Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2025-09-27 ↓
jonsykkel[asciilifeform]: im dont understand this part
jonsykkel[asciilifeform]: if a squaring costs 0.49 of a multiplication, and the adition subtractions and bitshift each cost 0.01 of a multiplication, u get 0.49*2+0.01*4 = 1.02
asciilifeform: jonsykkel: from where these numbers ?
asciilifeform: also take note, in the text, of 'asymptotically cheaper'
asciilifeform: (i.e. for very large integers, cost of addition/subtraction is basically 0 -- it happens as fast as you can read'em outta ram -- vs. cost of multiplications)
jonsykkel[asciilifeform]: i invented the numbers, as i understand ur logic, ur saying the fact that u can replace any multiplication with this difrence of squarings thing means necesarily that the squareings cant be cheaper than 0.5 of a multiplication, since u could then replace the x*y with a ((x+y)^2-(x-y)^2)>>2. but it ignores the cost of + - >
jonsykkel[asciilifeform]: thats proly true in practice yes
asciilifeform: jonsykkel: entirely correct, we ignore cost of +/- as width -> inf
asciilifeform: that's what means 'asymptotically' there.
asciilifeform: what's you been up to , jonsykkel , other than working through asciilifeform's proofs ?
asciilifeform for his part -- deep in fpga deserts, for some time nao
jonsykkel[asciilifeform]: aha, saltmine? ive been up to various non-computer stuf. making video game now, need a rsa for it, so geting bak to ffa
asciilifeform: naa, not salt mine, fwiw
asciilifeform: left the salt mines (hopefully, perma-left)
jonsykkel[asciilifeform]: gona turn it into #1 global esport, become brillionaire. maybe i fund ur computronium cube computer reserch
jonsykkel[asciilifeform]: nice, dats good
asciilifeform gonna have to upload the xgcd chapter at some pt before jonsykkel gets to where it's reqd
asciilifeform: w/out it, no key genning
asciilifeform: errything else afaik is there
billymg[asciilifeform]: awt: hard to disagree with that assessment. trump naming soros is the whitepill though, the administration doesn't have to win street fights if they can take out the financiers. i think trump et al. understand at this point, after the CK assassination and the attempt on trump, that the left is no longer just "playing polit
billymg[asciilifeform]: the desire for self-preservation ought to serve as sufficient motivation for them to wipe out the radical left, but for real this time
billymg[asciilifeform]: and if not, god help us all. but to me it looks like they know what's at stake
asciilifeform: afaik there's been no 'the left'(tm) worth mentioning in the reich since, idk, 1968. what there is instead: the lizards & their 'manchurian candidates'
asciilifeform: (typically includes both shooter and sacrificial lamb, e.g. that CK type who asciilifeform never heard of until kaput and river of crocodile tears from seemingly erry avail mouthpiece)
billymg[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: i also didn't know much about charlie kirk prior to his death. had heard of him, knew he was some right-wing commentator/proponent, but didn't know much beyond that
billymg[asciilifeform]: but after his murder it became clear why the left had such a hard-on for him, he was preaching blasphemy in their churches (the universities), and it was working
awt_akris[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: CK was flying under the radar - seems to have been very influential in getting trump elected and pushing various non-retard policies. My daughter knew who he was and she's 14. I thought he was just another podcaster debate me bro.
billymg[asciilifeform]: the youth, especially the males, were given an alternative to the demoralizing proposition of being forced to pretend that men can give birth
billymg[asciilifeform]: and other absurdities pushed by the left to demoralize sane normies
asciilifeform: awt: nfi, simply noting that not heard of subj prior to when he was plugged
awt_akris[asciilifeform]: Idk about no left - judiciary, universities, corps, all leftist.
asciilifeform: billymg: ~were~ they 'given alternative' tho? or simply thrown a bone?
billymg[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: if the defecting group is large enough, can defect and still live normal life
awt_akris[asciilifeform]: my taxes in california feel very leftist
asciilifeform: awt: they're reichist, rather than 'leftist'. (what's 'leftist' about e.g. sending $maxint to ukronazis, for instance?)
