Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2014-09-09 | 2014-09-11 → ↓
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 1100 @ 0.00063924 = 0.7032 BTC [+] {4}
asciilifeform: kakobrekla, BingoBoingo: i remembered the american firm that made electrocranial something-or-others - 'alpha-stim.' but i never tried or even saw their gadget - and, a bit dubious, smells a little of spam.
asciilifeform: but it does pop up once or twice in refereed journals, apparently.
asciilifeform has an entire book shelf of ancient crapolade re: electrocranial diddlage from 1940s up, in 4 languages. all decaying xerocopies. ought to scan in one day...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5865 @ 0.00076844 = 4.5069 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 50 @ 0.010639 = 0.532 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 50 @ 0.01063957 = 0.532 BTC [+] {4}
cazalla: meh, smh is a rag
cazalla: "Bitcoin prices have swung between more than $US900 to as low as $US341 this year as enthusiasts try to address the digital currency's weaknesses, persuade consumers to embrace it and overcome governments' concerns that it could be misused by criminals. " ok lol
RagnarDanneskjol: its the first I'd heard anything definitive about bitcoin-paypal
assbot: SBI launches multi-currency international card | Business Line
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8923 @ 0.00076653 = 6.8397 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 1150 @ 0.00061435 = 0.7065 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Don't Layer Currency Risk on Top of Equity Exposure
fluffypony: xmj: around?
xmj: fluffypony: si
xmj: fluffypony: How may I help you on this bright Wednesday ;)
fluffypony: xmj: so oaes_lib uses ftime() like a retard, and we don't have spare contributors to rewrite the two places its used to rather use gettimeofday - is there anything particularly wrong with using -lcompat for the moment till we can see to that?
xmj: that's c, or c++ ?
fluffypony: also the original oaes_lib author seems to eschew modernising it, so we may dump it completely at some stage rather than bother
xmj: hrm, i'm not a c dev
xmj: if you're interested in having that question answered from a BSD perspective, you could try #bsdports on efnet
xmj: there's plenty of people who could answer it
xmj: what's oaeslib do?
fluffypony: open aes
fluffypony: code.google.com/p/openaes/
xmj: hum
xmj: that's not AES-Ni is it?
xmj: hang on..
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: Oh, apparently the brain electricity stuff for sleep et al is being commercialized << well of course, everything's being commercialised, from cow piss (redbull) to an app to prove you're rich. dun really much matter if it works, as long as someone somewhere thought of it, it's available to buy.
mircea_popescu: gotta keep teh economy out.
mircea_popescu: i mean up
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: re: 100hz - i do lean towards the soviet hypothesis that at least a third of the sleep cycle is a vestigial waste of time. <<< why ?
xmj: BingoBoingo: brain electricity sleep stuff is prone to commercial failure, see Zeo.
mircea_popescu: to me all this "let's improve sleep" stuff reads a lot like "this cnc control code would be a lot better if we took out all sleep() references"
xmj: BingoBoingo: you can *technically* exist on 2h of pure REM sleep a day.
mircea_popescu: The20YearIRCloud: So shock therapy is old? << just about contemporaneous with electricity itself.
xmj: I know people who have done so for long(er) stretches of times
xmj: fluffypony: I got confused. aren't AES routines implemented by libcrypto?
fluffypony: xmj: afair this is used in the PoW, so it uses openaes for speed
xmj: PoW?
mircea_popescu: fluffypony afaik lcompat just does a gettimeofday clal anyway
mircea_popescu: xmj proof of work eh.
xmj: gotcha
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: yes exactly
fluffypony: lcompat seems to be working fine
xmj: fluffypony: thing being, iff it uses AES AND iff AES needs to be fast, you'll want to look into crypto(4) and aesni(4)
fluffypony: but going to actually rip this out and rewrite it to use gettimeofday on bsd
mircea_popescu: i wouldn't expect any problems. in fact it's probably better reviewed code than w/e it's been replaced with anyway.
xmj still waits for OpenSSL to be replaced with LibreSSL on FreeBSD
mircea_popescu: other than proper cryptography for all foss, as discussed coupla days re gentoo overlays etc, i would fucking love for all lines of code to come with a counter.
mircea_popescu: "how many times this was read. increment by hand"
mircea_popescu: as a v0.1. then for v0.2 of this, have an actual crypto signed procedure where everyone who reads a line of code signs and it's wot-abble this.
mircea_popescu: that's what github'd be doing, if it weren't wasting its time with imbecile females vying for attention the only way imbecile females know how.
mircea_popescu: anyone want to make a fork of git and implement all this ?
xmj: mircea_popescu: do feel free to put your money where your mouth is.
xmj: i'm sure you'll find lots of people who love paying for this
mircea_popescu: xmj what exactly makes you think my money isn't where my mouth is, nooblet ?
xmj: oh here we go again
xmj: /ignore -replies mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: RagnarDanneskjol ima wait for delivery on that other thing first, and i have a queue there anyway.
xmj: better.
mircea_popescu: ie, i'll need another bot after that one
RagnarDanneskjol: He and Alz had a long convo about it a few hours ago.. also put him in touch with chetty - discussed gribble for eulora
mircea_popescu: gribble for eulora ? wut ?
RagnarDanneskjol: he is going to deliver way ahead of schedule I believe
chetty: mircea_popescu, said there should be a gribble npc ...
mircea_popescu: o, in the monthly report ?
mircea_popescu: i read "gribble for #eulora" for some reason.
RagnarDanneskjol: oh - that too
mircea_popescu: lol this guy. hey RagnarDanneskjol is there something you won't try to do ? :D
mircea_popescu: you coming for the $conference incidentally ?
mircea_popescu: $conference
empyex: mircea_popescu: Next conference starts in 7 months and 7 days. Estimated cost today: 2.76775979 BTC (Details: http://trilema.com/2014/the-conference-third-edition/ )
RagnarDanneskjol: sure, sounds fun. I missed that
mircea_popescu: that's why that bot command is so handy. easy to miss things in the deluge.
mircea_popescu: i think fluffypony was going to charter a plane or i dun remember how that went.
RagnarDanneskjol: nice. so are you staying in BA for the forseeable future (not that its any my business)
fluffypony: we haven't really pursued that idea, the nice charters are very expensive per-person even if we fill the plane
mircea_popescu: RagnarDanneskjol yeah. fluffypony i imagined :p
assbot: Popescu'd need not be a verb nor a discussion. All say aye.., say AYE!, "AYE!" | Bitcointa.lk
nubbins`: so i've got these two new roomies
nubbins`: one of 'em just got a job at canada's top restaurant, which is, conveniently, just a short tumble down the hill from here
nubbins`: current plan is to injure his legs and confine him to the kitchen here
xmj: solid plan
xmj: nubbins`: alternatively you could -ask- them
nubbins`: oh he's already said he's gonna recreate some menu items for us
nubbins`: i just want to seal the deal
assbot: Jeremy Charles: Canadas real top chef - The Globe and Mail
assbot: My November speaking tour is coming together: LA, Sydney, Melbourne, Auckland, Queenstown
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "computer monitor of better than 600 x 300 pixels resolution." pandering to the new ega displays i see ? :D
nubbins`: ^ lel
mircea_popescu: you wanna seal the deal by breaking a guy's legs ?
mircea_popescu: jesus canucks are tought.
nubbins`: i'd like a gribble module that polls alf's output for interesting short stories
nubbins`: mircea_popescu the climate made us this way
mircea_popescu: no wonder all the eskimos are gone with only some scroungy inuit left
nubbins`: it's only with the advent of higher temperatures that we've mellowed. 10 years ago i woulda had the guy surgically attached to the kitchen counter
mircea_popescu: YOU FUCKEM ATE THEM DIDNT YOU
mircea_popescu: cazalla lol speaking tours. this is roughly the equivalent of the plague, don't envy a man his misery.
nubbins`: besides, the aboriginal people in this province are generally innu; you'd have to go a lot farther for inuit
mircea_popescu: you mean Two Dogs isn't originally populated by dogs ?
nubbins`: in fact, both were bred from an animal called the St. John's Water Dog
nubbins`: itself, a mixture of portuguese, english, and irish working dogs
nubbins`: why in the fuck do i know all this?
mircea_popescu: because you're canadian, and that makes you weird ? :D
nubbins`: heh.
nubbins`: golden retrievers come from this same stock
mircea_popescu: anyway, one wonders what happens when a coupla gals working canada's best whorehouse move in with nubsy.
nubbins`: almost all modern retrievers, in fact
nubbins`: mp: "in fact, the clitoris is located above the vulva, not below"
mircea_popescu: surgically attached to toilet bowl, shower curtain or bedstand ?
nubbins`: toilet bowl, wtf?
nubbins`: "this one just shits"
mircea_popescu: "here i shit, here i piss, here i come"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform anyway, the fundamnetal idea is sound. if one could weaponize idiocy at will one wouldn't need any further wishes from the djinn.
nubbins`: i feel like there's loot to be made with one of those bitcoin ATMs here, but i also feel like i can't be fucked to manage an ATM
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform anyway, the close is flawed. the mind can not on its own recreate the damagingly illogical. this is pretty much the largest most important safety we have.
mircea_popescu: it's a biological protection on the level of "dead by holding his own breath", except implemented in nature rather than in the body.
nubbins`: ah, in the normal run of events, sure.
nubbins`: go visit a bughouse and tell me none of those people recreated the damagingly illogical :D
assbot: BLIT - a short story by David Langford
mircea_popescu: it's a sf story about how the exposure to fractals make brains pop.
nubbins`: (i know a guy who claims he's had a cube stuck inside his brain for ~17 years. he declines to elaborate)
nubbins`: yah, i read that last night
nubbins`: good one
nubbins`: snow crash, same idea but novel-length and w/ language rather than sight
nubbins`: and, inexplicably, an adult male having sex with a female child
mircea_popescu: sf is period code for weirdo
mircea_popescu: much like queer used to be code for weirdo
mircea_popescu: so for some inexplainable reason 93% of all the comment spam sent to trilema has to do with bags
mircea_popescu: ie, women's handbags.
nubbins`: sci-fi eye on the straight guy
ThickAsThieves: <+mircea_popescu> it's a sf story about how the exposure to fractals make brains pop. /// a couple weeks ago i was charting for hours on end, using fib spirals and picking apart fractal patterns, and this repeating melody started in my head, not a song i knew, just a sequence. It was there for a day or two. First time I was musically inspired in a while.
mircea_popescu: not bad.
mircea_popescu: im curious who's gonna be the first b-a alumn to become famous in an unrelated field.
mircea_popescu: (i also have a bet with some unfriendly parties as to whether that film' gonna be criminal insanity or not, but that's a different story)
mircea_popescu: s/film/first/
ThickAsThieves: bitcoin has nasty habit of consuming "unrelated fields"
assbot: John Keefe Pictures - MTV TRL Presents The Jonas Brothers, T.I., Lady GaGa and Boys Like Girls - Zimbio
nubbins`: that douche on the left has essentially the same name as me
nubbins`: closest i've gotten to fame so far
nubbins`: infamy, i'm already there. but fame? different story
nubbins`: [11:25:53] samO__ (6d5dedf1@unaffiliated/samo) left IRC. (Changing host)
nubbins`: [11:25:53] samO__ (6d5dedf1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.109.93.237.241) joined the channel.
nubbins`: mask on a web client?
