BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Every now and then someone's digestive system has alcohol producing yeast become the dominant microflora
asciilifeform: there we go.
undata: http://www.npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2013/09/17/223345977/auto-brewery-syndrome-apparently-you-can-make-beer-in-your-gut
asciilifeform: there's a non-zero natural output of EtOH
undata: vice looked into their "factory" and found rats and mold
asciilifeform: nope, the death is on instalment plan.
mircea_popescu: eh, the curse of technology. nobody fucking dies for being stupid anymore.
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: alex shulgin ?
mircea_popescu: as stupid as possible, granted. once that is granted, nothing else can further be achieved. he can't be anything "as much as possible" hence.
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: writing about it - another matter << reminds of the people who take lots of psychedelic drugs and put the doses, timeline, and effects in a journal.
asciilifeform: writing about it - another matter
asciilifeform: idiots experimenting on themselves << we all experiment on selves.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: if bluematt (who was he?) doesn't appear - one of us must do the deed ?
thestringpuller: Jesus these idiots who don't know how to feed themselves are starting to just baffle me.
thestringpuller: Who the fuck eats Soylent with no fiber in it?
mircea_popescu: "In lieu of showering I sprayed myself with AOBiomes custom skin bacteria blend. Body odor is caused by the emissions of proliferating skin bacteria, as unique as a fingerprint. The Nitrosomonas eutropha taking over my skin now metabolizes ammonia into odorless nitrite and nitric oxide. Success!"
mircea_popescu: "Feces are almost entirely deceased gut bacteria and water. I massacred my gut bacteria the day before by consuming a DIY Soylent version with no fiber and taking 500mg of Rifaximin, an antibiotic with poor bioavailability, meaning it stays in your gut and kills bacteria. Soylents microbiome consultant advised that this is a terrible idea so I do not recommend it. However, it worked. Throughout the challenge I did n
mircea_popescu: ahaha these are great!
hanbot: so here's a game for y'all: http://thewhet.net/2014/illustrated/
ben_vulpes: decimation: have not yet tested, do not think that is the case.
ben_vulpes: obviously the answer is a class with state safely segregated within it
ben_vulpes: just - find all the places in which there's a testnet mention and try to figure out how to implement an off-network chain
decimation: so is 0.5.3 incompatible with the existing testnet?
ben_vulpes: the thing isn't actually all that impossible to reason about
ben_vulpes: if you dig into chainparams and main.cpp (iirc) you'll find such joys as the "stop generating a chain after 1 block is found so that...reasons"
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu would have that by the act of complaining i bring down more cpp upon my own back
ben_vulpes: i'm studying the regtest phenomena of 0.8.whatever
decimation: no worries. I find the stripped-down distribution much easier to study
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes about the same place.
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> recoleta* << and where for the fleeing usian pauper?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what'd you have them do, replace it with Q ?
mircea_popescu: nah, they get wiped everywhere
ben_vulpes: <Adlai> the GIL is good << aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah
mircea_popescu: decimation: why would anyone think it would be a good idea to escape chars below 7 bits? << gpg escapes the dash because it uses a dash-cvomposite as a special char.
decimation: asciilifeform: on a teletype it's easy to send ternary, just add another symbol
asciilifeform: and, so far, there's precisely one - where can.
ben_vulpes: there's a non retarded object system?
mircea_popescu: psychologically immature fucktards trying to protect themselves from their own insecurity with the world at large.
asciilifeform can't picture 'django' without picturing the tarantino film
mircea_popescu: <decimation> there's something about trying to make one library to rule them all that attracts a certain kind of busybody << word. this is EXACTLY the dynamic involved.
decimation: asciilifeform: you are implying you can encode the entire alphabet evenly
decimation: there's something about trying to make one library to rule them all that attracts a certain kind of busybody
decimation: ends up in the garbage
ben_vulpes: <thestringpuller> undata: it's unfortunate python gets a bad wrap though, Djanga seems more stable than say node.js << RECANT
ben_vulpes: <undata> dumb; at least they knew to stay away from Django << so much to this
ben_vulpes: tbf i forget the nuances
decimation: asciilifeform: you know what the 'third' charcter was used for?
