gribble: The Bitcoin Foundation: <http://thebitcoin.foundation/>; The truth about the Bitcoin Foundation - General - Bitcoin Foundation: <http://bitcoinfoundation.org/forum/index.php?/topic/1284-the-truth-about-the-bitcoin-foundation/>; Bitcoin Foundation News - CoinDesk: <http://www.coindesk.com/companies/bitcoin-foundation/>
mircea_popescu: ;;google the real bitcoin foundation
mircea_popescu: you should probably start with the mailing list.
thestringpuller: rotor pretty much builds the static on anything...
hdbuck: mircea_popescu got it, ty, while im still at it, maybe you could enlighten me as therealbtf client.. how am i supposed to make it work?
mircea_popescu: <hdbuck> maybe i missed something << only half the shares get actually traded.
hdbuck: and with the assistance of bingoboingo :)
hdbuck: thestringpuller yes very humbly
hdbuck: anyway, been a long time since i lurked, i think you guys are quite outsmarting the corporatist wannabes, and i like the sorta outraging honesty approach. so thanks.
mike_c: i'll add it to the todo list
hdbuck: thestringpuller yes sure, i understand, i’d still value some trade volumes to estimate the liquidity of the stocks there
hdbuck: yes, i just created an account there, but i mean, i’d personally argue it lacks some charts, no offense tho.
mike_c: talk to jurov if you don't like the logo
thestringpuller: mike_c: guess I have to add up the shares sold by owner based on trilema
mike_c: they aren't. mircea has a mpex account too
mike_c: see, half of s.mpoe shares are on mpex, so dividends are paid there.
mike_c: they all get divs :)
hdbuck: the ratio of mpex shares that get divs
thestringpuller: the plan is almost complete...
hdbuck: ah i see, any chance you would update them on btc-alpha? also volumes would be appreciated.
mike_c: depends on the stock
mike_c: not all the shares are on mpex
hdbuck: why woudl the info on mpex says 132.98367617 BTC on 18-09-15//Per share: 26 satoshi. but the latest monthly statement says Profit : 274.20932881 BTC
hdbuck: i’ve been researching mpex stocks, through btc-alpha mostly and mpex, but the informations seems divergent as per the divs distributed
jurov: nooo, only read the fallout
mircea_popescu: o you were there ?
jurov: punkman: they are aiming for certain burn rate extent. anything below *and above* it won't cut it
mircea_popescu: apparently my brain decided to cut to the chase, what "log", you're clearly going for the day's lols!
mircea_popescu goes to check out ba log, types lol. is surprised nothing comes up. fixes to log. gets the log.
deedbot-: [cascadian hacker] Supply's down, demand's up, better get the state involved! - http://cascadianhacker.com/blog/2015/10/10_supplys-down-demands-up-better-get-the-state-involved.html
deedbot-: [cascadian hacker] just another day in sunny cascadia - http://cascadianhacker.com/blog/2015/05/26_just-another-day-in-sunny-cascadia.html
trinque: ah there it is
assbot: Logged on 12-10-2015 04:06:28; pete_dushenski: still haven't seen the movie with nicholson et al. but it's supposed to be a decent flick, if not the most accurate of transpositions
punkman: jurov: but why did he turn down a billion from the chinese?
jurov: punkman imo the keyword is "burn rate"
punkman: "[$400m] will be doled out slowly, however, says Mr. Ravikant, so as not to overwhelm the market. In the first year, AngelList will disperse about $20 million of the money, ramping up to $50 million a year in subsequent years." and "on a recent trip to China, two different limited partners each offered him $500 million, but “we’re limited in how much capital we can absorb,”"
punkman: "Hired actors play the bride, groom and a surprise third party: a spurned lover or secret boyfriend who arrives “unexpectedly” – and with dramatic results."
punkman: "A typical “fake wedding” hosts about 600 or 700 paying guests" * $50 = $30k, say the venue charges $25 per head, that's a lot of pesos leftover
pete_dushenski: "sham ceremonies offer unparalleled chances to meet new potential partners. “It’s easier to meet someone at a fake wedding,” says Boniface. “I’d walk up and introduce myself as a cousin of the groom, and the girls immediately fell into their role. It’s like a game everyone joins in.”" << no es un pais pobre, es un pais de jugadores !
