asciilifeform: the sleep of fits-in-head breeds monsters.
trinque: Therefore, under this system there should be no need to resort to hairy hacking when fundamental internal structures are to be changed, or to "compile it with itself a few times until things settle down". << what the fuck?
trinque: adlai's link is in there, but from jun 2012
mircea_popescu: "This SF.net email is sponsored by the 2008 JavaOne(SM) Conference. Don't miss this year's exciting event. There's still time to save $100."
mircea_popescu didn't click on newman link, because meh, google shit. but now since came up again, decided to check it out. went to archive.is - not there.
adlai: http://jcsu.jesus.cam.ac.uk/~csr21/sbcl-0.0 << worth a read for anybody with even the most passing of interests in archaeology
adlai: python was always written in lisp. s/cmu/sb/ consisted of rewriting the bootstrapping logic.
trinque: the guy whose resignation I linked forked it from cmucl and rewrote it in lisp
asciilifeform: ( for n00bz/readers - yes, the compiler of sbcl was in fact called 'python'... quite a bit prior to the scripting language )
adlai: oh there are links in the links, and idiots spreading false myths (as opposed to the other kind)
asciilifeform: (the compiler in sbcl)
trinque: you're meant to y'know, click the links in pages
asciilifeform: adlai: presumably you are speaking of the older python ?
trinque: the guy just added optimization flags to a debian benchmark
adlai: trinque: maybe you're confusing the slowness of compilation with that of execution? python is a very slow compiler.
adlai: it DOES know that different markets on the same exchange could overlap, so a lower fruit is "triangular arbitrage" (eg, simultaneously trading btcusd, atcusd, and btcatc)
adlai: "time-arbitrage" (ie, buy-low-sell-high-and-hope-the-noise-continues) is entirely automatic (up to sane/profitable configuration), cross-exchange arbitrage is entirely unsupported. scalpl has no understanding of the fact that different markets on different exchanges might involve the same asset.
trinque: links therein...
asciilifeform: trinque: nfi where, it is the fastest cl i've personally used, hands-down (hand-massaged certain items in it to beat the shit out of cpp original, even)
asciilifeform: so the thing isn't really automatic, but semi-?
adlai: but neither does a lens notice that a cork slice looks like a grid from close up
asciilifeform: how does it withdraw the coin, to put elsewhere
asciilifeform: well suppose robot finds that btce is falling through the floor
adlai: the fact that usd (and other assorted shitcoins) are traded across multiple exchanges is merely an additional profit vector for future implementation... lone wolf projects lope one leap at a time
asciilifeform: how the hell does it arbitrage ?
asciilifeform: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160917/#61 << conspicuously absent are whatever mechanisms used for moving coin between the arenas
adlai: fwiw, whenever i fantasized about owning a lisp compiler, the imagined object went one step further than sbcl, and didn't depend on a C compiler for the 'kernel', but rather shat ELF objects (or whatever other format) from lisp
adlai thinks out loud: 'crystallising' might be a better metaphor than 'freezing', since the purpose isn't only to reduce code temperature, but also to remove impurities as they emerge
asciilifeform: when the thing barfs randomly, and underperforms in unpredictable ways.
asciilifeform: well from adlai's description in earlier thread, it sounds as if 'the time' had already come
adlai: it's almost "job security"; lets me publish my cake while preventing anybody else from eating it. whether i can eat it too (ie, debug this a decade after writing it) remains to be seen.
adlai: note that this code is written with no brains other than my own in mind
asciilifeform: whether scalpl or mpb.
adlai misses the days of scalping without competition
adlai: well, it is always throwing ssl packets, so it could also be that (this is the aforementioned plus-sized library)
adlai: magical bug inducer = scalpl running against the usual suspects of shitcoinistan
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: if you read the code, you will notice that trb is, at most times of 'very very busy bee', quite unready to react to rpc command because one of the global locks is engaged.
asciilifeform: about the dancer.
asciilifeform: unless folks ~publish~ the magical bug-inducers, i am inclined to agree with the old iddish proverb
adlai: asciilifeform: i suspect the culprit is the one CL lib of such quality that it has a plus in its name
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-17: [00:40:56] <adlai> mircea_popescu: sbcl dies on too many (for all i know, just two, in the precisely bad timing) ~outgoing~ queries
ben_vulpes: i'm in no rush, happy to run the hourglass out.
