mircea_popescu: what the fuck, are we stupid or something ? been using this thing for years, i promote it as the solution, something;'s missing ?
herbijudlestoids: sounds like functionality is there
herbijudlestoids: and rate them
herbijudlestoids: sounds like all it needs is an extra piece of functionality, so each WoT node can talk to other WoT nodes
herbijudlestoids: anyone know if the existing WoT software is open source?
ThickAsThieves: so what youre saying is, the best way to model reputation systems, is like how they work IRL?!
mircea_popescu: which incidentally shows you a different path into why the periphery can not be the standardisation driver
mircea_popescu: this is how financial networks work : when standardisation goes down the periphery eats it.
herbijudlestoids: right, i guess you dont need the wot for everyone
mircea_popescu: liquidity in the periphery
herbijudlestoids: so the wot goes down and liquidity vanishes?
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: ok so the existing server eats shit somehow, and you have your backup, someone wants to sell you 50 BTC and they screw you somehow, you want to let others know by giving that person a negative rating but you cant
herbijudlestoids: ThickAsThieves: if each WoT is just a node in the graph it can be exactly so
mircea_popescu: Vexual i have no idea. the disadvantage of making tools for a reason rather than towards a purpose is that it's really up to the users to figure out how to wring all the utility out of them.
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: do you just wget the viewratings.php?
ThickAsThieves: so it's a wot of wots then
mircea_popescu: it uses the mpex "make your own backups if you're worried" model
mircea_popescu: i have a copy of the current wot. so can you
herbijudlestoids: ok well in that case its horizontally compatible and doesnt depend on any adoption, in fact would be quite useful in case for example catastrophe strikes the existing WoT server it might be stored on someone elses computer
mircea_popescu: most of the possibility of the world is locked away from most people most of the time.
mircea_popescu: the declaration of love that sunk cleopatra is not something every roman citizen could have made any time they felt like it.
herbijudlestoids: ThickAsThieves: i was thinking of something like that, maybe you can model existing WoTs as nodes in the graph
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids your fundamental presumption is that everyone is at all times in the position to make anything.
herbijudlestoids: ThickAsThieves: well if the inertia of the existing system means nobody uses it, then it fails at its fundamental goal of being a distributed WoT that derives its value from having lots of credible ratings
ThickAsThieves: well i was gonna say, why is driving adoption so integral to the goal
Vexual: never too retarded, might have to reword the question
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids no, it's not intelligence you lack, it's the experience that'd inform that intelligence.
mircea_popescu: but compare and contrast (by which i mean meditate upon) the alt coin with max keiser's alt coin and you'll perhaps you'll come to something.
mircea_popescu: the very proposition belies fundamental ignorance of the entire thing, which is why i object.
ThickAsThieves: maybe you paid some other somebody to do it
mircea_popescu: it's just that you're new here and haven't gone through the training process
mircea_popescu: THEN you go about making things.
mircea_popescu: in order to become somebody you become somebody, the steps are laid out
ozbot: Alby Mangels Adventure Bound THE WHOLE SERIES - YouTube
herbijudlestoids: for example, if everyone in -otc continues to use the centralised version, because they dont want to lose their existing rep, then what
ThickAsThieves: the name is horrible
mircea_popescu: also, for the people following s.mg progress : working towards finally moving most of the thing into eclipse
mircea_popescu: (reason i hilited him is cause eventualy once he gets through the logs he can tell me lol)
mircea_popescu: then shrug.
herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: thoughts on the freenet distributed WoT?
herbijudlestoids: if you wanted a distributed WoT, i would recommend a DHT underlying whatever the existing one is
ThickAsThieves: i feel like there are a dozen bitcoiners probly trying to make this a la blockchain and dont know it already exists
herbijudlestoids: theres no "servers"
herbijudlestoids: ThickAsThieves: its not bad these days, but yea a little hard for most users cos they have to stop spammers so each identity has a "cost", you gotta fill out a page of 9 captchas or something like that
ozbot: Katherine Bryan International Solo Flautist - YouTube
herbijudlestoids: ThickAsThieves: there is one on freenet
ThickAsThieves: <herbijudlestoids> except the entire thing is stored on some server --- recently ive been preaching need for a decentralized wot
Vexual: theres ten kinds ow fuckwits
herbijudlestoids: except the entire thing is stored on some server
herbijudlestoids: i guess the -otc WoT is a "DAC"
herbijudlestoids: hmm interesting, the bitcoin wiki lists "keyhotee" "a DAC replacement for OpenID"
ThickAsThieves: i can envision their dream, i just cant see it surviving in a real world
ThickAsThieves: the clearest case ive heard
ThickAsThieves: the closest i've come to distilling why
ThickAsThieves: there's a vid somewhere
herbijudlestoids: i love the tropics
Vexual: yah mon nya work pon the sabbath
gribble: The operation succeeded.
