Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans

← 2015-03-31 | 2015-04-02 →
hanbot: lessee!
hanbot: lol installing 6 of 327, mayhap i missed a setup step. tyvm nubbins'.
nubbins`: apparently gentoo works a lot better when all your packages are up to date. this is about where my advice ends, i've been using it for a whole three days now ;p
hanbot is used to spraying updates with fire&loathing, good to know
nubbins` sighs, attempts 3rd cross-toolchain build of the day
nubbins`: now with more options enabled (tm)
trinque: hanbot: paste fart emitted from emerge
trinque: er nvm
trinque: looks like it's working
hanbot: well it's certainly toiling. it's very pleasant to watch it chew without complaining meanwhile.
BingoBoingo: !s faust
assbot: 1 results for 'faust' :
trinque: among friends of mine, we refer to gentoo as "gentoo quest" and for good reason
trinque: not so much an OS as a linux RPG
trinque: teaches you a lot
BingoBoingo: trinque: Ever play with pre-v10 slowaris?
trinque: BingoBoingo: not at all; fun in the same ways?
BingoBoingo: trinque: Best contrast I can find to OpenBSD. Gentoo is pure (theoretical)Linus-linux. Slowaris and OpenBSD are both... different
trinque: BingoBoingo: this I think is the saddest thing about fuck-ups like systemd, "cram everything into one program" is not novel. I wouldn't mind trying unix-like systems which *actually* tried something (novelly) different
BingoBoingo: trinque: Seriously. Busybox is boring. Complete dominion over memory functions as Obsd does, cool
asciilifeform: hanbot: no, they can't be ignored
asciilifeform: <hanbot> ... it's very pleasant to watch it chew without complaining << half the addiction potential of gentoo right there
asciilifeform: like watching a garden grow, if you could do so in real time
asciilifeform: <BingoBoingo> ... Busybox is boring. << it wasn't built to be interesting, but to take up the least space possible while still doing, approximately, the job.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Almost only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades
asciilifeform: essentially cut-down versions of all the customary userland utils but rolled into one binary, which then gets called from tiny scripts each of which pretends to be, e.g., 'top' or 'ls'
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: it makes for a largely usable box. boot up 'turdel', try it.
BingoBoingo is short on undedicated boxes of purpose and needs to start renting VPS's or hope BTC host starts
asciilifeform: did you ever even use all the possible flags for 'less' anyway.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I suck at both more and less
trinque: the distinction between separate programs and well-separated functions isn't a huge one
trinque: busybox fucks up not by "doing all the things" but by intertangling all the things
trinque: *could fuck up
assbot: Various implementations of the 'cat' command, for comparison. ... ( )
trinque: so as long as the commands it's providing aren't insanely tangled, no big deal
asciilifeform: 'busybox' is closer to the smaller incarnations
trinque: I think some might look at it and compare it to the systemd situation
trinque: where one codebase is providing a ton of functionality
asciilifeform: trinque: the only possible point of comparison is the swiss army knife aspect
trinque: yep, totally appropriate tool in an appropriate situation
asciilifeform: but these aren't processes crammed into one box
asciilifeform: these are fucking utils
asciilifeform: that run in shots
BingoBoingo: Alpine Linux looks interesting, but... before I return to linux I want to spend more time in weirdix full time
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: thing is, if you understand how to use 'buildroot' you no longer need distros
asciilifeform: (though i do like 'portage' more than hand-waltzing every proggy. if only marginally.)
asciilifeform: who the hell was ebriusinanis anyway?
asciilifeform: asks quite a few questions for a random fella.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> who the hell was ebriusinanis anyway? << Vexual, especially coherent tonight
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: how you know? did he sign ?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: PM behavior pattern. Not strongest authentication, kinda suspicious, but psych profile almost checks
BingoBoingo: !up ebriusinanis
asciilifeform: incidentally, i keep waiting for 'deceased' folks like pankkake or moiety to 'return from the grave' (after ninjasp4mz0r buys their keys for xxx btc)
ebriusinanis: its my katin name
ebriusinanis: *latin
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> incidentally, i keep waiting for 'deceased' folks like pankkake or moiety to 'return from the grave' (after ninjasp4mz0r buys their keys for xxx btc) << I'm not sure moiety isn't undead and normant.
ebriusinanis: pankakke would like these logs
BingoBoingo: pankakke is weird.
BingoBoingo: pankakke knows what his keys are worth and that is a lot
ebriusinanis: fail rages him
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: only worth, hypothetically, in the hands of a skilled operative
asciilifeform: who could convincingly (let's dream) pretend to be a 'prodigal son'
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: The problem with pankakke keys is faking pankakke would be expensive
asciilifeform: cheaper if you can pay the original to do it
BingoBoingo: So HBO scientology doc, not so bad. Jason Beghe's parts are the best.
BingoBoingo: !up felipelalli
felipelalli: !gettrust asteric
assbot: asteric is not registered in WoT.
mircea_popescu: "The web site is real. It was put up by my wife (JeanW on here now). To answer some questions posted above: I traded on The prosecutor in the case claims I needed a business money transmittal license to do that. Instead of just notifying me that they though I might need a license they have charged me with a felony which could mean up to 5 years in prison and a $250,000 fine.
mircea_popescu: Because I had to hire TWO law firms, one for the criminal case and another one for the civil forfeiture case, so far, defending myself against the charge of not having a license in order to trade on localbitcoins has cost me almost $200,000. This is a large chunk of our retirement fund and our daughters college fund. This does not count the property (Bitcoins, cash, etc.) I may have to forfeit in civil forfeiture."
mircea_popescu: born in the usa... he's fucked... born in the usa...
BingoBoingo: !up ebriusinanis
mircea_popescu: hopefully he gets his guts together and flies another plane into another usg office.
mircea_popescu: pretty much the only avenue remaining for elder us folk.
BingoBoingo: For the truly old there's still caverject and official's daughters
felipelalli: if this is true, this is actually sad. :/
BingoBoingo: felipelalli: I dunno caverject contains some serious trade offs in its method of administration
assbot: Cadbury Gorilla Drummer Drums To Phil Collins on Vimeo ... ( )
cazalla: will deedbot qntra march once it comes back otherwise
assbot: Qntra (S.QNTR) March 2015 Statement | ... ( )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 87300 @ 0.00024739 = 21.5971 BTC [-]
ebriusinanis: poso eh good luck with thqat shit
assbot: Who the Cap Fit - BOB MARLEY - YouTube ... ( )
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo lmao antonoderp and matonis going to aussie striker bitbillions "convention" !?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: As far as I know so far
mircea_popescu: top kek.
hanbot: asciilifeform> hanbot: no, they can't be ignored << ah okay. noted!
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 02:01:00; mod6: someone should publish a "how-to-build-non-derp-gentoo" receipe
mircea_popescu: << theres lots and lots and lots of wars going on in the rogue state.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 02:50:05; BingoBoingo: List has some serious lulz though, like the entire fucking state of Minnesota at all levels being on the list
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I can't even keep the local ones straight
trinque: cazalla: ^ dunno why it's dying, so I'm just going to stick it on a 24hr cron restart for now
trinque: !up deedbot-
assbot: dpaste: 3EAJT88 ... ( )
trinque: cazalla: give it the txt version; that's an html page
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 95100 @ 0.00024854 = 23.6362 BTC [+]
trinque: wake up ya bastard
deedbot-: accepted: 1
trinque: cazalla: there ya go; had to kick it from both sides
BingoBoingo: ;;seen brendafdez
gribble: brendafdez was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 6 days, 7 hours, 43 minutes, and 15 seconds ago: <brendafdez> mircea_popescu it works now. Anyway the IP I'm on now is one of a public AP, it shouldnt be whitelisted. I'll later give you my home IP, and BingoBoingo has my VPS IP already. I didn't know you were filtering.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21283 @ 0.00024854 = 5.2897 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 108200 @ 0.00024786 = 26.8185 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25950 @ 0.00025027 = 6.4945 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 100 @ 0.01467997 = 1.468 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73000 @ 0.00024732 = 18.0544 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 92698 @ 0.00024968 = 23.1448 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16100 @ 0.00025027 = 4.0293 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60600 @ 0.00024732 = 14.9876 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 96287 @ 0.00024716 = 23.7983 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17000 @ 0.00025058 = 4.2599 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 02:01:00; mod6: someone should publish a "how-to-build-non-derp-gentoo" receipe
assbot: Handbook:Main Page - Gentoo Wiki ... ( )
assbot: In a plea bargain, former DEA agent agrees to return 665,950 BTC stolen from MtGOX in 2013 : Bitcoin ... ( )
chetty: I'd like to ask a favor of someone coming to conf. PM me pls
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21200 @ 0.00025061 = 5.3129 BTC [+]
nubbins`: fluffypony you had me for a sec
assbot: Keurig and its competitors seek guilt-free ways to dispose of coffee pods - Business - CBC News ... ( )
nubbins`: protip: if you use a single-cup coffee maker, you might as well get rid of all the garbage cans in your house and just start throwing trash out your windows
nubbins`: dem 3 Rs not being followed
nubbins`: !up The20YearIRCloud
The20YearIRCloud: nubbins`:
The20YearIRCloud: Need anything?
nubbins`: just a backrub
nubbins`: oh and i'm bringing a civil suit against you for those posters
nubbins`: LEL APRIL FOOL'S
The20YearIRCloud: We just did a april fools on our FB page about buying a property and removing the houses so we can put down hotels
danielpbarron: height=308023 vs height=219293
nubbins`: is the latter a 5400?
nubbins`: or 72
nubbins`: that was for danielpbarron
nubbins`: i feel like that one was at 200k around a week ago :p
nubbins`: heh.
danielpbarron: it's super slow
danielpbarron: but i believe it can stay in sync once caught up
nubbins`: yeah
nubbins`: my laptop's got a 5400 as well, paused downloading blocks while i get this cross-toolchain unfucked
nubbins`: got an ssd on the way
danielpbarron: how long does your laptop take to sync?
danielpbarron: or has it ever?
nubbins`: hasn't fully yet
nubbins`: i had a power failure one day that set me back a bit
nubbins` groans
nubbins`: i literally cannot get boost built with this toolchain
The20YearIRCloud: Did you need anything from me nubbins` ?
nubbins`: just that back rub
The20YearIRCloud: i'll send you a certificate in the mail at some point
nubbins`: phew, got that in just under the wire
nubbins`: okay, the boost compile was throwing errors around some of the python stuff, but it's still going
nubbins`: LONG_BIT definition appears wrong for platform
mike_c: here i am reading the logs thinking "april's fools is so dumb, who falls for this crap.. ZOMG 700,000 btc?!?".
mike_c: i will now smack myself in the face for 30 minutes.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 79395 @ 0.00024962 = 19.8186 BTC [-]
jurov: hanbot should log in once more and join BTC-TC auction
mike_c: aw fuck me, i got buterin in the logs? that feels dirty.
nubbins`: f5 bro
jurov: stfu OgNasty
nubbins`: if anyone's wondering about pogotronics, i'm on my ~6th buildroot cross-toolchain compile
mike_c: ognasty, ok, i can live with that. kakobrekla: for the record, i'm laughing :) good one.
nubbins`: this may be the last one before i just try crosstools-ng
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6250 @ 0.00025061 = 1.5663 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: !t m s.qntr
assbot: [MPEX:S.QNTR] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.00033 / 0.00033 / 0.00033 (100 shares, 0.03 BTC), 30D: 0.00020808 / 0.00024802 / 0.00033 (45259 shares, 11.23 BTC)
thestringpuller: !t m s.mpoe
assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00024709 / 0.0002563 / 0.00026972 (5248239 shares, 1,345.17 BTC), 7D: 0.0001443 / 0.00025408 / 0.00028207 (37726525 shares, 9,585.79 BTC), 30D: 0.0001443 / 0.00030009 / 0.0004493 (98019397 shares, 29,414.85 BTC)
[]bot: Bet placed: 1 BTC for No on "BTC to top $700 before 1st July" Odds: 10(Y):90(N) by coin, 11(Y):89(N) by weight. Total bet: 131.96184834 BTC. Current weight: 74,938.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 170094 @ 0.00024878 = 42.316 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: lol what a makeover. they can leave it permanent
assbot: Welcome – Gentoo Linux ... ( )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51639 @ 0.00024766 = 12.7889 BTC [-]
jurov: ahahaha © 1970–1981 Gentoo Foundation, Inc.
trinque: "more inclusive" lol
Chillum: lol@gentoo
jurov: it gets deeper: click Games Team, Multimedia Team,..
Chillum: bah, my computer is not fast enough for pong
Chillum: they should make it more inclusive
Chillum: lol I remember drive music!
