Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2016-09-17 | 2016-09-19 → ↓
shinohai: !~laserkittens
jhvh1: ,ุ ₍˄.͡˳̫.˄₎ ุ ┌━ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ *pew*
shinohai: happy anniversary mod6
mod6: thanks shinohai :]
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/09/bombs-explode-in-new-jersey-and-manhattan/ << Qntra - Bombs Explode In New Jersey And Manhattan
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: lulzy electoral massage
mircea_popescu: how come everyone's got it in for jew york neyway
asciilifeform: in other lulz, https://archive.is/shLJy >> oh noez, laundry !11111
asciilifeform: 'As preferred customers, they often took Chapo's drugs without putting any money down, then paid the cartel only after they sold the product. This might seem unlikely, given the pervasive distrust in the underworld, but the narcotics trade is based on a robust and surprisingly reliable system of credit. In a sense, a cartel like Sinaloa has no choice but to offer a financing option, because few wholesale buyers have the liquidity to
asciilifeform: pay cash upfront for a ton of cocaine.'
mircea_popescu: no, in a sense of course they offer credit - they don't really want to be buried in bills.
shinohai: I'll gladly pay you next Tuesday for a kilo of blow today!
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2016/sztajnszrajber-and-things-no-seriously/ << Trilema - Sztajnszrajber and things. No, seriously.
shinohai: !~ticker --market all
jhvh1: shinohai: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 609.02, vol: 1248.77787529 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 609.815, vol: 3021.26362 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 612.2, vol: 1490.79478268 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 608.667451, vol: 232851.21380000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 612.039, vol: 321.26085504 | Volume-weighted last average: 608.710378274
shinohai: !~bcstats
jhvh1: shinohai: Current Blocks: 430399 | Current Difficulty: 2.2583287217945956E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 431423 | Next Difficulty In: 1024 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 10 hours, 5 minutes, and 13 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-17#1544461 << i already had it implemented for xref, so just needed to comment out (not (annotation-back-link-mkj-p annotation)) in the right place
a111: Logged on 2016-09-17 21:02 framedr_ghetto: phf: thanks for making a111 quote mkj log lines
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-17#1544485 << it was a knee jerk http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-11#1539368 on my part. i was thinking why not write and use own high level assembly emitter, but thinking about it it would not have improved discoverability, because the task was all or nothing anyway
a111: Logged on 2016-09-17 21:07 mircea_popescu: phf to answer the "why asm" thing : because if at issue is to obtain a correct f(lisp) so as it produces the same asm as gcc(c) then we'd better have a good example of target "same asm". his approach is judicious.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-11 00:43 mircea_popescu: honestly, i think the people who abstract-and-code are idiots anyway. first, you do it by hand. then, you automate what you did. this way a) end up with something that actually works, and even without much design skill is well designed, by mother nature's help ; b) avoiud the trap of "i spent five engineer hours to save myself thirty three minutes of secretarial work over the course of ten years."
phf: the advantage of something like a vop in general, is that you can emit part of the assembly that you're trying to get working in isolation first, can emit it and call in realtime (i.e. in a repl), can have multiple versions of until you get it right, etc.
phf: (an example is https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/cmucl/cmucl/blob/master/src/compiler/x86/float-sse2.lisp#L1426 x87-set-floating-point-modes prelude with keywords says some handy things about what's being emitted to put it in context, but then (:generator 6 ...) is your regular asm, mov xor ...)
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-17#1544418 << i thought psychosis was pretty common with bipolar, during the manic or depressive phases. at least in usg they prescribe antipsychotics to bipolars, though i'm not sure if that's always the case. supposedly you can take them on their own, because they have mood stabilizing effects
a111: Logged on 2016-09-17 19:51 mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160917/#562 << fwiw there's no psychotic ouverture of bipolar. 1st case mostly sounds as usgistan "let's call it something"/
phf: back when i knew the guy, i had a plan to stay in his house for a couple of weeks, wean him off his meds and depending on how that goes, give him acid to poke at his brain. he had some odd blindspots in his thinking that i wasn't sure if they were result of medication, or inherent. somehow multiple people were all up in arms against my plan, so i will never know..
