Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans

← 2014-04-09 | 2014-04-11 →
TestingUnoDosTre: and by "What" I mean, Why are there more bids between 405 to 400 than there are compared with 400 to 395
Duffer1: i think chatzilla knows it's about to be replaced
Duffer1: it's stopped wrapping text >.<
cazalla: MisterE: you know who runs CoinJar right?
cazalla: We have 4 major banks in Australia, CJ has been kicked from 2 now, other being CommBank
nubbins`: i gotta say, i liked australia a lot more as a kid
MisterE: I gotta agree with that sentiment
cazalla: yeah, seems there is a disproportionate amount of bitcoin scammers from here
cazalla: one of the latest being some real estate hustler who was in the papers saying he was bringing 100 robocoins to australia
cazalla: he also ran a conference where last year he said the winklevoss twins were book, months pass and it was the winklevoss twins are a maybe, then it's deleted from the website and the headliner was jeffrey tucker instead lol
cazalla: were booked*
nubbins`: crazy/10 would not do business with
artifexd: <- Uncensored video of it happening
ozbot: - Topless chick goes crazy in Mcdonalds
nubbins`: leel
nubbins`: actually crazy/10 would do business with
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 62 @ 0.0075 = 0.465 BTC [+]
nubbins`: ;;later tell mike_c lel, is overrun with bot spam ;(
gribble: The operation succeeded.
Duffer1: blah is there no weechat for windows?
Duffer1: nm cygwin brb buying linux laptop >.<
nubbins`: you can buy linux laptops? ;D
Duffer1: i can buy a laptop and install linux over whatever it comes with
TestingUnoDosTre: chrometop?
nubbins`: that's not the same as buying a linux laptop
Duffer1: i looked at those but they max at 16gb
nubbins`: mostly because you're paying microsoft $25
Duffer1: if i bought it new sure, but i'm looking at used, something i5 i can throw an ssd in
nubbins`: ah, then you get a pass
Duffer1: so my only experience with linux was probably 15 years ago, and was redhat4dummies
nubbins`: dell will uninstall windows and refund you the $25, as long as you don't turn on your new laptop and pay shipping both ways
Duffer1: what do i want these days?
nubbins`: try ubuntu or mint
Duffer1: thanks
nubbins`: 2:10am, time for sleep
mikaeldice: I can't wait for high resolution display support to become more common on desktop distros
mikaeldice: My lenovo yoga has a 3200x1800 display on 13", which most Linux distros look ridiculous on currently.. Good news is that a lot of the work is already done, just waiting to be included in distro repositories
mikaeldice: I think Ubuntu 14.04 will be the first if you don't want to pull a bleeding edge build for it
mikaeldice: Though I kind of dislike the more recent releases of ubuntu
Duffer1: downloading 13.1 atm from website
Duffer1: oo looks like i should wait for 14.04
cazalla: yeah, 15th i believe
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 20 @ 0.5901003 = 11.802 BTC [-] {4}
benkay: been talking a lot lately about bsd
benkay: don' want no mo ssl holes like that one
ozbot: Rice Hadley Gates LLC | International Strategic Consulting Firm
benkay: i want an international strategic consulting firm!
mike_c: nubbins`: ok.. now you have to pick out cat photos to create an account.
mike_c: 2,750 spam accounts created on eulorum. and mediawiki has no way to mass-delete users..
benkay: hahaha
benkay: sucker
benkay: uh so i'm no expert at these things
benkay: being barely capable at my chosen trade in "lisp etc etc
benkay: ("lisp")
benkay: i've just started hacking on c and man is this shit miserable
mike_c: i'll have to figure out how to add blocks in sql. the admin interface is useless.
benkay: tee hee abstractions
MisterE: c is suck
benkay: i dunno man
benkay: mebbe i'm retarded
benkay: i dig the types for sure
benkay: but voof. buffers? in my face? all the time? surely this is not a good use of my brain.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEEQ] 2460 @ 0.000064 = 0.1574 BTC [-]
fluffypony: benkay: that's the problem with being that low level
ThickAsThieves: how come china bans bitcoin every week?
ThickAsThieves: yet market always reacts
benkay: market consists of a few people trading over tin can telephones
benkay: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 411.26, Best ask: 412.0, Bid-ask spread: 0.74000, Last trade: 412.0, 24 hour volume: 15030.68265563, 24 hour low: 410.15, 24 hour high: 455.0, 24 hour vwap: 432.988977841
benkay: ;;ticker --market all
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 412.0, vol: 15030.68265563 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 409.437, vol: 15238.11147 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 413.2, vol: 12040.28843127 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 438.2, vol: 130.58213779 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 397.7559, vol: 5608.52530000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 420.93994, vol: 5.30464706 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 429.195, vol: 83.16219237 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)
benkay: 411 you say.
fluffypony: and that's why I don't price watch
MisterE: not price watching is no fun
ThickAsThieves: buying is fun
MisterE: then you can't make moves and coin up
fluffypony: MisterE: I suck at trading
fluffypony: day trading doubly so
MisterE: I dont usually trade multiple times in a day
MisterE: maybe once a day
MisterE: trends I look for are ~24 hr
MisterE: just for play fun, I have other investments that are in cold storage
MisterE: troll the btce trollbox for a while :)
fluffypony: the btc-e trollbox is an awful bunch of human beings
MisterE: truly
fluffypony: bought some of these to give to my parents and my in-laws:
fluffypony: arrived yesterday
fluffypony: it arrives unfunded and you email them to "activate" it, then they fund ut
MisterE: I once made a retarded comment about "double inverted helix head & shoulders formation at the 3rd Fibonacci band formed" in trollbox
fluffypony: (to prevent it being lost in transit, presumably)
MisterE: I promptly got a PM asking me what this high tech investment analysis was
fluffypony: MisterE: LOL!
cazalla: fluffypony: why would you trust them?
fluffypony: cazalla: didn't see any negative reviews
fluffypony: and we wanted something presentation-y
cazalla: but how do you know they don't keep a copy of the private key?
fluffypony: we don't
fluffypony: there's a 2 factor authentication thing
fluffypony: I mean check
fluffypony: it's just a gift to them for fun that they may or may not be able to use one day
fluffypony: it's not to put someone's life savings into
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0549898 = 0.11 BTC [+] {2}
[\]: where's mircea?
fluffypony: [\\\]: sleeping?
[\]: I wanted to introduce him to a bunch of new friends
[\]: I name dropped the channel in #bitcoin-pricetalk
akstunt600: oh hey fluffypony
fluffypony: hey akstunt600
akstunt600: thanks for the invite [\\\]
[\]: it wasn't a fucking invite
[\]: fluffypony, people don't know about /list *bitcoin*
fluffypony: people don't know about /list
[\]: sadly
keonne_: people don't know about irc in general
fluffypony: a lot of people think that mIRC *is* IRC
dub: sadly they now know about this channel
fluffypony: they have nfi about the underlying architecture or what services are available and what they do
keonne: dub: one insult from mirecea will probably change that
keonne: hows its going mr pony?
keonne: how is South Africa on this fine Thursday
fluffypony: keonne: not too bad
fluffypony: it's REALLY foggy today
fluffypony: I took a picture, will upload it in a bit
keonne: cool, i like pictures
keonne: especially of your wife
keonne: :p
fluffypony: we're like 1.2kms from shore, and the fog is right up at the house
keonne: wow thats pretty crazy
keonne: Paris is bright and lovely
fluffypony: ah nice
keonne: I'm leaving today, back to soggy wet England
fluffypony: Paris is beautiful in the spring
keonne: it really is
fluffypony: I could never live in England
keonne: i love England, but it is damp
fluffypony: I love the people and the culture, but the weather would make me sad
keonne: I'm from south Florida, and I hate the heat, so the mild weather is pretty nice
fluffypony: ah ok
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.056892 = 0.1138 BTC [+]
keonne: ok now to catch up on the logs
keonne: #bitcoin-assets is like a second job
ozbot: Whitehat hacker goes too far, gets raided by FBI, tells all | Ars Technica
MisterE: keonne: I went to HS in Miami also lived in Tampa and the keys for a while
fluffypony: MisterE: that guy is an idiot
fluffypony: 'I basically "confessed" everything to the FBI already.'
fluffypony: you never talk to the cops!
MisterE: yea
keonne: MisterE: I went to Beach High
keonne: for 2 years anyway, before driopping out
MisterE: S. Miami Beach?
keonne: yep
keonne: c/o 2005
MisterE: I dropped after 2-years too
MisterE: got a GED
keonne: same
keonne: mircea_popescu: <mike_c> yes, it's not like france where they just take your whole paycheck and give you a few dollars a week for coffee and cigarettes. << zing lmao. what you say nao pankkake ? huh ? huh ?
keonne: i lol'd because so true
MisterE: heh, probably in NL too heh
keonne: MisterE: So you grew up in Miami?
MisterE: yea in my teens
MisterE: I was all around the grove and Kendall area
keonne: You seem like a smart guy, so i am assuming you left asap
keonne: that place is a pit
MisterE: yea just before andrew we got out lucky
MisterE: indeed I went back after and asked my friend why they were staying
keonne: oh wow, that is lucky. My dad was emergency services so we stayed during Andrew, was scary/fun
MisterE: oh, I was young then just lucky timing. But later I worked as a paramedic in the west for 3-years
keonne: Yeah I was young too, but I remember it pretty well... I remember the national guard closing streets down and what not
MisterE: Homestead, man never seen anything like that
keonne: yep
MisterE: I'd ben there before I knew it was trailer city
keonne: most of Florida is trailer city, bad move really considering there is a yearly fucking hurricane season, geniuses
MisterE: You know the joke about What do tornadoes and divorces in Kentucky have in common?
keonne: the sun does funny things to people
MisterE: could be FL
keonne: i dont know the joke
MisterE: indeed and back when I was a kid there was so much coke
MisterE: oh, either way someone loses a trailer...
keonne: there still is lol
keonne: haha
MisterE: lel
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.04763005 = 0.2382 BTC [-] {5}
keonne: 18:44:21 asciilifeform: there was a great soviet cartoon about a kid who hates history class and then gets a time machine
keonne: 18:44:35 asciilifeform: he goes back and kills... just about everyone he failed exams on
keonne: asciilifeform: i need to see this
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 9 @ 0.04726788 = 0.4254 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 86 @ 0.04614534 = 3.9685 BTC [-] {9}
taub: one panic exhaustion to 350 please and strong reversal
keonne: ugh this robwhiz22 is making my head hurt
MisterE: taub: it's going to be like this until the 15th passes
keonne: ^ agreed
keonne: mircea_popescu: most of the trilema that's not written in vi is written in nano
keonne: i also like nano, keeps it simple, and i don't need extra fucking thumbs
MisterE: nano and pico ++
MisterE: I dont really know the difference like wget and curl
keonne: wget is recursive
keonne: curl isnt
keonne: among other things
MisterE: i read wget was designed for really crappy connections
MisterE: maybe that means longer timeouts
keonne: God i am regretting all the whisky last night
keonne: i can smell it in my sweat and it is grossing me out
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.05589301 = 0.1677 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [7C] 20 @ 0.00529499 = 0.1059 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [7C] 50 @ 0.00529899 = 0.2649 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [7C] 18 @ 0.00717783 = 0.1292 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 151 @ 0.58505045 = 88.3426 BTC [-] {9}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 52 @ 0.00208499 = 0.1084 BTC [+]
ozbot: Schneier on Security: Heartbleed
dub: herp de derp
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3505 @ 0.00096088 = 3.3679 BTC [-]
keonne: i hate that i have to sell bitcoin today :(
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.053845 = 0.2692 BTC [-]
jurov: ;;later tell mikaeldice i resorted to running startx -- -dpi 200 with kde, it works quite nicely.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
fluffypony: keonne: yeah that's the worst
fluffypony: when it's low and you have to sell to cover expenses
Apocalyptic: could be worse
keonne: yeah
keonne: its mildly annoying
ozbot: coinjedi / SCAMMERS: Declares "Push" on obvious win for BFL bet | Page 18 | Bitcoint
keonne: i hope china bans bitcoin again at the end of the month payday
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 414.1, vol: 22152.49644461 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 411.943, vol: 21222.59832 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 415.2, vol: 18674.85077075 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 425.0, vol: 137.01650657 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 405.72, vol: 6743.53190000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 420.0, vol: 8.00404786 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 428.352837, vol: 146.65163261 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)
BingoBoingo: ;;more
gribble: 412.969298238
jurov: ;;bc,convert eur
gribble: 1 BTC = 414.0 USD = 298.701 eur
MisterE: If you didn't already need a reason to DROP Dropbox:
fluffypony: I like DropBox
Apocalyptic: cloud storage is overrated
fluffypony: I mean, it's great for quick collaboration
fluffypony: Apocalyptic: yeah but I tried running ownCloud
fluffypony: and it was shit
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41350 @ 0.00096189 = 39.7742 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29852 @ 0.00096362 = 28.766 BTC [+] {3}
ozbot: labcoin lawsuit
fluffypony: the only problem with keeping the details all out in the open is that he can see it
fluffypony: and stay ahead of them
dexX7: i assume what is posted there is the bare minimum
fluffypony: hopefullly
dub: i assume that IS alberto
fluffypony: dub: clever
fluffypony: very meta if it is
dub: its not 'meta' at all
dexX7: it's not
dexX7: his id was confirmed
fluffypony: dub: it would be - its a scammer scamming the scamhunters :-P
dub: just like you confirmed who labcoin was before investin
dexX7: :D
fluffypony: "due diligence" much
dub: !t h am1
assbot: [HAVELOCK:AM1] 1D: 0.58000000 / 0.58934983 / 0.61000000 (209 shares, 123.17411349 BTC), 7D: 0.58000000 / 0.59094914 / 0.61889899 (326 shares, 192.64941846 BTC), 30D: 0.52200000 / 0.60916007 / 0.69510000 (2921 shares, 1779.35655173 BTC)
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 411.55, Best ask: 411.8, Bid-ask spread: 0.25000, Last trade: 411.8, 24 hour volume: 22673.97718376, 24 hour low: 400.11, 24 hour high: 453.96, 24 hour vwap: 423.36399149
dexX7: ^ i guess china banned bitcoin again
Mats_cd03: geez, the price keeps correcting each time i pick up more btc ;(
dexX7: before or after you bought? ;)
Mats_cd03: after hence the tear
dexX7: meh
Mats_cd03: im being punished for not using -otc
dexX7: how would -otc help in this case?
truffles: cheaper
Mats_cd03: it wouldn't, it would just be mildly cheaper
dexX7: ah
Apocalyptic: cheaper ?
Apocalyptic: otc usual rates are quite above the market price
truffles: u sure?
Apocalyptic: i'm an op there and frequent trader, so yeah pretty muc
truffles: so u know that coin guy pfff
truffles: let me quote u what happened
truffles: we were talking about pool, and how he can get 1k per game easy etc
truffles: so obv he's some kinda pool shark/baller
Mats_cd03: ;;tell benkay having adventures in C? me too we're bros
gribble: Error: I haven't seen benkay, I'll let you do the telling.
Apocalyptic: ;;later tell
gribble: (later tell <nick> <text>) -- Tells <nick> <text> the next time <nick> is in seen. <nick> can contain wildcard characters, and the first matching nick will be given the note.
Mats_cd03: senkq
truffles: tell?
truffles: oh he failed nm
Mats_cd03: Apocalyptic: oh... i was under the impression it was
truffles: truffles> why is coingenuity on the phone with banks?
truffles: <coingenuity> truffles: because banks are banning bitcoin
truffles: <coingenuity> try sending money to an exchange right now ;)
truffles: <truffles> if ure into btc why do u still hold onto bank accounts..
truffles: <coingenuity> truffles: i run one of the biggest bitcoin companies
truffles: <truffles> well i hope ure on there all day
truffles: * ChanServ sets mode: +o coingenuity
truffles: * You were kicked by coingenuity (you're)
truffles: <truffles> cry about it more plz
truffles: <@coingenuity> truffles: i'm trying to warn you to behave
truffles: <truffles> u mean to stroke ur ego?
truffles: <@coingenuity> really, dude
truffles: <truffles> oh look at u, u have "power"
truffles: * You were kicked by coingenuity (come back when you can behave)
truffles: chat spame
truffles: so then i in #bitcoin i was like "why are u such a bitch" i think im banned there too
Apocalyptic: maybe if you would write properly it wouldn't have escalated that far
truffles: haha
Apocalyptic: cause as far as I can see that's what the first kick was for
truffles: if spelling gets u kicks heh
Duffer1: truffles<coingenuity> truffles: i run one of the biggest bitcoin companies >> wtf is coingenuity?
truffles: some baller
truffles: mod on otc
Apocalyptic: Duffer1, he's running coinabul
truffles: i think he's on some kinda power trip ya know
Duffer1: isee
truffles: "Coinabul has been ripping people off for a while." shit no wonder he can drop 1k a game
kakobrekla: power trip? more like acid trip
Apocalyptic: kako, you have some history with coingenuity ?
BingoBoingo: Power Acid!
kakobrekla: i dont think i do
truffles: not surprised he's not a reputable guy
ozbot: SCAM - Coinabul owe me 81btc
Diablo-D3: so Im signing up with bitpay
Diablo-D3: so I can accept bitcoin
Diablo-D3: I dunno, after all the years Ive been in the Bitcoin community, I just can't turn my back on everyone
truffles: bitcoin for?
truffles: thought u cashed out and now rolling in money piles
ozbot: MPEx.RFC.1 pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: so please to read and comment
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 so you're averaging your cost down :D
mircea_popescu: <truffles> if spelling gets u kicks heh << dude i thought you were the english expert.
truffles: not on the internet
truffles: pretty sure id best u in something written in english for sure
mircea_popescu: on what, vellum ?
truffles: non pc topic
truffles: bring all ur minions too
truffles: prob not if one is english prof
mircea_popescu: mon minions font minette
mircea_popescu: poor mr gross.
mircea_popescu: has learned so little over so long.
dexX7: "not a scam but failed business"
ozbot: Why I used to trust Patrick Harnett
mircea_popescu: the failed business of having lied through your teeth accidentally for great justice.
dexX7: last edit nov 17 2012 though
taub: MisterE> taub: it's going to be like this until the 15th passes
taub: whats on the 15th?
dexX7: china finally bans btc
mircea_popescu: mod6 dignork only noobs want windows ok cancel boxes! i want my client to damn well do what i tell it to.
mircea_popescu: keeps me on my toes.
pigeons: if you dont want pirate risk, i can tell you its not with pirate and pay you less
mircea_popescu: pigeons in a meta-sense, everyone that fucked up so far has been fucked by the same thing : failure to take btc seriously enough. be it the derps that still don't have any, harping about how it's just a fad and quoting tired beanie babies examples,
mircea_popescu: or on the other extreme patrick harnetts and other herps figuring "oh, it's jsut a small little thing, i'm much bigger than it so should be ok"
mircea_popescu: the whole spectrum seems to reduce to "didn't take it seriously enough"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2584 @ 0.00014939 = 0.386 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22355 @ 0.00096159 = 21.4963 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: jborkl: We know how many btc there will be next year << he has it, btc supply is extremely well know. the function that stabilises the dishing out of btc over time has been EXTREMELY efficient so far, in spite of massive hashpower changes. i would say btc supply side is the best known of any material in history. including gold, which used to hold that distinction (which was a key to its monetization)
mircea_popescu: bounce i myself am happy with the "clueless woman, learned to use gpg last week, does not quite grok what keys are or how they work"
mircea_popescu: i have no idea how come they still give diplomas to lawyers and journalists that aren't fluent with gpg since their sophomore year, but hey.
bounce: because formalities and actual achievements are quite disconnected
mircea_popescu: mike_c: for instance, mp has a bunch of coins. they are not supply because they are not for sale. << they are supply even if they are not for sale. review Wickard v. Filburn :D
mircea_popescu: << still empty log lines ?! kakobrekla omg
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
truffles: maybe he's busy
Apocalyptic: he's editing the shit out of it
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: wrt not taking it seriously - not sure about other countries, but we have a new (2009) act here that says that a director will be liable for losses suffered by the company as a result of the director having taken or failed to act against certain unauthorised or unlawful actions and situations
mircea_popescu: cazalla the life of the p t barnum promoter of roadside attractions is a precarious one.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony pretty sure that was the case before 2009, both in common and civil law jurisdictions.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: not in South Africa
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla o wow he just pasted teh empty ? nm then
fluffypony: was pretty much the wild west here
mircea_popescu: fluffypony ah ah, ok.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45600 @ 0.00096168 = 43.8526 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: actually doesn't even load.
mircea_popescu: mikaeldice: Though I kind of dislike the more recent releases of ubuntu << word.
wywialm: hello all
mircea_popescu: [\\\] i am here.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4700 @ 0.00096159 = 4.5195 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: aww dub why so sour ? noobs taste good.
