asciilifeform: moar folx went to the bottle.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: why 'xcode and unity', and not 'the bottle'
asciilifeform: (answer is, the folx with 'acres of crays' will butthurt that their oh-so-precious special-purpose silicon is bricked)
mircea_popescu: because nobody made it, because everyone spent all their time fucking with xcode and unity.
asciilifeform: or, the other obvious mega-question, why there is no STRETCHABLE (a la keccak) block cipher
asciilifeform: especially transpositions as we know them. i'm still waiting to hear why s-boxes are fixed, rather than entirely configured by the key, ever.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: more dire, even, than this, we aren't dealing with 20 years of disinfo artistry, but ~70 ! hagelin, crypto-ag, etc. and the entire poppycock of transposition ciphers surviving into computer age
mircea_popescu: which is why the republican strategy in sociopolitical cryptography is to isolate the nsa assets - the kochs and dreppers and schneiers + a bevy of small fry boecks etc. let them sit on hacker news and upvote each other to death, but otherwise, outside of the usg reservation, they may not opine and they may not be used as reference.
mircea_popescu: also about 2/3 of the nsa strength in practice, because outside of getting idiots to do idiotic things - they ain't got nuttin.
a111: Logged on 2015-07-12 03:47 mircea_popescu: in any case : i don't like aes for purely political reasons. it became an apparent schelling point out of absolutely nowhere for no discernible reason. these situations always stink.
mircea_popescu: clearly the security helped.
phf: in other security "Child uses sleeping mom's thumbprint to buy $250 worth of Pokémon toys (cnet.com)"
asciilifeform: the thing executes in constant-ticks, looks like.
asciilifeform: pipeline doesn't leak timing either, because - if implemented correctly - you never branch on a secret (key or plaintext) bit.
asciilifeform: BUT it is in several ways, apparent to the naked eye, less retarded than aes
asciilifeform: now i will remind readers that 'serpent' is not, afaik, on any kind of scientific foundation. it was made using voodoo doll, just like every other block cipher. (what kind of doll, is described in the paper.)
mircea_popescu: there's certainly worse options than serpent.
mircea_popescu: and in other unixes bathroom news, http://68.media.tumblr.com/e9ad40055776fd92557b63fdad30f7ea/tumblr_odcvoq0Mht1uk5y45o1_1280.jpg
asciilifeform: the political history is also rather interesting (it was on track to winning the 'aes competition', received fewest thumbs-down votes from the panelists, but mysteriously torpedoed by usg and did not win)
asciilifeform: for instance, there are no tables.
Framedragger: also, as you noted earlier, there's a good chance a bunch of ssh *client* keys were generated on those machines, too, so also possible to try to bruteforce-login with generated keys (to servers which have broken rngs)
asciilifeform: one of the hidden evils of 'of course generating key takes 10 minutes!' traditional entropy starvation -- is that nobody expects to be able to do the test where you generate 10 billion keys and make sure that the resulting keys have gcd of 1
asciilifeform: then -- debianize.
asciilifeform: then enumerate factors.
asciilifeform: the other interesting experiment, yet undone, is to generate ssh, ssl, pgp, etc. keys on some of the other os with known-broken rng -- e.g., freebsd 2010-2014 (or when was it), possibly other
asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1733 << as seen here, good chunk of the first N ssh keys to pop were tropos boxen.
asciilifeform: the interesting bit re tropos is that it is not a konsoomer box, but infrastructural (isp, public wifi, gsm, utility sensors) and for some reason popular in orc world
asciilifeform: (it displays unremarkable ssh hello, the litmus for it uses the ssl cert that the boxes also display on 443)
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-28#1591868 << well, that's why ultimately -- flags, eventually it starts looking like the original signature of run-program that he's wrapping
mircea_popescu: i think they're fucking calenders.
asciilifeform: or the 462`750 ROSSSH
asciilifeform: huawei, on other hand!