ozbot: Jungle Brothers "Because I Got It Like That" (album version) 1989 - YouTube
gribble: The operation succeeded.
ozbot: John McAfee warning about the use of appliances for security breach purposes - YouTube
Vexual: im emailing the pm
Vexual: send me the bill
ozbot: Parliament Funkadelic - Bring The Funk - YouTube
Vexual: whats the damage?
cazalla: not really, i don't get much opportunity to read the channel given new born i'm dealing with
cazalla: fish, rake, my mind went to poker, otherwise no
cazalla: i'll give him a rake so he can pretend to be pigsy in the backyard
cazalla: can't wait to show my son the series when he is a little older
cazalla: that's better, OG monkey is better than the remakes
ozbot: [Zhang Jizhong] Journey to the West (2011) - Episode 3 - YouTube
Vexual: i spend half my time injecting stem cells into getmans to give them a sense of humour
ozbot: German Court Says Registrars Are Responsible for Content on a Website | TheDomains.com
kakobrekla: http://www.thedomains.com/2014/02/07/german-court-says-registrars-are-responsible-for-content-on-a-website/
Vexual: youre the first guy im giving points to on wot
Vexual: i breathe morning keytones and feel sad
jurov: ok.. but srsly, y u no register in the wot?
Vexual: rate the karaken intelligent an resasobablwe
gribble: The operation succeeded.
ozbot: The Specials - Ghost Town - YouTube
Vexual: theres bitcoin culture when you get to leichhhardt
herbijudlestoids: i already looked it up and confirmed on the marrickville council website :D
Vexual: keeep sucking dicks you motherfucking cuntz
Vexual: i vomited vereywhere in the bank
herbijudlestoids: my mates live right near petersham stn and i have won the schnitzel challenge at the white cockatoo
herbijudlestoids: not at all? 2 stops on the train from central, could walk to newtown from here
Vexual: all the flange
Vexual: with the rabbit
Vexual: hes al about the cubic inches
herbijudlestoids: Vexual: saturday nights in -assets is hiphop night for the hermits lol
Vexual: you read the logs
herbijudlestoids: proper true 999 from the perth mint sort of gold :)
Vexual: id rather stay home but life happens
Vexual: i dont leave the house, ive gt more social phobias than duffer and that other cunt put together
herbijudlestoids: not that i dont appreciate the company :P
Vexual: yeah i discovered your problem when i was wathxcing the last season of rake, my fave barrister
herbijudlestoids: anyway vex, what the f are you doing home on a sat night
herbijudlestoids: im using the absolute latest flashplayer
herbijudlestoids: i think because the difficulty only updates on each new block, so there is flat parts in the timeseries
herbijudlestoids: punkman1: where the rate of change does not change for several datapoints (days)
herbijudlestoids: i.e. over any given 30 day window, 20% was the lowest amount difficulty grew and 100% was the largest amount
punkman1: what's with the flat parts
herbijudlestoids: 20% was the lowest ROC i found
ozbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
herbijudlestoids: so, i just calculated the 30 day ROC for bitcoin difficulty since the start of 2013
ozbot: PXE presents A placa de Ipanema feat. The Herd - YouTube
Vexual: im all about the quality management and a chalenge
herbijudlestoids: (any of them)
ozbot: Milow - Little in the Middle (Official Unplugged) - YouTube
herbijudlestoids: i dont plan on buying BTC until the volatility dies off, thought it might be doing so but the last week of action has proved me wrong
herbijudlestoids: benkay: the way i figure is iv already missed the initial wealth transfer...so why bother? if BTC takes over, i will be able to sell my human capital in BTC just as i now sell it in AUD
herbijudlestoids: the only profitable strategy i could think of is that i know the ATO has good treatment for options if theyre hedges to delta <0.3
benkay: enjoy your lifetime of servitude to the state
herbijudlestoids: exactly, if its treated like any other asset class then ceteris paribus trading in BTC has a higher cost base to me
herbijudlestoids: Vexual: how are you doing that stuff without the ATO up your arse? or are you compliant?
