Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans

← 2014-03-27 | 2014-03-29 →
mircea_popescu: the20year3 so if the claim is that rent is trading under book, why not buy back shares ? and moreover, is the book value reported anywhere in any sense ?
mircea_popescu: xdotcomm_: benkay: how come exchanges /etc are not using this << because why would anyone sane give their keys away to some website ? might as well ask why no serious bloggers are ujsing disqus.
xdotcomm_: mircea_popescu: i thought it was comporable to irc-bot
mircea_popescu: the20year3 this "enough of our shareholders complain" tack is bollocks. i complain, and i'll have your head for it, plain and simple.
kakobrekla: nice job outspamming assbot (see below charts)
kakobrekla: lets see who gets tired first
mircea_popescu: xdotcomm_ how can it be comparable tho ? i mean... gribble actually ads functionality.
mircea_popescu: separating a website in two websites doesn't really.
kakobrekla: ah i forgot to mention MP re outspamming
mircea_popescu: cazalla that's actually an excellent q, hope you get some answer.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla waitwut ?
kakobrekla: yeah.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: That's about the sentiment I've been coming to have about my plot coupons.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo thought you'd appreciate that.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.59 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: you have beaten assbot per last 7 days and per last 30 days mirea.
mircea_popescu: deadweasel: why would anybody consult the public? << maybe the public is topless and looks good on its back ?
kakobrekla: mircea.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla haha! do a 2013 one ?
kakobrekla: goddamn kebroad.
mircea_popescu: lmao que broad!
kakobrekla: maybe, now its rolling 12 months
kakobrekla: i dont have that much history or smth
mircea_popescu: o yeah, got started in april huh
kakobrekla: im getting outtyped
kakobrekla: number 5 on 12 month, number 9 on 30 days and 24 on weekly
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla he managed to put an empty string in
kakobrekla: that bastard
kakobrekla: mircea_popescu but it was an empty line
BingoBoingo: Is this still an issue...
mircea_popescu: his client sucks ? i can't send empty lines
mircea_popescu: i didn't even know irc allowed empty lines.
BingoBoingo: Oh, ellipses don't hide text in the logs that come out of assbot no more
kakobrekla: now stop busting my balls and go fix your css
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves that's funny, because 99.999% of published researchers live off grants given by the people who want global warming to be a rthing.
mircea_popescu: my css is fine in that it doesn't exist.
kakobrekla: yes its possible to send empty lines but my altgr on mah keyboard is broken
kakobrekla: que broad i mean
mircea_popescu: $ticker h neobee
mircea_popescu: !ticker h neobee
assbot: [HAVELOCK:NEOBEE] 1D: 0.00155000 / 0.00209392 / 0.00279899 (50471 shares, 105.68201148 BTC), 7D: 0.00155000 / 0.00269506 / 0.00415500 (131383 shares, 354.08461268 BTC), 30D: 0.00155000 / 0.00387846 / 0.00600000 (562136 shares, 2180.22469375 BTC)
mircea_popescu: i guess the 25 people gave up too.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 669 @ 0.00243989 = 1.6323 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: llticker
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 501.79, Best ask: 506.47, Bid-ask spread: 4.68000, Last trade: 501.13, 24 hour volume: 55293.10877297, 24 hour low: 466.1, 24 hour high: 571.5, 24 hour vwap: 517.259175662
mircea_popescu: wait wasn't it supposed to have dumped etc.
mircea_popescu: these logs i'm reading are delayed or something ;/
mircea_popescu: whoa look at that! i wrote more this past month than the next 4 people bombined ?!
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla pls to redirect b-a donations address to trilema kthx
lnovy: c-c-c-c-ombo breaker
VanCleef: neobee got hammered
kakobrekla: mircea_popescu no can do, hackers control donations
mircea_popescu: mike_c there's only me posting as me. however, there's multiple people working on feeding me data and other predigested strings.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla lol good one.
mircea_popescu: mike_c oldest trick in the book, every talking head on the tv screen has a little speaker in his ear thing. course, my backup is slightly better than what tv stations can afford, but still.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1000 @ 0.00243989 = 2.4399 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23800 @ 0.00093704 = 22.3016 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: o look, 200 lines in the past coupla hours. poor people trying to read the chan.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16250 @ 0.00093194 = 15.144 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24200 @ 0.00093141 = 22.5401 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14950 @ 0.00093721 = 14.0113 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: Want to edit the wiki without paying a fee? Read this.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.05339959 = 0.267 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 13 @ 0.05432307 = 0.7062 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4636 @ 0.00093724 = 4.345 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12750 @ 0.00093904 = 11.9728 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: meow
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.10144642 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 20 @ 0.006099 = 0.122 BTC [+]
TestingUnoDosTre: o shit we are back on global warming
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8000 @ 0.00093871 = 7.5097 BTC [-]
copumpkin: I turned the heat up again
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.599998 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 177 @ 0.00240999 = 0.4266 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 19 @ 0.006099 = 0.1159 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: <kakobrekla> /// neat! i didnt realize i was such a blabber
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24750 @ 0.00093904 = 23.2412 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18595 @ 0.00093913 = 17.4631 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3605 @ 0.00093933 = 3.3863 BTC [+]
ozbot: LeoGroup Orchestrates Purchase of Stradivarius Violin Using Bitcoin - Press Release - Digital Journa
bitcoinpete: trading art for art, eh mircea_popescu?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 944 @ 0.00243063 = 2.2945 BTC [+] {5}
BingoBoingo: bitcoinpete: if it were one of the Violas, that would be real news
bitcoinpete: i'm still glad to see people with coin shelling out for legit shit
bitcoinpete: bitcoins are better spent on one-of-a-kind art than electronics from tigerdirect
drkow: tigerdirect is a shit store
bitcoinpete: if they must be spent
VanCleef: i hope my bitbet gets approved
bitcoinpete: they're a store
drkow: their bitcoin system isn't working in Canada
VanCleef: if you make a new bet and send funds to fund the bet but it doesn't get approved will you get your coin back?
drkow: I have been getting great value out of my bitcoins by purchasing (probably carded) gift cards
bitcoinpete: drkow where in canada are you?
drkow: east
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56564 @ 0.00093851 = 53.0859 BTC [-] {2}
bitcoinpete: drkow assette nubbins' is also east
drkow: wat
bitcoinpete: another guy here is from the maritimes
drkow: oh I'm between toronto/montreal
drkow: canada is lame
drkow: it's too damn cold
bitcoinpete: you ever lived anywhere else? or traveled much at all?
drkow: yeah
drkow: that's why I hate canada
bitcoinpete: well, you know where the door is
ozbot: Oleg Andreev - A million-dollar problem for Bitcoin exchanges
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.10144642 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56250 @ 0.0009393 = 52.8356 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 389 @ 0.00231675 = 0.9012 BTC [-] {10}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1000 @ 0.00214177 = 2.1418 BTC [-] {13}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5450 @ 0.00093677 = 5.1054 BTC [-]
bitcoinpete: ;;later tell benkay it's friday here!
gribble: The operation succeeded.
bitcoinpete: ;;later tell artifexd it's friiiidaaay!
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2561 @ 0.00093872 = 2.4041 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 69 @ 0.0022 = 0.1518 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9724 @ 0.00093677 = 9.1092 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24500 @ 0.00093957 = 23.0195 BTC [+] {3}
cazalla: i enjoy your articles bitcoinpete, easier read than trilema (for me)
cazalla: ah, he isn't here, i guess i shouldn't assume everyone uses a bouncer
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11600 @ 0.00094036 = 10.9082 BTC [+]
bocobit: i read a study that says only 20% of people are capable of independent thought
bocobit: which makes you think, am i part of that 20%
bocobit: and what constitutes independent thought, what are the parameters
bocobit: or maybe even more powerful, what makes the 80%
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 34 @ 0.006099 = 0.2074 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6936 @ 0.00094043 = 6.5228 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11514 @ 0.00094169 = 10.8426 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20577 @ 0.00094171 = 19.3776 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.59512 BTC [-]
chetty: bocobit, got a link to that study?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22000 @ 0.00093859 = 20.649 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18700 @ 0.00094183 = 17.6122 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1000 @ 0.00094007 = 0.9401 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10176 @ 0.00093544 = 9.519 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24350 @ 0.00093149 = 22.6818 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10074 @ 0.00093177 = 9.3867 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 4600 @ 0.00011791 = 0.5424 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22491 @ 0.00093768 = 21.0894 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 65 @ 0.00223 = 0.145 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14658 @ 0.00093768 = 13.7445 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2950 @ 0.00093787 = 2.7667 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 15 @ 0.05549997 = 0.8325 BTC [+] {10}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 59 @ 0.00241897 = 0.1427 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 50 @ 0.00241999 = 0.121 BTC [+]
jurov: bitcoinpete that oleganza's blog is theoretically nice
jurov: but in practice having locked bitcoins in 2-of-2 sig scheme would hurt liquidity
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.07249996 = 0.145 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 31 @ 0.071 = 2.201 BTC [-]
jurov: such as, traders can claim "no i dispute this trade, wont sign" when market moves unfavorably
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.07002044 = 0.7002 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: and there's where comaprison with NYSE falls short, NYSE can get to court (in worst case) to force misbehaving traders in the line
jurov: oh i overlooked the tweet
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22310 @ 0.0009382 = 20.9312 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.07000001 = 0.35 BTC [-]
VanCleef: poor guy should just refund him
MisterE: haha
VanCleef: what if u bet on a bet you made but it doesn't get approved
VanCleef: do you guys your coins back?
VanCleef: get*
cazalla: it'll be refunded
VanCleef: neat
chetty: that argument has been going on forever, a good example of the failure of personal responsibility
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 150 @ 0.0022 = 0.33 BTC [-] {6}
MisterE: this is the kind of people that nanny states produce
MisterE: states run by fscking insurance adjustors who have politicians in their pockets
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.07000001 = 0.21 BTC [-]
MisterE: The asshattery with this forum is strong!
MisterE: never really read bitcointalk, learned from bloggers and trusted articles or reading / asking questions on irc.
chetty: MisterE, most public forums are about the same
MisterE: but kakobrekla does come down on em like a ton of bricks lol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.048184 = 0.1446 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23813 @ 0.00093644 = 22.2994 BTC [-]
MisterE: lots of blood on the floor over on BTCe lol
MisterE: coins nice and cheap
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.05310102 = 0.1593 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.5951 BTC [-]
davout: ;;later tell benkay much atmosphere such dark wow
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10200 @ 0.00093702 = 9.5576 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15682 @ 0.00093702 = 14.6943 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13650 @ 0.00093943 = 12.8232 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22000 @ 0.00094136 = 20.7099 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.05310102 = 0.2655 BTC [-]
blackwhite: morning
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 500 @ 0.00229 = 1.145 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 46 @ 0.00229478 = 0.1056 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19528 @ 0.00093702 = 18.2981 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 12 @ 0.04636667 = 0.5564 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 9 @ 0.05310102 = 0.4779 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 216 @ 0.00239999 = 0.5184 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 14 @ 0.05310102 = 0.7434 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 78 @ 0.05310102 = 4.1419 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21750 @ 0.00093648 = 20.3684 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17100 @ 0.00093952 = 16.0658 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell bitcoinpete what's that about ?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: VanCleef yes you do get it back.
VanCleef: cool thanks
mircea_popescu: bocobit i read a study that 80% of studies are pure bullshit.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8400 @ 0.00093952 = 7.892 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 173 @ 0.00241797 = 0.4183 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5027 @ 0.00093581 = 4.7043 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.5952 = 1.1904 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 225 @ 0.00241797 = 0.544 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.5951 = 1.1902 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.595001 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 78 @ 0.00241797 = 0.1886 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 480 @ 0.00241797 = 1.1606 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 44 @ 0.00241798 = 0.1064 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 80 @ 0.0024178 = 0.1934 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9150 @ 0.00093213 = 8.529 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11723 @ 0.00093213 = 10.9274 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 60 @ 0.00241799 = 0.1451 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 59 @ 0.00242342 = 0.143 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 95 @ 0.00644423 = 0.6122 BTC [+] {6}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19300 @ 0.00093283 = 18.0036 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 284 @ 0.00243954 = 0.6928 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 451 @ 0.00244016 = 1.1005 BTC [+] {3}
artifexd: ;;eauth artifexd
gribble: Request successful for user artifexd, hostmask artifexd!~artifexd@unaffiliated/artifexd. Get your encrypted OTP from
artifexd: ;;everify freenode:#bitcoin-otc:fe0d9a7006ac40048c49ae0e278f7f52c229fdb8b8b55499e7264c31
gribble: You are now authenticated for user artifexd with key 11D1433947A3327A
artifexd: ;;rate bitcoinpete 1 Did exactly what he said he would do without delay
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user bitcoinpete has been recorded.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 8479 @ 0.00011406 = 0.9671 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 44 @ 0.00243 = 0.1069 BTC [-]
artifexd: ThickAsThieves Have you heard from Danny lately? Is he ok?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5100 @ 0.00093554 = 4.7713 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.05537999 = 0.1661 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: Looking for investment of ~2500 BTC for music festival, return = ~150,000 BTC
Duffer1: haven't seen a scam like that before
Duffer1: "In 1.5 months of marketing we grew our Facebook page to 9,500 likes with an average unboosted reach of 2,300 people per post"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20772 @ 0.00093751 = 19.474 BTC [+] {4}
CheckDavid: mircea_popescu: hi
CheckDavid: 3:53:57 AM mircea_popescu CheckDavid what start-ups specifically. <- you mean to ask which startup specifically I was considering fundraising for?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.07287649 = 0.2915 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: CheckDavid yeah but meanwhile my q was answered reading the log.
mircea_popescu: listen, the larger part of raising funds is the trust you command.
ozbot: La firma pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.07287659 = 0.2915 BTC [+]
CheckDavid: mircea_popescu: yes correct. But then one also needs a framework/platform to market my trust
CheckDavid: If that made sense
mircea_popescu: that'd be the wot, this channel and so forth.
CheckDavid: I see. But also a model on what to give in return for funding
CheckDavid: Be it equity or something else
mircea_popescu: it'd be equity.
mircea_popescu: this is a long solved problem, really.
Duffer1: you don't necessarily need a platform for that, unless you wanted your investors to be able to exchange quickly
CheckDavid: Someone made me consist ways to fund without equity dilution
CheckDavid: *consider
CheckDavid: Crowd funding is one way people have used to fund without equity distribution
Duffer1: do you have a product capable of attracting that kind of funding?
mircea_popescu: that's in no way related to funding.
mircea_popescu: there's business and then there's nonsense. i'm sure some kids somewhere are playing with money, but that has no bearing on business.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.0464 = 0.232 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3987 @ 0.00093637 = 3.7333 BTC [-]
CheckDavid: I see. So your take is that equity must be allocated to the investors right?
CheckDavid: Duffer1: no. Not yet at least
chetty: Crossword puzzles in a local Venezuelan newspaper are calling readers to violent protests with conspiratorial messages, the country’s information minister said today.
mircea_popescu: you can either take investment, which is a distribution of equity no matter how you disgusie it, from bfl-style to any other style,
mircea_popescu: or else you can take a loan, which is a loan.
mircea_popescu: that's it.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6851 @ 0.00093637 = 6.4151 BTC [-]
CheckDavid: Can this loan depend on the business performance alone?
CheckDavid: Or would it have to be a personal loan in some way as well?
mircea_popescu: no. a loan has no relation to the business performance, a loan is predicated on the credibility of the underwriter.
mircea_popescu: equity is related to the business performance.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.595005 BTC [+]
CheckDavid: I see.
CheckDavid: You are a very traditional business guy.
CheckDavid: You are the Warren Buffett of btc lol
mircea_popescu: you know, gravity didn't change direction since it was invented.
mircea_popescu: even if female dress and hairdo changed significnatly, and quite cyclically.
mircea_popescu: some things never change.
mircea_popescu: her tits will always point downwards on the long run, no matter what she wears.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1000 @ 0.0001179 = 0.1179 BTC [+] {2}
CheckDavid: Do you intend to say one should always short women?
CheckDavid: I very much appreciate the stock tip kind sir
assbot: Last 6 lines bashed and pending review. (
pankkake: !b 6
pankkake: lessons learned: SATA is shit, NCQ is shit, XFS is shit, GPU fans are shit
pankkake: …but I should finally be back
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26700 @ 0.00093573 = 24.984 BTC [-] {2}
CheckDavid: mircea_popescu: can u give me a car pliz? And a 3d printer tnx
pankkake: just print your car
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4390 @ 0.0009381 = 4.1183 BTC [+]
bitcoinpete: mircea_popescu benkay and artifexd were generous enough to lend me a few satoshis a week ago, which i duly repaid with interest today so as to learn that variety speak :D
bitcoinpete: artifexd ty!
bitcoinpete: artifexd noob question: do i rate you as well?
artifexd: That is up to you.
Duffer1: you can rate anyone for anything
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16500 @ 0.00093963 = 15.5039 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 90 @ 0.00242 = 0.2178 BTC [-]
bitcoinpete: Chamath is spot on here: "We’ve got to flush out all the has-beens and also-rans. There’s a bunch of amateur hour bullshit in the bitcoin ecosystem.”
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 9 @ 0.07287999 = 0.6559 BTC [+] {3}
Mats_cd03: hi QTs
ozbot: The bezzle-USD and the tide-USD pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: bitcoinpete whats not clear is who chamath is and why does he get to say this.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.595002 = 1.19 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 449 @ 0.00576817 = 2.5899 BTC [-] {6}
Mats_cd03: CheckDavid: have you considered enrolling in an intro accounting course? i think it would benefit you
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.595005 = 2.975 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: mircea_popescu: good timing, i just finished brewing coffee
mircea_popescu: hehe yw.
Dimsler_: the problem with ukraine
Dimsler_: is that its not a real country
Dimsler_: i do not understand why anyone cares
bitcoinpete: mircea_popescu he's one of the brighter valleyers not that this gives him credibility
Mats_cd03: because youre a shit reader
Mats_cd03: do you know what a warm water port is?
mircea_popescu: bitcoinpete talking about "bunch of amateur hour buyllshit in the bitcoin """ecosystem"""" in a pdf file ?
mircea_popescu: surely you see the humor.
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 that explains why the russians care, which was quite clear.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5950 @ 0.0009381 = 5.5817 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: course we know why exactly the us cares too, at that level.
Dimsler_: the belonged to russians
Dimsler_: in the first place
mircea_popescu: so did alaska.
Mats_cd03: only nominally
Dimsler_: just like 1/2 belong to poland
Dimsler_: wtf do you mean nominally
bitcoinpete: mircea_popescu i sequenced those poorly, first was a document by taleb & co., second was a random quote
Dimsler_: go pick up a fuckign history book
mircea_popescu: oh. i wish taleb embraced sanity ;/
Dimsler_: live in a box die in a box
mircea_popescu: bitcoinpete anyway, if you know the chap, perhaps drop him a link. as usual, the clearing of bs starts with teh self.
mircea_popescu: Dimsler_ why are you so aggro anyway
Dimsler_: because its the same bs on the news like always
Dimsler_: the american world police
Dimsler_: making a big deal about ukraine
bitcoinpete: mircea_popescu i only know him by reputation, such as it is. yes, some vetting is in order
Mats_cd03: crimea was an autonomous republic, not a sovereign territory with its own government
Dimsler_: shutup with that nonsense
Mats_cd03: its the functional equivalent of macao, singapore, taiwan, hong kong, or scotland deciding, lets organize militias and be rowdy
Dimsler_: using your bs coin terms sovereignity
Dimsler_: yeah right
Dimsler_: "republic"
kakobrekla: >@teddy @Xapo we've entrusted them with a shit-ton of have other big institutional funds...its a good sign.
kakobrekla: yeah.
Mats_cd03: sovereignty as its used in international law, yes
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 wasn't it a khanate originally ? that's EXACTLY what they did.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla who this ?
Mats_cd03: and they've been properly slapped down
Mats_cd03: because poor people with firearms always ends up well
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 on a long enough timeline everyone's getting slapped down properly.
Dimsler_: ukraine should be hacked up
Dimsler_: into pieces
Dimsler_: like the russians suggested
Dimsler_: plain and simple
Dimsler_: half that territory was polish
Dimsler_: the kosack was a fucking nomad
Dimsler_: he didn't care
bitcoinpete: kakobrekla mircea_popescu oof. dunce cappery
bitcoinpete: irllol
bitcoinpete: that's good shit
Mats_cd03: mircea_popescu: i think the latest post would be better with a link for the tide reference, e.g.
mircea_popescu: i suppose we'll see another anil dash-esque butthurt explosion followed by trying to date me
mircea_popescu: but what can you do for these people.
Dimsler_: evicerate the proliteriate
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 i kinda left it unreferenced fishing for noobs tbh. i'm kinda hoping the average clueless yet opinionanted keyboard warrior may pick on it to try and "mock" me.
Duffer1: bring lube?
bitcoinpete: mircea_popescu maybe chamath will ask you what kind of shampoo you use
mircea_popescu: <Dimsler_> evicerate the proliteriate < epic
mircea_popescu: also, brb, gotta trample this mouse underfoot.
CheckDavid: Mats_cd03: I did not. But yes maybe it would
CheckDavid: Do you have any suggestion?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18092 @ 0.00093963 = 16.9998 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: Kolin Burgess, a British bitcoin investor who spent much of Tuesday protesting outside of Mt. Gox’s abandoned office, in Tokyo, told a reporter for Reuters that he thought he had accumulated Bitcoins that were worth three hundred thousand dollars at the market’s peak. “I’m very angry,” he said. “It looks like that’s disappeared.”