mircea_popescu: infamy ? how are you infamous ?
mircea_popescu: and yes, you can login with nameserv from a webirc session as well as from any other session
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: vestigial waste of time. <<< why <<<< if you pharmacologically zap stages 3 and 4 of sleep - eventually death. stages 1 and 2 are spandrels. they're, as far as anybody knows, worthless - if you sleep only 1 and 2, approx. same as not sleeping at all. but our meat is not equipped for skipping straight to 3 normally.
mircea_popescu: define worthless.
mircea_popescu: what's your measure of worth ?
asciilifeform: waste of time.
asciilifeform: ;;google evolutionary spandrel
gribble: Spandrel (biology) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spandrel_(biology)>; Evolution The Spandrels of San Marco and the Panglossian ...: <http://faculty.washington.edu/lynnhank/GouldLewontin.pdf>; Adaptations, Exaptations, and Spandrels - Social Sciences Division: <http://www.sscnet.ucla.edu/comm/haselton/webdocs/spandrels.html>
mircea_popescu: you know that's no good do you ?
asciilifeform: not that 'stage 1+2 is a spandrel' is a proven hypothesis, of course. merely that it has not been tested. i suspect that it can be proven.
mircea_popescu: but even if it were, that's still not enough for what you're arguing.
asciilifeform: if it were, that's still not enough << ??
mircea_popescu: it isn't. you're saying it's "a waste of time", a spandrel merely means "not directly resulting from selection"
mircea_popescu: these aren't the same strength.
mircea_popescu: take the case of the heart.
asciilifeform: perhaps spandrel is wrong word.
mircea_popescu: the heart is a well designed pump, that works very well in its own engineering envelope.
mircea_popescu: people who use it outside of that envelope, such as for instance habitual stimulant abusers, stock brokers and other such "high stress" occupations usually die of heart failure.
mircea_popescu: the reason for this is that the heart can't do too many regime change cycles a day
mircea_popescu: now, having a period of time where it can relax and clean up may be exactly what it needs. even if this is enforced by cnc paralysis rather than another venue
mircea_popescu: the human body being a final case of "the protocol is the code". it works like we've discussed, as this insane collection of things repaired by malfunction in unassociated things
asciilifeform: hence stages 3, 4.
mircea_popescu: there were some renaissance mechanical models for this.
thestringpuller: ;;later tell BingoBoingo good luck my friend
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform note that for me to disprove your stance, all i need is an example of possible failure, which i've satisfied. for you to support your stance giving a counterexample is not enough.
asciilifeform: hypothesis here is that stages 1 and 2 are 'runway'
mircea_popescu: i read the hypothesis here as "stages 1 and 2 can be safely removed"
asciilifeform: test would be - some means of reliably rocketing through them straight to 3 on demand.
asciilifeform: (and staying in 3+4 without the normal gaps of 1,2)
mircea_popescu: only problem with that test is you won't be able to distinguish the source of any side effects - from the rocketing or from the rocket.
asciilifeform: certainly.
thestringpuller: walking into bitcoin-assets becomes more like walking into a random lecutre hall at a good university...
mircea_popescu: but anyway. i don't expect improvement here.
thestringpuller: and this is just "normal" conversation
mircea_popescu waves at thestringpuller
asciilifeform: just as the example you gave, of stimulant abusers - most of the documented medical sequelae, afaik, are from extreme sleep deprivation...
mircea_popescu: well, they removed 1 and 2 did they not.
thestringpuller salutes mircea_popescu and asciilifeform *good day sirs*
asciilifeform: and 3, 4, and they won't even lie down
mircea_popescu: rocket and rocketing again :)
mircea_popescu: but at this point, we suddenly face the danger of falling into nominalism. consider a pill that zaps 1&2 so you can 3-4 only, withj the caveat that to be used safe over a century, you have to lie down for two to three hours each day and relax independently of sleep.
mircea_popescu: well... so what does the pill do again ? allows you to rename things ? i can do that w/o pills :D
asciilifeform: well, for one thing you could 'sleep' when not palpably weary
mircea_popescu: i can do that now.
asciilifeform: like housecat
asciilifeform: (some people already know how to do this, yes.)
mircea_popescu: theres really nothing to know, you just... lie down and sleep
asciilifeform: then perhaps mutants.
asciilifeform cannot do this unless chronically deprived of sleep
mircea_popescu: !up chalbersma
mircea_popescu: i think the more likely producitve approach is psychologic tho
mircea_popescu: can you normally tell what's wrong with you, if something's wrong, and what food item was the cause, if you're sick ?
assbot: "What is Bitcoin?" silkscreened posters [1/50 left] : shutupandtakemymoney
nubbins`: an honor, i'm sure
asciilifeform: i'd say yes
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so then just lie down with yourself and relax, it's doable.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: takes an hour or to to even begin to switch gears, and that's if tired.
nubbins`: oh, it links to the ink-mixing post
asciilifeform precisely wishes to know why
nubbins`: i thought this was some sort of sarcastic butthurt style reddit
nubbins`: now i'm just confused
ThickAsThieves: skip to 3&4 with 5 shots of vodka
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: opposite effect, there.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform say, take the pet, go to yoga class.
mircea_popescu: on one hand, chicks in yoga pants!
mircea_popescu: on the other hand, relaxation is an important skill.
ThickAsThieves: but but vodka makes you live longer
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves i dun sell gherkins to gardners and vodka to russians.
chetty: mircea_popescu, has these insane instant change mode switches .... he really don't understand how the rest of us live
asciilifeform doesn't know the secret of the hypothetical, legendary 'motorized sleep.' but suspects that, just as eight cylinder engine is an improvement over the most skilled runner, there could be a means for improvement here.
ThickAsThieves: maybe we need to go on life support when we sleep
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: question'd be, which sort.
mircea_popescu: i don't think sleep improvement is impossible per se. but i do think what's herein contemplated is of the level of improving cpu caching with drills, lathes and other mechanical tools.
mircea_popescu: even if it works it hasn't worked.
ThickAsThieves: maybe humans have a built in hibernation function we dont know how to work yet
mircea_popescu: or maybe sleep is a very high level cognitive function, and humanity still struggles with logic.
ThickAsThieves: maybe we're always sleeping
asciilifeform has wild, '9000%' variation in sleep quality from day to day, since childhood, and would be satisfied with knowing why and having knobs for it.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you got the stomach for some mysticism ?
mircea_popescu: you know anything about the pashtun ?
asciilifeform: quite a bit.
mircea_popescu: suppose there's a well respected, honorful general of this one tribe
mircea_popescu: he lives in a hut, like all the others, rural pashtun.
mircea_popescu: suppose "good sleep" is being in his tent.
mircea_popescu: suppose the normal introduction so you may be allowed there takes a coupla hours, going through all the complicated pashtun honor ceremonies.
asciilifeform sees where this is going
mircea_popescu: suppose shady gringo in the kabul market offers to sell you a dust which, if sparkled around, will teleport you straight into tent, no further need for "Wasting time"
mircea_popescu: how much ?
asciilifeform: !s bathtub catapult
mircea_popescu: HOW you get there may be as important as how much time you spend, neh ?
mircea_popescu: after all, ninjashogun spent some time here too.
mircea_popescu: he HAS that catapult.
mircea_popescu: what's it do for him ?
mircea_popescu: plenty of people work up the nerve to speak over hours. plenty more probably haven't yet. so ?
ThickAsThieves: who wants to spend their waking ours managing their sleeping ones
asciilifeform: good analogy, except that, with correct plans, it is possible to survive the bathtub catapult (parachute exists.)
The20YearIRCloud: Closed on the loan today, joy
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves you ever met that blessed folk that will spent sixteen hours a day working to "make money while they sleep", 5 dolla an hour ?
asciilifeform: sixteen hours a day working to "make money while they sleep" >> they're struggling for escape from arbeit macht frei.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform maybe mere survival ain't the goal.
mircea_popescu: The20YearIRCloud how much did you get in the end ?
mircea_popescu: not bad.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform escape < they still get paid in paypal. what escape. incape.
asciilifeform: didn't say - successful escape. attempted.
The20YearIRCloud: It's a fixed rate credit line, which is nice as we can go out, buy properties, refinance said properties, then just continue to buy more
asciilifeform: a few bullets from the guard towers lodged in arse.
ThickAsThieves: i wonder if people who only sleep 3-5 hrs a day, live more or less waking hours than those sleeping 8+
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform but the premise is flawed. they're trying to escape... into da's office ?
asciilifeform: likewise, paid in scrip, but never need to wake up / go places / take orders - still a kind of escape.
mircea_popescu: i guess.
rithm hugs scrip
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves chetty used to sleep 4ish hours for many years.
mircea_popescu: i suspect this is a lot easier for women
ThickAsThieves: i rarely sleep more than 5 for a long time
asciilifeform: ah and that's another tidbit - some people need considerably less, for firing on all cylinders, than others. find out why. if can replicate - win.
ThickAsThieves: i do get tired though
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform some people are fucking dumb. others - not so. find out why, avoid, win.
mircea_popescu: wtf are you on about lol :D
asciilifeform: picture hypothetical - what if actually needing 8+ hours is something like 'beriberi'
mircea_popescu: if you're going for this why not make smart pill directly, why bother with sleep pill.
ThickAsThieves: i think eating frequency is a factor as well, metabolism
asciilifeform: what if we just aren't eating enough $rareearth
mircea_popescu: what if, ok. but i dun believe that has a leg to stand on.
mircea_popescu: sleep is very similar, and in fact one of the better arguments pro homogenity in the human race
asciilifeform does not even remotely know the answer to this one, but can't rule out a beriberi-like gotcha
mircea_popescu: the fact that all cultures had beds, and the fact that all cultures could go to bed with any others.
mircea_popescu: that exists in all climes ?
mircea_popescu: what WOULD you take to rule it out ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 400 @ 0.00488188 = 1.9528 BTC [+] {4}
asciilifeform: what would it take << beautiful question. let's say we find that chetty has, e.g., more efficient mitochondriae, that eat and shit less for given level of activity. and therefore require less cleanup. then we say 'can't fix this with aftermarket patch.'
mircea_popescu: how are you going to fix mother dna outside of eugeny ?
asciilifeform: that was example of 'can't'
mircea_popescu: (yes, that's how that "extra" dna from the mother side works - mitochondria has its own dna set)
asciilifeform: alternatively, scenario where there is a fix. some folks feel that they would profit from being - taller. in russia, they can fix this.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ah i read "can fix"
asciilifeform: (illegal in usa, afaik.)
mircea_popescu: lol how do they fix it ? suspension ?
mircea_popescu: procust's bed ?
asciilifeform: surgeon breaks both of your legs with a clever little instrument; sets them in such a way that they grow 10cm or so at a time - longer.
asciilifeform: a year+ in wheelchair.
mircea_popescu: i had no idea.
mircea_popescu: shitty trade tho. i wouldn't spend a year in wheelchair for an extra four inches
asciilifeform: matters more for one man than another
asciilifeform: used to be, folks would travel there for this op, just like others went to thailand for 'sex change' etc
ThickAsThieves: like Gattaca
mircea_popescu: im almost tempted by your theory. "you can sleep better if you never have sex again. here's the pill"
chetty: ooo GATTICA
ThickAsThieves: ever seen than movie?
asciilifeform: schlick.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform nah, the pill just makes you uber horny.
