asciilifeform: even today, buying the kind of insurance available for a token fee to civil service folks or employees of large concerns - costs 1-2k usd / month if you do it 'as a human'
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah that used to be true but these days with obamacare it might be about the same as everyone else, depending on the details
decimation: asciilifeform: contractors get what their employers offer; generally "getting zip" means buy insurance on your own dime
ben_vulpes: plus motherland satisderption
RagnarDanneskjol: i don't know for certain, just have to use all these benefits comparison resources for work and it appears dental/vision is always heavily discounted for gummint folk. and yes, they get the pretax bennies too
decimation: I guess if by "subsidized" you mean "group purchase price" then yeah
decimation: although I think they pay pre-tax money
decimation: mircea_popescu: minor nitpick - I don't think USG employees get dental actually: http://www.benefits.gov/benefits/benefit-details/4587 "Dental and Vision benefits are available to eligible Federal and Postal employees, retirees, and their eligible family members on an enrollee-pay-all basis."
ben_vulpes: it's all in the context
BingoBoingo: Vexual is often bashable, often not for his own uttering but for those of others that surround his.
ben_vulpes: its the simple things in life
assbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
gribble: The operation succeeded.
ben_vulpes: ;;later tell mike_c all for you baby. took two hours as i refactored the whole way login works. let me know if stupid shit happens around logins.
mike_c: benkay: nice work on the raw login! thx.
ben_vulpes: why do i even bother...
gribble: The operation succeeded.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
ben_vulpes: <jurov> that was more like a tweet << playing with the format a bit, yeah. 140 characters ain't enough, but less than 200 words can be fine too.
TheNewDeal: thanks for the history lesson
mircea_popescu: he did also sort-of maintain employment in the interval, so w/e.
mircea_popescu: i duinno that he did ever make any money, i highyl doubt it. he did go to some personal trouble to try and cover for the various potholes he made, at some point even selling (or claiming to ?) his guitar
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal> what was most annoying was he PMed me after I spoke with him here. Over the next hour or so he tried to convince me of his smashing businesses successes, and the danger of healthy skepticism << This is the reason for his neg rating.
TheNewDeal: what was most annoying was he PMed me after I spoke with him here. Over the next hour or so he tried to convince me of his smashing businesses successes, and the danger of healthy skepticism
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal he was a small, very vocal, very entertaining player.
asciilifeform was fully immune to pirate, usagi (?), all the other early birds of btc scamdom - how? by having nothing for them to snarf.
TheNewDeal: hadn't watched it with the voiceover yet
fluffypony: [2014-08-17T17:04:11+0200] <usagi> Look at my WOT brother. The wot itself is telling you how transpareently obvious you are
assbot: The Lilac Breasted Usagi Bird - YouTube
TheNewDeal: I'm just trying to piece usagi's relevancy in the mix
assbot: The Lilac Breasted Usagi Bird - YouTube
mircea_popescu: they all traded with each other, often on bizarre terms, which'd make any judge simply lump everything together in disregard of any veils.
mircea_popescu: part of the problem is that the guy run his affairs cca 2012 as if they were fantasy baseball. buncha names/identities with no substantial business existence or raison d'etre, making the thing difficult to remember or sanely structure historically.
mircea_popescu: consider the situaiton where a bunch of people actually believed the earth is flat at some point
TheNewDeal: wasn't usagi giving insurance though at a VERY late point in the pirate ship?
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal you're new here :)
kakobrekla: he had it listed there
TheNewDeal: why the hell would anyone insure against a default on pirate?
kakobrekla: the ponzi
TheNewDeal: what was the contract insurange against? default by _____ ?
gribble: You rated user usagi on Tue Apr 15 13:37:58 2014, with a rating of 1, and supplied these additional notes: Had a 1140 btc contract with usagi which entitled me to said amount on 2012-08-26. The final payment was done 2013-04-27, totaling 995 btc. The sum was 145 btc short but I agreed to let it slide because of distress on the market of the underlying 'securities' and rapid btc market (1 more message)
TheNewDeal: kakobrekla are you in the house?
