BingoBoingo: bounce: I'm cutting out the stupid repetition from being a bunch of slides
mircea_popescu: i was just thinking... i wonder if in the future the sex domme role and the hacker role will merge,
bounce: then again, should I leave the re-repe-repete-etc. stuff in so someone can make a fancy js thingy out of it?
chetty: haha, next they will prove astrology was right all along: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/11171567/Season-of-birth-affects-your-mood-later-in-life.html
bounce: needs a bit of editing for the re-rep-repe-repete-repetetive parts
mircea_popescu: well then stop biting cunts and get to work!
Escu: bite only the dicks.
mircea_popescu: do not bite the cunts!
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah for the n00bs, it contains some informations on timing attacks
punkman: is the log down?
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: are these 'bitcoin atm' or simply usg meatprint collectors ?
asciilifeform: what the hell happened to machine-for-btc outfits anyway
mircea_popescu: but then again, i'm not known to argue about technical choices with technical leads.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller i did not say "secure bitcoinz"
bounce idly wonders whether a basic heroku instance can be made to maintain an irc connection.
mircea_popescu: the minimum bar for b-a coders is, persons for whom this is a one person job.
mircea_popescu: then we need better persons.
mircea_popescu: well, just like with every one so far. the ability to roll a bot, the ability to handle gpg logins, produce webpages and maintain a database.
bounce: ok. what sort of skills do you expect will be needed to "code" the things that go into making your car?
bounce: so what is a website then, but a collection of pages, possibly numbering but one page? in fact, just one page (with loads of unnecessary javascript) is currently the trendy thing
thestringpuller: then you should say "I want functioning car. Ready to drive"
mircea_popescu: bounce that's a html page. not quite the same.
bounce: there you go
asciilifeform: the coals, red iron, lie detector - actually measure parasympathetic nervous response to stress etc
asciilifeform: not entirely the same thing (though usually presented as similar)
decimation: I guess the leidenfrost effect would protect you if done correctly
asciilifeform favours the return of hot coals - cheaper, more effective, more picturesque.
decimation: lol "As Western intelligence services continued to register successes with the polygraph as a counterintelligence tool, Soviet propaganda on polygraph machines changed from "bourgeois hoaxes" to (tested research devices.)
asciilifeform: i'd imagine modern ru has adopted the ritual. just the same as 'everything western' was lifted, for good or ill, in the '90s.
asciilifeform: afaik most of the use was in order to familiarize men with a torment the enemy was fond of using.
asciilifeform: decimation: much of the effect can be accomplished through lower-tech 'human' methods instead.
decimation: interestingly I don't think the kgb used polygraphs very much
decimation: asciilifeform: I agree that's the end effect, but in a supposedly 'democratic' government the idea is terrifying
asciilifeform: and to the degree that there is a function, it is to select for 'cold psychopath' (or whatever the fashionable term for the beast is.)
asciilifeform: incidentally, 'trial by ordeal' - in particular, methods which involve functions of the parasympathetic nervous system, e.g., hot coals or modern 'lie detector' - are ancient.
ben_vulpes: can't speak to the hasids or historically, but definitely in my experience.
decimation: asciilifeform: I suspect what's really the case is that once they have gotten to the 'top' bureaucrats come to appreciate their 'right' to interrogate their workforce at will
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: 'carry out the program' << yup.
bounce: they apparently have more intelligent commentary on their own scripture than, oh, islam, or even christianity
asciilifeform: bounce: it is not really necessary to believe in anything to 'climb up.' in fact, it would seriously get in the way.
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah but the very least the ses brass and their 'internal affairs' folks are believers (or at least unwilling to pretend otherwise)
asciilifeform: the 'method' idea is possibly lifted from the jewish tradition (where you are not, in fact, asked to believe in god, but to simply carry out the program, as i understand.)
asciilifeform: not necessarily, just willing to undergo the sacrament.
