014: penalty kick success rate over 60%" http://bitbet.us/bet/902/
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 94 @ 0.02392752 = 2.2492 BTC [-] {16}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 16 @ 0.06999993 = 1.12 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 35 @ 0.03045714 = 1.066 BTC [+] {2}
[]bot: Bet created: "FIFA World Cup 2014: total USA goals" http://bitbet.us/bet/903/
mircea_popescu: <assbot> Warren Buffett's $30 Billion Wager on Clean Energy Is One of His Safest Bets Yet | Motherboard << it's very safe.
[]bot: Bet created: "Blue Jays Flying High At All-Star Break" http://bitbet.us/bet/904/
mircea_popescu: we all know it's gonna lose, not much dispute.
jurov: how so?
jurov: expecting oil price to keep climbing in comparison to renewables is pretty safe assumption
[]bot: Bet created: "World Cup top scorer to net > 7" http://bitbet.us/bet/905/
[]bot: Bet created: "Neymar Wins Golden Ball" http://bitbet.us/bet/906/
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.01859916 = 0.1302 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: the only reason "renewables" seem economical atm is because govt picks up 80% of the tab.
mircea_popescu: govt won't be able to keep picking up any of the tab in the future,
mircea_popescu: but won't allow you to divest either.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3100 @ 0.00085853 = 2.6614 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: from a business perspective, renewables = suicide.
jurov: fossils are heavily subsidised, either
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.07 = 0.14 BTC [+]
mike_c: BingoBoingo, you still want to sell some no?
jurov: plus, if musk succeeds to get prices of batteries down
mircea_popescu: fossils are not subsidised, fossils are taxed
jurov: .... but dunno i know, maybe it's all just a bubble
mircea_popescu: about the same 80%
mircea_popescu: so currently, the situation is that in the marketplace, a kilo of beef costs 11 and a kilo of pork costs 13
mircea_popescu: except, the beef costs 48 to produce, and every kilo sold is a 37 loss to the government
mircea_popescu: whereas pork costs 3 to produce, and every kilo sold is a 10 gain to the government.
mircea_popescu: the idea that stuff costing 50 will be able to compete with stuff costing 3 once the govt is out of the picture is nutty
jurov: now the earth gas supplied to europe is which one?
mircea_popescu: you mean methane ? ch4?
jurov: here only household gas is subsidised
mircea_popescu: if you mean natural gas, it's pork.
jurov: industrial usage is not
jurov: how it is a gain to the govt? slovak one, not russian
mircea_popescu: nobody cares about slovak one :)
mircea_popescu: the us (and eu) are being crushed atm because they're paying the 37, whereas russia, saudi arabia etc are pocketing the 10
jurov: and solar/wind is expensive to install, not to produce
BingoBoingo: mike_c: I'd be amenable to selling up to half my bitcoin's stake in that bet.
jurov: the expectation is for the 48 to get down, and for 3 to get up
mike_c: BingoBoingo: this is b39, right?
jurov: i really don't know if it's realistic, but i don't think buffett haven't done any math around it
mircea_popescu: jurov install and maintain.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: Indeed it is.
mircea_popescu: jurov i think he's done plenty of math. it goes like this : "im too old to get it up anymore. will be dead soon anyway. who the fuck cares."
mike_c: and you are offering it at cost, yes? half for 0.5?
BingoBoingo: mike_c: I'm amenable to offering it at a discount, i.e. selling the 0.5 stake for less than 0.5 BTC.
jurov: afaik maintenance is the part that is currently heavily subsidized for fossils
mircea_popescu: you two are gonna write a gpg contract ?
mike_c: what fun is that. i'll take it at cost.
mircea_popescu: this is getting excited.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: Sold.
mike_c: k, send addr sometime and i will send payment
BingoBoingo: mike_c: The payout address for that bet works 1PzuSnKaJsKwgyAqb6sqc5nsw55v2MnHoz
mike_c: ok. i'm going to send from a hot wallet, so don't send my winnings back there :)
mike_c: er, shared wallet
BingoBoingo: Alright. When summer cooks the miners and its time to pay you I'll ask for an address.
