mircea_popescu: unlike bar down the street.
mircea_popescu: country gets a set of resources each generation, and ALWAYS SPENDS THEM. there's no option to "save", the 20yos now floating about will not be cryopreserved.
asciilifeform: is contention that asciilifeform is following in the footsteps of the mythical drunk who 'could drink erry day cuz he turned in his glass' ?
mircea_popescu: amortization is ~not meaningful~ in this context. there's nothing to ever amortize, macro-economically, that's specifically not how a country works.
mircea_popescu: the notion of "soviet computer work amortizing" is EXACTLY this sort of "naive extension". the ~very concept~ of "amortization" exactly mirrors the concept of "reproduction" in the previous step : you are using a naive notion that you're trying to extend naively.
a111: Logged on 2014-11-26 00:46 asciilifeform: have to understand, jet fighter is not really a complete machine. it is a tentacle of the larger industrial slave empire which produced and employed it.
mircea_popescu: of staying airborne, weight kills. so therefore, it makes way the fuck more sense to have iron bird's ovopositor on the ground, and construct a http://btcbase.org/log/2014-11-26#934786 rather than attempt a http://trilema.com/2014/the-complexity-of-life-a-triad/ "
mircea_popescu: "the notion that airplanes could reproduce through laying eggs is merely a naive extension, in the vein of 'object A has properties a and b ; object B shares property a and therefore it is reasonable ~~~on a first approximation~~~ to expect it exhibit proerty b'. nevertheless, artifacts differ from nature in that one fundamental aspect, that they're inefficient, and therefore to achieve same ends end up heavy, and in the case
asciilifeform as a larva, was taken to a su plastics factory where father was commissioning sumthing-or-other cover for some mechanism. and learned not only how plastic objects made, but why he 'no canhaz' custom one
asciilifeform: dunno what's the formula being sought, but how about that they don't, that can go to where built and see that it's factory and not farm ?
mircea_popescu: what is the hole in "reproduce airplanes through egg laying" ?
asciilifeform: what's the step?
mircea_popescu: nevermind that part, i'll explain that in the next step.
asciilifeform: where's the 'egg' here
asciilifeform: i currently dun grasp what hole mircea_popescu sees in the 'amortize via konsoomer' hypothesis. near as i can tell, it was the exact pattern. 6502 was initially costly, and cost dropped precisely in proportion to how popular 'atari'.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform dude, what the everloving fuck, if tomorrow i wake up with the notion evertyone in tmsr gotta get circumcised you're gonna do it ?! brejnev was not this popular or respected, not at any point in his life.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform those formative years are eminently not "amortize" in the batshit insane nonsense of having people-of-walmart involved.
asciilifeform: he was told by viziers that the only approach that has remote chance of staying solvent, was to copy ameri-tech. it had track record of working, surface to air rocket was copied at penny to the dollar of original cost, and worked a++ (still fielded in fact, from that period even)
mircea_popescu: lyonya25 "is happy to be rid of them"
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 20:25 mircea_popescu: meanwhile at the retard farms, LordMPofTMSR "Not even kidding." Lola_25 "Umm... what?" LordMPofTMSR "Think of it as an intelligence test. That you're failing." Lola_25 "Great! It seems like a quiz that I'm happy to fail" LordMPofTMSR "You failed everything to date, what "happy". You're happy like the chair's "happy" it can't walk : since it can not walk anyway... Now get lost."
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform establishment is never looking to crash and burn. not ever. brejnev "nixed" su ic in the exact sense of "happiness" from http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877404
mircea_popescu: it's my considered opinion that taking "the american experience" into consideration for any practical purpose is fundamentally stupid. might as well think in terms of "hey mr wright, this bird of yours is ok, but does it lay eggs ?"
asciilifeform: unless yer unspeakably loaded ( in usa this existed, and so there ~were~ 'bolixes', oddball affairs that were not 'pdp clone' )
asciilifeform: the aspec of this that stands out to asciilifeform's eye is that ic biz is moar like venus rocket than anyffing else. can't exactly save pennies from sofa cushion and upstart 'against establishment'
mircea_popescu: of course, the chinese don't need that for anything, but w/e.
