mircea_popescu: victim is the windowshead.
asciilifeform: victim, rather
asciilifeform: which implies that user keeps the machine plugged in
asciilifeform: in original description of uci, was described as 'cpu cycle by the pound' sort of affair
mircea_popescu: the end game is, your computer was liberated from the crap. your "data" made on your "software". no need for either, grow up.
asciilifeform: any and all of which look for other processes and occasionally snapshot to send back to $mothership - 'perhaps interesting', 'perhaps contains keys'
asciilifeform: winblows box, containing potentially 900 other pieces of shitware
asciilifeform: let's take the typical bot, of which existing nets ( of infected nodes, rather than 'voluntary' p2p ) are made
mircea_popescu: whether server A im talking to i'm talking so it adds 2 and 2 for me, or gives me a new friend, or shoots a missile, is not a part of design consideration.
mircea_popescu: there is no such distinction. gossipd carries all.
asciilifeform: you also want that nobody can affect how the net works by bringing 9000 of his own As to the table.
mircea_popescu: but yes -- the standard here is that at no point will you know (or care!) whether box A is box A or box E.
asciilifeform: in practice, some folx moar often than others.
mircea_popescu: the sad truth is that everyone is subject to key compromise at any time.
mircea_popescu: the solution is that some "people" will accept noobs and some won't. in practice, everyone will run multiple interfaces and thassat.
mircea_popescu: they are not distinguishable at all, what.
mircea_popescu: but -- the fact that A happens to already have a connection to B and therefore B can S for him does not imply or require either A or B be not behind a nat.
asciilifeform: there is a separate problem pertaining to uci, that does not reduce strictly to 'nat problem'
asciilifeform: and ergo net would have to be deployed in massive burst, whereby yesterday there were 0 S, but today 9000.
asciilifeform: my objection is that the star topology does not go away by virtue of being called something else. you have a class of fully-capable nodes, S, that can accept unsolicited pipes; and a much larger class of P ( lessay, peons ), behind NAT, who cannot. ergo stars.
mircea_popescu: and yes the fact that the list of S must be at least a dozen different lists and each a grosse long is why we can't do this arbitrarily early.
asciilifeform: i'll point out that i do not know of a different recipe than mircea_popescu's ( and in fact is same used by 'skype' and various heathens , for many years. )
mircea_popescu: back to it -- once A knows what ip B is at and B knows what ip A is at, they can exchange crafter packets to the point of parlaying it into an established connection. in order to find these, they both rely on their peers. if they have no peers, they don't properly speaking exist, and an angel from above in the shape of a tmsr lord will have to bless them with the spark of life.
asciilifeform: it's the 'insect' solution, gotta mention it for completeness.
mircea_popescu: i hear apple stocks them.
mircea_popescu: also gives the state of the art re mate finding in the greater uslandia. and it's the lulz of all time.
asciilifeform: existing botnets do this -- the familiar port scan and hammer
mircea_popescu: this is neither a solution nor a problem nor something fit for discussion.
mircea_popescu: amusingly i also put it in the log earlioer today. so what of it ?
a111: Logged on 2017-05-23 23:34 mircea_popescu: what fucking fix. they can't open it anymore than they can fuck the woman on the deserted island. "nobody to introduce us!!1"
mircea_popescu: a better world for computers where the rapist-racism of needing someone to introduce you has been resolved is truly not in any way different than the same re people.
mircea_popescu: there's no other way socialisation works than by introduction. this is not a problem. you are welcome to approach it, but you will be wasting your time.
mircea_popescu: what creates massive stars in practice is that the geeks doing this have no peers.
asciilifeform: it is a problem in the same way as it is for trb.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform this is only a problem in the sense of "i have decided to not work today so i can't"
mircea_popescu: ". A aiming to connect to B or vice-versa for any reason is accomplished through : A asks C for an ip for B. C provides A with ip for B and B with notification of A's request (at the least, its ip)." << A sends C a request. C sends A an ip for B and B an ip for A. both B and A start broadcasting at each other fixed packets until the conn is established.
asciilifeform: the problem -- and it IS a problem -- is that cold bootup, for ~any~ node, requires knowing a working S.
mircea_popescu: maybe we need to revisit the introduction part ?
