mircea_popescu: you can't buy this off the shelf. panels my foot. which is WHY http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661768
phf: i know i know, this thread is extremely frustrating. it's your classic armchair trolling "if i was building my way would totally work" well build then "i don't have time to deal with this stuff, but everyone else is an idiot"
mircea_popescu: and the most bitter fruit of this entire tree of idiocy being that in six months to a year, we'll be right back to "oh, orlol boat and lizzards are keeping the hydrogen engine under wraps".
mircea_popescu: to qualify in an argument with a fellow who routinely proceeds to idiocy on the level of "metal rusts" and whatnot.
mircea_popescu: the actual yacht which you can actually keep fucktoys on, which costs about 5 to 10 mn, does in point of fact take the labour of a thousand men over their lives. except we got tools to do it faster and cheaper.
phf: afaik they already build boats out of abs (cheap leisure boats, entry level yachts, as well as high end competitive stuff). in all cases it's different abs, and not necessarily stuff you buy from conveyer (stuff you buy from conveyer cracks)
mircea_popescu: it'll be better for boatbuilding than the plastic cutting item.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform because your brain dun work. half the roofs in the world are made of metal, no rust. if you get operated on they'll uyse what, fucking abs tools ? "oh, can cut with laser!11"
mircea_popescu: then you come and whine about all the boost in bitcoin and all the java everywhere. guess what ? they were building alfboatsd
mircea_popescu: remember ? you didn't like the correct solution (metal) because... you don't have a cnc mill. and that's a fucking criteria in design now, what the fuck engineer has lying about and perceives underutilized, esp if he happens to thin kit's cvool.
mircea_popescu: this is way the fuck better than anything you came up with so far, and we're not even trying. nor pretending to be keeping a blog about it, a la orlol.
mircea_popescu: though honestly, could also be made of pet bottles, arranged the other way. that'd help buoyancy!
mircea_popescu: things work the way they work because that's the way they work not because alien dragons from outer space.
mircea_popescu: and they ALSO charge what that cost in rome. ~whole value of house.
mircea_popescu: no. this is what fd does in "ourdemocracy" : like in latin empire, demolishes the one on fire to save the ones not yet caught.
mircea_popescu: tell you what, if boats were made of plastic the MTBS would be a week, and the "lizards" runnin the coast guard would charge you.
mircea_popescu: you mean the same lizards who provide the fire dept services your "house" utterly needs ?
asciilifeform: not cheap because lizards pocket the cost diff
mircea_popescu: o no wait, it's not cheap either.
mircea_popescu: this bad habit of having a firm idea of the solution to a problem you don't either understand or bother specifying.
mircea_popescu: how did you pick abs rather than i dunno, duralumin ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you'll need more basis for that besides "i'm alf and i dun like it". the ocean's been there longer than you have.
asciilifeform: the wood that a proper boat supposedly 'must' be made of.
asciilifeform: they're ridiculous.
mircea_popescu: no, at the "boat making" folks.
asciilifeform: at the veblenwood folx? yes i can.
mircea_popescu: but just because you're the prince of alflandia does not mean you can simply walk into an unknown barrio and talk smack at the locals.
asciilifeform: point is, i can and do routinely make, with own hands, items otherwise thought to be 'megabux, megawatt' ( per http://btcbase.org/log/2017-02-19#1615434 )
a111: Logged on 2017-05-13 22:02 asciilifeform: and holyfuq, the norland thing took almost hour of uv to cure, vs the advertised 10sec
asciilifeform: can buy by the tonne.
mircea_popescu: plastic IS used in boatsmaking, but it is specially made plastic, for the purpose.
