Hide Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2014-01-29 | 2014-01-31 → ↓
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 2000 @ 0.00086058 = 1.7212 BTC [+] {6}
herbijudlestoids: diametric: im not a 3d printing expert sorry :( just sharing the occasional link i think others might find interesting
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 3000 @ 0.00084003 = 2.5201 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1007 @ 0.00084 = 0.8459 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.601 = 1.202 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.56101902 = 2.2441 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.56 = 1.12 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4600 @ 0.00089667 = 4.1247 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 30 @ 0.0489999 = 1.47 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2908 @ 0.00089706 = 2.6087 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5400 @ 0.00089795 = 4.8489 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 23 @ 0.0489999 = 1.127 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.0489999 = 0.294 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20850 @ 0.00089706 = 18.7037 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 3193 @ 0.00007755 = 0.2476 BTC [-] {29}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 8000 @ 0.00007 = 0.56 BTC [-]
gecko_x2: sup :p
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 1000 @ 0.0004805 = 0.4805 BTC [+] {7}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1628 @ 0.00007 = 0.114 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.59496956 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.59496956 = 1.1899 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.59496966 = 1.7849 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 18 @ 0.049 = 0.882 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.59498964 = 2.38 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: 2193847870.17428 | Next Diff in 1081 blocks | Estimated Change: 11.6905% in 6d 15h 3m 41s
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.59498963 = 1.785 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 100 @ 0.00283975 = 0.284 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3586 @ 0.0008973 = 3.2177 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 29 @ 0.59499313 = 17.2548 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 81 @ 0.00571479 = 0.4629 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 58 @ 0.00574599 = 0.3333 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 10 @ 0.02751003 = 0.2751 BTC [-] {2}
herbijudlestoids: whos around
herbijudlestoids: credit cards have versible transactions, bitcoins dont. sometimes reversible transactions are provably useful, and arguably go to consumer piece of mind...discuss
herbijudlestoids: is there space in the bitcoin ecomony for some kind of dispute arbitrage over payments?
herbijudlestoids: obviously theres 2 of 3 style transactions, is that adequate? escrowe?
herbijudlestoids: oh too late, already bitrated.com
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1134 @ 0.00009074 = 0.1029 BTC [-] {3}
ozbot: Porngram
Duffer1: hello
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 20 @ 0.59 = 11.8 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: hi Puffer1
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 29 @ 0.601 = 17.429 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9600 @ 0.00089727 = 8.6138 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8912 @ 0.00089864 = 8.0087 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9250 @ 0.00089706 = 8.2978 BTC [-]
KRS1: Ho
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla lol
Namworld: I think I sent an email inquiring about advertising on Bitbet a few months ago. Don't think I ever got an answer on that, come to think of it.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 9 @ 0.02711112 = 0.244 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 30 @ 0.00574705 = 0.1724 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 20 @ 0.00575643 = 0.1151 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 500 @ 0.00327102 = 1.6355 BTC [-] {13}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 25 @ 0.00545 = 0.1363 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 54 @ 0.00542714 = 0.2931 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.601 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: Namworld that'd be the first time kakobrekla missed one.
ozbot: paracoin
ThickAsThieves: note that google Sites allow an exploit to autofill hidden forms
mircea_popescu: if you run js.
ThickAsThieves: i dunno, something to do with keychain apps
mircea_popescu: you mean last year's chrome vuln ?
ThickAsThieves: no, the keychain app sees "google.com" in the url, and autofills the hidden form, then youre fed a poll or some such other "submit" button
ThickAsThieves: i may be getting the details wrong but that's the gist of it
ThickAsThieves: not sure why paracoin is using goxprice tho
ThickAsThieves: isnt it time to finally cut the cord?
mircea_popescu: cause tvconf is a stubborn self-deluding old timer and etc.
ozbot: Throw Charlie under the bus and wash your hands clean of your biggest advocate
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 500 @ 0.00166114 = 0.8306 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: what a retarded thread
ThickAsThieves: some community...
Duffer1: i thought the luls were over for the night so i tried to sleep
Duffer1: couldn't sleep, now more luls
mircea_popescu: welcome to bitcoin, where the luls never cease.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves it's taaki's thread. what else'd it be
Neil: mircea_popescu: Likely it's been mentioned but bitbet is ~15 hrs behind the blockchain
ThickAsThieves: ah i was trying to suss who was taaki
ThickAsThieves: never knew his forum handle
mircea_popescu: it has ?
mircea_popescu: onoes. kakobrekla ! we're split!
ThickAsThieves: bet No on all the bets!
mircea_popescu: poor kako, prolly went to get his 13 hours of sleep this month
mircea_popescu: result ? Last block: 13 hours 42 minutes ago
ThickAsThieves: taaki is just jealous he had no friends to throw him under a bus, and no bus headed in is direction
Neil: I don't think bitbet gives bettors their true time when it falls behind like this... which is kinda unfair
mircea_popescu: Neil i think it goes by block times
ThickAsThieves: if youre betting 15hours before close, youre probly doing it wrong
mircea_popescu: suppose you bet now. bitbet doesn't know.
Neil: mircea_popescu: I'm 90% sure it doesn't...
mircea_popescu: once the demon restarts and it discovers your bet, it takes the blockstam time.
mircea_popescu: o you are ?
mircea_popescu: well then thanks for bringing it up, shall be checked
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves no but losing 15 hours of weight for no apparent reason hurts across the board
mircea_popescu: anyway, genjix used to think himself important, back when bitcoin consisted of me, some decent programmers which mostly meanwhile left, and a bunch of fucktards, just like him
mircea_popescu: he felt like he's friends with "all of bitcoin", a few exceptions notwithstanding.
ozbot: Penis Will Make You Slap Somebody (must see) - YouTube
mircea_popescu: meanwhile things like interscamgo have been laughed out of the space, and all he's left with is his expertise, which... you know. standup comedyt
ThickAsThieves: UK picks Open Document Format for all government files
Namworld: Okay, I'll say it. Who's genjix?
ThickAsThieves: next headline will be: Oracle Buys OpenOffice
mircea_popescu: ;;google amir taaki wikipedia
gribble: Amir Taaki - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amir_Taaki>; Amir Taaki Interview and #Bitcoin 2013 Wrap Up | Jupiter ...: <http://www.jupiterbroadcasting.com/37516/amir-taaki-bitcoin-2013-plan-b-7/>; Amir Taaki Answers Your Questions About Bitcoin - Slashdot: <http://interviews.slashdot.org/story/11/06/22/1737237/amir-taaki-answers-your-questions- (1 more message)
ThickAsThieves: he has a wiki
Namworld: Ah, Amir
ThickAsThieves: he's Scottish-English Iranian
mircea_popescu: it's better than any uncyclopedia.
ThickAsThieves: he got kicked out of high school for hacking
mircea_popescu: aww shit, they ditched the sasquatch pic.
mircea_popescu: anyone know how to navigate wikipedia history ?
Namworld: ok, I'm out. It's 8 am. It's late.
ThickAsThieves: click View History
ThickAsThieves: top right
ThickAsThieves: "You may be right, but you can't add negative information about living people to articles unless you have a high-quality source. Internet forums do not meet our definition of the term"
ThickAsThieves: "But it's allowed for positive information? "
truffles: -assets seems to dislike ppl i like woot
mircea_popescu: makes sense tho, if you didn't let random doofus self-report all the nice stuff they think about themselves
mircea_popescu: the butthurt would cover wikipedia.
mircea_popescu: truffles that's because you're an idiot.
truffles: ure a small dick
ThickAsThieves: oh no he ditnt!
davout: tumbleweed.wav
mircea_popescu: it's not that small.
truffles: well it might as well be
truffles: u try so hard to be the big dick though
mircea_popescu: ;;google trilema pula mea
gribble: The reasons why Bitcoin securities can't be regulated by ... - Trilema: <http://trilema.com/2012/the-reasons-why-bitcoin-securities-cant-be-regulated-by-the-sec/>; Wilcoxon tests for mean difference - Deakin University: <http://www.deakin.edu.au/buslaw/aef/workingpapers/papers/2011_6.pdf>; Stabilization Effects of Fiscal Policy in Croatia: <http://www.hnb.hr/dub- (1 more message)
mircea_popescu: google u sux.
ozbot: NSFW - Pula mea pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
truffles: blog spam
ThickAsThieves: so what is Bitcoin Foundation's next move after resigning Shrem?
mircea_popescu: it makes a c0k big!
ThickAsThieves: something to help it's image right?
ThickAsThieves: “We are now witnessing the long-awaited arrival of mainstream online casinos into the bitcoin universe.”~Matonis
mircea_popescu: i would bet the next move is some internal drama with someone leaving in a huff.
mircea_popescu: at least that's how it ususally works.
mircea_popescu: "He proposes a shift away from specialist thinking towards a creative society of generalist knowledge workers."
BingoBoingo: Maybe they will find out Vesseness has a bong? or Hearn?
mircea_popescu: ahahaa o gawdy, that wikipedia article rules.
mircea_popescu: Derplandia! An Utopian Future! by A. A. Fucktardaki
ThickAsThieves: a society of clay pot IPOs
ThickAsThieves: “We are not here to engage in a legal debate, we are here to serve up the very first legitimate workaround to the complex online gambling laws in this US market. We are returning to Americans their freedom to choose and giving them their power back!”
mircea_popescu: i wish this happened, seriously. if you could somehow get all the 20something derps their own fucking country...
mircea_popescu: god it would be so great.
mircea_popescu: in a decade or so we'd go on bimbo safari!
truffles: 20something men everywhere
truffles: sounds like a grand idead
mircea_popescu: men no, but bois and retarded girls, pretty much.
punkman1: mircea_popescu: you just need to build a big boat, they'll come willingly
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves "and we are conveniently forgetting to mention the other people who have been doing it for years and have much more volume than we everf had even in fiat"
mircea_popescu: "because business can in fact be built upon self-delusion!"
mircea_popescu: punkman1 yeah, but the problem is their parents wouldn't stay put.
mircea_popescu: which is kind-of sad, really.
ThickAsThieves: i like how he defines We Wanna Break the Law as "engage a legal debate"
mircea_popescu: afaik it's not actually illegal, is it ?
ThickAsThieves: in the US?
ThickAsThieves: if it isnt it will be
truffles: TAT are u still with "the foundation"?
ThickAsThieves: i was never a part
mircea_popescu: wasn't it illegal to process payments ?
ThickAsThieves: i contemplating joining one day
ThickAsThieves: then i didnt
mircea_popescu: one more can of paint you avoided stepping into.
ThickAsThieves: both feet are occupied anyway :)
ThickAsThieves: so if I understand correctly, Cointerra is finally shipping. the 2nd batch of customers getting units along with the 1st batch. The machines are not to spec, but customers get a 15% coupon to buy more of them, as consolation. Refunds in fiat are allowed.
mircea_popescu: that's pretty stellar considering the industry standards.
ThickAsThieves: now that newegg and tigerdirect are selling bitcoin mining kits
ThickAsThieves: it seems a major manufacturer must be contemplating an ASIC soon
mircea_popescu: probably.
mircea_popescu: hopefully nvidia does it.
ThickAsThieves: they may be on a short leash for innovating after these portable gaming things fail
Namworld: Nvidia... miner...
Duffer1: i could see nvidia sha vs amd scrypt
mircea_popescu: manufacture a billion dollar's worth of 100 and 500 watt mining rigs, as stand alone boxes, doing whatever, 5 gh/watt, 2gh/dollar
Namworld: Nvidia Bitcoin Miner...
mircea_popescu: they have the foundries and the engineers to do it.
Namworld: Well one of them is bound to do it eventually
ThickAsThieves: Intel could do 14nm or such
mircea_popescu: amd, nvidia, intel, they can all do it.
Namworld: I mean, the piles of cash thrown at any random new bitcointalk.org user claiming to be developing an ASIC
mircea_popescu: even apple or amazon could do it, if they weren't fucktarded.
ThickAsThieves: or Samsung
punkman: why not AMD?
mircea_popescu: yeah, at least a dozen diff south korean/japanese/hk/etc producers could do it too
ThickAsThieves: AMD is most likely imo
mircea_popescu: punkman i said AMD!
punkman: oh I saw nvidia only
mircea_popescu: unrelatedly : if any one was wondering if a wedding was ever made with the bridemaids in the buff : yes, it has. http://31.media.tumblr.com/26a90c55ec607f6fad54984ba75bd875/tumblr_mimvopGYAZ1ru15g3o1_500.jpg
ThickAsThieves: AMD didnt find a safe harbor in mobile
ThickAsThieves: they need another avenue
asciilifeform: if they weren't fucktarded, they'd do it 1) two years ago 2) embedded in run of unrelated IC, antifused out in consumer ver. 3) powered up silently 4) ip-proxied to look like 100,000 lamers with GPUs.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no they wouldn't do that.
wao-ender: mircea_popescu: seems you have very intelligent police there http://www.mojevideo.sk/video/f8b5/policia_vs_dvere.html
Namworld: looks like a fun wedding
wao-ender: Politia is romanian afaik?
mircea_popescu: politia, yes.
mircea_popescu: can you summarize the vid ?
wao-ender: they can't open doors for 13 minutes.
wao-ender: imho it should be great ad for vendor of secure doors.
mircea_popescu: romanian folklore/jokes usually has the cop as the dummy.
wao-ender: [AD] This door will resists Politia for 13 minutes!
asciilifeform: speaking of which
ozbot: The Domestic Surveillance Directorate
ozbot: New 3D Printer by MarkForged Can Print With Carbon Fiber - Popular Mechanics
ThickAsThieves: ideal for weapons, no?
