mircea_popescu: you short the derps globally by buying f.derp. or i guess individually by borrowing them from someone that bough them
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller short what ?
mircea_popescu: so one can take either end. this was discussed in teh logs!!1
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: if one issue goes up 100x in usd and btc goes up 10x and there's 10 issues, then it's just about wiped.
mircea_popescu: basically if each individual issue goes up 2x in btc, then it's just about wiped.
benkay: so all of the D series is backstopped by all of f.derp
mircea_popescu: they're backstopped by f.derp's assets.
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron if there's religious interest forums you know that i don't / other stuff you're already doing feel free to throw that into the mix.
benkay: mircea_popescu: DERPs are backstopped to the sum of BTC brought in by sales of DERP shares, is that correct?
mircea_popescu: that thing's massive, about the size of a bodybuilder.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there's a lot you don't know :
mircea_popescu: you can spend the rest of your days doing it for all i care, 24/7. you're to report each weekend and i'll pay you mondays.
mircea_popescu: don't spam, make sense, bring in the various good points we know about the world doesn't, bitcoin, b-a, bitbet, mpex, etc.
mircea_popescu: okay, what i want you to do is create a bunch of handles in various forums (i'll tell you which) and participate in the discussion.
mircea_popescu: do you wanna get paid to derp on the interwebs ?
mircea_popescu: vilage people are actualy a lot dumber than city people. they just have much fewer avenues to display their inanity.
decimation: I suppose that's the point of jury nullification
mircea_popescu: certainly murder of political figures is always justified on the face. they were, after all, political figures.
mircea_popescu: maybe the murderer had a point.
mircea_popescu: by the time you realise you should have it's too late.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform im sure they couldn't have survived in ther wild, but i dun see why that should matter.
mircea_popescu: i guess a lot of foreign military officers wondered why they've not simply shot hitler at any point in the 30s, just walk up to him and boom.
asciilifeform: are they any good - to eat?
mircea_popescu: i have no idea why i didn't just take the birds across.
mircea_popescu: among which two pelicans. which had figured where the door was, and what a door is. and were angling together to perhaps scare a dumbass tourist and manage to get out.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform did i ever tell you about the two pellicans ?
mircea_popescu: which ironically makes the entire "terrorist" thing quite appropriate, except, i wouldn't shot them for the show (which is what terrorism implies, that you kill people for no reason than to impress other people). i'd do it because their continued existence is incompatible with mine.
asciilifeform: i recently went to a zoo, where they had cheetahs. one cheetah was a little different from the others. every time i see him, he's clearly preoccupied with looking for a hole in the fence.
mircea_popescu: there's very little doubt in my mind that if i were in the sort of situation most folk over there enjoy, i'd simply be shooting people.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: let's say you were on the other side of the wire. my side. and you could escape, if you turned on that 'dulap' and gave up... cock&balls.
decimation: the eastern metropolis is especially bad on this count. high population density but everyone is alone
asciilifeform: the other thing mexicans, eskimos, whoever, anyone but homo americanus have is - tribe.
asciilifeform: if they come from my being a stonemason in mexico city, as far as i can tell i'm then already in a jail
asciilifeform: decimation: the 20k still have to come from somewhere.
decimation: yeah that's what most of the "early retirement" folks advocate. if you can live on $20k per year you can retire now if you have any assets to speak of
mircea_popescu: inconvenience yourself and you'll be free, but otherwise, you're predictable, and in being predictable you'll be a tool.
mircea_popescu: that's what the dam is built out of. convenience.
mircea_popescu: you gotta break the circle of "is necessary"
asciilifeform: but paid with other things
asciilifeform: and, in many (most?) states, adverse possession is virtually impossible to pull off (title holder must be aware of the squatter and do nothing for xx years)
asciilifeform: if tourist hadn't strayed miles from the road, if wind had been stronger - the dugout would be there still, with its inhabitant.
asciilifeform: now, if you're willing to live like a feral dog, it isn't even necessary to leave the country. i recall, a few years ago, an article about one fellow who lived in a dugout in a u.s. national park. for ~30 years. he was caught by pure chance.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what, like bitcoin ? << ameri-zek could escape if he had 10^7 usd or 10^4 bitcoin, say. but he won't ever see either, 'like his own ears without a mirror.'
thestringpuller: He makes some of the best documentaries though.
decimation: ascii have you seen "Happy People: a year in the taiga"?