Mats_cd03: mircea_popescu is in high spirits today
Mats_cd03: did you get an afternoon bj
mircea_popescu: i just woke up.
mircea_popescu: keonne: #bitcoin-assets is like a second job << first job for most people here.
truffles: so ure a morning person eh
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 16 @ 0.58 = 9.28 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: for some definitions of morning.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 24 @ 0.0056675 = 0.136 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: MisterE guy is definitely lying. had he made that reddit post BEFORE having tried to steal the data rather than as a coverup afterthought, all'd hgave been well.
truffles: some ppl r like zombies in the morning
mircea_popescu: yes, but those aren't the people that never woke up with a timer in their life.
truffles: orly
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 22 @ 0.60950995 = 13.4092 BTC [+] {9}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 40 @ 0.61903286 = 24.7613 BTC [+] {11}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 11 @ 0.62 = 6.82 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.610004 = 6.1 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.60002145 = 1.8001 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.60000001 = 1.2 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.6 = 2.4 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7861 @ 0.00096168 = 7.5598 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: you still around?
thestringpuller: from trilema: MPEx webservers will have to keep a copy of the database. This is practically unavoidable (I think) because of two things : you.d like to be able to issue account statements for customers when they want, rather than when you get around to itviii and you.d like to pipe trade data into other services (like twitter, assbot on #bitcoin-assets etc).
thestringpuller: does this mean that each webserver holds trade data?
mircea_popescu: pretty much
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEEQ] 2500 @ 0.00009082 = 0.2271 BTC [+] {3}
thestringpuller: oh for STAT
thestringpuller: i see...
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.05565641 = 0.2783 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.05567526 = 0.167 BTC [+] {2}
nubbins`: truffles, speeling = improtant
nubbins`: ;;later tell mike_c cats? now I'M signing up for multiple accounts :D
gribble: The operation succeeded.
nubbins`: mircea_popescu: inexplainably is, inexplicably, not a word
fluffypony: that's unexplendifirous
nubbins`: i think the word you're looking for is cromulent
nubbins`: mircea_popescu: +1 for lost-key safeguard process, that's clever
kakobrekla: ok lel
ozbot: Invest Bitcoins due to launch shortly!
fluffypony: shut up and take my money!
Mats_cd03: does gpg timestamping continue to be an issue?
Apocalyptic: seriously...
Apocalyptic: "i don't have any idea about wtf i'm doing"
kakobrekla: me neither
pankkake: GPG puts timestamps in signatures?
nubbins`: "The investment is more for people who want to safeguard BTC at the current prices"
nubbins`: so it's just like cashing out, but instead of cashing out into your local currency, you cash out into indian government bonds
nubbins`: sounds like a win-win-win
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11100 @ 0.00096168 = 10.6746 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: > Because of inherited weakness from pgp’s own timestamping, there is currently no reliable way to resolve time disputes : the client can very well present his own version (as included in the signed material), MPEx will present its own version (as reflected by when it has seen the order) and no further progress can be made (for which reason MPEx’
Mats_cd03: determination is final).
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6700 @ 0.00096168 = 6.4433 BTC [+]
nubbins`: wait a minute, i know why i'm so bleary
nubbins` makes coffee
Mats_cd03: only pakistani govt bonds are more safe
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.05566999 = 0.1113 BTC [-]
pankkake: and don't confuse them with pankkistani bonds
Mats_cd03: weak
ozbot: France Government Bond 10Y | Actual Data | Forecasts | Calendar
danielpbarron: "please learn to read. this coin is about raising awareness for rap music and rap victims. it's not about promoting rap. why would anyone do this? you're a sick person."
pankkake: what
truffles: tupac?
danielpbarron: a stupid altcoin, but i think the OP is trolling
danielpbarron: "yes. a launch. we have a coin, a website, a twitter, facebook, g+ profile, a windows wallet, no real concept and of course no innovation. everything you need for a great coin. this coin has muy potentialones."
pankkake: to the hood!
danielpbarron: made me laugh out loud when I read "rap victims"
MisterE: maybe it was typo
fluffypony: "muy potentialones"
truffles: pantalones
fluffypony: danielpbarron: definitely trolling
fluffypony: I mean, it's called RAPe
fluffypony: "Rap(e)Coin: the rap coin that's not about rape because rape is bad and rap isn't"
kakobrekla: is this one of the Rap-e-ghosts thingy
nubbins`: better get ultimate scammer rg on the line to find out
fluffypony: LOL kakobrekla
nubbins`: ;;rated rg
gribble: You rated user rg on Wed Feb 26 10:45:04 2014, with a rating of -2, and supplied these additional notes: tried to stiff me on payment for some design work.
danielpbarron: what's the deal with trezor? I'm gonna assume it's not as good as cardano will be?
danielpbarron: or should I not even be comparing these things?
kakobrekla: its good to asume its not even close to being the same thing
kakobrekla: assume
fluffypony: if you assume you make an ASS out of U and ME
fluffypony: *du-du-dish*
danielpbarron: i guess what I mean is, ... ultimately this is about securing BTC right? is trezor any good at that?
kakobrekla: cardano does not hold bitcoin private keys
danielpbarron: from what I understand, a lot of the cardano research is getting the right hardware RNG; is trezor up to the same standard?
kakobrekla: as to rng on trezor
kakobrekla: they use deterministic wallets afaik
danielpbarron: does that mean the user programs it?
kakobrekla: you supply the 12 or whatever words to make the seed from which all the future bitcoin key pairs are generated
danielpbarron: if I can type in the 12 words somehow, that's pretty cool
danielpbarron: otherwise, I don't think I can trust that little thing to make a secure enough seed
kakobrekla: its cool until it isnt.
danielpbarron: yeah it makes me suspicious when everyone is hyping it up and it's still on pre-order; sounds a lot like BFL
danielpbarron: "give us BTC today and maybe we'll ship you a product next year"
kakobrekla: thats trezor
danielpbarron: right, that's what I mean
kakobrekla: bfl is "give us btc and fuck you."
pLambert: has BitVPS buyout been discussed here yet? A big FU to all the shareholders
kakobrekla: what buyout?
pLambert: they are buying back shares based on the past couple dividends
Mats_cd03: 3btc is just a ridiculous cost imo
kakobrekla: dunno havent been following that story
ozbot: [BTC-TC] BitVPS
Mats_cd03: im not stingy, but its unnecessary
danielpbarron: 2 BTC is ridic for an aluminium upgrade, Mats_cd03
danielpbarron: Mats_cd03: I don't mind it costing a lot, but it's insulting to say that using aliminum costs 2 BTC more than using plastic
kakobrekla: >>I invested 700 dollars, and you think I can be content with your forced 20 dollars buy-back?
kakobrekla: I would have been less offended if you had just said "Fuck you, I'm keeping your money."
fluffypony: what have the dividends been like over the period? I take it not enough to cover the original investment?
danielpbarron: I am the issuer of the #5 ranked asset in counterparty :D
fluffypony: wd danielpbarron
pLambert: They keep saying "we are investing in more hardware, so dividends are low this month", then for the buyback they ignore all the hardware they just bought
danielpbarron: ty, fluffypony; I've got the market cap up to a record breaking 0.52 XCP
pLambert: arij: want to comment on this?
danielpbarron: pLambert: is this a mining company?
pLambert: BitVPS is a hosting company
pankkake: danielpbarron: is it something real?
pLambert: imagine if Warren Buffet wanted to buy shares of his company back based onthe dividends: $0.00 to you, shareholders
danielpbarron: pankkake: sorta, I backed my asset with a currency from a video game
pankkake: bitvps was profit shares though
danielpbarron: I'm doing it just for fun; trying out the protocol
benkay: thestringpuller: ping
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.054988 = 0.3299 BTC [-]
benkay: last bitvps statement was december?
danielpbarron: what's the most influential group of bitcoiners? the devs, the miners, or whatever you call the individuals who own a lot of BTC
benkay: some in this channel would hold it to be this channel
benkay: miners are influential in that txns that adhere to 0.6 rules will probably always get relayed
pankkake: define influential
benkay: devs, unles you're talking about conformal, don't really do much other than implement dirty code into bitcoin-qt
pankkake: transaction/network wise, both miners *and* public nodes. devs, nothing really, as it is with all open source software
danielpbarron: i've been tempted into thinking it was the devs and then the miners that had all the power
danielpbarron: but now I'm leaning to that other group, the group i'm not sure what to call
benkay: "powerful"'s a good start.
danielpbarron: "holders" ?
danielpbarron: venture capitalists? or just capitalists?
benkay: *shrug*
benkay: power comes in many forms.
benkay: sometimes it looks like btc, sometimes it looks like hashes...
danielpbarron: pankkake is right about devs, it's open source stuff
danielpbarron: so then why not the miners? and keep in mind I mean the pool operators, not the guy in his basement
pankkake: pool operators are highly dependent on their users, as it is very easy to migrate
benkay: everyone forced to more or less play the same way
pankkake: but, at least for now, miners don't really care about pool transaction policies
danielpbarron: they sorta do, or at least, they do when they are also a dev
danielpbarron: i can think of 1 example
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 7500 @ 0.00013209 = 0.9907 BTC [-] {14}
benkay: care to share, danielpbarron ?
danielpbarron: what? which dev is also a miner?
danielpbarron: is that not common knowledge?
benkay: oh, i thought you had an example of someone who cares about txn rules
benkay: and like maybe why and some other context
benkay: high hopes :(
danielpbarron: at the risk of starting the whole argument over again, the context is counterparty / mastercoin and the OP_RETURN controversy
benkay: oh sounds popcorny
benkay: what is this controversy?
danielpbarron: counterparty stores its data in the Blockchain and the devs don't like this
danielpbarron: that's the tl;dr
benkay: what's the controversy over op_return?
pankkake: storage is a cost, and no one's rewarded for storing
danielpbarron: OP_RETURN is a place to store extra data in a transaction
pankkake: that's why transactions should be as small as possible
danielpbarron: ya, what pankkake said
pankkake: I wonder if I can easily make my public nodes stop relaying OP_RETURN :)
danielpbarron: full nodes should get most of the transaction fees, but they get nothing
danielpbarron: anyway my point is, there is controversy over transaction rules, so miners have so influence in that regard
benkay: whoa you can store data in the blockchain without paying?
danielpbarron: benkay: sorta
benkay: do elaborate i'd be much obliged
pankkake: miners get paid, not "storers"
danielpbarron: benkay: you pay, but the payment doesn't go to those actually doing the heavy lifting
benkay: oh
benkay: eh fuck 'em
benkay: blockchain's a nightmare anyways
benkay: miners get paid right?
benkay: that's all i care about.
pankkake: for me, bitcoin is terabytes of bandwith per month - I don't mind as it's almost free, but don't make the madness worse
ozbot: Morgentaler abortion clinic in Fredericton to close - New Brunswick - CBC News
danielpbarron: yeah but they don't need the payment; they don't mine for profit anyway
danielpbarron: hey some good news!
benkay: miners don't mine for profit?
benkay: news to me.
danielpbarron: i believe miners mine for network control
jurov: pankkake meant nonminer nodes
benkay: the state sponsored ones definitely
jurov: i don't mind a terabyte per month,too but 10TB or more... um
danielpbarron: some individuals profit i guess, if they get really cheap electricity and make their own boards
benkay: this is one of those things about bitcoin. staging on the blockchain is just going to get more and more painfully expensive.
benkay: staying*
pankkake: yeah I think I'm capped at 6TB
benkay: either you'll pay for the privilege or you won't.
benkay: end of story.
danielpbarron: benkay: what do you mean "staying on the blockchain?"
Apocalyptic: how so benkay ?
benkay: staying up to date
Apocalyptic: the maximum potential blockchain growth rate is well known
danielpbarron: storage space is trivial
Apocalyptic: thanks for the block size limit
danielpbarron: the issue isn't hard drive space
Apocalyptic: it's just some gigs/year
benkay: we're talking about the mem pool, though, right?
danielpbarron: hard drive space is only an issue to those trying to take a principled stand on not storing content to which they personally object
benkay: txns in flight is the topic, though, correct?
Apocalyptic: <benkay> we're talking about the mem pool, though, right? // you can choose not to query peers for tx data
Apocalyptic: and only get blocks I think
benkay: so do that
danielpbarron: benkay: because OP_RETURN is too small to store counterparty data, they use multi-sig addresses instead, and that uses up memory
benkay: memory where for whom in what part of the process
danielpbarron: full nodes
danielpbarron: full nodes have to keep those addresses in memory as outputs that might get spent in future transactions
benkay: when do they need that? when validating a new block?
danielpbarron: when validating transactions
danielpbarron: full nodes are not miners and miners are not full nodes
Apocalyptic: he knows that
danielpbarron: there might be some overlap
Apocalyptic: but full nodes don't need mempool data for validating blocks
benkay: so take a counterparty transaction
danielpbarron: i might be explaining some technical details incorrectly; i'm not a dev
benkay: has it been confirmed yet?
benkay: let's tell a little story and try to work through this
benkay: start with a counterparty txn. is this thing in flight or has it confirmed?
dexX7: 1. metacoins and the utxo set:, 2. what is way more "avoidable" than multisigs is the creation of multiple unspent outputs "to have free outputs ready" (@ xcp) x_x
danielpbarron: i'm on the side of counterparty if I had to choose, i think the decentralized exchange is a great idea
thestringpuller: danielpbarron: oh boo another glbse investor
danielpbarron: i never used that site
benkay: he's underwriting, thestringpuller
thestringpuller: exchanges will always be centralized things, there can be multiple exchanges
benkay: thestringpuller: ping ping ping ping ping
danielpbarron: i think there is room for both centralized and decentralized
thestringpuller: but each excahnge is centralized as you will always trust the issuer
dexX7: benkay: think of "let's create new transaction types and coins, encode the transaction information and store it on the blockchain as pubkeys in multisig transaction outputs"
thestringpuller: you will always have to trust the issuer*
danielpbarron: i get that, thestringpuller
Apocalyptic: oh "decentralized exchange" idea again ?
Apocalyptic grabs some popcorn
danielpbarron: s/idea/reality/g
thestringpuller: i feel a decentralized exchange would be littered with scams
danielpbarron: just like everywhere else
thestringpuller: so you want an exchange for scams?
danielpbarron: you want to throw the baby out with the bathwater?
benkay: hang on this topic is stupid and boring and you're all stupid and boring for engaging in it
fluffypony: that's actually quite clever
danielpbarron: Bitcoin has enabled scams, so what?
thestringpuller: s.dice was teh closest thing to a scam no mpex...
thestringpuller: every other play exchange has had multiple scams...
danielpbarron: s.dice was a scam?
benkay: i want to know more about these memory requirements imposed by mastercoin
thestringpuller: like the ratio of scam to actual businesses was too damn high
danielpbarron: from what I read, S.DICE was managed very well
danielpbarron: benkay: why mastercoin? counterparty is live and working
benkay: counterparty whatever pedant
benkay: i lose track of all the colored coin implementations
danielpbarron: well, I'm not 100% behind the DEX; I understand the arguments against it, and it's not the end of my world if the devs figure out a way to stop it
kanzure: to be even more pedantic, counterparty isn't a colored coin implementation
kanzure: (don't kill me)
benkay: so you can't possibly be telling me that a full node needs to hold the whole bc in memory to do its job
benkay: is that so?
benkay: <-- does not run nodes
dexX7: the complaint was the amount of unspent outputs/utxo bloat created by those transactions - the argument fails because those unspent outputs are actually spendable and spent frequently
kanzure: the counterparty reference implementation requires a full bitcoin node with -txindex enabled
kanzure: so often this means reindexing the blockchain for nodes that haven't been using -txindex
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11111 @ 0.00096168 = 10.6852 BTC [+]
kanzure: uh i wonder if -txindex is the right parameter. hrm. it's the one about indexing.
kanzure: anywho then the counterparty server sends getrawtransaction messages over rpc to the bitcoin node for every transaction since the burn period began
dexX7: you don't need to hold everything in memory, but there is a database with all unspent outputs. more outputs = delayed lookup
fluffypony: my wife is talking about going to the US at some stage
fluffypony: "we must go to all 50 states. Except Alaska. Alaska isn't going to be nice."
danielpbarron: well i've seen plenty of individuals storing data in other ways, like using the last 4 or 5 decimal places of a balance to encode data
danielpbarron: the US kinda sucks; if you aren't here already, don't come
danielpbarron: not worth the risk of possibly not being allowed to leave
truffles: get items stolen at tsa
danielpbarron: get poisoned with crappy food, drugged water, groped by the "authorities," wealth confiscated because you probably sold drugs to get it
danielpbarron: or you're a terrorist
danielpbarron: honest individuals don't need money; Big Brother feeds them
kakobrekla: ;;ticker
fluffypony: danielpbarron: she meant for holiday, we would never move there
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 398.55, Best ask: 399.0, Bid-ask spread: 0.45000, Last trade: 400.0, 24 hour volume: 27083.22463861, 24 hour low: 398.55, 24 hour high: 446.97, 24 hour vwap: 417.472358929
danielpbarron: fluffypony: i know what you meant; don't do it
danielpbarron: for all of the above reasons
truffles: he'll have a great time let him go
danielpbarron: heh ok; just speaking from my own experience
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 15 @ 0.58002 = 8.7003 BTC [-] {4}
fluffypony: the food is crappy
fluffypony: when I said that on Reddit ages ago I got attacked by apologists
Apocalyptic: dat dive
danielpbarron: there are ways to get non-crappy food but you have to know what you're doing
danielpbarron: and you probably have to avoid some taxes to afford it
fluffypony: danielpbarron: yeah that's what I figured
fluffypony: oh look, welcome to the magical 400.00
danielpbarron: bitcoinaverage says 389
taub: its on
fluffypony: yeah just took a nose dive down
danielpbarron: i guess those peeps who were bugging me to buy the other day are happy now
benkay: no demand :)
benkay: bitcoin's a scam
fluffypony: benkay: I thought it was a ponzi scheme?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27400 @ 0.00096241 = 26.37 BTC [+] {2}
kanzure: i'm making a collection of overly-enthusiastic claims about bitcoin
kanzure: i'm open to suggestions for what content to include
fluffypony: kanzure: this is GOOD news!
kanzure: i want the stuff that will still found funny even if bitcoin does eat up the world
danielpbarron: "If I was Chairman of the U.S. Federal Reserve, the most powerful central bank in the world, I would be buying bitcoin like mad."
danielpbarron: LIKE MAD, YO
ozbot: Patrick Brazeau, suspended senator, arrested in Gatineau - Ottawa - CBC News
kanzure: personally i think all posts should start with "Yo,"
danielpbarron: haha i've probably been on that train, looks like MTA
nubbins`: from law-school dropout to canadian senator to strip club manager
kanzure: what's wrong with running a strip club?
