Hide Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2014-03-31 | 2014-04-02 → ↓
VanCleef: seedcoin is a massive scam i suspect
nubbins`: !t h smg
assbot: [HAVELOCK:SMG] 1D: 0.00007023 / 7.616E-5 / 0.00008000 (510 shares, 0.03884221 BTC), 7D: 0.00007023 / 8.449E-5 / 0.00009410 (6072 shares, 0.51303206 BTC), 30D: 0.00007023 / 8.993E-5 / 0.00012600 (17596 shares, 1.58233780 BTC)
nubbins`: dat discount
Mats_cd03: anyone have a link to the chart of bitcoin holders in the world
Mats_cd03: it has something about n numbers of holders having xx% of the holdings
kakobrekla: Panacea perf for March: +0.26%
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14200 @ 0.00094254 = 13.3841 BTC [-] {2}
kakobrekla: oh yeah i forgot to say, take that doctor forehead.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11900 @ 0.00094283 = 11.2197 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26800 @ 0.00094237 = 25.2555 BTC [-] {3}
[\]: so should I get more popcorn?
[\]: anything good?
BingoBoingo: Well, bitcointa.lk overtook itcointalk.org in officialness. Shrem and Failla are racing to negotiate with prosecutors first.
ozbot: Please remove this user from this forum. | Page 2 | Bitcointa.lk
BingoBoingo: Apparently Maged thinks the MPOE-PR account was sold or hacked.
[\]: I agree with ThickAsThieves
Apocalyptic: dat drama
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38150 @ 0.00094384 = 36.0075 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 26 @ 0.00578608 = 0.1504 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25800 @ 0.00094573 = 24.3998 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0639885 = 0.3199 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.10144642 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1750 @ 0.00094422 = 1.6524 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18823 @ 0.00094211 = 17.7333 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 10 @ 0.0561202 = 0.5612 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91394 @ 0.00094175 = 86.0703 BTC [-] {2}
moiety: kakobrekla: here?
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 482.0, vol: 19190.41597174 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 480.327, vol: 12406.03391 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 483.4699, vol: 15193.3086536 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 488.82, vol: 79.07079047 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 462.818096, vol: 4623.65040000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 491.40023, vol: 16.68824773 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 478.5824, vol: 128.77578004 | Volume-weighted last (1 more message)
moiety: BB :D hihi how was your weekend?
BingoBoingo: moiety: Not bad
moiety: BingoBoingo: glad to hear it :) how epic are the logs?!
BingoBoingo: moiety: They look grand today
ozbot: DVRs Used To Attack Synology Disk Stations and Mine Bitcoin - Slashdot
moiety: lolol "also run a bitcoin miner"
cads2: huh
cads2: I failed to be able to explain to my romanian cousin the notion of "nerd"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 1333 @ 0.0075 = 9.9975 BTC [+]
cads2: she couldn't connect the idea of someone really smart with the image of someone really socially inept
cads2: I wonder if in romania nerds simply fail to be socially inept
cads2: yes romanian nerds will hack some shit, but we'll also take some shots, snort some blow, and play with some women.
cads2: probably concurrently.
BingoBoingo: Reads so much better logified
moiety: some some some
moiety: lol
moiety: im loving this
moiety: BingoBoingo: the disappearing blogger returned again, this time to hang around and wondered where you hung around but thinks this is a bit much for him. sends his regards though
BingoBoingo: moiety: Jumpy?
moiety: yeah baby #2 on the way!
moiety: saving doge for college funds lol
moiety: i never thought id see the day
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 50 @ 0.0075 = 0.375 BTC [+]
MisterE: BTCe doin a little April 1 funny
MisterE: heh
antephialtic: but will we see MPesaEx?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 14 @ 0.06402567 = 0.8964 BTC [+]
moiety: cant be as good as here MisterE
moiety: re btc-e
MisterE: the log?
MisterE: yea it's just upside down
MisterE is jumping out at 497 to book $50 profit :)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10700 @ 0.00094422 = 10.1032 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32150 @ 0.00094274 = 30.3091 BTC [-] {2}
andreas_: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 482.28, Best ask: 482.99, Bid-ask spread: 0.71000, Last trade: 482.28, 24 hour volume: 22454.41465420, 24 hour low: 440.27, 24 hour high: 509.98, 24 hour vwap: 467.584036352
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 95150 @ 0.00094637 = 90.0471 BTC [+] {6}
MisterE: ;;premium btce
gribble: (premium <market1> <market2>) -- Calculate the premium of market1 over market2, using last trade price. Uses USD exchange rate. If USD is not traded on one of the target markets, queries currency conversion from google.
MisterE: ;;premium btceusd
gribble: (premium <market1> <market2>) -- Calculate the premium of market1 over market2, using last trade price. Uses USD exchange rate. If USD is not traded on one of the target markets, queries currency conversion from google.
MisterE: ;;premium btce bitstamp
gribble: Premium of BTC-E over Bitstamp is currently 0.945137618451 %.
VanCleef: ;;premium btce huobi
gribble: Error: This is not one of the supported markets. Please choose one of ['bcent', 'btcn', 'coinbase', 'cbx', 'bitmynt', 'btsp', 'btcavg', 'krk', 'btcde', 'btce', 'bfx'].
VanCleef: racists
MisterE: lel
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7700 @ 0.00094795 = 7.2992 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13994 @ 0.00094124 = 13.1717 BTC [-] {2}
jadne: chetty: so terrible
jadne: hardly even counts as trying
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21700 @ 0.00094055 = 20.4099 BTC [-] {2}
punkman: !t m x.eur
assbot: [MPEX:X.EUR] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.0025 / 0.0025 / 0.0025 (432 shares, 1.08 BTC), 30D: 0.0019005 / 0.00214608 / 0.0025 (3831 shares, 8.22 BTC)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31328 @ 0.00094936 = 29.7416 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06597999 = 0.132 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 65 @ 0.00578757 = 0.3762 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05739958 = 0.1148 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: ;;google site:trilema.com electoral bitcoin
gribble: Bitcoin pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/category/bitcoin/>; Wikileaks - MLXIII pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/wikileaks-mlxiii>; It working and you being competent pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/2013/it-working-and-you-being-competent/>
thestringpuller: ;;google site:trilema.com electoral system bitcoin
gribble: Bitcoin pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/category/bitcoin/>; Why MPEx is better than fiat institutions, part 930458 : we don't use ...: <http://trilema.com/2013/why-mpex-is-better-than-fiat-institutions-part-930458-we-don%E2%80%99t-use-lube/>; It working and you being competent pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/2013/it-working- (1 more message)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 50 @ 0.0075 = 0.375 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: morning good channel
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 476.99, Best ask: 479.0, Bid-ask spread: 2.01000, Last trade: 479.0, 24 hour volume: 24191.52407663, 24 hour low: 446.02, 24 hour high: 509.98, 24 hour vwap: 470.685034162
jurov: morning!
gribble: heads
nubbins`: morning
nubbins`: fuckin snowpocalypse here
nubbins`: 40cm overnight
thestringpuller: poor canadians
thestringpuller: they don't get spring time
nubbins`: i'm waiting for mother nature to pop out and say APRIL FOOLS LELELEL
mircea_popescu: nubbins` tis global warming.
nubbins`: one of the biggest mistakes ever was referring to man-made climate change as such
mircea_popescu: deck the halls in boughs of snowy
mircea_popescu: lalalala la la la laaa
antephialtic: in other news, coinbase may have been hacked.
mircea_popescu: i suspect one of the biggest mistakes ever would be to try and rescue the stupidity of global warming by semantics.
mircea_popescu: antephialtic myeah.
mircea_popescu: except you know, they are "professional" and thus fail to communicate.
antephialtic: they had a security issue that allowed user accounts to be enumerated, and I suspect that is the problem, that scammers are trying to combine that with fake info and sell as a real dump
antephialtic: but the hacker also has names associated with accounts
antephialtic: and offered to give password hash + last 4 digits of credit card if I pm'd him my email (which I didn't)
antephialtic: somewhat concerning
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12922 @ 0.00095014 = 12.2777 BTC [+]
nubbins`: someone shared this in -otc earlier
ozbot: ,-----. ,--. - Pastebin.com
antephialtic: I don't have any funds in coinbase, but they are a major point of centralization
jurov: well, i'm looking how will mircea call it when when half of oceania finally drowns
jurov: prolly he'll just call them stupid and move on
nubbins`: jurov: "all a big scam" ;p
ozbot: Twitter / Mircea_Popescu: http://t.co/KE3CB9NVZq Today ...
nubbins`: OH MY GOD A SNOW PLOW
antephialtic: mircea_popescu: that is the aformentioned user email enumeration issue
nubbins`: don't i just feel silly for shovelling a walking path down the middle of my street
mircea_popescu: jurov half of "oceania" is what exactly, some islands ?
mircea_popescu: oceania is not a thing
antephialtic: the hackers claim to have actually pwned coinbase
jurov: oceania are islnds by definition
mircea_popescu: jurov just saying, i called it stupid and moved on when i was about 9
mircea_popescu: has nothing to do with this
jurov: ah "not a thing"... another mp's canned reply
mircea_popescu: it's not canned, i make them up fresh.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform forwarded you some mile long email, mostly because i have no consideration for your time apparently.
mircea_popescu: but also because who knows, could be a comedy goldmine.
mircea_popescu: jurov no but seriously, what, some coral reefs ? some volcanic islands a mile wide ? this is something someone should care about ?
mircea_popescu: tickle the volcanoes, make a whole new "oceania"
mircea_popescu: antephialtic myeah.
antephialtic: anyways, its just alarming because the full name stuff is apparently real and doesn't seem possible to have been acquired by the email enumeration attack
mircea_popescu: probably leveraged it.
antephialtic: probably.
moiety: wtf freenode+
mircea_popescu: as someone said, when therer's a cockroach in plain sight, that's never the only cockroach around.
antephialtic: yeah I suppose they could have just used the emails to google for the names and then released that as a "partial dump"
antephialtic: when all they really had was the emails, and they were trying to get some idiot to buy their fake dump
ozbot: Sea Level Trends - NOAA Tides & Currents
mircea_popescu: they also released the known but apparently not widely known fact that coinbase is forwarding all tx history to teh us alphabet soup on a daily basis.
jurov: here the north sees sea level going down because glaciers melt and earth goes up because of reduced weight
jurov: but in tropics, everyone who lives in few meters above seal level is going to have problem sooner or later
nubbins`: trying to make the best of this april 1, the weather isn't helping
jurov: nubbins` yup :)
antephialtic: mp: yeah the hacker claimed to have found a file on their server called "compliance_dailysftp.rb" that uploaded a daily dump to IRS/FinCEN/FBI
mircea_popescu: jurov everyone is going to have problems sooner or later anyway. that's the definition of problems.
antephialtic: I asked them to pastebin it, then the guy told me to fuck off :)
mircea_popescu: antephialtic there's reasons we don't trust coinbase after all.
antephialtic: the only credible thing about that was that it is known their site is implemented in ruby on rails
nubbins`: what site isn't?!
mircea_popescu: no, i'll certify it if you care.
nubbins`: (lel)
jurov: as long as the problem don't cause mass migrations, it's fine
mircea_popescu: jurov well mass migrations out of oceania seems to be against your definition of oceania
mircea_popescu: mass migrations out of the tropics have been a thing since the 50s
mircea_popescu: the 1850s.
jurov: southeast asia will be the next
mircea_popescu: because the tropics suck ass, because they had run a welfare system for centuries.
nubbins`: i, for one, am looking forward to warmer summers, if not a drastic increase in the price of food
jurov: nubbins`: you forgot to draw welfare/socialist button
nubbins`: jurov i wanted to strike while the iron was hot ;(
nubbins`: i even forgot the "global warming" button
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 6 @ 0.04463333 = 0.2678 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: nubbins` ya srsly, how about you make a much bigger board ? this topic deserves some attention
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.05560027 = 0.1668 BTC [-]
nubbins`: anyway, re: global warming, what are ya, michael crichton? ;p
mircea_popescu: who's that ?
mircea_popescu: "was an American best-selling author"
mircea_popescu: by now that's pretty much become my "close page" cue
nubbins`: heh.
nubbins`: read his book "state of fear", you'd love it
nubbins`: he wrote jurassic park, among others
ozbot: State of Fear - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
nubbins`: "Most climate scientists dispute Crichton's science as being error-filled and distorted,[1][2][3][4][5][6] and it was described as "pure porn for global warming deniers" by one skeptical science journalist. [7]"
mircea_popescu: anyway. me leling at the pseudoscience of others does not promote me to the rank of pseudoscience author.
nubbins`: crichton was interesting in that he's the only novelist i can think of who included a lengthy bibliography in each book
nubbins`: "In March 2006, [journalist Michael] Crowley wrote a strongly critical review of State of Fear, focusing on Crichton's stance on global warming. In the same year, Crichton published the novel Next, which contains a minor character named "Mick Crowley", who is a Yale graduate and a Washington D.C.based political columnist. The character was portrayed as a child molester with a small penis. The
nubbins`: character does not appear elsewhere in the book."
mircea_popescu: this i can get behind.
nubbins`: anyway, lels aside, he wrote good fiction. his early stuff -- the andromeda strain, the terminal man, the great train robbery, eaters of the dead, congo... all good
nubbins`: almost all of his novels were eventually made into shitty movies, ghosts of their former selves
nubbins`: but that's the way it goes
mircea_popescu: not necessarily.
mircea_popescu: you don't HAVE TO option the book
nubbins`: well, ^
mircea_popescu: not anymore than you have to be "professional" on tardstalk or w/e.
nubbins`: you don't HAVE TO write your critics into subsequent novels as micro-dick diddlers either :D
mircea_popescu: no, that you have to do.
nubbins`: heh.
mircea_popescu: there's haves and then there's have nots, see ?
antephialtic: any of you ever read jonathan carroll?
nubbins`: ^ is that a button or a switch? ;D
nubbins`: ante nope
mircea_popescu: nubbins` lmao the switch is in here : http://trilema.com/2011/cum-se-bate-femeia/
nubbins`: name a good one
antephialtic: surrealist fiction. highly enjoyable. I recommend the Land of Laughs
nubbins`: heh!
antephialtic: its a bit sentimental for the crypto-anarchist type, but I enjoy it nonetheless
mircea_popescu: kinda looking forward to a full edition mp space cadet kbd.
nubbins`: antephialtic: as someone who's into g.g. marquez, i don't mind sentimentalism or surrealism ;D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 89 @ 0.0055011 = 0.4896 BTC [+] {3}
nubbins`: snowplow just came and pushed the contents of the street back onto my front step. gotta get back outside
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 75 @ 0.0058419 = 0.4381 BTC [+] {2}
antephialtic: random question: anyone ever tried to reset satoshi's email password before? only required info is birthdate
antephialtic: i doubt he was dumb enough to leave any identifying info there, but it would be interesting nonetheless
mircea_popescu: well how would we know what someone tried ?
mircea_popescu: have you ?
antephialtic: i've tried before, but after 3 (uninformed) guesses, the account got temporarily locked. Seems pretty reasonable to do over a long period of time (assuming gmx isn't smart enough to stop it)
antephialtic: it would probably be easier to just bribe a gmx employee
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.61754 = 1.2351 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: BitBet - Bitcoin difficulty to fall
mircea_popescu: check that shit out. falling, srsly ?
ozbot: Covered California Sends Deaf Callers To Hotline Offering ‘Hot Ladies’ « CBS Sacramento
antephialtic: man, israel just owns the US. How is it that Israel and Palestine are the ones in conflict, yet, the US is making concessions??
mircea_popescu: the new and much easier to read mpoe statement :
ozbot: MPOE, March 2014 Statement pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: antephialtic gotta pay to play.
antephialtic: this is analogous to the judge allowing Charlie Shrem to bang his daughter in exchange for him accepting a plea bargain
antephialtic: makes no sense.
jurov: mpoe-pr no more????
chetty: Kerry want to claim he made mideast peace
mircea_popescu: jurov aye.
asciilifeform: i thought she just moved to new forum?
mircea_popescu: antephialtic no, it's much more like the judge allowing the two unkempt youths fuck his teenaged daughter in exchange of not having his car all scratched up.
pLambert: does she still get paid even though she got banned?
mircea_popescu: pLambert well she didn't get banned in march
mircea_popescu: what am i going to do, run mr scrooge's offices over here ?
pLambert: depends on where you live
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform she wants a break.
pLambert: Isn't that how you get rich, byy acting like scrooge? ;)
mircea_popescu: i got rich by acting like gotti.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i marvel that she lasted this long - my dosimeter turns full black from just reading that phorum for a few min.
mircea_popescu: two years just about
mircea_popescu: actually...
mircea_popescu: hum the forum's down
mircea_popescu: but yes, feb 27th. she made it 25 months.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 28 @ 0.00415917 = 0.1165 BTC [+] {8}
mircea_popescu: !t hl rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00714000 / 0.00749986 / 0.00750000 (15688 shares, 117.65784000 BTC), 7D: 0.00525030 / 0.00721312 / 0.00750000 (20401 shares, 147.15492901 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.0061131 / 0.00900001 (61828 shares, 377.96051440 BTC)
ColdHardMetal: I'd say you got your money's worth.
mircea_popescu: ColdHardMetal always a risky proposition, bitcoin divestment for fiat. who knows, maybe in a decade i live to regret it :p
ColdHardMetal: we can only hope :)
mircea_popescu: the strange things we hope for.
thestringpuller: !ticker m s.mpoe
assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.0009404 / 0.0009483 / 0.00095556 (1585392 shares, 1,503.43 BTC), 7D: 0.00092844 / 0.00094386 / 0.00095875 (6748749 shares, 6,369.90 BTC), 30D: 0.000745 / 0.00087539 / 0.00096 (29415142 shares, 25,749.77 BTC)
jurov: ⚠ URGENT: Сoinbase hacked. We just sent you a request to pay 999999.99999999 BTC (worth €354,414,446.99 EUR) using Coinbase.
jurov: Click here to sign in and complete this payment LOLOLOLOL
jurov: funniest scam i have seen recently
mircea_popescu: it's not really a scam
mircea_popescu: well... i mean.... uh.
mircea_popescu: it is a scam, obviously. it's not without coinbase's involvement tho, which is what i mean. htey're using the same infrastructure a legit merchant would be using.