assbot: I do ... not really: young Argentinians spurn real weddings for fake ones | World news | The Guardian ... ( http://bit.ly/1G8aBRy )
pete_dushenski: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/09/argentina-fake-weddings-falsa-boda << arhentina is, like, the saddest place on earth. seriously, world vision should do their next film shoot there.
pete_dushenski: the joys of being in a servile profession.
pete_dushenski: http://blogs.reuters.com/breakingviews/2015/10/09/the-devils-dictionary-of-post-crisis-finance/ << this is what passes for 'edgy' in fiat finance. grade : b-.
pete_dushenski: though why you'd want to specifically live next to the idjits like me too stubborn not to drop out, i dunno
pete_dushenski: the kind for whom a pilgrimage to mecca is visiting comic-con in california, yes
phf: thing is, unless bad scifi movies, where you have plot, babes and action, this is clearly targeted at the new nerds. like agile consultants at web startups, who follow nasa twitter? ain't no way this nation ever getting to mars, is my conclusion from watching this movie.
pete_dushenski: but hey, showing hitler's 1935 classic wouldn't break box office records for the umpteenth billion time this year... or would it ?
phf: same issue with the martian. a mix of obsessive askreddit style scientism with startrek handwaiving, lots of things explained through exposition dialogue, lots of feel good "america! nasa! feelings!". zero value as a movie. i mean, there's an underdog character who Figures It Out and then he can be a complete aspy to The Big Boss, because he's now recognized as an authority
pete_dushenski: after 'interstellar', which i didn't even pay to see !, there's no way i'd see 'the martian', free or not.
pete_dushenski: maybe if you were completely unfamiliar with the scifi genre, such as it is (asimov, heinlein, clarke, etc.) then it might pass the sniff test. but good god did i find it offensively bad. just spoonfeeding the viewer like they were fresh out of the womb.
pete_dushenski: i had the same overhyped vibe from 'interstellar', which was pointedly atrocious.
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 21:42:49; phf: went to a movie theater to see The Martian. i only ever watch movies when in-wot recommend something enough, so i didn't realize how bad a movie can be, and this was one of the worst movies i've ever seen. snl "you can do anything" skit done with a straightface.. in space! but anyway, they've replaced all the regular rows, with reclining sits, and you can push the button for the sit to recline. i was
pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-10-2015#1296487 << bahaha of course all the derps in newspapers and whatever else won't shut up about 'the martian' and how it's 'so wonderful' and 'just as good as the book' that they obviously haven't read.
phf: but anyway nicholson in his early carrier basically has only one character, there's the pure form of that character in one flew..., there's the scary version in the shining and there's the funny version in the witches of eastwick, if you watch these three movies you'll be basically experience the entire nicholson acting range :>
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 21:21:42; mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> folks familiar with usg 'scientocracy' will laugh, but the fact is, the mind-reading box does not necessarily have to... work. to be put in use. << right right. cholesterol is bad for you except its good for you and salt is bad except its good and hey, as long as they got "science" what difference does it make that they're 100% consensused on opposite things every 30 years.
pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-10-2015#1296472 << this was the 'is it corn-free ?' article the other day.
phf: oh that makes sense, i've never thought of his movies that way, but he'd obviously be familiar with the form, being konigsberg
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 20:20:41; ben_vulpes: no, they won't do anything to anyone cheating emissions tests.
phf: i rewatched it recently, and it's one of those movies that's awesome when you're 12, and then you see just how bad it is, when you're past your 20s
phf: it's my favorite batman :) there's a word in russian, kapustnik, which is basically a movie or a festival, where a bunch of strong and famous performers get together to ham it up for fun
pete_dushenski: and i'll take your word for it on nicholson. strangely, i've only seen him in 'batman', 'anger management', and 'the departed', which were all when he was older. past his prime clearly.
pete_dushenski: phf: kesey definitely sells the acid angle.
phf: pete_dushenski: i don't know how successful kesey was at capturing the mind of a schizophrenic, but he certainly was good at relaying an inner state of an acid head. the movie is something else entirely, but still great, since it's basically jack nicholson playing his only role at his best.
