trinque will join the discussion when he has something that hasn't been said, and not simply to "make voice heard" or "join the debate"
a111: Logged on 2016-09-11 17:21 mircea_popescu: the silent are not necessarily thereby lazy! mebbe they're trying to understand the otherwise rather complex an' intricate matter in discussion.
trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-11#1539646 << aha. I'm certain all of us have been reading the exchange. (I hope some made use of !!subscribe to do so)
asciilifeform: incidentally, i must also add that there are potentially other solutions ( e.g., zkp auth.) that do not reduce to 'sh' or 'dc'.
mircea_popescu: and for the purveyors of domestic bliss, http://66.media.tumblr.com/a858a8f1b81fa051e6b49f2003f305e5/tumblr_nhytfvUjLo1qecl7ro1_1280.jpg
mircea_popescu: on the contrary, it's how i'd do it too.
asciilifeform: i will add that, despite the ~total impasse, this has been the most enjoyable public dialogue i've partaken in, in quite some time.
mircea_popescu: the silent are not necessarily thereby lazy! mebbe they're trying to understand the otherwise rather complex an' intricate matter in discussion.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i drop this here in attempt to coax the lazy folk to join us on your www.
mircea_popescu: anyway, discussion of specifix there plox, lest we manage to lose the ~only benefit so far, which is to say that nonsensical as it is, at least discussion is all in one place
mircea_popescu: of either kind in his production ; nevertheless he also claims dc is sufficient to sink any attempt to implemnet a gossipd.
mircea_popescu: the matter in dispute is how to handle authentification. one solution is decrypt-challenge. the other solution is signed-hello. i reject signed-hello for a number of reasons, both practical and theoretical, which alf doesn't seem to think much of but which i am satisfied are sufficient to sink any attempt to implement a gossipd on sh. alf purports to reject dc on similar grounds, except i can't find anything like an argument
asciilifeform: for anyone who, like phf, has been 'waiting for dust to settle', here's (imho) ~impartial summary: mircea_popescu demands one particular aspect of correct gossiptron: repudiability; and is willing to newjersyize ('best-effort') everything else. asciilifeform demands that the entire thing have strength on par with the basis crypto. mircea_popescu points out that this building demands an escherian, if you will, brick. asciilifeform - d
mircea_popescu: as the australian slut once said to her boyfriend, "roses are red, violets are blue, i'm at mp's house cheating you you eh."
phf: asciilifeform: i'll read it once the dust settles
Framedragger: asciilifeform: re. "Enemy can spam the channel but each of his packets can be rejected in ~constant time~" - ahh! that clarifies matters for me. will comment on blog later by PC. ttyl
asciilifeform: incidentally, is anybody other than Framedragger currently following the http://trilema.com/2016/gossipd-design-document conversation ? ben_vulpes ? trinque ?
Framedragger: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160911/#199 << ah, scheiße. unfortunately fix involves rewriting part of the log viewer which is based on regex. (to be clear, my fault entirely, of course). will be done - but not instantaneously, am afraid. thanks.
asciilifeform: at the door.
mircea_popescu: https://blockchain.info/search/a86c3b4efb1be5862dff6740a16cae83a785e78eb8a81b49c6f3337ca8e0b1cc << sees one, not the other.
asciilifeform: as with my 5btc leesedol bet a while back, and 1,000,001 folks' other examples.
mircea_popescu: the 2nd appeared out of unknown parts.
mircea_popescu: but ftr, i only transmitted the first.
asciilifeform: well then.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: would you care to reveal what you transmitted these with ?
a111: Logged on 2016-09-11 16:15 mircea_popescu: in other lulz & assorted "daily wtf that never happened on the bitcoin network and if it did it's mp's fault anyway", a86c3b4efb1be5862dff6740a16cae83a785e78eb8a81b49c6f3337ca8e0b1cc being high-S got malleated by da3008e8b15d36343bc07c05cf107a7b6d29df0467901401410f8fe0d8c76488 which however... doesn't actually exist.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-11#1539596 << fwiw, as far as i can tell, my boxes never saw these.
mircea_popescu: but then happily continued to act as if it did.
asciilifeform: eh hey we observed that the bloody thing doesn't reliably work, eons ago
mircea_popescu: there can by definition exist no meeting of the minds on such shaky, arbitrarily shapeshifting terrains.
mircea_popescu: the point ~everyone, from the propellerhead ethidiots to yours truly, prefers to not observe the fact that bitcoin can not be part of economic activity as is, because unspecified machinery with unpredictable behaviours are exactly not the substance of contractual agreements.
mircea_popescu: otherwise feel free to you know, stage mock debates/legal proceedings between payment processor ("we sent the txn as contractually obligated") and contracting firm ("we hired you to do the payments, do them") etc etc.