thestringpuller: oh during the yeart
thestringpuller: that's the one
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: norilsk ?
thestringpuller: i recently heard of a city in siberia that utilizes more energy to keep the city warm and operate than it would if people just commuted 100's of miles to operate the factories there...
asciilifeform: for most americans, walking to mexico would involve having to work for a living - a punishment far harsher than anything they do in jails here
mircea_popescu: i propose a new highschool charter. it teaches kids nothing, but smacks them every time they use "going to"
mircea_popescu: EcoChav: these girls are going to be using SWARM to raise funds: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWTXht6doPM <<
decimation: yeah I suspect walking to mexico is easier than the reverse
mircea_popescu: oh, but... THE BEARS
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform people's own dumb heads do the guarding.
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: you probably heard that many 'gulag' facilities were not guarded at all.
mircea_popescu: but i follow the link. huge title "Bitcoin will be partially or totally controlled". ie, by some govt.
decimation: you can own, you just have to confess to usg you have them
asciilifeform: note that the analogy is not exact. the american equivalent of a soviet job with travel privileges would be, say, the right to own significant foreign (or theoretically liquid enough to become foreign) assets
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller well tbh, i dun see why i'd have wanted to leave huxley's world. just hang out with the boss guy down at the bar.
asciilifeform: as diplomat, your 'wife' might actually be someone whose only job is to shoot you in the head if you start to 'turn.'
asciilifeform: incidentally, pretty much none of the above were sent abroad with actual wives, children
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller then eiher it's not a family, you're being forced to or you will be forced to.
decimation: yes, their fate is to stand and take whatever comes I suppose
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> we can surmise that he refused one or more, but they aren't done yet << something like that.
asciilifeform: if you 'see reason' - you're a free man. get to keep doing what you were doing. except with a little microphone listening, or the like.
asciilifeform: back to the treatment of nothaus - this was SOP for dissident types, at least post-stalin. you land, not in a jail cell, but a comfortable 'hotel room', where no one hangs you upside down, no! - but well-dressed, educated fellows have little chats with you over good coffee - to make you 'see reason.'
asciilifeform: many of the same issues facing folks who want to leave usa.
decimation: seems like that would be the thing to do
asciilifeform: they certainly did.
decimation: why didn't folks attempt to leave the "big jail" during ussr times?
decimation: an enterprising defense team would have him start another altcoin for the purpose of turning against it
asciilifeform: if nothaus is cut loose, we should expect him to turn up eventually in the role of a karpeles or brock pierce.
asciilifeform: we can surmise that he refused one or more, but they aren't done yet
asciilifeform: in cases like his, it is traditional for the inquisitor to make a series of offers to lighten punishment substantially in exchange for agent recruitment
asciilifeform: (soviet term, in contrast to the 'little jail' - a jail in the usual sense; the big one - ussr.)
asciilifeform: walking the globe without a gps collar ?
decimation: for instance they haven't managed to jail this von nothaus guy yet
mircea_popescu: exactly the same problems that limit the mob limit the government, and can be used identically.
mircea_popescu: this isn't nearly as cut and dried a matter as the usg likes to pretend (forced mistake, it has no alternative than to so pretend).
jurov: hm.. i guess when patent trolls come for cardano, there are better ways than seppuku
mircea_popescu: well now... here's the thing... you can't be talking while you're not able to talk, right ?
asciilifeform: my understanding is, the most one can hope for, if you aren't chtulhu, assanger, mircea_popescu - when the wagen comes, is to die with honour, without implicating other partizans
mircea_popescu: if the kingdom actually worked like teh king's ministers propose it does, i wouldn't be looking into the yard of the king's minister's wife at the car of the guy the minister doesn't know she fucks
mircea_popescu: i mean obviously, the king's ministers, no matter how cornered, will attempt to put forth the theory of how dominant their kingdom actually is.
decimation: he has magic hacking powers, give him the a. ames treatment!
asciilifeform: he was, famously, denied the traditional 'last phone call'
asciilifeform: when (imho undeservedly) famous social engineer k. mitnick was captured, the jailers actually believed he was a chtulhu
asciilifeform: the magic incantation in that case is adequate fire support
mircea_popescu: no, it's the "know the magic incantation that'll make them rue the day they messed with me so close"
asciilifeform: when at war, your perspective on what happens if you fall into enemy hands isn't 'know the magic incantations that will force them to let me go'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what do you perceive the difference being, between military and legal ?