asciilifeform: (and that's just 1 ver; iirc various others identify as plain ssh)
asciilifeform: they're pestilentially common
asciilifeform: ditto the huawei boxes, the voip thing, whatever it was called, and the dozen or so other examples i catalogued in recent months
asciilifeform: the thing to observe here is that, e.g., mikrotik, should be susceptible to the debian treatment (enumerate the possible factors, then shoot)
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-28#1591924 << lel, yet another 'mikrotik routeros', lost count by now of how many
mircea_popescu: and now i shall proceed to put to electronic paper my definitive solution for global warming - both the current hallucinated kind as well as any other.
mircea_popescu: in other lulz, "¿Sabes algo sobre Bitcoin?" "es una pagina web"
deedbot: diana_coman unrated vtheimpaler.
diana_coman: !!unrate vtheimpaler
jurov: venus colonization is most feasible in the atmosphere, there's a layer with ~20C temperature, ~1atm pressure, breathable N2-O2 atmosphere is lifting gas, you can have 30hour days by surfing jet streams ...
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 02:17 phf: there's not much discipline on unix with stderr/stdout. particularly gpg seems cavalier with it. so i wouldn't even bother with error/output separation. i'd make it always return a single value, string that's combined stdout/stderr, and fail when status code is not equal to zero. maybe add a key argument, that splits them if need be, but only once there's need.
mats: davout: well, its actually getting cheaper to live in, say, sf or boston, in the short-term, due to high rises going up
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 02:39 phf: http://btcbase.org/patches/hashes_and_errors#L118 you don't really want to do this. you're subseq'ing there to strip the a/ b/ but that's not at all a guarantee! i have a vpatch with `diff -ib -ruN /Users/pf/cmucl20d-build/src/hemlock/abbrev.lisp src/abbrev.lisp` in it for example. at the very least you want to abstract it away into its own function. that would correctly operate on a hashed-path datastructure.
davout: mats: hows that specific to these places?
mats: i'd like to move to hk or tw before i'm 30 but it seems to be getting more expensive all the time
mats: its not as bad in the city
mats: eyeballs on me all day when i'm on the cape
ben_vulpes: in other "how the mighty have fallen"s: https://media.ccc.de/v/33c3-8026-a_story_of_discrimination_and_unfairness
ben_vulpes: chinese moms control the purse strings
ben_vulpes: well i was going to ask if you were in the boston cn wot
mats: if i'm being honest i wanted to get away from the massive numbers of asians
davout: "In addition to the headline finding, the study also discovered that the more women earn, the greater say they have over the family's financial management." <<< such finding
mats: didn't turn out to be that different, the new money here is just young white dudes that wear brooks brothers instead of uniqlo
mats: i gtfo soon as i was an adult, to live outside of the reality bubble
ben_vulpes: heh the sv/us conflation
ben_vulpes: also are talking fathers, husbands, sugar daddies or 'beta buxx'?
ben_vulpes: mats: does 'mommy' typically hold the purse strings among yr people?
ben_vulpes: i have utterly nfi how women put up with all of the ornamental crap
ben_vulpes: in retrospect, the expensive part is having mismatched nail lengths
davout: yeah, googled it, got "Reticulating splines | The Sims Wiki | Fandom powered by Wikia", wtf levels increased :D
ben_vulpes: in the loading screen
ben_vulpes: "Reticulating the splines..."
ben_vulpes: but do you reticulate the splines
davout: i don't get it, the expensive part for me is "finding the nail clipper", not the "clipping nails"
davout: what do you need your nails for then? get yourself a pick or something
mats: the bet settles on 01 january 2017
mats: betting on btcusd not going to 1k is turning out to be quite the nail biter
mats: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-12-27/singapore-defaults-seen-as-bellwether-for-asia-distress-in-2017
BingoBoingo: My how the euro has fallen
phf: in this case, if you want to avoid the warning and not fuck with muffling, i'd stick with (cmd args &key input). fwiw that's what sbcl's run-program does already
phf: ben_vulpes: i think best way to answer that question is to read a lot of existing code from different backgrounds (pre-2000s code, famous people code, etc.). my rule of thumb is that you use optional if ~at call site~ it's still obvious what the argument means. otherwise you promote it to keywoard. (run "foo" `("-p" "bar")) makes sense, but (run "foo" `("-p" "bar") stream) you start guessing. is it input stream? is it output stream?
asciilifeform: and aha, ben_vulpes , recall during conf 4, mircea_popescu playing the baliset, we poured the waterz...
