whaack[billymg|asciilifeform|asciilifeform]: awt: happy to update, let us know when
whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-02-18#1079962 << would like to , but i don't have the iron to do it on
whaack[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: (et all) what should i expect to pay in heathen hosting for 2 Ghz + processor, 4GB RAM, 2 TB SSD?
whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: derp, didn't meant o be typing in pestnet but i guess i'll continue here
asciilifeform: whaack: assuming q is re a genuine physical leased box; answr depends heavily on geography. also observe that most vendors give handful of particular setups, you cannot necessarily get x ram, y disk, etc
asciilifeform: whaack: in usa typical cost of a box as described is 200-300 $ last i knew
asciilifeform: (monthly)
asciilifeform: whaack: in eureich, moar. in ex-sovokistan, less
whaack[asciilifeform]: asciilifeform: ty
asciilifeform: np
whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: awt: signpost: Origin of Consciousness book... what a trip, thank you for the recommendation
whaack[asciilifeform]: still reading, at the part about the schizos
signpost[asciilifeform]: glad you're enjoying it.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: imho it and other works point to individual being emerging from the distributed meat computer processing language.
signpost[asciilifeform] has a blog post concerning this he oughta finally squeeze out, but it's one of those permanently dissatisfying ones, rewritten many times.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: whaack: has he discussed the "old gods" of say assyria going silent yet?
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: seems to me we're seeing a comparable breakdown post "death" of western god, silence of the atomic-soul-before-monogod. timely that we just had a breakthrough in consensus algorithms.
signpost[asciilifeform]: this was what motivated me to take part in the republic, the need for revolution in construction of self, but in hindsight it was a kind of cargo-cultism similar to ever-more-elaborate ritual engaged in by priesthoods to access the gods once they went silent.
signpost[billymg|asciilifeform]: nietzsche said this breakdown separates us into the "last men" and the "ubermensch". former is a shattered form, infantile and schizophrenic. perhaps jaynes' bicamerals, whatever precedes constructing an integrated self-narrative.
asciilifeform: signpost: could speculate re 'schizos supply the rare rng input, priests constructively interpret it to empower and fatten selves' etc. but difficult to anchor conclusively to fact
signpost[asciilifeform]: latter is a creature who can wield authorial voice. these aren't new, scattered throughout history.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: I considered mp one when he was well.
signpost[billymg|asciilifeform]: authorial here means in the deepest sense, authoring the *gods* of other men.
asciilifeform: it's a talent, like e.g. music, but the 'instrument' is meat
signpost[asciilifeform]: yeah, wouldn't disagree really.
asciilifeform: what kinda music gets played there, depends largely on what, if anything, the 'musician' believes in
asciilifeform: ( if 'nuffin' -- what yer left with is a coupla GB of cock pics, in the end )
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: deadliest is when the man believes reality submits to him.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: reality submits to nothing.
signpost[asciilifeform]: other men, sure.
signpost[asciilifeform]: this isn't much before the cosmos.
asciilifeform: not entirely 'to nothing', electron does not go 'where allah wills' entirely.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: yeah, if we're supposing there is something "authorial" at the base of reality, submission there too, but not to men.
asciilifeform: but folx w/ talent for 'moving meat' largely at the end of the day only interested in that, rather than anyffin else, is addictive, a la heroin
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg] considers this in the vicinity of "compulsive masturbator"
asciilifeform: aha, special case of compulsive masturbator, who uses hands of others instead of own.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: this "what the musician believes in" is difficult, of course.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: requires him to shed his clothes, etc., face the other, the classical heroes journey.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: *hero's
signpost[asciilifeform]: apparent in mp's output was "why shouldn't the entire world be destroyed at the moment of my death?"
signpost[asciilifeform]: hell, universe, however broad one wants
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: it's not arbitrary to a mind in this kind of destructive rebellion. it *should*. imho that says much.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: nietzsche called this something like "wanting revenge upon memory" iirc
asciilifeform: to narcissist, universe starts an' ends with.. him. 'newz at 11'
asciilifeform: (recall last decree of old man adolph, 'dynamite errything!!!')
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg] would expect one of these to say "what does it matter how things are left after I'm dead", yet, appears to matter.
signpost[asciilifeform]: belies something imho.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: if it didn't matter at all, why bother with dynamite. crunch the cyanide and get gone.
whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: signpost: no, don't think i've gotten to old gods dying yet, but i read late into the night barely being able to keep my eyes poen so it's possible i missed it
whaack[asciilifeform] will be rereading this book shortly
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: he'll get to discussing the role of old stone totems, etc., in conjuring hallucinatory voices.
whaack[asciilifeform]: signpost: pretty sure i have not gotten there
whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: so far the most mind blowing part of the book for me was his comments on what consciousness is not, and the idea that consciousness was installed ala software on the brain via language after the brain had been running for a while without conscoiusness installed
whaack[asciilifeform]: i have heard that kids who do not learn how to speak a language by age 5-7 or so can never learn to do so later in life
whaack[billymg]: i'm curious whether these kids who never learn a language are conscious, and whether the fact that you don't remember years 0-4 are intimately tied with the fact that you are still installing language software during those years
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: certainly wherever we decide to draw the line for consciousness, there are many such developmental boundaries which enable or preclude kinds of thought.
signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: say, learning to use the subjunctive, modeling other people's minds/drives/etc, dispassionately introspecting base impulses, so on.
signpost[asciilifeform] could easily believe that most of the things walking around don't meet the bar for long-dead civilizations, let alone those that recently walked on the moon.
asciilifeform is of the ''consciousness' is a phlogiston' school of thought, but realizes that not erryone is prepared to take this pill
signpost[asciilifeform]: the term's so overloaded it's a barrier to the question, too.
signpost[asciilifeform] certainly has no problem with the meat-net lacking such a thing as free choice.
signpost[asciilifeform]: what would a thought without a cause even be?