Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2022-11-01 | 2022-11-03 → ↓
asciilifeform: $ticker btc usd
busybot: Current BTC price in USD: $20407.04
shinohai[busybot]: Doing some research on lilygo watch and a wild jurov appeared lol: http://forum.ulisp.com/t/lilygo-ttgo-t-watch-2020/605/4
asciilifeform: shinohai: photo is defo of same fella ( met him in at mp's thing in '14 )
billymg[asciilifeform|busybot]: god dammit, i think my isp here just started throttling torrents. ubuntu (as a test, 2k seeders) downloading at < 50kB/s
asciilifeform[busybot]: shinohai: not entirely surprising to see him in forums, d00d aint dead, just went for greener pastures.
asciilifeform: billymg: only torrents, or errything 50kB/s ?
billymg[asciilifeform]: only torrents
asciilifeform: billymg: which isp ?
billymg[busybot]: coopeguanacaste fibra optica
asciilifeform at one time had 'they're throttling torrents' moment, but turned out to be misconfig'd nat
billymg[busybot]: nothing changed in my config
billymg[asciilifeform]: and the torrents connect to plenty of peers, so not a discovery issue
billymg[busybot]: is why i tested the most mainstream torrent i could think of, the ubuntu iso
asciilifeform: surprising that they weren't before ( fiber monopolies in bananistans, slicing a 10g/s pipe to oversell to 1e7 people. recall the piz pipe )
billymg[asciilifeform]: i haven't been living at this property for last 15 months, just recently moved back. but i noticed in the condo i was living in that my download (and upload) speeds suddenly tanked to ~50kB/s a couple of days ago
billymg[asciilifeform]: that was a different isp (or possibly the same, but cable, not fiber)
billymg[asciilifeform]: so i figured, "oh well, moving out anyway", only to see the same thing here now
billymg[asciilifeform]: just emailed them asking more or less what their problem is
billymg[asciilifeform] pays for 3 separate fiber optic connections from these guys, in total around $160/mo
billymg[asciilifeform]: just checked, was different isp at the other place
billymg[asciilifeform]: one for me, one for groundskeeper about 150 meters away (on slower tier), one for rental units
billymg[asciilifeform]: could be consolidated into one connection, with ethernet running through the conduits instead of the fiber cable
billymg[busybot]: will see what they respond with, perhaps "must purchase 'commercial' plan if you want to torrent", in which case i would likely consolidate the three
billymg[busybot]: or see if any of the colo isps here don't mind me running a seedbox
awt[busybot]: Any particularly good warez/movies you are torrenting billmg?
billymg[busybot]: every gamecube iso: 5307f0db418ae2cb1f01d5a1acd4f02389d19ae0; every ps2 iso: 8517b29d393c291aa331e9f479b3767321b200ed; every ps1 iso: 5206a9321690fed58785297fc88955c861fd0b6d
billymg[asciilifeform] hasn't touched a game in the last two months or so but was into 'retro' emulation earlier in the year
billymg[busybot]: for anyone that wants to look up those rom dumps, they can be found by entering the hashes into here: https://en.btdig.com/
billymg[asciilifeform]: which i also thought was a neat project, written by a 'kevinlynx' who also does some lisp, erlang, and c stuff
billymg[busybot]: awt: if you're into that stuff, i found Parasite Eve and Ace Combat 2 for ps1 to be quite comfy
phf[asciilifeform]: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-11-01#1015211 << it's using x11. there's a precedent for fb, macivory was working directly with video memory blocks, but there's nobody capable and willing to do that hack
bitbot[asciilifeform]: Logged on 2022-11-01 22:25:46 asciilifeform[5]: phf: does your arm-mac port of the emulator still use x11 for output? or has own fb
phf[asciilifeform]: i like Castlevania: Symphony of the Night
unpx[busybot|asciilifeform] is questioning F2[x]/(x^8 + x^4 + x^3 + x + 1) imprimitivity in AES
unpx[busybot|asciilifeform]: It scratches my head just like non-unit elements of a ring are not able to generate a cyclic multiplicative group
billymg[asciilifeform]: phf: i fired that one up since i remembered enjoying Dawn of Sorrow and Portrait of Ruin as a kid but never played SotN, was not in a Castlevania mood in that moment so set it aside for later
asciilifeform: phf: near as asciilifeform was able to tell from reading the macivory 'lifesupport' srcs, the card shits directly to video ram. theoretically could emulate this (if wanted emulator w/out xorg)
asciilifeform: would prolly need to emulate aspects of 'ivory' that aint in the vlm & descendent items tho
asciilifeform: unpx: what were you trying to do ?