mircea_popescu: it's a country adequate to the time and needs of jefferson, it'd make the best agrarian 1700s the world has ever seen.
mircea_popescu: they're literally 1024 chickens, inconsequentially "democratic", fighting the "corruption" of meaning.
mircea_popescu: this is the substance of my original claim. it seems to me russian man decided not to think. and this has no bearing on "cocksucker said". nobody yet has listened to the cocksuckers.
mircea_popescu: see, this is my point : at some point somewhere around the 60s, kurchatov jr decided he's gonna... ?
asciilifeform: nobody afaik. that generation was the last with serious spine.
mircea_popescu: where's the 60s ?
mircea_popescu: i mean metaphorically! wtf, that conversation happened in the 40s.
mircea_popescu: no, name the son.
asciilifeform: i dunno whether he had sons
mircea_popescu: recall man who said to stalin "i suppose you could do that... but then..." ?
asciilifeform: they ~did~ ftr figure out 'make toys with tank comp cpu', but 10yrs too late
asciilifeform: the real open q is 'why could su NOT also sell in atari'
asciilifeform: there is also the 'install base pressure'. recall mircea_popescu's serpent thread, when looked like it may have to be scrapped, 'motherfucker, i built battleship on this thing and NOW you say to scrap'
mircea_popescu: including all, down the way to young women understanding http://trilema.com/2013/whore-strat/ is what they're for, and any and all pointsd.
mircea_popescu: romania was never as broke as in the 90s, at least not since the 30s. and it never in its history gave as good answers to fundamental problems.
mircea_popescu: not because mit didn't try telling, which it did, of course, but because it's evident the telling does exactly nothing, and mit sitting about going "oh, symbolics fuckards because we told them to" exactly like inca sun priest going "sun rises cuz we told it to!"
asciilifeform: there's a serious fucktardation risk factor one gets from being chronically broke
mircea_popescu: fact of the matter, for ~these reasons~ i don't even believe mit told original symbolics&co fucktards to be fucktards.
mircea_popescu: i very much doubt it was "brejnev's bean counters" that told soviet man to be stupid ; much as i doubt it was ceausescu who told morons to be morons, and IGNORE 16 months of their own life because "didn't sign up for this", and not eat the fucking fish because "how dares owner think of us as cattle when that's exactly what we are", and so on.
mircea_popescu: point being, "technical calculus institute" still stood in 1990 for random morons (whom ceausescu DID send to mandatory military training, 16 months, taught how to fire and everyhthing) could stand on the roof of "to guard", profiled on the blue romanian skies so they could be shot from any of the surrounding hills
mircea_popescu: but we're discussing the orientation here.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform well yes, i'm not discussing end results. a tiny country on the black sea isn't gonna outrun us/su, it ain't fucking finland.
mircea_popescu: and the ro made items were ~industrial automation~. the hardware at my house was "officially" being hard at work doing shit for hotels and textile mills.
asciilifeform: which ? where they baked z80 clone ?
mircea_popescu: take ro programme : romania never scrapped theirs (was one of ~many~ items ceausescu rightfully called moscow http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/in-re-bitcoin-devs-are-idiots.htm over.
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 20:38 asciilifeform: whereas in e.g. '60s su actually had ic (of a sort) prior to the gringos
asciilifeform: if mircea_popescu is referring to the http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877417 item, it wasn't troo ic , but capsule with coupla dozen diodes/transistors. moar like small pcb.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform this concept of "amortize" as you use here is EXACTLY of the nature of brejnev's economic thinking
mircea_popescu: the "consummer affair" is the gringo's exact version of the "thinking man gave up", coming 2 decades later. (ie, next generation of ustards copied prev generation of soviets. like they always do, btw)
a111: Logged on 2018-10-25 16:56 asciilifeform: imho the classical fab is an overwhelmingly incatronic tech, it centralizes unhealthily.
mircea_popescu: "the world has space for maybe 4 ic pyramids".