decimation: which means of course that everyone who works for the fbi is a 'believer'
bounce: or, as the case may be, fraud with cards and such
bounce: fingerprints work reasonably well as criminal corrobating evidence. as soon as that gets forgotten that the matching is taken as a binary guilty decision, then we have guaranteed miscarriages of justice all over
decimation: asciilifeform: after all, only experts can make the right 'match'
decimation: fingerprints are part of the general 'forensics' pseudoscience that is used as an aid in reducing the number of thinking people required to throw a chump in the gulag
bounce: all good and well to want to avoid societal collapse, but to pretend biology would willingly accomodate you there is maybe a bit much. the judge's answer thus is a good measure of the quality of the judicial branch
assbot: The Myth of Fingerprints
decimation: "The FBI described the fingerprint match as "100% verified". According to the court documents in judge Ann Aiken's decision, this information was largely "fabricated and concocted by the FBI and DOJ". When the FBI finally sent Mayfield's fingerprints to the Spanish authorities, they contested the matching of the fingerprints from Brandon Mayfield to the ones associated with the Madrid bombing."
bounce: noteworthy is that in the 100+ years fingerprinting has been in use, there's been something like one limited study (30k fingerprints or so), and that's it.
mats_cd03: on the subject of trials, my research is going swimmingly. roughly 20% finished.
asciilifeform: take the story with a grain of salt, perhaps i hallucinated it. if anyone can find the documents in question, post here.
decimation: bounce: the purpose of the security around the president is so the bureaucrats who really run usg can demonstrate their enthusiasm for the current symbol-in-chief
bounce: hehe. did the judge fall for that ploy?
asciilifeform: and actual trials where this fact was brought in - and always the crown's side would proclaim - 'this is not a fact because simply inconceivable, law and order would collapse.'
bounce thinks the amount of "security" around POTUS is both its own show and another sign that el presidente is not in fact in control of the government faculties
assbot: Brandon Mayfield - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
asciilifeform: there were studies which appear to show that fingeprints are not, in fact, as unique as popularly believed
decimation: asciilifeform: and when the masses try to call the government to deliver on their promises (revolutionary France) everything collapses
bounce already had the hunch that we'd be better off with a lot less "rights", but with the ones we do have, properly observed.
asciilifeform: 'unprincipled exceptions' (no you don't get to cross the street if the Fuhrer is within 1km) only go so far.
asciilifeform: thing is, modern 'rights states' (see some of mircea_popescu's pieces) create a problem - various 'rights' are Officially proclaimed, that, were they actually exercised en masse, would make the entire scamatron collapse overnight.
bounce: on a somewhat lighter note, compare "state of the art" datacentres with biometric access measures.
decimation: bounce: they employ plenty of warm bodies, very few people
decimation: the 'king's justice' has been watered down to "present your id card"
bounce: to the point of buying massive amounts of machinery then _leaving much of it crated in storage_
decimation: true, but at least in the early days the king's men would go out and hear cases, and judge them as they saw fit
bounce: feh. they have the people. they're just wasting resources on big large expensive machines that go 'ping'. they /could/ be hiring people for that money, but they're not.
asciilifeform: in as far as the crown goes, 'actual truth' is a matter between you and your gods
bounce: corollary: since parties deploying this are out to get you, not help you, they should be avoided. or neutralised.
decimation: so all they can do is make a cardboard cutout robot of a 'person'
decimation: asciilifeform: there's an even deeper truth there - the reality is that usg doesn't have the 'People' needed to determine actual truth
asciilifeform: they do not care if they actually, in physical reality, work. only that the results are considered prima facie evidence that whatever Officially happened - happened.
asciilifeform: my hypothesis re: biometrics is, imho, the only one proposed so far that has explanatory power for the fact that idiotically lame, e.g., fingerprint readers, nevertheless are happily deployed en masse by usg
decimation: asciilifeform: the 'weapons will not be issued' link is hilarious
bounce: engineers do, make, fix, etc. thinking starts maybe once the tech is widely deployed and cannot be put back in the box.
chetty: they think?
asciilifeform: the purpose of biometrics is to protect the system against -you-, rather than you against sc4mz0rz.
asciilifeform: engineers, who (as shown by the 'monolith' gedankenexperiment, search logs) often do not really apprehend how lizard-reich and its subordinate bureaucracies really think.
asciilifeform: 'it was your print, therefore it was you, now shuddup'
asciilifeform: chetty: the whole purpose of 'biometric' crap is to administratively fix the designated chump as the permanently-designated chump.
