asciilifeform: verisimilitude: aside from the gnarly calendar, can't think of any egregiously asinine aspect of traditional euro timekeeping.
asciilifeform: ( afaik last serious attempt at fiddling with it was during french rev, 'metric time', didn't catch on. cuz doesn't win in any clear way. )
asciilifeform: afaik is 1 of those things where any macroscopic change gets you moar headache re backwards-compat. than any possible win.
asciilifeform: the metric units which ~did~ catch on, let you answer practical q's in o(1), e.g. how many kalash rounds it'd take to boil a swimming pool w/ N litres, etc. but there's less clear use from 'how far did light travel from the sun in the time since caesar bit it'
verisimilitude: Time has no relation to moving planets, and it shouldn't be treated that way.
verisimilitude: I didn't yet include the quote, but run 'info date input formats' and read the quote included in the head of that section.
verisimilitude: Well, the command is actually the following: info 'date input formats'
verisimilitude: That's an article with which I'll collect notes and add onto it later, as I think of more.
adlai: joerodgers: LN attacks a problem different than the one attacked by bitcoin! I like to think of LN as an attempt to build some sort of SWIFT / VISA competitor, that uses bitcoin as its backing mechanism, since this viewpoint makes it clear that bitcoin is the bedrock and the others just happen to be structures perched on the surface
adlai: asciilifeform: ultimately, i guess the similarity between git and bitcoin begins and ends with merkle trees
theRealHashBrown: Is Phuctor still active?
theRealHashBrown: Also, is the Common Lisp operating system still being worked on?
theRealHashBrown: Just curious.
adlai: theRealHashBrown: "Phuctor will return!" (see conversations leading up to http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-10-28#1948552 for the details of why/where it went)
snsabot: (trilema) 2019-10-28 asciilifeform: fwiw mp_en_viaje made it quite clear in june '19 that he intends to close snsa. and this was part of the reason why i set up private rack, it will host phuctor in-exile, asciilifeform's www, and anyone else who has the courage and dun insist on marionette control of the entire thing simply as condition of hosting a box or 2.
theRealHashBrown: adlai: Thanks
adlai: i'm not certain what you mean by "the CL os", maybe masamune? the dude working on that vanished a while ago
adlai: there are other people who work on similar projects, mostly each in their own way. sniff around the internet and you'll find them eventually.
theRealHashBrown: The last real news of Loper OS was, I believe, the post about Mueller C Gates.
adlai: ah, that. I do not speak for asciilifeform , wait for a while and he will answer your questions himself.
adlai: alternatively, don't wait around, and read the logs (type /topic to see the IRC channel topic, that is a link to the logs)
theRealHashBrown: Sure. Thanks.
theRealHashBrown: This post contained some really interesting ideas: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1361
theRealHashBrown: I will never forget this part: "if you want ghetto, visit 'Urbit'."
adlai: ghetto? I thought that Moldbug was selling dukedoms!
theRealHashBrown: What really made me lost my respect for Urbit was when the team revised the specification of the foundational assembly-language Nock.
theRealHashBrown: The whole point of Urbit, what justified the entire formula-reduction approach, was the promise that their assembly-language would never change.
feedbot: http://thetarpit.org/2020/obituary << The Tar Pit -- Obituary
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-26#1013257 << hasn't any relation to gears of clock, or state transitions of cesium atom, etc. just the same -- or what am i missing.
snsabot: Logged on 2020-05-26 01:33:10 verisimilitude: Time has no relation to moving planets, and it shouldn't be treated that way.
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-26#1013261 << rather like 'flea uses dog as backing mechanism'.
snsabot: Logged on 2020-05-26 01:47:01 adlai: joerodgers: LN attacks a problem different than the one attacked by bitcoin! I like to think of LN as an attempt to build some sort of SWIFT / VISA competitor, that uses bitcoin as its backing mechanism, since this viewpoint makes it clear that bitcoin is the bedrock and the others just happen to be structures perched on the surface
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-26#1013263 << there's iron installed for it, but no, atm not active. direly in need of rewrite, and i haven't presently time .
snsabot: Logged on 2020-05-26 03:53:04 theRealHashBrown: Is Phuctor still active?
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-26#1013272 << if you (or other reader) know of someone who sells fpga on muller gate , with 100% documented internals, do say. otherwise what's the complaint about ?
snsabot: Logged on 2020-05-26 03:59:32 theRealHashBrown: The last real news of Loper OS was, I believe, the post about Mueller C Gates.
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-26#1013279 << ftr i started to lose interest when realized that their arch cannot be run directly on any physically-plausible machine. i.e. right off the bat.
snsabot: Logged on 2020-05-26 04:32:21 theRealHashBrown: What really made me lost my respect for Urbit was when the team revised the specification of the foundational assembly-language Nock.
