mircea_popescu: apparently accountancy become a pretty good business in the us, past decade.
pete_dushenski: the "new" 4 are all $25-35 bn in annual revenue
mircea_popescu: o they just promoted one
mircea_popescu: what big four ? one of them died with enron neh ?
pete_dushenski: oh sweet another fallguy
pete_dushenski: "Cathy Engelbert has been named chief executive of Deloitte LLP, the first woman to become CEO of one of the Big Four accounting firms in the U.S."
pete_dushenski: "what is the utility of a centimetre!"
thestringpuller: It's like the dinosaurs getting mad at mammals instead of the asteroid or something like that.
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: Yes, but back in the day people would just die after wasting too much energy trying to change something absolute in inevitability. (Doing rain dances during droughts instead of looking into irrigation).
pete_dushenski: i'm generous enough to propose that the value of a free and productive man is a bitcent
mircea_popescu: every redditard's mother, can be measured in bitcoin.
pete_dushenski: their energy has no utility
asciilifeform: if fleas could speak, i imagine they would be similarly vocal about the proper behaviour of dogs
mircea_popescu: the point of money is exactly this : that it may not itself be measured. there's no "utility" of money. it exclusively exists to measure everything else.
pete_dushenski: as per the definition
mircea_popescu: repackaging of ther "oh, utility of mining, all that electrictiy burned for nothing" crapolade.
thestringpuller: How do poor people have this much energy to be this vocal about something they will not be able to control...
mircea_popescu: and ship the results by horse courrier
pete_dushenski: like the sun is energy
mircea_popescu: all it has to do is make sure it's the best money. which it did. once that's done, utility is not a concern. you will work the blockchain if you have to do it by hand in dank cellars chained to the wall,
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: what I don't get is why people are freaking out they will have to pay a lot of money to use the system?
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: heya :)
mircea_popescu: the utility OF EVERYTHING justifies itself in bitcoin terms.
mircea_popescu: at any rate, all this talk of "utility of bitcoin" can get fucked. it's a flimsy if doomed and in any case transparent attempt to frame the question in fiat terms.
pete_dushenski: the ones who can code a bit
mircea_popescu: but anyway : it's not "mostly engineers". it's 100% of all the business people actually involved with bitcoin.
mircea_popescu: five years later... shit, it's the same thing. herp.
mircea_popescu: what i find comedic is the sort of schmuck that thinks he'll survive on intellectual dishonestly. here's the story : if i made it and you stole it, whatever you think about it and however you're representing it... it'll still work for me. not for you. that's the thing with culture.
mircea_popescu: "something i heard from all the people that all read trilema but i won't mention this"
mircea_popescu: except they don't have a source, somehow, magically ?
mircea_popescu: o look at it, suddenly the arguments that didn't exist now exist ?
mircea_popescu: I think of it from the perspective of utility. "
mircea_popescu: "It's largely engineers who think about it in terms of game theory. They think that if you have unlimited blocksize, then the cost of transactions will go to zero because there will always be a competitor that is willing to include transactions even if you're charging X. They believe this will cause a race to bottom and there won't be any incentive for miners to secure the network because they can't cover costs.
gribble: Crying Nut - Circus Magic - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgkSTFbWGPg>; 100Beat's 100 Best Korean Albums of the '90s - Rate Your Music: <http://rateyourmusic.com/list/Samzpoke/100beats_100_best_korean_albums_of_the_90s/>; South Korean punk discography - Tian An Men 89 Records: <http://www.tam89records.com/southkorea.html>
ben_vulpes: blast from the past!
mircea_popescu: i dunno what's more alienating than the bizarre that obviously feeds this comic strip.
mircea_popescu: on my tenuous grasp of insanity, it'd seem that it's an entirely vacuous thing, which takes the shape you impose upon it. if you insist it's dangerous... it will probably grow some dangerous appendages. if you treat it as benign, it will basically be benign.
mircea_popescu: on one hand, it does exactly nothing to anyone, including the kids in question, that some weirdo jacks off.