ThickAsThieves: mp you should watch it
mircea_popescu: i think i have.
asciilifeform saw, not impressed
mircea_popescu: isn't it some derpy "kid wants to be fighter jet pilot, cock not big enough, o lala la drama" story ?
ThickAsThieves: well, the goal is to be entertained, not impressed per se :)
chetty: well it did have application for longer legs
asciilifeform pictures a jet actually piloted using cock
ThickAsThieves: cock must be this big to ride
mircea_popescu: anyway, the us-agitprop makes me chaf. "o noes, you can do anything, retards are people too, form a circle let's hold hands"
mircea_popescu: meh. not my kettle.
asciilifeform: the way, some say, stephen hawking drives his wheelchair with arse muscle joystick
ThickAsThieves: good tshirt for a porn actress
mircea_popescu: ^ prolly done to death.
asciilifeform: form a circle let's hold hands << in old science fiction, it'd have been 'cripple builds cybernetic mega-coc, proceeds to kill worlds'
The20YearIRCloud: I found a few singlewide trailers for our company
The20YearIRCloud: we're looking at two different lots that have them, i'm pretty darn excited, it all gets me one step closer to being the slumlord I desire
asciilifeform: wait - people rent these?
asciilifeform thought trailer was for 'owning home' when you only have a few thousand usd in pocket
chetty: asciilifeform, no need for that anymore, mortages grow on gubermint trees
mircea_popescu: The20YearIRCloud trailers ?!
The20YearIRCloud: I've got a pretty good concept of what i want to do, just need a municipality where I can do it legally
ThickAsThieves: i rented a trailer when i first moced to fl
mircea_popescu: so what is that, the ohio happy brothel ?
asciilifeform: mortages grow on gubermint trees << more complicated than this. no houses in the usual sense, near what remains of civilization in usa, are permitted to cost less than mid six digit.
The20YearIRCloud: But the premise is to take crappy trailers, and have my guys refurbish them in a way that they'd be superior to most conventionally built houses with regards to energy, and then rent em out for median pricing
mircea_popescu: what's the floor surface of a trailer ? 200sq ft ?
rithm: closer to 1000
rithm: 750
mircea_popescu: that big ?
asciilifeform would happily live in a refrigerator truck, or a partizan dugout, or similar, if it didn't come with being corralled into a ghetto of similar wretches
rithm: depends on single or double
mircea_popescu: why not just buy shipping containers then. not so expensive, can be stacked...
mircea_popescu: rithm he just said double
The20YearIRCloud: ones i'm looking at are 900-1000
mircea_popescu: shit. he just said single.
The20YearIRCloud: Not legal in my area to use a shipping container
rithm: shipping container buried the side of a hill sounds lovely to me
asciilifeform: Not legal in my area to use a shipping container << perhaps you can guess why.
mircea_popescu: cauze it'd be cheaper and more efficient ?
The20YearIRCloud: At least, a trailer lives up to code when it was built, and it isn't illegal to use one that's old as dirt
rithm: mircea_popescu i totally do not follow the chat and just jump in randomly as if i knew what were going on
asciilifeform: for the same reason buckminster fuller's injection-molded plastic house was banned.
asciilifeform: real estate parasite scum live, breathe, to keep housing costly.
The20YearIRCloud: Zoning is quite slow
The20YearIRCloud: We're just catching on to doing steel skinned, soy insullated houses
nubbins`: wait, i thought it was unions that did his house-pod things in
The20YearIRCloud: the fiberglass people a pretty crazy when it comes to supressing new types of insullation
nubbins`: Big Glass
mircea_popescu: fiberglass isn't that bad, but it's fucking toxyc.
The20YearIRCloud: There's this one type of soy insullation we want, it's 4x more efficient per cubic meter than anything fiberglass has to offer, and some municipalities still don't allow
nubbins`: BIG GLASS IS IN THE TREES
mircea_popescu: The20YearIRCloud how do you keep the wevils out ?
nubbins` swivels wildly about
asciilifeform: big glass << laugh all you like, 'corning co.' is one of the few remaining mega-industrial giants in usa
asciilifeform: fiberglass toxic << yes
asciilifeform has workshop in a very large garden shed, that came with current rental. itches every time coming out of it.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform partizan dugout may be pretty cool.
mircea_popescu: i hear all the truant tattooed teenagers swarm there
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it'd be great, but would have to be deep in a forest, secret, with a stump for a chimney - just like during the war. because living in something that isn't a house is highly illegal in usa (unless part of a designated ghettoschwitz)
mircea_popescu: and it gotta be in usa ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i vaguely recall a story of yours, about a chum who went to usa and left in disgust, when he was not permitted to build other than a cardboard house.
mircea_popescu: well yeah. was a bunch o people, they got building permit and proceeded to built like at home. concrete pillars, brick walls etc.
The20YearIRCloud: alot of it depends on municipality
The20YearIRCloud: there's areas where I live that they don't care what you put up or what you live in (Sheds included), but those aren't areas I want property in
asciilifeform: gotta be in usa << currently. (as discussed in the past)
mircea_popescu: yeah well, partisan dugouts in the us may have to wait a few years.
asciilifeform: if could afford to escape - would. just like every other schmuck
asciilifeform: those aren't areas I want property in << designated ghettoschwitzes, yes. notice how it is highly illegal to keep out scum other than through real estate pricing, in any part of usa.
assbot: chalbersma +v failed; L1: 0, L2: 0
asciilifeform: cannot, for example, 'to buy property here you must solve this here single-variable integral.'
kakobrekla: !up chalbersma
asciilifeform: or even 'name the 50 states of usa'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "and their capitols"
asciilifeform: any of it.
mircea_popescu: the idea holds water tho. money is supposed to work as an iq-meter.
mircea_popescu: if it doesn't, THAT has to be fixed, not this.
asciilifeform: bidding wars
mircea_popescu: im not even sure i could do integration by hand, outside of recognising the formulaic equivalents.
assbot: Logged on 06-04-2014 14:59:26; mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ok. considering the what/how debate as accepted foundation : at any time there's a number of turkeys and a number of engineers.
asciilifeform: doesn't have to be integrals. i just picked an example from 'captchas' used on some russian forums.
mircea_popescu: haha they actually use integrals as captchas ?
mircea_popescu: but it's simple pattern recognition, right ? of the ilk of "what is x2 + y2 + 2xy"
asciilifeform: (perhaps mircea_popescu and i might've forgotten how to grind gnarly integrals mentally, but we still have the neurons to grind with 'macsyma' etc.)
The20YearIRCloud: No, not ghettos, extremely rural areas with low property prices/low market
asciilifeform: (american version)
The20YearIRCloud: If i'm going in those areas, i'm getting land for the land, not to build cheap houses
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ouch lol. i have nfi
mircea_popescu: what am i supposed to be, 18 ?!
asciilifeform: and the like.
mircea_popescu: heh. so the top is what, like 2/3x^2/3 + x ?
mircea_popescu: this shit's awful wtf.
asciilifeform brings this up as example of something that you certainly, definitely, under threat of harsh punishments, could not get away with in allocation of american housing.
mircea_popescu: does that russian forum actually expect someone to type out (2/3 * x ** (2/3))/((3/4 * x ** (3/4) -(6/7 * x ** (6/7) )+x as a reply to a captcha ?
mircea_popescu: or am i missing something ?
kakobrekla doesnt feel bad about 'XVII + nineteen' anymore
asciilifeform: answer's usually short.
mircea_popescu: well is this one ?
chetty: not so very different than making people jump through gpg hoops to get voice in here
asciilifeform can't be arsed. does not frequent said forums, or advocate this recipe.
asciilifeform: it was example.
nubbins`: chetty 8)
asciilifeform: but i'd rather do these integrals every ten minutes, than be asked to come up with $mil.
mircea_popescu: why the fuck ?
mircea_popescu: i got more $mil than #patience.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: you - yes. sure
mircea_popescu: let teenagers suck the cock and do the integrals, wtf are they for.
diametric: asciilifeform: you actually can make stipulations like that in american housing.
asciilifeform: point not being that i personally relish integral puzzles, but that if it were possible to escape usaschwitz by getting good at them, i'd be inclined to try.
asciilifeform: diametric: really? i was told it was banned as 'racist' at one point.
diametric: asciilifeform: re: home owners associations. they can basically place any number of arbitrary conditions on home ownership.
asciilifeform: ;;google disparate impact
gribble: Disparate impact - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disparate_impact>; Disparate Impact legal definition of Disparate Impact - Legal Dictionary: <http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Disparate+Impact>; What is disparate impact? definition and meaning: <http://www.businessdictionary.com/definition/disparate-impact.html>
mircea_popescu: diametric may have a point. you can prolly ge away with a community agreement where every tenant has to play scrabble or some shit
mircea_popescu: exactly.
diametric: mircea_popescu: exactly.
mircea_popescu: ha! i beat someone to it for once, even if it was 2nd pass.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i recall that if your torture test ends up affecting one ethnic faction more than another, you get in hot water
diametric: usually hoas are run by bored housewives and middle managers that want to feel the power of lording over people.
mircea_popescu: only if you take fed money.
asciilifeform: 'griggs vs duke power'
asciilifeform: though, if i recall, it concerned employment rather than real estate
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform also, the thing you cite is employment law.
asciilifeform ianal, does not know if 'integral torture' on real estate sales would be permitted in usa
diametric: asciilifeform: there are only very specific sets of things hoas can't do. For example they can't say "no blacks allowed" or "women can't park here."
mircea_popescu: in principle, disallowing absurd selection practices for employers may be unavoidable. otherwise, think of that church idiot and his "advice"
mircea_popescu: imagine how it'd proliferate.
asciilifeform: which 'advice'
asciilifeform: he had a number of crackpot recipes
assbot: How the other half lives, or Michael O. Church is a scummy fuckwit pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
chetty: personally I have trouble seeing the difference between "women can't park here." and bakers must bake any cake requested
diametric: chetty: US law specifically says one is "special"
diametric: bakers aren't afforded the luxury of a special status
mircea_popescu: chetty a baker applies for permission to be a baker.
mircea_popescu: a woman is a woman afore the state.
mircea_popescu: it's quite logical, if you care to follow the twisted remants of logic inside the system
chetty: mircea_popescu, well it used to be like that nayway, these days it can be a choice
mircea_popescu: which is why so much lobby to not distinguish natural and manufactured women
mircea_popescu: anyway, what irks me isn't the weirdo stuff in the us as much as the memetic tendency. if it worked like, "if you want women to park anywhere and bakers to bake anything, go to ohio ; if you want women to not be allowed to park anywhere, go to montana" etc it'd be fine.
mircea_popescu: have a pedo state, send all pedos there, have a 1950s household, send all 1950s types to utah, and so on and so forth
mircea_popescu: but if you try make all teh places run on the same software...
mircea_popescu: but no, lincoln must has know better what's best!
chetty: well that was the idea when they started ... but states as sovereign entities has gone away
mircea_popescu: well, the accident that guncotton is not made out of cottons while guns are made out of fllailed earth had something to do with it.
mircea_popescu: it's universal this, absent universally pervasive dedication to diversity, diversity flounders because by its very definition it's multiple examples are not all equally fit.
mircea_popescu: this is usually obvious in computer game design. if there's a warrior, a mage and an archer, having them all "equally powerful" defeats the point of having 3 of them. having them "differently powerful" often reduces to the former.
mircea_popescu: no real way to solve it.