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-26#1013278 << afaik i was the 1st to sell secondhand unit. (tbf i haven't much of an idea what happened to the thing since. i still get occasional spam from the co., hence learned of orig. author quitting, and erry coupla months 'we rebooted universe again, sorry', etc , but not much beyond this )
snsabot: Logged on 2020-05-26 04:01:16 adlai: ghetto? I thought that Moldbug was selling dukedoms!
adlai: LN is not just flea, it is the whole ... whatever the correct english plural of flea is. circus?
adlai: (and the lesser fleas, and littler fleas, and so on ad infintem!)
adlai: the one time I had a LN wallet, they made sure to show me that my balance included blahblah.099 satoshis, just in case I needed to pay for every single bubble in the beer
adlai: hairs split by length, then quartered, too
adlai: iirc at one point during a pre-LN discussion, Luke-Jr suggested that rational arithmetic could provide for entirely arbitrary splits, bounded only by the amount of data that the transactor wishes to shit into the transactions
adlai: maybe it was someone else, Luke-Jr is the tonal arithmetic fellow.
asciilifeform: adlai: hilarious idiocy. as if coin fragging were not already a headache. 'let's frag some moar.'
asciilifeform: and iirc that was the fella who complained about shitoshi-dice...
shinohai: it was, luke jr still has built-in blacklist in "knots"
shinohai: (if you `emerge -av bitcoin-qt` it builds specifically with certain "bip flags" pre set to segshit )
asciilifeform: to me, looks rather like yet 9000th pusher of terabyte-blocks-and-three-nodes-run-by-visa-and-paypal 'progress future' .
shinohai: oh yeah, builds WITH -knots flag
asciilifeform never had the slightest interest in building (much less running) that garbage, and never will
shinohai: so if you want vanilla bitcoin-qt with core liquishit syrup, you have to change USE flags.
asciilifeform: why wouldja want it at all, lol
shinohai: ikr?
adlai: iirc, his complaints re:S.DICE were moral, not technical
asciilifeform: adlai: his complaints included 'it frags coin into 'dust'' . i.e. 'ecological' whine.
adlai: hmmm. S.DICE did include single-satoshi confirmation of loss, didn't it :D
adlai: there is high justification for this... if the gambler loses, at least dust is created and everyone loses together with the gambler!
asciilifeform didn't read tardstalk, didn't find lukejr et al interesting then, and still doesn't
adlai read Luke on irc mostly, was still quite active, probably still is, in the "core" channels
asciilifeform: adlai: i never read these, either. nor the astrology or faith-healing chans.
asciilifeform: simply can't think of why to bother .
adlai: ehh, s.dice is interesting, although only as a historic curiosity of early bitcoin businesses
asciilifeform: approx. as interesting as the underground 'numbers games' run in back alleys of usa cities .
adlai: my impression was that they didn't do anything technologically interesting, it was quite a rudimentary usage of bitcoin. for all I know, could've started as Erik manually going through the motions, and then writing a script to automate.
asciilifeform: some farmers farm cows, others farm idiots, it's... a living , of sorts
asciilifeform: very characteristically, 'dice' author moved on to straight-out spam/scam racket. i had 0 sympathy when heard about his dekulakization .
asciilifeform: fwiw i've yet to hear of any 'btc fortune' amassed via anything other than scamming. in that respect very similar to traditional moneys.
asciilifeform: afaik closest thing to 'fortune of honest merchant' was the dope fella's.
asciilifeform: ( and even he, was effectively a shill for usg's tor scamola . and paid for this war crime with own arse. )
adlai: hmm, farm is indeed quite the appropriate "v.,trans." for this kind of activity; c.f. "organizing atheists is like herding cats"
adlai: i'm not familiar with Voorhees's spam racket, although he also founded one of the "account-free instant altcoin exchanges", that infamously logged as much information as possible, in case it ever became valuable, or got subpoenad, or, or...
shinohai: bwahaha, good 'ol shapeshit.io
asciilifeform: adlai: imho ~exactly~ same item as e.g. the vpnisms -- 'we dun keep logs, really, promise'
asciilifeform: !w poll
watchglass: Polling 11 nodes...
watchglass: 205.134.172.6:8333 : (172-6.core.ai.net) Alive: (0.022s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802
watchglass: 205.134.172.27:8333 : Alive: (0.086s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802 (Operator: asciilifeform)
watchglass: 205.134.172.26:8333 : Alive: (0.142s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802
watchglass: 205.134.172.4:8333 : (172-4.core.ai.net) Alive: (0.143s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802
watchglass: 108.31.170.3:8333 : (pool-108-31-170-3.washdc.fios.verizon.net) Alive: (0.147s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802 (Operator: asciilifeform)
watchglass: 192.151.158.26:8333 : Alive: (0.084s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802
watchglass: 208.94.240.42:8333 : Alive: (0.166s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802
watchglass: 143.202.160.10:8333 : Alive: (0.276s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802
watchglass: 213.109.238.156:8333 : Alive: (0.335s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802
watchglass: 188.121.168.69:8333 : (rev-188-121-168-69.radiolan.sk) Alive: (0.547s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631802
watchglass: 103.36.92.112:8333 : Busy? (No answer in 20 sec.)
verisimilitude: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-26#1013283 The rotation of the planets isn't consistent to the same degree.
snsabot: Logged on 2020-05-26 10:41:39 asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-26#1013257 << hasn't any relation to gears of clock, or state transitions of cesium atom, etc. just the same -- or what am i missing.
asciilifeform: verisimilitude: moar consistent than all but the newest artificial clocks (e.g. leap second was introduced only after atomic timekeeping)
verisimilitude: We no longer live in a time where a foot is measured dozens of different ways in the same country, either.
verisimilitude: What I describe is an ideal, however, so it's understandable it won't be followed out.
feedbot: http://mvdstandard.net/2020/05/argument-between-old-men-over-mask-wearing-escalates-to-stabbing/ << The Montevideo Standard -- Argument Between Old Men Over Mask Wearing Escalates To Stabbing
asciilifeform: verisimilitude: i admit that i generally do not focus on ideas that require conquest of known universe for implementation.
asciilifeform: ( leaving entirely aside the q of wtf to fuck with time base.. )
verisimilitude: Well, the first sentence of the article did point this out.
verisimilitude: It's a relatively soft topic, certainly, and I expect to have something more technically interesting near the month's end.