mircea_popescu: english teacher ;likely thing for a foreigner there to do.
nubbins`: i can't recall the details, but i feel like at the time it was a sort of "english teacher overseas" thing
nubbins`: any of you remember when it was called "the thin H line"?
mircea_popescu: much in the way kids used to replace the "made by" strings in the old 8086 days with a hex editor.
mircea_popescu: in fact, as ridiculous as mormonism is, he is an exact copy. the cultural relationship between judaism and christianity is exactly the same as between christianity and mormonism : a barely literate lout ran off with a few pages and made his own, self-important "variant",
mircea_popescu: the us doesn't have an equivalent.
mircea_popescu: and yes, on top of that there's a web of commentary stretching out approx to the roman period.
asciilifeform: approx. the same size as a set of 'britannica.'
mircea_popescu: davout well the split happened after some pretty heavy duty pruning.
mircea_popescu: speaking of which, condoms = masturbation don't they.
mircea_popescu: o wait. i thought you meant the pope's (abandoned) claim of sovereignity over teh sovereigns.
mircea_popescu: hey, technically a valid claim. all of europe exists as embezzled provinces of the roman empire.
assbot: Every Sperm is Sacred - Monty Python's The Meaning of Life - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1A68mea )
mircea_popescu: the entire "every sperm is sacred" thing is more reaction-catholicism than anything.
mircea_popescu: by the way, if ne1 here has a fetlife account, i finally moved over, drop me a line.
asciilifeform: the latter has been dead for many years, iirc
asciilifeform: the only memorable ones i ever saw.
mircea_popescu: wtf is wrong wit hthe world.
mircea_popescu: So please do not send me the following types of E-mail: "commission requests -- I just do not have the time for commissions"
thestringpuller: So the redditards want to impose straight up communism on us?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not personally. but i thought it was one of the most famous www comics ever published
thestringpuller: this is like coworker who brings team down but is never fired because government keeps them working
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform do yo uknow these people ?
asciilifeform: meant, who needs them in basement? not me.
asciilifeform: refuse to admit they;d be better off in chains in someone;'s basement << afaik most of'em are boys and thus can expect only butugychag
mircea_popescu: THE CONSUMERS HAVE COME TO EXPECT
mircea_popescu: coming from people who utterly refuse to admit they;d be better off in chains in someone;'s basement... well... what's to be expected.
mircea_popescu: davout daughter of the wider insanity "everything new is better" married with the patently nuts "better is what i imagine it to be".
thestringpuller: davout how is money ever fucking fair? one person having more resources that are finite means another person has less?!?!?
asciilifeform: is life. Quantity still has a quality all its own. Ten million dollars buys you a money printer, but ten dollars do not. Not even a proportionately-smaller one. Everyone who hopes to see some kind of democratizing influence in Bitcoin is gravely misguided: by some indications, the Bitcoin ecosystem is at least as top heavy as the world of meatspace finance.' << my ancient article
asciilifeform: davout: 'Yes, it was once the case that you had to be a financier to send an intact penny across the ocean. But the fact that Bitcoin enables you to do so does not turn you into a financier. Nobody cancelled money makes money. It would be rather like demanding that an asteroid should have the gravitational pull of Earth. The Third Rock From The Sun can hold an atmosphere and your piece of cosmic flotsam cant. Such
davout: thestringpuller: no, some people had, buried somewhere in them, the idea that bitcoin would not only be money, but 'nice money'
assbot: Logged on 16-01-2015 05:10:16; mircea_popescu: justusranvier http://qntra.net/2015/01/transaction-fees-and-the-future-of-bitcoin/#comment-7394
thestringpuller: I wonder why justusravnier "wants adoption" his other blogposts seem sane...
asciilifeform: to which the word 'fap' is also credited
mircea_popescu: beheading naked kings on the vaguest whiff of approaching even small ones -> best policy.
mike_c: it was always "you gotta pay for it". most people just don't connect the dots to understand that's what inflation is.
mircea_popescu: what that changes... ask them, not me, to borrow an alfism.