asciilifeform: phf: re microcode btw: there's a 'si:read-rom-word' in genera/distribution/sys/sys/wired.lisp . seems to eat argument n and walk out nth word of the rom. ( not tried it on mine yet )
asciilifeform: whole thing fwiw. 'COMPUTE-IVORY-REVISION' is sumwhat interesting, seems to imply that there was a ~4th~ rev. (previously only knew of 3 editions)
asciilifeform erry time loox at bolix srcs, is almost cured of the notion of doing anyffin w/ subj -- thing is of screamingly 'indian' flavour, over9000 mysterious hacks layered 1 on top of other
unpx[busybot|asciilifeform]: asciilifeform[crtdaydreams]: just trying to see if GF(2^8) does something strange with that polynomial compared to a promitive polynomial on the multiplicative side of things...
unpx[asciilifeform|busybot]: An looking at that same exact table I cannot unsee the order of that polynomial being 52
phf[asciilifeform]: (DEFWIREDVAR *MORE-SPECIAL* NIL) ;must always be T! set to nil at own risk 89-01-03 reti, don't switch it back, further discussion IGUANA:>reti>zora-unmodified-prom-exp.text
phf[asciilifeform]: i was so proud of this lisp machine joke that i also sent it to all 5 people who would get it
asciilifeform: phf: thing is fulla lulz like that. ( and asciilifeform either not dug enuff, or hasn't the right leaked tapes, to properly get most of'em )
asciilifeform: seems as if authors were quite certain that not only no 'heathen' would ever lay eyes on the sores, but not even to have to explain it to one at any point
asciilifeform: fwiw e.g. microshit's src dun look like this. (nor any other commercial sores asciilifeform ever glimpsed)
asciilifeform: at the same time, it -- evidently -- worked.
asciilifeform: ( it is at this pt that, if we were in a heathenpit, e.g. HN, ~somebody~ would be guaranteed to chime in with a 'lisp makes life too easy, encourages these iguanas...' etc )
asciilifeform: ( with oblig link to e.g. )
phf[asciilifeform]: i think the cause and effect is confused. lower in the system you go, the more likely it is that the code predates vairous accepted and established programming paradigms
phf[asciilifeform]: and the actual lisp machine people were both inventing those paradigms or else integrating them from elsewhere
phf[asciilifeform]: so like while everyone™ writes assembler, cadr's SYSTEM is written in the 1968 dijkstra pascal style: a file defines its state varibles at the top (kind of like pascal's declaration block), and then you have a bunch of structure programming style defuns operating on that state. but then alan kay invents object orientatio
phf[busybot]: n, so they bolt flavors on top, and now you have a combination of styles, because legacy code, etc.
phf[asciilifeform]: by the time you get to '98 genera, you have a dozen of paradigms, ranging from late 60s all mixed in a single system. and it's a sensible thing to write to whatever style you're working with in the particular part of code, unless you're prepared to do a full re-architecture/re-write
phf[asciilifeform]: so if you read document explorer, there's tons of places where "the correct architecture is now X, and we've migrated foo, bar and qux to it, but there's still buz and frob written in the old style"
phf[asciilifeform]: where's by the time they start writing windows you can find books on object oriented programming in c++ at barnes and noble. they use hungarian notation ffs is how spoiled they are :)
phf[asciilifeform]: and the whole "biplar lisp programmer" has nothing to do with lisp machine world, and more to do with the fact that by the time that meme appears most people who still write code are insane (or at least most vocal ones, the xah lees and the naggums)
phf[asciilifeform]: *who still write lisp code
asciilifeform suspects phf 100% right re above
phf[asciilifeform]: lisp machine code and lisp in general is the way it is, because bunch of grownups were inventing the future as they went along, and by the time their knowledge was delivered to the people, prometheus style, certain conclusions were already made, and then essentially crystalized from then on. windows circa '95 (i've not had
phf[asciilifeform]: seen 3.11 source) is basically genera circa '85 with all the legacy craft removed.