asciilifeform: i cannot presume to pin this down exactly. will share hypothesis tho : '50s-'60s su excelled at 'castles' , 'institutional' mega-constructions. venus rocket is a pyramid. but ic is a konsoomer-driven affair
mircea_popescu: the ~parents~ of the people who scrapped the bk decided to not be like their grandparents. why and wherefore ?
mircea_popescu: if not the above, then what ? cuz it fucking well wasn't 78 bean counters. by the time they were even asked anything, that WHAT was already two decades (ie, one generation) old.
asciilifeform: ( neither asciilifeform nor asciilifeform's elder brother ever saw bk in anyone's house, was ruinously expensive, but at public toilet type affairs was common )
mircea_popescu: the cute 00 prefix.
asciilifeform: and yes they fished it out. ran on those '60s pre-ics.
mircea_popescu: so, you know, "as the 70s dawned, russian man came to this weird personal belief that he who thinks last wins". i suppose in a sense could be abomb-psychosis driven.
asciilifeform: ( who even into '70s persisted in a belief that there's 'amazing su tech' worth fishing out of e.g. sunken su sub , with howard hughes' mega-boat )
asciilifeform: whereas in e.g. '60s su actually had ic (of a sort) prior to the gringos
asciilifeform: '70s was ro-style 'they'll give us yesterday's machine at today's price' sorta thing
mircea_popescu: 60s different from 70s is the argument here ?
a111: Logged on 2016-01-17 02:20 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=16-01-2016#1373619 << aha. not even in motherfucking ussr. where 'zil' made not only limo for brezhnev, no expense spared, but... trucks
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 18:45 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877236 << not my reading. there was plenty of interesting, original work , it was fatwa'd in late '70s by brezhnev's bean counters, who did not see the problem with 'copy DEC and use foreign soft, better cheaper faster' etc
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877283 << i'm not saying i got a read so clear i can argue anyone out of his ; but how does this reconcile with the "achieve&over-achieve" policy ; and ~everything else~ about that regime. after all, http://btcbase.org/log/2016-01-17#1373877 did not copy lincoln.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yup, that's the story exactly.
mircea_popescu: meanwhile at the retard farms, LordMPofTMSR "Not even kidding." Lola_25 "Umm... what?" LordMPofTMSR "Think of it as an intelligence test. That you're failing." Lola_25 "Great! It seems like a quiz that I'm happy to fail" LordMPofTMSR "You failed everything to date, what "happy". You're happy like the chair's "happy" it can't walk : since it can not walk anyway... Now get lost."
asciilifeform enhanced the spam trap a little bit
asciilifeform: ... it is also possible that they threw in random ints and got lucky, the machine log does not rule out this hypothesis
a111: Logged on 2018-11-27 15:05 asciilifeform: in other lulz, http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-26#1874898 worx a+++ : prior, there was always 1 or 2 spamola in the mod queue erry day, ~through the broken google liquishit~, whereas nao -- none
asciilifeform: in other lulz, http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-27#1875120 gambit still not 'final solution' to spamola -- i now get 1-2 turds in mod queue erry day. ( hats off, i guess, to the spammers who know how to xor 2 small ints.. )
BingoBoingo: It's what the vest folks are supposed to prevent
BingoBoingo: Anyways, the biggest threat to parked cars is people parking their own cars. According to local lore plastic bumpers make vechicles immune to low speed collision damage and so when parking local will force a parking spot into existence
BingoBoingo: Lack of intersections that allow them time to make their pitch, and they get seen touching cars
BingoBoingo: Official Blue vests sold their souls for more rules, Orange and yellow vests just want to get high and delay their own mortality
asciilifeform: it's rather like molestation of cow in india
asciilifeform: here in northern reich we have 'lemme wash yer car' bums but for the most part they dun dare to molest parked vehicle
BingoBoingo: But yes, the vest people interested in cars are a sort of bum
BingoBoingo: With whatever the fuck Y does being a coinflip
BingoBoingo: Mostly they sell paraguay brick weed to lower unvested pichis
asciilifeform: i vaguely recall that brazil used to shoot these right on the spot, a++ approach, but possibly this was in the good old days and nomoar
asciilifeform: these were bums?!