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 05:33 mircea_popescu: basically you picked the simplest one thing that dun work.
mircea_popescu: ther than some bits and pieces of a foundry installed in your kitchen.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the places where craftsmanship makes sense are eg the tomato planters discussed above. yes they have tractors that plow, but these tractors do not plow planters. EXACT same principle applies making boats -- or for that matter silicone. you somehow seem to understand that if you want "artisanal computer" the correct approach is mechanical calculator ; and if you want oceanworth computer gotta have the foundry, ra
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 13:33 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661585 << these 'long hard years' people did not have laser cutters, water-jet cutters, ABS plastic & other modern nearly-indestructible (and intrinsically-buoyant ! in some cases) materials
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661647 << neither do you. for that matter, these are not actually useful for craftsman ; they are useful for mass producer.
diana_coman: quite on the contrary really - I rather push so that he sees alternatives are also *possible and fine*
mircea_popescu is entirely undecided whether it's good or bad trait.
diana_coman: but he is what he is and it's not as if I don't know the thing
diana_coman: lol! neah, he's just... rather strict
mircea_popescu: diana_coman yup. also in the strange properties of materials. i once spent a half hour pouring water from one reciipeint to another.
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 14:27 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661640 << are you kidding me, i loved to fuck around the kitchen with my mom at that age. made all sorts of engineer pies, too!
diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661725 <- ofc he loves it; I suspect it's more about having a mother who ...cooks, you know; and in general the interest thing is really more like interest in ~anything close adult does
mircea_popescu: you can't have both of these at the same time, and duck behind one or the other depending which vein of solutions for your entirely psychogenic issue masquerading orally as a "technical problem" are being suggested.
mircea_popescu: gotta decide if your idea is "nothing can beat self-same craftsmanship and i am willing to sink in the time" OR "i will sink in no time, give me whatever trhe fuck it is that takes no time and effort".
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 13:32 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661582 << this is screamingly irrelevant to modern world -- why the everliving fuck would i want to use wood ?! or to cut it by hand?!!
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661645 << because a) wood is still, to this day, the better material for the purpose, in the sense lee sedol is the better go player. note that these WERE YOUR OWN CONSTRAINTS! you despise "made to rust iron bottoms", which is outright idiotic but in the common vein of "alf has no clue but figures he can have oppinion". you do not wish to pay the price of industrial process. you stirctly spe
jurov: *sigh* i keep getting calls from an UK number, as far as I understand, he's asking something about coinbr, when I ask them to come to irc/email he just says thank you. can't even fucking text, and not possible to call back
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 09:48 diana_coman: BingoBoingo, the cucumber plant was actually quite a hero: made dozens of cucumbers BUT it grew them to full size/ripened them *one at a time*; not an easy task apparently to make wholesome things even under rather favourable conditions as it were
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661643 << that's how they do it, like sicilians marry off the daughters.
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 09:40 danielpbarron: also, i have eaten at every restaurant worth the mention in this state and i can say honestly my food is on par or better than the top three
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661639 << wait, in ~connecticut~ ? they have pretty decent restaurants there, which were the top 3 ?
mircea_popescu: i suspect it should go in the "normal development handbook", 4-5 yo with no interest in mother kitchen activities is prolly under 80 iq.
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 09:41 diana_coman: and yes, 4 year old child routinely helps in the kitchen too, not a big deal; cutting stuff, mixing dough etc
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661640 << are you kidding me, i loved to fuck around the kitchen with my mom at that age. made all sorts of engineer pies, too!
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 09:35 diana_coman: fwiw I have yet to meet someone who cooks for themselves who doesn't consider they cook "very well" (or better); it's when cooking for others that one can really tell whether they are good at it or not
mircea_popescu: basically, the russians are jews.
mircea_popescu: though from experience russians a) never go alone (unless female, in which case they dun keep the money there anyway, if they ever get it) ; b) sorta delegate one to keep the dough.
asciilifeform: there are idiots anywhere.
asciilifeform: for all i know, it's the american expats, who do it
mircea_popescu: eh, i've yet to meet a greek that used their banks.
mircea_popescu: whereas all prepackaged sauce is the same endless variation of "let's see which ways we could flavour margarine / substitutes"
asciilifeform: in other lulz, in greece, https://archive.is/lLLfT >> '...the tax authorities will be able to issue online confiscation notices and immediately get their hands on the contents of safe deposit boxes, confiscating cash, precious stones, jewelry and so on. They will also be able to confiscate shares and other securities.'