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: they used some telepathic voodoo
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> (summary. aliens come, they have males, females, and ooloi. the latter run things and are really the only sentients. humans quickly discover that fucking in 3some with ooloi 'adapter' is the only really fun thing.) << gripping hand?
decimation: ah I thought you meant synchronous with the clock line
asciilifeform: and the .mil equivalnet
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: funny, we have physical virtual coins, but most money is in fact virtual physical money instead. << it's all a function of the small amounts of quantity involved.
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> in my studies, i'm particularly interested in the 'suck' that no one even notices any more. << so relevant
asciilifeform: parts of the unix stack responsible for baud rate << i can recite these in my sleep now.
decimation: I think they are gonna try tomorrow
gribble: The operation succeeded.
decimation: turns out they were sitting surplus in ukraine for 30 years
decimation: interestingly, it uses "AJ-26" engines, which were 'commercially purchased' by usg from... the soviet moon program
decimation: wallops island, one of the orbital rockets
decimation: asciilifeform: they were gonna launch a rocket tonight, visible from your house
asciilifeform: but today, other toys.
asciilifeform: today - i'd align the bugger myself
mircea_popescu: you could fix the thing with a steady hand and an amp
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there actually existed special allignment disks
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'The benefits of which one cant evaluate, the drawbacks of which are certain.' >> obligatory >> http://www.antarctic-circle.org/Shackadvert2.jpg
asciilifeform: this happened, perhaps three or four times, to mine, same era; father took it each time to a greasemonkey in some illicit cellar; it would come back - wrapped in a filthy oilrag - aligned.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: we took the unit on a sneakernet see what happens at everyone's house
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the frist time this happened, 5 inch drives, 11yo or so me & friends
asciilifeform: disk would read on given unit and only there.
asciilifeform: you still couldn't steal my monyz << reminds me of all the folks with misaligned heads on their floppy drives
nubbins`: "where's the keys?" "what?"
nubbins`: "best locks in the world"
nubbins`: no chrome install either, i suppose?
nubbins`: mircea_popescu fwiw the function calc_hash() in your pasted JS is the one doing the lifting
asciilifeform: ('this' being my - so far hypothetical - little shop of ho^h^hcode review)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i may have said this in the past, but this is rather like my 'elephant procurement company' (gedankenexperiment)
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal it's the dump of js as loaded on my system, because somehow it doesn't come to the same results as other people here.
TheNewDeal: nonono, the js dump
asciilifeform: TheNewDeal: old book.
TheNewDeal: what in the hell is that
asciilifeform never knew it was on the net, was actually about to w4r3z sc4n it & post, then found...
asciilifeform: unrelated: https://archive.org/details/HowToStartYourOwnCountry << a little riot of a book. no-bullshit guide to (failed) attempts at ab initio sovereignty. (i met the author in person, incidentally. fun fella.)
nubbins`: seems like punkbot is the iq tes
nubbins`: if your secret exponent is not 6b86b273ff34fce19d6b804eff5a3f5747ada4eaa22f1d49c01e52ddb7875b4b then something is borked
nubbins`: just put a single "1" in the passphrase
mircea_popescu: so im on the brainwallet orphan chain over here ?
mike_c: in the passphrase.. if you have any
mircea_popescu: lemme paste the js
mircea_popescu: maybe im putting it in the wrong hole.
mircea_popescu: what the shit.
mircea_popescu: do you even know what the odds are ?!
mircea_popescu: fell on the exact bundle pw ?
mircea_popescu: nubbins` dude srsly you ended up with the magic salt
nubbins` raises other eyebrow
nubbins`: no, i mean to tell you i put the deed ID into brainwallet.org and it spit out the associated public address
mircea_popescu: you mean to tell me you reverse-engineered the privkey on the basis of the address ?
