BingoBoingo: mike_c: So while you were gone MP went from valuing the silent reserves as something like people to instead valuing the folks silent for families and such reasons instead as somewhere between honeycomb tripe and the other three stomach's lesser flavors of tripe.
mike_c: yeah, it's not an unreasonable position.
mike_c: The more interesting question is what to do with someone you had a business relationship with that you now have negrated
mike_c: Of course, "relationship" with silent investors is a strong term, but still.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: In practice with Pizarro it ended up with regarding the negrated as the second to worst stomach's tripe. At the moment it is ambiguous.
BingoBoingo: Maybe the WoL thing and letting MP know which key attaches to your name may have been suboptimal in retrospect.
mike_c: I'm not hiding anything.
mike_c: You can't do business without knowing each other.
BingoBoingo: But the alternative to what I sent you is you take
Qntra school and commit three publishable pieces a week for two years. Having been active te time I have, I don't see anything other than that or the proposal I dropped in the gpg past having better than coin flip odds.
mike_c: I am happy to have a conversation with those not negrated, or anyone about the situation. I'm not going to hire you to represent me (but do honestly appreciate the offer), and I'm not yet willing to work my way back into the good graces of the realm.
mike_c: The question that stands now is what mp asked, what to do with the assets "owed" to what was a person in good standing, and now not for reasons of uninvolvement.
BingoBoingo: The thing is a lot of things happened in your period of uninvolvement like the entire history of an attempted ISP.
BingoBoingo: But for the lack of action after the seeing.... you've been written off as less than a person. It's a bit sad but that is how history unfolded.
mike_c: Seems to be. As mentioned awhile ago, it seemed unfitting to stay half-in.
mike_c: I may still come back, and did and still do believe I could work my way back in, but until then half measures are pretty worthless.
BingoBoingo: MP has also made it clear in the interim that the money doesn't particularly matter at all. The only argument that gets your coin can be made by someone he has rated 9, and the only argument that he will take seriously is submission to Republican power structures.
BingoBoingo: Every other argument fails for refusal to submit to Republican power structures.
mike_c: Well, like you said, it is a republic. So this seems like good case law.
mike_c: Could go either way, I'll be interested to see how it shakes out.
BingoBoingo: It's rather sad case law as I've come to enjoy the Roman law system.
mike_c: asciilifeform is still in good standing, fwiw, if it ends up "non-citizens get nothing" and the question then comes up "what to do with the coin", I propose give it to ascii for time served.
mike_c: founders get a tough end of the startup bargain
BingoBoingo: mike_c: I welcomed asciilifeform into my home this weekend for several consecutive days, but he fell out of the Lordship with S.NSA's unwind. I am open to an arrangement where the bulk of the coin ends up with asciilifeform.
mike_c: really? I did miss that part.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: I am open to make a deal out of anything, but the one non-negotiable is going to have to be a punative payment to someone MP rated 9
BingoBoingo: To demonstrate submission to Republican power structures.
mike_c: i'm looking up what happened where ascii got booted, if you have a link handy? otherwise I'll find it
BingoBoingo: It was a process over october. I'll try to find the exact link.
ossabot: (trilema) 2019-10-22 asciilifeform: diana_coman: moar in brief re expansions (will address pedantically in draft 2) -- they will have to be financed by actual revenue, and BingoBoingo-style auctions, i do not have massive capital (and what i have, is earmarked for physical irons, already ordered 'dulaps' and will be purchasing yet-moar of'em once it becomes clear that asciilifeform won't live alone in the rack)
BingoBoingo: FWIW I sent the box I bought at the Pizarro auction in asciilifeform's suitcase to his rack. i trust his hands.
mike_c: oh, yeah, I saw all that. I thought you were saying he got negrated. according to deedbot, he didn't.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: MP dropped him to +2 which takes him out of the lordship. Lordship in practice shifted from Deedbot +1 to MP +9
mike_c: ok - I am reconsidering your offer. Allow me a moment to think.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform is a good man, but per the rules of the forum he's not on the list of folks who can put forth remedies.
mike_c: I have also met ascii, and of course agree he's a good man. Otherwise would not have invested.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: Imma walk a bit. Do think. Yes it is a puzzle, but it is a puzzle you can win so long as you don't outright reject Republican power structures.
BingoBoingo: The biggest difference between now and the WOL era is the WoT mechanisms that let WoL list are now barriers to entering pleas and claims. Falling on the other side of the WoT barrier is also now the equivalent of being pork bellies stacked in a sausage factory.
BingoBoingo: It has been ~a year and a half that I've forseen someone falling into this misfortunate situation. I do regret that the test case is you, though later cases can only suffer still more misfortune. The screw turns one way.
trinque: curious how common law became republican precedent. was that before my time?
BingoBoingo: trinque: The inherited common law is not Republican precedent, but the mechanism that developed common law is how lords historically settled disputes.
BingoBoingo: Roman law is how you make cuts where the common folk are something else.
mike_c: BingoBoingo: I changed my mind, and my offer to hire you: I send you fee of 30 BTC (same amount the mpex account cost coincidentally). If you lose the case and I don't recover my dividend, you send 10 BTC to ascii (nothing to me). If you win and I do recover, then I send 10 BTC to ascii (and you keep the 30). in case of partial recovery, i dunno, we do something gentlemanly.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: Deal 15eVXAW7k8uKc5moDFUSc9Y3jmHFAenNXo
mike_c: great, i'll warm up some wallet
snsabot: Logged on 2019-12-19 01:47:39 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Aite, will test in a bit
snsabot: Logged on 2019-11-08 20:15:06 asciilifeform: dorion: you may begin whenever you wish. ( yer time slot is still to 1600 . )
snsabot: Logged on 2019-12-19 02:18:47 mike_c: Well, like you said, it is a republic. So this seems like good case law.
trinque: to an extent. I wouldn't do this for someone that meant me harm.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-12-19 02:58:38 mike_c: BingoBoingo: I changed my mind, and my offer to hire you: I send you fee of 30 BTC (same amount the mpex account cost coincidentally). If you lose the case and I don't recover my dividend, you send 10 BTC to ascii (nothing to me). If you win and I do recover, then I send 10 BTC to ascii (and you keep the 30). in case of partial recovery, i dunno, we do something gentlemanly.
mike_c: worked for years in an enterprise i invested in for no salary, and while not successful, made good faith effort throughout.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: That is exactly why I weight this argument strong and others dubious, the act of faith in the Turkish sense.
mike_c: cool, I'll be a customer.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Please do GPGgram me what you want for 1 quarter of colocation
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: box will go through its paces once I have headspace to do so, probably tomorrow.
mike_c: heh, have fun. BingoBoingo: I'm signing off, funds will hit that address tonight.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: Aite, I'm in UTC -3 so I'll see when I wake up and then get the ball rolling.
mike_c: BingoBoingo: payment delivered with the last block. good luck!
BingoBoingo: mike_c: Thank you for the strong demonstration of WoT value. Opening salvo has been placed in the forum.