mircea_popescu: imo this is from an earlier stage when the building blocks of what the problem was going to be were still being assembled.
diana_coman: fwiw I went there because of a former friend who kept pulling at me about it; nothing to do with stanca really, never even talked to him ever.
diana_coman: well, technically it was first the move to int64 and then the rest but practically they still overlapped to some degree and the similar pains etc.
mircea_popescu: oh was it in there ?
diana_coman: hm, in my memory the int64 kind of merges with eviscerating the gem mess out of the server
mircea_popescu: pretty sure i insisted a thing be published at the end of what was a longish march if memory serves, and pretty sure i was gratified in it ; moreover i recall interacting with a nobject
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: that's not possible as the only "old blog not moved" is that thing on wordpress.org that dates from...uhm, 2009/10 ?
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: do you mean the move to int64?
mircea_popescu: btw diana_coman there's no ossasepia on the original "holy shit, ints!!" or am i just not finding it ?
lobbesbot: Logged on 2017-02-21 21:53:17: <mircea_popescu> now, eulora DID move away from broken ints to sane ints during migration to 0.1.2, and i don't know anyone cared enohgh to extensively debug the insanity that is microsoft. so you might have found something. what exactly were those new errors ?
mircea_popescu: chema/?b=Compared&e=be#select][bit], then eventually a small pile of actually useful and working code is left behind, implementing 108% or so of what the old pile actually did while removing 98% or so of what it had no business doing"
mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956202 << not necessarily, what i meant was, "everything is first read, then the ints are fixed, then it's read some more, then all the shit is taken out, bit by [http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/draft-gbw-node-s
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-28 22:56:45 trinque: and jfw, dorion_road, if you don't see the word "Gales" in there, it's because I'm trying to disabuse you of the notion that there's such thing as a "Gales" which you made, by way of sheer numbers.
dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956159 << thanks. my position is gales, like cuntoo, is a stepping stone to tmsr os so looks like we're onthe same page there.
whaack: diana_coman: if i search for a piece of lisp code to do something, I have a (perhaps naive) belief that I am more likely to find something well written, since there are fewer people using the language
trinque: all my tmsr work to date could've been php or pyshits for all the difference it would've made.
trinque: nobody's defending python; I'm questioning the superiority of lisp for anything you might actually be doing on a regular basis.
diana_coman: whaack: wtf's "the cultural aspect of a (present day) more niche language" ?
whaack: trinque: pasting chunks of python code is also a pain given the blocks-created-by-tabs design
diana_coman: re paster though tbh this attempt (coming as it does on top of the previous mess with python and its flask) left me looking again for not using either.
whaack: trinque: First, I find it more pleasant writing in lisp. Second, I like the cultural aspect of a (present day) more niche language. Then for problems with python: i find the single line lambdas a strange requirement, and not having tail call optimization is lame (although i admit i can't think of many/any cases where that's been a problem)
trinque: and that's the latest, fattest busybox yet.
trinque: and both of these are larger, again, than ALL OF BUSYBOX
trinque: clozurecl ftr is just about as fat as sbcl these days.
trinque: I'd be willing to abandon lisp for now, seeing as how the usable components incur at least another 400k lines of bloat, and for that you gain yet another javascript ecosystem.
trinque: but I've had a pretty violently negative reaction to the whole pile.
trinque: lines are another bad proxy for complexity, but they're a better measure than the version triple
trinque: whaack: in this case, between sbcl-1.0.50 and the latest, the C kernel of the thing actually got smaller by roughly a third, while the lisp part expanded by about 100k lines
trinque: there's also this hard-to-define cultural decay element
whaack: trinque: I can't say I am principled in the manner. in general, i use the lowest version that works
trinque: I can genesize the phpwad as well.
whaack: diana_coman: From my experience, for most packages from quicklisp you're going to have problems if you don't have asdf 3+, which comes with sbcl 1.4.14 (not sure what the first version of sbcl with asdf 3+ was)
diana_coman: whaack: what version of asdf did you get to work with all the rest anyway?
diana_coman: ... lisp code is that it pulls in the drakma http client that pulls in as far as I can see another 18 deps (and moreover so far one of them fails anyway on my current setup aka centos 6 with sbcl 1.0.39, asdf 2.26; but I see that whaack reports sbcl 1.4.14 working for the logbot so I'll try it next with that and see.)
diana_coman: trinque: I had a look at your published paster lisp code; my current understanding is that it's only a part of what's required to stand up a backup paste service though, isn't it? mind pointing me to the rest of the bits/a recipe to put it all together? I had this idea that it's saner to replicate at the very least the paste service and a mirrored wot website. My current understanding of that paster ...