CheckDavid: He can't buy a new car now
Mats_cd03: CheckDavid: i dunno, khan academy does alright, but i took accounting when i was in university - up to you to find a good resource
Mats_cd03: i did find an excellent pdf on finance earlier today for an aspiring quant
mircea_popescu: the problem with learnin accounting is that it's not an art, it's a craft. you can perhaps learn philosophy in your own time, of \your own volition. accounting however requires a reshaping of your mental process, which people never undertake willingly.
Mats_cd03: i hate the internet... stupid spaces
mircea_popescu: forex-warez ?! we're clearly running out of brands.
Mats_cd03: ya dude its the blackest market
mircea_popescu: teh tramborghini!
CheckDavid: Ok. Thanks Mats_cd03
bitcoinpete: i put tramborghini doors on my escalade
CheckDavid: mircea_popescu: descending trend?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.04560025 = 0.1824 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6753 @ 0.00093963 = 6.3453 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14000 @ 0.00094228 = 13.1919 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12455 @ 0.00093824 = 11.6858 BTC [-] {3}
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: CheckDavid hm ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1050 @ 0.00093636 = 0.9832 BTC [-]
CheckDavid: mircea_popescu: fundamental analysis revealed that pair is in a downward trend
kakobrekla: ;;later tell davout the printing to pdf you suggested was rejected > "unreadable / bad quality / truncated (4)"
gribble: The operation succeeded.
CheckDavid: You know? The pair?
CheckDavid: Hint: not currency pair
mircea_popescu: you trying to say the girl is going down ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 900 @ 0.00241 = 2.169 BTC [-]
CheckDavid: 2:13:02 PM mircea_popescu her tits will always point downwards on the long run, no matter what she wears.
bitcoinpete: this is lulzy
mircea_popescu: their ad is even better.
ozbot: Twitter / bitcoinpete: @bitcorati Fraud detection ...
bitcoinpete: because words
mircea_popescu: i think he means a different sort of fraud detection.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 50 @ 0.00241 = 0.1205 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.595005 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 30 @ 0.00607498 = 0.1822 BTC [+] {2}
punkman: well shit, disk just had the CLICK OF DEATH, I think I lost a wallet
mircea_popescu: apparently, if you mostly follow chicks on twitter your timeline is full of women.
bitcoinpete: mircea_popescu mostly, yes, you're right.
bounce: banking security: bank sends plain text passwords in email. says it's safe because to log in you also need to know an email address. *that* email address, yes.
Mats_cd03: punkman: if youre unlucky you'll spend $200-500 to recover it
punkman: Mats_cd03: it was a doge wallet, not sure I care
punkman: (inb4 WHY U NO BACKUPS)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6889 @ 0.00093695 = 6.4546 BTC [+]
punkman: !t h neobee
assbot: [HAVELOCK:NEOBEE] 1D: 0.00155000 / 0.00206041 / 0.00276488 (51611 shares, 106.33997891 BTC), 7D: 0.00155000 / 0.00266469 / 0.00415500 (136878 shares, 364.73771220 BTC), 30D: 0.00155000 / 0.00380173 / 0.00600000 (556467 shares, 2115.53536147 BTC)
mircea_popescu: bounce ayup.
mircea_popescu: omg doge deflation
pLambert: !t h rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00525030 / 0.00570296 / 0.00649990 (1927 shares, 10.98959692 BTC), 7D: 0.00520970 / 0.00555269 / 0.00649990 (4050 shares, 22.48839803 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.00556877 / 0.00900001 (48203 shares, 268.43165089 BTC)
bounce: somebody needs to write a banking front-end that actually makes sense. features like ability to feed it your gpg key. I'd write it except I have no contacts with banks so they'll never buy such off of me. (what give software away? to *banks*?)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 101 @ 0.00574951 = 0.5807 BTC [-] {6}
punkman: bounce: need a proper backend first
mircea_popescu: bounce it's a moot point. banks aren't able to buy it anyway, unless the govt says do it.
mircea_popescu: much better to just make mpex run the current version of "banks" out of business completely,
mircea_popescu: then it'll be a moot point.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.595005 BTC [+]
rithm: is this the new -otc where the mindless chatter happens
ozbot: Triple Entry Accounting
rithm: that's a highlevel observation type question
mircea_popescu: rithm hopefully not.
rithm: ijs
rithm: i see a lot of channels but only some of them light up
mircea_popescu: now that's a great link punkman
punkman: relevant to "proper backend"
mircea_popescu: i was actually looking for it
punkman: "It should take an Act of God to start up in anything but the best possible security you can manage. A Presidential Order doesn't cut it. "
Mats_cd03: asciilifeform: the 556 will prevail, in answer to your question.
asciilifeform: Mats_cd03: history suggests that the 'lead standard' mode of a given country is strictly connected to what can be pilfered from military supplies, when the men guarding them turn free agent. so you're almost certainly correct.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 145 @ 0.00240999 = 0.3494 BTC [-] {2}
asciilifeform: unless mexico makes the difference.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform responded.
mike_c: geez, those furry beasts in the water on trilema are so cute i'm going to puke.
Mats_cd03: i was mostly thinking that the round is superior, is all. the weapons and rounds themselves are lighter than their counterparts
rithm: walmart has sued visa
rithm: this should beinteresting
mike_c: nah, lawyers will get paid and an agreement will be made.
mircea_popescu: mike_c >D
rithm: lately i find lawsuits to be some sort of method for absconding or hiding sums of monies
rithm: a lawsuit can be a further laundry
mircea_popescu: rithm you don't say.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.07288477 = 0.4373 BTC [+] {2}
rithm: wise beyond my years, i know
rithm: in my juvenile state i always assumed a lawsuit was a negative event
rithm: but i now i just see the spin cycle
asciilifeform: Mats_cd03: 'lead standard' (currency of a country in civil war) is rarely about military/technological superiority, except in degenerate case (e.g. british 'maxim' vs. zulu spear)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.07299999 = 0.438 BTC [+] {2}
Mats_cd03: wasn't disagreeing with you, just reflecting on qualitative differences
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 2.43923397 BTC to 4`857 shares, 50221 satoshi per share
Mats_cd03: interestingly, china is not well armed compared to the rest of the world
asciilifeform: Mats_cd03: the well-armed are the folks with the industrial capacity. and that would be who - if not china ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and again.
asciilifeform: granted their arms might still be buried in the ground, as ore, at the moment
Mats_cd03: i see your point, although im thinking of privately owned small firearms
the20year2: armed as what?
Mats_cd03: they certainly do have a habit of burying them and then digging them up for use against invaders every few hundred years
the20year2: China arms most of the middle east with weapons
asciilifeform: i would guess (by no means an expert guess, but that of armchair general) that the 'most barrels per man' is somewhere in the arab world
mircea_popescu: i imagine it's somewhere in the ex-russian central asia.
mircea_popescu: from mongolia to some stan
bounce: china has lots of cannon fodder. add some cheap mass-produced tat, and any opponent still has a bit of a problem.
mircea_popescu: bounce actually, that was the 70s. today, china leads the us in the space race.
Mats_cd03: it is remarkable to me that the greatest danger to chinese public safety
Mats_cd03: are people armed with kitchen knives and motorcycles
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1030 @ 0.00222226 = 2.2889 BTC [-] {14}
the20year2: and molotov cocktails
Mats_cd03: if the country wasnt shitty in other ways id love to live there, social stability and chinese women sounds great
mircea_popescu: if chinese women weren't ugly ;/
the20year2: and all gold diggers
the20year2: All the guys I know in china hate the women there
mircea_popescu: a woman can be trained.
bounce: that they do. not like the US couldn't see it coming, or anything. just that china can make do with very little. on top of that, they do have what looks like decent kit these days.
Mats_cd03: you guys must be great in social settings
the20year2: I certainly am!
mircea_popescu: were you being sarcastic ? my absent social skills prevent me from discerning sarcasm online.
pLambert: according to the US has the most guns per person
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10400 @ 0.00093964 = 9.7723 BTC [+]
the20year2: And it's growing a little every day
the20year2: Jan and Feb firearm sales were astronomical
asciilifeform: pLambert: 'barrels per man' includes 'man' and not merely 'barrels'
asciilifeform: cannon cannot fight by itself
bounce: too bad dual wielding isn't what the gamer kids believe it is
the20year2: gamer kids have no hope
bounce: though there's the ROTM
pLambert: I don't get it, whats the diff between barrels-per-man and guns-per-capita?
mircea_popescu: there's a lot more to that man angle than anyone readily admits. take that recent treysomething or the other case.
mircea_popescu: the monkey got shot, in the end, it's true
the20year2: double barreled shotguns count as two!
asciilifeform: pLambert: picture one of those palestinian hospital-cum-armoury places
mircea_popescu: only after beating the shit out of the eventual shooter for half an hour.
mircea_popescu: that won't wash irl.
asciilifeform: hundreds of wounded, plus women and children 'shields', enough artillery to equip a division
asciilifeform: but is there a division there?
the20year2: not division strength :D
mircea_popescu: people who shoot you the moment you've looked the wrong way are quite different from people who scuffle with you over their own gun which then sorta-accidentally discharges.
asciilifeform: a fixation on hardware is one of the 'professional diseases' of technological civilization
the20year2: i just don't like the people that complain about the legal constructs of the state for self defense and want to make it illegal to defend yourself
asciilifeform: ;;google yi yi zhi yi
gribble: Continuosly in Mandarin Chinese - Yi Zhi - Mandarin Language: <>; Zhi Yi Ong | University of Pennsylvania Department of Psychology: <>; Yi-Zhi Huang - Department of Mathematics: <>
asciilifeform: retarded.
Mats_cd03: i believe owning a weapon is a privilege rather than a right
asciilifeform: ;;google "yi yi zhi yi"
gribble: Continuosly in Mandarin Chinese - Yi Zhi - Mandarin Language: <>; Zhi Yi Ong | University of Pennsylvania Department of Psychology: <>; Yi-Zhi Huang - Department of Mathematics: <>
asciilifeform: ok no dice.
the20year2: And I don't
mircea_popescu: owning a weapon is an ability.
the20year2: I feel that the ability to adequately defend yourself and your family isn't just a right, it's required
Mats_cd03: i believe should be compelled to prove competency with it as well as commit to securing the weapon
mircea_popescu: privileges and rights don't enter into it.
Mats_cd03: ^ you
bounce: well, there's more to it than that. in the USoA there's also a strong cultural current that requires guns. and, relatedly, something to fight, so they'll keep on looking for exactly that. in that sense two wars at the same time is them 'merkins having a cultural field day.
mircea_popescu: the gun was there before there were privileges, rights or beliefs
mircea_popescu: it will hopefully survive all that crud.
asciilifeform: deadliest known weapon, long before gunpowder, is: set of balls
the20year2: The technological prerequisite to production of a firearm is quite low
Mats_cd03: in practical terms securing the weapon means two different locks for the bolt carrier group and the upper receiver
the20year2: which prevents access in time of emergency or delays a theif by a whole minute or two
Mats_cd03: if that was imposed, people dying of negligent discharges would drop 90%
the20year2: Negligent discharges are quite low overall and are decreasing by pretty large amounts in the US
Mats_cd03: if it takes you a minute to remove two locks and assemble the weapon you deserve to die to a home invasion
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 two different locks ?
mircea_popescu: what are you making there, a hope chest ?
the20year2: You think most people can do that when their door is being busted down?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13950 @ 0.00093549 = 13.0501 BTC [-] {4}
asciilifeform: my understanding is that such locks are usually meant against the owner's sons rather than enemies
the20year2: Why not require the same of police officers too? Since they have the same, or more negligent discharges than civilians
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 by the same argument, people who die by negligent discharge deserve to die anwyay /
Mats_cd03: youre more likely to die to a negligent discharge than to a home invasion
mike_c: the20year2: probably not a percentage basis?
Mats_cd03: thats the reasoning, anyway
the20year2: And you're more likely to be in a car accident 100 times over than an accidental firearm discharge
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i seriously don't see who'd like to keep that particular son.
mircea_popescu: the best way to raise boys is to regularly give them enough rope to hang themselves and then enforce the hanging once they started it.
bounce: well, it's a bit of a problem if that son first shoots half a magazine worth of neighbours
mike_c: the20year2: again.. seems misleading. is that just for gun owners?
asciilifeform: perhaps no one, but others want to keep theirs - and their domestic animals, window glass, etc.
the20year2: Among all accidental firearm discharges in the US , there were 600 deaths last year
the20year2: Compared to 3,500 drowning deaths, 750 people beat to death with hands and feet, 40,000 alcohol related deaths and 500,000 tobacco related deaths
mike_c: yes, but everybody has hands and feet. not everybody has guns.
asciilifeform: death statistics are a tiresome subject. no one dies of statistics.
Mats_cd03: how do you propose solving social problems with statistics
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28391 @ 0.00093973 = 26.6799 BTC [+]
the20year2: Well, i could base everything on how I "Feel", but i don't know that my feelings would have any impact on others
chetty: no such thing as social problems
mircea_popescu: i wonder how many deaths are "related" to statistics
mircea_popescu: in the sense they are "related" to tobacco
chetty: 95%
asciilifeform: i can think of one example
mircea_popescu: let's see... if some guy needs an operation and the insurance won't clear it because they judge he's too old/poor/etc, and he dies
mircea_popescu: this would be a statistics related death neh ?
asciilifeform: when the usg banned the instant 'hiv' tester device, the argument, if i recall, was that people would kill themselves on learning the result, if no surrounded by government-approved shrinks
benkay: ;;gpg eauth benkay
gribble: Request successful for user benkay, hostmask benkay! Get your encrypted OTP from
the20year2: Didn't all those people die during holomodor due to USSR's amazing statistics & record keeping?
benkay: ;;everify freenode:#bitcoin-otc:983637eb42b48a2be08fe9d0aa52ad0f7cb6412de4764cff08499c25
mircea_popescu: wait, hiv testing is banned in the us?!
gribble: You are now authenticated for user benkay with key 39F274AFBC7ACAC7
mircea_popescu: the20year2 it definitely could be argued.
benkay: ;;rate bitcoinpete 1 does what he says he will.
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user bitcoinpete has been recorded.
mircea_popescu: twas holodomor too
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not banned as such. but the 'holy grail' that could have eradicated the virus, a pocket-sized instant electronic gizmo, sat in a glass case at one of my old employers' facility
asciilifeform: and is not to be found at pharmacy.
the20year2: Although you could also blame it on lynshenkoism (sp) which kind of is a statistical thing there too
mircea_popescu: dja know how miciurin died ?
asciilifeform: 'fell from a strawberry tree' ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 34 @ 0.04541482 = 1.5441 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45900 @ 0.00094255 = 43.263 BTC [+] {5}
asciilifeform: like a jpm accountant.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not this one. a re-usable, electronic gizmo that took a few min.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.055055 = 0.1101 BTC [-] {2}
asciilifeform: could've been used by civilians prior to putting on condom, etc.
mircea_popescu: this seems to work the same way neh ?
mircea_popescu: i know pron companies now use something on the sets.
mircea_popescu: after that major scare a few years back
asciilifeform: the difference is important (expensive, disposable, slow) vs. reusable (cheap), compact, fast.
mircea_popescu: who reuses a hiv test ?!
mircea_popescu: seems a bad idea.
asciilifeform: i believe the gizmo in question used a 'microarray'
mircea_popescu: "i got hiv from sharing the hiv tester with a hiv sufferer"
asciilifeform: (SRAM with immunoreactant crap permanently bonded to the capacitors)
asciilifeform: spit, wash.
asciilifeform: repeat.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.07199 = 0.36 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: incidentally, the same tech could easily test the composition of a drug (pharmacy or back alley, user's choice)
asciilifeform: these things actually work.
asciilifeform: in usa (and colonies) - a fellow who sells actual solutions to 'social problem' crapola is liable to 'begin to have problems.'
benkay: mircea_popescu: re, that doesn't store private keys though.
ozbot: New regulated UK exchange opening
mircea_popescu: nefario trying the kenna trick.
mircea_popescu: benkay no i understand that. but if you use it, you have to still secure your site,
mircea_popescu: and then hope that both gpgauth and your link to it is also secure.
asciilifeform: or something like that
BingoBoingo: Duffer1: Your link looked link Dank discovered socks
mike_c: but if you use gpgauth and they get hacked, you have an excuse. so it's ok. like when your site goes down because aws goes down, built in excuse. </sarcasm>
benkay: o i thought the excuse was =========
benkay: "hashes match on my device!"
mircea_popescu: mike_c heh i see.
mircea_popescu: but seriously now, i fail to see what it offers. i mean i suppose one could loot their github for code, and the site could be just a demo.
mircea_popescu: the pr salute you.
asciilifeform: in other news,
benkay: i don't see my name there...
benkay: some salute.
asciilifeform: 'zorro' (aes-based cipher) is broken. sorry, pdf:
mircea_popescu: benkay a half mast salute ? :D
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform hjaha cool.
ozbot: Twitter / Mircea_Popescu: 'zorro' (aes-based cipher) ...
mircea_popescu: there, i've now robbed peter to pay paul.
mircea_popescu: can i be government yet ?
benkay: ;;gettrust eskimobob
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user benkay to user eskimobob: Level 1: 0, Level 2: -1 via 1 connections. Graph: | WoT data: | Rated since: Sat Jun 4 12:35:57 2011
tg2: Bro do u even r8
mike_c: true or false: if i type a password into my shell, and then call 'history -c', i am ok?
tg2: Hdd or ssd?
mircea_popescu: mike_c not ok.
mike_c: assume i am not worried about someone raw-reading my hdd. are there other attack vectors?
tg2: Auth logs often will keep a history of commands
mircea_popescu: yes. the shell only flushes the session at times.
mircea_popescu: so your -c may or may not hit what you want
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.07299999 = 0.365 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: a good approach is to search everywhere for another string in the history file, then wipe your password from everywhere you found keeps a copy.
mike_c: ok, thanks.
mircea_popescu: and this to be done after all processes involved ended.
tg2: Grep -iR "yourpass" /
tg2: Go have a coffee
asciilifeform: the 'zorro' thing isn't a mega-news, on account of it being a kind of 'castrated' aes variant
tg2: Lol
mircea_popescu: unless you conveniently search ram etc.
asciilifeform: but still interesting that people bother.
bounce: all the while "yourpass" sits in the process list for all to see
mircea_popescu: if you like yourpass you can keep yourpass.
ozbot: Putin says Crimea showed 'new capacities' of Russian army - International - World - Ahram Online
asciilifeform: because we're madmen, let's actually calculate this.
ozbot: Ukraine: Crimea Bases Under Russian Control |
ozbot: Extreme Electronics | Capacitance of a human body
asciilifeform: let's take the 100pF value, conservatively.
asciilifeform: ;;google russian army strength 2014
gribble: Global Firepower - 2014 World Military Strength Ranking: <>; Russia Military Strength - Global Firepower: <>; 2014 Russian military intervention in Ukraine - Wikipedia, the free ...: <>
mircea_popescu prepares to fall over laughing.
mircea_popescu: lol srsly.
asciilifeform: if we take the 69 million available men figure,
Mats_cd03: neat
asciilifeform: ;;calc (200e-12 * 69000000) / (1e-3)
gribble: Error: invalid syntax (<string>, line 1)
asciilifeform: whatever, ~13.8 millifarad.
asciilifeform: so, mp is quite close.
asciilifeform: mp wins 'fermi' prize.
asciilifeform: homework: calculate 'if the chinese jumped.'
asciilifeform: (actual physics puzzle from my childhood)
the20year2: Reserves are calculated differently in each country
asciilifeform: damn, not awake
the20year2: that's more than double 100pf , right?
asciilifeform: given value is for 200.
asciilifeform: incidentally, capacitance of the body is not mere trivia, but modern mobile gizmotry lives and dies by it (touch panel.)
asciilifeform: (try using a capacitative panel with your fingernail)
ozbot: Navy says farewell to fire-damaged sub Miami | Navy Times |
the20year2: do they put caps in styluses?
asciilifeform: in the russian wankasphere, at the time, there were countless wags suggesting nominating the drunk for 'order of lenin'
benkay: capacitor not necessary for capacitance
asciilifeform: virtually anything is a capacitor, depending on your circumstances.
benkay: pedant
asciilifeform: just some are larger than others.
benkay: some are also engineered and subsequently manufactured.
benkay: vs grown in wombs
asciilifeform: at this point, even cable monkeys, afaik, know this - because at high frequencies, a wire is a capacitor
asciilifeform: a kink in the cable - an inductor.
asciilifeform: the 'lumped element model' of electronics was ok for the first half of 20th c.
asciilifeform: now, not so much.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] [PAID] 49.34183188 BTC to 80`674 shares, 61162 satoshi per share
benkay: kinks can even induce reflections if your application's sensitive to 'em.
benkay: once had to design a nightmare of a cable harness for wafer probing.
asciilifeform: mismatched impedence -> also reflections. undergrad physics.
