btcg: random question: what do you folks think of the proposed embedded mining from 21?
justJanne: mircea_popescu: they aren’t for sale yet, but if you want to get a taste, you can buy an AMD GPU
justJanne: your phone will burn through your clothes. And then ignite everything around it, before becoming a blob of molten lava
mircea_popescu: mod6 the entire toaster miner thing was lulzy to begin with, but smartphone coronat opus.
justJanne: mod6: power is not the issue.
mod6: asciilifeform: heh, now these 21 guys are saying they wanna make embeddable mining chips for smart phones. glwt. seeing as how they run out of power in like 9 minutes as it is.
trinque: lol yeah I formatted the drive too
trinque: the tears
mircea_popescu: dude let the woman have her childhood. i listened to fucking iron maiden!
mod6: there's ~20 hours you'll never get back
justJanne: I’ve seen the movie 13 times in cinema >_>
mircea_popescu: they do a trick, for frozen cgi, which is very hard to do by hand, where they fold her face in a particular moe pattern. amusingly enough - this is very similar to how pharma works, because it involves searching the space of possible facefolds for something that's not in the uncanny valley and works.
justJanne: I didn’t draw them
justJanne: a friend did, but I collected them
trinque: heh maybe if the last two terms are swapped
justJanne: the law literally says "if you access an electronical data computation system unauthorized"
trinque: justJanne: someone requires I use thing X as part of my browser, and that's the day I stop using browsers
mircea_popescu: and therefore, my bitch!
mircea_popescu: so "prove i did it" has a very simple counter : if you weigh the same as a duck
justJanne: we’re talking here about a government where the chancellor has a PhD in Quantum Chemistry – obviously not stupid, but evil.
mircea_popescu: it's point is not to produce sicence, but to prevent people from clobbering each other.
mircea_popescu: you don't understand how the law works, trinque
justJanne: and governments then passing laws that "circumventing client-side access control" becomes a crime
trinque: so you've got one group of derps demanding the thing be "intuitive" to "those people"
mircea_popescu: trinque the selector thing is specific js tho, and it does something not afaik doable in html per se
justJanne: if your parents didn’t kill you for the dialup bill, though
justJanne: in 2010 you could throw wget -r on the new york times and get, after a few weeks, half of the web.
justJanne: adlai: yes, but in 2008 you could just curl the web and get it all
adlai: justJanne: dunno, it seems obvious that if you want to crawl the luser-visible web, you simulate the luser, not curl
justJanne: like that it encourages them to use more functional code
mircea_popescu: trinque i dunno dood, i love the select thing on trilema.
trinque: subcategory of... JS is an appalling language and bolted to the DOM it's even worse
justJanne: makes the job a lot harder for crawlers
assbot: Successfully updated the rating for copypaste from 1 to 2 with note: Confirmed for the ever-awesome HotWheels.
mircea_popescu: !rate copypaste 2 Confirmed for the ever-awesome HotWheels.
assbot: You rated user copypaste on 13-May-2015, with a rating of 1, and supplied these additional notes: Presumably, 8chan owner.
justJanne: although, there is something new
trinque: there's nothing "new" about html5
trinque: I'm not saying the browser isn't adding features; I'm saying it's aping the tired ways of a previous generation
trinque: and of course DRM and other shit
mircea_popescu: justJanne wait, the sad days from when you were... 9 ?
trinque: with a canvas like the canvas tag
trinque: flash was just another ecmascript runtime thing
justJanne: I remember the sad days of having to decompile swf objects just to rip a video.
justJanne: Now I can just grep through the JS, find the link to the .mp4, and wget it, and watch it offline
mircea_popescu: what now ? owned by a 19yo girl ? not even speaking her mother tongue ? HOW!!1 do you expect to end up bitter like me this wya ?
trinque: yeah I'll grant browsers are going further towards "open techmology" whatever that means
ben_vulpes: justJanne: have you been following the glibc travails?
mircea_popescu: solid point she has there bitches.
justJanne: hey, at least nowadays the web is getting better again.
trinque: man that was a glorious age of the internet
ben_vulpes: bitch please back in the day gnutella /was/ mainstream
justJanne: yeah, still – Tidal is the first service providing CD quality.