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-29 05:44:04 diana_coman: trinque: is the select thing not working on your blog? I'm trying to select that great "fits in hand" and I can't seem to, this doesn't do anything.
trinque: no, there's only one v tree
trinque: bvt: not trying to be a pedantic dick over here, but it's v that's the boundary around the other stuff, not the other stuff around v
bvt: mircea_popescu: re second q, imho cleaning up the components will be driven by how the OS gets [re]structured around V, too early to say right now
trinque: I agree that there should be single, correct answers when choosing components (as I'm trying to lay out the options for such selection in my series), but not that each component is always present in any system.
feedbot: http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/29/the-shady-business-with-shaders-in-cs-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-ix/ << Ossa Sepia -- The Shady Business with Shaders in CS (Notes on Graphics in Eulora, IX)
mircea_popescu: or to put it another way, i do not believe it is either intelligent or even tolerable to try and carry forward the "install" paradigm from derpworld. something much more akin to diana_coman 's work on eulora is what "get installed" will have to mean.
mircea_popescu: neways, as to the burning "OTOH, I wonder if things like Apache or imagemagick get installed, how will the package management system work out, and how comprehensible will system stay?" question -- i see the merit of using the clean spot as a fixed point to attempt expanding cleanliness. so, it would work by apache becoming tmserv or w/e, and not sucking anymore.
mircea_popescu: feather*
mircea_popescu: by ready availability of python or others." << indeed this is mindblowingly beautiful, and as far as i current;y know the foremost fearher in jfw 's cap.
mircea_popescu: "A feature that I liked a lot is that shell is the only scripting language in the default install of the distribution. Typically perl and python get pulled in unconditionally as a build dependency of a runtime dependency of some rarely-used default-installed utility, or are directly used to implement package manager, etc. With Gales, a decision about what scripting language to use can be made without constraints created
BingoBoingo: The logling where I deed the client's signed instructions again, this time under cutting length: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1956012
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Waiting for deedbot to go from acceptance to deeding. I've got the MPEx statement with my involvement note attached on top submitted to deedbot. (Clearsigned statement on its own here since GPG doesn't like making nested signatures). For whatever it may be worth, I've also got my client to sign [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/t
mircea_popescu: well now that i took all the time to write it, might as well link it : http://ztkfg.com/2019/12/thoughts-on-shrysr-leaving-younghands-and-asciilifeforms-excommunication/#comment-144 (though whaack stll jas to approve it)
mircea_popescu: oh right, the introvert indian engine guy, i see.
mircea_popescu: apparently now there's [ztkfg.com/2019/12/thoughts-on-shrysr-leaving-younghands-and-asciilifeforms-excommunication/][drama] about people i don't even recall ever hearing of. i have fiddy tabs open struggling to keep up with everyone over here and barely managing... it's like an xmas miracle or something.
mircea_popescu: who the fuck even is this guy
mircea_popescu: incidentally BingoBoingo what's the snag now ? your client ran off from under you after paying ?!
mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956154 << fucking nonsense of this ilk is how we ended up in the shit in the first fucking place.
mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956147 << this is probably the furthest afield asking in the history of askings on planet earth. but... sure, why not, if you'll happily accept ima fire up the magic box later and make the thing.
mircea_popescu: in keeping with the theme, "pedoworld reality distortion field" ends up spelled "wiki" in hawaii or some shit.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-28 09:08:25 hanbot: in other unexpected wins, wikipedia started redirecting my browser to "mandatory upgrade" sometime last week. of all the deprecations i've steadfastly watched pass by in my box's moat as it were, this one is by far the most satisfying.
mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956145 << i'm sure you can donate less than the cost of a cup of coffee or whatever though. remember, it's the site that doesn't advertise -- a point oft repeated via wikipedia not-advertising.
mircea_popescu: sorry for the constant complaints borne out of user error, plox don't take it to heart.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-28 07:29:14 spyked: mircea_popescu: hm, from what I see it only sent the comments/new feeds since it first saw mircea_popescu offline
mircea_popescu: in this morn's stray thoughts : if "wife" ends up spelled "waifu" in japanese, is it the case "kungfu" really should be "knife" ?
diana_coman: trinque: is the select thing not working on your blog? I'm trying to select that great "fits in hand" and I can't seem to, this doesn't do anything.
trinque: ftr not saying anything about the value of the gales work, above. I think it's quite valuable, but we'll get there.
trinque: and jfw, dorion_road, if you don't see the word "Gales" in there, it's because I'm trying to disabuse you of the notion that there's such thing as a "Gales" which you made, by way of sheer numbers.
feedbot: http://bingology.net/2019/reviewing-the-last-plans-and-new-plans-going-into-2020/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- Reviewing The Last Plans And New Plans Going Into 2020
trinque: teaser fact: busybox is *half* the size of grub-2 by LoC
BingoBoingo: In lulz at the local/international interface, local police seized some cocaine. They honestly assessed the pile at ~1 million USD using the local wholesale price. The story moved to the international press today. The BBC is assessing the value of the pile at ~1 billion USD using their local retail prices.