Mats_cd03: i love you guys
asciilifeform: try it at home!
asciilifeform: even the lowliest asian oscilloscope comes with built-in test waveform generator
benkay: minimum bend radii, maximum cable lengths, nobody ever wanted to cram that many probes that close together before, handed the problem to resident kid.
asciilifeform: attach to a cable made with two segments of mismatched impedence
asciilifeform: the other end, to a probe.
punkman: asciilifeform: what's a good chinese brand for scopes?
asciilifeform: then watch the echos.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform dude i think i actually can prove there won't be no "lead standard".
asciilifeform: punkman: mine's a recent 'rigol' (has documented interface, linux friendly)
asciilifeform: other people - use others
asciilifeform: for HF work, a 1978 'hewlett packard'
asciilifeform: wake up diametric, he'll describe his collection.
diametric: collection of what?
asciilifeform: instruments
asciilifeform: and their purposes
ozbot: College offers a course on Miley Cyrus, but not twerking
asciilifeform: ;;google Rigol DS1102D
gribble: DS1102D 100 MHz Mixed Signal Oscilloscope | Rigol - Beyond ...: <>; Rigol DS1102D 100MHz Mixed Signal Oscilloscope ...: <>; Rigol DS1102D Digital Oscilloscope 100MHz with Logic Analyzer ...: (1 more message)
asciilifeform: reasonably cheap, all-purpose gizmo
diametric: oh, I have a collection but ultimately I don't do enough electronics work to give that great of opinions on it.
asciilifeform: if a little of a 'trabambourghini'.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5050 @ 0.00093923 = 4.7431 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.05460057 = 0.3822 BTC [-] {2}
diametric: ;;google owon sds7102
gribble: Owon SDS7102 Deep Memory Digital Storage ...: <>; REVIEW - Owon SDS7102 - A look at the SDS series from Owon - Page ...: <>; OWON SDS7102 Complete Review - YouTube: <>
diametric: thats the one I have, it works well for my uses.
asciilifeform: i think most people (who have any dealings with such matters, at any rate) own at least 2 scopes - a chinese trambo, and a vintage american analogue unit.
benkay: "vintage"? how old is vintage?
diametric: yeah I have a 79 (i think?) tektronics of some sort I haven't used very much
asciilifeform: 1970s usually
benkay: those are a joy
asciilifeform: similar machines are still made. $2-3K+
benkay: i had to have someone who grew up with them teach me how to use them though.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.07299999 = 0.511 BTC [+] {2}
benkay: manuals having long since disappeared from the shop.
asciilifeform: using a scope isn't rocket surgery
asciilifeform: and you can usually find the manual on the net.
benkay: << lowly mechanical
asciilifeform: it's merely a voltmeter with a time axis.
benkay: plus also cameraderie and mentorship.
asciilifeform: the first oscilloscope wasn't even electronic in the usual sense (mirror on a rope, deflected by electrostatic charges, candle, projects on wall)
asciilifeform: most of what we think of as 'high tech' was created by people who never lived to see a plastic bag.
asciilifeform: think of it that way.
asciilifeform is mostly an uneducated brute, who learned of things by playing with them, and libraries.
benkay: lucky them, living in such a slow time and communing with such giants.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.073 = 0.146 BTC [+]
the20year2: if i had a major need for one i could have picked up a few by now
asciilifeform: instruments with acceptable, if not great, quality, are more available today than ever.
benkay: asciilifeform, mircea_popescu, diametric and chipfolk at large: on a scale of zero to crackpot:
asciilifeform: navhul-lacsup << urbit syllablegen? !
benkay: asciilifeform: looks like it, neh?
benkay: ahoy the sub
mircea_popescu: benkay i don't know enough about cpus to be useful there.
asciilifeform: somebody linked to 'mill' in my comment peanutgallery once
mircea_popescu: navhul-lacsup wait, so is this actually an urbit powered irc bouncer ?!
mircea_popescu: wait wait wait nowai, you don't lose connection nearly frequently enough.
asciilifeform: these folks are crackpots, quite possibly inspired by my ravings re: dataflow archs. so i am to blame.
asciilifeform: they've no hardware.
diametric: punkman: maybe, i vaguely remember reading after that came out the newer shipped ones don't work
diametric: punkman: i could be wrong
benkay: insufficiently-horsed is more like it.
mircea_popescu: so ascii is to blame huh ?
ozbot: "Behold the Lord High Executioner" - YouTube
asciilifeform: navhul-lacsup: 'you can't mold a bullet from shit' (rus. saying)
asciilifeform: curtis found a dog turd, dried for years, and decided that it is hard enough to whittle bullet from
asciilifeform: my recommendation is - don't - it will probably make you unhappy
asciilifeform: (tldr version - curtis re-invented: nothing. 'old wine in new bottle')
mircea_popescu: navhul-lacsup well nice toi have you anyways.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.BBET] 3350 @ 0.00050002 = 1.6751 BTC [-] {2}
rithm: if only they'd print serial numbers on all those tide bottles...
mircea_popescu: rithm they do.
mircea_popescu: all fmcg carries lot and serial identification.
rithm: are you sure? when did that start?
mircea_popescu: the 80s ?
rithm: i'll have to do more grocery shopping to confirm this theroy
mircea_popescu: look around the seams, usually where the typographical allignment marks are.
rithm: i personally operate mostly in the bezzle space obv
mircea_popescu: i think most everyone here does.
mircea_popescu: i know i do.
mircea_popescu: well... or used to, i guess bitcoin changes that.
rithm: i'm very intriqgued by the tideUSD market though
rithm: -q
the20year2: tideusd?
rithm: mmmhmmmm
the20year2: Tide? The soap?
mircea_popescu: rithm if us ngos were actually useful rather than a cozy retreat for useless white cunts, we'd have some research data available as to actual economic expenditure of ghetto household
mircea_popescu: i suspect on average about 1/3 of available resources goes to chemicals.
mircea_popescu: the20year2 yea
the20year2: i know soap theft is pretty big
benkay: "chemicals" including lots of nominally nutritive materials
rithm: mircea_popescu i have supporting data based on my surroundings that confirm your hypothesis
the20year2: you mean ghetto food too?
mircea_popescu: benkay i mostly meant psychoactives.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4300 @ 0.00093712 = 4.0296 BTC [-]
the20year2: Ah, drugs
mircea_popescu: rithm sure, i have a lot of anecdotal support
rithm: well alcohol and tobacco consume large portions of the blue collar paycheck
the20year2: I'd love to see the data
rithm: erm tideUSD
mircea_popescu: generally you can "crash", ie, board, for free with "friends"
the20year2: but look at top employers in ghetto areas
mircea_popescu: but "friendship" is borne out of sharing chems.
mircea_popescu: so in a sense, rent for the ghetto is paid in grams.
asciilifeform: then there are the Chukchas
asciilifeform: and their 'amanita muscaria'
rithm: ic
asciilifeform: where the drug is - literally - shared with friends.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform exact same practice existed in medieval romanian and prior
asciilifeform: (excreted unchanged, piss is served)
mircea_popescu: and in medieval crimeea, scythic times.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: everywhere the thing grows
tg2: grams/month living index
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22834 @ 0.00093663 = 21.387 BTC [-]
ozbot: Homeopathic remedies recalled for containing real medicine (Wired UK)
asciilifeform: good thing james randi didn't eat a kilo of that one
asciilifeform: during his demos
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 150 @ 0.00242896 = 0.3643 BTC [+] {4}
the20year2: oh dang
the20year2: i've never understood homeopathy, and i don't think most who believe in it do either
benkay: not much to understand, the20year2.
benkay: there's nothing there.
asciilifeform: re: << every bottle of laundry crap, in every shop, where i live - has a bulky rfid alarm gizmo chained to it.
benkay: asciilifeform: there aren't zappers floating around?
asciilifeform: the shop clerk disarms it with some electro crap built into the cash register, and snips off the alarm wire
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38850 @ 0.00093751 = 36.4223 BTC [+] {3}
the20year2: same with electronics in most stores
asciilifeform: thieves have been walking with shield bags for many years.
asciilifeform: same kind of bag used to house static-sensitive electronics, but larger.
benkay: asciilifeform: this defense ignores the store mandates that store employees not actually do anything during a theft for fear of liability.
asciilifeform: the alarm goes off many times, every day, cries wolf
asciilifeform: and who would chase a genuine thief? the 'minimum wage' clerk?
jurov: smile sheepishly, shrug it off, walk out
benkay: asciilifeform: that is what i'm driving at.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform cuz you live in the sticks. they don't bother with that shit here.
asciilifeform: one day we will probably see shops where you enter and leave through a 'man trap'
mircea_popescu: they DO however rfid the hell out of alcohol bottles
asciilifeform: lets you in if your (radio-enabled) card has credit
asciilifeform: lets you out if your balance - minus the prices reported by radio tags on the junk in your bags - is positive
asciilifeform: no clerks.
asciilifeform: ;;google mantrap
gribble: Mantrap - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>; What is mantrap - - TechTarget: <>; Mantrap (1926) - IMDb: <>
asciilifeform: aka airlock
ozbot: Bank robber trapped in Access Control Vestibule - YouTube
benkay: mircea_popescu: most places in the US alcohol is only touchable by the clerks.
mircea_popescu: the epic was made by me loading my own cart.
asciilifeform: benkay: in the cities. it is sold through a little window, like movie tickets.
BingoBoingo: benkay: Sounds like a sad place
asciilifeform: elsewhere, it is sold like ordinary things
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that's how they do pond shops here.
asciilifeform: ;;google chechen mafia booth
gribble: Who Knows Jack? - American Journalism Review: <>; The Judeo-Russian Mafia And The Bloodbath To Come, by Dr ...: <>; Chechnya Leaders Claim Terrorist Who Called for Olympic Attacks ...: < (1 more message)
benkay: oh it's the most hilarious in the occupied cascadian territories, BingoBoingo
benkay: we labor under a state sponsored liquor monopoly.
BingoBoingo: benkay: Here we have liquor and tobacco superstores where you can browse the aisles
benkay: go fuck yourself
benkay: i hate socialism
BingoBoingo: Walk up to the counter, walk out with a keg
asciilifeform: places where shops get robbed beyond some critical frequency tend to sprout 'chechen'-style kiosks. picture a shipping container, perhaps with a bit of extra armour, with a small hole.
asciilifeform: money enters, booze, smokes, etc. come out.
benkay: that was my experience in NYC, asciilifeform.
benkay: luckily, we don't have much actual in-person robbery here. just communism.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo is that chicago ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: St Louis.
BingoBoingo: The gas stations in less desirable areas have armor, glass and kiosks
mircea_popescu: weird shit.
BingoBoingo: The larger outfits just have people cabable of handling security handling security
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 25 @ 0.0706604 = 1.7665 BTC [-] {11}
BingoBoingo: The image midpage almost captures the scale of the place
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 9 @ 0.07 = 0.63 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 31 @ 0.0064999 = 0.2015 BTC [+]
ozbot: SAQ Signature concept honored by the Retail Design Institute
tg2: thats our fanciest booze store
tg2: 5500 sq ft
benkay: it's not nearly as bad here as i make it out
benkay: the nice stores are nice, obviously.
benkay: the monopoly is a horrendous thing.
tg2: yeah it's bad
tg2: an $80 bottle of wine in florida can be $300+ by the time it gets here
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 20 @ 0.0065 = 0.13 BTC [+]
tg2: probably one of the worst examples of government monopoly
benkay: what's even more funny is that canadian beef is cheaper here than it is up there.
tg2: yeah but we like USDA beef ;)
tg2: classic "grass is greener"
BingoBoingo: St Louis also has a sort of privately run beer welfare, take the free AB brewery tour and get two beers at the end
benkay: USDA's horrendously more expensive up north.
tg2: 12oz AAA tenderloin is $45+ in most places here
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9900 @ 0.00093964 = 9.3024 BTC [+] {2}
tg2: not from the butcher, but in any respectable restaurant
benkay: ah
benkay: i was going to say.
tg2: its around $78/kg here
tg2: for usda/aaa
tg2: from the grocery
tg2: $26 per 12oz
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.069998 = 0.49 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 333 @ 0.0065 = 2.1645 BTC [+]
benkay: argentina!
tg2: wife's family owns a bunch of dairy farms
Mats_cd03: .bait
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 60 @ 0.00659111 = 0.3955 BTC [+] {3}
tg2: so we get free-range grass-fed beef
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.055 = 0.33 BTC [+] {2}
the20year2: daaang
ozbot: Veteran cyclist killed by minivan knew the dangers all too well | The Columbus Dispatch
ozbot: Natacha Daro (NatachaDaroOK) on Twitter
asciilifeform: (tldr - jpm corpse)
the20year2: tg2: where are you?
mircea_popescu: lmao. most excellent wine here is about 10-15 bucks.
mircea_popescu: what 80, what 300.
tg2: I thought it was sacha grey in that pic
mircea_popescu: the finest cognac in the world goes for ~55 a bottle.
the20year2: AAA beef grade is USDA choice which is pretty low
tg2: :|
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 70 @ 0.0068611 = 0.4803 BTC [+]
tg2: I guess we have different taste in wine :)
mircea_popescu: possibly.
mircea_popescu: but i've yet to have a decent us wine.
mircea_popescu: i don't even mean good. decent. something i could in good conscience feed women.
tg2: i can give you a list of "to-try" if youw ant
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 64 @ 0.00242784 = 0.1554 BTC [-] {4}
tg2: you're close to napa I'm guessing
mircea_popescu: many have.
tg2: 1 just have one
tg2: you can try
mircea_popescu: no, im in romania. close to recas.
tg2: opus one
tg2: then insignia
tg2: then silver oak
tg2: ;)
mircea_popescu: insignia ?!
tg2: I have cases of it
tg2: its great
mircea_popescu: i thought that was a flat panel tv maker o.O
tg2: puts california on the map imo
ozbot: Insignia : Joseph Phelps Vineyards
ozbot: Opus One
BingoBoingo: ;;google insignia product
gribble: Insignia Consumer Electronic Products: <>; Product Support | Insignia: <>; Insignia Flat Screen Television Collection | LCD HDTVs | Insignia: <>
tg2: haha
tg2: yes they are
tg2: but the wine has more lineage
tg2: ;D
mircea_popescu: i dunno how much lineage it can have, but anyway
BingoBoingo: I have trouble trusting a brand named after something a brand is supposed to have, rather than actually having its own
tg2: it's a great wine
tg2: but it's $325 a bottle here
tg2: I found a case of opus one in a convenience store in maui
tg2: for $55 per bottle
tg2: at the back of a fridge
BingoBoingo: ;;ident
gribble: Nick 'BingoBoingo', with hostmask 'BingoBoingo!~BingoBoin@unaffiliated/bingoboingo', is identified as user 'BingoBoingo', with GPG key id 309BB8D7F3251143, key fingerprint ADD7A9A28F85E5EF1F51904F309BB8D7F3251143, and bitcoin address None
tg2: was 1996
tg2: this was in ~2008
ozbot: 1996 Opus One, Napa Valley, USA: prices | wine-searcher
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15615 @ 0.00093446 = 14.5916 BTC [-] {4}
tg2: anyway, all this to say fuck government monopolies
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 30 @ 0.0068611 = 0.2058 BTC [+]
ozbot: Cramele Recas/ Recas Winery
mircea_popescu: this'be the winery about 20 miles from here.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 483 @ 0.00698395 = 3.3732 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: they make something like 10 mn bottles a year, most of it sold as entry and mid range wine. if you run into it tho buy it, because it's probably the best you'll ever drink at that price level.
tg2: I would go for some italian super tuscans
tg2: that should be available where you are
tg2: sassicaia
punkman: I got this box of wine here that was about 3eur/litre.
punkman: same thing is shipped to France and bottled, then sold to Americans for a huge premium
tg2: my eyes are rolling so hard right now
punkman: yah
mircea_popescu: punkman about how it works, yeah.
tg2: next time you guys are in montreal ping me we'll hit the cellar :)
mircea_popescu: do you have to heat the cellars up there ?
tg2: yes actually
tg2: lol
tg2: I have a pit cellar (under the house) and cold air tends to make it's way down there
mircea_popescu: must suck
tg2: well if it freezes
tg2: you just ruined thousands of bottles
mircea_popescu: ya that's the end of it
tg2: so yes
punkman: I could use a nice cellar
mircea_popescu: but ideally, people should live in places where a properly dug cellar maintains a proper temperature with no exceptions.
mircea_popescu: there's criteria to choose where to live.
tg2: I /think/ it's actually below the frost line but I wouldn't want to test it out
tg2: I keep them at 14C
mircea_popescu: (incidentally, do you know how roman legionnaires chose where to settle down ? ie, they wanted to be able to grow wine)
tg2: well romans + wine goes pretty hand in hand
tg2: sadly I don't know of many romanian wines
tg2: geographically they should be able to grow the same caliber of wine as itali
mircea_popescu: they actually beat france.
mircea_popescu: better soil.
tg2: its a combination of soil and sun and temperature
tg2: craiova is about the same latitude as the two regions in italy and france that produce the "top" wines
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 3814 @ 0.00213751 = 8.1525 BTC [-] {23}
tg2: you need hills of the right orientation, arid seasons, mild temperature variances and the right amount of daylight (and, you know, some fugesi) to grow good wine
mircea_popescu: thats a map of the major wine producing zones
ozbot: Tesla Model S Awarded NHTSA's Highest Safety Rating - John Paczkowski - News - AllThingsD
mircea_popescu: mike_c quite impressive.
mircea_popescu: but you know, what happens if the obstacle isn't brissant
mike_c: immovable object, unstoppable force, who knows?
punkman: so they redesigned Paypal to be responsive or whatever, now I can't even get to my account page
tg2: lol
tg2: they're doing the world a service.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12300 @ 0.0009341 = 11.4894 BTC [-]
mike_c: plus neither I nor google knows what brissant means.
mircea_popescu: punkman there's a bug of stupid going around, they fucked up namecheap earilier.
mircea_popescu: mike_c from french brisser, which crumbles
mircea_popescu: the opposite of ductility
mike_c: ah. my limited language skills at work.
tg2: that special feeling when paypal sends you an email that your account is now "restricted" and they're going to hang on to your $200k while they evaluate the situation for the next 6 months
tg2: at which point they may or may not give it back
tg2: depending on how they feel
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18700 @ 0.0009341 = 17.4677 BTC [-]
punkman: I just use it for small purchases here and there
benkay: mike_c: show me the same thing with a piece of steel a la what kicked off a recent Tesla fire.
tg2: I'm surprised they haven't been sued into the ground yet. People are overly complacent
mike_c: they ran over an alternator and a tow hitch. but they were brissant.
mircea_popescu: tg2 they settle.
tg2: even gox - it amazes me
mircea_popescu: it's actually a decent way to make a buck.
tg2: "oh well guys looks like we lost 500m$" "silly us"
benkay: what, a tow hitch is brissant?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.055 = 0.275 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: mike_c well see, there's a reason why karate guys break one foot of brick but never try half inch of cast iron pot.
benkay: i figured those were ductile.
benkay: ah.
tg2: that concrete was likely cast for that express test
mike_c: actually less brissant than i thought
benkay: well it's still
benkay: steel
mircea_popescu: wow pretty good going with the hitch
benkay: ductile != brissant
ozbot: Easy Concrete Demolition, Rock Breaking, Excavating: How to Break Rocks, Concrete Easily with Dexpan
tg2: check that shit out
mircea_popescu: what's that item flyiong out after the puncture /
tg2: i'd like to see a tesla drive over that
benkay: bolt holding plates in, mircea_popescu
benkay: you can see the threads strip and then it wobble out
mircea_popescu: that's one motherfucking bolt
mircea_popescu: it looks like it'd barely fit a virgin ass.
tg2: its not a bolt
benkay: helluva lever arm across the width of the body
tg2: it's a pop pin
tg2: plastic pin that holds that cover on
benkay: a!
tg2: they use it in interior panels
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 5201 @ 0.0001179 = 0.6132 BTC [+] {2}
benkay: seems a bit inertia-y for plastic
benkay: should tumble and slow much more imho
benkay: but what do i know
mircea_popescu: anyway, pretty impressive armor they got on the thing
mircea_popescu: what is it, some poly something ?
benkay: could it be a metal pop pin?
tg2: it oculd yes but its likely plsatic
benkay: it's holding in super vibrate-y al plates, though.
benkay: those would cut right through plastic over time.
benkay: plus shine, plus no tumble and maintaining the same speed as car...
benkay: makes me think metal.
tg2: here
tg2: you can see, that is exactly what it is
benkay: nigga i know what a pop pin is
tg2: it could be metalic
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.055 = 0.11 BTC [+]
benkay: i'm marshalling reasons why it might be metallic.
tg2: > bolt holding plates in, mircea_popescu
tg2: clearly
benkay: <tg2> plastic pin that holds that cover on
benkay: <benkay> a!
mircea_popescu: the item in the video doesn't match that jpg
tg2: ^
mike_c: mircea_popescu: three shields, aluminum bar, then titanium shield, then aluminum deflector shield.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.59 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: mike_c all metallic ? impressive
benkay: lipo's, yo.
benkay: crashed a model airplane recently, banana'd a battery.
mircea_popescu: must be some high performance al-cu alloy
mike_c: re: not brissant: " provides another layer of deflection and finally causes the Model S to ramp up and over the object if it is essentially incompressible and immovable"
benkay: going to puncture it on a drunken weekend soon
mike_c: so if it doesn't crumble it causes the car to fly!
tg2: wifes s3 blew up while charging
mircea_popescu: this looks like 2618 level shit.
