mircea_popescu: "Now, both The New York Times and The Washington Post confirm that the Obama White House has now expressly authorized the CIA to kill al-Alwaki no matter where he is found, no matter his distance from a battlefield."
mircea_popescu: they assassinated us citizens. wtf, what planet is this ?
asciilifeform: '"Neither President Obama nor any White House official ever ordered surveillance on any U.S. citizen. Any suggestion otherwise is simply false," Obama spokesman Kevin Lewis said in a statement.' << 'proof'
asciilifeform: 'A spokesman for Barack Obama on Saturday rejected claims by U.S. President Donald Trump that the then-president had wiretapped Trump in October during the late stages of the presidential election campaign, saying it was "simply false."'
ben_vulpes: eh i'd rather invest in dirt
ben_vulpes: and where's cash in the 2007 col
pete_dushenski: i thought you had the rotation covered ?
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: simply the (perhaps obvious to log readers) point that diversification isn't a panacea particularly in the manner used by 'advisors', which is to say, within sectors and within asset classes rather than between them
pete_dushenski: you could probably find a few exceptions other than cash but not many
pete_dushenski: i like to remind anyone tempted to buy etfs "for safety" that cash outperformed every vanguard offering in 2007. lest we forget that ~half~ of the returns of us stocks during the last fifty years were dictated by only ten days.
pete_dushenski: anyways, i have no love lost for etfs even if their fees are lower than mutual funds of yesteryear. they're still a hodgepodge of thinly distributed garbage. i don't know anyone who seriously reaps a return from them.
pete_dushenski: also north of montana isn't really northeast yknow
ben_vulpes: pete_dushenski missed vanguard takeover of the world? ria's successfully still hawk high load funds in the northeast?
deedbot: http://www.contravex.com/2017/03/04/the-diversification-scam-is-spreading-you-thin-and-stealing-your-money-so-knock-it-off-already/ << » Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski - The “diversification” scam is spreading you thin and stealing your money. So knock it off already.
asciilifeform: ( though i have never, myself, been to this paradise, and the only artifact i know of from it is via pure rumour, the marvelous orichalcum-powered golden dildoes )
asciilifeform: no one will ever confuse anything we might recognize as trb for any artifact from the distant Planet of Sane People.
asciilifeform: but iirc there was indeed a thread, where mircea_popescu suggested multiple log streams, that can be separated or combined as necessary
asciilifeform: aha! i tried to dig up the thread, so far failed
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-04#1622055 << the discussion of separating logs happened when we last talked of logs and how to improve them, cca 2015ish.
mircea_popescu: there is that.
mircea_popescu: i crush the bee, shopkeeper, woman, etcetera.
mircea_popescu: should have permabanned them, is my current thinking.
mircea_popescu: there is that.
asciilifeform: this, from the posted log.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: they buy 1 thing -- a guaranteed avoidance of the situation of mircea_popescu's node
a111: Logged on 2017-03-04 17:53 asciilifeform: there is no prioritization because of trb's fundamentally idiotic uniprocess socket handling. ( if there is no preemption - there can be no meaningful prioritization ! )
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-04#1622031 << yes but this is also the major drag on wires adoption. they buy, little.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-04#1622003 << just one more of the libertard words. "evidence", "science" "consensus" "Rape" etcetera.
asciilifeform: and in fact the idiot variable-length tx scheme, with the attendant db, guarantees geometric growth in the cost
asciilifeform: because Being Able To Use Bitcoin might pay the bills, for node operator today (or may not, some folx are stuck operating a node for other reasons, say, trb dev work) but enemy can drive up the cost substantially , with no guarantee of an increase on the other side of the balance to match it
asciilifeform: incidentally the nonsense where 'hey, node operators get paid in Being Able To Use Bitcoin' needs to be put to rest properly
ben_vulpes: one of the things i took away from the past week of mega logs is that blockchains may have finite lifespans
asciilifeform: in the classical system.
ben_vulpes: well there is the protocolitic commitment that if the transaction is included, the miner will receive a fee, but that's it.
asciilifeform: (the logical end of ~that~, is visa and swift.)
