Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans

← 2014-02-05 | 2014-02-07 →
Vexual: points for goa trance
ozbot: Aeon Flux - The Complete Animated Collection Trailer - YouTube
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10800 @ 0.00092681 = 10.0095 BTC [-]
Mats_cd03: .bait
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: with info i dumped today I limited the population that coul be me to even rather naive lusers to 1
Vexual: you forgot to sa ratio
ozbot: Die Antwoord - Zef Side. - YouTube
BingoBoingo: Vexual: Finite things have answers in the world that aren't numbers though
Vexual: tell my oncologist
BingoBoingo: Vexual: methotrexate
ozbot: Seeed: Aufstehn - (official Video) - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.105 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4196 @ 0.00092614 = 3.8861 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10950 @ 0.00092033 = 10.0776 BTC [-]
ozbot: Die Antwoord - I Don't Need You (Unofficial) - YouTube
BingoBoingo: Vexual: You self chemo yet?
Vexual: no
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 2323 @ 0.0030001 = 6.9692 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 28 @ 0.00458895 = 0.1285 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 47 @ 0.00458894 = 0.2157 BTC [-] {2}
Namworld: Do you know the consequences of having bids at 10000 and asks at 500 bugged on the orderbook? All shorts/margins are considered in the profits massively. And you can just margin to the max based on fake profits. Apparently.
Namworld: And run your account into the red when the actual last price makes shorts/calls execute.
Namworld: Someone put a screenshot in markets channel
Namworld: Or actually they don't get executed based on last price... not sure.
Namworld: Either way
Namworld: If whoever put those orders in there removes them... might cause a mass execute of all margin orders.
Namworld: Because it seems the current situation gives everyone on finex more or less infinite margin.
BingoBoingo: 45 minutes
herbijudlestoids: whats that sound that the quarry makes
herbijudlestoids: in flinstones at the end of the day
herbijudlestoids: that noise just went off in my head
herbijudlestoids: yabbadabbadoo
Bugpowder: So is gox finally imploding?
BingoBoingo: Bugpowder: We can hope
Bugpowder: Just shut it down for the love of god
BingoBoingo: Bugpowder: When dicks can eat themselves
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7750 @ 0.00086293 = 6.6877 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.11839999 = 0.592 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.11999999 = 0.48 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 9 @ 0.12111111 = 1.09 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.12428571 = 0.87 BTC [+] {2}
herbijudlestoids: Namworld: any ideas how it happened?
herbijudlestoids: bug in the orderbook?
herbijudlestoids: poor matching system?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.12666666 = 0.38 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 11 @ 0.13045453 = 1.435 BTC [+] {2}
Apocalyptic: hey Bugpowder, long time no see
benkay: asssssses
benkay: whats up mah neeeeeg
herbijudlestoids: Bugpowder: there has certainly been some complaints on /r/BitCoin which i check once a week or so
Namworld: Bug in the orderbook. Someone managed to place a fucked order and it's stuck there, it seems.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1000 @ 0.00012949 = 0.1295 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 23 @ 0.005 = 0.115 BTC
benkay: vexual i didn't know you were a seeed fan
herbijudlestoids: Namworld: any indications why the order wasnt matched in auction correctly?
herbijudlestoids: or why the exch admins havent matched manually?
herbijudlestoids: how can there be any margin liquidations if the orderbook is broken :P
Namworld: Because something must be botched in the code and it doesn't work, obviously.
herbijudlestoids: not like they can clear any orders in the market on customers with margin calls
Namworld: Luk hiere, thangs ir bork'd op.
Namworld: Margin liquidation can happen on finex. People can withdraw LTC/BTC
Namworld: All numbers are borked up.
herbijudlestoids: how are the liquidations happening
herbijudlestoids: sorry if im pestering
Namworld: How would I freaking now?
Namworld: Code is borked is borked.
Namworld: Seems quite simple.
Namworld: It's the Bitopocalypse.
benkay: derpy web app developers match orders manually? don't make me laugh, herbijudlestoids
benkay: Namworld herbijudlestoids how do we profit off of all this incompetence?
herbijudlestoids: short bitfinex on MPEX? :P
Namworld: We don't.
herbijudlestoids: do not get involved
herbijudlestoids: best risk/reward ratio
Namworld: I tested with a small amount. No orders/margins go through. Withdrawals occurs.
Namworld: I would guess wallet would have gone empty OR Bitstamp would have been crashed/pumped infinitely if people managed to exploit it.
herbijudlestoids: it doesnt make sense to me unless the exchange is flawed by design
herbijudlestoids: youre saying the wide orders placed in the book jammed it up
herbijudlestoids: margin liquidations happen into the orderbook
BingoBoingo: Namworld: Bitocolypse was 11 months ago
herbijudlestoids: if liquidations are happening without going into the market then the exchange is taking on liabilities which might not be available when the market returns at the correct volumes
kakobrekla: mornin
herbijudlestoids: hullo kako :)
herbijudlestoids: whats your 2c?
kakobrekla: ;;ticker
gribble: MtGox BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 851.51234, Best ask: 853.0, Bid-ask spread: 1.48766, Last trade: 853.0, 24 hour volume: 17904.66180588, 24 hour low: 801.0, 24 hour high: 933.51848, 24 hour vwap: 868.59757
kakobrekla: i need coffee
Namworld: kako
Namworld: Bitfinex huge derping
kakobrekla: gox stuck?
Namworld: Have a laugh this morning
Namworld: No, Bitfinex...
BingoBoingo: kakobrekla: gox finally bleeds
herbijudlestoids: woah, the GHs/BTC price on has finally crashed too
Namworld: Someone managed to stuck a 10000 USD bid and a 500 USD ask that won't go away.
kakobrekla: wait isnt bitfinex just passing orders through
Namworld: So all margins, trades, etc are derping hard
kakobrekla: bah im outta power again
kakobrekla: mother fuckers
kakobrekla: later.
BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: Cex was always scam
Namworld: Awww...
kakobrekla: brb asap
herbijudlestoids: BingoBoingo: ? what do you mean? i thought the GHs/BTC price was always destined to go down, not a scam simply as a function of the ROI on 1GHs
herbijudlestoids: i been watching it since it was 0.18 lol
herbijudlestoids: if only you could short it
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9267 @ 0.00082189 = 7.6165 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: scam on the Doge/Itallian style
herbijudlestoids: in the sense of, its not a good investment to put money into versus just holding BTC?
herbijudlestoids: sorry, im retarded
BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: As in btter answer in 40 mins
herbijudlestoids: you gotta explain things real slow for retards
Mats_cd03: hes as clueless about what that means as you are
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.19376446 = 0.3875 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: if his english wasnt inconsistently shite id wonder if BingoBoingo was an AI
ozbot: EFF Challenges New Jersey Subpoena Issued to MIT Student Bitcoin Developers | Electronic Frontier Fo
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 500 @ 0.00172845 = 0.8642 BTC [-]
herbijudlestoids: lol this is a pretty hilarious article
jayk: BingoBoingo
herbijudlestoids: "We explained to the New Jersey Attorney General that Tidbit's code as configured was incapable of mining for Bitcoins, meaning it could not provide much of the information requested in the subpoena. Plus, New Jersey had no jurisdiction to issue a subpoena to Rubin, who lived in Massachusetts, or Tidbit, which had no connections to New Jersey at all; the server housing the code is not located in New Jersey and Tid
ozbot: Richard Sherman violently owns a troll on Twitter with Lombardi Trophy -
jayk: lol
jayk: he lost his twitter account ha ha
BingoBoingo: Mats_cd03 Nikkers
KRS-One: Major bitfinex fuckup
KRS-One: Trading halted
herbijudlestoids: KRS-One: scroll up namworld has some screenshots and a small amt info
BingoBoingo: KRS-One: Which fuckup counts nao?
Namworld: Old news, KRS
jayk: oh
benkay: Namworld herbijudlestoids how do we profit off of all this incompetence?
kakobrekla: that was fast.
Namworld: You apparently can't, benkay
BingoBoingo: benkay: Looks like Richard sherman could use a few BJ's
benkay: buh kill ring
jayk: poor sherman
jayk: he's probably celebrated out
KRS-One: holy shits
KRS-One: this is messed up
BingoBoingo: jayk: He still kept Dever from going long all game. Dunno how a cornerback could be better, He owned that shit.
KRS-One: I shorted almost 1000 LTC since amost $ its what, $14?
BingoBoingo: KRS-One: What scammed you nao? Doge?
jayk: they didn't talk about him though i was surprised
kakobrekla: how is it messed up, they have nice css
KRS-One: BingoBoingo: I only touch BTC/LTC.
BingoBoingo: jayk: The didn't need because he was good.
BingoBoingo: KRS-One: If you touch LTC Goat touches you... at night... quietly...
KRS-One: Just my f'n luck..wonder if I'll wake up and LTC is $22
jayk: i should add a section to wiki with bold text face Peyten's Fumble
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 63 @ 0.4987529 = 31.4214 BTC [+] {4}
BingoBoingo: jayk: No reason, was a boring game
KRS-One: and yet tweens are doubling, tripling their money on cryptsy of all exchanges with "doggie" coin and I got thousands sitting here I cant touch.
jayk: it'll be in the reels though in future games and bloopers
jayk: He'll be known for this forever.
jayk: at the store today i talked about it with complete strangers
BingoBoingo: 'Cous Somalia
Namworld: Well one user posted this earlier:
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2910 @ 0.00082988 = 2.415 BTC [+]
Namworld: It's a good condensed explanation.
Namworld: They say a picture is worth a thousand word after all.
BingoBoingo: Namworld: I will still loan for your tumor and revenge as collateral.
BingoBoingo: Goat kind of ruined the market though with the scam lambo
Namworld: Tumor and revenge as collateral?
Namworld: What?
benkay: scam lambo? what?
BingoBoingo: Namworld: I'll give you that roughly 300 btc if you can perfectly surgically extract a lobe of your lung. Remember. Nao ignore. DO better or be a bit hobo.
BingoBoingo: benkay: GOat's lambo. Made of pure filtered scam.
benkay: in that paid for with scam or doctored photos?
BingoBoingo: Goat is maybe 3 degrees warmer than thermos.
BingoBoingo: Goat is such scam.
BingoBoingo: I am glad I dun let drunk me know cold storage addresses because 12 years a Goat would get an Oscar.
herbijudlestoids: BingoBoingo did you put another bottle of vodka in ur butt again
BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: Doesn't matter I am 30 miles from the nearest person with the right to care.
BingoBoingo: Also I take my vodka in the mouth. And I regret that traitorous Kentucky existed.
Namworld: Courtesy lolcode
BingoBoingo: Namworld: Was nevar a thing
Namworld: Bitfinex had a brain fart.
ozbot: Argentine Banking System Archives Destroyed By Deadly Fire | Zero Hedge
BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: Ain't deadly with a body count
Namworld: That zerohedge article... it's gonna be good... in a sad sad way. I can feel it.
BingoBoingo: Namworld: Zeroedge is worse than Business insider, except they can know it.
benkay: wow they actually murdered people to cover up the bank malfeasance
BingoBoingo: Does Open Genera need money? Who would donate to tit?
BingoBoingo: benkay: Does cause 'Murica sound familar?
ozbot: Order book - Bitstamp
Namworld: Well I haven't seen such an orderbook in a while.
BingoBoingo: Namworld: mandingo fight?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.12 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: I have like, never wanted to enter a three month coma before like ever in my short ass life.
BingoBoingo: I blame the Cipher Anglo Trannie
BingoBoingo: For promoting scams
Namworld: What are you talking about? I don't have a clue what all you're saying is supposed to be about.
BingoBoingo: Namworld: Forum less, read moar.
Namworld: I barely use the forum.
BingoBoingo: Namworld: At least start with Aristotle's physics. That makes Altcoins special kind of purty.
BingoBoingo: I doubt I could hate White people more than BTC pushes me to.
BingoBoingo: I'd hate green people moar, but
Namworld: Are you on drugs right now? Each line seems either incoherent or unrelated to the previous one, more or less.
herbijudlestoids: is there any demand for physical wallets?
BingoBoingo: Namworld: Each next line seems more coherent than your last. Am I beating you on some sort on glacier sense olympics?
herbijudlestoids: cold storage wallets i mean
BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: Quite a bit for good ones
BingoBoingo: A lot of business there
herbijudlestoids: cos i was just looking at the coldcoins website cache, they were doing 5 for 50USD, laser engraved steel of BIP38 encrypted wallets
herbijudlestoids: and they closed down, citing not enough demand
herbijudlestoids: BingoBoingo: what constitutes a good one?
BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: Maybe their product was wrong?
jayk: christina o
benkay: business model, likely.
BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: Find what makes a good cold wallet?
benkay: you're not going to run a fab shop on wallets.
benkay: wallets might make a nice revenue stream for a fab shop, however.
herbijudlestoids: but a steel engraving machine only costs 700AUD?
benkay: subtle distinction that these programmerrers will never get.
benkay: well you gotta operate it, keep lights on, run a business you know.
benkay: business as waterwheel; water must flow. business must come through the operation. if business is a whole bunch of metalworking work, then wallets can be a small fraction of the biz and still work. if biz throughput is just wallet engravings, well, that sustains a much smaller operation.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16250 @ 0.00082531 = 13.4113 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MG] 1000 @ 0.0001001 = 0.1001 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MG] 1900 @ 0.00010001 = 0.19 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 220 @ 0.00082687 = 0.1819 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.NSA] 5000 @ 0.000107 = 0.535 BTC [-]
herbijudlestoids: ^ portfolio trade
benkay: missing bbet
benkay: who buys mg and not bbet? one throws off divs.
BingoBoingo: worse benkay
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 600 @ 0.00082687 = 0.4961 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: benkay: Mircea likes gurls who do BBEt math
benkay: BingoBoingo you ain't makin no sense no mo
BingoBoingo: Depends. Am I niggers.txt or
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 110 @ 0.00447453 = 0.4922 BTC [-] {5}
BingoBoingo: benkay: What can Yogi handle? Oh Lord Jesus its a fire? Fuck no!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28180 @ 0.00082687 = 23.3012 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: Who shorted functional gardens though...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17500 @ 0.00082613 = 14.4573 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 2897 @ 0.00078874 = 2.285 BTC [-] {17}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1825 @ 0.00065221 = 1.1903 BTC [-] {8}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1446 @ 0.00012937 = 0.1871 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 4373 @ 0.00051933 = 2.271 BTC [-] {17}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 10 @ 0.1245 = 1.245 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12340 @ 0.00082988 = 10.2407 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: I want to use amazon to move all my non furniture shit across the country
Mats_cd03: Why is moving still so expensive? Jesus
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20350 @ 0.00083282 = 16.9479 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.125 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1015 @ 0.00080063 = 0.8126 BTC [+] {2}
Mats_cd03: Also ozbot needs a voteban command
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.19376446 = 0.5813 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.52839998 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1087 @ 0.0001293 = 0.1405 BTC [-]
cazalla: i always found moving cheap
cazalla: but then i only needed to move a desktop + clothes until i bought a home
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 207 @ 0.00072513 = 0.1501 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 286 @ 0.0007 = 0.2002 BTC [-]
Rick_: hi
Rick_: Mircea is here?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 895 @ 0.00012939 = 0.1158 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.19376446 = 0.5813 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.19376446 = 0.9688 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38000 @ 0.00084336 = 32.0477 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.12 = 0.6 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.12 = 0.6 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.075 = 0.375 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.19376446 = 0.9688 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.12 = 0.6 BTC [-]
ozbot: Athletes and journalists start to check into Sochi. - Imgur
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.19376446 = 0.9688 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.12 = 0.6 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 500 @ 0.0004137 = 0.2069 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1000 @ 0.00012302 = 0.123 BTC [-] {9}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 200 @ 0.00434141 = 0.8683 BTC [-] {11}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22300 @ 0.00084864 = 18.9247 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.075 = 0.375 BTC [-]
grazs: lifestyle journalists who are spoiled brats, refreshing
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.12 = 0.72 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.12 = 0.6 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 10 @ 0.12 = 1.2 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04909987 = 0.2455 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.19376446 = 0.9688 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8250 @ 0.0008588 = 7.0851 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29400 @ 0.00085437 = 25.1185 BTC [-] {2}
ThickAsThieves: Current transaction count: 4,819; stuck transaction outputs: 55,546.70 BTC (as of Feb 06 2014 12:03:21 UTC)
truffles: ruined my 1st car yay
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.500101 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 7 @ 0.49717171 = 3.4802 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 13 @ 0.06846306 = 0.89 BTC [-] {10}
truffles: hi Chaaang-Noi
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 11 @ 0.05872727 = 0.646 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 300 @ 0.000795 = 0.2385 BTC [-]
ozbot: Mt.Gox Withdrawals -
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 630 @ 0.0008 = 0.504 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 203 @ 0.00084288 = 0.1711 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: MaxCoin, the new crypto currency founded by Max Keiser will launch on February 5 and it has a good chance of crossing $20 million in market cap its first month of mining.
ThickAsThieves: With over 88 altcoins listed on Coin Market Cap, it’s getting tougher to find the winners, but MaxCoin really stands out and here is why.
ThickAsThieves: MaxKeiserTV has 39K subscribers. His “personal” twitter handle has close to 91K followers and the Maxcoin “official” twitter handle has 4.2K followers. Pretty impressive for a coin that hasn’t launched yet!
ThickAsThieves: fukn autolinks
ThickAsThieves: MaxCoin’s mining difficulty will be retargeted using the kimoto gravity well algorithm. Recently, the Dogecoin developers have been thinking of retargeting this way as well
kakobrekla: algorhitmic dorra dorra bills yo
ozbot: Twitter / TheRealAltcoin: @maxkeiser @KeiserReport ...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17150 @ 0.00085692 = 14.6962 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 7150 @ 0.00012975 = 0.9277 BTC [+] {9}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 325 @ 0.003 = 0.975 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 175 @ 0.003 = 0.525 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 4000 @ 0.00012987 = 0.5195 BTC [+] {2}
truffles: keisercoin sounds cooler imo
truffles: sounds close ro kaiser
ThickAsThieves: do you even mine?
truffles: i dont even alt no
truffles: i was optimistic about the coins now after seeing it unfold ive gone cynic
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22400 @ 0.00085791 = 19.2172 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.12799999 BTC [+]
grazs: he's a tool
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.128 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35400 @ 0.00085412 = 30.2358 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 4518 @ 0.00012201 = 0.5512 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1916 @ 0.00011903 = 0.2281 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.52826801 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.52827001 = 1.0565 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 17 @ 0.52826894 = 8.9806 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.52839898 = 1.0568 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 1 @ 0.19376446 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.52839899 = 2.642 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29312 @ 0.00085386 = 25.0283 BTC [-]
KRS-One: delusions of self importance
truffles: just about everyone :p
KRS-One: everyone what?
truffles: thinks highly of self
KRS-One: not those who have been humbled..
KRS-One: might even take a few times..
KRS-One: I think everyone needs to be put to that test.
KRS-One: World might even be a better place.
KRS-One: And with more bait, of course.
KRS-One: .bait
truffles: id start with something else, like empathy
KRS-One: that ones like..BAM
truffles: booooobs
truffles: why is the lower region on display, is that like appealing?
KRS-One: those breastestes look down right uncomfortable.
KRS-One: truffles: not even
truffles: im sure there are some who enjoy that..
KRS-One: she better not travel quickly though any areas of great pressure difference or there could be a big ole mess.
truffles: face not even important enough ..
truffles: tv show had woman fall from respectable height into water, massive boobs popped heh
KRS-One: Nothing special at all..kind of beavis like...
KRS-One: Yeah! I heard abou tthat.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23000 @ 0.00085461 = 19.656 BTC [+]
KRS-One: and the one bitch on the airplane.
KRS-One: Could you imagine getting some of the fallout on you?? I'd be scared for life.
truffles: dunno if we're on the same ppl, but doubt they consider that when purchasing
truffles: u mean the person who bought or random?
KRS-One: ThickAsThieves: This was just for the lulz right?
truffles: silicone feels nice afaik
KRS-One: Is it traded on any exchanges yet?
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves did you ever get the code ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04909987 = 0.2455 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: i'm still crossing my fingers pankakke can help or it magically appears
ThickAsThieves: otherwise i guess i'll post bounties to strangers
mircea_popescu: da fuck is matt doing.
truffles: "Fight the fight, sing the song" hehe
ThickAsThieves: <KRS-One> ThickAsThieves: This was just for the lulz right? << as much as anything in life
truffles: haha
mircea_popescu: depends on whose life.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.04909986 = 0.1473 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: all values are dynamic, you taught me that
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28400 @ 0.00085557 = 24.2982 BTC [+]
truffles: even honey badger name drops hmm
mircea_popescu: if doge had the sense to start all addresses with Derp
Duffer1: hehe
mircea_popescu: then the association of herpetologist s could have made herpcoin
mircea_popescu: and we could have had herpderp altcoin wars
mircea_popescu: people. no strategic lulzforesight at all.
truffles: dodge envy itc
truffles: TAT what happens when some random noob gets pissed at u
Duffer1: who would get mad at tat?
Apocalyptic: someone who bought X-BOND above the buyback price ?
Duffer1: hehe
ThickAsThieves: i can think of more
ThickAsThieves: i'll either handle it, or i won't, or the crowd will
truffles: Apocalyptic have u played BingoBoingo yet?
Apocalyptic: yeah, was a one time thing though
truffles: im unhappy with the win loss ratio
ThickAsThieves: gavin hes lego hair
truffles: was he snail pace?
Apocalyptic: we call it playmobil hair here
truffles: yes no???
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34050 @ 0.00085406 = 29.0807 BTC [-] {4}
PsychoticBoy_: all assets are crap and virtual
PsychoticBoy_: not backed by anything but air
ThickAsThieves: is keiser promoting maxcoin legal? i mean it's like 99% ponzi no?
PsychoticBoy_: whole MPex for example
PsychoticBoy_: ppl still buying that degrading shit
ThickAsThieves: you were asking who gets mad at TAT?
ThickAsThieves: enter PBoy
PsychoticBoy_: no I am not mad
truffles: Usao Scoin
Apocalyptic: u mad bro ?
PsychoticBoy_: yup and the bigest terrorist is the USA
PsychoticBoy_: hopefully THEY get hat they deserve :)
PsychoticBoy_: f the usa
mircea_popescu: PsychoticBoy_ listen here, just because you ran a shit asset on the global scam exchange
PsychoticBoy_: come on Russia bomb USA
mircea_popescu: doesn't mean everyone's you.
PsychoticBoy_: gypsy king is speaking
mircea_popescu: easiest thing to do this, i'm stupid so therefore the world's dumb.
mircea_popescu: and that "degrading shit", for your information, has been here while you've been taking your goat sabbatical
mircea_popescu: "o herpderp i take a year off come back everyone forgot everything"
PsychoticBoy_: fuck goat
PsychoticBoy_: the scamming thai bitch
mircea_popescu: i can't distinguish between you glbse set.
mircea_popescu: but anyway. got shit to do so, later.
truffles: Goat is scammer?
PsychoticBoy_: uhhh you did not know
Apocalyptic: goat ran pirate's PT
truffles: link?
Duffer1: passthrough
Apocalyptic: passthrough
Apocalyptic: link ? check the forums, it's common knowledge here
PsychoticBoy_: chaaang noi is banned at most places
PsychoticBoy_: changes his name every day on bitcointalk
PsychoticBoy_: says enough
ThickAsThieves: how many days between when you change names?
truffles: well thats disappointing
PsychoticBoy_: I do not change name because I am a very very reputable member of this community :)
PsychoticBoy_: unlike others
PsychoticBoy_: many know me personal
Duffer1: ;;gpg info psychoticboy_
gribble: No such user registered.