nubbins`: because that's the private key generated from brainwallet passphrase BXZKQx2iLYyRpUCmdWCqJBvgUdvqWH4EE8TV1ns3pxLZ
nubbins`: 2nd sha is not the privkey afaict
mircea_popescu: a ok, so 2nd sha is the privkey. import it nao ?
assbot: Logged on 26-10-2014 20:32:15; punkman: deeds are sha256 hashed, hash is b58encoded, b58encoded hashes of all deeds are joined with ",", that string is sha256'd again and that's the private key
nubbins`: TheNewDeal sha > base58 > sha > ???
mod6: they probably 1984'd it
nubbins`: but i don't know how to get from the second shasum to that
nubbins`: mircea_popescu according to deeds.bitcoin-assets.com i'm supposed to end up with the brainwallet passphrase "BXZKQx2iLYyRpUCmdWCqJBvgUdvqWH4EE8TV1ns3pxLZ"
asciilifeform: 'Asked what had happened to the $8.8bn he replied: "I have no idea. I can't tell you whether or not the money went to the right things or didn't - nor do I actually think it's important."'
thestringpuller: Didn't a shipping container with 100 billion or so get lost in Iraq in the early 2000's as well?
mod6: *the day after
mod6: so the day after the 'billennium', Sept. 9th 2001, I think that was the day that rummy was like "Oops, we somehow misplaced 1tn."
thestringpuller: mod6: i actually had a leagal drink for the billinium <<< i was just growing pubes. now I don't feel quite so old.
mod6: i actually had a leagal drink for the billinium
asciilifeform would sign code, if some loony were to pay what the kind of labour that is involved in honestly signing 'will die by this' actually costs...
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: "there's no point getting in the wot, i have real world friends" << WoT isn't Facebook...*sigh*
asciilifeform: actually on second thought - better hypothesis for the physcoins - atavistic, Ur-fear of being pwned
mircea_popescu: similarly of, "i have no interest signing other people's code"
mircea_popescu: and this is a cognate of "there's no point getting in the wot, i have real world friends"
asciilifeform: if i recall, that was, that none of these folks have much incentive to speak up re: process
mircea_popescu: you can at the very least obtain the "most likely to fuckceed" information on a set of identifiable, different providers.
mircea_popescu: not so. this is like saying "the only way to identify boys from girls is as you're moaning".
asciilifeform: let's rephase - the only information you will ever get re: being fucked, in the case of the physcoins, is being fucked.
mircea_popescu: the way to know how long your cock is is to ask god, because obviously measurement will yield an error.
asciilifeform: namely, in the case of the physical coins, the only way to know whether you'll be fucked is - when you are.
mircea_popescu: i don't see how a case can be different from any other in a system where "one can make any declaration"
mircea_popescu: the wot, incidentally, works on exactly the same premise. one can make any declaration one wishes. it's not believed per se, but that's irrelevant. as time goes by confirmation either mouts or does not.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: punkman: they could at least vaguely describe their process/tools << and you'll believe? << for the record, description is not strictly a belief-driven phenomenon. consider at its most basic, schooling. teacher describes to you grammar. do you believe ? no, if you're in any way sane, not right off. but eventually what was a hypothesis gets tested out.
nubbins`: wait, no, there we go
mircea_popescu: nubbins` see how much better life is here in the paradise of proper error messages ?
nubbins`: er yeah, i don't get the same shasum as you at all
mircea_popescu: i guess best practice, "1st check deed signature, then hash to verify deed".
mircea_popescu: so the more likely hypo is "osx fucks up characters yo!"
mircea_popescu: decimation i think he omitted the comma after.
mircea_popescu: nubbins`'s host kicked him off the internets because he has been posting base58 strings to irc.
mircea_popescu: gernika if you like to hang out with expats/foreign kids the palermos and perhaps ricoletta.