nubbins`: nothing
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17700 @ 0.00096159 = 17.0201 BTC [-]
kanzure: oh i see, i should have asked what's wrong with the senate =)
nubbins`: EVERYTHING
nubbins`: seriously. the senate. highest judicial body in the country. guy gets fired for being a shitbag, and the best job he can scrounge together after that is putting together the weekly schedule at the fuckin Bare Fax
nubbins`: almost makes you think he shouldn't have been appointed to the senate in the first place
danielpbarron: "The banks would be saved because people would be borrowing as much money as possible in order to buy bitcoin." <-- ...
thestringpuller: bet closed
thestringpuller: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 390.0, Best ask: 390.1, Bid-ask spread: 0.10000, Last trade: 390.0, 24 hour volume: 30204.17198800, 24 hour low: 382.7, 24 hour high: 446.97, 24 hour vwap: 413.134967346
kanzure: danielpbarron: this is the sort of hyper-fanatacism that i am seeking
danielpbarron: one-of-a-kind stupidity there
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 385.52, Best ask: 389.82, Bid-ask spread: 4.30000, Last trade: 385.51, 24 hour volume: 30635.18837803, 24 hour low: 382.7, 24 hour high: 446.97, 24 hour vwap: 412.975167632
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 101 @ 0.05454506 = 5.5091 BTC [-] {3}
ThickAsThieves: ;;market buy 10000
gribble: Bitstamp | A market order to buy 10000 bitcoins right now would take 4496710.4412 USD and would take the last price up to 520.0000 USD, resulting in an average price of 449.6710 USD/BTC. | Data vintage: 232.9129 seconds
ThickAsThieves: ;;market buy 25000
gribble: Bitstamp | This order would exceed the size of the order book. You would buy 24098.515 bitcoins, for a total of 17899251.1321 USD and take the price to 99999.9900. | Data vintage: 0.0374 seconds
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 3.14857344 BTC to 7`663 shares, 41088 satoshi per share
ThickAsThieves: ;;market buy 15000
gribble: Bitstamp | A market order to buy 15000 bitcoins right now would take 7503392.7506 USD and would take the last price up to 655.6800 USD, resulting in an average price of 500.2262 USD/BTC. | Data vintage: 18.2787 seconds
ThickAsThieves: ;;market buy 20000
gribble: Bitstamp | A market order to buy 20000 bitcoins right now would take 11195529.8825 USD and would take the last price up to 849.9800 USD, resulting in an average price of 559.7765 USD/BTC. | Data vintage: 25.9547 seconds
ThickAsThieves: ;;market buy 22500
gribble: Bitstamp | A market order to buy 22500 bitcoins right now would take 13607783.7198 USD and would take the last price up to 1075.0000 USD, resulting in an average price of 604.7904 USD/BTC. | Data vintage: 45.7563 seconds
ThickAsThieves: ;;market buy 23500
gribble: Bitstamp | A market order to buy 23500 bitcoins right now would take 14785226.8837 USD and would take the last price up to 1299.9800 USD, resulting in an average price of 629.1586 USD/BTC. | Data vintage: 59.7878 seconds
ThickAsThieves: so about 24k coins on the market
ozbot: Weak Chinese Trade Data Cloud Growth Hopes -
dvsdude: Stephen Colbert will succeed David Letterman as host of 'The Late Show'
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12700 @ 0.00096323 = 12.233 BTC [+] {2}
ThickAsThieves: that works
ThickAsThieves: letterman is boring as shit
ThickAsThieves: too bad theyll suck the sould out of colbert
benkay: colbert and stewart's shows are utterly inane
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.05372855 = 0.3761 BTC [-] {3}
MisterE: ;;ticker --market all
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 394.01, vol: 32951.86032124 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 390.1, vol: 22796.91906 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 392.749, vol: 30240.18749975 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 410.01, vol: 129.0017673 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 393.274998, vol: 7320.90170000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 404.94534, vol: 10.79592654 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 391.7544, vol: 226.91088511 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEEQ] 1817 @ 0.00007206 = 0.1309 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.0520112 = 0.156 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0520112 = 0.104 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0520112 = 0.104 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: !t h neobeeq
assbot: [HAVELOCK:NEOBEEQ] 1D: 0.00006400 / 9.041E-5 / 0.00013699 (62600 shares, 5.65942599 BTC), 7D: 0.00000001 / 0.00014715 / 0.00045000 (549731 shares, 80.89403744 BTC), 30D: 0.00000001 / 0.0012483 / 0.00439999 (873212 shares, 1090.03105206 BTC)
benkay: !t h rent
assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00750000 / 0.0075 / 0.00750000 (100 shares, 0.75000000 BTC), 7D: 0.00750000 / 0.0075 / 0.00750000 (2267 shares, 17.00250000 BTC), 30D: 0.00510111 / 0.00700671 / 0.00750000 (27302 shares, 191.29708437 BTC)
benkay: how long does this one go for?
pLambert: until the end of the month, I think
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.052011 = 0.156 BTC [-]
benkay: ;;cal 17.00250000/2267
gribble: Error: "cal" is not a valid command.
benkay: ;;calc 17.00250000/2267
gribble: 0.0075
keonne: keonne: #bitcoin-assets is like a second job << first job for most people here. i see that, at least im honest, maybe one day i will be able to afford the trading platform fee and have my mind warped enough to warrant a spot in the full time club
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40321 @ 0.00095724 = 38.5969 BTC [-] {4}
keonne: er meant to tab mircea
nubbins`: what in the fuck is a job
keonne: honestly my job doesnt feel like a job, so i guess im lucky there
keonne: also h8 at nubbins`
nubbins`: don't h8, m8
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1136 @ 0.00014711 = 0.1671 BTC [+]
keonne: since in my mind hes lounging in a pool flush with btc and pussy in the virgin islands
keonne: dont ruin the image, i want to be you
truffles: haha
truffles: cept he lives in frozen canada :D
keonne: oh dear
keonne: but aye on the pools of btc and pussy
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 864 @ 0.00014984 = 0.1295 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 250 @ 0.00078399 = 0.196 BTC [+] {2}
truffles: pussy is so overrated anus is where its at
dignork: mircea_popescu, it's just a sensible default, which can be changed via weechat.look.paste_max_lines, same idea is implemented in some unixes by aliasing 'rm' to 'rm -i', just a default
nubbins`: it's too cold for backyard pools here
keonne: does anyone use the blockchain android wallet
nubbins`: android is for poor people
keonne: lol
truffles: dam i missed that memo
benkay: phones are for wage slaves
fluffypony: nubbins`: so you're a Windows Phone user, then?
ozbot: 'Android is for poor people'
keonne: lol such helpful
ozbot: Android Is Popular Because It's Cheap, Not Because It's Good
keonne: gizmodo is popular because it's cheap, not because it's good
ozbot: Android handsets a poor man's iPhone, research claims | News | PC Pro
ozbot: Rich People Like iPhones, Poor People Like Android – The Interrobang
fluffypony: gizmodo is popular? I stopped reading there a long time ago
truffles: so Iphones are popular cuz theyre shiny?
keonne: how do you have all these on hand nubbins`
benkay: such science
nubbins`: i don't
nubbins`: i just googled "android is for poor people"
keonne: lol
keonne: this is why you get all the pussy and btc
keonne: and im a simple wage slave
nubbins`: not really
nubbins`: smartphones are for fucking losers in general
keonne: asciilifeform: what was the name of that soviet cartoon you mentioned earlier
truffles: nubbins` what do u use?
nubbins`: IPHONE
nubbins`: i mean, iphone
keonne: iPhone
truffles: oh ok
truffles: im surprised cuz i read they dont withstand cold temps
fluffypony: nubbins`: want a wooden case for it? we have a bunch as gifts, but most of our customers are Android users, and the guy that makes them doesn't make Android cases
nubbins`: shrug. i keep my phone in my pocket, not my mailbox
nubbins`: fluffypony, i don't use cases, but tyvm
keonne: cases are for poor people according to nubbins`
nubbins`: now you're putting words in my mouth
nubbins`: cases are for clumsy people
keonne: guilty
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [7C] 20 @ 0.00759849 = 0.152 BTC [+] {2}
keonne: but i also did make up a life story for you
nubbins`: if you drop your $500 phone so often that you need to put it in a case, maybe you shouldn't have one
truffles: im pretty rough i need a case
keonne: my phone was $200
jurov: orly? mahogany smartphone box?
nubbins`: consider the statement suitably modified
keonne: still stands
truffles: 200 sounds so modest dam!
nubbins`: keonne: but was it subsidized?
keonne: nexus 5
keonne: no
nubbins` claps
keonne: unlocked off contract
keonne: no, subsidized phones are for poor people
keonne: and for people who will probably be perpetually poor
ozbot: 40+ Beautiful iPhone 4 and iPhone 4S Cases for Your Smartphone
keonne: because it's a really bad deal
nubbins`: no doubt you've got some math to back that up
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11150 @ 0.00096327 = 10.7405 BTC [+]
fluffypony: those are the cases we have
fluffypony: wood is pretty
nubbins`: it is indeed
keonne: thats nice fluffypony
nubbins`: engraving kinda ruins it
truffles: ppl actually back things up with scientific data itc? pfff
fluffypony: nubbins`: hush
nubbins`: might as well put a coca-cola logo on there
nubbins`: truffles: who said anything about scientific? napkin scribbles would do
truffles: might as well not
nubbins`: suppose you save $500 by getting a subsidy. at the end of your two-year contract, you own your phone
truffles: that baseball case looks cute
keonne: well lets see, $500 phone you get for $250 because you sign a 2 year contract paying ~60-80 a month. 
nubbins`: or you spend the extra $500, and two years later, you own your phone
nubbins`: what's the difference?
keonne: the difference is poor people shouldnt eb buying 500 dollar phones
nubbins`: well, that certainly answers a different question
nubbins`: how about the one i asked :D
truffles: im gonna aim for that 200 next phone!
keonne: sorry i keep going in and out of cell signal
nubbins`: shoulda bought an iphone i guess
keonne: or not be on a train going into tunnels
nubbins`: sure
nubbins`: either way.
nubbins`: explain to me how buying the phone outright is a better deal in the long run
keonne: depends on the price of the phone
nubbins`: let's say a new iphone
jurov: nubbins`: depends on if you're poor :DDDDD
nubbins`: $700 straight-up or $200 on a two-year contract
keonne: how much are those?
keonne: ah ok
keonne: thats insane..... first of all
daybyter: got my new smartphone today.
keonne: how much is the contract per month?
daybyter: pomp w88 Euro 105,- plus shipping.
TomServo: nubbins`: I think it depends on how much you value being able to switch carriers on a whim.
nubbins`: TomServo: $0
keonne: i mean i havent had a contract in 3 years
nubbins`: keonne: well, that depends heavily on how good you are at bargaining
keonne: and i have unlimited 4g data in both the US and Europe
TomServo: nubbins`: I'm just saying, that is what makes it a "better deal" to some people.
nubbins`: which (sorry to ruin the surprise) was the crux of my argument
keonne: for £15 pay as you go a month
nubbins`: canada is relatively expensive for cell service
nubbins`: i pay, i think, $50/mo
keonne: its all highly situational
keonne: i remmeber not even being able to get a sim card in canada
keonne: without a canadian ID
nubbins`: all different now, LTE nationwide
nubbins`: ah, without an id
nubbins`: not sure about that
keonne: in UK i go to the corner shop
keonne: and i can buyt as many sim cards as I want for£1 each
nubbins`: neat
nubbins`: TomServo: fair enough, but worth an extra $500?
daybyter: any android coders here, who also do java?
nubbins`: ostensibly you're changing providers to get a better rate
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [7C] 20 @ 0.007696 = 0.1539 BTC [+] {2}
nubbins`: to make it worth $500, you'd need to save ~$21/mo by switching providers
nubbins`: it could be argued that you just picked the wrong provider to start with
keonne: daybyter: not being snarky but dont all android devs have to know java? i thought that was part of the deal.
fluffypony: keonne: I was about to say the same thing
daybyter: I mean android and desktop-java.
fluffypony: say/ask
fluffypony: ah ok
daybyter: I have a lib that should run on desktop and android.
daybyter: no I wonder how to compile it best.
daybyter: add android.jar to the required libs?
daybyter: use conditional compiling?
bounce: write it for z-machine
daybyter: I used antenna back in the days of j2me projects.
nubbins`: i googled everything back in the days of writing code ;D
nubbins`: why reinvent the wheel!
daybyter: google had no good solution available?
daybyter: maybe I'm just the first one who had this idea? :-)
nubbins`: if we were fencing, i'd say touche
keonne: bloody tunnels
truffles: is that code for sex?
nubbins`: HEH.
keonne: haha
fluffypony: yay! sex!
nubbins`: i want to enter your bloody tunnel
nubbins`: i should try this on my wife when she gets home
truffles: she likes red so go for it
keonne: let us know how that goes
nubbins`: my money is on a chuckle
keonne: gents i am off
keonne: as always its been a pleasure
daybyter: cul!
nubbins`: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 401.95, Best ask: 402.95, Bid-ask spread: 1.00000, Last trade: 401.95, 24 hour volume: 36500.33354409, 24 hour low: 382.7, 24 hour high: 446.97, 24 hour vwap: 409.175624476
nubbins`: oddly, no suicide hotline phone number on reddit
keonne: god damn, this is a good article. I really want to see this movie even more now.
ozbot: Filantropica pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
fluffypony: keonne: you said you were off!
keonne: i know
keonne: train is a bit delayed
fluffypony: ah ok
daybyter: keonne: you're an android coder?
keonne: not at all daybyter
daybyter: you're an android designer?
keonne: The only coding I do is a very hobbyist hack job at python
keonne: im a designer in general, focusing on UI, and I do a lot of android apps
daybyter: oh...ok...
nubbins`: it'll be 14 months on sunday since i gave up programming
daybyter: hmmh...that sounds interesting!
daybyter: I want to create an android app and look for help with the UI.
keonne: current i am redoing the blockchain android wallet, which is why i as asking earlier if anyone used it
daybyter: interested in a trading app?
fluffypony: nubbins`: how are you handling it?
keonne: and if they wanted to bitch at me their least favourite things
keonne: nubbins`: congrats :)
nubbins`: fluffypony, never been happier
mike_c: eulorum is dead. long live eulorum.
mike_c: new server, new install
mike_c: copied shit over
nubbins` high fives mike
daybyter: I write java trading code.
mike_c: nubbins, i copied over your password hash so you should be able to login
daybyter: and currently port some stuff to android.
nubbins`: i was briefly excited when i saw the "recent changes" page until i took a closer look :D
nubbins`: tyvm
nubbins`: keonne: thanks :D
daybyter: looking for someone to make a pretty app.
benkay`: what's your budget?
benkay`: daybyter: what's your budget?
daybyter: I thought about a collab.
daybyter: maybe share the profit, if the app could be sold.
keonne: daybyter: sorry man, i really dont have the time
benkay`: what's the app?
keonne: plus you would hate working with me
daybyter: tradebot
daybyter: maybe manual trading, but I wanted to start as simple as possible.
benkay`: and you don't have the budget to pay for its production?
daybyter: I already got most of the stuff running on desktop.
keonne: i'm incredibly anal when it comes to design, and more engineers go crazy working with me
keonne: plus im expensive
mircea_popescu: dignork i know i know, jus' being an hardass spuriously.
daybyter: but I want to use a strategy that is a lot more simple.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves dvsdude benkay` what the shit, letterman was supposed to be a comic neh ? colbert is now funny ?
benkay`: colbert's never been funny.
daybyter: benkay`: mail me, if you are interested.
daybyter: my mail is in almost all my sources:
thestringpuller: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 401.99, Best ask: 402.0, Bid-ask spread: 0.01000, Last trade: 401.99, 24 hour volume: 36649.25150965, 24 hour low: 382.7, 24 hour high: 446.97, 24 hour vwap: 408.857388372
keonne: ok now im leaving for real
nubbins`: educating -otc on the perils of referring to cash-in-mail as CIM
benkay`: daybyter: not really interested.
daybyter: thanks for your answer.
truff1es: awww
nubbins`: "willing to do CIM" etc
nubbins`: my sides
mircea_popescu: mike_c yeah it wasn't working b4 was it ?
mike_c: it was basically under assault from spam bots
mike_c: i didn't realize what a honeypot mediawiki is.
nubbins`: lots of pages about buying discount shoes
mircea_popescu: nubbins` what perils be those ?
mike_c: but the new cat photos captcha should prevent that.
nubbins`: mircea_popescu basically just drawing snickers from dirtbags like me
nubbins`: ;;ud cim
gribble: | Upload a picture of Cim. 2. cim. Cum In Mouth. Meaning ejaculation of the man's sperm into anothers mouth. This may or may not be followed by the swallowing ...
ozbot: Urban Dictionary: cim
nubbins`: oddly, nobody looking for just COF
mircea_popescu: cash on forehead ?
nubbins`: ;;ud cof
gribble: | cof. Cum On Face - Sexual act often used when describing services offered by an escort. The escort I saw last night provided cof in addition to bbbj and fs.
ozbot: Urban Dictionary: C.O.F.
nubbins`: close enough ;D
benkay`: coin on, fellow.
mircea_popescu: is bbbj like a blowjob with three girls ?
truff1es: why wouldnt u think doods
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 398.52, Best ask: 401.75, Bid-ask spread: 3.23000, Last trade: 398.46, 24 hour volume: 36696.67930975, 24 hour low: 382.7, 24 hour high: 446.97, 24 hour vwap: 408.824895153
benkay`: 450 -> 398
benkay`: "why is it crashing?"
mircea_popescu: "because the exchanges are less and less relevant" ?
asciilifeform: we might be witnessing a bifurcation a la 'bezzle dollar'
asciilifeform: (or this happened ages ago, and i'm just the last one to notice)
mircea_popescu: they've painted themselves in a corner, basically. if all you wanna do is buy 20 bucks wortha btc to "have some", no way in fuck do you go through all the caudine forkland of "send us a pic with you holding a seal". odds are you don't even have a phone.
benkay`: there is a bit of a discount for magical bitcoins
mircea_popescu: if you want 20k worth of btc, no fucking way you'll take that level of service. just find an escort that does COF CIM and BTC
mircea_popescu: so i guess the scammers get a whole new market now.
asciilifeform: at this point, even the most threadbare engineer is probably just buying coin from his coworkers
fluffypony: I have a lot of people I know that prefer to buy from me instead of buying on the local exchange
fluffypony: even though I keep telling them to
fluffypony: because it's annoying
mircea_popescu: fuck the local exchange.
mircea_popescu: the future belongs to otc trades of btc.
mircea_popescu: the various fiat jurisdictions had ~5 years to get their shit together and suck our cock enough to acquire this revenue stream.
mircea_popescu: they have failed.
asciilifeform: wonder at what point exchanges will survive primarily on payola from whoever they are stoolies for, rather than commissions
mircea_popescu: no btc/fiat exchangesd for them. herp.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: we have a community here of < 500 people actively interested in Bitcoin, not just peripherally
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform at the point of 2014.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony cool.
fluffypony: it's tiny
mircea_popescu: depends who they are.
mircea_popescu: 500 is too many for spartans.
fluffypony: unfortunately the majority of them are kinda-nerdy-oh-look-here-I-can-get-rich
dignork: mircea_popescu, you said before that bitcoin-otc is irrelevant
truff1es: $$$$
fluffypony: dollah dollah billz, ya'll
bounce: otc is fun and fluffy and lovable and full of scammers
truff1es: ppl can change their minds
mircea_popescu: dignork otc as a concept. "over the counter"
mircea_popescu: as opposed to "in an 'organised' ie regulated market"
dignork: mircea_popescu, sure, but so far bitcoin-otc based on WOT is the closest to OTC that I've seen so far
mircea_popescu: bitcoin-otc was last i checked run mostly by dorks, and so consequently populated mostly by dorks
fluffypony: hah hah - this was posted re: the < $400 slump:
mircea_popescu: dignork i dunno, imo all of irc and a lot more is otc in this sense.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony sure, except we've seen it three times already : the people who are butthurt during upswings because they were left out still don't buy during downswings because now it's more like "Haha! it's dead!"