PsychoticBoy_: like all people on conferences
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.04800001 = 0.288 BTC [-] {2}
ThickAsThieves: did you go to the Amsterdam one?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7294 @ 0.00085309 = 6.2224 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [O] [O.USD.C155T] 20 @ 0.00792262 = 0.1585 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.50025452 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.128 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27756 @ 0.00085494 = 23.7297 BTC [+] {2}
PsychoticBoy_: yes I was at the Amsterdam con
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [KCIM] 67 @ 0.00339001 = 0.2271 BTC [+]
PsychoticBoy_: 45 min drive so it was around the corner
ThickAsThieves: maybe we met
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.04909984 = 0.1964 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19454 @ 0.00085851 = 16.7015 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 8 @ 0.54104998 = 4.3284 BTC [+] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 10 @ 0.128 = 1.28 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.129 = 0.645 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 13 @ 0.075 = 0.975 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17900 @ 0.00086017 = 15.397 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 8 @ 0.04909986 = 0.3928 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.130001 BTC [+]
Chaaang-Noi: hi truffles was sleeping :)\
mike_c: ;;bc,24hprc
gribble: 813.68
mike_c: this is the real problem with not announcing option excercies. we don't get to watch the drama unfold :)
mike_c: i bet the option whale is having a bad day.
pankkake: I thought they were at the end of the month?
kakobrekla: cheaper today
pankkake: lol, it looks like the only way to change your havelock password is to do "forgot password"
mike_c: ;;calc ((500/813) - .1) - .4879146
gribble: 0.0270915500615
mike_c: whale sold the puts, so mpoe could excercise for a mpex profit today
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 300 @ 0.04967205 = 14.9016 BTC [+] {12}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14774 @ 0.00086697 = 12.8086 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 424 @ 0.00302 = 1.2805 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 21 @ 0.00480099 = 0.1008 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 300 @ 0.0030469 = 0.9141 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1498 @ 0.00304689 = 4.5642 BTC [-]
ozbot: New lawsuit against Bitcoin miner manufacturer alleges fraud, negligence | Ars Technica
Duffer1: it's about time
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 200 @ 0.0030469 = 0.6094 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 2645 @ 0.00307646 = 8.1372 BTC [+] {10}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 2655 @ 0.00305301 = 8.1057 BTC [-] {5}
pankkake: "One of the world’s most mysterious Bitcoin-related companies" lol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 200 @ 0.00487092 = 0.9742 BTC [+] {8}
nubbins`: so it seems the inturnet is really upset about apple pulling from the app store, hey?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 94 @ 0.005 = 0.47 BTC
ThickAsThieves: god forbid Apple has a good reason
pankkake: I'm surprised it was allowed in the first place
nubbins`: but, but, i disagree with their reason
nubbins`: pankkake, the only reason it got in there in the first place was a sneak attack
kakobrekla: how so?
pankkake: introduce the app without X features, then introduce the features?
pankkake: that never works with Apple
pankkake: by the way, they don't even have to provide a reason for refusals :)))
ThickAsThieves: Overstock and Tigerdirect etc get a few extra hundred thousand and fade away
Duffer1: i accept bitcoin
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 0.76834323 BTC to 801 shares, 95923 satoshi per share
Duffer1: and lambos
pankkake: well, they deliver, at least
pankkake: IPO was getting a lot of coins without accountability
pankkake: if accepting bitcoins means a lot of publicity and sales, that's not bad :)
pankkake: are lambos a good store of value?
Duffer1: i have yet to receive one, i'll let you know if that happens
nubbins`: pankkake: the wallet features were hidden by default
pankkake: lol hidden
nubbins`: yeah
nubbins`: you had to open a blockchain account
pankkake: reminds me of the flash light app that had a secret feature
nubbins`: via web
nubbins`: then some sort of thing like keep the account open for 2 weeks
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 212 @ 0.005 = 1.06 BTC
pankkake: interestingly, apple does not review the code of the app
pankkake: so you can sneak things… but usually not for long
nubbins`: then open the iphone app via the same ip address that you've previously logged in with on the website
pankkake: amazing
nubbins`: yeah
nubbins`: it was a real fuckaround
nubbins`: but they flew under the radar for years
pankkake: and in the same way, you can sneak malware. rendering the whole thing "for your protection" a lie
nubbins`: in practice, this made the app really unreliable when on the go
nubbins`: they do automatic code reviews
nubbins`: no manual tho
nubbins`: unless there's a problem suspected
diametric: automatic code reviews.. what a joke
nubbins`: i agree
nubbins`: it's more for catching bugs than anything
nubbins`: mem leaks etc
pankkake: he probably doesn't know any respectable bitcoin service ends in .io
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 8 @ 0.12997221 = 1.0398 BTC [-] {4}
nubbins`: anyway, on a related note, xcode comes with some great code analysis tools
nubbins`: the IDE itself isn't the greatest, and Interface Builder is pretty derpy
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.130001 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 24 @ 0.0047894 = 0.1149 BTC [-]
nubbins`: but the code analysis features are top-notch
pankkake: powered by llvm?
asciilifeform: nubbins`: last i checked, those were just a thin gui skin on top of gdb and gprof.
nubbins`: pankkake, osx does use llvm-gcc
nubbins`: asciilifeform: could be, i never dug under the skin too much
nubbins`: afaik the whole thing is based on gnu tools tho
asciilifeform: well, Next's perverted gcc fork, anyway.
nubbins`: this caused problems when trying to compile the last eulora release for osx
nubbins`: terrible, terrible problems
asciilifeform: apple died in '99.
asciilifeform: replaced by Next. (with name changed to 'apple')
nubbins`: even the objects show relics of this
BingoBoingo: Apple died in 1984 replaced by Macintosh
nubbins`: NSString, etc
nubbins`: btw, objective-c is a brutal language to comprehend
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.13 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: Well, not entirely until about 89, but it was on its way
nubbins`: took me the better part of 2 months just to decipher method calls
nubbins`: nothing shows a more callous disregard for developers than code relics
nubbins`: sharepoint was brutal for this
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32500 @ 0.00086805 = 28.2116 BTC [+] {2}
nubbins`: first they misappropropriated all these common words like "site" and "web" and "part"
nubbins`: then in one major release, they reassigned the names to different things
nubbins`: what was once called a site is now a web, etc
nubbins`: but all the old class names remained the same
nubbins`: so Web w = new Web(); creates a new Site, etc
nubbins`: it's enough to make you walk away
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 5000 @ 0.00012909 = 0.6455 BTC [+] {9}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 6000 @ 0.00012985 = 0.7791 BTC [+] {5}
asciilifeform: in the '90s, i never imagined i'd miss the 'old apple'
nubbins`: old apple was before my time
nubbins`: hackintosh in '08 was my first non-casual exposure
asciilifeform: nubbins`: mostly - but not entirely - before my time:
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31465 @ 0.00086396 = 27.1845 BTC [-] {4}
nubbins`: ah, haha, this is like vb
nubbins`: or interface builder, to a lesser extent
asciilifeform: nubbins`: in exactly the same way that a junkyard full of bricks, roof tiles, etc. resembles a house.
pankkake: there'se a language where the keywords can be either French or English
nubbins`: legos, even
nubbins`: anyway, good article
nubbins`: there's a steady push towards an apple device being a device of consumption rather than production
nubbins`: this has been pretty much perfected in iDevices
nubbins`: osx is slowly following suit
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.19376446 = 0.9688 BTC [+]
ozbot: Long Live Cryptic Urgencies - Buttcoin - The P2P crypto-currency for butts. - Buttcoin - It's Bitcoi
ThickAsThieves: all these guys smashed their phones cuz some reddite said he'd give out money to the first 5 people
ThickAsThieves: no wthe post is gone
Duffer1: didn't he escrow?
nubbins`: well ya know.
kakobrekla: so in a few days they will say "sry, you can has btc"
nubbins`: i'll send 100btc to everyone who smashes their dick with a hammer
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 2 @ 0.05610001 = 0.1122 BTC [-]
nubbins`: 200btc if you upload it to redtube
kakobrekla: and fanbois will be "oh noes gotta get new iphone 5"
kakobrekla: apple makes more monies.
nubbins`: "know what'll hurt apple? if i smash my on-contract phone that they've already been paid for, in full"
kakobrekla: and then get a new one
Diablo-D3: nubbins`: lol
nubbins`: naw dude, they're totally going for a windows phone this time ;p
Diablo-D3: hurting apple doesnt even make sense
ThickAsThieves: itd hurt apple way more to sell it secondhand
Diablo-D3: its a fucking company
Diablo-D3: its not real
nubbins`: tat, the first video is already brutal
Diablo-D3: go focus on actually real shit like starving africans and chinese death camps
nubbins`: some wizard with a dart hangin out of his face
nubbins`: "this is not acceptable"
nubbins`: *smashes $700 phone*
dexX7: <Duffer1> didn't he escrow? << he did
Diablo-D3: smashing a phone is basically telling the people who suffered in china to make it their lives have no meaning and they are dying in vain.
Diablo-D3: so, good job there.
Duffer1: oh hey dex, haven't seen you in irc in a while, stayin busy man?
ThickAsThieves: smash the chinese then?
pankkake: they should ask themselves why they bought it in the first place, and make their auto-critique
ThickAsThieves: i'm so confused
Diablo-D3: ThickAsThieves: I'd love to smash the chinese government
ThickAsThieves: what do i smash to get my way?
dexX7: hey :) yea, kinda
nubbins`: wait, he's going to strikeAAAAHHH
Diablo-D3: just wipe all those fucks off the face of the earth
kakobrekla: smash diablo
Diablo-D3: but it'd take the entirety of the western world to get rid of them
Diablo-D3: and I dont see our rich fucks going to war with their rich fucks any time soon
kakobrekla: maybe some ltc will fall out
ThickAsThieves: can we not turn this into the viability of world wars?
ThickAsThieves: thank you
Diablo-D3: ThickAsThieves: rich people wars are not real wars
Diablo-D3: they fight wars with cash, not dollars
Diablo-D3: cash not bullets
nubbins`: man oh man
nubbins`: i'm actually a bit upset here
Duffer1: upset that no one has stepped forward to smash their dicks?
kakobrekla: smash the phone
ThickAsThieves: i'm so bad at Apple I refuse to reproduce!
Diablo-D3: *mad
nubbins`: Duffer1, upset at the stupidity of these retards
nubbins`: HULK SMASH
nubbins`: that'll show apple
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 100 @ 0.003065 = 0.3065 BTC [-]
Duffer1: don't even worry about what retards do
Duffer1: that's PR's job
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.1069323 = 0.2139 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 110 @ 0.003065 = 0.3372 BTC [-]
nubbins`: "really sending a message to apple here"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 65 @ 0.005 = 0.325 BTC
nubbins`: tat had it right, if he really wanted to stick it to apple, he would have sold his phone ;p
nubbins`: this is like if that single dad who paid us $400 for a bespoke kid's book said "fuck pink eye" and put his book in the shredder
nubbins`: we'd say "yes, fuck us" while smoking his money
ThickAsThieves: "i'm going sprint down 300 yards and try and get this rifle on target as fast as possible"
ozbot: R3 Destroys anti bitcoin iPhone with a rifle in exchange for a Nexus 5 - YouTube
ozbot: iPhone 5 phones destroyed in protest against Apple's anti-Bitcoin actions
asciilifeform: soviet version of the joke: 'man buys a ticket, rips it up and walks - to spite the trolley conductor.'
nubbins`: side note, what's with all these fucking idiots laying their phones on concrete and striking them with metal tools?
nubbins`: do they even eyes?
ThickAsThieves: metal tools are more organic
nubbins`: srsly, the only part of these videos where i cringe is when i see a metal implement striking concrete
ThickAsThieves: when will someone put one in a microwave?
nubbins`: as soon as i finish submitting this post to reddit
nubbins`: lel, i kid ;(
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 50 @ 0.49816901 = 24.9085 BTC [-] {16}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 42 @ 0.0047894 = 0.2012 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 183 @ 0.00306469 = 0.5608 BTC [-] {2}
nubbins`: did i mention the problem i was having with my iphone the other day?
nubbins`: fuckin thing completely stopped charging, 9 days out of warranty
ThickAsThieves: you are charging it wrong
ThickAsThieves: "We have surveillance video from the hotels that shows people turn on the shower, direct the nozzle at the wall and then leave the room for the whole day," the official told members of the press, according to The Wall Street Journal.
ThickAsThieves: Kozak was attempting to argue that foreign journalists were biased against Russia and were intentionally working to paint the Sochi games as a disaster. But in the process, he may have just spooked everyone assigned hotel rooms to attend the games.
nubbins`: cajoled apple into fixing it for free, later realized that the bottom of the port had a bunch of impacted lint
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 72 @ 0.00307801 = 0.2216 BTC [+]
nubbins`: so i guess i get a free box in the mail any day now ;p
ThickAsThieves: they let you keep the old one when replacing?
nubbins`: no, they mail you a box to return your broken phone in
nubbins`: literally an hour after i hung up, i scooped the lint out
nubbins`: works like a charm now
Duffer1: so they have video footage of peoples showers?
nubbins`: Duffer1, +1 heh
Duffer1: seems like a terrible thing to tell the press, but what do i know
Duffer1: didn't you get your phone replaced though nub?
ThickAsThieves: right in the shower head apparently
nubbins`: tat, got a link?
asciilifeform: someone should teach these folks about 'parallel construction.'
nubbins`: Duffer1, nah, have had this for just over a year
ozbot: Russian official says government has video surveillance of Sochi hotel room showers | The Verge
Duffer1: what'r you waiting for then, free nexus 5 go
ThickAsThieves: wsj source
ozbot: Russian Officials Fire Back at Olympic Critics -
ThickAsThieves: The Iron Shower Curtain
nubbins`: HAHAHAH
benkay: so basically it should be trivial for anyone to accept any altcoin
benkay: but running a full satoshi client for each chain is a little, ah, shall we say wasteful.
