mircea_popescu: in yet other news, http://40.media.tumblr.com/a336342d056702ca27301f9c05104785/tumblr_nscknciOZ01t7zqzuo1_1280.jpg
mircea_popescu: for a while they wanted to live in baghdad
mircea_popescu: for a while for instance they wanted to live in florence, venice etc.
ascii_butugychag: ever do the ulam spiral ?
assbot: Logged on 18-11-2015 14:54:26; asciilifeform: shinohai: 'i heard that ivan won a car in the lotto.' 'yes! but not ivan but piotr, not a car but an overcoat, not in lotto but at cards, and not won but lost'
ascii_butugychag: the one hitler has, which emerges at the press of a button, when suction is required ?
ascii_butugychag: remember the 'desk elephant' ?
ascii_butugychag: thestringpuller: ever see film 'fifth element' ?
assbot: Logged on 04-02-2016 20:37:03; ascii_butugychag: for a degreed mathematician, or even talented amateur, the life choices are generally a) web dev b) usg.
mircea_popescu: helps if you even the balance.
mircea_popescu: as is the ballet teacher holding a switch or light cane.
mircea_popescu: that is actually swtill the golden standard
ascii_butugychag: like the legendary nazi electric shock typing tutor.
mircea_popescu: "Dear Ms. Tarzian: Here's another idea I've had: Weight Beaters. Weight Beaters are a method of encouraging participants to lose weight. A participant who does not lose the desired number of pounds in a month is beaten up. This negative feedback can, of course, be combined with more traditional positive-feedback weight-loss mechanisms."
ascii_butugychag: also will nitpick, not idle, hosting the #1 trbtron since day 1.
Nicknaem: i'll be back, this isn't my final form. keep up the good work.
mircea_popescu: ascii_butugychag speaking of which, this very expensive rare custom job of a server that was made to be a phuctor host is going to be paid for the 2nd idle month.
mircea_popescu: sure, but i wish to hear a bunch of "oh there's nothing wrong with tiny block ciphers - bitcoin needs larger blocks!!11"
ascii_butugychag: the imbecilatronics will continue exactly as now until physically unplugged, i suspect
mircea_popescu: phf could have "yes, exactly" on one side and "right, exactly" on the other and you could just raise it as appropriate :D
mircea_popescu: more importantly : we've done enough positive work, to be met by the imbecile's "oh it never happened, if it did we did it already" as seen most recently in reddit's digestion of the block thing ; or in phuctor etc. it's time we do something inquisitive, and let the entire world full of fucktards admit that they're useless.
phf: mircea_popescu: ok, i don't get it, about the card printed
ascii_butugychag: yes but what precisely is the point of a block cipher that is slower ~and~ bulkier than abused-rsa.
ascii_butugychag: block ciphers are not actually necessary if we discard the speed requirement
mircea_popescu: https://cr.yp.to/softwarelaw.html << also not a bad read. files from "the days before america turned to usg-shit and the inhabitants still entertained delusions"
ascii_butugychag: or, more plausibly, the last pgptron gave up its smoke after being used in hand-to-hand combat
ascii_butugychag: nah, the trouble is always same, 'wtf did it all mean'
mircea_popescu: this being the chief argument against that.
thestringpuller: ascii_butugychag: if the looms are destroyed in a fire, there may be no way to reproduce exactly the same end product.
mircea_popescu: ascii_butugychag> the problem is that no such plans exist for ~anything~ except as part of the engineering context of their time << yet another one of the problems of not running v.
ascii_butugychag: the problem is that no such plans exist for ~anything~ except as part of the engineering context of their time
ascii_butugychag: thestringpuller: this is a very 'hollywood' conception of 'blueprints'
mircea_popescu: ascii_butugychag> -- because it maxed out in 1960s. << aka "because they have no practical utility"
ascii_butugychag: it is on the net
ascii_butugychag: thestringpuller: it is a dead field for different reason entirely.