mircea_popescu: mental issuez
fluffypony: that is VERY true
fluffypony: every time it's tanked I've bought on the downswing
ozbot: BitBet - Bitcoin to drop under $400 before June
mircea_popescu: this is a sad puppy
fluffypony: what is annoying is when the media talks about Bitcoin's "surprising resiliance despite being declared dead"
fluffypony: like wtf
fluffypony: just because someone says its dead doesn't automagically make it so
ozbot: BitBet - Bitcoin to drop under $400 before June
benkay: they imagine their imagination matters, fluffypony .
mjr_: what up everyone
benkay: oh look who it is
mjr_: hahaha
benkay: mr constantly dropping connections
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 546 @ 0.00075904 = 0.4144 BTC [-] {5}
mjr_: i know :(
benkay: still going to burning man with the shreminal?
mjr_: not sure...
benkay: 2 things i'm bummed about missing this year
mircea_popescu: fluffypony well yeah, it's sort-of like putin's surprising resilience in spite of being declared crazy.
mjr_: i was supposed to go hang out with him while i was in nyc
benkay: bm and mp
mircea_popescu: teh media has serious issues coming to some sort of representation of its own irrelevance.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: or Robert Mugabe's surprising resilience despite him probably being dead
mjr_: am I safe in assuming that everyone here thinks trying to change the bitcoin symbol is stupid and a waste of time?
mircea_popescu: mjr_ dude wtf was with all those parts.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 454 @ 0.00075 = 0.3405 BTC [-]
mjr_: when was that? I'm not sure if my laptop was even open...
kakobrekla: mircea_popescu ocd
benkay: i advocate we abandon the btc symbol all together and just use a capital b
benkay: 200B
mjr_: what up kakobrekla
mjr_: basically i think i slam dunked the argument against symbol change
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
mjr_: phones can currently type the bitcoin symbol...i don't even know how you would convince apple or motorola to add a keyboard
mjr_: or what keyboard it should be under
mircea_popescu: benkay i never used no dumbass symbol.
kakobrekla: you comming to ro or what?
benkay: bitcoin advocacy, mjr_ ?
mjr_: but the amount of changes that using the proposed symbol would cost dwarf any benefit
benkay: no symbol.
fluffypony: benkay: what about a backwards Euro symbol, then it looks kinda like a monkey butt
mjr_: i have to try and get people to shut the fuck up and open their eyes and see how the world works
benkay: no man it's a waste of time
benkay: fuck retards get paper
mjr_: good point
mircea_popescu: how about we just use $
mircea_popescu: not like the usd will survive anyway.
bounce: and let people think it's the new USD?
mircea_popescu: and afair they stole it off the mexicans on the same grounds.
bounce: USB, the new USD
benkay: too early
mjr_: well...there are 30 other countries using $
mjr_: many more using "dollar"
mircea_popescu: bounce no moar like BD, the new USD
mircea_popescu: mjr_ exactly. argentina prices everything in "dollars", there's 3 of them
mircea_popescu: at least.
mjr_: which was my point...zeroblock told me on twitter "amateur hour is over"...i was like so canada, australia, mexico, etc are still in amateur hour...
mjr_: in the real world, symbols are mapped onto many currencies
mircea_popescu: who is zeroblock and what makes him think he can talk about amateur hour lol
mjr_: hahahaha
mircea_popescu: mp, lord of the fundamental questions.
mjr_: just part of the group of people who think that they understand the standards committees and how the real world works
mjr_: similar to the whole "XBT" thing
mjr_: which is the same don't pick a name and then ISO standardizes
mircea_popescu: we should have a drama department
mjr_: ISO will tell you what the official name is, and then you adopt it
mircea_popescu: like every highschool.
mjr_: yep
mircea_popescu: then the fat chicks can go and pretend like they're acting there after school
mjr_: its good to be chatting, and btw, it is very fun seeing people talk about you when you are not htere
mjr_: its nice
mjr_: to see yourself in the mirror
mircea_popescu: well they were talking about how much you piss them off
mjr_: and I think I will start blogging more
mjr_: hehehe
mjr_: maybe i didn't read that far down
mjr_: why not just ignore me?
benkay: ey lookit what princessnell's been up to:
mjr_: as in the IRC command, not attention wise
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 72651 @ 0.00096485 = 70.0973 BTC [+] {5}
mircea_popescu: not sure.
mircea_popescu: benkay chick writing a paper about us ?!
benkay: oh indeed.
benkay: oh it's great
mircea_popescu: pastebin that shit
bounce: "why not just ignore all the spam in your inbox?" "why not just ignore that DDoS coming in?" -- such sensible questions.
mircea_popescu: bounce he's new.
benkay: it has footnotes and stuff that won't survive so well
bounce: shh. lemme admire the sensibility a bit more.
ozbot: Bitcoin Financial Regulation: Securities, Derivatives, Prediction Markets, & Gambling by Jerry Brit
fluffypony: also known as BFR:SDPMG
bounce: SSRN, wasn't that a class of antidepressants?
akstunt600: Maybe bitcoin really needs to get cracked down on for it to thrive the way we want
akstunt600: the gen y kids the ones that need the most arent even using it yet really
akstunt600: bounce, tHAT WAS MY FIRST THOUGHT
akstunt600: oops caps
danielpbarron: bitcoin doesn't get "cracked down on;" it does the cracking
mircea_popescu: bounce nah a social studies bs
akstunt600: hhahaha
mircea_popescu: akstunt600 an' who might you be ?
bounce: "wordy stuff that makes you need antidepressants", right ho.
akstunt600: Just a fellow bitcoin persons
benkay: Accordingly, to the extent a contract delivers bitcoins at a date after the sale
benkay: (and not their cash equivalent), and is being used by a party to manage price
benkay: risk, it would likely be considered a forward and be excluded from the
benkay: CEA.
benkay: bold claim.
fluffypony: I don't see any <em> tags?
benkay: i'd like to meet the person who's willing to test that 'likely' in the states, or finance the establishment of caselaw.
benkay: options on pg 20
mircea_popescu: ;;google pg 20
gribble: USS Monocacy (PG-20) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>; Pignose PG-20 PG-20 a/c powered amplifier: Musical ...: <>; Part# PG-20-160Q: <>
benkay: "bitcoinica valued expediency and experimentation over postponement and risk-aversion"
benkay: gotta read more of this later
benkay: vms need hacking
mircea_popescu: oh really ? and i thought it simply valued pretense and pretending over competence or obeying your betters.
mircea_popescu: poor phantomcircuit still imagines his brain works, i wager.
mircea_popescu: pretty cool.
goonsamchi: best to have diverse opinions, instead of a nation of sheep all taking the scientists' word for it, never considering the possibility that someone could be wrong
chetty: most people are wrong,most of the time
mircea_popescu: goonsamchi it's not a good idea to have "opinions" on matters you have not the authority to have opinions on.
bounce mentions david nutt
mircea_popescu: last thing we need is every fuckwit social sciences major having opinions about how silicon valley start-ups should be run and so forth
ozbot: Why medical studies often go wrong | CTV News
ozbot: Lies, Damned Lies, and Medical Science - David H. Freedman - The Atlantic
fluffypony: goonsamchi: so you'd prefer they take their medical advice from a TV personality?
goonsamchi: no, i think people should be allowed to control their own lives
goonsamchi: i believe in individual liberty and the right for people to be wrong
mircea_popescu: goonsamchi there's a difference between controlling your own life and having opinions tho.
goonsamchi: yes, and people should have both
mircea_popescu: nobody is disputing the woman's right to be as fucking wrong as she possibly can get away with.
truff1es: prob diff in murrca than rest of world
mircea_popescu: but i am outright denying her the right to air dumbassery under the guise that "she's entitled to an opinion"
mircea_popescu: she is not.
goonsamchi: not allowing people to be incorrect just leads to a monoculture of sheep who all think the same. even if they're right, there's still a lack of diversity
mircea_popescu: now how do you know that ?
truff1es: thats what this room would become haha
mircea_popescu: seems to me allowing fuckwits to have "opinions" has turned the us of a into a monoculture of sheep who all think the same.
mircea_popescu: had these same fuckwits been beaten to shit for daring to open their mouths when their teachers were speaking,
mircea_popescu: we'd perhaps have had something like 58 goethes coming out of there, this year alone.
mircea_popescu: at least if historical data is anything to go by.
fluffypony: goonsamchi: where do you draw the line? if a wildly popular personality says that everyone should kill themselves, and then a bunch of people do, should the person who expressed their "opinion" be entitled to it?
truff1es: beat some sense into them, thats it!
mircea_popescu: fluffypony definitely.
mircea_popescu: whoa this is going to be a good argument, i disagree with everyone.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: population control?
goonsamchi: you should be allowed to do anything you want unless it directly infringes on the rights of others.
mircea_popescu: no, but the discussion is metaphisics, and being listened to qualifies him to speak./
mircea_popescu: goonsamchi so your eating infringes on the rights of others, stop eating.
chetty: well there is a difference between having an opinon, and expressing it
goonsamchi: it does not.
mircea_popescu: how convenient.
mircea_popescu: of course it does. fucking world is constructed so your existence is built out of the death of your siblings.
mircea_popescu: thats how things work.
fluffypony: goonsamchi: there are starving people in Africa that would disagree
mircea_popescu: this is nothing less than the point of existence : for you to drive lesser versions out of existence, or for them to drive oyu.
goonsamchi: lol. my not eating would not affect the people in africa
mircea_popescu: how convenient #2.
benkay: mircea_popescu: the teachers'd need to be worth attending to.
mircea_popescu: benkay sure.
mircea_popescu: benkay im sure all of goethe's teachers were all supercool and worthy dudes.
mircea_popescu: not according to him, but what the fuck does he know.
chetty: you would listen to a 'teacher' that wasn't worth it?
mircea_popescu: problem is how the fuck would you distinguish.
mircea_popescu: idiots on the forum also think they know better. the reason they think so is because they don't know what they don't know
mircea_popescu: and on the basis of what they know, aka 0, they're right.
chetty: the best ones are the scariest!
fluffypony: but you can't even quantify "stuff you don't know"
truff1es: goonsamchi u make good points, id like to read more ur views on this
mircea_popescu: exactly.
chetty: if it hurts, you are learning something
truff1es: just wait til the sillyness washes away
thestringpuller: chetty if you start doing things right and realize you were once wrong you are also learning things :)
chetty: thestringpuller, and that hurts too
thestringpuller: most people seem to do things wrong, get told so, ignor as MP points out, then they run head first into concrete and complain about how they have brain damage
truff1es: told by whom?
fluffypony: although making mistakes *and learning from them* should be encouraged, no?
thestringpuller: you shouldn't make mistakes with other peoples money
thestringpuller: fucking use testnet
fluffypony: oh I agree with that
fluffypony: I was talking in generalisations
thestringpuller: no experimenting wiht production services, fucking get managers and shit. perhaps it's about time for another tally of the BTC losses due to scams and icompetence
chetty: fluffypony, that is I think, the definition of learning
mircea_popescu: fluffypony making mistakes should be encouraged in a narrow field : that where we don't know what the mistakes are. in the fields where we already know, they should not be.
chetty: bitcoins don't get lost (mostly) just transfered
mircea_popescu: such as, putting your hand in the flame may in principle do all sorts of cool things, like charge your phone battery
mircea_popescu: but it won't. so don't learn from fucking experience.
fluffypony: yeah I use the "stove is hot" analogy often
fluffypony: but you end up with a burnt hand afterwards
truff1es: if u were tough enough it wouldnt matter!
mircea_popescu: <truff1es> just wait til the sillyness washes away << funny how on the spot this guy is. since forever the strategy of the mentally defective has been, just wait until the cool people get exhausted, and try to rebuild socialism then!
truff1es: says the person who wants to beat people to submission
mircea_popescu: the epic resilience of stupidity.
fluffypony: I think testnet is an under-utilised feature
robwhiz22: Good evening.
mircea_popescu: the usg moving into cattle rustling
robwhiz22: Hi, mircea_popescu
chetty: shades of Waco??
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 38 @ 0.05195871 = 1.9744 BTC [-] {11}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 88 @ 0.05036279 = 4.4319 BTC [-] {6}
robwhiz22: You kind of disappeared the other day. I'm hoping you had a chance to read what I'd written you earlier. If so could you tell me a decision please?
robwhiz22: If you need any more information, feel free to ask.
fluffypony: robwhiz22: you never emailed me:(
fluffypony feels left out
TomServo: robwhiz22: You're the "I can fix the Cardano" guy right?
fluffypony: TomServo: yes
asciilifeform: 'fix' in the 'veterinary' sense of the word.
fluffypony: for the low, low price of 10 BTC
fluffypony: monthly
fluffypony: with interest
TomServo: Sorry, I should've also put fix in quotes.
ozbot: Anonymous derpage pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
bounce spots a developing tvtropes addiction
mircea_popescu: bounce no cause i was addicted muchly afore.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: gum chewing definition of “acultural” << term 'nekulturny' actually pops up in english texts on occasion. because it applies.
mircea_popescu: wow it does huh
jurov: really?
mircea_popescu: ty, adding to my bag.
mircea_popescu: i'd never have guessed.
jurov: ;;ud nekulturny
gribble: | ... chav, or naco. Ivan, you nekulturny bastard, don't pick your nose in public! by LN_Sac September 07, 2008. 57 9. Mugs & shirts Buy “nekulturny” mugs & shirts  ...
ozbot: Urban Dictionary: nekulturny
Apocalyptic: sounds like a slovak word
asciilifeform: probably exists in all slavic languages
BingoBoingo: ;;tslb
gribble: Time since last block: 24 minutes and 57 seconds
fluffypony: holy shit
jurov: from my cursory research it looks it's much more insulting in russian
ozbot: Americas overtake Africa as region with most murders | World news |
asciilifeform: basic soviet meaning, a fellow who's had no truck with human cultural achievements - literature, physics, philosophy, whatever
fluffypony: we're not so bad here!
asciilifeform: but also for folks with no manners
Apocalyptic: ^ that's the meaning that comes to mind first to me
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "a particular flavour of inhumanity"
asciilifeform: read 'savage brute'
mircea_popescu: fluffypony is that raw total or per capita ?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: looks like it's per capita
fluffypony: they do it on a "murders per 100k people" basis
asciilifeform: in some places, savage brute is someone who picks his nose - in others, one who never heard of differential equations.
asciilifeform: all depends on context.
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu ...
mircea_popescu: fluffypony wow.
bounce: the student club had a rule that you couldn't actually lie. ie answers must be truthful. but you could refuse to answer on grounds of the question being too direct. add in some rules that made buying the entire bar population beers both very easy to do and hard to figure out for the barman... well, it's a student club, whaddaya expect?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: yeah, I was quite surprised, the ex-pats have beaten the "murder rate in South Africa is the highest in the world" speech into everyone's heads we're starting to believe it ourselves
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 15 @ 0.57547032 = 8.6321 BTC [-] {7}
mircea_popescu: fluffypony but wait, you meant all of africa vs north, south and central america ?
bounce: compared to the conspiring, deceit, backstabbing, betrayal, "white" lieing, bald faced lieing, and all that, happening among the most cultured of any population, traditionally the aristocrats and like court dwellers, that's outright friendly and truthful.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: I'm talking specifically about South Africa - our murder rate is mentioned in the article, ~30 per 100k vs Honduras at ~90 per 100k
mircea_popescu: bounce aristocrats and courtiers don't map.
fluffypony: s/30/31
mircea_popescu: it's like saying smart people and web developers.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony what if you only count white people ?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: significantly lower
mircea_popescu: well then okay.
twizt: lol
mircea_popescu: i had bought the same arguments, omg sa is terrible.
fluffypony: we're a small part of the population (relatively), and a lot of the murders are gang related
fluffypony: for eg. Cape Town now has a higher murder rate than Johannesburg
fluffypony: but something ridiculous like 80% of the murders occur in Lavender Hill
fluffypony: which is gang warfare territory in the Cape Flats
fluffypony: that even policeman don't go into
fluffypony: much less white people
bounce: not true. any high concentration of power without proper management tends to bring lots of little kingdoms, warring each other. I'm told the pettiest squabbles can be found in academia.
mircea_popescu: bounce wait, what specifically isn't true ?
fluffypony: bounce: are we still talking about murder rates?
bounce: well, what did you mean with "don't map"?
mircea_popescu: lots of little kingdoms don't necessarily war each other, and moreover the wars of little kingdoms are not at all like the wars of national-socialist statal machines,
mircea_popescu: the sort that opposed the french and the germans, or the germans and the russians, or the french and the russians
mircea_popescu: bounce i meant aristocrats and courtiers are two mostly distinct things.
mircea_popescu: in general one can't be both. whenever aristocrats were forced to be courtiers historically, they lost their aristocracy, and the state collapsed
mircea_popescu: (seen both in china and in france, quite identical)
bounce: both are at the top of the societal pile, if in slightly different senses.
mircea_popescu: this does not make much of a similarity.
mircea_popescu: the top of a cake and the top of an oil tank aren't similar on grounds of topness.
bounce: but the cake is a lie.
bounce: anyhow, I'll gladly concede this since my interest is in a different point.
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, I am not available for chatting much longer tonight.
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, did you 1) find my proposal among your emails now? 2) do you have an answer? I submitted it with the request that you review and answer within three business days, which I thought was reasonable.
thestringpuller: ;;gettrust robwhiz22
asciilifeform: robwhiz22 is 'elusive joe'
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user robwhiz22: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: | WoT data: | Rated since: never
mircea_popescu: well... which point ?
asciilifeform: 'The "Elusive Joe" (Russian: Неуловимый Джо) has become an ironic nickname in Russia for various difficult-to-find persons (not necessarily unimportant ones). It is suggested that the nickname and the joke originated from a 1923 satirical novel An Elusive Enemy. American Novel by Mikhail Kozyrev (ru:Козырев, Михаил Яковлевич) which contained a funny song about a Joe who was e
asciilifeform: lusive because no one needed him.'
thestringpuller: lolololololololol
mircea_popescu: course it's more like elusive djo in russian
bounce: dose roossians
asciilifeform: naturally
asciilifeform: i used to think that 'elusive joe' is an american expression
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, the whole proposal - I can email again if you have trouble fining the previous emails. There 2 I think, of which you answered the second one inviting me here, and one follow-up one.
mircea_popescu: i do't think american expressions are allowed to contain words such as elusive
asciilifeform: basic idea, desperado who isn't wanted for anything but thinks he's 'hot on the run'
bounce: robwhiz22: the best way for you to stop running around in circles is stop running around in circles. drop the text in a pastebin and share. you have permission to do this already.
fluffypony: robwhiz22: I think you're on /ignore, he was talking to bounce
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform romanian canonical equivalent is "tu crezi ca te cauta militia pe messenger". ie, you think the militsya is pursuing you through im.
mircea_popescu: (joke beingthat the militsya was an obsolete institution, and famously the people it employed could not write)
robwhiz22: fluffypony, I doubt I am on ignore. He began to answer me but had to go. The other day, I had to leave earlier.
bounce: .oO( certainly argumentative )
bounce: re reinventing the wheel, wasn't there a medico recently that got a paper published essentially reinventing calculus (and naming it after himself, naturally)?
asciilifeform: bounce: well there was (still is...) a wealthy american crackpot who claimed cellular automata as his invention, suing anyone who publicly disagreed
asciilifeform: ;;google wolfram batshit insanity
gribble: Stephen Wolfram, A New Kind of Science: <>; Ten Years of Monster Raving Egomania and Utter Batshit Insanity: <>; Collection of Reviews of Wolfram's A New Kind of Science, Etc...: <>
asciilifeform: but that was a while ago.
asciilifeform: to my great shame, i (well, my research group, at my request) bought his software once.
