cerelenius: thats what occured in florence as well, you had the biggest prosperity ever yet they ended up imploding since the commoner couldnt afford to run a family
mircea_popescu: cerelenius that's fine, brains distribute about the same way.
cerelenius: the same thing under 100% gold standard
Vexual: floating a theory is free dickhead
davout: mircea_popescu: you forgot to mention the derp hour apparently
greenspan_fan: what is buying anything, then?
mircea_popescu: <greenspan_fan> all monetary is jewish monetary theory << actually it's gypstalian
cerelenius: i meant lending them
greenspan_fan: then don't invest in bitcoin. You'll get better returns with your trailer park meth lab.
mod6: fountainhead was ok. i think 'we the living' was better if you must.
greenspan_fan: cerelenius usury is what deadbeats call it when they can't meet the interest payments (because they're deadbeats), let alone the principal
Bugpowder: Or watch the movie
antephialtic: if you really must read a long one, read the fountainhead, its a lot better than atlas shrugged.
antephialtic: if you're going to read a rand book, read anthem, its much shorter and gets all her ideas across without 1200 pages of terrible dialogue
kakobrekla: jurov you wanna admin the thing?
davout: cerelenius: actually bitcoin is jewish in the sense that you're not invited
greenspan_fan: all monetary is jewish monetary theory
cerelenius: bitcoin is 100% jewish monetary theory, hoard coins and watch them swell in value while adding zero value
mircea_popescu: in the pudding.
B007: where is the business?
mircea_popescu: there's like comedy hour, finance hour, porn hour
davout: go trade them on gox
davout: mircea_popescu: are there?
mircea_popescu: davout there are smart jews ?
davout: mircea_popescu: wrong, the smart jews don't have anything left in gox since 2011
mircea_popescu: the jews will be affected.
greenspan_fan: and what about the jews?!?!?!?!?!?!?
Vexual: kakobrekla, how much do i owe on the dukebox?
mircea_popescu: white/blue shirts with lines, and the dots on white on the guy on left ? it's fucking outrageously unflattering.
mod6: it was nice addendum to the first list you made tho. but yeah.
mircea_popescu: jurov what i don't understand is... why are all those black guys dressed like if they were white ?
greenspan_fan: jesus, are you writing an article for your local freeman-on-the-land tabloid?
mircea_popescu: we need a motherfuckingspec.
mircea_popescu: mod6 barely scratches the surface, really.
cerelenius: mircea_popescu: can you comment on the foundation collapsing?
mod6: speaking of dev, i thought the most recent list of defects was pretty spot on. account naming issues, et. al.
davout: into anything anyway, don't even know who the fuck you are
mircea_popescu: greenspan_fan considering what counts for development these days that should increase the btc price.
cerelenius: davout: jews have a tendency for causing chaos, it goes back to choosing barabas in the new testament..
davout: cerelenius: is there something wrong with being jewish?
mircea_popescu: yes, it is often the case entire groups of millions of people are more clever.
greenspan_fan: It would be interesting to know how many of the dev team had money on gox
cerelenius: btce is russian run they are more clever
cerelenius: mircea_popescu: why do you think the foundation gets taken down?
cerelenius: bitstamp is a pita to withdraw from 5k+ they turn it into a huge Q&A session
cerelenius: the irony here is the exchange where nobody knows the owner ends up lasting the longest(btce)
Bugpowder: V is the worst
cerelenius: winklevoss had their own wallet...
cerelenius: mircea_popescu they held coins at gox?
mircea_popescu: it's possible this blow actually takes out the bitcoin foundation scamgroup,
mircea_popescu: toffoo most of the people clueless enough to have been exposed will probably be rescued by their investors now, a la second market.
toffoo: it's going to bite at least somebody big out there
cerelenius: his cabal took them
toffoo: any guesses here on "collateral damage" of gox collapse? who will be the 3rd-party businesses/services who will now collapse because they had coins/funds tied up at gox?