mircea_popescu: to a large degree, it was obvious that once we move from "inflation pays for it" to "you gotta pay for it" the "consumers have come to expect" were going to throw a shitfest.
asciilifeform: plus to see if can get any of the legendary wedges
mircea_popescu: assbot: Americas Booty Obsession Is Another Symptom Of Social Decline << i also like ass.
asciilifeform: iirc, we already know what there is to know re: that version
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform neat. this the pc valgrind ?
mircea_popescu: in this sense... ethereum will be a loss to people.
davout: according to some random bitcointalk dude the chinese journalist computed the loss by multiplying fake bitcoins on the order book by the current market price
davout: the whole thing is pure bs
mircea_popescu: it's possible, obviously, the chinese are nazi-private, but i dun really see it.
mircea_popescu: davout: never heard about it, but apparently they're putting bs&t to shame with a $400mn loss, sounds doubtful << yeah srsly, sounds like pure bs.
assbot: Logged on 09-02-2015 08:48:34; cazalla: gee what an afternoon, kid makes a run for it while changing his nappy, i end up covered in shit and then piss
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=09-02-2015#1013313 <<< i tell you, getting the girls only, and after a decade or two is the best policy.
davout: today #b-a explains the fedoras thing
mircea_popescu: incidentally, my measure to resolve the "police violence" thing would be a) everyone with a mental issue must wear a funny hat.
mircea_popescu: anyway, people only should hide the fact that they have a mental ilness if they wish to get shot.
nubbins`: "i don't think people should have to hide the fact that they have blood-borne pathogens" says the guy with Hep C who can't donate blood
nubbins`: "I don't think that people should have to hide the fact that they have a mental illness," Cooper said.
nubbins`: leaving aside the fact that the kid faked a SINGLE panic attack TWO YEARS AGO in order to get out of an exam
nubbins`: also, who the fuck hates the name "jonathan" so much that they wanna change it? what a loser
mircea_popescu: i meant the butter zone idjit.
nubbins`: remember the time i sold two 0.5-btc casascius coins for 27 btc? o.O
nubbins`: je voudrais quelque choses, what they are, no one knows!
nubbins`: trying to decide if "magnubs" or "nubpie" is the more appropriate portmanteau
nubbins`: but once you get an eye for it, you're better able to identify what people will desire in the future
mircea_popescu thinks this entire "numismatics as an investment" thing is not unlike the "my balcony garden as a tomato farm" thing, but hey.
nubbins`: whether this is the same money i receive from the sale of this coin is, i believe, inconsequential
nubbins`: i'm going to buy another with "my money"
nubbins`: thestringpuller not precisely, no.
nubbins`: incidentally, i have a 1.125oz Canadian numismatic piece from 2013 that I priced the other day... has increased in value by 50% since last summer o.O
nubbins`: it's the dirtiest coin i have, figured i'd pawn it off and replace with a nicer specimen
mike_c: i just spit out a mouthful of coffee :D "mircea_popescu:it is ANOTHER discussion to propose that you pile all the donkeys on top of the camels and then throw the lot in the river"
assbot: America’s Booty Obsession Is Another Symptom Of Social Decline ... ( http://bit.ly/1DwF5c8 )
cazalla: davout, i think it's a bitcoin company in name only, fiat ponzi otherwise but there is so much conflicting info out there that qntra didn't publish anything as of yet
davout: never heard about it, but apparently they're putting bs&t to shame with a $400mn loss, sounds doubtful
cazalla: thestringpuller, "results in a complete loss of any pms I may have had open." <<< now it all makes sense!
gribble: The operation succeeded.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
cazalla: thestringpuller, some days i regret it, some days not, but i could only stand and laugh at this one today
thestringpuller: cazalla: ugh young children. they scare me. i think as I get older I am developing child-phobia.
cazalla: and the missus was out so there i stood holding him with one hand to stop him grabbing it and unsure how to clean the mess up with the one remaining hand (got in the shower in the end)
cazalla: gee what an afternoon, kid makes a run for it while changing his nappy, i end up covered in shit and then piss
TheNewDeal: !down TheNewDeal
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 20:41:39; TheNewDeal: Anyone interested in a bitbet repurchase?