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, I've just clicked 'forward all' and reforwarded you my proposal and follow-up email. Please check the mail and I would very much appreciate a response. I feel I've given adequate time for your consideration.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.0347901 = 0.3479 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: the whole thing sounds like tom sawyer's aunt.
ozbot: Stephen Wolfram, A New Kind of Science
mircea_popescu: also, google does not return the wayback machine for a "web history" query.
mircea_popescu: meanwhile, they return all the wikipedia pages possible.
mircea_popescu: must be cool to run a search engine that consists of promoting your friends.
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu - ?
bounce: could (also) be self-selecting, of course. might wlel be.
bounce: s/wlel/well/
mircea_popescu: perhaps.
bounce: 9th paragraph, unkindly said, "applying the new jersey approach to the universe"
mircea_popescu: "My teacher, more patient than I would be with adolescent arrogance, gently informed me that it was a standard technique, in any book on linear algebra, called "reduction to Jordan normal form", after the man who discovered it in the 1800s. "
mircea_popescu: i want this entered into the record of proof for the importance of beating schoolchildren.
mircea_popescu: kids that have no experience with beatings have no conceivable incentive to abandon the notion they invented jordan normal form.
jurov: bah, even these who do
fluffypony: robwhiz22: why don't you just put the docs online for all to see/download? Or PasteBin it? You've been given permission to do so, after all.
bounce: nothing said the writer got beaten nor he didn't abandon the notion he wasn't the first when told
bounce: pretty cool he found it out himself, even if it turned out later he wasn't the first.
mircea_popescu: bounce sure, pretty cool.
BCB: <-- dev panel from PrincetonBTC
robwhiz22: fluffypony, I wouldn't need permission.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.047122 = 0.2356 BTC [+] {4}
fluffypony: dun dun dun DUN
robwhiz22: fluffypony, more importantly, it's not like I did the entire project on spec (Google 'on spec' or 'spec work').
mircea_popescu: "Martin-Löf showed, again roughly speaking, that complex objects will pass many high-reliability tests for randomness, and conversely objects which pass randomness tests must have high algorithmic complexity."
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what nonsense is this ;/
asciilifeform: not familiar with the 'complex objects' in question.
jurov: s/complex/shiny/
jurov: :D
bounce: go on, polish xkcd's "4" some more, why don't you? :)
mircea_popescu: me either, but as described it's scandalous.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: he was probably speaking of greg chaitin's entropy.
mircea_popescu: the guy does declare he's trained as a phys, so i guess rank cluelessness about math may be excused
mircea_popescu: no he's talking of Kolmogorov
robwhiz22: I wrote "mircea_popescu, for what you're discussing now you should look at kolmogorov complexity."
BingoBoingo: robwhiz22: If you thing your solicitation reveals flaws, public disclosure is the responsible thing to do
robwhiz22: but I didn't submit as I didn't want to become your consultant on here for free. :)
robwhiz22: And more to the point I don't really know the application. It's, quote-unquote "out of scope"
fluffypony: quote-unquie
fluffypony: *unquite
fluffypony needs more wine
asciilifeform: ok, for everyone who didn't catch it the first time i posted it,
ozbot: derp_more.txt -
asciilifeform: no one can say i wasn't patient.
BingoBoingo: robwhiz22: If you dunno they application how can you be competent to critique it?
asciilifeform: i'd also like to add, for the edification of future spammers, that blatant sockmuppetry (switching handles every week) does not add credibility.
robwhiz22: BingoBoingo, I didn't critique it. I don't know anything about any RNG project. I was just answering mircea_popescu's question, in which he quoted "and conversely objects which pass randomness tests must have high algorithmic complexity" and hten said "not familiar with the 'complex objects' in question.".
bounce: 966 lines. looks like a bit of a waste.
Apocalyptic: <asciilifeform> no one can say i wasn't patient. << and that's an understatement
jurov: tl;dr:<ninjashogun> cardano can suddenly change into usb keyboard hence its insecure
jurov: i did not read further
asciilifeform: see mp's essay about 'your wife changes into dog'
mircea_popescu: wait i wrote that ?!
asciilifeform: somewhere.
jurov: or a pig... there's actually a book about that
bounce: no, he is a dog. this is the internets.
mike_c: 3 hours! that take some serious zen power.
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, are you working on an RNG project? Do you have a link?
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, or announcement?
mircea_popescu: mike_c next time you want to ask me why the cardano isn't done by xmas...
asciilifeform: how many pictures of the damn thing have to be posted
mike_c: hehe
jurov: robwhiz22: it's often discussed here, if you'd actually read the logs
asciilifeform: as if an rng were a nuke, or any other rarity
jurov: but you seem to be write-only dude
bounce: maybe it should be. backdoored and all.
mircea_popescu: ;;google wilbur glenn voliva
gribble: Wilbur Glenn Voliva - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>; Wilbur Glenn Voliva visits New Orleans, Louisiana in 1912 ...: <>; $5,000 for Proving the Earth is a Globe | Modern Mechanix: <>
bounce: bogon-triggered tacnuke
mircea_popescu: he's like Julia A. Moore but forscience.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04799932 = 0.144 BTC [+] {3}
robwhiz22: jurov, why is it often discussed here? Could you summarize?
fluffypony: robwhiz22: the rng project is basically based on buttcoin:sharpie density
robwhiz22: jurov, is there a write-up somewhere?
thestringpuller: !last m s.mpoe
assbot: Last trade for S.MPOE on MPEX was at 0.00096485 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: i can't wait for this fellow's Amazing RNG Improvement ideas.
jurov: robwhiz22: google the logs for hookers+microphone
fluffypony: asciilifeform: the seed is a digital best when you're drunk;)
ozbot: Unsorted collection of various Cardano related updates + spurious pics pe Trilema - Un blog de Mirce
mircea_popescu: "This brings me to the core of what I dislike about Wolfram's book. It is going to set the field back by years. On the one hand, scientists in other fields are going to think we're all crackpots like him. On the other hand, we're going to be deluged, again, with people who fall for this kind of nonsense. I expect to have to waste a lot of time in the next few years de-programming students who'll have read A New Kind of
mircea_popescu: Science before knowing any better."
mircea_popescu: fuycking problem of bitcoin.
mircea_popescu: we do not want "more adoption", especially if that "more adoption" is sandmans brought in by aspirin bitcoin "jesuses"
asciilifeform: it is worth noting that herr w. created his flagship product by 'pulling a bitcoinica'
asciilifeform: (ran off with taxpayer-funded 'macsyma' and hired some people to write a gui)
thestringpuller: the problem of bitcoin is the problem of the internet...eternal september
asciilifeform: there's a unique species of crackpot - the kind with actual power
asciilifeform: e.g. lysenko
jurov: all that rubbish. why i had to do my first programming steps in qbasic?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that's not pulling a bitcoinica, that's pulling a washingtonica.
turbo_ac100: no block found for 45 min. Is that true?
jurov: because nobody could be bothered to make free list for msdos
jurov: *lisp
gribble: Time since last block: 45 minutes and 21 seconds
joecool: lawdy
[\]: balls
jurov: all these high horses
mircea_popescu: jurov if you stole msdos to the degree you thought it was free
mircea_popescu: why didn't you steal lisp too
jurov: cuz nobody around had it
fluffypony: jurov: you think that's bad, I started on GWBASIC and then progressed to Pascal
fluffypony: took me years to unlearn bad habits
asciilifeform: there were many lisps of various descriptions for msdos
jurov: i progressed to pascal, too
bounce liked pascal
mircea_popescu: i actually liked qbasic. dunno why all the hate.
asciilifeform: but, afaik, no 'adult' ansi common lisp
thestringpuller: who didn't like basic
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: qbasic or quickbasic?
thestringpuller: it's classic
mircea_popescu: nono, qbasic.
[\]: urmom
mircea_popescu: it had this auto eval window
daybyter throws in some java...
fluffypony: yeah that was cool
bounce: back when, no ubiquitous 'net, not even a modem, and no connections to extoll the virtues of lisp
mircea_popescu: you'd go ? 12*32 and it was really like ;;calc
[\]: I still remember seeing a=a+1 for the first time
fluffypony: I vastly preferred PowerBasic to Turbo PAscal
fluffypony: *Pascal
[\]: and thinking that that statement was impossible
bounce: did get a forth from somebody, but without a good book it was hard to get started with it
asciilifeform: phun phact. msdos 'edit' is actually 'qbasic', with the basic ineptly commented out - in such a way that the code is still buried in the binary.
[\]: since algebra says things must be balanced
fluffypony: asciilifeform: I remember
mircea_popescu: and besides. qbasic came with monkeys.bas
mircea_popescu: i kept editing the code to do weird shit. was loads of fun
fluffypony: omg that and the tank game
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: I learned something today I never knew...mind blown.
daybyter: fluffypony: combat?
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller it was [pretty obvious even at the time. they looked alike.
Diablo-D3: and you know whats really fun?
Diablo-D3: quickbasic uses a more powerful version of that editor
fluffypony: daybyter: can't remember
bounce: some things are best forgotten
fluffypony: I remember when I got my Nokia 6110 and it had Snake on it
fluffypony: I was like
fluffypony: "Nibbles?"
mircea_popescu: hahaha yeah
fluffypony: and nobody understood wtf I was talking about
Diablo-D3: fuck yeah nibbles
daybyter: that game?
fluffypony: *clicks*
Diablo-D3: no not that game
ozbot: QBASIC Gorillas - YouTube
Diablo-D3: gorillas
Diablo-D3: lulz
fluffypony: daybyter: yes!
jurov: anyway. what i want to say, despite it was quite decent environment, it naturally led everyone to use turbopascal&co.
Diablo-D3: but yeah, qbasic had a scortched earth clone
jurov: if there was a cool DOS game built on lisp
jurov: we could have been years ahead
daybyter: fluffypony: I started a rewrite of that game in javascript to use it for coin gaming.
asciilifeform: problem being, all 'small' lisps are interpreters (what nearly everyone thinks of all lisps as being)
asciilifeform: because optimizing compilers are bulky - and require serious thought to write
joecool: finally a new block
fluffypony: jurov: I will say this much, Turbo Pascal forced me to learn asm because some functions were orders of magnitude faster when offloaded to inline asm
mircea_popescu: actually it was a while until they had the first optimizing compiler working
jurov: what problem? 386 can run a nifty logic game with interpreter
fluffypony: who remembers Swag, the Turbo Pascal code snippets collection?
robwhiz22: sorry, I received a phone call and was disconnected without noticing.
mircea_popescu: i remember dlh, the useful game info collection.
asciilifeform: fluffypony: me. i still consult 'swag' for algos, once in a blue moon.
mircea_popescu: good enough ?
dignork: ew, I remember writing TSR programs in TP+asm, it was a horrible junk
asciilifeform: anyone remember the 'magical decompiler' somebody planted in 'swag'? (actually the 'gold bug' virus)
fluffypony: asciilifeform: I remember trading copies on stiffy disk because the Internet wasn't as common, and then eventually in like 1998/1999 downloading my first "current" release
fluffypony: dignork: it was the gold standard at the time :-P
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, you said earlier you did not see my two emails to you. I forwarded both to you now - did you get them?
daybyter: any android devs here?
daybyter: interested in tradebots?
robwhiz22: I used the address from the cryptome announcement, which you responded to once suggesting I talk to you here.
dignork: fluffypony, and Ralph Brown's INT list, although there was some nice interactive help system as well
robwhiz22: The forward includes both emails.
fluffypony: dignork: before that list I used a Peter Norton programming guide that had an interrupt table
bounce: borland turbo pascal was a great step-up to asm because it was easy to get going with --also nicely light-weight compared to C!-- and made inline asm ridiculously easy.
fluffypony: bounce: agreed
fluffypony: borland really screwed things up over the years
bounce: smallest TSR I did was... 32 bytes total memory cost. 16 bytes code, 16 bytes allocated memory given to DOS before exiting.
jurov: ^ and 20 years later, lispers still accusatorily point fingers in vain
jurov: Meh.
mircea_popescu: bounce inline asm is not easy in c ?
mircea_popescu: you can just put it in a pointer and... execute it.
fluffypony: dat asm
bounce: the tp compiler does its thing much quicker than the tc compiler
bounce: and can relatively simply be put on a 360k floppy; just drop the bgi stuff from the std lib collection. compiler, stdlib, 3rd party editor. off you go. that just doesn't work so well with C.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: if you want the compiler to asm for you, vs. having to drop in a hex string and function ptr to it, compiler has to understand inline asm.
dignork: bounce, there was a debug.exe just to write .COM, i think it was still supplied in winXP
mircea_popescu: but the difference is purely acaemic.
Naphex: people here should stop talking about turbo pascal
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 18 @ 0.05402874 = 0.9725 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: wtf is it going to do with it, give you asm error messages ?
Naphex: in order too keep this channel cool
Naphex: hehe
mircea_popescu: there i've asm'd.
asciilifeform: i'm one of the lucky (unlucky?) folks who uses x86 asm at day job.
mircea_popescu: i haven't since the days i was looking through files to spot stoned.b
mircea_popescu: before "antivirus" was a thing
asciilifeform: a fun diversion, for those innocent of such matters:
asciilifeform: ;;google ascii shellcode
gribble: Ascii shellcode - Blackhat Techniques - Hacking Tutorials: <>; Alphanumeric Shellcode - Metasploit Unleashed - Offensive Security: <>; alpha3 - Alphanumeric shellcode encoder - Google Project Hosting: <>
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, I will have to go soon.
fluffypony: asciilifeform: on embedded devices or generally?
bounce: borland turbo C also had a similar "basm" thingy, so no need to fsck around with hexstrings. tp was just the thing we used because it was easy to use. indeed, easier than tc.
asciilifeform: fluffypony: generally. reading, rather than writing.
bounce: back in the days of 'zines over modem and even the odd book with virus listings from the library. forbidden knowledge!
MGK: Anyone interested in a graded MS65 1BTC casasius coin? Asking 1.5btc.
benkay: graded?
benkay: MGK: graded?
MGK: yes
jurov: as in, .999 fine brass?
benkay: as in .99 pure btc
fluffypony: bounce: fk was the shiznat
benkay: ;;lasers
gribble: ┌━ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ *pew!* *pew!* *pew!*
jurov: ;;railgun
gribble: Error: "railgun" is not a valid command.
mike_c: ;;kittenlasers
gribble: Error: "kittenlasers" is not a valid command.
asciilifeform: ;;nailgun
gribble: Error: "nailgun" is not a valid command.
jurov: ;;monorailcat
gribble: Error: "monorailcat" is not a valid command.
fluffypony: bounce: or wait, I'm talking about the old South African zine called forbidden knowledge, not sure if you were just saying that in general
mike_c: ;;laserkittens
gribble: ุ ₍˄.͡˳̫.˄₎ ุ ┌━ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ *pew*
jurov: wuuut
benkay: wow.
mike_c: what? it's a kitten with a laser. no biggie.
bounce: that didn't quite reach faraway europe, I don't think, no.
bounce: or maybe it did and I just don't remember.
MGK: yes the brass 2013
MGK: sorry Im doing a few things
fluffypony: terrible
bounce: .txt file, starts with <html>. huh.
BingoBoingo: ;;manul
gribble: Error: "manul" is not a valid command.
mircea_popescu: ;;derpage
gribble: Error: "derpage" is not a valid command.
fluffypony: reading some of the stuff I contributed is painful
fluffypony: 14 years is a long time ago
bounce: ;;canned derpage
gribble: Error: "canned" is not a valid command.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10000 @ 0.00095797 = 9.5797 BTC [-]
benkay: hey mircea_popescu i think i'm misreading your mpex tech stuff article - web servers have a copy of the db to fulfill stat requests?
mircea_popescu: pretty much
mircea_popescu: it's anonimized to some degree, mostly by replacing keys, but that shouldn't be relied on.
benkay: do they then have a copy of the mpex keys as well? for the signing of stats etc?
benkay: mircea_popescu ^^
benkay: how does a stat get signed then?
mircea_popescu: that's complicated.
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, I'll try to reach you tomorrow. What is the best time to talk in here?
benkay: complicated i can handle
mircea_popescu: well no, what i mean is "that's complicated" in the sense of i'm not about to spill it.
MGK: PM me if youre interested in a MS65 1BTC coin
ozbot: An Error Has Occurred
benkay: oh i got that loud and clear
robwhiz22: mircea_popescu, that is a good policy.
robwhiz22: I'll be on tomorrow.
fluffypony: I look forward to robwhiz22 joining us tomorrow
fluffypony: maybe he'll show us the sekrit dokumints
benkay: ;;gettrust fluffypony
gribble: Currently authenticated from hostmask fluffypony! Trust relationship from user benkay to user fluffypony: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: | WoT data: | Rated since: Sat Apr 6 08:20:32 2013
fluffypony: ;;ident fluffypony
gribble: Nick 'fluffypony', with hostmask 'fluffypony!', is identified as user 'fluffypony', with GPG key id 7455C5E3C0CDCEB9, key fingerprint BDA6BD7042B721C467A9759D7455C5E3C0CDCEB9, and bitcoin address 1FAvFCgXBmJ4uV3p1NFzWkkyndH7FJ6Vzx
fluffypony: ;;voiceme
gribble: Error: You already have voice in #bitcoin-otc.
fluffypony hugs gribble
rithm: /nickserv identify rithm sekritpa55word
bounce proposes an ignore-o-meter that'll show who gets ignored by how many others in nice convenient bargraphs
rithm: DOH!
fluffypony: rithm: PRIVKEY NEXT PLZ
assbot: Last 4 lines bashed and pending review. (
dignork: rithm, /msg NickServ SET PASSWORD sekritpa55word2
rithm: -----BEGIN RSA PRIVATE KEY-----
rithm: Qb+jTmfu/LwZXAYpsmgsi17zU0RytRO0/jYJ2P9HoY6x3qVvwm/Uoog1iVjaDrBd
rithm: omg hax
rithm knew he shouldn't have used ssl on his bouncer
fluffypony heartbleedz rithm dry
bounce next develops a calculus of (whatever the term is for the state of being ignored)
rithm: i tested my shit
dignork: rithm, pastebin your privkey, it got truncated :(
rithm: none of the affected are exposed
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 30 @ 0.0075 = 0.225 BTC [+]
rithm: i'm taking my time
rithm: drinking beer and shit watching the internet burn
rithm: ya'll didn't even try to login to nickserv gah
rithm: boring
rithm: thanks fluffypony
rithm feels better
fluffypony: I try to make you happy
dignork: rithm, i just checked that i have this password in list of human generated passwords (i did)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.05405775 = 0.2703 BTC [-] {2}
rithm: nice
rithm: it's my passphrase to my wallet too
rithm: that i generated in stock ubuntu
rithm: it's still online with billions of bitcoins if you want 'em come get em bro
los_pantalones: so what's goin on right now? gox coins flooding mkt ?
fluffypony: rithm: I think I'm going to try random sha256 hash collision instead
mircea_popescu: los_pantalones what gox coins ?
akstunt600: lol gox coins
los_pantalones: karpeles selling usbs on the street?
akstunt600: hahhahahah yeah right
akstunt600: he is too much of a pussy for all that
los_pantalones: why not? he's dumb enough
los_pantalones: well, not that i'd know personally
los_pantalones: he seems dumb enough, excuse me
akstunt600: because hes scared
akstunt600: nooooo terrified
akstunt600: he thinks btc has been around 10yrs
fluffypony: ohaaaai Mark
akstunt600: hahha
los_pantalones: ever seen that study about how really dumb people don't realize they are dumb
los_pantalones: defense mechanism
fluffypony: akstunt600: I'm sure he meant 10 years experience in netsec and not btc, though
akstunt600: i know :p
akstunt600: im toying
akstunt600: hhahahahah jurov
akstunt600: this sidechain stuff is cool
akstunt600: like especially if they did like zerocoin styl on 2nd chain
los_pantalones: so, no theories on px move in here ?