ben_vulpes: heh i wonder if the thing will even listen to shutdown commands.
adlai: a db on another box would probably count, unless "what color are your packets"?
adlai: mircea_popescu: sbcl dies on too many (for all i know, just two, in the precisely bad timing) ~outgoing~ queries
mircea_popescu: adlai : tell you what, put whatever does the equivalent of php up, hit it with 10loads/second for half hour and see how hairy a shirt it is.
thestringpuller: LOL. 4 srs tho. spider-man is a pretty good example. why do you think sony sunk money into a 2nd spiderman trilogy (which became a disaster)? they wanted to keep the movie rights.
adlai: call me when the kids are playing Spiderman Go
thestringpuller: adlai: but royalties are where all the sweet money is in comics! if a comic, does really well, the license holders get a cut of pretty much everything spawned from the franchise.
adlai: the best thing about tintin is that nobody is around to dilute the syrup (and no, the movies don't count)
adlai grew up on tintin, probably the reason for his strong inoculation against political correctedness
thestringpuller: this graphic novel mania the weee-uh-boos set in motion is ridiculous.
thestringpuller: its funny how the opiate of the masses never really changes. it just finds more concentrated forms. :\ depressing.
thestringpuller: lol my mom is watching netflix on the wifi
adlai: from my experience in two situations not dissimilar from low-security gaol, mircea_popescu is correct about the staff
mircea_popescu: in other news, pop quiz is unanymous : jordan mactaggart was pretty hot.
asciilifeform: well, on a list of 'the four seeekrit evidences', stoolies, nsatronics , parallel construction, and ????. So what's ???? ... telepathy? magic 8ball?
asciilifeform: (the latter usually shits out pages-denied count)
mircea_popescu: "2011 FBI report finds broadening U.S. military presence responsible for rise in terror attacks" << hurr. "today we discovered that if we go attack some people, they'll attack us right back."
asciilifeform: ^ perhaps ~that~ is the subj of link !!
mircea_popescu: and in other "prison for women" news, http://66.media.tumblr.com/8821c5e865e9249a8dc810fae9938131/tumblr_o8cxlv1tVj1qc2yxpo1_1280.jpg
mircea_popescu: (they also know this ; which is why all the derpy "murder for hire" and assorted nonsense keeps trying to be tacked on)
mircea_popescu: just as long as you make sure that a) usg can't get at your wealth and b) you left a network behind you're liable to find the prison term more pleasant than life at home./
mircea_popescu: in practical terms, if you'll be going to prison for limp dick shit, your best move is to have bitcoin and a wot. the personnel is poorly paid, greatly infiltrated by gold diggers who correctly intuit this is their easiest way to endear themselves to the sort of people who can touch real money, however briefly, and generally very supportive. for as long as you got leverage outside you'll be fine.
mircea_popescu: anyway. "don't gamble" is solid advice. gamble works in prison exactly like outside - as taxation. unless you're running the joint, gambling is just another way of looking for a boyfriend.
pete_dushenski: http://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/the-nsa-has-files-on-a-country-that-doesnt-exist << how dare the nsa have a file on a nonexistent country that isn't tmsr!
mircea_popescu: incidentally, the retiarius' weapons may well make a comeback. drone should be able to drop weighted net on, say, schoolgirl, neh ?
asciilifeform: they're being fucked, from reverse end
asciilifeform: well, theoretically, 'reverse penetration'
asciilifeform: and theoretically cunt engine can work just as well on 'out' stroke as 'in', eh?
asciilifeform: and not just the 'gore', but complete kit, with chix 'butterflying' themselves while they spray it out, etc
asciilifeform: and didn't mircea_popescu tells us about some chick who had one every other month or the like
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in re earlier, gotta wonder re the existence of... abortion pr0n
mircea_popescu: and in other things that could beenfit from a blockchain trustless digital autonomous crypto anarcho syndicalist commune : https://www.emlalock.com/
mircea_popescu: anyway. hard to tell from a pic, there's considerable variance in abdominal swelling.
