artifexd: I'm talking about the identity keys.
asciilifeform: or the blockcipher symmetrics?
asciilifeform: where do the ephemeral keys come from
mircea_popescu: artifexd weak encryption altogether.
artifexd: How could the crypto routines be compromised in a way that would matter? Weak key generation? gossipd doesn't generate keys. Weak rng during encryption? I pick the rng (and can offer an option for you to supply your own). Encrypting a message with an "extra" key so peet can read it? That should be easy to see in the code.
mircea_popescu: seems a reasonable approach tbh, but generally people should free to use whatever they wish to use.
asciilifeform: i'll save the rest for when artifexd posts his apparatus.
mircea_popescu: as opposed to... well... it's what the build pulled in.
mircea_popescu: anyway. guy can use whatever crypto routines he's comfortable with, on the general understanding that he's read them and is actually comfortable with them
asciilifeform: let's say, specifically the use of questionable crypto routines
asciilifeform: but suppose he lubricates the razor in his own liquid shit.
mircea_popescu: if i pick a barber i don't go by the straight razor brand.
mircea_popescu: well ok, sure, but still. i dun see the problem, so b-a guy wants to play with go. his choice, his signature, why is this an issue.
asciilifeform: google is the i.g.farben of this particular hitler.
asciilifeform: not that vague. google brass dine with the fuhrer regularly, etc. this is well-known.
asciilifeform: basically, does not predate the age of corruption.
mircea_popescu: well... guess what ? nobody ever read fucking linux, either.
mircea_popescu: supposedly nobody ever read these
asciilifeform was simply floored with mindfuck that anyone would choose google's turdlang for a piece of critical infrastructure, and could not resist ringing the bell
asciilifeform: i'll run own client. (will tweak it for compatibility with the rest of you, when i have a little time.) and invite anyone who wishes, to read.
mircea_popescu: well, conversely, now they get to be reviewed.
asciilifeform: it isn't simply an 'other language', it's a massive toolchain created and maintained by a usg satrap.
asciilifeform: it didn't even occur to me that anyone would write such a thing in anything other than c
mircea_popescu: davout let's keep the drama one strand at a time
asciilifeform: i didn't commission the thing, lol
asciilifeform: but would like the option of getting off it. esp. for particular applications.
asciilifeform: the free world.
mircea_popescu: what else is there ?!
mircea_popescu: wouldn't one expect the libs also compile ?!
asciilifeform: it's all, theoretically, open
artifexd: All the libs are open
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: nominally open-source, but in the same sense as apple's 'darwin' kernel - that is, nobody who isn't paid, reads it
artifexd: go compiles on the big os's. Windows/Linux/OSX/BSD
asciilifeform: i don't run other folks' binaries.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what's the problem anyway, you weren't going to run his binaries ? no os compiler for it ?
davout: rfc sez "Steal gpg code - any version prior to the Snowden defection"
artifexd: Yeah. Hence the shell out.
asciilifeform: the original rfc also mentioned specifically use of gpg cryptoroutines
asciilifeform: i wouldn't either
asciilifeform: davout: 1) his gizmo is in 'go', a google-proprietary turdlang 2) he's using its built-in crypto routines 3) if you don't like this, have fun waiting 300-500msec/packet using the shell-callout
asciilifeform is rather sad to learn what he just learned.
artifexd: The shell out will be slow. Yup.
artifexd: <asciilifeform> speaking of which, did artifexd follow mircea_popescu's prescription and use a hacked gpg for 'gossip' ? << No. I'm using go's openpgp code. However, I'm structuring the code so that I can later add the option do the crypto via a shell out to gpg. Then you can use whatever version of gpg your heart desires.
mircea_popescu: so... what do you mean not everybody on the internet is a dumbass ?
mircea_popescu: hey, the average domestic animal regards its keeper as an animal of the same age and the same gender as it is.
davout: somehow they're too dumb to realize that their 'tips' are more insulting and spammy than anything...
mircea_popescu: yes. as ideas spread on the internet, the derps they touch become increasingly nonsensical.
davout: they kind of think that some random guy that never heard about bitcoin will be thrilled to receive a fraction of a cent in magic internet money, redeem it, and start spreading adopshun
asciilifeform: the earlier crowed of 'early adopting' cultist weirdos made considerably more sense to me. they just wanted 'to get rich,' i.e., to quit their jobs
mircea_popescu: also, if they never hear a dissenting opinion ever again that'll be soon enough.