asciilifeform: hrm, i thought they were ethnics ( incas who somehow slipped from the spanish mines ? )
asciilifeform: btw a very good chunk of the present-day cad monopoly biz is powered by tech written by bolix escapees. i tracked some of'em down ( and no they dun answer my mail... ) , they built the current cad houses.
asciilifeform: and -- will point out -- ran on the 3600 series boxen, where 4MB was 'princely' ram, and 2MHz was cpu clock.
asciilifeform: ( and it did both chips AND pcb AND motherfucking signal simulations !! )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: cad is 1 of the open problems for which a bolix clone would be +9000 mechanical lever.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877242 << fwiw 'cadence' has ~monopoly not only on ic cad, but on 'heavy industrial' pcb cad, for 16+ layers mobo etc. i actually one time tried to use it, warez , winblowz box, & all, it was monstrously gnarly, loathesome. but if yer making sumthing with 100,000s of netlist nodes, dozens of pcb layers, ball grid ics with 1,000s of balls, yer more or less stuck with it. i've avoided strictly by virt
BingoBoingo: I can't speak for Brasil other than Brasileros like to come here to escape beach crimes against their persons and property
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: he doesn't actually need to live next door to the rack
BingoBoingo: If it wasn't for the datacenter need, Peru, costal Colombia, or Atlantida, Uruguay would have been places to colonize
asciilifeform: last i recall, being tortured by heathen 'state' is +9000 martyrdom points ( but then again i might be out of date ? )
asciilifeform: sad if troo. eventually they'll not only pick the lot of you up, but you'll sit with 'bad conscience' ( why , exactly ? in ru old believers sat for decades in prisons with 100% clear consciences )
asciilifeform: i'm here cuz i'ma pauper. why are you in the reich danielpbarron ?
asciilifeform: incidentally, danielpbarron , iirc yer a money man, wtf are you still doing parked in the reich ??
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: they dun bother going to foreign rack, normally, if it suffices to pick up 'evil mastermind' who conveniently sits in the reich
BingoBoingo: No rails to fuck with because ass isn't heavy enough to need them
asciilifeform: usg claims ownership of all gamblers, http://trilema.com/2015/a-new-software-licensing-paradigm/#selection-133.0-140.0 - style; and thereby prosecutes pokerists in same style as e.g. cig smugglers in nyc
BingoBoingo: Anyways you take the ears off of a Qntra 9" deep rackmount box and it fits in a medium sized 24" checked bag
BingoBoingo: It's uruguay, as long as you don't advertise Uruguay marijuana to Uruguayos they don't care much, otherwise fall back to http://trilema.com/2013/simple-yet-effective-way-to-troll-white-rich-american-people/ nuclear option
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: then definite haram
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: theoretically inevitable gasenwagen. but in practice prolly depends on whether anybody actually uses.
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: consider. there's also FG option for rk.
lobbes: danielpbarron: fwiw my pizarro rockchip has served me well thus far as a home for both auctionbot and for mp-wp. Hell, you could run a mirror for your church's www in the event it goes down AND host the poker bot
asciilifeform: ( i recommend to read the sores , you will learn how asciilifeform approached the whole rng biz )
asciilifeform: i dun expect this is a q having a straight mathematical answer
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 03:37 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877212 << you can have a decent, new construction, 4-6k sqm floor space metal structure warehouse in ro for 100k+/-. but yes, more generally there's no place for real estate like europe. rest of the world, latam especially, 100% africans, built five huts in fifteen centuries. of which two burned down, so the other three are EVEN MORE VALUABLE NOW
asciilifeform: then i'ma leave it alone, prolly contains complete algo
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 03:23 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877034 << weird "saving self" thing, like the indians have with ejaculation. seems nutty enough if expressed, but it's kinda my takeaway, soviet thought "last man to think wins".