asciilifeform: aside from ad-hoc wires-for-pay and other orc duct tape
asciilifeform: from mempool operator to tx author -> 'oh here, take your dump, i PROMISE!111 i won't just throw it into the toilet'
asciilifeform: in the direction of tx-author -> mempool : 'here, i'ma take a dump, and YOU verify and store it'
ben_vulpes: is the cask system design necessarily exclusive of a mempool design?
asciilifeform: and yes, this only works with nodes that have cryptographically hard identity. and not with the syphilitic orgy familiar to classical trb users.
asciilifeform: key is to abolish the maybe-money in favour of money, and throw out the perhaps-potatoes in favour of definitively and immediately palpable potatoes.
asciilifeform: where you avoid the situation from mircea_popescu's old essay where 'in broken market, you give a bag of maybe-money in return for a bag of perhaps-potatoes' and everybody goes home to learn how cheated he was
asciilifeform: the cask scheme is simply a way to impedance-match a high tx pressure to finite space in blocks, with maximally (afaik) frictionless market.
asciilifeform: note that the miner is theoretically free to distribute some, or all of, the space in his block in any other way -- e.g. via dartboard, or sheep entrails, etc
asciilifeform: (miner can, if he likes, connect mouth hose directly to own arse, for so long as his blocks validate, he will simply forgo the fees then )
ben_vulpes: and there's no way to get transactions into blocks absent casks, right?
asciilifeform: when you roll a cask, you are saying, ultimately -- to a tx maker -- 'there is a place in a block reserved for your tx, fire away'
asciilifeform: it is either kept -- or not kept !
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: you didn't miss, there is no such thing
asciilifeform: (in trb, you also, recall, have the tx index db, and literally nobody knows what the dynamics are there)
asciilifeform: in classical trb, you have the 1MB/10min worstcase. but tightbounds are better.
asciilifeform: incidentally there is ye olde disk-is-full. and in future trbi with fixedwidth tx and block, node knows ~exactly when disk will fill, years in advance.
mircea_popescu: speaking of which, recall our ancient discussion re "buried nodes" and my reluctance ? dja understand HOW MANY OF THESE THERE ARE, silent unknown failure modes ?
asciilifeform: whereas if your node is launched to pluto, and you know that you will never read the log -- turn it off !
asciilifeform: rotate -- manually. when you're satisfied that there is no further use for the multi-GB log
asciilifeform: and yes, if you want to debug, you gotta log. don't think the enemy doesn't log your plaintext.
ben_vulpes: aight, aight, i forget that i'm the only person using svlogd
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: as is screamingly obvious from the earlier thread with mircea_popescu -- the debug log is terrifyingly inadequate for ~any serious work
asciilifeform: but i will leave this to other folx for nao
asciilifeform: what the thing really needs is 'indicator lamp', i.e. a field in getstatus that shows last event that happened on each wire.
ben_vulpes: off the cuff, would an exponential whine backoff suck?
asciilifeform: there is no prioritization because of trb's fundamentally idiotic uniprocess socket handling. ( if there is no preemption - there can be no meaningful prioritization ! )
asciilifeform: (i was unable to think of any reasonable way around this. if you silence the whine, you will never know that your wire peers dropped.)
asciilifeform: in fact if the peer on the other end of the wire goes down, you will get multi-MB whine in your log.
asciilifeform: now it is also important to understand the limitations of the current wires patch. there is ~no~ prioritization .
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: congrats to you, you did all the hard work. tank brigade goes nowhere without the engineers laying down bridgework
asciilifeform: and if you have a trb built with wires, it is 10min work (on client end), 10 seconds on the master.
asciilifeform: imho the Right Thing is, each node is wired to a handful of serious people.
ben_vulpes: it is what, ten minutes of work to set the master up
asciilifeform: congrats to ben_vulpes , the first d00d to request , and be issued, a wire to dulap.
a111: Logged on 2017-03-04 01:53 asciilifeform: (if you ~only~ requested by height, anyone could put you on 1way voyage to pluto and you'll stay there.)