trinque: and will just see 10 bucks more than the 10 bucks I'm already not paying
trinque: justJanne: yeah just average consumer derp is not going to tell the difference between that and spotify's ogg-whatever
ben_vulpes: last i saw was the hbo special
mircea_popescu: this is the hot model woman from 10 years ago right ?
trinque: yup, the people who listen to him and beyonce aren't even paying for spotify
ben_vulpes: wowee justJanne with the opinions
justJanne: The difference between Dr Dre and Jay Z? Jay Z’s product actually is something more than marketing speech
trinque: heh looks like there's some noise about dr dre being behind burning man
mircea_popescu: is this the guy that owns burning man ?
justJanne: and the sound quality, tbh, is great. Just not worth 20$ a month
justJanne: I found a way, but now I have a few thousand files encrypted, the corresponding PBKDF2WithHmacSHA1 encryption keys, but was too lazy to find the client-side salt for that
trinque: streaming service that got whoever's still considered "famous" in music together, stamped their faces on the thing
justJanne: I wanted a way to scrape them.
ascii_field: (there are notable exceptions, e.g., ilfak guilfanov)
justJanne: the in-browser DRM is a native binary that is pretty much stripped of any information, actually kinda hard to use, but the Android version of almost everything is stupid
mircea_popescu: kinda funny that drm never got as clever as viruses. even back when both these were clever, the ms-dos era.
ascii_field: justJanne: traditionally copy protection is implemented, where the rubber hits the road, by poor schmucks who aren't dumb enough to believe that it 'works' but still gotta collect that salary, and so 'are only following orderz'
justJanne: but then I discovered they have an unobfuscated android app, so I got lazy and started instead decompiling that one
ascii_field: it's really just a ritualized version of the familiar cracking of w4r3z
ascii_field: justJanne: that last one was called 'the bomb' where i went to school
justJanne: we did lots of optimizations in the past weeks, homework this week is "you have this blob of binary, find out what it does, circumvent its checks"
justJanne: as >> moves the sign
mircea_popescu: so then...
trinque: teaches the best to hold back too; that's always good
justJanne: Yeah, that’s not the issue.
trinque: learn how to pass the whole class
justJanne: we got it down to 8 operations, but others got it in 7
mircea_popescu: planation for this is the deeper genital cavity of S. bilineata, which stimulates the males more than when mating with guppy females."
mircea_popescu: "Male guppies (Poecilia reticulata) have been observed to forcefully copulate with females by trying to insert their gonopodium (male sex organ) into females genital pores, whether or not they are accepting. Sometimes, male guppies also try to forcefully mate with Skiffia bilineata (goodeid) females, which resemble guppy females and tend to share the same habitat, even when guppy females are available. A possible ex
mircea_popescu: in other news, "In the newt species Notophthalmus viridescens, males carry out a courtship behavior called amplexus. It consists of males capturing females that do not want to mate with them and using their hind limbs to grasp the females by their pectoral regions." << check out the newt pua!
mircea_popescu: i mean if you have your own iron you don't need it's one thing, but otherwise... best own the box.
Jautenim: mircea_popescu can they be ordered from teh EU?
ascii_field: Apocalyptic: the precaution taught in school is that 'prng is bad because enemy might learn the seed.' which is a 'lie of omission' - given the existence of a relation between bit N and bit N+1, enemy may have the means to infer N+1 (and N-1) from N
Apocalyptic: but that isn't relevant to the "tests" discussed
ascii_field: 'The yeasts could be locked in secure laboratories, worked on by screened employees. Sharing them with other scientists without government permission could be outlawed.' << what even.
ben_vulpes: Jautenim: not a great deal, i think mod6 ran one in less than 200MB of RAM recently, but that was with asciilifeform's 'orphanage thermonuke'
Apocalyptic: mxtm, you read the digits onward...
mxtm: Apocalyptic: then how would it be an entropy source
mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic this is the case for all
Apocalyptic: it is actually conjectured that pi contains all the possible finite sequences you can think of
mxtm: Apocalyptic: the nth digit of pi doesn't change
Apocalyptic: <mxtm> it's the same always // what
Jautenim: I came to ask what are the rough requirements
ascii_field: but with the fact that once enemy catches on, he will laugh himself to death (this being your only hope)
mxtm: it's the same always
justJanne: the issue with pi is that it is a very slow RNG
mircea_popescu: justJanne the application here is that, if i give you a string of random numbers which unknown to you are the nth digit of pi onwards, you may think you have entropy by "tests".