trinque: and in that spirit, part 1 of my contribution to the OS thread shall be published tonight, and so on by days until finished. maybe 4/5 parts.
hanbot: in other unexpected wins, wikipedia started redirecting my browser to "mandatory upgrade" sometime last week. of all the deprecations i've steadfastly watched pass by in my box's moat as it were, this one is by far the most satisfying.
spyked: mircea_popescu: hm, from what I see it only sent the comments/new feeds since it first saw mircea_popescu offline
mircea_popescu: !Q later tell spyked yo, feedbot's unwinding the whole history of comments on trilema at me fo rsome reason, halp!
mircea_popescu: !Qlater tell spyked yo, feedbot's unwinding the whole history of comments on trilema at me fo rsome reason, halp!
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-10 12:10:44 BingoBoingo: Reading the ongoing conversations in the forums and castles, I get a building suspicion that further cutting on Gentoo is going to start looking like cutting on CrystalSpace
deedbot: 2019/12/16 09:33:35 <spyked> http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954760 <-- certainly looks like a spin on greenspun's rule: any system that amasses enough complexity (for some values of "enough", at least) becomes a contender for the "operating system" label. imho emacs, wp, cltrons all fit in there.
mircea_popescu: nevertheless -- this introduces no relativism. the ethical choice stays the ethical choice, and the moral state remains the moral state. yes or no, the perpetual question, and well... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CTZty62iqo
mircea_popescu: this isn't a complaint -- i don't personally mind evil exists, nor do i believe it shouldn't exist or that its absence would signal any kind of improvement. without evil the world's boring as fuck, which is why idiots asking dumb questions like "how come an infinitely good god has small children raped to death" are fucking stupid. evil is a better addition to the world than fucking cinema, it'd be way too borning to try
mircea_popescu: from whence it can further spread -- much like camels who never saw other camels spit don't know how to spit nor ever spit, while camels who did see other camels spit do know how and actually do it, just so people don't come up with evil naturally, they just replicate it from having seen it before.
mircea_popescu: and everyone else is stuck somehow reconciling your supposed "great technical acumen" with your apparent incapacity to intellectually function enough to match a age-adequately developed nine year old slut -- which is incidentally how the elaborate narrative of the naysayers even evoloved over time : the others dealing with the anal child is how anal childhood even gets implanted in heads in the first place.
mircea_popescu: it gets you stuck saying patently dumb shit like "alliance of the smart against the stupid" when what you quite transparently ~really~ mean is very much "i thought this guy was gonna vouch for my imaginary partitions of a) above!" ;
mircea_popescu: it's not exactly novel, but on the contrary well documented to date. lotta cripples have lived since the practical implementation of rochester's all men be cowards if they durst.
mircea_popescu: in the end, what you do is hang out with the other cripples. that's it, the loser table at the highschool cafeteria, where you tell each other stories of "how you aren't really geeks", and how one day you'll get the cheerleader, the usual fare. making pacts about losing your virginity by end of school...
mircea_popescu: your life becomes a carousel of a) identifying partitions upon the world that'll neatly divide it across the line of "this part exposes my dysfunction" / "this part doesn't expose my dysfunction" (definitionally an impossible task) and b) making up stories about how it all works out, or will, or whatever.
mircea_popescu: no sucks because... it really doesn't. once you decide you actually "like" your dysfunction, or in any case you're not equal to its remedial, you're stuck hanging out in #asciilifeform with all the other cripples.
mircea_popescu: there's strictly two possible answers you can ever produce, and they're yes or no. yes sucks because, well... it is suicide. [http://ossasepia.com/2019/10/31/working-with-ideals-and-perfections/#comment-6848][]quite literally], the little girl gotta die.
mircea_popescu: every time you discover something, you get the same exact choice, again and again each time. you get the same choice that also happens to be the ~only~ meaningful choice you ever get, or ever could possibly get : are you going to fix it ?
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-27 08:17:17 mp_en_viaje: neways, your main hope is deconstructing the supression machine, not trying to find it new fields of employ.
mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-27#1956098 << here's what ~i~ mean : as you live, the very substance of what living even is will work to expose things you're no good at. this is what it is, and what it can ever possibly be. much like all energy manipulation is an entropy increase, all living is self-discovery.
mircea_popescu: so listen... while you were away there's been a lot of progress ongoing in the republic, these guys now have blogs and stick to publishing planning schedules and such wunderbar alien techs. you gonna catch up with the group ?
ossabot: Logged on 2018-11-15 11:58:12 mircea_popescu: i'll want the coin back next year. now go forth and own stupidity no more!
feedbot: http://qntra.net/2019/12/alphabets-youtube-takes-down-bitcoin-and-crypto-videos-before-quickly-restoring-them-as-irrelevant/ << Qntra -- Alphabet's Youtube Takes Down "Bitcoin and Crypto" Videos Before Quickly Restoring Them As Irrelevant
diana_coman: yeah, he tried there for higher than he realised; had a talk with him on that.