asciilifeform: what even is that object they're 'birthing'
asciilifeform: eh wait, sc4m! some of these chix dun look pregnant at all
mircea_popescu: some of the weirdest shit there. including somebody who thought using a common glass salad bowl as a receiver is a good idea, somehow ; lotta casual "your cunt's bare, why not be naked" stuff, and etc
phf: well, cmucl version was very cmucl specific, when i ported it to lispworks i made it portable, but i'm sure there are some small things left
mircea_popescu: and in other tooling news, http://66.media.tumblr.com/1f3675ccd63cc4eedc95167f1685315a/tumblr_o4kjg3ie4S1ui7jcmo1_400.gif
phf: right, but the url above timeouts
trinque: ^ announcement of Newman's resignation from the project
asciilifeform: the trb method.
asciilifeform: trinque: we have the pill. pick a time, t. and all sbcl work after t, is dead to us...
trinque: best lisp compiler is in the hands of imbeciles, is wat.
asciilifeform: 2016-08-31 19:52:36 stassats not their intentions'
asciilifeform: '2016-08-31 19:52:31 stassats frankly, i don't believe in the web of trust, you can only know who uploaded
asciilifeform: '2016-08-31 19:52:29 Xof the copy of my key that was on sourceforge had an error in it ever since it was uploaded'
mircea_popescu: "most lisps today are buggy half working implementations" or how did the quote go.
asciilifeform: and any work with scheme will inevitably have the flavour of 'recreating common lisp from scratch.'
asciilifeform: as in, there is a very pedantic test suite.
asciilifeform: the thing is, it's a frog, but a standardized frog.
mircea_popescu: this method seems wasteful ; from experience it actually delivers. the more direct, intuitive approach not only always fails, but predictably so, which is why it's such a great ally of statu quo.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this is sorta why i came upon the notion of resurrecting 'tinyscheme'
mircea_popescu: the way to owning technologies is ; by picking technologies to own that are small enough on the way there. much like the way to eat a whale is by eating earthworms while frogsized.
mircea_popescu: BUT THE SIXTH CASTLE STAYED UP!
trinque: nameless bastards, afraid of signing their works.
phf: i've used cmucl in the past, like 10 years ago, and still have most of my lisp code for it/in it. than i switched to ccl and deployed few things commercially with it. the only lisp i've never explicitly worked with except toying around is sbcl
mircea_popescu: because 5yo me had observed some cows, and figured... what the hell!
phf: but the rewrite happened for two reasons, one is that i wanted to do interesting analysis on entire corpus (which is something python will strugle with) and that tmsr canon called for technology ownership. cmucl seems like a reasonable stack to own, considering that it's abandonware. fwiw it benchmarks faster than either sbcl (by fraction) or lispworks (by a huge margin, wtf now) on doing bit twiddling like the search that we do
mircea_popescu: i only have to go in there when someone "upgrades" something.
mircea_popescu: this is how they think, you know ? and while not conscious, because celenterates, nevertheless effectual. because a large collection of betas will naturally fall on solutions to the problems of betas.
trinque: one of them at least is a complete idiot who told me in #sbcl that gpg signing was pointless because "somebody could just pay me to sign something malicious"
mircea_popescu: not to necessarily discourage the eager from using lisp or anything else. by all means. but certainly to discourage an unrealistic view of performance etc.
trinque: sbcl has been taken over from the original guy
phf: asciilifeform: well, fwiw i used sbcl for years and was running in increasingly larger number of problems. just small annoyances. when i tried interacting with sbcl "community" it turned out to be the usual suspects, google employees, gender pronounced. i have the same antipathy to sbcl as you to llvm
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform iirc you deployed the only thing known on python which worked ; and serve via apache ?
pete_dushenski: 'EVERYTHING MUST GO IN THE DISHWASHER AND THAT MUST BE FINE.' << chez moi i throw everything in the dishwasher, which i then run when full and empty thereafter, while the girl does this 'wash by hand as you go and air dry on the rack' thing for reasons i don't fully comprehend.
asciilifeform: the interpreter ?
asciilifeform: phf: is there a reason you're allergic to sbcl and will try even payware before it ?
pete_dushenski: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160915/#334 << looks like contravex uses the same footnote plugin as trilema, so you should be good to go
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform based on exactly this type of interaction with exactly this type of fellow, back then.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i dun see anyone here (other than me, but w/e) ever spend time debugging apache etc.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it costs about two or three days of the programmer.
phf: there was this idea in the naggum emails that all the problems go away once you stop being cheap and pay for a real lisp. maybe that was the case in 2001 when he wrote it, but in practice it turns out to not be so
asciilifeform: and incidentally if it's the crippleware version it will fail to allocate when you reach the cripplement limit
asciilifeform: phf: you went straight there from cmucl ?
asciilifeform: and the 'poor man's dynamometer' of phillips screw - no longer essential
asciilifeform: anyway the description given is off, phillips screw was used precisely because it slips when torqued up. 'torx' and similar - do not. they were introduced when dynamometer (torque wrench) became standard at conveyor.
phf: yeah, i decided to touch the server and now everything's broken
mircea_popescu: release only works half the time.