ColdHardMetal: I got one of those from: fuckingspammer@mailinator.com at least they're forthright about it.
moiety: i thought it was an april fools thing because of the ridiculously high numbers
moiety: and the emails
jurov: moiety and you clicked, just for fun?
moiety: i dont use coinbase lol someone showed me what they got
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21029 @ 0.0009404 = 19.7757 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: twitter's been going pretty nuts over my repaste there.
moiety: tweeter? i havent been today yet
moiety: lies i did earlier
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.064 = 0.128 BTC [-]
moiety: http://i.imgur.com/NCBsGMt.png?1 thats the coinbase snip i was shown
jurov: i received exactly the text i pasted (minus the trailing LOLOLOL)
cazalla: "Coinbase provides your full transaction history to the FBI, FinCEN and IRS every day. They are under a gag order."
mircea_popescu: cazalla log ?
thestringpuller: guess I'm bitcoins on the street for now on
VanCleef: thats pretty messed up if true
cazalla: mircea_popescu: it was on front page of /r/bitcoin
mircea_popescu: no i mean, the answer to your q is in teh log.
cazalla: maybe someone is just taking advantage of the leaked emails to spread more bullshit
cazalla: yeah, i'm behind
mircea_popescu: there's a reason we don't trust the bitcoin scam foundation bunch.
antephialtic: here's a short convo I had with the hacker
ozbot: 0bin - encrypted pastebin
antephialtic: or, rather his messenger
antephialtic: (obviously I wasn't going to buy the dump)
antephialtic: just wanted to see if the hack was real
cazalla: ah, nubbins` already posted it, mb
ThickAsThieves: coinbase joke is stupid
VanCleef: so it is a joke tat?
ThickAsThieves: they were so scared people would think it was real they put hack in the subject of the email
ThickAsThieves: the point of April Fools is for the target to think it's real
ThickAsThieves: it's like Troll Appreciation Day
VanCleef: well 10 chinese bitcoiners did get executed today by the chinese gov, i don't think they're laughing
ThickAsThieves: no, but they are happy
cazalla: VanCleef: I googled that - chinese bitcoiners executed, first result is a laugh
cazalla: "Bitcoiners prefer finance and kindles to sex"
ozbot: Hyper Speed Vertical Train Hub proposed for New York and London | Mail Online
VanCleef: reading
jurov: lol
jurov: the illustrations with the birds...
mircea_popescu: look kakobrekla now your ?trick is immortalised : https://twitter.com/Mircea_Popescu/status/450987172683055104
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9550 @ 0.0009405 = 8.9818 BTC [+]
moiety: ThickAsThieves: i thought as much because of the emails and the fact all the amounts were so stupidly high
ThickAsThieves: question, why are US capital gains tax tiers gated by the one-year term? and is it appropriate to apply such to bitcoin under those reasons.
VanCleef: i think its obamas fault
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11864 @ 0.00094407 = 11.2004 BTC [+] {2}
ThickAsThieves: i assume it's to promote longer terms of invetsment, but is that to benefit the dollar itself, or to promote longer-term invetsments in the economy of the country?
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves you really must ask a tax accountant that.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10100 @ 0.00094039 = 9.4979 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: my own guess would be that it's one of those quirks that end up in legislation of dual party systems
mircea_popescu: ie, some nonsense both sides were too tired and too tied down other places to argue
antephialtic: as you said, its to incentivize long term investment over short term speculation
ThickAsThieves: wow i thought youd have the usual make-me-feel-like-an-idiot answer
ThickAsThieves: i am disappoint
mircea_popescu: lol nubbins` add a switch pls.
ThickAsThieves: antephialtic, but why
nubbins`: you are [an idiot/wasting my time/first against the wall when i am king]
antephialtic: because old people who vote tend to buy and hold over the long term. but uncle sam wants some of those sweet profits from the prop traders on wall street
ThickAsThieves: i doubt thats the reason on record
antephialtic: and as a form of social engineering to make the capital markets more stable
mircea_popescu: sooo.... someone just sent a 2btc donation to mah trilema credits address ?
mircea_popescu: ty, kind sir.
ThickAsThieves: it would seem it promotes/protects inflation somewhat
mircea_popescu: nubbins` no, more like "if you throw this the op feels like an idiot"
nubbins`: tat this is related to http://imgur.com/Ydmf7Xl
nubbins`: TBH "bitcoin is here to cum" might be my favourite
the20year2: Major news : Berkshire hathaway acquires RENT.
mircea_popescu: i thought they just bought the month of april.
the20year2: Just april the 1st
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35800 @ 0.00094465 = 33.8185 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: nubbins` do you have a @twitter or too hipster for THAT too, in adition to atc ?
ozbot: JK (jon_keefe) on Twitter
mircea_popescu: MPOE-PR : "whai are you a muffin of pubic hair with a sausage finger?!"
mircea_popescu: the obvious answer being, "because that's what nubbins` makes : sausages"
nubbins`: heh.
nubbins`: that's your beard
nubbins`: overhead shot obv
nubbins`: why is mpoe-pr a muffin of pubic hair with a sausage finger?
mircea_popescu: the log's even better : mircea_popescu: a hair MPOE-PR you "whai : are of sausage a finger?!" pubic with muffin
mircea_popescu: 14:11:52
mircea_popescu: mircea_popescu: makes nubbins` that's : being, obvious answer sausages" "because the what
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell decimation epic quote, i shall use it!
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: so lemme push everyone's favourite button then.
nubbins`: haha
locksmith: dude my girlfriend's sitting 1 inch from me
nubbins`: better stop clicking links then
ThickAsThieves: welcome to the internet, gf
mircea_popescu: why so short ?
mircea_popescu: 1 inch isn't much
ThickAsThieves: it's the leftove rinch
nubbins`: 14:22:51locksmith:inch from me sitting dude my girlfriend's 1
locksmith: haahhaahah
mircea_popescu: lol good one tat.
ThickAsThieves: "inside" jokes ftw
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 19 @ 0.61995572 = 11.7792 BTC [+] {5}
locksmith: just read the article as well, I can translate it for anyone interested
mircea_popescu: locksmith go ahead
mircea_popescu: summary tho pls.
locksmith: yep. (it's saying stuff discussed over at btctalk but whatever)
locksmith: title: "NeoBee ceo nowhere to be found"
locksmith: - trading of company's stock halted
ozbot: imgur: the simple imgur blog
mircea_popescu: wouldn't it be ironic if neobee ends up getting more press for free now than they got back when they were paying for it ?
locksmith: they're saying that them (newsit.com,cy) as well as Politis newspaper tried to contact the company and could not get ahodl of them
novusordo: "Coinbase provides your full transaction history to the FBI, FinCEN and IRS every day. They are under a gag order."
antephialtic: TaT: do you actually know why the shares stopped trading?
ThickAsThieves: i believe a reason was given publically, no?
locksmith: also the article goes on and on wondering how many people danny took money from
locksmith: and then just translates bits and pieces from the coindesk article
mircea_popescu: locksmith hopefully they don't keep on with this or else maged might ban newsit.com.cy
locksmith: including danny's supposed "quote"
antephialtic: "questionable trading"
antephialtic: ... what really happened
mircea_popescu: antephialtic my own theory, as a completely uninvolved observer, is this :
mircea_popescu: havelock is under a lot of pressure because all their scammy assets are turning into a visible loss, so rather than man up to it they prefer to simply close trading as the bubbles pop.
VanCleef: i think havelock will close down sometime this year
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18240 @ 0.00094769 = 17.2859 BTC [+] {3}
ThickAsThieves: Neo compliance officer did make a formal recommendation to halt
locksmith: I'm an uninvolved observer as well but have 2 individual sources within Neo. the hard truth is that for the past week the employees could not get ahold of DB, and their paychecks will probably not be met for the month of March (they haven't been paid yet from what I know)
ozbot: BitBet - And Then There Was One
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves locksmith these things seem a little contradictory.
antephialtic: (also uninvolved, just curious)
antephialtic: locksmith, seems like a very elaborate scam, no? why not just steal all the money after the IPO, why go to all the trouble of building a storefront and advertising, etc.
mircea_popescu: antephialtic i dunno that scam was ever seriously argued other than as a technicality.
antephialtic: and MP, that explains the trading freeze, not the disappearance of the CEO
antephialtic: regardless of the tradeing being stopped, surely a competent/engaged CEO would have issued a statement to reassure investors?
locksmith: I haven't called scam. all I'm saying is that they got to a point where they can't pay back their creditors. i.e. they owe over 150,000 euros to their marketing/pr firm Telia & Pavla BBDO
antephialtic: what about all the capital they raised?
antephialtic: down the toilet?
ozbot: A new forum or board is required : neobee
antephialtic: mp: will do
antephialtic: just sayin, whatever the issue is, it isn't solely with havelock
jurov: ^ just posted clear example
antephialtic: ain't no drama like bitcoin drama
mircea_popescu: kinda why the price is up i guess.
mircea_popescu: bitcoin, still backed by lulz and drama.
jurov: yes, neobee causing bitcoin to soar
locksmith: also, something not said anywhere else: danny announced to his employees on thursday the 13th that he was left in his wallet with 100btc while someone overlooked into his pc and saw a bitstamp account with WAY more than that
antephialtic: bitcoin is a fractal of entertaining scams
lewicki: breaking the bitstamp 2fa is no small feet...
locksmith: I wouldn't be surprised if he was also deep into the karpeles thing, he was looking into a flight to go to japan from cyprus through dubai and couldn't find connecting flights at dubai
locksmith: lewicki - his account was locked in and someone saw it when danny was still on his pc
locksmith: all this are rumours of course, just to keep us entertained as the tower crumbles.
thestringpuller: !ticker m s.mpoe
assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00094007 / 0.00094763 / 0.00095556 (1579375 shares, 1,496.67 BTC), 7D: 0.00092844 / 0.00094377 / 0.00095875 (6788064 shares, 6,406.40 BTC), 30D: 0.000745 / 0.00087566 / 0.00096 (29481818 shares, 25,816.18 BTC)
mircea_popescu: locksmith well sure, the guy kept trying to buy relevancy, first with his clueless stumble into the bf thing, then probably derping around mtgox,
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller report was out earlier btw.
thestringpuller: yea read it, poor mpoe-pr
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06687999 = 0.2006 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: she's taking a break you said?
mircea_popescu: well originally it was ok, so moving over to .lk, but then she was like listen, can i have some time off nao ?
mircea_popescu: and i really don't see how i could've said no.
ThickAsThieves: things have a way of working themselves out sometimes
mircea_popescu: indubitably.
ThickAsThieves: she'll come back to obvious purpose prolly
thestringpuller: MPOE-PR deserves a holiday.
mircea_popescu: inasmuch as any person deserves their sanity.
mircea_popescu: i know few people who could've done it, what she did
mircea_popescu: and they're all women.
jurov: yes, she deserves. and yes
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [KCIM] 77 @ 0.00162119 = 0.1248 BTC [-] {13}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34528 @ 0.00094967 = 32.7902 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell cads no, it's not that romanian nerds fail to be socially inept. is that romanian teenage queens fail to be socially apt, and so the nerds have no contrasting background to stand out against.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: moiety wait, you're pregnant ?!
moiety: lolol! no i was passing on news about someone else, mircea_popescu XD
chetty: only problem is - it is not a joke :(
mircea_popescu: nubbins` the part i don't understand are the bottom left buttons. an d and an a ? whay ?
moiety: "making them a scapegoat" - thought thats one of the reasons for having kids?
nubbins`: that's an O and an A
nubbins`: 'cause you're always saying "a a now i get it" or "o"
chetty: moiety, +1
nubbins`: as someone who grew up with these words being spelled "ah" and "oh", respectively, this always struck me as quaint
mike_c: btcalpha accountants say: mpoe march revenue should be 180.37141356, not 139.62178334
mircea_popescu: well my a is an ah, but my o isn't really an oh. much more acute.
mircea_popescu: mike_c btcalpha accountants are indeed wise.
mike_c: buncha pencil pushers
moiety: i grew up with it spelt oh but i keep typing o since coming here lol
mircea_popescu: well mohiety, that'd be because you're flexible.
nubbins`: mirceah pohpescu
nubbins`: time for shovelling (round 5)
mircea_popescu: nubbins` did i ever tell you about that one time i had to do it ?
moiety: lolol
ozbot: Does Mt.Gox's CEO Have a Secret History of Committing Fraud?
mircea_popescu: at the risk of beating a dead, if fat, horse.
moiety: my friend dug out a race track for his dog in his garden
VanCleef: short answer, yes
VanCleef: very dodgy character
mircea_popescu: davout / pankkake what'd be your english rendition of "souricière" ?
davout: mousetrap?
mircea_popescu: well obviously
mircea_popescu: is it the lock-up in the police station where they keep people pre-warrant ?
davout: yes, that too
mircea_popescu: gawker's french is worse than mine.
mircea_popescu: you'd think, you know, for some progressive libtards wearing no bras because their mothers burned them in paris in 68
mircea_popescu: they'd have a more cursive mastery of that language.
davout: whatcha referring to?
mircea_popescu: earlier linked piece
ozbot: Does Mt.Gox's CEO Have a Secret History of Committing Fraud?
davout: ah
davout: yes, they got the souricière thing wrong
davout: it doesn't refer to entrapment but more to the cell itself
mircea_popescu: "The Bitcoin community will surely learn a number of lessons from the Mt. Gox disaster, and here is a simple one: when investing in Bitcoin, make sure the guy you're trusting with your money doesn't have a secret past committing fraud. Even if that means finding someone who knows French."
mircea_popescu: that part at least is workable.
mircea_popescu: though they should take their own advice :D
davout: yes, the bitcoin community totally has a history of learning from lessons
mircea_popescu: vaguely related,
ozbot: Gawker Sucks: Hey Jordan Sargent: Fix your article
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.06689832 = 0.4014 BTC [+] {3}
jurov: lol that's like "make sure you don't disclose anything to secret agent"
aclot: :)
ozbot: Is it possible the person selling those shares was Danny Brewster? : neobee
aclot: bwah
mircea_popescu: much lol.
ozbot: JuicyGrabs comments on Neo & Bee employees unpaid and unable to contact CEO @BtcDanny
mircea_popescu: i like that part.
mircea_popescu: for my numerous crimes of having known about various future pops months/weeks in advance, i shall henceforth be known as mp_goldstein
antephialtic: <JuicyGrabs> I didn't "lose" anything because I don't invest for short term and to be swayed by trolls and paid shills. I used this chance to buy more.
VanCleef: mp_steinberg
mircea_popescu: which steinberg ?
chetty: mp_nostradamos
mircea_popescu: antephialtic he's fine, his investment is for the longest term.
antephialtic: infinite term.
jurov: till death do us part
mircea_popescu: st peter's book of investments.
antephialtic: they should have named the company herp & derp
mircea_popescu: the neo forum name was taken
mircea_popescu: soo, someone had pointed out an error with the bitbet dividend last month ?
