trinque: and if ISIS wants to keep the outsiders busy, have at it
trinque: entering the gate meant being approved to do so
trinque: I had this incredibly vivid dream years ago of a city which denied access based on some mechanism (undefined in the dream) of verifying identity and relationship to those dwelling within
trinque: might very well be that something like ISIS will kill a great many "westerners" in the future
trinque: I would just like to see bitcoin kill these morons too
pete_dushenski: only the losers get ripped.
trinque: ah well there we agree
trinque: and how is their ideology going to rip through my heart?
trinque: and theirs is what?
pete_dushenski: ideologies will rip through the heart of whatever armour you've got.
trinque: cities have defended themselves well against raiding hordes of morons before
pete_dushenski: under your defensive technology is a satellite colony orbiting the earth
trinque: furthermore if all they can manage is guns and missiles, the non-morons that understand science can respond with defensive technology that makes that irrelevant
pete_dushenski: instead they have -dozens- of fiefdoms, all pledging allegiance to an ideology and a black flag
trinque: they've got that baghdadi guy
pete_dushenski: trinque i mean hey, if isis were going the centralised route, don't you think they'd have a king or ruler already ?
phf: ben_vulpes: eventually, aha. i'm not even sure yet that i can repeat the process. for example part of build process is a script that chooses between gcc-4.6 and clang based on whether it's .c or .mm. the fact that the result links i think is a miracle
pete_dushenski: doesn't appear to me that they're trying to build an 'empire' in the centralised sense of the term
trinque: mongols they are not
trinque: as for bitcoin, one *would* hope those working within it do understand the mechanics of the technology involved
decimation: tribalism is in the bones over there, I find it unlikely that a political entity could centralize power effectively
trinque: isis is a cargo cult thinking allah will bring them more russian or american weapons if they piss in the wind some more
trinque: I do not see the equivalence at all
pete_dushenski: so what, bitcoin made the computers, chips, and internet infrastructure that it's taking over the world with ?
trinque: sitting on oil wells they didn't drill
trinque: they're primitive morons with weapons somebody else's war machine manufactured
pete_dushenski: hell, even the 'elite' ideologies can fall victim to dreams.
trinque: sure, and their ideology is based on magical thinking
pete_dushenski: i don't see an external player that has the means or the will to take them down. they're no wimpy upstart. isis means business.
pete_dushenski: from the inside out.
pete_dushenski: decimation i'm with you there.
trinque: they also go extinct
pete_dushenski: isis will continue to grow, because that's what lifeforms do : they grow.
trinque: but it would require them getting that far
trinque: pete_dushenski: I could very well see something 20 years down the line that's much different
decimation: it's political suicide in the us to commit to another full-scale middle east war, which is what is giving isis breathing room
pete_dushenski: trinque sorry, you're saying that isis is a nuisance that'll be wiped out if they get too uppity ??
pete_dushenski: trinque well, the west's 'science' is a largely (if not entirely) a lot of fluff 'epidemiology'
trinque: they're going to what, shout about allah and shoot hand-me-down russian weapons?
pete_dushenski: it won't take a generation if the saudi's run out of oil money
trinque: if what's said about their regressiveness regarding science is true, they're not going to amount to anything
decimation: in 30 years after their rule is solidified...
decimation: mainly because nobody can convince themselves to give enough of a shit
pete_dushenski: aha, again, the expense of occupation of syria/lebanon is more than any soi-dissant 'world power' can seem to muster.
decimation: pete_dushenski: not really, it's quite simple, they would fall to a single marine division if on the field in open battle
decimation: if there's a threat to saudi rule - it's their own stomachs: http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/07/saudis-solar-energy/395315/
pete_dushenski: decimation again, only if they can afford it
pete_dushenski: trinque those 3, yes, plus usa currently holding down the eastern corners of the mediterranean with turkey and egypt
decimation: also they would very likely summon usg
decimation: saudis are not ruthless enough < I strongly doubt. Saudis would throw every merc in the world at someone challenging their rule
trinque: those seem to be perpetually beating war drums against eachother; perhaps ISIS is a complicating factor in that situation which none want to approach lest they unbalance the former
trinque: I am not a scholar on the subject, but it seems as an outsider that the major factors are Saudi, Iran and Israel
pete_dushenski: and why should the middle east be anyone's problem other than that of the middle easterners ?
trinque: among other things I think whatever successes ISIS has had reflect that nobody really wants to have Iraq or Syria be their problem
pete_dushenski: but isis has a sufficiently powerful 'why' that their soldiers are cheap and oh so very cut throat
trinque: how many oil fields do they have now?
pete_dushenski: i dun seriously think that the saudis are ruthless enough nor rich enough to win this contest
pete_dushenski: saudis are already teetering on the bring of self-immolation post-abdullah
pete_dushenski: there's little doubt of that.