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661616 << sauce, incidentally, is the killer. don't eat the shop shit, no matter whjat it is. homemade mayo takes five minutes once you learn how to make it ; white sauce is extremely easy to make, if scary ; tomato sauce certainly doable esp if you have a sane electric stovetop. that is ALL the sauces, everything else is combinations.
asciilifeform: unrelatedly, i have nfi who trb node 208.94.240.42 belongs to, but it's been stuck in the 300,000s for ~ages~
mircea_popescu: and my idea, somewhat in the vein of http://trilema.com/2017/time-to-get-out-by-the-way/ and more generally bitcoin, is that if you stick to it, corporations wil lwither and die. they're one of those evils which can only breathe for as long as good men do nothing.
mircea_popescu: 3.677 ) rather than the idiot banks. and so on and so following, the key imo is to trade with independents rather than corporations.
mircea_popescu: this being the major consideration -- i hire a lawyer, i don't retain a law firm. i work with accountants, not with ernst and fucking young. i much prefer to interface with the "criminals" doing actual personal banking for customers (you know, "money laundering" folks, also mentioned in say http://trilema.com/2013/what-the-drug-trade-is-how-the-drug-trade-works-and-why-silk-road-didnt-work-and-didnt-matter/#selection-63.559-6
mircea_popescu: between these two, you've covered the (imo) proper and useful homemade substitution in the food chain. nothing wrong with buying meat from the butcher -- tho it helps immensely if he's an actual butcher, as opposed to an employee of some franchise.
mircea_popescu: vegetable garden is a lot more fun if you make girls work it naked. i would rate such an item above the orchard.
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 09:27 danielpbarron: the way i figure, i'm locked into this undesirable location enough with what technical goods i possess. if it got so bad i couldn't buy proper raw ingredients anymore, i'd be better off moving elsewhere anyway, which i would like to do before such an extreme situation
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661612 << depends. a pig sty is no one's idea of a good time (well, with exceptions i think we have illustrated in the logs) ; but something like your own orchard is very strictly speaking land improvement, about same value as a pool (larger footprint though). they were used as such by the romans in their estate retreats, there's extant manuals, this is a well documented concept.
mircea_popescu: not to mention, i was some variation of "LordMircea" in pretty much every game I ever played since forever, cuz wtf you gonna do for a nick. eventually, nel mezzo del camin, reality actually alligned, and the fantastic pseudonym became simply descriptive. what can you do.
mircea_popescu: and in other idle chatter : http://kingsandlegends.com/ is actually quite cool. very much what a browser game should be.
asciilifeform: ( the one on crapple, is known offender )
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 09:09 danielpbarron: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661290 << i can relate (in that I hate this world and everybody in it -- really. everybody. to be alone and sustaining would be heaven), and the answer is the Bible. I'm not saying you should stop doing the great work that you do. but that there is relief in the way you dream of in the world that is to come, if you are made to believe. If God could change my mind on this matter (which he did, i wa
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661605 << wtf do i do now. was the line cut in the original also ? or did i actually an' for the first time since this thing exists lost some bits ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform definitely worth running on some of the more ocmmon luser architectures. very likely to discover 65536 wide keyspaces and shit.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661594 << no but see, it's more of a trade barrier than anything. the whole point of geting preexisting data was that it'd be faster and cheaper than buying chip ; and since you already have it ...
asciilifeform: i've been exploring subj as part of the shitoshi question.
asciilifeform: ( after this, we can plug in gpg-on-winblowsrng and enumerate the set, then bust these... )
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661592 << not in principle. maybe the reserve is a little high, maybe the concept is too soon ; certainly he can't pay and it's somewhat dubious to explain why he should. but hey, gotta start sometime/somehow/somewhere.