ThickAsThieves: seems somewhat frequent to have numbers errors in mpex reports/divs
ThickAsThieves: testing your devotees?
mircea_popescu: well i think there's less error here than the average, really
chetty: his calculator needs new batteries
mircea_popescu: just that my shit gets caught all the time
ThickAsThieves: ive removed btctalk from my bookmarks
ThickAsThieves: feels good to not check it anymore
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 18 @ 0.00583019 = 0.1049 BTC [+]
ozbot: BitBet, March 2014 Statement pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
ThickAsThieves: i see an error!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06400204 = 0.32 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: April Fool's!
mircea_popescu: god dangit
ThickAsThieves: "It’s just fingershaped happenstance."
mircea_popescu: also since we're on bitbet, and since ppl are asking like http://bitbet.us/bet/635/1btc-10-000-usd/#c2703
mircea_popescu: anyone bored could make a tool to add up the balances in publicly displayed addies as an open audit thing
ThickAsThieves: tell kako to use the beer fund
ThickAsThieves: or bitbet's, more appropriately
ThickAsThieves: seems a worthy cause
mircea_popescu: course this probably understates bitbet controlled btc, seeing how if a large chunk is used to make a small payment the remainder is still bitbet's, but anyway
ThickAsThieves: could provide a constant link to dynamic audit
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves well if it's house-released it's not the same thing
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06400204 = 0.32 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: pretty fancy really
mircea_popescu: i'd rather decentralize etc.
ThickAsThieves: blockchain is already decentralized, dont be so forumite
mircea_popescu: people are constantly asking "well how to acquire respek and a wot weight". this is *precisely* how
ThickAsThieves: the only centralized part is bitbet expenses and disclosure
mircea_popescu: lurk here, pick one of these that's a good fit for you and run with it. they're like... at LEAST weekly occurences.
ThickAsThieves: the rest could be blockchain-dynamic
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves expenses aren't really that centralised. i mean which lines ?
mircea_popescu: house bets made is public,
mircea_popescu: rectifications are public,
mircea_popescu: referrals i guess aren't public.
ThickAsThieves: expenses?
ThickAsThieves: i just mean why stop at proving you have the coins
ThickAsThieves: your whole book could be dynamic
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16984 @ 0.00094075 = 15.9777 BTC [-]
benkay: derpstributed application bitbet
ThickAsThieves: provably solvent
ThickAsThieves: provably fair
ThickAsThieves: provably homosexual
mircea_popescu: provably fucking your wife
ThickAsThieves: too slow!
mircea_popescu: this discussion reads a lolt better in the lolg.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06869731 = 0.3435 BTC [+]
benkay: bitbet is now a dac
benkay: april fewls
ozbot: Dual EC DRBG
antephialtic: nice writup of NSA fucking up all the codez
antephialtic: "Adamantiadis' code recovers the state from 30 output bytes within 12.1 seconds on the reference CPU."
benkay: distributed autonomous corporation
benkay: it'd be soooo lulzy to get -pr to troll btctalk with that
benkay: SO LULZ
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 11 @ 0.0686973 = 0.7557 BTC [-] {4}
benkay: bitcoin might go up 100 dollars on the lulz
benkay: "popescu reverses stance on colored coins"
benkay: "ethereum ready for big boy time"
benkay: be great
ThickAsThieves: just buy ethereum to kill it
ThickAsThieves: show how weak it is and teach its supporters
benkay: no its too good
mircea_popescu: they're killing it just fine on its own
mircea_popescu: why give them money.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39800 @ 0.00094017 = 37.4188 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: Twitter / jonwaller: We had a great #Ethereum ...
ThickAsThieves: severe lack of beards
mircea_popescu: some beards grow inside the neck.
punkman1: beards = trust
ThickAsThieves: programming with their tablets
mircea_popescu: what the fuck would be going through a weirdo's mind that sported an OHIO tshirt
punkman1: MP's glorious beard being the most trustworthy
mircea_popescu: i mean, obscure band, i can see. you're hoping to hop the solist/celist
mircea_popescu: but obscure state ?!
ThickAsThieves: read the shirt though
mircea_popescu: ok it got even lamer.
ThickAsThieves: all their beards combined into one
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 2.47941077 BTC to 4`937 shares, 50221 satoshi per share
mircea_popescu: that looks just like my pubic hair.
mircea_popescu: this guy's pretty epic. "i do ixcoin. i think it'll be huge"
mircea_popescu: should change his name to banya.
benkay: sublime text
chetty: hey I found ceoDanny
mircea_popescu: long legs almost excuse a beard.
mircea_popescu: chetty neobee didn't have a lambo. afaik that's bitpay
chetty: well he has had time to get one
thestringpuller: bitpay wastes a lot of money
artifexd: How the hell can you code on a tablet? The lack of pixels alone...
mircea_popescu: artifexd i never understood it.
antephialtic: thestringpuller: how so?
benkay: artifexd: if you don't strive for efficiency in your process in the first place...
thestringpuller: antephialtic: They spend astronomically more money in comparison to MP's companies...
Mats_cd03: im being mindfucked by the logs
artifexd: I'm used to working on multiple 30" monitors so the thought of working on a 7" tablet scares me.
thestringpuller: so I'd imagine they are spending in excess
chetty: I dont even like coding on a laptop if I can help it
benkay: ugh fix the logs
benkay: actually nvm
Mats_cd03: seriously what is this 19:50:13 mircea_popescu: tumbler, an great bitbet but use how properly this so a much is in purpose, moreover isn't for to trivial how designed is on showing this anyway, it as any service exercise
benkay: i'm sure nothing happened
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
benkay: chetty: some day this year i'll get an office and move back to multiple monitors
Mats_cd03: i spent a few mins reading and i was trying to figure out if im really fucking high or the logs are broken
benkay: but for now, cafe lifestyle
benkay: Mats_cd03: did you check the date?
benkay: i'm considering telling a PM that all of his company's backups failed and have been corrupted for the past month.
Mats_cd03: this is worse than ponies, youre ruining my coffee time
mike_c: Mats_cd03: you've been april fooled :) try this: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?stopitkako&date=20-02-2014#520188
benkay: happy april
benkay: stoppitkako well done
artifexd: lol @ stopitkako
Mats_cd03: thx ily mike_c
benkay: mike_c: i for one do not appreciate the fix
benkay: now i have to read the logs
mike_c: i know, right? no days off around here
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
benkay: i see you debugging -assets in production, mike_c
mike_c: i didn't figure out the algorithm.
mircea_popescu: darn too slow again
mircea_popescu: mike_c prolly just random sort ?
benkay: phprand
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34308 @ 0.0009409 = 32.2804 BTC [+] {2}
benkay: rand-ish
kakobrekla: yeah the entropy on it is bad, no cardano sorry guise.
benkay: what kind of cabal is this anyways
Mats_cd03: what are we doing tonight brain?
mircea_popescu: fucking ourselves out ?
benkay: ;;later tell Duffer1 NASA was just a wholehearted theft of european talent. nothing endogenous to the USA.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
benkay: s/wholehearted/wholesale
benkay: asciilifeform:just about every interesting technology attributed to a mega-organization was done on 'stolen time.' << yeah, as always, asciilifeform has it
mike_c: i feel like i've asked this before, but: bitbet revenue line 'fees from refunds'. how are fees that bitbet paid considered revenue?
benkay: 1%
mike_c: oh oh
mike_c: right
mike_c: i was thinking tx fees on sending out refunds
mircea_popescu: brb found an error in the rectification o.o
benkay: bitbet also mining farm
mircea_popescu: actually : this is a good matter for public consultation.
benkay: APE-WIL FEWLS
mircea_popescu: so : last month bitbet made 3.68215306 btc, which should have gone as follows : 1.104645918 should have gone to the public shareholders, 1.288753571 to kako and 1.288753571 to me.
mircea_popescu: this because we still hold 70% of the shares, not yet listed.
mircea_popescu: through my mistake 3.68215306 have gone to the public shareholders instead.
mircea_popescu: how would teh wise other ppl rectify this problem in the current report ?
mike_c: what can you do? mark it under expense and carry forward.
mircea_popescu: no because that degrades the dividends owed on the 70% of shares not listed
ThickAsThieves: the guys that made the error?
mike_c: overpay yourself and kako in the same amount, then carry forward the expense.
mike_c: screws future investors, but they can see that in the report and take it into consideration.
ThickAsThieves: the question lies in whether and where the culpability lies
ThickAsThieves: i think it is not the shareholders that should be owed
ozbot: BitBet, March 2014 Statement pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mike_c: not really. the company accountant screwed up. can't penalize specific shareholders for that
mircea_popescu: i think this is a better solution
mircea_popescu: "make the mistake larger" seems the wron way to go
ThickAsThieves: so bitbet/you/accountant are eating the loss?
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves no ? it's just a floating charge against public share dividents.
ThickAsThieves: i disagree with that
mircea_popescu: because why ?
ThickAsThieves: account should be settled at time of report
mircea_popescu: that redces to "every corp should dissolve"
ThickAsThieves: its meant to read that an error was made and that cant be undone by carrying it over
ThickAsThieves: as mentioned,
ThickAsThieves: it fucks up trading of shares
ThickAsThieves: i suppose a shareholder should read footnotes and know he'll come in owing some divs
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 4000 @ 0.00040028 = 1.6011 BTC [-] {20}
mircea_popescu: but what ?
mike_c: but now it is more confusing. there is no line item for that charge.
mircea_popescu: mike_c myeah
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves what happens if one month the revenue from closing bets is 1 btc but the house takes in 1k new bets, worth 100 btc
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 500 @ 0.00085017 = 0.4251 BTC [-] {5}
mircea_popescu: obviously that 99 btc will be carried on the book until it melts away
ThickAsThieves: bitbet accidentally lost some money
ThickAsThieves: that's how it should go
mircea_popescu: (we had something similar happen at least once iirc)
ThickAsThieves: not sure if it washes any different though
mike_c: i guess the issue is that this is a cash flow statement, and the charge belongs on the balance sheet.
mircea_popescu: mike_c myeah kinda smushing things together in there
ThickAsThieves: unless bitbet intends to charge an employee or contractor for the loss, the shareholders eat it regardless
ThickAsThieves: certainly dont pay out MORE to balance the loss
mircea_popescu: that no.
ThickAsThieves: if you had a full board, theyd probly seek reimbursement from the accountant
ThickAsThieves: if that person is an employee
ThickAsThieves: not sure what measures are appropriate
ThickAsThieves: firing in some cases
mircea_popescu: afaik the normal practice is simply clawback.
mircea_popescu: and if you derp you go to jail
mircea_popescu: like that recent guy with the 90k
ThickAsThieves: to be candid though, you have an an accounting problem that appears to be consistenly inconsistent
ThickAsThieves: a change of guard it likely in order
mircea_popescu: in that meta sense : i'm quite happy with it, because it both creates caselaw and casepeople.
ThickAsThieves: on the surface this is healthy
ThickAsThieves: cuz now all your people check every month
ThickAsThieves: and probly enjoy doing so
ThickAsThieves: but what if a major problem happens
ThickAsThieves: more caselaw... ?
mircea_popescu: pretty much. what else ?
ThickAsThieves: prevention?
mircea_popescu: i think this is the road to prevention.
ThickAsThieves: possibly
ThickAsThieves: but you bias
mircea_popescu: well yes i bias.
blackwhite: hello gents
mircea_popescu: mike_c half tempted to move bitbet on a nz0 basis tbh.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves the problem is that people who are actually qualified to do this stuff do not wish to do it, because they were qualified by fiat and wish to die in fiat.
mike_c: yeah.. it is not really accurate to call it a nz0 given how many assets it has :)
mircea_popescu: willy nilly have to create and qualify bitcoin cpas.
ThickAsThieves: then maybe my suggestion to go full dynamic aint so bad
mike_c: er, zac
ThickAsThieves: kill multiple birds with one stone
ThickAsThieves: automate the whole thing
mircea_popescu: it's bad. technology has never nor will it ever replace people.
ThickAsThieves: no mistakes
mircea_popescu: if we don't have our own cpas, and our own fucking missiles, we'll have trouble.
blackwhite: technology has already replaced people
blackwhite: in many areas
ThickAsThieves: well your cpa tells your programmer what to make
danielpbarron: who is "we"
ThickAsThieves: once, excel didnt exist
mircea_popescu: doubt we're that far yet, but i can appreciate your point in principle.
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron bitcoin.
mike_c: maybe mpoe-pr wants to learn accounting
mircea_popescu: i just hope she doesn't want to learn breastfeeding.
mike_c: she can do both at the same time
mircea_popescu: didn't work out for smickles, that theory.
danielpbarron: what does that even mean?
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron you're new here. why not read the logs for a while and ask q after ?
kakobrekla: perhaps wait a few more hrs with that advice.
mircea_popescu: a there is that
mircea_popescu: jesus new guy trying to read the log.
kakobrekla: make the wiki work
ThickAsThieves: i made the categories and two links! what more do you want!
bounce was going to say that excel isn't really appropriate for much of anything, then thought of "appropriate technology"... and excel is indeed pretty much the opposite.
ThickAsThieves: nah i'll help more tho
mircea_popescu: yeah we need more wiki people. hey moiety, do you know what the manuls have been telling me ?
danielpbarron: i don't need to read the logs to understand you are collectivizing all bitcoin users as if they all have the same goals
moiety: hmm manuls?
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron yeah, but you do need to read the logs to understand other things.
ThickAsThieves: you need it to not say weird shit like that
mircea_popescu: moiety they said you should be working butt off on wiki.
danielpbarron: how about you have your missile and i'll have mine? no need to personify Bitcoin
mircea_popescu: who are you ?! and why are you determined to feed my ignore list ?
moiety: that's because they can't read mircea_popescu .. what does the wiki need
kakobrekla: moiety at this point, a lot of flash, i think.
mircea_popescu: moiety articles. think you're trying to tell stuff to your newb friend, so she can talk in -assets without being silly. what'd go in there ?
kakobrekla: yes in a flash form
mircea_popescu: stop sabotaging the slander omg
kakobrekla: im sorry, dont take me seriously.
kakobrekla: ctrl - z
kakobrekla: ctrl - z
kakobrekla: ctrl - z
kakobrekla: there
kakobrekla: all good.
moiety: lol
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: z ctrl - kakobrekla: ctrl z - kakobrekla: z - ctrl
mircea_popescu: fucken spazz.
mircea_popescu: so now that mpoe and bbet are all fucked up, allow me to ruin the monthly reports of nsa too.
moiety: I'm not actually allowed to include manuls in this am i
mike_c: what's a wiki with no manuls?
benkay: mircea_popescu: list all shares on mpex. divs can only be paid to full float. remove a source of pebkac errors.
mircea_popescu: benkay then people can start pulling a danny.
benkay: pardon?
ThickAsThieves: and it's fud fodder
mike_c: benkay: owner-shares are not supposed to be tradeable
mike_c: they are contracted to maintain a % of ownership
moiety: <mircea_popescu> "[...] without being silly." << you did just ask me, but i will try.
benkay: the problem is this manual "half the shares are not on the exchange" thing.
benkay: or .7 or w/e.
ThickAsThieves: i dont share that concern
mircea_popescu: benkay nothing to stop the issuer from selling the treasury shares.
ThickAsThieves: i think they should not be on the exchange
benkay: well this is a design of exchange thing
benkay: as designed, sure, not really a good idea to set people up to do a runner.
ThickAsThieves: make issuer-grade accounts?
benkay: if you have 2 classes of shares, maybe track both classes of shares with the share tracking thing.
ThickAsThieves: that cannot trade
mircea_popescu: moiety cool. if you fuck it up all these other experts can fix it. but it seems unless someone starts nobody does sortt of thing
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves trade engine wants to kill your guitar.
ThickAsThieves: kako how do i get wiki access
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 485.03, Best ask: 485.8, Bid-ask spread: 0.77000, Last trade: 485.03, 24 hour volume: 24505.07026789, 24 hour low: 446.02, 24 hour high: 509.98, 24 hour vwap: 474.365683399
ThickAsThieves: that guitar comment went over my head mp
ThickAsThieves: i still think having the shares "listed" isnt a good path
ThickAsThieves: but i can see how it's possible to facilitate such and some benefits it could bring
mircea_popescu: google zappa my guitar wants to kill your momma
mircea_popescu: ;;google zappa my guitar wants to kill your momma
gribble: My Guitar Wants to Kill Your Mama - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Guitar_Wants_to_Kill_Your_Mama>; Frank Zappa & The Mothers - My Guitar Wants To Kill Your Mama ...: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JXCht5H9oU>; Frank Zappa - My Guitar Wants To Kill Your Mama (HQ) - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0Oj-eZqpHE>
kakobrekla: ThickAsThieves pm
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.06408505 = 0.3845 BTC [-] {2}
moiety: This is where he tells you to flash your webcam... or was that just me?
Mats_cd03: http://www.reddit.com/user/JuicyGrabs somebody that loves neobee and hates mpex... weird
ozbot: overview for JuicyGrabs
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.0569 = 0.1138 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06400205 = 0.32 BTC [-] {2}
ThickAsThieves: seems common
mircea_popescu: totally muy muy very weird and strange
Mats_cd03: mp has a powerful effect on people
ozbot: MPEx owner in danger of being extradited to US to face charges
ThickAsThieves: it's is charge in life it seems
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 729 @ 0.00094007 = 0.6853 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10171 @ 0.00093989 = 9.5596 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: wait, he found an article from two weeks ago ?
mike_c: first: bug in the snsa report :D "demo-ed before a rapturous applause"
ThickAsThieves: "Bear in mind that we’re almost a full year away and things may well change. A definitive schedule will be published late March 2014."