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-18#1544569 << i've been toying with the notion of 0 compiler
a111: Logged on 2016-09-18 17:27 phf: (an example is https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/cmucl/cmucl/blob/master/src/compiler/x86/float-sse2.lisp#L1426 x87-set-floating-point-modes prelude with keywords says some handy things about what's being emitted to put it in context, but then (:generator 6 ...) is your regular asm, mov xor ...)
asciilifeform: very tight interpreter strictly.
asciilifeform: a la tinyscheme
phf: no jit either?
phf: i think main line lua is that way, very tight interpreter, and i guess it's fast enough for gaming (tm)(c)
asciilifeform: jit он от лукавого
asciilifeform: lock up all the x86-aware liquishit in a few 100kb of hand-asmed kernel and never touch again.
asciilifeform: it lives in l0 and no jmp ever goes out of l0 .
phf: since no jmps..
asciilifeform: betcha there is even a magic bit in amd docs that'll force no-inst-fetch-out-of-l0.
asciilifeform: phf: jmp but strictly in the interp's state machine.
phf: nx bit on any page that you touch
asciilifeform: on all pages but kernel.
phf: i guess the trickiest part then is the "x86-aware liquishit", which is enough assembly subset to make it useful, but not enough to construct an escape hatch
phf: oh right, and i called it a year ago, asciilifeform has gone full chuck moore :p
asciilifeform: dunno, i think i went 'full chuck moore' a decade ago?
asciilifeform: and phf: i think you misunderstand - no 'subset but without escape hatch' or whatnot. just pure interpreter.
asciilifeform: 0 new x86ola emission at runtime.
phf: oh so disk controller is part of interpreter?
phf: aaah
phf: hmm
asciilifeform: disk+nic, nothing else.
phf: hmm
phf bb
asciilifeform: i actually considered all of this in '07 but rejected because 'idiots will patch it to do jit and bring back all of the evils'
asciilifeform: but now we have wot.
asciilifeform: it is at least theoretically possible to resist.
asciilifeform: and if we can get performance on par with, e.g., my 4mhz bolix 3620 - it's a win. of sorts.
asciilifeform: phf (and any other interested folk) if you have a bit of spare change, buy yourself a 'pcengines api2', either 2 or 4gb model, it's this comp that comes with schematics. then we can play.
asciilifeform: amd g-series with , iirc, gpl schematics.
asciilifeform: it is cheap because 0 video and 0 place to put.
deedbot: http://www.contravex.com/2016/09/18/check-your-hope/ << » Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski - Check your hope.
BingoBoingo: !~step4
jhvh1: 4. Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
mircea_popescu: i kinda like these because they're so ambiguous.
BingoBoingo: Kinda the point. Their meanings can be reinterpreted over a lifetime for those sick folk who need it, because capable of only unhealthy relations with booze et al.
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160918/#39 << sure. but obviously having both ends helps debug subtle corners and improves your control over the whole matter.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-18 17:24 phf: the advantage of something like a vop in general, is that you can emit part of the assembly that you're trying to get working in isolation first, can emit it and call in realtime (i.e. in a repl), can have multiple versions of until you get it right, etc.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-18: [17:24:27] <phf> the advantage of something like a vop in general, is that you can emit part of the assembly that you're trying to get working in isolation first, can emit it and call in realtime (i.e. in a repl), can have multiple versions of until you get it right, etc.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo yeah, and they're not directly wrong, which is both rarte and helpful for this purpose.