awt_akris[asciilifeform]: need moar leftists
awt_akris[asciilifeform]: ukraine is weird - end result is leftist though - more dead white christians
billymg[asciilifeform]: letting in the third world helps keep the anarcho-tyranny engine running
asciilifeform: for example -- 20th c. leftists would've been very puzzled re e.g. the ongoing effort to bankrupt reich's welfare coffers by letting in 'all of mexico'
asciilifeform: simply imho the 20th c 'polit compass' is not useful currently, is behaving as rng rather than compass.
billymg[asciilifeform]: direct dekulakization too obvious, let the hordes of poors do the dirty work, selectively enforce the law so that crime is legal and defense against crime is illegal
billymg[asciilifeform]: dekulakization is leftist
billymg[asciilifeform]: so yes, seeing leftism run rampant across all of the west
billymg[asciilifeform]: modern "marriage" and family is also leftist, where man has no power, woman holds divorce gun to his head, state can kidnap children via CPS etc. -- all leftist
asciilifeform: dekulakization -- yes, but expanding nato, reich war machine, fattening lockheed et al & swarm of oligarchs? also 'leftist' ?
asciilifeform: seems as if 'left' & 'right' in reich largely agree re 'state above individual', in its various manifestations
asciilifeform: the only disagreement seems to be -- occasionally -- re which 'enemies of the people' they'd like to use the police state apparatus against
billymg[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: redistributing wealth from those who earn it to oligarchs running the weapons companies, via taxation, seems very leftist, yes
asciilifeform: billymg: not disputing the description of what's currently going on in reich, but rather the usefulness of 'compass' familiar from 20th c
asciilifeform: the trans-xyzs imho not have much to do with the folx who got MG'd by pinkertons for demanding 8hr work day etc
billymg[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: are we talking about "leftism the ideal", as sold by leftists? or what is observed in practice (taking other people's shit)?
asciilifeform: both, tho the bait & the reality of the mousetrap oughta be treated separately
billymg[asciilifeform]: i'm not aware of any historical example where worked as advertised and didn't devolve (or evolve as itended?) into some form of dekulakization. so if reality always follows directly and consistently from 'bait' then i don't see a problem with referencing the bait's label to describe the entire scam
billymg[asciilifeform]: the lizards call it "leftism" and so that's an easy label for me to use as well
awt_akris[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: indeed what made the 3rd reich "right wing"?
asciilifeform: awt: 'blood & soil'(tm)(r) wankage, emphasis (variably performative) on tradition, religion, pedigree, etc. neh
asciilifeform: (in reality n-1st reich was a veeery mixed bag, so actually easy to retro-pain 'left' or 'right' depending on the commenter's inclinations.)
asciilifeform: *retro-paint
asciilifeform: for that matter, post-ww2 part of stalin's reign was in various aspects an anglo 'rightist''s wet dream -- small biz permitted, phamblyvalues, abortion verboten, even sex-separated schools, penmanship wankage, 19th c epaulettes reintroduced, could continue, volumes of examples
awt_akris[asciilifeform]: Seems like then really there hasn't been any "right wing" since the end of WWII. Or possibly WWI.
asciilifeform: the seekrit thing is, the totalitarians won ~everywhere~ -- from physical, rather than political, causes
asciilifeform: until sumbody comes up with 'tesla's death ray' or sumsuch similar means for a small town to win against billion-slave thrall economy & its wunderwaffen -- will continue
asciilifeform: awt: e.g. thailand, or brunei, or saud, arguably qualify. they simply aint world powers
asciilifeform: 'world power' seems to require dekulakizing millions , enthralling'em to the great inca, so as to build rockets/nukes/etc hardware
asciilifeform: nobody seems to get raging hardon for e.g. nepal tho, even while as 'right' as one'd like afaik
asciilifeform: tradition -- respected there! xyz -- 'know their place', again afaik, etc
asciilifeform: not sure what is their tax rate, but doubt is higher than anglotardreich
awt_akris[asciilifeform]: can bugmen be rw?