pete_dushenski: i should say, 'one of the commies', there are two main commie parties in canada : 'new democratic party' and 'liberal party'
pete_dushenski: the commie pretty much hung himself last week in saying that he'd defend niqabists. the incumbent conservative told the pakis to pack their bags, essentially affirming that this is a christian country with christian values
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 20:09:50; asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: fingerprints were 'debunked' in the 1900s
pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-10-2015#1296418 << this identification issue is quite the hot button item in canadian federal politics atm, mostly surrounding the use of the niqab by new immigrants during citizenship swearing-in ceremonies.
pete_dushenski: still haven't seen the movie with nicholson et al. but it's supposed to be a decent flick, if not the most accurate of transpositions
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 20:07:23; asciilifeform: intimidation of chumps, as in 'lie detector', will take care of two thirds of the 'patients'
pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-10-2015#1296402 << calling them 'patients' gives me the creeps for some reason. maybe it's because i just read 'one flew over the cuckoo's nest' and have lobotomising mental hospitals on my mind..
pete_dushenski: http://cascadianhacker.com/blog/2015/10/10_supplys-down-demands-up-better-get-the-state-involved.html << particularly more like this
gribble: The operation succeeded.
pete_dushenski: ;;later tell ben_vulpes keep the blog posts acomin' please !
mircea_popescu: where's the "and then i harassed some nurses" chapter in the man's own rendering of his saga ?
asciilifeform: over here, they have working iphones.
mircea_popescu: meanwhile at the smarter kids fort, http://41.media.tumblr.com/2acd27e393e94288e05c0482302669c6/tumblr_nuohzcEyOi1ttqu7ro1_1280.jpg
mircea_popescu: just like bums drag around broken iphones. they might not work, but fuck, he's practically like almost one step removed from actual humanity. those great fabulous half-god creatures that actually use iphones and actually have professions.
mircea_popescu: the irony being that they exactly got it : these fucktards actually believe gonzalez@gmail.com is "moar professional".
mircea_popescu: the people in those various times were supported by earnest empire.
asciilifeform: i've spoken to enough old folks in usa, dug through enough archives, old advertisements, to know what people earned and what they paid for a roof over their head.
asciilifeform: because iridium is pricey and i'd like to use the money to buy turkeys.
asciilifeform: all i'd like is the option of ordinary porcelain.
asciilifeform: the way i see it, in present-day usa you have the choice of buying plastic toilet with rusty nails instead of a seat, or iridium toilet.
mircea_popescu: what the fuck do you think freedom is.
mircea_popescu: and that was a rather direct result of "freedom to experiment".
mircea_popescu: i dunnop that there existed anything more offensive than the jewish ghetto of eastern europe cca 1920.
mircea_popescu: maybe part of why they got fucking exterminated like cows was that they LIVED LIKE FUCKING COWS ?????
mircea_popescu: all the coats were gray from all the home heating expwerimentation, and 40% of the population lived off processing garbage.\
asciilifeform: you mean the post-enclosures london?
mircea_popescu: meanwhile if you're curious and bored, read the coupla excellent mongraphs re life in london cca 1800.
mircea_popescu: at which the shorty starts breakdancing too\
mircea_popescu: what the fuck is wrong with you ? asks shorty
mircea_popescu: a tall guy that has visible parkinson and a short guy happen in the same restroom
mircea_popescu: and since we're picking on the structure of reality, why not the freedom to be a different height. maybe if you could experiment with height you'd have more pleasant urinatory experiences or who knows what.
mircea_popescu: yeah. except the absence of this freedom is no proof that the freedom would benefit, and your hypotheses as presented are unpersuasive.
asciilifeform: if one demands a 'final solution' - yes. but what i asked for was the freedom to try solutions other than bezzle.
mircea_popescu: the example given was well, a case of dwimnwis.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: notice that i did not say 'exterminate people who didn't graduate in maths.' i said 'what if people had freedom of association.' the example give was, well, an example.
mircea_popescu: and in yet another branch off this tree, im not even sure your ideas of selection would be a net positive.
mircea_popescu: either that or make some money.