PeterL: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-04#1621939 << I am not sure this would happen, you would still have to verify the blocks - unless you have absolutely no connection to anybody else, in which case you would be equally stuck under current conditions
asciilifeform: in pygmystan, they have not invented writing yet, gotta retell same yarn again and again and... again. we -- have writing.
asciilifeform: mrottenkolber: could try reading the logs
asciilifeform: (i don't recall seeing a 'ru mega-hack accusation ... no evidence' in the beobachter.
asciilifeform: meanwhile, völkischer beobachter entertains, https://archive.is/XajR5 << 'President Trump on Saturday angrily accused former president Barack Obama of orchestrating a “Nixon/Watergate” plot to tap the phones at his Trump Tower headquarters last fall in the run-up to the election .. no evidence ...'
asciilifeform: digested, as per the log, more or less immediately
asciilifeform: they're pseudos
asciilifeform: because - i dare say - they ain't nodes
mircea_popescu: it's about my own conclusion. i'd say it belies the need for some fixing.
mircea_popescu: so the working theory being, that a) node spent ~weeks trying to digest block 419221 and failing ; b) eventually managed but by then not able to obtain the next one because of reasons discussed except ; c) recently it managed to briefly connect to the magic node it would talk to and get another 100 or so blocks ?
asciilifeform: but interestingly, quite recently was able to reconnect to the 'first connected to' node, the idiocy i described yesterday, and sync just a bit.
asciilifeform: ~that~ was where the thing sat stalled, for eons
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there are 1955176872 lines of debug.log between block 419220 and 419221
mircea_popescu: phf unsurprising ; indian industrialization happened mostly under the soviet... "influence".
phf: back then su was pumping resources into india, but according to su economic strategy that mostly resulted in factories and hospitals. now americans are pumping resources, but that mostly results in moar mcdonalds. so naturally men with long memories are testy
phf: bhai is basically hindi for brother, which is bhratri (bratr) in sanskrit, which is same word as russian "brat", english brother, etc.
phf: it means indians and russians are brothers, and is a slogan for soviet/indian friendship from about 50s to 80s
asciilifeform: i have nfi in what shithole today anyone likes the americans.
phf: in related lulz i got a lot of "soviet union was a good thing" from conversations with indians. a lot of older indians seem to hate americans and miss the good old "bhai bhai" days
asciilifeform: phf: most of today is re mircea_popescu showed a trb node that's been wedged, in a peculiar way, since july. but the l0g will still be there later.
phf: i'm mostly reacting to "things missing" bit. i otherwise would like to remain ignorant of going ons in the world, until i'm forced into interracting with it again in a few days
asciilifeform: phf: he uploaded entire blk0036 in the end, see l0gz
mircea_popescu: and otherwise, i bid all a very good thight
mircea_popescu: now then ; the reason i even looked at this node is that i was going through a list of potential candidates to put in the new asciilifeform ssh thing.
asciilifeform: (if you ~only~ requested by height, anyone could put you on 1way voyage to pluto and you'll stay there.)
mircea_popescu: anyway, the problem with "request block by height" is that the block height is an ambiguous identifier of actual blocks.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no it's clear how it should work ; whether it ends up working that way is open, but hey.
asciilifeform: clinch is : getheaders ALSO WANTS A HASH as starting point ! ALSO won't work by height !!
asciilifeform: which you are expected to do (because he was dropped as a child) using either a bastard's header, recursively as discussed earlier, or 'getheaders'
asciilifeform: i'll add that 'week' is merely a guess, from my arse; perhaps a couple of hours is enough, under the right circumstances ( idiot peers + sufficiently many blocks made in interval )
asciilifeform: : the idiot specialcase -- will trigger.
asciilifeform: this is also why mircea_popescu rebooting the node, will almost guarantee to bring it to life
asciilifeform: and, notice, it asks first-chance-strangerfuck for the blocks-from-genesis.
asciilifeform: tardoshi had a motherfucking SPECIAL CASE for 'i'm a new node'
asciilifeform: note that ProcessBlock() only ever asks ~the bastard-supplying peer~ for the bastard's prevblock.