Namworld: Finally, a printer suitable for those weapons 3d printing blueprint
ThickAsThieves: "If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear."
asciilifeform: let's have /him/ fire with a barrel 'as strong as aluminum', we'll watch.
punkman: is Cody Wilson still doing the 3d-printed gun thing, or is it just Dark Wallets for him now
mircea_popescu: probably just reefer for him now.
mircea_popescu: aluminium is not really that strong, is it ?
mircea_popescu: did he mean duraluminium ?
punkman: there's strong aluminum
Namworld: Imma print myselft a carbon dane axe and a viking helmet (an historically accurate one without horns)
Namworld: Because fuck guns actually
ThickAsThieves: throwing stars and darts for me plz
mircea_popescu: i'll just order dildoes
mircea_popescu: because fuck your wooden horses
asciilifeform: working temperature of printer extruder. max temperature of chamber during firing.
ThickAsThieves: carbon fiber nunchuks!
asciilifeform: seriously, get a desktop CNC mill. it will make anything from a halberg to a schmeisser.
kakobrekla: Namworld, huh? can you tell me which email did you send from. i remember us talking via irc and i dont ignore emails.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform but not by itself.
Namworld: "It even has a higher strength-to-weight ratio than CNC-machined aluminum."
Namworld: My god...
Namworld: One could do many things with such a printer
Namworld: I'm not sure kakobrekla
Namworld: I'm heading off. Doesn't matter for now anyway.
Namworld: Scrat hasn't been around in a while.
ThickAsThieves: impenetrable fortune cookies!
Namworld: Goodbye.
Namworld: TaT... that's a dickish prank.
Namworld: I like it.
ThickAsThieves: road spikes
Duffer1: you could just use a drill in a wood frame for desktop needs
ThickAsThieves: there's some fun
Duffer1: or a dremel
kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> poor kako, prolly went to get his 13 hours of sleep this month
kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> result ? Last block: 13 hours 42 minutes ago
kakobrekla: cause im doing it on hand.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.598 BTC [-]
jurov: ;;bc,tslb
gribble: Error: "bc,tslb" is not a valid command.
jurov: ;;tslb
gribble: Time since last block: 57 seconds
jurov: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 283212 | Current Difficulty: 2.193847870174279E9 | Next Difficulty At Block: 284255 | Next Difficulty In: 1043 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 6 days, 17 hours, 29 minutes, and 48 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 2440229238.49 | Estimated Percent Change: 11.23056
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 254 @ 0.00271007 = 0.6884 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 548 @ 0.00271002 = 1.4851 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 847 @ 0.002701 = 2.2877 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 55 @ 0.00270101 = 0.1486 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2000 @ 0.00007266 = 0.1453 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 2210 @ 0.00044457 = 0.9825 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.62479999 = 1.2496 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 40 @ 0.049 = 1.96 BTC [+]
nubbins`: i'm 32 today :0
kakobrekla: congrats
kakobrekla: many didnt make it this far.
nubbins`: i was about to say "no need, all i did was not die"
asciilifeform: happy bday nubbins`
nubbins`: but you've got a point :(
nubbins`: tyvm
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 10 @ 0.02947999 = 0.2948 BTC [+] {5}
mircea_popescu: sooo... obama to congress "you're fired". congress gives standing ovation.
mircea_popescu: that country is turning into the fucking bitcointalk of politics, i swear.
mircea_popescu: mostly notable for the comedic relief.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6700 @ 0.00089908 = 6.0238 BTC [+]
ozbot: NYDFS Department of Financial Services live meeting on the 28th (today?) and 29 - Pastebin.com
mircea_popescu: if someone still wanted a transcript of the dfs retardation.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 4 @ 0.02989915 = 0.1196 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: Oh, so much missing from that paste.
mircea_popescu: well yes, it's only a few pages.
BingoBoingo: Doesn't even cover the interesting points. Doesn't even seem to make it past to the first pannel to get to the LTC and VanCleef woman going full Amir
mircea_popescu: well... got a full transcript anywhere ?
BingoBoingo: I've got a bunch of notes on notebook paper I'll prolly move online next week. Going to watch the hearings again to make sure nothing especially lulzy was missed.
mircea_popescu: well you know, if you're gonna do a complete one do a complete one
mircea_popescu: that's not a transcript tho, just the collection of written matter submitted.
BingoBoingo: has most of the prepared statements now. Looks like to get a full one for the questions, or at lest the interesting questions I might have to make it
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Here's the lulziest of the prepared statements (was read verbatim) http://www.dfs.ny.gov/insurance/hearing/vchearing/van_cleef.pdf
BingoBoingo: I'll paste it as plaintext
ozbot: dpaste: #1577206
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6700 @ 0.00090009 = 6.0306 BTC [+]
polac: hello i ahve a question please
polac: have*
mircea_popescu: wait, VanCleef was the\re !?
mircea_popescu: polac shoot
polac: thanks
polac: mircea popescu?
polac: bot or human
polac: this is the oficcial acnel for bitbet?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Dunno if it IRC VanClef, but it was the girl's name
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.62479997 = 3.124 BTC [-] {2}
polac: some one eee
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 9 @ 0.62497777 = 5.6248 BTC [+] {3}
BingoBoingo: polac this seems to be the best channel for bitbet
polac: ok i have some questions but i dont see lot of activity here
BingoBoingo: What I don't get about the tesitfying Van Cleef is instead of Bitcoin they wanted to discuss:
BingoBoingo: "a company called COEPTIS is preparing to launch the Global Standard System (System) that will issue a medium of exchange called the Global Standard Currency (Currency). This Currency, which will circulate electronically on a closed settlement platform, will be 100% backed by physical gold, providing for freedom from default and fully protecting the holder’s value."
Troic_: polac, it will come (the activity) or you can just ask, perhaps someone else knows the answer.
BingoBoingo: polac: IRC is a slow medium. Put forward the questions and someone should get to them within an hour or day or so
mircea_popescu: polac yes it is.
mircea_popescu: that's the first time someone wanted to know if im a bot ;/
chetty: you aren't?
deadweasel: it's pretty obvious he is.
assbot: his AI is almost as good as mine
deadweasel: well, he's your bot, assbot
jurov: rofl
deadweasel: AI making AI, what has the world come to?!
polac: ok is related a bet on bitbet.us . if i make a BET that is obvius that will win.. .. how i know how much BTC i will get on reward how i make the calc
jurov: polac have you noticed there is a calculator?
polac: is this BET . that left 7 hours .. to end
jurov: right on the bet page
ozbot: BitBet - Bitcoin Market Capitalization to be above 4.5 billion USD on Feb 1st
polac: yes i know that is a calculator. but i dont know if is the clean amount or total amount
polac: here stas say if i put 1 btc i get ---Yes pays: 0.9904118 BTC ----- No pays: 1.04474976 BTC
polac: so if i put 1 btc i get 0.99 + 1 btc investment i get total 1.99 ?
BingoBoingo: polac: You'd get 0.99 total because of betting so late.
polac: so how much i get? bcz calculators say i get 0.99
polac: how much i can get that is what i wanna know
jurov: 0.99btc
BingoBoingo: polac: That's what you'd get. Betting 1.0 BTC would return to you a total of 0.99 BTC
polac: so intstad of win i loss
polac: 0.1 btc?
BingoBoingo: polac: 0.01 BTC, but yes. Because it is a sure thing.
polac: i undersatnd now so the calculator say the total profit i get included the . amount of the bet i pplace + profit?
deadweasel: polac, minus your late betting
deadweasel: meaning you're too late to make money on this bet if you bet yes and win.
deadweasel: you should probabgly wait until the betting is closed, and place it then.
deadweasel: it seems to work out well for people.
deadweasel: they learn LOADS
jurov: in other words, the weight of your bet is less than bitbet fee
polac: another question iwhen i put the (Send winnings to originating address) i dont need to do nothing more. will be automatly send to the wallet from the money come from
polac: ok so its only good when the weight its high?
jurov: yes, that's the principle, bet early, get more
kakobrekla: get a better rate
kakobrekla: i dont understand the last question re sending winning to originating address
mircea_popescu: <polac> so how much i get? bcz calculators say i get 0.99 << you get exacty what it says, 0.99
mircea_popescu: deadweasel evil boy!
mircea_popescu: polac IF you run a full node wallet, then yes you control the address, and so will be ok.
jurov: polac: you need a wallet that contains actual private keys (such as bitcoin-qt/multibit/electrum)
mircea_popescu: if however you do not run a full node, then you will be in trouble most likely.
mircea_popescu: use a special address to receive.
kakobrekla: well, blockchain.info wallet is client side rite, so that should work too
polac: i use.. electrum client
polac: its ok?
jurov: yes, with electrum you'll be fine with sending to originating address
mircea_popescu: just make sure you don't delete it/lose that wallet in the meanwhile.
kakobrekla: the bad thing about using same address is that you lose stats
kakobrekla: unless you send from same one each time
mircea_popescu: well maybe to him it's a good thing
kakobrekla: i gues
ozbot: Italy shocked at Mafia's fatal hit of 3-year-old boy - Washington Times
mircea_popescu: The boy, Nicola “Coco” Campolongo, age 3, was shot along with his grandfather, Giuseppe Iannicelli, and his grandfather’s companion, age 27, CNN reported.
mircea_popescu: gotta love the fucktarded press. "unprecedented" ? these people have perhaps not seen... i dunno, the godfather ?
mircea_popescu: fucking trilogy debuts by kids being killed.
deadweasel: polac: be sure your bet will make it on-time. check for slow transactions, include a transaction fee.
deadweasel: and don't bet more than you can stand to lose. it's gambling, not investing.
polac: that is the trick on bitbet.i
kakobrekla: also check in bitbet footer if the last block was 14 hrs ago
polac: us
deadweasel: also the same goes for investing
polac: fee shouldbee deduce automatic
deadweasel: you should be deduced automatically
polac: its better .. trading i think
polac: pay outs are very small
deadweasel: not if you're early on the correct side of a bet.
polac: somes of you have won a bet lately
kakobrekla: its fairly easy to do 0 fee tx which will always get included in the first found block
deadweasel: that might require reading a document!
kakobrekla: or i can tell you how its done
mircea_popescu: yes, some people won some bets recently.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 10 @ 0.24310363 = 2.431 BTC
polac: 16-12-13 19:19 Yes 63`178 1.00000000 13ZmZ 1.17699815
polac: 1 b tc.. bet and get .0.17 in 2 months common
polac: trading that btc just 1.. you can get it in 2 or 2.5 btc in 2 monhts
mircea_popescu: there was a guy who got 0.4 BTC trading 200 ltc in twenty minutes yesterday
ThickAsThieves: polac, will you be naming ALL the ways one can increase their coins?
ThickAsThieves: then we can exhaustively paint them against betting
ThickAsThieves: or we could save the time and send you to just-dice
mircea_popescu: but the question is valid, ik wonder what's the best return on a bet on bitbet so far
ThickAsThieves: probly the guys who took my 50btc
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 8 @ 0.0485 = 0.388 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla mind running a coupla queries ?
ThickAsThieves: in dollars, probly the 2bn bet, in bitcoins, probly a BFL bet?
mircea_popescu: in bitcoin ofc.
kakobrekla: well, i gotta take my gf out for a walk nao but when i get back sure
ozbot: The Emerging Bitcoin Civil War
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla lol that sounded pretty hot. take pics.
benkay: so guys when my shitty corner of the world falls apart how do i stay hooked into the btc transaction network?
benkay: how, long term, do i keep computers that can broadcast transactions running?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.24310363 BTC
mircea_popescu: can't you just move like everyone else ?
benkay: there's a bet in there!
benkay: on one side, that internet and computers never return to this area
benkay: on the other that they do
ThickAsThieves: just use a secret/encrypted channe;
benkay: USA: the next africa?
ThickAsThieves: not in our lifetime
mircea_popescu: it's probably going to be illegal to use encryption in the us soon enough
mircea_popescu: (real encryption. you'll have to use apple/google/ms/w/e)
ThickAsThieves: maybe you are right
ThickAsThieves: if the NSA motto is "If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear"...
mircea_popescu: it's already illegal to use encryption in the uk.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.24310363 BTC
mircea_popescu: meanwhile my motto is "fuck with me and maybe you'll live to regret it"
mircea_popescu: i wonder which is more appealing to the average person.
benkay: probably the former.
ThickAsThieves: No Trans Fat is more appealling to the avg person
mircea_popescu: i guess we have a political debate to settle huh.
benkay: political debate?
benkay: more about nature of derpy average humans - most don't care about the tyrant under whom they sweat.
ThickAsThieves: how can we decentralize this problem?
ThickAsThieves: decentralization is always the answer
mircea_popescu: benkay in which case they don't get a vote at all.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04500022 = 0.225 BTC [-]
benkay: mircea_popescu: you're all over today man. first it was what's more appealing to the bell curve and now it's about who gets to vote on a thing.
benkay: i thought there was no voting in the future, just the decisions of btcholders.
twizt: lol
ThickAsThieves: he means voting via decisions
jurov: ;;seen pigeons
gribble: pigeons was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 6 weeks, 4 days, 3 hours, 19 minutes, and 8 seconds ago: <pigeons> should make an exact mpex clone with no new functionality just charge 5% to view it in a bootstrap template
mircea_popescu: LANGUAGE BETRAYS ME!
mircea_popescu: let's learn esperanto.
