mircea_popescu: wao-ender what the hell is that
asciilifeform: there is one author, chetty?
mircea_popescu: then there's crystal space, which is a collection of tools including networking and tons of other stuff
mircea_popescu: nah, there's cal3d, which is a gfx library mostly. open source.
asciilifeform: yes, i saw the bit about the uncooperative graphics libs, etc. but who wrote the remainder?
thestringpuller: lol a lot Diablo 2 players with they could type with one hand
ninjashogun: mircea_popescu, I've had private conversations that were just fine. It's true that you disagree with my approach and have clout here, you certainly set the tone in here, that's your right.
ninjashogun: mircea_popescu, well, this does not match my impression of conversations off of this channel. You seem to be the only one with a very strong view. I would humbly submit that it is due to your strong interest in one particular financial model. Of course if you start swearing at me people will dislike me.
ninjashogun: BingoBoingo - trust models can't be programmatic, or they will be games. For example someone will set up $10K just to spend on interest as they do hundreds of transactions with trusted members over a year - the only goal being to be given a $200K transaction that they then walk off with. You can't build trust programmatically.
BingoBoingo: ninjashogun: People don't have a "WoT score" they have personalize networks. The score is the least relevant part of a WoT
BingoBoingo: The used real world contracts to defraud, when they should have implemented a strong trust model
ninjashogun: yeah mircea_popescu, I just heard of an exchange that might have just walked off with millions in deposits, because rather than rely on real world contracts to protect creditors (people who deposit) it just built an online trust model.
BingoBoingo: ninjashogun: Well just this afternoon someone supposed a deal, I took and and the thing was resolved in minutes.
ninjashogun: nubbins`, why is it a benefit for you that that even exists? (For cases where there is a real world identity behind both sides)
ninjashogun: I don't need 'any size loan' and we could look at the budget breakdown together as well - I would expect it to be based on real world identities and paperwork, not IRC.
ninjashogun: sorry, nubbins`, just read the backlog now. I was chatting with a couple of people sorry.
nubbins`: not enough of them in one spot for a queue to be necessary
nubbins`: the elderly and infirm be damned!
nubbins`: they're trying to phase out home delivery now, and move everyone to neighbourhood "supermailboxes"
mircea_popescu: maybe if the post office quit being a whore it'd actually not go bankrupt every 15 years.
mircea_popescu: nevertheless the net worth, average expenditure etc of married women exceeds that of prostitutes.
mircea_popescu: consider the situation of prostitutes. while fucking random men for money is in fact more income than your average married woman makes on a day by day basis, cash in hand basis
mircea_popescu: but if you gave it up suddenly the post office wouldn't be floundering anymore.
mircea_popescu: perhaps i'm being silly, but i suspect there's actually a hidden barb in there. ie, superficially it seems there's too much money to give in,
nubbins`: i'd be able to take the "no flyers please" sign off my mailbox
nubbins`: guess this means the price of stamps is going up
nubbins`: interesting that they chose that for a headline, rather than "Canada Post now vetting and censoring addressed admail"
BingoBoingo: I've probably talked mean to him in the past
BingoBoingo: Maybe Usagi's Eternal bond can buy into the gambling loan from hell.
BingoBoingo: The problem with that loan structure known is it is easy to compile hypothetical losing bets after the fact
mircea_popescu: and to top it all off, i actually took the time to point out to him the previous beggar that ended up here drug in by the openbsd story
pLambert: getting a BTC loan is easy ... paying it back is the hard part!
mircea_popescu: pLambert we've not even come to the part where he's taking a BTC denominated loan.
mircea_popescu: of course they're recorded.
pLambert: oh, wait, these things are recorded?
mircea_popescu: then copme back a week later going "hey guise pls charity ???"
mircea_popescu: "Feb 25 08:13:06 <ninjashogun>guys I've received some suggestions to "lurk" and "read logs" here, which I wouldn't really have time to do. It was nice meeting you all though and I may be back as the project progresses. Overall I don't think I will be spending a ton of time building WoT, advisors, etc - as I have real-world references for the moment that I would expect anyone to consutl."
pLambert: I don't understand, why would you take a personal loan to finance your business instead of having your business get the loan it needs?
asciilifeform: ninjashogun: for instance, if you were to reveal what the hardware is, i might take pity and tell you how to obtain an equivalent for 17 instead of 17k usd.
jborkl: you would be better off going to the lending subsection on bitcointalk
mircea_popescu: anyway, taking ideas on how exactly one manages to help the dunning-kruger crowd of entrepreneurs.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo no, because the hip thing to do is to come here each week and not wot, and then ask mp to tone it down a bit
asciilifeform: i'm genuinely curious what this fellow intends to do with the money
ninjashogun: to myself, as a personal loan. I would like to do it this way because the company has become much more valuable, has assigned IP assets, etc. It doesn't make sense to raise a small amount of company by the company.