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 484.63, Best ask: 485.93, Bid-ask spread: 1.30000, Last trade: 485.0, 24 hour volume: 12575.72910500, 24 hour low: 462.56, 24 hour high: 492.0, 24 hour vwap: 476.417919968
chetty: but in practice it tends to reduce to the lowest common denominator not the most fit wins ...
mircea_popescu: you underestimate the importance of cheapness.
mircea_popescu: there's more ants than people alive not because ants are better tea company
mircea_popescu: but because they cost less to produce and less to maintain
mircea_popescu: cheapness is, so to speak, the mother of fit.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] [PAID] 4.46195344 BTC to 1`149`988 shares, 388 satoshi per share
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 1.40933458 BTC to 15`374 shares, 9167 satoshi per share
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: re 9000%: factors for me are exercise and regularity of schedule
mircea_popescu: and this one is for my mom : http://i.imgur.com/68Uyseu.jpg
thestringpuller: ants are also eusocial
thestringpuller: probably more termites than ants
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller the entire "eusocial" bs is little more than socialist propaganda.
mircea_popescu: just about zero scientific merit to it.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu is anti-social
mircea_popescu: no, i'm eusocial, and i take offense at the dilution of terminology.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 1000 @ 0.000605 = 0.605 BTC [-]
assbot: HardwareWallet
kakobrekla: >GreenAddress : safer multiplatform wallet with multisignature, second factor confirmation of all transactions and anti-goxing protection.
kakobrekla: It is unfortunately not possible to release HW-1 with an open firmware due to NDA restrictions, however you can verify with the specification that all commands do what they are supposed to do, and that clients are only sending documented commands.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 858 @ 0.0006014 = 0.516 BTC [-] {4}
thestringpuller: NDA restrictions?
thestringpuller: from who? themselves?
ThickAsThieves: NDA that greenaddress gas with NSA
thestringpuller: wtf is "anti-goxing" protection?!?!?
thestringpuller: is this just for the lulz?
ThickAsThieves: means they won't let anyone named Mark have an account
ThickAsThieves: !up truffles
ben_vulpes: ho shit
ben_vulpes: ;;seen truffles
gribble: truffles was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 21 weeks, 4 days, 22 hours, 32 minutes, and 40 seconds ago: <truffles> tell me when the experiment is over
truffles: its not over
truffles: i was curious
truffles: i tried to arrange that chess match with nubbins a while back kinda difficult to do when not in same room..
ThickAsThieves: that almost makes sense
truffles: it bugs me when i dont resolve things..
ben_vulpes: bingoboingo's had much success running games over irc and webgames...
thestringpuller: I challenge ben_vulpes to Starcraft!
artifexd: My "copper rounds" just showed up. They *are* nice.
jurov: BLIT << wasn't this actually invented by monty python? only they had it as deadly joke
jurov: obv the joke itself wasn't broadcast
ben_vulpes: thestringpuller: it's been years and i was never any good :P
jurov: re:smart pill - i think there may yet be surprising discoveries
jurov: such as, wide occurrence of latent chlamydia
jurov: that bugger tends to lurk in fat tissue where it is untreatable by antibiotics and slowly releases neurotoxins
jurov: result? unexplicable pain and lowered mental performance
jurov: why it isn't object of research till recently? doctors were taught it's simple treatable veneral disease
jurov: ans sexual diseases research is uncool
jurov: how do i know? i was diagnosed ch. pneumoniae (lung one, not the sexual one)
jurov: and not in lungs, but on skin
jurov: and every time i exercise and get skinner, i get sick
ben_vulpes: fascinating!
jurov: tl;dr: there is surprising health stuff we hide from ourselves because of our own culture
rithm: i'm in good health, i've never broken a bone or had any type of major surgery
rithm: i love menthol cigarettes too
ben_vulpes: i too support more sex disease research
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8500 @ 0.00076812 = 6.529 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8912 @ 0.00076607 = 6.8272 BTC [-] {2}
ben_vulpes: twould be grand if life could go on without condoms
HeySteve: hello, was wondering if a prepared NDA exists which can be cryptographically signed?
HeySteve: great, even better if you have a link
thestringpuller: re: health. pharma corps suppress a lot of research to increase profits it seems.
The20YearIRCloud: HeySteve: i'm pretty sure they can, since they've talked alot about contracting via blockchain
thestringpuller: The20YearIRCloud what are you referring to?
The20YearIRCloud: I'll have to dig it up, but there's a few altcoin or places that say they can sign contracts via blockchain
thestringpuller: wouldn't gpg contracts be easier?
HeySteve: I'd think so
ben_vulpes: HeySteve: i mean i bought mine, and gpg sign it.
HeySteve: yeah someone linked me to a good generic one, will use that with gpg sigs
ben_vulpes: strip the text out, hard wrap it at 80 chars, gpg sign it
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: what would it take << beautiful question. let's say we find that chetty has, e.g., more efficient mitochondriae, that eat and shit less for given level of activity. and therefore require less cleanup. then we say 'can't fix this with aftermarket patch.' << I dunno mitochondral replacement might be an interesting experiment
BingoBoingo: If mitochondria are some separate symiote we just depend on, there may be a way do a replacement
assbot: Bank of Japan drives rates below zero | Business | The Guardian
The20YearIRCloud: I'd hope that driving rates below zero and seeing little inflation would be more of a sign to keneysian economists that believe that inflation is solely driven by interest rates
assbot: 403 Forbidden
The20YearIRCloud: interesting
ben_vulpes: 403 forbidden?
assbot: 403 Forbidden
ben_vulpes: weird.
assbot: Cryptostocks PROBLEMS
kakobrekla: too bad it isnt in the bash
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: It is unfortunately not possible to release HW-1 with an open firmware << lol
mircea_popescu: artifexd: My "copper rounds" just showed up. They *are* nice. << which are these ?
mircea_popescu: jurov: obv the joke itself wasn't broadcast << yeah i think you can say that. what was it, 70s ?
artifexd: The coins that look all circuit board-y
mircea_popescu: you mean the ones i linked like two days ago ?!
mircea_popescu: jurov: tl;dr: there is surprising health stuff we hide from ourselves because of our own culture << interesting, the chlamyda story.
mircea_popescu: The20YearIRCloud: I'd hope that driving rates below zero and seeing little inflation would be more of a sign to keneysian economists that believe that inflation is solely driven by interest rates << there's no possible significance to keynesians anymore. they're a cult by now, like the collodial silver derps.
mircea_popescu: "o no but it relaly helps, we've just not found out what yet"
mircea_popescu: "everything"
mircea_popescu: omg lok at that, kakobrekla is still on account #4. what happened there, their mods got thrown in jail or something ?
kakobrekla: i just got this one today.
rithm: trickle-down, yo
mircea_popescu: !s "with Cryptostocks than MPEx"
assbot: 1 results for '"with Cryptostocks than MPEx"' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=%22with+Cryptostocks+than+MPEx%22
mircea_popescu: lol it's from a jimmothy thread ?
mircea_popescu: "Why not addressing one of the several elephants in the room? Why is 90% of their revenue from recruiting new investonomers? Why is the exchange owner taking such a huge role in "educating" his "investors"? Why is every single company co-owned by the exchange owner?"
mircea_popescu: duh. because bitcoin people are stupid, in both cases. why else ?
jurov: !mpif
assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021650 B (Total: 473.44 B). Delta: -1.08 B. Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.00022 BTC [+]
atcbot: No data returned from CoinMiner.net
atcbot: [PityThePool Hashrate]: 9.93 GH/s [iSpace Pool Hashrate]: 1.73 TH/s
mircea_popescu: 1.7th ?! that's a lot innit ?
atcbot: [ATC Diff] Current Diff: 1878190.93 Est. Next Diff: 283088.83 in 1271 blocks (#46368) Est. % Change: -84.93
atcbot: [X-BT] Bid: 205 Ask: 221 Last Price: 221 24h-Vol: 2k High: 221 Low: 221 VWAP: 221
artifexd: mircea_popescu: yes those
atcbot: [X-BT VWAP] Bid: 205 Ask: 221 Last Price: 221 30d-Vol: 843k 30d-High: 250 30d-Low: 170 30d-VWAP: 195
kakobrekla: ;;calc 14/232
gribble: 0.0603448275862
atcbot: [ATC Diff] Current Diff: 1878190.93 Est. Next Diff: 283088.83 in 1271 blocks (#46368) Est. % Change: -84.93
mircea_popescu: i don't get it. shouldn't 2 th breeze through ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 48 @ 0.01046331 = 0.5022 BTC [-]
atcbot: No data returned from CoinMiner.net
atcbot: [PityThePool Hashrate]: 0.69 GH/s [iSpace Pool Hashrate]: 1.12 TH/s
mircea_popescu: i guess those are just random numbers basically
BingoBoingo: ATC is an interesting lab for what happens when nethash and difficulty disagree in strong ways
assbot: BitBet - Bitcoin to surpass Berkshire as an investment :: 1121.08 B (85%) on Yes, 193.66 B (15%) on No : Buttcoin
mircea_popescu: "There's another fun gotcha: the winnings are paid out in bitcoin. So if bitcoin falls, and you win the bet, the value of the magic beans you won also goes down."
mircea_popescu: "Plus if you lose, you lose magic beans that were worthless anyway."
assbot: RghoNomic comments on BitBet - Bitcoin to surpass Berkshire as an investment :: 1121.08 B (85%) on Yes, 193.66 B (15%) on No
BingoBoingo: "Best part of that bet: The "scams" link lists the highest volume USD (Bitfinex) exchange as a scam AND it lists Coinbase as a scam."
mircea_popescu: how is bitfinex an exchange at all ?
mircea_popescu: it's just this bucket shop where you can pretend like you're trading bitcoin
BingoBoingo: Well, ask r/buttcoin
mircea_popescu: something good did come out of this tho. hey kakobrekla check this out : http://bitbet.us/bet/786/bitcoin-to-surpass-berkshire-as-an-investment/
assbot: BitBet - Bitcoin to surpass Berkshire as an investment :: 1121.08 B (85%) on Yes, 193.66 B (15%) on No | closing in 5 months 1 week| weight: 46`812 (100`000 to 1)
mircea_popescu: as per title, 193.66. as per page display, 193.65
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker--market all
gribble: Error: "ticker--market" is not a valid command.