Chillum: I could only play 2 drive songs though
danielpbarron: !up qntranet
pete_dushenski: jurov i just noticed that the february qntra disbursement didn't end up in my coinbr acct
assbot: Qntra (S.QNTR) February 2015 Statement | ... ( )
jurov: oh, did you ask for it?
jurov: to be done every month, i mean
jurov: my records show it was done only once
pete_dushenski: hm yes, i'm only seeing that first month's as well
pete_dushenski: i suppose this is where i formally ask for all my s.qntr shares to be transferred
jurov: best would be to sign a statement asking for it to be done every month
jurov: as other people did
pete_dushenski: okie dokie. will do
assbot: Bitcoin diceware on a TI-89 graphing calculator on Vimeo ... ( )
trinque: !up deedbot-
trinque: pete_dushenski: it probably took, but try again
deedbot-: imported: E6625CC14638C4CA404694E9165749929F9A6BDD
ben_vulpes: spamgun bothering anyone else recently?
trinque: ben_vulpes: email?
deedbot-: accepted: 1
ben_vulpes: trinque: yup.
trinque: ben_vulpes: yeah, silly amounts of spam over here too
ben_vulpes: trinque: are you familiar with the story of ninjashogun aka robert viragh?
pete_dushenski: << hehe derpbama is a talkshow host now.
assbot: A Conversation with President Obama and The Wire Creator David Simon - YouTube ... ( )
pete_dushenski: already warming up for life post-2016 and the endless tours of conferences and speaking engagements
trinque: ben_vulpes: not specifically, logs suggest he's a scammer, loudmouth, etc
nubbins`: i thought he was a robot that just spouted words about business
pete_dushenski: david simon clearly wondering to himself "why did i agree to let this guy grandstand about things he doesn't know about?"
pete_dushenski: "my god he's boring"
hanbot: jurov:hanbot should log in once more and join BTC-TC auction << the what now?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 99800 @ 0.00025061 = 25.0109 BTC [+] {2}
pete_dushenski: !s auction
assbot: 358 results for 'auction' :
assbot: BTCT.CO (BTC Trading Corp) Server with Code (also ran ... ( )
pete_dushenski: ^"very successful exchange" for sale
jurov: yes, make an april joke mpex is interested
pete_dushenski: yours for the low low price of $100k
jurov: pete_dushenski: i'm not sure what you request? that i should keep the shares in custody?
pete_dushenski: 'custody' = 'holding'
pete_dushenski: so yes, please
pete_dushenski: unless you mean sometime other than 'transfer to pete_d's coinbr account' when you say 'custody'
pete_dushenski: something*
assbot: The Internet is a playground. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( )
jurov: i undersand what you mean, but it's ambiguous
jurov: cuz the srares alread y are on coinbr, just not yet claimed
ben_vulpes: pete_dushenski: the 25' steel twirly slide i once clambered upon the outside of as a child has been replaced by a 5' doofy plastic thing
ben_vulpes: also didn't the log thing happen last year as well?
trinque: pete_dushenski: yer thing's up on as of the last block
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2014 02:27:44; mike_c: omg. the log is remapping pathways in my brain. it's making me dyslexic.
ben_vulpes: oh funny - assbot gets the right handle
pete_dushenski: jurov: well i'm glad you understand :)
pete_dushenski: trinque: first deedbot deed for pd in the record books!
mike_c: ben_vulpes: yes, he is committed.
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: same... the tallest structure is now maybe half what it was 20 years ago
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: last year's log hurt my head something fierce!
pete_dushenski: i genuinely thought that everyone in here was scrambling their words in some kind of pattern, eg 5-3-4-1-2 but i couldn't crack the code
jurov: lolwut
hanbot: "I am barred by the SEC settlement from doing anything securities related for two years anyway." oh help me rhonda
pete_dushenski: "GoDaddy shares opened at $26.15, 31% above its initial public offering price." << wait, why the fuck are they going public in the first place ?
mike_c: same reason as everyone else?
pete_dushenski: ya, kinda rhetorical i guess
mike_c: they got bought out by PE that wants its money.
pete_dushenski: speaking of pe, the ontario teacher's pension fund continues to kill it
pete_dushenski: they saw 22% growth in the pe holdings in 2014
pete_dushenski: ya never know, mebbe those teachers won't starve
pete_dushenski: !up bitstein
pete_dushenski: howdy bitstein
bitstein: hey hey hey
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40600 @ 0.00025091 = 10.1869 BTC [+] {2}
pete_dushenski: so about that post-twitter life...
bitstein: feelsgoodman.jpg
danielpbarron: i'm honestly surprised my account isn't suspended yet
danielpbarron: i've been blocked by so many sews
pete_dushenski: plugging your ears and hoping that the bad words don't leak in must be a terrible way to live
pete_dushenski: bitstein: so much extra time on your hands eh ?!
pete_dushenski: without that news thirst being quenched (qntra can only do so much) i've found myself blog hopping and reading more dead tree books
pete_dushenski: and... spending more time here
bitstein: pete_dushenski: indeed. suddenly thoughts turn more back to work and play rather than how to amass fake internet points
pete_dushenski: remember klout ?
bitstein: i try not to
pete_dushenski: my goodness that thing pretty much single handedly ruined sm
bitstein: sounds like someone didn't have a very good score
pete_dushenski: i had a score ?
bitstein: The Ministry of Analytics keeps a score on everyone's social media success:
assbot: Brazil (Terry Gilliam, 1985) - Ministry of Information - YouTube ... ( )
trinque: I love that movie.
pete_dushenski: man they can hustle!
pete_dushenski adds it to his list
bitstein: trinque: Robert de Niro's my favorite in it
jurov: !mpif
assbot: F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021357 B (Total: 467.04 B). Delta: -0.09 B. Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.000207 BTC [+]
jurov: !t m f.mpif
assbot: Ah, your hair. Your hair is soft. It's like a girl's. Now how do you get it that way?
jurov: looks like it wasn't traded at all
jurov: las 30d
pete_dushenski: bitstein: speaking of de niro, i just watched mean streets the other night
pete_dushenski: come to think of it, mebbe i should do an article on mean streets
bitstein: how was that?
pete_dushenski: de niro was killer. he was the cock of the walk, a smooth customer
pete_dushenski: the film definitely had some moments that are hard to imagine happening today
pete_dushenski: ok ima write this up
bitstein: I put it on my list.
nubbins`: *cough*
nubbins`: !s ima write this up
assbot: 5 results for 'ima write this up' :
ben_vulpes: holy heck a whole half btc of donations this month
ben_vulpes: thanks again for the accounting, jurov
mats: nao you can finally retire in luxury
ben_vulpes: in somalia
trinque: jurov: pls to be sticking on dpaste
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
trinque: also up the thing; I will let people know when things have changed
ascii_field still doesn't have a buildable bitcoind-
trinque: for now, real life duty calls
jurov: it will always be limited to dpaste?
ascii_field: not even my old patch fixes it any more.
ascii_field: results in 'error: reference to ‘int64_t’ is ambiguous' and many litres of consequent barf
ben_vulpes: ascii_field: pogo or...?
ascii_field: standard build
ben_vulpes: bwat.
ben_vulpes: virgin foundation tarball?
ascii_field: without it - the barf quoted last night.
trinque: jurov: nope, just until the next time I have a spare evening
ascii_field: nm - the c++03 thing wasn't pre-merged either
ascii_field: at any rate, my patch no longer fixes the build on my boxes.
nubbins`: yeah, the -l z line was removed
nubbins`: nothing else from your portatronic patch is in
ascii_field: it doesn't work with or without.
nubbins`: stock works?
nubbins`: wait
nubbins`: ascii_field you're saying won't compile /and/ it won't compile after you merge your portatronic patch?
ascii_field: different barfs
nubbins`: you have compiled stock 0.5.3 tho?
ascii_field: 'util.h:650:8: error: ‘uint32_t’ does not name a type' without patch
ascii_field: with - see above.
ascii_field: stock - yes.
ascii_field: the new static build won't crank even with my patch.
nubbins`: out of all the patches included in, only one of them actually adds code. all the rest just snip.
nubbins`: might be worth reverifying the couple that you didn't write, maybe even the manifest trim thing
ascii_field: as far as i can tell, the behaviour of gcc is somehow minutely different
ascii_field: because of changes in the build system
nubbins`: what ver of gcc?
ascii_field: 4.8.3 on this box
ascii_field: 4.9.2 on other
ascii_field: same results
nubbins`: i compiled on darwin w/ 4.9.2
ascii_field: i believe it
nubbins`: are you getting that error in the actual bitcoind compile, or one of the deps?
ascii_field: bitcoind
ascii_field: deps build fine.
nubbins`: ok, a couple sources suggest instead of using <stdint.h> using boost/cstdint.hpp
nubbins`: seems to be as many different solutions as there are people asking the problem, which is never a good sign
ascii_field: nubbins`: verified just now that it does not fix.
nubbins`: there was another lib suggested, where is it
nubbins`: try <cstdint>
ascii_field: error This file requires compiler and library support for the ISO C++ 2011 standard. This support is currently experimental, and must be enabled with the -std=c++11 or -std=gnu++11 compiler options.
nubbins`: er yeah, there's that too :S
ascii_field: ^ and i refuse to do this.
ascii_field: because I SHOULD NOT HAVE TO
nubbins`: might be worth finding out if/where uint32_t actually is hiding on your system
ascii_field: this should not matter!
nubbins`: hey, agreed
ascii_field: and it lives in stdint
ascii_field: like on everyone else's box
nubbins`: are you using your or the one?
ascii_field: release
ascii_field: i was trying to build the release.
ascii_field: including stdint.h (as per my patch) in util.h gives
ascii_field: bitcoinrpc.cpp:1761:49: error: reference to ‘int64_t’ is ambiguous
ascii_field: result.push_back(Pair("coinbasevalue", (int64_t)pblock->vtx[0].vout[0].nValue));
ascii_field: In file included from /usr/include/stdlib.h:314:0,
ascii_field: from /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/4.8.3/include/g++-v4/cstdlib:72,
ascii_field: from /home/stas/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1/ourlibs/include/boost/config/platform/linux.hpp:15,
ascii_field: from /home/stas/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1/ourlibs/include/boost/config.hpp:53,
ascii_field: from /home/stas/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1/ourlibs/include/boost/foreach.hpp:30,
ascii_field: from headers.h:7,
ascii_field: from bitcoinrpc.cpp:6:
ascii_field: __intN_t (64, __DI__); [... snipped many pages of crud ... ]
nubbins`: ah, it's /ambiguous/. that's different
ascii_field: this is AFTER my patch
ascii_field: before - see earlier.
nubbins`: k i gotcha
nubbins`: is boost/cstdint.hpp or <cstdint> included in bitcoinrpc.cpp, by any chance?
ascii_field: nubbins` has a copy too, can read it, no ?
nubbins`: oh you!
nubbins`: plz to uname -a
ascii_field: gentoo as always
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66964 @ 0.00025101 = 16.8086 BTC [+]
ascii_field: x86_64
nubbins`: once this buildroot compile finishes i'll give it a try on my gentoo vm
nubbins`: !up ascii_field
assbot: Casascius 0.5 BTC Silver Series-2 physical bitcoin: NO RESERVE, 30-DAY AUCTION ... ( )
nubbins`: ^ for those who wish to see goods traded without regard for fiat cost
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 79100 @ 0.00025101 = 19.8549 BTC [+]
assbot: When Will The ECB Start To Taper? | A Fistful Of Euros ... ( )
assbot: Git - dragonfly.git/commit ... ( )
ascii_field: fact is, that thing - as written - should build on NO ONE's machine - given as util.h is using a type that is not defined therein, nor anywhere else! (stdint.h is not included in -any- of the files)
nubbins`: huh.
ascii_field: uint32_t is not defined by anything in or linked from the bitcoind sources.
ascii_field: if your gcc sees it, it is apparently because it does non-standard things behind your back
nubbins` envisions a .foundation standardized build environment in the near future
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: yes.
ben_vulpes: DUDE.
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: don't take my word for it
ascii_field: try it.
ben_vulpes: i built the damn thing before we shipped that tarball.
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: on what ?
ben_vulpes: debian 6 vm.
ascii_field: which gcc ?
ben_vulpes: that i do not recall offhand
ben_vulpes: hold plz
nubbins`: fwiw i installed fresh 4.9.2 via homebrew right before i compiled bitcoind on darwin64
danielpbarron: i have not been able to build the latest release either / same problem ascii has described
ben_vulpes: ascii_field: gcc (Debian 4.4.5-8) 4.4.5
ben_vulpes: mind you my whole env is structured around reproducing what would have been in the wild ca. the 0.5.3 release
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
nubbins`: 4.4.5, that's older by a few minor revs
ben_vulpes: myup.
nubbins`: was that current cca. 0.5.3?
ben_vulpes: that's from a debian that was current ca 0.5.3...
ben_vulpes: probably ran apt-get update and apt-get upgrade as well, 'cause i dun know any better
ben_vulpes: danielpbarron: plz to report build failures!
ben_vulpes: ascii_field, nubbins`: debian 6.0.10
nubbins`: !up McNumpty
nubbins`: Chillum you hear of this "rosin" stuff all the west coast hippies are on about?
ben_vulpes: nubbins`: isn't that the stuff with which you enfrictionalize your bow?
nubbins`: yes. also makes solder flow nicely.
nubbins`: generalized, rosin is produced from resin
ascii_field: also found in traditional sealing wax, iirc.
nubbins`: i'm asking Chillum about a specific regional variation thereof
ascii_field: at least in the recipe i was taught
ben_vulpes: DRUGS
thestringpuller: DRUGS!!!!!!
ben_vulpes: terrist.
nubbins`: ascii_field +1
nubbins`: anyway hippies have now discovered that if you take a hair straightening iron and crush marijuana buds with it
nubbins`: rosin squirts out
ascii_field: why specifically that heat source ?
nubbins`: $12 at local drug store
nubbins`: it's their pogo
ascii_field: what's next, smoking out of the desoldering iron sold at ratshack ?
nubbins`: the serious types upgrade to a large t-shirt heat press
ascii_field: the one with the rubber squeeze bulb
nubbins`: ascii's face when low-end "vaporizers" are essentially this
ascii_field: i thought 'low end vaporizer' was a glass bottle and a candle
nubbins`: lightbulb and a butane torch!
ascii_field not expert
nubbins` had portable vaporizer, fit in hand, ~size of "family" walkie talkies
ascii_field: nubbins`: how does it work ?
nubbins`: rechargeable Li battery powering a heat coil around a barrel-shaped oven chamber
nubbins`: 8-seg display and target temp controls
nubbins`: you pack chamber w/ grass, close lid, let unit heat up, inhale thru straw
ascii_field: high-tech!
nubbins`: it really is
nubbins`: you could cook chicken nuggets in it
ascii_field: but how do you know how much dose you end up with ?
ben_vulpes: and this is why i don't vape.
ascii_field: i.e. is there a volumetric gauge ?
ben_vulpes: titration story is woefully inadequate.
mats: buncha druggies
nubbins`: ascii_field a discerning user would weigh a dose on a scale, say 0.1-0.2g
ascii_field: nubbins`: but wouldn't the concentration in the leaf itself vary /
nubbins`: the unit works best when packed fully but not tightly, which is generally around this weight
nubbins`: ascii_field from strain to strain, yes
mats: p hard to evaluate dosage without getting lab quality wax
Chillum: nubbins`: I don't like the various solid extracts being made these days
nubbins`: ascii_field "med shops" and "compassion clubs" will offer dozens of strains, each with different percentages of the various cannabinoids
ascii_field: wtf is a 'compassion club'
ben_vulpes: what's the difference between acuitas and acuitatis?
nubbins`: stores that sell dope to people who say they're sick
nubbins`: generally openly and in areas where not explicitly legal to do so
ben_vulpes: ascii_field: generally a single control intake is enough to calibrate against a given 'purchase'
nubbins`: Chillum probably has hundreds of such places within a few hours' drive
danielpbarron: lol thc dosage can vary with little consequence
Chillum: nubbins`: 2 blocks, another in 4 blocks
nubbins`: ascii_field ^
Chillum: I think about 6 in the city
ascii_field: the uint32_t thing is infuriatingly retarded
ascii_field: i mean, wtf
lobbes: <danielpbarron> lol thc dosage can vary with little consequence < exactly this.
lobbes: ascii_field: I feel like I'm thanking you every week for some reading material, but thanks for the orlov introduction. It is becoming my latest addiction
assbot: BitcoinStats ... ( )
ascii_field: lobbes: generally, the earliest orlov is the best
nubbins`: <+lobbes> <danielpbarron> lol thc dosage can vary with little consequence < exactly this. <<< oh, agreed, i find the ratio of thc to other cbds makes way more of a difference
nubbins`: ascii_field there's also a very wide comfortable dose range
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
BingoBoingo: !up chmod755_
mircea_popescu: << "usg employee agrees to testify in court that the usg owns an amount of bitcoin that the usg wishes to be known it owns."
