mircea_popescu: Abstract. It is often claimed that the security of theoretical quantum key distribution (QKD) is guaranteed by the laws of physics. However, this claim is content-free if the underlying definition of theoretical QKD is not actually compatible with the laws of physics. This paper observes that (1) the laws of physics pose serious obstacles to the security of QKD and (2) these laws are ignored in a
mircea_popescu: EXACTLY the same shit.
mircea_popescu: "poor black mothers are a key resource in the public money spending field of social services"
mircea_popescu: it's like fucking politicians "thinking". really, does "entanglement" have the STATUS of so and so ?
mircea_popescu: why do they keep doing this.
mircea_popescu: "entanglement is a key resource in the research field of quantum information"
mircea_popescu: yes yes. lemme summarize the question. IF you can show that two particles are entangled, HOW do you show that you have ALL the entangled particles in your control, for an entangla-tuple.
mircea_popescu: granted, i've not gone to school at the premier lightbulb lighting institution in the world.
mircea_popescu: if the dumbass thing weren't a pdf, i might have made a trilema blast piece. which perhaps explains why it is pdf.
mircea_popescu: there is no such thing as "quantum" cryptography.
phf: asciilifeform: guy had that sword simulation fiasco, perhaps he decided that perky nih bureaucrat types (with rigged tomboy/ethnic/... upbringing) are better future builders. could be worse, could've gone joss whedon altogether
phf: "Is the security of quantum cryptography guaranteed by the laws of physics?" i have no expertise to make a comment on it though
DianaComan: the devils, yeah :))
mircea_popescu: i blame the devs!
mircea_popescu: well suppose you have 1mn and 1 have 1mn. then tomorrow, you have 100 dead molluscs q 150 and i have 100 bng recipes, q 150.
mircea_popescu: but what calculation is this then ?!
DianaComan: well, so far it's very crude: are you in the positive or in the negative? then again, for comparing god help us given all the sikriz
mircea_popescu: <DianaComan> and seeing how that compares (as results ie money) to those of the other players << this'd work if we even had any sort of a valuating function!
asciilifeform: but then my demo ran out and i got booted, and haven't played since)
DianaComan: asciilifeform, the playing part is a. figuring out what is what and b. crafting your strategy and seeing how that compares (as results ie money) to those of the other players
mircea_popescu: for instance asciilifeform : last night i loaded up the 500 abandoned eggs DianaComan sold me, plus some shiny rock shards i had from before, also abandoned birds' nests and disgusting goop, put 500 recipes for flinty toothpaste in my mind, said /bot craft 500 and went to bed. this morning i had like 300 of the things.
DianaComan: well, there is a lot to be said about intelligent mining/exploring too for sure
DianaComan: back when I was more hopeful that I actually have the time for at least half the ideas I had
DianaComan: no, not really because the bot by itself is basically a dumb robot
DianaComan: there is some very satisfying quality of "it works for me while I SLEEP" component to it too
asciilifeform: then how are you 'playing' ?
asciilifeform: if you 'leave the bot..', aintcha playing 'core wars' ?
mircea_popescu: i have been playing it continuously for like 5-6 months now. just leave the bot what to do.
mircea_popescu: a right the 3d.
asciilifeform: but if had these, would play..
mircea_popescu: it's a wonder you don't play eulora, for these reasons.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform compartimentalization is the best and most fun part of schizophrenia.
asciilifeform: i mean, what, mircea_popescu wrote the equation, then drank bottle of vodka, and forgot, and now is re-deriving it, playing against past self ??
asciilifeform: didntcha write the thing?
asciilifeform: the linked item may as well be in chinese
mircea_popescu: the numeric properties we have found, however, are out of sight.
mircea_popescu: it's directly evident the quality of recipe used ; and the quality of the bundle processed are factors.
mircea_popescu: so the problem there is : me and her, crafters of different skills, are trying to figure out how the game computes the output quality of a crafting process.
mircea_popescu: was in the log, a second.
mircea_popescu: did you see the horror of quality output ?
mircea_popescu: "are they on a plane ?" "fu!"
mircea_popescu: so he means "the two basic arithmetic operands are polymorphic by type" rather than "all mathematical operations are generic functions".