TheNewDeal: "In the event of a full pirate default, NYAN.C will loose out, and CPA holds NYAN which holds NYAN.C. Then we have contracts on the outside as well. All in all CPA will remain very solvent, it may lose 20% of it's value in a full default. But we stands just as ready to gain 20% if pirate doesn't default." - it will remain very solvent
TheNewDeal: did he insurance against multiple parties with the same CPA?
mircea_popescu: hm. maybe pirate was earlier, there were a bunch
gribble: You rated user usagi on Tue Jul 3 07:45:25 2012, with a rating of 2, and supplied these additional notes: good business, thanks =).
Anduck: sup TheNewDeal?
mircea_popescu: i don't think there's been a block with a transaction in it since may.
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal well it's got 1.7th perm from now on, plus whatever other people throw at it, so im guessing a 5 to 10 th rate going forward is probably its level
atcbot: [CoinMiner Hashrate]: 2.71 TH/s [PityThePool Hashrate]: 0.00 GH/s [iSpace Pool Hashrate]: 1.13 TH/s
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu> i dun think atc ever dropped two digits sort of shit. << You forget before the civilized times ATC would trade at ~500 and 100 satoshis in the same hour
atcbot: [CoinMiner Hashrate]: 2.65 TH/s [PityThePool Hashrate]: 0.00 GH/s [iSpace Pool Hashrate]: 1.13 TH/s
TheNewDeal: I'm just talking about the mining
fluffypony: LTC dropped 20% today, Darkcoin is the major loser
TheNewDeal: isnt' atc stalling at the moment?
fluffypony: "as they transition" is transitory
fluffypony: I agree - "Blockr.io will continue to operate as usual for now as Sašo and Samo transition to their work at Coinbase."
mike_c: "Blockr.io will continue to operate as usual for now"... and then it will go away.
mike_c: fluffypony: blog post indicated the whole thing is going away.
fluffypony: I mean "will blockr.io stop support ATC, thus culling it from the list of coins for which it provides blockchain explorers"
fluffypony: neither
mircea_popescu: fluffypony are you aiming to ask "will blockr.io be shut down integrally or will the atc part somehow magically survive" or do you aim to ask "will atc implement blockchain culling like the btc does"
assbot: Culling - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
assbot: culled - definition of culled by The Free Dictionary
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: the blockr one
fluffypony: also fuck Coinbase, again, they irritate mea
fluffypony: so do we know if the ATC block exporer is going to be culled or not?
mircea_popescu: (more likle, the implication is you're from the us, and thus mate once for a lyftyme)
pete_dushenski: using another man's condom is like using another man's mouth to prechew your food before its shoved down your feeding tube
TheNewDeal: do you think the females would enjoy a reused condom?
mircea_popescu: more so for the other man part than for the spider web part, god knows how that works.
mircea_popescu: but perhaps the implication is that it'd be icky to use another man's spider web condom
thestringpuller: TheNewDeal is a master at vivisecting animals into humans
pete_dushenski: like she's not involved in the contraceptive process
pete_dushenski: so why exclude the female grandchild?
TheNewDeal: best comment on the article "I want a spider goat condom, that I can pass down to my male grand child."
TheNewDeal: pete_dushenski was hoping they would mention Island of Dr. Moreua, just finished that one up
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: the last (third) book's been out for ages, too.
pete_dushenski: i've got year of the flood on my reading list
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: just the fun ones
asciilifeform: not really the sensational chimera the article suggests. ordinary goat that secretes a usefully spidersilky protein in the milk.
mircea_popescu: !up thExit
mircea_popescu: "then when it finally went through his face light up "you just gotta know how to work these treknologies"
mircea_popescu: sad that the story fails to include a "he mumbled god dangit while kicking the machine a couple of times"
xanthyos: glad i wasn't the test case
xanthyos: punkman: he spoke to me just a couple hours ago planning to try the lamassu
punkman: heh >> dustintheweb: Story time: I just bought 0.2 from a Lamassu ATM. It timed out in mid process w/out ever updating the bitchain. I about crapped my pants, but the business owner opened the box for me, got my money out, then we tried it again until it worked.