thestringpuller: ascii_butugychag: re: nuke designer. I remember reading a wired article saying that practical nuclear engineering (bombs) is a dying field since no one can technically test nuclear detonations. Most of the students who were learning from manhattan project-age engineers were learning via word of mouth.
mircea_popescu: they certainly had a golden decade.
ascii_butugychag: the champs of recent history re: both-at-once was prolly israel. hence a dead gerald bull.
ascii_butugychag: sorta funny how us is rather like an inverse su in this respect
ascii_butugychag: so stuck with the meat circus.
ascii_butugychag: or the one who came by my old office disguised as 'friendly neighbour, retired blahblahblah'
mircea_popescu: and, this is the important part, ~AND~ those dumbasses would be hanged by their foreskins.
ascii_butugychag: he was being pushed into the corral.
mircea_popescu: if the snake was as competent as is required for a living animal, it would certainly not harry djb with inept shit of that level.
ascii_butugychag: the successes - we don't see.
mircea_popescu: and yet there it is.
ascii_butugychag: only happens when 1,001 other conveyor steps ~failed~ catastrophically
ascii_butugychag: the legal skullduggery is sorta like wetwork
mircea_popescu: note that the tsar's snake similarly was seen as the shit skin only, and look where that took the tsar!
ascii_butugychag: cannot otherwise have a skin, without it
ascii_butugychag: for a degreed mathematician, or even talented amateur, the life choices are generally a) web dev b) usg.
ascii_butugychag: it is one of the few fields where usg pays Moar and provides better working conditions than actual industry
ascii_butugychag: the thing about airplanes is that usg does not have so many captive welders, metallurgists, etc.
mircea_popescu: even then - prefers to buy coke and whores instead.
mircea_popescu: usg can build anything it wants, and it'll never want to build anything useful. much better, more interesting shiny baubles scattered all over the field.
mircea_popescu: the true curse of idiots is that they think they know what they want. and they do get it, most usually.
mircea_popescu: except no idea where to point the spears.
mircea_popescu: nope. they can only build items that look enough like the image of a plane as hashed through their culture.
mircea_popescu: understand this "can" correctly : can cargo cult tribe build any item out of straw and mud that they wish ?
mircea_popescu: the enemy can't bake as much as a brick.
ascii_butugychag: also i will add that preferring 'weird' operations, vs. simple arithmetic, costs us more than it costs the enemy.
mircea_popescu: incidentally, are you happy with the call for papers as is ?
mircea_popescu: there's a sad dearth of research in this field. we don't even klnow which of pi*e and pi+e are transcendental. etc.
mircea_popescu: except the only paired transcendentals i know of are pi and e.
ascii_butugychag: 'fuck you, my public key is m * the next mersenne prime'
ascii_butugychag: alternatively you put'em in the blockchain
ascii_butugychag: and the idea is, i think, old
ascii_butugychag: sender would have to crack the turd.
ascii_butugychag: btw you could achieve this right now, by handing out (disposable) crypted turds containing public key (also single-use) that you would then insist on receiving on.
mircea_popescu: if someone has to expend 1 petahash every time they send me encrypted anything, that's grand.
mircea_popescu: it only hinders the people who want to talk about it, is all.
mircea_popescu: contrary to piously fraudulent consensus in the field, expensiveness is a quality of cryptographic items.
mircea_popescu: the main advantage, perhaps counterin tuitively, to the PE? scheme is that it's so veryt computationally expensive.
ascii_butugychag: this is sort of why i'd like to take the opposite approach, rather than take a 'this looks confusing!111' item like transcendental digits, take a proven-nphard problem and 'cryptoify' it somehow
mircea_popescu: kinda why we go deep into the shag.
ascii_butugychag: the danger of using transcendentals for crypto is that it opens you up to clever analogue (!) attacks
mircea_popescu: maxint in there is quite literally, maxint. currently pi is computed up to about 2*10^13 or so digits. signed 64 bit max is ~10^19
mircea_popescu: notably, this scheme does not necessarily produce the correct plaintext every time. CRC will probably have to be included in the message in any case ; massaging of convenient º/º' pairs will be required to get error rates statistically under an acceptable threshold.