mp_en_viaje: mwanwhile in other coincidental great things, i found the article where (among other great things, such as early warnings to beings an engineer) i discuss the problem of toddlers and dynamic equilibrium. which, i recall, was wanted and not found at some point somewhat recently -- i just can't anymore find where that happened.
mp_en_viaje: neways, your main hope is deconstructing the supression machine, not trying to find it new fields of employ.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-26 18:12:01 trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-26#1956047 << I'll respect this, and stop trying to inject my own self-evaluations into the matter.
feedbot: http://trilema.com/2019/do-you-know-why-theyre-just-so-damn-awkward-i-only-ask-because-i-finally-figured-it-out/ << Trilema -- Do you know why they're just so damn awkward ? I only ask because I finally figured it out!
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-26 06:08:34 mp_en_viaje: diana_coman, imo all the rest can stay. also imo it is more important to be right than principled. the principles can be written in afterwards, for as long as you're right ; if you're wrong no writ will save you anyway.
trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-26#1956047 << I'll respect this, and stop trying to inject my own self-evaluations into the matter.
trinque: speaking of updating ratings, in reflecting, I've been quite affected by the year's events as amply evidenced in recent logs.
deedbot: BingoBoingo rated nicoleci 2 at 2018/10/29 02:18:13 << Mircea's chattle, summarizer in training, Outside the Wire
deedbot: BingoBoingo updated rating of diana_coman from 5 to 9 << Master of the Serene Republic's University, S.MG, etc
BingoBoingo: !!rate diana_coman 9 Master of the Serene Republic's University, S.MG, etc
lobbes will bbl; attending meat matters for the holidays and will have sporadic terminal access until ~Jan 2
ericbot: Logged on 2019-12-26 09:52:57 mp_en_viaje: in other housekeeping, hey diana_coman lobbes wouldja mind taking alf's derpy alt-bitcoinwizards off the loggers header list ?
mp_en_viaje: diana_coman, this is a great beautiful mirror to that "in theory, there's no difference between theory and craptice" ditty : "in principle, there's no difference between right and principled".
mp_en_viaje: diana_coman, imo all the rest can stay. also imo it is more important to be right than principled. the principles can be written in afterwards, for as long as you're right ; if you're wrong no writ will save you anyway.
mp_en_viaje: because fucking obviously, the reason you do things is so you have to undo them two weeks later, such is the great benefit of dealing with people.
diana_coman: tbh I kept pondering what *should* be in there to start with; on one hand it would make sense to have #trilema + deeded chans really; onth dunno, I'd want #trinque for instance and he hasn't asked for a deed, so uhm.
mp_en_viaje has fixed the long over-due logger links on trilema also.
mp_en_viaje: little point playing fave with morons, gotta either have all or none (and ideally -- none).
mp_en_viaje: in other housekeeping, hey diana_coman lobbes wouldja mind taking alf's derpy alt-bitcoinwizards off the loggers header list ?
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-25 13:21:44 hanbot: dorion_road haha, so you met voorhees in 07 '13 and this, two months previous, seriously never came up? There's a truly toxic acquaintance for ya.
dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-25#1956032 << the conference was mentioned, but I don't remember when or by who - josh rossi is also in that pic and moved to panama in 2013. the importance of who was meeting wasn't seriously discussed with me and I didn't have the smarts at the time to ask and figure it out.
hanbot: dorion_road haha, so you met voorhees in 07 '13 and this, two months previous, seriously never came up? There's a truly toxic acquaintance for ya.
BingoBoingo: In gifts the locals give me this Navidad, the names inside the FA are tearing at each other. Mujica "Rights agenda was a mistake" Other derps "Muh feminismo, un violador eres tú", Mujica "I spent 12 years getting thrown into dark holes"
whaack: mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-24#1956017 <<-- ty, I had figured the message was meant for lobbes prior. I'll take a look into getting the toolbar showing on the individual article pages. They are hidden by default on mpwp's Kubrick theme.
diana_coman: jfw: Keksum's 3rd genesis is now signed and mirrored; as you've gathered already the previous comments on your article directly, I linked that and there's no need that I see for an additional article; also, you messed up something with your Keksum's article title now.
feedbot: http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/24/some-gothic-fashions-of-another-era/ << Ossa Sepia -- Some Gothic Fashions of Another Era
bvt: mp_en_viaje: http://trilema.com/2014/peri-metaphyseos-in-english-this-time/ http://trilema.com/2014/the-two-all-essences/ ?
feedbot: http://trilema.com/2019/theres-no-better-way-to-ensure-the-enmity-of-the-mediocre-than-by-exposing-their-mediocrity-for-what-it-is/ << Trilema -- There's no better way to ensure the enmity of the mediocre than by exposing their mediocrity for what it is.