BingoBoingo: ;;later tell TheNewDeal I'm afraid I'm out of 'No' stake to sell without losing my excitement.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
TheNewDeal: haha mkya
kakobrekla: should be an auction or smth
BingoBoingo: Well, it kind of was.
jurov: well, stockholm forecast is up to balmy 24C .. not something to fry knc datacenter
jurov: ove next week
jurov: where's asicminer housed?
BingoBoingo: Well, knc ships miners out to other people doesn't it? I think Asicminer is somewhere costal south China.
jurov: looks like it's hongkong
jurov: 33C in Sunday, otherwise less
jurov: just picked most concentrated spots
BingoBoingo: I'm also considering less concentrated spots, like the Hillbillies in Texas and the MiddleWest whose data center is their garage.
assbot: bitsquare.io - The P2P Fiat-Bitcoin Exchange
jurov: how many asics are there?
jurov: in hillbillies'garages?
jurov: pool ddos will have much higher effect imo
BingoBoingo: Well does Slaughter actually have a datacenter?
BingoBoingo: I doubt it, but I bet he has a garage.
jurov: how many % actm has?
BingoBoingo: No idea, but there's a bunch of forum tards and such out there...
jurov: he's using forum tards to generate hashrate?
BingoBoingo: I think so.
BingoBoingo: Thank you mike_c
mike_c: no thank you! we'll be the first ever to make money betting against difficulty :)
jurov: mike_c rly?
mike_c: i think we'll lose, but i like the odds now.
mike_c: jurov: first best greatest
jurov: iDiff-* was introduced when? a year ago?
mike_c: nobody has made money on idiffs betting against difficulty, that's for sure.
jurov: i did
mike_c: no way. they've all been capped?
jurov: till tat + asics came around
jurov: to be precise, i did not bet against difficulty, too. just sold them at sufficiently high price
assbot: BitBet - Bitcoin difficulty over 5.6B before April :: 9.83 B (5%) on Yes, 180.55 B (95%) on No | closed 2 months 3 weeks ago
assbot: BitBet - May I suggest 9B difficulty? :: 6.44 B (8%) on Yes, 72.03 B (92%) on No | closed 1 month 2 weeks ago
mike_c: fine, we won't be the first. but still best greatest.
jurov: on that note, can't be some mpif put into idiff MMing?
assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021649 BTC (Total: 433.00 BTC). Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.00021703 BTC [-]
TheNewDeal: 1K4Fs has virtually 60% of the no
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: That's mircea_popescu
TheNewDeal: indeed
BingoBoingo: It helps to know the other bettors
BingoBoingo: ;;tslb
gribble: Time since last block: 11 minutes and 24 seconds
mircea_popescu: <jurov> on that note, can't be some mpif put into idiff MMing? << too risky
TheNewDeal: too frisky?!
BingoBoingo: Altcoin, Less Risky than Idiff
TheNewDeal: Altcoin makes the cut, but idiff is too frisky?
assbot: Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1XARHGT.txt )
mircea_popescu: altcoin is pretty much risk free.
TheNewDeal: on my screen, it shows my message before
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: That's because your screen plays favorites
BingoBoingo: ;;rate TheNewDeal's screen -1 Biased
gribble: Error: 'screen' is not a valid integer.
TheNewDeal: hahaha
kakobrekla: altcoin can only lose 200 satoshi.
BingoBoingo: %ticker
atcbot: [X-BT] Bid: 143 Ask: 250 Last Price: 143 24h-Vol: 0k High: N/A Low: N/A VWAP: N/A
mike_c: 57 down, 143 to go
BingoBoingo: I hope ATC crashes to Doge prices for a while.
kakobrekla: how much is doge
mike_c: not with this nethash
mike_c: it's at like 6 th/s
mircea_popescu: doge is what, 50 by now ?
kakobrekla: which?
atcbot: [ATC Diff] Current Diff: 715369.85 Est. Next Diff: 502280.32 in 1204 blocks (#36288) Est. % Change: -29.79
mike_c: kakobrekla: atc.
kakobrekla: and dropping
mike_c: not exactly
kakobrekla: just approximatley?
mike_c: nethash was at 5 th/s. then it plummetted to 1 th/s after last diff change.