los_pantalones: or no cares ?
fluffypony: what boggles my mind is that they (mtgox) were liquid enough to pay someone to rewrite everything in a less-crap way, and to permanently employ a bunch of CISSPs (at the very least)
benkay: ;;later tell princessnell it's actually gpg keys which are tied to mpex accounts
gribble: The operation succeeded.
fluffypony: to have such an Ivory Tower complex that you don't is...well...
mircea_popescu: los_pantalones no one cares.
jurov: fluffypony look no further than thermos
fluffypony: jurov: don't get me started
fluffypony: makes me seriously irritated
akstunt600: thermos?
fluffypony: akstunt600: yes, he doesn't keep the coffee hot!
mircea_popescu: fluffypony they never were liquid enough. not ever.
akstunt600: hahhahahhahahah
jurov: fluffypony no problem, lay here on the couch and let's latalk
jurov: *talk
kakobrekla: also put your pants down.
benkay: davout mircea_popescu x.eur has delivery performed by delivery of cash to a bitcoin-central account, right?
fluffypony: and if someone can give me a scalp massage
mircea_popescu: benkay yes.
mircea_popescu: people don't quite grasp how bad a business mtgox was on a cashflow basis.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: 1. it was created by jeb mccaleb, the douche that recently fucked up kraken, and some other derps, on a shoestring.
dignork: mircea_popescu, but nobody knows really, have they ever published any reports?
mircea_popescu: it went nowhere so 2. karpeles took it over, with aid from some angel investors.
akstunt600: what did you expect they were a magic the gathering trading site
mircea_popescu: he proceeded to buy some failed polish exchange, which was over its history a loss,
akstunt600: well not officialy but i dont believeit
mircea_popescu: and then 3. got raped by jeb mccaleb (the "auditor") taking btc to 1 cent.
mircea_popescu: then they ran at a loss for all of 2012, piling more and more angel round money into a hole.
akstunt600: yeah such sad shit
mircea_popescu: then just as 2013 brought increased prices and revenues, they lost 5mn dollars to the us fed, because karpeles is retarded and doesn't understand when to say no.
akstunt600: at least they didnt try to sell goxshares
akstunt600: like cryptorush fiasco
mircea_popescu: all through this they were trying to daytrade, and doing it as well as bitcoinica
fluffypony: or IPO it
mircea_popescu: (horribly badly)
akstunt600: but thats small potatoes
akstunt600: omg IPO would have been epic
fluffypony: akstunt600: I know
fluffypony: in fact
mircea_popescu: this is something you can maybe carry on for a while, but if you're trying to it's a damned good idea not to annoy me as a side dish.
fluffypony: they should have done it as a coin
jurov: akstunt600: they will inevitably try it as "Gox"
fluffypony: GoxCoin IPO
akstunt600: Oh yeah that
mircea_popescu: and so this brings us to the spring of 2013, ever increasing pressures and eventually their collapse.
akstunt600: gox builder
mircea_popescu: they never actually had a lump of money they didn't owe someone.
jurov: i want to see a bank that'll dare to manage New Gox's acct
akstunt600: hahahha i dont even want to see that attempted
mircea_popescu: dignork yes.
mircea_popescu: pdf, of course.
akstunt600: mircea_popescu, that makes perfect sense to me
akstunt600: I never touched them
dignork: mircea_popescu if i read the history correctly, their report was published once, and long time ago
mircea_popescu: three reports they published afaik
mircea_popescu: 2010, 2011, 2012
ozbot: Investor Group Seeks Court OK to Buy, Revive Bankrupt Bitcoin Exchange Mt. Gox -
jurov: need to find non paywalled article
los_pantalones: google the headline
mircea_popescu: jurov that's ok, that's the last anyone'll ever heard of that.
jurov: The investor group, which includes Brock Pierce, a former child actor-turned technology entrepreneur,
jurov: i think that's all i need to know
fluffypony: from now on I'm going to tell people I"m a former child actor-turned technology entrepreneur
jurov: .. and investor with hollywood ties
dignork: well, for 1btc I'd buy it just for lulz
akstunt600: hahhah jurov
mircea_popescu: dignork you familiar with court supervised acquisitions ?
bounce: not me, explain away. why do they need an "investor group" to pony up one full bitcoin, given that they're not paying the debts outright but planning to pay'em back by running the thing anew?
dignork: mircea_popescu, yes, not too deeply though. But I'd buy it only as "dignork", pgp key 8334BB7B5BDFA126
samson_: I can't get over the fact that 'Chicago-based SilkRoad Equity' are involved in this...
mircea_popescu: bounce you need to either pay upfront more than the judge evaluates the assets could conceivably fetch, or else execute a credible plan to deliver. and since this is examined by jurists rather than business people (and let alone forum fucktards) the estimates tend to be quite conservative.
akstunt600: samson_, I know right
fluffypony: samson_: I thought you were joking
samson_: no joke
mircea_popescu: there's a reason why noobs never succeed with these.
akstunt600: I dug that up to a while a go and was liek WTF
fluffypony: I know
bounce: oh to start a company and requiring all titles to have "derp" in them somewhere.
fluffypony: Chief Derper
fluffypony: or Herpiest Derper
bounce: conservative as in generous?
cazalla: not surprising to see someone like Brock Pierce involved given his history with RMT, he's the 2nd person I've come across in bitcoin that I knew of before Bitcoin, first being voorhees from wickedfire heh
mircea_popescu: no, conservative as in "where did you go to school ?" and other anathema mp-esque questions the child actors of this world abhor.
dignork: bounce, not for the buyer
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: do they use a jury for financial stuff as well??? geeze...:/
mircea_popescu: fluffypony no, but that makes it worse.
bounce: "higher than a bargaining businessman would-be buyer would bid", then.
fluffypony: I misread your sentence
fluffypony: I thought you said examined by jurors
fluffypony: too much wine and it's 12:30am
mircea_popescu: jurists, ie, people of teh legal profession
fluffypony: yeah re-read it now :)
bounce: ah. need to have an impressive name and such. so that's why this "child actor" got roped in.
jurov: i suspect hollywood wants to tap the drama
bounce: spendy drama quality drama
akstunt600: hahhahha fluffypony I would like to annouce new chief operating derp
ozbot: WebPagetest Test Result - Dulles : - 04/10/14 22:25:40
cazalla: I think he did much more in RMT than h is child acting days tbh
fluffypony: akstunt600: also we need a Derp Scientist
mircea_popescu: cazalla what's rmt ?
akstunt600: yup yup
cazalla: real money trade
bounce: a Science Derpist
mircea_popescu: jborkl indeed
mircea_popescu: cazalla uh what is that ?
cazalla: chinese gold farming
cazalla: he was THE guy back in the EQ days
mircea_popescu: and voorhees you say ?
cazalla: yeah wickedfire which is interesting because I read an article where you said it would attrack the internet marketing crowd and I say there thinking oh top kek that's me
ozbot: Mr. Derp - Video Clips - South Park Studios
cazalla: sat there, fuck i need a coffee
ozbot: - the simplest provably fair bitcoin multi-lottery (instant)
fluffypony: I even pm'd them to tell them
fluffypony: and then they announce a new SSL cert, wtf
bounce: now the race is on to see who can post their secret key here the first
bounce: s/here the/here/
mircea_popescu: cazalla so what do you do, marketing wise ?
cazalla: nothing now, i just use to run spam blogs fill with adsense
mircea_popescu: fluffypony my wicked heart smiled when the thing was announced and schneier had to write an article about how he is affected. i on the other side, did not.
mircea_popescu: cazalla that's been dead for a while.
cazalla: panda/pengion killed it for me
fluffypony: cazalla: yeah, Google started loving content
cazalla: penguin even
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15200 @ 0.00095797 = 14.5611 BTC [-]
cazalla: fluffypony: i wouldn't go that far, more like loving adwords and their pushing their own products into every profitable vertical
asciilifeform: what's the excuse for a blog using ssl anyway?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "security"
asciilifeform: seekoority.
fluffypony: asciilifeform: aren't we moving towards SSL on everything forever?
mircea_popescu: we are moving away from ssl and generally pki, and generally usg-crap. forever.
cazalla: still, never though indians writing 250 word articles for $3 would scale like it did
asciilifeform: as if ssl were useful if it worked as printed on the box.
cazalla: thought*.. going back to bed, damn baby crying all night and can't even focus on spelling
asciilifeform: all the noise people made about key escrow in the '90s - they swallowed it in the end regardless.
asciilifeform: all the buggers had to do was rename it 'pki'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform here's the thing : bitcoin finally creates the possibility for natural selection.
asciilifeform: a turd 'by any other name would smell as...'
mircea_popescu: it matters not that ther world is full of mastodons as long as two mice are fucking somewhere.
akstunt600: WOW mu bro just refunded 3 neptunes
akstunt600: Thats 30k in btc wow
akstunt600: he shorted from 1k btc rpice wow
thestringpuller: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 380.28, Best ask: 380.62, Bid-ask spread: 0.34000, Last trade: 380.28, 24 hour volume: 43714.37060882, 24 hour low: 375.0, 24 hour high: 444.26, 24 hour vwap: 403.597670398
MGK: Im selling a graded MS65 1bitcoin casacious coin, asking 1.5BTC.
SatoshiJack: mp,tat -- you guys need to get some people building around atc! I've tried contacting the devs -- but no luck getting them to show atc some love...
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.58 = 3.48 BTC [+]
jurov: SatoshiJack: brainwallet should work with atc out of the box, no?
SatoshiJack: nope -- I don't think so -- no way to have it autogenerate based on the rules for atc... they will have to add support which would mean tweaking code for determinsitc wallets etc...
jurov: but atc has same rules as btc
benkay: different addresses, tho
jurov: how different?
benkay: what does your altcoin addr start with?
SatoshiJack: I will give you full details in a day or so -- we are going through the code now -- and figuring out what we have tobuild for it --- our big thing is -- how we generate address etc... I need to be able to generate like 1000 or so at a time -- and also to be able to submit transactions similar to how works with for transaction submits...
benkay: huh
ozbot: Badger Badger The Original Dancing Badgers!
benkay: coulda sworn they were different
akstunt600: thought you could use some cheering up
ozbot: Mystery of Prince Rupert's Drop at 130,000 fps - Smarter Every Day 86 - YouTube
benkay: once upon a time i took 2nd place in physics for attempting to quantify polarization of light coming through a prd as a proxy for embedded stress
benkay: just look how fucking fast that thing tears itself apart
benkay: ha!
ozbot: Mystery of Prince Rupert's Drop at 130,000 fps - Smarter Every Day 86 - YouTube
benkay: fractures move at like 1 mile/sec
benkay: wild stuff.
Mats_cd03: cute
blackwhite: so whats going on with btc? was it the australian bank that caused the drop?
midnightmagic: lol australian bank?
ozbot: Bitcoin firms dumped by National Australia Bank as 'too risky' | World news |
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8150 @ 0.00095797 = 7.8075 BTC [-]
benkay: ops for assbot?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.047899 = 0.2874 BTC [+] {2}
thestringpuller: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 361.0, Best ask: 363.12, Bid-ask spread: 2.12000, Last trade: 363.12, 24 hour volume: 49912.39410578, 24 hour low: 357.57, 24 hour high: 442.46, 24 hour vwap: 398.8274112
CheckDavid: What is bitex?
CheckDavid: Exchange?
ozbot: .:: BITEX.COM ::.
CheckDavid: Maybe
CheckDavid: But it's in Russia
CheckDavid: And I thought the skin was British
benkay: why don't you bring the link
CheckDavid: Because I don't have
CheckDavid: I only heard about it
CheckDavid: Bitex ltd
kakobrekla: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 357.04, Best ask: 357.58, Bid-ask spread: 0.54000, Last trade: 357.04, 24 hour volume: 50103.19440652, 24 hour low: 357.04, 24 hour high: 442.46, 24 hour vwap: 398.721153266
CheckDavid: Skin = admin
mircea_popescu: SatoshiJack there is really no diff between bitcoin and altcoin addy gen. same algo.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5603 @ 0.00095797 = 5.3675 BTC [-]
SatoshiJack: I hear ya mp... my issue is how to generate the transactions --- and send --- blockr does not provide -- but it's all good -- we are working around :)
mircea_popescu: there's an altcoind neh ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.58000001 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 20 @ 0.58 = 11.6 BTC [-]
MisterE: morning
MisterE: ;;ticker ---market all
gribble: (ticker [--bid|--ask|--last|--high|--low|--avg|--vol] [--currency XXX] [--market <market>|all]) -- Return pretty-printed ticker. Default market is Bitstamp. If one of the result options is given, returns only that numeric result (useful for nesting in calculations). If '--currency XXX' option is given, returns ticker for that three-letter currency code. It is up to you to make sure the (1 more message)
MisterE: ;;ticker --market all
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 355.0, vol: 52651.69613421 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 349.721, vol: 41922.56088 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 354.64, vol: 45261.05802284 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 364.99, vol: 234.57248346 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 362.1216, vol: 8919.47740000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 353.75804, vol: 20.11537123 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 363.883873894, vol: 308.9653489 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)
jborkl_: Mircea , you see the mtgox news yet? Not that is any surprise
jborkl_: It is
minersdidit: karpeles get arrested?
benkay: nooz?
jborkl_: Mtgox possibly being bought
jborkl_: WSJ reported a couple hours ago
mike_c: yes, was discussed.
minersdidit: bought you mean handed over
danielpbarron: does that mean all those GoxCoins are worth something after all?
MisterE: handed over in terms of "take my exchange, please"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11047 @ 0.00095797 = 10.5827 BTC [-]
minersdidit: bitcoin will probably be back to single digits by the time they settle that mess
kakobrekla: wont go below 2
jborkl_: They would be assuming debt also
jborkl_: How much idk
minersdidit: wasnt karpeles using it as his personal piggyback?
mircea_popescu: jborkl it was here
minersdidit: bitcoins shitty economic algo killed the value
Duffer1: oh hai guys
danielpbarron: yeah the devs should have written it to give 50 billion units to their friends every month so it could be more like the dollar
minersdidit: bitcoin follows quantity theory of money which is flawed.
minersdidit: it will always have insane volatility. miners create 3600 coins even under falling demand
minersdidit: or when value rises theres no mechanism to supply the market
minersdidit: so you get insane ups and downs
minersdidit: impossible to use as settlement
minersdidit: youll have persistent periods of hyper deflation and hyper inflation like now
minersdidit: makes it useless
danielpbarron: to you, maybe
danielpbarron: I find it to be very useful; I'm not alone
danielpbarron: i'd rather have a volitile good money than a stable bad money
minersdidit: yea you arent very bright. the economics are flawed you have insane costs
minersdidit: its not about price stability that is absurd as well
minersdidit: you have no mechanisms that respond to market demands for money
danielpbarron: i guess you've never been to #bitcoin-otc
minersdidit: whats a trading post got to do with anything lol
danielpbarron: there are 629 mechanisms in there
minersdidit: money has to be elastic it cant be static ie linear
Duffer1: i don't see how you can say that when nothing like bitcoin has existed before
minersdidit: sure it has
minersdidit: 100% gold standard did the exact same thing
Duffer1: instant, secure, worldwide, private value transmission does not = gold
minersdidit: danielpbarron: because economies are fractals they arent linear
danielpbarron: what does that even mean
minersdidit: im not argueing the superior technicalities
minersdidit: im argueing the flawed economics behind the coin creation
minersdidit: ie the supply
danielpbarron: you aren't doing a very good job
danielpbarron: i'm trying to understand you
mike_c: what money are you talking about? m1?
minersdidit: when the market demands for money increase bitcoin has no mechanism to supply it and vice versa
Duffer1: you mean you're ignoring the technical superiority in favor of your baseless assertions
minersdidit: its based on quantity theory
minersdidit: my assertions are baseless look at the price goes from 80 to 1200 back down
minersdidit: that will always occur
danielpbarron: minersdidit: the things you are saying are not true
minersdidit: making it impossible to use as settlement.
Duffer1: "that will always occur because.. gold"?
danielpbarron: bitcoin does indeed have many meechanisms to supply
minersdidit: danielpbarron of course they are true. we can observe it occuring
minersdidit: miners create coins regardless of market needs for them, this increases volatility when they drain the liquidity pools
danielpbarron: you must have your eyes closed then, because there are tens of thousands of "mechanisms"
minersdidit: no there arent.
minersdidit: hence the insane volatility
mircea_popescu: minersdidit who are you exactly ?
danielpbarron: you are making the argument that a central bank knows better than a decentralized network
minersdidit: a troll
mircea_popescu: a ok. carry on.
Duffer1: anyways have you guys heard the great news?
danielpbarron: even if the central bank was better at stabilizing prices (it isn't) that wouldn't make up for the corruption inherent in giving that much power to one authority
minersdidit: danielpbarron um when did i bring up central banking or fiat?
Duffer1: for only 11,200 btc you can be the proud owners of 40% of YET ANOTHER havelol startup
minersdidit: and when did i say stable prices are optimal?
ozbot: [HAVELOCK] AlcheMiner Scrypt ASIC IPO Friday April 11
minersdidit: typical bitcoin shill. instantly brings up the fiat strawman that was never discussed in the first place
danielpbarron: well then start making sense
danielpbarron: i can't read your mind
minersdidit: learn to read i am making sense
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6550 @ 0.00096211 = 6.3018 BTC [+] {2}
minersdidit: when the market needs bitcoin theres no mechanism to supply them other then the set in stone linear 3600 coins, this brings insane price volatility to the upside
danielpbarron: ok so you want something like bitcoin, but with.. more inflation? or a backdoor to let devs tweak the block reward?
minersdidit: when that wanes out, you get insane volatility to the downside as the algo keeps supplying useless coins
danielpbarron: yeah and i'll buy them
danielpbarron: problem solved
minersdidit: no for bitcoin to work you need some decentralized system that works on the real bills doctrine
minersdidit: thats the only way the gold standard functioned
Duffer1: minersdiditwhen the market needs bitcoin theres no mechanism to supply them >>> you work for money, that's the mechanism
minersdidit: when that mechanism was removed it collapsed
Duffer1: why would it issue more than you work for?
minersdidit: duffer1 um no you dont work for bitcoins when the volatility is so insane you cant measure what your work is even worth.