tg2: like expanded and then blew out
tg2: burnt the nightstand
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 100 @ 0.00565714 = 0.5657 BTC [-] {8}
tg2: next level samsung QC
BingoBoingo: ;;seen vexual
gribble: vexual was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 4 weeks, 1 day, 19 hours, 31 minutes, and 14 seconds ago: <Vexual> lasers in the eye is never good tat
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3639 @ 0.00094073 = 3.4233 BTC [+]
tg2: benkay, just charge it at 5-10x it's C rating
benkay: where's the fun in that, tg2 ?
benkay: 'sides, risky for the charger.
tg2: ok ok shoot it with a firearm
benkay: that's another plan.
benkay: but firearms and booze are not my favorite combo.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 100 @ 0.00404933 = 0.4049 BTC [-] {7}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 20 @ 0.007215 = 0.1443 BTC [-] {2}
the20year2: almost .0075
BingoBoingo: firearms and booze are like cars and booze, best kept well apart from each other in time and space
benkay: !t h rent
assbot: I haven't understood a single word you've said since I met you, not one single word.
benkay: the manip is in, eh, the20year2 ?
benkay: plan to let your stockholders sell at the same price as your round 2 ipo?
benkay: iplol
the20year2: i haven't had to buy a single share to increase price
moiety: evening
benkay: totally, man.
benkay: lo mo
kakobrekla: how cum the ticker aint working, this aint right.
benkay: !t m s.mpoe
assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00092844 / 0.00093601 / 0.000944 (1677335 shares, 1,570.02 BTC), 7D: 0.00092844 / 0.00094341 / 0.00095875 (6339010 shares, 5,980.31 BTC), 30D: 0.000745 / 0.00086422 / 0.00096 (31068816 shares, 26,850.50 BTC)
benkay: !mp
benkay: !help
assbot: List of commands:
assbot: !ticker <exchange> <ticker> (desc: returns current ticker values, supported: MPEX, HAVELOCK, BTCTCO) {short: !t}
assbot: !last <exchange> <ticker> (desc: returns last price value, supported: MPEX, HAVELOCK, BTCTCO) {short: !l}
assbot: !mp <signcrypted url> (desc: returns the response from MPEX order)
assbot: !rules <nick/chan> (desc: chan guidelines) {short: !r}
assbot: !exchanges <nick/chan> (desc: lists exchanges and brokers) {short: !e}
assbot: !jd (desc: returns relevant stats from
assbot: !bash <lines> (desc: bashes last <lines> lines to bash) {short: !b}
assbot: !quote <lines> (desc: quotes last <lines> lines and returns dpaste url) {short: !q}
BingoBoingo: !t h COG
assbot: It says some pelt-wearin' trapper, some stinkin' bean-suckin' possum skinner, he's gonna collect that reward money.
kakobrekla: nothing.
benkay: testing...
benkay: testing in production....
benkay: assbarf
mike_c: assbot is trying to catch up to mp's line count
kakobrekla: havelock api is down
kakobrekla: or they changed ips
kakobrekla: or something
kakobrekla: ping topace
benkay: he's not involved any more, kakobrekla
benkay: GOSH
kakobrekla: but he is their sys admin
kakobrekla: afaik?
topace: pong
kakobrekla: something wrong wit the api?
kakobrekla: lol assbot
topace: did the IP change ?
topace: you had me change the hostname
topace: but i figured it was the same IP
topace: if the IP changed, then i need to modify firewall
kakobrekla: its the same ip
moiety: assbot has diarrhoea?
kakobrekla: lets take this to private
BingoBoingo: !t m MNKY
assbot: It says some pelt-wearin' trapper, some stinkin' bean-suckin' possum skinner, he's gonna collect that reward money.
moiety: lolol
topace: !ticker h rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00600000 / 0.00665087 / 0.00735000 (1380 shares, 9.17820480 BTC), 7D: 0.00521010 / 0.00581253 / 0.00735000 (5100 shares, 29.64390553 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.00559595 / 0.00900001 (48904 shares, 273.66417474 BTC)
kakobrekla: dafuk
moiety: ;; later tell mircea_popescu a turtle surfing seal pup?! lolol
gribble: The operation succeeded.
kakobrekla: !t h rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00600000 / 0.00665087 / 0.00735000 (1380 shares, 9.17820480 BTC), 7D: 0.00521010 / 0.00581253 / 0.00735000 (5100 shares, 29.64390553 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.00559595 / 0.00900001 (48904 shares, 273.66417474 BTC)
kakobrekla: what is this nao
kakobrekla: benkay you are broked
benkay: i r broked?
benkay: !t h rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00600000 / 0.00665087 / 0.00735000 (1380 shares, 9.17820480 BTC), 7D: 0.00521010 / 0.00581253 / 0.00735000 (5100 shares, 29.64390553 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.00559595 / 0.00900001 (48904 shares, 273.66417474 BTC)
kakobrekla: anyway, where were we
kakobrekla: wheelbarrows!
BingoBoingo: !t h COG
assbot: [HAVELOCK:COG] 1D: / 0 / (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: / 0 / (0 shares, 0 BTC), 30D: 0.00200000 / 0.03427132 / 0.08349952 (1224 shares, 41.94809170 BTC)
benkay: !l h rent
assbot: Last trade for RENT on HAVELOCK was at 0.007215 BTC [-]
mike_c: holee shit. michael abrash is joining carmack at oculus. amazing.
mike_c: indeed assbot.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.055 = 0.11 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: which one is michael abrash
mircea_popescu: noob moiety sending later tits to present people.
moiety: i didnt know you were here
moiety: i need to read all ze log before responding
mircea_popescu: all zeee logs!
benkay: vile hdr
mircea_popescu: nice feet tho.
tg2: that's how you get ants
moiety: not so keen on that one iono why
joecool: hdr, throwin up rainbows now, thx
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo o hey, wd.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Thanks
BingoBoingo: Everyone is free to guess at the identity of the generous soul
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1333 @ 0.00011999 = 0.1599 BTC [+]
moiety: ace stuff BingoBoingo :D
moiety: ok! ok! jeez stop hounding me folks: MOTD
mike_c: mircea_popescu: carmack and abrash were the talent & brains behind id software (doom,quake)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 407 @ 0.00211306 = 0.86 BTC [-] {7}
ozbot: UNDERVIEW: Photo
tg2: this is a nice curated collection
tg2: storage:/storage 307T 252T 56T 82% /storage
tg2: fk gotta add more space
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 626 @ 0.00200994 = 1.2582 BTC [-] {10}
tg2: my porn collection knows no bounds
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.58127506 = 2.3251 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.58100002 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20850 @ 0.00094073 = 19.6142 BTC [+]
KRS-One: heh
KRS-One: .bait
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.07259996 = 0.2178 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 66 @ 0.00199999 = 0.132 BTC [+]
tg2: ;;ident
gribble: Nick 'tg2', with hostmask 'tg2!~tg2@', is identified as user 'tg2', with GPG key id 31FAA963C3333333, key fingerprint BFB291FE6B88A151B3BD2F9C31FAA963C3333333, and bitcoin address None
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 300 @ 0.00195015 = 0.585 BTC [-] {5}
tg2: .bait
tg2: ozbot help
ozbot: All commands can be processed in channel or in PM
ozbot: Commands: .bait .count .diff .earn .exchange .nethash .rates .lcrates .tslb
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14900 @ 0.00094081 = 14.0181 BTC [+] {2}
tg2: possible to populate bait?
BingoBoingo: tg2: Post to tumbler?
tg2: tags?
mike_c: michael lewis' new book is about hft traders. should be interesting. (lewis=liar's poker, moneyball, the big short)
mircea_popescu: mike_c who was the guy with the katana ?
BingoBoingo: Richard Stallman?
mike_c: don't know, don't think it was lewis
mircea_popescu: nono, worked with those two, ended up making a game company which burned through 10mn of 1990s dollars to make some katana game
mircea_popescu: which never got made. largest vaporware story in gaming.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 19 @ 0.58100001 = 11.039 BTC [-] {2}
benkay: stephenson
mircea_popescu: Daikatana!
mircea_popescu: John Romero
mike_c: vaporware video game must be duke nukem
mircea_popescu: he was the third man at id, but apparently got erased.
benkay: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 497.12, Best ask: 497.6, Bid-ask spread: 0.48000, Last trade: 497.12, 24 hour volume: 42616.48906348, 24 hour low: 466.1, 24 hour high: 532.0, 24 hour vwap: 501.447744429
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.58083333 = 3.485 BTC [-] {2}
tg2: "Flash Boys" is the name of the book
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.58 = 2.9 BTC [-]
tg2: I just want to read some shit about through-earth data transmission
tg2: and i'm sure HFT will be the first place it shows up lol
mike_c: BingoBoingo: it was kako.
mike_c: easy blockchain sniffing.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.10144642 BTC [-]
mike_c: not like the other day when you posted that md4 challenge and i almost fried my graphics card trying to crack it.
tg2: fucking ebay - i searched for lipo batteries ONCE, literally 1 session in the last year
tg2: my hompage is now full of rc cars
tg2: order $100k of surplus servers
tg2: not even 1 server on there
tg2: solid graph ebay
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.10144642 BTC [-]
the20year2: Sweet, .008
mike_c: now the ipo is underpriced!
mike_c: "i"po
the20year2: crap, i was wrong, it was displaying asks, granted there's only about 25 shares between .0075 and .008
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10572 @ 0.00094335 = 9.9731 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 250 @ 0.00193468 = 0.4837 BTC [-] {7}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1000 @ 0.00187956 = 1.8796 BTC [-] {12}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.59490453 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42386 @ 0.00094661 = 40.123 BTC [+] {4}
ozbot: bramcohen: Freenode sucks
mircea_popescu: lulzy butthurt
benkay: how ams even identity
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.055 = 0.11 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 115 @ 0.00739164 = 0.85 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: and since we're on it,
ozbot: Freenode - Encyclopedia Dramatica
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.055 = 0.11 BTC [+]
pLambert: what's going on with NEOBEE, why are they stopped trading?
mircea_popescu: it ticked a minunte ago, what stopped ?
mircea_popescu: well they didn't announce it or anything.
pLambert: I think that is their method of announcement?
mircea_popescu: possibly butthurt over having shed 50% over a week and well... yet another one of those great "half your money in half a year" glbse-style things.
mircea_popescu: pLambert i guess it must be.
pLambert: is ThickAsTheives still the pass-through manager for this one?
mircea_popescu: pt from where to where ?
pLambert: from direct shares to Havelock
pLambert: "Havelock Investments has been formally informed by the Pass-Through Fund Manager" <-- that guy
pankkake: yes, he is
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves you actually managing neobee on hl ?
ozbot: vulnerability
mircea_popescu: funny when the first time some webservice is taken seriously by someone
mircea_popescu: is simply to describe how pointless and broken it is
mike_c: i get cloudflare errors 75% of the time i try to go to havelock.
tg2: who's sysadmining over there?
pankkake: such protection
tg2: L2webscale
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25162 @ 0.00094806 = 23.8551 BTC [+] {2}
tg2: re: rent -> The median purchase price for one single-family freestanding residential home in our areas of business stands at approximately $37,500.
tg2: > The majority of these kinds of homes will rent for $700 per month
ThickAsThieves: I am no longer involved with LMB/Neo
tg2: right
mircea_popescu: benkay check it out, @benkay is nao more famous than you are
ThickAsThieves: You'll need to contact Neo/LMB or Danny for any other info
benkay: wasn't via me, tho mircea_popescu, was it?
pLambert: then who is the Pass Through Fund Manager now?
ThickAsThieves: LMB would be the only party with power over it
mircea_popescu: no, it was via stan.
pLambert: is it really a pass-through if the company is running it themself?
benkay: also twitter fame?
benkay: i think that i'll pass.
benkay: i'm not out of retirement yet, free to troll silicon valley all day.
benkay: shit i ain't even sufficiently well capitalized to go *into* retirement yet!
ThickAsThieves: the offering was always under the control of Neo, any role I was a part of was as an independent contractor
ThickAsThieves: sorry LMB, not Neo, technically
benkay: although Survant James hit a milestone recently - we now have eight full months of runway in the bank at current rates.
tg2: was anyone notable using zorro aes anywya lol
benkay: *fist pump after fist pump after fist pump*
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
benkay: lol "much as goat is not related to pirate"
tg2: fk a guy I fired is making 170k/yr at amazon now :'9
tg2: how is this even possible
tg2: silicon valley, pls
benkay: tg2: aws only hires the fired
benkay: nobody else is taking those jaeorbs
mircea_popescu: benkay i still don't get what the relation is supposed to have been. just that the guy can't stfu ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.57000003 = 2.28 BTC [-] {3}
benkay: was goat not a pirate pass through operator?
mircea_popescu: no, goat part is clear. tat/neobee part
pLambert: yes, he was the biggest
benkay: goat me
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 10 @ 0.07803404 = 0.7803 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 50 @ 0.00404004 = 0.202 BTC [-] {3}
benkay: was not tat originally affiliated with n/b?
mircea_popescu: well that's what im looking for.
benkay: you're the one with researchers on staff.
tg2: FOLLOWERS: 14
tg2: quality over quantity I suppose
pLambert: was neobee using TAT as a way to get into the community? I feel like there were scammers that did something similar before?
ThickAsThieves: benkay it would depend on your definition of affliated
Apocalyptic: benkay, what's your relation to the paper ?
benkay: B=====D
benkay: ^^ staff
mircea_popescu: benkay actually that log link is quite epic.
mircea_popescu: it's all coming back to me.
mircea_popescu: "Feb 24 21:08:44 <mircea_popescu>what's going on in your head ? "
BingoBoingo: benkay: Is that php?
ThickAsThieves: pLambert I'm not clear to line of your questioning as it seems somewhat speculative, but as I mentioned, the relationship from the start was a contractual one between separate parties
mircea_popescu: so actually tat had some sort of ipo-coupon asset (xbond) which ipo-couponed neo, and then he was running the neobee hl asset.
bounce: no, the more advanced facebook "hack" variety
mircea_popescu: so now ThickAsThieves when exactly did you stop running it ?
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
benkay: ThickAsThieves:i have a contract with Neo
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4000 @ 0.00094822 = 3.7929 BTC [+]
benkay: BingoBoingo: phpenis
BingoBoingo: ThickAsThieves: You ever start that blag
ThickAsThieves: mp, I think all I can really say at this time is that you'd need to contact LMB for more info.
mircea_popescu: no, im contacting you for more info.
benkay: see that's the kinda thing that tars you with the LMB brush, ThickAsThieves
mircea_popescu: so, you were running an asset. why aren;'t you announcing it stopped trading, if it did
mircea_popescu: and why arent you announcing you're no longer running it and who is now running it, if you aren't.
mircea_popescu: what the hell is this, havelockism ?!
pLambert: TAT, when did you stop running the pass-through?
ozbot: Park Slope Kids Salon: Stop Calling Your Wifi "LuLu's Anal Bleaching"
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: possibilities for beautiful names are limitless. 'NSAPenalBattalion'.
asciilifeform: ('NSAShtrafbat' for the culturally literate)
BingoBoingo: I remember flipping my Wifi'sname back and forth between Skynet and John Conner for some time
benkay: mine is surveillancevan97***
mircea_popescu: NSAnalButtLion
mike_c: hm. Neobee halts trading, TaT is running from it.. guess this is one is diving into the dead pool.
pankkake: cease to be traded… temporarily?
mike_c: i don't think temporarily counts, but it sounds like it will be permanent soon to me.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8789 @ 0.00094836 = 8.3351 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: not looking terribly good.
benkay: let the mods figure it out.
mircea_popescu: how the fuck some "company" slash "ceo" that can spend enough to mediabuy a small mediteranean island can't get their corp comms in working order is beyond comprehension.
mircea_popescu: only in bitcoin
mircea_popescu: somehow nobody goes to conferences tro say "hay! we're so fucking retarded, you wouldn't believe!"
pLambert: yeah, looks like the bet should resolve to "Yes" even for a temporary halt of trading?
mike_c: i don't think that's the spirit of the bet, but i don't think it matters.
benkay: if there were actual btc on the line, the mod who approved it might get a caning
BingoBoingo: ;;tslb
gribble: Time since last block: 7 minutes and 44 seconds
pLambert: And Herp sees the trade stopping as a good thing: "This was probably a good move due to all the manipulation. Spamtroll manipulators had a field day recently while Neo was busy elsewhere."
pankkake: yeah that made me WTF too
mircea_popescu: busy... elsewhere ?
pLambert: wait, we are the same person, pankkake, right? Why am I talking to myself?
mircea_popescu: kids wanna accounting-fraud their own books (which they don't keep anyway) and woe unto anyone getting in their way.
pankkake: :). the actual crumbs is talking to itself on the forums quite often
BingoBoingo: As the asshole who wrote that BitBet my though was havecocks not lasting through the end of the year
benkay: they're under no real pressure
benkay: they skim off trades, and delist when things start looking shady
ThickAsThieves: In case any of you missed it, Havelock has shared that "the compliance officer of Neo and Bee Ltd has stated that due to an increase of abnormal activity on the LMB share platform, there may be a high possibility of questionable trading activity. While Neo and Bee Ltd investigate the issue further they have strongly recommended that we halt trading and transfers."
neilol: ^^ it's inconclusive
neilol: and to anyone saying TAT is running from this... he stepped down weeks ago
benkay: ;;gettrust neilol
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user benkay to user neilol: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: | WoT data: | Rated since: never
benkay: and who are you, neilol ?
mircea_popescu: wait what ?!
ThickAsThieves: neilol, please don't speak for me
mircea_popescu: benkay has it basically. skim while fools flock, delist once it goes to shit, the glbse v2.0
mircea_popescu: higher admin effort.
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
ThickAsThieves: i appreciate the effort, but you do not have facts
velacreations: when did TAT step down and why wasn't shareholders notified?
psterryl: could it be that btcapples guy who did tons of off-market trades between LMB and Havelock?
benkay: velacreations: see the link of mike_c 's
mircea_popescu: mike_c that's the asicminer stuff neh ?
mike_c: 23:39:35ThickAsThieves:NEOBEE is not changing operators.
HeySteve: hey velacreations, enjoyed your aquaponics work
Diablo-D3: velacreations: awhile back, and they were.
jurov: velacreations: paranormal activity
jurov: TaT was snatched by aliens
mircea_popescu: so wait... neobee asked havelock to halt trading because *neobee* suspects there's insider trading going on ?
pankkake: Diablo-D3: you must be confusing with AsicMiner
jurov: and subjected to hyperadvanced rectothermal technology
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8500 @ 0.00094743 = 8.0532 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 500 @ 0.00560863 = 2.8043 BTC [-] {10}
velacreations: they were, funny, I am not seeing anything pertaining to NEOBEE in that link
mircea_popescu: basically what happened here, the cfo ran off with a block of shares ?
Diablo-D3: pankkake: might be?
neilol: Jesus - sorry, not speaking for you TAT, didn't realize it was actually a sensitive issue
velacreations: that is AM, and TAT clearly says NEOBEE isn't affected
neilol: just a few uninformed not paying attention
mircea_popescu: neilol who are ye ?
neilol: depends on what you mean
neilol: no one by most accounts
neilol: probably
ThickAsThieves: the contract with LMB and our services was officially terminated today, initiated by me
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.07298718 = 0.5109 BTC [+] {3}
mike_c: so you are the one who ran away with shares?? (j/k)
Duffer1: every ending, new beginning etc..
neilol: oh internets
mircea_popescu: yes well as general practice, the underwriter of a stock can't just quit, they have to leave the stock to be shepherded by someone else.
psterryl: has there been a hack as some people are suggesting?
mircea_popescu: i suppose in this case, since it's stopped trading anyway it's kind-of moot.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11128 @ 0.00094836 = 10.5534 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.07299692 = 0.438 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 4 @ 0.07805001 = 0.3122 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: mp, the current manager would now be LMB
velacreations: exactly, MP, how does a fund manager just "quit" without notifying the fund?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.07045014 = 0.7045 BTC [-] {4}
mircea_popescu: velacreations well, apparently he just has notified it.
ThickAsThieves: the PT was always run under the authorization of LMB
velacreations: mp, what I mean is that he has (in the past) given advanced notice, and it was sent on official channels, like the exchange, company website, fund thread, etc
Diablo-D3: Hrm.
Diablo-D3: Hey guys.
benkay: ThickAsThieves: would you clearsign and pastebin something to the effect of "I am no longer affiliated with Neobee, your next point of contact is thus and such."?
Diablo-D3: I want you to prove I should accept Bitcoin for my business.
benkay: you shouldn't.
ThickAsThieves: benkay, is that not evident otherwise?
benkay: it'd be a nice precedent.
jurov: ^ tat, i agree
benkay: i could put it on my blog
ThickAsThieves: no problem
Diablo-D3: think if I start a forum thread, in dollars
benkay: thanks, man.
Diablo-D3: with a coupon code thats like
Diablo-D3: "votebitcoin"
Diablo-D3: and say there has to be 25 uses of the code
Diablo-D3: before Ill accept bitcoin
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves can't hurt anything
Diablo-D3: people would do it?
mircea_popescu: ;;ident ThickAsThieves
gribble: Nick 'ThickAsThieves', with hostmask 'ThickAsThieves!~ThickAsTh@unaffiliated/thickasthieves', is not identified.
jurov: Diablo-D3: what's ur bsnss? hosting?
Diablo-D3: jurov:
ThickAsThieves: gimme a few mins to auth and sign message
ljack: hello all
benkay: thanks, TAT
mircea_popescu: velacreations this chan is the gazette of record of all bitcoin asset matters, but that aside i agree it's not convenient for various investors etc to not get info in whatever channels and forms they prefer.
jurov: Diablo-D3: US only?
velacreations: mp, it's not convenient when "official news" has traditionally been given through other means
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 45 @ 0.005602 = 0.2521 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: i see it.
ljack: I hate that I missed your announcement TAT, is there any chance you will be posting it in a public place besides here?