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 12:16:22; assbot: In a plea bargain, former DEA agent agrees to return 665,950 BTC stolen from MtGOX in 2013 : Bitcoin ... ( )
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: 4/1
mircea_popescu: hey, at least after calling out their usms scam, they're now forced to put dea agents "in prison" to try and certify ownership over imaginary stakes of btc.
mircea_popescu: still doesn't do as much as deedbot'd do.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field yeah, only fo real.
ascii_field: i'll believe if it remains 'real' tomorrow.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 12:32:18; nubbins`: protip: if you use a single-cup coffee maker, you might as well get rid of all the garbage cans in your house and just start throwing trash out your windows
nubbins`: mountains of plastic
mircea_popescu: do you mean one of those $20 a pop coffee makers with about half liter of carafe ?
nubbins`: if you cared anything about, say, not making these: you wouldn't use a keurig in the first place
nubbins`: the pod ones
lobbes: I never understood those, either. Even if you want one cup of coffee.. just use one cup of water
mircea_popescu: o that stuff. i don't know anyone that uses it o.O
mircea_popescu: i guess i don't date widely enough in the aging hipster crowd.
ascii_field: they are used by folks too lazy to wash machine or measure, grind the beans
nubbins`: yeah, i obv don't carry the numbers in long-term storage, but they're incredibly pervasive and just as wasteful
ascii_field: the machine sorta does for coffee what the brass shell did for the rifle
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> do you mean one of those $20 a pop coffee makers with about half liter of carafe ? << In usia measuring the coffee grounds to use one of those became "Too Hard"(TM) hence now people buy grounds in pre measured plastic cartridges
nubbins`: then the idea of a user-refillable pod came about
mircea_popescu: dude who cares, just fill the filter.
nubbins`: now the new coffee machines have DRM
BingoBoingo: They are too lazy, this is what Bush and Obama did
mircea_popescu: what "rights" ?
nubbins`: the right to only pour hot water through authorized plastic widgets
nubbins`: right?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: nubbins` is not making this up. i have seen this machine.
nubbins`: mircea_popescu i seriously do not know why anyone thinks one of these machines is easier or tastier than a simple pour-over
ascii_field: nubbins`: easier because don't have to wash.
mircea_popescu: there's just no way any government can be organised to deliver the sort of humiliating, depersonalising, invasive experience the us folk have come to expect.
mircea_popescu: the only way for them to get what they want is private initiative.
mircea_popescu: of like, the mongols.
nubbins`: ;;google filthy keurig water tank
gribble: Keurigs Harbor Mold, Bacteria, and Algae: <>; How to Clean (Eliminate Mold in Water Reservoir) and Care for a ...: <>; How to Clean Your Keurig - A Few Short Cuts: <>
nubbins`: "don't have to wash" 8)
mircea_popescu: i think if isis took over say pennsylvania, and forced all sorts of bizarro stuff upon the citizenry, there'd finally be a huge sigh of satisfied submission.
nubbins`: lel snopes!
mircea_popescu: this nickle and dime "we'll poke at your asshole a little if you go to an airport" thing isn't cutting it.
nubbins`: one result of the plastification of the world is that everything's shaped to harbour mold now
mircea_popescu: mold is your friend.
mircea_popescu: (also, it's not just the shape. plastics are pretty much ideal substrate for microorganisms)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66100 @ 0.00025101 = 16.5918 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: !up ascii_field
nubbins`: yeah.
ascii_field: ben_vulpes et al: so i fix the idiot integer bugs (despite which this apparently built on various folks' machines) - and now
nubbins`: wow, a guy just sent me a photograph of a pgp-signed custody document, with a piece of paper over his personal info, saying "this should be enough, preferably you don't need to know the other 19 coin addresses"
mircea_popescu: re " warning: Using 'getaddrinfo' in statically linked applications requires at runtime the shared libraries from the glibc version used for linking" ascii_field wtf is that shit !?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: the result of attempting to build the latest static 0.5.3 on my boxes.
mircea_popescu: do i misunderstand what statically linked means ?
mircea_popescu: nubbins` enough fore what ?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: after fixing a number of typedef bugs which, going BY THE FUCKING BOOK OF CPP ought to prevent the thing from building ANYWHERE
nubbins`: enough for me to verify that there exists a piece of paper with a bunch of pgp shit on it that i can't do anything with
mircea_popescu: ascii_field so wtf is this ?!
nubbins`: "this heavily redacted version of a pgp-signed document should be enough"
mircea_popescu: nubbins` no i get that part, but why is some derp proving stuff to you and what sutff ? you running kyc nao ?
nubbins`: naw i wanna buy a casascius coin from him
nubbins`: and i want him to prove he's the first owner
mircea_popescu: yeah toitally. should be enough o.O
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: to make long story short, therealbitcoin's release does not build on any of my boxes.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: after discovering and eliminating several of the reasons for this, i discover a new one.
mircea_popescu: that's one thing. the other thing is, what the fuck do you mean "x in statically linked application requires material from gcc used at the time"
mircea_popescu: this is the exact opposite of what statically linekd means.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: as you probably suspected, static linking as such is broken on extant systems.
ascii_field: no one has used it for much of anything long enough, apparently.
mircea_popescu: well this'd be a fucking problem.
ascii_field: allowed to 'rust'.
mircea_popescu: because now we don't know if it opesn't build because of it or because of you
mircea_popescu: and for crying out loud.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: my tests consisted of two gentoo boxes, one 'old and grey', the other built in october.
mircea_popescu: and the failed static linking happens on both ?
ascii_field: ditto the integer errors
ascii_field: (which result from my gcc NOT going behind my back and inserting stdint exactly where wanted, the way everyone else's apparently does)
mircea_popescu: is there some obscuritas in tenebrae switch or something needed on gcc when REALLY statically linking ?
thestringpuller: dr. ascii_field do you hate python?
ascii_field: has any of you lot checked to see that the executable resulting from this build ACTUALL contains the openssl built by ?
ascii_field: and not the systemwide one
ascii_field: thestringpuller: i only ever use it as a less-carcinogenic substitute for perl
mircea_popescu: the cancer is so advanced x.x
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 16:06:30; nubbins`: i thought he was a robot that just spouted words about business
mircea_popescu: ascii_field for that matter, you know, why the systemwide one ? the correct one! downloaded from
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: see, my boxes are set up to do precisely what i explicitly ask'em to do
ascii_field: and not 'helpful' crap behind me back
mircea_popescu: ascii_field listen, would you consider putting up reference compositions ?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: compositions ?
mircea_popescu: for w/e you use ? sort of like "this is alf's hammer"
ascii_field: as in, disk image with compilators, etc ?
mircea_popescu: or w/e exact form most adequate.
mircea_popescu: the idea is, for someone wanting to copy your environment, to be able to do so with minimal work
ascii_field: i suppose mircea_popescu wants one that runs on qemu or bochs or the like
mircea_popescu: a sh script
ascii_field: iron-independent
mircea_popescu: well, not necessarily.
mircea_popescu: if it comes with a specification of parts that's also workable.
mircea_popescu: as a for instance.
mircea_popescu: the idea is, it seems clear to me that mere package-level specification is dysfunctional./
mircea_popescu: this bs where we write down what we put into make or w/e does clearly not work.
ascii_field: parts that i mention in public have a tendency to become... less obtainable
mircea_popescu: and so what we're essentially doing when confronted with a bad software stack (pick a pogo, fix the os, run it there) is the correct solution not just for THAT one problem
ascii_field: so emulator probably better
mircea_popescu: but for all the problems derived from the same source.
mircea_popescu: and so... universalised.
ascii_field: but everyone will have to make peace with 30x lengthened build times.
ascii_field: and shuttling crud to/from the emu
mircea_popescu: emulators are a bad idea. just keep mentioning parts in public.
ascii_field: like we're nintendo devs
ascii_field: incidentally, perhaps you folks remember that i wanted to do this, in the beginning
mircea_popescu: vaguely.
mircea_popescu: i had no fucking idea, then, of exactly the state of rot in foss.
assbot: Logged on 22-10-2014 18:16:50; asciilifeform: no, that's braindamaged. qemu image - complete minimal bsd with all components, boots up (emulated) on any arch from any culture.
mircea_popescu: but the more i look at it the scarier it gets.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field an "emulation" is basically "let's run a vps". noty.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 16:06:30; nubbins`: i thought he was a robot that just spouted words about business
mircea_popescu: oops wrong link.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 16:12:29; jurov: pete_dushenski: i'm not sure what you request? that i should keep the shares in custody?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: vps << i said emulation, not virtualization
mircea_popescu: the difference is minute.
ascii_field: emulated machine will run same on 'cray' build in '88 and on 'multivac' in the year 3000.
ascii_field: think nintendo or commodore emulators used today.
ascii_field: the difference is not at all minute
mircea_popescu: "same" for any definition of same that doesn't include, say, someone stealing your data.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: think for a minute. not suggesting to run battlefield apparatus -on- emulator. but a place to standardize imaginary machine for cross-compilators.
ascii_field: like knuth's 'mix'
mircea_popescu: ascii_field i am actually suggesting people move their day to day computing AWAY from "linux" or from "gentoo" which are MEANINGLESSSSSSSSS
felipelalli: here only to say that worked! I got a fright hell!
assbot: Logged on 22-03-2015 04:00:07; mircea_popescu: <<< note the important takeaway here. nothing keeps people in other places with shit banks from being intelligent, getting in wot, becoming part of the actual bitcoin marketplace. there's people here from all over the world. over time, a low effort / consumer thing like btcjam HAS TO devolve into the typical check advance / spam loan operation.
mircea_popescu: to SPECIFIED stacks of SPECIFIED software made by identified people.
ascii_field: beginning to see where mircea_popescu is going
ascii_field: buildroot for pc...
mircea_popescu: so i run "alf".
ascii_field: essentially, suggesting that we sit down and become 'gentoo'
mircea_popescu: ascii_field exactly. which is why i said, "when confronted with a bad software stack (pick a pogo, fix the os, run it there) is the correct solution not just for THAT one problem but for all the problems derived from the same source."
mircea_popescu: there's nothing magic about usgavin trying to fuck up the bitcoin stack.
mircea_popescu: he's not distinguishable from poettering trying to fuck up the linux userland
mircea_popescu: or from a whole array of equivalent muppets all "doing their part".
mircea_popescu: same problem, same solution.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu is only the 3rd or 4th fella to suggest that i take up maintaining a linux planet
mircea_popescu: not a planet mind you.
mircea_popescu: just a place.
ascii_field: it's a planet.
ascii_field: try to understand how the original gentoo went to seed
mircea_popescu: "you want to be here, you must buy nvidia hf-333 for a video card" is perfectly okay.
mircea_popescu: consider ^
ascii_field: titanic amount of work for one schmuck's spare time.
mircea_popescu: this is incidentally not a bug. it is a feature. it helps us put pressure on hw manufacturers too
mircea_popescu: "we don't want your latest version. we want X. fuck you."
mircea_popescu: this entire "latest version" bullcrap has to go away anyway.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: thing is, look how the 'freeze it all in amber' thing works on bitcoind.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field shouldn't be any extra work really. just, bundle the software with a description of the hardware.
ascii_field: herculian labour, and it's one piddling proggy
mircea_popescu: don't tell me we lost the "interchangeable parts" to THAT degree.
ascii_field: we did.
mircea_popescu: what the fuck do you mean ?
mircea_popescu: a bitwise copy of your current system on an assemblage of the same hardware wouldn't boot ?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: if exactly same, then will. this is kinda my notion with 'pogo'.
mircea_popescu: so then.
ascii_field: but the devil lives in the details. i have on my desk, for example, two nominally-identical microcontrollers which behave - differently.
ascii_field: in some errata sheet there may or many not be an explanation.
ascii_field: this also applies to, e.g., pc southbridges
ascii_field: ata controllers;
ascii_field: video boards;
mircea_popescu: so you'll soon discover "same part number" when we're talking boards means exactly nothing, and we'll be stuck tracing down exact vintage ?
ascii_field: don't take my word for it. ask another schmuck who works with low-level iron.
ascii_field: and the plague is ancient. it is how usg ended up with its attempts to standardize cpu
assbot: Logged on 12-03-2015 01:50:22; asciilifeform: 'mil-std-1750a' for the curious.
mircea_popescu: well, the good news is that serenissima really has no unemployment.