mircea_popescu: "change the world"
asciilifeform: what do the reddit folks want ?
asciilifeform: the part that's puzzling is - a classical cargo cult has 'the airplane flies', or an analogous prayed-for outcome
mircea_popescu: same here : not doing anything, but hey, they're "involved" with bitcoin.
mircea_popescu: not learning anything, but hey, they've gone to college.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no im pretty sure he has it. "they feel like they're doing something". much like their education.
asciilifeform: what's the appeal ? i find it hard to picture any of them amassing any kind of serious coin this way
asciilifeform: what is with reddit and the 'tipping' thing? is everyone 'roleplaying' a waiter, a bootblack ?
mircea_popescu: the redditards are kinda too easy to poke fun at
mircea_popescu: chicks face with the phone too.
ben_vulpes: i love how they have precisely 1 vine
TomServo: That must be the best use of vine to date.
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mircea_popescu: i mostly hung out with the girls. and if the girls didn't show up i mostly harrangued the prof.
jurov: i don't know how i managed to survive 4 hour lectures on uni, had only nokia brick then
mircea_popescu: the government!
mircea_popescu: they say it about me tho!
teward has privacy screens on either way but still
teward: mircea_popescu: yes, just sayin for those of us who IRC while in class from the back of the room... ;)
MetatronOne: mircea_popescu> unrelatedly : today i find that prior to 1820 or so, hawaii was all-nude, and that the proper an' traditional hula dance is to be done without panties or other apparel. | woah. what a way to ruin it!
mircea_popescu: in that it drastically limits the pool of potential attackers and attackable material.
mircea_popescu: well, depending of what you actually need to sign, never putting your signed matter over the wire unencrypted can help a lot.
joecool: mircea_popescu: i was unaware of the entropy issues on signing until after this was implemented, until then i had assumed it was only important to generate the keys themselves with sufficient entropy
mircea_popescu: unrelatedly : today i find that prior to 1820 or so, hawaii was all-nude, and that the proper an' traditional hula dance is to be done without panties or other apparel.
mircea_popescu: and inasmuch as you're a person rather than an organisation, "forced coercion" is really not very much use.
mircea_popescu: joecool the 2nd's most concerning.
joecool: an adversary with large resources will likely be able to get around that through forced coercion before even needing to try to attack the implementation (which I still believe would be a nontrivial task unless the system had a rootkit installed that maliciously generated signatures, that i would see on the counter)
joecool: mircea_popescu: there are two major problems with this implementation that i see. both are problems the cardano solves, 1. the system knows it's a smartcard and malicious software could use it, and 2. weak entropy generation for signing
joecool: if i needed to protect from a 3-letter agency i'd have bigger problems than the shortcomings of a smartcard
joecool: yeah i know you hate them
joecool: asciilifeform: it's just constant fighting to do most anything with the software, it's laid out poorly, simple tasks like minting smartcards, i literally have to back up the config directory for it and copy to mint more cards
mircea_popescu: cazalla not particularly. unless you either have exclusivity, a scoop or actual documents,
cazalla: i use to cover the company A raises X amount of capital but have been skipping them as you could really just word replace the amount and company name from a previous article and be done with it. does anyone actually care about such things and wishes to see them?
asciilifeform: now the code is virtually unreadable, and this is true for all versions. no argument.
asciilifeform: but what is the horrible part ?
joecool: i wish -assets would take on attempting to make gnupg2 less horrible, which is the preferred version of gnupg in here anyway?
mircea_popescu: the one with "too important, i didn;t recognize him" had me rolling on the floor lol
mircea_popescu: that's the female prayer, thank you allah for not having made me sheep (beast of field)
undata: https://quranexplained.wordpress.com/2010/01/11/cannibalism-in-the-quran/ << dunno the veracity of this
mircea_popescu: i dunno how inclined teh arabs would be to fight if losing means they're eaten.
mircea_popescu: i wonder what the us army would look like on the ground if they actually started eating the afghanistani.
asciilifeform: e boards; and for back-up, deep in all their hearts, there were always the Nukes, they loved to remind you that we had some, right here in-country. Once I met a colonel who had a plan to shorten the war by dropping piranha into the paddies of the North. He was talking fish but his dreamy eyes were full of mega-death.'
asciilifeform: 'That night I listened while a colonel explained the war in terms of protein. We were a nation of high-protein, meat-eating hunters, while the other guy just ate rice and a few grungy fish heads. We were going to club him to death with our meat; what could you say except, Colonel, youre insane?