xanthyos: stander: get in the WoT, you have 3 people who are waiting to give you postive rating!
mircea_popescu: people here have shit like i dunno, laser cutters all over their kitchen. so... you're in good company
X-Rob: I've probably spent about 10k over the years on video cards, power supplies, etc. I haven't put any dollars into it in over 18 months (since ASICs became The One True Way(tm), basically).
mircea_popescu: <Apocalyptic> <X-Rob> I normally just reinvest into hardware. // this strategy is bound to fail << i think he pretty much said he enjoys the tinkering aspect. so from his pov it's perfect, put some money in, letting it run itself out. bitcoin, the very complex and realistic online mmorpg/mud
mircea_popescu: it's like "dudes if you don't make the world friendlier to stupid people i'll stab myself in the eye"
TheNewDeal: apparently he was quite angered after I downed him the first time
mircea_popescu: the reality in the field is exactly opposite : i can dump porn pics all day and it'll stil be more important for bitcoin than tim swanson';s "books".
mircea_popescu: +r is based on this imbecilic theory that the content matters and the people do not.
mircea_popescu: heck, even the bureaucracy understood it eventually. hence no iraq 51st state
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Yeah, the parody article's only flaw is there are no signs of Sino-Russian intervention yet. Merely observers.
mircea_popescu: as the compatriots said twenty years ago, Azi in Timisoara, Miine'n Ferguson, MO.
mircea_popescu: <TheNewDeal> mp did you ever do any dirty deals with usagi? << many moons ago. http://trilema.com/2012/bitcoin-still-not-quite-ready-for-cdos/
assbot: Michael Brown shooting: Amnesty International sends team within US for first time as National Guard deployed - Americas - World - The Independent
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal> on bitbet, people always write up a bet about stocks like GOOG will close at above 1200 before jan 1 << so it's like freedom, let them have fun.
mircea_popescu: (coupla paras at the end0
assbot: Pushing the soft tender flesh of a friend against the sharp rotating blades of the immutable machine. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform http://trilema.com/2014/pushing-the-soft-tender-flesh-of-a-friend-against-the-sharp-rotating-blades-of-the-immutable-machine/#comment-105667
X-Rob: as a lot of them just leave the defaults. Which is fine for a slow, scrypt, pool. But terrible when you point TH of SHA at it.
X-Rob: Apocalyptic: I normally work on ;;genrate + 10%, and I justify the +10% as 'I know what the fuck I'm doing, and you're going to get that hashrate pointed wherever you want it'
Apocalyptic: if you find people willing to rent hardware for a ridiculous price then you're good regardless
X-Rob: that paid off all my avalon3 gear which I bought on a whim and then immediately regretted.
X-Rob: Apocalyptic: It works in my, specific, limited circumstances. I have access to free power, and, I lease my hardware out. I also get to ride the wave of pump'n'dump coins, without actually any exposure.
X-Rob: damn having two people starting with 'the'
X-Rob: TheNewDeal: ^^
X-Rob: thestringpuller: about 15TH
X-Rob: thestringpuller: Yes, and not very often
gribble: The operation succeeded.
TheNewDeal: what's with the stock bet precedent of "close at price" vs "trade at price" ?
mircea_popescu: mpex was new, plenty of finance people had just for the first time in their life had this new pympex weirdo device and key based trading and etc.
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal the common wisdom at the time was that someone butterfingered. either it was meant to be a buy rather than a sell, or too many zeroes or something
TheNewDeal: there's my n
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller you gonna do letter parts next ? :D
TheNewDeal: did it ever rebound to the same level?