cerelenius: up until the fall 2013
cerelenius: well yea but they were honoring btc withdrawals
cerelenius: is the 700k stolen figure true? how does that even make sense
cerelenius: mircea: care to comment on the price thnx
mircea_popescu: basically the french strike me as the sort of people who'd be in favour of a government accuplation scheme.
davout: on an unrelated note the french are in favor of internet big brothering -> http://www.lefigaro.fr/flash-eco/2014/02/25/97002-20140225FILWWW00021-les-francais-pour-la-surveillance-d-internet.php
mircea_popescu: but im not in the business of quantifying such.
mircea_popescu: maybe if you were mtgox cca 2011 and had 9x% of the market you could bring the arugment that it's nonsense to empower errors by going outside
davout: at least on the x.eur side that's something that you could quantify
mircea_popescu: it wouldn't make sense no matter how large the market is, because you arguably can still control it.
davout: wouldn't it make sense if the market was larger?
greenspan_fan: "If you’re sad about your bitcoins losing all their value, maybe you should have put out more lands so you could bring them out earlier." -- @deliciousbees
davout: and that it would theoretically possible to use the future's implied spot to get the collateralization requirement
davout: we were discussing the basket, and how mtgox was kinda ruining it
mircea_popescu: Bugpowder that'll be announced then
davout: mebbe other that i forget/don't know about
davout: greenspan_fan: there's assbot, ozbot, gribble
Vexual: im the orb
Vexual: or g* is five or ten rather than 3.45565
davout: still gotta work on the bot
davout: not there :D
mircea_popescu: some gap there.
davout: i hope my 300 EUR/BTC bid gets to feel the pain too
nubbins`: the satoshi%
mircea_popescu: pretty sure he's in the 100 archons, and pretty sure there's over 100k people with some bitcoin dust somewhere.
Vexual: the viking?
Bugpowder: If only Lawsky had rolled out the bit license earlier
nubbins`: occasionally other people do it too
nubbins`: i face backwards if i'm the first person to get in
gribble: Aerosmith - Love In An Elevator - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3Yrhv33Zb8>; Love in an Elevator - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_in_an_Elevator>; AEROSMITH LYRICS - Love In An Elevator - A-Z Lyrics: <http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/aerosmith/loveinanelevator.html>
mircea_popescu: how about banning fucktards from taking the elevator with you
nubbins`: A Goldman spokesman, after being told that @GSElevator had been unmasked, said in a statement, “We are pleased to report that the official ban on talking in elevators will be lifted effective immediately.”
antephialtic: mircea_popescu: what is the source that all winklevosses money was in gox
ninjashogun: guys I've received some suggestions to "lurk" and "read logs" here, which I wouldn't really have time to do. It was nice meeting you all though and I may be back as the project progresses. Overall I don't think I will be spending a ton of time building WoT, advisors, etc - as I have real-world references for the moment that I would expect anyone to consutl.
mircea_popescu: course they probably get a free pass from investors
mircea_popescu: extent of the damage not quite known yet.
ninjashogun: mircea_popescu, your own net worth is quite up there from your exchange site? (With all its glorious stylesheets)?
Bugpowder: In other news. http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/02/24/gselevator-tattletale-exposed-he-was-never-in-the-goldman-elevator/?hp
ninjashogun: mircea_popescu, when you said above that this channel was worth "over $1b" I didn't takei t seriously as if it has like 500 regulars then just a couple of people worth $50M - or a single Internet billionaire who drops in sometimes - would account for that
mircea_popescu: ninjashogun i think it just looks for the <title> element in html
mircea_popescu: what have i been reading the wrong books ?
mircea_popescu: Bugpowder how the fuck does that work man. on my list breast cancer is one where early discovery has the greatest impact. in there with skin cancer.
ozbot: Log In - The New York Times
Bugpowder: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/25/business/apparent-theft-at-mt-gox-shakes-bitcoin-world.html?smid=tw-share&_r=3
ninjashogun: lnovy - if it's any consolation, they just came out with a 128 GB micro sd card.
mircea_popescu: and what they did wrong.
mircea_popescu: o hey. didja help all the people buying mtgox debt learn a lesson ? lol
ninjashogun: mircea_popescu, I guess you just wrote the beautiful front-end right :)
mircea_popescu: i still dunno why they've never been seriously implemented.
mircea_popescu: antephialtic i'd rather see Cramer-Shoup myself.