assbot: Logged on 19-08-2015 00:18:24; asciilifeform: cabbie: 'this ford is a piece of shit. stalled again.' mircea_popescu: 'i have a solution!' cabbie: 'oh???111' mircea_popescu: 'here, have this broomstick.' cabbie: 'how do i drive customers on that, feed my family' mircea_popescu: 'you misunderstand, my good man. you stuff it in your arse.' cabbie: 'and... how does this feed by family?' mircea_popescu: 'no, you sit there with it in.'
asciilifeform: which is where we get to the sacramental:
mircea_popescu: freedom was never for the poor.
asciilifeform: there is this thing called 'freedom of association'. used to be a thing in usa.
mircea_popescu: but it does not automatically make the emplaced system unoptimal.
asciilifeform: where i live, at present, any experimentation in selectors ~other than rent bezzle~ is specifically forbidden by usg.
mircea_popescu: a la cecens. they can distinguish non-worthy dogfucker, yes.
asciilifeform: in practice, the 'do not want' is identifiable with minimal effort. because these are not spies from washington, but human refuse
asciilifeform: except in this hypothetical, we are not designing a soviet rocket factory, and pondering how to keep out spies from washington.
mircea_popescu: and this is not even fucking paramount or nlc ; and those are jack shit, basically they produce footage, big whoop. try making an atomic dirigible next.
mircea_popescu: modest studio = 6 camera people + 9 or so trainees ; about two dozen fluffers + administrative assistants ; about 2-300 models ; cleanning and maintenance crew ; execs and other suits.
mircea_popescu: let's go through the list.
mircea_popescu: even something as tiny as a porn studio will not be served by the model.
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> in the old-fashioned, meatspace, dunbar sense. << the OTHER problem with this is that there isn't eno9ugh space in the dunbar-based graph to cram everything you need.
mircea_popescu: it's pretty much the only thing working to starve reddit into submission.
asciilifeform: ... no brands? he gets to have a chat with the residents
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> i hear that not-breeding-them-in-the-first-place also worked great <<< how the fuck are you gonna manage this wonder. so you select a woman. and her spawn will... regress to the mean. of course. and she'll love it anwyay. of course. and now what ?
asciilifeform: well, first you check the applicant's forehead for brands.
mircea_popescu: well doh. how do you identify the nigger.
mircea_popescu: the problem is that given a facebook friendlist of 50k imbecile 20something females who, if asked "like to read" and then if pressed are apparently unaware that books EVEN HAVE AUTHORS
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: can't help but wonder if the blurry '90s thing was installed... deliberately! if it did not smudge, no one would know it is digital!!1!!11
mircea_popescu: anyway. the problem is not identification in the sense of this x = the x we know to be ok.
mircea_popescu: your working projector intended for a home was 1k new, their "cinema multiplexo!11" projector was prolly 2k and they bought it on time, so paid 5k or w/e.
asciilifeform: in the old-fashioned, meatspace, dunbar sense.
asciilifeform: and know one another.
asciilifeform: ideally, guard is one of the residents, who take turns on checkpoint duty.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and HOW does he know them.
asciilifeform: the way this works best is that the guard knows everyone who belongs inside the wire, by face.
mircea_popescu: if it were as simple as orc = black we'd have long exterminated the blacks and be living in paradise
asciilifeform: ask the israelis
mircea_popescu: "oh, forger the hard problems involved while i focus on painting the fence! that'll do it!"
phf: biggest disappointment of visiting northrop grumman one time-- no auto-turrets. i thought surely there if nowhere else.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform like what other ways ? you're not willing to spend 12 hours a day beating them
mod6: asciilifeform: <+mod6> Ok while I work on this for a while, I'll pull that bundle down. Should have one up sometime in the next few days to a week.
asciilifeform: betcha there is such an edition.
phf: i guess that's kind of like seeing conan the barbarian cover on beowulf
phf: or that there's wire to begin with, or that he has a fur hat, or some semblance of warm clothes. or the "sharapov and the bandit part 5" style of print
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 21:09:34; mod6: http://thebitcoin.foundation/v/V-20151011.tar.gz
asciilifeform: in the fine tradition of sf cover art, where the artist must never, under any circumstances, know anything at all about the inside of the book.
asciilifeform: what's ridiculous? that he's standing right next to the wire? sure.
phf: by the way i stopped by some russian bookstore on the way to saunas and spotted this utterly ridiculous shalamov cover http://static.ozone.ru/multimedia/books_covers/1011527549.jpg. i don't even.
asciilifeform: has none of these issues.