asciilifeform: hard to get > rw than the confucian bots neh
asciilifeform: in so far as the compass arrows have any kinda philosophical meaning at all
asciilifeform: (rather than 'people i like!'/not symbol)
awt_akris[asciilifeform]: There is a divide on the current "right" between the "wholesome chungus marry fat wife and raise 7 kids" crowd and the "aristocratic" right.
asciilifeform vaguely aware of this, finds lulzy
asciilifeform: where, for instance, ought the 'wholesome fat wife' to get the dough to put the 7 through 100k$/y private school? (or are they to attend plebe school, to be impregnated/shivved/etc there ? )
asciilifeform: there aint a 1952 phactory worker 'makin' enuff to feed 8' for each of these to marry
asciilifeform: or take the 'aristos' (i'ma assume we mean mr. mold et al?) -- where's the certainty that the god emperor they'd like to see enthroned will grant'em all titles ?
asciilifeform: both flavours distinctly, imho, cargo cult.
asciilifeform: quite literally. 'we'll put on these costumes and wave these here flags and douglases fulla delish cargo will surely land'
asciilifeform: the douglases aint coming.
asciilifeform recently got chinese pcb's fabbed, for <$100 for a bag of a+++ au-plated etc. protos, and nao with new taxes it'd be ~500. still <1/2 of what it'd cost to 'made in usa', which remains a lul:
asciilifeform: ... usa suppliers aint even interested in small protos for 'human'. aint worth their time, for the most part.
asciilifeform did 'usa' prev, to see what was like, in '17 was already month+ of phone tag just to get actual conveyor motion, the only thing that worked pronto is them charging asciilifeform's cc
asciilifeform: chinesium -- fully automated, www form, upload shits, 3d later -- mailed
asciilifeform: 0 meat puppet involvement.
billymg[asciilifeform]: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2025-09-28#1035019 << let's not diminish the importance of these symbols in environments where "people i don't like" actively want to kill me and my family
billymg[asciilifeform]: current symbol for "group that wants to kill me" is "the left"
asciilifeform: billymg: the rub is, the 'people you like', also often find equally willing to kill you, not tomorrow but day after, so to speak
asciilifeform: and for some other pretext. but when yer dead yer just as dead
billymg[asciilifeform]: if it ends up that way then that's a problem for tomorrow
billymg[asciilifeform]: more urgent to address problem of today, in order to make it to tomorrow
asciilifeform: the fundamental enemy is the megastate, rather than a particular batch of (largely -- scripted) loonies, is the thing
asciilifeform recalls when 'trans' existed in onesie-twosies and even soviet press discussed'em as scientific curiosities, 'marvels of american tech'
asciilifeform: just about erry su dweller was convinced that 'trans' could birth children, for inst.
asciilifeform: nobody saw one, even on tv, is the thing
asciilifeform still suspects that today's reich 'trans' is simply a rebadging of the ru 'skoptsy' heresy -- folx snipped own balls (and of initiates, sometimes under false pretexts) to get rid of sex drive
billymg[asciilifeform]: the issue with the looney troonz is that they are mentally ill and are being riled up by the left to attack their enemies. so not so much their mere existence, but the way they're being wielded
asciilifeform: billymg: picture yerself as reich emperor (soros if you like). what'll ya do with $maxint d00ds who no longer have any prospect of getting laid ? wait for revolt? so they're snipping'em
billymg[asciilifeform]: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2025-09-28#1035009 << imo we're in uncharted territory here, could be that billion-slave model is becoming less relevant (due to advances in automation)
billymg[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: no disagreement there, the world is drowning in surplus males no doubt
asciilifeform: billymg: observe that 'advances in automation' did not help iran, they had no working air cover for the centrifuges, it'd appear
asciilifeform: reich flattened'em for nth time
asciilifeform: make 1e4 modern jets, aa batts, etc. or no sovereignty, is the thing
asciilifeform: + proper intel, research apparatus (homegrown, not on lease from reich), etc
billymg[asciilifeform]: but i can't take seriously the reich emperor who looks at this problem and looks right past africa and instead sets his crosshairs on the relatively small percentage of whites in western countries
asciilifeform: billymg: crosshairs are on 'people who expect nice things' and hence political risk
asciilifeform: coolies who 'just want crust of bread' are a++ per emperor.