ascii_field: ergo, utility for battlefield crypto does not reduce to mathematical tests
Jautenim: lurker at contravex, trilema & the logs for some time now
trinque: interesting; I'll consider the dieharder source code a starting point for further research.
assbot: Logged on 08-04-2014 03:16:07; asciilifeform: don't be the schmuck who builds rng which throws away batches of bits that fail some test
mircea_popescu: (if you think about it : an entropy source that always pass tests is by definition not entropic. see last year's amusement with the "guess number" toy alf made)
mircea_popescu: you must have a theory as to what exactly would it do before you can actually say a rng was shown weak by dieharder.
ascii_field: it is a comparative, rather than absolute measure
trinque: I'll chew on the thing for a while and see what comes of it
trinque: ben_vulpes: oh and... several weak results from the consumer hardware I have laying around
trinque: mircea_popescu: does seem that we keep encountering the rot of glibc
trinque: ben_vulpes: the actual dieharder code uses glibc internals in a way that used to work, now does not due to as yet undiscovered source of rust, with vague indications that compiling with std=c99 has implications for glibc
ben_vulpes: trinque: what the actual fuck "not worth maintaining"
mod6: anyway, i have high hopes that some of these steps could even be automated to aliviate the pain of building this by hand.
trinque: rather than a copy step; might've been what you meant
mod6: mircea_popescu: ahh, yeah. having gone through the gauntlet already on the thing at least a dozen times in aws, and also now having re-read the Gentoo-Handbook, i feel like I'm very close on this. To complete the guide, i wanna test out all of the steps on real hardware so the steps are accurate. I believe it'll entail something like creating a USB boot image, then booting off of that, then creating a stage3 in a chroot, then deploying that to
assbot: Logged on 07-05-2015 05:21:17; mircea_popescu: this is unlikely to EVER change. i tried to move it to gentoo but the attempt burned, toppled and sunk into the swamp.
mircea_popescu: why do anons on trilema prefer to name themselves obama-something ?
mod6: And as far as the gentoo stuff goes, I kinda had to put that on hold for a minute. I'm going to finish the rest of that up on real hardware. But to do so, I gotta drive across town and buy a new box. I might wait until after the 1st to continue this front.
mod6: aside from keeping up with the unfolding nosuchlabs work, within 7000 blocks of my next regression benchmark being finished. should have some new charts to look at in 24 hours.
mike_c: thanks! nice things can happen when there is a good foundation to work from.
mircea_popescu: but it's a tower of cool to shake the very foundations of "web 2.0" idiocy.
mircea_popescu: ayup. mike_c got some serious magic going there, im impresst.
mircea_popescu: btw copypaste ^ now there's a banner to a respectable exchange in the rotation, people can buy btc there.
mircea_popescu: ah yes the eur. aite on it.
assbot: Logged on 17-05-2015 13:41:39; davout: ;;later tell mircea_popescu http://i.imgur.com/g5ci4oK.png <<< the paymium banner
mircea_popescu: Shook was on the scene, telling 11Alives Duffie Dixon that the image was highly disturbing, aggravating, obnoxious and illegal.
mike_c: box is still standing. yet another reason I need to move to BISP though. it seems ok for now.
mircea_popescu: mike_c how's teh traffix mah bruther ? too much ?
trinque: I have a half-baked notion that people in the US like this show because they are aware of 200 years of history, if that, and only of their own dirt
mircea_popescu: by now, im not so sure of the mental health of tv watchers anyway. i guess it's prolly best not disturb them.
mircea_popescu: "we are the 1 herp, because percents are a jdif conspiracy"
trinque: mircea_popescu: yep, she's going around freeing teh peoples, torching the previous rulers with dragons
mircea_popescu: is game of thrones the one with a dumb bitch that's the hero in spite of not doing anything ? (outside of feelings)
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: Logged on 18-05-2015 19:45:42; davout: ben_vulpes: in everyday life you can say "en vélo" and "à vélo", you won't sound retarded either way, the correct way is "à vélo" though, "en voiture", "en avion", "à cheval". depends on whether you're inside or not
trinque: the one with dicks would be more relevant to the show... most plot-oriented softcore porn ever created
davout: ascii_field: oh god, the chair
mircea_popescu: i notice alf is very chan-oriented these days. picrelated all day from this fellow.