TheNewDeal: if anyone is interested in the bitbet repurchase, refer to explanation here http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-02-2015#1009188
ascii_modem: i would like the writers to remember this.
ascii_modem: eventually they always turn up, those fiddypounds'o'notes
mircea_popescu: attracts a particularly felonious type, too. there's this guy, who claimed he never worked with the secret police, then they found fiddy pounds worth of notes, at which point he declared that it was the patriotic duty of everyone to help the secret police!
ascii_modem: yes that was the original type
mircea_popescu: the chief element is familiarity.
mircea_popescu: well the word means false police report for pay. but generally, the sort of late warsaw pact atmosphere.
mircea_popescu: and i come from a time and place where they had delatiune
ascii_modem: touched on the pathology in question
mircea_popescu: rarely has it been the case that a man did a more thorough job of crushing himself before my eyes.
mircea_popescu: it is not the "moral" considerations that drive it. the moral considerations are merely the pretext under which the inept hand takes refuge.
mircea_popescu: i think incidentally, that this is the fundamental impulse driving most bowdlerization.
ascii_modem: re: stooge squad: simple hypothesis is that the toolkit being used on us was made for others. but - for whom?
mircea_popescu: s a magnificent castle; for the greatest baron in the province ought to be the best lodged. Swine were intended to be eaten, therefore we eat pork all the year round: and they, who assert that everything is right, do not express themselves correctly; they should say that everything is best.""
mircea_popescu: ""It is demonstrable," said he, "that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as all things have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for the best end. Observe, for instance, the nose is formed for spectacles, therefore we wear spectacles. The legs are visibly designed for stockings, accordingly we wear stockings. Stones were made to be hewn and to construct castles, therefore My Lord ha
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell danielkrawisz what are you, the second coming of pangloss ?
ben_vulpes: ascii_modem: are you talking about the minor pestilence?
mircea_popescu: this is such idiocy the likes of which was never seen.
mircea_popescu: ascii_modem yu don't understand how the world works.
ascii_modem: i'm still at a loss re: who hoped to achieve what, exactly, by sending in the latest ninjaspamz3r
mircea_popescu: well at the very least express yourself better. i dunno anyone who'd think much of thought crime.
assbot: Successfully updated the rating for danielkrawisz from 1 to -2 with note: thinks it is likely that larger blocks would be adopted
ascii_modem: (was my hypothesis)
mircea_popescu: shit i hope i have these pics somewhere.
mircea_popescu: "We do not know what he would have saidit is just possible that the unprocurable pamphlet, 1601, would supply a clue but we may guess that it would have wrecked his reputation and reduced his income to reasonable proportions."
BingoBoingo: Ended up changine pubkey and commenting the alert trigger out of main.cpp
ascii_modem: BingoBoingo: snip same way, or change the key verif. conditional to 0
BingoBoingo: I run a node on 0.8.6 as a charity for the SPV wallet using freeloaders
ascii_modem: BingoBoingo: i killed the alert thing with own hands
mircea_popescu: people dun have to have an opinion do they
napedia: I'm guessing you're talking about Daniel. The answer is that there is an internal split at SNI regarding the block size. Daniel is on the other side of Michael and Pierre.
mircea_popescu: The tale is told, too, of a certain woman who performed an aeolian crepitation at a dinner attended by the witty Monsignieur Dupanloup, Bishop of Orleans, and that when, to cover up her lapse, she began to scrape her feet upon the floor, and to make similar noises, the Bishop said, "Do not trouble to find a rhyme, Madam!"
bitcoinquestions: anyone here wanna play bitcoin bounce? It's a simple game I made up to build up trust. Person A sends person B .5 BTC then person B ends the game by either running with the money or returning .5 BTC. Person B can continue the game by sending Person A 1 BTC back. Rinse and repeat.