chetty: its pretty funny actually, really annoys those folks that expect the fingerprint scanners to work :)
bounce: then there's the "yes but we added sensors to check you're alive" -- that doesn't help you once this happens: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4396831.stm
chetty has low skin oil, they have a hard time getting prints when I go thru immigration :P
bounce: or the brasilian doctors with latex fingers. or the aussie kids with gummi bears. or schaeuble's fingerprints in datenschleuder. or various other demonstrations.
asciilifeform: the sausage experiment.
chetty: didnt the whole fingerprint thing get destroyed recently with iPhone lift?
bounce: now, visa and mastercard aren't banks, but they work for banks. which then gives the lie to the premise that banks are safe places for money (or valuables, for that matter) and as such are worthy of the customer's trust
bounce: rather transparent ploy at that, but succeeding
asciilifeform: burden of proof (to impossible degree) will be on the chump, to show that his fingerprint was lifted.
asciilifeform: that is, the chump can once again be presumed guilty of fraud if he dares to contest a charge, just like in the 'bad old days.'
bounce wonders if mastercard will stump up the costs for fingerprint surgery in case of fingerprint-theft, or they'll rather just burn the customer instead
asciilifeform: ergo >>> u.s. soldiers sent to the hot zone will be enforcing obola quarantines by... asking politely.
asciilifeform: provided it is packed in their checked luggage.'
asciilifeform: Liberia. The U.S. Embassy, in coordination with UNMIL, does not allow U.S. military to
asciilifeform: only because no one yet has the audacity to list usg payola as 'profit'
kakobrekla: yet they are still not profitable
asciilifeform: coinbase << the folks who delay transactions to help you get shafted optimally?
ben_vulpes: kakobrekla: one can claim, but there's a trilema for that :P
ben_vulpes: i'm getting the gist.
mats_cd03: i forget the rest.
mats_cd03: LXC has been battle tested for a few years. containers, decades. seccomp is available in the LXC driver, but not in libcontainer. so, the same risks as before -- arbitrary execution of kernel code. leaking to other containers, lack of fine-grained access to devices (in the works, i belieb)
ben_vulpes: just a few years ago i was building wafer hosts - there is much i don't know about websec.
ben_vulpes: would you enumerate the risks?
ben_vulpes: for instance, different versions of the python imaging library for different services.
kakobrekla: i was like is ascii telling me something in binary and i have to guess the first bit ??
asciilifeform: phototransistor sensor won't light a room. air quality sensor won't remove pollution. thermometer won't heat the house. hygrometer won't remove humidity. 'shake sensor' won't shoot intruders. etc
kakobrekla: buttstamp guys that got 10mio funding for their exchange a while back invested part of that in https://cubesensors.com
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user PinkPosixPXE to user CryptoKitten: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=PinkPosixPXE&dest=CryptoKitten | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=CryptoKitten | Rated since: never
CryptoKitten: I thought if I grouped this nick in nickserv gribble might link their auth status, but that was probably ambitious.
CryptoKitten: yea figured it might be the nick
gribble: Currently authenticated from hostmask CryptoKitten!~PinkPixie@ec2-54-86-70-168.compute-1.amazonaws.com. CAUTION: irc nick differs from otc registered nick. Trust relationship from user assbot to user PinkPosixPXE: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=PinkPosixPXE | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=PinkPosixPXE | Rated since: never
CryptoKitten: hrm.. I am authed
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user CryptoKitten: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=CryptoKitten | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=CryptoKitten | Rated since: never
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user CryptoGoon: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=CryptoGoon | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=CryptoGoon | Rated since: never
CryptoKitten: though that was never the motive :)
CryptoKitten: You'd think the Pink prefix on the other would elude to my gender, but perhaps it's not girly enough
kakobrekla: lol you two confuse the shit out of me
Adlai: kakobrekla: ok, but this was the same guy spamming mats_cd03
bounce is holding out for WOM-driven encabulators for the digital age
kakobrekla: Adlai if you can up yourself you can up others
Adlai: if i'd wanted comeback i'd have asked your mother to spit in a cup
Adlai: investing is more than "just gambling", but some derivatives are structured in a way which makes them more like a fancy roulette wheel than "investing"
Adlai: wrt casinos... the market is just one big decentralized casino
RagnarDanneskjol: probability theory even*
RagnarDanneskjol: er no. martingale relates to general probabilistic theory, is used in predictive trading systems, not just dice games derp
Adlai: my main reason for using kraken for developement is their minimum order size of 0.01 euro, which means i can risk a lot less capital
Adlai: no. so that's the AUM of all scalpl instances which i have configured myself, but i highly doubt that there are any others.
kakobrekla: you gather stats remotley?