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 478.54, vol: 11585.02199166 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 473.5, vol: 3851.5951 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 476.5, vol: 8487.06626041 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 477.220814, vol: 14662.47770000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 475.00001, vol: 0.02 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 488.4138, vol: 65.71840573 | Volume-weighted last average: 477.10619284
BingoBoingo: !up bhcoins
kakobrekla: myea one is using floor and the other is round
BingoBoingo: Hello bhcoins
kakobrekla: flor i mean
kakobrekla: whats with the double o, i dont know
kakobrekla: o no it floor
kakobrekla: flur.
punkman: someone tried to scam me as `punkman, just how high are these idiots
assbot: Researcher Fired At NSF After Government Questions Her Role As 1980s Activist - Slashdot
kakobrekla got confused cause of failed syntax highlighting :(
assbot: Researcher Fired At NSF After Government Questions Her Role As 1980s Activist - Slashdot
assbot: BitBet - Bitcoin to surpass Berkshire as an investment :: B (85%) on Yes, 193.66 B (15%) on No | closing in 5 months 1 week| weight: 46`810 (100`000 to 1)
gernika: `punkman tried to scam me as well.
kakobrekla: actually im not fixing that.
assbot: A Statue Of Satan With A Huge Erection Has Appeared In Vancouver For Some Reason
assbot: A big chunk of the Sierra Nevada caught fracturing on video | Ars Technica
BingoBoingo: https://twitter.com/Lee_Ars/status/509728184242151424 << Looks like Lee is choosing Vox over BTC...
assbot: W/o getting too mushy, this is the best job Ive ever had & my coworkers are the best bunch of folks Ive ever had the privilege to work with
BingoBoingo: Wait, confused tech writers
BingoBoingo: Tim's the one with Vox
kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> how is bitfinex an exchange at all ? < ask josh?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 9 @ 0.1783311 = 1.605 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.18481066 = 0.9241 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 34 @ 0.18970204 = 6.4499 BTC [+] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.19001666 = 1.1401 BTC [+] {3}
ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo: that video needs to be run through the google dewigglifier
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: The video wiggles only because the world does
BingoBoingo: Not all bedrock is created equal
BingoBoingo: alf: people who do tall surgery http://www.gomerblog.com/2014/09/bones/
assbot: Bones: An Orthopedic Surgeon's Perspective - Medical Satire - GomerBlog
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla myeah
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo a well.
assbot: Veterinarians Behaving Badly: Rabies Testing & Quarantine
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: That was a false alarm on the reporter, confused him with a nearly indistinguishable reporter for Conde Nast
mircea_popescu: "She even managed to gracefully handle the incessant "point of order" type questioning from the one guy in the back, who always has to ask a stream of arcane academic questions that are irrelevant to anyone living in the real world."
mircea_popescu: these fucking derps and their "real world"
BingoBoingo: Well, I dunno that Bitcoin has made it too far into medicine yet aside from that Dr. Goss guy with the MyBitcoin fiasco
mircea_popescu: dude rly ? this chick is easily the most annoying shrill pest at any party.
mircea_popescu: she's made all that out of someone dropping the wrong shit i nthe bag ?
BingoBoingo: Yeah, amazing how whining about shit is a pest past time.
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
BingoBoingo: Vetrinarian is almost like the parody orthopod
BingoBoingo: I prolly should have went to doctor school and been an orthopod
asciilifeform: re: bat and banana peel:
asciilifeform: obligatory:
assbot: Error 403
asciilifeform: yes, it's -that- robert wood.
asciilifeform: (woods' metal; destroyer of 'n-rays'; etc.)
asciilifeform: 'The Parrot and the Carrot one may easily confound / They're very much alike in looks and similar in sound, / We recognize the Parrot by his clear articulation, / For Carrots are unable to engage in conversation.'
assbot: Error 403
asciilifeform: copper rounds << i thought almost all modern bullets have copper jackets.
mircea_popescu: rounds as in coins
BingoBoingo: ATC mined > 200,000
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: exercise and regularity of schedule << exercise, easy; regularity of schedule is a dream to me, on account of my profession.
mircea_popescu: my schedule is utterly irregular if it helps anything.
kakobrekla: i dont even have one.
asciilifeform: 'HardwareWallet' << lol! they never get tired, do they.
BingoBoingo: What is a schedule and does it self lubricate?
asciilifeform: not possible to release HW-1 with an open firmware due to NDA << anybody got an ion beam machine? 'gentlemen, start your engines.'
kakobrekla doesnt
asciilifeform: irregular schedule because you don't feel like sleeping in a given week is rather different from because phone rings and you have to get in a wheeled coffin because otherwise starve.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform> irregular schedule because you don't feel like sleeping in a given week is rather different from because phone rings and you have to get in a wheeled coffin because otherwise starve. << I prefer to think of my car as an ablative Iron Man suit that protects me from exertion and damage at high speeds
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how is this different ?
asciilifeform: same as difference between ordinary sex and working as 'crack whore'
asciilifeform: or, horse in mongolian plains, far from man, and cart horse
mircea_popescu: i don't see it. so in both cases you don't feel like sleeping that week
mircea_popescu: if you felt like it, you would.
asciilifeform: in case #2, just as you might feel like it, the bells might well ring.
asciilifeform: #1 - you want, you sleep.
mircea_popescu: i dun credit this. you kill a guy, you've killed some guy. there's no "i had to kill him", is there ? there's no "i had to eat this icecream". you eat it, you get fat, you don't, you don't.
asciilifeform: the observation was specifically about sleep (rather than the particular activity during the day, such as killings)
mircea_popescu: but even that.
asciilifeform: not sleeping because don't want yet is rather different from other people keeping you awake
mircea_popescu: if you don't feel like sleeping, does it matter what bell arrangement you use to ruin your sleep for you ?
BingoBoingo: Eh, some weeks I'll sleep 3 hours. Others I'll sleep 12 a day.
asciilifeform: bell is used by other people to ruin your sleep. in exchange for food & housing.
asciilifeform suspects he is not alone in this experience here
mircea_popescu: this is like "the sun is moving on the sky" "no the earth is moving really".
BingoBoingo: I live atm next to a fucking race track. have slept through races
asciilifeform: nah, more like the difference between being told 'let them eat cake' and eating cake.
mircea_popescu: you know the difference between antoinette and teh populace isn't that she's richer than them, it's that unlike them she dun care if she dies.
kakobrekla: i think mp is tying to say that everything but death is optional
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla no but i mean... you gotta APPLY to these people's waking up service. job interview and all that.
mircea_popescu: at some point in there you gotta admit you pretty much went "sleep, fu."
mircea_popescu: now im asked to credit that whether you do this for purely aesthetic reasons or otherwise makes a difference.
mircea_popescu: well... what difference does it make ? you're still awake.
kakobrekla: your universal law of sleep undisturbness is unknown to most of the world.
mircea_popescu: hey, i bring light intra tenebrae :D
BingoBoingo: ;;tickler
gribble: Error: "tickler" is not a valid command.
BingoBoingo: ^ nanotube
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker dude
gribble: (ticker [--bid|--ask|--last|--high|--low|--avg|--vol] [--currency XXX] [--market <market>|all]) -- Return pretty-printed ticker. Default market is Bitstamp. If one of the result options is given, returns only that numeric result (useful for nesting in calculations). If '--currency XXX' option is given, returns ticker for that three-letter currency code. It is up to you to make sure (1 more message)
mircea_popescu: stop pinging the poor guy spuriously. he like teaches and shit.
BingoBoingo: Why can't we tickle yet?
mircea_popescu: jesus fuck
mircea_popescu: $depth s.mpoe
empyex: mircea_popescu: [S.MPOE] Bids: 3700 @ 0.00076773 10633 @ 0.00076594 10800 @ 0.00076507 10275 @ 0.00076418
empyex: mircea_popescu: [S.MPOE] Asks: 22250 @ 0.00076782 14306 @ 0.00076969 36377 @ 0.00076980 4395 @ 0.00076988
mircea_popescu: 9 satoshi apart ? what is this, some sort of joke ?
assbot: When adopting African kids with AIDS becomes mandatory, urinate in public. As a sex offender you're not allowed near children. /hashtag/lifehacks?src=hash
mircea_popescu: yeah, because that law won't change o.o
TheNewDeal: ok kind of pissed here. submitted a good wager with 1.6 btc zeroconf, doesn't get accepted. somebody makes a shitty bet about 4chan and posts .09 btc and it gets accepted?
mircea_popescu: can it be with specifics ?
BingoBoingo: I though it was clear that 2BTC is pretty much the new zeroconf magic number
TheNewDeal: badgers bet
TheNewDeal: 1.66 is virtually 2, and if I would have known .3 btc would have made any sort of difference I would have obviously added it
BingoBoingo: Blame sports it seems it the issue
TheNewDeal: sports wasn't the issue. No bets being placed on soccer, while creating 50 bets was a issue
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] [PAID] 166.02027623 BTC to 500`000`000 shares, 33 satoshi per share
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal i have no idea why i have to drag it out of you. you';re the upset party, you're supposed to be naturally verbose.
TheNewDeal: badgers ncaaf
TheNewDeal: i was betting on them winning their next 7 consecutive games
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: Were you betting on No?
TheNewDeal: I bet on yes!
TheNewDeal: and it could have been open for as much as 6 weeks for betting
mircea_popescu: 07-09-2014 Rejected Badgers (NCAAF) to finish 9 games with 2 losses (or more)
mircea_popescu: Rejection reason: Consider submitting with substantial paid wager.
mircea_popescu: that ? you put 1.6 on yes ?
TheNewDeal: 1.666 to be technical
mircea_popescu: what do you figure the odds to be on this ?
BingoBoingo: Wisconsin doesn't exactly have a challenging schedule
mircea_popescu: 2 or more losses means they need what, 2 out of 9 wins ?
mircea_popescu: has there even been a game with 8 losses out of 9 ?
TheNewDeal: they need to win all of the games up until 9, or they will have 2 losses
mircea_popescu: s/game/team
mircea_popescu: (or more)
assbot: Wisconsin Football - Badgers News, Scores, Videos - College Football - ESPN
TheNewDeal: #9 was an away game against purdue
BingoBoingo: #18 Wisconsin should play the rest of their season undefeated
TheNewDeal: that's ridiculous
BingoBoingo: WTF Bullshit schedule is that
TheNewDeal: ill bet you on that
TheNewDeal: nebraska and iowa are no gimme
BingoBoingo: I would, but that would be Un-PC given Bo Pellini's face Chlymidia
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal so are you clear on wha happened there ?
TheNewDeal: I had to bet more, is what I understand
BingoBoingo: But of the stretch to the Purdue game, Wisconsin should still be able to Lose to Northwestern and YEs still wins.
mircea_popescu: Badgers (NCAAF) to finish 9 games with 2 losses (or more) <<< ie, if they have 5 losses, it's a yes.
BingoBoingo: Illinois isn't beating Wisconsin
mircea_popescu: if they have 9 losses, it's a yes.
TheNewDeal: if that have 2 losses, it's a yes
TheNewDeal: and i wrote that it closes
BingoBoingo: Maryland *might* beat Wisconsin if alf can shock their team just right
TheNewDeal: I realize it was worded shitlity, but I needed to draw some light on the fact that they already lost one game
mircea_popescu: well so a) word it better ; b) obscure sports bets 2 btc as per whenever i announced this.
asciilifeform confesses he never once saw maryland play a game, despite living in 100 metres of where the (local half) of the games played out for 2 years, and within 5km for past 11 yrs.
mircea_popescu: what's this anyway, baseball ?
asciilifeform: i assumed football.
asciilifeform: (american football)
mircea_popescu: maybe you're not in the demo.
asciilifeform: possibly.
asciilifeform is embarrassingly ignorant of matters of modern sport
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: What happened to the B1G, You don't play any of [Michigan. Michigan State, Ohio SucksCocks University}
TheNewDeal: they split it up
TheNewDeal: they play a tournament at the end of the year now
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: why would chlamydia cripple a footballist ?
BingoBoingo: What, like JewGolf?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: He's the coach, needs to be able to see.
BingoBoingo: !up chalbersma
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3700 @ 0.00076773 = 2.8406 BTC [+]
RagnarDanneskjol: chalbersma is the pool dev we discussed
mircea_popescu: wellcome chalbersma
chalbersma: Hello MP
mircea_popescu: RagnarDanneskjol now to get me up to speed, where did we discuss this ?