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877236 << not my reading. there was plenty of interesting, original work , it was fatwa'd in late '70s by brezhnev's bean counters, who did not see the problem with 'copy DEC and use foreign soft, better cheaper faster' etc
a111: Logged on 2018-08-01 22:03 mircea_popescu: there is no such thing as data that is all three of 1) random ; 2) useful and 3) buffered.
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: we have a thread re the problem of storing rng.
BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: Well, something must be said for the parallels between an independent box and a sort of temple.
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 03:15 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1876942 <<->> http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-29#1876009 ; also ended anglo finance and ~everything else. there's a ushinski story about the cat fighting a falcon, end results similar.
BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: Given that your system makes partnerships and joint ventures difficult, have you given thought to services you could offer the republic or your church which might justify racking a box?
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 16:44 BingoBoingo: In the Qntra comments: http://qntra.net/2017/07/miners-signal-segwit-via-bip-91-lock-in-avoiding-user-activated-fork/#comment-120995
lobbesbot: BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
BingoBoingo: And 'n further lulz not-President McCain gets more funeral time than Jorge Walker Bush I
BingoBoingo: Also many apologies, this should have been linked much more in the past http://trilema.com/2013/simple-yet-effective-way-to-troll-white-rich-american-people/
BingoBoingo: In sad news normally the kiosko on my block would be open today. It is not. Apparently grab and run shoplifting kills margins here.
BingoBoingo: In the Qntra comments: http://qntra.net/2017/07/miners-signal-segwit-via-bip-91-lock-in-avoiding-user-activated-fork/#comment-120995
lobbesbot: BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
BingoBoingo: !Qlater tell amberglint your last line ties into the real estate thread. Easier to buy things than make things or have them made
amberglint: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877242 << getting more 'sovereignty' which supposedly impelled the ru gov to buy the fabs in the first place, could gradually replace the IC software stack with something homegrown if cared; nothing to impel anyone without those fabs, of course
BingoBoingo: Now if you want to see delusional cranked up a few notches... There's Paraguay https://inmueble.mercadolibre.com.py/MPY-400223044-vendo-quinta-en-minga-guazu-alto-paranakm-185codg38-_JM
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877212 << you can have a decent, new construction, 4-6k sqm floor space metal structure warehouse in ro for 100k+/-. but yes, more generally there's no place for real estate like europe. rest of the world, latam especially, 100% africans, built five huts in fifteen centuries. of which two burned down, so the other three are EVEN MORE VALUABLE NOW
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 02:32 asciilifeform: ( in bucharest there's a microshit bldg, where they keep amstan 's . but that's afaik more or less it )
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 01:17 amberglint: I've tried to obtain any docs for the VLIW thing, but it's under NDA for some reason
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877053 << the "AriseBank" reason. there's this large class of idle idiots who think "secrecy" might be confused with value. much like there's a cloud of fat stupid old women not even the dogs would fuck, who imagine they're being coy.
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 01:12 amberglint: why the hell Soviets were so hell-bent on not doing anything original
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877034 << weird "saving self" thing, like the indians have with ejaculation. seems nutty enough if expressed, but it's kinda my takeaway, soviet thought "last man to think wins".
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 00:43 asciilifeform: from looking with the right magnifying glass, asciilifeform formed distinct impression that jp was raped by usg in erry hole not once, as ordinarily supposed, but ~twice~.
a111: Logged on 2018-11-29 17:55 mircea_popescu: led to the usual symptoms of imperial decay -- monetization of real estate (a bad idea throughout, even if it repatriated the money japs made selling toyotas/sinking detroit in the 70s -- sorta like arsenic is bad for you even if it "keeps syphilis inactive" and so on) ; the star model driving and being driven by the fashion cycle, and so the fuck on.