BingoBoingo: http://slashdot.org/submission/4440577/the-problem-of-teaching-the-controversy-in-infosec
ascii_field: to the deserving.
davout: mircea_popescu: i wish the b-a fairy gave me more money, instead of more hair
davout: there seems to be something to waht mircea_popescu's saying wrt to 'riding', but it doesn't look that's the full story, i found another source that says both "en/à vélo" are correct
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: i was drummed out of academia while reasonably young, for the crime of not-giving-a-rat's-arse
mircea_popescu: davout :) you have been blessed by the b-a fairy.
mircea_popescu: if it pays so well how come you're not there aha.
ascii_field: 'It doesn't work when Nadia Heninger goes to sell Phuctor before Stanford - Nadia Heninger doesn't own Phuctor, and the actual owners are very much present and very much capable to bitchslap her into oblivion.' << actually, 'crime pays.' chick gets a phd and cushy sinecure, etc.
mircea_popescu: depends on whether you're riding it or not.
davout: ben_vulpes: in everyday life you can say "en vélo" and "à vélo", you won't sound retarded either way, the correct way is "à vélo" though, "en voiture", "en avion", "à cheval". depends on whether you're inside or not
mircea_popescu: "Or perhaps they did that stupid human trick that never fails: If you have excess funds, procreate until you no longer have excess funds, then share the funds equally until you all die." << afaik this was never done in practice, outside of easter island. not that women everywhere didn't endlessly & forever try. but anyway, re the ancient women broken strat discussion, THIS is a fine statement of the problem.
trinque: "In closing, for the tl;dr / eli5 / etc crowd : this article is not for you. Go back to doing the dishes, we'll wake you up once you need to buy a new flag." << fucking glorious.
mircea_popescu: btw, anyone with a slashdot acct ? plox to dump the above link ?
trinque: mircea_popescu: I noticed scoopbot was absent for a while, and after many complaints just loaded the feeds plugin into tenyks
mircea_popescu: trinque i dunno what you two did there. what did you do ?
mircea_popescu: ever since the us got on this kick about retards using things, stuff that's not for retards has been at a disadvantage.
trinque: as scoopbot is not back I assume deedbot- is the new guy for that too?
trinque: does sound like the project could use cleanup beyond that
mircea_popescu: ascii_field well, you know how that goes. "within the constraints". "you can't have this and nsa so this can't be had"
deedbot-: [Trilema] On how the factored 4096 RSA keys story was handled, and what it means to you. - http://trilema.com/2015/on-how-the-factored-4096-rsa-keys-story-was-handled-and-what-it-means-to-you/
ascii_field: they will be happy to learn just how clever cosmic ray is
ascii_field: we should stop settling for small change and take this to the astrophysicists
ascii_field: the reduction requires altering a header field
ascii_field: in yet other news, one of the invalid-sig keys is a careful reduction of key size by 1 bit, and very interesting pattern of modifications to public N (not one-bit-flip and not from-this-point, but regularly spaced)
mircea_popescu: which is kinda the point.
mircea_popescu: i don't think they can work this fast.
mircea_popescu: obviously, nobody is going to have to explain to anybody why they lied or anything, but hey. free internet!
mircea_popescu: if you let them "agree" to "the reasonable" "explanation" you can laugh at them later. if you don't, it's gonna be "oh srsly we presented this before stanford" all over again
mircea_popescu: but this is why you want "the internet" to have its time to proffer its reactions.
ascii_field: didjaknow they can sign
assbot: Logged on 18-05-2015 14:31:30; mats: osprey falls outta the sky, again
ascii_field: they had, what was it, crackable 'demos' ?
assbot: Logged on 18-05-2015 14:23:20; asciilifeform: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Researchers-Break-RSA-4096-Bit-Keys-481475.shtml << oddly, one fishwrap got the name spelled.
Apocalyptic: i'm nearly convinced there isn't by now
Apocalyptic: oh, I thought you knew the answer and it was a challenge
ascii_field: Apocalyptic: not atm. but i'm currently occupied with other things
Apocalyptic: heh, so there is none known to you ?