mircea_popescu: (there was this event, back in 2012 iirc, when someone sold like 1mn shares in shallow bids, resulting into a temporary 99.9% drop of the price)
mircea_popescu: sounds like btc is nao copying mpex, i recall how pissed ppl were on the first and original sd dump
gribble: Bitstamp | A market order to buy 1000 bitcoins right now would take 480559.8422 USD and would take the last price up to 492.0000 USD, resulting in an average price of 480.5598 USD/BTC. | Data vintage: 0.0276 seconds
atcbot: [CoinMiner Hashrate]: 2.26 TH/s [PityThePool Hashrate]: 0.00 GH/s [iSpace Pool Hashrate]: 0 TH/s
atcbot: [CoinMiner Hashrate]: 2.21 TH/s [PityThePool Hashrate]: 0.00 GH/s [iSpace Pool Hashrate]: 0 TH/s
asciilifeform wonders if the musket will come back into fashion
asciilifeform: http://www.scribd.com/doc/236628112/Baltimore-District-Court-gun-ruling << mega-lol. u.s. federal judge quietly cancels the 'right to bear arms' thing by proclaiming that modern tech is not included.
BingoBoingo: Coinbase better be unintentionally lulzy and let the ATC block explorer live...
assbot: The Coinbase Blog Coinbase Acquires Blockr.io, Welcomes New Staff
asciilifeform: chetty: the poster is a favourite of librarians.
asciilifeform: there is a third option, that i'll bring up for completeness because it appears to be very popular these days: piss in a paper cup, write 'beer' on it, drink up.
asciilifeform: just as, if you want a glass of beer, no need to go to the pub - find some sand, salt, build a forge, having the glass, find some hops, barley... perhaps you will drink a superior beer in a few decades
asciilifeform: well, technically not required. you can always decide to spend the next 20 years as a historian and walk the author's sources yourself, coming to his - or a different - conclusion.
asciilifeform: required reading: j.c. scott, 'the art of not being governed.'
asciilifeform: why did the rulers of ussr, china, etc. push so aggressively for mechanized agriculture? to free the plow-pullers from their toil so they can watch opera?
asciilifeform: in so far as food can still be produced via traditional low-tech methods, the dream remains a dream
asciilifeform: the folks pushing the 'urban' ('totalitarian', etc, pick favourite term) model of civilization cannot really ever let go of the dream of the total annihilation of the 'rural' model.
TheNewDeal: pete_dushenski , from a book my father was reading, one does not need to fast for 24 hours to reap the benefits
TheNewDeal: chetty, they're called mexicans
asciilifeform: eventual goal, for the state, is an endgame where you can't grow your own potato in secret any more than you can produce your own 14nm cpu.
chetty: USA doesn't really have farmers in the fields anymore
usagi: Rome once tried to raise taxes on farmers to something like 100%. Farmers responded by abandoning their fields.
asciilifeform: if something gets in the way of this business model - in usa or elsewhere - terminator.
asciilifeform: usagi: at present, they have a very lucrative business (in usa) of filing mass lawsuits against folks on whose property their product ends up, through whatever means. hence the unprofitability of 'terminator'
chetty: <usagi> Thanks, I was looking at monsanto the other day actually and according to them at least, they don't produce "terminator seeds".// YET
usagi: Thanks, I was looking at monsanto the other day actually and according to them at least, they don't produce "terminator seeds". http://www.monsanto.com/newsviews/pages/terminator-seeds.aspx
chetty: asciilifeform, I still dont care to eat 'unknown' stuff. THe way they go about creating those things is insanity
asciilifeform: chetty: even with the poison, to approach something like the lethality of the mass automobile would be quite a feat. the more interesting aspect of present-day 'gmo' is geopolitical ('terminator seed', etc.)
chetty: asciilifeform, yup, and that one is bad enough, the unkinown ones are scary
asciilifeform: chetty: speaking here of the one incontrovertible engineered effect (augmented tolerance for herbicides, pesticides)
chetty: <asciilifeform> there is only, at present, 'foods optimized to resist gargantuan quantities of herbicide on the field.'// actually I dont think they much have a clue all the effects of the 'engineering' they been up to
thestringpuller: maybe after I finish the visualizer
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: i say you start your own blog. super easy to do. then you can be the home of #b-a comics!
thestringpuller: and you can be the publisher
thestringpuller: i can write a few scripts and then my buddy can draw frames
thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: aight, nubbins can be the comic editor
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: let's make some!