mircea_popescu: we could readily employ thousands.
ascii_field: now, i'm not saying we should all eat our nagants, nothing can be done. one can achieve some measure of stability. but as things fall apart, as they increasingly are, the fuzz at the edges will look like... this.
ascii_field: see earlier thread re: infuriating idiocy
mircea_popescu: << only if you're not stupid. otherwise, works great.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 16:36:53; pete_dushenski: plugging your ears and hoping that the bad words don't leak in must be a terrible way to live
ascii_field: the real solution is iron standard and impalements for violators
ascii_field: a -rational- standard against which -rational- folks won't rebel.
chetty: lmao, vlad?
mircea_popescu: ascii_field there is no such thing as a rational standard.
mircea_popescu: all standards are, by the nature of what a standard is, irrational.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu is technically right
ascii_field: what i actually meant was 'one which is not actively insulting to the intelligence of practitioners'
mircea_popescu: but the only way to have that
mircea_popescu: !up ascii_field
mircea_popescu: is to make it actively insulting to the stupidity of the nonpractitioners.
ascii_field: well yes.
assbot: Loper OS » The Five Types of Technological Standard ... ( )
mircea_popescu: and this is a major political decision we are, as far as history knows, the ONLY group willing to make.
assbot: Executive Order -- "Blocking the Property of Certain Persons Engaging in Significant Malicious Cyber-Enabled Activities" | The White House ... ( )
mircea_popescu: so willy-nilly we can't practically use the vomit of the others.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo ima read the qntra. usually better than original.
ascii_field: holy fuck
BingoBoingo: ^ Why linked before qntra finished
assbot: U.S. Navy alarmed at Beijing’s ‘Great Wall of sand’ in South China Sea - The Washington Post ... ( )
ascii_field: 'any person determined by the Secretary of the Treasury, in consultation with the Attorney General and the Secretary of State, to be responsible for or complicit in, or to have engaged in, directly or indirectly, cyber-enabled activities originating from, or directed by persons located, in whole or in substantial part, outside the United States that are reasonably likely to result in, or have materially contributed to, a
ascii_field: significant threat to the national security, foreign policy, or economic health or financial stability of the United States...'
BingoBoingo: Lizard fangs have been bared
chetty: they are warming up the wagens
mircea_popescu: welll hopefully you all got your propertah out of the us at any point during the many discussions as to teh effect.
ascii_field: 'I hereby determine that the making of donations of the type of articles specified in section 203(b)(2) of IEEPA (50 U.S.C. 1702(b)(2)) by, to, or for the benefit of any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to section 1 of this order would seriously impair my ability to deal with the national emergency declared in this order, and I hereby prohibit such donations as provided by section 1 of
ascii_field: this order.'
nubbins`: lel.
nubbins`: donating to .foundation just got made illegal
mircea_popescu: that's ok, donating to the irs is actually illegal.
nubbins`: phew
mircea_popescu: one's just gotta pick on which side they wish to live ilegally.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 18:24:13; ascii_field: ^ and i refuse to do this.
mircea_popescu: kinda curious what ben_vulpes / mod6 make of this.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: it built on their boxes, on account of ????? in their gcc.
mircea_popescu: well what is the ????
ascii_field: and ~?????? in mine.
mircea_popescu: maybe it's thompson's drillbit ?
ascii_field: i promise to say when find out.
mircea_popescu: a) i don't think think this would have been caught by pretty much any other outfit on the planet and b) i don't see the proposition we've found a deep seated hole is readily dismissable.
mircea_popescu: for all we know, this is how the universally diddled compiler is discovered.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: i would not waste the gentlemens' time if i did not think this were interesting.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23911 @ 0.00025101 = 6.0019 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: not for being likely, but for it being exactly the way in which that unlikely'd be seen.
ascii_field: re: mein Führer's decree: when i tell folks i have an expiration date in the none too distant future - they laugh.
ascii_field: still laugh ?
mats: "three govt officials can pwn your shit at will on the basis of evidence at least as good as obama's attribution of the sony attack to north korea"
ascii_field: mats: schmuck on the street, if any of them read it, will mutter 'good, they'll hang spammers finally' or the like.
mats: and ya don't even have to be american to participate. democracy.
ascii_field: as i've said perhaps a dozen times, if there isn't an icbm battery between you and the lunatic nato reich - you're fair game to them.
mircea_popescu: mats quite exactly.
mircea_popescu: anyone "owning" in the us is deluding themselves.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field and especially if there is.
ascii_field: if there is and you can demonstrate readiness to use it - as in, 'we catch ONE more blackwater in donbass and new york is glass' - then possibly no
ascii_field: but there is not at present such a king.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field if there was, you'd know it by this sign, that he'd glass new york anyway.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: long ago.
mircea_popescu: somethinglike thjat.
mircea_popescu: anyway, for the record : the us president does not have the rights it gives itself.
chetty: well dont people generally have the rights they step up and take?
ascii_field: he has the ability.
ascii_field: which is to say, he can push a button and i starve
mircea_popescu: no, rights are exactly not that, which is why the concept even exists.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field he might have the ability. does not have the right.
chetty: but who is going to tell him so?
ascii_field: like every criminal, the officials of usg do precisely as much as they can comfortably get away with.
mircea_popescu: i just told him so.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field obviously.
mircea_popescu: cue obama going for a condolezza rice impersonation. "nobody had any idea what we were doing was illegal."
mircea_popescu: "i just graduated from stanford, i don;t know anything."
ascii_field: word 'illegal' to them only applies to misbehaviour of the cattle
ascii_field: not to farmer.
mircea_popescu: interestingly enough, i take the same view.
ascii_field: farmer by definition cannot commit cattlemisbehaviour
chetty: no its worse, he commits farmer misbehavior
mircea_popescu: i suppose war is inevitable when people agree in principle but not in fact.
mircea_popescu: a cow won't fight another cow, nor a farmer another farmer,
ascii_field: ultima ratio regum (TM) !!
mircea_popescu: but when a cow thinks itself a farmer and thinks the farmer a cow...
mircea_popescu: this has to come to blow
mircea_popescu: anyway, let's up the stakes a little here.
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: you might want to have some other fella, who isn't to hang soon, maintain serenissima-linux.
BingoBoingo: !up nubbins`
mircea_popescu: i like people who will hang soon.
mircea_popescu: lived most of my life as one.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu morituri te salutant !
assbot: Logged on 12-03-2015 01:41:14; asciilifeform: 'Bien Darkmans then, Bouse Mort and Ken The bien Coves bings awast, On Chates to trine by Rome-Coves dine, For his long lib at last.'
trinque: when they declare working on a piece of open source a threat to national security, time to find a shore and start swimming
ascii_field: trinque is posting from the sea ?
mircea_popescu: trinque bitcoin is factually a threat to the usg "national security". it exists to end them.
ascii_field: that 1btc will do us good in 'gitmo'
ascii_field: will have to learn to ecdsa in head.
mircea_popescu: << he has a point. failures are potentially more important than successes.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 19:07:26; ben_vulpes: danielpbarron: plz to report build failures!
mircea_popescu: ascii_field well, eventually 1 btc will be ample fortune for one to live.
trinque: so how about that gossipd
ascii_field: in the martian colony, circa 4000 ad, yes.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field i'm thinking more like 2030s.
ascii_field: trinque: mine's not done. and i don't think the other fella's is, either. but ask him
mircea_popescu: trinque artifexd been working on it. he occasionalyl comes up for air.
trinque: I'm thinking deedbot wants something other than http and dns if it is to survive
trinque: and you know, me
mircea_popescu: hey, you ever dumped the history in there ?
ascii_field: the weakest link is the people, not the machines.
trinque: I have it, but no I have not
ascii_field listened (in car) to an infuriatingly zimmermanish interview with jon callas (former pgp, now 'silent circle' garbage)
ascii_field: wanted to throw up
mircea_popescu: old men are usually stupid.
ascii_field: not that old.
ascii_field: and not stupid. knows what he's doing
ascii_field: but i could almost -smell- the mendacity
mircea_popescu: what exactly does he know ?
ascii_field: seriously synathesia here
ascii_field: *synaesthesia
trinque does a double take
mircea_popescu: or to quote, "Goddamn right, that's right. Guys come on: "Oh, the blah blah blah, I know what I'll do: I'll go in and rob everyone blind and go to Argentina cause nobody ever thought of this before.""
trinque: did the president just decree himself able to steal property over any vaguely defined "threat" whatsoever
mircea_popescu: trinque yes. he now has more powers than putin.
ascii_field: trinque: nah, lbj did that
ascii_field: trinque: it's been renewed since
ascii_field: by each succeeding one.
trinque: ascii_field: yes but surely there was at least a veneer of protocol there?
trinque: not yeah, I walk down two halls or whatever
ascii_field: arguably fdr was the first
mircea_popescu: im kinda curious how is jurov going to rationalise away the fact that on the balance of things, the us thug is actually more thuggish than the ru thug.
trinque: and "hey guys, go assfuck X"
ascii_field: what 'protocol' did he follow for the jp internment thing ?
ascii_field: his word - like that of the other great tyrants of his time - was enough.
trinque: yes you're right
trinque: notably though, all pretense of some exempt caste aside from the ruling class is now gone
mircea_popescu: ascii_field oh meanwhile i recall who callas is. the reason i don't like openpgp!
ascii_field: just hearing him talk... was like suffering a case of food poisoning
mircea_popescu: << as is singular and atis is pluran 2nd person
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 19:25:48; ben_vulpes: what's the difference between acuitas and acuitatis?
mircea_popescu: o as at amus atis ant
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: the us thug is actually more thuggish than the ru thug << ru thug did not come to texas, arm the republic of texas separatists so they can shell dallas, and raise international stink of 'consensus' when the locals defend it
trinque: yesterday I spent a fair amount of time thinking about how the US was already the totalitarian govt of much of the world long before I was born
trinque: and that in developing this capacity it was inevitable that they'd bring it home
trinque: the "regime change" machine
assbot: ClubOrlov: License to Kill ... ( )
mircea_popescu: like ambulas = one walks ambulatis = two walk.
nubbins`: FWIW fresh on gentoo, building openssl by itself: Makefile:640: recipe for target 'install_docs' failed
ascii_field: nubbins`: iirc that never worked
ascii_field: nubbins`: tex bug
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: 'further compensation to satisfy at least five times the value of property lost at the time the loss occurred' << their favourite thing is not only to steal lands, houses (who even has these any more) but to freeze bank account and then have fun staying out of the street and the morgue, much less paying attorney
mircea_popescu: ascii_field im not saying it's a complete solution. i am saying it is a lot more than nothing.
ascii_field: not saying it means nothing.
ascii_field: just that mr o can push a button, and send me to beg for spare change and 'big mac' on highway.
mircea_popescu: anyway, alligns incentrives correctly. "have you or anyone you know or care about been stolen from by the usg ? come join the people working to take away its shit"
mircea_popescu: if you derp much longer in there, yes.
mircea_popescu: but this is not news.
ascii_field: this also applies to the other schmucks
ascii_field: in usaschwitz
mircea_popescu: certainly.
mircea_popescu: heck, BingoBoingo has some stories about how it applied to him already, give or take.
mircea_popescu: in other news, "It seems obvious to me that global warming is caused by carbon dioxide, and the main source of carbon dioxide is lawnmowers. I have noticed over the years that it gets really cold during the winter, and during that time I rarely hear lawn mowers. But, as soon as I start hearing the occasional lawnmower in the neighborhood, it starts getting warmer. By midsummer when I hear lawnmowers every day, it is al
mircea_popescu: most always hot weather. And, as lawnmower use starts to taper in the fall, it starts getting cooler again."
mircea_popescu: just as good as any "earth science" out there.
mircea_popescu: " Lawnmowers have a nearly immediate effect on the local climate, too. In my area, lawnmowers are rarely used at night, and even 8-hours of lawnmower inactivity can cool the neighborhood by 20-degrees Fahrenheit. The tight correlation between lawnmower use and temperature is so closely related, that the scientific debate on the subject should be closed."
mircea_popescu: "To those that suggest that the Sun has something to do with the weather, I say that is just a superstition. The Sun is far too far away to have any effect on the neighborhood. And besides, the Sun comes up in the winter, but it does not stay warm. But, as soon as people stop using lawnmowers, it gets cold. So, it seems obvious and irrefutable that carbon dioxide causes global warming, and lawnmowers are the main sourc
mircea_popescu: e of carbon dioxide."
ascii_field: ^ gold.
ascii_field: re: earlier thread: i will point out that folks who got on the plane and left usa borders but still earn a living from something on which usg might exert pressure, directly or indirectly, are still inmates of usaschwitz.