KRS1: lol esperanto
ThickAsThieves: Mi fartas bone.
KRS1: Lord High Potentate would be proud.
pankkake: "it's probably going to be illegal to use encryption" history repeating itself!
pankkake: I remember the stupid laws we had in France, where anything >128 bit was forbidden
benkay: how is the cardano protected from RNG diddling?
pankkake: of course, only big businesses were affected, the software was there for regular people
asciilifeform: benkay: if you can be more specific, you'll get a more interesting answer.
benkay: othis mid-delivery interception of computer bits and pieces to put hardware on 'em before they hit the data center
benkay: argh
benkay: i'm thinking about this mid-delivery interception of computer bits and pieces to put hardware on 'em before they hit the data center in a fashion that the end-customer is generally never wiser
pankkake: hmm… how about a seal?
asciilifeform: pankkake: seals inspire unjustified confidence
asciilifeform: the art of forging seals is centuries old.
benkay: what kind of seal actually works? i'm aware of any.
benkay: unaware*
pankkake: I don't have any knowledge of a foolproof seal
benkay: so what's the point?
deadweasel: feelings
pankkake: well there mihgt be
deadweasel: want to feel secure
pankkake: perhaps ship the device in two parts?
benkay: man i don't wanna 'feel' secure!
benkay: i want to know how NSA plans to address the in-shipment diddling of computer bits by fiat organizations.
asciilifeform: pankkake: there are two identical rngs (removable.) each is an analogue device, with convenient probe points and a very simple circuit (29 parts, 26 of them passives)
pankkake: I was thinking of some sort of cryptographic seal; you'd have to activate the device in some way
pankkake: of course, I have no idea if it can work
asciilifeform: FW is signed, and users will be encouraged to suck it in and verify the sig
asciilifeform: each unit will also come with a set of high-res photographs of its internals, signed with my personal key.
pankkake: well, that was the best I could come up with when thinking about "signing" the hardware
asciilifeform: the only real defence against an elaborate fake is to actually understand the function of the device
asciilifeform: the way a Pashtun understands his Kalash.
pankkake: it won't prevent tampering by highly qualified bad guys
asciilifeform: a sufficiently qualified enemy deserves your arse.
ThickAsThieves: put anthrax inside, problem solved
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> a sufficiently qualified enemy deserves your arse. <<
mircea_popescu: only if "qualified" = his q - his q.
mircea_popescu: i mean his q - your q.
pankkake: the future is drone delivery with complete video feed of the fly path, with blockchain time proofs!
pankkake: hm, I'm not sure the second part solves anything
pankkake: video feed would be sent to the expeditor, obviously
asciilifeform: there is no 100% defence, even in principle, against a world-class forger
asciilifeform: one can take photos, sufficiently detailed to include imperfections of the pcb, solder joints, etc. and sign them
asciilifeform: but this requires the user to actually give a damn
asciilifeform: and sit with a jeweler's loupe, etc.
pankkake: is there any way to take pictures in a reproducible way?
asciilifeform: pankkake: it depends what you mean by 'reproducible'
pankkake: the images would then be comparable by a machine
asciilifeform: if you are considering a machine for the comparison, you are in a state of sin.
benkay: there is also the glitter fingernail polish approach
ThickAsThieves: it could be done sorta
asciilifeform: the idiots are 'wired' almost certainly stole that one from this channel.
ThickAsThieves: get a lightbox, calibrate the camera mount placement
pankkake: that was my idea, yes
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 90 @ 0.24310363 = 21.8793 BTC
ozbot: octopus Mike Hearn defaced bitcoinBull Inaba QuantPlus Raoul Duke cryptoa - Pastebin.com
pankkake: interestingly I had Mike Hearn without knowing anything about his function
pankkake: function as in "official title"
ThickAsThieves: someone's ignore list?
pankkake: mine
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves pankkake's idea of a blog.
pankkake: haha
pankkake: short term project is to stop forums and blog more
mircea_popescu: it DOES have css, so.
pankkake: I basically replaced a forum I got banned from by another
ThickAsThieves: kako should just add a blog section to the #b-a website
ThickAsThieves: then let channers post
mircea_popescu: so i just crafted a double bacon burger. sadly, it can't be eaten.
pankkake: you can create a "planet"
mircea_popescu: dude this isn't such a horrid idea.
mircea_popescu: post via assbot, only let ppl in its wot post.
ThickAsThieves: itd work way better than all of us trying to start our own thing
mircea_popescu: collective blog.
benkay: sounds socialist
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves it'd work cheaper, not sure better.
pankkake: benkay: yeah. that's why planet's better; everyone blogs how he sees fits, the planet aggregates
ThickAsThieves: the marketer in me thinks itd be better all around
ThickAsThieves: save trilema
asciilifeform: next thing we know, we're all moving into a cult commune with a hundred years of canned food and auto-turrets...
ThickAsThieves: which does pretty good
benkay: auto turrets for all!
pankkake: so readers go to one place if they wish, but bloggers are where they want
ThickAsThieves: so a feed reader, curated
ThickAsThieves: rather, filtered
ThickAsThieves: but curated sounds so centralixed
benkay: i don't want readers who can't subscribe to an rss feed on their own
benkay: shit, i don't want readers who don't curate their own reading lists!
ThickAsThieves: yknow chrome doesnt make it easy
pankkake: I know a blog that has *only* a RSS feed
ThickAsThieves: i know blogs that dnt have em at all
benkay: cryptome doesn't have an rss feed for that matter
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> next thing we know, we're all moving into a cult commune with a hundred years of canned food and auto-turrets... >>> and nudity for womenz under 35 ?
pankkake: maddox.xmission.com used to not have one, too
ThickAsThieves: you could also implement the trilema blog fees
ThickAsThieves: to support assbot's family
ThickAsThieves: and the writers
mircea_popescu: anyway, buncha people have blogs, which imo is the best thing.
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: would be interesting to see a widget like 'metafilter' with a 1btc entry.
mircea_popescu: but for the lazy bums a global stopgap can't hurt
pankkake: "Assets Assimilated"
mircea_popescu: this way we get best of both worlds, all sorts of social phenomena on shared blogs
ThickAsThieves: in this sense i am indeed a lazy bum
ThickAsThieves: occassionally an urge to tell a tale
ThickAsThieves: but to make a blog?
ThickAsThieves: to get readers?
mircea_popescu: in other words : public fucking and private fucking aren't even the same fucking. they don't replace each other.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves forget the readers, who cares.
pankkake: creating a blog is easy. wordpress.com, done
ThickAsThieves: i happen to believe that art is for the viewer, not the creator
mircea_popescu: this novel nuttery with the readers. who cared, cca 1970, when telling a joke, how many people in the office were gathered round ?
mircea_popescu: it's like "o dan's joke was so much better, even sammy from the mailroom was here"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.620012 = 3.1001 BTC [-] {3}
ThickAsThieves: its sharing of experience, it has value beyond its own existence
ThickAsThieves: thus the more it is consumed, the more impact it has
benkay: moreover, its mostly the firm's partners that the joke is intended for, not the typists and accountants.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves maybe your readers all live in 2200. how do yu know ?
mircea_popescu: art can be for the viewer, but that doesn't necessarilyu mean google analytics is meaningful.
ThickAsThieves: i thought you were more existential?
ThickAsThieves: like you care about 2200
mircea_popescu: i don't. i also don't care about readers as such.
ThickAsThieves: i also believe in creating an environment of facilitation
mircea_popescu: we're discussing your view here
ThickAsThieves: if you want a flower to grow, maybe plant a seed
ThickAsThieves: hell, maybe you even water it!
mircea_popescu: dude, if you got a seed plant it already, forget the flower. what, keep it in your pocket till it becomes lint ?
ThickAsThieves: well i did say it was a lazy idea
benkay: what's the best time to plant a tree?
benkay: twenty years ago.
benkay: what's the second best time to plant a tree?
benkay: today.
mircea_popescu: the big loser in all of this is, of course,
ThickAsThieves: not 19 years ago?
mircea_popescu: it's like...
mircea_popescu: "hey, implement this thing ? " "may i spend some time with my girl ? " "ok"
mircea_popescu: comes back... hey, we got 43987593485 more things to implement.
mircea_popescu: DARE YOU take off ever again ?
ThickAsThieves: then he gets mad at the girl "see what happens!"
mircea_popescu: poor chick ends up with irish sunglasses...
mircea_popescu: "all i did is walk!"
ThickAsThieves: walk yourself next time!
mircea_popescu: here's the leash, you got hands, go walk!
ThickAsThieves: <asciilifeform> ThickAsThieves: would be interesting to see a widget like 'metafilter' with a 1btc entry. <<<< i recall at least a couple "idea men" saying theyd make similar things
ThickAsThieves: also, i think mjr has a micro blog payment thingy
ThickAsThieves: blottery?
ThickAsThieves: incentivized reading or such
ThickAsThieves: in the past i suggested similar,
pankkake: I used to have a bot posting RSS feed updates to channels, but it was some Ruby crap and blew up
ThickAsThieves: run a service that holds like .1 btc for you in an account, it runs a chrome plugin,
pankkake: but that kind of stuff is quite useful
ThickAsThieves: it autopays in blog fees while urfing
ThickAsThieves: and gives you a popup if over a certain price
ThickAsThieves: to approve
ThickAsThieves: frictionless micropayments
pankkake: that's how the web should have been
pankkake: instead of advertising everywhere
ThickAsThieves: well it will
mircea_popescu: as i said! fucktards were allowed on the web before payments were put in, fucked everyhing up
ThickAsThieves: the advertising thing is almost fully milked
pankkake: isn't advertising one of the first things to be cut, when companies have financial troubles?
ThickAsThieves: small biz
ThickAsThieves: not big biz
pankkake: oh, I thought it was
ThickAsThieves: its backwards, yeah
ThickAsThieves: small biz cuts the thing they need most
ThickAsThieves: its very difficult for small biz to interpret value from marketing
mircea_popescu: or to avoid being scammed by marketeers.
ThickAsThieves: was my next point
mircea_popescu: last thing a small biz needs is to try and fucking compete with the government-backed wasters.
ThickAsThieves: they are bombarded with "opportunities"
ThickAsThieves: a small biz gets burned repeatedly
mircea_popescu: whenever i hear of a start-up working on a superbowl ad...
ThickAsThieves: and then when they finally bump into someone that can actually help them, they have lost all faith
mircea_popescu: speaking of which, after talking about advertising yest i got some pretty interesting info... seems superbowl is also pretty much dead.
mircea_popescu: they can barely sell tickets anymore.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.615 = 2.46 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: bitbet shall transcend sports after all then
ThickAsThieves: bets on superbowl advertisoing revenue are way more fun anyway
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 60 @ 0.04899999 = 2.94 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 30 @ 0.00350877 = 0.1053 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: "My name is Manthan, but you can call me nahtnam."
mircea_popescu: people today!
mircea_popescu: and unrelatedly... "50 percent of physicians reporting that they’ve consulted wikipedia for information on health conditions."
mircea_popescu: nofucking woder health insurance is so expensive.
ThickAsThieves: the other 50% use webmd
twizt: time to pretend to be a doctor
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 10 @ 0.24310363 = 2.431 BTC
mircea_popescu: i imagine for every person getting scammed by some bitcoin ceo
mircea_popescu: there's 100 or 1k patients beinbg scammed by some webdoctor
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.6 = 2.4 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.6 = 1.2 BTC [-]
benkay: far better to have a friend who's been through the american nursing training
benkay: than visit a hospital and have to trust some 'doctor'
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04500022 = 0.225 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04500022 = 0.225 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.24310363 = 0.4862 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 5 @ 0.02989907 = 0.1495 BTC [-]
ozbot: Assets Assimilated
ThickAsThieves: the url is a bit... abrasive
pankkake: ~10 minute setup :)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.58301004 BTC [-]
pankkake: I'd take any virtual host given, say planet.bitcoin-assets.com
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 6 @ 0.02989907 = 0.1794 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 6 @ 0.02989907 = 0.1794 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: assass lol
pankkake: ;;ud buttbuttinate
gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=buttbuttinate | buttbuttinate. The word "assassinate" after it has been mangled by a particularly stupid censor. It is a shame we still aren't sure who buttbuttinated JFK. He was in  ...
ozbot: Urban Dictionary: buttbuttinate
ThickAsThieves: is there a transcript of all the NY hearings?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20233 @ 0.00089612 = 18.1312 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 417 @ 0.00089601 = 0.3736 BTC [-]
ozbot: Gavin Andresen ’88 is Chief Scientist at the Bitcoin Foundation and lead developer of the Bitcoin
ThickAsThieves: this from a bitcoin magazine ad: http://bankinnovation.info/
ThickAsThieves: invitation only
ThickAsThieves: but advertises on bitcoin mag?
ThickAsThieves: Bank Innovation 2014 will be a forum for executives and innovators to collaborate and share ideas to improve customer acquisition and retention through new products and strategies.
ThickAsThieves: ha there is a different Neo presenting
ThickAsThieves: Navin is founder and CEO of Neo, a startup that aims to disrupt credit risk assessment of thin-credit and sub-prime consumers by leveraging alternative credit data.
pankkake: Neo & Buzzwords
mircea_popescu: apparently all noobs have to go through the same wringer
mircea_popescu: be they princes or paupers.
mircea_popescu: whatever, bitcoin is here to cater.
ozbot: Perkinsnacht - WSJ.com
ThickAsThieves: i learned a new word, commentariat, thanks wsj!
deadweasel: chief scientist?!?!