asciilifeform: electric chair, meanwhile, did its fair bit to delay the adoption of alternating current mains (just like its inventor, edison, wanted it to. though he would've like to delay it forever.)
asciilifeform: if things had gone slightly differently, we might be debating whether medicine ought to make use of hypodermics, even today.
asciilifeform: story time. the appearance of the mass-produced hypodermic needle in 19th c. came in time for the peculiar debate in usa re: 'humane' methods of execution. poison injected via hypodermic (today's fashion) was proposed. rejected at the insistence of the medical world - they argued, probably correctly, that it would scare off folks from agreeing to be injected with anything. (eventually electric chair was adopted.)
pete_dushenski: iirc le putin is banning gmo crud in his fair land, if the sanctions aren't doing it first
pete_dushenski: therefore having an issue with the use of "gmo" is akin to having an issue with a "president" who could be a figure skating soccer mascot, but isn't
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: for any other application, you need a total ability to piss on patents - backed up with thermonukes. a la ussr.
pete_dushenski: surely not the only possible application of genetic modification, just the only one anyone is bothering with
pete_dushenski: the term is associated with the profit-oriented, risk-burying activities of megacorp abc
asciilifeform: or say, go and fix RuBisCO, world's most inefficient enzyme, bottleneck in photosynthesis. then grow enough on garden plot to feed entire street. destroy land/wealth equivalency, mass chaos, good times.
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: that'd be the tomacco you're looking for
asciilifeform: there is only, at present, 'foods optimized to resist gargantuan quantities of herbicide on the field.'
asciilifeform: gmo foods << a term annoying as all hell. there are no 'gmo foods
pete_dushenski: "The Precautionary Principle: Fragility and Black Swans from Policy Actions"
assbot: Pushing the soft tender flesh of a friend against the sharp rotating blades of the immutable machine. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: mp lists derps, mpex servers go offline, mpex servers come back online, nobody wants to do series a anymoar. the lyf&tymes. << is it already the third generation? like http://trilema.com/2014/pushing-the-soft-tender-flesh-of-a-friend-against-the-sharp-rotating-blades-of-the-immutable-machine/#footnote_3_56091 ?
pete_dushenski: cazalla: pete_dushenski, "Yes, dear People Of The World, you belong to your family, your faith, and your traditions, not your ?nation.? Where else does this exist than perhaps countries such as Japan? Families have been destroyed, faith abandoned, very little tradition left. What's left but nationalism? (I started to fall into this trap). << that's sorta teh point of their nefarious exercise. what's left is your own
pete_dushenski: if anyone else has seen medical literature supporting the theory that fasting is effective for cancer treatment and prevention, feel free to toss it in the contravex comments section
artifexd: I'm sure they do.
artifexd: You will be required to submit a report to Fincen that includes the identities of all parties involved. But the transaction itself is not illegal.
chetty: no if about it, now I wonder if they had to pay capital gains tax
usagi: If the state openly sold bitcoins that is pretty much a statement that selling bitcoins is legal
StephanLivera: bitcoin itself is not illegal, nor would the state attack it by attempting to outright outlaw bitcoin. It would preferably try to make it too onerous to use with regulations instead. This way it's like a 'soft banning'.
StephanLivera: usagi, but they even sold the silk road bitcoins. If they find illicit drugs, they don't sell those - they destroy them. So that in itself shows some treatment of legitimacy
chetty: think they tax WoW gold too
usagi: Note that stating it is property is not a statement it is legal; drugs need to be property so that you can be in posession of them
StephanLivera: Yes it is, but there are difficulties identifying all bitcoin transactions, and difficulties tying transactions to a user
usagi: I don't think they are interested in stopping it
pankkake: bitcoin was conceived to ignore regulation, yes, so yes it benefits from regulation on other things
StephanLivera: chetty, exactly - the tighter government controls constrict people and their choices, the MORE they want to look elsewhere. The best 'elsewhere' is bitcoin, most people just haven't realised this yet.