Apocalyptic: ascii_field, i'm still thinking about your "exercice for the reader" from yesterday as to how get $othersmuckQ without at least doing a division for every modulus encountered
Apocalyptic: I misunderstood what you were saying then
ascii_field: and what i meant was that one must demonstrate that one could import the pubkey, somewhere, and verify material that was signed with it
ascii_field: thus i conjecture that full factorization can be had, at reasonable cost, if there is a reason to attempt it
ascii_field: Apocalyptic: see earlier link re: lenstra. there are algos which are optimized for the kind of scenario which appears to exist here (a multitude of smaller primes rather than two extremely large ones)
Apocalyptic: afaik you need to have phi(N) to get d from e, and computing phi(N) is equivalently hard as getting the factorization of N
Apocalyptic: ascii_field, the part where you can sign, which implies knowledge of the private exponent d without having fully factored the modulus N
Apocalyptic: ascii_field, can you comment on <Apocalyptic> "for after we demonstrate that one could 1) sign with the dud key" wait you can sign without fully factoring N ? this is news to me
Pierre_Rochard: yup, read it, this is their latest post with more details
assbot: Logged on 13-05-2015 21:42:17; asciilifeform: re: '21' etc >> 'The cornerstone of the strategy as presented would have been the release of consumer products that would turn power from wall sockets into bitcoin through the widespread dissemination of bitcoin mining chips.' << -somebody- clearly reads the 2013 #b-a logs.
Apocalyptic: anyway the remainding part I have is not divisible by primes below something like 1 billion if I remember my tests correctly, may still qualify as -small- though
Pierre_Rochard: little intermission to discuss -assets instead of pgp for a sec: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdhNkv4ryuM (background on the meme: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/pepe-the-frog )
Apocalyptic: *these days
Apocalyptic: "for after we demonstrate that one could 1) sign with the dud key" wait you can sign without fully factoring N ? this is news to me
ascii_field: one of the state-of-art factorizers, lenstra's elliptic curve factorization,
ascii_field: Apocalyptic: i was saving this exercise for after we demonstrate that one could 1) sign with the dud key 2) it would verify on some broken pgptron, somewhere
Apocalyptic: (the full factoring is interesting because it's the only way to compute the private exponent d)
Apocalyptic: but there is still this huge reminder, which is certainly not prime, that remains to be factored
ascii_field: primes? so there we go.
Apocalyptic: ascii_field, I did some trivial factoring on the reminder, got 2 more primes
ascii_field: Apocalyptic: feel free to perform, e.g., miller-rabin on the larger factor
Apocalyptic: I would like to point out that unless yesterday's modulus was fully factored, which I have no knowledge of, we actually didn't factor the invalid subkey discussed
ascii_field: Apocalyptic, decimation: i will let mircea_popescu include this and other interesting zoological specimens in his next article.
Apocalyptic: <ascii_field> at least one falls under the classical 'generated and correctly signed with dud key' // is that key at least a classic RSA key, meaning its modulus consists of only 2 prime factors as opposed to the case discussed yesterday ?
ascii_field: decimation: this is not a consistent pattern across the entire set.
decimation: ascii_field: someone on the hn comments also listed the diff between the two keys, and it was 32-bits long
ascii_field: the remainder lack any self-sigs and -will- import
ascii_field: several have invalid self-sigs and for a subset of these, a non-rotten antecedent key can be found (as pointed out by the peanut gallery)
ascii_field: at least one falls under the classical 'generated and correctly signed with dud key'
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: presently the samples of interest fall into several categories
decimation: apparently the phrased was used in a song http://lyricstranslate.com/en/meine-welt-my-world.html-0
ascii_field: curious if anyone tried to point out their 'mistake'
ascii_field: BingoBoingo: got an account at 'the register' ?
trinque: I just learned that yesterday from the fine folks at HN
ascii_field: so, one of the recent phucked keys contains two subkeys, both of which are phucked. and the self-sig is... valid.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
ascii_field: ;;later tell decimation does phrase 'grenzenlos naiv' have any idiomatic meaning on top of the obvious ?
trinque: you can click foreign keys to traverse them, so on
trinque: I am merely scratching the surface of what I'm looking at, so far
trinque: and the idea that this GUI widget corresponds directly to some piece of data