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/09/bitcointalk-database-in-the-wild-for-some-time-now-new-forum-software-years-late/ << Qntra - BitcoinTalk Database In The Wild For Some Time Now, New Forum Software Years Late
mircea_popescu: in other lulz & assorted "daily wtf that never happened on the bitcoin network and if it did it's mp's fault anyway", a86c3b4efb1be5862dff6740a16cae83a785e78eb8a81b49c6f3337ca8e0b1cc being high-S got malleated by da3008e8b15d36343bc07c05cf107a7b6d29df0467901401410f8fe0d8c76488 which however... doesn't actually exist.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-11 15:14 Framedragger: [lol, massive outage of servers (http://gedimai.iv.lt/?id=493) - "we hereby inform that presently the majority of our network nodes are experiencing issues [read, are +/- down]; therefore the servers behind said nodes may be unreachable." i'll bitchslap them after they recover
Framedragger: (and ftr hosting a parliament candidate's website on the same server as something to do with tmsr may have been a choice too curious.)
Framedragger: r them to recover, and meanwhile i'm off to a punk concert. ttyl.
Framedragger: mircea_popescu and everyone, so just in case it was unclear, everything to do with mkj.lt is down 'cause (apparently, as of now) the network is down. cause as of yet unknown, as they've confirmed when i called. the system also helpfully informs me that server is using 64.50 GB out of available 10.00 GB, and the free disk space available ("-54.50 GB") is less than the recommended free space amount. things shall be migrated, i will however wait fo
mircea_popescu: but yes, there's ~no application one can work on that is going to be as seriously high demand as doing stuff here. people go through entire careers in corporate computer science without ever encountering the sort of omgwtfbbq you get for two week's stay.
Framedragger: [lol, massive outage of servers (http://gedimai.iv.lt/?id=493) - "we hereby inform that presently the majority of our network nodes are experiencing issues [read, are +/- down]; therefore the servers behind said nodes may be unreachable." i'll bitchslap them after they recover
asciilifeform: betcha usg is as we speak in the process of writing the ban on 'hackinsider trading' or whatever claptrap.
asciilifeform: researchers. But it also represents an approach that bypasses the sort of legal maneuverings and threats, suppression of information, and inaction that have been experienced by researchers who have discovered vulnerabilities in other products. Researchers who discovered a vulnerability in Volkswagen electronic engine locks, for example, were forced to withhold a paper for two years through a court injunction filed by the automaker in
asciilifeform: rm that had "shorted" St. Jude's stock on the information in order to profit from a drop in the stock's value. The researchers at the security firm MedSec chose to take this route to disclosure, MedSec CEO Justine Bone said, to "ensure that St. Jude Medical responds appropriately and with urgency." The partnership with a short-seller is a fundamental departure from the established approach of responsible disclosure normally taken by
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/faRIr << and somehow we missed this gem. 'Trading in the stock of medical device manufacturer St. Jude Medical was halted Friday afternoon after a dramatic drop in its value. That drop was triggered by news of alleged vulnerabilities in the company's cardiac care devices. The vulnerability was disclosed not in a report by the company, but by security researchers partnered with Muddy Waters Capital, an investment fi
asciilifeform: in other noose, boeck delivers!1111 >> https://threatpost.com/number-of-devices-sharing-private-crypto-keys-up-sharply/120379 << guess of what there is 0 mention, etc.
Framedragger: if they send me a letter saying "our network got fucked due to ddos initiated at your ip" imma laugh
Framedragger: so apparently the hosting provider which i've been paying since 2008 without sweat just went down. like, i can't load their homepage and client area. they better have a good explanation for entire cluster going down
shinohai: mircea_popescu Framedragger this is where wizards learn their wizardry craft! BY FIRE. <<< never a truer statement has been uttered.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger this is where wizards learn their wizardry craft! BY FIRE.
mircea_popescu: ah do that then
Framedragger: (crazy. i'm dumping the contents of vim buffer through the literal ssh terminal, by hand, 'cause i can't save them and i need to. good times!)
mircea_popescu: hm i thought the wiki got updated.