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 21:31:08; mircea_popescu: asciilifeform>had standard lcd. but the latter do not resemble the machines i have previously used having such << speaing of which, i went to a local cinema yest. place tries real hard to be us like. they had digital projector. not only were the pixels visible with naked eye from middle of room, but
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-10-2015#1296476 << lulzy, the one i have at home, apparently, is better
asciilifeform: atm nobody knows precisely their mass.
phf: for fair comparison therealbitcoin loc should include relevant openssl bits
asciilifeform: for comparison, therealbitcoin is < 700kB
phf: actually yeah. i was always curious why "trust system" that presumably is baked into keyrings is different from signing the key with your sig
asciilifeform: i cannot even begin to fathom the kind of retardation that produced 'keyrings'.
asciilifeform: fetching wot automagically defeats the very purpose of using pgp
asciilifeform: this is the kind of thing i was afraid of when first contemplating automating any of this
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 23:39:50; mod6: One can do this for sure. The idea was, if the user just has the scrpit, and nothing else, they could sync all the latest wots/seals/vpatches from a mirror.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-10-2015#1296513 << the rent bezzle solves a problem, yes. which could be solved in other ways.
mod6: Ok while I work on this for a while, I'll pull that bundle down. Should have one up sometime in the next few days to a week.
mod6: it is not required to do that, one can just populate the stuff by hand, ofc.
mircea_popescu: see, the idea being that pubkey gotta be a special category.
mod6: no, it sync's stuff from the mirror via wget, currently
mod6: how will the secure population of the pubkey dir work? just by pulling keys manually or is this an automated function?
mod6: hmm. well, i can take all of the sync stuff out for sure. will reduce a ton of code.
mircea_popescu: mmm i don't think that's either intended functionality or a good idea.
mod6: One can do this for sure. The idea was, if the user just has the scrpit, and nothing else, they could sync all the latest wots/seals/vpatches from a mirror.
mircea_popescu: to run v in the first place one's supposed to provide a populated pubkeys dir.
mod6: I guess I could just not print who signed the mirrors. Leave the mirror list sigs in place on the server, and they can be checked later by hand if anyone wants. but i kinda like how it shows who signed it.
mircea_popescu: the concept of unaffordable housing chiefly exists on this earth to keep women pliable and young derps out of the pool.
ben_vulpes: everyone wants affordable housing, they just don't want to house people who need affordable housing anywhere near themselves.
mod6: hmm. chicken/egg type of problem, maybe not so simple. if one wants to check the signed mirrors before init, how can sigs be checked from wot if no wot yet exists.
ben_vulpes: trinque: you might find it amusing that now that the rains have moved in, Hinson is holding a series of neighborhood meetings to figure out "what to do" about colonel summers.
mod6: found a bug. will fix on next time posted. for now; after `./v.pl init http://thebitcoin.foundation` is run, run `./v.pl w` to ensure all of the WoT's get imported to the keyring.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes> the entire operation's profit plan for the forseeable future is to increase the forced obsolescence rate and drive down the number of atoms and fab processes in the whole thing while charging ever more. << and even so it won't be able to keep up with inflation.
phf: kakobrekla: i didn't have any expectations, i didn't know anything about it until half hour before. one of the people who invited me walked out half way through and the other one appologized.
mircea_popescu: it hit all the dumb spots, it could stand as a two hour summary of "this is a full description of how these imbeciles are imbeciles"
mircea_popescu: this thing (baires) was an INCREDIBLE collection of the stupideology of argentinians.