mats: out of sheer self-interest and to return the balance of power to as it was
pete_dushenski: mats sure, in dreamlandia where anyone can be allies with the devil and then turn their back on him whenever they feel like it with no repercussions.
mats: hard to anticipate, they've gotta take baghdad first
pete_dushenski: maybe if obama promises to pay eternal tribute to the caliphate, isis won't wipe his face in his own vomit.
mats: well, they weren't the enemy at the time. just 'moderates' looking for cash and weapons to fight al-Assad
pete_dushenski: gotta find victories wherever you can. and, hell, just create them ex nihilo everywhere else.
pete_dushenski: mats lol. now helping the enemy win is a victory !
mats: hey, he armed ISIS. close enough to 'boots on the ground'.
pete_dushenski: the dude couldn't even put boots on the ground in syria, as fucking if he could do better than gavin and hearn.
pete_dushenski: the only thing obama is gonna crush are his video game enemies in 'easy' mode.
Adlai: last i heard, from the most reputable of reputables, obama was gunna "crush" bitcoin
Adlai: please tell me it was the same event
Adlai: thus our answer is in fact just another question
ascii_field: (they also had obama, no less than twice. also missed that. snore.)
Adlai: one good thing did come of the meetup, my new Bitcoin Price Index is fees/coin
Adlai: as though i'm in the right part!
ascii_field: i live in wrong part of the world for this
Adlai: but you get the idea
ascii_field never went to anything even vaguely bitcoin-related in the flesh other than for mircea_popescu's c2 and c3
Adlai is guessing that ascii_field steers clear of bitcoin "meetups", of all their shapes and forms
Adlai: who's ever had somebody try to sell them bitcoins unsolicited?
ben_vulpes: thestringpuller: aka teledildonics?
mircea_popescu: http://36.media.tumblr.com/4f9a3353edb5edf22b8f889c0bc2486f/tumblr_n2apt70IYI1tsigedo1_1280.jpg << here's the woman, and here's the tech. therefore, woman in tech.
thestringpuller: but love the line "This compulsion means that, for the first time, the opinion of the ignorant masses (if misled, or merely divided) can actually destroy Bitcoin."
ascii_field: afaik it is part of the overall crap fleet.
ascii_field: the one moving to/from 6-char brainwallets
ascii_field: it 'did' the 950+kB blox, what else
mircea_popescu: the "tx spam" bs never did anything.
BingoBoingo: ascii_field: Takes about as much time as any other "problematic" block but gets chewed through just the same
gernika: <+mircea_popescu> by now a multitude of people have copies, of that chain. << got it. switched to another node and now syncing.
mircea_popescu: but the truth, in general, is that closed systems have a very short shelf life. you can get away with it for a matter of years, maybe, if you're very good at managing it. not decades.
mircea_popescu: had no particular expectation to see anything like this yet, either.
ascii_field: how, i must say i wonder, did mircea_popescu even persuade anyone to shovel the sheer tonnage of shit to write his soviet pdp clone 0.6
mircea_popescu: *towards* i guess, is the better word
ascii_field: probably somewhere deep in the 2012 shitter
ascii_field does these things for actual reasonz
ascii_field: we cremate orphan tx. and the 'tx spam' is sent in rapid succession, and depends on previous instances of same, and hence spends much of its life cycle as 'orphan tx'
mircea_popescu: the stator nodes don't suffer from it
ascii_field: afaik i'm the only one actually running a public-facing realbitcoinotron
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 20:32:01; mircea_popescu: it didn't actually work, obviously, but i must say without all the work the foundation put in, it probably WOULD have.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field not fully understood yet, but it seems to exploit a buffer overflow in their own fucktarded code.
mircea_popescu: it didn't actually work, obviously, but i must say without all the work the foundation put in, it probably WOULD have.
mircea_popescu: relatedly : i am reasonably satisfied the ~950 kb single tx a few days ago was trying its best to make pre 0.10 clients unable to verify the chain anymore.
mircea_popescu: gernika_ it's up and down as i have the 363736 issue examined.
trinque: ben_vulpes: the lesbian dreadfort notwithstanding
trinque: in this case presumably the city itself would be controlled by someone in particular
ascii_field: trinque: also not so easy. see the key revocation thread of last month.