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160918/#42 << the us clinical practice is literally insane. they also diagnose psychosis and prescribe medication in prepubescent individuals. psychosis in such is a strict biological impossibility.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-18 17:51 phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-17#1544418 << i thought psychosis was pretty common with bipolar, during the manic or depressive phases. at least in usg they prescribe antipsychotics to bipolars, though i'm not sure if that's always the case. supposedly you can take them on their own, because they have mood stabilizing effects
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-18: [17:51:09] <phf> http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-17#1544418 << i thought psychosis was pretty common with bipolar, during the manic or depressive phases. at least in usg they prescribe antipsychotics to bipolars, though i'm not sure if that's always the case. supposedly you can take them on their own, because they have mood stabilizing effects
BingoBoingo: !!up yr
deedbot: yr voiced for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: Hello yr
yr: hallo
mircea_popescu: i don't trust an us educated psychiatrist anymore than i'd trust a shaman orthopedist.
yr: I'm sorry BingoBoingo, I pm'd you
BingoBoingo: Anyways on the bipolar they swing from anti-convulsants to antipsychotic depending on what's trendy that year.
BingoBoingo: yr: I don't know you well enough to PM, so now you have voice!
mircea_popescu: sad fucking nonsense, they hung mengele for much less.
yr: was just expressing my appreciation for your collective work, and would like to provide a small donation for hitting the site up once in a while for my informations
yr: is there an address for that?
BingoBoingo: yr: WHich one of the sites?
mircea_popescu: well there's the income tax address of teh republic...
yr: I wasn't aware there was more than one
BingoBoingo: 1FundZy7m7b8begbh9haCguKJcAdFopRJ9 << Supports the work of the real bitcoin foundation. But yes many sites.
yr: where can I read about the real bitcoin foundation?
phf: (i turned off a111 for mkj)
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo lol, guy tries to do a nice thing, discovers the size of the republic, ton of birkcs.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: It happens
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160918/#44 << ftr, you know relatives/friends are universally "up in arms" against girly's plan to "move to $distantlands to live as sexual slave of this guy". doesn't usually seem to do anything.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-18: [17:55:52] <phf> back when i knew the guy, i had a plan to stay in his house for a couple of weeks, wean him off his meds and depending on how that goes, give him acid to poke at his brain. he had some odd blindspots in his thinking that i wasn't sure if they were result of medication, or inherent. somehow multiple people were all up in arms against my plan, so i will never
scriba: know..
BingoBoingo: yr: Don't worry much. You aren't the first to be shock by just how much is going on here, but so far you are the most polite.
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160918/#45 << now THIS is certainly a nice idea that the shitty hardware utterly precludes.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-18: [18:00:04] <asciilifeform> http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-18#1544569 << i've been toying with the notion of 0 compiler
mircea_popescu: iirc in the early days of c-as-replacement-for-straight-asm it's exactly how compiler became a thing. "dude... fuck hardware."
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160918/#51 << no it's not. it ~can~ be, which is a whole different thing.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-18: [18:02:22] <phf> i think main line lua is that way, very tight interpreter, and i guess it's fast enough for gaming (tm)(c)
phf: you mean because there's luajit and no wot?
mircea_popescu: i mean because "don't do this, don't use it there, don't do this way". in any game there are parts you could do in fucking xml. that you write those in lua, or lisp, or anything does not make the anytihng "fast enough for gaming", much like the 14yo doing the parts of "slut" that don't include fucking doesn't make the 14yo "old enough for sex"
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160918/#73 << there's a fine steel hatch to lock that down with now ; so you can transition to not doing it because x86 sux.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-18: [18:14:14] <asciilifeform> i actually considered all of this in '07 but rejected because 'idiots will patch it to do jit and bring back all of the evils'
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160918/#77 << with the time, being the main qualifier. if you have the time and willing to promise commitment thereof but can't afford, whine and someone will surely gift you it.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-18: [18:22:30] <asciilifeform> phf (and any other interested folk) if you have a bit of spare change, buy yourself a 'pcengines api2', either 2 or 4gb model, it's this comp that comes with schematics. then we can play.
phf: oh i thought they use lua for mainloops, but actually i'm not sure. it might just be all scripting. one "fast" lua project that i know, which is luke gorrie's "snabb switch", uses luajit though
BingoBoingo: !!up yr
deedbot: yr voiced for 30 minutes.
shinohai: welcome yr
yr: hello
BingoBoingo: Keep coming back, it works when you work it.
phf: that was not the right command..