ThickAsThieves: anything to definitively add?
mircea_popescu: mike_c how do you say past of "to demo" ?
ThickAsThieves: demonstrated
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves notrly.
mike_c: i mean, either demo-ed before a rapturous audience
mircea_popescu: there, implemented both fixes.
mike_c: or demo-ed to the sound of thunderous applause
mircea_popescu: pls don't crimp my esl style.
bounce: no no no it was clearly rapturous applause before a thunderous crowd
mircea_popescu: rancorous thunderclapping and also nubbins snowpocalypsae
ThickAsThieves: anyone know a good article explaining WHY the WoT is good, something to convince a noob
bounce: and what's that old fashioned thing with dashes? these days you are supposed to sprinkle apostrophes across your prose just in case you missed a spot, but no dashes
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves maybe a re-write of the girl
mircea_popescu: s wot thing on bitcointalk ?
mircea_popescu: that'd make a decent wiki page anyway
ThickAsThieves: that's my thought, trying to make sure some context is injected into the wiki
ThickAsThieves: a buncha a links is only arguably better than 'go read the log'
mircea_popescu: verily. hence "re-write"
mircea_popescu: btctalk post had some good ideas/sturcture but not really a full and complete "why wot" thing
mircea_popescu: more like a subsection
ThickAsThieves: link handy?
ThickAsThieves: google giving weird returns for the forum
ozbot: Reputation system?
mircea_popescu: why do womenz look so great in ball gags
ThickAsThieves: kakobrekla, how to edit categories and add pages?
VanCleef: this bloomberg interview is interesting
VanCleef: i mean article
VanCleef: mp is famous
mircea_popescu: net notorious mpg
kakobrekla: ThickAsThieves
ozbot: manual [DokuWiki]
kakobrekla: see namespaces
VanCleef: what do you think about it all mp?
VanCleef: nothing to worry about for u?
mircea_popescu: not particularly.
VanCleef: herp has got a bit of a hardon for u
mircea_popescu: im kinda surprised nobody's come out with the "herp is really mp" line.
mircea_popescu: i recall j-something was suspected of it
VanCleef: i think this will affect havelock more so
VanCleef: and as i said earlier will probably close down sometime this year
kakobrekla: ThickAsThieves also there is a playground page to play around with
kakobrekla: if there is something specific you want to do i can tell you what you need to do
kakobrekla: if you want to create a new page on top of the dir, just visit the url you wanna create
kakobrekla: and create the page
kakobrekla: it will show in the menu automatically
kakobrekla: if you want a subpage, you can use nest it
ozbot: wiki:playground:test [bitcoin assets wiki]
kakobrekla: like dat
kakobrekla: but for now keep it on one level if you can ThickAsThieves
ThickAsThieves: mostly wanted to edit categories and create them
ThickAsThieves: just need to sort how to edit them now
kakobrekla: edit what, a category?
bounce: so I tried a writeup wrt something on -otc: http://pastebin.ca/2690120 apart from zomfg too long, comments?
kakobrekla: just make a new one delete old
VanCleef: did mpoepr really get banned from bitcointalk?
VanCleef: seems a bit harsh
bounce: ze mod said so, must be true then
VanCleef: sorry if this is old news or asking too many questions
mircea_popescu: VanCleef was yesterday's lulz
mircea_popescu: bounce it's not too bad as a case study
VanCleef: this doesn't seem like something TAT would post
ozbot: Please remove this user from this forum.
ThickAsThieves: well i did post it
VanCleef: oh okey
VanCleef: thanks for confirming
ThickAsThieves: ok i've added short descriptions to all the wiki links so far, surely they'll need editing and maybe some references
VanCleef: thought you got hacked or something :/
bounce: pr00f of h4x, I say. just like mpoe-pr clearly got h4xx0red. the mod was right!
ThickAsThieves: like what is so hard to believe
VanCleef: lol just didn't seem like it was you
ThickAsThieves: that i hate bullshit?
ThickAsThieves: and will swear over it?
mike_c: can he say broken windows a few more times? he doesn't sound dumb enough yet.
mircea_popescu: windows is pretty broken...
mircea_popescu: the wot post
ThickAsThieves: k i added the link as-is for now with suggestion for rewrite
mircea_popescu: "Coinbase isn't some random website made in a basement. It's a well funded, YC backed, known-founder company that complies with relevant banking law. There's absolutely nothing to suggest that they hold a partial reserve or have any ill intention whatsoever."
mircea_popescu: again, this bullshit ?
benkay: let's give the shitshow some credit, shall we?
benkay: "The steal-all-your-money rate of bitcoin businesses is running right around 100%, and you're going to lecture people that "they can only ever lose a small portion of all stored user funds"? Really?"
mircea_popescu: "The last "isn't some random website made in a basement" case was NeoBee. There were bunch of others before that, exactly similar.
mircea_popescu: Coinbase IS EXACTLY a random website made in a basement. So is AirBnB. So is everying else YC backed. Get over yourselves, lay down the pipe, you're a laughingstock for a reason.
mircea_popescu: This is the reason."
mircea_popescu: if anyone feels like passing it along.
mircea_popescu: yc imagines itself respectable nao, god help us.
ThickAsThieves: isnt that my quote?
mircea_popescu: "in depth coverage" ?
ThickAsThieves: bitpay i want my pound of flesh!
mircea_popescu: a little girl stole your quote
mike_c: i like coinbase. i don't have to hold any $$ with them in order to buy btc.
ThickAsThieves: she doesnt even look chinese
mircea_popescu: mike_c but you do have to hold your id with them
mike_c: yes, so my buys are recorded. what am i going to do? use localbitcoin and buy all my coin on the street corner?
mircea_popescu: not the point.
mircea_popescu: what if i go out and steal your server now ?
mircea_popescu: i got your actual passport, i got your address, your cc number, anything.
mircea_popescu: i could change your tax accountant
mircea_popescu: i could take out a new credit card.
mike_c: how is this different from any other online service?
mircea_popescu: i could withdraw your 401k early and guess what ? even if you do gert it back, the tax is still due.
mircea_popescu: what is this, how to make bitcoin paypal ?
mike_c: it's not making bitcoin paypal. once i buy my bitcoin, coinbase is no longer involved.
mircea_popescu: i don't think the average us person realises exactly how fucked they are. and the "well everyone else is just as fucked" thinkin doesn't really work.
mircea_popescu: yes, but you're permanently exposed.
mike_c: my bitcoinz are not though.
mircea_popescu: your bitcoins are not, no.
benkay: dude mike_c buying over irc is way more fun
mircea_popescu: if you have the sense to withdraw it
mike_c: steal my 401k, what the fuck do i care? it's worthless anyway.
mircea_popescu: which most people do not.
mircea_popescu: well i see what you mean, but! i imagine so do you.
mike_c: there is a practicality here. i can actually buy bitcoin with coinbase (with no $$ balance). there are extremely limited other ways for me to do that.
mircea_popescu: hey, your own life is yours to lead.
mike_c: i suppose. i wish -otc were better, but it's not.
mircea_popescu: coinbase is still a pos.
mike_c: hehe
mircea_popescu: there's you know, ringworm infested puddles all over africa
mircea_popescu: which are water for the locals, on the basis of the practicality that w/o water your le is a day.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35100 @ 0.00093989 = 32.9901 BTC [-]
mike_c: ok. yes, i see that point.
mike_c: i guess it's just that the other water sources are filled with sewage, so the ringworm doesn't look so bad.
mircea_popescu: not ringworm, that's fungal
mircea_popescu: wtf is that evil worm thing called
mircea_popescu: ;;google dracunculiasis
gribble: Dracunculiasis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dracunculiasis>; CDC - Guinea Worm: <http://www.cdc.gov/parasites/guineaworm/>; WHO | Dracunculiasis: <http://www.who.int/topics/dracunculiasis/en/>
mircea_popescu: that thing
benkay: otc is not really a pain in the ass.
benkay: know how much you want to buy, have it in a moneypak.
mircea_popescu: benkay i suppose it depends a lot on where you live etc
benkay: it is *moderately* inconvenient.
benkay: why does it depend on where you live? even in the states one can buy moneypak with cash.
mircea_popescu: how the fuck do i know
benkay: people are insufficiently wary about touching both the fiat rail and the crypto rail at the same time.
ozbot: #bitcoin-otc order book
mircea_popescu: maybe he lives five miles from any moneypak thing and it's run by zombies
bounce: s/even/only/ IIRC
bounce: need more peeps put their orders in there
benkay: it goes like this mike_c
benkay: "wtb btc with moneypak 2kusd"
bounce: then ignore all the scammers
mike_c: honey for the scammors. i'll try it again sometime.
benkay: yeah well then do your dilligence on trust ratings.
mircea_popescu: alternatively, maybe start with peanuts and work people up.
mircea_popescu: do 10 trades on 10 dolla moneypacks,
mircea_popescu: select the 8 that didn't run, do 50 dolla
mircea_popescu: select the 7 that etc do 100
mircea_popescu: eventually people's histories with you are more valuable to them than any one trade so even the scammers won't scam you.
Apocalyptic: typical otc scammer won't go that far anyway
Apocalyptic: last night dude took 2 hours to scam $10
ozbot: BTC.sx Receives Largest Seedcoin Fund Investment: Virtual Incubator Finances the First Bitcoin-Only
mircea_popescu: again largest and first ?
mircea_popescu: this'll never end will it.
mircea_popescu: largest search engine, first ever to use a search box! derpoogle.co!
kakobrekla: > In fact, this opportunity gives Seedcoin a substantial position in the most reputable, popular and advanced derivative trading platform for Bitcoin.
kakobrekla: > We congratulate BTC.sx on their continued success and the global respect they have earned among Bitcoin traders,” says Eddy Travia, Cofounder and Chief Startup Officer of Seedcoin.
moiety: mircea_popescu: i just caught up properly. is mpoe-pr ok? I hope so. it's pretty rough going dealing with shit for a long time and it then it ending unfairly.
mircea_popescu: they should also invest in that casino thing , whatever it was called.
Namworld: I guess in some places, $5 per hour is excellent pay.
mircea_popescu: moiety what's so unfair about it lol. she told teh guy where to stuff it, how many employees get to do that ?
kakobrekla: >With offices in New York City, London and Singapore, BTC.sx has an innovative, intuitive and proprietary platform that allows users to easily trade Bitcoin derivatives.
kakobrekla: brick and mortar, dude.
moiety: ThickAsThieves: if you really want banned, simply go in anything and personally insult people offtopic. its the only thing they ban for, in their words.
Namworld: And the guy knows he's not going to be sued for it.
Namworld: So, well... yeah, I'm not surprised. Those kind of people will be around as long as it works.
moiety: its unfair because of the way that forum is conducted
moiety: imo
bounce: asleep at the wheel then trying to pull a sgt. hardass, wasn't too impressive from what little I saw of it.
mircea_popescu: Namworld good point re the relative safety. i guess many of them aren't unaware of it.
Namworld: It's completly not worth it to sue them, plus people won't do it just for the principle because the person is probably poor and in bad need of money. So why send a message by suing for something so small? (On top of it being close to impossible, re other jurisdiction combined with low amount)
Namworld: I'm sure it's a job for many on the forums/otc.
mircea_popescu: how to make a living as a thirld world flea.
Namworld: Scamming 10 bucks here, 50 there, making new accounts and a few posts and small trades.
Namworld: Some might not be poor. Like a kid, just for the thrill. Scam a little amount.
Namworld: Etc.
mircea_popescu: prolly can clear 10 dollars a day on average, for 8 hour's work, which is just about the worldwide net average salary.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12664 @ 0.00093936 = 11.8961 BTC [-] {2}
ThickAsThieves: <moiety> ThickAsThieves: if you really want banned, simply go in anything and personally insult people offtopic. /// seems a step too far for me, i'll just not visit anymore unless to view a reference from this chan, or the like
Namworld: At the same time, why would they ban scammers? It's not like it's their job to investigate and provide proof of scams and then ban them. That's not how forums work. Plus the whole thing about banning without proof at first.
moiety: it's actually really easy lpace to forget about
moiety: place* ThickAsThieves
mod6: lol @ logs kako
mircea_popescu: question : who was lilo ?
Namworld: I can see why they'd say they only ban people derailing conversations/insulting without proofs. And just put a little scammer tag only once it's proven it's a scam.
mircea_popescu: answer : a mobster and acting boss of the bonanno crime family.
mod6: lilo` was a freenode admin back in the day.
mircea_popescu: ;;google carmine galante
gribble: Carmine Galante - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carmine_Galante>; Carmine Galante - Crime Library: <http://www.crimelibrary.com/photogallery/most-deadly-mobsters.html?curPhoto=2>; The Mob's Greatest Hits: Carmine Galante | National Geographic ...: <http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/channel/inside-the-american-mob/videos/the-mobs-greatest- (1 more message)
mod6: oh nm. heh
mod6: (well, when it was openprojects.net or whatever.)
Namworld: They provide a medium to communicate, they don't protect people from themselves/scammers.
mircea_popescu: Namworld yeah except if you ban people that tell you to get fucked after you deleted a half dozen posts they made ostensibly because "you have to minimise the visibility of moderation" but really because you just as well didn't want their content visible
mod6: was reading through the logs, was like: O_o are they all on LSD today?
mircea_popescu: things start looking a little different suddenly.
ThickAsThieves: Namworld i think your view is too black & white on the matter
mircea_popescu: mod6 we are, but it's unrelated.
mod6: haha
ThickAsThieves: it's not their duty to seek and prove scamming
ThickAsThieves: it is in their financial interest to be ethical though
ThickAsThieves: possibly their legal one too
Namworld: Perhaps, I didn't read about that part of deleting posts complaining about moderators.
ThickAsThieves: would YOU have allowed Garr to keep up his antics?
mircea_popescu: generally speaking this is true. it gets real hard to argue no mens rea after you;ve been shown to have taken positive steps.
Namworld: That's the other issue with forums. If some admins/mods are bad and good at it, you won't see it.
kakobrekla: interestingly there seems to be two groups of people. first think asseters took ze drugs, the second group thinks they them selfs are on something. perhaps this tells a thing.
Namworld: Garr? is he still there under his own account?
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla lol indeed.
nubbins`: vexual hangs in the balance
nubbins`: waiting
ThickAsThieves: yes Nam he is
ThickAsThieves: he has solicited investment after being outted
twizt: mircea_popescu: did they extradite you yet lol
mircea_popescu: totally.
twizt: funny ass thread
ThickAsThieves: mods wanna mod, but dont start with their own rep system for targets?
mircea_popescu: i'm extraditing myself over to the bar in a minute.
ThickAsThieves: the whole thing is obviously hopeless
mircea_popescu: gotta extrudate some shots
twizt: lol
Namworld: I'd probably have left him there, yes. Let people rate each other/sort scammers out/investigate offers. It's trivial to make new accounts anyway. Scammers might as well keep their account with psts but also tainted reputation.
mircea_popescu: mebbe specially rendition some chicks outta their clothes while at it.
twizt: lawyering up atleast?
Namworld: Not like banning them would prevent them from coming back under a new identity.
mircea_popescu: Namworld not giving scammers the ability to make "Self moderated" threads would be one thing.
mircea_popescu: tbh i think it's where mpoe-pr's outlook turned.
mircea_popescu: from "derps derping bitcoin" to "these people are criminals in disguise"
mircea_popescu: at least going by the digests.
Namworld: That should indeed be implemented. So scammers can't leverage an account with lots of post to make a clean thread. Yet again, if you don't look up the guy's history even if the thread is clean...
mircea_popescu: well so then talk about broken windows
mircea_popescu: first, allow any random scammer to moderate hteir own thread
mircea_popescu: after people get used to this, maged can start deleting posts that inconvenience his clients.
mircea_popescu: there you have it. well broked.
ThickAsThieves: the problem is this conversation puts us down to their level, and that pissed me off too
ThickAsThieves: we're here all trying to sort the finer points of why its fucked
ThickAsThieves: it's just fucked
mircea_popescu: well he started it!
Namworld: They already gave a rating system for people to leave feedbacks/make investigation of scam accusation easy. Rating page will list all the wrongs people are accused of.
ThickAsThieves: it needs owners that care about their thing
ThickAsThieves: they do not care
ThickAsThieves: that's that
mircea_popescu: at best, that.
kakobrekla: you can still rate even if you are banned so i use that to leave messages to people
Apocalyptic: you're still banned kako ?
ThickAsThieves: poor kako
kakobrekla: yes thermos did not respond to my email
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.0569 = 0.1138 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: didnt thermos entrust John K with forum coins?