mircea_popescu: the properties which º' must exhibit may make the entire scheme unfeasible, but i can't seem to prove º' may not exist.
mircea_popescu: the properties which º must obviously exhibit make it only partly similar to plain multiplication - perhaps group theory may produce a good candidate, i have not currently a very clear picture of what this item should actually be, but seems like some sort of modulo-multiplicator.
mircea_popescu: to decipher you calculate the maxint+key to maxint+key+block digits of e with a plouffe-like algo (not here included) which you º' with the ciphered message yielding the original plaintext.
mircea_popescu: you need a proper "destructive multiplication" item, which i'll discuss later, noted here º. you proceed to calculate the maxint+key to maxint+key+block digits of pi via repeated applications of the original plouffe algo, and you º the result with the plaintext message which yields the ciphered message.
mircea_popescu: So in re the tmsr call for papers. the Plouffe-Euler-? block cipher would work as follows :
phf: mircea_popescu: i've been using his guide in the early 2000s, but then i think he caved and switched to laptops, because he stopped updating it. he has a recent build recommendation https://blog.cr.yp.to/20140602-saber.html from his "saber cluster"
mod6: A great idea, overall. Thanks for posting that and putting up the reward.
BingoBoingo starting to believe the materialism if anything might have made Marxism safer than what Idealism wrought in the Harvard educated.
mircea_popescu: the chief disadvantage of living in a large country.
PeterL: I used to really be into following sports and politics, at some point I realized my fervor had equally little effect on either, I am trying to cut back and ignore them
ascii_butugychag: (the ~actual~ usg would not have it)
ascii_butugychag: the hilarious part about american politicircus is that none of the groups pandered-to actually ever ~get~ so much as a bite of the carrot
BingoBoingo: Alright the one thing worth taking away from the "Phenomenology of Spirit" is that USSA is evil in a more profound way than USSR was most of the time.
ascii_butugychag: 'liberal' in usa means 'panders to these 17 types of losers who exist in loose coalition'
PeterL: I think liberal used to mean something different, but the term has been coopted by idiots
PeterL: make the rich pay! gimme gimme gimme"
mircea_popescu: what's liberal mean in the us anymore, retarded ? communist ?
PeterL: to liberal to fit in with the democrats
PeterL: the socialist
ascii_butugychag: he was put on the stage for same reason as, in last cycle, mike gravel
ascii_butugychag: that there is no escape from clitler was obvious years ago
BingoBoingo: Over this past week Rush has back off of his Trump promotion and shifted focus to the actual race between the two legit hispanic candidates.
punkman: wonder what will be the biggest bbet in 2016
BingoBoingo: *Further eventually ciphers.
BingoBoingo: Eventually TMSR will get counting. Then we can have arithmetic. Eventually ciphers.
BingoBoingo: trinque: These things happen.
ascii_butugychag: this is so basic that it is even beaten to death in usg standards documents for their crud, in public
ascii_butugychag: new one is introduced over the wire enciphered with old one, but enemy has no idea WHEN.
ascii_butugychag: incidentally, all block (and even stream) implementations in the battlefield use over-the-wire rekeying
mircea_popescu: so then.
ascii_butugychag: if i can't decide friend or foe after first 512byte, then no go
ascii_butugychag: as discussed in the gossipd thread.
ascii_butugychag: you do if you want to follow the NOBODY GETS NOTHING FOR SHOWING UP principle
ascii_butugychag: we're stuck with the net.
ascii_butugychag: in what other !
mircea_popescu: nobody filed the proof with your office ?
ascii_butugychag: which, if you include padding room, is rather questionable at 512b
mircea_popescu: looky : the insane 500 byte udp limit PRECLUDES good cryptography
ascii_butugychag: otherwise stuck with pure rsa
ascii_butugychag: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-02-2016#1396374 << if i can't encrypt a 512byte udp (or file off the protocol number as per gossipd thread) single-packet-hello turd, it's useless
ascii_butugychag: then what?