Namworld: It's only gox, the rest will recover
Namworld: For the sake of speculators dropping out/news/etc, damage is done.
joecool: mircea_popescu: again i don't use them either, the lack of support though isn't from waryness, it's from the number of old gnupg clients in the wild
Namworld: What the hell is going on? I leave for a few hours and the whole Bitcoin world goes to ashes?
antephialtic: davout: thanks for the tip, going to try to set that up
benkay: there is only lisp.
joecool: until then, openpgp smartcard for me
joecool: i'm using 4096-bit RSA for the forseeable future, but ecdsa seems attractive if i can write a javacard implementation to work on my yubikey neo
davout: antephialtic: you can already have the same feature if you trade x.eur on mpex
mircea_popescu: joecool im suspicious as al lfuck of the entire thing.
joecool: mircea_popescu: depends on the curve chosen
davout: (the localbitcoins thing)
davout: oh nice, i didn't the dip
mircea_popescu: what i hear is they moved something like 10k armored vehicles so far today.
mircea_popescu: sheet's getting warm there.
mircea_popescu: http://www.debka.com/article/23704/Russian-units-transferred-from-securing-the-Sochi-games-to-the-Ukraine-border
benkay: in other news, i'm talking about lisp at the Portland Python night this month. if there are any Portlanders listening, you should come and NOT TALK ABOUT BITCOIN FFS.
joecool: mircea_popescu: congrats on mpex outliving yet another exchange
mircea_popescu: then again this seemed geared for africa
benkay: unlike the vcs, i suppose
mircea_popescu: let the man have fun.
benkay: this is what is wrong with the planet
greenspan_fan: it's the new thing
Bugpowder: mircea_popescu: Nope, it sounds like a good idea, but I don't think it will really work. the reason the pregnancy ones work is the hormone level goes up >1000x. MMPs are not that unregulated, maybe 2-3x by volume? Need to read the paper but I imagine the ROC curve is pretty ugly.
mircea_popescu: and you can see then.
ninjashogun: greenspan_fan, so first of all obviously you would not give a cash to a pseduonmn :) We can get in touch if appropriate. Could you tell me a bit about yourself - do you have any investments in startups to date? (or been involved iwth one)? Do you like matheatics or theoretical computer science?
greenspan_fan: mircea_popescu when did the SEC come knocking?
mircea_popescu: this is the forum.
ninjashogun: so out of a $50K investment, probably a few hundred would go to server costs and $47K would sit in the bank for six months. while we build it (Though I know that is not what investors like to hear)
mircea_popescu: no, this is the real forum.
ninjashogun: it's all software, we have jobs at the moment
ninjashogun: So what I was tihnking is that this isn't a real 'forum' (in that most IRC channels are basically just trolls etc) and that I would just escalate to another form of contact (skype etc) and be in touch while it gets rolled out
ninjashogun: Duffer1, thanks for the feedback
ninjashogun: again, this is the idea that caused this startup to be created this week. (I did consult with advisors the last week or two about it.)
ninjashogun: Duffer1 I can PM you the specific graph application (in gerneral terms)
mircea_popescu: and while that is unfortunate, it's nevertheless what it is.
mircea_popescu: i get that this doesn't help you any in the sense of getting you to do what you want to do
mircea_popescu: ninjashogun listen, you're really misbehaving here, albeit perhaps unintentionally. the correct approach is to lurk and read the logs for about half a year. then you'll be in a position to meaningfully engage th dragons here.