ThickAsThieves: cuz he couldnt hold them himself
Namworld: Honestly, I'd probably just ban people insulting others/derailing threads regardless of how likely they are right or the accused is a scammer.
ThickAsThieves: so heavy, the coins
mircea_popescu: "Venezuela Orders Landlords to List Homes for Sale"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.0569 = 0.3414 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: so much lol coming out of that thing
Namworld: Insult = ban, explanation as to why someone shouldn't be trusted/their offer is bad, okay as long as polite.
ThickAsThieves: Namworld, the forumites are perpetually insulted
mod6: I wanted MPOE-PR to kill that site with fire.
ThickAsThieves: it's a state of being for them
mircea_popescu: "california housing market too expensive for underprivileged groups ? PEOPLE MUST NAO LIST HOUSES FOR SALE PAYMENT IN COWRIES"
mircea_popescu: Namworld that's what you think for lack of experience. what's "an insult" ?
Namworld: Insult as randomly calling people words and swearing at them, not people "feeling" insulted.
mircea_popescu: your mother was a hampster and your father smelt of elderberries.
mircea_popescu: what not ?
ThickAsThieves: yeah but you cant train forumites on what to complain about
ozbot: Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries - YouTube
ThickAsThieves: they have only their feelings
novusordo: "I am insulted that this person is calling out my scam"
ThickAsThieves: your mods would quit
ThickAsThieves: maybe thats why their mods suck
ThickAsThieves: need better pay
ozbot: Leah McGrath Goodman: "I Am Satoshi Nakamoto" | The CoinFront | Bitcoin News
mircea_popescu: o ywah, let's mess with that stupid cunt some more.
Namworld: Calling out a scam is not an insult. It's at best accurate, at worst an erroneous assumptions.
ThickAsThieves: so do you allow false accusations then?
ThickAsThieves: suddenly youre in the business you said you shouldnt be in
ozbot: Twitter / Mircea_Popescu: @truth_eater Hey toots, how's ...
mircea_popescu: pls to keep reminding me nao and again.
Namworld: What business?
ThickAsThieves: <Namworld> At the same time, why would they ban scammers? It's not like it's their job to investigate and provide proof of scams and then ban them. That's not how forums work.
ThickAsThieves: the line blurs at people making scam accusations
ThickAsThieves: it's not quite an insult, but quite insulting
ozbot: YUM Introducing Seagate's New Drive Portfolio.
ThickAsThieves: it's not provable, but also not true discourse if false
ozbot: Alleged Silk Road Creator's Lawyer Denies Bitcoin Is 'Monetary Instrument,' Moves To Drop All Charge
mircea_popescu: they caught on lmao.
Namworld: And I wouldn't ban scam accusations, weither true or false, like I wouldn't ban someone I thought is probably a scammer, weither true or false?
mircea_popescu: "Your honor, we finally got around to reading 2012 Trilema. We humbly submit this is a complete gamechanger."
Namworld: There's a difference between "This guy is a scammer LINK" "This is a scam because X, Y, Z or because I think so" and "You sound like a scammer, get the fuck out you dimwit scum"
ThickAsThieves: is there?
mircea_popescu: really ?
mircea_popescu: is there a difference between "i perceive a difference" and "there is a difference" ?
ozbot: MPEx owner in danger of being extradited to US to face charges
novusordo: uh oh
benkay: jig up?
Namworld: No. But as admin I get to determine what is and what isn't acceptable. Even if the nuance is subtle.
mircea_popescu: wasn't this befoar ?
novusordo: let me post that to reddit without reading it
Namworld: I'm not there to protect people's feeling like I'm not there to protect people from scammers. Just preventing straight up inflamatorry posts without substance.
ThickAsThieves: wow theyre really gonna try and harass you now...
ThickAsThieves: this should last, what, a week at most?
mircea_popescu: Namworld yes well, some people make MPs thing, some other people make Bitcoin thing.
mircea_popescu: do you see a difference there ?
mircea_popescu: if it was JoeDorksForum your position would stand a lot better,
mircea_popescu: especially if that JoeDork was someone with a reputation of any kind.
mircea_popescu: rather than a 20something nobody with nary a clue.
Namworld: There's a reason why I'm not a forum admin tho, hard decisions to make, everyone always butthurt all the time, more bland content and same old being repated you can't read and filter everything.
mircea_popescu: so this has been an exercise in "let's discuss how the salmon would fly if it had no wings" ?
Namworld: It isn't a JoeDork'sForum?
mircea_popescu: ;;google joedorktalk.org
gribble: No matches found.
mircea_popescu: apparently not.
kakobrekla: the problem is just one
kakobrekla: they do not moderate the content but the form
kakobrekla: if it were the other way around
pankkake: bitcointa.lk does not detect the extension :(
Namworld: I wasn't aware it was somehow official. Is the Bitcoin foundation official too?
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla deeper than that : they moderate the content to favour scammers, under a pretense of moderating the form.
mircea_popescu: the gmaxwell sin.
mircea_popescu: Namworld it claims to be. peoples implicit claims are held against them.
Namworld: As such, my point is as valid as if the forum was called theymosandcotalk.org
Namworld: It claims to be a Bitcoin forum like the foundation says Bitcoin Foundation. That people perceive them as official or not, I don't care.
mircea_popescu: well maybe you should run a catholic choir nambla local group then ?
Namworld: A little mention "not official, Bitcoin is decentralized" under the names would be nice, but what if they don't? I ain't going to harass them all day long, now, should I?
Namworld: Why would I run a catholic choir?
mircea_popescu: i have no idea. why would these derps run a bitcoin forum ?
pankkake: I forgot there is https://www.bitcoinforum.com/ too - jurov uses it
Namworld: Because they decided to.
Namworld: If people think they're official, it's because they don't understand Bitcoin, not because they run a Bitcoin forum.
mircea_popescu: "n 1994 Crichton became the only creative artist ever to have works simultaneously charting at No. 1 in television, film, and book sales"
mircea_popescu: jesus that shit's broken
Duffer1: to be fair jurassic park was a good book
nubbins`: that's some bo jackson shit
nubbins`: BO KNOWS
Namworld: Same as if someone thought someone running gunstalk, goldtalk, sportstalk or whatever kind of forum was the official worldwide representative of guns, gold or sports respectively.
Namworld: If someone thing it's official, it's because they have no idea of the substance of the topic, not because the forum owners didn't put enough disclaimers.
Namworld: think*
mircea_popescu: dude get out. if you're running sportstalk.org and ban all discussions of all white players you're going to be drawn and quartered.
mircea_popescu: "o, i'm not racist, it's just how i run my forum which is mine"
Namworld: We're not talking about wether the mods did something wrong or not right now...
tg2: so how many shares of mpex exist?
nubbins`: Namworld: if sportstalk.org predated widespread use of sports, it probably would be quite the hub of activity.
Namworld: Just about them claiming to be somewhat official.
nubbins`: that's distinct from being official, tho
tg2: so satoshidice was listed on mpex before?
tg2: so how did it get sold to private party then
Namworld: Yes, all I'm saying is, if they're biased, okay. But why blame them for people confusing them for being official?
mike_c: it got sold, shareholders on mpex got paid..
Namworld: Did they ever claim to be official? I recall seeing claims of being the largest discussion forum about Bitcoin and that's it.
Duffer1: tg2 probably a trilema article on it
twizt: lol
nubbins`: Namworld not afaik.
tg2: wouldn't all the shareholders have to agree to sell it?
mike_c: most shares on mpex are non-voting.
tg2: yes, but if you owned a share
tg2: and you didn't want to sell it
nubbins`: tough darts
mike_c: and you have a non-voting share..
tg2: just curious about the process
mike_c: same as if google sold itself and you owned shares. nobody cares what you want.
mircea_popescu: there's no process. mpex shares hold no voting rights. nobody asks your opinion on how the comp is run.
mike_c: geez, i am starting to sound like you.
Mats_cd03: you get paid and you go on your merry way
tg2: > The MPEx holders nevertheless received 0.0035 per share,
tg2: i see
Namworld: and that's the point I was talking about. I don't care about people believing them to be official because of that. It's not like it's their problem or anyone's to go put disclaimers on everything so people don't have to think and just follow directions.
tg2: how difficult is it to get listed on mpex?
mircea_popescu: that depends. most derpcorps find it impossible.
tg2: yet pptapr and giga no issues?
Namworld: Not too hard I suppose, but yeah, what Mircea said.
mircea_popescu: otherwise kakobrekla asciilifeform etc could comment on it
Namworld: It's not like the requirements are too much or too hard to meet.
Namworld: It's that most scams fail to even come close to meet those requirements.
tg2: so if the dice buyout was kosher, ie: all the buyers got their fair value for their shares, why is SEC sniffing around for that corp in particular?
Namworld: Because some people wanted to keep shares/complained?
benkay: MPEx is the big target.
Namworld: I suppose especially those who bought from the slices of shares over IPO prices.
tg2: things like that happen though in regular companies that are listed, private party has an interest, buys all the shares above market, non-voting can't do much about it
Namworld: Because sell price way under IPO price, yet all MPEx shareholders got like 3x the price per share such they they'd get over the initial IPO price at the expense of private shareholders.
Namworld: Yet this excellent deal for MPEx holders didn't please people who bought way over IPO price.
mircea_popescu: tg2 we never got to know what they actually wanted because they could never figure how to express themselves.
mircea_popescu: the simile would be a down syndrome kid walking into a shop going GLEEEERHRHRHR!!
Namworld: Afaik, I think it was not Erik that sold shares over IPO, but the offer was other shareholders that wanted to sell at those high prices?
mircea_popescu: shop owner goes hey! if you want to buy sometrhing, go like this, if you want to borrow something, go like this
mircea_popescu: kid goes GLEEEERHRHRHR!!
Namworld: or something to that effect.
mircea_popescu: eventually shop owner calls the special down syndrome kid number to have the kid removed from the premises.
ThickAsThieves: http://blog.coinbase.com/post/81407694500/update-on-coinbase-data-security TLDR: There is nothing wrong with our system, but we fixed it
mircea_popescu: hopefully they find someone in new york whose brain works and they patch it up.
mircea_popescu: alternatively, they get a pitchfork mob going, and i'll have to hire a security detail around the shop.
mircea_popescu: either way, life.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves such fucktards with this bs. just won't learn will they.
Namworld: Either way, people butthurt about buying too high from the bigger shareholders who sold when the price was high.
Namworld: If I recall right, I bought afterward, when price was much lower, not long before SD sold.
Namworld: and all holders on MPEx got a very good deal in that sale.
tg2: SEC isn't really used ot asking nicely
tg2: I know people involved in the awesomepennystocks.com fiasco
tg2: sledgehammer approach
tg2: take houses, take cars, indict everybody
mircea_popescu: tough tits for them. i was not kidding when i said their future is at stake. it is.
mircea_popescu: they wanna take a crap all over it, no big deal really.
Namworld: Basically, contract was respected. People are mad about the SD deal because they can't verify anything about the sale. They bought at a high price and claim Erik sold to "himself" for low after selling some shares for a very high price or other such accusations.
mircea_popescu: we give bitcoin to the russian-ec or to the chinese-ec or to the cyprus-ec
Namworld: Now, if they could prove that, the story would be different.
mircea_popescu: whoever finds a non-down syndrome kid first wins.
tg2: that's a tough accusation to clear
mircea_popescu: tis a race.
tg2: but yeah it does open the door to fukc al ot of people when you pull strings on both sides
tg2: ie: oh profits are down on dice..."
tg2: shares drop
tg2: -> buy back
tg2: that kind of stuff
Namworld: But without proof, contract was respected, shareholders got a great deal, and people are complaining about buying high before profits diminished and price going much lower.
tg2: "great deal"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24350 @ 0.00093998 = 22.8885 BTC [+]
mike_c: getting bought out well above market price is a great deal.
tg2: hard to calculate who got the great deal
tg2: and who didn't
mircea_popescu: afaik there was this longstanding theory that erik is betting with himself. i never could see any proof for it, people were welcome to find it etc.
tg2: but in general yes
ozbot: The question of the year in BTC pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: hardly any sort of news.
Namworld: They get 1/2 instead of 1/6th of what they paid because MPEx shareholders got about 3x too much for what the sale price was.
Namworld: They got like .0032 instead of ~0.0011 I think as the sale price commanded.
tg2: how much was bought over ipo
tg2: presumably it was sold by vorhees
tg2: then it deflated
Namworld: 10 million at 0.0022 and 0.0027 I think it was, in two slices. Or was it 3?
tg2: then bought back at "ipo" price
Namworld: The IPO was lower than the price holders got.
tg2: how high did it climb after ipo
Namworld: People complained because new shares were put up and sold in the 0.004-0.006 range if I recall right, for about 5 million shares?
Namworld: Afaik it was not Voorhees' I think, just one of the private shareholder selling. I suppose accusations come from people who bought then.
ThickAsThieves: it was actually the first thing i ever did in bitcoin communication, sent a msg to erik asking how it could be proven he wasnt stealing
ThickAsThieves: it's why i made a forum account
mircea_popescu: what did he say ?
ThickAsThieves: lemme find it
Namworld: They got the short end of the stick, but is it because a scam occured? Contract was respected and outperformed. They bought at the high.
Namworld: Now without proof Erik did anything wrong... what are you to do?
tg2: ultimately somebody had to buy above 'value'
tg2: whether or not erik did anything to deflate or inflate that value
tg2: is really the only way he could be guilty of anything
mircea_popescu: generally, btc stocks follow a hump pattern
mircea_popescu: asicminer went from .1 to 5 then to .5
ThickAsThieves: "What could stop SatoshiDice.com from using it's own profit pool to place bets on it's own site to hide profits from shareholders?
ThickAsThieves: Am I missing something about the setup that prevents this?"
ThickAsThieves: How would this hide profits from shareholders? It would do the opposite... it would inflate the site's earnings (because 1.9% of all bets becomes site profit) and then would require that the site pay shareholders -more- than they should legitimately have.
ThickAsThieves: For example, if I took 10 btc of SD earnings and rebet it over and over and over, eventually it would all be owned to the shareholders on mpex because they would see that the site had xxxxxxx in bets and xxxxxxx in profit owed to them.
ThickAsThieves: Does that answer the question?
mircea_popescu: many children, many people with no training or much understanding, lot of hype.
Namworld: A dose of mob justice, with unproven guiltyness??
tg2: yeah its pretty clear when you use fixed wallets
ThickAsThieves: "Yes, thank you Smiley
ThickAsThieves: I thought I had answered my own question after I sent my message to you. I thought your answer was going to be "Because all of the coins are stored in the public addresses on the home page, and everyone would see we were filtering out money". Do the coins all stay in the wallets posted on the home page (until dividends are paid), or do they get moved around in storage?
ThickAsThieves: Your answer makes sense though.
ThickAsThieves: Thanks again! "
tg2: to see where money and bets are going
ThickAsThieves: "The coins are not stored on the public addresses shown on the homepage. They go into a secret chamber buried underneath the arctic circle Wink
ThickAsThieves: that's it
tg2: the only way to counterplay would be to know the private keys in advance
tg2: but you'd see the house % going down
ThickAsThieves: from January 2013
Namworld: Well to be fair, it's not a proof of innocence. But justice isn't supposed to work that way. It's not supposed to be guilty until proven innocent.
tg2: anybody working on a distirbuted-trust system for these types of scenarios?
tg2: where every voting shareholder gets a proportionate, verifyable voting mechanism?
mircea_popescu: tg2 anyway, you can take the message upstairs. "guy actually said you either play ball or he buries you, it seems improbable but he does have a history of doing exactly that."
tg2: I knew somebodyw as working on a wallet-splitter where you sent to an address and it split it by a fixed % and sent back out to the other x addresses
tg2: but you still ahve to trust the service
Namworld: I'm not sure how such a system would work to actually prevent fraud. Unless that system had exclusive amangement of funds. But then running a business would be close of impossible if all money spent needs to be approved by shareholders.
tg2: yeah I think the reality is it would be possible
Namworld: Plus it still doesn't prevent fraud...
Namworld: Assuming majority is in on the fraud...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26350 @ 0.00093815 = 24.7203 BTC [-] {2}
tg2: but yeah ultimately it comes back to the same issue where the people running the business have to maek hte decisions
domsch: Hey guys, Dom here. I’m in the process of setting up a few businesses and am actively involved in a few crypto-hubs. Just wanted to hang out in a few IRC channels to talk with people from the space.
tg2: I guess there just needs to be more liability there
tg2: which is sort of why the SEC was created in the first place
benkay: what kinda biz, domsch?
kakobrekla: domsch prolly a good call.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19731 @ 0.00093998 = 18.5467 BTC [+]
domsch: Crypto-related. We are mostly concerned on the educational aspects of the space and are creating several tools that are there to add liquidity to the market and help users embrace the new technology (not just bitcoin of course) in their every day life.
benkay: add liquidity how?
benkay: where's the overlap between "educational aspects" and "tools to add liquidity"?
ozbot: Bitcoin POS Terminal - Imgur
twizt thinks its time for a bunch of big words to be used, while making little to no practical sense
benkay: well that's better than a QR sticker.
domsch: educating and approaching the average consumer goes hand in hand.
domsch: and yes, it definitely is lol
Namworld: There's already large processors offering service plus conversion plus daily bank deposit for 1% fee.