Doomsday celebs, technomaniac projectionists; chemicals, gases, lasers, sonic-electric ballbreakers that were still on th
mircea_popescu: TomServo welll... some guy i never heard of presented on some webpage i never saw before as important, turns out he's another gavin, doing parlour tricks atparties and whatnot.
cazalla: talk is cheap! make them illegal, be a doer like bill gates
asciilifeform suspects that most of the world's mosquitoes live not too far from him
gribble: We begin bombing in five minutes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_begin_bombing_in_five_minutes>; Ronald Reagan - We Begin Bombing In 5 Minutes - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgSSRE27GQ0>; Reagan Bombing Joke - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zv13ZnkpWos>
undata: you want to really change the world, legalize acid
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undata: this pot legality thing is just another american political football. no one ever had trouble getting weed, nor passing a drug test. its a distraction issue.
mircea_popescu: it's somehow the fashionable thing, i dunno.
MetatronOne: well atleast they can start smoking while undercover
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mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski government is the junior partner by tradition / legislation
pete_dushenski: well obama might be the senior partner, but he's only one man
asciilifeform: 'My suggestion was quite simple: Put that needed code number in a little capsule, and then implant that capsule right next to the heart of a volunteer. The volunteer would carry with him a big, heavy butcher knife as he accompanied the President. If ever the President wanted to fire nuclear weapons, the only way he could do so would be for him first, with his own hands, to kill one human being.'
mircea_popescu: the solution are as always : either make the senior much richer (which really is not feasible) or break the relationship.
mircea_popescu: it's an unstable situation this, where the supposedly senior rulemaker is cheaper to buy than the supposedly junior partner.
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski it would seem the story there isthat obama knows that congress can be bought quite cheaply
pete_dushenski: also, the white house "doesn't need" all kinds of things it can't do, like stop assad or whatever
pete_dushenski: i already broke into the b-a lordship in 2014 so...
mircea_popescu: "here's the temperatures in the past 30 years. on the basis of this, here's how the temperatures woud have been in the past 5000 years, if our presupositions are correct. on the basis of this, here's the story of the future : our presupositions are correct"
pete_dushenski: not enough art classes for kids so they get all obsessed with rulers and crayons as adults
pete_dushenski: same as the linear projection braindamage
mircea_popescu: "why do we interact with the fantastic representations in our head rather than with the flesh and blood woman before us ? IT IS EASIER!"
mircea_popescu: "The reason for doing this is that we can better reason about the output of a CSPRNG; by contrast, it is difficult to reason about the output of the entropy source." << gotta love the sweet innocence on display here tho.
mircea_popescu: but in other news, http://33.media.tumblr.com/67e27cfcdd4a64b5a0ca2e7000e540c4/tumblr_n7cv52cTok1r6rmfno1_500.gif
mircea_popescu: In the immortal rights of Moss, Goddamn right, that's right. Guys come on: "Oh, the blah blah blah, I know what I'll do: I'll go in and rob everyone blind and go to Argentina cause nobody ever thought of this before."
kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> well whos the guy ? < fuck if i know. i just made a bet he wont reply, but he did. iirc.
pete_dushenski: like the last chick, lawyer whatever her name was
pete_dushenski: though he could well be another fall guy
pete_dushenski: there's no term limit in alberta
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> why these folks renamed it, i cannot say. << guess/
mircea_popescu: well whos the guy ?
mircea_popescu: <kakobrekla> and mp had direct contact with the man iirc << who this again ?
thestringpuller: i srsly though the hawks were still owned by Ted Turner/Time Warner
TomServo: Is that the 'no, I assure you I'm racist' self-outing guy?
thestringpuller: people aren't really complaining too heavily tho locally since the teams is actually good this season
thestringpuller: i never knew he owned the hawks until recently
thestringpuller: the lost city of Atlanta
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller where are you located again?
pete_dushenski: fantastic place to visit, wouldn't want to live there.