mp_en_viaje: dorion_road, aw fuck, the other two aren't even in english huh. this fucking blows, and it's where the sadness starts, i don't know how to fix this.
mp_en_viaje: to a certain degree it's rather confusing that your toolbar only shows on index page, i keep thinking i'm on the latest article all the time.
dorion_road: I've read the english translation of the essences series. I don't recall when I did though and I'm probably due for a re-read.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-23 15:43:10 mp_en_viaje: right, imminence is being in the very near future ; immanence is the essential tight coupling tying essences to phenomenology.
feedbot: http://qntra.net/2019/12/uncaring-markets-see-us-dollar-fall-against-peso-uruguayo-and-brazis-real-while-peso-argentino-will-not-stop-shitting-the-bed/ << Qntra -- Uncaring Markets See US Dollar Fall Against Peso Uruguayo And Brazil's Real While Peso Argentino Will Not Stop Shitting The Bed
lobbesbot: BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
mp_en_viaje: anyway, the latter immediately loads a kantian context, much like saying "subconscious" loads freudian.
mp_en_viaje: you ever read the essences series ?
mp_en_viaje: right, imminence is being in the very near future ; immanence is the essential tight coupling tying essences to phenomenology.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-23 07:48:16 mp_en_viaje: dorion_road, can you explain the difference between imminence and immanence ?
dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1955968 << I couldn't when I read the question. I looked into the etymology and gather imminence refers to projection and immanence refers to inherence.
lobbesbot: BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
diana_coman: mp_en_viaje: the side effects? lol.
mp_en_viaje: do that ; add to it a plain statement of your involvement, and we can take it from there.
mp_en_viaje: you're not even a witness here, to be producing something like say the smickles affidavit. so far the only way that thing can be classified as is a letter of credit, i guess ? you're saying i should give mike_c some dough as you think he's good for it ?
mp_en_viaje: the basis for a claim tuesday can't be a document signed thursday. even if whoever signs it has the autority, which i dun see how you have here.
mp_en_viaje: so far it'd seem you expect your signing something you wrote yest retroactively produces some the money however long ago ?
mp_en_viaje: which the ?
mp_en_viaje: but what ~THE~ money are we talking about ?
BingoBoingo: mp_en_viaje: I'm not saying whether you should pay the money or not. I am saying it would be consistent with the way you've worn the MPEx CEO hat before to pay. You, ultimately, are free to decide to pay or not pay. My client paid me to introduce his interests to the forum, otherwise his interests would have gone unrepresented and certainly unpaid.
mp_en_viaje: BingoBoingo, i don't get it, so the idea is i should pay money because you say so ?
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: I apologize for addressing points for the record in a manner that appears to be addressing them to you specifically.
diana_coman: ftr, I wasn't either asking for or indeed expecting the sort of "this must be paid no matter what", no idea where you took that from.
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: GPG contracts are such that a case can only be so strong without hallucinating a denial of the fundamental difference between GPG contracts and fiat contracts.
BingoBoingo: fundamental part of what makes the Republic.
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: MPEx is built on GPG contracts upheld voluntarily. Introducing "these GPG contracts must be upheld always and forever no matter the cost as if they were fiat contracts" would be subversion. For that, in representing the claim I can't say "This must be paid no matter what" or other constructions along that line without attacking a
mp_en_viaje: dorion_road, can you explain the difference between imminence and immanence ?
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-21#1955881 - fwiw, I read through this deed; I hope that is not all of "making the case" as BingoBoingo_ sees it.
mp_en_viaje: they have very little skin.
mp_en_viaje: you know why rabbits sleep with their eyes open, btw ?
mp_en_viaje: i had a list of these to get to later, now's that later, boy howdy what a string. apparently this dcu thing's working out.
mp_en_viaje: meanwhile I am nothing in particular, because I have done nothing in particular... man, the gems just keep on coming.
mp_en_viaje: there's a reason wikitards & redditards & etc waste their days away. that reason might no be, but just as well might have plenty to do with our neglect of running the slut competitions.
mp_en_viaje: in other lulz, check out these fucking idiots : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_Knepp https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Knep
mp_en_viaje: back in 1600 samuel pepys never missed a performance of the duke's company, he really liked mary knep, guess how the fuck he ever got to know she existed.
mp_en_viaje: if it weren't for those guys, all there'd be on tv would be bronco busting, wrestling an' etcetera. look up Bonnie McCarroll & women bronc riding to see the fuck i mean.
mp_en_viaje: now don't fucking tell me you didn't understand this is both a) how human society advances and b) what the fuck we even do here.
mp_en_viaje: and same with theatre, and with all "entertainment" run off the backs of young women : his grace and his friends' liveried sluts.
mp_en_viaje: that's what lucia fucking is, "let these bitches who think they can sing break their teeth". it was SUPPOSED to be undoable, which it's why it is. and it's not the only item in that vein, either.