mircea_popescu: "Unless you have been through this, with much of it kept secret to protect means and methods of investigation and prosecution, prepare for an exciting first time on the actual hot seat, not on TV or online where hypnotic disinfo rules and seduces the unwary to believe tickling the comsec tiger's tail is fantasic rep building." <<< heh.
asciilifeform: this is why i simply don't get people who continue to think of their relationship with the u.s. court system in legal, rather than military, terms.
mircea_popescu: the exact equivalent of jury nullification
mircea_popescu: <decimation> ascii so the point is that the court can dodge questions of "what exactly are you charging me with?" by making a grand-jury circus? << the principle is that "the people" can charge you with w/o the shit they want.
assbot: Bernard von NotHaus Seeks Acquittal, New Trial » Titania - the Open Source Ethical Society
decimation: yeah him, did they actually sentance him
asciilifeform: decimation: which is why, with the possible exception of folks who can cough up astoundingly large ransom, falling into the hands of u.s. 'justice' system should be thought of as equivalent to ending up in a gestapo dungeon.
decimation: ascii so the point is that the court can dodge questions of "what exactly are you charging me with?" by making a grand-jury circus?
asciilifeform: (what's that? this - http://longstreet.typepad.com/thesciencebookstore/2010/11/propaganda-and-surrender-tickets-world-war-ii-1953-1945-part-i.html)
decimation: in other words each household needs to keep its own shit in order
mircea_popescu: he may not be talking too much or too loud\ly about it because of that shithead ida, and her unwanted, unwelcome and damaging "love", but otherwise...
mircea_popescu: decimation but you see the signs of decadence much closer to home : the moment people start shying away from calling someone a cunt in the street, because o noes, we're civilised now. that's it.
asciilifeform points out that this was the situation in ussr. virtually everyone was technically reserve corps.
mircea_popescu: because the relative value of things can't really be fixed.
mircea_popescu: the point is specifically to be able to serve everywhere, so to speak,
mircea_popescu: decimation the problem is exactly there : a roman citizen is required to be part of the army, even if he could serve the republic "better" elsewhere.
mircea_popescu: and from there on... anyone with a wrench can wrench a deal out of you.
mircea_popescu: pretty soon it's "we're too cool for our children to be killed off like the worthless shitbags they are"
mircea_popescu: decimation it only indirectly results from a too long period of wealth and power. i know, for i've been wealthy and powerful my entire life. the trick is to not buy into comfort. that's the direct causation : once people become comfortable and think "i'm too wealthy and powerful to be here fucking with a wrench inside this engine on the side of a road".
mircea_popescu: Daniel: "We believe that we can build a better future. We believe that we can enable all to participate in a revolution of collective ownership, something that will radically shift the nature of human society." wtf; are they socialists? <<< lulzy danielpbarron
decimation: "Decadence is a moral and spiritual disease, resulting from too long a period of wealth and power, producing cynicism, decline of religion, pessimism and frivolity. The citizens of such a nation will no longer make an effort to save themselves, because they are not convinced that anything in life is worth saving."
mircea_popescu: people who're not fucking aren't going to be interested, unless, of course, they're retarded.
mircea_popescu: this is such idiocy. rich people are rich people. they're not "hispanic", they're rich.
assbot: Wealth Share of Hispanic Population May Triple by 2025 | St. Louis Fed On the Economy
decimation: even their "model" predicts no movement, but the press release predictably says: http://www.stlouisfed.org/on-the-economy/wealth-share-of-hispanic-population-may-triple-by-2025/
decimation: percent of the economy's total wealth by 2025
decimation: The U.S.'s Hispanic population was about 50.5 million in 2010, representing 16.3 percent of the total population (Table 1).1 According to the Federal Reserve's Survey of Consumer Finances and its Financial Accounts of the United States, Hispanic families had about ... about 2.2 percent of total wealth ... In summary, we project the Hispanic share of total wealth to increase from 2.2 percent in 2010 to either 2.6 percent or 3.2
assbot: In the Balance : Hispanic Population's Share of Wealth Likely to Increase by 2025
mircea_popescu: if only they had a smidgeon of business sense to start back in 2013 by coming here, they'd have actually had a future.
mircea_popescu: when one starts pretendling like reality, going to school in their pony suit and mixing fiction in power points... well... that's actually unhealty.