ThickAsThieves: tell those BitcoinBigfoot guys that Dom
ThickAsThieves: they make "educational" brochures filled with logos
Namworld: But this little device is actually quite elegant.
benkay: bitcoin consumer tech, man.
benkay: just say no.
twizt: bro for something that big
twizt: it better play hd movies
ThickAsThieves: ascii porn at least
mircea_popescu: domsch who's "we" ?
benkay: .asciibait
twizt: that thing looks as big as a mac mini
twizt: lol
domsch: yes I really like what Bigfoot is doing. I don’t think that anyone in this space can be treated as a competitor (in broad perspective of course) - we are mostly all after the same and pursue the same ideals.
kakobrekla: its not meant to be carried around eh
mircea_popescu: dude. who. is. we.
benkay: you're all after the same thing but not competitors?
benkay: what?
domsch: me and my team. I’m not alone. We are around 7 people right now.
twizt: we is me
mircea_popescu: do you have a name ?
Namworld: A mac mini? This thing looks smaller than a small computer fan. How small is a mac mini?
twizt: I am we
mircea_popescu: dominik schiener sez your client. that you ?
domsch: yep.
mircea_popescu: you the 17yo italian guy with fileyy / 360box game hacks ?
kakobrekla: the name sounds german
domsch: I am actually 18. And I’m german.
mircea_popescu: europe. gets complicated.
mircea_popescu: ok. get in the wot, and read this :
domsch: and I have never owned an xbox.
ozbot: Dominik Schiener - AngelList
ozbot: Bitcoin is creating a whole new set of problems pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: and i do mean read it.
domsch: ok hold on
mircea_popescu: take your time.
twizt: 18 years old developing hardware.. or ur professors doing it?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 250 @ 0.00085015 = 0.2125 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.0444 = 0.222 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1000 @ 0.00085 = 0.85 BTC [-]
domsch: Good read. And I definitely agree with you on some of the aspects that young people (of my age, younger or older) are in this space to grasp an opportunity - these are the people that don’t see the future, the long-term benefit. These are the people that are there to fuck you in the ass when they see the slightest chance to get away with a few bucks.
benkay: what what, in the butt
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05739997 = 0.1148 BTC [+]
domsch: I can tell you a personal story, how I tried to run my first startup, (a performance based advertising network, known as CPA = Cost Per Action) and how I was scammed out of my last $1000 and had to work over the summer as a construction worker to get enough money to continue working on the project.
domsch: I am not in this space to make a buck and seize every tiny opportunity, or even try to scam people. I’m here for the bigger picture. I may be young, I may be dumb - but I am trying.
benkay: ;;google trilema variety speak
gribble: You're gonna have to learn that variety speak pe Trilema - Un blog ...: <http://trilema.com/2013/youre-gonna-have-to-learn-that-variety-speak/>; Pro idiotas, which obviously means, people who have ... - Trilema: <http://trilema.com/2014/pro-idiotas-which-obviously-means-people-who-have-ideas-ie-idiots/>; The Family pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/2013/the- (1 more message)
benkay: "nobody knows how to make movies, but there are some people who know how to not make movies"
benkay: maybe reconsider the point-of-sale angle, sir.
mircea_popescu: domsch just don't let that grasping fuck you over.
mircea_popescu: a 50yo that fucks up is therefore losing his key for ages 51-70 or w/e
mircea_popescu: a 18yo that fucks up is losing his key for all time. you're risking a lot more than the 50yo, who already fucked the girls, drank the meads, got bored.
mircea_popescu: and in this space, fucking up is extremely easy. just ask danny.
mircea_popescu: or charlie or whoever.
mircea_popescu: benkay eh, he can't argue everything simultaneously. first let him you know... introduce it.
twizt: whos danny
mircea_popescu: danny "cyprus" brewster.
Namworld: domsch, so many young people with your mindset came around to do BTC services/business, only to have everything go down because of the tiniest mistake. BTC doesn't forgive, hackers don't forgive. Smallest error can doom you.
twizt: what company?
Namworld: High failure/scam ratio.
mircea_popescu: twbt newbie.
mircea_popescu: twizt i mean
twizt: neo bee?
twizt: it fucked up already? lol
mircea_popescu: if you prefer the cyrillics spelling
domsch: yeh I definitely understand where this is coming from. As people say: “It doesn’t matter what your idea is, it only mattes who you know.” That’s why I’m trying to be surrounded by the right guys. I am working on the networkign right now and meet the right people that have been there, done it.
mircea_popescu: aite, dun worry about it.
twizt: i wonder how much money neobee wasted on all that promotional crap
twizt: what are their sales?
twizt: lol
domsch: and don’t worry. I won#t be the Chief Compliance Officer, President, CEO, developer and support staff of this project lol
mike_c: what will you be?
ThickAsThieves: "we" of course!
twizt: I shall be we
twizt: gdammit ThickAsThieves
ThickAsThieves: it is written
twizt: beat me to it
domsch: an entrepreneur.
ThickAsThieves: a thought leader
twizt: We have written it, I shall be done
ThickAsThieves: is there an english word for entrepreneur, it's annoying
ThickAsThieves: business man
mike_c: it would be better at this stage to attach yourself to a more experienced entrepreneur.
nubbins`: "entrepreneur" :D
twizt: BMEN
nubbins`: is there an english word for restaurant? :D
domsch: in the early days of a startup titles don’t matter anyways as we still have to prove all of the hypothesis and actually get a working model up and running. So all these fancy titles are useless. It’s about getting shit done.
thestringpuller: Man i love this channel
twizt: drive thru nubbins
thestringpuller: smarter over time
mike_c: domsch: that is bs. somebody is in charge.
thestringpuller: rather than the general trend of the internet to become less intelligent over time
pLambert: nubbins`: diner
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.05658333 = 0.3395 BTC [-] {2}
twizt: domsch: all im reading is canned rhetroic lol
twizt: you sound too sales pitchy
nubbins`: pLambert: that's french too
twizt: (in my mental voice)
pLambert: eatery?
nubbins`: ehhh.
nubbins`: jim bob's rib hole is an eatery
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06869732 = 0.1374 BTC [+]
nubbins`: different from a restaurant :D
thestringpuller: domsch: "Right and wrong are just words. It doesn't matter who you know or what you say. What matters...is what you do."
mike_c: it would be better to learn by attaching yourself to someone experienced. this is a bad industry to learn by failure for the reasons already mentioned.
domsch: there is definitely someone in charge. But what’s the point of all the titles in the early days?
pLambert: food-place
thestringpuller: mike_c: you can learn by failure via spectating
mike_c: to a degree. you still must get in the trenches to really learn.
domsch: great quote
thestringpuller: mike_c: true, you will never be able to fully comprehend the defense strategy against a large DDoS without having experienced it like say mircea_popescu
mike_c: or by working for mp when it happens.
truffles: <thestringpuller> u sure its him or he's paying some minions
thestringpuller: paying minions to DDoS him?
truffles: of expertise
ThickAsThieves: <twizt> you sound too sales pitchy /// methinks youre attacking the kid a bit too prematurely
thestringpuller: ThickAsThieves always the nice guy
ThickAsThieves: at least let him fuckup for himself before declaring him a fuckup
ThickAsThieves: he's here aint he?
truffles: noisy spectators get a bad rap itc
mircea_popescu: <twizt> i wonder how much money neobee wasted on all that promotional crap << me too. but it doesn't seem like theres ever going to be a report.
mircea_popescu: <thestringpuller> smarter over time << word. this shit sharpens under my very eyes. it's... uncanny.
mircea_popescu: whoa look at that, truffles still exists ?! when did that happen.
truffles: i happen all the time dood
mircea_popescu: dood eh ? so what were you in for these past few months ? larceny ? truculence ?
pankkake: promo crap, oracle license, building
truffles: u want to know why i left n returned just ask
truffles: im bored
thestringpuller: lol oracle license
thestringpuller: mpex doesn't even use oracle...
pankkake: MP is the oracle
truffles: i enjoy poking at u mp cuz others dont seem to dare :D
mircea_popescu: yeah but you suck at it.
thestringpuller: what about tiberius?
truffles: i wouldnt wanna be good at that nonetheless
truffles: has ur english improved mp?
thestringpuller: ;;seen nanotube
gribble: nanotube was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 day, 2 hours, 5 minutes, and 8 seconds ago: <nanotube> benkay: the implication would be that output would be sorted by volume? :)
truffles: ill wait for the spam n check it out i gues
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05699999 = 0.114 BTC [+] {2}
twizt: i didnt say he was a fuck up lol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.0561 = 0.1683 BTC [-] {2}
truffles: u said mp's a fuck up?
truffles: didnt say that*..
twizt: truffles: talking abt domsch
truffles: ofc some1 else ok
twizt: mysql server is free who need a oracle lisence?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.05699999 = 0.171 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.0453 = 0.1359 BTC [+] {3}
twizt: open question: anyone know how i can pull the kraken spot price using their api? where do I insert the symbol/pair on the url to retrieve the price?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.05699999 = 0.171 BTC [+] {3}
domsch: I wouldn’t say fuck-up. I am rather trying to participate and be actively involved.
twizt: im not calling u a fuckup lol
twizt: chill
truffles: domsch what do u do?
twizt: <3 all around
thestringpuller: domsch: lurk first. there will always be work to do. learn to do the work first tho
twizt: ^^
truffles: hint hint dont step on toes
twizt: lol truffles
twizt: nah fuck that burn bridges domsch
domsch: one of the products http://imgur.com/a/pVsEJ we have have been working on. But there is more to come.
domsch: and yes, lurking, reading and listening to the mistakes of others is probably the only way to be prepared for this.
truffles: only way..
truffles: so what is this
steven-__: very nice unit how much ?
pankkake: so it's a nfc payment terminal?
thestringpuller: looks like it uses QR codes too
pankkake: oh right
pankkake: pretty cool, very simple design
domsch: as a young kid that is just getting started, doing the above is pretty much the “only way” to prepare oneself. A problem that I have seen in the past is that a lot of people are reluctant to work with youngsters like me - which I do really understand.
truffles: do u look scary?
domsch: part of that is why it’s great that Internet and Bitcoin allows people to stay anonymous for some time and just convince the other person through words and their abilities.
truffles: if one can get the job done..
cazalla: he's got those shrem eyebrows that make you think twice
thestringpuller: domsch: you said "we" you don't have niggas?
thestringpuller: where's your crew?
domsch: haha - no I hope I don’t. But it’s most stereotypes with locals. I live in the Alps and people around here are process driven: You go to school, college, then you work for someone for a ffew years and ONLY then you can consider running the show.
twizt: we is me
gx: anyone with some BTC twitter followers wanna help a brother out with a retweet? trying to get our beta update out to the public. pm me if interested, thx. sex and drugs in return
twizt: lolol
domsch: and yes, this is an NFS terminal. They are not ready for serial production yet as we will do some tests in Zurich sometime soon.
domsch: NFC*
twizt: domsch check ur pm
truffles: oh u dont think any1 will copy it huh
domsch: ou I definitely do - we will open-source it all.
domsch: this is a gadget supposed to be there for the public use - it is there to add value, not generate money.
truffles: so its for free?
gx: https://twitter.com/Coinigy/status/451094162037673984 <- fuck it. i dont understand social media. share it if you care
ozbot: Twitter / Coinigy: Coinigy Beta Update & ...
khersonus: domsch: gpl/bsd/something else?
truffles: if u paint it black it could be like a little black box :D
kakobrekla: >We Need Your Help
kakobrekla: As with any new startup, exposure and early adoption are the keys to success. Please help us out by telling your friends, liking our Facebook page and following us on twitter.
domsch: all the CAD files + software will be free. But if you want to buy the actual unit (meaning already produced) you’ll have to pay. This is for those who don#t have access to a 3d printer and don’t want to go through the hassle.
kakobrekla: impressions.
gx: kakobrekla is there something wrong with that line?
kakobrekla: well unless this is a faucet, then no
truffles: domsch ok, sounds interesting gl
kakobrekla: an exchange does not need facebook likes, it needs market makers, for example. and those arent on facebook.
gx: kakobrekla we're not an exchange.
gx: reading comprehension goes a long way nowadays.
kakobrekla: faucet then
kakobrekla: dunno i would say you faild to convey the message
truffles: is the bitcoin message board down or something?
domsch: thanks a lot truffles.
gx: ok, thanks for the constructive criticism, any idea what we could do to improve on conveying the message?
khersonus: "less than 20s of delay. This number will be lowered in time to only a few seconds." << I don't think I'd call that "low latency"
kakobrekla: when i open that link
kakobrekla: i get about 1000 px of white space first
kakobrekla: would be a good place to write "WE DO <this>"
kakobrekla: or "WE ARE <this>" or whatever
gx: which link specifically?
ozbot: Coinigy Beta Update & Screenshots
gx: the link is a copy of the email blast we just sent out
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 225 @ 0.00581941 = 1.3094 BTC [+] {6}
gx: are you on mobile perchance
kakobrekla: its what you gave me.
gx: i understand, i was curious if you were getting whitespace on coinigy.com vs the link i gave you
gx: i'm not getting whitespace so i'm just inquiring
kakobrekla: anyway, pictures are bad
kakobrekla: you are not in photography biz
kakobrekla: as far as i can tell
kakobrekla: so far
gx: clearly not
gx: bad in what respect
gx: are you positive you're not looking at this on a tandy?
gx: ;)
truffles: so coinigy is the name?
kakobrekla: whatever, free advice ends here.
gx: correct. did we not convey the name properly?
truffles: coinigy?
gx: kakobrekla i'm just ribbing you a little bit
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 2 @ 0.05699999 = 0.114 BTC [+]
truffles: srsly?
truffles wants to go to all the btc startups and shake em
gx: truffles seriously? is that rhetorical? in which case, no- that's not the name.
truffles: what is the name
gx: we've been tossing some ideas around, such as MPEZ or HAVELOX. but they're not rolling off the tongue.
truffles: those sound a lot better though
gx: regardless, appreciate the feedback, as negative as it's been :)
truffles: if its great, i wont say one bad word
bounce: tandycoin
gx: can't improve without constructive criticism. so far apparently there's whitespace, the pictures are shit, and the name sucks
kakobrekla: i dont see any pictures so whatever content you got there is gone
truffles: dude that name is turrble
rithm: derp
gx: there's a pronunciation guide for you oin coinigy.com
gx: you racist bastard :)
kakobrekla: so this is aka btcrt
TomServo: first indicator that it's no good.
kakobrekla: or rtbtc
kakobrekla: or what is it
truffles: if u have great product none will care
pankkake: maybe because I'm French, coinigy is hard to pronounce
rithm: what is coinigy
truffles: so make it great
rithm: why are we calling people nigy's
phf`: gx: just fyi mac speech synth pronounces it as "coy-niggy"
kakobrekla: well, you have a presence on irc so props for that.
gx: kakobrekla regarding latency, the <20s is a catchall as not all exchanges offer websockets support. so we're forced to poll.
pankkake: google translate says coy niggy too
kakobrekla: what is the biz model of this?
truffles: lol at these pronounciations
twizt: fees kako
rithm: i'm not a coy nigger
kakobrekla: twizt you cant just say 'fees' and think you are done explaining
rithm: this site has upset me.
gx: kakobrekla users purchase credits.
rithm runs off to eat watermelon
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17200 @ 0.00093771 = 16.1286 BTC [-] {3}
kakobrekla: credits , like a monthly subscription or ?
gx: credits are good for manual and auto trades
kakobrekla: so pay as you go
gx: not monthly, credits that are banked in your account, and are used up when you place a trade through the system
thestringpuller: damn mpoe is going to crash down before divs are paid
kakobrekla: yes, pay as you go.
mike_c: !t m mpoe
assbot: Some are born to endless night.
thestringpuller: !t m s.mpoe
assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00093761 / 0.00094535 / 0.00095556 (1383881 shares, 1,308.25 BTC), 7D: 0.00092844 / 0.00094327 / 0.00095866 (6785318 shares, 6,400.43 BTC), 30D: 0.000745 / 0.00087641 / 0.00096 (29567602 shares, 25,913.37 BTC)
truffles: "We've been purposely vague up until this point as to what exactly Coinigy is, and how it works. " good stuff
kakobrekla: >NOW COMPATIBLE WITH EVERY MAJOR CRYPTOCURRENCY EXCHANGE
kakobrekla: you know wouldnt hurt to list those
TomServo: truffles: exactly where I stopped reading.