mp_en_viaje: is the very simple "we each have these herds of sluts we're competing" basis, upon which donizetti came and offered a useful tool : "hey guise ? ima write a piece no human female born out of human female can EVER fucking sing. it'll just be fucking impossible. you can watch them die trying, crash and burtn on the stage, all their natural girly hopes and aspirations and the rest of the coy behaviour debris eviscerated for y
mp_en_viaje: the reason lucia was ever written by donizetti (and if it weren't written by him, it'd have been written by someone else! -- not "the same" in the irrelevant, misunderstood sense of "same exact surface", "same exact stringing of notes", because IT IS NOT THE FORM OF THE ARGUMENT THAT LENDS IT CREDENCE. but same in the only meaningful way : sameness of function, lucia, "the thing tha
mp_en_viaje: you own these beautiful animals which you train to compete.
mp_en_viaje: to include the competition of young women they own and trained. there's exactly no substantial difference between "showbusiness" and racing horses or "bloodsports", cockfighting, dog fighting etc.
mp_en_viaje: is that centuries ago rich and powerful men modulated their natural social competitiveness (also known as "gentle" in the gentleman, "let's compete SOME OTHER WAY than with fists and clubs", that's what it is)
mp_en_viaje: to be perfectly clear & understand each other : the ENTIRETY of stage, from "broadway" to "highbrow theatre" to ballet to ice skating to ~EVERYTHING ELSE~, the absolutely and strictly only reason ANYTHING like the stage exists in contemporary degeneracy,
lobbes: Mocky: you still got the same # I wager? If so I'll hit you up in 2020 and we can figure something out
lobbes: Mocky: lol, sounds fun at least. Listen, I owe you a lunch one of these days (I still feel like a dick for making you wait that last time). I'll be out of state until January, but if you're free sometime early next year I dun mind making the trek up to your neck of the woods
Mocky: treating me well but I haven't been managing it well. I went a little overboard trying to earn more money and seeing three chicks at the same time. I exceeded my capacity to manage it.
Mocky: oh thank you. I'm pretty sure I have everything but would use the backup to double check
BingoBoingo: mp_en_viaje: That word exists here verbally with substantial frequency, but... the search engines don't seem to know it.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-19 00:45:07 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955677 << this may even be so. but trinque , have mercy : in obtaining any desired result, the manager has indeed to await patiently for ~all possible~ results be delivered ? there is NO possibility of choice available, you mean, in the sense of none ~at all~ ?
trinque: this is probably also so, and with more layers between me and the intolerable.
mp_en_viaje: there's tremendous difference between "i want something like that but with a better face" and "i want a great looking woman that's my 5th grade classmate from back in jr high".
mp_en_viaje: the main thrust of my earlier comments was that it's likely you'll have to moderate your expectations. there's a humongous difference between what i mean by nice and what i suspect behind your "place-and-period" indication. in approximate math terms, you want something 3 or 4 sigmas away from what i want.
ossabot: Logged on 2017-06-23 13:57:56 trinque: it is factual that the non-pussified mexican culture is a huge boon for texas.
mp_en_viaje: there was a chinese man at king louis' court. human reproduction so greatly benefits from a little bit of exogamy, no human society was ever unporous.
BingoBoingo: The more specifc construction that the US is a Chinese buying internment camp also seems to work. Kinda the defining struggle of the Trumpreich. Pantsuits and others wholly owned by the Chinese needlessly make noises to impress their captors, Chinese largely indifferent as they can just wait for this little bit of excitement amongst the white worms to pass.
mp_en_viaje: in other lulz, /me surveying thoroughly harvested resource nodes : "damn, how come every time i find a rare it's 0/5. i should kill all the other players." then, after some reflectiion : "the problem's if i killed them all, who'd then buy all my shit". helpful slavegirl : "maybe you should put them in buying internment camp". /me thinking about it "i guess that's what the us actually is".
mp_en_viaje: and on the cultural standard, you'll still have to explain both, it's not like one's free. "but but but, greg abbot was ~trying~ to be good!" vs "what does this button do ?", doesn't seem you're saving anything either way. always cheaper to live in the present than to reconstruct the past.
mp_en_viaje: it's probably simpler to go help them hang Cecilia Phalen Abbott by her fallopian tubes than to go build yourself a time machine, on the purely technological standard.
mp_en_viaje: meanwhile while we're talking, the former us state of texas is being taken over by an emergent new world isis, undeclared as such, but stronger nevertheless, the "cartels" in pantsuitspeak.
mp_en_viaje: time of the revolution and read all up on Antoine de Saussure Peronette de Crocketagne's grandson's adventures.
