Naphex: or an exchange transaction != payment transaction
Naphex: davout: but an exchange transaction != a bitcoin transaction
Naphex: davout: brb gotta eat, continue afteward if you're still on
Naphex: and maybe order rules
Naphex: because it handles exchange data, and orders, and order queues, and execution
Naphex: right?
Naphex: but why does it have to also manage the wallets, and record user transactions, and process payments
Naphex: well, the exchange api will be that sequential queue.
Naphex: yep
Naphex: and eventually you will have to split it to scale
Naphex: i just think one big app to handle wallet api, exchange api, payments api might just be too big
Naphex: which will interlink
Naphex: or be split into modular nodes
Naphex: see, now will that api do payments processing as well in the same big app?
Naphex: they come up with servicing in mind, and the same way a client hooks up to them web platforms hook up as well
Naphex: and payment nodes to process payments and get auto notifications from them
Naphex: exchange nodes can be accessed to convert the currency
Naphex: and they can handle their duty, wallet nodes can be used by clients to connect and manage their wallets
Naphex: there is no problem with coupling, nodes come out with coupling since start
Naphex: so i can have wallet nodes, exchange nodes (which can be split into INSTRUMENT servers)
Naphex: yep
Naphex: now i know services are secure and they stay clean and sharp to the point code
Naphex: then interlink
Naphex: I like my stuff modular, i split a big app into scalable services
Naphex: <+davout> Naphex: i don't think splitting apps would make it less vulnerable, on the contrary, having only one attack surface is easier to manage <<
Naphex: but i have done a lot of that for embedded and it worked out very nice
Naphex: but rarely i have to do that for backends, as in hardware nowadays is too fast to care
Naphex: i do the same in jave, write JNI if there are bottlenecks or too slow performing native functions
Naphex: yep
Naphex: python's not bad. twisted python is perty okay
Naphex: speed
Naphex: but i don't use servlets or other middleware, so there's that.
Naphex: xmj: yes
Naphex: then you got really good tools, and profilers and debuggers
Naphex: xmj: its pretty lean, fast, threading is a dream and NIO is great and fast and easy to implement
Naphex: thats correct ;]
Naphex: xmj: nowadays i usually write standalone java for backends
Naphex: since merchant are going too need merchant reports, invoice listings, button generators, cart generators, apis and plugins to intergrate in popular ecommerce platforms
Naphex: and a lot of clutter in a big app
Naphex: probably but that opens a whole lot of room, for vulnerabilities, bugs, spaghetti code, maintainance problems
Naphex: i think exchange / payment services are too big fields too keep under same app
Naphex: but the merchant services will be a whole differnt app with merchant in mind, and all the features that come with merchant gateways
Naphex: he can
Naphex: so atleast they share same wallet/account
Naphex: well interlink code is needed anyway, for wallet apps and the rest
Naphex: then BTCXPay for payments / BTXChange for trading/exchanging
Naphex: and unifing the wallets so they can interlink
Naphex: i mean we're working on finalizing the payment/merchant gateway as well. but we're building them as separate projects to avoid clutter
Naphex: no i mean just in general, the code the platform etc
Naphex: won't it clutter up with all the merchant features?
Naphex: you're doing merchant services / exchange under the same platform?
Naphex: just change Bitcoin-Central to Paymium on front page, and you're about done :P
Naphex: what's he going crazy about?
Naphex: i'm working on a realtime protobuf interface for trading, with incremental streamed updates and realtime orders.
Naphex: and just sell that mass improved
Naphex: also why would someone just roll another fast interface when they can roll a high performance i/o protobuf one
Naphex: anyway davout did you ever implement FAST and is anyone using it?
Naphex: :)
Naphex: just starting a trend
Naphex: yeah
Naphex: looks like i have some offset
Naphex: yeah man, 11:24
Naphex: :)
Naphex: no worries, every time someone does it a shiba inu dies
Naphex: see? how's that working, cmon i already am voiced ;]
Naphex: !up Naphex
Naphex: interesting how freenode irc servers don't keep mod states, and just resend the +v message every time you hit another /mode cmd
Naphex: yeah
Naphex: !up davout
Naphex: howdy
Naphex: also it is relativly cheap at 0.14eur/click
Naphex: miners will look for miners, etc
Naphex: so easy to engage audience
Naphex: a lot of interest in tutorial videos
Naphex: jurov: no, google placement ads
Naphex: jurov: adwords/analytics for btcxchange.ro
Naphex: i am surprised
Naphex: you guys want to hear something funny, youtube is probably the best place to advertise to engage bitcoin related / seeking audience ;o
Naphex: i want 100 mil of awesome bitcoins tomorrow
Naphex: and too make the market available for bigger guys
Naphex: price needs to rise by bubbling up, to match demand though
Naphex: lol i gotta cheer up
Naphex: oh cool, so you don't already spam your friends about bitcoin?