kakobrekla: i have no idea what standards you got to apply for 'major'
truffles: im trying to continue
truffles: looked at pics though
kakobrekla: anyway time is out.
truffles: this is tldr stuff
truffles: dude i can shorten this up for u
gx: it's an email blast that we sent to our subscribers, it's not meant to be short nor tldr
thestringpuller: damn stop wasting kako's time
thestringpuller: he has like
thestringpuller: stuff to do
thestringpuller: ask kako .01 btc / answer
truffles: its kinda bad was offering free help u know
gx: regardless, we're still in alpha, we're not listing the specific exchanges although they can be seen in the screenshots.
gx: i appreciate any help- and i expected criticism. main thing is just trying to get the word out.
truffles: anyways it nice to see creativity
thestringpuller: okay don't listen gx
thestringpuller: get the word out
thestringpuller: have a bunch of people use your product
thestringpuller: then it fails for the smallest reason
thestringpuller: then everyone hates you
truffles: i wont hate u
thestringpuller: truffles won't hate you
gx: i don't care if anyone hates me, i pasted it here for a reason, harshest critics :)
truffles: i think theyre being nice though
thestringpuller: gx hate is a dumb word, lets use distrust instead
truffles: u trust him now then
thestringpuller: if people distrust you, then you have no foundation at all, and getting this "word out" is meaningless
gx: understandable. we'll be updating the site with more information about us, including shoe pics, SSNs, etc soon.
mike_c: ;;gettrust gx
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user mike_c to user gx: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=mike_c&dest=gx | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=gx | Rated since: Sat May 25 10:25:06 2013
twizt: lol
rithm: ;;ident
gribble: Nick 'rithm', with hostmask 'rithm!~rithm@unaffiliated/rithm', is identified as user 'rithm', with GPG key id None, key fingerprint None, and bitcoin address 113UToFpzVkTHnavtNkUJtjdFQW2BU5xLW
rithm: no trust here either gx
rithm: don't feel bad
gx: you guys are really crushing my soul right now.
twizt: dude who cares look at ur [m
twizt: pm*
twizt: lol
truffles: u can always start over
mircea_popescu: gx so who might you be ?
gx: mircea_popescu i'm just a coder with ambition, that's all. and i've done trades on otc, just not under this nick
thestringpuller: ;;gettrust gx
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user gx: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=thestringpuller&dest=gx | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=gx | Rated since: Sat May 25 10:25:06 2013
mircea_popescu: well under which nick ?
thestringpuller: This user is currently NOT AUTHENTICATED. This user has not authenticated for more than 311 days. If you are currently talking to someone who claims to be this person, you may be talking to an impostor and scammer.
gx: i'm trying to remember, it was a damn long time ago
mircea_popescu: so then nm that neh ?
mircea_popescu: anyway. so you're a coder with ambition. got a name ?
gx: sure, my name is william kehl. add me to your untrusted sources file :)
mircea_popescu: phf` lmao that's pretty kickass a name
ozbot: Missouri University of Science and Technology
gx: anyways. my otc nick wouldve been gxdia or guardia, guess i didnt deal with that. maybe i'm thinking of litecoin otc
gx: if that exists
mircea_popescu: afaik it does not.
rithm: ;;gpg info guardia
gribble: No such user registered.
rithm: ;;gpg info gxdia
gribble: No such user registered.
thestringpuller: ;;gpg info gx
gribble: User 'gx', with keyid None, fingerprint None, and bitcoin address 14nQyQz1mxgPTmq7BGTQpgtT6mGdmsikeD, registered on Sat May 25 09:20:22 2013, last authed on Sat May 25 06:20:22 2013. http://b-otc.com/vg?nick=gx . Currently not authenticated.
rithm: bam
gx: guess not- i've bought and sold via irc though. a few years ago. guess i'll register with otc and then all will be well
mircea_popescu: o look TomServo lives. /me waves
rithm: ;;balance 14nQyQz1mxgPTmq7BGTQpgtT6mGdmsikeD
gx: since having an otc account is some standard of trust, lmao
rithm: you guys are stalkers sheesh
thestringpuller: WoT works tho...
TomServo: mircea_popescu: Ahoy!
thestringpuller: ;;gettrust Athero
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user Athero: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=thestringpuller&dest=Athero | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=Athero | Rated since: never
thestringpuller: ;;gettrust Aethero
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user Aethero: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 3 via 2 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=thestringpuller&dest=Aethero | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=Aethero | Rated since: Wed May 2 19:24:52 2012
rithm: aethero
rithm: like the butterfly
rithm: it's a genus or a species i do not reminder
mircea_popescu: this log is too short. pls thestringpuller to halp elongating ty.
rithm: lepidoptera was his girl
mircea_popescu: gx ok so you're an ambitious coder by the name of kehl, and you did what ?
mircea_popescu: some sort of autotrader script or am i not following ?
gx: metrics and autotrading script that ties into multiple exchanges, yes.
gx: and i'm still digging up my otc account
gx: i swear i have one
mircea_popescu: you have any sort of relevant background ? like being a quant or a latency tech or something ?
gx: ctrl+f'ing all over the place
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 19 @ 0.58549129 = 11.1243 BTC [-] {10}
gx: mircea_popescu i'm just a coder, but my biz partner has experience with quant and we have advisors who are daytraders
mircea_popescu: well, lotsa new people on here these days, pretty cool.
gx: i've been idling in here for quite awhile, just dont speak up much
mircea_popescu: either that or you're significantly brighter than the average and just got lucky.
mircea_popescu: anyway. i gotta go now to stand trial as a witness in a civil proceeding @ a local bar, so.
mircea_popescu: plz don't break bitcoin while i
mircea_popescu: 'm gone.
gx: enjoy
mircea_popescu: i wanna be here to liveblog it when it happens.
diametric: so, i'm sifting through the scrollback. some kind of daytrading tool coming out soon?
gx: i also have to bow out for some beers, it's been a pleasure, thanks for the lambasting everyone
gx: ;) hugz
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.068 = 0.476 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 25 @ 0.0075 = 0.1875 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 137 @ 0.0075 = 1.0275 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06869732 = 0.3435 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 55019 @ 0.00094238 = 51.8488 BTC [+] {5}
benkay: did i hear truffles is back?
benkay: truffles is back, all these new faces
benkay: something's fishy.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06700001 = 0.201 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 300 @ 0.00083501 = 0.2505 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 317 @ 0.000835 = 0.2647 BTC [-] {4}
zacm: WOW mpex in bloomberg
arizona: yessiree
tg2: Dun dun dunnnn
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 81 @ 0.00313709 = 0.2541 BTC [-] {7}
benkay: not the old news?
benkay: or very much the old news.
dexX7: live? link?
ozbot: mpex - Bloomberg Search
dexX7: 21 Mar 2014?
benkay: silly socks are silly, trolling with old news
dexX7: yea
benkay: zacm, arizona, tg2
benkay: no subtlety, these guys.
dexX7: i think zacm is legit, have seen him in #bitfunder for a long time
benkay: ah well bitfunder == legit then nooz to me
tg2: what about arizona
tg2: oic, sock accuasations from benkay - ahem
tg2: ;;gpg eauth tg2
gribble: Request successful for user tg2, hostmask tg2!~tg2@205.204.66.35. Get your encrypted OTP from http://bitcoin-otc.com/otps/31FAA963C3333333
benkay: well, 'sock'
benkay: who are you again?
tg2: ;;gpg everify freenode:#bitcoin-otc:288632a9b19b898d49bd8da2a1e442d4f3aac51b71cde6fc8d4609ae
gribble: You are now authenticated for user tg2 with key 31FAA963C3333333
pankkake: zacm is a legit idiot, yes
tg2: benkay why u calling me a sock
tg2: sock for who
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29050 @ 0.00094378 = 27.4168 BTC [+] {2}
tg2: which secret agenda am I pushing here lol
benkay: u savvy scare quotes?
tg2: scare for what?
benkay: implies b) c) or d) definitions for word
benkay: or maybe just a shibboleth
benkay: hard to tell on the internet.
benkay: hello?
benkay: this is dog.
tg2: you skipped your clozaril regimen?
assbot: Last 8 lines bashed and pending review. (http://dpaste.com/1767942/plain/)
benkay: !b 8
KRS-One: .bait
tg2: > implying
KRS-One: T'sup nubbins.
pankkake: nice dress
nubbins`: having a business meeting :0
benkay: well get off irc! how rude.
tg2: > business meeting is on irc
zacm: hm
zacm: so this is disconcerting to see the lemmings on bitcointalk cheer on us gov action against mpex people. bitcoin community must be eagerly anticipating govcoin i guess
benkay: what, govcoin?
zacm: the article is from 2014-03-19 but I only saw it today from this bitcointalk post https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=553092.0
benkay: not three years of 'forum sucks, mpex at least isn't a scam' getting under everyone's skin?
dexX7: ah okay
dexX7: yea it's kinda old news
zacm: benkay, or whatever the federally approved crypto ends up being...
tg2: federally approved lol
dexX7: there is another thread opened by mpoe-pr
benkay: o there's a new photo of mircea_popescu
ozbot: Interacting with fiat institutions [such as the SEC], a guide
tg2: mpoe-pr lol
pankkake: that pic is horrible. *saves*
tg2: has anybody put any thought into a bitcoin insurance company?
tg2: not in the sense that "oh we'll replace your bitcoins if they get stolen or lost" type of stuff
dexX7: but?
tg2: but for insuring companies that are traded
neilol: like a credit default swap
neilol: i guess
dexX7: ah
neilol: need a derivative market
tg2: would make sense
tg2: you'd have to evaluate the business being insured
neilol: might be tough to get someone to take the other side
tg2: figure out a premium that makes sense
benkay: which companies would you insure, tg2 ?
dexX7: well, there are afaik a few who want to open an insurance serivce.. even this twobitsidiot
tg2: any companies, they companies would pay the insurance as a sign of faith against insolvency
dexX7: and reddit rumors mentioned a "big player"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.066 = 0.198 BTC [-]
benkay: well given that 99% of 'bitcoin companies' are barely concealed scams, the thing doesn't fly unless you can point at a potential customer that's not a scam.
neilol: well SecondMarket CEO said that some large insurance companies were approaching him looking to create products around btc
tg2: maybe not like insurance, but instead a certification
neilol: like an auditor
neilol: someone audited coinbase
dexX7: ah, i think that was what i meant, neilol
tg2: well not exactly
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.0655 = 0.4585 BTC [-] {2}
neilol: its definitely a business
turbo_ac100: There is a working bitbet search plugin on mycroft now (no ref :P). The 2nd hit is the right one. For it to make sense it should be made auto-discoverable though. Like so https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/Add-ons/Creating_OpenSearch_plugins_for_Firefox#Autodiscovery_of_search_plugins
tg2: there would be certification requirements
tg2: like proving that you are solvent every so often
tg2: proving that you follow certain guidelines
dignork: neilol, but audit was strictly technical, keys safety etc.
tg2: proving that certain key individuals are known identities
tg2: and who have actual real-world assets
tg2: without having them divulge that
tg2: but if they break their certification
tg2: everybody knows right away
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33503 @ 0.00094352 = 31.6108 BTC [-] {2}
tg2: a hybrid bond/certification system
neilol: yeah dignork you're right. I'm thinking something like a KPMG or Deloitte would do
benkay: seems a bit premature. there's barely anyone to trust in the first place, much less people in whom one can trust instead of actually trusting your counterparty.
neilol: full rip through of financials, accounts, investory etc and certify books match real life
tg2: no but I think that now would be time for that
benkay: neilol: let's just get someone who's not an MPEx scam to issue financials first before we worry about auditing those financials, eh?
neilol: haha
mike_c: he's not kidding.
benkay: tg2: so start building some trust. run that operation.
tg2: it allows exchanges to prove to a certain degree of trust that that they are solvent without having to show their cold wallets to everybody
tg2: liek an audit
neilol: wild west has its drawbacks
tg2: but with an additional level of oversight
benkay: tg2: you'll have to overcome the stigma ratings agencies in btc face post-pirate.
neilol: begs the question: how could you do an audit without counter party trust
neilol: might be an oxymoron
benkay: no that is actually the question
benkay: trust is that which all business runs on.
benkay: no trust, no business.
benkay: "trust but verify" requires trusting first.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.065 = 0.13 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: turbo_ac100 the second hit?
tg2: it does yes
tg2: why do people trust bonds
HeySteve: working on a Proof of Trust coin. the Web of Trust has been an inspiration
tg2: why do they trust fannie/freddy
tg2: not that it isn't misplaced
benkay: tg2: why do they trust neobee?
benkay: tg2: why did they trust pirate?
benkay: tg2: why do people by pmbs?
tg2: well that is different, those people had direct interests with the company they were representing
mike_c: we need a trusted auditing company like Arthur Anderson
mike_c: then this shit won't happen anymore
benkay: we need companies that need auditing first, mike_c .
benkay: "need", also.
tg2: <benkay> we need companies that need auditing first, mike_c .
mike_c: ugh. how old are you guys?
mike_c: is enron before your time?
tg2: <benkay> well given that 99% of 'bitcoin companies' are barely concealed scams
benkay: too young :)
benkay: not entirely.
tg2: I think there is a need for this kind of liability secured "trust"
benkay: but let's go down the list by market cap, shall we?
benkay: who's got the biggest mktcap in btc-denominated securities?
tg2: sort of like a whoisguard but that holds the parties behind it responsible and sets up audit procedures and processes they have to follow
tg2: like a hybrid ISO and compliance board
tg2: really a 3rd party
tg2: who's best interest is in securing these businseses
benkay: ;;calc 0.00094307 * 1000000000
gribble: 943070
benkay: so that's mpex
benkay: almost a mil.
tg2: 500m $USD
tg2: yet it holds no liability to the companies it lists OR the individuals that invest in it
tg2: *invest in those companies
benkay: "holds no liability to the companies it lists"
benkay: uh
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10900 @ 0.00093956 = 10.2412 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 50 @ 0.0075 = 0.375 BTC [+]
benkay: like i'm twelve, please.
tg2: its worth $500m
benkay: 943k, but semantics.
tg2: that is no security against the companies it lists running away and taking everyones $
benkay: are you familiar with bitvps, tg2 ?
tg2: yes i just read it actually
tg2: from the link posted by mircea_popescu before
benkay: so...
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.0569 = 0.1707 BTC [-]
tg2: you're asking how a situation like that could have been mitigated by sucha trust organization?
benkay: har the value of S.MPOE is probably in that mircea_popescu delisted bitvps 'aggressively', whereas everyone else lists outright scams.
benkay: not really. everyone got paid out at par per the contract.
benkay: nothing to mitigate.
tg2: who paid them out
benkay: mpex
benkay: this trust thing, you see.
tg2: ok, I didn't read that in the delisting doc
benkay: well if it didn't happen you have quite the scoop there
tg2: no legal recourse from mpex -> bitvps?
benkay: ;;google trilema gpg contracts
gribble: GPG contracts pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/2012/gpg-contracts/>; The future of Bitcoin regulation pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/2013/the-future-of-bitcoin-regulation/>; Some basic discussion of Bitcoin macroeconomy pe Trilema - Un ...: <http://trilema.com/2013/some-basic-discussion-of-bitcoin-macroeconomy/>
benkay: no recourse in bitcoin.
tg2: but this company operates in the meatspace
benkay: think about it for a while
benkay: read the stuff
benkay: everything ultimately operates in meatspace.
benkay: ffs...
kakobrekla: that link should be in the wiki
tg2: I honestly wasn't aware that mpex paid out for delinquent listings
benkay: tg2: you should read the listing contracts.
benkay: so anyways if you come up with anyone to whom you'd sell this bond/insurance/rating thinger let us know
benkay: but it sounds a little defocused.
turbo_ac100: kakobrekla: second hit when searching on mycroft. There are two versions since they (he?) do versioning by hand. Since 1998 I guess...
tg2: I'm just surprised that noone has pursued it, it seems that mpex is doing just that however by covering their delinquent listers
tg2: so that is good to see, not sure why that isn't advertised more prominently
kakobrekla: turbo_ac100 i managed to come to that page but i still dot get it, what is the url that needs to be provided for the plugin
benkay: refrain of everyone who's looked into mpex more thoroughly, tg2
benkay: been there myself
benkay: the 'why' tho is that mp doesn't care about people who don't read in detail.
tg2: makes sense
tg2: I read the listing criteria I saw nothing about absolving personal liability in ti
tg2: other than WOT
benkay: well read the gpg contracts thing
kakobrekla: apparently theres some xml file ?
tg2: but I guess that would go against it
benkay: 'no recourse in bitcoin'
tg2: ^
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.05699999 = 0.171 BTC [+]
kakobrekla: turbo_ac100 can you pastebin the xml ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.065 = 0.13 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06473333 = 0.1942 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: [XML] bitbet search - Pastebin.com
turbo_ac100: The "template" part should be axed. The mail address used was a meltmail.