phf: not enough reverb. i always thought baliset being a 70s instrument, considering that they had those portable source of energy in their shields, would be a kind of guitar moog
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: d00d has little plastic models of the probez in his office, would go on and on..
asciilifeform: for some reason i picture the 'baliste' in 'dune' as working like this.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> mircea_popescu: iirc the longest-enduring venus probe croaked after 1h. from overheat. << Or corrosion. Place requires ph balancing
asciilifeform: but i fuhget the vendor
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: no, not the toy, a tunable/playable thing
ben_vulpes: some 1.5 years back i leapt off the couch and demanded a hand-held instrument to awaken dormant pathways
ben_vulpes: still gotta fuckin quarantine the thing when it shows up.
mircea_popescu: then wut.
asciilifeform: do i win the prize.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform masamune;d better be. ben_vulpes hey, find the hole, get a prize.
ben_vulpes: and all the hours spent changing belts and capplugs
ben_vulpes: why in the not gentooing your own boxes
asciilifeform: i have nothing in particular against the d00d, but it is quite genuinely unclear to me where the 'value added' is.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform suspicion is unwarranted for the following reason : if he was aware he's packaging crap, he'd not be courting you ; or him. because unlike him you do have wwws. so either he's patently insane or else got something. in either case, a few hundy, not the end of the world. a decent escort is ~same.
asciilifeform: from the l0gz, it looks like a shitlinux with sbcl preinstalled (big fat breakthrough?)
mircea_popescu: dude he sold 4 boxes, if he makes enough for a decent meal out of that he's ahead of the game.
asciilifeform: also gabriel_laddel_p's boxen flying off the shelf, but still no permanent postbox..?
mircea_popescu: oh speaking of which, gabriel_laddel_p why not packaging fuckgoats with the masamunes ?
gabriel_laddel_p: You should be able to charge whatever and "they" can suck it.
gabriel_laddel_p: asciilifeform: say that you derp around with MGL_MAT and make a neat handwriting recognition module like the HP Compaq TC1100 had.
gabriel_laddel_p: I don't want someone to be able to look up a webpage and debate you about what it is that they get.
gabriel_laddel_p: asciilifeform: to move fiat monies into republican coffers. You all get free reign to sell masamune and take 100% of profits past buying the first one.
gabriel_laddel_p: ben_vulpes: I have 4 other people who want them/one. Need to organize my thoughts, stop reading about [redacted] and actually respond to their emails.
phf: also sbcl got some balls. they've been adding all this stuff, don't do this, don't do that. i suppose you can either muffle it, or just not optional the second argument and pass nil everytime there's nothing. fwiw your code always has an argument list, so it's non issue
gabriel_laddel_p: ben_vulpes: will be (figuring out how to, and then) sending you an encrypted gpg thingy tomorrow.
ben_vulpes: anyways, otaku gaijin shit aside a) do you have videos of this thing working or am i supposed to believe that it does because you now have a key you can use and b) how much for the whole circus, delivered
gabriel_laddel_p: Incidentally, it is pronounced "maza-mune". Yes, yes, as you wrote is technically how they say it in japan, but it sounds stupid.
ben_vulpes: gabriel_laddel_p: how do i know you're not running the longest and lowest-dough scam with these masamune boxen?
ben_vulpes: "swiss cheese" then meaning something like "notions are touching each other for no reason other than that's how the air bubbles formed"?
ben_vulpes: so that there are a set of operations that just happen to be implemented with "external programs" is no reason their errors should inherit from "external program" errors
phf: you have a set of (incomplete and adhoc, but there) crypto operations. they speak their own language. they can succeed, they can fail, but none of that has to do with "external programs". that's a different set of operations that deals with unix etc. that speaks its own language
phf: no, that's no the issue, it's more like a complexity along arbitrary lines
phf: but your bad-signature is an external-program-error, so the whole things is a swiss chese
phf: well, more important whose reporting the failure. if you want to pass through to the user the fact that there's a shell call out somewhere and it has all kinds of mechanisms. but verify should probably speak for itself in its own terms.
phf: well, it's only interesting if you're going to restart, otherwise..