KRS1: sup, chief
ThickAsThieves: chief scientist get many wampum
kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> but the question is valid, ik wonder what's the best return on a bet on bitbet so far
kakobrekla: 5758.8%
mike_c: anticipation..
mike_c: link??
mike_c: who won the lotto?
kakobrekla: well i guess anyone can compile this list since all the stuff is public
mike_c: hm, but hard to tell which bet the wagers were on, right?
mike_c: ^ derp
kakobrekla: Bet #1834 on #277: 0.01000000 B in, 0.58588048 B out, 0.57588048 B gain (5758.8%)
mike_c: yeah, i glanced over the "on #277" somehow
ozbot: BitBet - BitBet haxxed in 2013
kakobrekla: and more
ozbot: BitBet - BitBet haxxed in 2013
ozbot: BitBet - BitBet haxxed in 2013
mike_c: 277 was a special bet though
kakobrekla: still no
kakobrekla: a wait you cant do that
ozbot: BitBet - BitBet haxxed in 2013
kakobrekla: ok well we can exclude that one if ya want
kakobrekla: if you throw it oout
kakobrekla: you get
kakobrekla: Bet #161 on #42: 0.03000000 B in, 0.69300000 B out, 0.66300000 B gain (2210%)
mike_c: that was a house bet. i'm curious what the best gain on a user bet was. i'll look through.
kakobrekla: cant satisfy assets
mike_c: a demanding bunch.
ThickAsThieves: that's best in %, what's best in coin qty?
kakobrekla: but house bet 'out' can go to user mike_c
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 33 @ 0.02957418 = 0.9759 BTC [-] {4}
mike_c: true
kakobrekla: ThickAsThieves hm you mean most coin won or biggest gain?
kakobrekla: well gains you got ther
kakobrekla: you want biggest bet or what
ThickAsThieves: most coin won
ThickAsThieves: by one bet
kakobrekla: so biggest gain in btc amount, not by percentage
kakobrekla: or biggest 'out' ?
ThickAsThieves: biggest gain
ThickAsThieves: i can probly just put this in a spreadsheet and sort
kakobrekla: 1 sec
mike_c: this might be it. over 1000% return, not bad.
ozbot: BitBet - Higgs boson support
ThickAsThieves: Bet #496 on #7: 100.00000000 B in198.99762832 B out98.99762832 B gain (99%)
mike_c: yeah, but you have to multiply the BTC x the exchange rate at the time :)
kakobrekla: i think.
ThickAsThieves: idc about exchange rate
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 5 @ 0.074 = 0.37 BTC [-]
ozbot: BitBet - BFL will deliver ASIC devices before March 1st
ThickAsThieves: that guy
ThickAsThieves: 321.65447788btc gain
kakobrekla: now you can follow him
ThickAsThieves: looks all funded from MPEx
kakobrekla: dunno talk to mpex re that :)
ozbot: Bitcoin Address 1LSLFzSMD1ZDSiNV1bvJm9QNj1EhnC49eg
kakobrekla: whats that?
ThickAsThieves: the IN tx
kakobrekla: anyway, if someone wanted to hide something, it isnt particularly hard
ThickAsThieves: from mpexy wallet to bitbet
kakobrekla: so someone made a bet with making a withdrawal on mpex
kakobrekla: >I fully believe we need to hire a PR manager, as my time can be much more effectively used actually working on things as opposed to maintaining this thread.
kakobrekla: doing what zactly, jerking off to free porn?
ThickAsThieves: who said that?
kakobrekla: that hard?
kakobrekla: the name starts with garr and ends with retard
ThickAsThieves: oh, he still talks?
pankkake: I know but I read it before. anyway, those PR guys are useless if they're just remote random forum users with no info
ThickAsThieves: useless in the honest sense, at least
pankkake: what he really needs is a guy to take over the business
kakobrekla: he needs to be raped by niggers.txt, not a pr person.
pankkake: in the honest sense?
ThickAsThieves: well hiring a PR is a great move for a scammer
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 12 @ 0.02941176 = 0.3529 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: pankkake there is no business there
ThickAsThieves: especially if you hire a populare forumite
kakobrekla: nothing to 'take over'
kakobrekla: except pile of shit and scam
kakobrekla: whod want taht
pankkake: the mining hardware, the coins
ThickAsThieves: ans especiallu if hiring means getting paid in shares
kakobrekla: he lost a bunch of coin
kakobrekla: doing stupid shit
kakobrekla: he baiscally defaulted
pankkake: well, yeah
kakobrekla: and will pay out of his own pocket, he says
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 11 @ 0.02820002 = 0.3102 BTC [-] {2}
kakobrekla: but the diff will go to 50410 billion trillion zillion
kakobrekla: and he wont pay shit.
ThickAsThieves: i guess these scams will exist til the diff calms down
ThickAsThieves: its just too easy
kakobrekla: >alincoln, I do realize that that would be the best case scenario for you. However, please acknowledge that I am taking a heavy loss on this one, so please accept a full refund of your initial investment Plus all dividends up to the last one that was paid. With that case, you've still made more money than just holding coins, which is pretty damn good.
ThickAsThieves: even now, people paying .65 for AM shares?!
kakobrekla: sounds zactly like inaba
kakobrekla: whos dick he was sucking not a few months ago.
kakobrekla: maybe sperms got in his brain
kakobrekla: and now this.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: <pankkake> what he really needs is a guy to take over the business << pankkake has a point there.
mircea_popescu: buncha derps with no business want to hire pr ? pr to do what. what they need is someone to take over their LIFE
mircea_popescu: like, a parent.
pankkake: well, given his age…
mircea_popescu: "the internet is not your daycare, ma'am"
mircea_popescu: instead of "protecting children"
mircea_popescu: fuck children. protect the adults.
kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> <pankkake> what he really needs is a guy to take over the business << pankkake has a point there. << no biz, no point.
pankkake: why do you guys hate him so much though?
deadweasel: maybe you should start S.BDEV, offering consultants for a % of business improvement profits.
mircea_popescu: i dun hate him.
ThickAsThieves: i dont cqare enough to hate
mircea_popescu: deadweasel cheaper to just remake their "busness" properly.
ThickAsThieves: but i even tried leveling with him privately
deadweasel: oh ya
mircea_popescu: nobody goes around fixing bad hamburgers som,eone overcooked
ThickAsThieves: and all he did was beg to have his trust fixed
kakobrekla: its just the most straight forward scamfest to troll
ThickAsThieves: and when i said no, he negrated me
ThickAsThieves: just a scammer
kakobrekla: i thought that middle girl has amish beard for a sec
ThickAsThieves: hehe me too
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.62280186 BTC [+]
ozbot: Devotional Sex
mircea_popescu: it's a splendid idea, what. chicks getting dorks to lap them up and drool a lot.
punkman: "Lite Devotional Sex is for men who like most things about Devotional Sex, but are unwilling to meet the tough ejaculation restrictions of full Devotional Sex. "
mircea_popescu: you know, for the record : as weird as it may seem, this has been mainstream sexuality since about queen victoria up until 1970-1980.
lippoper: what is up with the cars in subway?
mircea_popescu: only the introduction of effective cheap contraception and the rise of porn broke it up and sent the woman back on her knees
lippoper: kakobrekla
kakobrekla: lippoper i wont spoil the fun.
ThickAsThieves: it's reverting
ThickAsThieves: men want their mommies back
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 78 @ 0.0056 = 0.4368 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: Vault of Satoshi, 24 h Trading volume - Imgur
mircea_popescu: certainly has a solid bedrock of interest.
mircea_popescu: and tbh... nttawwi.
ThickAsThieves: ;;ud nttawwi
gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/add.php | Write for a large audience. Lots of people will read this, so give some background information. Don't name your friends. We'll reject inside jokes and definitions ...
mircea_popescu: not that there's anything wrong with it
benkay: here's to setting women back on their knees
benkay: mine's crocheting a 'kneeling rug'
mircea_popescu: benkay careful you don't bit more than you can chew :D womenz can be a handful.
benkay: dem hardwood floors
benkay: yeah man i know!
kakobrekla: womenz can be a handful. < is that a handjob reference?
KRS1: Bait:
benkay: but the most handfully they've ever gotten with me was when i wasn't regularly putting them on their knees.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla how was the walk anyway
kakobrekla: very snowy
kakobrekla: got bout 40cm here
mircea_popescu: it's pleasant here, like maybe 5.
kakobrekla: its nice, clean and quiet
kakobrekla: reminds of apple too much.
mircea_popescu: lol KRS1 you get points for clever shilling at least.
KRS1: .bait
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 9 @ 0.58279556 = 5.2452 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.580258 = 1.7408 BTC [-] {3}
ozbot: Dogecoin and Quarkcoin Hot, Other Altcoins Not, on First Day Vault of Satoshi Trading – Digital Cu
lippoper: 24hours in Vault of Satoshi | Some noteworthy statistics:
lippoper: 88% of trading was performed in USD, Bitcoin was the most traded crypto, combining for $19.4k, or 48% of the total dollar volume. In a not-too-distant 2nd was Dogecoin, combining for $14.1k, or 35% of the total volume. No other cryptos came remotely close. Litecoin was a distant 4th, posting just $2100 in total dollar volume.
mircea_popescu: why is this noteworthy ?
lippoper: That's what the article said
lippoper: Are you telling me the news is lieing to me?
lippoper: lulz
pankkake: how do you get fiat in and out of VoS?
mircea_popescu: im telling you there's no way to distinguish random scammy "exchange" #854687 from all the others and nobody really cares what alt coin traded five grand more than which other altcoin
lippoper: cool
lippoper: pankkake, they have a verification system
lippoper: takes 3 days for bank transfers to clear
pankkake: so it's bank transfers. good
mircea_popescu: you in any way involved?
mircea_popescu: anyone here know the DrahogErusiel forum character incidentally ?
lippoper: no just heard about it yesterday
lippoper: that VOS is based in Canada, where they are treating virtual currencies as a commodity
lippoper: so it should be legal and taxable over there
mircea_popescu: commodities are taxed in canada ?
lippoper: aren't all commodities taxed?
mircea_popescu: i think you may be confused.
mircea_popescu: dja mean like a sales tax ?
KRS1: fawk lippoper nice bait..much love
lippoper: yeah
mircea_popescu: perhaps. all previous canadian exchanges ended up turning kinda shady so it never really got tested.
lippoper: KRS1 wasn't as good as your last one... ;-)
KRS1: i'll trade ya
mircea_popescu: nubbins` you there ? or anyone wanna escrow some painting comission for me ?
lippoper: mp, i'm not sure how it all works to be honest, but from what I understand Canada gives businesses more confidence to deal in virtual currencies because at least they've defined it as a commodity.
KRS1: mircea_popescu: I have not yet been rated
deadweasel: nubbins`: you declaring your btc?
twizt: nicee
twizt: only the one in the middle and left
pankkake: I'd take middle and right
KRS1: Mmm nice
deadweasel: i'm using my imagination (at work), i'll take the top 6
KRS1: left boobs too big
pankkake: no such thing
KRS1: deadweasel: theres left mid and right
KRS1: i like mid and right
deadweasel: it's like i'm 13 again!
lippoper: i'll take one for the team and grab the big boobed girl on the left
deadweasel: kind man, lippoper
lippoper: such wingman
mircea_popescu: the fountain of ircyouth
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.04899999 = 0.196 BTC [+]
lippoper: very motorboat
KRS1: lol
KRS1: wonder what sex games can be driven by btc
Dimsler_: i tried to buy pimpcoin
Dimsler_: from the creater
Dimsler_: refused to sell it to me
twizt: lol
KRS1: need something with the allure of sex, addiction of dice and the ease of payment of BTC.
twizt: win a escort KRS1
Dimsler_: to have all the whores and johns using it?
twizt: box bet for escorts
KRS1: Heroin delivery by late night Bait?
twizt: fill the box
twizt: winner gets 3 hrs
twizt: with XYZ pornstar
twizt: = business
twizt: LOL
Dimsler_: sex industry is going to be the next step for btc
KRS1: not bad i have some contacts for that hmm
KRS1: just local tho
twizt: use a site like eros
mircea_popescu: sex industry is kinda thick, kinda dead and doesn't really need a special coin
mircea_popescu: nor could they use it.
Dimsler_: pimpcoin is genious
KRS1: i know the guy who bought bitcoin.xxx
Dimsler_: if you went on the backpage
twizt: international yo
Dimsler_: and started advertising it to girls
Dimsler_: you'd probably get some users
Dimsler_: imagine if your a whore
Dimsler_: and offer to take btc?
Dimsler_: imagine the traffic you'd get
twizt: lol
Dimsler_: from the advertising alone
twizt: pay ur hoes with pimp coin
Dimsler_: it'll be like overstock.com
KRS1: mircea_popescu: the porn industry does NOT have a way to take micropayments
Dimsler_: except no shitty lawnchairs
assbot: 123!
mircea_popescu: KRS1 or any product those micropayments'd be for.
KRS1: damn
KRS1: i guess
Dimsler_: mircea_popescu, in most countries whores have pimps
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 68 @ 0.00283294 = 0.1926 BTC [+] {3}
Dimsler_: and a smart pimp should be on the btc bandwagon
Dimsler_: for monetary control of his steed of whores
mircea_popescu: pimps will take anything you pay them.