billymg[asciilifeform]: and then what? rule over rubble?
asciilifeform: rule a la brazil, presumably
asciilifeform: or brits in old india
billymg[asciilifeform]: yeah, looks like shit
asciilifeform: mountbatten afaik was quite comfy in india. for him -- 'not shit', eh
asciilifeform: shit for ~errybody else
billymg[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: do you believe in the two competing factions of elites theory?
asciilifeform: billymg: why 2 ? ( which 2 do you suppose they are ? )
billymg[asciilifeform]: yeah, i guess N elite factions
asciilifeform: at this pt there are prolly N
asciilifeform: just as in e.g. sovok circa '89
billymg[asciilifeform]: do you see that as an accurate model or is there only one and any perceived palace conflict is pure theater for masses?
asciilifeform: erry shithole locale has own elite which would like to convert to feodal titular nobility, say
billymg[asciilifeform]: ok let's say in usg.reich then
asciilifeform: billymg: the 'conflicts' you see if you turn on a reichvision set -- theater
billymg[asciilifeform]: one faction of elites in usg, or > 1?
asciilifeform: >1 surely
asciilifeform: for inst., the 'give lockheed et al $1t to do 'star wars'(tm) again' naturally in conflict with 'give $1t to ukrs to deposit in zurich and snort coke for 10k yrs' -- surely in conflict
asciilifeform: whether or not they know they're in conflict
asciilifeform: thing is, people who are exquisitely broken in the head, tend to believe in 'erryone gets what they want', 'lion lies with lamb'
asciilifeform: e.g. 'infinite immigration' somehow together with 'welfare state'
billymg[asciilifeform]: i'm wondering about the coolies vs. "people who expect nice things" sides of the $maxint surplus meat problem
asciilifeform: billymg: see e.g.
billymg[asciilifeform]: so let's say there are two, for simplicity, sets of elite. one says "forget about the coolies, let's first take out those that expect to live one family to a house"
billymg[asciilifeform]: the competing faction says: "hey young man, would you like to take out some coolies for us, you'll get to keep most of the spoils"
asciilifeform: 1 problem: what spoils ?
asciilifeform: what spoils brought back from e.g. afgan ?
billymg[asciilifeform]: idk, terraform africa and south america. the same way settlers without much else going for them in old europe came to america
asciilifeform: fella comes back, takes off his uniform, gets a 'gs' jerb, pushing paper. who paves his street ?
asciilifeform: coolies.
billymg[asciilifeform]: why come back? he stays in south america and breeds the natives
asciilifeform: spain did this in south a. nao shining example of advanced civ there ?
billymg[asciilifeform]: can bring white peasant wife from the US too if he likes
asciilifeform: or e.g frenchies in africa, ditto
asciilifeform: didn't seem to work for producing civ-capable folx, did it
billymg[asciilifeform]: they didn't kill enough of the native males
asciilifeform: in argentina, indians multiplied by 0
asciilifeform: helped ?
billymg[asciilifeform]: i'm not familiar with the indians in argentina reference
asciilifeform: problem: dead folx can't work (so you need new coolies -- or what, the white masters to work in the mines themselves? )
billymg[asciilifeform]: so keep enough around to be slaves
asciilifeform: argentina imported euro-coolies
billymg[asciilifeform]: that seems to be what the chinese are currently doing in africa
asciilifeform: billymg: 1 diff: they're doing it on very compact scale
asciilifeform: i.e. for certain strategic minerals
asciilifeform: rather than trying to occupy the continent & build latifundia etc
asciilifeform also heard various things re the effort not always being +ev for the chinese
asciilifeform: very difficult to get the locals to e.g. maintain so much as a truck in working order, even at gunpoint
billymg[asciilifeform]: "it's all so tiresome" TM (R)
asciilifeform: slaves, as it happens, are actually quite expensive in 'total cost of operation', when you include the fella with the rifle, the slowrolling, untrainability, etc.