mp_en_viaje: for that matter : by the time the 60s rolled around there were adult tejanos all over texas shaking their head at this elvis greasy, faggoty bs and thinking back to a greater time in, say, 1890, back when cattle was still speaking spanish and the east coast dudes hadn't really shown up with their idioties, "how to make it all cheap". while in the actual 1890, actual mexicans in texas were looking up through almanacs at the
mp_en_viaje: but the end's always gonna be buey zaraza, tus ojos tristones mirando la huella parecen buscar el milagro de aquellos pasitos que al irse la ingrata no supo dejar. it has to.
mp_en_viaje: no joke about the spanyards, either. Mientras que, bajo el peso del trigo, los ejes cansados los siento quejar, yo, anudando mi pena a esa queja, con cantos y silbos te sé acompañar. is a fucking thing, which they did. thoroughly, and well -- or if not well, then as well as could be done, for sure.
mp_en_viaje: by the time the 80s roll around and everyone's driving and they kick the cattle out ass by ass to plonk down oil rigs, it's done for. the distances narrowed, and oil trade is integrating in ways cattle trading is not.
mp_en_viaje: 1960 texas is predicated on the remnants of three centuries' british struggles with the dutch encountering six centuries spanish struggles with the beasts of the land, women, horses, cattle generally, defeating it in the field and then having the intelligence to rape the carcass raw.
mp_en_viaje: trinque, i don't expect 1960s tx is reproducible outside of a hard reset. highly coherent, profoundly skilled workforce in a complete worldview will absolutely require the conditions that spawned them, and will necessarily dissolve once the solvents show up.
BingoBoingo: trinque: Maybe rural UY in the sense of the departments of Maldonado, Flores, or Rocha. I've not yet investigated out there yet.
trinque: was kinda curious if UY would end up being something like this. sounds instead like another latam communist-wannabe.
mp_en_viaje: to a certain degree it depends on one's particular interests. these are fine tuned for my needs
trinque: mp_en_viaje: I'm curious, in all your travels, whether you've found another tolerable outpost.
mp_en_viaje: hanging out with alf rotted your brain, the same disorganised randomness exudes off you both by now.
mp_en_viaje: and otherwise, i'm not going to go through the rest of this drunken braying. start over, and start over like you know what the fuck you're doing.
mp_en_viaje: quote #trilema there. that's how authority flows.
mp_en_viaje: but in general : stop quothing shit from other chans into here. that's not how authority flows.
mp_en_viaje: i should kick you off of this case altogether, that's literally the dumbest possible move available to you.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-19 13:50:30 BingoBoingo: diana_coman: And per the agreement if he recovers coin the total damage is 40 BTC as he sends 10 BTC to asciilifeform. http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/asciilifeform/2019-12-18#1003953
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955803 << dude seriously, your notion of representation is you're going to quote some line from alf's channel as if that's now the channel of record ?
mp_en_viaje: a much simpler "x paid me to represent him in deed y via tx z" will go a lot further than tjhis other stuff you're doing, you know ?
mp_en_viaje: if a third party claims your client really paid you to subvert the republic rather than work with it, what do you have to say then ?
mp_en_viaje: if your client claims to not have "really" been your client later, what do you have to say then ?
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-19 10:04:00 BingoBoingo: Per the agreement mike_c has made a payment to me for my voice in the forum with no provision for any refund to himself. He chose this demonstration after being offered the cheaper alternative of instead sweating out his ammends in the Qntra newsmines
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955792 << this is too vague as such. consider the two most obvious possible issues downstream : severance and subversion.
mp_en_viaje: s keep it simple instead. deed the basis of whatever claim it is you're representing and state the basis of your representation for the log ? something plain like "paid me so and so to represent this, here's the proof of payment"
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-19 10:03:44 BingoBoingo: mp_en_viaje: Despite the long absence mike_c has made a substantial act of submission to the Republican power structure as gated by the Web of Trust. Over time, the bar for demonstrations of submission made by absentees that should have known better... I can only see it rising. Hence the screw turns clarification on the strategy last night
feedbot: http://bingology.net/2019/conducting-a-job-search-in-2019-part-one-the-environment-inside-and-outside-the-republic/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- Conducting A Job Search In 2019: Part One - The Environment Inside And Outside The Republic
mp_en_viaje: shall get to the logs and such presently.
feedbot: http://www.krankendenken.com/2019/12/paying-penance-for-walking-the-path-of-derealisation/ << Krankendenken -- Paying penance for walking the path of derealisation
ericbot: Logged on 2019-12-19 17:50:35 BingoBoingo: Under my original proposal in the event mike_c's coin was not returned I would have refunded him 10 BTC reducing the damage to 25 BTC. Under this structure, mike_c is out 30 BTC minimum, outcome independent.
lobbes: fwiw I can see how it can be argued as submission, primarily because BingoBoingo's client has agreed to pay a fee regardless of the outcome.
lobbes: It does not look like there is any disagreement on 1. However the question of whether 2 is an actual demonstration of submission seems like it is still open.
lobbes: BingoBoingo: So if I'm understanding correctly, your argument rests on two things: 1) one must demonstrate submission to Republican processes (thus recognizing the sovereignty of tmsr) 2) your client has demonstrated submission with his acceptance to pay you 30 btc for voice
BingoBoingo: Which outcome in this case leaves a borader path open for someone's pages to ask Hussein Bahamas eat a bowl of lumberjack shit in exchange for a literal coinflip that will determine whether or not the page escalates his plea for a small mercy to the page's lord?