mircea_popescu: and will discover peers and act as a peer beacon for others and so on.
mircea_popescu: as long as at least one of them actually works, the box is now connected. and will stay connected.
mircea_popescu: you put, on the box you own, whatever list of your peers as you deem fit.
asciilifeform: if serf can't get on the actual net, this is not something that can be solved ~for~ him by anyone else
a111: Logged on 2017-07-20 18:50 mircea_popescu: you have nodes N1...Nn all behind a nat. Server S popus up and connects them in pairs such that no Ni is without at least one peer. Server S dies. The whole N1..Nn remains connected forever, notwithstanding how any NjNk connections may die.
mircea_popescu: there is. again in the vanishing hope that may help : http://btcbase.org/log/2017-07-20#1687348
asciilifeform: there is no external cure for aol.
mircea_popescu: again -- stop baking empire into your work. whether positively or negatively.
asciilifeform: 'hole' is the wrong word re how udp holepunch works
mircea_popescu: the whole "will never as long as www" bullshit is just a larger cycle pwnat delusion.
mircea_popescu: nonsense. "the eternal hole" is worse delusion than proper fuckoff.
asciilifeform: ( and other tcp )
mircea_popescu: necessarily. if you grant nat implemented correctly, your problem is exactly that of the british girl on the deserted island. "so how was the sex ?" "i dunno, no star topoloigies!!!"
asciilifeform: there are some invariant 'holes' that will never close so long as the thing has to pass www
mircea_popescu: hey. the world runs on fuckoff since ~forever.
a111: Logged on 2017-07-20 18:50 mircea_popescu: you have nodes N1...Nn all behind a nat. Server S popus up and connects them in pairs such that no Ni is without at least one peer. Server S dies. The whole N1..Nn remains connected forever, notwithstanding how any NjNk connections may die.
mircea_popescu: can "problematize" about it all you want, but when you're done -- the solution is to http://btcbase.org/log/2017-07-20#1687348
mircea_popescu: there's temporary Sn. this is quite literally just how life is.
mircea_popescu: then your problem has no solution.
asciilifeform: there must NOT BE any such thing as 'S'.
asciilifeform: can haz, or not, is a question that can be posed. but to give a solution WITH stars, is neither here nor there.
mircea_popescu: you keep wanting the solution expressed in different terminology and upon delivery promptly proceed to change the terminology.
asciilifeform: but the problem is not solved by pretending it not to exist.
asciilifeform: but if you propose to package it with a hardcoded list of existing peers -- guess what, this is what people traditionally do. they get unplugged, and then whole net is useless.
mircea_popescu: a box you own can connect to the network through the usual process : asks all your peers for peers to connect to.
asciilifeform: ( there are various 'cheats' around this, but all resolve to hardcoded hidey-hole ~somewhere~ that contains where next to connect )
mircea_popescu: anyway -- the way to collect is that you don't have to pay for a S coming up. just like the car using less gasoline -- you do collect.
asciilifeform: there is no way to distribute an infector without hardcoded ips
asciilifeform: understand, nat is the principal weak link in botnet topology.
mircea_popescu: this is ALSO good : breask the ip-box bijectivity, as was intention all along transparently throughout spec docs.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the correct approach to that problem is for all boxes which can not obtain leased ips but only dynamic ips to own two internet connections.\
asciilifeform: there is no way to collect.
mircea_popescu: ie, alt-soilves the bitcoin node problem
asciilifeform: which turns the class of S-capable nodes into stars.
mircea_popescu: you have nodes N1...Nn all behind a nat. Server S popus up and connects them in pairs such that no Ni is without at least one peer. Server S dies. The whole N1..Nn remains connected forever, notwithstanding how any NjNk connections may die.
mircea_popescu: let me rephrase this for your own terminology then.
asciilifeform: and it can't because D has no way to contact the A and B pair .
mircea_popescu: ie, D then asks B, "what about A ?" and B provides ip and notification to A.
mircea_popescu: suppose you have nodes A, B behind a nat. suppose A and B run gossipd, and have been introduced to C. A aiming to connect to B or vice-versa for any reason is accomplished through : A asks C for an ip for B. C provides A with ip for B and B with notification of A's request (at the least, its ip).