Dimsler_: think about it, they can't skim from the pimp
Dimsler_: the pimp controls the transaction
mircea_popescu: you ever been one ?
Dimsler_: he can chronologically time stamp the whores whereabouts
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 685 @ 0.00283576 = 1.9425 BTC [+] {3}
Dimsler_: no
mircea_popescu: well, do you hang out / go drinking with any ?
twizt: KRS1 are u a dev?
Dimsler_: guys that run girls?
Dimsler_: i try not to associate with the dreges of society
Dimsler_: if thats what you're implying
mircea_popescu: then why do you try to solve their problems ?
Dimsler_: for my own personal gain obviously
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 37 @ 0.0028399 = 0.1051 BTC [+]
Dimsler_: to collect me 3% on pimpcoin
Dimsler_: or other
mircea_popescu: yes, but the problem is it all stems from your own personal delusion, i'd say.
Dimsler_: greed is my motivational factor
Dimsler_: which other ones did you want me to have?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 65 @ 0.00284 = 0.1846 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: well, that's fine, but it doesn't help in this angle.
Dimsler_: i love all the preaching bitcoiners how they are going to be saving farmers in argentina or africa
mircea_popescu: anyway : pimps will take whatever the customer pays.
Dimsler_: fact is btcs main use will be for illicit purposes
Dimsler_: ofcourse he will
mircea_popescu: bitcoin is interesting for the student/teen that doubles as a hooker on her own
twizt: hookercoin
mircea_popescu: because that way she can't get caught, not really, and moreover she gets the crowd she likes
twizt: has it been made yet?
twizt: LOL
mircea_popescu: (ie, white dorks/nerds)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 50 @ 0.00284999 = 0.1425 BTC [+]
Dimsler_: well bitcoin is for anyone who doesn't want to A) have a problem with asset seizure B) wants to hide there activity financially C) want to launder there proceeds
Dimsler_: so why wouldn't the pimp facilitate the usage of bitcoin
mircea_popescu: so the last thing a pimp wants is crypto.
mircea_popescu: the pimp and the govt have in fact the exact same interests :
mircea_popescu: a stable of cattle they're exploiting.
Dimsler_: ofcourse but the pimp is operating within his own brutalizing operation
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 80 @ 0.0028462 = 0.2277 BTC [-] {2}
Dimsler_: outside of the norms of the government criminal gang
Dimsler_: hes not paying taxing or utilize the court system for conflict dispute
twizt: government = real mafia
twizt: lol
ozbot: Damian Marley - Welcome To Jamrock - YouTube
twizt: 100% racket
Dimsler_: well mircea_popescu is correct
Dimsler_: countries are giant farms
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 70 @ 0.0028399 = 0.1988 BTC [-]
Dimsler_: they have the slaves, the brutalizing class, the high preists, and the farm keepers
mircea_popescu: anyway, more's the point : i been trying to get the fucktarded girls on crypto for 2 years.
mircea_popescu: they're dumb as rocks, lazy as a limp cock and proud like peacocks.
mircea_popescu: it's slow going, and in the end who the fuck cares.
Dimsler_: thats why a simple pimpcoin interface
mircea_popescu: lead that linked thread, you'll get the gist of it.
the20year: Feb 3rd for RentalStarter on HL
KRS1: The grass is greener on the other side.
ozbot: Julian Marley - Boom draw - YouTube
KRS1: lippoper: ^^ for you ganja man
lippoper: nice thanks mon
pankkake: the tomatoes are more attractive than the girl
twizt: fake tits
lippoper: aww how fappable
pankkake: nice!
mircea_popescu: nice tomatoes.
lippoper: yay dogecoin has reached coinmarketcap.com's #5 position
lippoper: oh wait
lippoper: slipped back to 6
pankkake: sometimes Nxt breaks, too
mircea_popescu: considering ripples are #2 there... lol.
lippoper: I bet the redhead is the hottest and you can't see any of her assets
pankkake: she seems to have the biggest
lippoper: I think i was right
twizt: cant see any of that
twizt: lol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 35 @ 0.02995081 = 1.0483 BTC [+] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.24310363 BTC
ozbot: [CRYPTO-TRADE] Crypto-trade.com IPO and official thread
mircea_popescu: so much fail
Dimsler_: sorry i'm back
benkay: y'all made me strip the babe down and lose like 2 hours of workable time
KRS1: HAHA
benkay: downsides of the home office
benkay: what was i doing again?
benkay: "WOMAN MORE COFFEE"
ozbot: Our book gives you ★ PRIVACY ★ and ★ PRIZES ★
Dimsler_: lol contest
Dimsler_: honestly that entire forum is a den of theives, liars, and fraudsters
Dimsler_: mircea_popescu, what did they sell btct.co for anyway/
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8850 @ 0.00089601 = 7.9297 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: sold ? it was never sold.
mircea_popescu: it just shut down.
dub: What a viscous cycle.
Apocalyptic: he's willing to sell it at least
Neil: mircea_popescu: Seems I was right - bitbet gives you weight based on when bitbet processes the bet, not when the bet went in the blockchain... which is not good for extended downtime
herbijudlestoids: here is the distribution of 10 tick log normalised returns in MPOE for the last 2 days http://imgur.com/bGRhQW5
herbijudlestoids: looks like a good skew
pizzaman1337: 2 days isn't much of a sample size though, is it?
herbijudlestoids: similar formation to the 1 tick returns i plotted yesterday, seems like there is plenty of room for speculators
mircea_popescu: Neil yep
herbijudlestoids: pizzaman1337: all i got so far :) but youre right small sample size
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids looks remarkably centered tbh
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: returns definitely seem to skew positively, the distribution does not show the commonly taken levy form that i usually see, more like poisson distribution
mircea_popescu: virginal
herbijudlestoids: i want to construct some kind of benchmark index from the different assets and use that to build information ratios etc
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids i mean, for prices to distribute normally it'd mean there;s not much meta activity going on
mircea_popescu: ie, virginal.
azi`: does anyone happen to have any experience with cryptostocks.com?
herbijudlestoids: financial timeseries vary rarely distribute normally
mircea_popescu: azi` yes. it's a scam.
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids yeah.
azi`: mircea_popescu: why is it?
herbijudlestoids: anyway these are just play charts until more data comes, just to get myself familiar with ingesting it and processing it...
mircea_popescu: see for instance the sad story of their own selfipo, linked an hour ago. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-01-2014#468657
pankkake: it's another one
pankkake: CipherTrade, CryptoTrade, CryptoStocks
mircea_popescu: ow fuck.
azi`: so much of these sites these days
ozbot: BTCInve
azi`: so many scams..
mircea_popescu: bad link azi. hang a second.
ozbot: [CRYPTOSTOCKS] Vircurex [VCX] - Going public
mircea_popescu: there's tons of other stuff, this one is funny because the guy running it pretty much stole each and every possible way.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 51 @ 0.00584957 = 0.2983 BTC [+] {5}
herbijudlestoids: sounds like old mrs clinton will be the next dem candidate
lewicki: tough act to follow...
mircea_popescu: she doesn't even get the benefit of pms
mircea_popescu: lol i see goat is putting a lot of effort into perhaps a comeback.
mircea_popescu: that should go over well.
mircea_popescu: Neil you getting pm at all ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 9 @ 0.04534966 = 0.4081 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: Dilbert comic strip for 01/30/2014 from the official Dilbert comic strips archive.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.24310363 = 0.4862 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 23 @ 0.03200207 = 0.736 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 22 @ 0.03200182 = 0.704 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 55 @ 0.02687298 = 1.478 BTC [-] {8}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 15 @ 0.02511116 = 0.3767 BTC [-] {2}
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: if the trading volume of MPex picks up considerably, will you still be streaming orders via assbot?
jurov: herbijudlestoids: assbot already aggregates orders
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04899989 = 0.245 BTC [+]
jurov: at least on his chan
jurov: but #assets-trades could get into trouble cuz flooding
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.04899992 = 0.196 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: Selling 4.13M stolen DogeCoins
dub: cant put anything past these shibes
KRS1: those dirty dogs
pankkake: scammers scamming scammers
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids it already has picked up considerably.
mircea_popescu: dub remarkable how calous, 3rd world teh forum has become.
dub: uh, lol?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5980 @ 0.00090133 = 5.39 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: dude is back in there bumping his shit, not a care in the world etc.
dub: like isk, doge has an implied level of lawlessness
dub: lawl'essness too
mircea_popescu: which just happens to be over 9000
mircea_popescu: anyway, teh diids pushing it should be just about running out of suckerpool. should be lulzy to see it unwind.
jurov: verily, they should build drones and take it inbetween them somewhere in desert
nubbins`: mircea_popescu: 4 hours too late, but i'm here now!
mircea_popescu: nubbins` you know that guy ?
nubbins`: which guy? not 100% caught up
mircea_popescu: DrahogErusiel
mircea_popescu: forum painter dood
nubbins`: ah, don't know him, but those paintings he's selling look amazing
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
mircea_popescu: well he's too clueless to know me, so do you wanna escrow his fee ?
twizt: lol amazing
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 68 @ 0.005 = 0.34 BTC
ThickAsThieves: "do you want to be a baby hitler or full grown?"
nubbins`: mircea_popescu, sure
nubbins`: sorry, stepped away
mircea_popescu: nubbins` so be a darling say so in the thred.
nubbins`: sure, got a link?
nubbins`: i'll race ya
mircea_popescu: i'm screaming at wannabe pr outfits.
ozbot: portraits, commissions, and original paintings by Maureen Gubia
nubbins`: "at the club, at the beach, or in the amazon. "
nubbins`: ahahahah
nubbins`: actually amazing
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
nubbins`: over the years, i've stopped taking "this would be great album art" as a compliment
ThickAsThieves: "a company purchasing and selling convertible
ThickAsThieves: virtual currency as an investment exclusively for the company’s benefit is not a money
ThickAsThieves: transmitter. " ~ FINCEN
nubbins`: so what the fuck is mike caldwell?
nubbins`: these people..
ThickAsThieves: "The first ruling states that, to the extent a user creates or “mines” a convertible virtual currency solely for a user’s own purposes, the user is not a money transmitter under the BSA"
nubbins`: solely for a user's own purposes
ThickAsThieves: "If further clarification is needed, FinCEN encourages the submission of a request for an administrative ruling. The procedure for submission of administrative rulings can be found at FinCEN’s Web site"
ThickAsThieves: the doc links to more docs with elaborations
nubbins`: not sure which "official" thread is more pathetic, asicminer or cavirtex
mircea_popescu: that's sad.
ozbot: Visa Inc (V) news: Visa's CEO Discusses F1Q 2014 Results - Earnings Call Transcript - Seeking Alpha
ThickAsThieves: asked about Bitcoin
ThickAsThieves: "And there’s certainly some interesting things about Bitcoin and other things like it, but there’s also a great deal of complexity. People talk about things like frictionless and things like that, and when you actually dig through it, it’s really not the case. It’s far more complex than that. And we feel very comfortable with the business that we have here."
mircea_popescu: famous last words.
nubbins`: he's right about frictionless
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: iv counted 46 ticks over 2 days, to compare to say the S&P 500 i would expect 46 ticks every 2 minutes?
mircea_popescu: that he is.
herbijudlestoids: lets say the rate of trading goes up to 10 ticks an hour, will you still stream on irc? :D
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids afaik the limit is 1 per second.
mircea_popescu: (freenode's)
mircea_popescu: anyway, my point was more that the trades streamed when it was half a bitcoin worth 50 dollars, and it's still streaming when it's 50 bitcoins worth 50k
mircea_popescu: and from there to 50m is about the same distance.
herbijudlestoids: not sure if youre talking to me, but do oyu really believe BTCUSD valued at 1mio?
benkay: of course
benkay: herbijudlestoids ^^
jurov: if btc is to be small part of international trade
benkay: this is a room of true believers ;)
jurov: then it just has to go there
herbijudlestoids: well the highest valuation i had heard so far was 798,000
benkay: oddly specific number.
benkay: sounds like a winkle.
herbijudlestoids: i take notes of oddly specific numbers
nubbins`: voss
benkay: something a winklevii drops on the floor and nobody wants to touch
ozbot: Bitcoin prices, Bitcoin inflexibility pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: lol ozbot delayed
nubbins`: i tried!
mircea_popescu: john guy keeps disappearing.
nubbins`: nod.
mircea_popescu: anyway, not the first time cluelessnes costs a guy his bread.
nubbins`: sometimes for months at a time
nubbins`: the "salty" he mentioned, i've done business with
nubbins`: just checked to see if he's in the wot, lel: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=saltyspitoon
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11500 @ 0.00090076 = 10.3587 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: lol i guess it marginally qualifies.
deadweasel: so, mp, what kind of hitler are you?
deadweasel: on da beach? in da muff?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 71 @ 0.049 = 3.479 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: artist's gotta have some freedom neh ?
deadweasel: it seems to scare him..
deadweasel: he should do one like marge did of Monty Burns.
mircea_popescu: it's a sad time we live in when the close minded burgeois scares the revolutionary artists.
mircea_popescu: shouldn't it be the other backwards around ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12786 @ 0.00090137 = 11.5249 BTC [+]
deadweasel: i try not to should on things anymore, I'm always wrong.
jurov: benkay, what??? are we are talking about the portrait you wanted to procure?
nubbins`: i may have pasted that one here before
benkay: dah what jurov?