BingoBoingo: Doge is about 68 satoshis
mike_c: that lasted a bit
mike_c: and now it's at 6 th/s
kakobrekla: someone hopping the diff?
Apocalyptic: yeah unbalanced rent some hashpower
mike_c: two parties involved. pool-hoppers, and then unbalanced trying to screw the pool hoppers.
Apocalyptic: to avoid these hoppers
mircea_popescu: <kakobrekla> and dropping << nah was -80% a coupla days ago
kakobrekla: so its dropping less :p
mike_c: well diff is :) but nethash isn't
kakobrekla: yeah nethash is just being hopped
mike_c: yeah. it's a bit of a mess. but such is the life of a young altcoin.
kakobrekla: the way of the road.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.0233 = 0.233 BTC [-]
benkay: <zrobo> cryptsy.com: 1 dogecoin = 65 satoshis. coindesk price $0.0004. 24 hr volume: 944 megadoge
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 9 @ 0.01902 = 0.1712 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5700 @ 0.00085519 = 4.8746 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 305334 | Current Difficulty: 1.1756551916903952E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 306431 | Next Difficulty In: 1097 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 14 hours, 50 minutes, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 12251801307.5 | Estimated Percent Change: 4.21254
mircea_popescu: damn it's tight.
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 14 / 1.1756551916903952
gribble: 11.9082534564
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 1.19 ** (1/3)
gribble: 1.05969850212
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 1.19 ** (1/2)
gribble: 1.09087121146
BingoBoingo: I really don't think we are making it to a third adjustment.
mircea_popescu: 33 days, of which a week here
mircea_popescu: so 26. nope. it ain't happening.
BingoBoingo: The trend says yes, but the externalities say no.
BingoBoingo: lol, is that Dogecoin trying to build some interest?
BingoBoingo: Anyone ever front you that billion Doge to take a short position?
mircea_popescu: in spite of all the pretense as to "exchanges" and tips and whatnot, it'd seem 99%+ of all doges are actually held by the admin group
mircea_popescu: not much of a currency in any sense.
assbot: #bitcoin-assets log
asciilifeform: (it was pushed as 'only for the lulz', note)
mircea_popescu: i guess so
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15450 @ 0.00085428 = 13.1986 BTC [-] {3}
benkay: hey pgp!
benkay: ;;gettrust pgp
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user benkay to user pgp: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=benkay&dest=pgp | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=pgp | Rated since: never
benkay: huh check out that registration date
TheNewDeal: info pgp
asciilifeform prodded colleague to reg with gribble. he digs out pgp key from... 1992.
Apocalyptic: I bet it's sub 1024 bit
asciilifeform: 1024 if i recall.
asciilifeform: 'The new, thicker copper layer did resolve the heat build up from the current flow. Temp has been reduced by 20C with the new boards.' (from jborkl, quoting bfl co. lamenting its troubles.)
asciilifeform: ^ what happens to folks who refuse to do arithmetic before going into production
asciilifeform: imagine a manufacturer of, say, ups, or tv, whatnot, posting an update like this.
asciilifeform: why this never happens?
kakobrekla: also preorders
asciilifeform: and this.
asciilifeform: i can almost understand taking preorders if you're a broke, ragged dervish. but these folks have already exited that stage.
asciilifeform: likewise, luring people into preorders to fund a chip fab project almost makes sense. but boards?
kakobrekla: yea but risk on a chip is far greater
asciilifeform: i suspect that: when they tape out a dud asic, they simply... take preorders longer.