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: nah this particular thing is likely the harmless and ordinary 'you can redefine the + sign to polymorph on type' as in cpp, commonlisp, ada, etc
mircea_popescu: it IS after all both mathematical and an operation.
mircea_popescu: wait. i read it to mean that r-s theta is pre-built.
phf: i'm only hoping they mean they have proper numeric tower, rather then straight up "this plus can be anything"
mircea_popescu: "in julia, all mathematical operations are generic functions"
mircea_popescu: "uses a somewhat mainstream syntax rather than sexpr"
asciilifeform: the language-of-the-day come-into-our-proprietary-shitlang-parlour-said-spider-to-fly folks have been much the same for two decades +.
mircea_popescu: they choose not to run!
asciilifeform: this was the basic objective, obvious to anyone with iq above bathwater temperature
phf: (http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2016/01/24/the-theoretical-foundation-of-social-engineering-practice/)
BingoBoingo: phf: It desperately needs a followup addressing the 20th century evolution of the thing and the obfustication that was heaped upon it.
BingoBoingo: phf: Thing was a reaction the the civil war and proposed as a solution to avoiding civil wars while still allowing everything to appear contentious
BingoBoingo: phf this social engineering strategy has a long history in USG kingdom. Invented by "St Louis Hegelians" who then moved to Harvard and infected USG. Favorite means of USG for getting desired outcome by letting crowd pick the narrative for how they got there.
asciilifeform: in cn there is no serious dispute re master keys
phf: i wonder if the whole charade has anything do with growth of iphone adoption in china
phf: i guess the attempt is to create controversy on account of everyone being weary of usg syndevs, "look! we have some non-compromised companies"
phf: should be in quotes, a hypothetical jedi mind trick brought to you by usg
phf: that is not the precedent you're looking for
ben_vulpes: have you...turned your computer off and then on again?
asciilifeform: in other interesting nyooz, zoolag appears to be perma-blackholed.
asciilifeform: http://trilema.com/2016/la-tati-ni-i-greu-or-the-pervy-romanians-etnobotanical-study/ <<l0l!
asciilifeform: 10:49 <+deedbot-> [Trilema] La tati ni-i greu, or "The pervy Romanians - etnobotanical study" -
asciilifeform: but i suppose people are quite like chess pieces, in the sense of having plastic mold tabs
mircea_popescu: the penile anatomy is that the foreskin is connected to the glans by this skin fold.
gribble: Frenulum of prepuce of penis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frenulum_of_prepuce_of_penis>; Frenulum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frenulum>; Frenulum of tongue - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frenulum_of_tongue>
asciilifeform: do these folks fuck lawn mowers or what
mircea_popescu: at least for the lower class folk that dun wear condoms!
mircea_popescu: i don't mean circumcision. i mean the split that usually happens in uncircumcised males once they get into their own and vigurously fuck a damsel.
asciilifeform: they didn't detach those where i'm from
mircea_popescu: i have all the everythings i started with!
mircea_popescu: and so like the bum living in the city and benefiting of the subway even if it couldn't be built on HIS tax receipts,
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i know the feeling. i drink coffee like i smoke, a pot a month. but i am blessed with the company of oyung ladies that are crazy for the stuff,
asciilifeform: but i'm beginning to appreciate the merits of the fancy cooking machines: while people use them, they can still count as 'work'
mircea_popescu: phf alrighty then!
mircea_popescu: it's in the terms of his inheritance.
phf: i briefly dated a jamaican girl in college whose grandfather had a coffee plantation, they sold most of it to roasters but roasted some for artisanal resale. i don't know if that was necessarily "best" coffee, but that's certainly not coffee i can forget
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform can not buy any desk items lest they have lasers and no fans!
trinque: asciilifeform: gotta get yourself a french press for the desk
asciilifeform: instead of drinking the machine.
asciilifeform: pretty much whole office treks across the town to get it
asciilifeform: i think the machine ~exists~ in order to make the gasoline-smelling 'starbux' swill taste great in comparison
phf: my building has a coffee machine downstairs, that is loaded, daily by a mexican team, with fresh beans bought from a reasonable supplier. the coffee is passable, but perhaps sounds like mana from heaven compared to "kurig" ors
asciilifeform: phf: in prison one makes chess pieces from bread and piss, what else is there to do.