gribble: The story of Pointless and Witless pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/2013/the-story-of-pointless-and-witless/>; MPOE, January 2014 Statement pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/mpoe-january-2014-statement>; Notorious M.P. layin down that subliminal shit, na mean ? pe Trilema ...: <http://trilema.com/notorious-mp-layin-down-that- (1 more message)
bitcoinquestions: It seems like something he could convince the masses to upgrade to, but I'm assuming the miners know better than to let that happen, correct?
bitcoinquestions: And there's no way Gavin doesn't know exactly what he's doing, right? Like is it possible he convinced himself that it was a good idea?
bitcoinquestions: mircea_popescu: I did a lot more critical thinking about the blocksize limit and holy shit I feel so dumb for ever thinking Gavin's proposal was a good idea.
thestringpuller: "OMG the blocksize limit is too small" last 6 blocks: 108k 26k 112k 97k 553k and 602k
thestringpuller: flailing my arms yelling "they aren't people!!!"
thestringpuller: i keep getting into arguments about non-people (the ones who would put arm in wood chipper)
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: My gut is telling me that changing the public keys to garbage is going to be the quick << not that dirty, either.
mod6: asciilifeform: when you get a chance, you should do a new submission to the list for the alert & win32 patches. thx in advance.
mod6: it seems that alerts were probably moved out to their own file in later versions.
mod6: BingoBoingo: alerts were snipped via this patch: http://thebitcoin.foundation/turdmeister-alert-snip.tar.gz -- It's not posted to the btc-dev mailing list yet. This might have been because of issues with messages getting snarffed back in Oct./Nov.
jurov: i.e. your node would think others misbehave by sending invalid alerts
BingoBoingo: jurov: I'm fucking around on 0.8.6 two lines in alert.cpp in that version possess public keys for verifying "Upgrade Alerts". My gut is telling me that changing the public keys to garbage is going to be the quick dirty way to effectively neuter the alert system in the build. Figure each time I build change the garbage subbing for pubkeys.
jurov: BingoBoingo: depends on the patch
BingoBoingo: Question for the foundation: When futzing with bitcoin sources to build more recent phoundation version, changing the constant in alert.cpp to garbage will keep a node so built from recognizing and/or passing a Gavin alert. Yes or no?
bitcoinquestions: (not python specifically but you get the point)
cazalla: anyone reading the hong kong 400m bitcoin loss and wondering why it's not on qntra, difficult to ascertain the facts on this one but it would appear hong kong media are clueless.. speaks to qntra's need for a chinese correspondent
trinque: I will say that listening to those familiar with the soviet collapse has been enlightening
BingoBoingo: bitcoinquestions: This channel has rather good global coverage. Even Africa is included in regular participants. Asian participation is a bit lacking though.
bitcoinquestions: trinque: good point haha. Is this channel all in Romania? How is it there?
trinque: bitcoinquestions: having loved ones is a good reason to get out of the US.
bitcoinquestions: I would do anything to be able to drive the price down because I'm collecting coins, but I was wondering whether or not there's a point where you are happy with your assets in terms of BTC and then just want to increase the value of the coins
bitcoinquestions: mircea_popescu: Another question I have for you. Are you happier when the BTC price goes up or when it goes down?
mircea_popescu: so then do.
bitcoinquestions: mircea_popescu: yeah man everyday I feel more and more that I need to get out of the US
mircea_popescu: forget that part and think of bandwidth. romania does not have this problem, but the us does. bandwidth accessibility is actually going down, not up, and it looks like it may go away entirely.
mircea_popescu: how are you to make them ? where do you buy your raw materials for bitcoin ? where do you hire workers and pay them in bitcoin ?
bitcoinquestions: mircea_popescu: alright fair enough, I was just proposing a hypothetical to make sure I understood your position.
mircea_popescu: and that at one point, when they had a flood, hard drive prices exploded on the market by a factor of 3
mircea_popescu: exactly schmexactly. there's a difference between the idle imagination of youth and the knowledge of men. for instance : i know but you don't know that the vast majority of hard drives are produced in the same few acres of asian shore.