asciilifeform[busybot]: the 1 detail could add , possibly -- the atrocious quality of period irons ( 3600 era, where 3 tonnes of wire-wrap ) , made for the 'magick-toggle-no-9001-please-dont-change' style
asciilifeform: warehouse fulla 74xxx not shown. but yea
asciilifeform: they made outta what they had.
asciilifeform erry time thinks to gripe re 'fpga too small' -- recalls above photo
asciilifeform: the amazingly frustrating thing re modern era is that over9000 interesting things nao over9000x easier to do than in that '78; but the intersection b/w sets of folx with the time and those who giveashit is nullset
phf[asciilifeform]: i'm kind of with locklin on this, it's because we've replaced slide rules with digital :>
asciilifeform: 'invent future' gave way to 'how do i con the folx with the printer, brrr outta somemoar dough'; so long ago that phrase 'invent future' nao sounds quite like sovok 'apple trees on mars' nostalgia flavour
asciilifeform: the iron for e.g. lispm on fpga costs coupla hundy. but who has time, to recreate the os etc. (other than aristocrats, very busy with quite other biz, lol )
bitbot[busybot|asciilifeform]: Logged on 2022-10-31 17:04:55 asciilifeform[5]: 'wai do anyffin but lines of coke off back of whore, if yer not a luser' etc
signpost[asciilifeform]: sounds like another consequence of the evisceration of the economic middle, which happened in parallel to this era.
signpost[busybot]: yep asciilifeform beat me there
asciilifeform: signpost: tbf greenblatt et al weren't amateurs in kitchen, but eaters at a very generous pentagon trough
asciilifeform: trough still, theoretically there; but when disgorges coupla $mil, what it buys is 10kloc of java and coupla yachts, typically
asciilifeform: somehow not lispm lol
asciilifeform: 'snake shed its legs'
asciilifeform: + as phf alluded to, close contact w/ 'modern kompyooting' is enuff to cure justabout anyone of all desire to 'try to greenblatt'
asciilifeform: what remains is the diagnosable schizos and a few old men.
signpost[asciilifeform]: commentary on where inventing the future went; printola destroys the pentagon's ability to select as much as it destroys the (at one point) young men's ability to produce.
asciilifeform: signpost: the selectees, unsurprisingly, 'exam-take'
signpost[asciilifeform]: pentagon trough at one point produced sr71. trough's not by itself a sin, but what's in it, who eats.
signpost[asciilifeform]: subj of FPGAs, my two arrived.
asciilifeform: same thing happened in sovok. 1st gen of folx who actually amounted to sumthing; then, their children, and the latter 'coke from back of whore'(tm) and finita la commedia
phf[busybot]: there's a music package on whisperer tapes, that is a kind of shared endeavor by various researchers, that was never released or even given a name ("defsystem MUSIC"). somebody at CCRMA packaged and released a (significantly evolved and nerfed) subset of it as Common Music, and i suspect the reason why it's significantly n
phf[busybot]: erfed is because it's chock full of patented stuff. i've not spent much time establishing that the codes are the same, but cursory look at definstrument form seems to imply they are identical. but anyway there's a bunch of code in there written by john chowning, the inventor and the main patenter of FM synthesis, and judgi
phf[asciilifeform]: ng by style it was written for a cadr
asciilifeform: phf: may explain the otherwise mysterious inclusion of a princely 16bit/44khz (iirc) sound card in the 36xx consoles
asciilifeform: with its own m68k
asciilifeform: ( some of it visible here )
asciilifeform: the 'golden toilet' luxury of ^ possible not obv to modern eyes -- but there was equiv. of 2 or 3 'commodore amigas' in there, transistor for transistor
asciilifeform: just in console
asciilifeform not ever owned the 2nd edition of console, so not knows if moar compact / vlsi'd
asciilifeform: there were 2 of'em
asciilifeform: both with in-house custom glass (nobody at the time sold off-the-shelf 'svga'-res. tube)
phf[asciilifeform]: “He spent six years turning his breakthrough into a system of musical importance and eventually was able to simulate a large number of musical sounds, including the singing voice. In 1974, Stanford University licensed the discovery to Yamaha,[4] with whom Chowning worked in developing a family of synthesizers and electro
phf[asciilifeform]: nic organs. This was Stanford's most lucrative patent at one time,[5] eclipsing many in electronics, computer science, and biotechnology.”