Naphex: why do they care about your twitter?
Naphex: those like 2 free timely confirmations?
Naphex: wow
Naphex: 5k satoshis
Naphex: did they deliver?
Naphex: https://i.imgur.com/YhddPNq.png a look on yearly average. peaks is attack and wall cliffs are optimizations
Naphex: and will have insanely higher reliability /performance then any cloud delivery
Naphex: the cost of that should be small enough for any decently running bussiness to aford
Naphex: to serve those almighty precious customers
Naphex: it will rape 2 days max of your time and insure you have a stable performant solution
Naphex: while running nicely very fast and not on stressed hardware
Naphex: thats probably enough free space to scale for another 3 years
Naphex: https://imgur.com/a/Kj1oD so this is how a good scaled and tought out solution will look like if you planned stuff early
Naphex: sounds good!
Naphex: in ze cloud
Naphex: if you're working on any app that doesn't need that, host it wherever you like
Naphex: period
Naphex: if you need secure shit, or you want your data secure you don't use VPS
Naphex: its simple
Naphex: is this the whole expensive thinking discussion again?
Naphex: nice.
Naphex: daphna and daphne?
Naphex: soo the sec investigators were named
Naphex: http://www.drivearabia.com/news/2014/06/03/2015-audi-a7-s7-rs-7-revealed-with-minor-facelift-uae-saudi-ksa-qatar-gcc/
Naphex: the new RS7/A7 looks gorgeus
Naphex: hehe
Naphex: well you do live in africa ;]]]
Naphex: reading*
Naphex: was readying the usagi thread
Naphex: or your bash history file, or just listening to your tty
Naphex: too bad they can just grab your walletpassphrase from your code lolol
Naphex: "This" makes me seem totally irresponsible. But here's the deal; we had regular, weekly, off-site backups. Even if someone got a hold of the backups they would be unable to take money out of the wallet without the password. And despite people saying "RAID is not a backup""
Naphex: "give him all your money. maybe the next failure could be due to some rats chewing on the cables ??" i lol'd
Naphex: hehe
Naphex: its probably both
Naphex: lol
Naphex: "Actually I have to admit I am a little suprised at the negativity I'm getting over this, it's as if people automatically assume every failure is intentional."
Naphex: oh someone will
Naphex: 16:07 <+mircea_popescu> xe4l, nobody is going to drop such a valuable exploit on such a shitty thing << you don't burn exploits
Naphex: xe4l: probably hacked em with shitty brute force scans
Naphex: haha
Naphex: so culty
Naphex: LEAN thinking
Naphex: i've seen 16 y/o with access to hacked vps supervisors on pretty big providers
Naphex: VPN*
Naphex: developed using lean mean startup strategy of makeing the website, and hosting the vps on amazon aws
Naphex: with everything you do readable to everyone
Naphex: on cloud hosting
Naphex: import some mexicans
Naphex: is U.S. not producing any more good sysadmins?
Naphex: for your super uber new online bussiness
Naphex: to me this sounds exactly like the markting bull in the oldies, where you buy shitty 12$ hosting
Naphex: the low level shit
Naphex: and bleah hardware
Naphex: and networking
Naphex: like its expensive to think about infrastructure
Naphex: i don't get most of the arguments anyway
Naphex: what have this people been brain washed to do
Naphex: and install em
Naphex: to buy some servers
Naphex: see, now it takes 2 days
Naphex: lean startup strategy == fail startup strategy?