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-07-2015#1201280 << this appears in, among other places, 'beneath a steel sky'.
trinque: and you could perhaps sign a "my cardano was stolen" message to address thestringpuller
trinque: seems you'd have some other key elsewhere, you'd sign your cardano key
trinque: thestringpuller: same answer as if someone steals your anything
ascii_field: i can't wait to see all the nails folks try to pound in with this microscope.
mircea_popescu: well if you email it anyway... why bother with bcrypt ?
ben_vulpes: the *unsalted* *unhashed* *stored* password
ben_vulpes: the *stored* password
ascii_field: nubbins`: 'How often, or on what system, the Thought Police plugged in on any individual wire was guesswork. It was even conceivable that they watched everybody all the time. but at any rate they could plug in your wire whenever they wanted to. You have to live - did live, from habit that became instinct - in the assumption that every sound you made was overheard...'
nubbins`: <+ascii_field> nubbins`: as i understand, buyer can contact you and ask to pay in cocaine <<< i suggested to buyer we take tx off-site; he agreed. mildly surprised message filters or smth didn't get in the way
ascii_field: imho the fella was trolling
trinque: ascii_field: but he banned the specific mask for that user
mircea_popescu: ascii_field on the same ip.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: you know that's the shared arse for everyone who comes in from nosuchlabs.com, right ?
mircea_popescu: no dude, "the consumers have come to expect". pssshhh
ben_vulpes: whoa mp's getting out the banhammer
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 16:58:35; fromphuctor: im pretty sure there's laws in place that give me the right to have that info removed
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-07-2015#1200957 << o motherfucker will there be no end of this idiocy
mircea_popescu: bitcoin is open for everyone who can keep the whole thing. the whole blockchain, the whole mempool, etc.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller the notion that bitcoin is open "to everyone" does not include fromfuctorhead above.
ascii_field: thestringpuller: but it is also true that most nodes presently have sufficient physical ram to hold the mempool
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-07-2015#1200905 << you can't, and fuck your stupid mother for fucking the lousy drunk that would spring forth an attempted abortion such as yourself for EVEN THINKING ABOUT IT.
thestringpuller: this being the default functionality
thestringpuller: it seems this is broken, if tx's oom a nodes' mempool wouldn't this technically be a fraction of the mempool shared by other nodes with more memory?
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: why would the network isolate you if you're dropping tx's out of the mempool?
nubbins`: <+ascii_field> who exactly expected to be able to use btc there <<< once listed a casascius coin on ebay. a buyer messaged me through the site asking to pay in btc :o
ascii_field: i dare say the second
mircea_popescu: but it is i think the first chance to actually improve on extant code by writing something since the start of this project. rather than just cutting warts off and sewing the crater together
ascii_field: possibly the most dangerous change yet proposed
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 15:40:48; funkenstein_: for broadcasting a TX today i would recommend blockchain.info, coinb.in.. there are a few others that will get your tx to miners
ascii_field hopes that no one is waiting for ~him~ to write this, is occupied with other things presently
ascii_field: then - yes
ascii_field: 'no incentive' for most of the network participants to do what they are doing - is the current situation.
mircea_popescu: you may either present : a) the whole mempool (current best behaviour) or b) a selected fraction (hopefully future best behaviour)
mircea_popescu: because you present an arbitrary fraction of the current mempool, there is no incentive for anyone to peer you.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: briefly describe hypothesis re: why an evict-oldest mempool node would end up isolated
ascii_field: 'why not start small, he said, offering the yoga n00b a single nail'
mircea_popescu: ideally the -so much, +so much and min_node_value are to be set in config file by user.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field nothing wrong with keeping a finite ip db and flushing the lowest entries as needed, just like iptables works.
mircea_popescu: g accepted txn. then it refuses connectioon to shit nodes. permanently. it still reads from them, but sends nothing.
mircea_popescu: so, how about, something like this : 1. pogo acquires max memory to be used for tx pool ; 2. pogo accepts txn into this until full ; 3. pogo calculates per byte value for eacxh accepted txn ; 4. pogo accepts new txn only if their per-byte value constitutes an increase to its pool ; 5. pogo keeps a score on all nodes ir EVER SAW, by IP! as to what txn it sent : -so much for sending unacceptable txn, + so much for sendin
ascii_field: this is closest to the default behavior (death of whole node)
ascii_field: already has the limit
ascii_field: like i said for the orphans,
ascii_field: rather than 'oomkill because retarded'
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: was trying to point out that we need a mechanism to manage mempool on the node. just simple oldest-evict for starters.
trinque: and either enter or don't
trinque: you go up to some gate and do assbot-style authentication
trinque: it's a problem solved by both the WoT and building cities according to a concept of "good standing == access" not universal access for all
thestringpuller: ascii_field: you can set the policy to drop tx's without fees from the mempool i though
ascii_field: we have two of these left: the block index (discussed previously, 300 byte per blk) and the mempool.
mircea_popescu: if i recall this was discussed, i was spouting things like "sort the tx pool by value per byte, kick out bad txn and nodes that propose them, always offer a buttered selection to askers"
mircea_popescu: im not setting mental limits on the basis of implicit conventions.
ascii_field: who exactly expected to be able to use btc there
mircea_popescu: "Please understand that you mentioned you accept "Bitcoin" as a method of payment. Some online payment companies are fairly new and inexperienced and they do not provide sufficient fraud protection to members. When we review payment methods to determine whether they are allowed on eBay, two key factors that we consider are "Security and Safety" and "Ease of use". Please do not offer this payment method."
nubbins`: it's not like the etc etc
mircea_popescu: and the infortmation of WHO READS IT is not usg's business.