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: have you ever heard of the freegold hypothesis?
herbijudlestoids: i guess its one option you didnt consider
mircea_popescu: so i have
jurov: someone wanted to procure mirceas portrait
herbijudlestoids: i personally put some weight behind it
jurov: and asked nubbins` to paint it
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids i don't see how it limits btc
jurov: now i had some brainfart "that they want to paint him as hitler?"
herbijudlestoids: it doesnt necessarily
jurov: nevermind me
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4000 @ 0.00090342 = 3.6137 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids for that matter, bitcoin could actually be it.
herbijudlestoids: some of the properties you apply to BTC apply equally (or more so) to gold and that is an asset that happens to already be on ECB balance sheet ;)
mircea_popescu: they don't apply to gold in any sense.
mircea_popescu: you're basically saying "the stuff i say about cars also applies to other locomobiles, such as steam powered train engines and horsedrawn carriages"
herbijudlestoids: "Nevertheless, the pressure is unyielding : people holding Bitcoins have no practical incentive to get rid of them, and people trying to get rid of their increasingly worthless dollars have no recourse. "
mircea_popescu: sure, except fundamental issues prevent either from competing with the combustion engine.
mircea_popescu: and since there's no room for 2nd place, it will just be this.
mircea_popescu: much like the us has no train infrastructure, and uses trucks for everything. trains would be more effective for trucking, but gasoline engines are more effective overall and so... trains are fucked.
herbijudlestoids: what youre proposing here is essentially BTC takes over the economic role of USD as global reserve asset
mircea_popescu: it takes over the role of everyting. usd, eur, rmb, sdr, gold, stupid facebook tokens, in-game currencies like isk,
herbijudlestoids: no? so why do holders of Bitcoins have any practical incentive to hold them lol
mircea_popescu: likes, everything.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2600 @ 0.00090342 = 2.3489 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: this is why visa can't compete, not really, even if it doesn't know it yet.
herbijudlestoids: i personally feel that BTC makes a good medium of exchange but a poor store of value
mircea_popescu: they can't flawlessly merge ten billion likes into the value of an oil tanker.
mircea_popescu: that personal feel flies in the face of reality.
mircea_popescu: my wealth stored in btc has been doing better than anyone's any other wealth.
deadweasel: mircea_popescu, at some point, don't you have to start worrying about physical security.. hired goons of the status quo and whatnot?
mircea_popescu: do you ?
herbijudlestoids: so short term relative performance now equals reality? lulz
deadweasel: i am not valuable to the status quo
deadweasel: so no, not until my government runs phsyically amok
mircea_popescu: but you did buy like... a lock.
mircea_popescu: which was a % of your net worth.
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids well, reality is that which happens, you know ?
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: so if i do a quick stock scan and find all the global penny stocks that outperformed BTC since inception, wouldnt those actually be the best store of value :/
herbijudlestoids: surely you jest
mircea_popescu: for curiosity, do this :
mircea_popescu: find penny stocks worth < 1 cent per share in 2010
mircea_popescu: that are now worth > 1000 dollars per share.
jurov: ^ with billions total valuation
mircea_popescu: we're not talking six month's worth of pump and dump here.
mircea_popescu: we're talking four friggin years.
mircea_popescu: short term, yes. reality ? also yes.
mircea_popescu: i'm kind-of curious if he actually finds one. afaik it doesn't exist.
herbijudlestoids: your scan parameters are wrong
mircea_popescu: how so /
herbijudlestoids: you should be looking for a 4Y ROC 100000%
mircea_popescu: 10k btc pizza actually happened in 2010.
mircea_popescu: mno. <1 cent to 1k usd = 10000000%
herbijudlestoids: sorry yea, but the scan "1c to 1k" is wrong
mircea_popescu: (technically 10k btc for a 19 dollar pizza would mean 0.19 cents each, but we'll let that slide)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16200 @ 0.00090139 = 14.6025 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: so scour the entire list of known pinks for anything matching it, i'm not picky.
benkay: pinks?
mircea_popescu: you can go all the way to 1950 for all i care.
mircea_popescu: benkay they used to be printed on pink paper.
benkay: ha
mircea_popescu: that juicy moment when person suddenly realises the immensity of this shit.
herbijudlestoids: give me a sec
herbijudlestoids: took me a second to make the scan
mircea_popescu: i'ma go spank a girl till you find anything ?
mircea_popescu: poor her, that'd suck as a fate huh.
herbijudlestoids: scanning now, largest so far is BIOM on LSE 46,959%
mircea_popescu: o i remember biom
mircea_popescu: foot prosthetics or something like that they did
herbijudlestoids: ok that was the biggest one
mircea_popescu: actually it seems it's not what i thought it was
herbijudlestoids: about ~5 stocks in the 10-50,000 range
mircea_popescu: biome plc
mircea_popescu: well you see... 50k ain't 10mn. not even close.
ozbot: BitBet - Fico will be elected President of Slovakia
mircea_popescu: some guy there is seriously named FICO ?
jurov: local chars are missing
jurov: yes. robert fico
herbijudlestoids: so maybe my maths is retarded but i calculated (1000-0.01)/0.01=99999%
mircea_popescu: well... i hope his credit is good...
herbijudlestoids: so how did we get 10 million?
mircea_popescu: where did you get the % from ?
herbijudlestoids: rate of change
kakobrekla: jurov bitbet doesnt like your char
mircea_popescu: so on the right you get a % for free ?
mircea_popescu: (10-5)/5 = 1% ?
herbijudlestoids: o right, yea my maths is retarded gotta * 100
mircea_popescu: those last two digits are the best two digits.
herbijudlestoids: i guess up to oyu if you wanna use 4Y ROC as proof of its viability as a store of value but i dont feel very convinced
mircea_popescu: im not trying to convince you. i merely made the previous points.
mircea_popescu: fact is so far it did so work. what the future brings... the future knows.
herbijudlestoids: well it works inasmuch as you can convince people to join the BTC economy and exchange real good and services, and in cases where you cant it doesnt work
mircea_popescu: not at all.
mircea_popescu: this is like the intuition of everyone, but it's perfectly false. bitcoin works fine irrespective of what anyone does.
herbijudlestoids: i doubt you actually expect that your net worth denominated in BTC would be equal to a fraction if you tried to convert it all at once to say USD or whatever
mircea_popescu: so you doubt.
mircea_popescu: you familiar with gresham's law ?
herbijudlestoids: am i wrong? do you expect theres enough liquidity for you to make a transition like that without any loss?
mircea_popescu: ok so. it doesn';t matter what people do or don't do
mircea_popescu: merely the preference to save strong currencies and to spend weak ones ensures the price differential.
mircea_popescu: compared to anything else man made, bitcoin is adamantine.
herbijudlestoids: i swear i mentioned something about global reserve asset earlier
herbijudlestoids: preference to save is enforced by the marginal global saver
mircea_popescu: so i mentioned something in 2011, what of it >D
herbijudlestoids: what they save in is the store of value
herbijudlestoids: you cant just call a currency the strong one for no reason. the use of a particular asset as a store of value by the marginal global saver(s) is what gives it that characteristic
herbijudlestoids: i.e. what are those entities converting their productive surplus into
mircea_popescu: but i have an excellent statistical reason
mircea_popescu: that 10mn earlier.
mircea_popescu: no business in the history of business did anything like this
mircea_popescu: only currencies can, and only currencies do.
mircea_popescu: basically in the 2010-2014 the entire world had a zimbabwe moment
mircea_popescu: and didn't even know it.
mircea_popescu: (much like the actual peasants of zimbabwe, what do they know of finance)
jurov: oh, they did notice ever fattening stacks of bills
mircea_popescu: i guess. and obama is increasing the minimum wage, and more qe, and more bailouts, and so on and so forth.
herbijudlestoids: im not really sure what any of the above has to do with greshams law lol
mircea_popescu: it's a better model than the "marginal saver", in that it relies less on statistical artificery.
mircea_popescu: other than the statistical reason (ie, bitcoin is the strong currency because of its history) there are actually legions of other reasons. bitcoin is fungible, unlike any other fiat
mircea_popescu: (in that no court can order the de-fungibilisation of bitcoin)
mircea_popescu: in any dispute of currency the more fungible wins, period.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 100 @ 0.00426999 = 0.427 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 60 @ 0.00426999 = 0.2562 BTC [+]
herbijudlestoids: i think youre a pretty smart guy, dont really want to get into a full blown thing so i will just say i disagree that through the lens of greshams law, bitcoin is the "strong currency" which savers have a preference to save in. if youre interested in maybe considering a different view heres FOFOA on the topic (a bit long) http://fofoa.blogspot.com.au/2011/06/bitcoin-open-forum-part-3.html
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 50 @ 0.00426999 = 0.2135 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9450 @ 0.00090342 = 8.5373 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: you gotta appreciate this position is in no way novel to me, you know.
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: appreciate that
mircea_popescu: for that matter, moldbug is still shy on my bet
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 65 @ 0.00426999 = 0.2775 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: and you'll be well advised to take note that for all his childish posturing a) yarvin capitulated and tried to make his own bitcoin
mircea_popescu: b) which attempt bitcoin crushed.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 40 @ 0.00426999 = 0.1708 BTC [+]
herbijudlestoids: hmmm well i would never have argued that the USG will shutdown bitcoin or that bitcoin will be worthless, those seem like two stupid things to bet on
herbijudlestoids: although i would posit that considering the nature of centralisation of the internet currently, it might not be that hard for the USG to do so
herbijudlestoids: also i dont think bitcoin is worthless, i think it has a considerable value as a medium of exchange
decimation: I think Mr. Yarvin was correct in his analysis about the game theory of bitcoin saving
decimation: it's Gresham's law, as MP mentioned
kakobrekla: hm i didnt know davinci way gay
decimation: he underestimated the avarice of those who would influence USG decisionmaking
CheckDavid: how does gresham's apply to bitcoin'
herbijudlestoids: can you please explain for us retards, how "bitcoin just is"? considering it requires a globally distributed network of hosts to constantly verify and transact? fractures introduced to the network topology, or similar, seem to argue against the idea that bitcoin is simply a mathematical construct. you need compute power and communication to implement and distribute the construct
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids ironically, the medium of exchange function is the thing at which bitcoin sucks worst.
decimation: It exists just like the democrats and republicans exist
decimation: there's no reason why they exist really, everyone could change their minds tomorrow
decimation: yet they don't
decimation: and won't
mircea_popescu: since i'm doing a trilema retrospective apparently, here, see that : http://trilema.com/2013/bitcoin-prices-bitcoin-inflexibility/#comment-92015
herbijudlestoids: decimation: wut? is that seriously the answer?
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla srsly ?!
decimation: why not?
kakobrekla: www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsE0BwQ3l8U&feature=youtu.be&t=27m47s
mircea_popescu: who else did you not know was gay ? elton john ? boy george ?
mircea_popescu: queen lezzie ?
kakobrekla: i dunno, i do not study these things.
mircea_popescu: you don't study lezzies.
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: the comment you sent me seems to directly contradict your statement that bitcoin will replace everything
decimation: LoL that German youtube guy "Der Diktator der Kunst ist Ideal."
Dimsler_: mircea_popescu, what are you estimate daily active users at
Dimsler_: currently
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids how so ?
mircea_popescu: Dimsler_ active users of what, pot ? i dunno, 50mn.
Dimsler_: btc
mircea_popescu: i have no idea. there's like 7k or so full nodes iirc.
herbijudlestoids: if it is to replace everything, how can it also "never be a direct means of payment for retail anything"
mircea_popescu: where's the contradiction ?
mircea_popescu: has electricity replaced female labour in the house or hasn't it ?
herbijudlestoids: well, i assume your "everything" includes direct means of payment for retail things, since you included even facebook ecash or whatever in your list of things it is to replace
mircea_popescu: sure, it still needs appliances.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4300 @ 0.00090211 = 3.8791 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: you're going to have stuff built on top of btc to handle the subsidiary and marginal task of retail.
mircea_popescu: but btc will dictate how these look and how they work and how they feel and even what retail is.
mircea_popescu: much like... no 1800s woman on her knees polishing the floors is much represented in the modern vacuum cleanner.
decimation: There's no reason in principle why one couldn't extend bank credit which is convertible to claims on BTC
decimation: Therefore no reason why you couldn't run a btc credit card
decimation: of course you would want a non-retarded security model
mircea_popescu: actually, to clarify, "takes over" != "replaces".
mircea_popescu: at least, not in your reading.
decimation: I'm also assuming the word "bank" means something different than the modern western concept
decimation: like, the bank knows about your actual credit riskiness, rather than just accepting fiat insurance
decimation: I donno, I came to bitcoin via Mr. Yarvin. In retrospect his doubts about Bitcoin look silly.
herbijudlestoids: ok, well im not really sure how bitcoin not being used for retail makes it a bad MoE, but ok thats your view
herbijudlestoids: decimation: not really sure what your comment re republocrats was about, very far from the answer i was looking for
herbijudlestoids: or even the type of answer
decimation: well, what I was attempting to convey was the idea that bitcoin is contingent on coordination amoung many in a mysterious way
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1050 @ 0.00090342 = 0.9486 BTC [+]
decimation: In the same way, the US political parties stay in power even when both obviously operate against the interests of those who are coordinating
herbijudlestoids: err if bitcoin is contingent on coordination then the statement "bitcoin just is" is false.