Naphex: that you're doing high level expensive thinking on
Naphex: and run everything elsewhere not thinking about anything except your very nice hot new facebook app
Naphex: don't plan shit
Naphex: so basicly
Naphex: and they will have a big sec status on their servers
Naphex: <+mircea_popescu> Naphex: most of their customers are banks, and all kinds of srsfolk << that made my uvula bleed. when did banks become technologically apt omfg. << Maybe but they can pick good datacenters ;]
Naphex: and if you can't do it, hire someone who can
Naphex: picking hardware to run your shit should be one of the first steps
Naphex: xmj: hey distracted, since when do you do high level apps, and not think about the hardware they are running or the performance you want to get out of it
Naphex: run your shit forever
Naphex: 200eur/month for 32GBram sever, with 32 cores, and some fast storage
Naphex: or just everyone poor?:)
Naphex: i mean whats this thing about costs nowadays
Naphex: host your sendmail on vps1, http vps2, whatever
Naphex: and run them up and down
Naphex: i mean, hey if you want some virtualizing buy 10 servers, host some hypervisor
Naphex: cacacloud
Naphex: caca
Naphex: most of their customers are banks, and all kinds of srsfolk
Naphex: but i still doubt they sell any cloud
Naphex: i told him to shove it
Naphex: my AM tried to sell me some cloud :)
Naphex: nowadays yeah
Naphex: i am very happy with my dc, they have everything <3
Naphex: jurov: yes
Naphex: and recover after that
Naphex: a dc should have proper ddos mitigations, and solutions for ddos/dos. and the worst case scenario they should cut your upstream
Naphex: jurov: i've never heard of threat of explusion from dc, and if you get that just move. louzy dc
Naphex: yes the webdevel generation
Naphex: and meanwhile profiting
Naphex: who just want to run their shit without every thinking about anything
Naphex: too me it just sounds like lazy developers and lazy bussiness owners
Naphex: well thats just washy washy
Naphex: no point in delusioning yourself forever with outsourcing, and clouds, and virtual stuff
Naphex: or just quit or sell it or whatever
Naphex: to maintain your shit
Naphex: and some coders and a designer
Naphex: you better hire a sysadmin
Naphex: i mean, if you're making dough
Naphex: and deprecate/switch some servers
Naphex: i mean replace and ocassional broken drive every year or so
Naphex: xmj: if you pick good hardware and balance rightly there is not that much maintainance
Naphex: so you better make sure if its serious you pick a very good datacenter, with protection and other several high profile customers
Naphex: also you don't want shitty datacenter support running with your hard drives
Naphex: but having datacenters with qualified professinals and an actuall account manger. + guarded access to the datacenter
Naphex: well, don't know how much of a need it is
Naphex: everything is physical, on _owned_ hardware in special datacenters.
Naphex: cold wallets can just be multisig
Naphex: jurov: i have a whole cluster of servers :p secret keys run on encrypted hardware, servers run bare and have several layers of security & apis for it.
Naphex: jurov: what keys?
Naphex: well, it shouldn't be down in the first place
Naphex: http://regmedia.co.uk/2014/06/02/swift_benchmark.jpg i like it how they beat python in it trololol
Naphex: so..
Naphex: "Objective-C without the baggage of C."
Naphex: then snapshot that and use it to clone servers
Naphex: i compile from source on verified sum packages
Naphex: your ram, your encryption, your keys, your storage, your IRQs
Naphex: you can even skip thinking that anything stored there is secure. cause everything is available to the hypervisor and who runs it
Naphex: why would you do anything on a hypervisor you don't control is beyond me.
Naphex recommends using dedicated servers instead of virtual anything.
Naphex: mircea_popescu: yep, 250k/year
Naphex: and managing them so some control commands in there
Naphex: asciilifeform: hmm, lets say data aquisition. grabbing gps data from vehicles
Naphex: asciilifeform: what would be your default language for writing a multi-threaded backend, with lots of sockets and nio?
Naphex: :))
Naphex: and java is the best ;]
Naphex: lol
Naphex: and using fopen('/dev/sttys*') to read serials and sh unix scripts with stty to setup serial ports
Naphex: and had some php scripts running as daemons over sockets to emulate IPC and threads
Naphex: if you're wondering how is that possbile, it ran a browser in full screen on the front-end
Naphex: so don't do that :)
Naphex: but just for lulz, i once saw a embeddec computer for public transportation, written in php :)
Naphex: anyway all languages are just tools, use what fits best with you/your team, your hardware etc
Naphex: asciilifeform: its deffinetly better:D
Naphex: for lets say 3 years, enough that every programmer there is bored shitless
Naphex: but picturing a 8-man dev team working on a project in lisp
Naphex: i don't doubt they exist
Naphex: my huge problem with lisp its readability
Naphex: c'mon now lisp aint that cool
Naphex: but that custom php wallet software, jesus :]
Naphex: mike_c: i doubt ZF had anything to do with mtgox vulns
Naphex: ZF for php was more then decent
Naphex: so tired of coding lately, damn you burnout syndrome!
Naphex: looks like the same systems the use for elections
Naphex: heh
Naphex: yep
Naphex: regarding truecrypt shutdown, most of the posts regarding it have the same comments, in slightly different writeing spanned across most top posts :o
Naphex: but explains some of the canary
Naphex: yeah
Naphex: its probably true,
Naphex: BingoBoingo: how is that confirmed o.O;
Naphex: BingoBoingo: so after 1 month of usage any suggestions/complaints regarding the frontend?
Naphex: pretty*
Naphex: prettu 4k dump
Naphex: correction time already?;D
Naphex: hehe
Naphex: real men use real hosts:D
Naphex: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/254pv8/the_bitcoin_foundation_must_remove_satoshi_as/
Naphex: payments even:P
Naphex: mircea_popescu: probably, because before ranting about it here they couldn't find my paiments :))
Naphex: mircea_popescu: but guess what, emag is delivering my shizz woop:D
Naphex: mircea_popescu: yeah i'll get some time to document it and make some examples.