RagnarDanneskjol: a few weeks ago in chan
mircea_popescu: can ye link ?
mircea_popescu: !s is your friend
assbot: Logged on 20-08-2014 11:38:13; mircea_popescu: <RagnarDanneskjol> I know more than a few highly competent pool hosts if this one proves unreliable << so hook something up
mircea_popescu: aha. well, that proved reliable so far, but anyway, let's see if we can do something for your friend here.
mircea_popescu: chalbersma what do you have in mind ?
RagnarDanneskjol: regarding p2pool setup / hosting that is
X-Rob pays attention
mircea_popescu: X-Rob refresh me, what's the problem with p2pool in bitcoin again ? too slow -> orphans or what was it ?
RagnarDanneskjol: i didn't think there was an atc p2pool avail with monitoring, etc that anyone could use
X-Rob: mircea_popescu: nothing's really wrong with p2pool in bitcoin, as it has a decent block time
mircea_popescu: RagnarDanneskjol well x-rob was going to make one, but then he got high.
BingoBoingo: Now the COinminer ATC p2pool was configured poorly or something?
X-Rob: p2pool with coins that have ultra-short block times cause issues, as the p2pool share time is 1/10th of the coin block time
X-Rob: It kept falling over, I think was the major issue.
mircea_popescu: why that ?
mircea_popescu: !up chalbersma
mircea_popescu: can he even talk lol
X-Rob: BingoBoingo had already voiced him 8)
BingoBoingo: Well a problem with the Coinminer p2pool was they never fucking responded to inquiries
mircea_popescu: so then why exactly are there no p2p pools in bitcoin ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10350 @ 0.00076594 = 7.9275 BTC [-]
X-Rob: mircea_popescu: p2pool in bitcoin was 5% of the network, last time I looked.
BingoBoingo: There's a Bitcoin p2pool
X-Rob: that's not 'no'.
mircea_popescu: kay, i stand corrected
chalbersma: I was more wondering what exactly you were looking for.
mircea_popescu: why's it so anemic ?
X-Rob: Ah. That's a different question. BEcause people can't math.
mircea_popescu: chalbersma well, atc is this direct btc clone. it currenlty has not much of a usable pool.
atcbot: No data returned from CoinMiner.net
atcbot: [PityThePool Hashrate]: 0.00 GH/s [iSpace Pool Hashrate]: 1.61 TH/s
BingoBoingo: Oh Pity the Pool died again...
atcbot: No data returned from CoinMiner.net
atcbot: [PityThePool Hashrate]: 0.00 GH/s [iSpace Pool Hashrate]: 1.52 TH/s
mircea_popescu: X-Rob speaking of ppl can't math : "Basically, by specifying the price to such a huge place, it gives an advantage because it takes a smaller price change to win."
BingoBoingo: And iSpace is the opposite of stable
chalbersma: I've set it up with bitcoin and from what I understand atc is almost identical it "should work" almost out of the box.
X-Rob: mircea_popescu: what's that gibberish?
mircea_popescu: fresh offa reddit. people apparently believe that 1.4589799845796 is specified narrowerly than 2.
X-Rob: I'm assuming it was comprehensible in context?
X-Rob: Oh
X-Rob: No
X-Rob: No it wasn't.
assbot: Mark_Karpeles_Jr comments on BitBet - Bitcoin to surpass Berkshire as an investment :: 1121.08 B (85%) on Yes, 193.66 B (15%) on No
mircea_popescu: chalbersma do you run a bitcoin pool atm ?
chalbersma: Yes I run one for RSM an internal P2pool node for bitcoin with a few alts merge mined.
RagnarDanneskjol: RSM being
mircea_popescu: red star mining ?
chalbersma: Red Star Mining.
chalbersma: Indeed
BingoBoingo: chalbersma: How's your Bitcoin history?
chalbersma: Mid range started getting involved summer of last year.
BingoBoingo: chalbersma: Given the first name Meni... Can you offer a last name and a list of transgressions?
assbot: chalbersma/btcaddrtocsv GitHub
RagnarDanneskjol: he's a candidate who came to me, i interviewed a few times and deemed worthy of such an undertaking
TheNewDeal: for a second I thought he operated a pool for richard stallman...
assbot: Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/0XF8XT8.txt )
assbot: xrobau comments on BitBet - Bitcoin to surpass Berkshire as an investment :: 1121.08 B (85%) on Yes, 193.66 B (15%) on No
X-Rob: I couldn't resist
asciilifeform saw 'red star', thought 'what a soviet mining firm might've been named', went to check 'http://bitcoin.su.' lo and behold - there's one.
mircea_popescu: sorry bout that.
asciilifeform: frozen in time, links to 'mtgox'
chalbersma: :) Ya I didn't name the company.
mircea_popescu: chalbersma so what's your relation to the guy running it, w/e his name is ?
asciilifeform: (and glbse!)
chalbersma: We're friends. Are you asking me to tell you his name?
RagnarDanneskjol: he's a nice southern gentleman who wanted to work in crypto and just happened to live in close proximity to them
RagnarDanneskjol: he didnt know in advance of employment, correct me if i'm wrong chris
mircea_popescu: chalbersma well no, but we aren't friends is all :)
RagnarDanneskjol: big surprise
mircea_popescu: anyway, so you setup a private p2poolk for rsm. anything non private / i can verify ?
chalbersma: Ya he has an opinion about you but then again he's a bit hotheaded and has opinions about a lot of people. But he gave me my first break in bitcoin so...
mircea_popescu: chalbersma contrary to what BingoBoingo may have you believe, there's no secret initiation rite, especiually nothing involving blood.
mircea_popescu: or sorbothane.
chalbersma: Ya but I needed someone to "show me the ropes" so to speak. I'm sure I could have done it myself but this gave me a structured way to start.
asciilifeform sorbothaned for nothing!
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: It totally involves blood, but yes it isn't secret... Totally public
mircea_popescu: !up KRS-1
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7329 @ 0.00076418 = 5.6007 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: chalbersma: What are your favorite Unixisms?
mike_c: RagnarDanneskjol: did you mention awhile ago that you were involved with a new ATC block explorer? or did I make that up in a dream?
chalbersma: ATM the RSM p2pool has a private IP in the DC but we're working on getting it a public one. When the request comes back you'd be able to log into the public stats page and check it out.
mircea_popescu: chalbersma what sort of load does it carry ?
RagnarDanneskjol: mike_c -I'm working on it - a wallet too, should be done soon
RagnarDanneskjol: like maybe this week
KRS-1: Anyone care to share your thoughts on this article? I know many of you aren't America, but perhaps you can relate afterall. http://boldanddetermined.com/2011/11/10/the-continued-pussification-of-the-american-male/
assbot: The Continued Pussification of the American Male
mike_c: ah, excellent
chalbersma: ATM 5 1TH/s miners from bitmine.ch
BingoBoingo: KRS-1: Yours?
KRS-1: no not at all
nanotube: BingoBoingo: tickler eh hehe. mircea_popescu thanks for the concern :D
mircea_popescu: chalbersma and what do you run it on ? vps ? amazon ?
KRS-1: I don't publish anything.
mircea_popescu: nanotube :p
BingoBoingo: KRS-1: Why not, you've often had insightful things.
mircea_popescu: kinda really shy. KRS.
KRS-1: I've often thought about it tbh.
mircea_popescu: "Gentlemen, being a man is great. You get to use your muscles to pick up heavy things, you get to use your dick to fuck things, and you get to use your brain to think and create things. It’s no wonder feminist’s hate men – they desperately want what we have but they can never have it. But how the heck have they convinced MEN that being a man is bad or evil?" << ah come on, women can't lift things ? wtf.
BingoBoingo: I mean German women are the backbone of Europe
KRS-1: I've got to admit the author has an edge and I find a lot of his writing pretty good.
mircea_popescu: KRS-1 well so the guy has broadly speaking a point. otherwise he's much too blund and sorely uneducated/uninformed to make much of it.
mircea_popescu: not my cup.
BingoBoingo: Whatever happened to BTC knife guy
assbot: Supermicro | Products | SuperServers | 1U | 5018A-TN4
mircea_popescu: for a 1th/s pool ?
chalbersma: Originally designed it to do scrypt p2pool with many alts but the scrypt hardware we pre-ordered was delayed.
KRS-1: Cool thanks for checking it out
BingoBoingo: chalbersma: Where do you Colo?
assbot: netsolus | IT Services Kansas City
BingoBoingo: chalbersma: I've been looking at datacenters in the region for my blog
BingoBoingo: Fuck KC, I was hoping you'd have an StL solution. Or maybe CoMo
KRS-1: imo Texas is the best place to set up shop
BingoBoingo: Only Texans I've met have been steers and queers
KRS-1: HAHA I've heard that before
KRS-1: At least 5 major carriers converge somewhere in Dallas. Major peering points.
mircea_popescu: txas is good. atlanta is also good. slc is actually decent
mircea_popescu: chalbersma ok so, part of the problem here is that the entire market cap of atc is about what it'd cost to get a server colo'd.
chalbersma: Depending on the size of the atc blockchain you may be able to host it on a VPS cheaper.
chalbersma: Or potentially host it off someones home connection for a smaller fee.
RagnarDanneskjol: its miniscule <100mb i believe
decimation: re: hoa << it's a scam that's also perpetrated by the 'property management' industry
BingoBoingo: I could move 4 times in the next year so my home connection is iffy
decimation: they charge several hundred $usd to provide the 'paperwork' needed to sell a house with covenants
mircea_popescu: you have a home now ?!
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Well, I have a domain name
BingoBoingo: Otherwise I have couches
decimation: also many states/counties charge a high fee to reproduce the official deeds with covenants
mircea_popescu: who cares about a few hundred ?
BingoBoingo: HOA's are a scam because most of them ban unkers
TheNewDeal: KRS-1 not totally convinced "soy is an estrogen enhancing garbage by-product." Used to supplement it while lifting weights in the past, worked just fine for muscle buidling
BingoBoingo: *bunkers
asciilifeform: unkers ?
decimation: well individually nobody (it's a roundoff error in the total 'fees' required to transact us real estate) , but spread over thousands of transactions you have a 'special interest'
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Meant bunkers, I would love a studio apartment under the pasture
BingoBoingo: !up chalbersma
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: if you can't build a bunker in secret from aerially-observing enemy, it isn't a real bunker.
asciilifeform: nor are the lands sufficiently large then
decimation: also many of them have language banning antennas of all kinds -- this was 'encouraged' by the cable companies
asciilifeform: carry away the earth in buckets, if you have to, in pant pockets - as pictured in 'the great escape.'
mircea_popescu: chalbersma what's this datacoin thing ?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Amaxing how much of the research in this field is documented on "reality tv"
asciilifeform: decimation: antennae << unenforceable in usa. fcc (fed gov.) has final jurisdiction over antennae.
mircea_popescu: !up chalbersma
decimation: they usually also ban things like clotheslines and pretty much anything unusual
decimation: asciilifeform: that only applies to regular humans using 'small' (less than 1 meter) sat dishes or tv antennas
chalbersma: Almost dead now. I was quite interested in it. Was permanent storage in a blockchain. Never really valuable but an interesting concept.