mircea_popescu: so we can verify you did in fact follow the instruction rather than honestly think you did.
mircea_popescu: you could list the private key you got.
mircea_popescu: "don't work" is the best error message, after... anything else.
assbot: Logged on 26-10-2014 20:32:15; punkman: deeds are sha256 hashed, hash is b58encoded, b58encoded hashes of all deeds are joined with ",", that string is sha256'd again and that's the private key
nubbins`: mircea_popescu yeah and there's something more to it than that, because instructions as given don't work
BingoBoingo: Or make all of the sleep REM
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo they could solve DREAMS dude.
nubbins`: TheNewDeal i'm just trying to verify one of these things but it's hard if i don't know the process
BingoBoingo: http://robrhinehart.com/?p=1152 << Oh, YCombinator guy who imagines he killed food pretends to do the same for water and sanitation
asciilifeform: decimation: nah, the scene where harrison's opponents contrieve to have his clock shipped from one town to another on a suspension-less oxcart
mircea_popescu: this is beneficial tho, i had some good lolz reading the support tickets earlier in logs
asciilifeform: decimation: sats encountered more shock on the road << see also the famous film 'longitude'
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal kako's workin' on it.
mircea_popescu: punkman: asciilifeform: cazalla: little to gain, plenty to lose << but they could at least vaguely describe their process/tools << asciilifeform yes, nobody requires them to send sample units. something like "we're buying atmospheric noise off random.org folks" or "sixty free cs servers, and we suck the urand pool dry" or w/e.
decimation: sats encountered more shock on the road
decimation: I was listening to this podcast: http://www.theamphour.com/201-cheap-respins-and-a-time-machine-multiscience-mercenary-marketplace/ << the guy from the satellite company said he had to drive his small sats to the shake table
kakobrekla: all 4 of them.
mircea_popescu: scam finally ran with the bitcoinz ?
asciilifeform seriously considered donating the box to 'smithsonian'
asciilifeform: i am swimming in 'solved problems' that i - in particular - cannot access the solutions to.
mircea_popescu: undertand, shipping is a solved problem. it just costs money, but it's not the case that consumer mail is all there is.
mircea_popescu: so they will have to hire one.
asciilifeform: as in, verify that all the parts actually function.
asciilifeform: there are perhaps 20 people on planet qualified to test this machine.
Duffer1: no doubt, sorry i've only followed a few lines of the convo :P
mircea_popescu: Duffer1 he has a point tho, museums routinely pay exorbitant fees to move their fragile shoit around.
asciilifeform: this particular machine was, iirc, assembled from surviving parts of the DOAs.
asciilifeform: a serious museum curator - such as david s. - could finesse these issues, yes.
asciilifeform: also have to appreciate the hdd. if it croaks, an equivalent unit will not actually make the machine go. os can only be installed from tape. i own neither the tape deck nor the tape.
mircea_popescu: people can reconstruct tits and virginity. you telling me they can't remake a board edge ?
asciilifeform: if they snap - that's that
mircea_popescu: that should be fixable no ? the card edges
asciilifeform: those aren't the problem
asciilifeform: (most of the extant units are duds at this point)
asciilifeform: otherwise he can say 'scammer, shipped dud'
asciilifeform: plus the only way the buyer can be sure that it functions, is to power it on where it stands now.
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: ancient grandfather type
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: he loves being bothered.
asciilifeform: wtf did the otc go ?