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: this also includes folks who have nothing to do with usa but live in a nato muppet state
ascii_field: e.g., nubbins` in ca
ascii_field: !up nubbins`
asciilifeform: !up nubbins`
ascii_field: so it isn't simply a matter of physically getting out - any idiot with 1k-usd or so can do that. but you also have to completely divorce the 'legit global economy'
nubbins`: underground economy bru
thestringpuller: for all those drug dealing just to get by
nubbins`: all of a sudden the freewheelin hitchhikin hippies aren't so stupid :0
thestringpuller: stack your money until it get sky high
thestringpuller: ascii_field: this is why we have organized crime.
ascii_field: nubbins`: when the canadian affiliate of usg decides that nubbins` is a t3rr0r1st!!!1111!!1 and supplying mains current to his home is an atrocity which must end, 'underground economy' will do so in its place ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 320800 @ 0.0002554 = 81.9323 BTC [+] {6}
thestringpuller: buy a new identity?
thestringpuller: beome nubbins` #2
nubbins`: ;;rated othernubs
gribble: You have not yet rated user othernubs
nubbins`: wat!
nubbins`: ;;rated othernubs`
gribble: You rated user othernubs` on Mon Oct 20 13:34:32 2014, with a rating of 10, and supplied these additional notes: not a bad guy.
thestringpuller: ^- see ascii_field easy peasy
trinque: rational folks may be comtemplating the implications of the decree they just read
trinque: dunno that I'm rational, but I'm contemplating it
ascii_field: trinque: the implications are unsurprising. merely a friendly reminder from usg that anyone in range is fair game to it to rape with a telephone pole, and that - unless you're mircea_popescu, putin, or one of a hundred other folks who can say 'no' and make it stick, all you can do is to wait your turn.
ascii_field: for those who still don't get it - it costs more to -actually- remove someone from usg planet, than it does to lift them into orbit.
ascii_field: cost in terms of actual, vs. paper, wealth.
ascii_field: and yes mircea_popescu wrote about pulling pretty gurlz into orbit. this is easier, gurlz weigh less.
ascii_field: and they make good petz
funkenstein_: i still don't get it
ascii_field: funkenstein_: you will.
funkenstein_: i hope so
funkenstein_: cause sometimes it sounds like you guys believe there is a real usg
ascii_field: i mean, the whole lot of us schmucks who are stuck here
ascii_field: will 'get it'
funkenstein_: we're all stuck here
ascii_field: funkenstein_: other than mircea_popescu
trinque: due to what, my half-working rubber stamp apparatus?
ascii_field: trinque: it works great when it's your time.
trinque: lol
ascii_field: go tell herr ulbricht that it doesn't.
ascii_field: and srsly, this is just the -famous- people
ascii_field: the schmucks get the joe stack treatment
funkenstein_: that bit about the father getting jumped by 45 guys with usg hats totally ruined my april 1 thanks a lot guys
ascii_field: and we only know of stack because he had a creative way to blow his stack, so to speak.
ascii_field: the list of the folks dekulakized, libelled, injured, killed by usg thugs - is bookcase-length.
ascii_field: if it were ever put on paper
funkenstein_: thanks for sharing anyways, warnings are good
funkenstein_: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: and on top of this all, bitcoind release doesn't staticbuild.
ascii_field: (see earlier, substantive thread, before the obamitler thing)
nubbins`: <+ascii_field> nubbins`: when the canadian affiliate of usg decides that nubbins` is a t3rr0r1st!!!1111!!1 and supplying mains current to his home is an atrocity which must end, 'underground economy' will do so in its place ? <<< understand that "underground economy" means you have neither a mortgage nor a lease in your own name
ascii_field: nubbins`: and what, no one does ?
trinque: nubbins` operates from a crypto-knapsack
ascii_field: who to mooch off ?
trinque: nubbins`: want to host deedbot- from that thing?
nubbins`: ? i can name a hundred people, right now, who live in this fashion
ascii_field: nubbins`: i can name, if i want, a hundred people who live in dumpsters.
nubbins`: you do not know a hundred people who live in dumpsters.
ascii_field: understand, subjects of usg always have the choice of moving into a private, independent ambulatory jail
ascii_field: saves usg cost, yes. it is encouraged.
asciilifeform: !up nubbins`
ascii_field: nubbins`: understand, i do not know them personally. though i used to keep the company of some people who -ate- from dumpsters
nubbins`: right.
nubbins`: anyway, whether or not one can survive comfortably off the radar is more a function of the route their life has taken thus far. it's not in the cards for everyone.
ascii_field: to follow this logic to the end, it is much better to be a rat than a man
ascii_field: because rat is as pleased with dumpster as a man would be with sultan of brunei's palaces
nubbins`: only if you're happy with living as a rat.
ascii_field: rat does not need elektron microscope or 6-axis milling machine, yes
ascii_field: so he is quite happy.
nubbins`: and that's where your path has taken you
funkenstein_: nor does he have to drone on endlessly on the tragedies of the human condition
ascii_field: funkenstein_: to be fair, rat might whine if he could speak
ascii_field: we just don't know precisely about what.
nubbins`: understand that your desire to own a 6-axis milling machine directly conflicts with your ability to live happily off-radar
danielpbarron: the rat has no soul to be saved for the kingdom of God
ascii_field: nubbins`: and i don't even own one..
funkenstein_: danielpbarron, i disagree
nubbins`: you don't need to own a thing for its desire to shape your set of acceptable environments
ascii_field: nubbins`: but even something like living in a dwelling without the company of strangers is a titanically expensive luxury in most of the world
nubbins`: that's why the off-radars live with strangers (or, more frequently, friends)
ascii_field: nubbins`: and if you can't think when surrounded by loud, noxious strangers and their excreta ?
ascii_field: then 'quit thinking, your life led you to no good' ?
nubbins`: nope. then work as a contractor for the man.
trinque: so... why not drop off the face of bitcoin entirely until escape velocity
ascii_field: trinque: escape from what? usg's largesse? aha right.
funkenstein_: this has probably crossed our minds trinque
ascii_field: as if any of us has a snowball's chance in hell of escape.
ascii_field: the choice is between 'die' and 'die like a man'
funkenstein_: ascii_field we have already escaped.
ascii_field: funkenstein_ lives on atomic battleship in north atlantic ?
ascii_field: how many rockets ?
ascii_field: have you tested any, to see if still work ?
funkenstein_: why would i need rockets?
ascii_field: because when hitler says 'funkenstein_ does not get to eat any more, anyone found feeding him will be fed to lampreys' what will funkenstein_ reply ?
funkenstein_: hardly needs a reply does it
ascii_field: there is precisely -one- language in which there could be a reply.
ascii_field: a reply that is meaningfully understood and acted on, at any rate.
funkenstein_: i don't think that language is rocket
trinque: nor I.
ascii_field: going purely based on historical example here.
funkenstein_: i speak horticulture
ascii_field: don't take my word for it. try speaking other languages to it, see how far you get.
trinque: my only goal is to get out of the way of a giant that's already mortally injured
ascii_field: i don't see this 'injured.'
funkenstein_: i don't see this giant
trinque: ^ that's the injury
ascii_field: funkenstein_: when they drag you away, feel free to imagine that the 'giant' is a gaggle of midgets. much difference it will make in 'gitmo.'
trinque: "drag away" for what
funkenstein_: a gaggle of midgets can be dangerous as fuck i give you that
jurov: wait what, how do we measure the thuggery here?
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 21:22:34; mircea_popescu: im kinda curious how is jurov going to rationalise away the fact that on the balance of things, the us thug is actually more thuggish than the ru thug.
nubbins`: qualitatively
jurov: that is?
ascii_field: jurov: think, if you prefer, of two robbers - one who wants to steal his neighbor's house, in which he used to live but got foreclosed on; and one who steals entire planet.
ascii_field: jurov: you have ru and usg respectively.
funkenstein_: ascii_field, if a bunch of assholes wearing usg hats take me down, i will know it was a bunch of assholes wearing usg hats took me down, not a giant
ascii_field: funkenstein_: all state is made of midget
ascii_field: there were never giants in that other sense.
jurov: dear ascii_field, he will get his house, but will end up yet poorer
jurov: what do you think happen next?
funkenstein_: agreed. petty tyrants.
assbot: MRW I get tricked into seeing something I really wish I hadn't ... ( )
ascii_field: jurov: dueling mega-states leave the schmucks poorer, who could be surprised
trinque: nubbins`: blehhhh
trinque: nubbins`: your mascot?
nubbins`: MRW convo turns to usd-goliath
jurov: it boils down to who'd you rather befriend: the narcist, or the paranoid
jurov: i'd prefer some third way, but serenissima is not world power yet
jurov: so then i'd begrundgingly go with the narcist
ascii_field: jurov: it can't even power a linux distro yet.
trinque: meanwhile I'm not about to run out in front of the white house with my dick out and a target painted on my chest
ascii_field: jurov: the paranoid wants to live in quiet in his bunker, with buffer zone made of idiots who sided with his molesters around, for safety. the narcissist wants to cut up everything good and bright that ever was to cut into designer purse for self.
nubbins`: a-ha
ascii_field: *of dead idiots
jurov: if they mistook finnish and central eu folk for such idiots
ascii_field: mistook?!
jurov: then they deserve what they got
trinque: man, I just wanna end up unknown somewhere with a greenhouse
trinque: that'd be fine
trinque: let the thing wear itself out
nubbins`: hm when building make, first bjam command produces: ...failed updating 1 target...
ascii_field: jurov: small non-atomicsovereign kingdoms don't get to have foreign policy, only to switch rapists
nubbins` wonders the easy way to discover said target
ascii_field: quite analogous to individual schmucks as discussed earlier in thread.
nubbins`: in the midst of the thousands upon thousands of warnings
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
jurov: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: i can readily believe that jurov personally prefers to live in a us colony than ru colony - and do not take issue with this, it is very much a private matter
ben_vulpes: <ascii_field> (which result from my gcc NOT going behind my back and inserting stdint exactly where wanted, the way everyone else's apparently does) << i don't even know how to check which tools are lying to me
ben_vulpes: readelf was new to me as of 2 months ago
jurov: ascii_field: even you don't want to live in russia
jurov: so that's why i wonder what you endlessly argue for
ascii_field: jurov: not exactly
trinque: impalement it sounds like
trinque: lol
ascii_field: jurov: i argue that anything that meaningfully opposes usg is to be applauded
ascii_field: that means no muppets (e.g. arabian nationalists funded by u.s. dept of state) or symbionts (cn) or parasites (north kr)
funkenstein_: well that would mean you applaud most all citizens of usa
ascii_field: ru is not 'the future', just the best-looking horse in the usg glue factory, in this regard.
ascii_field: the one still kicking a little.
ascii_field: occasionally knocks some teeth from the demented butcher's mouth.
funkenstein_: this is why north america loves putin
asciilifeform: !up nubbins`
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> we could readily employ thousands. << you and what budget?!
ascii_field: ^^^^^^
ascii_field: perhaps he meant the old meaning of word 'employ'
ben_vulpes: put to work.
ben_vulpes: burn the biodiesel.
ascii_field: as in 'find a use for, assuming they can eat tree bark and build own computer from mud'
danielpbarron: qntra shares for a start
ascii_field: danielpbarron pays his rent in qntra shares ?
danielpbarron: it's an example of where the budget comes from -- anywhere in the world
ascii_field: what budget.
danielpbarron: the one that redily employs thousands
ascii_field: what there -is-, is an infinite budget of -hate- for the buggers.
ascii_field: it's what keeps me going
ascii_field: i don't expect atomic dirigible to pick me up from the hell
danielpbarron: anyone in the world who can get their hands on bitcoin can help fund that hate
ascii_field: but every time i have a small success in the things i work on, i picture some 'full spectrum dominance' type who will have to sell his daughters six minutes sooner
ascii_field: because of what i did
ascii_field: and it keeps me going.
ascii_field: danielpbarron: the bitcoin doesn't buy additional hate. usg does that.
ascii_field: for free.
ben_vulpes: <ascii_field> mircea_popescu: i would not waste the gentlemens' time if i did not think this were interesting. << rather.
nubbins` can also not get compiled on gentoo, but for completely different reason
ascii_field: nubbins`: oh ?
ascii_field: please post the barf
nubbins`: headers.h:21:27: fatal error: openssl/ecdsa.h: No such file or directory
nubbins`: i'll pastebin more relevant vomit
danielpbarron: i have had that error
jurov: i can see annoyed and bored late roman citizen "go germans go" .. just not my cup of tea
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 14:04:55; danielpbarron: ;;later tell mod6 having some troubles here
nubbins`: i did get 1 failed target on openssl build
ascii_field: jurov: fair. i'm not sitting and 'go, zetas, go' either.
danielpbarron: well that's a relief; i had thought my gentoo install was borked
nubbins`: oh, and actually, yeah bitcoin-v0_5_3_1/ourlibs/include/openssl does not exist
ascii_field: jurov: though BingoBoingo did 'go ferguson go' a bit
nubbins`: none of the headers are there
nubbins`: guess that was an important target :p
nubbins`: wait, no, boost failed 1 target.
nubbins` scratches head
funkenstein_: "blocks" : 315048, "connections" : 10
ascii_field: the whole fucking ecosystem is rotten to the bone.
ascii_field: (see earlier thread)
danielpbarron: i find that fact to be comforting as it is generally consistent with the reality described in the Bible
ascii_field: i'ma go sit in traffic for a couplea hours now. perhaps one of you independently wealthy folks can fix it meanwhile.
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> lived most of my life as one. << my turn to live under the gallows shadow
nubbins` yawns
nubbins`: fuck am i ever glad shit like this is just a hobby now
funkenstein_: !rate ascii_field 1 on our side
assbot: ascii_field is not registered in WoT.
trinque: funkenstein_: what's "our side"
nubbins`: funkenstein_ try asciilifeform
trinque: this is what's problematic to me here; I am on no one's side...
trinque: well this and other things
funkenstein_: guess it was the royal we ;)
nubbins`: !b 3
assbot: Last 3 lines bashed and pending review. ( )
nubbins`: close
nubbins`: trinque everywhere's got problems, they're just, uh... /different/ here
ben_vulpes: funkenstein_ fancies hisself a laird nao?
nubbins`: whoa
ben_vulpes: ascii_field: relax - it's just an april fool's joke :P
funkenstein_: begging your pardon sirs
funkenstein_: just meant to say i liked the chap's spirit
nubbins`: danielpbarron around?
nubbins`: found missing openssl headers, they're just in the wrong spot.
nubbins`: add ~/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1/openssl-1.0.1g/include to your path
ben_vulpes: funkenstein_: that's the spirit
nubbins`: or figure out why puts the shit in the wrong dir
danielpbarron: nubbins`, where would that go?
nubbins`: $ export PATH=$PATH:/home/dpb/dev/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1/openssl-1.0.1g/include
nubbins`: $ echo $PATH
nubbins`: if it looks kosher, then try ./ again
nubbins`: oh hm
nubbins`: wtf!
funkenstein_: holy shit
nubbins`: danielpbarron that actually doesn't work.
funkenstein_: BingoBoingo tell me it's april fools please
funkenstein_: persons located, in whole or in substantial part, outside the United States <--- ???
BingoBoingo: <ascii_field> jurov: though BingoBoingo did 'go ferguson go' a bit << Then the peace vampires came out, like USG Informant Al Sharpton.