asciilifeform: who won't be killed in any other way.
asciilifeform: theoretically this set will include some (largeprime)*(largeprime) folx.
asciilifeform: there is a variant where you nail large-factored N, where p*q=n and p-1 or q-1 have small factors.
asciilifeform: it's in the pipeline.
mircea_popescu: does sound like a better use of resources than further increasing 8ball.
asciilifeform: all them folx who skimped on 'test p-1 and q-1'
asciilifeform: right now an entire day in the week is reversed for '8ball', and the result is always these, 'make the rubble bounce'
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661644 << i probably oughta pollard-rho these and be done with it
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 03:17 asciilifeform: there is ~nothing~ that can remotely hold a candle to craftsmanship-with-your-own-hands-for-your-own-fucking-self
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 09:41 danielpbarron: which perhaps says more of the horrible state of restaurants in this area. it shouldn't be the case that i can produce better than the professionals
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 05:34 mircea_popescu: what man can make with own two hands i have seen, it's a pleasure to ride, it sells for loads of money, but to fuck in the thing you have to be young and she has to be flexible.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661586 << you won't see a plastic boat , or one that is 8m wide, or pykrete, or any of the other technologies eschewed by the veblenists
asciilifeform: they did not have modern metallurgy, either ( there are metals that will laugh at a thousand years of salt water, e.g. hastelloy )
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 05:33 mircea_popescu: no man ever made a galleon, you understand, nor a manowar. these are made by 100s of people labouring over long hard years.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661585 << these 'long hard years' people did not have laser cutters, water-jet cutters, ABS plastic & other modern nearly-indestructible (and intrinsically-buoyant ! in some cases) materials
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 05:33 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661461 << boatwright will still require good quality wood, and other things. and making a boat (unless it's viking style, which is no good in ocean) requires ~a lifetime. the limit on the age of sail was early industrial process.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661582 << this is screamingly irrelevant to modern world -- why the everliving fuck would i want to use wood ?! or to cut it by hand?!!
diana_coman: BingoBoingo, the cucumber plant was actually quite a hero: made dozens of cucumbers BUT it grew them to full size/ripened them *one at a time*; not an easy task apparently to make wholesome things even under rather favourable conditions as it were
diana_coman: and yes, 4 year old child routinely helps in the kitchen too, not a big deal; cutting stuff, mixing dough etc
diana_coman: good; I'm just a bit surprised of all the emphasis here on ...cooking, lol; granted, I grew up with cooking being just usual everyday thing to do, just like waking up, washing etc but still
BingoBoingo: The cucumbers? Were any eaten?
BingoBoingo: anything come out of the sukes?
diana_coman: fwiw I have yet to meet someone who cooks for themselves who doesn't consider they cook "very well" (or better); it's when cooking for others that one can really tell whether they are good at it or not
diana_coman planted cucumbers and the like last year simply for the child to see; not a lot of time spent on it, no
BingoBoingo: And starting seeds can swiftly turn into the expensive part of very small scale tomato'ing
BingoBoingo: At that size it will have outgrown any objectionable pesticides by the time its fruiting
BingoBoingo: This late in the season in your neck of the woods probably safest to get a plant that's already started. One or two of the ubiquitous "Bonnie" 4 in peat pot starter plants would be fine and run ~2.50-4 USD a piece and give you a roughly 2 month head start.
shinohai: Tomatoes (or the smallest of gardens, for that matter) have never been -ev thing for me, ever.
BingoBoingo: It's an enjoyable past time. Plants take manure up front, but composted so less smell. Livestock constantly produces fresh smelly manure on the other avenue.
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 03:16 asciilifeform: exactly like how mircea_popescu gets food finer than the finest, costliest cook could reliably make for him for money
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 01:15 asciilifeform: 100% physically closed cycle, motherfuckers, on mars, if i could!1111
mod6: anyway, the -otc days maybe came and went a long time ago. so gabriel_laddel_p might be sol.
mod6: ya lost me there.