asciilifeform: mno. if there is a massive class of boxes that cannot plug directly into each other -- stars.
asciilifeform: so as things presently work, nobody can connect ~to~ them.
mircea_popescu: making everything depend on gossipd present and running is the right thing anyway.
asciilifeform: gossipd dun have the problem
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform here's the thing : we don't actually have the problem of nat traversal. in the following sense : gossipd is not intended to work without introduction. as part of the introduction, the introducer server can provide ips. those can then be used for everything, bitcoind, you name it.
mircea_popescu: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DEZLXpyXcAACS6k.jpg the dood has a pretty decent twitter.
mircea_popescu: shinohai and see if @Fox0x01 wants to come over also. apparently there's chicks into "offensive sec" whatever that is.
asciilifeform: the thing usg mandates on all large machines for export
asciilifeform: betcha they disable that cnc mill also
mircea_popescu: (from the guy's timeline)
mircea_popescu: "Apparently future-dated gps packets disable Stingray phone signal intercept devices. The device thinks its license has expired and locks up." in other lulz
asciilifeform: i have a theory which might, potentially, lead to a pill, will put it here slightly later
mircea_popescu: i suppose this goes on the list of tasks. "find nat hole".
asciilifeform: or any other non-1990s-usgolade protocol.
mircea_popescu: a solution to the problem would actually help trb too
asciilifeform: ( the 'star' does not have to physically pass ~all~ packets between ~all~ leaves, but this is still not actual p2p )
asciilifeform: the only quasi-reliable method ( 'udp hole punch' ), used by , e.g., 'skype', STILL requires a 3rd party non-natted box to broker the connection
a111: Logged on 2017-07-19 16:32 asciilifeform: the real usgtronic gem here is that there's massive existing investment in 'this is a transform of SOME dna sequence, SOMEWHERE, now tell me which' hardware
a111: Logged on 2017-07-20 08:40 jurov: they took djb's joke seriously
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-07-20#1687147 << twasn't a joke, evidently the whole http://btcbase.org/log/2017-07-19#1686643 is right on point.
a111: Logged on 2017-07-20 15:50 asciilifeform: which makes the whole thing quite vulnerable.
a111: Logged on 2017-07-20 15:49 asciilifeform: the need to use un-NATed boxes as proxies, so that NATed boxes can speak with one another, creates star topologies
trinque: right, so usg crumbles, erdrogan or whoever throws a big neo-caliphate party, invites everyone to go israel-stomping. russia and china collectivey "meh" and lol at the US losing a colony
asciilifeform: last i heard, turks dun make own jet either..
trinque: y'know, if they're used to leaning on / suckling from USG, and it crumbles, they might consider leaning on whichever is biggest. turkey?
pete_dushenski: makes sense, but ya, trinque 's q is still open then
asciilifeform: other thing, remote-boobies are difficult with transistor-poor culture.
asciilifeform: merely sold 2-3 generations behind state of the art.
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: su didn't do the remote-disable thing, for exported iron
pete_dushenski: in other rough regions, the usg 'left' is still confuzed as fuck http://archive.is/X9fwz
asciilifeform: trinque: that'd depend on whether 'usg vanishes' includes 'usg remote-disable codes leak'
trinque: was this true in the last such war?
trinque: meanwhile, correct me if wrong, they're all stacked with american military hardware
trinque: what'd happen with the various sunni powers if suddenly usg vanished?
pete_dushenski: mojahed runs winbloze... on phone. or his boss does. or his gf does. or the new recruit does. "coming to a pocket near you" (tm)
pete_dushenski: this is post-nation-state world, cyber-d and a little bit of land is the best you can hope for.
pete_dushenski: for whatever 'cybermilitary' is worth, i'd pit .il against any other
asciilifeform: nobody cancelled the jet.
asciilifeform: ( tried to, but usg offered 'for phreeee' and israelis were dumb enough to bite the hook )
asciilifeform: afaik they still dun have a, e.g., self-made fighter jet.