BingoBoingo: What if my dick curves ever so slightly to the left? It's conductive... antenna?
assbot: Over-the-Air Reception Devices Rule | FCC.gov
asciilifeform: right, 1m.
decimation: right, 30 foot tower with 15 foot HF dipole is banned
decimation: most us folk think antennas are 'ugly'
mircea_popescu: decimation well in exchange you get to not have a pole around
decimation: "The rule (47 C.F.R. Section 1.4000) has been in effect since October 1996, and it prohibits restrictions that impair the installation, maintenance or use of antennas used to receive video programming. "
BingoBoingo: Antenna need not be pole. Saltwater lake works too.
decimation: you see, it's okay to receive propaganda
decimation: BingoBoingo: not if you want low-angle radiation for maximal ionospheric skip
mircea_popescu: chalbersma i see. well okay, so do you see yourself running a bunch of pools in the future ? or what ?
BingoBoingo: decimation: Then you dig your lake a better hole and insert pipes for "irrigation"
decimation: although it's true that many objects can be made to radiate if matched properly
decimation: although a salt marsh would make an ideal ground plane
BingoBoingo: decimation: or ground aspargus mound works perfectly
decimation: many hams use a 'flagpole'
decimation: or string sufficiently invisible wire in a tree
chalbersma: Not sure to be honest. I'm a Sys Admin by day so it seemed natural to bring those skills to bitcoin as I started to get into it.
mircea_popescu: trustable btc hosting is probably in more demand atm
mircea_popescu: if you sysadmin for a living start your own host.
asciilifeform: hams use a 'flagpole' << think from this angle - any scenario where a gigantic antenna is a plus, it is also quite important that it be hidden from prying eyes
chalbersma: If they're is enough interest in p2pool and other mining servers I might consider it.
assbot: In D.C., a 13-year-old piano prodigy is treated as a truant instead of a star student - The Washington Post
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you can't hide an antenna. this is the definition of antennae.
asciilifeform: decimation: linked 2 days ago here.
decimation: sure you can hide antennae
mircea_popescu: decimation 12 or 13 ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: can hide if receiving.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform if receiving don't even need all that much.
KRS-1: lol so many sysadmins
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: (unless it's 1941 and you're pissing inadvertent heterodyne noise to a waiting wagen on street)
KRS-1: errywhere
decimation: yeah the real complication comes when you want to pump high power into something and have it not burn/explode
RagnarDanneskjol: chalbersma - the interest is there - I get requests for pool talent all the time.
BingoBoingo: chalbersma: Any experience with Solaris or Free(storage)BSD? Any intent on running a hosting operation yourself?
mircea_popescu: after bitvps went to the dogs i dunno that there's actually any dedicated btc hoster
KRS-1: BingoBoingo: I work for a datacenter in Canada. I often thought of setting up something but I go blank when I think of what to do.
chalbersma: @Bingo would consider it in the future. Not looking into starting a hosting gig full time at this point. I haven't worked with Solaris but at my last job I did setup an internal FreeBSD webserver for them and I've been keeping up with FBSD for a while (esp. that ZFS goodness).
KRS-1: openstack often comes to mind lately though
BingoBoingo: Openstack is bollocks, mysterymeat
chalbersma: @Bingo I am also interested in MaidSafe it seems like if it's implemented properly it could be the decentralized Amazon EC2.
decimation: I was thinking to myself this evening: what if Washington DC were washed into the sea tomorrow? usg's contingency plans would probably be to move the government west, in the middle of the kulaks they have been harassing for decades. I don't think that 'contingency usg' would survive as an entity that we would recognize.
mircea_popescu: what sort of silly counterfactual is this.
decimation: re: solaris << had a proper live stack tracing system. This is what linux has: http://poormansprofiler.org/
assbot: poor man's profiler
BingoBoingo: decimation: You know StL was considered as a potential replacement DC after it was sacked by Canada
BingoBoingo: decimation: Dtrace has been a thing since I was a wee college freshman
chalbersma: I've heard rumors of Denver. Major air hub, centrally located, US mint, near AF College...
BingoBoingo: Only problem is legal weed
chalbersma: Plus the usg couldn't get any worse if it was toking up. :)
BingoBoingo: I dunno anymoar after Obummer
asciilifeform: profilers << 'valgrind.'
RagnarDanneskjol: !up RagnarsBitch
mircea_popescu: allow me to contribute a naked woman with cane marks on buttocks and buckets to the discussion. http://38.media.tumblr.com/cf703026c6e39b636e296a6e9a8a9072/tumblr_mrhlp197Gz1sum4lro4_500.jpg
decimation: asciilifeform: try running 'valgrind' on an application that requires high-bandwidth/speed performance
BingoBoingo wonders if there is a 68k port of Valgrind
asciilifeform: decimation: requires, as in, to work in any logical sense at all?
decimation: chalbersma: denver would be logical. my point is that I suspect that usg employees are paid $$$ to write fantasy
asciilifeform: profiler generally exists to eyeball what portion of the time is spent where in the program.
decimation: asciilifeform: no as in if it must keep up with real-time hardware
asciilifeform: decimation: you're stuck purchasing an ICE then.
decimation: can you buy such a beast for high-end intel boards?
asciilifeform: decimation: yes.
BingoBoingo: <decimation> asciilifeform: no as in if it must keep up with real-time hardware << Sounds like someone needs to buy Alpha IP from Intel
decimation: linux actually has something called 'perf' that does this - sorta - but the problem is that it doesn't do a full backtrace
assbot: How to Have a Non-Monogamous Relationship | VICE United States
chalbersma: So this p2pool server are you looking for one to run with ATC or with Bitcoin? My understanding is that ATC is not merge minable.
asciilifeform: decimation: intel's ice port - http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1441 (empty)
assbot: Loper OS » Mechanics of FLUXBABBITT.
decimation: asciilifeform: heh yeah, but does it track frame pointers?
BingoBoingo: ATC is totally not mergeminable, and there are questions over whether pool hosting costs could be justified for:
assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021650 B (Total: 473.44 B). Delta: -1.08 B. Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.00022 BTC [+]
atcbot: [X-BT] Bid: 205 Ask: 221 Last Price: 221 24h-Vol: 2k High: 221 Low: 221 VWAP: 221
asciilifeform: decimation: lets you set hardware breakpoints, incl. on register access
atcbot: [X-BT VWAP] Bid: 205 Ask: 221 Last Price: 221 30d-Vol: 842k 30d-High: 250 30d-Low: 170 30d-VWAP: 195
atcbot: [ATC Diff] Current Diff: 1878190.93 Est. Next Diff: 282937.87 in 1266 blocks (#46368) Est. % Change: -84.94
asciilifeform: decimation: like any decent hardware debugger for other archs
BingoBoingo: Valgrind definitely has higher resolution than resedit for sure.
BingoBoingo: Resedit being the last great dev tool offered by apple
mircea_popescu: chalbersma was for atc yea
chalbersma: If the idea is to minimize costs then a VPS is probably your best bet for now. Especially considering that the blockchain is so small. Question can other sha-256 coins be merged ontop of atc? Like namecoin
mircea_popescu: not afaik
BingoBoingo: No merged mining is possible with ATC, by ThickasTheives design
BingoBoingo: ATC is a totally independent SHA-256 chain
decimation: BingoBoingo: actually osx has 'dtrace'
assbot: Brendan's blog » Top 10 DTrace scripts for Mac OS X
BingoBoingo: decimation: OSX is not Mac OS and is not a thing I recognize as existing.
chalbersma: I think the real issue then is how much "ummph" does the VPS in question need. I've not had a chance to experiment with the minimum requirements for ATC or p2pool ontop of ATC.
decimation: asciilifeform I suspect such hardware would not be cheap
BingoBoingo: decimation: The last version of Mac anything was 7.5.1
mircea_popescu: X-Rob wa the pool falling over because not enough cpu ?
X-Rob: mircea_popescu: I have no idea. It just stopped giving me work
chalbersma: Does anyone have an idea of how much ram atc's daemon uses?
mircea_popescu: maybe it's because the work had too many decimals.
assbot: Last 4 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/3HT3AC6.txt )
mircea_popescu: chalbersma 4mb ?
decimation: X-Rob: why do you think folks are willing to pay more than the expected return to rent miners?
BingoBoingo: !up AndChat|679296
X-Rob: decimation: Because they are willing. It's not a hypothesis.
mircea_popescu: im a case study in that neh ?
X-Rob: mircea_popescu: No, actually, you're not. I think I ended up charging you about 0.1btc over estimate
chalbersma: So not much at all. I think the p2pool node I setup for RSM was using about 400MB of RAM but I was telling that server to manually connect to a number of peers.
assbot: Re: Upper limits of CL - Naggum cll archive
atcbot: [X-BT VWAP] Bid: 205 Ask: 221 Last Price: 221 30d-Vol: 842k 30d-High: 250 30d-Low: 170 30d-VWAP: 195
mircea_popescu: X-Rob so that's not overpaying ? because why, not enough decimals ? :D
X-Rob: Because that's well within statistical uncertanty
BingoBoingo: !up Guest36874
mircea_popescu: but admitting for the sake of admittance.
asciilifeform: profilers << first, try 'gcov' - bare essentials, conveniently baked into gcc.
X-Rob: mircea_popescu: I think he's referring to me being at estimate * 1.25 on leaserig.
decimation: asciilifeform: I think with the new 'dwarf frames' & libunwind things have gotten better on linux
X-Rob: decimation: I feel that I'm always at the bottom edge of the market of rig hire. I don't want to appear to rip people off
X-Rob: However, I invested 1BTC to lease a bunch of rigs when SSD was released
X-Rob: I ended up owning almost 10% of the coin
mircea_popescu: what is ssd even
X-Rob: which I then sold and recouped my investment with a nice margin
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: SSD is burn only
X-Rob: mircea_popescu: Sonic Screw Driver. Tor-based coin. Technically interesting.
mircea_popescu: uh. jeez.
decimation: X-Rob: good move, sounds like a decent business
asciilifeform: decimation: http://pastebin.com/scRkxz9w << example from life
assbot: [C] example of gcov - Pastebin.com
X-Rob: decimation: It's not a business. It's a hobby.
mircea_popescu: tbh i imagine that's what powers the 25%. narrow base.
asciilifeform: decimation: here - it counted. ~5000 hrs of runtime, had to count.
Guest36874: I'm almost certain its not a CPU or decimal issue...pool crashing that is
chalbersma: I noticed someone said they didn't like bitvps but they have VPS for $20/mo that may do the trick. I assume other vps providers have similar pricing. 2 cores 2G 20GB 2TB transfer.
asciilifeform: decimation: (on 32 cpu. cost money, at the time.)
X-Rob: mircea_popescu: yep. It's unusual for my main rig to be idle for more than 6 hours or so.
BingoBoingo: chalbersma: Bitvps has history here
BingoBoingo: ;;gettrust rg
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user BingoBoingo to user rg: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 4 via 13 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=BingoBoingo&dest=rg | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=rg | Rated since: Sun Jun 5 13:39:49 2011
thestringpuller: keep dem hashes going
thestringpuller: BingoBoingo: Namworld helped to turn bitvps around
decimation: asciilifeform: thanks for the example
asciilifeform: decimation: not so much example for output (you can see that in 'man' page) but of where you might actually bother with profilers.
decimation: asciilifeform: I find that they are useful for picking the 'low hanging fruit'
decimation: programmers today are so lazy and wasteful with memory
mircea_popescu: it's judicious allocation decimation. compare cost of ram chips with what programmers cost.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6750 @ 0.0007626 = 5.1476 BTC [-] {2}
decimation: I wish the hardware had garbage collection built-in like your dream, but the problem is that the von neumann world is going the other direction
asciilifeform: 'programmers' is a ware in the same sense as 'food'
mircea_popescu: this is true
decimation: mircea_popescu: I guess I'm talking more about 'thrashing' - allocating and deallocating memory without care
thestringpuller: the life and times
mircea_popescu: ;;rate chalbersma 1 new blood.