BingoBoingo: Anyways, we've got this Republic which is sovereign. We've got a lord of lords in MP. Does not paying mike_c maximize coin that certainly stays inside TMSR, sure. Does not paying mike_c reduce the space in which Lords can credibly extract rents from those who've touched Pantsuit in the past, I very strongly suspect so. If we consider the cause of increasing the power of the Lordship over Pantsuit Delusonists...
BingoBoingo: mike_c agreed to pay substantially for representation along WoT lines. If he gets paid out and retreats forever back to Pantsuit dreamland or gets aggressive... he'll set a good precedent for closing the window that got him paid for all later comers.
diana_coman: so then I have no idea what it is.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-19 10:03:44 BingoBoingo: mp_en_viaje: Despite the long absence mike_c has made a substantial act of submission to the Republican power structure as gated by the Web of Trust. Over time, the bar for demonstrations of submission made by absentees that should have known better... I can only see it rising. Hence the screw turns clarification on the strategy last night
BingoBoingo: That's not the argument at all. The argument follows from http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955790
BingoBoingo: This is a republic of men, not laws. The second order effects, benefits or hazards that follow a decision seem to be of incredible importance.
diana_coman: and moreover I don't think it's signalling that should be a concern really (in this case or in another).
BingoBoingo awaits others weighing in as well.
diana_coman: BingoBoingo: uhm, no, I don't agree on either points.
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: If mike_c doesn't get paid it sends the signal that TMSR doesn't ever deal, following this external relations is difficult because of the "What the hell can a lord do for me" objection. If mike_c gets paid, TMSR matters, WoT matters, and voice has value as can be demonstrated through the outcome of the case... but the precedent is not sufficiently restrictive so as to prevent future tightening, refusals, etc.
diana_coman: in the case where MPEx does not pay him out, I don't see how he has a say into what happens to the coin so I fail to see how is that part meaningful; if he wants the coin to be paid to asciilifeform entirely then he can do so once he gets it, no? if he doesn't get it, then he can't say what is to be done with it.
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: If someone comes on a day after mike_c is paid out by MPEx, I can't imagine this hypothetical next person would receive any offer for voice nearly as cheap as 30 BTC.
diana_coman: BingoBoingo: looking at it from the other side, do you mean to say that if someone comes tomorrow willing to pay 30 btc to have some issue heard in the forum (on which they also stand to possibly get more than the 30 btc as the most favourable result) then it follows that they submitted to tmsr?
BingoBoingo: The fact that he valued voice, whether MPEx pays him out or not... I don't see how that isn't submission. In his best case he gets coin out, maybe he does turn it all over to hostile parties. He agreed that in his worst case where MPEx does not pay him out... his coin stays with Republican interests.
BingoBoingo: mike_c gave us what Daphna Waxman didn't. Sure, Daphna Waxman is salt pork that happens to maybe still be on the hoof. If Daphna Waxman ever shows up... for mike_c's decision to make a deal... there is a screw to be turned.
diana_coman: ftr I do NOT mean that he shouldn't get the coin or anything of the sort; I literally mean what I say above namely that I don't see how does that qualify for submission.
diana_coman: that's where I find it hard to buy the "submission" thing, at the "get it to use it outside" bit.
diana_coman: BingoBoingo: as things stand, he is at any rate after getting the coin to use outside tmsr; because can't yet "find time" or whatever; sure, some price to pay for getting it out, that much his actions acknowledge + some appreciation for asciilifeform's work, certainly.
BingoBoingo: There is a sharp edge facing those who fall of the wrong side of the WoT map. It cleaves.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-17 05:00:55 mp_en_viaje: i get we're basically getting scammed by the duplicitous nature of the lazy, and will be, forever. cuz that's how the world goes, that's how laziness survives as a survival mechanism in the first place. but i'd much rather we understand each other on the topic, than it just proceed on my authority and then whatever, ten years later it'll be "mp just shouldn't have paid all these asshats" or who the fuck knows what
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: Note also what mike_c did not do. He did not go shopping around for a lower bidding lord after I gave him the strategy and then clarified the strategy, catching him up on where the Republic has advanced during his absence.
BingoBoingo: Maybe you don't want to call it submission, but it is an acknowledgement of the Republic as Sovereign.
BingoBoingo: Under my original proposal in the event mike_c's coin was not returned I would have refunded him 10 BTC reducing the damage to 25 BTC. Under this structure, mike_c is out 30 BTC minimum, outcome independent.