BingoBoingo: funkenstein_: Did you read the order? It is linked and on the white house website as well as attached in full text at the botton of the post
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: ^ qntra on the topic is up
BingoBoingo: !up NewLiberty
hanbot: ;;later_tell BingoBoingo very nicely done. coupla edits: United State's Government's / States' ; Republic of the United State's of America / States
gribble: Error: "later_tell" is not a valid command.
hanbot: orly?
hanbot: ;;later tell BingoBoingo very nicely done. coupla edits: United State's Government's / States' ; Republic of the United State's of America / States
gribble: The operation succeeded.
hanbot: derp.
nubbins`: danielpbarron mkdir ourlibs/include/openssl; cp openssl-1.0.1g/include/openssl/* ourlibs/include/openssl/
nubbins`: aha!
nubbins`: this brings me to:
nubbins`: util.h:650:8: error: ‘uint32_t’ does not name a type
nubbins`: ^ asciilifeform
nubbins`: ^ mod6 ben_vulpes
nubbins`: alf, take small solace in the fact that it's not just you?
nubbins` invites anyone currently watching to google the above error, with quotes
BingoBoingo: hanbot: Should be fixed
nubbins`: only results are from log
nubbins`: asciilifeform i'm done w/ this for the evening, but my next step will be to try again with gcc 4.4.5, which mod6 says was current (in debian) when 0.5.3 came out
nubbins`: it's entirely possible that gcc broke this
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo "Faced with technology that forces it to reveal its teeth and claws, along with the reaping of the fruit the United States Government planted in its subversion of the computing stack at every level, the fangs are being bared and the claws unsheathed."
mircea_popescu: dude srsly... too meta.
mircea_popescu: << that's prolly going too far. the usg can prolly "exert pressure" on the price of soy, nevertheless you can still go to argentina's remote east and grow some soy for yourself.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 21:42:51; ascii_field: so it isn't simply a matter of physically getting out - any idiot with 1k-usd or so can do that. but you also have to completely divorce the 'legit global economy'
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 21:43:36; nubbins`: all of a sudden the freewheelin hitchhikin hippies aren't so stupid :0
mircea_popescu: just, vagrant stupid rather than delusional stupid.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Toned down the meta a bit.
mircea_popescu: yeah. simile and such are very iffy in newsprint.
BingoBoingo pours a drink because cutting the liquor budget substantially for the short to medium term future.
nubbins`: bbl meatspace headspace
mircea_popescu: << this is where the entire "smart" turns to stupid. the only thing them smart hipsters can do is be my slavegirls.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 22:11:02; ascii_field: who to mooch off ?
hanbot: mircea_popescu how's a hipster blowjob go?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: nevertheless you can still go to argentina's remote east and grow some soy for yourself << grow me a 0805 resistor.
mircea_popescu: << no. it is strictly a function of whether they are posing a threat to the leviathan or not. strictly that. no "routes". you can only matter if you can actually blow a hole in them, and you can only blow a hole in them if you don't depend on someone's permission for your activity.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 22:14:49; nubbins`: anyway, whether or not one can survive comfortably off the radar is more a function of the route their life has taken thus far. it's not in the cards for everyone.
asciilifeform: or so much as a gram of soy, that the chinese can't grow cheaper, with which to buy one.
mircea_popescu: in this sense, someone who has to mooch wifi and someone who "owns" a mortgage are identical.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not my fault boys are worthless irl, when irl is designed by usg.
mircea_popescu: this is deliberate and intentional.
asciilifeform: ^ this is why i don't get nubbbins` presenting bohemians as mega-example to learn from
mircea_popescu: he's just going with his past groupthink.
mircea_popescu: << no. living off radar is not a matter of vanishing yourself. it is a matter of forcing the op to turn the radar off.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 22:17:18; nubbins`: understand that your desire to own a 6-axis milling machine directly conflicts with your ability to live happily off-radar
mircea_popescu: his desire to own a cnc mill is a result of his desire to own a nuke, which is a result of his desire to go "either you stick to this rule or i kill you"
mircea_popescu: which is necessary.
mircea_popescu: anything conflicting with this chain is about as interesting as "a bitcoin" that doesn't mine off the main chain.
asciilifeform: dustcoin?
mircea_popescu: hanbot i have nfi lol
mircea_popescu: << and it's not a matter of desire, we're not discussing aesthetics here, as if we were living in a post-functional world where even bothering to think about "where does the tap water come from" is a waste of time.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 22:18:07; nubbins`: you don't need to own a thing for its desire to shape your set of acceptable environments
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: ... be my slavegirls << in that case,
asciilifeform recommeds that mircea_popescu start collecting slavegirls who are handy with systems programming. though the trouble may be that ones of the correct vintage (no later than early '80s) are probably beginning to spoil...
mircea_popescu: it is a matter of need : in order to ensure your space you must control whole chains. there's no escaping this, and so someone will have to. nobody particularly has a desire to run a cnc mill or an ic fab, but if one wants working software, one has to. and so it flows.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform a naked woman can be taught anything if you're willing to break an uncountable set of sticks.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: teach'em, why not
mircea_popescu: the part that's worth teaching is easy to teach, and unrelated to intelligence.
mircea_popescu: the part you won't teach them shouldn't be taught anyway.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: wake me up when they get kernel
mircea_popescu: "how to make this counterintuitive sht work ? " "don't."
asciilifeform: wake me up when they build a fab.
mircea_popescu: y u wanna sleep so much.
asciilifeform: even a 'fairchild' circa '70s fab.
asciilifeform: practicing for cemetary.
asciilifeform: i hear sleep is the main order of business there.
mircea_popescu: i never hear of anyone flunk the cemetery.
mircea_popescu: scarcely any need to practice then.
mod6: so re: all the uint32_t, sorry that you're all having problems with this. I guess I missed a lot of stuff.
asciilifeform: mod6: read the log. i fixed it, only to reveal a mega-bug
mircea_popescu: mod6 do you have any idea why your thing compiled it ?
asciilifeform: where none of the 'static' stuff actually worked ever.
mircea_popescu: yeah, read whole log,
asciilifeform: will post patch for 'fix' in a spell. gotta change clothes first.
asciilifeform: problem, currently, is that no one but me seems to be able to replicate this!
asciilifeform: maybe hanbot can try? gentoo box?
mod6: mircea_popescu: nope. none. my deb6 environments (yes more than one) all compiled it fine with gcc 4.4.5. i didn't have problems on gentoo either fwiw. but not sure what the gentoo AMI had for a compiler. my guess is that I was fooled by gcc.
mircea_popescu: mod6 the question is : why has your compiler not complained about an undefined symbol
mircea_popescu: given tyhe symbol is in fact undefined.
mod6: no good answers there.
mircea_popescu: its mother is, "what else is your compiler putting in you don't know about"
mircea_popescu: and their joint horrible twin sister being, "hey, turns out so called static builds aren't even static"
mircea_popescu: by now we have a family of these monsters, which is very worrisome,.
mod6: i think, maybe im not the right guy for this. or at minimum, I need someone who can look over my shoulder on this. there's no way we should have these issues 5 months into a project.
asciilifeform lays off the poor ^ key
asciilifeform: but mircea_popescu has it.
asciilifeform: in spades.
mircea_popescu: mod6 no, actually, there's no way to have these issues INTO GCC!!!
asciilifeform: i take it mircea_popescu is a gcc-bug-virgin
mircea_popescu: which is a 20 year old project, and which i had been using as a reason to justify why im not taking a piss in rms' hairdo
asciilifeform: or - was
mod6: mp: im not sure I follow
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there's bugs and there's bugs.
mircea_popescu: mod6 from which point ?
mod6: I don't know why it worked for me.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: rms is long in the tooth, old, and endlessly hammered by clean-shaven fools who don't eat 'toe jam' and spit in his face
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> mod6 no, actually, there's no way to have these issues INTO GCC!!! << here. what?
mircea_popescu: mod6 what i'm saying is, this stuff would not reasonably be expected by you, nor is it a function of the project.
asciilifeform: for all we know, 'toe jam' is a micronutrient
mod6: i guess it was doing something strange on my end, or maybe debian 6 has something strange it does?
mircea_popescu: it looks more like very major issues with gcc itself.
asciilifeform: one without which a decent compiler is quite impossible.
mod6 reads scroll back
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the issues cut deeper than gcc. we are dealing with what ilkka kokkarinen called 'unprincipled exception', where something is allowed to stay broken because fixing it would break 10,000 other things.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform why i'd kinda like to get to the bottom of this.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform unprincipled exceptions are fine IF DOCUMENTED
mircea_popescu: the undocumented unprincipled exception is something entirely different.
asciilifeform: it is also possible that i am somehow mistaken about all of this
mircea_popescu: the only way to find out is to hammer the things that worked until we know why the fuck they worked.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform incidentally, ever published the recipe to obtain that "statically linked is not statically linked" error ?
asciilifeform: but regardless, i have at least two dozen proggies on this here box that -have- to be built with gcc x.y.z or else
asciilifeform: it is nothing new to the veteran turd-shoveler.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the recipe consists of attempting to build it on either of my boxes after patched to fix the integer thing
mircea_popescu: people derping about how "bitcoin will fail because tis or that" are such fucking idiots, incidentally. COMPUTING NEVER WORKED.
mircea_popescu: if that were the criteria...
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what's the peculiarities of said boxes ?
asciilifeform cranks out patch
mircea_popescu: how would someone reproduce it ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: posted earlier in thread
asciilifeform: about to post more detail
mod6: <+ascii_field> has any of you lot checked to see that the executable resulting from this build ACTUALL contains the openssl built by ? << i never did, this could be a problem too
mircea_popescu: << is this something along the lines of "nothing bad can happen to me im a nice person minding my own biznis" ?
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 22:26:52; funkenstein_: i don't see this giant
mircea_popescu: mod6 i thought you tested it in vms ?
mircea_popescu: those'd only have one conceivably.
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> the idea is, for someone wanting to copy your environment, to be able to do so with minimal work << i think going forward this is the only thing we'll support/build from/work on, something that we agree is "good"
mircea_popescu: yeah but how deep does it go
assbot: Yanis Varoufakis: "Greece to Adopt the Bitcoin If Eurogroup Doesn't Give Us a Deal" | ... ( )
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 22:37:17; ascii_field: mistook?!
mircea_popescu: NewLiberty never heard of the site, so...
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> mod6 i thought you tested it in vms ? << yup. one virtual box deb 6 vm, one aws deb6 AMI and a friend had a separate deb6 ami. my gentoo testing was on gentoo aws AMI also.
mircea_popescu: so it wouldn't have an openssl other than what makes
mircea_popescu: unless there's a magic one ?
mod6: i can take a look at mine in xxd, just a moment.
mod6: (the virtualbox one, in particular.)
hanbot: asciilifeform> maybe hanbot can try? gentoo box? << would love to help out, unfortunately i haven't managed to get it working quite yet.
assbot: Logged on 01-04-2015 22:43:56; ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> we could readily employ thousands. << you and what budget?!
mircea_popescu: fuck that shit, obama is the blessed child of the heavens, can run deficits ?
mircea_popescu: what sort of contest is this ?
mircea_popescu: i am happy to announce that for the fy 2014 serenissima ran a whopping 5798796857967496834% deficit
mircea_popescu: all voluntarily contributed.
mircea_popescu: this is the contemplated policy going forward.
mod6: someone also mentioned that we (the bitcoin foundation) should host the openssl, bdb, and boost libs on our website for dl. i decided against that as i like someone to feel like they're getting a copy from the originator. (this is from yesterday)
mircea_popescu: yeah that someone was me
mod6: so that's why that isthe way it is.
mircea_popescu: the reason i proposed that is because i have no doubt the "originators" will sooner or later run away with the code.
mod6: fair assessment. i thought the same thing at first, and even had all the libs on our site. then started thinking conversely about it.
mod6: we can change that up. that's easy enough.
asciilifeform: jurov!!!!!!!!!!!!!
mircea_popescu: not like people can't pull them from the source.
asciilifeform: it ate it
asciilifeform: motherfucker
mircea_popescu: think of it as a cache or something.
mod6: sure
asciilifeform: and then i put it in a tarball and signed
asciilifeform: and STILL ATE IT
asciilifeform: jurov!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
jurov: asciilifeform sigh. it expects a clearsigned text, not just attachments with detached sigs
asciilifeform: i thought signed text can replace body
asciilifeform: (NO I WILL NOT manually trim the line lengths of the compiler barf.)
asciilifeform: and i don't -want- them trimmed
asciilifeform: i want that thing to display as it would from my fucking disk.
jurov: no that's fine, just put short clearsigned comment what are the other attachments about
mod6: fuck
mod6: so i dunno, but this doensn't look right:
mod6: my deb machine was installed in december, but maybe the system wide OpenSSL 1.0.1g was upgraded in feb. The version the system wide gives me is April 7 2014. The xxd output looks like its indicating the one from the system.
mod6: *sigh*
mod6: brb
mircea_popescu: !s devil pay love him
assbot: 2 results for 'devil pay love him' :
mircea_popescu: mothefucker. the two results lead to... referneces, without actual link, of the original.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform happen to recall original ?
assbot: Pushing the soft tender flesh of a friend against the sharp rotating blades of the immutable machine. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( )
mod6: so if that's not working as expected, I (we) need help getting the makefile in order so that it does this correctly & the script if that's part of the problem also.
mod6: obviously, i don't have a clue as to what's going on there.
ben_vulpes: mod6: how does that dpaste indicate the system ssl?
ben_vulpes: i don't know how to read xxd output at all
mod6: 'OpenSSL 1.0.1g 7' << is probably referring to the output seen here: OpenSSL 1.0.1g 7 Apr 2014
mod6: I don't know for sure though.
mod6: alf might know. i bet it's the wrong goddamn one
ben_vulpes: isn't that the release date of 1.0.1g?
assbot: OpenSSL: Old 1.0.1 Releases ... ( )
ben_vulpes: the version of openssl you and alf found to not wedge bitcoind?