ninjashogun: And for a bit of information, the team is distributed - he is in Kentucky and I am from Boston
ninjashogun: Here is the other person's profile that he responded with: "I am a full stack web/desktop/mobile developer. Currently my weapon of choice is C# for the back end stuff, and JavaScript for the front end. I am also versed in Objective-C (I have three apps on the app store). Daily my bread and butter is developing web apps. Lately I've been developing cross-platform mobile games. I have a degree in Math, so I know just a bit of graph theory... this
greenspan_fan: I get really sick of people defending btc-dev not doing important things because they're "probably" np-complete
mircea_popescu: (do you know how to review the logs ?)
mircea_popescu: review the logs for various lulz.
mircea_popescu: ninjashogun for the other part of your question, i would say everyone speaking here knows a lot of math.
asciilifeform: folks who think they have an efficient solution to an np-complete problem should not settle for small change.
mircea_popescu: davout you two can work together.
mircea_popescu: if you manage to insert it into the next round of ycombinator a la sokal, you get a bonus.
mircea_popescu: "Ice-breaking ships help keep Chesapeake Bay waters safe" <<< check out all the global warming.
mircea_popescu: but you're nowhere near the zone.
mircea_popescu: ninjashogun they're also inclined to play, something vc's aren't normally. ATC got started because people were bored and so far cost about 50k or thereabouts.
ninjashogun: mircea_popescu, it doesn't matter if they're worth $10M altogether or $10B. As long as at least one person here has a portfolio and is interested in startups
mircea_popescu: nevertheless, i'll bet you're not getting a dime so far.
ninjashogun: antephialtic - No, I don't want to specify it here. It's not about solving an unsolved problem, but rather applying existing theory in a novel way.
mircea_popescu: ninjashogun people here are worth well over a billion all together.
copumpkin: and the good people aren't looking
ninjashogun: Yes, but we have an innovation they don't.
antephialtic: can you specify the specific graph theory problem you are trying to solve? (other than simple bipartate matching)
ninjashogun: the moment I announce on hackernews (hwere I have a profile) at the right time of day, I will have some sign-ups
copumpkin: and several others I've seen
greenspan_fan: since the netflix for prostitutes was immediately rejected by y combinator
copumpkin: lots of other people want in too
greenspan_fan: my idea for a start-up involves me applying to thousands of places for remote work, then farming out the resulting offers to india
ninjashogun: So I am looking for a roughly $50K investment (nominal, could be less). Is anyone here in a position to conssider that, has a portfolio and has been involved iwth other startups in the past? An interest in mathematics (specifically graph theory) helps immensely.
nubbins`: tier 2 job search for people who know they're not up to snuff
nubbins`: as cheeky as that sounds, you're actually onto something there
copumpkin: and one of them had high expertise, low desirability, and the other had low expertise high desirability
mircea_popescu: let's not confuse the two.
nubbins`: unfortunately all these people are in btc ;(
ninjashogun: No other site does this - other sites just are glorified text searches or databse searches.
nubbins`: some people don't want the best and brightest, they just want people who can do an okay job
antephialtic: isn't that just the stable marriage problem?
ninjashogun: This is the issue that we solve.
ninjashogun: mircea_popescu, that is the problem we have solved.
ThickAsThieves: no one wants to fill out another resume
greenspan_fan: mircea_popescu not a fan of string theory?
mircea_popescu: ninjashogun but how do you account for flexibility in either side ?
nubbins`: bad news for the imgur giraffe tho
greenspan_fan: you don't need business, just data. Cash out and pass the buck to facebook or whomever
ninjashogun: mircea_popescu, the specific problem we're solving is "connecting jobs with job-seekers". I.e. finding the best qualified candidate for an employer, or the place to work for a job-seeker. BETTER than a text search where they both just blurt out what they need (exactly) on the part of the employer or everything they have done (exactly) on the part of the job seeker.
ninjashogun: greenspan_fan, I don't think so. I am sure every job site would be open to us sending people to their ads :)
mircea_popescu: ninjashogun specifically, what is the problem you are solving ?
copumpkin: you can then multiply graphs with unusual semirings to get more interesting behavior
ninjashogun: Duffer1, then when we have a set of profiles and a critical mass, we can get listings ourselves directly, and get the money from them. However, there has to be content initially.