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids i merely said that out of the various functions, that happens to be the one it does worst.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 144 @ 0.00090708 = 0.1306 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: doesn't mean it's bad. just means it's much better at other things.
herbijudlestoids: "bitcoin just is, as long as many coordinate in a mysterious way"
decimation: Do you think the triangle is in a simliarly precarious position?
herbijudlestoids: difference.
mircea_popescu: be so kind not to modify my statements by your discussions with third parties eh :D
herbijudlestoids: sorry mircea_popescu
herbijudlestoids: decimation: how much crack do you smoke?
decimation: Indeed.
herbijudlestoids: surely by now your dealer must know you by first name
mircea_popescu: the mark of the true junkie : he keeps a stable of dealers, rather than the other way around
kakobrekla: up his ass, or ?
ozbot: New York State Regulator Promises Tough Bitcoin Rules - Bloomberg Law
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 200 @ 0.00166253 = 0.3325 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: lol new york, trying hard to outdo new jersey
mircea_popescu: “If the choice for regulators is to permit money laundering on the one hand, or to permit innovation on the other, we are always going to choose squelching the money laundering first,” Lawsky said at the hearing.
decimation: Indeed. Exactly as you predicted, the regulators are more than happy to cede currency regulation to Bitcoin, if Bitcoin allows them to crowbar their banks.
mircea_popescu: it's funny tho, making exactly the wrong moves. you couldn't pay them to be this conveniently stupid.
decimation: The hilarious part to me is that they think their "bitlicense" will allow to them dictate to bitcoin, rather than the other way around
mircea_popescu: bitcoin was taken to $10 by lulz, to $100 by lulz and drama and to $1000 by lulz, drama and mining.
decimation: It's going to go to > 1 mil based on this stuff
mircea_popescu: i guess with the extra "watch us fail" boost 10k may even be possible
decimation: It's because a few indiviuals in key positions think they can ride the wave of terror to power
Dimsler_: i think 50k will be possible
Dimsler_: i think the run up will be one that nobody will be expecting
Dimsler_: from the historical research on bubles i've read
Dimsler_: 50k is quite possible
mircea_popescu: “If that same company can be started in the U.K. or Germany, maybe that innovation just gets pushed offshore,” Liew said.
mircea_popescu: "Nobody will care that the original paper may have been written by an American and the original discussion on the long forgotten original Bitcoin forum was carried in English. I can deal just as well with Russian investors, I can deal just as well with Chinese investors, Bitcoin is completely neutral from a cultural perspective. This neutrality means that cultures will have to compete. So far the US is losing this comp
mircea_popescu: etition at this level. If things don’t get fixed soon the only thing that we’ll be able to say for sure about Bitcoin regulation will be that it won’t be written in English, and it won’t consider US interests or sensibilities."
mircea_popescu: mircea popescu said
mircea_popescu: except... you know, a little earlier.
Dimsler_: well i dont' really want to deal with the west
Dimsler_: btc-e is russian so is g.hash
decimation: Lawsky at times sympathized with the goals of the investors at the hearing, complaining that it could take ?days? to pay his credit card from a bank account. And he criticized fees immigrants pay to send money home, and welcomed the chance to use Bitcoin to reduce the costs.
decimation: ?That?s a huge thing, for the country and New Yorkers,? Lawsky said.
Dimsler_: both operate in secrecay
ozbot: The future of Bitcoin regulation pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
Dimsler_: under silence
mircea_popescu: "This is possibly the last chance to take those piles of fundamentally worthless US dollars and use them for something with any sort of future value."
Dimsler_: the way it should be
mircea_popescu: last chance came... and went.
decimation: It's a huge thing for New Yorkers indeed.
herbijudlestoids: lol it went?
herbijudlestoids: yet it could still go to 50k?
mircea_popescu: “The Bitcoin ecosystem of companies and investors has to engage to allay real concerns and avoid being pigeonholed by policy makers,” Klein said.
mircea_popescu: ahahaha! HAS TO ?
mircea_popescu: lol. listen to them go
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids yup.
herbijudlestoids: implication is that its no longer possible to exchange USD for something with any sort of future value...
mircea_popescu: you're trapped in this mental representation wherein stuff can only happen with permission. this is not how things happen. your choice is whether you're on the boat when it sails or not.
mircea_popescu: your choice is not whether the boat sails, or when.
mircea_popescu: or how, or where to.
mircea_popescu: not practically, no.
mircea_popescu: technically it is still possible, but in retrospect it'
mircea_popescu: ll be one of those things that "could hav been"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20128 @ 0.00090108 = 18.1369 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.24310363 BTC
herbijudlestoids: im not trapped in any such mental representation and dont really believe for example that a BTCUSD price punctuation event would need "permission" to occur lol
decimation: what controlling factor would limit its rise?
herbijudlestoids: if the possibility came and went then the implication is that people *today* have literally no option for investment...so BTCs are out for those people?
mircea_popescu: well, i dun know what you think, obviously. im merely noticing that what you say comes from this one point of view.
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids the article was discussing investors, you know ?
Dimsler_: more lke speculators
mircea_popescu: now, people do have options. it's just they won't take them.
mircea_popescu: there's options you have, and then there's options you actually can take.
mircea_popescu: some are forbidden, some just escape your view.
herbijudlestoids: but the opportunity has not gone
mircea_popescu: technically.
herbijudlestoids: you said it has gone :P
mircea_popescu: in practice, it's gone.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12550 @ 0.00089833 = 11.274 BTC [-] {2}
Dimsler_: what are we talking about
Dimsler_: whats gone?
mircea_popescu: if back in april wanna-be investors had actually invested, the us still had a chance.
mircea_popescu: should have started earlier, but there was still space.
mircea_popescu: by now... heh. hardly.
mircea_popescu: Dimsler_ link above.
Dimsler_: are we talking about btc speculation?
decimation: There are only a few more orders of magnitude of growth left before it becomes the world trade currency
mircea_popescu: decimation the people are more important.
mircea_popescu: the fact that andressen horovitz is not in the wot today dooms it.
mircea_popescu: should have been in the wot two years ago.
decimation: Or Paul Singer?
Dimsler_: fucking jew
mircea_popescu: or whoever.
ozbot: Hedge-Fund Manager Paul Singer ‘Shocked’ by Bitcoin Popularity - MoneyBeat - WSJ
Dimsler_: bitcoins not that popular
Dimsler_: 4mil users?
Dimsler_: lol
Dimsler_: maybe 500k active
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids let's examine the following avenue : maddoff's "investments" collapsed like so much termite eaten furniture.
mircea_popescu: why was this ?
mircea_popescu: "mismanagement" right ? "misrepresentation", right ?
Dimsler_: maddoff ran a pyramid scheme
Dimsler_: fed by blind greed
mircea_popescu: well... what exactly is this misrepresentation ? what is its substance ?
Dimsler_: there wasn't any
mircea_popescu: a cluelessness about the real value of assets, which may as well mean "buying US stocks" as it may mean "moving money from our account to our account"
Dimsler_: well the problem with US stocks is they all suck
Dimsler_: unless you're buying tobacco or liquor
decimation: US stocks are a trival case of the CEO's pirating money from the "investor's" 401k accounts
herbijudlestoids: madoffs investments collapsed because of a cluelessness about the real value of assets?
Dimsler_: everything else sucks
mircea_popescu: can you prove to me the entire troop of us hedge funds aren't little maddofs running around, shielded by "industry standards" ?
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids yes. you disagree ?
herbijudlestoids: not sure that statement made much sense to me
mircea_popescu: ok. let's get to the bottom of this.
Dimsler_: how does it not make any sense
herbijudlestoids: but i can prove to you quite easily through factor decomposition that most US hedge funds are not doing anything special at all
Dimsler_: the US stock market is a giant boiler room
mircea_popescu: maddoff's balancesheet, before the collapse, showed some assets.
Dimsler_: a game of hotpotatoe
Dimsler_: refer to current price of facebook stock
herbijudlestoids: i wish people would stop interrupting your interesting comments with inane bullshit so i can try to understand
Dimsler_: huge market cap, little revenue
asciilifeform: "can you prove to me the entire troop of us hedge funds aren't little maddofs running around, shielded..." << i can prove that this /must/ be so
Dimsler_: little value
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids no such luck on irc :)
herbijudlestoids: stfu morons
Dimsler_: i'm summerizing his comments
Dimsler_: into peasent english for you
Dimsler_: to understand
mircea_popescu: it'll be a pm discussion.
herbijudlestoids: your summary is about as useful as the stupid analogy that decimation gave earlier.
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids dja know how to use the pm system ?
Apocalyptic: keep it in the chan mircea_popescu if you can
Apocalyptic: herbijudlestoids, just /ignore people that annoy you
kakobrekla: you have just been ignored.
mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic i'll just publish the thing when we're done
TomServo: I got all excited and ran out of log. :(
kakobrekla: lmaio
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8100 @ 0.0009054 = 7.3337 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18450 @ 0.00090024 = 16.6094 BTC [-]
decimation: If not bitcoin, than some other cryptocurrency. And if any cryptocurrency, than bitcoin.
decimation: asciilifeform you mention on your blog your efforts to discover the inner workings of FPGAs - have you made enough progress to create a self-modifying compute unit?
asciilifeform: decimation: depends what you mean by 'self-modifying'
asciilifeform: the protocol for pumping in the 'bitstream' is simple and documented;
decimation: I mean that it can program itself after design time
asciilifeform: the correspondence between each bit of the bitstream and the internal logic of the fpga is a $billion secret
asciilifeform: the reason for this secrecy is interesting and perverse
asciilifeform: the major vendors earn far more renting out 'cores' (read: libraries, for things like ethernet and pci) than through selling the chips per se.
decimation: Why hasn't something like "opencores" largely replaced that?
asciilifeform: because the opencores libs aren't optimized for a particular fpga
asciilifeform: and therefore have mediocre-to-poor performance on most jobs
asciilifeform: take, for instance, sdram controllers
asciilifeform: if you don't optimize for a particular fpga, you can't get anything close to the maximum rated clock of the sdram in question
asciilifeform: because each logic element (incl. switch matrix) in the path is an extra few ns. of delay
asciilifeform: and the whole shebang is speed-limited by its 'weakest link' (longest delay)
decimation: Is it a clock speed question or is it a quantity of gates question?
asciilifeform: those are directly related. but yes, both.
asciilifeform: likewise, each vendor (and even particular flavours of fpga from same vendor) provides slightly different building blocks on top of the usual LUTs
asciilifeform: e.g. multipliers, shift registers, etc
asciilifeform: if your design maps well to what you have, you get decent (minimal) 'footprint' and speed
asciilifeform: if not, then not.
decimation: Interesting. So these companies make their money by building proprietary cores on top of their proprietary chips.
asciilifeform: the closed architectures are motivated not only by fear of reverse-engineered licensed cores, but
asciilifeform: they have an incentive to make it as painful as possible to write anything from scratch
decimation: So they insert an artifical layer of indirection in the hardware and give you an opaque software layer to undo it
asciilifeform: not quite artificial
asciilifeform: the internals really are somewhat complicated
decimation: So, why doesn't some no-name Chinese fab make a relatively "generic" chip and take over the market?
asciilifeform: likewise, the vendor software usually includes a mountain of 'travelling salesman' optimization trickery licensed from hell knows where
decimation: I guess it wouldn't include said trickery
asciilifeform: the chinese, according to some, do make clones of various Xilinx units
asciilifeform: but presumably they simply use pirated tool chain
asciilifeform: just like soviet pdp clones often ran unmodified pirated os
asciilifeform: that was sort of the whole point
asciilifeform: avoid the dev work
asciilifeform: you don't actually need to understand very much about an IC design to clone it.
decimation: Presuming you have the mask?
asciilifeform: you can get the mask.
asciilifeform: (it's in there, after all.)
asciilifeform: this is how soviet clones of DEC chips ended up exact duplicates, complete with the (poorly translated, with a dictionary, by DEC) profanities
Apocalyptic: mircea, fair enough
decimation: Do you think there will ever be a day when hardware makers find it in their interest to peddle hardware that has an accessible interface?
decimation: Or will they always be beholden to chasing after some lock-in dream?
asciilifeform: transparent hardware -> $, lock-in -> $$$$$$
decimation: And yet, bunnie points out that freescale has opened the docs for their ARM clone
asciilifeform: docs only, or the complete chip mask and sources for the latter ?
asciilifeform: highly doubt (2), if only because arm is a licensed product
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9688 @ 0.00090525 = 8.7701 BTC [+] {2}
decimation: I suspect only datasheet/programming model
asciilifeform: interestingly, the earliest (late '80s) fpgas did not have this problem
decimation: and they probably only open that because they are a two-bit player
asciilifeform: they were well-documented and extremely simple, because they were originally just a substitute for buckets of PALs/GALs
asciilifeform: no one would've dreamed of trying to implement a cpu on one
asciilifeform: a few thousand gates, max
asciilifeform: today there are fpgas with several mil. of gates, costing in the high five figures (u.s. dollar)
asciilifeform: and you still won't get layout docs
nubbins`: i downloaded an osx program the other day, double-clicked to open, "this application was not created by an authorized developer" or some such
nubbins`: had to right-click and select open
decimation: Plus, good luck achieving max clock rate and not melting the chip
asciilifeform: decimation: the vendor toolchain usually calculates your maximum clock rate, based on theoretical path delays (usually a conservative figure, as you'd expect)
asciilifeform: nubbins`: welcome to the Nintendoized world
decimation: suppose your design occupies most of the gates and ends up clocking nearly all of them at max rate.
decimation: It seems that at some point you are going to need more current
nubbins`: asciilifeform, i always was curious about the "walled garden!!" type people who also owned consoles
nubbins`: no fuckin shit it's a walled garden, y'know?
nubbins`: that said, nothing more than a mild inconvenience to disable the feature, i'm sure
asciilifeform: decimation: vendor usually specifies a max current. and then you go, X cm^s, Y watts dissipated, need such and such heat sink...
asciilifeform: nubbins`: don't be surprised if mac os '11' or whatnot simply refuses to run 'unsigned' apps
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 122 @ 0.00084426 = 0.103 BTC [+]
decimation: nubbins` - I enjoyed your German painter link. "Der Diktator der Kunst ist Ideal."
decimation: that's the obvious next step for apple to take
decimation: I believe they have unofficially said as much
nubbins`: asciilifeform, that'd be the worry, but i don't think it'll happen any time soon
asciilifeform: never forget why MS bailed out apple in the '90s.
nubbins`: decimation, jonathan meese is an intense man
asciilifeform: apple is the 'good cop' in a classic 'good cop / bad cop' number.
nubbins`: don't get me wrong, they'll fuck ya raw all kinds of ways for a buck
herbijudlestoids: after a rigorous discussion on bitcoin, i always top it off with a quick
nubbins`: but i don't think there's enough to gain from blocking all unsigned apps for them to risk it
decimation: Ascii, have you considered that the insecurity of MS (and apple) crapware now justifies the Pentagon's budgets?
asciilifeform: decimation: i get to consider this every day, for money.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13500 @ 0.00090052 = 12.157 BTC [-]
decimation: For the amount of money the USG shovels into the beltway bandits, we could have your princely secure terminals
asciilifeform: ms turned the 'email virus' from an urban legend into reality, single-handed.