asciilifeform: yamaha opl3/4 & clones still humming along in over9000 toys aha
asciilifeform: ( incl. errybody's childhood 'adlib' & 'soundblaster' )
phf[asciilifeform]: that's like 10 to 20 years later :>
asciilifeform: well yes, 10+y is about how long takes for 'after-hours experiment' -> patent landgrab -> 3$/ea. off-shelf ic
asciilifeform: approx same interval b/w 'after hours' bell unix & commercial unix ws errywhere
phf[busybot]: nah, you're just missing a chunk of history where yamaha was releasing synthesizers first, for researchers (e.g. synclavier) and then for the peoples, e.g. the legendary DX7
asciilifeform: likely ( asciilifeform -- not musician, knows subj largely from toy side )
phf[busybot]: dx7 was basically the first digital synthesizer that sold to general population in significant numbers
asciilifeform: dunno, the 6581 circa '82 iirc. but possibly dx7 was 1st piano-shaped standalone ?
phf[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform, yeah, we're using two different terms :) synthesizer as a chip, and synthesizer as a "thing that a musician can use to make music"
asciilifeform: then yes
bitbot[asciilifeform|busybot]: Logged on 2022-11-02 16:19:18 signpost: subj of FPGAs, my two arrived.
asciilifeform not had time to attempt, but expects over9000 dep hell
phf[busybot]: mos is a PSG "programmable sound generator", which is your classical "introduction to digital signal" sound chip. you have noise, a bunch of waveforms and a bunch of envolopes. at the channel and resolution of hardware at the time you basically can produce that oldschool chiptune sound
asciilifeform: phf: correct. came with 2dozen registers where had to diddle in realtime to actually play sumthing musiclike
phf[busybot]: fm synthesis is a significantly large number of those basic elements, combined in a particular way to provide a good enough approximation of real world sounds to make the result appealing to general pop
asciilifeform: (could, interestingly, ~read~'em too, and do simple feedback)
asciilifeform: right, was no question of 'resemble acoustic instruments' with 6581 (tho coupla people managed to do recognizable human voice, eating 100% of cpu)
asciilifeform: (recall e.g. c64 'mission impossible', 'stay a while, stay forever!' intro)
asciilifeform owns a 'roland mt32' (plugged into msdos box) where used anuther 'last gasp before wavetables' period tech, subtractive synthesis
asciilifeform: phf: interesting link btw; had nfi it had e.g. ripple-carry adder
asciilifeform: also asciilifeform entirely mistakenly assumed that yamaha's fm ics were hybrid digital-analogue, with the sines produced via voltage-controlled oscillators
asciilifeform: apparently -- not, had table in rom etc
crtdaydreams[busybot]: re:fpga the icestorm creator's webshit appears to be [hacked?][https://clifford.at/]
crtdaydreams[asciilifeform|busybot] wish could 'unsee' d00ds twitter page
crtdaydreams[busybot]: yeha doods webshit defo hacked and shilling btc casino
crtdaydreams[busybot]: had to double take after looking at twatter
phf[asciilifeform]: shoulda used mp-wp
phf[busybot]: yah, i got curious how bad it could be, i've paid a dear price
crtdaydreams[busybot]: I don't trust any src from this person to be untampered with, considering they seem unable to secure a machine that serves html opposed to an entire development toolchain.
phf[asciilifeform]: crtdaydreams, i don't know why you had to misgender her, her pronunce are clearly identified in her twitter about and it's not they/them. it's 2022 and we still have to have that conversation!