ben_vulpes: i read "handler-case destroys the call stack" and thought to myself "if i can avoid that, i probably should".
asciilifeform: phun phakt: as an undergrad i worked for the d00d who curated the 'Вега' probes. but he was already, naturally, in usa, and sorta old, nutty.
mircea_popescu: but for srs, it's not actually known why the fuck.
mircea_popescu: wasn't that the moon ?
mircea_popescu: btw, what's the latest in crackpottery re venus lack of magnetosphere ?
ben_vulpes: brin mentioned a trick with endothermic lasers
mircea_popescu: point is, there are expensive things and cheap things. compensating for a lack of atmosphere is fucking expensive. properly cooling is nothing compared.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: iirc the longest-enduring venus probe croaked after 1h. from overheat.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 01:56 phf: i'd write it as (cmd &optional args &key input), because you always have to provide cmd (where's right now you can write (run) and the compiler won't catch it), more often than not you have to provide args and sometimes you have to provide input
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-28#1591550 << sbcl makes a style warning about &optional and &keys together. i lack the intuition to override the compiler here, does this weaken typechecking and is it worthwhile?
mircea_popescu: why's everyone always skip over venus ? mars is too hot ; the moon is too small. neither make any fucking sense.
asciilifeform: 'TRUMP hotels on the moon and mars, for starters. For those who want to ENGINEER this (and much, much more), email me at: gabriel valeth laddel @ gmail dot com, using the subject line “MAGA: THE SPACE RACE IS ON”'
mircea_popescu: http://www.broomie.co.uk/full-event-president-elect-donald-trump-rally-in-cincinnati-oh-12116/#comment-320544 << in other lulz.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 02:41 phf: i'm going to stop wall of texting the log though
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 02:34 phf: heh, this is straight up rubyism http://btcbase.org/patches/veh-genesis#L145. it would've been much cheaper to (defstruct hashed-path path hash) and so that later you don't have to poor man datastructure by (gethash 'path ...) (gethash 'hash ...) all over the place
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-28#1591571 << o hey, you found the oldest and most heinous sins i didn't fix
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 02:25 phf: also in the same handler-bind you're losing a branch. if there's an error, but it's not "BAD signature", then the whole verify silently succeeds. you probably want to (error c) in the else branch to rethrow whatever
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-28#1591569 << i used http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/joF2F/?raw=true to convince myself that this is not true when writing the thing at first
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 02:17 phf: there's not much discipline on unix with stderr/stdout. particularly gpg seems cavalier with it. so i wouldn't even bother with error/output separation. i'd make it always return a single value, string that's combined stdout/stderr, and fail when status code is not equal to zero. maybe add a key argument, that splits them if need be, but only once there's need.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 02:05 phf: ben_vulpes: actually you're get-output-streaming twice there, first time http://btcbase.org/patches/hashes_and_errors#L24 and second time http://btcbase.org/patches/hashes_and_errors#L28
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 01:58 phf: also as a rule you don't really want to let string output streams escape their scope. they don't have standard type (one cmucl it's lisp::string-output-stream for example), so you can't test for it, and for all intents and purposes they act as incomplete builders: you can't do anything with them except get their value, so why not get value there and then?
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 01:56 phf: i'd write it as (cmd &optional args &key input), because you always have to provide cmd (where's right now you can write (run) and the compiler won't catch it), more often than not you have to provide args and sometimes you have to provide input
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-28#1591550 << gotcha, it was an &rest before which may explain the contortions
BingoBoingo: wonderful specimen for the colletion alf
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 02:41 phf: i'm going to stop wall of texting the log though
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-28#1591575 << no go ahead, there is a prize for completeness.
mircea_popescu: "To whomever it may concern - I strongly advise against hiring the bearer of this letter, as she is not sufficiently qualified to take a piss."
mircea_popescu: what the fuck happened to "can her in front of the whole staff, in the terms that she may seek employment once she conquers the requirements for preschool ; and if she wants a recomendation letter this is going in the first paragraph."
mircea_popescu: " bwahahaha what the shit already.