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pete_dushenski: http://www.contravex.com/2015/01/16/go-ahead-jim-prentice-raise-taxes-in-alberta-and-see-if-by-2025-the-province-isnt-an-economic-shithole-like-quebec-and-ontario/ << what good is a blog if you can't take a run at local politicians, amirite?
asciilifeform: (how and why it works is a primary school level mathematical proof. i recommend that anyone unfamiliar with it, try to derive)
jurov: but these people nave a need to construct such reasoning
jurov: if it would be merely about von neumann, then ok
jurov: Thus, it is possible to say that the resulting device is at least as secure as a CSPRNG, but, since we have a constant stream of new seeds, we can be confident that it is actually a better source of random numbers than a CSPRNG that is seeded less frequently.
asciilifeform: why these folks renamed it, i cannot say.
jurov: The output of the conditioner is then fed into a cryptographically secure pseudo-random number generator (CSPRNG). The reason for doing this is that we can better reason about the output of a CSPRNG; by contrast, it is difficult to reason about the output of the entropy source.
jurov: Most entropy sources don't produce "good" random numbers. The source may, for example, produce ones only 25% of the time. This doesn't negate the value of the source. However, the "obvious" non-randomness must be eliminated; that is the task of the conditioner.
jurov: i went on some googling why the "conditioning" and found this gem: http://lwn.net/Articles/525204/
kakobrekla: and mp had direct contact with the man iirc
kakobrekla: but only the unworthy.
jurov: cardano is another league than this
gribble: (rate <nick> <rating> [<notes>]) -- Enters a rating for <nick> in the amount of <rating>. Use optional <notes> field to enter any notes you have about this user. <nick> must be the user's GPG-registered username, Your previously existing rating, if any, will be overwritten.
BingoBoingo: Well according to the NCAA written rules, they aren't alowed to. According to the unwritten rules of the actual government of the sport they totally are allowed to give away and sell it.
mircea_popescu: "LSU football equipment is leased to student-athetes, who are not allowed to give it away or sell it." fucking outrage.
BingoBoingo: rithm: There's one that always has that spread a couple towns over.
assbot: What I find interesting about it, is that it appears to be effortless; like these are the cast offs, the "While ima here, Ill let you know".
BingoBoingo: Apparently the dollar fell against 87 octane yesterday at retail
mircea_popescu: "So lets learn from the Swiss. Theyve been careful; theyve maintained sound money for generations. And now theyre paying the price."
mircea_popescu: it's kind-of remarkable (not really) just how self-labeling stupidity actually is. the difference between trying to "explain yourself" as an idiot and simply wearing a lot of large "hey everyone, i'm the idiot!" signs and tags is hard to notice.
mircea_popescu: those people just failed to "enter the looking glass world" when "everybody" did.
TomServo: In glancing through the comments on Krugman's piece, he seems to be getting pretty well lambasted there.
mircea_popescu: that what the us considers important thinkers have no access to basic data, because they're isolated on a WoI, should speak volumes.
mircea_popescu: "And for three years it worked. But on Thursday the Swiss suddenly gave up. We dont know exactly why; nobody I know believes the official explanation, that its a response to a weakening euro. " << ha-ha. everyone you DON'T know knows the explanation. it was published on fucking trilema for crissakes, not even as a news item.
mircea_popescu: Hey! This page will never end! Just keep on scrolling to see more posts! < lol busted. anyway! i guess it goes back i nthe pile that has been holding "open transactyions" since about 2011.
mircea_popescu: "With the two attacks we thwarted in 2014, the GUI development had to take a bit of a backseat." << in depth description ? links ? somehow for me to evaluate if they're due to the world being full of idiots (ddos ?) or the devs being idiots (we were using ruby!!1)
mircea_popescu: (when what looks like a term of art has basically two apparently divorced meanings via google, it's suspicious if they don't seem mutually aware)
mircea_popescu: "OpenAlias is different. Not only does it "square Zooko's triangle" " << the entire discusison of that thing (my mind went, ok, let's try and poke one particular thing and see" is nice and all for the zooko discussion, but a) it's not clear to me what's the relation to open alias corporation if any
davout: i was personnally quite impressed by the "let's start by a financial report"
mircea_popescu: Testing infrastructure consists of a Mac Mini hosted at MacStadium, as well as a beefy testing box hosted at Hetzner in Germany, on which we have a number of VMs for the various operating systems and variants we target. >> much better.
davout: mircea_popescu: maybe in the sense that it was inherited as a messy bytecoin code base
mircea_popescu: 35 weeks of development (245 days) since Monero was inherited by the Core Team 594 separate commits << inherited by whom ? how ? if that inherited had linked to a gpg signed testament...
mircea_popescu: this would explain the shockingly large 50 btc donations figure for an altcoin i guess.
mircea_popescu: "Expenditure for the year comprised of 3 totals as some costs could not be settled in BTC or were preferably settled in XMR. Our expenditure was 190.513492 BTC + 1 891.31 XMR + US $5 732.80, which is around the 212 BTC mark. Thus the shortfall of 164.5 BTC was paid out of the Core Team's own pockets in the hopes of recovering the funds later on (ie. just in case anyone was wondering, not only do the core team not get p
mircea_popescu: that not right in there ?