Diablo-D3: jurov: only Dallas location atm.
benkay: ljack: i'll host it too.
BingoBoingo: Oh, the whole forum is showing up
ljack: lol, i never use irc. until today.
benkay: welcome ljack this is where the biz actually transpires.
ljack: i see now; ill know better in the future
ThickAsThieves: no one "missed" any announcement, so far as the asset was halted beforehand anyway
ThickAsThieves: i'm bcverified now btw
ThickAsThieves: feel free to check
benkay: ;;ident ThickAsThieves
gribble: Nick 'ThickAsThieves', with hostmask 'ThickAsThieves!~ThickAsTh@unaffiliated/thickasthieves', is identified as user 'ThickAsThieves', with GPG key id B28732FE807495EC, key fingerprint D649FD3B664A6BCF801D727EB28732FE807495EC, and bitcoin address 1NfXM69erAWPDdNrZ2k2UkuV7HDPc6Ebwk
ThickAsThieves: my gpg is tied to the same
ljack: wasnt trying to insult; just read on the forums that you were no longer involved, was seeking clarification
benkay: would you clearsign a statement that I can host please, ThickAsThieves ?
ThickAsThieves: please clarify "clearsign:
benkay: gpg clearsign
ljack: I purchased some of the btcapples shares, concerned about the authenticity of them
benkay: or bitcoin sign a message
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.5705 = 1.141 BTC [+] {2}
benkay: sorta the same thing (sorta)
jurov: the text would be "I was notified of paranormal activity and decided to blabla"
benkay: paranormlol
velacreations: of course the whole forum is here, they want to hear the news
ljack: I dont mind them freezing it; just want to know I didnt get burned. Guys claims they are legit though
neoncillo: aliens always ruining nice things, first egiptians, then mayans, now neobee
ljack: GreenBits from the forums btw
mircea_popescu: benkay you can host what ?!
benkay: text.
mircea_popescu: you mean the chan log ?!
artifexd: While I expect that TAT will only issue an "I am no longer affiliated" type statement, adding a reason why would be nice.
benkay: are you not reading logs today mircea_popescu ?
mircea_popescu: artifexd i sort-of suspect he'd have said it by now if he perceived he could.
mircea_popescu: benkay i am! what!
artifexd: Hence my expectation
benkay: i want a gpg signed thing!
neoncillo: artifexd, +1
benkay: logs are insufficient.
jurov: that's why the paranormal suggestion
ljack: Yeah, I dont expect to hear the whole of it
asciilifeform: as someone quite far from all of this, i still find it interesting just how much of the '2011 bitcoin' world is still chugging along.
mircea_popescu: benkay no i get that part, but once he signs a gpg statement what do you need permission to host it for ?
asciilifeform: does the chumpatronium never run out?
benkay: i don't need permission to host it
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform stuff is hard.
benkay: i'm asking for a thing that stands on its own.
asciilifeform: how hard is it to simply sit on coin?
mircea_popescu: "<benkay> would you clearsign a statement that I can host please" read to me that you want him to permit you to host it in writing lol.
mircea_popescu: i see what you actually meant nao
benkay: bah no sir
mike_c: asciilifeform: facebook has over 1 billion users. chumpatron will never run out of fuel.
mircea_popescu: seemed so fucking weird lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23240 @ 0.00094932 = 22.0622 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform question of mothers towards their young sons that got a girl pregnant, since forever :
mircea_popescu: "how hard is it to just sit on that cock!!1"
chatquack stumbles in
ThickAsThieves: Address: 1NfXM69erAWPDdNrZ2k2UkuV7HDPc6Ebwk
assbot: Last 4 lines bashed and pending review. (
jurov: !b 4
mircea_popescu: daugthers, idem
assbot: Last 8 lines bashed and pending review. (
mike_c: !b 8
ThickAsThieves: Message:
benkay: ThickAsThieves: pastebin?
jurov: TaT wants to get bashed :D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 421 @ 0.00047331 = 0.1993 BTC [+] {9}
asciilifeform: phacebook luserbase might pay with anal virginity, but at least they're not spending actual money
mircea_popescu: seems a dubious consolation.
neoncillo: bitcoin/actual money, pick one
asciilifeform: i'm just trying to wrap my puny brain around the conundrum of why 'havelock' etc. still exist
benkay: a little anal always consoles me.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's easy.
mircea_popescu: you know, like coloring books, nobody says they shouldn't exist, just, they should exist in a much more fucking responseible fashion
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 610 @ 0.00095634 = 0.5834 BTC [+]
benkay: thanks, ThickAsThieves
mike_c: well, one way it existed until now is TaT fronted five of the funds. now he's down to zero.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 36 @ 0.0075 = 0.27 BTC [+] {2}
frenchie: so you initiated the termination of your contract with neo for what reasons ?
mircea_popescu: mike_c which means some eager young fellow full of hope and good intentions is about to show up
asciilifeform: just feels like a mindfuck to wander into, e.g. leningrad hermitage and see... colouring books.
artifexd: ThickAsThieves Can you tell us when was the last time you had any direct communication with Danny?
ThickAsThieves: I last spoke with Danny on March 21, 2014
GreenBits: Im not too concerned this is a cut and run, too much capital invested at this point. But that is interesting TAT
mike_c: xapo will fix all these problems. they bury shit in a mountain.
kanzure: even if everyting is okay it is probably a good idea to terminate
kanzure: because communication channels can be compromised
asciilifeform: do they also bury the user in the mountain?
asciilifeform: you know, the fellow with the password
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform mostly, their head.
mircea_popescu: it's just big enough to fit in a mountain.
mike_c: no no ascii, they have "layer on layer" of security. it'll be fine.
mircea_popescu: mike_c aaa, but was it built from the ground up with a cock in mind ?
kanzure: ThickAsThieves: were the terms of your contract public?
mircea_popescu: wait no that's not how it went
asciilifeform: when do we get a mountain for burial of pgp keys?
benkay: it's called, asciilifeform .
GreenBits: May I ask if this lack of communication contributed to your decision?
benkay: js-secure!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform itd be a pretty korean thing to do, you know ? buy a mountain, sculpt the faces of great bitcoin jesuses all around, have a light at the top to represent satoshi...
ThickAsThieves: kanzure, no they were not
frenchie: TAT: can you disclose what motivated your decision to terminate the contract ?
kasa32: ThickAsThieves - what made you terminate the agreement since you spoke with Danny on 21st?
kasa32: you had no recent communication with him
mircea_popescu: frenchie kasa32 this is in the log.
kasa32: he didn't say
mike_c: he said he wouldn't say.
mircea_popescu: no, he didn't, but he was asked.
asciilifeform: re: the mountain: it would at least begin to make sense if the people involved provided an actual service - say, they hold keys and try to verify that you are the meatbag the key belonged to when you walk into an anal probe chamber
asciilifeform: but afaik this is not what is happening
mircea_popescu: "try to" is not an actual service
asciilifeform: well i said 'begin to' make sense, rather than 'makes sense'
mircea_popescu: hehe that you did
benkay: is NeoBee under the authority of Cypriot or EU banking regulators?
asciilifeform: the way that a child drawing a stick figure in mud 'begins to make sense', but a drunken hippie taking a shit onto a canvas doesn't
neoncillo: I think it's not since bitcoin is not money in the EU
mircea_popescu: benkay cyprus uses the euro. there's no such distinction really.
benkay: didn't think so. wiser heads, etc.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 18 @ 0.0074999 = 0.135 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 95 @ 0.00732663 = 0.696 BTC [-] {3}
jurov: benkay sure it is. they do work with euros
jurov: bitcoins are supposed to be mostly the backing
benkay: the scam contention being that there's no way they can actually resist a haircut.
ThickAsThieves: The basic reason is that, with my role being largely to facilitate transfers, I could not perform my contract without guarantee it would not make me party to the trading activity under investigation. As mentioned, Neo also recommended halting all such activity as well.
asciilifeform: how do the mountain people decide whom to disgorge a key to?
mircea_popescu: that's the problem, they can't really.
dexX7: investigation - what timespan?
asciilifeform: maybe i'm thick, but it seems to reduce to a poor version of 'brainwallet' but with a 'priest'
mike_c: it's a sequence of steps. layers.
mike_c: "we’ll use multiple security layers to verify that you have authorized the request. This will initiate a sequence of secure steps to get your requested bitcoins transferred to your wallet within 24 hours."
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you know, just like true love reduces to you waiting ouside the door while they do it.
ThickAsThieves: dexX7 I do not understand your question, but it's unlikely I have any timelines to offer at this time
mircea_popescu: lol@forum doing irc liveblogging
mircea_popescu: must suck to be stuck on the shittier platform, eh ?
mircea_popescu: such web. much 2.0.
jurov: asciilifeform maybe there's nice little sauna near the summit
asciilifeform: how does mountain corp. decide which 'you' is you ?
jurov: designated secure
kanzure: you're saying i should be grateful for irc? that's a funny one
deadweasel: are you not?
kanzure: i'll answer as soon as i'm done netsplitting
mircea_popescu: let's not be splitting the nets.
frenchie: thanks TAT, what's your best guess at what's happening ?
ThickAsThieves: frenchie, ask LMB/Neo
mircea_popescu: who was it that said she had called but then nobody picked up ?
frenchie: well that would be too easy
mircea_popescu: o the reuters gal.
velacreations: @ThickAsThieves how long have you known about the suspicious trading issues?
mircea_popescu: velacreations irc highlights people when you mention their name, no need for @s and stuff.
asciilifeform: the 'store btc as service' folks make my brain hurt. it's as if there were suddenly chains of mega-restaurants where they pre-chew food
asciilifeform: and everyone seems to be eager to visit
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22000 @ 0.00094902 = 20.8784 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: proposing that people who can't remember keys can function in civilization seems like an especially cruel lie
mircea_popescu: i can't remember my key, what are you on about. 4096 bits, srsly ?
mike_c: well, i think the service is more for those that can't secure their keys.
asciilifeform: not key per se
asciilifeform: but the key to the key
mircea_popescu: aha! BUT!
mircea_popescu: this already means you're using SOMETHING to remember your key, yes ?
asciilifeform: most people can remember enough key to make keeping some physical thing or other a reasonable proposition
asciilifeform: and, for things one can't remember (e.g. gold, disk of warez) one can remember a hiding place
asciilifeform: seems like a basic biological function
mircea_popescu: store btc as a service, if done right (like say used to do it) has its places. you go to trade some btc in ny central park, you take a blockchain url with you.
kasa32: <mircea_popescu> can you tell us more about the letter you received from US authorities?
kasa32: did they issue more veiled threats?
kasa32: since then
velacreations: mircea_popescu thanks, is there a way to reference their name just by clicking on it, or do I have to type it out every time?
asciilifeform: interestingly, it is quite feasible to memorize 4096 bits
mike_c: velacreations: tab-completion.
mircea_popescu: for instance right now to have it spit out velacreations i type out vel and hit tab
asciilifeform: just has to be done correctly
mircea_popescu: you need a client for it tho
asciilifeform: stage magicians do it all the time
asciilifeform: 'mnemonists'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i wouldn't want it in my memory anyway.
velacreations: thanks guys
asciilifeform: when i was a student, i tried to work out a way to crank reasonably-heavy rsa mentally.
asciilifeform: a la Trachtenberg's arithmetic
mircea_popescu: i wonder if there actually exists an irc client w/o autocompletion
asciilifeform: (trachtenberg was a mathematically-inclined fellow who ended up in auschwitz)
tg2: Pi to 1k only takes a few days
kasa32: <mircea_popescu> are you afraid about US taking legal action? can they bring you to US to testify?
asciilifeform: 'how i need a drink, alcoholic of course, after the heavy lectures involving quantum mechanics.'
tg2: and then repeat every 2x the previous time frame
asciilifeform: now everyone here will remember 15 digits, for life.
tg2: Sec can't do much out of the us
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.07005 = 0.2802 BTC [-] {3}
kanzure: asciilifeform: yes i'm sure there's someone, somewhere, doing rsa in head
ozbot: Havelock Freezes NEOBEE Trading, ThickAsThieves Steps Down as Fund Manager
bounce basically never uses autocompletion. currently maybe not even bound to a key.
benkay goes back to building docker images
asciilifeform: mental rsa would be the ultimate in authentication.
asciilifeform: even if not for encipherment
mircea_popescu: kasa32 these are civil proceedings.
tg2: Well, as long as babikian is still hanging out without reprimand
benkay: jurov: a link to my post there would be neat
kanzure: benkay: do you use plover to build docker stuff
tg2: After frauding billions in penny stocks
benkay: ;;google plover docker
tg2: I wouldn't be worried about SEC asking for info
gribble: Kohl's Plover, WI, 54467 - <>; Kohl's Department Store - Plover WI 54467 | 715-344-0480 | Bed ...: <>; - PyCon US 2013: <>
bounce: rsa gets impractical quickly on paper, much less mentally. might look into that crypto by pack of cards thing though.
mircea_popescu: benkay if they're not dockers, they're just pants.
kanzure: benkay: plover is like veewee except less awful
kanzure: benkay: the box builder automation stuff
benkay: kanzure: link me?
asciilifeform: bounce: you'd want something like 'napier's bones'
kanzure: bounce: do you have a link for that?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20172 @ 0.00095324 = 19.2288 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: kanzure you the comedy central guy ?
benkay: kanzure: packer you mean
bounce: I'd have to dig
kanzure: mircea_popescu: huh? probably not. i don't know who you are referring to.
mircea_popescu: a bryan bishop fellow.
kanzure: benkay: that link is a good one for explaining it
asciilifeform: wait, bishop?
kanzure: mircea_popescu: interesting. there's a few people showing up with my name. i want them gone.
kanzure: mircea_popescu: there's also this person from theverge with my name.. sigh.
asciilifeform: kanzure: i think you used to work with a chum of mine from uni
mircea_popescu: well iirc this guy had some sort of cancer, so you might get your wish
benkay: kanzure: nope. clients don't need all that.
bounce: breaking mirrors is bad luck, don't you know
asciilifeform: kanzure: mike w.
kanzure: asciilifeform: nice, wittig?
mircea_popescu: "come to -assets. only a coupla hundred people here, but you probably have friends in common"
kanzure: asciilifeform: that was a long time ago
kanzure: asciilifeform: 2008
kanzure: asciilifeform: and they didn't put me on the paper anyway
asciilifeform: kanzure: chemical modelling?
bounce: oh right, "solitaire (cipher)", bruce schneier vehicle for the cryptonomicon
kanzure: asciilifeform: dna logic gate stuff
asciilifeform: kanzure: you still in that business?
kanzure: asciilifeform: i moved into non-academic garage biology stuff
asciilifeform: good move
mircea_popescu: gotta save that one for when anyone asks what's in my fridge.
kanzure: see ##hplusroadmap
asciilifeform: kanzure: neato. once worked with the 'abi 394' pictured on the 8th slide.
ozbot: Zurich 2016: First "Cybathlon" is fine with "technology doping" | Ars Technica
kanzure: asciilifeform: terrible piles of crap, aren't they?
kanzure: there's no good reason these machines should cost so much
asciilifeform: the plexiglass one - how are you pumping? SAW resonator?
kanzure: if machine price goes down then synthesis costs can be tweaked
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11400 @ 0.0009549 = 10.8859 BTC [+]
kanzure: well that was an old presentation
kanzure: i've since determined that microfluidics is not the best way for now
kanzure: ideally you should limit the number of stupid-hard problems you are solving simultaneously..
asciilifeform: how is microfluidics a hard problem?
kanzure: well to do dna synthesis on the scale that i want it, you need hundreds or thousands of microfluidic gates
kanzure: and then you need to bother with photolithography and all sorts of other issues
kasa32: <mircea_popescu> US has authority to arrest you and bring you to the US. They have done this before. Just check Liberty Reserve incident
asciilifeform: slide deck must be ancient. co2 laser for 10,000 ?
kanzure: hah
kasa32: <mircea_popescu> you may want to prepare yourself for that scenario
kanzure: that might have been for a new laser
asciilifeform: it's ~1k today
kanzure: it's entirely possible that i suck at sourcing
asciilifeform: the only way to get good at sourcing is to pay with one's lunch money
asciilifeform: teaches quickly.
kanzure: sure. yeah i'm done with grants/whatever. just use my own bucks.
kanzure: not worth my time
asciilifeform: much easier, but very similar problem - home ic fab
asciilifeform: i intend to get there. one day.
kanzure: right.. so some friends and i were putting together an idea for using lasers to build microfluidic chips.
ozbot: laser etcher
asciilifeform: 40w tube readily cuts glass
asciilifeform: cut channels, then fuse
kanzure: need about 10-50 micron channel widths
asciilifeform: not hard if you can get the beam sweet spot
kanzure: but again i think this approach is probably bad; why not just build a bigger version like the traditional machines
kanzure: and once it's working, start ripping away and downsizing
kanzure: there was this oligo arrayer open source project that did it for ~$20k
ozbot: The POSAM Inkjet Microarrayer
asciilifeform: one of the reasons why the 'DIY' bio instrumentation stuff is obscure is that ebay exists
asciilifeform: and very serviceable surplus tech can be had by anyone
asciilifeform: for pennies on the dollar
asciilifeform: it is interesting to see the 'market' price of various things vs. the 'we buy it with u.s. tax dollars' price
kanzure: last i looked the synthesizers bottom out on ebay at $400-$700 "maybe working"
asciilifeform: much easier to fix a dead merrifield or whatnot than build all of civilization from raw materials
kanzure: and ~$2k for "probably working" and $50k for "sorta new, or exactly new, except we know that nobody is building this crap anymore so we're not going to lie to you"
asciilifeform: granted, 'fix' sometimes involves tearing out the electronics
kanzure: do you know of any synthesizer manufacturers that still exist? i'm aware of the refurb shops
kanzure: ABI etc got swallowed up and cancelled their manufacturing
asciilifeform: i've been out of the business for some years, unfortunately.
kanzure: nah it's good to get out of that uh.. industry.
mircea_popescu: kasa32 you must have missed the part where i told you this is a civil matter.