asciilifeform: there's a reason wai the white man deprecated'em in 19th c in favour of 'wage slave'
asciilifeform: the latter -- cheaper, moar capable of complex work, and even compete for the chance to serve, train self at own expense, etc
billymg[asciilifeform]: and yet we're now at a point in the west where not even 'opportunity' to wage slave
asciilifeform: because (cribbing here from mp!) 'they're africans, whatever colour they are'
billymg[asciilifeform]: so the elite have a problem on their hands then. too many disaffected/disenfranchised young white males
asciilifeform: this'd be where the various zombification programmes come in, neh.
billymg[asciilifeform]: algo A, currently implemented, is anarcho-tyranny where orcs and looney troonz serve as the weapons
billymg[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: yes, and pacification
asciilifeform: cheap dope, estrogen shots, reddit, etc
asciilifeform: and nobody's holding'em down and forcing, eh, they're queuing up willingly
asciilifeform: like chinese 'opium retired'
billymg[asciilifeform]: large numbers of them, yes
asciilifeform: for that matter, opium per se, iirc, is back
billymg[asciilifeform]: but those that e.g. followed what charlie kirk was pushing are going to the gym, going to church, studying, etc.
billymg[asciilifeform]: a virtuous elite could figure out a way to wield that group
asciilifeform: very easy to gym, church, etc. when the gravy train rolls. what when their god abandons'em (e.g. 'pink slip') ?
asciilifeform: with what pay for gym? etc
asciilifeform: that whole subculture imho quite 'marie antoinette'
asciilifeform lulz at 'youtube influencers' preaching 'value of hard wurk!!111' etc
asciilifeform not aware of anyffin resembling 'virtuous elite' in reich, only of grifters pushing variants of 'become virtuous elite(tm) in 21 days!'
billymg[asciilifeform]: well apparently not "very easy" if the rest are just queuing up for reddit and fent
billymg[asciilifeform]: what i'm trying to get at is i believe there is a less-evil-than-soros faction
billymg[asciilifeform]: so perhaps can't call that "virtuous" but still.. less evil than soros
asciilifeform: in '80s su there was an underground hit song, 'chained with one chain'
asciilifeform: about how various folx, not necessarily evil, but find that they are forced to work evil
asciilifeform: different types, but 'with 1 chain'
asciilifeform: may disagree on various, but ultimately go where chain goes.
billymg[asciilifeform]: not sure i understand
billymg[asciilifeform]: you said >1 faction. are they all equally evil or some more evil than others?
asciilifeform: >1 faction, but all fundamentally agree on most things, e.g. the 'printing press', quarrel only re who gets what % of the moolah train
asciilifeform: there's not a 'let's not print' faction, it's structurally suicidal from elite pov
asciilifeform: (i.e. actual, serious 'not print' would result in rm -rf ~all~ of the current elite factions )
asciilifeform: ditto e.g. 'close nato' -- not at any serious risk of happening, it can only be 'closed' if simply rebranded into sumthing else, else lizard reich comes apart overnight like su
billymg[asciilifeform]: so people wise to that game can now hold btc, and one faction, "the left", is openly hostile to btc holders, the other, "maga", is leaving it alone
asciilifeform: billymg: not quite
asciilifeform: the gruppenfuhrer who gasses 5000 jewz / mo. vs the 1 who stops at only 1000, neither will be invited to 'yad vashem' in israel, eh
asciilifeform: 'maga' has not e.g. removed taxation of btc, nor unplugged the 'fire extinguisher', afaik
asciilifeform: price (adj for the real usd inflation) has been stagnant 4evah
asciilifeform: ( i.e. the 2022 65k was considerably > today's 100+ in puch. power )
billymg[asciilifeform]: does this mean that this is what maga wants, or signs of a power struggle and indication that maga is not yet in complete control?