ThickAsThieves: dammit I need to get this Altcoin source going
benkay: what's the Altcoin magic value?
nubbins`: over 9000
benkay: also i know this is an oldlink but it still delivars chuckles:
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 816 @ 0.003065 = 2.501 BTC [-]
nubbins`: so, anyone buying rentalstarter tomorrow?
ThickAsThieves: i think it has been between .00000300 and .00000100btc so far
benkay: ThickAsThieves: the "magic value" is a header in the protocol that identifies which network a client is a part of
ThickAsThieves: and what a client network?
Duffer1: nubbins' if i had anything left - no i wouldn't
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.13 BTC [-]
benkay: in this case network referring to the network of nodes broadcasting and verifying transactions
ThickAsThieves: is the same question as "do you have a dump of the genesis block?"
benkay: a client being the Satoshi implementation or bitcoinj or multibit w/e
benkay: no.
Duffer1: i like almost everything about it but I'm sure btc itself will do significantly better
ThickAsThieves: well it was made from
benkay: magic value is a part of a header sent between nodes. genesis block is the root of the merkle tree.
ThickAsThieves: and i can get source for other coins made by them
benkay: if you had the source for alt you could ack "magic" and find it pretty quickly
ThickAsThieves: for my alt, or any alt made the from same codebase?
ThickAsThieves: my issue is the source code doesnt exist anymore
ThickAsThieves: and i am waiting on coingen to make an identical one so we can reverse create source for the orginal
nubbins`: Duffer1, +1
nubbins`: i don't see rental properties outperforming btc
ThickAsThieves: yes, my comprehension of the details you describe is pretty low
benkay: ah well i'm giving the wrong instructions anyways. it's a bit obfuscated:
ThickAsThieves: but i am willing to pay to get this solved so i can then pay to have pools made or whaver
ThickAsThieves: get it listed on exchanges
benkay: it'll be interesting to see if clients built from the regenerated source code will be able to talk to clients in the wild
nubbins`: what are you gonna do when people start actually wasting/losing money on atc?
benkay: cash out, obviously.
ThickAsThieves: i dont even own any
nubbins`: doesn't matter
nubbins`: people are going to take it seriously and they're going to lose money
nubbins`: and you're enabling that
Duffer1: he's not wrong there TaT hehe
nubbins`: i know it's a big lel, but you should kill this before it grows legs
ThickAsThieves: i'm not sure he's right either
benkay: yeah but that's the "kids are going to hurt themselves with guns" argument
ThickAsThieves: also who's to say?
benkay: teach some firearm use, let the idiots die.
ThickAsThieves: maybe it really does kill all the other alts
pankkake: lol, the coinget coin I took the source from even has the same port number
pankkake: coingen
nubbins`: maybe it really does, yep
benkay: why would you change the port number?
mike_c: yeah, where's the hate for bernankoin? as long as he doesn't pump/dump, what's the crime?
pankkake: because it's anothe coin
benkay: also the n-coin game will go forever
pankkake: mike_c: there's no hate for bernankoin
pankkake: it's *impossible* to premine anyway!
ThickAsThieves: nubbins ive decided your argument is not sound
ThickAsThieves: you had me worried
nubbins`: you've decided that the guy selling apples w/ razors to creepy old men is not at fault, because he's not the one handing them out to kids?
mike_c: i guess nobody will lose money on bernankoin cuz you can always just print more to keep people from losing money
nubbins`: "lel pre-razored apples, what a riot!"
Duffer1: lol
nubbins`: and we all have a chuckle and a kid slices his neck open
pankkake: well anyone printing it for more than a few hours is a fool
ThickAsThieves: in a world where there can be any number of alts, all on same codebase, no one alt is better than the other
nubbins`: but hey, fuck him, he shoulda checked!
ThickAsThieves: that includes bitcoin really
nubbins`: alts have two purposes: to experiment with ideas and to have a lel/run a scam
ThickAsThieves: says who
asciilifeform: eventually, mining breakthrough, and people will regret having undermined the whole concept of blockchain by having a swarm of little chains
mike_c: that's three purposes
nubbins`: says me
nubbins`: mike_c: the lel/scam is the same thing
asciilifeform: 'fail to hang together, and you will hang separately'
ThickAsThieves: mining breakthrough?
asciilifeform: hypothetically.
ThickAsThieves: but really, what makes bitcoin better than an altcoin other than its adoption level?
ThickAsThieves: it's all the same shit
nubbins`: one's real and the other is for fleecing rubes, that's what
asciilifeform: entirely ignoring the 'features' (many vs. few coins, frequents vs. rare blocks, etc) and premining,
asciilifeform: the difference is: who has it.
nubbins`: if you're fine with rubes being fleeced, then there's no difference, no
asciilifeform: every cryptocoin can be seen as an attempt to 'replay the history of money'
asciilifeform: with (optionally) different winners.
asciilifeform: much depends on who these winners are.
mike_c: there is a difference between selling real estate in florida that is secretly swampland, and openly selling swamps.
ThickAsThieves: and it's impossible to have two coins coexist and be healthy?
asciilifeform: hard to sell swamp to people who understand what a swamp is.
mike_c: right, which is why you haven't bought any ATC
nubbins`: it's impossible for a rubecoin to be healthy, yes
ThickAsThieves: is it impossible an altcoin will become the winner over bitcoin?
asciilifeform: it isn't impossible. we live in a world with ms-winblows, for example.
nubbins`: let's be clear, your experiment isn't intended to become a winner over bitcoin
asciilifeform: there are many such 'winners'.
nubbins`: it's intended to have a chuckle
benkay: even if there is a mining breakthrough, the compute deployed against alts couldn't save bitcoin...
nubbins`: but the funny thing about intentions...
ThickAsThieves: says you
nubbins`: says me, yes
nubbins`: says you, as well
ThickAsThieves: no actually
ThickAsThieves: says the miners
ThickAsThieves: thats all really
TomServo: ThickAsThieves: You saying you don't own any and won't mine any doesn't preclude that?
ThickAsThieves: preclude what
TomServo: It winning over btc
ThickAsThieves: what i say doesnt mean much
nubbins`: that's becoming clear ;D
ThickAsThieves: seriously
ThickAsThieves: i know i fuck around
nubbins`: i do too
nubbins`: the suckers being suckered don't
ThickAsThieves: but you guys arent giving real arguments here
ThickAsThieves: you act like i'm inventing altcoins
asciilifeform: whether a particular alt is 'trying to win over btc' can be determined by looking at what it is being traded for.
Duffer1: it's a subjective moral argument
asciilifeform: if it is being parcelled out in exchange for btc...
asciilifeform: then it is clear which coin the author regards as genuine and having a future.
Duffer1: based entirely on what you believe is moral or amoral
nubbins`: duffer, it boils down to this, yes
nubbins`: promoting a lelcoin as being serious is amoral
nubbins`: in my view
ThickAsThieves: what if the other just wants to do create the thing to see what happens
nubbins`: others disagree
asciilifeform: would you happily part with gold, for instance, if you believe that 'gold standard' will make a comeback?
Mats_cd03: so what was the size of the mpex whale fee
nubbins`: what if i just want to stuff a cigarette with match heads to see what happens?
mike_c: nubbins`: do you think it was immoral to flip houses during the housing bubble?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.11900001 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: so far its mostly been an expression for me, some luls sure, but kinda performance art
ThickAsThieves: i havent even pondered what my investment strategy might be for it
ThickAsThieves: i dont care
ThickAsThieves: maybe i buy some
ThickAsThieves: maybe i dont
nubbins`: mike_c, there was a housing bubble? ;p
nubbins`: i think it's immoral to sell a cardboard box painted up like a house to a new family
ThickAsThieves: thats not what this is
nubbins`: bernankoin, you read the spec and have a lel
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.119 BTC [-]
nubbins`: dogecoin, you see people actually losing things of value
nubbins`: intentions don't matter, what people do with the thing you've made does matter
mike_c: bah. and bitcoin is to blame for assasinationmarket
benkay: is running a gambling house a moral operation, nubbins`?
nubbins`: benkay, no
nubbins`: mike_c: assassinations are purchased with or without bitcoin
nubbins`: rubes losing money on ATC doesn't happen without ATC
mike_c: of course it does.
mike_c: that money is lost simply by rubes having it.
ThickAsThieves: you cant die from frostbite while bathing in lava either
asciilifeform: 'if i hadn't picked his pocket, some other fellow would've.'
ThickAsThieves: except i'm not picking pockets
nubbins`: nice rationalization, isn't it
nubbins`: no, you're just selling tongs
nubbins`: yyyep
ThickAsThieves: i'm selling streets
nubbins`: streets serve a useful purpose
ThickAsThieves: maybe people get robbed on them
ThickAsThieves: so does currency
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18450 @ 0.00085735 = 15.8181 BTC [-] {2}
ThickAsThieves: maybe people build businesses on them
Duffer1: this argument is why i never made Hodorcoin, in the end, someone was going to lose money on it
nubbins`: if you can justify it to yourself, there's not much i can do to convince you otherwise
nubbins`: just wanted to offer a perspective
mike_c: i lost money on mpex once. mp is a scammor.
benkay: everything is a scam
ThickAsThieves: i can say i dont want to hurt anyone
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35005 @ 0.00085841 = 30.0486 BTC [+] {2}
ThickAsThieves: but i cant say that i wont sell knives
nubbins`: sure, and you can offer perpetual mining turds that anyone with a brain would know is a bad purchase
asciilifeform: take classic btc. it was a net gain in wealth, rather than simply a machine from moving money from one pocket to another, because it made new things possible. what new things does the altcoin-of-the-day make possible?
nubbins`: but you can't say that you're not intentionally fleecing rubes
asciilifeform: 'my ferrari' is one answer. but not an answer that will satisfy skeptics.
ThickAsThieves: well if we go buy the Altcoin's mission it's purpose is to get everyone to stop mining every other altcoin
ThickAsThieves: would you count marginal success in that as a good thing?
kakobrekla: allowing for txes when 1mb limit is being hit for one but thats where it ends
nubbins`: would you count getting people off heroin and into crack as a good thing?
jborkl: not to the dealers
ThickAsThieves: i dont think that's a proper comparison
asciilifeform: this is more like getting all of the addicts to buy from one large dealer instead of quitting
nubbins`: sure it is, they're trading one terrible choice for another
mike_c: if you accept the axiom that any coin besides bitcoin has no value.
ThickAsThieves: the problem is you are making assumptions that are false
Mats_cd03: Some people just lack enough empathy
nubbins`: do tell!
asciilifeform: just asking the question of where the added value is.
asciilifeform: it's a legitimate question.
ThickAsThieves: you assume all altcoins are a loss/waste
ThickAsThieves: i do not
nubbins`: i don't assume that
nubbins`: altcoins are a great way to test out new concepts
asciilifeform: if there's added value ('i've an nsa-resistant work-function, here, look') we're all ears.
nubbins`: but a big machine that spits out slightly tweaked alts isn't
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 500 @ 0.003078 = 1.539 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: again i think this is a false assumption as well, alts needing new concepts
nubbins`: nobody's saying you NEED to test new concepts
TomServo: ThickAsThieves: is it a "preformance piece" or "maybe a viable altcoin, we'll see"?
asciilifeform: then your real proposition is 'i ought to be Satoshi and will use the powers for Good'
nubbins`: just that there's the potential for learning, growth, new thought processes, etc
ThickAsThieves: you are saying the NEED is required for value to exist
ThickAsThieves: it;s not a fact
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.11833333 = 0.355 BTC [-] {2}
ThickAsThieves: there are no powers i get or use
asciilifeform: 'a) repaint your black car. it should be blue. b) why should i ? a) blue is just as good as black b) wtf a) here, i'll sell you some paint b) what's the value to me a) it doesn't need added value, blue is better '
denlove: I wish I had someone send bitcoin to please. 16ZdMuyrVuuupSjVZyPmBWwjHsbcweKGUk
nubbins`: denlove, eat a bag of dicks
ThickAsThieves: blue is different
ThickAsThieves: doesnt need to be better
kakobrekla: I wish blowjob and icecream
nubbins`: you're trying to rationalize your lelcoin right now, in this conversation
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: good luck with the chump harvesting.
ThickAsThieves: seriously, you cant definitively win one argument and now i'm a shill
nubbins`: what's with "winning" "arguments"?
TomServo: TomServo | ThickAsThieves: is it a "preformance piece" or "maybe a viable altcoin, we'll see"?