Adlai: at no point in history has the total AUM of all running scalpl instances exceeded $10K
RagnarDanneskjol: again - I just deconstruct these things for research/amusement purposes.. no plans to 'do anything' with code really. I have a day job that keeps my too busy, any fre time is for ma doggies
Adlai: the user configures pretty much everything about how it interprets the market, my goal is for this to essentially be a trading slave which you can teach your algorithms and then sip martinis while it trades away
Adlai: * | Vexual concede it'll be immediately after he takes my money << the beauty of scalpl's design is that you don't have to give me your money to use it, although you do have to trust the exchange which you choose to use
kakobrekla wonders how long does it take for Adlai to ignore the noise hole.
RagnarDanneskjol: i reverse engineer code mostly, find out what makes it tick.. thats about the extent of my interest in the coding world. I'm an rf hardware guy
Adlai: +Vexual | need a brain? « the more the merrier, provided that you're an "adder" and not a "divider" :)
Adlai: although the most correct answer to your question is "me", since in it's current form it still kinda requires me to manually set it up
Adlai: RagnarDanneskjol: me, and a friend is planning on using it in a hedge fund sometime soon, and has been running it on a bit of personal money to test the waters until the fund goes live.
RagnarDanneskjol: hmm cool. kind of weird I'm the only one who's forked scalpl to date... thought it would be a lot moar popular by now
Vexual: what does it do?? the readme is a bit spergie
RagnarDanneskjol: you got some nice work there Adlai
Adlai: Vexual might want to sort that out then :)
Vexual: it isn't the be all and end all
kakobrekla: dont get lost among the slaves
Adlai: btw if i haven't spammed it at you yet, i'm working on http://github.com/adlai/scalpl if this is the kind of thing that interests you
Adlai: my main purpose in life these days is working on my open source library, my secondary purpose is not to starve. the trick is to juggle the two purposes properly.
Adlai navigates the shoals of impending employment
Vexual: what about a submarine? get on at the dock?
assbot: Norway’s amazing new abstract currency - Ideas - The Boston Globe
ben_vulpes: how are you to fight the usg thusly?
ben_vulpes: but -- digging nevertheless.
mats_cd03: its really incredible the kinds of things you can do with one liners in sysdig.
gribble: draios/sysdig · GitHub: <https://github.com/draios/sysdig>; Home · draios/sysdig Wiki · GitHub: <https://github.com/draios/sysdig/wiki>; How to Install Sysdig from the Source Code · draios/sysdig ... - GitHub: <https://github.com/draios/sysdig/wiki/How-to-Install-Sysdig-from-the-Source-Code>
mats_cd03: BingoBoingo: theres also sysdig, which is a relatively new thing.
mircea_popescu: "o hey guise, now that the bitcoin crowd has headshot'd our openssl holes, please everyone fuck up their init!"
mats_cd03: mircea_popescu: the wheel being reinvented?
BingoBoingo: Printer because the computers were reset every day at midnight
mats_cd03: vmware is also moving towards support for docker when they were adamant about it for months prior to the switcharoo
mats_cd03: for example, did you know the windows 10 team is adopting fixes for ntoskrnl to make it work with docker?
BingoBoingo: Maybe consult the Manul? http://www.earthtouchnews.com/media/179015/06_02_2014_manul_Pallass-cat_1_GalleryLarge.jpg
cazalla: http://qntra.net/2014/10/moopay-goes-from-robusto-to-busto/ difficult to give a shit about these altcoin scams
gribble: thedrinkingrecord.com is down
BingoBoingo: ;;isup thedrinkingrecord.com
gribble: Error: "isupthedrinkingrecord.com" is not a valid command.