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 00:38 asciilifeform: jp was a hair's width away from picking up the torch that anglotardistan dropped, and anglos knew this, and so in late '80s they engineered an economic implosion for'em
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1876942 <<->> http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-29#1876009 ; also ended anglo finance and ~everything else. there's a ushinski story about the cat fighting a falcon, end results similar.
mircea_popescu: "Rice, 30, first claimed to have raised $300m from AriseBank's coin offering, then upped that figure to $600m, and later promised this could be the first billion-dollar crypto-dosh offering. However, despite all that publicity and hype, it is claimed hundreds of punters invested just $4.25m in exchange for the bank's tokens." << keks. and this is after usg multiply-magic, "we found 777 kgs of cocaine in the shape of a toyota
a111: Logged on 2018-11-30 23:14 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: it's a biz, there are folx who do it, i've talked to half dozen of'em last yr ( all in cn , 0 in latrine america ) -- but i dun presently know how to break into it
a111: Logged on 2018-11-30 23:03 BingoBoingo: Having a rebuilt caterpillar is usually a result of it being inconvenient to rent when it brings the most convenience
mircea_popescu: \http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-30#1876891 << kinda the problem, this is how airports end up owning a fleet of eg iceploughs : "we only need them 3 days each decade -- but as it happens it's always the exact fucking three day you can't possibly fucking find one to rent, of these items that otherwise go for 500 a day."
a111: Logged on 2018-11-30 22:56 asciilifeform: it's rather like a 'caterpillar'. how many folx do you know who have own 'caterpillar' and dun work it erry day for daily bread.
a111: Logged on 2018-11-30 22:37 asciilifeform: i still can't fucking believe that d00d. 'my experiment requires 3 litres of virgin tears' 'hey al, i took 300 virgins and ran then rom-coms until they cried 3L, here it is in a mason jar' 'but! reasons!'
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-30#1876843 << sort of thing that makes me suspicious of the whole "good science" theory etc. but, won't rehash, pretty sure we did that already to the point it died of end mommentum.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-30#1876836 << whole fucking idea is to a) lighten the load of dying empire ; b) round the coffers of republican corps to better divorce from vagaries of usg faux "market".
mircea_popescu: in the other lulz : LordMPofTMSR 38M Master ~~~1y~~~~ "How goes ?" mermaidkynna 25F sub 4h "Good"
mircea_popescu has just drank, can then pick it uo
asciilifeform: whoknows, maybe that's where they sell hdds..
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> somehow montevideo with , what, 2mil+ people, can't keep a zoo open << Aparently there is another newer zoo
asciilifeform: but somehow there it was.
asciilifeform: i have nfi how it is even possible to have ~empty town where ~erry other walker you see on the sidewalk is a hot chix.
asciilifeform: ( in bucharest there's a microshit bldg, where they keep amstan 's . but that's afaik more or less it )
BingoBoingo: Well, they had the whole communism thing where mircea_popescu got a silver spoon and everyone else payola
asciilifeform: out of what, would they.
BingoBoingo: I thought they uninvented it
asciilifeform: they starve.
asciilifeform: beautifully depopulated , too, 0 crowds, 0 queues. sorta like a hypothetical bunenos aires after redditbagging complete.
asciilifeform: ( perhaps if one tried to set up there, would find out.. )
asciilifeform: i dun think i in entire life saw bldgs as sweet as the ones in timis.
a111: Logged on 2017-11-28 00:02 asciilifeform: other typical items : http://www.loper-os.org/pub/timis_sad_mansion.jpg http://www.loper-os.org/pub/timis_sad_mansion_2.jpg http://www.loper-os.org/pub/timis_sad_factory.jpg
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: then it's straight miami 'I AM WORTH!' delusionism, i guess
BingoBoingo: IVA's the bitch
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> i bet they get tax writeoff for 'not sold or rented it this yr, just like last 20 yrs' like ameritards get << Well property taxes here like income taxes are relatively low.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> and that's a washington price. these people have fucked heads. << Well, how many dindus does Washington have vs how many Montevideo has
asciilifeform: i bet they get tax writeoff for 'not sold or rented it this yr, just like last 20 yrs' like ameritards get
asciilifeform: and that's a washington price. these people have fucked heads.