mircea_popescu: "Obesity can be a disability in the EU. That makes it a sticky legal issue and given that she is the lone female, that makes it doubly so. If she's transgendered (which is possible given that she stands up apparently) then it's triply so. This is so intertwined in legal ramifications I can't imagine anything you can say or do (other than what you are already) that doesn't need a lawyer to make sure you don't end up in a suit.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 02:17 phf: there's not much discipline on unix with stderr/stdout. particularly gpg seems cavalier with it. so i wouldn't even bother with error/output separation. i'd make it always return a single value, string that's combined stdout/stderr, and fail when status code is not equal to zero. maybe add a key argument, that splits them if need be, but only once there's need.
phf: it's an "overkill" for a "unix script", because you throw all that data out anyway soon after constructing it. but in a lisp instance, when you already have all that data in the ~correct form~ you can start writing a dozen of different functions to analyze it, without getting bogged down on format trivia all over the place
phf: fwiw btcbase parses path component into a pathname, and the hash is (member nil bignum)
phf: been (if (not (hashed-path-hash c)) ...) because you ~reader~ should've already massaged it all into the kind of data computers understand. btcbase uses nil for empty hashes, you could have :empty or whatever, but certainly not carying strings and dictionaries all over the place.
phf: the main folly are the unixisms all over the place. lisp works with a clear read/eval/print cycle. read means that you want to take outside input and convert it into a concrete data structure. so you shouldn't have a hash with strings in it. things like (string= "false" (gethash 'hash c)) should not happen so far down the call chain. your ~reader~ should convert the input data into a format that's easy to work with. the check could've
phf: i'm going to stop wall of texting the log though
phf: also you don't want to concatenate paths, because that's how you end up losing separators and getting injection attacks and such. (merge-pathnames ...) will still work on strings, but will do the right thing
phf: http://btcbase.org/patches/hashes_and_errors#L118 you don't really want to do this. you're subseq'ing there to strip the a/ b/ but that's not at all a guarantee! i have a vpatch with `diff -ib -ruN /Users/pf/cmucl20d-build/src/hemlock/abbrev.lisp src/abbrev.lisp` in it for example. at the very least you want to abstract it away into its own function. that would correctly operate on a hashed-path datastructure.
phf: heh, this is straight up rubyism http://btcbase.org/patches/veh-genesis#L145. it would've been much cheaper to (defstruct hashed-path path hash) and so that later you don't have to poor man datastructure by (gethash 'path ...) (gethash 'hash ...) all over the place
phf: also in the same handler-bind you're losing a branch. if there's an error, but it's not "BAD signature", then the whole verify silently succeeds. you probably want to (error c) in the else branch to rethrow whatever
phf: http://www.nhplace.com/kent/Papers/Condition-Handling-2001.html this is the canonical document on error handling in common lisp. it's long and dense, because powerful machinery
phf: http://btcbase.org/patches/hashes_and_errors#L68 you don't really want to use handler-bind here. you want h-b only when you're working with the whole restart machinery. (handler-case (let ...) (external-program-error (error) ...)) is equivalent of the try/catch that you're doing here
phf: there's not much discipline on unix with stderr/stdout. particularly gpg seems cavalier with it. so i wouldn't even bother with error/output separation. i'd make it always return a single value, string that's combined stdout/stderr, and fail when status code is not equal to zero. maybe add a key argument, that splits them if need be, but only once there's need.
jhvh1: adlai: The operation succeeded.
adlai: ben_vulpes: dunno how this happened, but the link to http://cascadianhacker.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/hashes_and_errorsvpatchben_vulpes.sig is missing a bunch of periods
phf: i think it's actually related. otherwise he'd have to get-output-stream-string there again. all the folly starts with that weird run
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: naively, i expect gpg to exit 0 if the signature is good
asciilifeform: unrelated, ben_vulpes : how come you search the gpg output for 'bad signature' rather than 'good signature...' ?
phf: ben_vulpes: actually you're get-output-streaming twice there, first time http://btcbase.org/patches/hashes_and_errors#L24 and second time http://btcbase.org/patches/hashes_and_errors#L28
a111: Logged on 2016-12-22 17:58 asciilifeform: common lisp committee was hobbled by babelism, had to stuff in the redundant idiocies, and never got to, say, actually developing streams properly (why the fuck are we stuck with hacks like gray streams? and where is the commonlisp with ~working~ mop ? etc)
phf: also as a rule you don't really want to let string output streams escape their scope. they don't have standard type (one cmucl it's lisp::string-output-stream for example), so you can't test for it, and for all intents and purposes they act as incomplete builders: you can't do anything with them except get their value, so why not get value there and then?