mircea_popescu: it's been the ruin of an entire generation.
mircea_popescu: personally i blame the school system. this new idea whereby instead of beating them every time they fail to consult the dictionary upon encountering an unknown world they're encouraged to guess "based on context" what "it might mean"
ninjashogun: asciilifeform, I would like to bootstrap a bit farther and need to make further milestones that have a nontrivial cost for me.
ninjashogun: asciilifeform, because that was over a year ago, and that was to the company.
pLambert: mircea_popescu: do we need another trilema post about how things are supposed to work?
asciilifeform: if financed, then why ask?
ninjashogun: mircea_popescu, well, considering that the startup has already been financed to an extent, your statement is false. Something can't be unfinanceable if it has been financed.
asciilifeform: is the intended implication that... you don't intend to?
ninjashogun: asciilifeform, I don't think a bank loan can be used to finance what I'm doing. If it could there would be no need for angels in the world.
ninjashogun: likewise, the person that I basically actually have done all the legwork with, shared many forms of contact, etc, and agreed on basic terms - I also met online (different channel.)
asciilifeform: ninjashogun: perhaps you have mistaken the address. loan lives at bank.
ninjashogun: last week or w/e I also connected with people. Didn't find the right match. Different people could be in here now.
mircea_popescu: yeah it was like "i'm shooting this pencilneck" "dude what the fuck do you care about some random us pencilneck. go to peru, build there."
mircea_popescu: ended up with a fucking bitter legal fight and eventually left the place with the idea that the us is a pre-modern shithole
mircea_popescu: yes, but in the roman empire land is actually owned.
gribble: The Eiffel Tower Replica In Slobozia, Romania Is Especially Awesome: <http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/01/the-eiffel-tower-replica-_n_4337941.html>; Slobozia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slobozia>; List of Eiffel Tower replicas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Eiffel_Tower_replicas>
asciilifeform: in anglo world, land isn't really owned, just borrowed from the crown - like in ussr.
mircea_popescu: The appeal by Megan Williams was dismissed because the 'benefits of the development did not outweigh the harm to the character and appearance of the countryside'.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so move to missouri. you can live in a beer can tower there
moiety: asciilifeform: there was a couple here built an amazing house and they had to tear it down becauseit didn't qualify
mircea_popescu: but plans to move up in the world
asciilifeform: moiety: structural, rather than decorative
mircea_popescu: you can prolly buy scrap for the cost of metal.
moiety: asciilifeform: couldn't you sort of paint the inside iof it with cement?
mircea_popescu: pLambert the implied simply translates the fact that the earnigns and the price signals are averages and so... a guess.
mircea_popescu: poor thermic and fonic insulation
mircea_popescu: moiety there are problems, such as due to lack of foundations.
moiety: i bet they don't look like that mircea_popescu
pLambert: mircea_popescu: in your statements you keep saying "The P/E implied value per share is so far 0 BTC." What is that going to say when you do have earnings? Do you have a PE value you will calculate an estimated price from?
mircea_popescu: there are problem
mircea_popescu: ps : for the people not doing agrifutures : gf is the code prefix for feeder cattle.
moiety: yes you can mircea_popescu in fact, loads of them at once!
moiety: the bitbet i have been waiting for!
ThickAsThieves: word, the date threw me
benkay`: these arts are really impressive
ozbot: Calling out the Bitcoin Foundation Scam.
benkay`: that thing where you have shares off the exchange
benkay`: didn't you just pay to less than the nominal float?
mircea_popescu: as mpex won't let you pay for less than the records show, and you don't want to pay for more.
mircea_popescu: benkay` but in seriousness : the float in the div command allows 3rd parties to verify the float.
nubbins`: well, there is one way
mircea_popescu: im just slightly distraught that there's no way i can blame this on kakobrekla
FabianB_: i guess it's the only sane way to move it to next month
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves efficient market hypothesis!
FabianB_: heh, the bbet usual :)
mircea_popescu: early dividends because the mp can't math.
benkay`: why does the div command even have a notional float?!
FabianB_: mircea_popescu: i have the feeling i got too much ;)
mircea_popescu: FabianB_ report published, dividend paid, was there a problem ?