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo " So far it hasn't been enforced due to its extreme vagary, but in the unstable environment of applied United States law. Not with the sudden resurgence of threats to invoke the All Writs Act reentering the public discourse in late 2014."
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform lol always great to read the comedy gold classics every time us policy backfires massively.
TomServo: Another great article BingoBoingo.
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thestringpuller: a super villian would have been running this shit from Africa and would have actually killed people in the process
thestringpuller: d00d they are calling him a supervillian already
thestringpuller: no wonder the Feds were able to compromise Silk Road if Tux was running it.
fluffypony: thestringpuller: nah, probably only a couple of minutes - you have to remember that he would only have heard the news shortly before that Tweet, what with the self-induced mocha frappacino coma binge he's been on lately
BingoBoingo: Well Where might McCaleb have met Kapeles if not the silk road over a spoonful of black tar?
jurov: it's completely incomprehensible to me why they have chosen karpeles of all people
fluffypony: so just a regular scammer, then
fluffypony: yep it doubles up to 6gb when its spooling to disk (every 12 hours), as it creates a copy of the blockchain object
fluffypony: and the lmdb branch is reasonably stable, but Linux only at this stage
jurov: it worked for maybe a day, then linux died
jurov: just for fun i have tried to cap RSS using control groups so that the rest would go to swap
jurov: pity the monero memory problem isn't resolved yet (keeps blockchain in memory, needs 30G)
davout: just so i have an idea what it's about so i can dig further if needed
midnightmagic: anyway, excuse the offtopic
midnightmagic: i need undeformable support. the weight of my leg on my heel while driving is pretty excruciating, but normal shoes would ruin my feel of the floor and pedals
mircea_popescu: there must be some shop left somewhere that still does it. they make chain mail by hand and whatnot, i can't imagine shoemakers all died out.
mircea_popescu: twenty years ago you could have leather shoes made by design to order in quantities of one, up in harlem.
midnightmagic: mircea_popescu: I've been looking for a heel form specifically like that to wear for long trips in my sportscar. Minus all the metal and straps. I think a heel form support over the outside of a vibram would probably double my range without rest.
asciilifeform: the extinction of adequate physical equipment, also.
asciilifeform: (i can think of perhaps one or two ways, but labour competition is quite certainly not one of them)
mircea_popescu: and outdoors half the time for that matter.
mircea_popescu: i keep the girls nude indoors.
mircea_popescu: they probably learn more useful & important stuff playing counterstrike than mashing the kbd for code.
decimation: so, the chinese peasant is a textile hobbyist in the way that the 'computer geek' is a programming hobbyist?
mircea_popescu: it's what computer geek means, these days. "shy, socially awkward teenager that doesn't know how to use computers, in spite of spending a lot of time with them"
mircea_popescu: them exactly.
asciilifeform: the programmatory equivalent of chinese textile labourers ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i mean mostly the ruby and web2.0 "we r code" bunch.
mircea_popescu: dunning kruger is not reserved to idiots. it's just another name for the aspie's sufferance.
mircea_popescu: yet somehow their inability to score girlfriends or be the life of the party does not even begin to hint to them that perhaps they're ill prepared to judge economic phenomena.
mircea_popescu: anyway, if ever there was a social experiment to illustrate just how little computer geeks understand, bitcoin's it.
mircea_popescu: that's not really the mechanism here tho.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: they were abruptly hollowed out and made good 'floors' for remaining concerns - pharma, call centres, etc.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: re: buffett's textile plants: i once worked with a greybeard - a former director of a research lab at, iirc, kodak (many years ago.) he was reduced to programming by ill fortune, age, disease. told many stories, but concerning textiles, that his laboratory was built inside an abandoned textiles plant, one of a great many in the american south.
mircea_popescu: justusranvier http://qntra.net/2015/01/transaction-fees-and-the-future-of-bitcoin/#comment-7394
decimation: I suppose the simple (call-put) analysis ignores the prevailing interest rates in each currency, which would also affect the future price
decimation: I guess the simple call-put analysis would imply a future increase in price
decimation: interesting, the march 15 euro future on CME is at $1.16, with a $1.16 call at $0.0248 and put at $0.0195
mircea_popescu: never again. do what you will, and fuck them.
mircea_popescu: not like you're going to do anything whatsoever BECAUSE of the usg.