phf: i'd write it as (cmd &optional args &key input), because you always have to provide cmd (where's right now you can write (run) and the compiler won't catch it), more often than not you have to provide args and sometimes you have to provide input
ben_vulpes: tried to dial back the programmer-imposed unnecessary complexity
mircea_popescu: ^ recommended not just because of the 85 bitcents in prizes
asciilifeform: i'm still waiting to learn of a corpse where the wifitronic burglar alarm 'mysteriously' recorded nothing, but i also suspect that we will not read about it in the völkischer beobachter.
mats: >... we discovered numerous devices that were used for "smart home" services, to include a "Nest" thermometer that is Wi-Fi connected and remotely controlled, a Honeywell alarm system that included door monitoring alarms and motion sensor in the living room, a wireless weather monitoring system outside on the back patio, and WeMo device in the garage area
phf: i for one am looking for to a gattaca future, where i have to hire a standin for myself. to run amazon echo and nest and facebook and all the other things like that so that there aren't any irregularities
asciilifeform: 'With every home in Bentonville hooked up to a smart meter that measures hourly electricity and water usage, police looked at the data and noticed Bates used an "excessive amount of water" during the alleged drowning.' << wtf, what was he drowned in, a dirigible hangar ?!
mats: (this is mildly relevant to the courts circus project)
asciilifeform: 'Amazon stores all the voice recordings on its servers, in the hopes of using the data to improve its voice assistant services. While you can delete your personal voice data, there's still no way to prevent any recordings from being saved on a server.' << noshit
asciilifeform: (as seen in the 'act from cause' thing etc)
asciilifeform: somehow i thought that 'an mp' is almost definitionally a d00d who knows ~exactly~ what he wants, and thrusts in that direction, rather like the edge of a knife orients force
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: would be a biter with insufficient venom to kill rather than emotionally wound
mircea_popescu: from what i read of the mythical founder, he read very much like a young naggum / gl
mircea_popescu: at least in intent/intuition i can see the cat-v, wanted to be tmsr, didn't know what it wants or how it goes thesis.
BingoBoingo: One could say same about OpenBSD except their mp (Theo) was and stayed poor and stooges (Bob Beck) rallied to gatekeeper and treasury positions
phf: asciilifeform: if you squint really hard, in the same sense that "scene was closest precursor to tmsr in computing before"
phf: kind of like cat-v, from recent memory, was a fledgling tmsr at one point: mp died, asciilifeform's left elsewhere, maggots still there
phf: most of the things seem to have sane core, which you can dig for for a long time, but it's there, and the reason is that ~doing anything at all~ is so much effort, everything that's done is a byproduct of some human being constructively spending energy at one time in one place.
ben_vulpes: strikingly similar to some other description of how perl grew "object oriented programming"
phf: lars bak used to work on high performance smalltalk virtual machines, then java. v8 is still the case "ok, let me write some semblance of sane technology for this shit language of yours". since then everything that's happened around javascript is cargoculting v8
mircea_popescu has always wondered how much of the ecdsa push met with approval because people couldn't do bignum math anyway.
mircea_popescu: actually the crypto lib should be in js anyway. down with fucking ints.
asciilifeform: iirc we had thread re 'node.js', in the context of corps with mandatory transsexual op etc
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you use curl on the box to call into the loopback where an apache server with lamp runs.