Vexual: i can get you btc agro forestry and all the shit
benkay: maintain your fiat investments the way you normally od
herbijudlestoids: its not about realising them
benkay: chetty: refusing to embrace the future will be the death of many things. apple is on that list.
herbijudlestoids: benkay: how is it realistic? lets say i want to split that 10k across my other investments, its immediately back in the financial system
ozbot: Bitcoin vs. Apple: Videos of Users Destroying Their iPhones Proliferate on YouTube | A Lightning War
chetty: http://libertyblitzkrieg.com/2014/02/07/bitcoin-vs-apple-videos-of-users-destroying-their-iphones-proliferate-on-youtube/
benkay: do you not have the resources to pull it off?
benkay: well yes, one must always sacrifice convenience on the altar of security. be it security from rogue computers or security from rogue regimes...
herbijudlestoids: theoretically, but its not really convenient
herbijudlestoids: if i take sell BTC to buy AUD i need to explain that to the tax office
herbijudlestoids: benkay: almost, the spike at 400 is a crazy swing in price at the 400th tick in the timeseries
benkay: so the spike at 400 is a crazy swing in price 400 ticks ago?
ozbot: Calvin Harris - Acceptable in the 80's (With Lyrics) - YouTube
Vexual: yeah im where daytraders make their money
herbijudlestoids: Vexual: what of it? New York close/New Zealand open is the 24h close
herbijudlestoids: like the charts you can see on mpex.co already, i just dont think theyre portraying useful info
herbijudlestoids: benkay: intraday mean reversion is basically betting against whatever just happened. if the price went down, you bet its about to go up.
herbijudlestoids: "why not time normalised" because MPEX doesn't really seem to operate like a regular exchange in terms of time and also there is not really enough trades happening in any given hour/4h/day block to make a realistic OHLC bargraph
herbijudlestoids: you dont "believe" in them? lol
herbijudlestoids: and then i take the rolling standard deviation of that value over the last 20 ticks
Vexual: wheres the wazardry?
herbijudlestoids: benkay: so the 20 tick log normal return is ln(CurrentTickPrice/TwentyTicksAgoPrice)
herbijudlestoids: its the 20 tick standard deviation of 20 tick log normal returns
benkay: need more context. what is the index axis?
jayk: On November 22, 1987, an unidentified man wearing a Max Headroom mask intercepted the signals of two television stations in Chicago.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
benkay: ;;later tell asciilifeform http://www.greenarraychips.com/ the greenarray chips begin to approach your dream of computation fabric. they're obviously lacking in some important area, but i'll have to ask you about that later.
herbijudlestoids: volatility on MPOE, http://imgur.com/MixUdTD ...otherwise known as "why intraday mean reversion is probably not safe"
jayk: there was that strange sat transmission broadcasted over america...
benkay: my partner recently went out for lunch with the gentleman who came up with Forth. he apparently cut his teeth hacking into satellites, implementing Forth with their op codes and then deploying better-than-launched-with flight control software.
ozbot: ICE/ISEE-3 to return to an Earth no longer capable of speaking to it | The Planetary Society
herbijudlestoids: vex got into the vodka
benkay: I am fucking the nanny!
Vexual: who are you the fucking nanny?
benkay: macy's fucked up their cerrrrt
herbijudlestoids: hmm nah i guess that explains it, iv never seen mining hardware good for ROI before and i guess this isnt either
herbijudlestoids: there is a bit down the bottom where the guy says something about having 10 of them
benkay: Delivery Date -- This is a PRE-ORDER, now on Batch 2 Round 1, all further orders are available for dispatch Late April 2014.
herbijudlestoids: nope, check the page
punkman1: these folks are multiplying
herbijudlestoids: this isnt the exact one i saw, but yea, sold as new http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Prospero-X-1-100Gh-s-Bitcoin-Mining-ASIC-Miner-New-In-Box-/111270548942?pt=AU_Components&hash=item19e83dd5ce
herbijudlestoids: but the machines only just came out?
benkay: implying that the man in question simply doesn't know that he's dead yet.
herbijudlestoids: ah, as in difficulty rising faster than expected will mean it cant ROI? i guess so, the calculation i used assumed 50% increase/month in difficulty
herbijudlestoids: specifically, last night i saw on ebay, a prospero x-1 100GH/s for 650AUD when the BTC/AUD price was 780...