mircea_popescu: how would this work ? you mean you manufacture the hard drives in house ?
bitcoinquestions: mircea_popescu: Ah I see. Interesting. That is definitely the case as of today. That being said, let's say I create a company that is able to provide hard drive space for cheaper, but I only accepted payment in BTC. If this company existed would your opinion change?
mircea_popescu: if on the other hand expansion is paid in "hard drives" chances are whosoevere wants to participate has to SELL bitcoin to buy fiat assets.
mircea_popescu: point remains : if the expansion is paid in bitcoin, whosoever wants to participate has to SELL fiast assets and buy bitcoin.
mircea_popescu: what has made me come to this conclusion is neither here nor there. i am not proposing anything to you. i have made my own determinations, and if you inquire i tell you the reasons. that's how far that goes.
mircea_popescu: so : a) gavin is in no way involved in bitcoin development ; b) gavin's insanities have nothing to do with bitcoin's problems, and in no case are they solutions. as you'd expect of someone who has nothing to do with it in the first place.
mircea_popescu: it is ANOTHER discussion to propose that you pile all the donkeys on top of the camels and then throw the lot in the river.
mircea_popescu: it is one idea to discuss how to load the donkeyus and the camels respectively, to best do this.
mircea_popescu: to understand exactly the situation, you have camles and donkeys, and have to carry a billion tons of rubble.
mircea_popescu: this is completely differet a matter, and it is not proper to mix it together in the consideration of an actual problem. it is not an actual problem.
mircea_popescu: these are, obviously, both going to be employed, in some combination, because the thing is going to grow too huge to allow exclusivity
mircea_popescu: another one is, to pay for it in fiat, via paying for disk space.
mircea_popescu: there are two avenues to pay for it. one is, to pay for it in bitcoin. via paying for txn.
bitcoinquestions: mircea_popescu: Okay of course the proponents of the change are the ones who must justify it. But the justification is pretty simple, with a larger block size the network can support more transactions per second. This allows more transactions to be onchain instead of through trusted identities.
mircea_popescu: "XII. The current 1Mb limit is arbitrary. We want to change it. Please ignore the fact that the discussion is about whether to change or not to change, and please ignore that the onus is on whoever proposes change to justify it. Instead, buy into our pretense that the discussion is about "which arbitrary value". Because we're idiots, and so should be you!"
assbot: Third pass addressing the more common pseudo-arguments raised by the very stupid people that like the Gavin scamcoin proposal pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1vzm5Zm )
mircea_popescu: particularly relevant, http://trilema.com/2015/third-pass-addressing-the-more-common-pseudo-arguments-raised-by-the-very-stupid-people-that-like-the-gavin-scamcoin-proposal/
mircea_popescu: you said that you read my articles, which is nice, but it'd be a lot better if instead of saying you did you showed me you did, by asking meaningful rather than meaninglessly general questions.
bitcoinquestions: as I was trying to ask early - why do you not like the change to increase the block size?
mircea_popescu: there's, intermittently, some unidentified derp that floods noobs
decimation: well, there's a certain lefty predilection toward paranoia/violence that seems stable over the centuries
decimation: in 1790 mr. ddos would have been on one of the sans-culotte's murder gangs
bitcoinquestions: yo i dug through your posts on trilema about how you think Gavin is sabotaging bitcoin or whatever for wanting to increase the block size. Are you afraid of DDOS attacks because there are not enough full nodes?
decimation: thestringpuller: they are fishing for some property to indict. maybe the local cops want to have some new toys
thestringpuller: Usually cop is like "You got anything valuable in the vehicle?"
thestringpuller: "You're broke nigga, you gonna really persecute the nigga payin your salary"
thestringpuller: I say that to cops a lot when they pull me over for being black
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: i love your quotes on the US being broke
decimation: yeah the conversation topic is quite inane.
decimation: perhaps farther removed actually
mircea_popescu: they sound australian to me.
mircea_popescu: The term was coined by the physician and writer Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr., in an 1860 article in the Atlantic Monthly.