mircea_popescu: it was a problem of 0 vs "the hashed value of 0"
mircea_popescu: ascii_butugychag the example then was that the chain allows you to introduce known-weak points in a subsequent pass without being able to know it
ascii_butugychag: and now i wonder how the fuck mircea_popescu can live with rsa
ascii_butugychag: this is rather like arguing that 'cutting a man's abdominal cavity open will weaken and kill him.' YES if we haven't invented antiseptics yet
ascii_butugychag surprised at how mircea_popescu puts up with 'cementing' the abominably-broken gpg set
mod6: alright, i've got a local fix for gernika's bug where it'll press the entire tree out if the given vpatch is not in the flow.
mircea_popescu: this is fucking stupid, as it just cements the bad but apparently tmsr-acceptable now cipher.
ascii_butugychag: but re: earlier thread, i'ma publish 'g'. and it'll have one or more of the bad old ciphers from gpg. BECAUSE gpg is ~already~ the weak link in the proposed system. or ben_vulpes doesn't get to download his w4r3z
mircea_popescu: buncha retarded children told too often they're smart and special by drunks and whores.
mircea_popescu: note that this is how the "scaling bictoin" "discussion" among "experts" goes :
ascii_butugychag: 'this is clever and i have nfi how anyone could possibly attack' is proof of ~nothing~ but the intellectual limits of the author
ascii_butugychag: rather than provable difficulty.
ascii_butugychag: the basic problem with ALL known block ciphers is that they are based on fairy dust
mircea_popescu: no matter how broken old shit is, it may be only used to bootstrap the creation of correct shit.
mircea_popescu: new stuff is made right. that's the principle.
mod6: yeah, i agree. im hoping that after this round of fixes in place, that the mission-critical features are solid enough to warrent a genesis.
mircea_popescu: i think it should yea. besides, here's the beauty of it : "broken" v as previously was could nevertheless be used to bootstrap fixed v as currently it is found. you know ?
assbot: Logged on 04-02-2016 03:19:11; mod6: mircea_popescu asciilifeform ben_vulpes trinque shinohai et al: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2016-February/000209.html
assbot: Logged on 04-02-2016 03:19:11; mod6: mircea_popescu asciilifeform ben_vulpes trinque shinohai et al: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2016-February/000209.html
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-02-2016#1396210 << wouldn't it be logic-er at this point to create a v genesis, and then add to that ? << Well, in short, yes. Just am aiming to get it in a good working condition and well vetted before a 'genesis'.
mircea_popescu: fix MY fucking flat tyre so i go where I wanted to go in the first place., don't tell me idea is better than 2kbit bassomatic, i couldn't give less of a shit.
mircea_popescu: so sure, they "fixed" his error, but the wrong way. i don't want a fix for a flat tyre that consists in loading me up on a trai nthat goes a different direction.
mircea_popescu: and re bass-o-matic, note that while ineptly implemented, the origianl p.z. had the exact same intuition. it happens to be the correct posture here, with the expansion that 25 years added - back then 256bytes was a disk block iirc.
mircea_popescu: going ahead just because the horse you're on happens to want to go is how the christian knights were assraped again and again. rein it in, the horse is yours not you the horse's.
assbot: Logged on 02-02-2016 23:48:55; mircea_popescu: incidentally, thinking vaguely along the lines of making a b-a call for papers for symm cypher, what would we actually want ? i'm thinking a) block sizes of 1, 4, 16, 64 kbytes. none of that bit-denominated bs, wtf is this, 64 bits. fuck that. b) key size of 64kb fixed. c) bonus points for proved hardness, as-hard-as-x etc d) bonus points for not using just basic arithmetics. fuck this shift-and-xor
assbot: Logged on 04-02-2016 15:44:39; PeterL: maybe make up our own block cypher? or just use them all in series?