asciilifeform: dollars to doughnuts, it lost connectivity for a week or two. at which point the necessary bastardry-recursion depth became longer than any of his node's peer's typical uptime.
asciilifeform: (it's effectively recursive. when bastard comes in, we ask for its predecessor. which, if it is also a bastard to us, triggers same process. ad infinitum, until we get the thing we actually want, which is our next block )
asciilifeform: laters then
mircea_popescu: aite, ima go examine beauty in the flesh. will push the thing to web when it's done.
asciilifeform: let's see if anyone answered . gotta see the log.
asciilifeform: trb's response to an orphan is 'tell me mybestheight+1th block DAMNIT'
mircea_popescu: yeah. then i can't conceive. it did complain thousands of times of orphans, which implicitly resulted in block being sought.
asciilifeform: it still happens, see the quoted src
mircea_popescu: did the orphanage burner ruin trb 's chances of unwedging in this situation ?
asciilifeform: the other is the idiocy where it asks, but only ~the first node it talked to when booting~ !
asciilifeform: one is to ask bringers of orphan blocks for our currentheight+1.
asciilifeform: so mircea_popescu , as you can probably tell, if node misses the window when $block was being actively thrown at it, then it has only these two knobs for attempting to get it
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> ill complain to mod6 also. << im about 18 hours behind on the log, will catch up and will revisit tomorrow.
mircea_popescu: yeah. and since you mention it, trb-i definitely needs a clarified push-or-pull model because the current system is the soul of unconsidered adhocery
asciilifeform: (and grunting through the mempool)
asciilifeform: at all other times, it passively sits with open mouth, waiting for blox to fall from the heavens
asciilifeform: http://btc.yt/lxr/satoshi/source/src/main.cpp?v=makefiles#1364 and http://btc.yt/lxr/satoshi/source/src/main.cpp?v=makefiles#1735 are the only times a trb node asks for blocks explicitly from peer
asciilifeform: really all of the procrustean truncations gotta go.
asciilifeform: it sure as fuck isn't . which is why it has to be massaged out from the log segment known to contain it.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform part of the problem is that "00000000000000000136" is not much of a unique id in thefirst place.
mircea_popescu: all of these'd have also made me notice it.
asciilifeform: remains -- to see the log (was it ever offered 00000000000000000136 in an inv vector ? and, did it ever request it from anybody ; and lastly, did it ever receive . )
mircea_popescu: but before that it returned the plainest normalcy, 37 connected nodes etc.
mircea_popescu: i did turn off the node to be able to push out meaningful bdb item think about it.
asciilifeform: ( if at any point an exception was shat , it'll be cached there )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: if you have not yet switched the box off -- what does getinfo return ?
asciilifeform: the behaviour is inherited from tardoshi
mircea_popescu: no argument there ; you however may in turn recall that trb is by inheritance an utterly chtonian horror of heap allocation etc.
asciilifeform: (this was a major brain-melter during the prbisms thread)
shinohai: Whatever the outcome of the node wedge fix is, I need to write all this down as it may be a powerful tool to fuck with enemy in the future.
mircea_popescu: ie, you ~could~, theoretically, write such shit into a block that it wedges nodes.
mircea_popescu: loads of all that "unable to decode address" things, which is my only vague "there could be something here".
asciilifeform: 00000000000000000136 rather
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no, i'll complain to you, because really there's no need trb logging be THIS RETARDED
asciilifeform: sooo somewhere in mircea_popescu's log, there'll be a getinv for 0000000000000000036, the prev block, then for this final one, 0000000000000000038 (complain to tardoshi re the procrusted hashes, not to me..) ,
asciilifeform: ( i lean to the latter hypothesis , it is a thing that regularly happened - admittedly not to the extent seen in mircea_popescu's specimen -- among my nodes, and was why i could no longer put off the 'wires' thing )
asciilifeform: or neither -- a prb-everywhere-and-not-a-drop-to-drink problem , conceivably.
mircea_popescu: let's do that then
mircea_popescu: i guess i'm just going to publish the log altogehter ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: can you get the log inclusive of the last ACCEPT (case-sensitive) and all lines after ?