BingoBoingo: ;;isupthedrinkingrecord.com
assbot: Haus Wittgenstein - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
decimation: lol wittgenstein designed a house in Vienna: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haus_Wittgenstein "I am not interested in erecting a building, but in [...] presenting to myself the foundations of all possible buildings." —Ludwig Wittgenstein[4]
Maryjane: Bees. He didn't like to bathe. I recall him saying "I like to stink. :)"
Maryjane: The pursuit of my bosses business. He was weird.
asciilifeform: at least the boxes were moving for a purpose.
Maryjane: I felt like sisyphus at my last job. But lifting 50lbs for 14 hrs isn't jolly work. Every time I grabbed one box there was another.
xanthyos: the futility of wiping your ass so perfectly when you're just going to take a shit tomorrow
BingoBoingo: agorecki: What is there to ponder you have voice and Obola has sweating blood?
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> who doesn't love the story of sisyphus. << Sisyphus
asciilifeform: who doesn't love the story of sisyphus.
mircea_popescu: decimation hilarity washes out after the say 100th attempt.
decimation: there is an 'uncanny valley' between 'competent - will deliver' and 'hilariously inept'
mircea_popescu: there's something adorable about people who can't do things but keep trying endlessly.
mircea_popescu: you familiar with the scott story about their braveheart guy in a cave with a spider ?
BingoBoingo: They exist though
mircea_popescu: im unequal to the task of explainign this one
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform dumb kids in opressive environments grow up into these most adorable adults.
mircea_popescu: decimation moreover, the "smart" kid has all sorts of shit figured out
assbot: Logged on 19-07-2014 03:17:34; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: if i didn't know any better, i'd imagine we went to uni together. we had 'the same' chick! she bedeviled our number theory prof with at least a hundred very boneheaded questions every lecture. he seethed, boiled, but couldn't throw her out. why? 'registered special needs.' (going for math degree!) she even got unlimited time on exams.
decimation: yeah, I guess I can see that. one would be more fustrated with the kid who seems to be able to get it, not the kid who is on the short bus
decimation: I suspect that the impedence mismatch between his brain and the dull schoolboy's was too much to properly match
mircea_popescu: he didn't aim to kill them.
decimation: mircea_popescu: have you visited any 'germanytowns' down there in ar yet?
gribble: Johnny Cueto Statistics and History | Baseball-Reference.com: <http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/cuetojo01.shtml>; Johnny Cueto Stats, News, Pictures, Bio, Videos - Cincinnati Reds ...: <http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/_/id/28955/johnny-cueto>; Johnny Cueto - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnny_Cueto>
asciilifeform: the anglos - masters of taxidermy.
BingoBoingo: No mircea_popescu Twas you have no friends, all in Ohio hellhole nao, make meaning. That twas the Prussian renaissance
asciilifeform: at any rate, the anglos did what they do best, and now there's a kind of stuffed animal with 'germany' sticker we have now instead to enjoy.
decimation: I read the wrong year, born 1889 in veinna
assbot: Ludwig Wittgenstein - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
asciilifeform: which other frege.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Well for blowback operated machines of the time it is whatever Browning himself deigned
mircea_popescu: decimation not even what i had in mind. i think i ruined someone's life with frege earlier in the logs.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> someone even took the trouble to translate notes to english, in many cases. << Sad so long take for 9 letter dictionary
asciilifeform: presumably - enthusiasts are making them still...
asciilifeform: someone even took the trouble to translate notes to english, in many cases.
asciilifeform: note - full machinist drawings for historic arms can, with minimal effort, be found on the net.
asciilifeform: decimation: the cartridge - was.
asciilifeform: decimation: misconception. study the drawings. very different systems.
BingoBoingo: Tis a heavy motherfucker
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: In American lore the only silent bullets happen in .45 ACP or .22 LR
decimation: I heard from a fellow who was in charge of trying to duplicate german paint technology post-wwii. they were amazed to find german railcars painted 10 years earlier that looked new
BingoBoingo: 1911 Forces my brain to think of the Colt pistol
asciilifeform: mostly then.
decimation: well, it was also partially done during the first world war too
decimation: it is sad that the world has largely lost this diaspora because of hitler's derpage