BingoBoingo: I think I'm going to stop reading the "Phenomenology of Spirit". I didn't get sober to import the mental version of systemd.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-02-2016#1396264 << few do. just another in the long list of gotchas gpg has been gleefully suppling us with over the years. was a big thread about it coupla years ago, but not really repeated often hence.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: yeh. i mean the inkling is good, but this seems a footnote in something else.
BingoBoingo: The magic pisstank turns out to be placebo when comes to NOx apparently... But I guess this is a bit much for that point.
assbot: Logged on 04-02-2016 10:23:40; jurov: oh i see "MPEx will issue twice that count of shares, allocating half to the Qntra board block, and half to the respective authors"
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-02-2016#1396257 << yes because the board has half reserved. it's how cazalla got paid when he quit.
mircea_popescu: up until the point ascii_butugychag made shiva, it made sense to refrain from multi-genesis situaiton for complaisance. but now that there's two, might as well have 3 and this one is actually useful.
assbot: Logged on 04-02-2016 03:19:11; mod6: mircea_popescu asciilifeform ben_vulpes trinque shinohai et al: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2016-February/000209.html
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-02-2016#1396210 << wouldn't it be logic-er at this point to create a v genesis, and then add to that ?
mircea_popescu: btw, for the list of "best shit in the world only found in argentina" it's cherry season and omfg. never have i had black cherries like they have here.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> jurov oops ima take the 384 back soz. << It's my bad in addition to total words I should have reported total shares.
mircea_popescu: jurov oops ima take the 384 back soz.
thestringpuller: that part of drug induced idiocy to understand the idiots is priceless
thestringpuller: BingoBoingo: " It took nitrous oxide intoxication temporarily reducing his mental faculties in a particular way to grasp the Hegelian program as its proponents did." << GIGA-L0L
assbot: The Theoretical Foundation of Social Engineering Practice | Bingo Blog ... ( http://bit.ly/1TGysw6 )
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: After http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2016/01/24/the-theoretical-foundation-of-social-engineering-practice/ and doing some reading to get to being able to read historical Hegel started reading Hegel. Fucker's a fount of Imaginationland based socialist evil.
thestringpuller: ascii_butugychag: you would venture to mordor if it was worth the trip.
ascii_butugychag: i like bernstein but the adoption of his blockciphers by the enemy casts darkness on them.
punkman: ascii_butugychag: the keccak folks have "Duplexing the sponge: single-pass authenticated encryption and other applications"
gribble: BassOmatic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BassOmatic>; PGP Timeline - Cypherspace: <http://www.cypherspace.org/adam/timeline/>; Considering PGP - Gibson Research Corporation: <https://www.grc.com/sn/sn-418.pdf>
thestringpuller: mother box?
PeterL: maybe make up our own block cypher? or just use them all in series?
BingoBoingo: ascii_butugychag: At this rate mebbe just surprise us with a block cipher in obfusticated C? Make money taking bets on how long it takes for people to figure out what ciper was pulled out of the hat?
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: It's your turn to toss a blockcipher at ascii_butugychag
thestringpuller: good morning ascii_butugychag how is the labor camp?
gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=fupa-dupe | Mar 14, 2009 ... While getting your cock sucked, the person performing the act goes all the way down to the fupa.
BingoBoingo: Ambuguous is the right word.
jurov: if you subtract previous monthly report, subtract errors, too, in the same place
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: Logged on 04-02-2016 03:19:11; mod6: mircea_popescu asciilifeform ben_vulpes trinque shinohai et al: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2016-February/000209.html
jurov: hi AaronvanW, how is the nordic system?
jurov: anyway, the rest of shares were distributed to coinbr accounts.
jurov: so that's okay, only the +384 distribution issue remains
jurov: oh i see "MPEx will issue twice that count of shares, allocating half to the Qntra board block, and half to the respective authors"
mod6: but not for at least a week. i need some time to look into that and to let people test the beta patch. i want to get these resolved so we can move on.