phf: hmm, good thing that guard was there..
a111: Logged on 2016-04-01 20:37 phf: trinque: rsync, tmux, asdf, really nothing smarter than that
BingoBoingo: In other broken sold under the name of the working http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1544180
phf: yes, scp, screen, asdf. i had a v based deployment but i wasn't happy with it, so i'm trying to rethink it
a111: Logged on 2016-09-18 21:40 mircea_popescu: iirc in the early days of c-as-replacement-for-straight-asm it's exactly how compiler became a thing. "dude... fuck hardware."
asciilifeform: it wasn't re 'let's program in x86 asm' , lol
asciilifeform: it was re 'let's keep tinyscheme-like thing in l0 and no other x86 progs anywhere'
phf: ben_vulpes: actually right now i'm heathen-ing it, by using quicklisp too. problem is btcbase depends on 35 different projects (like hunchentoot pulls 8 deps, cl-irc 2, etc.) so cmucl version i had all 35 hand patched to various degrees. the right way seems to be giving all those project the v treatment: pull them in, strip them of fluff, genesis, etc.
phf: but that's a hell of a lot more work
ben_vulpes: you don't say
phf: so my v based deployment had a hack, vpatch by diff artifact has a prelude section, that you can put whatever in. it's basically space before the first --- line
phf: err, before the first ^diff ...
mircea_popescu: phf maybe im just behind the times. for all i know they use javascript internally all over blizzard now, whatevs.
phf: so i use it to put a patch description, but if the section has ^L\n( or ^L\n; then i just execute everything between ^L and diff ... after the patch has been applied
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no, i understand the dream. just pointing out that it didn't work once before.
phf: so the vpatch becomes something like "getting baz to work^L(load "foo") (load "bar") diff ... foo.lisp ... +... -... etc diff bar.lisp ... +... -..."
mircea_popescu: phf no point in being too ashamed of the early pubescence of the republic. if that's the best that can be done then that's the best that can be done, others may be able to improve on it which is welcome, but there's complete immunity from the very hollow somethingawful approach of "your tobacco uses pot lol". nobody cares, really, what something awful may say or think on any topic, chiefly because they're fundamentally idiots.
phf: but obviously it doesn't have to be just load, can also be code that does a mutation on state or whatever
mircea_popescu: so you know, there's no benefit to be acrued through hiding hacks from view.
phf: anyway, i should probably write the first version up, while it's a lul between attempts
BingoBoingo: !!up yr
deedbot: yr voiced for 30 minutes.
yr: just noticed - that the real luke-jr?
BingoBoingo: Lurks here, but he doesn't get lended voice anymore
yr: interesting
yr: well, I'm going to lurk for a while -- is there another way to flag you down besides pm?
a111: Logged on 2016-09-16 19:47 pete_dushenski: 'I was dead-set on finding a house with a garbage disposal, or "garburator" as our sorry ("Sorry!") neighbors to the North call them,' << l0l! love the souble dorry. also, i've never lived in a house or condo with a garburator and may never.
BingoBoingo: yr: Register a key, flagg me down when you do, collect a rating, and learn to voice yourself?
BingoBoingo: !!topic
yr: okay
BingoBoingo: !!help
phf: also sop is to ask for a pm from anyone who's speaking (i.e. awake and at keyboard) at the moment
phf: err, pm for up
BingoBoingo: sop is also what you do with a mop to get water off the floor
mircea_popescu: "the logic of steel" wtf is he about ?
mircea_popescu: lafond never heard how caesar died or what.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> "the logic of steel" wtf is he about ? << Early book of his.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> lafond never heard how caesar died or what. << Historicaly common, but was uncommon among the fauna local to him historicaly.
BingoBoingo: Rat is common plague is alf land. Uncommon in Bingo land.
mircea_popescu: still, even thinking about it, both dagger and knife are insane weapons for the lone operator. unless with a group of friends, preferably sons of the people running the city as seein in italian renaissance for example, you're asking to be killed.
mircea_popescu: armed enough to be murdered for it ; not armed enough to keep angry mob at bay.
mircea_popescu: !!up makotako
deedbot: makotako voiced for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: But Sanity is uncommon in USia, and especially uncommon in Urban areas.
mircea_popescu: the logic of parochisteel.
shinohai: BingoBoingo while I'm in here this evening, you want a oglafbot added ?