ozbot: Judge orders Mt Gox CEO to U.S. for questions on failed bitcoin exchange
antephialtic: Karpeles in the US - should be interesting
kakobrekla: added to bitbet, can someone with firefox confirm it is actually working
kakobrekla: i have no clue
mike_c: i don't know if that was there before :)
turbo_ac100: for me it says Firefox couldn't download search engine http://bitbet.us/media/search.xml
mike_c: "error on line 10 at column 16: Opening and ending tag mismatch: Image line 0 and SearchPlugin"
turbo_ac100: newline fuck up?
mike_c: looks like <os:Image tag is not closed
mike_c: or rather, it is closed before the 'data' element.
turbo_ac100: my bad. Just a second
kakobrekla: i removed one part of it
kakobrekla: <os:Url type="application/opensearchdescription+xml" method="GET" template="http://mycroftproject.com/updateos.php/id0/bitbetusv4.xml" rel="self">
kakobrekla: </os:Url>
mike_c: i mean this line:
kakobrekla: isnt this waht you said to axe out
mike_c: <os:Image width="16" height="16">data:image/x-icon;base64,AAABAAIAEBAAAAAAIABoBAAAJgAAACAgAAAAACAAqBAAAI4EAAAoAAAAEAAAACAAAAABACAAAAAAAEAEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA////Af///wH///8B///$
kakobrekla: a yea
ozbot: [XML] bitbet search - Pastebin.com
kakobrekla: what about that get template thing
kakobrekla: mike_c does it work nao?
mike_c: looks good to me
turbo_ac100: second to last line there is a 'template=' part pointing to mycroft that *shouldn't* be needed since you can't use the template anyway
turbo_ac100: works here too
kakobrekla: great, thank you both
kakobrekla: ;;rated turbo_ac100
gribble: You have not yet rated user turbo_ac100
kakobrekla: ;;rate turbo_ac100 1 did a firefox plugin for bitbet
gribble: Error: User doesn't exist in the Rating or GPG databases. User must be GPG-registered to receive ratings.
kakobrekla: do you have a handle?
turbo_ac100: Will register. Haven't done so for too long. I'll come back to you.
mike_c: just what i needed.. easier access to bitbet. there goes another pile of coins.
mike_c: thanks turbo_ac100!
turbo_ac100: Itch == scratched!
benkay: beery musings on hiring cut rate developers and bringing technical debt down on your non-technical ass: http://cascadianhacker.com/blog/2014/04/01_i-dont-build-vms-on-developer-machines.html
benkay: blackwhite, mike_c mircea_popescu kakobrekla jurov and others with experience in software game thoughts welcome
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20797 @ 0.00093956 = 19.54 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 37 @ 0.04297892 = 1.5902 BTC [-] {17}
ozbot: MPOE-PR Perma-Banned after warning, Temp Ban more appropriate?
benkay: she needs a break anyways
benkay: all that cortisol's gotta hurt after a while
blurden: who was she?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 753 @ 0.00093959 = 0.7075 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: blurden: She did PR work for mircea_popescu on the forum. And was banned yesterday. Only real ourcomes is the forum is nao shittier and MPEx loses a recurring expense.
benkay: ;;ticker m s.mpoe
gribble: (ticker [--bid|--ask|--last|--high|--low|--avg|--vol] [--currency XXX] [--market <market>|all]) -- Return pretty-printed ticker. Default market is Bitstamp. If one of the result options is given, returns only that numeric result (useful for nesting in calculations). If '--currency XXX' option is given, returns ticker for that three-letter currency code. It is up to you to make sure the (1 more message)
benkay: !t m s.mpoe
assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00093761 / 0.00094363 / 0.00095224 (1204518 shares, 1,136.63 BTC), 7D: 0.00092844 / 0.00094315 / 0.00095866 (6836953 shares, 6,448.31 BTC), 30D: 0.000745 / 0.00087678 / 0.00096 (29662669 shares, 26,007.79 BTC)
BingoBoingo: !t h neo
assbot: The vision of Christ that thou dost see ... is my vision's greatest enemy.
benkay: !t h neobee
assbot: [HAVELOCK:NEOBEE] 1D: / 0 / (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.00155000 / 0.00222093 / 0.00288888 (79093 shares, 175.66021386 BTC), 30D: 0.00155000 / 0.00341061 / 0.00540000 (458355 shares, 1563.26867969 BTC)
blurden: !t h rentalstarter
assbot: The round stones beneath the earth... have spoken through the fire.
blurden: !t h rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00750000 / 0.0075 / 0.00750000 (1705 shares, 12.78750000 BTC), 7D: 0.00525030 / 0.00722193 / 0.00750000 (20590 shares, 148.69955354 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.00614936 / 0.00900001 (59161 shares, 363.80201440 BTC)
BingoBoingo: ! h cog
ozbot: The people behind Bitcoin | bitslog
benkay: "So once again, I must thank Aravind, Gavin, Timo, Luis and all other great people for being behind Bitcoin, which means no other thing that transmitting the passion for it to other people."
BingoBoingo: I smell another hardfork in the next 18 months
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62450 @ 0.00093696 = 58.5132 BTC [-] {3}
turbo_ac100: !t h cog
assbot: [HAVELOCK:COG] 1D: / 0 / (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: / 0 / (0 shares, 0 BTC), 30D: 0.00200000 / 0.03005337 / 0.06998899 (913 shares, 27.43872983 BTC)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6800 @ 0.00093677 = 6.37 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: more of a FOG than COG
pankkake: kakobrekla do you know who banned you?
kakobrekla: first time yes, second time no
pankkake: so they actually act anonymously. cowardly scum
pankkake: who was the first?
kakobrekla: badbear
pankkake: ah, with the good trust trating already lol
asciilifeform: ;;gpg eauth asciilifeform
gribble: Request successful for user asciilifeform, hostmask asciilifeform!~asciilife@pool-71-191-246-235.washdc.fios.verizon.net. Get your encrypted OTP from http://bitcoin-otc.com/otps/B98228A001ABFFC7
asciilifeform: ;;gpg everify freenode:#bitcoin-otc:6d513a0718c57a04a7b7789d1718a0451eb1f4173191a8c2476bf21b
gribble: You are now authenticated for user asciilifeform with key B98228A001ABFFC7
asciilifeform: damn i leave for one day to do meatspace crap and miss all the fun.
asciilifeform: how difficult is it to get listed on mpex... kakobrekla asciilifeform etc could comment on it << i still have no idea what to say to hypothetical random people who want to be listed.
asciilifeform: aside from 'have useful idea, mp might invite you as co-author'
mike_c: well, you're skipping the step where you spent x years becoming an expert in your field.
BingoBoingo: Well, the history of ventures without MP as a coauthor on MPEx hasn't been spectacular with X.EUR's fate undetermined as of yet. Maybe davout should be included in the asked as well.
asciilifeform: plenty of people know how to program.
asciilifeform: but, for some reason, they are all very far away.
asciilifeform: or, almost all.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10347 @ 0.00093871 = 9.7128 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: Well, there's programing, programming well, copypasta, and then just being a dick to a REPL prompt
BCB: who did MP piss off this time?
BingoBoingo: BCB: The PR pissed off Maged
BCB: ha
BCB: what happened ;;tldr
BingoBoingo: Maged or other mods had been deleting posts, so... loss doesn't seem to be big
mike_c: maged: "shut up". PR: "fuck you". maged: "you're banned".
BingoBoingo: Basically it was the NeoBee thread.
ozbot: Betting Analysis Gems: BitBet.py | Bingo Blog
mike_c: BingoBoingo: can you wrap that in <pre></pre> ?
BingoBoingo: mike_c: It doesn't work with the footnotes tool like that. Simply returns the same result.
BingoBoingo: And April Fools, so puzzle
mike_c: hehe. you are full of puzzles lately.
BingoBoingo: mike_c: Well, why not?
mike_c: no reason. keep us on our toes.
BingoBoingo: At least I didn't try translating the thing to a LISP first
MisterE: All ur pass are belong to iSec
asciilifeform: MisterE: reminiscent of the 'is my bank card stolen' service.
asciilifeform: for those who remember mp's essay about bezzle-dollars:
asciilifeform: apparently one of the things you can't get for these is: rental house in the wash. dc metro area.
asciilifeform: it is always one thing to read a philosophical bit, and another to taste it on one's sorry skin
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40216 @ 0.00094042 = 37.8199 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: if only we had that 'rental starter' crap here.
asciilifeform will soon have finished 7th year in a 30 m^2 flat.
MisterE: I live in a box too
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Well, if moving to the midwest was an option for you...
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i'd move to antarctica if there were work there.
BingoBoingo: And such is the problem
asciilifeform: hell, to mars.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 50 @ 0.00583999 = 0.292 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 38 @ 0.00584186 = 0.222 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: not far off is the day when the black mold outweighs me, gram for gram.
BingoBoingo: Well, I had the great fortune of once living next to the bulding whose walkway collapsed first
asciilifeform: i do believe that my kitchen floor will collapse 'when', not 'if'
MisterE: LMAO @ MOPE PR banned
thestringpuller: old news
thestringpuller: check logs
MisterE: so a comment is not allowed being that the world and this chanel doesn't revolve around your time zone?
MisterE: I dont read bitcointalk unless directed to it
thestringpuller: what time zone are you in?
MisterE: Bangkok
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17895 @ 0.00094128 = 16.8442 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: whatever happened to goat?
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: Now he wants Garr's head
thestringpuller: lolol whut?
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: Now that Cog has become so far beyond saving, he finally got angry
ozbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
nubbins`: ^ early draft of a poster we're working on
benkay: embiggen sunburst
KRS-One: Vaca Cabeza.
KRS-One: If anyone spots a tsunami lemme know.
MisterE: yea been loking myself
MisterE: this is where it is headed
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5500 @ 0.00094128 = 5.177 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: a tsunami is coming towards your home
Mats_cd03: created by local field disturbances created by...
Mats_cd03: your mother
MisterE: not possible, mother is not local
nubbins`: heh, a guy i sold a casascius coin to has decided he really can't afford it and is wondering if i'll buy it back from him
nubbins`: imagine
Mats_cd03: i distinctly recall saying you basically robbed the guy
Mats_cd03: so... surprise?
asciilifeform: nubbins`: i wonder if anyone would buy a casascius coin that i've touched, after what i said about them
MisterE: plot thickens...
nubbins`: Mats_cd03, i resent that!
nubbins`: nobody was basically robbed :0
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: It might have extra numismatic value
nubbins`: asciilifeform: only way to be certain is to buy one and try to sell it ;p
nubbins`: "I've been reconsidering my finances and I'm not sure I am in a position to hold on to this collectors item"
nubbins`: i mean, i feel bad for the guy
nubbins`: but i'm not about to buy a coin off some random noob with no trust ;p
mike_c: those things are such a crapshoot. you have to trust the whole chain of people who have ever touched it.
mike_c: how's the market? has the premium over btc moved up or down?
joecool: on those coins? they hold a nice premium
mike_c: yeah, i'm wondering the trend. nubbins` has been dealing them for awhile
joecool: i sold mine at 50% premium months ago and i'm seeing em go for 100% over face now :-\
mike_c: wow
dexX7_: re: mpoe-pr ban ... was this an april fools joke? i don't see any sign of a ban
nubbins`: percentage over face isn't a great way to price them, it's better to think in terms of absolute value over face
nubbins`: mike_c: depends on the coins. brass ones in general pull smaller premiums
nubbins`: the silver 1btc coins fetch 2.1-2.3 these days
Ken`: will mtgox yubikeys ever become a collector's item?
Ken`: got one here with logo
nubbins`: the last silver 0.5btc coin i sold (rare holo, mintage 45) went for 6btc
kakobrekla: 10$ in 10 years Ken` .
nubbins`: unfortunately kako already used the largest eyes possible
joecool: nubbins`: what are the 10BTC silvers goin for?
kakobrekla: also whats with the brass hate
nubbins`: joecool i've seen rubes offering upwards of 25btc, but this is a guaranteed loss.
kakobrekla: its 99% guaranteed brass
joecool: nubbins`: omg really?
nubbins`: i wouldn't pay a satoshi over 15
joecool: nubbins`: i sold mine for 15
nubbins`: kakobrekla: honestly i don't know.
nubbins`: the casascius market is on drugs
nubbins`: 2011 1btc with series-1 "error" holo: 3-5btc
joecool: it's like the miner market, OVERPAY FOR ANYTHING WITH BTC STAMP ON IT
nubbins`: 2011 1btc with series-2 holo (much more rare): 2btc
nubbins`: go figure
kakobrekla: should make a special btc logo featured turdtwister
nubbins`: 25btc coin: 35-40btc
nubbins`: because "less than 2x face"
mike_c: hah. nice.
nubbins`: so all the poor rubes go "ah, less than 2x face, great deal", thinking that's how coins are priced.
nubbins`: it's shocking
kakobrekla: how much are the empty ones?
nubbins`: depends, maybe a hundred bucks for a brass
kakobrekla: fucked.
nubbins`: empty 25s go for several hundred
joecool: crazy, mike's doin p.well for himself i guess
nubbins`: afaik he was independently wealthy before he started making coins
nubbins`: but yes, at the time he stopped, he no doubt had a massive pile of btc
nubbins`: i personally gave him something over 60btc
joecool: i was looking at the gox db leak, he moved coin out of there pretty quickly, i do not think he was one of the big losers in there
nubbins`: nah, he's smarter than that
MisterE: "numismatic value" lmao
nubbins`: MisterE: it's a real thing, imagine ;D
MisterE: lol I know :)
MisterE: I'd just like to buy the bullion without the numismatic part sir
MisterE: you can keep the extended warranty service too.
nubbins`: heh.
MisterE: self-sufficiency is its own reward :)
nubbins`: well, ya know... amagimetals.com, silvergoldbull.com, etc :D
MisterE: silvergoldbull haha
nubbins`: bullion is a nice hedge
nubbins`: ah hey, Square gives you a free card reader when you sign up for an account
nubbins`: neat
asciilifeform: i set the 'bozo bit' on 'square' when they caved in to the FUD and replaced their purely-analogue card reader with an elaborate crypto turd
asciilifeform: just so people couldn't use it as a generic magstripe reader.
nubbins`: too bad
MisterE: just what stores with a rack of 8 readers need, another one
joecool: asciilifeform: good to know, i need to dig around and see if i have any of the old style
MisterE: I'm so glad I hang out here and dont have to track all these scams by myself
MisterE: Ahh these are for smartphones
nubbins`: wow, look at that.
nubbins`: MisterE yep, turn a tablet into a PoS
asciilifeform: amazing what people are willing to spend on inserting antifeatures.
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
nubbins`: that really is a crypto-turd
MisterE: pretty good side by side comparison, obviously the old model is just a magnetic head
nubbins`: yeah
MisterE: pay moar, for less functionality!
nubbins`: suppose you could make one out of an old tape recorder and a few lines of objective-c
asciilifeform: excuse was, if i recall, that scammers will use the reader to lift cc #s.
asciilifeform: as if these had any trouble buying chinese readers
asciilifeform: (these, and stacks of blank cards, sell on ebay every day)
MisterE: thats exactly what I was thinking when I saw it, old tape recorder
asciilifeform: alignment is critical
asciilifeform: most cards have multiple tracks.
MisterE: yea cloning is trivial and has been I don't buy it
asciilifeform: the more realistic explanation is that they didn't care to see people write magstripe stuff using their reader
asciilifeform: (original 'square' reader was usable by any machine that had a 3.5mm headphone jack)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.61789884 = 1.2358 BTC [+] {2}
nubbins`: wellllll, still a tip-two ring-sleeve jack
nubbins`: tip-two-ring-sleeve
nubbins`: w/e, you know what i mean :D
nubbins`: (this is the same sort of jack that headphone+microphone combos use)
MisterE: or A/V/cables
MisterE: A/V cables*
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 58 @ 0.0039993 = 0.232 BTC [-] {4}
asciilifeform: yeah - but the new turd craps out a blob rsa'd to square's public key.
asciilifeform: rather than plain stripe bits.
ozbot: Maged permabanned MPOE-PR because she swore shock | Page 2 | Bitcointa.lk
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 19 @ 0.00592698 = 0.1126 BTC [+] {2}
VanCleef: bitcointa.lk loads up really slow
stompysteve: where in the world is carmen sandiego
stompysteve: i mean danny brewster
VanCleef: nobody knows
VanCleef: maybe he really is in a coma
stompysteve: doesnt make any sense
stompysteve: you would think someone would have maybe made like a half ass statement or something by now
MisterE: maybe the scammers disappeared him
stompysteve: mpex got him tied up
BingoBoingo: Who really knows if "Danny Brewster"==Danny Brewster.
stompysteve: what does he have a fake family now too lol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 50 @ 0.0075 = 0.375 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.59 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: stompysteve: Who is to know that Neo Danny wasn't some orderly who stole coma Danny's identity
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.61594729 BTC [+]
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