Duffer1: simply because the market wants it to?
minersdidit: a money supply expands and contracts ie ELASTIC
TestingUnoDosTre: there are so many fucking bitcoins dropping
minersdidit: like an economy
Duffer1: your work is worth x btc
minersdidit: lol dude you cant even tell me what your work was worth an hour ago
minersdidit: the price moved what 20%?
benkay: i;ll price my work quite happily in btc
benkay: .5/hr
Duffer1: it's worth x btc, what people choose to price that in fiat is a separate matter
minersdidit: and im not talking about fiat price
minersdidit: you can "price" bitcoin in anything since its a ratio
danielpbarron: idk, i think these only appear to be problems to individuals who still have a foot in FIAT
minersdidit: you cant value your work when the meter stick you are using is a rubber band
minersdidit: to measure with
danielpbarron: if all your inputs and outputs are BTC, you wouldn't notice so much
minersdidit: yea you would lol
benkay: the other side is that i know the fraction of the monetary reserve my work is worth
mike_c: curious, where would you have "stabilized" the price? $1? $10?
benkay: i find that rather satisfying.
minersdidit: i wouldnt stabalize the price. i just told you, you need something like decentralized discount bills that settle in BTC
minersdidit: thats beyond your primitive understanding to even bother explaining
danielpbarron: then why bother mentioning it
mike_c: try speaking english, that will help.
minersdidit: its not about PRICE satbility. its about mechanisms that respond to market needs hence reducing volatility
Duffer1: minersdiditand im not talking about fiat price >> yes you are, your btc work will always be worth x btc, the only volatility is fiat market pricing of that work
minersdidit: price stability is NOT wanted in any economy
minersdidit: prices need to move around
benkay: <minersdidit> thats beyond your primitive understanding to even bother explaining << tiberius move, iirc
minersdidit: bitcoin cant work alone its already been tried with 100% gold
mike_c: actually 5% gold 95% tungsten
benkay: claim, claim, claim, wait for sucker to bite, argue, say 'you're too stupid for me to possibly explain this'
Duffer1: hehe
danielpbarron: the old states used to water down the gold coins; nothing new under the sun
benkay: government will always dilute the currency, given the opportunity.
minersdidit: i dont have to claim anything the evidence is all around you
minersdidit: look at insane volatility
benkay: luckily it doesn't matter
benkay: i can wait 10 years
danielpbarron: yeah i'm not worried
benkay: if it's still blow stamps for kiddies at that point, no big.
minersdidit: @ $1200 a btc miners were being subsidized to the tune of 5million dollars to secure 80k transactions
benkay: i have resource streams.
minersdidit: that 5million was coming out of users
mike_c: my bitcoin is still worth a bitcoin. except the ones i lost on that stupid $400 bitbet.
benkay: HAW
benkay: no, those are still worth 1B too.
minersdidit: it was impossible to sustain becuase we dont even have 1billion of fiat on order books
benkay: sounds like a bubble, minersdidit
danielpbarron: lol benkay
minersdidit: miners now get paid what 1million to secure the same 80k transactions
minersdidit: do you see the problem here? as the real value rises so does the cost to run the network
benkay: how is the subsidy different and the txn value the same?
minersdidit: its not differnt
minersdidit: the subsidy is like a $40 per transfer tax
minersdidit: in december
danielpbarron: minersdidit: do you know how much wealth is wasted running the current financial system?
Duffer1: you're pricing mining activity in fiat?
benkay: miners got paid 25 bitcoin to move some other number of btc around, plus txn fees
minersdidit: you can price it in anything dude
minersdidit: miners had obscene margins and every incentive to realize them
Duffer1: i price it in btc...
minersdidit: hence its what theyve been doing
minersdidit: miners created bitstamps order book every 3 days in november
benkay: lose everything buying at 1200, minersdidit ?
Duffer1: since that's the reward for doing the work..
minersdidit: dude can you read?
minersdidit: they are getting paid extra for no new work performed
benkay: now or then?
minersdidit: even now
benkay: eh
benkay: still not really caring.
minersdidit: theres not enough fiat demand to support what miners are creating out of thin air everyday
steven-__: not sure im following you minersdidit
mike_c: is there any fiat demand? who wants fiat?
minersdidit: 3600 coins per day x 400 is what the miners are being paid in subsidies
Duffer1: coin generation, network security are work as well
minersdidit: to "secure" a network that only transfers 67k
minersdidit: they will be constantly on the ask side
minersdidit: which is what has been occuring
danielpbarron: minersdidit: there is a lot of wealth that will be fleeing FIAT soon, and it will choose Bitcoin
minersdidit: no it wont
danielpbarron: well that's my bet
minersdidit: bitcoin has no liquidity to support any type of wealth fleeing into it
minersdidit: and for every seller of BTC there is also a buyer
minersdidit: so your arguement makes no sense
danielpbarron: ok, that statement seems to completely contradict the other stuff you've been saying
Duffer1: capital flight will seek precious metals and other solid commodities imo, btc a bit too
danielpbarron: either there is too much BTC or not enough? which is it?
TestingUnoDosTre: mike_c, at least you didn't almost lose .5 btc at the last minute like this guy <-----
minersdidit: no it doesnt. the quantity theory of money that bitcoin is based on, guarantees insane volatility
minersdidit: which will NOT attract wealth
minersdidit: hence why 5 years in we still have out of control price swings
benkay: so make the perfect alt
minersdidit: its not a question of that
mike_c: TestingUnoDosTre: um, i actually lost. seems worse than almost lost :)
benkay: with elastic supply
minersdidit: money has to reflect what the economy is doing, which is a fractal it expands and contracts hence elastic
TestingUnoDosTre: i lost, and I also lost the 1% by trying to bid last minute
minersdidit: it cant be a linear algo lol
akstunt600: benkay, i agree
akstunt600: that would be nice
akstunt600: but how?
minersdidit: bitcoins value is relative to the liquidity pool of bids that is available
benkay: economy is a fractal yo
minersdidit: miners drain that pool constantly
ozbot: The 10 Most Insane Things You Didn't Know About the Universe | Marvels of the Science | Episode 6 -
minersdidit: making it more difficult to attract more
akstunt600: Fucking miners
akstunt600: oops wait im a miner
benkay: lay off the entheogens, kid.
Duffer1: this whole conversation >.<
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2771 @ 0.00095723 = 2.6525 BTC [-]
minersdidit: yea you too stupid to see it
benkay: resorts to ad hominems
minersdidit: youll have persistent hyperinflation and hyperdeflation
danielpbarron: i'm starting to get what you are saying, minersdidit, but I still don't agree
minersdidit: its not my theory, its reality look how bitcoin acts
minersdidit: its 5 years in.
akstunt600: minersdidit, Sooo that why dogecoin is better?
akstunt600 akakkakakkakakakka
danielpbarron: exactly, 5 years old... that isn't very long ago
akstunt600: very very young
minersdidit: thats a century in internet time.
danielpbarron: well it only took the dollar a century to lose most of its value; Bitcoin's looking pretty good
minersdidit: 5 years on the internet with instant information awareness is like 100-200 years
minersdidit: yea bitcoin does it in a day lol
akstunt600: danielpbarron, hahhah so true
MGK: anyone interested in buying a graded MS65 1btc coin?
TestingUnoDosTre: wtf is that
danielpbarron: i've never seen Bitcoin lose most its value, but I wasn't around for that first MtGox hack
MGK: a casacious coin?
MGK: never heard of those?
minersdidit: danialbarron its lost what 40% in the last 24hrs alone?
minersdidit: what will it take for you to see most of its value? 51%?
TestingUnoDosTre: like a coin that you can hack by pealing off the adhesive?
danielpbarron: that's not most, and that's also an exageration
minersdidit: im sorry 1/3rd
benkay: say we clear back to 10
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 20 @ 0.03587424 = 0.7175 BTC [+] {7}
minersdidit: bitcoin has lost about 60% of its "value" from january 1st
benkay: it's lost none of its value.
benkay: the crypto's still rock solid.
benkay: the txn net is stronger than ever.
benkay: the fundamentals remain.
benkay: fiat pricing silliness has not and never will matter.
minersdidit: price in anything
minersdidit: its down 60-70%
TestingUnoDosTre: alright, but if you had 10 dollars waiting to invest in bitcoin last week, versus today, how much more bitcoin would it buy benkay?
benkay: make this argument in a decade.
TestingUnoDosTre: totally not a legitimate argument
benkay: not you, TestingUnoDosTre
benkay: the "it's crazy vix week dot butts! bitcoin is useless!" argument.
minersdidit: bitcoin will be at version 0.92 in a decade with the current developmeant team
minersdidit: still promising multi sig
TestingUnoDosTre: bitcoin utility hasn't budged a bit, but the value has most definitely dropped
danielpbarron: i think multi sig already exists
benkay: see now jump to a new topic, a new stupid claim
minersdidit: the utility sucks. 30% value swings in 24hrs
benkay: utility != price, price != value
benkay: ffs
minersdidit: plus horrendous bid/ask spread when trying to get some
benkay: yeah it's expensive and hard to get. what of it?
benkay: so is good blow.
danielpbarron: this is ridiculous, it's open source; if the devs really did suck (arguable..) then new ones will sprout up
minersdidit: no they wont
benkay: reference client isn't the only client
minersdidit: nobody pays them to sprout up
benkay: conformal do you even?
minersdidit: will mircea come in with a donation like openbsd lol
danielpbarron: minersdidit: maybe
danielpbarron: who paid satoshi?
minersdidit: you did
danielpbarron: so who will pay future devs?
Duffer1: minersdiditnobody pays them to sprout up >> have you heard of github?
benkay: next.
minersdidit: bitcoin developers are poor quality because their is zero incentive to attract proper professionals
benkay: read the conformal source. next.
TestingUnoDosTre: laughable at best ^
minersdidit: its a circus of amateurs from the last dotcom crash
benkay waits for this thread of troll to spin out
minersdidit: how is it laughable, theres persistent amateur bugs discovered
TestingUnoDosTre: amateur?!?!
danielpbarron: there is probably some truth to that one (re: amateurs from dotcom)
minersdidit: all the failures of the dotcom crash resurfaced in bitcoin
minersdidit: andreas etc.
TestingUnoDosTre: how quickly was an openSSL bug patched in the bitcoin community when released
danielpbarron: yeah, I read all about them on bitcointalk lol
TestingUnoDosTre: how long will the openSSL bug persist in everyday use?
minersdidit: wasnt it exposed for 2 years
mircea_popescu: so are we getting a proposal on how to fix bitcoin or noit just yet ?
mircea_popescu: TestingUnoDosTre prolly a year or so
danielpbarron: lolol ^^
BCB: mircea_popescu, did you see that new paper about regulation
BCB: you were mentioned
danielpbarron: yeah get to the point and write your new superbitcoin already, minersdidit
TestingUnoDosTre: which paper <BCB>
minersdidit: im too stupid too and theres no need
BCB: looking
benkay: princessnell's, most likely.
danielpbarron: minersdidit: then stfu
minersdidit: my statements are still accurate
benkay: k great thanks
minersdidit: bitcoin development team = losers from dotcom bust
benkay: yup great awesome
minersdidit: drifted on the internet for a decade until bitcoin came along
Trader1333: hi guys
benkay: .bait
minersdidit: hi Trader1333
Trader1333: i am wondering if there is a way to buy future contracts for BTC?
danielpbarron: if you want to rile bitcoiners up with that line, go to #bitcoin-dev
TestingUnoDosTre: ;;google bitcoin future
gribble: Bitcoin's future: Hidden flipside | The Economist: <>; Felix Salmon – The Bitcoin Bubble and the Future of Currency ...: <>; Bitcoin: The Currency Of The (1 more message)
Trader1333: trying to acquire either 5 BTC weekly or $2500.
Trader1333: worth
Trader1333: willing to do a legally binding agreement of such and put forth my car as compensation should it cost too much
minersdidit: losers will always be losers, bitcoin allowed that particular group to get "another chance" to return to silicon valley, hence their constant obsession with conferences
danielpbarron: Trader1333: you sure about that? I hear Bitcoin is too volitile to be worth anything
Trader1333: i see BTC dropping to $100 but i dont care i need BTC weekly and constant. i need a way to buy BTC and i dont care if it goes to $10k or $1 im buying same amount weekly
danielpbarron: hah, I live really close to the last conference and I didn't go (or even hear about it)
Duffer1: i'm reminded of krugman's 'why the internet will never be popular' thesis..
Trader1333: i flip it weekly and make good margins. hell i make more than someone as a general manager of a fast food joint and i only do it for 5 hours a week roughly.
minersdidit: well the internet is a cesspool
minersdidit: i dont think anyone except andreas denies that lol
TestingUnoDosTre: <BCB> i see no mention of mp
danielpbarron: minersdidit: i agree with you there
Trader1333: problem is this stupid market no one wants to sell. so i figured if i offered a contract to buy at 1% above bitstamp the same amount every week, month to month contract, there would be some interest.
BCB: TestingUnoDosTre, it is in the attached paper
Trader1333: dont have time for the stupid market volatility.
minersdidit: if you actually read krugmans article he was kind of correct.
minersdidit: the internet generation is poorer then their parents
benkay: that's for damn sure.
minersdidit: that simple fact shows you that the internet failied to deliver the utopia guys like andreas claimed it did
Duffer1: andreas?
minersdidit: yea high priest of bitcoin
minersdidit: antonopolous
benkay: new, unrelated tangent...
benkay: kakobrekla: ping
minersdidit: and silicon valley "tech" and innovation is a joke. they create companies that sell advertisements
benkay: fun trollage in here this afternoon
minersdidit: use ignore benkay
kakobrekla: yeah well it is what it is.
benkay: what's ignore?
Trader1333: know its not the place, but if anyone wishes to sell 6.6 BTC let me know. or a contract to buy $2500 on Monday at whatever bitstamp +1% is.
Duffer1: trader1333 #bitcoin-otc
Trader1333: go to OTC where its a bunch of circle jerkers no thank you. oh and escrow is required.
minersdidit: yea the bastion of liquidty
benkay: ;;gettrust Trader1333
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user benkay to user Trader1333: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: | WoT data: | Rated since: never
benkay: well with trust like that
minersdidit: any bets up on bitbet when bitstamp goes the way of mtgox?
benkay: surely you're familiar with a search bar, minersdidit
minersdidit: already starting not to pay people out larger then a few K ammounts
Trader1333: @benkay who cares about trust, we use an escrow. cash deposit, moneypak, whatever method you need.
Trader1333: i dont come on IRC after i got thrown out for basically buying and wouldnt accept the chatroom's escrow.
Trader1333: then got called a scammer and such.
benkay: good plan
benkay: run up into a foreigners bar
minersdidit: then what escrow did you want to use?
Trader1333: i only use members of bitcointalk such as DannyHamilton, Tomatocage,, etc.
minersdidit: fellow scammers
benkay: get beat
benkay: "THEY'RE MEAN!"
MGK: who are you on bitcointalk forum?
Trader1333: LOL scammers. what a joke.
danielpbarron: everyone is a scammer if you give them enough time or money.. except me! you can trust me
Trader1333: does anyone know a place in BTC that sells futures for BTC price?
Trader1333: i need a way to lock in prices when i buy or get buy order fulfilled.
minersdidit: mircea will sell you anything but good luck ever getting out of the trade.
TestingUnoDosTre: scamtopia
Trader1333: i have no interest in getting out of the trade.
Trader1333: im looking for a way that i can preserve my USD investment value.
MGK: lol
minersdidit: mpex will sell you put options
Trader1333: i buy BTC on coinbase and want the same USD value come friday whether the value of BTC has gone up 100% or down to $1.
TestingUnoDosTre: *for a preciious premium
minersdidit: lol nobody sane will do that
minersdidit: hence why mpex options failed
Trader1333: personally i see BTC dropping to $100 anyways
Trader1333: but like i said, i am not an investor in BTC at anything over $100. im only a mover.
Trader1333: i need constant BTC coming in which is what is slowing things down right now as this stupid bullshit pyramid scheme basically market was quickly raised to $1100 and now people think itd actually go back, ha.
minersdidit: benkay is a player
benkay: more like a clown
Trader1333: Pump and dump and everyone fell for it and people still fail to see itl lol.
benkay: court jester, if you will.
mircea_popescu: BCB no ?
BCB: mircea_popescu, linked above
Trader1333: Popescu do you offer a way I can hedge a BTC purchase I make every week on Monday so that it remains the same USD value whether it goes up or down...a futures contract if you will.
mircea_popescu: Trader1333 probably not. you have no wot and generally, nobody gives a shit.
minersdidit: mircea you have a WOT and you still scam
minersdidit: whats that got to do with anything lol
Trader1333: dont care about WOT willing to meet in person if need be and sign contract binding my car to failure to pay. i buy 5 BTC weekly or $2500 every week, month to month contracts.
Trader1333: car worth 3x that.
TestingUnoDosTre: where is your moms house / where do you live Trader1333?
mircea_popescu: you'll pay whatever it costs whenever you find anyone willing to sell yoiu some. if you ever do.
TestingUnoDosTre: sorry no can do, I'm midwest mang
Trader1333: hell ill escrow the following week's payments too.
TestingUnoDosTre: I only deal in straight cash, homay
Trader1333: not against escrow, just wish i had options. i would use coinbase instant buy but they changed their bullshit to only being visa credit cards for backing the account.
Trader1333: i only have mastercard credit cards.
Trader1333: as do i testing.
TestingUnoDosTre: go to bitcoin-otc
danielpbarron: he probably got banned from there already
minersdidit: mircea_popescu: comment on development team
Trader1333: $2400 cash in hand last 4 days and willing to buy BTC at bitstamp +1% and have it in hand same day. Its impossible. When market rising and things good could find it all the time.
thestringpuller: Trader1333: get in the WoT dude...
thestringpuller: stop being a n00b
TestingUnoDosTre: bitstamp +1% isn't even a deal
mircea_popescu: BCB what's unclear to me is why are any of those three people qualified to opine on regulation.
MGK: you sound like a total scammer
benkay: plus cash sucks, Trader1333, gotta go with moneypak
minersdidit: thickasthieves and goat are on WOT
Trader1333: Do tell MGK how i sound AT ALL like a scammer.
minersdidit: both are scammers
Trader1333: i want to hear this.
Trader1333: i say escrow, i say next week's payment in advance and all.
Trader1333: do tell HOW AM I A SCAMMER.
thestringpuller: minersdidit: how is ThickAsThieves a scammer?
Trader1333: do tell mgk you little prick.
minersdidit: he was hawking all sorts of garbage
Trader1333: you want to run your mouth and u dont know me.
thestringpuller: ;;gettrust ThickAsThieves
minersdidit: with his TATinvestments
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user ThickAsThieves: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 1 via 1 connections. Graph: | WoT data: | Rated since: Sat Mar 2 11:19:18 2013
benkay: kinda weak wot.
MGK: trader1333 scamming since 1994
Trader1333: does bitsimple accept any other methods besides bank wire? i'd use them all day if there wasnt that stupid bank wire fee.
minersdidit: TAT was mirceas nigger for a bit before going off on his own and hawking the latest scams
Trader1333: oh really? wheres that number come from u nit?
minersdidit: lol MGK
thestringpuller: minersdidit: he reapid XBOND, people made that a bubble and ruined it
minersdidit: hes a nigger
thestringpuller: so are you
benkay: IMPASSE
BCB: mircea_popescu, someon has to do it. Speculating about bitcoin is a cottage industry
MGK: BCB buy this MS65 1BTC coin from me I got from NightOwl
TestingUnoDosTre: why the fuck would anybody buy "physical" bitcoin
BCB: an they I love physical bitcoin.
BCB: There are some nice ones out there
TestingUnoDosTre: they literally can be stolen
BCB: But I already have too many
danielpbarron: I almost did and then the next day some hacker figured out a way to get the key without ruining the sticker
BCB: The Silver Bitcoin Wallets are nice
MGK: yeah I sold a .5 to blazedout and looking to sell this one too
MGK: but this ones in a ANAC case
BCB: I only collect 10 and 100 BTC coins
BCB: perferably gold
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15474 @ 0.00095701 = 14.8088 BTC [-] {2}
minersdidit: which ones BCB
BCB: mostly casascius coin. I have a few Titians and a Silver Wallet.
minersdidit: whatever happened to darkwallet?
MisterE: *sigh* gonna be a long log to catch up on today :)
minersdidit: gavin decided to jump ship
MisterE: TestingUnoDosTre: numismatic value :p
Duffer1: misere you can probably skip the bit where minersdidit starts talking up through now, nothing of value imo
TestingUnoDosTre: is that like the value of the penny after they stopped using copper?