ThickAsThieves: i dont know
ThickAsThieves: it just is
asciilifeform: the trouble with chump harvesting, morals aside, is that there is always a new, slicker chump-harvesting artist coming to town.
asciilifeform: whose 'no added value needed' proposition is 'just as good' as yours
asciilifeform: but new/exciting.
mike_c: that's not trouble if he's not trying to harvest chumps
nubbins`: so value, many excite
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 150 @ 0.003078 = 0.4617 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: let them compete, idc
asciilifeform: live by the chumps, die by the chumps. who are fickle.
ThickAsThieves: its nothing to do with chumping people
nubbins`: let them eat cake!
ThickAsThieves: there will be wealth in more coins than bitcoin, for as long as this paradigm can even exist
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25070 @ 0.00085996 = 21.5592 BTC [+] {3}
pankkake: well, I'm stuck :(
ThickAsThieves: your arguments live in some imaginary ending where only bitcoin is left
asciilifeform: the other thing, your alt may be 'honest', but plenty are not. say, quite soon governments will begin herding people (through guile or force) into national altcoins.
asciilifeform: with central control.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.1289 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: the proliferation of chumpcoins sets the stage for this
asciilifeform: by destroying the Schelling point.
asciilifeform: 'divide & conquer'
Duffer1: interesting proposition
ThickAsThieves: you cant stop it if thats the path
ThickAsThieves: and it certainly wont be because i made Altcoin
pankkake: it's pchMessageStart, but I'm not sure how to reverse-engineer it
asciilifeform: 'no drop of water believes that it is to blame for the flood' etc.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21450 @ 0.00086492 = 18.5525 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: altcoins are seeking their place, itll always be dynamic, but they will have a place
ThickAsThieves: it's our reality
ThickAsThieves: you cant will it away
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28800 @ 0.00086998 = 25.0554 BTC [+] {2}
Duffer1: lets put aside the moralizing and focus on the likely outcome of the experiment
mike_c: imagine a grid with 100 tiny squares and 1 enormous square. Add as many tiny squares as you want, the Schelling point remains.
Rick_: mircea is here?
asciilifeform: Duffer1: we already know the outcome. that's what makes it a distinctly disappointing experiment.
Duffer1: paging mircea_popescu , mircea_popescu to the desk please
ThickAsThieves: oh you do?
ThickAsThieves: intersting
Duffer1: i believe that is the likely outcome as well ascii
asciilifeform: somewhere in russia, a drunk is unzipping, preparing to piss in an apartment lobby. you prod him, he answers 'drunks will always piss in lobbies. you can't just will it away.'
Duffer1: getting from here to there would probably be very interesting though
pankkake: does anyone here know basic C? how do I print, say, 0x0b? I want it to be 0x0b on the screen, or similar
asciilifeform: 'besides it already stinks'
ThickAsThieves: no, you are trying to say pissing shouldnt happen at all
asciilifeform: pankkake: printf("%x", foo)
ThickAsThieves: or that there is only one place to piss
pankkake: thanks, this is also what I found :)
pankkake: I need to find something interesting to write in C
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: merely that the world would stink less if people could agree to piss in toilets, or the woods, but not apartment lobby.
nubbins`: what he's saying is piss in the fucking toilet
nubbins`: not in people's faces
ThickAsThieves: by that argument why do we allow more than one fiat?
ThickAsThieves: why hasnt that been cleaned up?
ThickAsThieves: didnt require bitcoin to do so
asciilifeform: for the same reason that a town has more than one burglar
ThickAsThieves: you really see it that way?
asciilifeform: very basic game theory.
mike_c: pankkake: take something slow in one of your python programs and write a C module for it
ThickAsThieves: and what of this grand plan to make a better
ThickAsThieves: mircea is scammer too?
nubbins`: "a better"
nubbins`: atc = "a better" alt?
jurov: pankkake: rewrite pympex (but dunno if there's portable gpg C library)
nubbins`: PMTs = "a better" way to invest?
pankkake: I doubt the performance issues of pympex are in the Python code ;)
ThickAsThieves: so enabling the more efficient creation of Altcoins is moral, but making one is not
jurov: i had in mind portability issues
nubbins`: nobody's saying that
pankkake: there are many gpg python libs, which all suck in a different way
ThickAsThieves: so it's just a fleecing of rubes plan of mp's?
nubbins`: nobody's saying that either
jurov: pankkake: yep, even some forks with same name
nubbins`: making a new compiler != creating exploits
asciilifeform: ignoring morality entirely. if you'd like to live in a future where crypto-coins are a useful thing, vs. a fogotten fad, think twice about cranking out spamcoins.
pankkake: in the end, for what I wanted to do, I ended up calling gpg directly
nubbins`: signal-to-noise-ratiocoin
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 900 @ 0.00307922 = 2.7713 BTC [+] {2}
benkay: asciilifeform: would you elaborate on how cranking out altcoins will do *anything* to bitcoin?
mike_c: pankkake: curious what you were trying to do that was not working with the python gpg lib?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 750 @ 0.0030798 = 2.3099 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: benkay: one of the big strengths of classic btc is that it is a schelling point.
asciilifeform: now every idiot wants 'his own' blockchain. and soon, every government, with master keys baked in, naturally
pankkake: it's wasn't really about working, but I didn't want to add a dependency for nothing
mike_c: ah
pankkake: in the end most of the feature is calling gpgv
asciilifeform: in the latter, fiat infusions will make these boobycoins appear to be (temporarily) valuable
asciilifeform: and chumps will flock to them.
pankkake: which is also portable :)
asciilifeform: getting used to central control, pre-mining by national mints, and all of the traditional joys of fiat.
asciilifeform: 'embrace and extinguish.'
mike_c: i think you are vastly overestimating public knowledge of even the existence of altcoins
ThickAsThieves: I think you have limited the possible futures too much
Duffer1: Max Keiser ‏@maxkeiser 17m
Duffer1: #maxcoin mining and buying panic is building... all system look good to go. @maxcoinproject
Duffer1: >.<
asciilifeform: naturally, people will shit out alts. nothing i can say here would put the slightest dent in it. just as they will continue to throw cigarette butts from cars.
nubbins`: replace max with alt
asciilifeform: every cig thrower is king of his own universe for a few seconds
asciilifeform: just like the alt author.
mike_c: i like that analogy. so TaT threw a cig butt on the ground. who cares?
ThickAsThieves: the burning forest!
kakobrekla: green peace
pankkake: fucking fuck, now it connects, but every block is an orphan to it…
nubbins`: mike_c: yeah, who cares! we can do this forever!
mike_c: yes, we can. the world has not yet crumbled from tossed cig butts.
nubbins`: fuck everything, it's the road's fault for being there
nubbins`: "not yet"
nubbins`: you've got that part right, at least
nubbins`: "it hasn't happened yet!"
nubbins`: ergo, it never will!
ThickAsThieves: again a bad analogy
nubbins`: when can we expect mike_ccoin?
mike_c: never, i own one ATC. hence my position :)
asciilifeform: life in garbage world, sans cleanup crews.
benkay: but "good money drives out bad", asciilifeform. every local government can print their own fiat, demand taxes in their own shitcoin, and all of the wealth will stay in bitcoin.
nubbins`: "so what if we're helping turn cryptocurrency into a digital liberia"
nubbins`: "fuck the signal, here's some more noise"
asciilifeform: the question we're about to learn the answer to is close to: 'does the average person actually appreciate toilets and garbage trucks? or would be be just as happy using his local beach?'
mike_c: this is like imagining that the btctalk retardation will hurt bitcoin.
benkay: there is only noise in the universe. moments of signal are rare and unusual and vanish rapidly. thermodynamics at work.
nubbins`: benkay, that's about two steps from "what IS reality?"
mike_c: but he threw his butt in the toilet. it was announced on btctalk.
kakobrekla: everything is locel on the net
kakobrekla: local
benkay: not hardly. it's more along the lines of "seeing clearly in the fog is difficult", nubbins`. not "everything is foggy so fuck it".
nubbins`: mike_c, ah, the toilet? that's okay, then
nubbins`: once you flush things down the toilet, they're gone
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 545 @ 0.0031181 = 1.6994 BTC [+] {3}
ThickAsThieves: Maybe, I make Altcoin, it does pretty good, then something goes bad and people lose a bunch of money. Then I admit you guys were right. The guilt eats my soul til I realize I must now design the best coin ever. I do, and it kills bitcoin, and the world basks in a new dawn of finance. I load up IRC "sup fuckers, good thing I made Altcoin!"
benkay: just because the signal is loud and clear today is not a reason why it should remain that way.
nubbins`: "well, the tanker was leaking oil something fierce, so we towed it outside the environment"
nubbins`: "into another environment?"
nubbins`: "no, OUT of the environment"
mike_c: ok, i give up. let's debate abortion and gun control instead.
kakobrekla: kill fetuses with guns!
nubbins`: ThickAsThieves: ...
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: i, for one, had no notion of convincing you that bamboozling people is wrong. only that you are ultimately burning your own furniture for heat.
mike_c: they aren't fetuses they are human beings. murderer.
kakobrekla: no, guns kill people, not people. not a murderer
pankkake: to make a "successful" altcoin nowadays you need more than releasing it
asciilifeform: right now, alt enthusiasts are shitting on a relatively clean beach.
Duffer1: when i argue against something, i take the time later to try to argue for it, i can't think of any arguments for altcoin atm (but that could very likely be user error) hehe
ThickAsThieves: asciilifeform, you are likely right, but it is already shaping up to be an interesting excercise
asciilifeform: they happily take their btc earnings from selling the alts and enjoy the valuable, relatively-stable coin.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 96 @ 0.00312 = 0.2995 BTC [+]
nubbins`: "can we trust this ThickAsThieves fellow?" "of course you can trust me, neobee, AM, etc" "but what about the perpetual mining turd and the altcoin thing?" "no no no, those were just a lel"
nubbins`: ^ this is the other side of it
kakobrekla: someone has to be on the other side of the sell asciilifeform
jborkl: so what did I miss about GOX? just read a article that bitcoin withdraws are not working now? (not that I use them anymore)
nubbins`: you asked me if mp was running a scam by making a better coingen. i ask you if there's a mirceacoin
asciilifeform: nubbins`: 'Bob the Bridge Builder.'
nubbins`: wait, the same bob who sucks dicks?
nubbins`: i've heard of him
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 99 @ 0.0030795 = 0.3049 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 76373 @ 0.00086841 = 66.3231 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: i do wish mircea was here, because even if i'm outright in the wrong, he'd at least be able to make that clear. i'm having real trouble with these arguments.
ThickAsThieves: and to comment on TAT.VM
asciilifeform: not sure even karl friedrich gauss could make this any more clear.
ThickAsThieves: First, I didn't really realize what would happen, and I really did not intend to harm. However, I do regret it.
nubbins`: ^ picture yourself saying this about ATC 6 months from now
benkay: it's fine
nubbins`: please
benkay: you've done nothing
ThickAsThieves: And that regret did have an affect on my latter movs.
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: if this is true, it isn't too late to publicly repent and call the thing off.
asciilifeform: it would be a very educational act.
benkay: how are you going to do that?
ThickAsThieves: i will not
asciilifeform: well, we tried.
ThickAsThieves: if it dies it will be due to my attention span more likely
jborkl: What are you doing anywy Tat, I missed that part
Duffer1: Altcoin jborkl
nubbins`: jborkl, helping scammers fleece rubes
nubbins`: or inventing the future of crypto
ThickAsThieves: in a meta moment i made a meta altcoin
nubbins`: we can't agree
ozbot: The Real Altcoin (ATC) - Never mine another altcoin again.
ThickAsThieves: look the slogan is also the disclaimer
ThickAsThieves: what more can i do
mike_c: btw, i disagree that an honestly run buisness that ends in failure is tarnishing to a reputation.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1200 @ 0.003078 = 3.6936 BTC [-] {4}
ThickAsThieves: are you referring to TAT.VM?
asciilifeform: mike_c: if pump'n'dump is a type of honest business, i'd hate to see what a scam is now
mike_c: he's not pumping & dumping!
nubbins`: mike_c: you disagree that displaying a shocking lack of foresight is tarnishing to a reputation?
nubbins`: jesus
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 147 @ 0.003078 = 0.4525 BTC [-]
benkay: what is this shocking lack of foresight?
mike_c: a shocking lack of foresight? super harsh. a lot of entrepeneurs fail
nubbins`: benkay, mike_c: TAT.VM
nubbins`: [16:07:54] <ThickAsThieves> First, I didn't really realize what would happen, and I really did not intend to harm. However, I do regret it.
ThickAsThieves: i dont regret it as a failure
ThickAsThieves: i'm not sure i'd even call it a failure
nubbins`: maybe you could whip up a regretcoin, premine a bunch, and send them to the rubes who got fleeced
benkay: how was vm a failure?