herbijudlestoids: well i was just curious about your guys opinions, since its the first time iv ever seen a mining rig for sale that was able to ROI since...since GPUs were the thing
benkay: well i'm intrigued to hear what you have to say but i suspect the long and the short of it is going to be 'unless you get the hardware or juice at a discount the breakeven is never'
herbijudlestoids: and last night i actually noticed there were miners for sale that were ROI more BTC than they were worth
herbijudlestoids: i just developed a piece of software in december and we are going to demo it to ...a very large linux org next week, they are creaming their pants whenever our CEO mentions it
herbijudlestoids: that is the plan, weve had a few buyout offers already but have to keep pushing them back as we grow
benkay: i'm mostly curious about how other web-tech consulting operations break out pricing
herbijudlestoids: might not be the latest ver but should be close to
herbijudlestoids: took off from there
herbijudlestoids: well, apparently...basically i was just a regular sysadmin who knew puppet, and one large org needed a guy who knew puppet...i ended up deploying the pilot and first production phase
benkay: i'll grill you about your biz all night, friend. i just hit a wall on this thing and ran out of brain at the exact same time.
herbijudlestoids: this is the smallest company iv ever worked for, usually i work for large research organisations and unis building this kind of stuff
herbijudlestoids: we dont provide a public cloud benkay, we build the public cloud for companies that want it ;)
herbijudlestoids: i split my time pretty much equally between them, 9-5ish at the company and 6-~bedtime researching, reading news, etc and then i will place trades on NY close
herbijudlestoids: full disclosure benkay, like i said to kako the other day, i got a regular day job in a small company doing large scale openstack ops and iv been trading (mostly EOD) since 2008
benkay`: it's SO MUCH FUN to be technically correct in a room full of hipsters, and similarly great fun to say it the way the rest of the world does in a room of nerds.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
benkay`: ;;later tell mircea_popescu now for a tcp test harness. on one hand, 'yak shaving'. on the other hand, things worth doing are worth doing well.
Vexual: did you buy the godlike generator?
benkay`: what's the grand total of rentalstarter sold?
punkman1: "He threatened to set off a bomb with a cellphone if his demands were not met, but the crew fooled him — and the other passengers — into thinking the plane had landed in Sochi when it was actually in Istanbu"
chipug: so many headlines re fancy opening for sochi and very few about the hijacker that tried to get a plane to fly into it
Namworld: If price had went up, even if it didn't go to over 5000, the price the PUTs were sold would have been more than their execution value, so the seller would be in the money.
Namworld: The puts were sold into MPEx bids. Although the strikes were 4100-5000 USD per BTC, the price those PUTs were sold meant it was only at a small loss at time of sale. So if prices went up, profits, if price went down, losses.
punkman1: Perlboy: might be a good exercise to do the math yourself
Perlboy: cause there's conjecture as to whether the bitcointalk thread actually understands correctly
Perlboy: BingoBoingo, punkman1 is this based on the Bitcointalk thread or actual confirmation from mircea_popescu?
duduqa: changed the password
duduqa: well, I´m the same hlpshuehue
BingoBoingo: With steps along the way
punkman1: Perlboy, someone bet big on BTC price going up by the end of February
Perlboy: 'rather than make you repeat' <-- Which I suspect you wouldn't. :)
Perlboy: if so, was it explained what it meant? Some peeps in another channel are confused and just trying to determine if i should go back track through my logs rather than repeat the same thing over and over again
Perlboy: hi mircea_popescu, has someone come in here and asked about the assbot big put contract flows a day or two ago?
chipug: hplshuehue: you should change your password just so no one else can use it either
hplshuehue: I gave up a more enthusiastic participation in the brazilian bitcoin community
hplshuehue: Hi there
hplshuehue: Thank you, Mr. Mircea Popescu, and thanks everyone for helping the growth/spread/development of bitcoin
punkman1: kinda hard to get it right on the grill though
mircea_popescu: chetty i hear they're very smart.
chipug: they ^ wash like cats
chipug: that's the japanese chin
mircea_popescu: isn't this the dog that catlicks itself ?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: They probably pay better than people trading on Cryptsy do
mircea_popescu: isn't the doge some japan dog ?
asciilifeform: besides, they needn't travel far. chinese will 'convert them to rabbits and squirrels' for hatters.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: That might be the most efficient option.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: pack the skins in a crate?
chipug: ThickAsThieves: i prefer this to the other name.. i think it's nicer when there's a meaning behind names for things.
ThickAsThieves: In Buddhism, alms or almsgiving is the respect given by a lay Buddhist to a Buddhist monk, nun, spiritually-developed person or other sentient being. It is not charity as presumed by Western interpreters. It is closer to a symbolic connection to the spiritual realm and to show humbleness and respect in the presence of the secular society.
asciilifeform: (and if some joker already hooked up the asics, it'd be pointless)
mircea_popescu: lol bitcoin is the ultimate in candy i swear.
mircea_popescu: o look, the usps dildo
BingoBoingo: Altcoin is flying up, straight into the sun!