Jezzz: .r
ozbot: Bitstamp | Buy: $500.00
ozbot: Coinbase | Buy: $503.41
kanzure: asciilifeform: so if you know mike then how do you know me
mircea_popescu: kanzure so what are you actually trying to make ?
asciilifeform: kanzure: he introduced me to some of your works.
asciilifeform: long ago.
kanzure: asciilifeform: what is he doing?
kanzure: mircea_popescu: trouble? mostly software at the moment
asciilifeform: kanzure: last i spoke with him, he burned out and became a programmer!
kanzure: oh good, yeah he was okay at that
asciilifeform: doing some sort of dreary web crap
asciilifeform: to eat.
kasa32: <mircea_popescu> civil matter? Kim Dotcom was civil matter also and US managed to get him arrested so...
mircea_popescu: kanzure no no, with the 10micron channels and other stupid hard problems
kanzure: mircea_popescu: i had a colleague on that project and he's still convinced that microfluidics is the way to go, so he's still working on that in portland
benkay: is he involved in the low-g stuff as well?
asciilifeform: kanzure: ever work with 'tecan corp.' xyz robot?
mircea_popescu: kasa32 you have many distinct categories all confused up here.
kanzure: asciilifeform: i've poked at tecan things. in particular i was playing with jcline's perl library for tecan control.
mircea_popescu: kanzure ok, but the way to go WHERE
kanzure: benkay: not that i know of
kasa32: <mircea_popescu> you mean cos of megauploads a legal entity?
kanzure: mircea_popescu: dna synthesis
asciilifeform: kanzure: i actually spent 2 yrs. writing a total replacement for the idiot software stack those things came with.
mircea_popescu: kasa32 i mean because there's no such thing as an arrest in civil proceedings, and i never heard of an arrested witness yet and so on and so forth.
mircea_popescu: kanzure ok but to make what ?
kanzure: asciilifeform: to sell back to tecan?
tg2: mircea_popescu: what is mpex's SEC analogue
asciilifeform: kanzure: tried to! even landed a conference with them. guess how it went.
mircea_popescu: tg2 exact analogue does not exist.
kanzure: mircea_popescu: all sorts of things. it's a basic requirement for conducting almost any interesting molecular biology project ever.
asciilifeform: kanzure: 'what do you mean it doesn't run on top of our winblows stack'
bounce: nor should it, probably
mircea_popescu: kanzure which is why i am trying to get a specific out of you.
tg2: You should create mpsec
mircea_popescu: bounce i guess not.
tg2: And issue requests for information to the SEC
tg2: Lol
kasa32: <mircea_popescu> yes but if you are called as a witness in a trial, they might bring you there by force
kanzure: mircea_popescu: i don't have a specific project in mind, and if i did, i would just buy the dna from a synthesis company.
mircea_popescu: tg2 i'd rather build organically on proved-to-work infrastructure developed in small steps
mircea_popescu: than go all out with idiocy that'll never work a la us congress.
kasa32: to testify
bounce: they're chasing an idea of "fairness" that's a poor fit to fiat, possibly worse for bitcoin
asciilifeform: kanzure: it's still theoretically for sale. number of takers: zero.
kanzure: asciilifeform: well, you could always sell it to someone else i guess
kanzure: asciilifeform: or open source it
mircea_popescu: bounce i don't think that discussion is yet ripe. so far they've prosecuted one guy.
mircea_popescu: there's a thousand to go that i and anyone else with a shred of sanity left would readily agree are prosecutable
mircea_popescu: once done with that pile it may be sensible to examine wtf is what.
kanzure: asciilifeform: cool. let me bounce some ideas around in my head. i might be aware of some opportunities (nobody that would want to outright buy this, but.. stuff that is happening.)
asciilifeform: kanzure: what's interesting is that virtually everyone who owns one of those machines has a grad student wretch supervising it's stumblings in perso
bounce: possibly. there's also them being wilfully ignorant, even impotent, in eg. the flash crash thing
kanzure: asciilifeform: do you know the people?
mircea_popescu: bounce the curse of regulators, in all times and places, is that they can't afford to hire the sort of brainpower they need.
asciilifeform: kanzure: nope
mircea_popescu: which is why mpex is really such manna from heavens.
kasa32: <mircea_popescu> they can also charge you of conspiring to help US citizens avoid taxes and such and whatever charges or charge you with money laundry
kasa32: it's not like they haven't done this before
mircea_popescu: kasa32 are we trying to write a block buster movie script here ?
asciilifeform: amazing how $300K machine comes with visual basic turd that often physically destroys the enclosure when the thing boots (carriages get sent to the axis limits, because $300K apparently doesn't buy you limit switches...)
kasa32: I'm just saying you need to be careful and prepare yourself
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform just add a bit of plastic foam!!!
kasa32: it might happen
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform do you know the story of the irradiation accidents with medical equipment cause of this problem ?
mircea_popescu: (comp took out some plastic stoppers to save on costs)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'therac-25'
bounce: well, though this is a dangerous suggestion, might look at some sort of theoretical underpinning of why regulating, with what overarching goal if you will. I don't really see them do more than plug holes that may or may not exist
kasa32: take all precautions and such
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in our case it was a gurl holding a fist over 'big red button'
asciilifeform: rather than foam
mircea_popescu: kasa32 your sentiment is appreciated, but had you heard of me before last week ?
kanzure: asciilifeform: so did you reverse engineer the tecan protocol or did you just buy their sdk or what?
asciilifeform: reversed 100%.
bounce: though an environment where a lot of what's being done in fiat is flat out impossible is a good dampener already
asciilifeform: and all of the other instruments that were to be used with the damn thing
mircea_popescu: bounce a lot more thought will have to be poured into those things
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6932 @ 0.00095519 = 6.6214 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: idea was to get rid of the wretches hand-carrying samples to/from instruments
asciilifeform: because wtf is the point of a robot then
mircea_popescu: kanzure clearly stan has too much time on his hands.
bounce: by people with suitable detachment as ooposed to the usual driven to do good type
kanzure: you're talking to the guy who reverse engineered pokemon red and crystal
kanzure: so.. if anything, don't talk to me about time.
bounce: s/oop/opp/
mircea_popescu: bounce in general it's been my experiences that only committees that include at least one asshole yield anything usable.
asciilifeform: kanzure: in my spam flick, you can see the bugger stuff a plate in a non-bot-enabled plate reader
bounce: heh
kanzure: "oh a few hundred thousand lines of terrible, shitty z80 asm? why of course i'll reverse engineer that!"
benkay: without assholes on the committee, how can you even know the members are human?
bounce: you've been training for that, haven't you?
kanzure: without assholes, how would you know we're human?
benkay: no asshole, not human.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.055 = 0.11 BTC [+]
bounce: apropos therac-25, that was that thing that only pooped out cryptic numbers to be looked up into large books of errors?
mircea_popescu: "I was born like this, I had no choice. I was born with the gift of a golden voice"
asciilifeform: now i just reverse shit to eat.
mircea_popescu: bounce one of many but yes
asciilifeform: 'you are what you pretend to be, so be careful what you pretend to be.'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform if that worked bitcoin would be full of ceos, venture capitalists and other peaks of intellectual achievement.
kanzure: asciilifeform: every time venter announces another $40M genome i just laugh
bounce: in a way the habitually ignored overly verbose blatter found in intrusive popups on desktops today is the other extreme... with the same effect
kasa32: <mircea_popescu> I've seen some tweets about the letter you received
bounce: s/tt/th/
asciilifeform: funny how my father actually spent a good deal of life doing the same (reversing western consumer junk for the soviet market)
kanzure: asciilifeform: if i had to pay $40M for every completely custom genome, pfft
kanzure: asciilifeform: are you the p90 guy
andyfletcher: looks like the pdf was wrong in the SEC assertion that handing over the data wasn't against EU data protection regs. MEMO/13/923 and MEMO/14/60 which were approved by the EU Parliament on 2014/03/14 refer to 'all natural persons'. Not just EU citizens.
mircea_popescu: kasa32 yeah. well... i've been here preparing things for many years so far.
Apocalyptic: kanzure, heh, you remind me of a dude
bounce: kanzure, just buy some gm corn in the nearest supermarket
Apocalyptic: that RE some Wii games
kanzure: nope i haven't touched wii yet
asciilifeform: ;;google p90
gribble: FN P90 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>; Power 90 Workout—Power 90 Reviews—Get Fast Results with ...: <>; FNH USA - Distinct Advantage :: FN P90® Series: <>
kanzure: asciilifeform: private-eye wearable heads up something
ozbot: - delroth's website
mircea_popescu: andyfletcher you don't say.
asciilifeform: i have an ancient page about it, yes
kanzure: asciilifeform: oh, then mike told me about you
ozbot: Parallel Port Interface to the Private Eye P4 Head-Mounted Display
Apocalyptic: kanzure, how much time you spent on it ?
kanzure: Apocalyptic: wii? none whatsoever
stompysteve: whats going on with neobee i just got online
Apocalyptic: on the pokemon crystal
kanzure: Apocalyptic: way too much time man
mircea_popescu: they can't even comply with the actual fed regulations on document handling.
kanzure: Apocalyptic: pokemon red is "done"- it compiles without baserom.gbc
mircea_popescu: which... you know.
kanzure: asciilifeform: my roommate was building this,
asciilifeform: kanzure: we're still just as far from a 'human price' svga ocular as we were in 1990.
kanzure: asciilifeform: (this was a few years ago, so no glass comments etc)
Apocalyptic: <kanzure> Apocalyptic: way too much time man // i bet, was looking for something quantitative
asciilifeform: 'glass' is barely vga.
kanzure: Apocalyptic: at least 100 hours
Apocalyptic: that's not much
kanzure: i guess not, no
kanzure: but the upper bound is probably 2000
mircea_popescu: andyfletcher anyway, you should get a cookie for being the first commentator of the matter to have spotted it. somehow the press covered it extensively but failed to notice stuff like that.
mircea_popescu: perhaps because the press isn't very well equipped to report these days.
asciilifeform: the electromechanical piece of junk features in my link is, funnily, still far ahead of what you can buy now
asciilifeform: if you want an ocular for something other than viewing porn on airplanes
andyfletcher: /me is happy to wave a finger in the direction of the SEC and say "Not allowed"
asciilifeform: razor-sharp monochrome, with square pixels
mircea_popescu: who the fuck wants to view porn on airplanes. so you get yourself all good and ready and then what ? ask the stewardess to draw the curtain and the girls to drop the tops ?
asciilifeform: (the 'movie'-grade displays have staggered rgb, like the cheap camera viewfinders which... they are)
kanzure: mircea_popescu: it's the principle
jborkl: Neo bee halted for abnormal trading activity
joecool: old news
mircea_popescu: jborkl scroll up honey :p
mircea_popescu: kanzure what principle is that ?
jborkl: Ah
kanzure: personal computing?
mircea_popescu: i thought porn something.
kanzure: asciilifeform: maybe interesting to you
mike_c: asciilifeform: new oculus is 960x1080 per eye. that beats svga :)
asciilifeform: square pixel grid?
asciilifeform: because if not, go and try reading text
kanzure: oculus is the wrong form factor anyway
asciilifeform: back we go, to the days of microcomputing with tv sets
asciilifeform: and who wants to wear a helmet
mircea_popescu: weren't such bad days, those.
kanzure: asciilifeform: so why is everyone such a fuckup with making these?
ozbot: Chaos - Battle of the Wizards pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
asciilifeform: kanzure: lockheed corp. et al make fine ones. $50K+
asciilifeform: so, patent trolls.
mike_c: well, i assume not square pixels since there's a lens right in front of your eye.
decimation: That 'therac-25' incident is interesting, thanks for the tip. If you are making a 'firmware interlock' for a radiation machine, I would think you would at least make it in TTL or on an FPGA or something.
mircea_popescu: mike_c he knows what he's asking. you can't really read on the things
kanzure: asciilifeform: does yours still work?
asciilifeform: square in the sense of not being staggered rows (optimized for film)
asciilifeform: yes it works
kanzure: decimation: i think that was before fpgas were on the market
decimation: find, cpld
mircea_popescu: decimation or not take out the 0.01 cent plastic stoppers
decimation: I bet some mba management directed that
decimation: "how can we shape the bottom line today?"
mike_c: ah. don't know whether the rows are staggered. i didn't know there were displays like that.
asciilifeform: if there was any kind of demand for an svga ocular, the chinese would piss on the patents and we'd have them.
asciilifeform: naggum's binders.
ozbot: Re: creation of lisp machine/lispOS - Naggum cll archive
mike_c: who wants to read in VR anyway?
decimation: I find that 'modern' cameras with giant LCD's are universally worse than the old-fashioned viewfinders with baffles
mircea_popescu: for instance, i'd like a measurement overlay.
asciilifeform: but not 100M wankers.
asciilifeform: not yet.
mike_c: well, overlays would be more of a see-through augmentation thing, not a closed off VR experience, no?
mircea_popescu: decimation the insulting part is they're dropping the optical viewfinder ;/
asciilifeform: think of what a terrific waste a non-ocular display is, for a fellow working alone
mircea_popescu: mike_c maybe
asciilifeform: my lcds are soaking up ~200W
ozbot: : Photo
asciilifeform: all so i can have a few emacsen going
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform o, i got kw here.
mircea_popescu: fuck it. i'd use a megawatt. what's energy for ?
mike_c: this is bitcoin, we don't care about wasting electricity.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.57 = 1.14 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu and his room of Trinitrons
mircea_popescu: i save on heat!
asciilifeform: personally i'm less concerned with wattage than space
asciilifeform: living in a flat
mircea_popescu: so move out of the sticks.
mircea_popescu: do you know what 5k sq feet of floor space + garages cost in a SANE PART of the world ?
kanzure: no?
decimation: I think a competent driver with a good measurement overlay coupled with a radar/laser rangefinder would be more safe in a variety of conditions
asciilifeform: i can guess
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12500 @ 0.00095436 = 11.9295 BTC [-] {2}
decimation: especially if FLIR were available
mircea_popescu: about the same you pay for a speeding ticket.
kanzure: can you give me another analogy
mircea_popescu: decimation absolutely.
kanzure: i've never paid for a speeding ticket
mircea_popescu: good laser you can drive in fog.
decimation: that's clearly an application for high resolution optic viewers
mircea_popescu: kanzure stop sucking and go get a speeding ticket.
kanzure: mircea_popescu: yeah, i should
decimation: ideally you have car-mounted sensors without any blockage from the columns in the vehicle
mircea_popescu: decimation obviously, lasers in the lights.
mircea_popescu: actually... you don't really need oculars for this
mircea_popescu: you could make a decent window.
mircea_popescu: this i think is a start-up idea right here, sell window + sensor kids for the aftermarket.
pankkake: I want sensor kids
mircea_popescu: people would be all over your shit. 100mn of them too, because nothing gets a guy off quite like having the girl that's about to give him a blowjob think he's batman
kanzure: sensor kids
mircea_popescu: kits omg
decimation: I think the angle here is that the "my startup life" folks in california want to jump directly to full automation. Why not mine the more easily achievable sensor augmentation market?
mircea_popescu: decimation what do they know.
mircea_popescu: someone get elon musk in here lol.
benkay: subject of more easily achievable sensor markets, check out the new client
Musk: mircea_popescu, he's busy with exploding Tesla's
decimation: maybe we can wrap everyone in a titanium shell so they don't experience hardship in life
Musk: decimation, ah!
mircea_popescu: Musk well, imagine how cool it'd be if the front window'd show the explosion parameters in futura font
mircea_popescu: just as you're flying through teh clouds
mircea_popescu: what the... did i lose interwebs or did everyone somehow inexplicably shut up for two minutes
mircea_popescu: i'm calling 911.
decimation: reading reviews of people who work at SpaceX, it's obvious the business model is "milk underpaid labor from engineers who like "space" on facebook"
Musk: well the Neo fud seems over for now.. :3
mircea_popescu: decimation not a bad model.
mircea_popescu: dairy revolution ensured the supremacy of europe. milking is big, man.
Musk: Farmenomics ?
decimation: I think there was a discussion on this channel awhile back about the national security implications of cowgut in WWI Germany
mike_c: decimation: not necessarily a bad deal for the engineers. lot to be said for liking what you work on.
mircea_popescu: milking AND liking
decimation: I'm told that most cows line up to be milked
mircea_popescu: they do. mastitis is deadly.
mircea_popescu: and painful.
decimation: Perhaps this is also related to the "beetle man" attitude
mircea_popescu: o look at that. elon musk was not here.
mircea_popescu: i mean, not elon musk was here
ozbot: Would you send money or bitcoins to MtGox when it re-opens? (poll)
mircea_popescu: Question:Would you send money or bitcoins to MtGox when it re-opens? (Voting closed: March 27, 2014, 03:11:32 PM) Yes 34 (43%)
mircea_popescu: No 45 (57%)
mircea_popescu: Total Voters: 79
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ^ enjoy baby.
decimation: so are these the deer that walk up to the hunter and kneel down?
ozbot: Looking for investment of ~2500 BTC for music festival, return = ~150,000 BTC
mircea_popescu: decimation no, these are "the community". according to themselves.
ThickAsThieves: what is it with people trying to connect all things they dont like to MPEx?
pankkake: "p.s: notice name of the seller "btcapples". A notorious spammer troll connected to Mpex. "
pankkake: that guy…
copumpkin: 150k btc return sounds like a good deal!
ThickAsThieves: i beat you!
copumpkin: ozbot: sign me up!
copumpkin: then I can finally be richer than mircea_popescu
copumpkin: it's always been a goal of mine
decimation: apparently there is sufficient fuel remaining to re-open the gox chumpatron
mircea_popescu: btcapples ?! who's that ?
mircea_popescu: between crumbs, btcapples and a pankkake we can make OUR OWN PIES
ThickAsThieves: btcapples seems to be the only guy to ever conduct a forum-based sale of NEOBEE shares through the LMB platform
mircea_popescu: copumpkin well if you organise a btc festival that nets 150k coins you'll definitely end up with more stds than i ever had.
mircea_popescu: "Also, he tried to sell these(whoevers') shares under false pretense. I believe it was financial hardship?"
mircea_popescu: was it actually not his shares ?
ThickAsThieves: i dont know whether he's one of the people suspected
ThickAsThieves: but he's got my attention now
copumpkin: okay, can someone pump up S.MPOE to 1 btc each?
copumpkin: thanks
mircea_popescu: "People think that anything goes on the internet, but if Neobee was a legit stock under the jurisdiction of the SEC, all the FUD spreaders on the internet would be locked up VERY QUICKLY for the crap they have been pulling recently."
benkay: !t m s.mpoe
assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00092844 / 0.00093843 / 0.00095634 (1640418 shares, 1,539.42 BTC), 7D: 0.00092844 / 0.00094382 / 0.00095875 (6432706 shares, 6,071.32 BTC), 30D: 0.000745 / 0.0008648 / 0.00096 (31129876 shares, 26,921.16 BTC)
pankkake: the amount of shares was pretty small… no one should care really
ThickAsThieves: that poster has never seen pinksheet forums
benkay: Phildo lol great name
mircea_popescu: sec definitely spends its time reading yahoo finance boards o.I
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.57 = 1.71 BTC [-]
benkay: ;;google jonathan lebed
gribble: Jonathan Lebed - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>; |: <>; Pump And Dump - CBS News: <>
mircea_popescu: so basically the shill brigade is arguing this theory whereby indefinite suspensions are a good thing.
mircea_popescu: why are they even involved in this for the love of christ.
benkay: mircea_popescu: not only do they read yahoo boards, they also go after 15 yo's
ThickAsThieves: the psychology of the forum needs its own study
ThickAsThieves: it's amazine really
psterryl: ThickAsThieves: " i dont know whether he's one of the people suspected"
psterryl: Suspected of what?
ThickAsThieves: did you not see the statement?
pankkake: isn't it basically stockholm syndrome?
mircea_popescu: JERRY: I don't even want to talk about it anymore. What were you thinking? What was going on in your mind? Artistic integrity? Where, where did you come up with that? You're not artistic and you have no integrity. You know you really need some help. A regular psychiatrist couldn't even help you. You need to go to like Vienna or something. You know what I mean? You need to get involved at the University level. Like wher
mircea_popescu: e Freud studied and have all those people looking at you and checking up on you. That's the kind of help you need. Not the once a week for eighty bucks. No. You need a team. A team of psychiatrists working round the clock thinking about you, having conferences, observing you, like the way they did with the Elephant Man. That's what I'm talking about because that's the only way you're going to get better.
psterryl: yeah im just wondering what constitutes "suspicious trading activity"
pankkake: maybe I should create an exchange where you can only trade if trade.value > lasttrade.value
pankkake: they would love it
mircea_popescu: pankkake isn't that basically the bitcoin gem "idea" ?
mike_c: pankkake: that is havelock.. see RENT, see NEOBEE, see ..
ThickAsThieves: psterryl, i dont think i have an answer in that regard
mircea_popescu: mike_c rent got suspended too ?!
mike_c: not suspended
mike_c: referring to new ipo at higher than market price
benkay: o but haven't you heard mike_c the market price is now near the next "i"plol price!
benkay: !t h rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00600002 / 0.00683184 / 0.00750000 (1556 shares, 10.63033884 BTC), 7D: 0.00525000 / 0.00590396 / 0.00750000 (5321 shares, 31.41496367 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.00560668 / 0.00900001 (49033 shares, 274.91242278 BTC)
benkay: !l h rent
assbot: Last trade for RENT on HAVELOCK was at 0.00749997 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: mike_c there's a different problem there : if they ipo'd at same price as before they'd have a fiat dilution on their hands.
benkay: seeeeee?
mircea_popescu: and i fucking need to stop calling subsequent offerings "ipos"
mike_c: this terminology. you can only ipo once! that's why they call it "initial"
mircea_popescu: one day people will be quoting this shit and laughing at me.
mike_c: inb4
mircea_popescu: spos, srsly.
psterryl: ThickAsThieves no worries, hopefully LMB put out a statement at some point
ThickAsThieves: i like it
benkay: reduxpo
mircea_popescu: iam12andwhatisthispo
benkay: can gravity po?
mike_c: benkay: maybe it's like an acquisition rumor. why not buy all the lower priced shares if you know it's going to be forced to 75.
ThickAsThieves: that doesnt really work out here
ThickAsThieves: you presume people will buy at 75
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26950 @ 0.00094868 = 25.5669 BTC [-] {3}
ThickAsThieves: kinda unlikely, no?
benkay: past shareholders aren't going to be allowed to sell at that price, mike_c
mike_c: i don't presume that at all. but it's either that, or a complete scam.
mircea_popescu: i still don't understand the merger idea too well, tbh.
mike_c: a random 50% pop after this new PO is announced..
benkay: newpo
benkay: poopyo
mircea_popescu: rent guy was going to get some north carolina similar service
mike_c: yeah, we discussed. read the logs already ;)
ThickAsThieves: the20year2, take it from, just stop
benkay: could just be buying leads, although where capital's going to come to develop them is anyone's guess-JUST KIDDING HAVELOCK
mircea_popescu: they're not even contiguous ;/
mircea_popescu: mike_c no i read them.
mike_c: oh right, you explained to him that a business that just needs capital has no competitive advantages.
mircea_popescu: it's more complicated than that.
mircea_popescu: but anyway, in his case, maintaining offices in two states, he's setting himself up for the bomb
mircea_popescu: even if everything else had worked!
mircea_popescu: where's that brilliant men link ?
mike_c: he's not maintaining offices. just providing capital to that other company.
mike_c: it's basically a loan.
ozbot: From the Stacks: Why I Never Hire Brilliant Men |
jurov: for certain values of brilliant
mircea_popescu: worth a read.
decimation: I read it as: "I hire only those with high conscientiousness and low neuroticism"
mircea_popescu: not a bad read
mircea_popescu: neurosis correlates with intelligence about to the same effects rot correlates with wood.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.07299493 = 0.146 BTC [+]
decimation: the problem is that actually accomplishing this would be racist
mircea_popescu: how would it be racist ?!
mircea_popescu: you mean, it'd mostly exclude white people ?
decimation: behavior and personality is highly heritable
decimation: certain groups, probably
mircea_popescu: race != some random group.
skinnkavaj: Whats happening with NEOBEE?
skinnkavaj: I have not been around
decimation: the point is, any test that would be given to an applicant to attempt to detect his or her conscientiousness would be illeagal, like IQ tests are (in the US)
mike_c: lots of blue-collar jobs give personality tests before hiring
decimation: yeah and google gives what amount to IQ tests
decimation: which put them at risk of a civil-rights lawsuit
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10950 @ 0.00095278 = 10.4329 BTC [+]
skinnkavaj: Seems like a great time to buy NEOBEE
skinnkavaj: Or am I missing something here?
skinnkavaj: pankkake you know
mike_c: just one of many things you are missing is that no one can buy.
skinnkavaj: I know that
skinnkavaj: But when it opens up
skinnkavaj: And why is it closed in the first place
mike_c: you don't know, yet it is a great time to buy.
mircea_popescu: decimation iq tests are illegal in the us ?!