Framedragger wonders if it's the trilema-following bot army. will check
mircea_popescu: http://sameatschildren.tumblr.com/post/45962915522/do-it-now-guide-to-proper-bra-fit-and-measuring << not altogether a bad guide ; but the part where even usians figure out their everything is practically useless, often harmful and in any case shouldn't be used might make it into a BingoBoingo xtend ?
jhvh1: shinohai: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: i suppose ingest/excrete would be the english dysfunctional-but-best pair.
mircea_popescu: aaand in other lulz,
mircea_popescu: an' honestly, tis a pleasure to have who to write such stuff for ; far exceeds any sort of inconvenience in the writing.
jhvh1: shinohai: The operation succeeded.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-10: [03:36:56] <jhvh1> mircea_popescu: Hrotsvitha - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hrotsvitha>; Hrotsvitha von Gandersheim - Women's History - About.com: <http://womenshistory.about.com/od/medgermansaints/p/hrotsvitha.htm>; Hrotsvitha of Gandersheim – FREE Hrotsvitha of Gandersheim ...: <http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G2-3446400099.html>
mircea_popescu: ahhh such lovely weather ; sunny, balmy...
a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 03:58 mircea_popescu: Framedragger log rendition of jhv includes >; and > in the url ?
pete_dushenski: http://takimag.com/article/life_de_bois_theodore_dalrymple/print#axzz4JvSqDyZi << and now, your moment of langue de bois, fresh from the world of usg.med
jhvh1: pete_dushenski: The operation succeeded.
pete_dushenski: !~later tell thestringpuller sorry for the delay, fire over the caddy pics when ready!
mod6: is the one ^
mod6: ben_vulpes has signed all the patches currently available at the foundation: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/9z89i/?raw=true
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> in other news good god is anne holton ugyl. << omg ugh. yah, she's beat.
mircea_popescu: in other news good god is anne holton ugyl.
ben_vulpes: pete_dushenski: and it appears that i no longer have the original tgz. shinohai ?
ben_vulpes: pete_dushenski: i just got the php off my hands, man
ben_vulpes: the wisdom of asciilifeform's eat/shit is now apparent.
asciilifeform: but it wouldn't pogo - not without writing the nand flash driver from ~scratch.
phf: there was some old obscure reason why we ditched openbsd. i think it was driver support on that backup gardget
pete_dushenski: "we realised that we have no business in bitcoin/auto industry so we've elected to take the easier road of pretending that our deep reserves of offshore cash can be used for anything other than mattress stuffing. if you don't mind, we're just going to plug our ears now LALALALALALA"
pete_dushenski: http://archive.is/J86hJ << speaking of problems chez one infinite loop drive, "Apple changed the focus of the project, shifting from an emphasis on designing and producing an automobile to building out the underlying technology for an autonomous vehicle."
pete_dushenski: for comparison, "Clinton's running mate, U.S. Senator Tim Kaine of Virginia, along with his wife, Anne Holton, released 10 years of tax returns at the same time in August. They paid a federal effective tax rate of 20.3 percent on income of about $313,000 in 2015."
pete_dushenski: "Pence and his wife, Karen, reported adjusted gross income over the 10 years ranging from about $113,000 last year to over $187,000 in 2009, while the effective state and federal tax rate ranged from a low of just over 10 percent in 2013 to a high of 16.5 percent in 2014, the figures show." << in other news, this is not a bad tax rate for a us middle classman from indiana, really. vp pence is either a
pete_dushenski: usg.aapl badly needs the negative press for its primary opponent as iphone 7 plus is set to launch with ~no useful upgrades other than double-lensed camera.
pete_dushenski: "A U.S. government safety agency on Friday urged all consumers to stop using Samsung Galaxy Note 7 phones, which are prone to catch fire, and top airlines globally banned their use during flights.
pete_dushenski: shinohai, phf, ben_vulpes would one of you gents be do kind as to pass along a signed copy of the wp-mp pkg ?