mod6: my hunch is that this is not working as expected. I need alf to verify for me.
mod6: or help me verify
asciilifeform: jurov: can delete 2nd post, it is redundant
asciilifeform: or zap it all, i'll resend in a sec
asciilifeform: ^ finally.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu et al ^
mod6: asciilifeform: is there a definitive way to check the binary for which SSL is linked in?
asciilifeform: mod6: readelf
asciilifeform: readelf -a bitcoind | grep -i ssl
asciilifeform: i think this only works for DYNAMIC
asciilifeform: cannot possibly work for static build.
asciilifeform: which is one of the penalties for going static
mod6: did you see my paste?
asciilifeform: the only way to know what's in a static build is a disassembler, a stead hand, a thermos of coffee, and some familiarity with the constituent parts
asciilifeform: *steady hand
mod6: yeah i get nothing from these: root@debian-test:~/release-test/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1/bitcoin/src# readelf -a bitcoind | grep -i ssl
mod6: root@debian-test:~/release-test/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1/bitcoin/src# readelf -a bitcoind | grep -i SSL
asciilifeform: and you won't.
asciilifeform: because - elementarily - static.
asciilifeform: that means it's all ground beef.
mod6: ok got it.
mod6: so need to run in gdb and disassemble.
asciilifeform: try turning debug symbols back on
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> which is one of the penalties for going static << The most important part of a turkey sandwich is the ham
asciilifeform: then might get something from the DWARF data.
mod6: next part here... in your email, it seems that you apply your patch "asciilifeform-kills-integer-retardation.patch", and this doesnt seem to completely solve it...
mod6: there is another error beyond that one??
asciilifeform: read whole thing plz
asciilifeform: after the words 'Let's try that build again:'
mod6: yeah,it's weird. it seemed to puke on this:
mod6: /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/4.8.3/../../../../x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/bin/ld: cannot find -lssl
mod6: /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/4.8.3/../../../../x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/bin/ld: cannot find -lcrypto
decimation: ^ openssl failed to build/install
asciilifeform: it built
asciilifeform: this is the static build, remember!
asciilifeform: it built.
asciilifeform: and is exactly where it was supposed to go.
asciilifeform: this is the build.
decimation: that's a good point, why is ld complaining
asciilifeform: or hm, no it isn't.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's not retarded having a manifest with it dood.
asciilifeform: missed this because the dir was there, and with some contents
asciilifeform: but not the whole thing.
decimation: dynamic libraries are the depressing result of the c-machine's sad attempt to have a global namespace
asciilifeform: decimation has it
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> cannot possibly work for static build. << this.
mircea_popescu: the only reasonable way to go forward at this point would be a) edit the source of the ssl we intend to use to include a magic string ; b) make ; c) strings on the binary.
asciilifeform: or turn debug on.
asciilifeform: then objdump.
mircea_popescu: im not sure i'd trust it. hey, if gcc is dubious ?
asciilifeform: cms.pod around line 457: Expected text after =item, not a number
asciilifeform: cms.pod around line 461: Expected text after =item, not a number
asciilifeform: cms.pod around line 465: Expected text after =item, not a number
asciilifeform: cms.pod around line 470: Expected text after =item, not a number
asciilifeform: cms.pod around line 474: Expected text after =item, not a number
asciilifeform: POD document had syntax errors at /usr/bin/pod2man line 71.
asciilifeform: Makefile:640: recipe for target 'install_docs' failed
asciilifeform: make: *** [install_docs] Error 1
asciilifeform: ^ how openssl dies.
mircea_popescu: in general this is the golden pill to defeat "general purpose" poisoned compiler, that auto-pulls the magic diddled dependency : put a x = "hash" in the code, compile, see if it included it.
asciilifeform: note that it died a mostly silent death, buried beneath a torrent of barf from other compiles
asciilifeform: and did not notice.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: ultimately we audit the bins
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there is no escape from this.
mircea_popescu: "/home/stas/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1/ourlibs/include/boost/asio/detail/impl/socket_ops.ipp:2900: warning: Using 'getaddrinfo' in statically linked applications requires at runtime the shared libraries from the glibc version used for linking"
mircea_popescu: this is seriously a bigger deal than whatever obama fucking derped today.
decimation: that's a common bug
asciilifeform: (i sorta do this for a living. but no one should take only my word for things.)
mircea_popescu: decimation tell ?
asciilifeform off to pet pet, bbl
decimation: if I recall the getaddrinfo calls up the resolv.conf apparatus
decimation: <glibc uses libnss to support a number of different providers for address resolution services. Unfortunately, you cannot statically link libnss, as exactly what providers it loads depends on the local system's configuration.
assbot: c - Create statically-linked binary that uses getaddrinfo? - Stack Overflow ... ( )
decimation: ie it loads 'binary plugins' by design
mircea_popescu: so basically the problem there is that it says it's static but links dynamically ?
decimation: I gather the warning means that it will probably work on the system on which it is built but if you move it to a different system (the binary) you might not be able to resolve dns properly
mircea_popescu: fucking dns.
decimation: yes, the traditional glibc/dns client shit is quite turdly
decimation: but apparently nobody gives a shit, like the open ntp ddos amplifiers
mircea_popescu: which then inspires idiocy in stuff like wordpress. "hey, open ddos amplification is industry standard!!11"
decimation: yes, exactly
BingoBoingo: <decimation> but apparently nobody gives a shit, like the open ntp ddos amplifiers << Software names make this shit weird because there was ntpd which had this problem and openntpd which to my knowledge didn't
decimation: ntpd was a somewhat misguided attempt to turn unix into a 'scientific instrument'
assbot: Nuclear waste spill: How a pro-organic push sparked $240m blunder • The Register ... ( )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 74000 @ 0.00026088 = 19.3051 BTC [+]
scoopbot: New post on Trilema by Mircea Popescu:
decimation: "But enough of such simplicities, let us now turn our attention to the real headscratcher. The source of that drum was Los Alamos, which is largely – but by no means exclusively – a nuclear weapons lab. And we have someone there who apparently preferentially purchases organically. A"
BingoBoingo: Oppenheimer himself was enough of a hippy to go on the "bad" list
ben_vulpes: so what *is* the #b-a sanctioned os?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41002 @ 0.00026089 = 10.697 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: without a full deturding of a stack there likely can not be a single one blessed OS
ben_vulpes: at the end of the day, man must compute
decimation: ben_vulpes: I use rhel because I know it
decimation: but rhel 7 may end that
ben_vulpes: how did you come to rhel?
decimation: it was used in my day job, became a habit
decimation: although I agree with folks who assert that redhat is gov't influenced, I also think that there is something to the idea of freezing a baseline and keeping it stable
BingoBoingo: OpenBSD has been nice to me, but weird compared to linux and as a point that displeases MP poor fundraiser Bob Beck is in their WoT
decimation: my issue with openbsd is relatively poor hardware support
decimation: but that's a function of their focus
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 291751 @ 0.00025271 = 73.7284 BTC [-] {3}
BingoBoingo: I had to replace the wifi card in this machine at a cost of $25, but that was not a dealbreaker. It's the other weird that prevents wholesale recommendation. It to asciilifeform's disappoint lacks an Ada
asciilifeform: what machine
decimation: why can't you build gcc/gnat?
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: daily work beast
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo's ?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: OpenBSD does not have a working ada in its ports that I could discover
ben_vulpes: nvm i think i'm off-thread
BingoBoingo: If I want to revert to Nigbuntu or a linux, Sure I can get an Ada.
decimation: ben_vulpes: what linux/unix are you most familiar with?
ben_vulpes: "os x"
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: it has gcc. build with ada included in --enable-languages
ben_vulpes: feelsbad.png
asciilifeform: this should also work on crapple
decimation: I made a bug report on macports recently, was told to fix myself
asciilifeform: (assuming ordinary gcc still builds there!)
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I'll add that on the 5.7 release to do list
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: not related to what we were doing though...
asciilifeform: or to openbsd
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> (assuming ordinary gcc still builds there!) << It seems they use a... modified GCC
decimation: I'm sure you can get ada working on osx but it's not as simple as 'port install gnat'
asciilifeform: (when i do the thing that requires the ada, it won't be happening on openbsd. or gentoo)
decimation: asciilifeform: buildroot?
decimation: actually some folks have tried to build ada kernel
decimation: as in no os?
asciilifeform: this is easier than it sounds
BingoBoingo was going to pick up an UltraSparc box this month, but the Chimp in Chief has forced a revision of all my budget priorities
asciilifeform: because ada spec -includes a scheduler-
decimation: yeah, basically single main() loop
asciilifeform: not same as a naked main() in c
decimation: that's nice
asciilifeform: you get civilization.
asciilifeform: the comforts of home.
asciilifeform: ;;google ada ravenscar
gribble: Ravenscar profile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>; Guide for the use of the Ada Ravenscar Profile in high ... - SIGAda: <>; The SPARK Ravenscar Profile - AdaCore: <>
asciilifeform: ^ all the detail you could ever wish for.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: is your medium-term goal to cross compile bitcoind with buildroot?
ben_vulpes: forgive my *staggering* thickness
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: aha
ben_vulpes: (is it in the set of whatever whatever)
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: but you are running ahead of the class even here.
asciilifeform: i actually sat down that time to properly fix the bastard blocks thing
ben_vulpes: my hero!
asciilifeform: wanted to build an instrumented version of bitcoind for this
asciilifeform: on ordinary machine.
asciilifeform: with nothing fancy or crosscompilatory whatsoever.
asciilifeform: and ended here.
ben_vulpes: putting bitcoind on pogo.
asciilifeform: i realize that i could do this just as well with my old traditional build.
ben_vulpes: somehow.
asciilifeform: but there is a Release !
asciilifeform: and wanted my patches, when any, to diff -from it-
asciilifeform: not from the old crap
asciilifeform: because that's sorta what releases are for
ben_vulpes: what version was your "old crap"?
asciilifeform: included all the patches but the static-build stuff
asciilifeform: well, all the accepted patches plus my unaccepted integer fix patch (not today's, but the earlier one in portatron)
ben_vulpes: which was the integer patch again?
asciilifeform: that one
decimation: asciilifeform: < You can kinda run 'dtrace' on linux with his scripts
assbot: Linux Performance ... ( )
asciilifeform: the ancestral 'strace' works for me
decimation: yeah that's the lion's share of it
asciilifeform: but we're talking about a b0rk3d -build-
asciilifeform: not run.
asciilifeform: incidentally, my own portatronic build did not work without this patch.
assbot: security/openssl build failure | The FreeBSD Forums ... ( )
asciilifeform: Motherfuckers.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu check it out ^
BingoBoingo naive, insufficiently initiated here, but how does build with libressl portable 2.0 or later on a linux?
mod6: it probably does not
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i have not tried it
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: but recall the thread where mircea_popescu demanded mathematical proof.
decimation: I remember fixing that by turning off docs
ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo: i recently got an itch to try that myself
asciilifeform: aha so now we have a local fork of openssl ?
asciilifeform: who wants to maintain it ?
ben_vulpes: join the glorious open source archaelogy project of #bitcoin-assets
ben_vulpes: "does the sub fly if i tape this jet engine to it?"
assbot: Logged on 26-02-2015 21:33:29; mircea_popescu: asciilifeform stuck with math proven equivalence.
BingoBoingo: I suggest this not as a solution to the OpenSSL turdation and version hell, but as a way to identify which parts of OpenSSL turdify unforgivably
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: it is, to use my technical term, a spittoon.
asciilifeform: !s spittoon
assbot: 24 results for 'spittoon' :
decimation: If you look at how redhat 'maintains' a baseline of code, you find that they pile up patches as shit breaks
BingoBoingo only gave chewing tobacco 3 weeks as a habit before returning to smoked tobacco
asciilifeform: decimation: the patches reliably break, in their turn, other things
decimation: indeed, which require more patches
decimation: this kinda 'works' when you are trying to keep a somewhat frozen baseline
decimation: not so much if you want to add any features
asciilifeform: which is why that human turd jon callas kept going on and on about how 'real security patches, even against user's will, because updates are the most important thing in security'
asciilifeform: this is 'the hole through which the night walks in', to borrow a mircea_popescuism
decimation: ^ real security is designed without bugs
asciilifeform: and is meta-designed to make this thinkable and practical.
decimation: but as long as 'we' are maintaining someone else's code it's pretty much inevitible to fall into the hole
asciilifeform: we never got out of it
asciilifeform: were always in the hole.
decimation: indeed.
assbot: Re: [saag] Algorithms/modes requested by users/customers ... ( )
decimation: "Compare this to the example I gave earlier of performing a TLS exchange with Amazon. This performs an in-depth test of all the crypto algorithms (corresponding to the FIPS algorithm tests, including ones that FIPS ignores), and the crypto mechanisms (many/most of which FIPS again ignores). In other words simply by connecting to Amazon using TLS and ordering a "Scrubs" DVD for
decimation: $19.95 I'm getting more comprehensive algorithm testing than I can for a five-figure sum with the FIPS algorithm tests."
asciilifeform: the tests are a chump tax charged on folks peddling turdware to usg and friends
decimation: aye, because usg 'requires' it
asciilifeform: exceptions free for the asking for 'favourite sons' of course
asciilifeform: you will never hear of northrop or lockheed losing a contract from failing to pass 'fips' etc
asciilifeform: see the case of the 'drone' pinched in iran, which was gps-spoofable because crypto was omitted entirely
asciilifeform: which 'fips' did -it- pass.
assbot: iOS 6 granted FIPS 140-2, approved for U.S. government use | ZDNet ... ( )
asciilifeform: of course it plays
asciilifeform: being a dept of usg
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 133000 @ 0.0002609 = 34.6997 BTC [+]
decimation: "U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), a division of U.S. Homeland Security, said it would pull the plug on its 17,600 employee BlackBerrys and favor iPhones instead. The deal, according to a "solicitation" document, would be worth $2.1 million — to the U.S. taxpayer, at least."
asciilifeform: (there is no private industry, in the traditional sense, in usg-dom. nothing larger than a hotdog stand, certainly.)
ben_vulpes: oh, humbug.
ben_vulpes: maybe not where you live.
decimation: asciilifeform: usg buys everything on the 'friends&family' plan
asciilifeform: nowhere.
asciilifeform: see tlp's piece.
asciilifeform: say ben_vulpes sells aluminum siding. by the gigatonne.
asciilifeform: private?
asciilifeform: but then look - who buys it? with what ?
asciilifeform: and for what.
ben_vulpes: i dunno man, new relic isn't terrifically dependent on government purchases.
ben_vulpes: salesforce either.