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: maybe i missed something... but where's the source code?
nubbins`: benkay: it wasn't a failure for TAT
ThickAsThieves: you missed something ;)
benkay: that's part and parcel of the story, asciilifeform. he didn't pay for the source.
nubbins`: mike_c was the one who mentioned failute
nubbins`: *failure
asciilifeform: who in his right mind would run this
ThickAsThieves: i regret that some people really did not understand what they were buying, despite utter transparency
asciilifeform: 7MB is room for all of the world's trojans, etc
nubbins`: do you regret that you really did not understand what you were selling?
ThickAsThieves: which wouldnt be so bad
benkay: nubbins`: it's a perpetual mining bond. pay btc now for a thing that becomes rapidly more useless.
ThickAsThieves: if it werent for the dramatic mining diff changes that came like 1 week after release
nubbins`: benkay: yes, that's correct
ThickAsThieves: i knew what i was selling
asciilifeform: pay for the source?
nubbins`: that's worse
ThickAsThieves: it was spelled out quite clearly
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.12020001 BTC [-]
nubbins`: you knew you were selling overpriced turds?
benkay: it was crystal clear.
asciilifeform: as if it took more than ten minutes to grab a copy of bitcoind src and change the constants
mike_c: do you hate JD too? people have lost more on that then they will ever lose on atc.
nubbins`: [16:07:54] <ThickAsThieves> First, I didn't really realize what would happen
nubbins`: [16:14:38] <ThickAsThieves> i knew what i was selling
mike_c: and people don't "understand" volatility or EV
ThickAsThieves: am i a criminal for profiting off jurov when he did the opposite?
benkay: yes well this is the world in which we live, asciilifeform. people can't grep source and depend on web apps to make altcoins from them.
ThickAsThieves: i sold mining futures
nubbins`: i'm not saying you're a criminal, i'm saying you're hurting other people as well as yourself
ThickAsThieves: oh i did not hurt myself
asciilifeform: i changed my mind. we should all love Altcoin. anyone who runs a 7MB turd of unknown provenance deserves the lessons contained therein.
ThickAsThieves: i gained some very valuable experience
nubbins`: oh, you hurt yourself, even if you don't realize it yet
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: i hope you stuffed some serious 0day strange in there.
ThickAsThieves: i didnt even make it
ThickAsThieves: bluematt did
nubbins`: "i didn't put the razor in the apple, i just gave it to the kid"
mike_c: now that they are making a mistake out of security ignorance instead of financial ignorance it's better :)
nubbins`: we're going to run out of soap if this hand-washing continues
mike_c: we're already out of soap boxes.
nubbins`: oh, zing
mike_c: hehe
nubbins`: luckily everyone's already standing on one
ThickAsThieves: consider also that tatvm enabled me to do every release after it
ThickAsThieves: xbond, neo
nubbins`: consider that pirate's scam enabled him to buy a bunch of blow
ThickAsThieves: so xbond was blow?
nubbins`: consider that tatvm has tainted everything you've done since
ThickAsThieves: and your integrity is flawless?
ThickAsThieves: so basically i hath been judged by nubbins long ago?
nubbins`: go dig up some dirt on me, i'll wait here
nubbins`: and basically, yep
ThickAsThieves: good to know i guess
nubbins`: good to know if you take something away from it
nubbins`: useless to know otherwise
Duffer1: i still <3 you TaT
Duffer1: another haiku!
TomServo: Well fascinating conversation, either way.
nubbins`: indeed
mike_c: roosevelt had something to say about this
nubbins`: mike_c: did he say "if your friends have to issue public warnings not to invest in things you create, you're probably a legit businessman with a future"?
TomServo: Something I think asciilifeform touched on, judging the merits of all cryptocurrencies... isn't hashrate pretty much the end-all-be-all?
mike_c: i don't think that was it
asciilifeform: TomServo: hash rate isn't all of it. lack of seigniorage is another.
nubbins`: mike_c: i'm terrible with quotes
mike_c: i have had friends start buisnesses that i would not invest in. that didn't make them scum.
TomServo: asciilifeform: Ah yes, with that being equal though?
mike_c: why do i keep misspelling business?
asciilifeform: there's a difference between 'use my thing. because it's better' and 'use my thing. it's better, really. and oh btw, if you buy in it will pay for my 1kg/day coke habit.'
TomServo: I thought it was pretty interesting to see the LTC DOGE hashrate intersect, and then re-intersect and what those implications might be.
mike_c: yeah, tat is rolling in blow from atc.
asciilifeform: seigniorage is an actual problem. i personally know perfectly reasonable, intelligent people who won't go near btc because of Satoshi's coins.
kakobrekla: TomServo the implication is, people can get fooled more than once
nubbins`: good a time for a break as any
nubbins`: coffee!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.1282 BTC [+]
pankkake: I give up on making a source for Altcoin… I don't understand why it orphans the blocks
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 252 @ 0.00307 = 0.7736 BTC [+]
pankkake: the only thing I didn't chaneg is[0].scriptSig and I have no idea what it is, if it matters, and how to find its value
pankkake: OK maybe I can get it in the first transaction, which seems isn't me… weird
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 2 @ 0.06999 = 0.14 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40250 @ 0.00086847 = 34.9559 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 200 @ 0.00084288 = 0.1686 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24350 @ 0.00086705 = 21.1127 BTC [-]
nubbins`: bee bee el, pan-frying cod
pankkake: lol getrawtranscation doesn't work for the firt tx it seems
pankkake: meh, anyway I don't know what to do with it
pankkake: waste of time :(
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 200 @ 0.0008429 = 0.1686 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 240 @ 0.0008429 = 0.2023 BTC [+]
the20year: Tomorrow is the big day :D
Duffer1: just reopening trading or are you going for another round of financing?
Duffer1: have i asked that?
the20year: another round of funding via havelock
Duffer1: ah ok
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19950 @ 0.00086705 = 17.2976 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.19376446 = 0.3875 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 36 @ 0.00302808 = 0.109 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13450 @ 0.0008684 = 11.68 BTC [+] {2}
benkay: man fuck a gym. just keep free weights at your house and fuckin' use 'em.
TomServo: Dangit. I got pulled away.
nubbins`: benkay: i use the gym for the bikes in winter :)
TomServo: asciilifeform: I somehow mis-read seigniorage as sovereign, so derp on my part. But I see your point.
benkay: nubbins`: are you a cardio guy?
chipug: there's a parody keiser coin now?!
TomServo: Not sure it's a parody.
nubbins`: benkay: i'm a bike guy :D
nubbins`: too treacherous outside to ride in the winter tho, even with studded tires
benkay: i love bikes
ozbot: Fat Sand Fat Cruiser
benkay: ozbot is back!
benkay: .bait
nubbins`: i see a bike around town sometimes with wheels like that
ozbot: Skinny Puppy Wants Compensation For Music Used in US Interrogations - Slashdot
TomServo: nubbins`: saw that, my sides.
nubbins`: ^ one of canada's greatest musical exports
nubbins`: five bucks says they used BRAP vols. 3/4
nubbins`: wow, ALL the comments so far are about the "new look" of /.
nubbins`: do they even internet?
TomServo: I know, it's crazy.
TomServo: Every story.
nubbins`: ahahahah
nubbins`: lel @ name
benkay: dudes does anyone know where the initial peers are stored in the litecoin codebase?
TomServo: chipug: Oh, hadn't seen that. I thought you meant Max's actual coin.
chipug: TomServo: no i think this just popped up today in response to maxcoin
chipug: max keiser's twitter page gives me a headache
ThickAsThieves: I swear it wasn't me!
Duffer1: hehe
chipug: ThickAsThieves: ..... you suuuure??
chipug: lol
Duffer1: even odds it's someone from this chan
chipug: i love the banana
chipug: please put nipple tassles on him also!!
asciilifeform: from the circus:
ThickAsThieves: [16:06] <BlueMatt> sorry for the delay.....
ThickAsThieves: [16:07] <BlueMatt> anyway, the coin is gonna rebuild with a slightly different genesis block
ThickAsThieves: [16:07] <BlueMatt> the original download can be found at instead of
ThickAsThieves: [16:07] <BlueMatt> well, all you have to do is figure out the genesis block change
ThickAsThieves: [16:07] <BlueMatt> but, I dont have a way to readily do that
ThickAsThieves: [16:08] <ThickAsThieves> but the person that dumped the genblock can?
ThickAsThieves: [16:08] <BlueMatt> sure
ThickAsThieves: in case you still have any fight left in you pankakke ^
pankkake: well, that won't really help me, as I only tried the genesis block change and other magic values, no renaming etc. before I was sure it worked
ThickAsThieves: maybe it was something bad about the source you worked from?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.12820001 = 0.5128 BTC [+]
chipug: asciilifeform: what was that?
asciilifeform: chipug: trial of u.s. sailor. described in
chipug: thanks
Namworld: It looks like Bitfinex just fixed the glitch and are back in business and everyone is happy or something.
Namworld: And that nothing was stolen =/
Namworld: Okay... I was expecting them to have long gone under.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 303 @ 0.00300357 = 0.9101 BTC [-] {12}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 623 @ 0.00309335 = 1.9272 BTC [+] {6}
Duffer1: or run with the money
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 376 @ 0.0031 = 1.1656 BTC [+] {2}
dexX7: there were coins stolen?
Apocalyptic: Namworld, they gonna slowly recover the stolen part with the fees and delay payouts if necessary imo
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11500 @ 0.00086788 = 9.9806 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 2000 @ 0.00312134 = 6.2427 BTC [+] {5}
nubbins`: making dinner, recipe calls for a lightly beaten egg
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 351 @ 0.00312699 = 1.0976 BTC [+]
nubbins`: so i announce "i like my women the way i like my eggs!!"
nubbins`: wife says "lightly beaten?!"
nubbins`: and i say "no, white"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 36 @ 0.00312699 = 0.1126 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 22 @ 0.04999991 = 1.1 BTC [-] {2}
dub: poached, scrambled and scotch?
dub: fertilised?
TomServo: mmm. scotch.
TomServo: There's a Laphroaig in my near future.
nubbins`: lovely
nubbins`: the trick with these "the way i like my women" jokes is to fool people into assuming the wrong thing
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 15 @ 0.04070104 = 0.6105 BTC [-] {5}
nubbins`: i like my coffee the way i like my women!
nubbins`: "hot?"
nubbins`: "nope. strong, black, and slightly bitter"
pankkake: The company also reported a net loss of $645m
ozbot: BBC News - Shares in Twitter plummet after user growth slows
ThickAsThieves: just when i started using it!
dub: its coz I stopped using twitter
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 349 @ 0.00172845 = 0.6032 BTC [-]
Rick_: any one can reach mircea?
Duffer1: anything we might be able to help you with?
Rick_: i withdrawed some btc
Rick_: but i cant reach him now
Duffer1: do you know how to send a PM?
Rick_: no
Rick_: how
Duffer1: <---double click his name, type stuff in the new window, he'll probably get back to you when he's around
dub: you could try emailing
Rick_: i used query,but he seems not there
Rick_: I emailed him yesterday,no reply yet
dub: withdrawals are not automatic in case you were wondering, usually processed daily iirc
Rick_: he is not here for last hours?
dub: ;;seen mircea_popescu
gribble: mircea_popescu was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 7 hours, 49 minutes, and 14 seconds ago: <mircea_popescu> but anyway. got shit to do so, later.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14095 @ 0.00086853 = 12.2419 BTC [+]
Rick_: okay,thank you everyonw
Rick_: everyone
KRS-One: .bait
pankkake: nipplelicious
KRS-One: .bait
ThickAsThieves: pankakke, plz note pm, in case you missed it
pankkake: I saw it, I'm working
KRS-One: those are the kind of girls that when you see them wake up in the morning without the hair and makeup they look like hell
ThickAsThieves: cool cool
pankkake: actually it seems you were right, using the source from bluematt seems to WORK!!
ThickAsThieves: i jate being right
pankkake: some of the magic changed values I guessed were already changed, including the one I couldn't figure out
pankkake: and now it's syncing
dub: Please be advised that BTC on MtGox are not fractional.
dub: we just don't have enough to cash erryone out
ThickAsThieves: but how will we send small transactions!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6900 @ 0.00086853 = 5.9929 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: guess we'll have to use altcoins
dub: Im long doge
dub: in anticipation
benkay: in case your curious what kind of work i do, client number one just cut over and emerged from embargo
benkay: you're
ThickAsThieves: you build carts?
dub: you fuck plants?
truffles: you're curious?