StephanLivera: pankkake, I think regulation is pretty irrelevant - government might SLOW bitcoin, but it will not stop bitcoin. it's just come too far, and the benefits are too great for it to be stopped now
StephanLivera: BigBitz, exactly - another area where btc shines, because it's very easy to "demand delivery"
StephanLivera: now there were things like e-gold etc. but there's the problem. 1) counter party risk and 2) high chance of governmental take down
StephanLivera: given bitcoin's position as the top cryptocurrency (and the only one, really) - people will need a way to transfer value internationally with ease
StephanLivera: I think it's really a matter of time until the next round of bank failures, bank bail-ins, currency devaluation etc. When that happens, people will be heading for the hills, nobody wants to be left holding the fiat bag
cazalla: nfi, my take away was there is only so much you can borrow to sell it down until it's no longer an option
kakobrekla: so you can only miss the chance to sell 10k 3 times or something?
gribble: Bitstamp | A market order to buy 5000000.0000 USD worth of bitcoins right now would buy 9121.2065 bitcoins and would take the last price up to 600.0000 USD, resulting in an average price of 548.1731 USD/BTC. | Data vintage: 0.0303 seconds
gribble: (market buy [--fiat] [--market <market>] [--currency XXX] <value>) -- Calculate the effect on the market depth of a market buy order of <value> bitcoins. If <market> is provided, uses that exchange. Default is Bitstamp. If --currency XXX is provided, converts to that fiat currency. Default is USD. If '--fiat' option is given, <value> denotes the size of the order in fiat.
gribble: Error: The "Market" plugin is loaded, but there is no command named "fiat" in it. Try "list Market" to see the commands in the "Market" plugin.
gribble: Bitstamp | This order would exceed the size of the order book. You would buy 24371.327 bitcoins, for a total of 21123101.8979 USD and take the price to 99999.9900. | Data vintage: 47.0314 seconds
gribble: (buy [--long] <amount> <thing> [at|@] <priceperunit> <otherthing> [<notes>]) -- Logs a buy order for <amount> units of <thing>, at a price of <price> per unit, in units of <otherthing>. Use the optional <notes> field to put in any special notes. <price> may include an arithmetical expression, and {(mtgox|bitstamp)(ask|bid|last|high|low|avg)} to index price to mtgox ask, bid, last, high, (1 more message)
gribble: The operation succeeded.
gribble: You rated user sgornick on Fri Sep 28 05:44:50 2012, with a rating of 3, and supplied these additional notes: Solid guy..
assbot: Killer whale throws sea lion 20 feet into the air! Ketchikan, Alaska - YouTube
pankkake: "Why did this get down voted? Maybe they didn't read past Tim, you ignorant slut"
RagnarDanneskjol: the swanson post is a riot
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user sgornick: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 3 via 3 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=sgornick | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=sgornick | Rated since: Thu Dec 2 21:13:08 2010
mircea_popescu: mp lists derps, mpex servers go offline, mpex servers come back online, nobody wants to do series a anymoar. the lyf&tymes.
mircea_popescu: ALL IT TOOK WAS AN ARTICLE ON TRILEMA TWO YEARS AGO TO BUCK THEM
cazalla: litecoin under $4, perhaps my bet http://bitbet.us/bet/773/ltc-under-1-usd-before-2015/ will get there in the end
thestringpuller: lol toilet on the ceiling
punkman: so you go up to the machine to withdraw some money, and the machine is like fuck you dude, I don't take pirateat40BTC
punkman: no caleb is already on to the stellar thing
mircea_popescu: maybe they buy euderpium too and make a supernexus
RagnarDanneskjol: still. i feel I can somehow interject with a better technical solution for them and retain the business/sleep better at night
fluffypony: they're asking you to build a piece of software that isn't inherently malicious
fluffypony: they're not asking you to make weapons to kill puppies
fluffypony: and the thing is
RagnarDanneskjol: correct they will go somewhere else
fluffypony: (hint: the answer is yes)
RagnarDanneskjol: I know - I think too much is getting lost in translation here with them.. but you're right