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes ingress and egress, if you wish. though they refer to entrance and exit by willing agents under their own power.
asciilifeform: the seeker - will find. aha.
mircea_popescu: i'm an anthropologist! i look for these things!
asciilifeform as a small kid thought that laser ~demanded~ ruby, and that this was the reason why there were not lasers everywhere in orc household
mircea_popescu: "Binary-types is *not* helpful in reading files with variable bit-length code-words, such as most compressed file formats. It will basically only work with file-formats based on 8-bit bytes (octets). Also, at this time no floating-point types are supported out of the box. The ieee-floats library might be useful."
asciilifeform: 575 of these by now.
asciilifeform: after the leveldb thing aha.
mircea_popescu: holy shit apparently this guy's cca 2014 windoze prb stores blockchain in 128mb files, 100+ of them by that point ?
mircea_popescu: worst thing you can do for kids is make it easy for them
asciilifeform: consider the sharashka folk, etc.
asciilifeform: to revisit this wonderful digression, i've long suspected that the notion that 'great conditions' are great for output, and 'harsh gulag' - not, is not exactly true.
asciilifeform: the 'not sexy but works' fella
asciilifeform: auschwitz had > notable graduates as harvard, in the period it existed.
mircea_popescu: yes ; but the ones that didn't turn out functional didn't because of it ; the ones that did, they did in spite of it.
mircea_popescu: because they were raised by a single woman married to a single man in a house with a single room, one chair and one teacup.
asciilifeform: quite the mystery to asciilifeform .
asciilifeform: without cluttering up the bottom logic layer.
asciilifeform: even THERE ordinary run-length compressor would solve same problem
mircea_popescu: and moreover, if you DO variable length, then do proper fucking variable length. everywhere.
asciilifeform: they certainly have 0 justification in bitcoin
mircea_popescu: anyway. all these variable length integers are a fucking eyesore.
asciilifeform: i dun get it. what would be the use of a tx timestamp
mircea_popescu: few paragraphs around there yes
asciilifeform: 'I do not know why Satoshi did not decide to include a transaction time stamp. It's only 4 bytes, and it is a valuable piece of information that people really need access to. For now, all you can do is use the timestamp of the block and hope that's close enough for government work. And by government work, I mean close enough for tax and accounting purposes. Since the value of bitcoin is very volatile and can go up and down by mas
mircea_popescu: motherfucker...
mircea_popescu: no but his considerations on the subject of time!
asciilifeform: who, i wonder, is the intended reader of this.
asciilifeform: who the hell is ratcliff anyway
asciilifeform: after learning this, orcish code where SEPARATE 'eaters' and 'shitters' for binary turdolade are seen, turns the stomach.
asciilifeform: it is interesting because it illustrates the CORRECT way to do 'formats'
mircea_popescu: "Another important note needs to be made here. The block-length is *not* equal to the amount of data in the block! Meaning, after you read the last entry in a block, that offset often can be, and will be, *less* than the total length of the block reported. Your parser must take this into account and seek the file pointer to wherever the next location in the file is indicated by the block length value." << another example
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform nah, the code he's using (bitcoin qt! dude's a total eth-dork) is really shitty.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-11 00:47 mircea_popescu: "It is important to note that it is possible that instead of finding the magic ID, you instead find a bunch of zero bytes. In my own copy of the blockchain I have encountered a case when parsing through a .dat file, where the header is missing. Instead there is a large block of zero bytes and then the blockchain picks up again later. I don't know why/how this occurs."
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-11#1539363 << i could've sworn there was a hopper i could drop into
mircea_popescu: "It is important to note that it is possible that instead of finding the magic ID, you instead find a bunch of zero bytes. In my own copy of the blockchain I have encountered a case when parsing through a .dat file, where the header is missing. Instead there is a large block of zero bytes and then the blockchain picks up again later. I don't know why/how this occurs."
mircea_popescu: and of course the "256 bytes that changed the world" thing referenced from one raddcliffe's "codesupository" blogspot blog is gone.