ThickAsThieves: well i'm vegan at least
truffles: oh no
benkay: we dragged the frontend kicking and screaming into 2014, dragged an ancient django application from 1.2 to 1.4, delivered myriad performance improvements totalling in excess of 10x across the whole stack, and implemented distributed work queues to decrease the risk of large data processing jobs
ThickAsThieves: it looks nice
mike_c: why 1.4 instead of 1.6?
ThickAsThieves: i wouldnt even feel scammed if i sent them money
ThickAsThieves: hmm it's not even a cart
benkay: the next development iteration is going to focus on putting a 'buy' button next to each plant, redesigning the remaining pages that look like they're from 2006, taking people's money when they do click buy and turning into a plant on their doorstep, using the 56+ nurseries the site owner already has relationships with for distributed development
KRS-One: fuck plants, they are boring.
benkay: distributed fulfillment
mike_c: boring is good. no scooping poop.
truffles: plants take work man
Duffer1: infinite scroll would be nice
benkay: 1.4 was necessary for some particular features, i forget what precisely. chose to not go all the way to 1.6 to mitigate risk.
benkay: oh yeah, did i mention the stack automation and rearchitecture?
Duffer1: it's a great looking sight though, i love the homepage
benkay: there was enough risk in this project that 1.6 made me uncomfortable and i stopped the upgrade at the release that bought us the features we needed.
truffles: they should have a subcategory "exotic plants"
benkay: thanks! the owner did the wires and we implemented it.
benkay: anyways, we have availability for other projects.
mike_c: i upgraded to 1.6 recently without many bumps. but i think i went from 1.4, so less risk
truffles: fruits*
ThickAsThieves: benkay, have you ever done anything in online education software
mike_c: bitcointalk is unusable. if only they had thousands of btc to improve the site with.
benkay: i've played with plenty.
benkay: is there something specific to the online education software domain that's not applicable to general webappery?
benkay: what are you curious about?
ThickAsThieves: just having a bad run with the team on it
ThickAsThieves: and the two before that
benkay: ouch
benkay: what's the stack?
ThickAsThieves: i'm pretty far removed from it now
ThickAsThieves: it's LAMP
truffles: wonder how this tastes , looks interesting
ozbot: Solanum muricatum | Pepino Dulce | Pear Melon | Sweet Cucumber| plant lust
benkay: phpbrekla's your man for that
ThickAsThieves: he'd probly cry at this code
dub: I heard tux might be in the market
benkay: company line on php is "we're only interested in the project if the client is prepared to make a large investment in moving away from php"
benkay: that said we can always manage a project and assemble a team for the right price.
benkay: there is a php fee tho :(
ThickAsThieves: the investment, in my eyes, would be in a team that can be counted on and is proficient
ThickAsThieves: the PHP is incidental
pankkake: I used to be in a php shop, but we did pass twice on a project that was simply… impossible to comprehend
ThickAsThieves: of course cost determines all in the end
ThickAsThieves: they are finally installing the new version of the software onto a live server this week
ThickAsThieves: after like 18mos
benkay: ka yikes
benkay: first thing we typically do is set up infrastructure, CI and low-friction deploys.
ThickAsThieves: and I had bigger plans for it, so it needs ongoing work
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11844 @ 0.00086853 = 10.2869 BTC [+]
truffles: too free?
benkay: There is a clear need for governments to be able to hold internet users accountable for their actions if they are engaged in performing or supporting illegal activities.
benkay: my ass
truffles: end of irc?
benkay: there is a clear need for networks that route around governments.
dub: cracknet at it again
benkay: anyways, thanks for enduring my pitch, -assets.
ozbot: April Jones: Matthew Woods jailed over explicit Facebook comments | UK news | The Guardian
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
ThickAsThieves: benkay i was considering a business path of: 1. Implement and use it with this school, work out bugs, add anything obviously needed 2. Approach several clients in other training fields (Hazardous Goods Shipping for example) and offer hosted solutions, making the software cater to more industries 3. Convert to SaaS DIY Training Lesson Builder
ThickAsThieves: it's been a while since i looked into possible competition though
benkay: sounds like a great model
benkay: eh i wouldn't worry about competition. instead, focus on landing clients, making them happy and taking their money.
ThickAsThieves: well as things form i may hit you up for costing
dub: Duffer1: oh boy
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 100 @ 0.0031191 = 0.3119 BTC [+] {2}
dub: wake up the philosoraptor
truffles: " we have contacted or been contacted by law enforcement agencies and provided our co-operation" but why :(
truffles: irc srs biz
ThickAsThieves: whats that truffles?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 49 @ 0.0031 = 0.1519 BTC [-]
truffles: didnt know these networks would invovle law into matters with users
Duffer1: TaT it's from Jurov's link above
Duffer1: GCHQ ddosing irc
jayk: government?
jayk: yeah quakenet
jayk: lame
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10465 @ 0.00087194 = 9.1249 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 132 @ 0.00084299 = 0.1113 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8800 @ 0.00086976 = 7.6539 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 130 @ 0.00084299 = 0.1096 BTC [+]
pankkake: [2014-02-07 00:11:21] Network difficulty changed to 62.7k (449.0Gh/s)
pankkake: I guess I should still be able to find blocks solo
dub: doge?
pankkake: Altcoin
KRS-One: U guys ready for teh pump
KRS-One: lol@sturles
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 36 @ 0.00301007 = 0.1084 BTC [-] {2}
ThickAsThieves: someone plz confirm i github'd that right
ThickAsThieves: i'm a newb
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 289 @ 0.00300075 = 0.8672 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1000 @ 0.0030003 = 3.0003 BTC [-]
pankkake: that works
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 40 @ 0.00311964 = 0.1248 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13900 @ 0.00086813 = 12.067 BTC [-]
dub: need to make another build box
dub: can't play with the other kids
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18150 @ 0.00086782 = 15.7509 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 300 @ 0.005 = 1.5 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.129 = 0.645 BTC [+]
herbijudlestoids: woah nelly!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.04837803 = 0.4838 BTC [-]
ozbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
herbijudlestoids: hectic..what happened to MPOE
KRS-One: Pussy Riot was on Colbert Report today
KRS-One: something sexy about the cryllic language spoken by young hot womens.
KRS-One: .bait
herbijudlestoids: was there a dividend payout or something?
ozbot: Wozniak To Apple: Consider Building an Android Phone - Slashdot
Duffer1: still wouldn't buy it
ThickAsThieves: Wozniak To Apple: Aren't You Glad I'm Not Your Boss?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13700 @ 0.0008678 = 11.8889 BTC [-] {2}
pankkake: .bait quality bait lately
ThickAsThieves: jinxed it
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04837802 = 0.2419 BTC [-]
herbijudlestoids: so KRS-One did bitfinex come good last night? or still busted?
ThickAsThieves: some lols:
ozbot: iPhone 5 phones destroyed in protest against Apple's anti-Bitcoin actions
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12500 @ 0.00086813 = 10.8516 BTC [+]
herbijudlestoids: ThickAsThieves: lel
punkman1: "There iz only one good substitute for the endearments ov a sister, and that iz the endearments ov sum other pheller's sister."
punkman1: .bait
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2000 @ 0.00086705 = 1.7341 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1350 @ 0.00311923 = 4.211 BTC [+] {13}
benkay: if you're upset about apple not allowing bitcoins on the iphone, you understand neither apple's business models nor bitcoin.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1000 @ 0.00312349 = 3.1235 BTC [+] {2}
wao-ender: price rush
wao-ender: .bait
wao-ender: ThickAsThieves: lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15050 @ 0.00086813 = 13.0654 BTC [+]
pankkake: nice tittoo
ozbot: iPhone 5 phones destroyed in protest against Apple's anti-Bitcoin actions
benkay: dumb and dumberer.
nubbins`: with updated graph
nubbins`: benkay, +1
sypher_: hi all
Duffer1: hello sir
benkay: good evening
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25800 @ 0.00086813 = 22.3978 BTC [+]
sypher_: any hindsight on whats happening now?
benkay: ;;ticker --market btcavg
gribble: BitcoinAverage BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 771.23, Best ask: 773.38, Bid-ask spread: 2.15000, Last trade: 772.88, 24 hour volume: 56992.51, 24 hour low: None, 24 hour high: None, 24 hour vwap: 798.18
benkay: gox is falling apart and everyone's trying to cover?
sypher_: aight.
benkay: dunno man ask a speculator
sypher_: was looking at the gox graph of cleared transactions, few minutes ago they started clearing them in bulk ...
sypher_: or pretending to do so.
benkay: how would they go about pretending to clear them?
sypher_: graph data is coming off their servers afaik.
herbijudlestoids: sypher_: got a link to the graph?
ozbot: Mt.Gox Withdrawals -
benkay: dat average withdrawal size lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14170 @ 0.00086705 = 12.2861 BTC [-]
herbijudlestoids: sypher_: thoughts?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 7386 @ 0.00012998 = 0.96 BTC [+] {4}
herbijudlestoids: to me it looks like they have been clearing the smaller transactions
herbijudlestoids: that is why the avg withdrawal transaction amount is going down
sypher_: herbijudlestoids, i'm just a noob so i may have completely wrong thoughts.
sypher_: I'm thinking that big ones are playing to make it go down so they can buy in cheaper, having it rebound later
herbijudlestoids: well they can already buy it on bitstamp or other exchanges for significantly cheaper than the mtgox price
sypher_: not talking mtgox
sypher_: looking at btce and bitstamp
herbijudlestoids: err no, i meant opinions on the withdrawal transactoins...nevermind
sypher_: sorry, told you, noobish.
sypher_: was just here to try and understand that pattern there ;)
herbijudlestoids: which pattern where
sypher_: btce, big sell orders that aren't getting fulfilled, seems to me that many are panic selling under those and thats driving it down quite a bit
sypher_: then the big sell order gets cancelled and put at a lower price, but not getting fulfilled... doing like that since 165 earlier.
sypher_: 765 sorry.
herbijudlestoids: ignore the orders in the book
herbijudlestoids: real volume hits the market directly
nubbins`: fun fact, if you have btc or usd in mtgox, you're part of the problem! :D
sypher_: glad i don't have them then :-) just bought in at 162 on btce, now I'm in almost panic selling mode. :D
herbijudlestoids: sypher_: my guess is its much simpler and that the price on the shitty exchanges is going down to match the price on the good exchanges
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 3500 @ 0.00013001 = 0.455 BTC [+]
sypher_: herbijudlestoids, name a couple good exchanges?
nubbins`: ^ trick question
sypher_: lol, why is that nubbins` ?
nubbins`: obvious answer is correct one ;D
sypher_: haha. :)
herbijudlestoids: the ones clearing transactions successfully, at high volume and with no regulatory issues
herbijudlestoids: check the bid/ask spread to see which has the narrowest and most liquid spread
sypher_: seems like naming them is out of the etiquette here, sorry for the question, didn't know
sypher_: will do
nubbins`: i kid
herbijudlestoids: its not out of etiquette, i dunno for sure so im not gonna name a name
Duffer1: the point was there aren't any to name hehe
nubbins`: implication is that there aren't good exchanges, just varying degrees of shitty
herbijudlestoids: like i said, you can verify quantitatively by analysis of the bdi/ask spread
sypher_: ah, got you guys, thanks for the hand holding
herbijudlestoids: on mtgox right now the spread is $5, bitfinex $0 bitstamp $2, btc $1 and icbit $4
herbijudlestoids: so i would just discard mtgox and icbit for analysis, concentrate on the liquidity of the spread for bitfinex and bitstamp
herbijudlestoids: err s/btc/btce
sypher_: why excluding btce?
sypher_: i mean, why only bitfinex and bistamp, not btce?
herbijudlestoids: i did include btce sorry, there was a typo
herbijudlestoids: use yer brain
sypher_: ;) i meant on the one that you would concentrate ;)
herbijudlestoids: use your brain, interpret what im saying. dont let a typo trip you up
sypher_: aight :)
herbijudlestoids: i feel like the space left by and coldcoins is an interesting space
herbijudlestoids: any thoughts on what it might take to do it right?
Duffer1: don't live in the US?
sypher_: lol
Duffer1: comply with your local money transmitter laws and you're probably ok
herbijudlestoids: so, sell on darkmarkets instead? lol
punkman1: why do you think physical coins are interesting?
herbijudlestoids: not so much physical coins as metal (i.e. fireproof) cold storage
herbijudlestoids: i think its interesting because its a necessary dimension for all who might want to save bitcoins securely for a long duration
punkman1: I don't see the advantage
herbijudlestoids: where is mircea_popescu when you need him
herbijudlestoids: punkman1: advantage over...a USB key?
sypher_: herbijudlestoids, wouldn't it just be simpler to print it yourself instead of a metal trinket with an embedded key somewhere?
punkman1: sure
herbijudlestoids: sypher_: if you print it, ink fades, paper burns, etc
herbijudlestoids: punkman1: well lets say i put 1,000 BTC into a USB key and encrypt it securely etc and then my house burns down
punkman1: why would you not have a backup of that?