phf: asciilifeform is like a study into usg foot soldier culture, sometimes i feel like he relishes in the role
davout: probably the 'office' part if i had to guess
deedbot-: [Trilema] La tati ni-i greu, or "The pervy Romanians - etnobotanical study" - http://trilema.com/2016/la-tati-ni-i-greu-or-the-pervy-romanians-etnobotanical-study/
asciilifeform: industrial l0ltr0n1cs: http://www.dianacoman.com/2016/03/28/when-the-messenger-shoots-back/#comment-249
asciilifeform: the c/unix malloc, that pretends to give you arbitrary blocks of N bytes on demand in O(1), is a pernicious fraud.
asciilifeform: rather than, to borrow mircea_popescu's old analogy, going about like idiot prole cow woman who 'falls pregnant whenever'
asciilifeform: under the hood.
mod6: ok, so ; new block is found. we serve the live block queue (size 64 blocks, oldest (height-wise) is in the front) and recycle the memory, appending it to the end of the free queue. we then serve the free-list queue, populate it with the data from the new block and append it to the live block list
asciilifeform: <asciilifeform> in-betweens are for the birdz.
asciilifeform: <asciilifeform> there are precisely TWO known sane approaches to programming a computer.
phf: there's inherent divide between two strategies, anyone who claims bridging it is selling you something
asciilifeform: the result, sadly, is distinctly 'un-lispy'
asciilifeform: sorta how you budget for max-whatever for every category, so as never to have to say 'i cannot pay the electric bill'
asciilifeform: (spoiler: ada aggressively promotes sanity, in particular here the item described by mircea_popescu roughly a year ago, which is that a program must occupy EXACTLY its maximal memory footprint at all times)
mod6: i had to look it all up in the reference
asciilifeform: re: the latter, see thread from ~1h ago
mod6: <+asciilifeform> as in, re-use the blocks sanely. << ok so we'd have to therefore keep a 'free list' - a list of objects/items that have been deleted and are "recycled" and may be used again or I suppose we could then call 'Ada.Unchecked_Deallocation' on an item in the free list to shink the list thereby reclaiming the memory.
asciilifeform: melted my brain right through the mouth, it did
asciilifeform: in other nyooz, the immunocompromise thing was accurate, already folks who oughta know better, on old planet, asked me if i'd host a powerranger idiot repo 'for trb'
asciilifeform: aha the goose-feeding tool
mircea_popescu: there's this implement, keep it open.
asciilifeform: i've never farmed ducks, are they typically debeaked ?
mircea_popescu: i wonder how many fine jewish boys helped the ducks being fattened swallow their peas with the peanis.
asciilifeform: english crud tends to not be on the net already
asciilifeform: american legendary 19th c. folk hero davy crockett is said to have fucked whooping cranes. but he took off the head first.
mircea_popescu: incidentally, do you know how to fuck the bird in hand ?
asciilifeform: this was iirc plainly described in the original source
mircea_popescu: no bird actually has a cunt, but what do the finns know.
mircea_popescu: did we ever say the finnish proverb is "even pigeon has a cunt" ?
asciilifeform: (to finish off the 'broken hearts' - they let you defrag a memory without actually moving anything.)
mircea_popescu: have you spent the past week re-reading logs in integrum and doing head-xreferencing ?
asciilifeform: ( <assbot> Logged on 20-03-2014 14:20:09; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'cum se suge pula' << can't help but associate this in my head with the finnish proverb, 'Pillu se on pulullakin' )
mircea_popescu: also ftr pullulation IS an english word. wtf is with these "spellcheckers" omfg
asciilifeform: they existed on some variants of lispm
mircea_popescu: it's of the nature of "it is possible, at least by napkin pullulation, that one day we have AI".
asciilifeform: so that's another way to have 'variable blox'
asciilifeform: it is hypothetically possible, at least by napkin calculation, that one day memory device will be built , of usefully high capacity, that... wears out before you can ever fill it up
mircea_popescu: other than ring buffer ?
asciilifeform: incidentally, did we ever do the 'bottomless ram' thread ?
mircea_popescu: i meant more in the sense of you'd have to be an idiot to need it, but neways.
asciilifeform: it is the habit of idlers like asciilifeform to sit around knitting silk for NO FUKCING good reason11111
asciilifeform: well yes, fella falling from the empire state building is a bit occupied, too busy to build a chute.
asciilifeform: (and he will pay the price of non- O(1) allocation.)