Mats_cd03: mircea_popescu: what do you think future revenues look like after the changes
benkay`: thinking they're running companies
deadweasel: i exist, therefore rate me a positive 1
nubbins`: [17:16:35] <ProphetDaniel> And I would like to receive a positive 1 rating for learning the GPG/OTC for BTC
nubbins`: [17:15:46] <ProphetDaniel> Hi there gentlemen
nubbins`: i wish there was someone else trying this on osx so we could compare notes ;(
asciilifeform: fools will install the patched version, and 'ahhh i'm seekure now.'
mircea_popescu: gedankenexperiment : cleanning the streets in my town is open source
asciilifeform: it would remain derp even if the code were written to spec, by a god.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "what, you mean just because people could expend highly specialised, intricate work that's usually highly paid for free it doesn't mean they also will?!?!?!"
asciilifeform: 'It's significant that no one managed to notice such glaring errors, particularly since they were contained in code that anyone can review.' << ahahaha
asciilifeform: Don't Blame The Mice!
mircea_popescu: and you know VERY well exactly how far off the item is
nubbins`: best casascius photos i ever took with a phone, and they're shit: http://imgur.com/a/BWHw5
nubbins`: phone cameras usually have auto-focus as well, which really shits the bed photographing the holos
mircea_popescu: there's special kits for taking pics of small shiny shit like coins
nubbins`: even the good photos are shitty. those things are almost impossible to photograph well
nubbins`: 18btc pissed down the drain
nubbins`: i honestly feel bad for the people paying 30btc for a 10btc piece because they saw an 0.5btc piece sell for 1.5
mircea_popescu: but all that is plainly indifferent to you. there's no requirement the fucktards know who gaia is.
mircea_popescu: and of course a bunch of fuctards who imagine THEY had anything to do with it
mircea_popescu: your efforts explode exponentially, the fact you put in some sane structure today attracts wall street tomorrow
mircea_popescu: take it the other way : the more you put into educating market, the sooner you'll have an educated market.
asciilifeform: there's your pedigree record...
nubbins`: i've been offering to extend the chain of custody with every sale
nubbins`: i've got pgp-signed documents from casascius stating my fingerprint and the serials of the coins i bought from him
mircea_popescu: it'll prove invaluable down the road
mircea_popescu: someone should make a site allowing the pedigree of coins to be traced
nubbins`: the problem with saving them for a decade is that i don't think the btc premium will hold up
mircea_popescu: so buy a bunch and save them a decade
nubbins`: yet they command a lower premium
nubbins`: fun fact, the 2011 1btc series-2 (non-error) are much harder to find
nubbins`: all of the series 1s have errors ;)
artifexd: Wait. No. Only 500k of the 1.5 mn is me.
mircea_popescu: a, the aero thing is yest news really.
artifexd: I put part of it on there.
mircea_popescu: did they rule ?
benkay`: leave the fucking states.
mircea_popescu: how slow are atc blocks these days ?
BingoBoingo: K, I am still waiting on a confirm on my withdrawal from the exchange
gribble: You are now authenticated for user BingoBoingo with key 309BB8D7F3251143
artifexd: The asks are thin. I'd be willing to do a million for 150 satoshi each.
moiety: asciilifeform: flippin' heck! @ the captcha
mircea_popescu: pm me an addy then
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'm on x-bt as well. For an OTC trade I dunno if I can sell for less than 200 satoshis seeing how thin the asks are.
ozbot: X-BT - The new marketplace for trading Bitcoin with Litecoin, Namecoin and Altcoin
asciilifeform: (circuit-level implementation, done correctly, would leave no room for doubt as to the fate of every input bit, and the origin of every output)
mircea_popescu: i think 125ish was the cheapest it ever went
benkay: transactional database transactions: what the hell is that and why would anyone?
asciilifeform: unrelated: did anyone ever answer the call to implement btc reference client compatible in verilog?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform if the bitch is spherical.
asciilifeform: (e.g. melt hot glue without destroying the glued item)
asciilifeform: the most chinese possible. as in, bouncing ball for air pressure gauge.
mircea_popescu: o the actual thing
asciilifeform: when i bought a digital hot air machine circa '07, it came with a whole sausage of power plugs for various phones of the period
mircea_popescu: jesus all the anger.
asciilifeform: in the east, people do indeed fix phones!
mircea_popescu: "Now I know better. The government is in the hands of satanic, globalist traitors who are following a script to destroy America and its people"
mircea_popescu: fun fact : thai underage prostitutes also value those among them that can fix smartphones.
asciilifeform: (presumably, to install winblows on the platoon laptop, so grunts can play Quake.)
mircea_popescu: anyway. the us is in this position where it has to learn to play second fiddle/cocksucker to the actual powers that be
ozbot: The Military Draft
mircea_popescu: the entirety of the combatant populace would be "can they just rape us instead ? we'll fuck for peace"
mircea_popescu: if it comes to war and there's a general mobilisation, the us couldn't gather even ukraine's 1%
mircea_popescu: i don't give a shit that the us could deploy fifty or fifty thousand specially trained idiots.
mircea_popescu: and incidentally : this is quite instructive for the attentive watcher. with the exception of china and some other asian majors, NOBODY is capable of war.