BingoBoingo: THe ability to do 30 continuous minutes of secretarial work ought to be up there with the ability to load a half ton of topsoil into a truck as a bare minimum requirement for employabilitit
mircea_popescu: honestly, i think the people who abstract-and-code are idiots anyway. first, you do it by hand. then, you automate what you did. this way a) end up with something that actually works, and even without much design skill is well designed, by mother nature's help ; b) avoiud the trap of "i spent five engineer hours to save myself thirty three minutes of secretarial work over the course of ten years."
phf: true, but right now the number of patches is so low i go out of my way to grab anything i can find anyway
mod6: anyway, please, check out the reground ones, make sure they look good, and if you feel good about 'em, send me a sig :]
mod6: im not gonna worry about it. i went through some pain to get them exactly reground correctly, you checked them (iirc) and said they were "correct." but that was pretty much the end of it.
mod6: i dunno, it was back in the day.
mod6: in fact, i think you said that you wouldn't sign them.
mod6: phf: if you're talking about 'malleus_mikehearnificarum' and 'programmable-versionstring' then you'd be correct. they were reground, and never resigned by alf.
phf: asciilifeform: well, if you look at the seals folder you'll noticed that your sigs for the two patches are not there either, nor do i have them in my backup. since i remember meticulously going over mailing list and collecting vpatches and sigs, then correlating them to what mod6 had, then ... etc. etc. i suspect that there's some reason for why they are missing but i don't remember what it is. i suspect that it has something to do with regrinds t
phf: asciilifeform: http://thebitcoin.foundation/v/seals/ ask mod6, but i suspect that both were reground, and you didn't resign either since that happened
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-10#1538902 << you'll probably find this as useful as any other rodent carcass left on your pillow, but over the last 2 months i've racked my own metal, migrated out of virtualization to the new box, ported my blog to mp-wp, and stood the obvious tmsr services up on the new box (blog, paster, node). it doesn't look like much from the outside, but paying down debt of necessity
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/patches/asciilifeform_orphanage_thermonuke << did i ever tell phf how much i enjoy looking at the colours ?
asciilifeform: further downstream
a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 21:39 a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 19:00 phf: four vpatches have been certified by the vulpes family, http://btcbase.org/patches/genesis http://btcbase.org/patches/bitcoin-asciilifeform.1 http://btcbase.org/patches/rm_rf_upnp and http://btcbase.org/patches/bitcoin-asciilifeform.2-https_snipsnip
asciilifeform: in places where there are still walk-in bank.
mircea_popescu: "nigga, i wouldn't piss on you if you were on fire, who the fuck do you imagine is going through artistic queue movements."
asciilifeform: not counting that incident with the box (in logs a few yrs ago)
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: and eat bills as well these days
mircea_popescu: the poor got their ebt or w/e it is ; fuse banks with restaurants, they can have a waiter to take your order and a bank teller. who the fuck heard of this, seated servant before me standing ?!
asciilifeform: esp. not after the machines happily eat cheques etc.
mircea_popescu: who the fuck in his right mind wants to go talk to a teller.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 23:11 mircea_popescu: they're just petty thieves with the wrong address, walked in the bank because to them it looks just like the 7/11
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-10#1539300 << here in the heart of mordor (and quite likely elsewhere in the land of the phreeee) the banks react. i.e. they are abolishing walk-in rooms with tellers etc. entirely. atm or gtfo.
mircea_popescu: "I have never had a need to believe. Though this mental state of apostasy has saved me the anger that accompanies the disillusioned man in his 30s who finally discovers that some important pillar of his life was built upon a lie, it is no sign of superior intellect." << lafond in peak form.
mircea_popescu: they're just petty thieves with the wrong address, walked in the bank because to them it looks just like the 7/11
mircea_popescu: by this point, im persuaded a half hour caning session for any would be mugger would do a lot more agains the phenomenon than anything the "legal system" has to offer.
mircea_popescu: WE CAUTION WE HOLD TH BOMB, IF ONE TRIES TO (TREACHERY) WILL DIE AND SAIDTHAT YOU WOULD NOT WANT TO PlAY DIE WE NEED SEVENTY THOUSAND DOLLARS WITH OUT THE PIECE WE SEE YOU WELL AND YOUR FAMILY ARE WAITING FOR YOU AGINE NO (TREACHERY). (NB) READ 4 MINUTES SENT THE HOSTAGE BOMB WE NEED THE $75,000.00
<< check this out, spammers got omega rage from being ignored by the rich people.