shinohai[busybot]: lol I haven't checked logs of poor alf's irc in so long didn't notice this until now unpx http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-10-21#1114150
dulapbot: (asciilifeform) 2022-10-21 d4: shinohai: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=E1ht
phf[asciilifeform]: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-11-02#1015354 << thank you, lord, for reminding me that your way is true, etc.
bitbot[asciilifeform]: Logged on 2022-11-02 17:45:09 signpost: woof.
signpost[asciilifeform]: at this point yurp falling to islam would be a vast improvement.
phf[asciilifeform]: i think that might be an american expat
phf[asciilifeform]: because there's a handful of tweets (i'm down the rabbit hole) of interacting with transphobic austrian medical services written in a way that seem to imply being an outsider
signpost[busybot]: oh, sorry austria. carry on!
signpost[asciilifeform] has been browsing the "detrans" folks lately too.
signpost[asciilifeform]: it's sad stuff, woke parents/teachers/etc pushing the kids into the castration cult.
signpost[asciilifeform]: makes me wonder whether there's a mechanism which *WILL* impose a filter upon reproduction no matter how unthreatening the environment becomes.
signpost[asciilifeform]: a filter will be supplied.
dulapbot: Logged on 2022-11-02 14:30:19 unpx[asciilifeform|busybot]: An looking at that same exact table I cannot unsee the order of that polynomial being 52
bitbot[busybot]: Logged on 2022-11-02 17:34:06 crtdaydreams[jonsykkel|awt|signpost]: yeha doods webshit defo hacked and shilling btc casino
asciilifeform: shithub has the sores ( which was always a gigantic ball of py3 btw, and if anyone wants old vers plox to say )
asciilifeform: the alternative is fwiw the vendor's closed turd (in which case no reason not to use xilinx's, they sell 20x larger chips); or 'write own'
asciilifeform: if go with choice 2 or 3, also includes 'write own sdram and ethernet' etc
asciilifeform at one time tried to write sdram controller, from waveforms pictured in the datashits. not got far, didn't have the uninterrupted 3+yrs this job needed
asciilifeform: crtdaydreams: not necessarily hacked, btw -- domain expir'd
signpost[asciilifeform]: she has a new domain; old one is deadnaming!!1!11
asciilifeform has nfi if even same meatsack, not as if previous version had pgp sigs
asciilifeform: 'today you play jazz, tomorrow you sell the motherland'(tm)(r)(sovoklul)
asciilifeform: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-11-02#1015363 << outcome of swallowing could easily end up 'trans-islam' (kosher per shia!) neh
bitbot[busybot]: Logged on 2022-11-02 17:59:23 signpost: at this point yurp falling to islam would be a vast improvement.
signpost[asciilifeform]: sure, standard admonitions against sticking your dick in crazy apply.
signpost[busybot] meanwhile over here working sbcl's lockless atomic ops into oc encoder
signpost[busybot]: I'm going to need to find a prng that is cheap to re-seed, because that's the bottleneck in both py and lisp
signpost[busybot]: (not surprising)
asciilifeform: signpost: try marsaglia
signpost[asciilifeform]: ty! will look into it.
asciilifeform: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-11-02#1015369 << main 'filter' is 100+yo by nao -- if you aint a farmer or 'nobility', children are expensive pets, rather than +ev workforce. so trend to logical conclusion.
bitbot[busybot|asciilifeform]: Logged on 2022-11-02 18:04:33 signpost: makes me wonder whether there's a mechanism which *WILL* impose a filter upon reproduction no matter how unthreatening the environment becomes.
signpost[asciilifeform]: see also georgia guidestones, yep
phf[asciilifeform]: сегодня ты играешь треш, а завтра бабу свою съешь
asciilifeform: signpost: recently found out that partizans dynamited'em
asciilifeform: phf: aaha
signpost[asciilifeform]: re: oc, also need to chop into many simple-bit-vectors rather than sitting all blocks down into one large bit-vector
asciilifeform: signpost: can one easily invoke mmap from sbcl ? ( expect that could, if only via ffi )
signpost[asciilifeform]: sbcl's fast bit ops (xor in this case) can't be run quickly over displaced arrays, unfortunately.