asciilifeform: !up pgp
kakobrekla: dunno then why silicon valley isnt silicon anymore.
asciilifeform: because usa.
asciilifeform finds u.s. uni professors hotlinking to images on his site; tempted to replace with goatse
assbot: Snowdenbot wasnt just for TED, now lives in his ACLU lawyers office | Ars Technica
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SHA] 5 @ 0.042 = 0.21 BTC
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: wtf is the point?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Some people instead of just doing IRC get a small car instead?
asciilifeform: afaik, these 'robots' were originally intended for 'micromanagement' types to roll around a factory floor, pointing remote-controlled laser pointer at lazy monkeys, mouthing obscenities through speaker
BingoBoingo: It still isn't too late for that.
assbot: US Marshals step in, thwart efforts to learn about cell tracking devices | Ars Technica
asciilifeform: ^ turd concerns the use of a well-known mitm gizmo for cellular
asciilifeform: (consumer pnohes make no effort to authenticate - whatsoever - so this is trivial)
BingoBoingo: Yeah. Amazing how records request can have problems.
asciilifeform: the interesting thing is that there is theoretically no need for such a thing, considering that towers are more or less owned by usg
BingoBoingo: Indeed
asciilifeform: so why mitm? answer: manufacture of guilt.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35100 @ 0.00085407 = 29.9779 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: the next 'new york death ray' idiot won't play ball? won't make the necessary phone call? now it can be made... for him.
asciilifeform: this is also the answer for why 'heartbleed' was necessary, considering that usg has at-will access to root certs
asciilifeform: if you can already read, why mitm? answer: for - writing.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21522 @ 0.00085677 = 18.4394 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: Major terrorism trial could be held in secret for first time in UK legal history | Law | theguardian.com
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6550 @ 0.00086204 = 5.6464 BTC [+] {2}
Blazedout419: omg so who is going to buy into sha on havelock?
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> imagine a manufacturer of, say, ups, or tv, whatnot, posting an update like this. << this is a 2012 comment.
mircea_popescu: you're not meta enough by now
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> this is also the answer for why 'heartbleed' was necessary, considering that usg has at-will access to root certs << not that simple.
mircea_popescu: it had no access to self-signed certs.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SHA] 50 @ 0.042 = 2.1 BTC
assbot: Major terrorism trial could be held in secret for first time in UK legal history | Law | theguardian.com
mircea_popescu: on one hand, the legal principle that dorks a la mari reid & her crew may be kept secret will logically extend to defendants, too.
mircea_popescu: now any terrorist and any tax evader has good title to refuse any sort of information sharing, much like the prosecutor's own men do.
mircea_popescu: moreover, they have very little option in the matter, as their safety strictly depends on this sort of secrecy.
mircea_popescu: basically, technology has already made the state impossible, just at the time bitcoin showed up but mostly unrelated to it.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.26079984 = 1.304 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: was gonna answer 'but nobody used self-signed certs' - then remembered having done so personally at one point
mircea_popescu: plentyof people do.
Mats_cd03: asciilifeform sees monsters in the shadows
Mats_cd03: i dunno if i can agree
asciilifeform also sees monsters under floodlight
Mats_cd03: it could be much more mundane
Mats_cd03: like it costs the telcos money to staff people responding to LEO requests for access
Mats_cd03: and mitm is just simpler in execution
asciilifeform: probably exactly this appears on the grant applications, yes.
asciilifeform: incidentally, one can trivially bake the cellular mitm gizmo from consumer hardware. (exercise for alert reader)
Mats_cd03: that sounds interesting, go on
asciilifeform: ;;google verizon network extender hack
gribble: It's a Cinch for Hackers to Break Into Your Verizon Network - Gizmodo: <http://gizmodo.com/its-a-cinch-for-hackers-to-break-into-your-verizon-netw-790461949>; How To Compete With NSA By Hacking a Verizon Network Extender ...: <http://hardware-beta.slashdot.org/story/13/07/16/1343238/how-to-compete-with-nsa-by-hacking-a-verizon-network-extender>; DailyTech - Hackers Show Regular (1 more message)
Mats_cd03: i was under the impression the equipment for this kind of thing was approaching <$1000
mircea_popescu: 10 years ago
Mats_cd03: never looked into it
asciilifeform: ^ vendor declared victory after disabling easy firmware update mechanism on the gadget. board still has jtag port, removable flash, etc.