Duffer1: mistere.. dat frued slip do
MisterE: haha, both of you
minersdidit: i thought this was suppose to be the smarter chat
minersdidit: instead the same shills repeat the same lines
Duffer1: we can't all be beuatiful
Duffer1: or good spellers
MisterE: probably have more holdings tho :p
MisterE: I know terrible metric
minersdidit: core developers killed bitcoin imo
minersdidit: losers make losers
MisterE: trollol
ozbot: The sins of the group of posers behind the so called “Bitcoin Foundation” pe Trilema - Un blog d
TestingUnoDosTre: wheres the ignore button
mircea_popescu: TestingUnoDosTre /ignore nick ALL
MisterE: *!*
minersdidit: Deliberately and quite maliciously tried to meld the BleedingHeart openssl vulnerability into the Bitcoin code. The move seemed bizarre at the timei, seeing how there was exactly zero need and pretty much epsilon benefit of implementing such kludge, and given that everyone with a clue involved pretty much agreed PKI is broken beyond repair anyway. To properly understand the implications of this : NSA has had, for two years
MisterE: trollharder.jpg
MisterE: minersdidit: they would really benefit from your wealth of knowledge in the BTCe chatbox
minersdidit: go away
Duffer1: lmao
MGK: all honesty bitcoin is stupid slow
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 15000 @ 0.000145 = 2.175 BTC [-] {3}
TestingUnoDosTre: in all honesty, stocks are stupid slow
TestingUnoDosTre: it takes me lieeeeeek 3 days to sell it and get fiat to my bank
benkay: real world is slow anyways
MGK: it takes like 3 days for me to send bitcoin
minersdidit: great article by mircea
TestingUnoDosTre: you need to upgrade your subscription to aol
MisterE: MGK: stop being a tight ass and include some tx fee it will be instant
MisterE: lol AOL
MGK: yeah I cashed out from ghash 30mins ago
danielpbarron: bitcoin is slow????? try getting your FIAT in 30 minutes
MisterE: you can, Western Union but you will pay dearly for it
MGK: if btc was so great I wouldnt need FIAT
mircea_popescu: sepa is about five minutes.
danielpbarron: if you need FIAT then why do you want BTC??
minersdidit: it depends where you send WU too
minersdidit: to some places its cheap
MisterE: true there is also SWIFT
minersdidit: lol go send btc in 5minutes to someone you cant even locate it in a city
minersdidit: 20% atm fee and palm print
danielpbarron: minersdidit: that's still FIAT
TestingUnoDosTre: pretty sure I can send btc without an atm or a palm print
minersdidit: go get one i said.
MisterE: btc finds them wherever they go with their wallet
danielpbarron: Bitcoin doesn't require a palm print; that's FIAT's doing
minersdidit: no thats just stupid nerds and robocoins doing
minersdidit: WU does not ask for a palm print lol
MGK: last block mined was 1hr 13min ago
MGK: lmao
danielpbarron: WU charges like 16 bucks
MGK: bitcoins dead yo
minersdidit: danielpbarron yea and localbitcoins has like a 3-10% spread.
minersdidit: nobody earns a bitcoin income other then miners
danielpbarron: you keep criticizing Bitcoin for FIAT's problems
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 100 @ 0.00583999 = 0.584 BTC [-]
minersdidit: no im criticizing it for bitcoins problems
minersdidit: how can you get any if 80% of them are held by 50 people
MisterE: you've yet to articulate an accurate problem that I've seen
danielpbarron slaps himself
MisterE: they are infinitely divisible
minersdidit: even if you offer services and producers youll never get any customers
minersdidit: since nobody has them in the first place lol
minersdidit: products*
MisterE: you're probably right
TestingUnoDosTre: holy shit 1 hr 13 minutes
MisterE: no sense wasting your time here with a failed technology eh?
MisterE: how abotu moving along
MGK: I just said that testing
MGK: bitcoin is dead yo
danielpbarron: I wonder if a bunch of miners turned off their rigs with the price dip
MGK: I wish
minersdidit: why would they do that?
MGK: but that wont be the case ever
minersdidit: even at 360 its free money
TestingUnoDosTre: i hope so because I bet that it won't get over 9b in may :D
minersdidit: costs like $2 to mine a btc
MisterE: danielpbarron: thats exactly what happend
danielpbarron: it costs electricity, minersdidit
ozbot: WTF? Healbe scampaign reaches $1m thanks to undisclosed contribution from Indiegogo’s hardware chi
mircea_popescu: indiegogo goes havelock lol
MGK: and GHAH mines the block
danielpbarron: minersdidit: there is a very predictable price point at which miners are better off buying BTC rather than buying electricity to mine
minersdidit: danielpbarron: you are clueless. producing an ASIC costs nothing, just becuase some scam companies sell them to retail tards for 20,000% markup does not mean they cost alot to make. the concentrated miners are producing BTC for next to free.
minersdidit: some tard in his basement maybe has high costs
minersdidit: the big operations dont
danielpbarron: minersdidit: right, but that has nothing to do with operating costs
minersdidit: the operating costs are 2 dollars a coin and you sell for 370
minersdidit: its not rocket science lol
minersdidit: to a "believer"
minersdidit: tard trades paycheck for what a miner produced out of thin air
minersdidit: only reason mining hardware is sold in the first place is because of the 20,000% markups and you get straight up fiat without having to mine BTC first then do the pain in the ass conversion
minersdidit: so its like you already mined the rewards when you sell hardware
danielpbarron: hey i'm not saying mining isn't scammy
minersdidit: now think about that lol
minersdidit: its like selling call options all day
danielpbarron: i think buying mining equipment is stupid
Duffer1: i'm trying not to, everything you've said is so wrong in so many ways it's giving me a headache
minersdidit: yea sure
TestingUnoDosTre: it's true though
minersdidit: tards labor away and get their paycheck to hand over to ASK side. you know someone has to be selling BTC for fiat. if its the "future" why are they selling it
minersdidit: miners are on the ask side since they are the only ones with BTC incomes
TestingUnoDosTre: please perform a calculation with known hardware at current difficulty and electricity costs minersdidit
danielpbarron: my income is BTC denominated
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12100 @ 0.00095807 = 11.5926 BTC [+] {2}
minersdidit: dude that calculation is meanigless because half these asics cost jackshit
danielpbarron: trying to start a Bitcoin business lol
minersdidit: the power consumption is low
Duffer1: also calculate how much is being sold vs how much isn't
TestingUnoDosTre: I know algebra is difficult
minersdidit: people are producing coins for free
minersdidit: next to free
danielpbarron: you are totally wrong there, minersdidit
minersdidit: retail tards have to make back their equipment they paid 20,000% markup for
TestingUnoDosTre: it's TOTES for free
danielpbarron: right, miners are dumb, we agree there
minersdidit: retail end miners are stupid
minersdidit: guys who get asics for pennys are smart
danielpbarron: yes, again, i agree
minersdidit: even they realized its better to sell for fiat at 20,000% profit then mining BTCs lol.
danielpbarron: they might even have used that 20000% markup to buy BTC
minersdidit: they buy cars, houses, business's
danielpbarron: good for them, they deserve it
minersdidit: well stockholm syndrome 101
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 800 @ 0.00095686 = 0.7655 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 27 @ 0.03417221 = 0.9226 BTC [-] {11}
minersdidit: tards think they are participating or buying a piece of "technology" lol all they are doing is transfering wealth from 1 party to another
TestingUnoDosTre: now you're just going all minarchist on us
minersdidit: ask yourself whose on the sell side when 50 people own almost all the coins?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 20 @ 0.05141349 = 1.0283 BTC [-] {5}
TestingUnoDosTre: you could say the same thing about... anything with value
TestingUnoDosTre: does everyone own equal amounts of oil
TestingUnoDosTre: how about gold
TestingUnoDosTre: real estate?
minersdidit: oil gets consumed
minersdidit: bitcoin has zero utility outside of its EXCHANGE value.
minersdidit: everything youve named has utility outside of exchange
TestingUnoDosTre: same thing with DOLLARS
minersdidit: dollars are needed to pay debts off
danielpbarron: (read: taxes)
TestingUnoDosTre: and gold?
TestingUnoDosTre: please explain the great utility of gold to me
minersdidit: gold is special because it has a high stock to flow ratio
danielpbarron: BTC is needed to pay BTC debts off
minersdidit: no other commodity has that property
benkay: what suckers have btc debts?
minersdidit: ie in 24hrs more gold is traded then mined in a given year
danielpbarron: wait what? gold is good for the same reason Bitcoin is bad??
minersdidit: so you never have supply surprises
benkay: give it 80 years, and bitcoin will be in the same position.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 33 @ 0.05020911 = 1.6569 BTC [-] {5}
minersdidit: bitcoin has no value outside of exchange
minersdidit: you cant do anything with a btc
benkay: 'cept of course send it to someone in argentina
[\]: can't do anything with a dollar
benkay: or colombia
minersdidit: if theres no liquidity the price collapses like now
TestingUnoDosTre: you seriosuly can't do much with gold
minersdidit: you cant do ANYTHING with btc
minersdidit: its not even something.
minersdidit: if theres no exchange liquidity the value tanks like now
TestingUnoDosTre: you can verify a certain hash of a file at a given time
nubbins`: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 355.68, Best ask: 356.89, Bid-ask spread: 1.21000, Last trade: 356.89, 24 hour volume: 61196.03807026, 24 hour low: 339.79, 24 hour high: 436.06, 24 hour vwap: 389.993712597
TestingUnoDosTre: and you can send a message
MisterE: god has some industrial uses too
nubbins`: dat rate
MisterE: it's being consumed slowly
benkay: holy fuck that's a descent rate
minersdidit: bitcoin has zero useage outside of its liquidity pool
nubbins`: TestingUnoDosTre: once is fine, spamming with it isn't ;)
[\]: who's the guy that keeps repeating the same statement over and over
[\]: oh, that's right, the troll
minersdidit: oh look dumbass is here
minersdidit: go back to #bitcoin
nubbins` yawns
[\]: oh look, jackass that has to name himself after his argument so he doesn't forget
akstunt600: hahha [\\\] hey [\\\]
Duffer1: his earlier talk about quantum economics gave me hope of interesting discussion, i was dissapointed
minersdidit: gmaxwell let you out of the basement today?
[\]: minersdidit, gmaxwell has nothing to do with me
danielpbarron: lol, quantum economics
[\]: gladd to see you still have a mancrush
minersdidit: arent you his bitch
TestingUnoDosTre: laughing at duffer, for the record
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 50 @ 0.04918049 = 2.459 BTC [-] {4}
Duffer1: hehe
[\]: ...No.
[\]: I do what I want, when I want. gmaxwell and I have no affiliation.
TestingUnoDosTre: what caused the flood of retard into this channel today?
minersdidit: whose taking bets on when the bitcoin core has another security fuckup
[\]: TestingUnoDosTre, its easy to be a bear when there's a downtrend.
[\]: They all disappear during the bull markets.
MisterE: The troll is strong here today, must be the exchange price has brought it out
danielpbarron: i've never even used Bitcoin Core; who cares
MisterE: ^ that
Duffer1: testing i was thinking it was one of the talk twitter heads mircea_popescu pissed off..
[\]: TestingUnoDosTre, MisterE, the trolls usually come out about now.
[\]: if you've been around for a few years, you notice the pattern.
minersdidit: hopefully this bear market leads to most of the devoplment team leaving. gavin going is a positive step
minersdidit: then we can make a decent bottom
akstunt600: wait untill newfag season
MisterE: this is my first dip with the #-assets crew :)
Duffer1: i actually hope the same thing miners
[\]: Gavin hasn't left. He's just not the lead dev.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 35 @ 0.04811428 = 1.684 BTC [-] {3}
MisterE: fun fun
[\]: MisterE, I'm sorry.
TestingUnoDosTre: <MisterE> samesies
benkay: by my count we're solidly in the middle of september, akstunt600
MisterE: wish it happened more often heh
akstunt600: hahahhaha benkay
minersdidit: this bear market wont end until most of the core developmeant team is gone and btc foundation closed
MisterE: oh newfag season must be even teh worst
TestingUnoDosTre: please don't associate those two entities together
[\]: lol
MisterE: never even thought of it
minersdidit: why not
minersdidit: its the same group of people
danielpbarron: idk, i like a lot of what minersdidit says
[\]: the ignore list grows by one
TestingUnoDosTre: it's like comparing the Winkelvii brothers with satoshi
benkay: core dev team and btc fundation are pretty tightly aligned
minersdidit: satoshi left because he realized the fucktards in the project and didnt want anything to do with them
MisterE: yea minersdidit is clearly not dumb
nubbins`: who's satoshi?
benkay: who's nubbins` ?
[\]: minersdidit, quotation needed.
nubbins`: oooooo
benkay: ka-zong
nubbins`: who IS me?
benkay: who even ams you!
MisterE: Satishi Whogivesafuck
gribble: I don't recognize you.
[\]: where did satoshi ever call Gavin a fucktard?
minersdidit: when he left
[\]: In fact, satoshi was the one that gave Gavin rights.
minersdidit: hence the leaving.
[\]: herpderp
minersdidit: gavin has been a disaster ever since fork, constant patches and fucked up releases
[\]: You've got your info wrong, in traditional troll fashion.
minersdidit: .9 lasted what 48hrs?
[\]: but who needs facts
minersdidit: before being exploitable
MisterE: minersdidit: why don't you code someting better
Duffer1: do you have any bitcoins minersdidit?
TestingUnoDosTre: has anyone been keeping tabs on any satoshi addesses, is s/he to blame for this downtrend?!?!?!
MisterE: easy to rip on others
[\]: .9 was barely exploitable.
MisterE: not so to create solutions
minersdidit: yea it lasted 2 days before .91
danielpbarron was completely uneffected by the "exploit"
[\]: and 2/3 of the internet was hit by it.
minersdidit: why was it in the software in the first place
[\]: so to make a fuss becaues bitcoin was caught is rather stupid
[\]: because RPC over SSL isn't a bad thing.
ozbot: The sins of the group of posers behind the so called “Bitcoin Foundation” pe Trilema - Un blog d
minersdidit: best article on the topic
Duffer1: do you have any bitcoins minersdidit?
danielpbarron: minersdidit: because a bunch of the devs are sucking up to FIAT and are trying to make Bitcoin jive well with the old system
minersdidit: no i sold months ago
TestingUnoDosTre: <---- lost all his bitcoins to Ukranian videochatters in 2010
[\]: Its easy to pull out quotes that are right when you make thousands of them. how about you point out all the quotes that were wrong?
minersdidit: whenever i saw bitcoin foundation mugs i knew i was doing the right thing
[\]: shittons of false claims
[\]: keep making claims until one comes true
[\]: ala jesus
minersdidit: go back to your basement dude
danielpbarron: can't say I don't wish I sold months ago
minersdidit: gmaxwell awaits
[\]: woah, did I outtroll the troll?
[\]: I think I did
TestingUnoDosTre: speaking of jesus... who's celebrating his resurrection this year with a fatty?
minersdidit: the fact is the developmeant team are tards and amateurs
[\]: since he had to go back to his gmaxwell boner
mircea_popescu: TestingUnoDosTre no way they took btc in 2010 ?!
mircea_popescu: [\\\] dude you come on like once a year and then to argue with my ignore list. wtf is this.
[\]: mircea_popescu, isn't it past your bedtime?
[\]: :p
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.048 = 0.48 BTC [-]
[\]: mircea_popescu: ikr
[\]: its the same troll
[\]: different nick
[\]: its cute , almost
benkay: must be spring break
[\]: probably some butthurt litecoin miner
benkay: tib, don't you have skirt to chase?
MisterE: Ukrainian cam girls on the BTC bleeding edge TestingUnoDosTre? I missed the golden age :/
TestingUnoDosTre: <mircea_popescu> ok maybe it didn't happen. just remembered someone posting an old scam of some person scamming for some allaged underage european chicks accepting bitcoin for videochat
mircea_popescu: wasn't that... taaki ?
mircea_popescu: [\\\]'s other gf ?
TestingUnoDosTre: please pull up the article... it was hilarious
MisterE: plot thickens
[\\\] sets mode: +r
TestingUnoDosTre: anything goes!!!
mircea_popescu: guy's not russian, he just has some skin condition.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 44 @ 0.0447519 = 1.9691 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 35 @ 0.02818544 = 0.9865 BTC [-] {15}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.0485 = 0.1455 BTC [+] {2}
TestingUnoDosTre: this chat returned to normalcy after I ignored minersdidit :(
Duffer1: he stopped talking :P
akstunt600: TestingUnoDosTre, Oh good it wasnt just you
benkay: wait 'till minersdiditi through minersdiditxiv show up
akstunt600: He was ...... interesting
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.0463675 = 0.2782 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 11 @ 0.025 = 0.275 BTC [-] {2}
[\]: see you in a year
minersdidit: later scumbag
akstunt600: hahhahha
[\]: akstunt600: so much more fun than pricetalk, eh?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 13 @ 0.04547002 = 0.5911 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 4827 @ 0.00014999 = 0.724 BTC [+] {2}
akstunt600: and more intelligible convos
akstunt600: I love it
MisterE: "exchanger_006: is it a good time to buy now guys? its looking like a huge pump?" // exchanger_006, Just burn your money you will at least get some BTUs out of it that way.
TestingUnoDosTre: alright but one thing he did mention that I was picturing last night was
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 805 @ 0.00079999 = 0.644 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 24 @ 0.025 = 0.6 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 179 @ 0.00084998 = 0.1521 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.58998 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.04500003 = 0.315 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.025 = 0.25 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 325 @ 0.0075 = 2.4375 BTC [+]
MisterE: ;;later tell minersdidit
gribble: The operation succeeded.
TestingUnoDosTre: hahahahah
TestingUnoDosTre: I want to buy more bitcoin, but I was a tid bit too impatient over the last couple weeks. Thoughts, words, advice?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.59 = 1.18 BTC [+]
minersdidit: buy mpex stock instead
ozbot: dpaste: #1776187
minersdidit: buy mirceas role playing game lmao
mircea_popescu: srsly ? coincrack ?
ozbot: Eulorum
minersdidit: 8months and thousands of btc later
Duffer1: i don't see a need to hate on eulora
minersdidit: well yea it was just a scam to take btc off people like all of mirceas listings
Duffer1: interesting
minersdidit: you must be new
Duffer1: that's unfortunately true
TestingUnoDosTre: can't believe I never have watched Huobi on bitcoinwisdom... this is like btcCrack
minersdidit: most of its volume is fake
MisterE: heh fake orders are fake
MisterE: they get pulled so much
MisterE: 750k LTC in 30 min yea right!
minersdidit: bobby lees brother runs it doesnt he
minersdidit: the troll who spawned litecoin
steven-__: btc china guys brother made ltc
MisterE: thoght bobby did
minersdidit: yea asians
minersdidit: theyll copy anything
MisterE: haha so true
minersdidit: charlie lee is touted as some type of inventor becuase he copy and pasted bitcoins source code lol
akstunt600: lol at that
akstunt600: i had to comment
akstunt600: ohhh minersdidit i think your touching on one of my theories
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9155 @ 0.00096132 = 8.8009 BTC [+] {2}
minersdidit: whats that
akstunt600: I think okcoin and huobi are in on it with CB
akstunt600: well less CB and more Charles lees
minersdidit: those arent even real exchanges
akstunt600: and others
akstunt600: like caleb chen etc
akstunt600: minersdidit, thats wha im saying they are gibling up cheap coins
minersdidit: the real exchanges on bitcoin have no volume
minersdidit: bitstamp is another sham as well youll never get large $$ out of it
minersdidit: unless you an insider
akstunt600: i use cryptsy
akstunt600: its small but it works
minersdidit: they dont have fiat
akstunt600: im small tho so its suiting
akstunt600: they will shortly
akstunt600: im stuuck on CB until then
MisterE: btce here
akstunt600: but again thats not even an exchange really
minersdidit: btce is alright
minersdidit: bitstamp is another mtgox in the making with those 2 scumbags running it imo
MisterE: for dodgy Bulgarians :p
akstunt600: hahhahah yup
danielpbarron has gone otc
minersdidit: dude otc is for people with 20 dollar trades
minersdidit: the fact that its 2014 and theres not a single reliable btc exchange that is safe
akstunt600: pretty ridiculous
minersdidit: wheres all the VC money too lol
akstunt600: its here
akstunt600: you wont see it on the exchanges tho
minersdidit: what about the transmission payments to the poor african farmer
MisterE: Vodaphone processes most of those now
MisterE: moves most of the money via mobile phone for rural South Africans I was reading recently
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