Apocalyptic: herbijudlestoids, so you guys are done ?
herbijudlestoids: im baitin arent i?
asciilifeform: the software 'industry' has the memory of an alzheimer's patient. it's like the '90s never happened.
nubbins`: the number of lost hours alone spent making websites work with ie6
asciilifeform: and ms isn't a company in the sense of, say, coca cola (or even the original 'standard oil') - it's a crown monopoly
nubbins`: (and 7, 8, 9)
asciilifeform: if no consumer ever bought a winblows pc in a retail shop again, it would survive in something close to its current size, simply from the government largesse
herbijudlestoids: asciilifeform: interesting thought, i hear yesterday the UK endorsed ODF for all documents in the future
nubbins`: "we can't open this, can you send it in .doc?"
Apocalyptic: better send it as niggers.txt
asciilifeform: the real one?
asciilifeform: or the ms 'embrace and extend'ed turd
nubbins`: odf 3.11
herbijudlestoids: they just spec ODF
herbijudlestoids: so i guess real one
KRS1: .bait
KRS1: rawr
decimation: I guess when peasants buy computers, peasant computing is what we get
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8300 @ 0.00090039 = 7.4732 BTC [-] {2}
Apocalyptic: <mircea_popescu> [03:33:34] in practice, it's gone. // is it ?
mircea_popescu: for people who were curious : http://trilema.com/2014/no-argument/ the discussion
mircea_popescu: TomServo ^
herbijudlestoids: haha i got a little lost in the post where you offered 10BTC to the guy to put a sharpie in his butt
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids you found your way to where i used that same sharpie to rape something awful ?
herbijudlestoids: newp, reading the "I can't even" now lol
herbijudlestoids: this sentence "Right that, right there, even if she spent the entire interval nude, made soap out of her own sebum and ate food stampsvi you would not be able to cover cost." ...i feel like....i love this sentence
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2300 @ 0.00090024 = 2.0706 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7300 @ 0.00089963 = 6.5673 BTC [-] {2}
decimation: I like the shout-out to "ham radio"
asciilifeform: re: the btcapocalypse: still seems to me like it would be wise to invent the parachute before, rather than after, being pushed out of the plane.
herbijudlestoids: asciilifeform: pls explain for retards
asciilifeform: would help to get the 'ham radio' / mesh network / btc-over-pigeon system now, rather than when it becomes the only possible means of running the network.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17574 @ 0.00090052 = 15.8257 BTC [+]
decimation: indeed, that sounds quite fun
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the one critique i have to this is that should it be invented afore, it'll then necessarily be known afore. this is perhaps unideal. bitcoin was invented before or after ? does it work because it was invented after ? would it have, were it invented before ?
herbijudlestoids: asciilifeform: i agree with the idea of building the infrastructure so that it doesnt necessarily need the internet
mircea_popescu: admitting you agree the parachute moment was at the latest nixon
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 326 @ 0.00090194 = 0.294 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: my argument isn't even that 'the great anti-btc firewall of earth' is coming, but that modern telecom is an extremely fragile beast
mircea_popescu: restructured like that i have nothing.
asciilifeform: mesh net is surprisingly easy, but largely non-existent because there is very little commercial incentive
asciilifeform: (actually, strong incentive in the other direction)
herbijudlestoids: there is a couple of interesting mesh options happening
herbijudlestoids: the obvious ones everyone knows about
herbijudlestoids: but also gnunet has some support for the concept, including the ability to inject packets directly onto a WLAN device without need any existing network
asciilifeform: even ignoring various 'license-free' radio bands, you can easily send bits to everyone on your side of your mains power step-down transformer
ozbot: Egypt Shut Down Its Net With a Series of Phone Calls | Threat Level | Wired.com
decimation: ?There are a handful of big providers you would need to coordinate with and they are all licensees of the state telecom, so they are all beholden to the Telecommunication Regulatory Authority, so your license is dependent on following the rules,? Labovitz said.
asciilifeform: anyone interested in the subject would do well to understand the basic principles of 'spread spectrum'
herbijudlestoids: new version out recently for 30c3
asciilifeform: where, in principle, one can radiate sufficiently little at any given point of spectrum to make classical triangulation virtually impossible
herbijudlestoids: mesh adoption is sort of like bitcoin adoptoin tho
herbijudlestoids: how do you convince everyone to run a client, and in the end most "consumers" run it from the cloud anyway
asciilifeform: since this would have to be a piece of physical hardware, the only solution afaik is to manufacture a tremendous number of widgets and give them away.
herbijudlestoids: thats an interesting idea.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6550 @ 0.00090194 = 5.9077 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: bonus points if you can engineer the net to make operating a node a profitable affair, like btc mining
herbijudlestoids: theres one like that, tornet
herbijudlestoids: i mentioned it to those bitcloud cunts but they didnt care
herbijudlestoids: too busy hyping
asciilifeform: in fact, now that i think of it, btc is the missing puzzle piece in the ancient problem of bootstrapping a global radio mesh.
herbijudlestoids: admittedly i dunno how mature the code is or what. https://github.com/bytemaster/tornet
Duffer1: S.NSA's next project ascii? :P
asciilifeform: no, just idle wankery
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> in fact, now that i think of it, btc is the missing puzzle piece in the ancient problem of bootstrapping a global radio mesh. << /me grins
mircea_popescu: btc is in fact the missing piece in the ancient problem of bootstrapping everything of this sort.
jayk: ;o
kakobrekla: even the parachute.
mircea_popescu: fun fact : parasuta is, in romanian, yet another word for whore.
herbijudlestoids: do romanians have lots of words for whore?
mircea_popescu: possibly the most.
herbijudlestoids: wow they do.
herbijudlestoids: but your one isnt on there
mircea_popescu: petarda (ie, firecracker) ; zdreanta (used scrap of cloth) ; there's prolly 100+
herbijudlestoids: ah right you include colloquialisms
mircea_popescu: all romanian is one huge colloquialism
mircea_popescu: lele actually wouldn't be recognised as such. it's a disused word and most speakers would only take it as an antiquated form for older sister/girlfriend
mircea_popescu: dama either, it roughly covers the us "dame"
herbijudlestoids: yeah you can see the little bar next to it shows google isnt as sure as for the other words
mircea_popescu: jesus google is shitty, there's a conjunctive verbal form there, definitely can't work as a noun nor does it mean whore.
mircea_popescu: wait, drab means whore in english ?!
herbijudlestoids: probly the entire thing is done by machine learning and no validation ;)
herbijudlestoids: so to the machine, somehow drab is somewhere on the synonym chain for whore
mircea_popescu: no, it does. won\der of wonders.
mircea_popescu: hey kakobrekla : it's not just slovenly, it's also slatternly!
mircea_popescu: does slatterna exist somewhere around /
herbijudlestoids: haha slatterna is a place in sweden
herbijudlestoids: ho ho ho i wonder
mircea_popescu: ;;google trilema poftiti la muie
gribble: No matches found.
mircea_popescu: eh come on.
mircea_popescu: btw herbijudlestoids do yourself a favour get in the wot today.
herbijudlestoids: im in it, do you mean identify myself?
mircea_popescu: o you are ? ok then.
mircea_popescu: noobs usually don't figure it out/need prodding.
herbijudlestoids: vexual and bingoboingo told me to go on i tthe other day
herbijudlestoids: i signed up because i do what im told!
mircea_popescu: good for you
herbijudlestoids: but nobody will rate me, so i cant rate bingoboingo as a 10 based on his sexual attractiveness
mircea_popescu: o you know those two drunks ?!
herbijudlestoids: i do not know them specifically except in their capacity as people i also briefly spoke to on this chan :P vex at least lives in same country and likes similar music
Duffer1: i suspect at least one of his buttcoins is actually him...
mircea_popescu: well... at least i presume vexual drinks. tho it could be any number of things :D
herbijudlestoids: whats the point of being on the WoT? dont i need to transact to get rating? i dont plan on transacting :P
herbijudlestoids: well not soon anyway
Duffer1: even if you don't transact you're still learning the right habits
mircea_popescu: the point is that if anyone needs to figure out wtf you're up to they know who to ask
Duffer1: gpg is useful knowledge
mircea_popescu: ie, the people they know that rated you
herbijudlestoids: yeah i knew gpg and stopped using it when they invented OTR
mircea_popescu: otr is a diff usecase.
herbijudlestoids: literally had to create a new key cos i forgot my password
herbijudlestoids: well, it wasnt for me obviously ;)
herbijudlestoids: i think i have not signed or encrypted anything with a GPG key in years
mircea_popescu: otr ensures you that your messages can only be read at one point on the network, and that once the conversation is ended anyone could have written it.
mircea_popescu: gpg keeps the content of the conversation secret.
herbijudlestoids: let me explain: i used to conduct various communications using GPG over email. now i use a combination of tails, i2p and pidgin+OTR or i2pmessenger+OTR
herbijudlestoids: thats why i stopped using GPG
mircea_popescu: was i2p strong ? i don't even remember
herbijudlestoids: strong enough for my purposes
herbijudlestoids: i was a user back when it was just iip over irc so i guess iv got a softspot for it
mircea_popescu: o look, they got .i2p
mircea_popescu: hey, did namecoin end up stealing THEIR code ?
herbijudlestoids: what do you mean? afaik .i2p is not a globally resolvable namespace
herbijudlestoids: its just like a hostsfile except called addressbook
mircea_popescu: you know there's a coin that basically does dns
herbijudlestoids: are you talking of namecoin?
herbijudlestoids: personally i prefer implementations like the GNUnet Name System (GNS)
herbijudlestoids: but dont have much requirement for globally resolvable namespace in darknets anyway
herbijudlestoids: (personally)
herbijudlestoids: i thought there was some flaw discovered in namecoin that killed adoption
mircea_popescu: not afaik
kakobrekla: you cant kill something that isnt there
herbijudlestoids: is that article incorrect?
mircea_popescu: a, no. it's just more recent than i've been paying attention.
Apocalyptic: it's been resolved since
mircea_popescu: i have more like a 6 months span on stuff that far on the periphery
herbijudlestoids: Apocalyptic: o so patched and all good again?
herbijudlestoids: maybe i should convert my 0.02BTC into NMC and buy mpex.bit
herbijudlestoids: just to piss off mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: lol save it for when you run into teh trilema paywal
Apocalyptic: then sell it for 100btc
mircea_popescu: lol there's going to be the piss-mp-off gem on the fgorum, people buying it from each other on the grounds that any day now it'll piss me off
Apocalyptic: lol, someone registered impex.bit, but mpex.bit is still free
Duffer1: mpex.bit the latest fuffle
Apocalyptic: get it while it's hot
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15498 @ 0.00090315 = 13.997 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04998999 = 0.2499 BTC [+]
herbijudlestoids: seems cheap for domains
herbijudlestoids: 0.01NMC, you could register every word in the english dictionary for not much NMC
herbijudlestoids: compared to how much itd cost to get the equivalent .coms
Duffer1: seems like an interesting way to attack the coin
Duffer1: buy the dictionary
mircea_popescu: wasn't there some sort of limit in place ?
Duffer1: oh no idea
Apocalyptic: not afaik mircea_popescu
Apocalyptic: and how would you enforce such a limit ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 11 @ 0.04999813 = 0.55 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: Since domains are extremely cheap to obtain with Namecoin, and registered domains cannot be seized (they can only be transferred by their owner), Namecoin has had problems with cybersquatters buying up domains, hoping to resell them later for a profi
mircea_popescu: seems the dictionary's already bought, pretty much.
Duffer1: that's unfortunate
Duffer1: i can't imagine how they'd solve that issue
Duffer1: other than by making domains unrealistically expensive
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