mircea_popescu: (all those and many others would have popped it for review you realise)
mircea_popescu: anyway, i plan to restart it sometime tomorrow, if anyone wants further datas it's a fine time to say.
asciilifeform: because the last block in mircea_popescu's blk0036 is a main-chain block
mircea_popescu: ie the node appeared fine.
asciilifeform: fwiw the heathens seem to have this same 419373 , https://blockchain.info/block-index/1242663
asciilifeform: it sat there wedged ever since ?!
ben_vulpes: oh and this doesn't actually render the header in a digestible form. okay, disregard.
mircea_popescu: it'd be tremendously helpful for instance if the trb node had found it within its good graces TO FUCKING PUT TIMESTAMPS IN THE LOG.
mircea_popescu: well those nailings being the principal point of this exercise.
ben_vulpes: with the caveat that there is something funky with satoshi counts in this parser that i have yet to properly nail: http://cascadianhacker.com/2584.txt
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: no, think about it, blockchain is a tree, but the turdfile is a linear tape
ben_vulpes: is there a straightforward mapping of height to position in blk.dat i missed?
mircea_popescu: 419373 and thereabous
asciilifeform: if ben_vulpes's parser worx -- then yes
asciilifeform: (does not need to be, obviously, literally in this form, but the same effect)
asciilifeform: well yes. hence why i said 'draw tree', i.e. list the blocks in form, e.g., b1->b2->{b2a1, b2b1->b2b2->b2b3} << in this example, b2a1 is orphanlet
asciilifeform: tardoshi stored them in linear tape for some reason, with 0 markings
asciilifeform: just means to dump the which-block-depends-on-which-blocks tree
ben_vulpes: aye, let me find the log line
mircea_popescu: dude why can't he do whatever it is he's doing lol ; i did publish the thing.
asciilifeform: (well rather, mircea_popescu could really use one. but he probably doesn't have the runtime readily set up)
pete_dushenski: in other measurement strange, https://www.cnet.com/news/icon-smart-condom-ring/?ftag=COS-05-10aaa0b&linkId=35064659
asciilifeform: y'know, which then turned into mimisbrunnr
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: i don't see a block debugger in there
asciilifeform: then we would, for instance, know , what mircea_popescu's node heard, and when
asciilifeform: incidentally trb probably ought to shit a sha512 of incoming block into the debug log
asciilifeform: what i meant is, i specifically do not have the most basic means of answering the most basic questions about the blocks, other than their bitwise identities as pictured earlier
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that's a major part of the problem, everything can appear as orphans to a portion of the network only.
asciilifeform: upstack: the sad thing is, i am not even equipped to answer whether 419373 was part of an orphanable forklet on mircea_popescu's node ; and if so, when orphaned at large
asciilifeform: the real puzzler is why not reorgs.
asciilifeform: trb's block push/pull mechanism is so retarded, that it is possible for a node to go for eons in a wedge, simply from never receiving the necessary unwedge blocks.
mircea_popescu: i've looked at the block specifically, i can't figure out why it would say such a thing myself.
asciilifeform: there is a much simpler, though disheartening, explanation
mircea_popescu: not 150gb theree3of.
asciilifeform: these eggogs refer to mempool tx
mircea_popescu: that the log essentially consists of complaints that txn can't be validated and so the block can't be added.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what leads you to this hypothesis ?
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20170303/#268 << i have nfi either, but it ~looks~ like it did not believe A NUMBER OF txn from the root of the reorg are validable.
ben_vulpes: i have no idea what goes on in these certificate program scams but i can't imagine not leaving if someone actually put a coloring book in front of me
asciilifeform: ^ BingoBoingo and other t00lz collectors.