asciilifeform: 'they had a war and nobody came'
mircea_popescu: once a state makes the comitment of calling a general mobilisaiton and its ignored,
moiety: BingoBoingo: there you are i tried to twitter at you
BingoBoingo: artifexd: ATM I would not be selling ATC at the current market prices
moiety: lol at least these ones get shoes
benkay: i'm uninterested unless they're yours, mircea_popescu
gribble: You are now authenticated for user benkay with key 39F274AFBC7ACAC7
nubbins`: i only finished reading the sentence because my peripheral vision picked it up
nubbins`: My name is Clark Moody, and this is my website. First of all, I love Jesus, and I want you to know him. He has changed my life forever, and His love has the power to change you.
mircea_popescu: quite typical for libertards to get stuck blaming the curb.
mircea_popescu: together culture and civilisation describe privileged wife,
mircea_popescu: as contrasted with culture, which is the totality of ideal productions of an ~.
mircea_popescu: deadweasel civilisation is the totality of material productions of an identified primate group.
deadweasel: so in the most useless sense, we are civlised.
deadweasel: civilization via wikipedia: Civilization or civilisation (in British English) generally refers to state polities which combine these basic institutions, having one or more of each: a ceremonial centre (a formal gathering place for social and cultural activities), a system of writing, and a city.
mircea_popescu: to me it registers as the #1 item on the list of why the us can't be4 taken seriously as a civilised state.
jborkl: as I understand it just the State of Texas lew enforcment takes in a billion a year mainly on weed
mircea_popescu: whop the fuck came up with that stupid idea.
asciilifeform: they do.
mircea_popescu: o gee! just like the soviets.
asciilifeform: (that being the armed stormtroopers)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the 'useful' part of the latter is being merged into the 'ministry of love' (DHS)
mircea_popescu: tyl : veteran affairs cost as much as education or health care. who knew there's a cost to all that jingoism.
ozbot: Breaking down spending in Obama's budget proposal - The Washington Post
mircea_popescu: (this, incidentally, is also why all the limited edition crap)
asciilifeform: so this is something like the ads on the washington d.c. metro for fighter jets and destroyers?
mircea_popescu: ferrari sells cars by convincing poor lithe 20something chicks to blow anyone in a ferrari
mircea_popescu: "look how cool and from the future we are"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i don't think the people targetted actually drive.
asciilifeform: who the hell wants a touch screen in a car
Mats_cd03: looks like a good competitor to the stuff in tesla's cars
asciilifeform: i'd rather eat steak than stake.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you were so woefully, drastically and deplorably off the mark with that
asciilifeform: phun phact. first time i ever heard of reddit, i parsed the name as 'Red [i.e. communist] Edit [as in editorial]'
gribble: (ticker [--bid|--ask|--last|--high|--low|--avg|--vol] [--currency XXX] [--market <market>|all]) -- Return pretty-printed ticker. Default market is Bitstamp. If one of the result options is given, returns only that numeric result (useful for nesting in calculations). If '--currency XXX' option is given, returns ticker for that three-letter currency code. It is up to you to make sure (1 more message)
deadweasel: it's not recording stats anymore either
ozbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
ThickAsThieves: well they just said "Hey look at me!"
mircea_popescu: what's the rush.
ThickAsThieves: they just slapped a squished logo on it
mircea_popescu: then gox goes away and price suddenly is quite stable.
asciilifeform: the only sure bet is that there will be some sweet placebo to reassure the chumps that 'this time, It's Different !11! (TM)'
asciilifeform: expect a 'MtFox' or the like, using mouth and arse- prints for N-factor authentication and 'AML' government id both
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: a team of chumpatronic engineers is working around the clock to fix this.
wao-ender: these trading platform should rise
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: no, what i meant was, the receiving end
arij wonders what will happen to the bitvps link on clarkmoody
arij: rtbtc lets you trade at gox/stamp using the API
mircea_popescu: fucktarded romanian spammers. buy spam software, replace the subject/body copy,
Apocalyptic: <ThickAsThieves> so they are opening a trading platform // wait, rtbtc was not just charts ?
Duffer1: acquire all the things
arij: really? when did they buy cm/rtbtc?
ThickAsThieves: so they are opening a trading platform
mircea_popescu: the bitcoin founation policy of decentralisation ?
ThickAsThieves: they bought rtbtc
gribble: The operation succeeded.
nubbins`: the rest of canada, not so much
Mats_cd03: is there a sizable irish pop in cn
Mats_cd03: any bets on when the next exchange with >1000btc gets robbed
mircea_popescu: is keefe like the most common canadian name ?
nubbins`: "O'Keefe said the city will act quickly on complaints once they're received, but if a landlord refuses to allow an inspector into the unit, the city then has to go to court. If an order to clean up a property is then ignored, they would have to go to court again."
nubbins`: "theft"
nubbins`: the "first" bitcoin "bank"
mircea_popescu: pretty sure it's not the first thing posing as a bank no