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: There were no matching configuration variables.
asciilifeform: and they're a household thing, made by 1,001 chinese whatevers.
pete_dushenski: 'but eventually relented and traded the garburator for a hood over the stove,' << current place... doesn't have range hood. smoky ? smelly ? open the windows and patio doors and get a cross-breeze going
mircea_popescu: is "garburator" supposed to be "garbage carburator" ? because that may be the lamest corporate attempt at humour to date.
pete_dushenski: 'I was dead-set on finding a house with a garbage disposal, or "garburator" as our sorry ("Sorry!") neighbors to the North call them,' << l0l! love the souble dorry. also, i've never lived in a house or condo with a garburator and may never.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-15: [23:12:10] * mircea_popescu was reading pete d, ended up on "Knowing that on average humans have one testicle and one ovary, what are the odds that this human's left ovary is a testicle ?"
pete_dushenski: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160915/#629 << 'what are the odds that this human's left tit is a hairy enough to shade the sahara?'
asciilifeform: in other 'news', heathen 'rng design' folk write what aaaaaalmost looked like good intro to subj, https://forum.stanford.edu/events/2016/slides/iot/Ben.pdf , until the mindfuck 'Want to keep generating entropy bits without needing to keep powering the HWRNG Use HWRNG to seed a PRNG (AES counter mode)...'
phf: (i'm using this "fuck you phf, love freenode" to upgrade the btcbase instance, so site is down for half hour or so)
mircea_popescu: in other news, cockroaches are more robust than women ; especially in radiation contaminated areals.
trinque: but doesn't help if there are myriad cases one must use ghost
phf: by the end of this exercise we're going to all have the total sum of all the hacks that are in eggdrop, indepedently rediscovered
phf: there are more things in heaven and earth, horatio
mircea_popescu: and in other news, hot damn it's great watching girls work out.
phf: `card.freenode.net * a111 "Nick/channel is temporarily unavailable"` well then...
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes the native logging of prb are fascinatingly bad.
ben_vulpes: oh that's lulzeriffic, the processblock log lines don't get timestamped?
asciilifeform: what's the log look like ?
ben_vulpes: ya well that is categorically not the case for this node.
asciilifeform: (and though the algo is infinitely parallelizable, it has 0 parallelism as implemented by the idiot)
ben_vulpes: memory use aside, is the 100% cpu use symptomatic of blackholing, asciilifeform ?
mircea_popescu: in the sad story of exactly this, the first time i ran new eulora client, it crashed. i've bee nrunning it in gdb ever since, has not crashed since. 5 weeks!
ben_vulpes: yaok i'll accept that the engine room needs a new dial.
trinque: ben_vulpes: go back in time and compile in the instrumenter before this happened!
ben_vulpes: what means "compiled in" then?!
ben_vulpes: curious to see what's in there while it's live.
ben_vulpes: well compiled in, i still hafta restart the process
asciilifeform: there was another instrumenter that compiled in, and worked in real time, see june/july '15 ml
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i'd have to restart the process to get data out of valgrind, right?
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes et al: what happened to actually instrumenting with valgrind etc, as i described in agonizing detail on the ml last year ? the linux footprint thing is not very useful.
mircea_popescu: the rest is ~more or less normal.
mircea_popescu: 00007fd9b506c000 5972292K rwx-- [ anon ] << what's in there ?
mircea_popescu: and in other "i'm just dumping links for bots to archive" news, http://logs.minigame.bz/2016-09-16.log.html#t17:44:03
asciilifeform: we all have materials table on the wall, just as mircea_popescu
ben_vulpes: in other strange, my trb node is currently sitting on 9756 VIRT, and has an entire core completely pegged.