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: ya, reaching for sure. the point upstack was that paying sticker for pharma helps arm .il to the gills more than it helps usg maintain international kommonity relevance and that the former will outlast the latter
pete_dushenski: just because you're eating the liver, doesn't mean you won't find another source of food when it's gone or as soon as the aging father finally croaks. but this is a stretch analogy.
asciilifeform: the anglos ultra-specialized in the 'divide and conquer' thing, it is burned into their firmware somehow.
asciilifeform: ' our cow died but hey, we can burn the neighbour's barn '
a111: Logged on 2016-08-01 00:44 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-01#1511937 << oh, "color revolutions" dun work ? tell you what, we'll steal your country's exports and with the proceeds finance an alt-country we'll pretend is realy your country. ha-ha!
pete_dushenski: reich doesn't need challenging anymore, does it. looks like it's pretty well occupied with the enemy within.
asciilifeform: why to do this -- originally was simply to preserve british empire. later, to keep the fire burning, so that nothing fit to challenge the reich is born from the ash.
asciilifeform: ( usg uses the 'crack whore' business model with the israelis. send payola, but also keep'em from actually solving - via proper genocide + conquest of moar desirable real estate -- the problem that requires the infinite payola to begin with )
pete_dushenski: then again the alternative to public yeshiva is 'lurker' than somehow, someway never seems to mature into full blown adulthood.
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: and ? what does this prove other than that girl playing house knocks on wall of cardboard box before entering ?
a111: Logged on 2017-07-08 03:18 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-07-08#1680532 << at one time we had a fella ( pete_dushenski ? ) embark on a 'major life and times of the l0g' thing. what became of this ?
pete_dushenski: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-07-08#1680613 << i undertook 'yeshiva' which didn't explicitly involve log highlighting and dissection even if it sometimes turned out that way. i should actually make a separate category on the ol' blog for #t logs levitan'd
pete_dushenski: you think anyone takes usg's ip racket seriously anymore ? this isn't then 1960s
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: modern-day .il is a parasitic rider on usg -- and not merely in the well-known 'free money' sense, but also in that the ~only exports are 'intellectual property' racket, which rides on usg's patent enforcement shakedown
pete_dushenski: lol gotta love that bitbet is back... o brother what a gongshow.
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: i'm more inclined to liken the 'new' .il to that of 'new' china : sucks up resources of imploding empire for as long as the going is good all while increasing self-sustainability and military capability. israel might be socialist but they're nowhere near as soft-bodied as the decaying west. closer to .su-.cn hybrid than .su-.us hybrid.
pete_dushenski: or maybe translation is a project for otherwise loose cannons (eg. adlai )
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: currently hitting language barrier tho, gotta strengthen my .il-foo
pete_dushenski: not totally sure i buy the thesis but i can see where it comes from. at the very least current-day .co.il has 'chechens' to actively oppress, unlike us which just beats the piss out of itself.
asciilifeform: ( who first 'peace with british', despite the british being the folx nailing the door of nazi europe shut; afterwards -- 'peace with arab' )
asciilifeform: picture, the original was something vaguely tmsr-flavoured. replaced -- with the familiar socialists and misc. quislings
a111: Logged on 2017-06-13 14:57 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform very funny that jew thing you dug out. literally, the ENTIRE argument is "hey, let us scam you, because that's what goverments do, and if the goyim see us scamming you they'll believe w r government".
a111: Logged on 2017-06-12 23:16 asciilifeform: ^ 'altalena affair' resulted in the switcheroo where the upstanding folx ( irgun et al, who held the position 'rm -rf britain' , were replaced by the internationalkomyooniti obedient muppet circus who ended up 'recognized' by said komyooniti as 'israel'
a111: Logged on 2015-09-09 22:08 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: 'hagana' et al set the gold standard for blowing up brits, aha
asciilifeform: unrelatedly, i noticed pete_dushenski had a piece re israel -- were you awake for the hagana thread ?
pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo: blackzilla is enjoying the seasonal weather more than i'm enjoying the seasonal smoke. being downwind of the massive bc fires isn't doing wonders for the ol' respiratory tract. (waking up coughing, etc.) . needless to say i've a newfound appreciation for the sorry denizens of chinese mega-cities. it's one of those "you never know what you've got until it's gone" (tm) things
asciilifeform: which makes the whole thing quite vulnerable.