mircea_popescu: there's nothing wrong with this any more than there's anything wrong with watching animated pony cartoons.
mircea_popescu: so, yeah. people like to dream. one dream they like to dream is that they'll be the sherlock that'll discover "the real satoshi". another dream they like to dream is the vicarious wealth of amillionbtc.
assbot: Chain Archaeology - Answers from the early blockchain
mircea_popescu: decimation it's just... you know. pretty much everyone i know who's been mining in 2010 has actually lost the majority of bitcoin they ever mined. irrespective if they still mine or not.
mircea_popescu: decimation i am aware. it's not "his" estimation. there's been this thing pushed around since 2011ish, a meme equivalent to "who really is satoshi"
decimation: that's alot but not enough to shake the foundations of bitcoin
assbot: The Well Deserved Fortune of Satoshi Nakamoto, Bitcoin creator, Visionary and Genius | Bitslog
decimation: https://bitslog.wordpress.com/2013/04/17/the-well-deserved-fortune-of-satoshi-nakamoto/ << this guy estimate's satoshi's fortune at 1M btc,
assbot: Log In - The New York Times
chetty: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/27/business/the-typical-household-now-worth-a-third-less.html?_r=0
mthreat: http://stopmasturbationnow.org/weather/17-year-old-girl-stuck-by-lightning-when-masturbating/
assbot: The Coins Source Trust Index
mircea_popescu: <decimation> quite. To be fair, satoshi still has his hand on the banana << i don't see it.
decimation: quite. To be fair, satoshi still has his hand on the banana
asciilifeform read their original paper, thought it could lead to something vaguely interesting - until the premined turdcoin came out...
decimation: I guess it's one of these turing-complete contract bitcoin wanna-bes - I haven't seen any serious analysis of the codebase yet
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform according to their own claims, they got > 5k btc deposited by people looking to get a total 10mn of the shits.
assbot: ethereum
decimation: kind of I guess https://www.ethereum.org/
asciilifeform: they have code?
mircea_popescu: decimation if this gets funded ima allow interested buyers to take positions. either directly or via bitbet.
decimation: My favorite thing about it are the random code snippets that are supposed to demonstrate how awesome it is, but in fact demonstrate that it's crazy
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform welcome to the world of a different set of idiocy.
mircea_popescu: obviously i'll be buying some once it comes out. if shit happens like on icbit , where your bids are simply ignored while it "sells" to lower bids... then it's not reputable.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it will, yes. it will resurect the not-yet-corpses and make the rest obvious.
mircea_popescu: in fact : traditional views on sexuality impose monogamy as a standard because that's the only way to hide just how dumb and inept a commune actually is : by keeping it real small.
mircea_popescu: right. then it becomes fashionable and before you know it the dumb broads in your household are giving pps to each other. and you can't do shit about it, because they're not your slaves, they're your "equal partners"
decimation: which is generally the goal of most gov't meetings, gov't education, etc
mircea_popescu: the problem is exactly what he states : pp makes it easier for the presenter, harder for the audience. this is not a tradeoff you want
decimation: he writes about how powerpoint contributed to retardation at nasa which lead to the shuttle's destruction
assbot: Edward Tufte: Books - Essay: The Cognitive Style of Powerpoint
mircea_popescu: decimation omfg he's copied me. THEIF!
decimation: Ed Tufte is a little crazy but his classes are worth taking. His position is that you present your ideas in the form of an essay or paper. Then you talk about the salient points and field questions. The projector is for showing information dense pictures, like the baseball stats page from a newspaper
decimation: I like his attitude toward meetings wrt powerpoint - he went the full Ed Tufte: http://www.philanthropydaily.com/jeff-bezos-powerpoint-prohibition/
decimation: derps have no choice but to invest in amazon because they don't see any good alternatives
mircea_popescu: actually tbh bezos may be the only guy in the derpeconomy of websites and whatnot that i actually like.
decimation: amazon benefits from being one of the few well-run companies in the us right now - this gives them the power to create their own frame
decimation: Bezos insists on taking the long view. In his letter to shareholders last year, he responded to criticism about spending by saying investing in a "just-in-time fashion would be too clever by half."
decimation: lol over the butthurt re: amazon posting quartly loss:
[]bot: Bet created: "Russia or Ukraine formally declares war on the other before September" http://bitbet.us/bet/1005/
DreadKnight: old men are more into the real thing
DreadKnight: it worked pretty well with Riot and League of Legends, lots characters / skins having that in-game and there's also Nikasaur chick presenting the community fanart showcase on youtube channel
DreadKnight: yeah, a lot of shady people are using bots and such to sell their magic crapware
mircea_popescu: (i made some comments about buying traffic yest, now im innundated with people pitching their various traffic generating offerings. some are lulzy)
kuzetsa: mircea_popescu: what's with the spam tool?