asciilifeform: runs linux!
asciilifeform: used to be that it took actual sweat to source 'miniature tower' radio components
Mats_cd03: o, but patched, hrm
asciilifeform: patch is a joke
asciilifeform: as described above
Mats_cd03: probably
asciilifeform: not probably - certainly
asciilifeform: if i like, i desolder the rom and introduce mine.
asciilifeform: this is a ~$300 gizmo you can buy - retail
asciilifeform: it sits in your house, you can mutilate it at your pleasure
asciilifeform: other u.s. telcos have similar products
Mats_cd03: how interesting
Mats_cd03: do you have a link
asciilifeform: but this isn't particularly interesting. the interesting part is that everything people speak of as 'inseekoore!' re: cellular comms, was baked in very deliberately - and publicly - at the start.
asciilifeform: e.g. the toy crypto of gsm
Mats_cd03: i generally presume incompetence before malice
asciilifeform: ;;google A5/1
gribble: A5/1 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A5/1>; A5/2 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A5/2>; Animation of A5/1 cipher - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgZAI3DdUA4>
Mats_cd03: how interesting
asciilifeform: before the telco 'network extender' gizmos were sold (incidentally, a scam - the telco still charges for minutes despite using the chump's own local wired bandwidth!) mitm-ing was demonstrated using 'software defined radio' (inexpensive board, does exactly what is printed on the crate)
dub: femtocells, meh you get to use your handset
asciilifeform: yeah, pay per minute for the privilege of using own hardware.
asciilifeform: great deal.
dub: thats up to provider
asciilifeform: all u.s. providers, last i checked, charged exactly the same on femtocell.
Mats_cd03: neat, ill have something else i can do with the device im ordering
assbot: HakShop — HackRF Pre-Order
dub: well if you're counting minutes on your mobile, im sorry
Mats_cd03: asciilifeform is probably going to tell me im getting ripped off
dub: nobody has a hardline these days so its a valid offering
asciilifeform: for non-u.s. folks - 'landline' phone is poison here, because it is considered fair game for spam (unlike cell)
asciilifeform: so they're slowly going extinct
asciilifeform never had own landline in entire adult life
Mats_cd03: i still get fucking spam
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform thye're not so considered in europe but idem gohing extinct
Mats_cd03: sucks to suck
dub: not so slowly tbh
Mats_cd03: wait 20 years
asciilifeform: i can get pseudo-landline (tack-on to fiber terminal) for around 10 usd / mo. but... why?
mircea_popescu: i had my own landline. it wasn't particularly useful
dub: I have pots signal on my dsl line but I couldnt tell you the number
mircea_popescu: (trivial to tap too. if you think gsm cypher is bad, try headset-and-hairpins)
Mats_cd03: poor cell tower coverage, necessary to have a working phone in an emergency (e.g. elderly person), zombie apocalypse, etc
mircea_popescu: internet should be wired, phone wireless.
asciilifeform: zombie apocalypse with fiber service, right
Mats_cd03: i suppose i should scale it back to natural disaster
dub: the emergency service arguemtn for pots is fast becomming irrelevant as teh network becomes less resilient
Mats_cd03: and how is it becoming less resilient
asciilifeform: the old pots lines are gone where i live.
assbot: #bitcoin-assets log
dub: you're not wired back to a full CO anymore and the cabinet has no better battery than a cell tower
asciilifeform: i've more battery in here than in the cabinets. sad.
dub sheds a tear for his DMS100 days
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22850 @ 0.00086895 = 19.8555 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9200 @ 0.00086895 = 7.9943 BTC [+]
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