asciilifeform: the need to use un-NATed boxes as proxies, so that NATed boxes can speak with one another, creates star topologies
asciilifeform: ( for n00bz : NAT is why there was never a fully 'p2p' w4r3ztron )
a111: Logged on 2017-07-19 21:30 asciilifeform: in other olds, filed under ucilogy, http://samy.pl/pwnat
asciilifeform is mildly surprised that there isn't, as of yet, such a thing
jurov: systemd on boot doing GET requests there in 3..2..1
jurov: they took djb's joke seriously
mircea_popescu: and in other best looks, http://68.media.tumblr.com/f87af7e55bf9a8ccd4e784ac79f38a38/tumblr_n6i7j3LGrJ1stzc8to1_1280.jpg
mircea_popescu: "html trier-and-errorer" doesn't have the same ring to it.
mircea_popescu: people today have very litle mental adherence to that ancient "nothing's heavier than earth" thing. kinda why making chicks mudfight is good for their brainbox.
mircea_popescu: it was a great accomplishment for a bunch of people who had a very direct experience of the hardness of soil, worked with hand-made tools pulled by sick horses and pregnant wives -- and i mean this literally.
trinque: "yes corn, BUT THEN!"
mircea_popescu: twasn't, per se, "gotta have... corn! as far as the eye can see" in any way or in any sense other than the 1950s romanians being impressed with the ro commies "a LINE OF TRACTORS! 100 deep!!!"
trinque: just make the HTML coders all grow their own damn food, keep them occupied. not as "envirowhiner" but "hands full, own life in them"
mircea_popescu: trinque the picture of sad yet resplendent idiocy over time comes into much better focus if one comes to term with the saddest fact of all : at every juncture and throughout, everyone really meant well.
trinque: gotta have... corn! as far as the eye can see
mircea_popescu: "I'm now an HTML coder at a startup in San Francisco. The “World Wide Web” has enabled me to crawl out of my debt-hole and bootstrap myself into the lower middle class. For the first time in my adult life, I can afford to <b>eat</b> in restaurants where I don't<b> work.</b" << if anyone's curious or keeping score, THIS is what impels all the dizzy dorks of today. their very own VHS tapes, if you will.
trinque: guess I'm wrong about the proportions of ddt use re: ag. I have counted mass-production of The American Dream among the place's sins.
mircea_popescu: (at the time, soviet industry more or less indian industry today)
mircea_popescu: cheap to make, pretty much everyone with a chem plant made some. which is how the soviets ended up using it.
BingoBoingo: US was definitely big user though, river valleys in Mid west all malarial north to Chicago until the chemming
mircea_popescu: "and this is how my grandfather built brighton"
mircea_popescu: anyway. i'll rack the "us--major player in ddt history" up there with "apple could buy russia" and all other self-referential wank.
mircea_popescu: but ftr -- first that banned it was hungary ; and generally the warsaw pact. not teh us.
mircea_popescu: arguably won a few battles in south pacific theatre.
mircea_popescu: trinque ironically, most of what ended up in the ocean was dumoped there by us army trying to replicate successful european usage.
mircea_popescu: (and ftr, the usians had been whining about it just about since ww2. rando with a "book" on the topic is about as relevant as pink.)
trinque: was being used in agriculture, which I'd wager is where most of the bulk of what ended up in the ocean originated
mircea_popescu: ddt is entirely euro item. invented by swiss, used to clear europe of eg malaria. euros changed their mind in the 60s
trinque: the whole thing is based upon "mass produced idiot should be fed, gonna have to mass produce whatever 3 crops and feed them their derpmeal"
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: usa was at its economic peak ; usa banned -- others copy.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: And exposed to oxygen and sunlight they survive how long? Proximity to factory would be bigger concern than proximity to deployment.
mircea_popescu: is the next proposition going to be "michael moore matters" ?
trinque: should stop the mass production of food instead : solved.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform afaik the thing was, much like "clean engine exhaust", entirely euro-nonsense.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: they are 'available' in whole usa, stuck to fruits, vegetables, sprayed into lawns etc
asciilifeform: the stopping had far moar to do with ustard pro concerntrolls than toxicology.