greenspan_fan: ninjashogun the scraping part could be a thing unto itself
nubbins`: 5 if you want, all the rules still work
ninjashogun: Duffer1 - hi, Duffer1 . The business plan is to get profiles for free, based on the novel application, which will cause people to want to upload their profiles to us, and use them to fill vacancies scraped from other sites. (Meaning for starters the other sites get the money from it.)
copumpkin: mircea_popescu: well, there's an obvious interpretation of a square matrix as a graph
mircea_popescu: you can generalise the graph space neh ?
mircea_popescu: Duffer1 it's a start-up, what business plan. they maybe have an idea is all.
greenspan_fan: but I always conceptualized pagerank for instance as being essentially graph theoretic in nature
ninjashogun: So just to put this in context I have just connected this week with the other mathetician I am creating this site with, so it is a very fresh startup opportunity. To whoever asked about the means of investing, standard terms as you would suggest based on hearing abou thte opportunity etc.
greenspan_fan: also, idk how they teach qm in romania, but you can get by OK without knowing matrix mechanics
mircea_popescu: ninjashogun basically everyone's point is that regardless how you personally look at it, mathematic reality is accessible to everyone on their own terms.
ThickAsThieves: all design uses grid theory, coincidence?
ninjashogun: database queries are applied set theory. Ours is different, it's based on graph theory and is a very novel application that results in much better matches ,and ALSO a good reason for people to upload their profiles.
ninjashogun: No, keyword search doesn't use graph theory. It uses set theory. (In the form of database design)
mircea_popescu: greenspan_fan in the sense al qm uses matrixes, sure.
greenspan_fan: are you on crack? all search uses graph theory
greenspan_fan: better than search based on graph theory?
ninjashogun: WhatsApp just sold for $16Billion, and there is a huge bubble in the valley . technical jobs are very scarce. we have 1) something much better than search, based on graph theory (without sayin gmore) and 2) a reason people will upload their profiles for this reason :) We can get a lot of technical profiles just from launch / announcements (on hacker news etc)
Bugpowder: Couldn't see the shut down coming
Bugpowder: The BITCOIN ORACLE
ThickAsThieves: i trolled the guy enough you'd think he'd have learned...
fract4l: Apocalyptic: hey, personally i think the camel picture is hilarious....
ThickAsThieves: <ThickAsThieves> OneFixt did you at least diversify into other exchanges already?
ninjashogun: Not much ThickAsThieves . I'm raising $50K for a new job web site based on applied graph theory (not to relationships/connections - something else)
fract4l: mircea_popescu: haha... i suppose so. maybe your picture on the camel made people not take you seriously?
copumpkin: but he thinks the same about me
fract4l: interesting that MP, the #1 hated guy on the forums, turns out to have more integrity then anyone thought......
mircea_popescu: just... whatever, it's there.
mircea_popescu: if anything ima take the website down eventually.
mircea_popescu: a large chunk of the way i designed mpex is so as to empower people to grow their own stuff
mircea_popescu: greenspan_fan but srsly, it's legitimate. if you think you can help some people do shit, help them. nothing wrong with that.
mircea_popescu: i just got an email from a friend, it goes "hey can i have like 10-20 bux worth of bitcoin cause im testing this service and i lost all the btc i mined on my laptop back in the day"
benkay: copumpkin you missed the part about accumulation.
mircea_popescu: provided he didn't lose the laptop
benkay: that's why the accumulation's important, mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves inasmuch as one intends to measure sophistication, bitcoin holdings alone would show on the historical record an insufficient measure.
benkay: they are accredited by virtue of having and accumulating bitcoins
Bones_: greenspan_fan - if anything his website exudes "dude who knows what the fuck he is doing". Not to suck your dick or anything mp but anyway that's how I saw the website
greenspan_fan: putting it another way, given your thoughts re: art, you could consider patronizing some pre-autistic teenager with a color palette and a dream