BingoBoingo: Short walk (other side of front door) to the feria https://inmueble.mercadolibre.com.uy/MLU-457798235-en-cordon-_JM
asciilifeform: or those horrid 3 variant of thorn the arabs have.
asciilifeform: sorta how the hindu glottal 'd' isn't to us.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: they aint got a 'r'.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> but we currently have 0 penetration into cn, so i've nothing to add to this yet << Chinese tend to have more trouble with the letter "rr" than I do
asciilifeform: there's arguably 2 separate problems at hand : 1) how to bake an ic such that it's an actual economic proposition, rather than resembling that car e. musk launched to mars 2) to get it done by someone other than malicious winshit-idiots . both -- currently open problems.
asciilifeform: iirc mircea_popescu's hypothesis was that the whole thing is an 'idiot tax' for people who don't know how to get'em made in cn
amberglint: at least they eat input from Magic CAD without NDA crap?
a111: Logged on 2018-10-25 05:14 asciilifeform: there's a coupla 'small scale' fabs, but on close examination smell like ripoff, they ship with literally 0 guarantee of yield , and in laughable qty , and with laughable transistor count, and -- to add insult to injury -- die packaging not included, you gotta somehow find someone to do it, somewhere
asciilifeform: + they charge weight in diamonds, per die.
asciilifeform: there was a french one also, similar.
asciilifeform: ( at 'modern' micronicities, fab process is no longer standard but custom to the chem, and entirely diff at each fab house. hence the proprietary tooling crapolade. )
asciilifeform: pcb fabs, much more pedestrian affair, are run sanely, they eat PNGs and text file of coords/rotations for placer robot.
asciilifeform: last yr ( and before ) i talked to a coupla ic fabs, in various countries. they all not only run winshit but demand that you use their 'standard cells', which available (surprise?) under nda
asciilifeform: indeed they do
amberglint: the 'sovereign' fabs all run Cadence and Mentor Graphics stuff
asciilifeform: wake me up when they make a http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-23#1865375 , + open docs like http://nosuchlabs.com/hardware.html
asciilifeform: i dun think any plebe has laid hands on the thing or ever will
asciilifeform: some meathead minister signed off on it, and guesswat, it's Official textbook nao! in some shithole
asciilifeform: i have a b00k like that here, 'учебное пособие по криптографии' somthing or other. which fails to contain rsa.
asciilifeform: ( then they went and ~licensed~ american mips. and i stopped wanting to buy. i can buy mips already )
amberglint: oddly enough, there's a university textbook on Elbrus, no instruction set there either: http://www.mcst.ru/doc/book_121130.pdf
asciilifeform: rather like elbrus.
asciilifeform quite fond of alpha, the architecture book was ~thin~
amberglint: asciilifeform: never heard of the limousine, but I know that C# was made by Delphi people
asciilifeform: famously sent limousine to pick them ALL up on same evening
asciilifeform: aka 'the itanic'
asciilifeform: same reason the video card crapolas are closed source
asciilifeform: ( asciilifeform and then mircea_popescu variously attempted to buy , 0 to show for it )
amberglint: I've tried to obtain any docs for the VLIW thing, but it's under NDA for some reason
asciilifeform: neither seems to exist on commercial markets anywhere
asciilifeform: there's 2 , 1 clone of 'itanic', 1 of sparc iirc
amberglint: the Elbrus designers can count as native, no?
asciilifeform: and they fab photoclones of ameri-crud.
amberglint: AMD fab was gathering dust for ~7 years before it was recently put to any use
amberglint: these days Russia buys outdated fabs from AMD and IBM
amberglint: why the hell Soviets were so hell-bent on not doing anything original
asciilifeform: amberglint: also familiar. it went to same place as all the non-pdpclone su stuff.
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 00:35 asciilifeform: 'Before leaving this subject, I should mention that there have been a number of interesting LISP Machine designs done outside the U.S., particularly in Japan. For example, see [Hayashi]' << asciilifeform once spent coupla months trying to dig up these. and europistan's 'racal norsk' also. found ~0.
amberglint: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1876938 << there was also a Soviet Refal machine: http://www.keldysh.ru/papers/2003/source/prep2003_99.doc
BingoBoingo: The local favored cocaine alkaloid