BingoBoingo: But will he ever see the numbers YOURS produced in that GB?
mircea_popescu: those dudes DID in fact pursue all sorts of (their version of) actual quality.
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 00:56 asciilifeform: those aristos died of stupidity-- thinking that they were exempt from having to learn about money, similarly to modern brahmins 'exemption' from crypto
mircea_popescu: what man can make with own two hands i have seen, it's a pleasure to ride, it sells for loads of money, but to fuck in the thing you have to be young and she has to be flexible.
mircea_popescu: no man ever made a galleon, you understand, nor a manowar. these are made by 100s of people labouring over long hard years.
mircea_popescu: basically you picked the simplest one thing that dun work.
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 03:16 asciilifeform: exactly like how mircea_popescu gets food finer than the finest, costliest cook could reliably make for him for money
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661461 << boatwright will still require good quality wood, and other things. and making a boat (unless it's viking style, which is no good in ocean) requires ~a lifetime. the limit on the age of sail was early industrial process.
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 01:44 mircea_popescu: plowing tractors have special hydraulics to keep it in. lot of force, more than the pull.
BingoBoingo: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661370 << They do indeed. Three point hitch. For small applications sleeve hitch and weight work.
asciilifeform: idea being 'vandal-proofing' rather than finest-kbd-money-can-buy
asciilifeform: they are used in 'internet kiosks' etc.
mod6: looks like they make stainless keyboards for industrial use
asciilifeform: and then pete_dushenski et al are mega-surprised when they buy porche and it's plastic.
asciilifeform: ( i would , for instance, put a whole column of -- yes, modal!111 -- bitsetter 'metas' b/w the left-F block and `/tab/ctrl/shift/ctrl
mod6: i considered getting one of these, but i wanted to try the concave thing first on something ~half the cost.
asciilifeform: not being able to physically relocate the keys, is frustrating.
asciilifeform: this even with not having to use x configs for anything, as i have custom micro in there with custom fw
mod6: speaking of special keys in the middle, i suppose one could remap all of the maltron keys into the middle.
asciilifeform: funnily enough, my 'f' gives me 24 'extra' keyz, of which i've only to date used a few ! ( to make the missing f11, f12, esc, printscr, scrollock )
phf: “ and then you tell your keyboard driver og X or whatever that you have placed the parens {} [] () and <> (unshifted and shifted) in what used to be the 6YHN colum”
phf: he basically just took the naggum posts from ron garret's complete(-ish) archive of comp.lang.lisp
asciilifeform: and certainly the keyboard
asciilifeform: to revisit upstack : imho naggum's mega-insight was that the hands have 0 business being so close together as they typically are, and that the space ~between~ them oughta contain specials
asciilifeform: iirc he had ( and ) both in there. but could be wrong.
phf: you're either chording or traveling. there's only enough space for alphabet there. naggum's hack is that he puts opening parts of { [ ( pairs on the middle row, but he still has to chord for closing. (he presumably uses electric mode)
asciilifeform: key modes, imho, are like the topmost shelf in bookcase in a house with proper (19th c euro) ceiling height -- a place for rarely-used things
asciilifeform: other specials not so useful in lisp
phf: sure, but the rest
phf: unless you have unchorded specials, and you use number keypad for numbers, but then you have hell of lateral travel
phf: you already chord to get to any of the special symbols, when you press shift
asciilifeform: the only legit justification for chords is not-having-to-move-fingers-laterally
mod6: i vi/m, and i have to say that with the kinesis, the tiny ESC key bugs me. so i remap ESC to the right thumb ctrl key, and the 'OS' key to ctrl.
phf: yes, but it's nothing like the item in question
phf: ~sounds~ is the keyword here
asciilifeform: why not have 10-key chorder then.