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/iqUhn << in other noose. << i dun think i've ever seen such compact one. and certainly not for sale 'to humans'.
asciilifeform: i have RENAMED THE FILE !11
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the log from mircea_popescu's node unsurprisingly sheds 0 light.
mircea_popescu: (note that one of these is about 2.5k blocks long, like 2 weeks ish)
mircea_popescu: it ~could~ end up in there.
asciilifeform: now for the money shot:
asciilifeform: 1sec, let's finish the earlier escapade :
mircea_popescu: if you want to trace specific peers i can grep the monster debug i guess
mircea_popescu: it being the last blk
mircea_popescu: anyway, at the time i turned it off it was widely connected, and spamming the debug log 10lines/sec sort of rate
asciilifeform: ^ i suspect this beast, if not a piltdown man, was made using the method described by lomachinsky , with the old radioprotective drug that causes gigantism in mammal
mircea_popescu: do you want the last block.dat or such ?
asciilifeform: at any rate plz don't lose that thing's blockchain, mircea_popescu , can use my 'blkcut' or ben_vulpes's ver of same, to get at the blox
mircea_popescu: in other lulz, i found a trb node which is locked on block 419373 and dumps all blocks as unacceptable bastards
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2017/03/another-guest-lecturer-attacked-on-us-campus/ << Qntra - Another Guest Lecturer Attacked On US Campus
asciilifeform: btw when i first saw ^ photo i parsed it as a wtf, because of the peculiar position of the ballsack, it looked as if it could be a hyena-like concave proboscis, holding a dildo
a111: Logged on 2017-03-03 17:19 phf: catching up with rss and some of the log linked articles is literally like taking a bath of shit.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo "the lamestream a fake news media appeared to be" l "a pool of 13,000 evaluation."
mircea_popescu: the way alf dating scene worked, at least in my imagination, was girl now and again propositions 'im then has to spend the next three hours arguing with him because "it'll never work".
asciilifeform: in particular, the 2nd link.
asciilifeform: in other veryolds, 'It is now common knowledge among computer scientists that NP-completeness is largely irrelevant to public-key cryptography...' -- ( (very sadly) Papadimitriou . 'NP-completeness: A Retrospective', 1995. http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.32.8685&rep=rep1&type=pdf )
a111: Logged on 2017-03-03 17:05 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-03#1621464 << lel, this happens to asciilifeform/pet regularly. i think of it as 'yes there are fast neutrons wherever you are, but go and extract useful energy from'em'
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-03#1621476 << i'm mindblown at the notion that you actually approach women.
trinque: aha. the guy's own face read expendable
mircea_popescu: somehow this question never gets asked, "facebook spent 50bn to buy... users." ok... if they bought them where are they ?
mircea_popescu: dude... if the thing existed... WHERE DID IT GO ?!?!?!
a111: Logged on 2015-11-08 23:08 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes match.com, plenty of fish, okcupid tinder and the rest of the lesser known implementations of the social media dating scam are all owned by iac.
a111: Logged on 2017-03-03 17:02 phf: and host listed just a handful of dollars below budget hotel option for the area, so clearly knew what she was doing
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-03#1621475 <<-->> http://btcbase.org/log/2015-11-08#1320298 "she". what fucking she. the notion that ~people~ use airbnb is exactly like the notion that "groupon was a consumer revolution".
Framedragger: heh i recall buying some electronics at ccc in hamburg by doing a live transfer from mtgox. those were the funny days
a111: Logged on 2017-03-03 15:35 asciilifeform: so now they're flynning him also.
mircea_popescu: BACK THEN the pretense to "we are bitcoin revolutionz blabla" could be maintained. and strictly for such reasons.
mircea_popescu: phf the stripper offwork thing is a toss-up i guess. it depends a lot on the environment or something ; i've known both kinds, ie "girl next door by day champion stripper by night" as well as "stripping is my whole life and my car plates read TITTY"
asciilifeform: ( https://blockchain.info/tx/5da9e054f81716ff54fefa10fae3c025685faf5170d1b270b3384a3406d781e0 << typical example of tx spamola, in recent few blox. and yes i'd rather link to mimisbrunnr but it does not seem to have linkable tx knob presently. )
asciilifeform: trinque: i must confess, i have not been keeping up with the fauxcoinz
trinque: though honestly, where's the LIGHTNING TRANSFER announcement, whereby the various exchanges link up for "faster transfers between exchanges"
trinque: no, the conspiracy goes to 11!1!11!!