asciilifeform: in other noose, http://searchengineland.com/european-court-says-linking-illegal-content-copyright-infringement-258442
a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 19:00 phf: four vpatches have been certified by the vulpes family, http://btcbase.org/patches/genesis http://btcbase.org/patches/bitcoin-asciilifeform.1 http://btcbase.org/patches/rm_rf_upnp and http://btcbase.org/patches/bitcoin-asciilifeform.2-https_snipsnip
mircea_popescu: violence IS the answer.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-10: [19:00:17] <phf> four vpatches have been certified by the vulpes family, http://btcbase.org/patches/genesis http://btcbase.org/patches/bitcoin-asciilifeform.1 http://btcbase.org/patches/rm_rf_upnp and http://btcbase.org/patches/bitcoin-asciilifeform.2-https_snipsnip
mircea_popescu: who bought the farm ?
phf: four vpatches have been certified by the vulpes family, http://btcbase.org/patches/genesis http://btcbase.org/patches/bitcoin-asciilifeform.1 http://btcbase.org/patches/rm_rf_upnp and http://btcbase.org/patches/bitcoin-asciilifeform.2-https_snipsnip
pete_dushenski: ok well ima set that up and we'll go from there.
shinohai: But yeah, appreciate the offer of help. I miss perusing the bash-ism and really want that feature back.
pete_dushenski: i guess the white ones woulda been euwhiggas or something
mircea_popescu highfives himself for the most contortedly elaborate constructed joke in human history.
pete_dushenski: in other alpha greens, i can totally get behind the definition of 'alpha male' that doesn't involve maintaining palaces full of harem girls. a deep sigh of relief was breathed across the land.
mircea_popescu: ah! lettuce fix then
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: on my trilema gorge sesh i noticed a linking inconsistency in the elliot chronicles. all subsequent parts link to their direct predecessors with the exception of http://trilema.com/2016/the-story-of-elliot-rodger-by-elliot-rodger-adnotated-part-three/ which links to part one.
mircea_popescu: this is not the worst though. there's some 5-6-700 comment articles from back in the romanian days.
mircea_popescu: coupla comments turn into 6k words in the blink of an eye.
a111: Logged on 2015-03-10 11:48 adlai: what really amazed/disappointed me was that NONE of the initial press coverage of 'soylent cream' mentioned 'soylent green'
covertress: there's always soylent. people, not https://www.soylent.com/ - further, i agree with you adlai, http://btcbase.org/log/2015-03-10#1047512
pete_dushenski: better they die in the ovens than being slowly and painfully digested by stomach enzymes. sterilisation is the humane kill, like kosher neck slitting
shinohai: What about all those poor microorganisms that would suffer and die in the dirt during the sterilization process?
pete_dushenski: shinohai: i guess there's always eating sterilised dirt
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: molyneux cribs from trilema with regards to the 'rights' fiction but then takes that perfectly reasoned (and seasoned) protein and tries to cook it... non-violently
shinohai: I didn't like the extra comma, twas removed
asciilifeform can't be arsed to listen to it either, he's listening to police radio and it is gut-bustingly hilarious
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-10: [15:51:09] <asciilifeform> iirc he's one of the mr.mold-style americanized faux-anarchy fellas.
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160910/#368 << i'm not going to listen to audio ; but seems he's spreading the gospel neh ?
asciilifeform: iirc he's one of the mr.mold-style americanized faux-anarchy fellas.
covertress: submitted for everyone's listening pleasure and philosophical debate: Stefan Molyneux | The Deadly Superstition of Human Rights (and other gems) https://youtu.be/ewSaQ9u5lwU
shinohai: o/ mod6 the African build went fine btw
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2016/a-complete-theory-of-politics/ << Trilema - A complete theory of politics
a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 12:43 shinohai: I kinda wish BitBet was still around in old form to bet on how many of these "companies" will still be around in 12 months https://bnktothefuture.com/search/pitches
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-10#1539176 << fountain of lulz. e.g., 'Loyyal 'Pre-Series A' - The Internet of Loyalty'
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: hard to properly word a "company not around" clause is the problem. according to usg, ibm and cisco are both "still around".
shinohai: I kinda wish BitBet was still around in old form to bet on how many of these "companies" will still be around in 12 months https://bnktothefuture.com/search/pitches
mircea_popescu: and in other pi delta chi news : sluts can't spell. http://66.media.tumblr.com/fd8ac4df3e24c750579697d584510b07/tumblr_od52zaeZCw1ud9ntao1_1280.jpg
mircea_popescu: not right now ; i'm about to go to bed. but prolly tomorrow ; and besides there's other people who want to hire noobs, so ask in chan
vinimore: is there anything else I can do?
mircea_popescu: no ? mind the typing.