asciilifeform doesn't vi, either
phf: but the big insight of arensito is to move all the special chars into an additional mode. so parenthesis are for example on altgr-k altgr-l etc.
phf: yeah, there's actually some "modern" qwerty modification that puts special chars on middle column
mod6: phf: aha. even with qwerty on the kinesis, it still messes me up a bit now on regular staggard row layouts. i never tried alt layouts such as dvorak since a friend went through the same thing. always found himself having to switch everyone elses keyboard to dvorak just to "use" their keyboard for a minute.
asciilifeform: you can bathe it..
asciilifeform: the up-side : 1) incomparable ( at least i cannot describe it in words ) feel of 'click' 2) theoretically eternal board. there are NO electrical contacts exposed, it works on electric fields.
phf: mod6: i used that one for a long time with arensito layout (http://www.pvv.org/~hakonhal/main.cgi/keyboard). still the most pleasant typing experience i've had, but was also entirely antisocial, i.e. couldn't use any other keyboards at all
asciilifeform: oh and i oughta mention, getting the thing together requires woodworker's clamps and just-so nudge'shove, takes 5-6 tries, during each of which all 122 keys fall out and separate into spring, anvil...
mod6: is there any specific model you use/prefer?
asciilifeform: or, at the very worst, 'white alps'
mod6: it's got the cherry mx reds. been using it for a month. im getting used to it.
asciilifeform: there is no substitute, i will probably die still using my current gentoo.
asciilifeform: even, for instance, the keyboard asciilifeform is using at this moment, took a man-month of asciilifeform
asciilifeform: there is ~nothing~ that can remotely hold a candle to craftsmanship-with-your-own-hands-for-your-own-fucking-self
asciilifeform: exactly like how mircea_popescu gets food finer than the finest, costliest cook could reliably make for him for money
asciilifeform: and yes, i'd expect to pay ~materials by weight~ cost, considering that thread was about a hypothetical boat that ~one builds with own hands~
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the yacht i visited recently had 2 ~q - beds and was externally not larger than three BingoBoingo-trucks stacked vertically
jhvh1: mod6: The operation succeeded.
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> not sure, possibly nobody gave a shit. << iirc no websites for either existed at the time of listing.
mircea_popescu: not tom ention the part where it's "Car-sized" on the outside and "q-bed sized" on the inside.
mircea_popescu: he wants to pay ~what pvc costs per the weight for an ocean-going item. it's not unlike me speccing "i want computer made out of seminole grain. they can make pasta out of it, why not computer."
mircea_popescu: phf the "constraint" resultant strictly determines the item as a psychological rather than physical constructy.
asciilifeform: the kraken is sadly inescapable.
phf: yes, but what about the kraken
asciilifeform: btw orlol never mentions kingstons, and imho they are the most important control on any serious boat!111
phf: considering that the thing is designed for fambly, shooting will be a mercy
asciilifeform: incidentally this here is another possible minus of 'old tanker as houseboat' idea. picture the pirates. they might shoot you out of sheer frustration...
a111: Logged on 2017-01-05 03:32 mircea_popescu: famous russian gun commentator guy explains this cannonicaly, imo. "thief - wants to get loot. not to die with you there."
phf: (all of this is pretty obvious, if you ask yourself, how did you have so many skirmishes during the age of exploration, given how big the ocean is and how few vessels compared to now were on the surface)
phf: or sitting without wind and current in the middle of nowhere, praying that you have enough gas to take you to a closest stream
phf: i don't have enough experience with open ocean sailing, but the ocean is not as big as you think, as far as pirate avoidance is concerned, because of the currents. you have stable streams, that are essentially mandatory for long distance travel. piracy has been traditionally carried out at various locations where these currents terminate or switch. if you're primarily relying on wind (and there's only so much gas your little boat will carry), you will
a111: Logged on 2016-07-19 22:30 mircea_popescu: if the sheep found a way to graze on rafts, the wolves would ride around in speedboats.