asciilifeform: i will point out that it is possible to build a physical machine that behaves as if it were possible to have multiple memories, and auto-defrags the space
mircea_popescu: but "i" talked to all these moorexperts!
mircea_popescu: in the sense of, it being part of sanity.
mircea_popescu: you're not about to tell me the block limit is actually part of ada,
mircea_popescu: this defeats the whole purpose of VARIABLE sized blocks
asciilifeform: as in fact described by mircea_popescu in the bitcoin-fs thread.
asciilifeform: but this defeats a good chunk of the purpose of using ada to begin with.
asciilifeform: then you can 'write c' aha.
mircea_popescu: you know "me", i'm a coder. i'd do anything rather than think.
asciilifeform: as in, re-use the blocks sanely.
asciilifeform: students of the lang, e.g., mod6, prolly understand why
asciilifeform: it has allocation but NOT free ! (you can 'cheat' and re-enable it, but then your proggy is considered 'cursed')
asciilifeform: then yes.
mircea_popescu: and as an added benefit i'm no longer the young man i used to be, doing 100+ articles/month like 2010
mircea_popescu: mod6> bunch of us have been learning scheme and Ada << hey, time spent retooling the shop is still work
mod6: no worries though, it'll be there.
mod6: yah, there's a lot of stuff. trilema will probably get you caught up as a readers-digest
mike_c: yeah, hard to reproduce bug-for-bug in another language.
mod6: i'll catch up by the time im like 394 years old.
mike_c: yeah, then it got worse
mike_c: not much up - I got my life settled a bit and came back and have been working my way through the shitstorm that hit around here.
asciilifeform: mod6: much of today there was 'how large is this hole'
mod6: mike to the c!
mod6: anyway, re your ddt comment, seems to be an analog for "a hole where the night creeps in"
asciilifeform: mod6: arithmetizing what the events of today would look like on a gossiptronic net.
mod6: <+asciilifeform> now i could be wrong, perhaps it ~won't~ become a magnet for the vermin that were previously shot on sight << already is!
mircea_popescu: anyway, ima be taking the sluts to a nude promenade, bbl.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=03-10-2014#856353 << possible starting point, but i misplace the mega-thread
mircea_popescu: for that matter, the site's nto even picked as of yet.
mircea_popescu: no, really, their efforts and value are not for a second in question. but the bridge to absolute "a well designed mathematical mechanism" has not yet been made
asciilifeform: there's an engl ver
mircea_popescu: anyway. i also recommend hamiltonians for they interested in becoming less dumb in finance & economy than the famous sheep of http://trilema.com/2010/rabinul-si-oaia/
mircea_popescu: anyway, alf : we share in teh ideals. lemme convict the man for wearing down the rails deliberately after i see the superconducting magnetorail in operation.
mircea_popescu: but that was so long ago perhaps the monastery has meanwhile been rebuilt upside down ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform last i checked with the learned monks, they didn't even have a FUCKING CIPHER
mircea_popescu: gavin has nfi idea ; but generally - this stuff is hard, and the people who grok it damned few if extant at all.
asciilifeform: a well-designed ~mathematical~ mechanism doesn't HAVE 'unknown unknowns.' it has PROOF where 'unless x,y,z ' (e.g., ecdsa break, or p==np) 'mechanism works such-n-such'
mircea_popescu: a very poor understanding of actual finance and actual economics, as much as it is the direct cause of floundering of the formerly great american empire ; is also directly evident at work in bitcoin and among the geeks.
mircea_popescu: what can you tell me of the unknown unknowns ?
asciilifeform: to fix the 'miners can selectively deny tx', for instance
mircea_popescu: troubles you met how, by following the blowups of the fix he did for the problems he did see ?
mircea_popescu: to fix what, the troubles you met ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu himself teaches us that 'you are responsible for ALL questions on the exam'
mircea_popescu: while the man wasn't the bright and fresh messiah we all would have no doubt preferred,
asciilifeform: briefly back to thread, i credit miner cartel, as i did in the beginning, as the INEVITABLE consequence of satoshi IDIOCY
asciilifeform: but i have less excuse than most, i followed the subject before it was a subject, had my own crackpot bitcoin, unpublished, a decade ago, etc.