BingoBoingo: Nah, because tradition. However do add responses for !~tradition1, etc. Also add a reply for the seekrit 13th step.
makotako: No thanks shinohai
shinohai: kk bb
shinohai: !!down makotako
deedbot: shinohai may not !!down makotako.
makotako: mahahahahahahahahahahaa
mircea_popescu: makotako who are you again ?
makotako: what do you mean, AGAIN?
shinohai: Kryptoncoin troll
shinohai: i dunno
BingoBoingo: makotako: Please see
BingoBoingo: !~step5
jhvh1: 5. Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
mircea_popescu: i mean again as in you should have started with that ; and i'm giving you the benefit of the doubt pretending like you did and i didn't notice.
makotako: Nope, I never introduced myself.
mircea_popescu: that'll do then.
mircea_popescu: !!down makotako
shinohai: !~bcstas
jhvh1: shinohai: Error: "bcstas" is not a valid command.
shinohai: !~bcstats
jhvh1: shinohai: Current Blocks: 430450 | Current Difficulty: 2.2583287217945956E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 431423 | Next Difficulty In: 973 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 6 days, 15 hours, 56 minutes, and 42 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None
shinohai: My eyes
ben_vulpes: how do they go, after the showwwww
ben_vulpes: title song off that album is rather good.
deedbot: accepted: 1
deedbot: accepted: 1
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-18#1544713 << would be a concern were americans to get angry and mob ever, see: http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/18/us/minnesota-mall-stabbing/
a111: Logged on 2016-09-18 23:30 mircea_popescu: armed enough to be murdered for it ; not armed enough to keep angry mob at bay.
mircea_popescu: but the bovine quality of the inhabitants of that land (btw, it's pretty clear by now north america destroys the soul : if you recall the spanish ran into the same useless pussies back cca 1500 as the marauding hordes would meet today. apparently it dun matter if redskin or allegedly paleskin - if you live in north america you turn into buffalo) has little to do with some sort of eternal logic of armsmastery.
phf: there was a scifi story where a ship landed on a planet, lush, beautiful, with a cow like creatures inhabiting it. so they taste the cow meat, and they hang out, until, and i'll spoil it for you, they all turn, one by one, into same case
phf: *same cows
shinohai: !~later tell BingoBoingo http://ix.io/1oeh
jhvh1: shinohai: The operation succeeded.
shinohai: Zuck gets cucked again, this time by city council: http://archive.is/zkff9
ben_vulpes: http://www.wrightspeed.com/technology << perhaps not the dumbest thing i've seen!
deedbot: http://cascadianhacker.com/the-hilarious-unprofitability-of-uber << CH - The Hilarious Unprofitability of Uber
deedbot: http://danielpbarron.com/2016/much-more-sisters/ << Daniel P. Barron - Much more sisters
mircea_popescu: check it out, danielpbarron somehow has a recent comments plugin that includes diana_coman 's blog ?!
mircea_popescu: o nm, was a pingback.
mircea_popescu: "What, as we say, dat? Could Uber be competing to own the vertical and horizontal in a space and failing to bite off an element of the business model that profitability is predicated on the ownership of?" << ben_vulpes can you say that again, but in a language, this time ?
mircea_popescu: and in other news, a proper postmortem piece re "I attribute a large part of my abject failure to stuff cubicles with commodity labor and churn out software all day long to how willing" when ?
mircea_popescu: oh and also, "especially if you're the hardworking-yet-broke, but-somehow-stupid-enough-to-be-family-having type like myself." is the story of a generation. write a blog for them, they will come.
BingoBoingo: ty shinohai
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/09/another-crack-in-ether-handlers-fume-hood/ << Qntra - Another Crack In Ether Handler's Fume Hood
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