asciilifeform: aa displaced
signpost[asciilifeform]: believe so, yeah
signpost[asciilifeform]: this prototype's all in memory, but will need to move to mmap or other suitable file interaction means
signpost[asciilifeform]: phf: I nibble on her time to time but so far haven't torn off a bite.
phf[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform, which reminds me that i know a girl who works for the ministry of culture, and she got a call for a laundromat, and she said "no, i'm sorry, this is a wrong phone number" and hung up. every time we drink she brings it up as the biggest regret of her life
asciilifeform wunders how sumbody goes from 'let's painfully reverse & map out fpga and write verilog synth' to this, but not comes up with any hypothesis other than phf's
bitbot[busybot]: Logged on 2022-11-02 17:36:25 crtdaydreams[jonsykkel|awt|signpost]: [twatter ftr][https://twitter.com/oe1cxw]
bitbot[asciilifeform]: Logged on 2022-11-02 15:37:18 phf[awt]: and the whole "biplar lisp programmer" has nothing to do with lisp machine world, and more to do with the fact that by the time that meme appears most people who still write code are insane (or at least most vocal ones, the xah lees and the naggums)
shinohai[busybot]: jfc the nightmares that twitter link induces. Imma have to go stick my face in some snatch RIGHT NOW to remove that atrocity from my memory.
shinohai[busybot]: be back tomorrow
crtdaydreams[asciilifeform|busybot]: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-11-02#1015379 << dun make sense, site itself still links to fpga stuff and shithub links to site
bitbot[asciilifeform|busybot]: Logged on 2022-11-02 19:20:43 asciilifeform[5]: crtdaydreams: not necessarily hacked, btw -- domain expir'd
bitbot[busybot|asciilifeform]: Logged on 2022-11-02 19:14:27 asciilifeform[6]: shithub has the sores ( which was always a gigantic ball of py3 btw, and if anyone wants old vers plox to say )
bitbot[busybot|asciilifeform]: Logged on 2022-11-02 19:14:27 asciilifeform[6]: shithub has the sores ( which was always a gigantic ball of py3 btw, and if anyone wants old vers plox to say )
crtdaydreams[busybot]: asciilifeform: (I would like the old vers plox, tarred and signed preferrably)
crtdaydreams[asciilifeform|busybot]: This raises the Q; how shiny?
crtdaydreams[busybot|asciilifeform]: Bare minimum is an audit (curious if ascii or anyone else has read da sauce)
crtdaydreams[busybot]: [only relevant sauce in question atm][https://github.com/f4pga/prjtrellis]
asciilifeform: crtdaydreams: asciilifeform neither audited it nor intends to , is elephantine
crtdaydreams[busybot|asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: intend to use proprietary binturds?
asciilifeform: crtdaydreams: at one time used xilinx's (for e.g. FG) but not intending to again
asciilifeform: crtdaydreams: if you think about it, there aint a meaningful attack vector against fpga proggy ( author of boobytrap has nfi what you intend to put and where )
asciilifeform: concern is moar re 'does the synth tool rm -rf /' etc
asciilifeform: sooo run it on unnetworked box.
asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/pub/misc/icestorm-master.zip fwiw, sha256:dcf78fbe525887f5e8c363a8039ffd5f00fd23b5127b5f0f86eae4b9b743ce5f
asciilifeform aint aboutta sign it, is steaming pile which made ~0 effort to read
asciilifeform: read it yerself.
asciilifeform: the thing is a reversing tool; the pertinent proggy is 'yosys'
asciilifeform: ( by same ex-human fwiw )
asciilifeform: the ver on asciilifeform's box is 0.7+259
asciilifeform: circa '16.
asciilifeform: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-11-02#1015413 << indeed, not noticed (apparently in sidebar)
asciilifeform: so pwned.
bitbot[busybot|asciilifeform]: Logged on 2022-11-02 23:07:03 crtdaydreams[jonsykkel|awt|signpost]: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-11-02#1015379 << dun make sense, site itself still links to fpga stuff and shithub links to site
asciilifeform must bbl
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