BingoBoingo: <ben_vulpes> maybe not where you live. << You may know there where, but not the how to look
asciilifeform: is mickey-d usg ?
asciilifeform: no one who walks in, likely is usg. certainly not official procurer
asciilifeform: but where do the clientele get their dough ?
ben_vulpes: "everything comes from the government" my arse
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: take jupiter.
ben_vulpes: what now?
asciilifeform: while not everything in the solar system 'comes from jupiter' - he has a say in what happens.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> is mickey-d usg ? << When I worked there after Library school frozen meat cam in boxes labeled Cargill, member of Carlisle group, indicted somewhat in Farenheit-911
asciilifeform: and nothing can be meaningfully described without him.
ben_vulpes: modern fascist state permutation of all aspects of life.
BingoBoingo: "National Socialism"(TM)
ben_vulpes: plenty happens beyond its domain. its domain, as was the french, is vastly less broad and strong than it thinks.
decimation: 'the mountains are high and the emperor is far away'
asciilifeform: ^ pre-telegraph - was true
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: Perhaps re-read though beast has a dissciative mental disorder and this brave soul reporting suffers isolation the thread doesn't tear
BingoBoingo: <decimation> asciilifeform: usg buys everything on the 'friends&family' plan << And no one knows how tenous their connection is as Force, Carl Mark IV can likely attest
asciilifeform: <ben_vulpes> salesforce either << usg is not the post office. usg is precisely the folks who perpetrate things such as 'salesforce.'
decimation: BingoBoingo: "Among the purposes of 'Snowden' - who never 'stole' any documents - is to increase the sense of terrorism and blackmail among governments; " < to believe this is to travel through the looking-glass
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: aha!
BingoBoingo: decimation: I have never seen pills colored #FF000 nor #0000FF even when observing pharmacy school slide decks for two years
assbot: Logged on 02-04-2015 01:26:21; scoopbot: New post on Trilema by Mircea Popescu:
BingoBoingo: decimation: Snowden is not a person with Agency, yet he has handlers who are Agents.
decimation: mircea_popescu: note that china knows how this game works; is taking 'possession' of the south china sea
assbot: Logged on 02-04-2015 02:00:00; BingoBoingo: OpenBSD has been nice to me, but weird compared to linux and as a point that displeases MP poor fundraiser Bob Beck is in their WoT
mircea_popescu: decimation im very much left wondering by asciilifeform's ideas about china. i dunno that it's in any sense comensal with the us.
[]bot: Bet placed: 1 BTC for No on "Bitcoin above MtGox $266 high 2 years on" Odds: 36(Y):64(N) by coin, 63(Y):37(N) by weight. Total bet: 9.38145505 BTC. Current weight: 16,797.
decimation: well, china has a relatively small core of 'managers', usg is really a headless beast
mircea_popescu: (commensal = eating at same table)
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I know openbsd has a plan for governance post-Theo. The exact plans are opaque to me. It would be abberant for Beck to naturally outlive Theo, but... known unknown
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "I can verify that downgrading to Perl 5.16 works." uh ?!
nubbins`: asciilifeform haven't peeked at your latest mail yet, but applying the portatronic patch turns my uint32_t error into an int64_t error
nubbins`: but there's another error right before that, almost missed it.
nubbins`: bitcoinrpc.cpp:1761:30: error: expected primary-expression before ‘(’ token
assbot: It turns out the photo of 4-year-old Syrian girl surrendering to a camera is real, not faked.
BingoBoingo waits for Vatican to invade Damascus
nubbins`: rename it davatican
nubbins`: here all night.
nubbins`: but really though, the closest stable gcc version to mod6's 4.4.5 that portage still carries is 4.4.7
nubbins`: i'm gonna give that a shit
BingoBoingo: Also here apparently is what BuzzDave is up to atm, would rewrite but drinking my drink before crisis budget hits tommorrow.
assbot: Coinbase Seeks 'Invasive' Details on US Bitcoin Mining Operations ... ( )
nubbins`: tbh gentoo is the odd one out here, which is curious
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 148250 @ 0.00025289 = 37.4909 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: << you don't understand : we already ARE stuck with this. want it or not.
assbot: Logged on 02-04-2015 02:21:46; asciilifeform: aha so now we have a local fork of openssl ?
mircea_popescu: since bitcoin pulled the code AS IT WAS and built a chain on it, the optionsare :
mircea_popescu: fork the chain or maintain the historical copy.
mircea_popescu: thjaty's it.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo da force gotta know what to steal, right ?
mircea_popescu: usg doing a splendid job of getting the muppets do the "case da joint" work for free.
decimation: ^ french housewives enforced the various 'maximums'
BingoBoingo actually affected by MP's deed of the day. lacks assets for USG to steal
BingoBoingo: *minimally effected
asciilifeform: nubbins`: but applying the portatronic patch turns my uint32_t error into an int64_t error << apply the -other- patch. the one from 2hrs ago.
assbot: Logged on 02-04-2015 02:24:41; asciilifeform: this is 'the hole through which the night walks in', to borrow a mircea_popescuism
nubbins`: yeah, just checking that now
assbot: Leonard Cohen - Democracy - YouTube ... ( )
mircea_popescu: hm... check that out, actually it isn't. he has a "coming through a hole in the air", thing. and there's an excellent "the night comes on. it's very clam. i'd like to imagine my father was wrong..." very powerful verse somewhere else.
mircea_popescu: i guess i contributed the mix. dj mp.
asciilifeform: Coinbase Seeks 'Invasive' Details on US Bitcoin Mining Operations << this is, to use the 'manosphere' term of art, a 'shit test'
mircea_popescu: ... but you don't wanna lie... not to the yo-oung...
asciilifeform: anyone who doesn't send them off to pound sand up arse - has bowed to usg
assbot: Leonard Cohen - Love Calls You By Your Name - YouTube ... ( )
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's probably useful in building the lists of who can be dekulakized willingly.
BingoBoingo: I dunno if anyone here other than hanbot will be familiar with BuzzDave's MO, building ASIC mining farm at any budget, whether feeds scamzors or not in the process irrelevant
asciilifeform: list of who doesn't even consider it dekulakization - merely owner coming 'back' to take what is 'his', that he merely let you store in safekeeping for a spell.
asciilifeform: if you built a miner, 'you didn't build that'
mircea_popescu: well... nothing is as strictly relevant to national security as a mining farm, factually speaking.
mircea_popescu: airjets can be made out of imported parts. and are. and they suck. and it doesn't matter.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu has it
asciilifeform: this has more immediate implications than commandeering mere jet factory.
BingoBoingo knows of no circumstantial evidence that suggest USG proxy more than exists for BuzzDave.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo we're talking more "coming years" than "situation atm" here.
decimation: parts of usg would gravely protest other parts of usg minting non-usd
BingoBoingo imagines in this instance lizards sacrificing CoinBase cred in swap to offer cred to Dave
mircea_popescu: ". The deal, according to a "solicitation" document, would be worth $2.1 million — to the U.S. taxpayer, at least." << how to get 20k ipads for 100 bucks each ?
mircea_popescu: decimation this is not going away. the usg's hunger for btc far exceeds its hunger for anything else COMBINED.
decimation: mircea_popescu: perhaps, but to fully realize it usg would have to publicly destroy the dollar bezzle
mircea_popescu: you act from this strange notion of perfect knowledge.
decimation: who is gonna want to be paid in dollars while the fed is hoarding bitcoin
mircea_popescu: everyone ?
mircea_popescu: i don't think you appreciate how stupid people are.
mircea_popescu: who wants to fuck with an ipad when there's a perfectly usable desktop ?
decimation: I suppose the same holds roughly true with gold
mircea_popescu: who wants "drm coffee machine" ?
nubbins`: EVERYONE
mircea_popescu: who, pray tell me, eats the shit it eats that it just shat ?
decimation: but the sheer fact of usg's gold's possession 'made' it the reserve currency
mircea_popescu: the sheer fact of the b-a of the time made it. the usg follows in all dances. never yet lead, never will lead.
mircea_popescu: once those went away... well...
mircea_popescu: and as "we" have agreed bitcoin is what it is, well...
decimation: the 'headless beast' is hard to kill but easy to misguide
mircea_popescu: what are you going to kill lol, bilge water ?
mircea_popescu: "i am arthur son of uther pendragon, defeater of the molds, killer of the bilge water!"
asciilifeform: more like ants.
asciilifeform: who hasn't killed an ant colony
mircea_popescu: im off ! laters.
asciilifeform: nubbins`: there we go
decimation: one could imagine killing an ant colony, but not all ants on a continent
asciilifeform: as decimation helpfully pointed out ~1hr ago, ssl didn't build
asciilifeform: see log as to why.
decimation: asciilifeform: one wonders what the openssl authors use as a 'baseline os'
nubbins`: "glibc uses libnss to support a number of different providers for address resolution services. Unfortunately, you cannot statically link libnss, as exactly what providers it loads depends on the local system's configuration."
asciilifeform: decimation: probably winblows
asciilifeform: when you scratch the surface, you always find some imbecile who develops on winblows, and then asks 'whatchalookingat'
decimation: nubbins`: no that's a different issue, not critical
asciilifeform: 'doesn't everyone?'
decimation: heh yeah 'mingw'
decimation: 'I really like visual c++'
asciilifeform: nubbins`: this was after my (today's) patch ?
asciilifeform: nubbins`: what do you get without it ?
nubbins`: i'm in lockstep with you, seems
asciilifeform: nubbins`: wait
asciilifeform: that's without -any- patches of mine?
nubbins`: with the portatronic patch.
asciilifeform: ok so nubbins` has what i have.
nubbins` coughs, scratches arm
nubbins`: it's real bad, man
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 209550 @ 0.0002609 = 54.6716 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: This is BingoBoingo and welcome to day one of Axe time
decimation: asciilifeform: it strikes me that a handy product would be a little ada microcontroller with an implementation of rsa
asciilifeform: decimation: afaik there were never dedicated ada silicon
asciilifeform: though it would have made sense (bounds checking, etc. a la lisp machine)
asciilifeform: ada, like lisp, is not a language. it is merely a kind of void left by removing retardation.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu:fork the chain or maintain the historical copy. << third option: make new apparatus, prove idempotence.
BingoBoingo unsure how to handle axe time behind enemy lines
decimation: well, the point is that a fairly rigorous device could be made
decimation: and I suggest that key material is loaded with: paper card
asciilifeform: decimation: i did suggest paper card at one point.
decimation: yeah I think I recall. like the 'Fialka' machine
asciilifeform: like every '40s machine.
asciilifeform: and even '80s in many cases (u.s. naval crypto used paper cards until '90 or so)
decimation: easily human inspection AND comparison
asciilifeform: of keys.
decimation: the trouble is getting enough 'holes' on a reasonable size paper
decimation: the "fialka" grid is only 30x30
BingoBoingo: If this is what axe time is like /me wonders about sword time survivability
asciilifeform: 'Warning: never connect this 3-pin male plug (24V DC) to the 3-pin female plug (230V AC) of the mains cable. Due to bad design, it fits perfectly, but supplies the mains voltage to the 24V input of the cipher machine, causing permanent damage to the cipher machine. Be warned!' << l0l
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu must have been thinking of this machine the other day.
decimation: heh it's not a particularly fancy circuit
decimation: the psu
asciilifeform: check out the 'tempest' psu.
decimation: ah yeah that's more useful
asciilifeform: funny how they gave a damn re: tempest on a fucking ROTOR CRYPTO MACHINE
asciilifeform: crackable in about thirty seconds on 'commodore 64'
asciilifeform: and why, precisely, does it need the digital output ?
asciilifeform: in the -power supply-
asciilifeform: i can see this being given to unreliable warsaw pact nations to -amplify- their tempest emanations
decimation: simply swap the right parts...
asciilifeform: 'Although it may seem unnecessary, the data socket (marked МАШИНА II) must be connected, as otherwise the machine will not work. This is done to ensure the use of the TEMPEST feature (see below). ' << seems to imply that it was a straight pass-through
asciilifeform: to force dumb orcs to use it
asciilifeform: instead of the old-fashioned power supply.
asciilifeform: clever.
decimation: surely someone in the 'unreliable nation' would have had suspicions
asciilifeform: so 'tempest' is mistake in terminology here
asciilifeform: shame on'em.
asciilifeform: (on 'cryptomuseum')
asciilifeform: i see now that it was not a pass-through
asciilifeform: you actually need this to retrofit constant-power
decimation: "The value of the dummy-load resistors is choosen carefully, so that they the circuit draws the same current as the solenoids. As a result, the PSU will not only supply a constant voltage, but will also consume a constant current" < this seems dubious on production units
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 87700 @ 0.00026091 = 22.8818 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: decimation: you can see the trimpots
asciilifeform: plausible.
asciilifeform: 'In some of the circuits, 2TC613 ICs are used [1]. Each of these ICs contains four transistors, They belong to one of the first generations of Russian ICs.' << another howler
asciilifeform: that is -not- an integrated circuit in the modern sense!
decimation: was that one of your 'tiny pcbs in a tin'?
assbot: Logged on 18-02-2015 06:16:02; asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: before i fall asleep, i remembered to tell, that there actually were 'integrated circuits' in ussr that were built in the way you suggest
decimation: I like the 30 mil traces
asciilifeform: they didn't solder by machine, aha.
decimation: plus had to drive solenoids
asciilifeform: having a printed circuit in this machine at all was 'high tech'
asciilifeform: incidentally,
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