mircea_popescu: anyway, yes, gold is very dense. a coffee mug full of gold is easily 2x the yearly income of the mug's owner
trinque: the piece is called "America"
asciilifeform: 'The long-planned participatory (shall we say) sculpture by the Italian artist Maurizio Cattelan — a fully functional, solid 18-karat-gold copy of a Kohler toilet, an over-the-top apotheosis of wealth — was installed in the humble restroom on the fifth-floor ramp of the Solomon R. Guggenheim Museum late last week and will be open for business to anyone with the urge on Friday...'
mircea_popescu: good thing they're not using paper ballots.
asciilifeform: in other lelz, http://www.theonion.com/article/disillusioned-hacker-starting-to-feel-like-he-has--53953
diana_coman: loool, well deserved penance indeed then
diana_coman: shinohai> danielpbarron would be proud of me going all the way back and dragging table with loot in penance <- wait, did you do it *manually*?
mircea_popescu: but oh, no, none of that. thousands of derps all "know", in the sense of being wrong in the same way ; and borges is President of the Argentine Society of Writers.
mircea_popescu: not to mention that what we thought is the goal can't possibly be the goal! so how about we stop with the shit and do things right.
mircea_popescu: yet somehow this inept cycle of self-effacement does NOT enlighten their stupid heads that yo! what we thought was the problem couldn't have possibly been the problem, seeing how the better we fix it, the worse things get! and then we have to circumvolutedly revert the very fix!
mircea_popescu: !), inasmuch as they wanted to something stupid, turns out to be contrary to what they... ~actually~ wanted to do.
mircea_popescu: wow / eve / etc : people go through the early game, master it, then can't move on to the logical next phase so they just quit. so now AAA studio is forced to salvage broken game that broke their playerbase through... oh shit, incentives. ie, inflation, ie, "we'll give you free level 60 characters". because guess what, the inflation was actually better than death, and their success at doing what they wanted to do (prevent bots
mircea_popescu: which incidentally... it really makes me chuckle at the predicament of "AAA" studios. so first, they make a broken game (broken here defined as, not-neutral state-evolution-graph) ; because their game is broken, they have to forbid bots - not just in form, but in practice. then if they don't manage to forbid them too efficiently they die everquest/diablo 3 style, inflation. but if they do manage to forbid them, they die like
shinohai: danielpbarron would be proud of me going all the way back and dragging table with loot in penance
shinohai: as I said, the game plays you
mircea_popescu: but of course to get there gotta put some study in to climb teh curve.
mircea_popescu: shinohai you know once you get half decent at the metagame you don't have to baby it. i spend about 10-20 minutes a day changing bot diapers is all.
mod6: thestringpuller: saw your blog post btw yesterday. yeeaaaaaaaah.
shinohai: it's a pain in the ass
thestringpuller: mod6 is the real life mr. robot
mod6: hahah, i wont spoil the choice quotes for anyone.
shinohai: saw the clips
mod6: <+shinohai> !~later tell mod6 You might appreciate: https://twitter.com/ECorpCEO/status/776519710259019777 << lol! did you see the latest one?
BingoBoingo: But funny things can happen to them. Like when the token trophy Muslim Hillary advisor got cucked by her man's sexts to all the twitter pr0n spammers.
mircea_popescu: i suppose it's supposed to be "funny" ; the only problem being that cancerous fags can't possibly be funny. not no matter how hard they try ; not just because they try too hard.
mircea_popescu: shinohai i can't help but notice the fascination with this mysterios ceo figure in the usg.pinoy dept.
jhvh1: shinohai: The operation succeeded.
BingoBoingo: lol, anyways apparently southpark season 20 started this week. I am still lolling at their "member berries" wordplay
mircea_popescu shudders at the hamplanet problem china is prolly hatching
mircea_popescu: who the fuck wants cake bad enough to steal it
shinohai: *Alibaba and the 4 moon-thieves
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/09/alibaba-clamps-down-on-internal-theft/ << Qntra - Alibaba Clamps Down On Internal Theft
mircea_popescu: condolezza rice was literate, carly fiorina was an exemplary woman, blablabla in the exact same sense elliot rodgers was a supreme gentleman "descended of aristocracy".
mircea_popescu: no. the ENTIRE FUCKING THING. all of it.
mircea_popescu: the entire western canon, 1966-2016, is a fabrication. the entire fucking thing. not "global warming" or "smoking kills" or "rape on campuses" or "barack obama, scholar" or whatnot other pinpoint nonsensical "movements". not even "environmentalism" or "feminism" or you know, "war on" this or that.