phf: went to a movie theater to see The Martian. i only ever watch movies when in-wot recommend something enough, so i didn't realize how bad a movie can be, and this was one of the worst movies i've ever seen. snl "you can do anything" skit done with a straightface.. in space! but anyway, they've replaced all the regular rows, with reclining sits, and you can push the button for the sit to recline. i was
ben_vulpes: the entire operation's profit plan for the forseeable future is to increase the forced obsolescence rate and drive down the number of atoms and fab processes in the whole thing while charging ever more.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: 'lcds' << apple SOP. watch exists to maintain price point of late model pn0hes, which exist to prop price point of new pn0hes, which exist to prop price point of the *cheap* craptop...
mircea_popescu: in other news, http://40.media.tumblr.com/1843b7f9b3044d65b6f6e83f9f663465/tumblr_ngpkg23or21tcv3gao1_1280.jpg << good tits are a thing.
mircea_popescu: i have no idea how they imagine the pos digital projector can compete with a 1950s soviet thing that went around the villages to show propaganda shorts.
mircea_popescu: the fucking scannig speed of that thing. omfg.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform>had standard lcd. but the latter do not resemble the machines i have previously used having such << speaing of which, i went to a local cinema yest. place tries real hard to be us like. they had digital projector. not only were the pixels visible with naked eye from middle of room, but
mircea_popescu: <ben_vulpes> anyways, the notion that the us courts have the mandate to execute people or have any other stort of effect on the world is long past its sell by date << word.
mircea_popescu: or that there's more examples of this pinnacle of lulz than there are "scientists" drawing breath at any given time.
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> folks familiar with usg 'scientocracy' will laugh, but the fact is, the mind-reading box does not necessarily have to... work. to be put in use. << right right. cholesterol is bad for you except its good for you and salt is bad except its good and hey, as long as they got "science" what difference does it make that they're 100% consensused on opposite things every 30 years.
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 18:15:21; mircea_popescu: this is the sunday psa that eulora needs more noobs.
mod6: (Hint: Please rtfm at least one of the guides before anyone says "Doesnt work!")
assbot: How a secret Chinese military drug based on an ancient herb won the Nobel Prize - The Washington Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1jXDoi3 )
BingoBoingo: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/10/06/how-a-secret-chinese-military-drug-based-on-an-ancient-herb-won-the-nobel-prize/
mod6: Ok, so I've posted my version of V for some review before it goes to the ML. Inside the archive you'll find a `v.pl', `v_quick_start.txt', and `v_users_manual.txt' - and each with a corresponding sig.
asciilifeform: my other thought was that it is even possible that both variants used physically-identical components and the cheaper one was somehow crippled in software.
asciilifeform: but instead to prod people to the costlier 'high res' variant
asciilifeform: my first thought was that these are not intended to actually sell
asciilifeform: there was a row of apple portables, and some had high-res lcd (sold as 'retina' trade name) while others had standard lcd. but the latter do not resemble the machines i have previously used having such; instead, they were atrocious, with what looked like triangular pixels, dithering visible to the naked eye;
asciilifeform: unrelatedly, today i went into a shop and saw a type of chumpatronic contrivance for which i do not know the name:
ben_vulpes: no, they won't do anything to anyone cheating emissions tests.
ben_vulpes: anyways, the notion that the us courts have the mandate to execute people or have any other stort of effect on the world is long past its sell by date
assbot: Antonin Scalia Says Executing The Innocent Is Constitutional - Business Insider ... ( http://bit.ly/1R61Gke )
asciilifeform: http://www.businessinsider.com/antonin-scalia-says-executing-the-innocent-is-constitutional-2014-9
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: see famous case with portland lawyer that the incompetents in the usg wanted to frame for the madrid bombings.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: last i saw, the u.s. left loves dna test. so long as it is mainly used to exonerate blacks
ben_vulpes: the threat of voodoo won't work anymore.
ben_vulpes: but when the voodoo is known to everyone as voodoo, which the left will *ensure* happens with the DNA saga
ben_vulpes: and generally the big stick works.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: fingerprints were 'debunked' in the 1900s
ben_vulpes: the whole legal/scientocratic edifice is shaking apart as the science part more trivially debunkable.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes has it, it will be another 'dna evidence'
punkman: people still believe in the old model
asciilifeform: the 'voodoo intimidation value' of the old-fashioned kind is, afaik, thought to suffice
ben_vulpes: and will likely suffer the same public humiliations