Duffer1: casc coins don't solve that herb hehe
sypher_: herbijudlestoids, chroma life 100years, printed on photographic paper; USB key with a backup in a bank safety box
herbijudlestoids: Duffer1: les casc and more cold in that use case
Duffer1: mill out a qr code on aluminum would do nicely
sypher_: but i do like the idea of metal coins; if only, as 'ego' items ...
punkman1: herbijudlestoids: I think it's a solution looking for a problem
sypher_: i also dig the usb - bit coin enabled key on almost human tv series :-)
herbijudlestoids: punkman1: appreciate the opinion :)
herbijudlestoids: its well out of my realm of understanding
punkman1: it's pretty much the same as backing up any other piece of data
punkman1: if your house burns down, you got fetch it from the offsite backup
herbijudlestoids: i guess i get what youre saying, that having the wallet files stored in multiple locations securely is probly as good as a cold storage device itself
punkman1: wallet file, long brainwallet key, whatever
sypher_: and I'm back in fiat.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8873 @ 0.00086703 = 7.6932 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 94 @ 0.00313499 = 0.2947 BTC [-]
nubbins`: herbijudlestoids: an embossed labelmaker with some aluminum ribbon, say
herbijudlestoids: nubbins`: why not, for example, laser engraving direct to steel?
asciilifeform: simple recipe:
asciilifeform: etch a circuit board
nubbins`: sure, bit of a higher barrier to entry.
nubbins`: i don't have a laser
asciilifeform: about $50 in supplies
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7000 @ 0.00086813 = 6.0769 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: fiberglass will last centuries, copper might corrode but will still be readable.
asciilifeform: (gold plate it if you want to be sure.)
nubbins`: don't you need caustic chemicals for that?
herbijudlestoids: but how does it handle in a fire asciilifeform? :D
asciilifeform: handles great in fire.
asciilifeform: will look very ugly but keep its shape.
nubbins`: hm, i'm obviously not up to speed
herbijudlestoids: hmmm, i havent etched a board since i was in high school
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 27 @ 0.005 = 0.135 BTC
asciilifeform: ferric chloride will do
nubbins`: wait, you said no corrosive chems!
asciilifeform: corrosive to copper, that's it
nubbins`: not manflesh?
asciilifeform: not particularly.
asciilifeform: don't eat it.
nubbins`: interesting
ThickAsThieves: read-only
sypher_: russia seems gone >_>
nubbins`: mydoge on ios
nubbins`: ah, my sides
nubbins`: smash all the things!
nubbins`: ^ read that, actually not bad
nubbins`: canada post already sells numismatic coins from the mint
nubbins`: and postal money orders, of course
nubbins`: so it's not a huge leap
sypher_: was reading about the USPS but its just a few talks atm, even the article itself is cautious
nubbins`: high-level meeting
KRS-One: such wow. much credibility.
nubbins`: KRS-One, scroll up nine lines.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4882 @ 0.00086813 = 4.2382 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 21 @ 0.005 = 0.105 BTC {2}
ozbot: Silver Gold Bull - 1 oz 2014 BitCON Silver Round - Silver
nubbins`: another lame round from Silver Beatoff Silver Shit
sypher_: uff, when's it gonna stop falling ... i wanna go to sleep! ... >_>
herbijudlestoids: sypher_: what kind of games are you playing that youre losing sleep over the movement
sypher_: nothing, just excited to see the troll box on BTCe with all the boys shouting ... i just wanna buy back in when its gonna stop fallin; exited at a loss some time ago.
herbijudlestoids: what price did you want to buy at?
sypher_: 722 would be my target
herbijudlestoids: why not do a options spread on MPex? short the 722 puts
herbijudlestoids: and long whatever appropriately derisks you
herbijudlestoids: price goes to 722 and you get exercised, if not collect premium
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9800 @ 0.00086838 = 8.5101 BTC [+] {2}
sypher_: you're way over my understanding grade. I'm at the 'buy low; sell high' phase; which i could translate in 'i'm an idiot'. :-)
herbijudlestoids: options give you the right but not the obligation to long/short the underlying asset at a given strike price and date ...e.g the option to long BTCUSD at 1000 regardless of the price as of Jan 2014
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7400 @ 0.00086849 = 6.4268 BTC [+]
herbijudlestoids: option to long is a call, option to short is a put. if you sell a put, youre selling the right for someone to short at a given price
herbijudlestoids: so you sell someone the contract which gives them the right to short BTCUSD at 722. they will never exercise this contract unless the price is <= 722
KRS-One: heh thanks nubbins`
KRS-One: oops
herbijudlestoids: if the contract expires or the price doesnt go below 722, you get to keep the "premium", the cost of the contract you sold
herbijudlestoids: if it does, then they exercise and short BTCUSD at 722, leaving you long BTCUSD at 722
herbijudlestoids: i dun know if MPEX supports naked short the contracts, looks like they only allow you to do what they call a SPLIT order, otherwise known as an options spread, so you short the 722 puts and long some distant strike call, like 1000 calls.
nubbins`: sorry for the stupid question, but i'm exceptionally thick with this sort of thing
nubbins`: that orgy of puts that was purchased the other day
nubbins`: purchaser is expecting btc to fall below ~500 or whatever it was?
herbijudlestoids: its impossible to tell really
herbijudlestoids: they could be insuring long contracts on another exchange or other options
herbijudlestoids: maybe they hold 1000BTC on bitstamp and want to insure against the price going below 500
nubbins`: slightly different question, purchaser profits if btc falls below 500?
herbijudlestoids: depends entirely on implied vol
nubbins`: just based on those actions
herbijudlestoids: if the price goes to 500 but IV when puts were purchased was at 50% and goes down to 20% then the puts might still be worthless
benkay: herbijudlestoids: no naked shorts on MPEx.
herbijudlestoids: value of option includes delta, theta, vega etc
sypher_: herbijudlestoids, thanks for the explanation, I'm trying to get my head around it
herbijudlestoids: nubbins`: buying puts tends to be more of a call on IV than anything else...term structure also plays a part in profit, take a look at the NYSE listed VXX ETF versus VIX for an example of what term structure being in contango can do to a rolling IV long
dexX7: huh wasn't it the other way around aka. this guy sold puts?
herbijudlestoids: well, someone obviously sold the puts to the buyer
herbijudlestoids: if there is no naked puts then they must have been written against something
dexX7: the guyer was mpex/oe?
herbijudlestoids: i doubt its possible to know
nubbins`: afaik mpoe uses bond deposits to back options
nubbins`: although i'm barely at the level of understanding what i just said
herbijudlestoids: no i think youre correct, but i dont know anything about it specifically
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
dexX7: soo.. if i understand correctly, when the price goes up, this guy wins, right?
dexX7: just to be sure hehe
nubbins`: no idea anymore
herbijudlestoids: so the trader is shorting BTCUSD 500 puts
herbijudlestoids: the trade is a bet on IV being high and leveling off or going down, and that they wont get exercised (i.e. the price wont go below 500)
herbijudlestoids: if BTCUSD goes to 1200 in 1s then IV will go up and the value of the puts will increase commensurately...when puts are fare OTM (out of the money) then their intrinsic value is mostly comprised of IV
herbijudlestoids: if BTCUSD stays at 750 for 2 weeks without budging and IV goes down then the value of the puts goes down and whoever short them profits
herbijudlestoids: IV==implied volatility
herbijudlestoids: am i making sense?
herbijudlestoids: the value of the option isnt dependent just on price
nubbins`: you're talking about a foot above my head here, but the failing is mine, not yours
sypher_: nubbins`, think about how i feel; knowing that you're a whole 2 legs over my head. :-)
nubbins`: i'm a tall man :D
herbijudlestoids: there is no set in stone method to calculate the value of an option. there is the black scholes model which has its proponents and detractors. regardless of which model you use, there is a bunch of standard inputs called the greeks
nubbins`: sure
herbijudlestoids: delta, vega, theta, rho
herbijudlestoids: there is also some others like lambda and gamma, depending on your model
herbijudlestoids: now aside from all of this, there is the current market price that the options are worth
herbijudlestoids: lets stick with the example of a JAN 2015 $2000 BTCUSD CALL
nubbins`: okay
herbijudlestoids: the market price of the options "imply" what the market is considering the value of those greeks will be at settlement
nubbins`: the greeks are seismographs, for lack of a better analogy, correct?
herbijudlestoids: does that make sense? the market price of any given option might be very far away from what your model reckons it should be
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10050 @ 0.00086849 = 8.7283 BTC [+]
nubbins`: yes, sure
herbijudlestoids: so the market is implying, forecasting, trying to get the best price for what they think the options are worth
herbijudlestoids: the forecast isnt just for where the price of BTCUSD will be relativeto $2000 in a years time
herbijudlestoids: its also forecasting vega, delta etc
herbijudlestoids: some of the greeks are numeric values that you can simply calculate, like theta, which is the time value of the option.
herbijudlestoids: depending how far ITM/OTM (in the money or out of the money) the option is depends on what the market price of the option actually consists of
herbijudlestoids: for example, if the option is far OTM (e.g. the price of BTCUSD is $1 and the call is for $2000) then the value of the option will consist mostly of vega and theta (which is decaying as time goes on)
nubbins`: is it fair to say that the price of a given option indicates not only an expectation of price, but of volatility?
herbijudlestoids: like i said, depends how far ITM/OTM
benkay: yes. that is a core valuation principle.
benkay: sometimes a heavier factor than other times.
herbijudlestoids: now options have some synthetic equivalency
sypher_: uhm.
sypher_: herbijudlestoids, nubbins`, got an account at gox?
herbijudlestoids: i.e. shorting a $2000 call has the same/similar payoff profile (at settlement) to long $2000 put
herbijudlestoids: sypher_: no
herbijudlestoids: i own 0.02BTC
sypher_: there's a kinda bad news I'm reading on the troll box
herbijudlestoids: pastebin it
sypher_: gox hacked
herbijudlestoids: pastebin!
copumpkin: isn't that hte old one?
ozbot: Twitter / revishere: RT @deletesec: @MtGox ...
nubbins`: that tweet is from yesterday
nubbins`: and to answer your question, no, i don't have an account at gox
copumpkin: the tweet might be
copumpkin: but is the list ancient?
dexX7: it's the old one from 2011
dexX7: matches one to one
copumpkin: yeah
sypher_: then fake >_>
dexX7: yup fake. if you want to compare the lists
herbijudlestoids: nubbins`: need more or make sense now?
nubbins`: herbijudlestoids, that clarifies things a bit, but i think what i really need is to visit the library
herbijudlestoids: nubbins`: there is this awesome blogger bill luby, he does ...hardcore options geekery explained for the masses.
herbijudlestoids: mostly for regular markets but its all the same maths
nubbins`: ah, like the Scientific American of finance
herbijudlestoids: i actually got a kickass long vol model for NYSE index ETFs, probly wouldnt work on MPex
mike_c: nubbins, options are entirely about volatility. option pricing is "known", with volatility being the only variable in the equation.
herbijudlestoids: nubbins`: one last point is that you can build positions that are much more dependent on IV than price, for example if i buy a call and buy a put for the same strike and expiry
herbijudlestoids: mike_c: err, well the underlying price isnt known :P
mike_c: strike price is known, spot price is known
mike_c: IV is the only variable
herbijudlestoids: lemme know how your IV only model works if MPBOR decides to move or whatever
mike_c: :) are you saying mpbor is a risk-free interest rate?
herbijudlestoids: well in the case of MPex options are you saying there is no rho?
herbijudlestoids: is the market so locally inefficient that price forecasting ability plays no role in alpha generation?
benkay: lol mpbonds risk free
mike_c: sry herb, yes. i am saying rho=0
herbijudlestoids: well in that case ok
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6700 @ 0.00086849 = 5.8189 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.496 = 0.992 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 1 @ 0.13 BTC [+]
nubbins`: ;;seen thestringpuller
gribble: thestringpuller was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 week, 3 days, 8 hours, 1 minute, and 56 seconds ago: <thestringpuller> ;;ticker
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5294 @ 0.00086763 = 4.5932 BTC [-]
mod6: $vwap ^OIX
mpexbot: mod6: ^OIX 1 day: no data 7 day: average: 106.61730011 high: 106.48204971 low: 122.22370491 volume: 1556 btc: 33.85537371 30 day: no data
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 62 @ 0.003135 = 0.1944 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8880 @ 0.00086849 = 7.7122 BTC [+]
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