asciilifeform: if i had even so much as mined on the ~fpgas that i already owned~ when the thing began, i would be in neighbouring dirigible to mircea_popescu
asciilifeform: i walked the razor blade for a very long time, ended up very p0000r for it
mircea_popescu: it's the curse of humanity.
mircea_popescu: smart folk are difficult to persuade to give a damn about anything other than onanism.
asciilifeform: (hamiltonian mechanics recommended to all in the audience, helps)
mircea_popescu: at the time it was politically expedient to not admit the possibility ; even as it loomed.
mircea_popescu: it may get a run for its money 3-4-6 halvings down the road. maybe even one for each.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i buy the miner cartel! if you recall, i walked into #b-a with miner cartel.
mircea_popescu: your idea with (indepoendent miners very threadbare + sybil) is much higher latent heat than the (miner cartel) situation.
mircea_popescu: yes, it's true that the naive view of bitcoin network rapidly collapses into your view, on the basis of your theory.
mircea_popescu: which is why there's one.
mircea_popescu: not for the cartel.
asciilifeform: but they are so threadbare, that a loss of 2-3% can mean death.
asciilifeform: sybil has the upper hand over miners
asciilifeform: this is the exact point where i disagreed, the last time we did this thread and were interrupted
asciilifeform: argument here is - if miners do not ~collectively~ countenance the sybil, it cannot operate ?
asciilifeform: if mircea_popescu has the time/patience, let's arithmetize
mircea_popescu: it seems to me any operative model for this dispute will have to be a) item that does something ; b) which would be restricted to members of a priviledged class ; c) which the item is purported not to be a member of ; d) while admitting the priviledged class was necessarily aware of the behaviour and tolerant of it.
asciilifeform: cartel of miners is something that plausibly may exist, as i said before. but i do not see it as the ~necessary hypothesis~
mircea_popescu: identify the pairs in this example for my benefit cuz i dun see any relation ?
asciilifeform: but i hold that (b) is more reasonable hypothesis ipso facto.
asciilifeform: other - that ru had electron beam gun.
mircea_popescu: (for the curious, the primitive technology was, dumbass plane shading microwave towers. same thing the germans used to fire their rocket plane munitions in ww2.)
asciilifeform: two theories dominate,
asciilifeform: a top-of-the-line american jet is found with a clean fist-sized hole lengthwise, incl. pilot's arse. pieces reassembled, and everyone shits their pants in astonishment.
mircea_popescu: just... you know... "how did actor plane end up in us controlled airspace ?" "well... they were in on it" "so it was a us plane" "uh no.. it was NOT REALLY." "mk ?"
mircea_popescu: it ~could~ be argued that what they shot down was an ACTOR plane acting the part of being a fighter jet in a film about serbs.
mircea_popescu: as you know - the serbs, using very primitive technology, shot down an "invisible" fighter jet.
mircea_popescu: i would expect it to be dissolvable on purely formal grounds, because the whole thing is nothing other and nothing more than a nominal attempt. but dunno why this isn't obvious.;
asciilifeform: i believe that mircea_popescu is a clever fella, and that, given the prior available to HIM, it 'necessarily doesn't'
mircea_popescu: there is an outstanding issue ; i dunno how much you actually still credit the (separate network - not miner cartel) theory. i dunno how to approach that to make it plain to you it holds no water. tho it necessarily doesn't.
asciilifeform: when i asked re: the cartel, i got : http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-03-2016#1432648
ben_vulpes: nevertheless, ask i did, and answer of some sort i received.
ben_vulpes: i asked "why did you not bring this before the forum first?", and received "what, /you/ idiots?", from which i derive that i am not to expect answers, and if to not expect answer why ask?
mircea_popescu: (there's also a difference between asking admiral lord nelson what color are his flags ; or how his cannons work ; and asking him why he put the ships in a line ten apart. but this for another time.)
mircea_popescu: but there's a space between what your quote shows and what "futility-cum-insubordination of a footsoldier asking anything" means.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes there's really nothing wrong in asking anything.
ben_vulpes: eyyy trinque not that you're short of work or anything rn but hey, add 'titles' to the todo list?
asciilifeform: trinque: if mircea_popescu had been going for the 'fuck off, who asked anyone' angle, why would he have bothered to write the qntra piece re: miner collusion ?
trinque: or what did the declaration I signed mean?
trinque sees the king angle, and also the "anything in my hands is mine to do with, and who asked anyone else?"