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 14:43:36; fluffypony: why not just stick qntra / a mirror behind CloudFlare? it's a news site, it's not like the information is super sensitive
jurov: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/patches.html and it found its way here, too
kakobrekla: [20:38:58] <punkman> http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-July/000123.html
ascii_field: danielpbarron: anything about rejected blocks in the debug.log ?
ascii_field: i suppose mod6 and ben_vulpes ought to make the call
ascii_field: then again, i wouldn't put it past some chinese grad student to throw it in somewhere
funkenstein_: thestringpuller, wow that is awesome. do people use this in grav. or e&m simulations?
ascii_field: appears to be fully explained in the lined article.
thestringpuller: ascii_field: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fast_inverse_square_root#Overview_of_the_code
assbot: Why did victims in Islamic State beheading videos look so calm? They didn’t know it was real. - The Washington Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1I0dtRl )
ascii_field: https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2015/03/11/why-did-victims-in-islamic-state-beheading-videos-look-so-calm-they-didnt-know-it-was-real << usg's canned response to ^
gernika: thestringpuller: mp's seed node listed here: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:4a4Og6KrsB4J:qntra.net/2015/07/most-serene-republic-begins-advertising-public-blockchain-seed-nodes/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
thestringpuller: you talking about the real bitcoin? or bitcoind?
ascii_field: , the sausage is just the start of it—that's ground up and made into meatballs, meatloaf, and a million other products.'
ascii_field: 'The site’s support documentation explains how it works: “First you write a normal original article. Then you make two rewrites of it. All three articles (PDF) must have the same number of paragraphs and each paragraph of each article must have about the same meaning.” This is because the end product is cut up, chopped, and changed to create even more alternative stories. In the content-producing machine
gernika: Maybe the qntra node is running short of connections?
mod6: thestringpuller: ha
thestringpuller: mod6: "The bitcoin foundation doesn't care reddit-people." - Kanye West
mod6: would be inetersting/nice to see the ms time on how long it takes to process blocks {365`251, 365`252}; blocks > 900kb
ascii_field: https://www.os3.nl/_media/2013-2014/courses/ccf/chromecast-cedric-peter.pdf << re: the device spoken of yesterday. discusses fw reflashing
ascii_field: and that's the default nick
ascii_field: trinque: folks who click the link on phuctor www get a webportal into freenode
trinque: anyone else noticed the from* pattern of nicks?
ascii_field: (why not write to google? they censor first, ask questions later)
ascii_field: nor google, which appears to be the proximate cause of his sorrows
ascii_field: none of which the fool wrote to, presumably
fluffypony: it's not like this is a revenge porn site and we're laughing at the diminutive size of his member
fluffypony: I do find the righteous indignation humorous
ascii_field: nor that this fella's mother gave him this name (again, which name?)
ascii_field: trinque: we haven't even any reason to believe that mr x owns the private key to this pubkey (which? also no idea)
trinque: fromphuctor: you've been done a service at another's expense, and you're behaving like a fool
trinque: they ought to have a test for this in early childhood
fluffypony: so you can hear the same thing again?
ascii_field: then you are officially fucked and i officially have zero sympathy.
ascii_field: fromphuctor: what other information? the only things visible are what is in your key - the name and email addr entered when it was generated.
fromphuctor: im not concerned about the key floating around, just the other information listed on nosuchlabs
fluffypony: also known as the "sorry for you" problem
fluffypony: 'Once a public key has been uploaded, it is difficult to remove. Some users stop using their public keys for various reasons, such as when they forget their pass phrase, or if their private key is compromised or lost. In those cases, it was hard to delete a public key from the server, and even if it were deleted, someone else can upload a fresh copy of the same public key to the server. This leads to an accumulation of old fossil
ascii_field: i.e. your enemy can submit the key again
fromphuctor: do you maintain the database for nosuchlabs
ascii_field: the answer is no.
fluffypony: hosted by the Glorious Defenders of Privacy at MIT
ascii_field: aha, virtually all of the pubkeys in phuctor come from sks.
fluffypony: but pubkeys are easily browsable on other key servers
trinque: I'm still perplexed by the idea that someone would be bothered by what is a highly beneficial *free* service annotating entirely *public* data