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
skinnkavaj: mike_c: I like to buy on others fear
mircea_popescu: skinnkavaj so buy some lehman.
skinnkavaj: pankkake: Thanks sir
skinnkavaj: There is a conspiracy on bitcointalk
skinnkavaj: That pankkake and mircea_popescu you are the same person
skinnkavaj: SOmething must have happened on NEOBEE
skinnkavaj: Question is what
mircea_popescu: weren't they supposed to at some point release a report ?
pankkake: I was on a forum where we had this ongoing conspiracy that there really were 2-3 users on the forum and everyone else was sockpuppets
pankkake: but that was for fun, mostly
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: Are you in bed with MPOE-PR or have I misunderstood that?
mircea_popescu: im sittin' on a chair.
decimation: oh yeah, "iq tests" are illeagal, or at least they can form the basis of a civil rights lawsuit.
skinnkavaj: So boring when MPOE-PR on the same thread post the same link all over again, instead of debating
mircea_popescu: decimation you know it's "illegal"
decimation: the United States alleges that defendant City of New York's use of two written examinations on a pass-fail basis, as well as its rank-order processing of applicants, in the screening and selection of applicants for appointment to the rank of entry-level firefighter, has resulted in disparate impact upon black and Hispanic applicants, is not "job related for the position in question and consistent with business necessity" and does not otherwise
decimation: meet the requirements of Title VII.
skinnkavaj: pankkake: Do you have any investment in any security I check out?
mircea_popescu: yes but a) the city of new york is a public corp and b) firemen and generally blue collar workers are hardly what we were thinking about
skinnkavaj: Feels like its so boring nowadays
skinnkavaj: Nothing good to invest in
skinnkavaj: Before it was a lot more
skinnkavaj: And yet bitcoin is much bigger now
pankkake: I have nothing, I took my losses from havelock just because fuck it
mircea_popescu: yeah, all very good stuff
skinnkavaj: So should be more securities
decimation: well, a private corp would open themselves up to civil suits
decimation: I'm surprised this hasn't happened with silicon valley already
skinnkavaj: pankkake: On NEOBEE or what did you have there?
pankkake: on everything, I got out of neobee a while ago
skinnkavaj: I am opening a new altcoin exchange for Litecoinlocal, before I was determined that we should have fee shares and take fees on the trading
skinnkavaj: Now I have decided to offer it for free
skinnkavaj: With no fees
skinnkavaj: And no shares
skinnkavaj: I am gonna make money by offering a really simple dice game on every altcoin traded
skinnkavaj: I wounder how Huobi makes money though
skinnkavaj: Must be expensive to deposit there
skinnkavaj: Or high withdrawal fees
skinnkavaj: It's kinda fun with zero fees, to really see how much your code and server can handle in terms of total trades per second
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: I have never understood how MPOE works, but anyway the questionn goes how many trades can you handle per second right now?
skinnkavaj: pankkake: Progamming anything right now?
pankkake: maybe
skinnkavaj: Tell me
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: Boring answer really..
mircea_popescu: anyone saw cul de sac ? an older polanski film.
mircea_popescu: Donald Pleasence is quite good in it.
benkay: skinnkavaj: not much. no more trades on havelock, ThickAsThieves no longer running the 'fund'.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.0444 = 0.222 BTC [+]
benkay: so how about this:
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.056399 = 0.1692 BTC [+]
benkay: bezzle -> crypto may yet fly
skinnkavaj: benkay: Didn't TAT quit managing it long time ago?
skinnkavaj: Or maybe it was asicminer
benkay: am
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.0564 = 0.1128 BTC [+] {2}
skinnkavaj: If he quit asicminer
mircea_popescu: "confirmed that a bitcoin exchange that holds client funds with a licensed overseas payment service provider is not required to obtain a licence in the country for its activities."
skinnkavaj: Maybe he quit also NEOBEE for the same reason
mircea_popescu: sounds like the average coindesk article.
skinnkavaj: I guess he thought it was too much work
benkay: don't really think it was the work of the thing, skinnkavaj.
mircea_popescu: benkay you know i like reading your blog
benkay: he'd have said something along those lines when the forum showed up and put him through the wringer
mircea_popescu: but the viewport is too wide by now.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10131 @ 0.00094546 = 9.5785 BTC [-] {2}
benkay: say it ain't so, mircea_popescu
skinnkavaj: benkay: Do you have any reason to believe it was not that reason?
mircea_popescu: skinnkavaj didja read the log ?
skinnkavaj: Not the full
skinnkavaj: Please inform me
benkay: please pay me
skinnkavaj: I have not catched up with it yet
skinnkavaj: benkay: For what gtfo
benkay: at least tell me i'm pretty
skinnkavaj: Well I can stretch to that
mircea_popescu: benkay you've not asked too many people, btw. as best i can tell they're neither a giant scam trying to run witrh a ton of btc, nor a legitimate business.
benkay: what's your read, mircea_popescu?
mircea_popescu: they're an outfit run by an incompetent if vain kid that drank the kool aid. they got some btc together, made some media buys and... that's it.
mircea_popescu: very dot-com ish really, but history is only useful to the literate.
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: But the original prospectus was really well thought thru
skinnkavaj: He did have a good business plan
skinnkavaj: Or else so many wouldnt invest with him
mircea_popescu: skinnkavaj ever pick up a chick that looked good at the disco only to get scared in the morning ?
benkay: skinnkavaj: are you referring to the part where they claimed they'd be able to protect cypriots from haircuts?
skinnkavaj: And I dont think much BTC business is "legal"
skinnkavaj: In fact not many business at all
skinnkavaj: Not even fiat business
skinnkavaj: Apple is still breaking the law..
mircea_popescu: you're skidding all over the place.
benkay: US law, which is not law any more by dint of outlawing the un-out-law-able.
benkay: US tax law which has put itself into the voluntary donation zone?
skinnkavaj: benkay: US tax law was put into voluntary donation zone when Bitcoin was first launched in 2009
skinnkavaj: By technical reasons
benkay: sure
benkay: USG is slowly aligning themselves with reality on the ground
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: Is MPOE a registred company in US or why did SEC contact you?
mircea_popescu: i imagine they contacted me because they wanted to talk.
mircea_popescu: what silly q is that.
skinnkavaj: Erik Vorhees was smart
skinnkavaj: Fake selling SD to himself
dexX7: proof?
skinnkavaj: "Anonymous investor"
dexX7: who did pay the shareholders then?
skinnkavaj: It's obvious when you think about it
skinnkavaj: Himself from everything he earned
skinnkavaj: He have a lot of BTC
dexX7: (i don't know how much that was)
dexX7: why do you think this was smart?
skinnkavaj: So he would not get into trouble and can still operate SD
skinnkavaj: I believe we will see more fake sells since it's the best option to clear your name, while still holding on to that money making machine
skinnkavaj: Which is your baby, as an entreprenour
mircea_popescu: this is pretty much nonsense.
mircea_popescu: why not enjoy the credibility of a well run asset ?
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: Because of legal problems obviously
mircea_popescu: i dun see what you're talking about, "obviously".
benkay: ;;tslb
gribble: Time since last block: 7 minutes and 27 seconds
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: So you think SD is a legal service?
benkay: legal where, skinnkavaj ?
skinnkavaj: In any country of the world
mircea_popescu: dude seriously, stop.
mircea_popescu: there's no such thing as a "legal service". there's illegal stuff, and then there's the rest.
mircea_popescu: there's no "any country in the world"
mircea_popescu: you don't even know how many countries there are, in the world.
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: Is this your strategy in the future?
skinnkavaj: I wish you good luck, I honestly do
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.07249972 = 0.145 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: yes, my strategy in the future is to continue to point out obvious nonsense coming my way.
mircea_popescu: who knows, maybe it somehow ends up cutting down on the general nonsense
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16349 @ 0.00094303 = 15.4176 BTC [-]
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: We live in a corrupt world you should know that
skinnkavaj: SD is not legal and neither is MPOE, but I love the fact that you are not agreeing with me on that
mircea_popescu: eh your face is not legal.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18300 @ 0.00094107 = 17.2216 BTC [-] {3}
CheckDavid: I heard mpoe was the most legal of exchanges
assbot: [MPEX] [S.BBET] 1750 @ 0.0005 = 0.875 BTC [-]
TestingUnoDosTre: mircea , is legal in every planet in the Milky Way?
skinnkavaj: TestingUnoDosTre: Leave him alone now I think he understood my point and I like his intentions
dexX7: intentions?
TestingUnoDosTre: his evil intergalactic intentions
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 85 @ 0.06926507 = 5.8875 BTC [-] {13}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8250 @ 0.00093954 = 7.7512 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: the most legal illegal exchange run by an asshole with good intentions
mircea_popescu: someone write the book so 50cent can make a song about the movie based on it
mircea_popescu: then we can quote its wisdom
CheckDavid: How illegal is mpoe?
dexX7: let's ipo the idea
mircea_popescu: s'il egal.
benkay: ill egalitarian.
skinnkavaj: mircea_popescu: Try listen for one minute in a clip from this audio book
benkay: o lookit that spotify lets you sign up with email again
benkay: guess zuck won that one in the short term and lost it in the long term
ozbot: Facebook feud outside club | Page Six
mircea_popescu: skinnkavaj learning to read spoiled me for audiobooks.
TestingUnoDosTre: is that seriously a 50 cent produced audiobook?
mircea_popescu: "Go search deep for code (for sale) for online gambling sites.
mircea_popescu: The most expensive code packages for gambling sites have the most deceit and advanced algorithms to rip-off the gambling fool and protect the investment of the operator. The very best ones you'll never find for sale, however. These algorithms always sit on top of whatever "edge" the operator decides to take (the "edge" is the part of the tilted table some sites even openly advertise nowadays).
mircea_popescu: there's nothing better than a good conspiraci theorist.
mircea_popescu: bitcoin invented fair gambling, bitbet is a parimutuel implementation, anon forum derp comes to harp about how deceitful "sites" are.
mircea_popescu: i imagine these people followed hercules around augeas' stables complaining about all the mess he's making.
dirt_: amazing
Mats_cd03: hue hue
ThickAsThieves: "Edmund Moy, the former director of the U.S. Mint who’s become an outspoken proponent of digital currencies, saw a mix of good and bad as well, but ultimately he made two cogent points: first, that this is is a rule, not a law, and there’s a difference, and, two, that it can be changed as circumstances warrant."
ThickAsThieves: what is the exact difference between an IRS rule and a law?
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves that i get to laugh at you poor sods moar ?
mircea_popescu: a rule you can have overturned by arguing more things before the supreme court than if it were a law.
mircea_popescu: because congress does have legislative discretion, but agencies do not.
mircea_popescu: we're talking a decade and a hundred million in either case.
mike_c: most of the IRS code is law, but not the btc part.
ThickAsThieves: so you must break the rule to even attempt to learn it's definition?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8800 @ 0.00093954 = 8.268 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: or at least "test" its definition
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves no, you don't have to break it to sue.
ThickAsThieves: is there some argument to what is allowed to be taxed at all, and bitcoin not fitting that spectrum?
mircea_popescu: no, because the us does not recognise allodial title.
mircea_popescu: anything can be taxed.
ThickAsThieves: like isnt there an underlying premise for taxes being that, for example you cant profit from a shipping company without roads, and taxes pay for roads, therefor you must pay them
ThickAsThieves: the USG neither provides for, nor maintains, nor creates bitocin
ThickAsThieves: something seems off
mircea_popescu: that bullcrap is entirely irrelevant to the discussion.
mircea_popescu: it's roughly the coating in the pill, various people sprout it because you know, the slavegirl that aesthetically loves her collar isn't really as much of a slavegirl or something.
ThickAsThieves: do you have an argument against the IRS rulings or you think they are sensible?
mircea_popescu: but taxes have exactly zero to do with roads.
mircea_popescu: the irs can tax anything the fuck it pleases. the reaction to taxation you dislike is leaving the jurisdiction, not arguing the point.
mike_c: even then you can't escape. you have to give up citizenship.
mircea_popescu: so give up citizenship.
mircea_popescu: (course iirc, you're not allowed to do so unless you prove it's specifically NOT because you dislike the taxation system. quite the racked your owner got going there.)
mike_c: and there's a fee :)
ThickAsThieves: surely a small price to pay
mircea_popescu: you can't imagine, on a more personal note, how fucking outlandish this is to me.
mircea_popescu: if someone told me twenty years ago i will live to honestly pity the fate of the poor us citizens i'd have laughed for the rest of the day.
mircea_popescu: and i'm not even fucking old! i'm sitting here and im thinking... holy shit now THAT must suck. what a curse to be born with.
mike_c: could be worse. china is worse.
mircea_popescu: i do not believe china is currently worse.
mircea_popescu: korea is worse.
mike_c: foxconn has more suicides than jpmorgan.
Duffer1: the breathable parts of china sound nice
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.0564 = 0.1692 BTC [+]
dexX7: foxconn has about 1000x more worker than jpmorgan
benkay: girl is out of town for the weekend. this means.....
ozbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
Mats_cd03: i was in guangzhou a year ago
dexX7: did you like it?
benkay: mostly because i've forgotten how to cook since this one started doing it for me
Mats_cd03: i saw a few dozen dead pigs floating down a river as i was driving out of the province
nubbins`: i made homemade pasta sauce and meatballs last night
nubbins`: it was amazing, so spicy ;0
Mats_cd03: soured me on the experience
nubbins`: yes, the company was amazing too
nubbins`: yes, simply amazing
nubbins`: yes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.06892001 = 0.6892 BTC [-] {4}
mircea_popescu: benkay you gotta learn to cook, this is embarassing.
TestingUnoDosTre: easy there assbot
Mats_cd03: were the meatballs homemade
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla could assy perhaps only say amazing once an hour or something ?
mircea_popescu: i got a reputation to amazingly protect here.
benkay: mircea_popescu: i know how to cook!
benkay: amazing popescu
mircea_popescu: benkay you don't and i can tell just by looking at that poor excuse of a plate.
benkay: gtfo
benkay: i hand fried those potatoes
Mats_cd03: anyway like i was saying, i think some farmer had bought bad feed for his pigs and accidentally poisoned them
mircea_popescu: i have a lot more experience with noob cook chicks than you imagine my friend.
mircea_popescu: that's lashable cooking.
kakobrekla: mircea_popescu isnt it easier to just limit nubbins` ?
benkay: what's wrong with my plate?!
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla but he's so small!
Mats_cd03: and whos going to dig a proper hole for all of those bodies? thats fucking laborious
Mats_cd03: so he put them on the back of a pickup and then dropped them off somewhere upstream
mircea_popescu: benkay it looks like someone who can't cook made it.
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 either that or there was a pig geyser sprout on the river bed.
benkay: bah you and your aesthetics
benkay: viewport this
benkay: arrangement of nutritive items that
mircea_popescu: tis not a matter of aesthetics.
mircea_popescu: tis a matter of i can tell if the carpenter is a noob by whether his "chair" is fucking level.
nubbins`: Mats_cd03 yes, the meatballs were homemade
benkay: oooooooh
Mats_cd03: id eat your homemade meatballs, nubbins`
Mats_cd03: ... wink
mircea_popescu: homeball his mademeats too
nubbins`: kakobrekla you can't hold me down!
mircea_popescu: ok, honesty time :
mircea_popescu: i always thought nubbins are the little bumps around the nipple on an aroused areola.
Mats_cd03: i have those
mircea_popescu: stop ruining it for me.
Mats_cd03: sorry
benkay: me too.
mike_c: benkay: eggs are overcooked. that yolk's gotta run.
mircea_popescu: you're too young to have areolae.
benkay: ya well, the plate was in the oven keeping the bacon warm
benkay: i did fuck the yolks up.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.0444 = 0.1332 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06887978 = 0.3444 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: he thinks he can cute :D so adowable!
mircea_popescu: s/cute/cooke
benkay: keep going
benkay: alright fine you got me
mike_c: the potatoes look raw
Mats_cd03: horrible cooking dude
benkay: i'm an engineer
benkay throws up his hands
mircea_popescu: are you a c0k engineer ?
mircea_popescu: i mean c00k
Mats_cd03: its impressive you havent accidentally poisoned yourself yet
benkay: coke, but you know
mike_c: Mats_cd03: he hasn't eaten it yet :)
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 well if he ends up in east river...
kakobrekla: by the looks of it its deliberate
mircea_popescu: benkay gf comes home from her trip, finds dead pigglet, hauls him to pickup truck
mircea_popescu: (they have a pickup in ny!)
benkay: i love you guys too.
benkay: sad truth is i'm fishing for a second housekeeper cum cock sucker
benkay: i guess the assettes don't deliver?
benkay: mo i'm going to poison myself
mircea_popescu: well then your cum'd be poisonous.
benkay: i don't know the difference between brotein and carboderprates
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: re: earlier thing: 'griggs vs. duke power co.'
asciilifeform: ;;google griggs vs duke power co.
gribble: Griggs v. Duke Power Co. - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>; Landmark: Griggs v. Duke Power Co. | NAACP LDF: <>; Griggs v. Duke Power Company | The Oyez Project at IIT Chicago ...: <>
moiety: sup benkay?
benkay: girl left
benkay: i can't cook
benkay: halp
moiety: i entirely passed out earlier D:
moiety: oh jesus
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yeah but that's ability to perform the job, you know ?
moiety: do you have a toaster
benkay: no toasters are convenience tools of the devil
benkay: also i live in murka and have to compromise on counterspace
mircea_popescu: moiety> do you have a toaster <<< ahaha fucken epic.
mircea_popescu: benkay "halp halp i need to cook" moiety, always motherly, starts small. "toaster ?"
benkay: this isn't funny mircea_popescu i'm going to die
moiety: prexactly - convenience. i think toasters are good because they have a timer, you cant burn the house down. please buy one
mircea_popescu: death is kinda funny...
benkay: yeah normally i'm into snuff too but today it's meeeee
mircea_popescu: so wait! benkay was shooting for two girls but in the end his one had enough and now he's... mancooking ?
mircea_popescu: o this is cartoon worthy
moiety: wait, you mean properly left? not just away for the weekend?
benkay: no its just for the weekend
tg2: Shiiit, ltcponzi 500 ltc in 40 minutes :/
benkay: WAIT NO HALP
moiety: oh i was gonna say you need to get a microwave too
mircea_popescu: moiety so far he thinks it's temporary.
tg2: Fack
tg2: Gotta start going this lol
benkay: Mats_cd03: that has sugar in it
Mats_cd03: are you diabetic
benkay: i will be if i cook myself goddamn pralines all the time
mircea_popescu: "how to become diabetic in three easy steps"
benkay: bake?
benkay: does one cook or bake pralines?
Mats_cd03: it was mostly the website and not the link, but i do love me some pralines
mircea_popescu: bake, bitch an' gargle
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: re: griggs: this was one of those cases that ended in creating a 'talmudic wall' (as the hassid jews call this situation)
Mats_cd03: is baking
benkay: fuck baking
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so it was.
asciilifeform: not until recently did anyone dare to give even vaguely intellectual puzzles to potential hires
benkay: so much time
Mats_cd03: youll live longer if you eat baked goods
asciilifeform: because of the 'disparate impact' (actual legal term) standard established by griggs
asciilifeform: (ianal!)