vinimore: it says I'm the only user hahaha
vinimore: wait... how do I go to the chat again?
thestringpuller ponders if mircea_popescu is the real life Raymond Reddington
asciilifeform: hey did we ever have thread re the 'culture test' in lsl ?
mircea_popescu: then again - beats larry.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger log rendition of jhv includes >; and > in the url ?
asciilifeform: i want the blue velvety nazi panels from 'wolfenstein'.
mircea_popescu: where the fuck is it already.
trinque: I'm just gonna end every statement I make with "and there will be sluts"
mircea_popescu: well if it's discussed with slavegirls and a great pink fuzzy harem with soft velvety marbles and foggy complex pools... then yes@
asciilifeform: iirc the gypsies work this way already.
trinque: now because the real world example of existing payments is used, it triggers the immune system.
trinque: there was another thread where it was discussed that the common person would merely operate out of an account held by his lord, and everyone bobbled heads at that because the framing felt good.
mircea_popescu: ie, whether you fit 0.001% of bloated cc txn or 0.01% of trimmed cc txn, the smallest txn you include will still be ~same.
mircea_popescu: you STILL Get about the same monetary value as the bottommost tranche of your dutch auction
mircea_popescu: if you trim the txn to remove bloat, and then take only 0.01% that still fits in blocks
mircea_popescu: there's a bigger effect at stake : if you take the 100mn, and trim them to the top 0.001% say, to fit in blocks, you will get the bottommost tranche of this dutch autction say 1mn dollars (random number)
thestringpuller: Regardless of how delusional the payment industry is.
thestringpuller: trinque: This doesn't change the fact the initiative trend towards bloat rather than efficiency.
trinque: the 10% is still bigger than a block
asciilifeform: so all else equal, they want chump to pay N times, vs 1.
trinque: ther eis a whole round of dead shartups on that idiot idea
mircea_popescu: and i suppose if the ulterior point here is that of those supposed 100mn txn or w/e, 90% are just there to be there ; it has some legs to stqand on.
trinque: you are not going to find orders of magnitude change in removing that from the bulk of payments
thestringpuller: the point i'm making is the payment industry WANTS to bloat payments. they prefer 12 payments to 1 payment
asciilifeform: eh if visa dings him 5bux every time he pulls it from the holster
trinque: "I have decided how the world works and will now run around picking phenomena from it as fits my narrative."
thestringpuller: trinque: from my point of view it's better to buy 1 year of netflix in cash from a store than to have them charge your debit card 12 times throughout the year.
mircea_popescu: trinque if paper counts then we got a problem because i suspect it makes txn uncountable.
thestringpuller: okay for instance the prepaid card exists specifically to gouge poor people. each time you use the thing, you have undisclosed fees (which was closed when russell simmons got sued over rush card in 2011/2012). loyalty programs exist to increase tx volume so people "spend more". every initiative at the payment processor level is to create bloat.
trinque: instead of quoting slogans out of things people said (where they actually had context with gave them meaning!!!)
trinque: thestringpuller: would you fucking speak in specifics
thestringpuller: trinque: lemme simplify - from my experience the throughput of a payment processor is due specifically to the devolution of the use of money.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: or, iirc, any other year
trinque: doesn't the paper count in this context?
trinque: more importantly, the willingness to ignore instances in one's own day where he bought a screwdriver or roll of toilet paper...
trinque: the inability to hold to a particular topic is astonishing
thestringpuller: trinque: sure. but from my experience with payment processors they only exist because people don't know how to use money.
mircea_popescu: and considering the amount of frontrunning etc...
trinque: right, accounting rather
mircea_popescu: well looky, consumer payments aren't really financial exchange. they're you know, cc payments.
trinque: kill half the earth, you could still have a world where 1mb blocks do not hold all the financial exchange
trinque: thestringpuller: I was establishing some ways to measure the current throughput of the world's financial system, not crediting any particular entity with this throughput.
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: Hrotsvitha - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hrotsvitha>; Hrotsvitha von Gandersheim - Women's History - About.com: <http://womenshistory.about.com/od/medgermansaints/p/hrotsvitha.htm>; Hrotsvitha of Gandersheim – FREE Hrotsvitha of Gandersheim ...: <http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G2-3446400099.html>
mircea_popescu: rather.
mircea_popescu: hence my comment about "not bothered to understand"