ThickAsThieves: i didnt know Portishead made a new album in 2008, it's actually good as the other stuff
kakobrekla: bit4x "wait, let me find the quote, go fuck yourself"
fluffypony: ie. who got given money for their shitty idea
fluffypony: "A market map of the entire Bitcoin startup ecosystem"
cazalla: it's just the total lack of sex that shocked me more than anything
fluffypony: re: the discussion on having kids
benkay: i'm starting to realize also that an engineering team that's blitting from one project to another is never going to be as effective as the same team focused on roadmap and cohesive set of business objectives.
benkay: vision for next 2 years is to grab bigger and bigger slices of the pie, maybe using mobile as a wedge and demonstrating kickassery and then expanding scope to whatever can be had and paid for.
benkay: and another project is basically closed but we're still in the dance-around-and-grab-at-each-other's-nuts phase w/r/t actual working relationship and what has one
benkay: in derpy consulting companyville, a small and attention-draining project has been completed and discharged which is *awesome*, for both the money and the cognitive bandwidth. we've an agreement in principle with another client to take more of a technical project management role, handling more of the coordination of roadmap + code production and moving the product along while the ceo feller focuses on sales and other higher-level
benkay takes note of all the places new MPEx properties advertise
mircea_popescu: you know the guy's site is linked above
assbot: 1 Introduction - "CRIME" - The Illustrated Guide to Law
benkay: for those following along at home, the 1st comic in the hotlinked legal horrorshow: http://thecriminallawyer.tumblr.com/post/13656784545/1-introduction-crime
assbot: The crime of being American pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
benkay: http://trilema.com/2012/the-crime-of-being-american/#comment-89947 // my how time flies
benkay: "optimizer of future degrees of freedom" is the closes i've come lately.
assbot: The crime of being American pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
benkay: http://trilema.com/2012/the-crime-of-being-american/ // i have WoT citizenship.
DreadKnight: well nvm, reading up a lot of articles on the subject
DreadKnight: so how come big companies like Apple and such don't buy back all the shares? I can think of a few possible reasons but maybe I'm missing something important...
assbot: Strict Liability pg 1 | The Illustrated Guide to Law
mircea_popescu: the average lifespan for a blog is about 13 months, and that's an upper bound for dumbass internet kids and their projects.
mircea_popescu: btc111_ the notion that they have the discipline to maintain work on that thing after 9 months' delay six months from now is beyond ridiculous.
mircea_popescu: the internets have no idea.
mircea_popescu: DreadKnight that's something to ask your tax attorney not the internets.
DreadKnight: if dealing with bitcoins, do I have to bother with taxes?
mircea_popescu: very little changed since 2012 on the score.
mircea_popescu: have a stab at that first link there
mircea_popescu: people can hype all they want, i deflated the dogecoin hype just fine, what's so special about eth ?
mircea_popescu: btc111_ you overvalue hype. this isn't fucking feminism, or some other internet thing where what people say matter.
btc111_: hah. interesting statement. care to elaborate? im not trolling... don't you think the hype will push it higher when it launches?
btc111_: MP: who's the central bank here?
mircea_popescu: 0 is not a bit of a stretch. the central bank is nominally 0 risk in any economic system.
gribble: They really are Buttcoins nao pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/2013/they-really-are-buttcoins-nao/>; Perfect money corrupts absolutely pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/perfect-money-corrupts-absolutely>; Bitcoin pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/category/bitcoin/>
mircea_popescu: ;;google they really are buttcoins nao
Duffer1: bitcoin, keep them
mircea_popescu: btc111_ the default risk is 0.
btc111_: trying to model the default risk into my structured product
btc111_: wahts the default risk on those contracts?
RooK314: Well I finally get here and seakazoo leaves for the night
btc111_: is MPEX still selling 5000:1 ether for march expiry?
thestringpuller: DreadKnight: I live in the suburbs so there is either 1) speeding cars or 2) no cars
thestringpuller: I get nice and drunk, then step on my board - and voila - gravity takes me home.