Mats_cd03: (over range-top cooking of meats)
Mats_cd03: me, i'm trying to live forever
qwebirc471694: fact: bears eat beets
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and of course it is, as always, based on the commerce clause.
benkay: eh, forever's overrated
mircea_popescu: one almost dares hope that a wholesale repeal of commerce clause jurisprudence may fix teh us
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: as is virtually everything done by usg post-fdr
asciilifeform: that's like hoping for a cancellation of ckkpss. oh wait.
benkay: mircea_popescu: never going to happen.
moiety: ok so benkay do you have any little hard yellow shaped things in the kitchen that look like this?
benkay: haw
moiety: :P
benkay: there are hard things in the kitchen for sure
benkay: dunno bout past
benkay: pasta
moiety: qwebirc471694: excellent fact
mircea_popescu: benkay gimme the heavenly forge for a week, it'll happen.
qwebirc471694: ahhh I'm losing my name
mircea_popescu: hm, am i the only one that knows what the heavenly forge is ?
moiety: benkay, this is worse than i thought. just phone a pizza for now
Mats_cd03: i looked it up on google and the second link was ''
benkay: mircea_popescu: what are you on about
TestingUnoDosTre: there we go
mircea_popescu: the heavenly forge is this quill
kakobrekla: order a pizza and put in a toaster
Mats_cd03: so the heavenly forge is definitely fan fiction right?
mircea_popescu: and whatever it writes, is the future.
moiety: kakobrekla: you are a man too huh
mike_c: lol kako. i agree.
benkay: can i get a pizza with bacon on it?
mircea_popescu: ;;google "nor all your piety nor wit"
gribble: Edward FitzGerald (poet) - Wikiquote: <>; The Moving Finger - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>; Omar Khayyám - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>
asciilifeform: aha that one
moiety: benkay from dominos, yep
asciilifeform: everyone in usa knows that one
asciilifeform: because of clinton
mircea_popescu: please redirect all things which are bacon to benkay
kakobrekla: moiety i did came through didnt it.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform lol
asciilifeform: it's true!
benkay: i don't need all the bacon sheesh that'd be greedy now
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2964 @ 0.00093954 = 2.7848 BTC [-]
moiety nods at kakobrekla - just a wee bit
mircea_popescu: benkay trade it for sum bitches
mircea_popescu: dem bitches looooove that bacon
TestingUnoDosTre: didn't we have some bacon ritz yesterday?
cazalla: should i register a gpg key in addition to bitcoin address for wot or is a bitcoin address enough?
asciilifeform: 'the moving finger writes, and having writ...'
moiety: men: toasters, youredoinitwrong
benkay: ah yes squirtable bacon
benkay: "come here baby let me squirt some bacon on you. mircea popescu said bitches love bacon."
moiety: cazalla: more other way around, key>address
Mats_cd03: centrifugal deep fat fryer for that delicious crisp layer of chicken...
ozbot: SPINFRESH Automatic Fryer - Perfect Fry Company
cazalla: moiety: thanks, time to learn this gpg stuff i guess
mircea_popescu: cazalla both work
moiety: cazalla: use BingoBoingo's guide. best way, one sec
benkay: cazalla you don't need to put bitcoin address into wot
benkay: in fact, might not be a great idea
benkay: addrs and identities are two separate extremes on the spectrum
benkay: addrs disposable
benkay: identities inso
mircea_popescu: you can change them anyway.
mircea_popescu: log in with either, update the other as needed.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8950 @ 0.00094071 = 8.4194 BTC [+]
benkay: naw
benkay: gpg for comms, btc for $$$
TestingUnoDosTre: which one was the BingoBoingo guide?
benkay: ;;google drinking record gpg
gribble: PGP/GPG Guide | Bingo Blog: <>; Signature Thursday: Geany a GUI text editor for GPG tasks | Bingo ...: <>; Bingo Blog | - of Bitcoin and Boingo: <>
ozbot: PGP/GPG Guide | Bingo Blog
moiety: see lol i slow
benkay: we'll larn you yet
moiety: got distracted saving tabs... ironically to speed up browser
moiety: couldn't you have a couple of people using an address though?
benkay: moiety!
mircea_popescu: it's not a bed.
moiety: if i just missed something glaringly obvious, forgive me, i did just wake up. I've shared an address before, is all
mircea_popescu: anyone know the car brand ?
benkay: trabamborghini
asciilifeform: moiety: this'd be more like sharing toothbrush.
mircea_popescu: moiety how've you shared an address, ye hussy!
moiety: benkay the badge is right there! citroen
moiety: and for the site. me + dev had access
mircea_popescu: well it's not really how they're supposed to work.
mircea_popescu: so don't do that.
mircea_popescu: make two or w/e.
mircea_popescu: and wd on the citroen! it may be a trabamborghini, but it's the french trabamborghini.
asciilifeform: trabazerati.
moiety: thats fair enough, i was just at that point having everything done for me
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform if you're going there, trapzderati
moiety: citroens arent very good though
mircea_popescu: better than vauxhalls.
moiety: very true
moiety: also, citroen>renault if we are keeping to french
moiety: everything over vauxhall (unless its a ford)
benkay: moiety: you might be the first person with a good reason to implement m of n signing
benkay: lol doge m of n
moiety: i don't personally doge, well i mined 41 to learn the process. such wealth.
benkay: are there any alts which one can mine with a cpu and at least get a few?
benkay: dage i gather, but does that still hold true?
moiety: plenty, in the beginning at least, all the galters are cpu poolers too
benkay: maybe the infinitely inflating currencies live on in the processors of cpus and gpus
benkay: as their value decreases, so does hashpower from professionals applied against them.
benkay: haha
moiety: are scrypt asics a thing yet?
benkay: tg2: ^^
PObro: kncMiner has some scrypt miners for Q2/Q3 this year.
tg2: Gridseeds are out already
tg2: knc is gonna kill it though
cads: moiety: at least one company I've seen are claiming to be shipping a scrypt asic
benkay: have a good evening, everyone!
tg2: I hope scrypt responds poorly to Asic difficulty hike
cads: though I thought the memory requirements of scrypt is what made it inefficient to try to solve with an asic.
tg2: Less efficient
tg2: still 50x more than gpu lol
cads: gotcha
tg2: Vs 1000x more with sha256 asics
moiety: cads: great, a bfl v2?!
cads: bfl?
tg2: vertcoin is the only hope for no-asic and I'm sure it will happen
tg2: Their implementation is dumb
moiety: Big Fucking Liars aka Butterfly Labs
tg2: Knc is legit though
cads: has no researcher investigated mixed hash approaches?
tg2: Cads, look into x11 cpins
tg2: Coins* namely darkcoin
asciilifeform: why this mega-interest in coins optimized for botnet mining?
tg2: Lol
jborkl: Wtf is going on in here
tg2: Cause botters dos exchanges to make $
cads: lol, x11's site begins "With professional Scrypt mining hardware on the way it is time to look for the best alternative hashing solution that will keep crypto currency within reach of everyone."
asciilifeform: 'cpu optimized' == 'botnet optimized'
asciilifeform: what part of this is a secret
cads: asciilifeform: nice
cads: I hadn't thought that
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19800 @ 0.00093923 = 18.5968 BTC [-] {2}
tg2: Even gpu is swarm friendly
cads: right
tg2: 35% of systems have discrete gpu
tg2: Including phones
cads: because kids/manchildren with hefty gaming gpus
mircea_popescu: actually, as a purely academic point, does anyone know a hash that is genuinely cpu-favourable ?
asciilifeform: heterogeneity of gpu makes the bot artist's job tricky
mircea_popescu: none of this ram ostrich bs
cads: asciilifeform: I would use haskell
moiety: americans: do you have a gov site dedicated to people records?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: cpu-friendly vs. what?
mircea_popescu: moiety no, they don't have central government.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform basically, a huge lot of control instructions somehow
asciilifeform: here's a simple one
cads: god it would be so great to find out these guys actually use next generation compiler tech to specialize their viruses to the hardware :)
asciilifeform: encode payload as bits on a grid, and run cellular automaton
asciilifeform: e.g. langton's ant
cads hates not knowing what's going on in the criminal sector of computer science
asciilifeform: or 'life'
moiety: ty mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: yeah srsly, graph anything. good point
mircea_popescu: would it hold as a hash tho
asciilifeform: say, 1e8-th state is the hash.
asciilifeform: or rather, a conventional cryptographic hash thereof
asciilifeform: (of the grid bits)
mircea_popescu: no good reason not to chain them
asciilifeform: to make it 'asic-hostile', demand an outlandishly large grid.
mircea_popescu: then again, at least for life there are purely math algos
asciilifeform: there's exactly one - 'hashlife'
mircea_popescu: well a bunch of derivations but ok
cads: asciilifeform: is hashlife hard or surprisingly easy to understand?
asciilifeform: surprisingly easy
asciilifeform: langton's ant is a bit more interesting
asciilifeform: in that the answer is very compact
mircea_popescu: it's not hard.
asciilifeform: the ant always ends up 'building a road'
asciilifeform: the output of the 'hash' can be 'starting on which move'
asciilifeform: this doesn't require you to hash the entire playing field
cads: looking up "hash life" on youtube got me to a video by "Swag Sensei"
asciilifeform: and there is presently no known means of predicting, other than by running the ant, when the bridge will be built
asciilifeform: and there is, afaik, no proof that it is always built
asciilifeform: but no known counter-example either.
cads: oh it's just smart memoization
asciilifeform: everyone is invited to try it
cads: durp
cads: nothing like stochastic/predictive?
cads reads on
asciilifeform: ;;google langton's ant
gribble: Langton's ant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <'s_ant>; Langton's Ant - YouTube: <>; Langton's Ant -- from Wolfram MathWorld: <>
asciilifeform: incidentally, hashlife starts grinding to sub-naive speed if your playing field is complex
asciilifeform: (highly entropic)
asciilifeform: because it no longer compresses.
asciilifeform: given that GOL is proven turing-complete, it would follow that there is no generic shortcut to nth-state
asciilifeform: unless p == np
asciilifeform: (and possibly not even then)
samO_: haven't had internet conn. for almost two days! nearly lost my mind... :D what happend in the mean time, anything significant?
asciilifeform: one could make an arbitrarily hardware-unfriendly 'hash' using automata, merely by demanding a large and well-entropic (crypto hash of payload, bit-spread) playing field
asciilifeform: and a turing-complete automaton
VanCleef: the fuck is up with havelock
tg2: I have a useful distributed work coin project on the burner
VanCleef: shit dont even work properly anymore
VanCleef: useless site
asciilifeform: make the field large enough, and everyone is reduced to swapping to disk!
tg2: gonna be better than wasting hashes on nothing
asciilifeform: (why anyone should wish this is another question.)
samO_: also, is there a chat log history of this channel somewhere? thx!
tg2: Just Google your username
tg2: Who admins havelock
tg2: Niggas need some help
tg2: Not even a heavy site to lift
asciilifeform: paging herr doktor wolfram!
asciilifeform: who loves stealing useless ideas
asciilifeform: let him steal this one!
asciilifeform: ;;google wolfram batshit egomania
gribble: Stephen Wolfram, A New Kind of Science: <>; Ten Years of Monster Raving Egomania and Utter Batshit Insanity: <>; Collection of Reviews of Wolfram's A New Kind of Science, Etc...: <>
asciilifeform: there we go.
mircea_popescu: samO_ who'd you be ?
asciilifeform: proposed algo, for those who insist:
asciilifeform: take j x k bit playing field.
asciilifeform: fill bits, in sequence, with sha2(xxx), then sha2(sha2(xxx)).... until field is full
asciilifeform: then run langton's ant, starting from the middle of the field
asciilifeform: output is an integer, N
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell benkay "One cannot issue ratings until one is rated oneself. This is a useful feature that prevents a lot of misuse of the system. If scammers cannot stuff the WoT database with their sockpuppets, they cannot artificially inflate their ratings. Granted, the mechanism is weak and easily gamed, but the simple presence of a barrier reduces much malfeasance." this made no sense. you know it made no sense. why
mircea_popescu: is it there then !?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
asciilifeform: corresponding to 'bridge is being built'
asciilifeform: alternatively, run 'life' on the entire field, for M moves, and output is sha(field)
mircea_popescu: in fact!
mircea_popescu: you can have difficulty scale as... the size of the field.
asciilifeform: as i said above.
mircea_popescu: a you did ?
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
mircea_popescu: what i mean is
mircea_popescu: the mining difficulty parameter is not some arbitrary zerofill
mircea_popescu: but the size of the field to compute.
asciilifeform: well yes.
asciilifeform: that'd be how it has to be.
asciilifeform: now all you need is a reason to actually do this.
mircea_popescu: how many numbers are the product of two others ?
mircea_popescu: all nonprimes basically huh.
asciilifeform: not incl. 1?
mircea_popescu: in fact you can allow life on a 1 wide grid couldn't you
asciilifeform: certainly
asciilifeform: although it would need to be called something else
mircea_popescu: yeah, i think the lowest would be 3 ? or 5 ?
mircea_popescu: maybe 5.
asciilifeform: most possible cellular automata degenerate to a steady state rather than give the kind of 'soup' one normally looks for.
asciilifeform: (yet another 'discovery' by people long ago that herr W claimed for himself)
ozbot: White House regulate cow flatulence climate agenda | The Daily Caller
asciilifeform: so long as you use an automaton that has been proven turing-complete, and use a reasonably entropic starting field state, you're pretty much safe from shortcuts
asciilifeform: and people are stuck having to compute the state transitions for the whole field, as many times as specified
asciilifeform: unless p == np, rocks fall, crypto dies
asciilifeform: likewise, scaling the difficulty in time and space becomes trivial.
cazalla: moiety: that gpg guide is good, this was much easier than i thought it would be
moiety: cazalla: yeah definately, i got the live version :D he is a very good sensei
asciilifeform: anyone who has the apparently common distaste for the asic folks should give this some thought.
MisterE: morning dudes
MisterE: asciilifeform: did you read tg2's analysis of sha-356 asics vs scrypt asics on bitcointalk?
MisterE: 256*
asciilifeform: MisterE: nope. i pretty much never see bitcointalk
MisterE: it's realy good and concise
asciilifeform: except when linked here - and even then, every 50th time or so
MisterE: yea from what I can tell its mostly trash
MisterE: I will find it
kakobrekla: trash mixed with gold
kakobrekla: but mostly trash
asciilifeform: any surprises therein for folks who understand the algos?
mircea_popescu: gold mixed with comedy
mircea_popescu: but mostly comedy
stompysteve: anyone got any info on neo and whats going on past they stopped trading due to sus activity
mircea_popescu: stompysteve read the log will you.
mircea_popescu: who had that link ?
asciilifeform: sha-356!?
MisterE: asciilifeform: probably not for you it's about the state of and medium-term future of hardware and mfgr. proceses
asciilifeform: the ideal botnet-optimized (i.e. what scrypt wants to be) algo is described above.
mircea_popescu: MisterE so link it
MisterE: searching my logs now
MisterE: oh it's on litecointalk thats why didn't find it right away... [2014-03-27T12:19:20+0700] <tg2> // Discourse welcome!
asciilifeform: ;;google heusser satcoin
gribble: SAT solving - An alternative to brute force bitcoin mining: <>; Proof of concept code for SAT-based bitcoin mining: <>; jheusser/satcoin · GitHub: <>
tg2: Yeah knc updated their numbers, I should update the post
asciilifeform: 'Current/Next gen bitcoin/sha256 asics are already at the forefront of manufacturing process, they cannot get more power efficient without waiting for a new manufacturing process to be available (14nm)' << nah
mircea_popescu: tg2 you realise people wouldn't build the ram as part of the asic do you ?
asciilifeform: why brute force. it's like nobody gives a rat's arse enough to even try
tg2: They went for the "less ram faster latency" approach
asciilifeform: hence 'lifecoin'. you're stuck with the RAM
tg2: I stand by my analysis though that it won't be near as prolific as sha256
mircea_popescu: nearly as prolific as bitcoin miners they will never be
tg2: Although knc sure is trying to prove me wrong lol
MisterE: and won't depreciate so quickly like sha-256 2nd gen
mircea_popescu: the reason, of course, is that bitcoin is worth three to four degrees of magnitude more.
MisterE: I heard knc was not reliable and they have had a lot of delivery misses int he past?
mircea_popescu: MisterE not as bad as all that.
tg2: They are probably one of the best right now
MisterE: they also mine so there is a conflict of interest iirc?
tg2: Hashfast are clowns
MisterE: oh, perhaps I'm confused with another 3 letter mfgr?
tg2: They assemble them out of house
tg2: at a workshop 5 minutes from my office
asciilifeform: i've always wondered if folks interested in mining despite the negative ROI are really just looking to convert fiat to btc by whatever means possible.
tg2: Yeah I think that's a way to look at it
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how about the people who "invest" despite negative roi ?
tg2: Don't forget gpu's hold some value
tg2: shit even shoddy first gen sha fpga's are still being sold lol
MisterE: and generate transactions that help keep the network healthy
mircea_popescu: rational behaviour isn't exactly the rule.
MisterE: BTC still has a gold rush mentality that personally I dont think is doing speculators any favors
asciilifeform: think of it this way - some people are prepared to pay double, triple, the 'usual' cost for btc, so long as they aren't using an exchange
asciilifeform: esp. americans
MisterE: smart ones supply the miners and speculators
gribble: Error: "d" is not a valid command.
asciilifeform: not everyone has an 'otc' vendor that they're willing to trust
TestingUnoDosTre: say wahat gribble?
ozbot: 5.007 billion | Next Diff in 1326 blocks | Estimated Change: 15.9722% in 7d 17h 34m 28s
MisterE: asciilifeform: the mining centers I've read abotu who are doing it right have paid back their investments within months
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform those people trade otc.
MisterE: there was just the article in Ars abotu the guy who controls ~10% of hash rate
asciilifeform: MisterE: large concerns with ready access to the latest widgets, sure.
mircea_popescu: well i guess, but it's becoming edge-r and edge-r
asciilifeform: the poor schmucks buying thirdhand asic, not so much
MisterE: but medium - small guys are throwing money away?
MisterE: lol ok
mircea_popescu: it's really very hit and miss.
asciilifeform: but there's a standpoint from which it makes sense to buy a junk miner
mircea_popescu: "large concerns" that thought they had access to the latest widgets expected to come out... november 2012 are mostly bankrupt today
MisterE: yea tg2 does a good job explaining that depreciation, expecially of 2nd gen sha-256 asics
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: that'd be because the only way to have reliable access to latest xxx is to... build it
tg2: Yeah I pitty anybody who dropped btc on a bfl product
mircea_popescu: MisterE it's a theory. it's not outrageously or massively wrong, but im not too persuaded.
ozbot: Meet the manic miner who wants to mint 10% of all new bitcoins | Ars Technica
tg2: Even the "next gen" 600gh is garbage
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not even. more builders went out of business than stayed in.
MisterE: yea BFL really scammed a lot
MisterE: my buddy ordered a 10mh box and was shopped a 7mh box
asciilifeform: some people will spend 2K usd to get 1 btc, if it means they don't have to bend over for 'aml' crapola or trust someone
mircea_popescu: ahh, remember the days when am was derping about "having 30% of all hashing for a year"
MisterE: they are being sued
MisterE: a lot
mircea_popescu: it was.... six months ago ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform someone they'll still be trusting.
tg2: I honestly think they started out with the goal of scamming and then btc blew up so fast lol
mircea_popescu: unless they're taking a microscope to the box, who's to say what's in there ?
asciilifeform: think 'silk road' and 'why didn't they just go to the dark alley to buy the coke'
MisterE: well performance doesn't lie heh
MisterE: plus I thing it was stamped on the box
tg2: I hope this Canadian class action against gox bears some fruit
mircea_popescu: anyway, i'm off. take it easy all.
MisterE: BFL could not deliver the product my buddy ordered and instead of refunding sent a lesser spec
asciilifeform: from this crackpot theory, mining doesn't need to have much +EV so long as it isn't too far in the minus.
tg2: I'm glad they decided to do it, they were on the fence about it for a few days
MisterE: I hope they all do
MisterE: I heard they were being sued the first time a couple months ago but that also people were lining up to file
tg2: Ain't nobody spending 2k for 1 btc lol
tg2: no matter how shady
asciilifeform: tg2: many 'home' miners end up doing just that.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12000 @ 0.00094137 = 11.2964 BTC [+] {2}
MisterE: I made a big buy (for me) at 500 yesterday
tg2: Not by intent
tg2: I have 250k of gpus running
asciilifeform: tg2: that's what i was wondering. perhaps it isn't always accidental
tg2: dat cheap hydro
MisterE: it goes out in pieces to the electric company
tg2: And most of it was bought with btc mined from a single 5970 lol
MisterE: so if they can amortize it spending 2k on a BTC is acceptable I guess.
MisterE: heh yea think of that scale jump
tg2: My thoughts are, my power costs me .05c
tg2: Cdn$
MisterE: you got hydro?
MisterE: or nukes in the back yard?
MisterE: in US you get cheap power if you live nearish a nuke plant
tg2: Rate m power
TestingUnoDosTre: I bought some at 500 as well
TestingUnoDosTre: pissed because I made a small purchase around 400...
MisterE: yea I see a lot of support at 500 TestingUnoDosTre
tg2: plus cheap cooling most of the year
MisterE: all the bad BTC news lately hasn't budged it at all
MisterE: very good sign
TestingUnoDosTre: I see a lot of don't really care how things pan out over the next 2-3 months
MisterE: tg2: the successful miners of the future will have to monetize that heat
tg2: People in cali and uk already losing money
TestingUnoDosTre: US miners are going to have to evade taxs or more out
tg2: Umm already doing something with my 600,000 btu lol
MisterE: what you doing tg2 ?
tg2: Have grass growing outside in the middle of February
MisterE: I mean hell you can just well insulate and heat your house if you live in a colder place
MisterE: lolol :)
tg2: While it's -20C out
xdotcommer: weather is changing
MisterE: you so high roller
tg2: It's to much heat for a house
MisterE: in 20 years you;ll have to run an a/c for your February lawn heh
tg2: almost 200,000 W
MisterE: damn
tg2: With darkcoin about 110kw
MisterE: I'm thining of the centralized boilers in NYC that heat several blocks
tg2: You can recycle it
MisterE: as scale of rigs increase a colo facility that makes use of that heat in a similar way would be interesting
tg2: I tried to make a deal with a golf dome to heat it for free over the winter
MisterE needs to learn about darkcoin
MisterE: thats the kind of thinking out of the box I'm talking about!
MisterE: any inroads?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16600 @ 0.00094266 = 15.6482 BTC [+] {3}
MisterE killed the chat :/
ozbot: Auroracoin - Forked and Game Over
cazalla: top kek
Apocalyptic: "Luke is that you?
Apocalyptic: " lol'd
kakobrekla: is it even sha?
Apocalyptic: no idea
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2537 @ 0.00011999 = 0.3044 BTC [+] {2}
VanCleef: iceland is now for sale
VanCleef: thanks auroracoin
MisterE: heh
Apocalyptic: VanCleef, interested by some island land ?
kanzure: hah it's already forked. that's fun.
kanzure: man i've had so many people asking me about it. they all think it's the government.
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