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user chalbersma has been recorded.
mircea_popescu: !up chalbersma
mircea_popescu: you can self-up if identified to gribble, just pm assbot !up
decimation: as memory becomes slower relative to cores*cache available the incentive is to micro-manage how data is shoveled into the cpus
mircea_popescu: or make the bus wider
mircea_popescu: !up upme_boolcrap
upme_boolcrap: how goes it
mircea_popescu: im on my third slice of chocolate cake
asciilifeform: upme_boolcrap: where'd you put your key.
upme_boolcrap: nice cake
upme_boolcrap: i put my key in my other wallet
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform uphim.
upme_boolcrap: locked it in my safe and abandoned ship
asciilifeform: !up upme_boolcrap
mircea_popescu: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 320082 | Current Difficulty: 2.7428630902257874E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 320543 | Next Difficulty In: 461 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 3 days, 2 hours, 15 minutes, and 18 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 29144209996.7 | Estimated Percent Change: 6.2547
upme_boolcrap: what kind of chocolate cake
TheNewDeal: network caught a cold
decimation: keys aren't safe on the ocean floor: http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/nukevault/ebb305/
upme_boolcrap: how many women do you have cooking for you at once Mr.P?
mircea_popescu: home made
mircea_popescu: depends on the day.
upme_boolcrap: i imagine they are mostly naked?
mircea_popescu: sometimes.
upme_boolcrap: you a a god amongst men Mr.P
chalbersma: Ya I remember reading about the RG problems. I use bitvps for my blog and it seems fairly stable. But I assume that there's probably a number of people offering VPS hosting for bitcoin these days.
mircea_popescu: no. among women.
upme_boolcrap: how can i convince my wife to let me have more wives
mircea_popescu: chalbersma not that many, really.
mircea_popescu: upme_boolcrap bring her here.
BingoBoingo: chalbersma: What is your blog?
TheNewDeal: blag*
assbot: Mid West Guy | A blog detailing useful stuff I've learned.
upme_boolcrap: if she let me have more wives she would have to clean less
upme_boolcrap: and cook less
upme_boolcrap: this isn't all bad for her
asciilifeform: upme_boolcrap: you need a replacement wife. a correctly specced one encourages installation of auxiliary wives.
mircea_popescu: depends what mess you make.
upme_boolcrap: auxiliary wives
chalbersma: @upme Has to be about redundancy :)
upme_boolcrap: you guys got it made.
chalbersma: Not really a marriage until it's N+1 eh?
asciilifeform: upme_boolcrap: mind you, socket for aux wives is just a start - you still have to obtain and install.
TheNewDeal: chalbersma what was mwgi
BingoBoingo: chalbersma: I know you linked an atom server architecture earlier, but x86 can't be your fave... can it?
decimation: chalbersma: some good tips on your blog, thanks for writing them up
chalbersma: http://ark.intel.com/products/77987 x86-64 arch on this particular processor.
assbot: ARK | Intel® Atom Processor C2750 (4M Cache, 2.40 GHz)
decimation: chalbersma: lol you still maintain hp-ux?
chalbersma: It's the low power stuff.
asciilifeform: hp-ux << lol!
upme_boolcrap: yeah mr.S
upme_boolcrap: so when are we fired
asciilifeform threw out a 50kg hp-ux (pa-risc!) box when moved
chalbersma: Yep the company I work for still developes the latest stuff for HP-UX. Luckily we're moving off it for RHEL later this year.
upme_boolcrap: i kind of feel like i have to deliver something
decimation: atom cpus suck but they are low power
asciilifeform: upme_boolcrap: lol, have some dignity in our honourable mass grave!
mircea_popescu: upme_boolcrap say, did oyu have a few drinks ?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I might be throwing out a lot of boxen soon.
upme_boolcrap: maybe ascii
upme_boolcrap: maybe a few drinks
upme_boolcrap: maybe i have indulged in the medical marijuana
BingoBoingo: <chalbersma> Yep the company I work for still developes the latest stuff for HP-UX. Luckily we're moving off it for RHEL later this year. << Stahp or I'll have to cover you in my systemd fatwah
chalbersma: They have AIX too!
assbot: Romanian Billionaire Saves OpenBSD | Bingo Blog
BingoBoingo: AIX isn't real though
decimation: chalbersma: are they selling to usg?
BingoBoingo: AIX is just fancier panties for S/70
asciilifeform: upme_boolcrap: find bug >> http://pastebin.com/scRkxz9w << should occupy your newly-found mental powers
assbot: [C] example of gcov - Pastebin.com
upme_boolcrap: one look at that
upme_boolcrap: makes my face bleed
chalbersma: @decimation yes but not all the AIX/HP-UX clients are government.
asciilifeform: upme_boolcrap: originally phriend's, not mine. i merely de-c++ed, profiled, optimized, massaged, found where to run.
decimation: next someone is going to come around saying they maintain IRIX
upme_boolcrap: what is it supposed to do?
asciilifeform keeps an irix box around.
decimation: asciilifeform: they were pretty to be sure
decimation: awhile ago I was looking for modern dumb-terminal, found here: http://geoffg.net/terminal.html
assbot: Geoff's Projects - ASCII Video Terminal
asciilifeform: upme_boolcrap: calculates m. petitjean's chirality index for alpha-quartz crystal lattice of growing size. just as printed on the box.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Isn't Irix basically crotchless panties?
assbot: Free Pages Personnelles: Erreur 404 - Document non trouvé
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: more or less. don't plug the ethernet in.
asciilifeform: modern ascii terminal << ibm 5250, say.
asciilifeform: why does it have to be modern-as-in-right-now
asciilifeform kept an ibm 3161 in uni, right in dorm room
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Modern is A/UX and system 7, everything used nao is postmodern
decimation: asciilifeform: my main requirement is to ditch x-ray crt
assbot: IBM 3101 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
BingoBoingo used NetBSD's GPG fork on my MacSE/30 this fucking spring
asciilifeform: decimation: crt is what makes it worth having.
TheNewDeal: asciilifeform is ceill the typo?
asciilifeform: nice, slow phosphours.
BingoBoingo: result: machine burned
decimation: yeah what bingo said
asciilifeform: TheNewDeal: trick. no typo.
TheNewDeal: fuck that
decimation: I would agree that finding one that spoke rs-422 would be neat
asciilifeform: you can plug that 'ibm' or whatever into - anything
BingoBoingo: Seriously, burned rather than finish finding entropy to generate keys
asciilifeform: if it speaks asynchronous serial (and what doesn't)
BingoBoingo: <decimation> asciilifeform: my main requirement is to ditch x-ray crt << How else are you going to spot USD???
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah I see it supports RS-422, that's neat. Would be useful for a home serial-terminal server
asciilifeform misses crt, but every time he buys 'amazing!11! well-preserved111! trinitron' - it's a faded turd.
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
BingoBoingo assumes the reason for metallic ink on high denomination USD bills is X-Ray shadow at the air port
asciilifeform besides, would need 4+ of them
decimation: asciilifeform: makes me sad I ditched my 21 inch trinitron a few years ago, but it was a heavy bitch
asciilifeform: the phosphour fades, and there is nothing to be done about it (besides a dreaded heathen recipe - boost the gun voltage. result: 'radiation king (tm)')
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah the weight is mostly the lead in the glass to protect from x-rays
BingoBoingo regrets not talking first realish job into the other 3 processors and GB of RAM into the Ultra 80
decimation: junk dealers are selling all kinds of old ibm rs-422 terminals for various crazy asks
asciilifeform: rs232, mostly
asciilifeform: not that it makes more than a few pennies' difference to anyone
decimation: probably the way to find those cheap is to find some library or other such institution 'upgrading' to microshit
BingoBoingo: Only real difference between rs-422 and rs-232 is five minutes with a knife
decimation: BingoBoingo: rs-422 is a differential signal
BingoBoingo: <decimation> probably the way to find those cheap is to find some library or other such institution 'upgrading' to microshit << Interesting you mention this nao, get back to me in 2 weeks
BingoBoingo: decimation: I spz. knife instead of plug for a reason...
decimation remembers every pos and library using said terminals growing up, only to be replaced with buggy-ass windows for no reason
asciilifeform also saw this
decimation: I actually worked in a library in my youth, I quite enjoyed the spring keyboard and the 'peripheral' laser scanner
BingoBoingo: FUKU... or whatever my coinbr referal code is. I'm trying to get library work nao.
asciilifeform: who cares what their display weighs? how often, it moves !?
BingoBoingo: Exactly. Mac OS 7 was the shit.
decimation: why not freedos?
BingoBoingo: It was the GUI that corresponded to what the machine offered.
asciilifeform: put it this way. either you're a grown man and can pick up 50kg like feather - or - you're a cripple, and someone hangs around who can pick up -you- (to put in bedpan) - and this person will carry your display.
BingoBoingo: !up chalbersma
decimation: asciilifeform: I carried that thing over many moves, finally decided lcds were good enough to replace it
decimation: then I became addicted to the extra square feet of space
asciilifeform: decimation: i decided, and then some time later came to believe that was wrong - and it was too late.
decimation: it's true, I miss the contrast ratio for one thing
asciilifeform: !up upme_boolcrap
decimation: no led/lcd has a true black
BingoBoingo: !up upme_boolcrap
BingoBoingo: decimation: Only Liberia still has true blacks
decimation: and New Zealand
BingoBoingo: No, those aren't black, those are Abbo
upme_boolcrap: oh thank u sir.
upme_boolcrap: stan did i tell u yet
upme_boolcrap: that watermelon
upme_boolcrap: was amazing
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
decimation: a good sweet watermelon is one of the pleasures of the end of summer
upme_boolcrap: it really is
upme_boolcrap: i hope to grow at least 60 next year
upme_boolcrap: one for every day of august and september
decimation: lol do you have acres of space?
upme_boolcrap: for 60 watermelons?
upme_boolcrap: just 3 acres
upme_boolcrap: potatoes are also a big crop
upme_boolcrap: of mine
decimation: you live within commuting range of ascii? You must be rich
upme_boolcrap: why would i be rich
decimation: real estate inflation
BingoBoingo: Becaue you live in prime cotton country
upme_boolcrap: i live in the hills
upme_boolcrap: its not to far out there
upme_boolcrap: its kind of perfect
upme_boolcrap: im still in a development
upme_boolcrap: so if someone kills me
upme_boolcrap: someone else will know
upme_boolcrap: but i have alot of room between other houses
upme_boolcrap: so i can roam naked in my yard if i wish
decimation: I've heard of people commuting from west virginia to the dc area
decimation: sounds crazy to me
upme_boolcrap: we only go in once a week
upme_boolcrap: its 1.15 hours to work
decimation: ah well that would be okay then
upme_boolcrap: too far for me to drive each day
decimation: I was talking with a guy who worked near the Googleplex the other day - apparently he knows people that commute 3 hours each way
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