mod6: so yah, if i can get something figured out for that bug, maybe there will be a beta2 patch.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> second call for least-hated block cipher ??? << fucking the least ugly girl at the party means you'll do a lot of uglies.
mircea_popescu: <TomServo> I've finally got a node past the wedge, and there was much rejoicing << wd.
mod6: so you ran something like `./v.pl p v foobar non-existing.vpatch` and then something ends up in foobar?
gernika: mod6: testing out v99995. I notice that if I attempt to press a non-existant v.patch, there is no error, and it goes ahead and presses *something* (seems to generate the full source in the target dir). Not sure if this is intended behavior or not.
asciilifeform: but the thing is, the ~total~ lack of sound theoretical basic for ~any~ publicly known block cipher, makes the breaking of one entirely 'ordinary' news, when it happens.
BingoBoingo: Look what makes the news on a day archive.is is having problems https://archive.is/RBGBW
mod6: In regards to the above email section 0x04: To test this, one can simply grab polarbeard's vpatch and sig and drop them into place, then try to press the entire tree. This should hault throwing an error since the actual output hash does not match the ~expected~ output hash.
mod6: mircea_popescu asciilifeform ben_vulpes trinque shinohai et al: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2016-February/000209.html
phf: so in my gossipd attempt i'm basically just slinging gpg packets over the wire. have a little state machine that reads/validates openpgp packets from the wire. that doesn't work for streams though.. (in before eww)
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform is so much more chatty at the new job
TomServo: but i'm probably just relaying the blatently obvious
TomServo: re: the conversation of logging earlier, I tend to launch bitcoind within a tmux session and have seen errors dumped to console after a hang/crash
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: BitBet - Connor McDavid will live up to the hype :: 0.45 B (3%) on Yes, 12.72 B (97%) on No | closed 4 days 2 hours ago ... ( http://bit.ly/1QdP60r )
BingoBoingo: ;;later tell pete_dushenski for the lulz https://bitbet.us/bet/1198/connor-mcdavid-will-live-up-to-the-hype/#c5609
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: BitBet - Connor McDavid will live up to the hype :: 0.45 B (3%) on Yes, 12.72 B (97%) on No | closed 4 days 2 hours ago ... ( http://bit.ly/1VKaf7t )
BingoBoingo: ;;later tell pete_dushenski I'm glad this one closed. Now that he's back he's on pace to hit 80 points. 30 games left, got three points in his first one back. https://bitbet.us/bet/1198/connor-mcdavid-will-live-up-to-the-hype/
mircea_popescu: lmao people are dating on the basis of hating fat people ?
mircea_popescu: maybe not as self-combustingly insane as the Bitcoin notion of "accounts" , but still.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-02-2016#1396112 << for the record, the concept of "wallet" is pure nonsense.
mod6: the graph has been updated as well.
mod6: ok mirror is updated. i've pulled, pressed, compiled and am now running with all the latest.
mircea_popescu: by now the gap is so large people can't even grasp it.
BingoBoingo: And the best part is | works very well offline
BingoBoingo: Or | to thermal receipt printer
Carli-: BingoBoingo: yes, but you want minimal contact for the airgapped machine. so some people recommend burning CD's
adlai: Carli-: have you ever heard of "feature creep"? being able to specify a feature, which is related to an existing program, doesn't mean the same program should include that feature
BingoBoingo: In a useful OS you can | things all over the place
Carli-: mircea_popescu: iirc, the only thing that "touches"-- you can burn a CD/USB (qrcode?) of the transaction from the offline wallet. Also, it lets u run Multiple Wallets at the same time-- is there a way to do this in bitcoin-qt?
adlai is still curious about the 'garza' hostmask
mircea_popescu: "Cold storage was innovated by the Armory Bitcoin wallet. Armory provide a first-of-its-kind interface for easily managing offline wallets for true cold storage. "
Carli-: mircea_popescu: Is there a guide on how to do it in bitcoin-qt? here is more info on how Armory works: https://bitcoinarmory.com/cold-storage/