asciilifeform: rather than a 'stfu, idiot, you asked for philosopher's stone'
phf: can presumably spec out the thing by noting all the instances of "omg, i definitely not don't need X that does Y what are you stupid" and building a constraint rules out of them
a111: Logged on 2017-05-25 00:18 mircea_popescu: eh, my recollection of the discussion is, "there's houseboat and there's yacht. there's no batshit-nonsense for the ~same reason there's no golf club cum baseball bat cum tennis racket."
gabriel_laddel_p: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-25#1661215 < the end of this thread was MP noting that if you wanted a boat, buy it when the Korean shipping firm imploded, else stuff.
gabriel_laddel_p: asciilifeform: diva send the x61? I have someone waiting on me to deliver a masamune atop it
asciilifeform: theoretically you dun need a physical unit, for such a test
gabriel_laddel_p: for MNIST or the like?
asciilifeform: because , for instance, they already have one.
mircea_popescu: let the man do his ada rsa
gabriel_laddel_p: On the basis that FG won't rest on some portion of the state space when you train your model
gabriel_laddel_p: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-24#1661195 < have you tried selling FG to data science / machine learning types? IE the only group of young people with disposable income.
mircea_popescu: plowing tractors have special hydraulics to keep it in. lot of force, more than the pull.
mircea_popescu: which is the fundamental point of poverty.
mircea_popescu: THAT is what qualifies, not the butthurt bullshit of wanna-be princeses upset some other dorks they cant' distinguish themselves from got a cooler car.
asciilifeform: and whence the ox.
mircea_popescu: for that matter, get back to me when any of them actually work a field, by hand, to make 100 dollars in 6 months of oxen labour.
asciilifeform: they also have living capital, in india etc : people who, e.g., still know how to make cloth, and can live N to a room without killing self or each other
mircea_popescu: india, ghetto. the us ? heh.
asciilifeform: they're in afgan, where rent is 20
mircea_popescu: with the women making clothes by hand out of stolen scraps, and all the complexities of soups etc.
asciilifeform: that meat ain't meat, it's whatever they scrape from the floor at meat plant, + corn starch
mircea_popescu: that may be ; but there exists no ghetto in all of the us today that can compare to eg ghencea, or whatever other "urban development".
asciilifeform: i'll point out that su built massive economic base , on the plunder of which the 'civilized' west ~ to this day ~ runs
asciilifeform: i dun see anything peculiar in the pics..
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2010/piinea-amara-a-baietasilor-de-cartier/ << 1st image there. ro "hip hop" band (ro terminology), ie gangsta rap. they ACTUALLY have the creds tho, comiong from the actual hood.
mircea_popescu: subsistence living has a peculiar meaning in romania of the 80s.
mircea_popescu: i'm just saying, leverage isn't this magical thing from the sky.
mircea_popescu: the correct approach to "live rent free" is to work it as a business. the rest is poppycock.
mircea_popescu: nevermind that. consider this : my living arrangements, were they to be separated as an independent profit center, were in the green pretty much every year for the past 20.
asciilifeform: fact is that it is the most effective way to 'get moar money'
mircea_popescu: there's a reason ~everyone applies that method. the reason being 10 overbids 9 whereas 8 does not.
asciilifeform: ( and in fact i considered lafondlandia, even, and did go there, and haggle with realtors, chitchat with the criminally insane locals, etc. and concluded that it was just short of +ev )
mircea_popescu: why not increase income ? it's the traditional approach.
asciilifeform: fwiw i'd like to solve what i see as the solvable problem, of minimizing living expense without having to live among scum
mircea_popescu: aite then.
asciilifeform: if i were to pay 10x less rent, would have more than 10x the unwanted hyoomancontact.
mircea_popescu: mmm. i dunno. i mean in the sense condoms are three bux or w/e, break the "Student"'s budget
asciilifeform: make optional. the way having children is.