Adlai: (it's not in the b-otc order book anymore)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: good question! answer: packing it in such a way as to guarantee safe shipping would be prohibitively expensive. the man i bought it from, david schmidt (last symbolics employee) refuses to ship his remaining stock, after a multitude of DOAs.
decimation: can be done, just a pain in the ass
decimation: in the us, with that weight class, one must deal with 'freight operators'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform tbh i always wondered about the "shipping economically" part. surely 100lbs worth of various things have been shipped before, even in the us ?
assbot: Logged on 12-09-2014 19:19:30; asciilifeform: except - they aren't banning monsanto garbage. they're banning 'gmo.'
mircea_popescu: cazalla: question if anyone can help - is there a genuine security reason for someone to refuse to disclose how they generate entropy for the private keys contained in their physical bitcoin coin products? << not really, no. other than "we don't have a clue how it's done but this is sekoority and so being mysterious is the next best thing"
Adlai looks in the otc book
Adlai: the IBM thinkpad is good too, and still running like clockwork, 12 years later
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the chinese.
mircea_popescu: and they nearly went bankrupt with it.
gribble: Sergei Mavrodi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergei_Mavrodi>; MMM (Ponzi scheme company) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MMM_(Ponzi_scheme_company)>; Новости МММ-2012 - page screenshot of ...: <http://3py4p4ods8eqivzcenynzr9rp7gt35bzg399i2tksesul6wmpyfe1nsawtno.com/news/>
Adlai: well yes, that is a valid sense of the word
mircea_popescu: Adlai in the sense of gucci bags, nice.
Adlai: they've made some nice hardware too
mircea_popescu: apple it's what yahoo has aspired at all these years. if they had any sense, they wouldn't have hired melissa no clue, they'd have hired jobs back then
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> who in his right mind would consider 'apple', for instance, if microshit did not exist << i don't run a windows machine. for me ms might as well not exist. however, i did get apple powered tablet to check out their game marketplace.
asciilifeform: this generally ruins folks for life on the concept itself
asciilifeform: that is, a deliberately archaic variant that brings back all the dark age stereotypes (slow, no iteration constructs, poor i/o)
asciilifeform: the folks who attend uni, sometimes even worse than never hearing of it at all, learn 'LISP'
undata: man, this is the generation of programmers that thinks nosql is a great idea
decimation: they didn't teach lisp in those days
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah I remember rejecting perl; finding pythong as the best alternative
asciilifeform: no, power of the frying pan
undata thinks random shuffling among the things people are capable of
bounce: power of the crowd?
asciilifeform only has one theory, 'good-cop-bad-cop symbiosis' with perl
undata: python would be if not advisable, forgivible if someone ripped the classes out
mircea_popescu remembers riding rimm all the way down.
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski: this represents a 200% greater loss than last year while revenue doubled. <<< yeah, the time to short the pos approaches.
asciilifeform: the ruby by yukihiro 'i half-learned common lisp, i confess' matsumoto ?
mircea_popescu: ruby is the failure
bounce: next you'll be saying ruby is the future
asciilifeform: the pitiful object systems that lack even basics like 'mixins' are not merely cockless, but armless, legless
mircea_popescu: Adlai oh, you involved with the project ?
asciilifeform: dafuq's the point of mopless clos
bounce forgot who argued that of the four main things in OOP only encapsulation was really important, but things like (multiple) inheritance are just that much shinier
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski: ;;later tell DanielKrawisz Looking forward to seeing you rationalize this gem <<< i dunno, it's like the guy went off the deep end past coupla weeks.
Adlai: we got stuck on how to implement a MOP for sheeple, and it hasn't seen enough use for people to miss it... but it's a rather faithful translation of MOPless CLOS
asciilifeform: oop as straightjacked (i.e. other than clos) - yes.
decimation: asciilifeform: I get the feeling that oop is sick at a metaphysical level
mircea_popescu: Adlai i still got the impression it was discussed before. maybe im just confused, maybe assbot was down right then, dunno.
Adlai: mircea_popescu: actually not in the logs, unless anybody paid attention when i brought it up :)
asciilifeform: or even showed symptoms of having so much as smelled the book gas in kiczales et al
decimation: oop is one of those things that sounds great on paper, but when a group of programmers try to use it they end up with unmaintainable spaghetti code
mircea_popescu: i guess a fairer evaluation is to say oop got the blessing of suck, the way www did.
bounce: quite sure that if there wasn't OOP they'd've thought of something else to write crap code in