ben_vulpes: it is called as the man says "node.js"
mircea_popescu: there is A LOT of strength in this, having a core of libs/utils that aren't merely written, nor merely reviewed, but TRANSLATED
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: you omitted the third and obvious option
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes considering the only reason your lisp vtron even exists is because you're apparently fond of reimplementation,
asciilifeform: 'I made this half-pony, half-monkey monster to please you / But I get the feeling that you don't like it / What's with all the screaming? / You like monkeys, you like ponies / Maybe you don't like monsters so much / Maybe I used too many monkeys / Isn't it enough to know that I ruined a pony making a gift for you?' (tm) (r) (j. coulton)
ben_vulpes: rather
mircea_popescu: and in other fictions, http://68.media.tumblr.com/d90db4a0d70dabb47bbb9806b3438a62/tumblr_oeuu9lQCsf1rrq7ino1_1280.jpg
BingoBoingo: "The amount of hospitalisations and appointments that have lead me to this point isn't a low number" doesn't see problem in being a fatso https://archive.is/37T8w#selection-85.279-85.377
mircea_popescu: but as a principle, the shell exists for a human operator. shelling from code is much like taking knives and forks, melting them, and trying to dropforge tools. they WERE ALREADY metal that was forged into something. go to that source, change that from knives to wrenches or w/e you are doing. no need to involve the whole supermarket chain to sell you metal ingots in fork shape at 20bux a half dozen
mircea_popescu: if the thing you're shelling to is actually the right thing, take the code put it in a lib or in your application.
mircea_popescu: grandfathering principle.
mircea_popescu: now then. can the lispheads live with the idea of an ada tmsr-cryptolib ? perhaps with it as a reference and a lisp copy ?
mircea_popescu: gotta discuss this otherwise we'll end up with apical chaos.
ben_vulpes: i am trying to figure out how to handle widely-distributed versions of ironclad not working in the way i need them to work for my v to verify hashes on press
mircea_popescu: course since the nsa consulting work for minigame is going to produce ada rsa, it might be an idea to have an ~ada~ tmsr crypto lib.
ben_vulpes: might be more practical to make a genesis for the fixed version
mircea_popescu: no practical way to just steal the sha itself make it a standalone ?
mircea_popescu: ok so if they put patches in at least, what's the argument against linking to them ?
a111: Logged on 2016-12-26 02:38 phf: ben_vulpes: according to master this is the reason http://glyf.org/tmp/ironclad-sha512.patch unsigned for obvious reasons
mod6: ah ok. was that the pdf i didn't read?
ben_vulpes: phf linked the patch, he fixed it
ben_vulpes: plan then is to grind this patch for my v out shelling out to sha512sum
ben_vulpes: i don't want to say something like "ensure you have HEAD of the Ironclad library", i think it's more likely and more in line with waht mod6 is doing to shell out to sha512sum
trinque: also a link on the page.
phf: is there link outside of twitter?
trinque: ben_vulpes: www-wot package farts out a bunch of json index files for the search
mod6: and we had some ideas regarding the same, but didn't come to any specific conculsions.
trinque: that it came out as a trollface smiley is a sign from the gods.
mircea_popescu: then in a few centuries tmsr guard can protect the scotuspope much like the swiss guard in rome today. nice hats and all.
mircea_popescu: which i suppose is the main strategic direction of tmsr - in a few years they either pay us to "secure" all systems or else the systems burn down.
mircea_popescu: as a point of sovereign strategy, you always want to trade with the smallest and toughest of the neighbours - it's productive, plus it softens them up ; and to loot and pillage the largest, softest of neighbours (preferably under the guise of "being allies" and "keeping the peace" if possible, but outright rapine otherwise).
mircea_popescu: rather.
asciilifeform: (see also the feasting on corpses thread, not so long ago)
asciilifeform: and in 17th c it was probably the fattest +ev to invest in pirates.
mircea_popescu: even emperor-god-jobs was KICKED OUT OF HIS OWN CORP by the fuckers.
mircea_popescu: it is ~also~ much easier to scale isis than to scale ~your business~ predicated on selling to the us consumer. chiefly because yes "but mp! ipos happen every day!" sure they do - not for ~YOU~. for them. see http://trilema.com/2015/you-know-what-gets-no-airplay-unflattering-truth/
mircea_popescu: you want your customers to be tough, because if they survive so do you.
mircea_popescu: there's an important business strategy point here that's not discussed among the chickens, but hark : it is actually a better business strategy to sell to isis than to us consumer - because isis is still on the ground in spite of usg shooting missles at it ; whereas us consumer is barely standing in spite of usg pumping all it can print straight into him.
asciilifeform: because not printing private key on the fucking plastic WOULD BE WRONG!1111
mircea_popescu: the question of course is whose is it.