asciilifeform: but this is how the usa muppet theatre worx, yes, 'pick $party, they only rape you 80% as hard as the other 1'
asciilifeform: billymg: it isn't entirely impossible to distinguish 'not in control' from 'lolnope, never even wanted'
billymg[asciilifeform]: same re: antifa beating up normies in the streets. signs that this is what maga wants, or that maga is not yet in full control?
billymg[asciilifeform]: or any other issue
asciilifeform: so, for instance, theoretically trump could decree 'irs budget for collecting tax on btc sales is now $0', 'blanket pardon a la biden on anyone accused of not paying btc tax', etc
billymg[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: what do you think is more likely then? to me it seems like trump is making a much better go of it this time around but still hasn't fully taken power
asciilifeform: no statutory bar to this afaik (ianal tho)
asciilifeform: he could do it nao. but asciilifeform aint holding breath
billymg[asciilifeform]: if the fire extinguisher is turned off and btc is allowed to 'melt up' then 20% reich tax wouldn't be bad at all
asciilifeform: potus still has, at least on paper, various powers -- for instance, to release any and all seekrit docs
asciilifeform: (all 'classify' in us is, on paper, within presidential decree strictly)
billymg[asciilifeform]: ^ that's the crux of it, 'on paper' is apparently not the same as actual power
asciilifeform: billymg: re btc, was merely giving example of 'what's convince asciilifeform that maga(tm)(r)(c) has come' )
billymg[asciilifeform]: see e.g. deportations and all the roadblocks thrown up by random judges
billymg[asciilifeform]: the left still controls most institutional power
billymg[asciilifeform]: and so trump's 'paper power' is less effective
asciilifeform: billymg: wouldja even know re the deportees wankage if reich media did not amp it ?
billymg[asciilifeform] believes he's aware of this though and working on it
asciilifeform: could see any of it by looking out the window ?
asciilifeform: dun matter how many mexes mr. t deports, or how few, white man will still not be offered 100k$ and 'picket fence house family' to lay asphalt, nao or 10y from nao
billymg[asciilifeform]: idk, would have to ask awt or signpost how things look in their locales
asciilifeform: it's a distraction, in the usual style, like nixon's poodle ('taken as a bribe', also filled tv screens )
asciilifeform: re 'does trump have power' -- the 'good king, evil barons' discourse is as old as recorded history afaik
asciilifeform: 'he'd like to but they won't let' is the meme, today just like was in ru during reign of nik ii
billymg[asciilifeform]: so then there aren't >1 factions
billymg[asciilifeform]: and bullet that whizzed by his ear also part of the show
asciilifeform: nfi, iirc there was a popular version that it was
asciilifeform not followed the subj in detail
billymg[asciilifeform]: what, in asciilifeform's view, would be evidence of "real conflict"?
asciilifeform: say, tanks firing at parliament, a la moscow in '93
asciilifeform: secession of tx, ca, etc
asciilifeform: blanket pardon for whoever plugs an 'enemy of the people'(tm) (fill in the blank as preferred)
asciilifeform: could continue, but imho sketched general idea
billymg[asciilifeform]: gotcha, and would agree
asciilifeform: these are the kinds of rattles of empires actually dying (and new thing being born)
asciilifeform: vs. 'muppet show' dynamics.
billymg[asciilifeform]: sure, at this point it's just down to one's intuition as to whether or not these types of events are approaching
asciilifeform: not on the list, eg.. decrees re which toilets hermaphrodites may shit in. or some pickpocket from guatemala being deported (or not). etc
asciilifeform: will see, neh.
asciilifeform must bbl
billymg[asciilifeform]: imo those are provocations in the lead up to real conflict
← 2025-09-27 ↑
Random(pest) | Download hourly DB snapshot | Get Source Code