mircea_popescu: now find these things.
mircea_popescu: "President of the Argentine Society of Writers and as Professor of English and American Literature at the Argentine Association of English Culture"
mircea_popescu: they got borges, and that's good enough. what if he's president for life of an item that doesn't exist.
mircea_popescu: in other lulz, if one googles for argentina's writer's union, the only result is BOXING writers union. that's it.
mircea_popescu: the list of things modern derp doesn't realise could do because never had opportunity to find out is long indeed.
mircea_popescu: phf back in her younger days chet held open kitchen for the girls of the neighbourhood + some foster kids ; because she could cook, and wasn't an idiot - which was more than could be said about the respective girls' mothers/grandmothers.
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-16#1542754 << i was trying to translate dao-kakao and realized that it's impossible, since there's no equivalent of мат in english language. fuck, cunt, dick, grunt
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> (now, as to ~why~ in the latter case, i do not know) << Usually because people now "finish" basements in new construction placing a toilet below sewer line. Grinder is so turds can be pumped up to sewer line.
phf: current place has a decent sized kitchen, it's one of those arrangements where kitchen is part of living room, but it's almost comical how badly it's designed. nobody who's participated in the design of that kitchen has ever cooked anything in their entire lives.
phf: i used to think hanging out in the kitchen is exclusively su thing (i know i know), but iranians do the same thing. and the pattern is exactly the same, everyone's drinking tea, and then somebody will just break out a skillet and make omelette or whatever, "of course for everyone in the room"
mircea_popescu: and the reason for this being, evidently, that they didn't get kitchen-socialized in due time.
asciilifeform: none that i can tolerate the company of for >10min or so
mircea_popescu: they have no young where you live ?
asciilifeform: ... the who?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform gotta start having the young'uns over to learn how to cook and things.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-15 23:59 mircea_popescu: anyway ; i will propose that the large kitchen is a fundamental part in the happiness and sane social insertion of young women ; that even poor places in orcland implement it as more essential sociocultural component than, eg, men's mechanicizing garage ; that all effort should be directed at having one above all else.
asciilifeform: (now, as to ~why~ in the latter case, i do not know)
asciilifeform: one can get them even for toilets here.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-15 23:37 mircea_popescu: here we sit wondering about "garburators", which i dun have, and dun particularly want ; meanwhile he sits around with roach nests deliberately placed in the house, something the soviets cca 1966 wouldn't have allowed.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-15#1542736 << it is a device that sits in sink trap and grinds down objects therein
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: who was walking along the street singing fun songs: Hari Krishna, Hari Ram, Hari Smehopanorama!
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: Pizdanutsya ... - said the teacher Raprishnsh-vutra.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> BingoBoingo: if he's in a typical american house, the conduit is solidly drywalled ~into~ the wall. << But he can run new conduit from box along the ceiling anchored to outside of wall
mircea_popescu: this "monogamous relationship living in block of flats with 50 sqft kitchen" thing is nonsense in ways the victims don't even grasp.
mircea_popescu: anyway ; i will propose that the large kitchen is a fundamental part in the happiness and sane social insertion of young women ; that even poor places in orcland implement it as more essential sociocultural component than, eg, men's mechanicizing garage ; that all effort should be directed at having one above all else.
ben_vulpes: i should indeed see the * produced in dirigible
mircea_popescu: aanyway. you should see the piles produced in a dirigible. we occasionally (in full formation, chef + sous chef + 2-3 helpers) manage to dirty every dish in the house.
ben_vulpes: otherwise smoke not *really* a problem, just, can get cloudy.
ben_vulpes: nah, i moved out of portland to escape the countertop digester
mircea_popescu also never uses and doesn't like the machine dishwashers. they miss spots ; competent woman can do much better job much faster ; get her gloves, teach her how to etc.
mircea_popescu: here we sit wondering about "garburators", which i dun have, and dun particularly want ; meanwhile he sits around with roach nests deliberately placed in the house, something the soviets cca 1966 wouldn't have allowed.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes you know, no cooking process is allowed to smoke. if there's smoke coming out she is doing something wrong. generally overheating the oil.
mircea_popescu: usually they end up paying you so they get to maintain the social pretense of being contractors.