trinque: one thing in common is that nobody involved had any idea what they were doing
trinque: they're all going in; what's this "the one thing they don't want you to know about dead fish"
BingoBoingo: Scarcity of oceanic edibles is likely still more synthetic girly hormones getting pissed out unmetabolized and Seaciety suffering pantsuit
mircea_popescu: and i'm not discussing other items. the thesis was this one, not "this one compared to arbitrary others"
asciilifeform: fukushima does 0 on the timescale a fish lives on.
mircea_popescu: well, we ate them, we fukushima'd them, for a while we also ddt'd them. we still plastic slush them, it's a large ocean.
asciilifeform: or that it had anything to do with the scarcity of oceanic edibles ( we -- ate them )
mod6: i suppose the only non-toxic way to get rid of the nearby mosquitoes is to buy up all the surrounding properties and then take a flame thrower to the lawns.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> i'd much rather eat it, than anything sold nao << Any more the only things labeled for indoor use are permethrins
mircea_popescu: the other half of it being that it is very toxic to fish ; back then people still had this strange notion that oceans will continue populated in the indefinite future.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> no. i recall the faggots, not yet VERY overweight, going to the things that meanwhile got captured by apple, much like coca-cola captured xmas << In elementry school historical context for the then present was established to be "on the verge of paradise, if only we stop littering"
mircea_popescu: anyway. the problem with ddt was bioaccumulation. it was the original spark for a lot of the current understanding of "why it is bad to eat agroindustrial shit". ddt is weakly toxic, but it and metabolites accumulate, get stored in fat, etcetera.
mod6: <+asciilifeform> removal of ddt was one of the original triumphs of rampant envirowhinery. << "it softens up the eagle eggs!!1"
mircea_popescu: aaaahahahaha o brother. "postmodern film/video theory & crit with an emphasis on phenomenology" ? reheheheally.
asciilifeform: 'wasps? no prob, open the airlock a bit'
asciilifeform: i'm almost surprised they don't assume orbit
mircea_popescu: anyway. straight alcohol, like the 99 proof stuff for making at home liqueur. fire hazard, but otherwise repellent and killer of bugs.
asciilifeform: had one of these here
mircea_popescu: with the wasps laid out after
mircea_popescu: if its a paper wasp colony, destroing the nest is usually enough.
mircea_popescu: depenmds what you replace it with. the only time i actually used something, i boiled tobacco.
asciilifeform: just as the replacement freons. because it wasn't about toxicity.
asciilifeform: fact : the replacements moar poisonous to mammal.
ben_vulpes: much less the nursery lol, i am old and nigh to my grave and so spray liberally about myself. but the wee ones? i'm nottabout to pump the kid full of chemicals when i go so far the fuck out of my way to keep them out of his life in the first place.
asciilifeform: removal of ddt was one of the original triumphs of rampant envirowhinery.
shinohai: Otherwise USG wouldn't be payong benefits to all these peeps that developed cancer from Agent Orange in Vietnam
mircea_popescu: this is alltogether dubious.
asciilifeform: i'd much rather eat it, than anything sold nao
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: makes my lips numb, i don't really want it in the house.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i wouldn't put it in the house.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i thought the notion was, 'yes you can marry but not marry-without-having-been-whore'
ben_vulpes: in other woman stories, the wasps chewed a hole through the ceiling into the nursery last night
mircea_popescu: you know all tjhe pretense of superiority of "honest" women always amused me. their pretense goes, that they could whore at any time, opt not to. in reality, whores could marry at any time, opt not to.
mircea_popescu: prostitution wasn't on the table. more like marriage.\
mircea_popescu: anyway, they never specify because they never give a shit. you're generally supposed to have a new book you're trying to promote or such.
asciilifeform: for one thing, ~all of the other ads, are for witchcraft ( magical dream enhancement pills etc )
asciilifeform: 1989 issue, p.25, ad: 'Cray on a chip. ... The computing power of a Cray supercomputer will be accessible to PC owners by the end of this year thanks to the Intel i860 Megaprocessor. ...'
a111: Logged on 2017-07-19 23:06 phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-07-07#1680305 << by the way the first three issues of mondo are on archive.org https://archive.org/details/Mondo.2000.Issue.01.1989, https://archive.org/details/Mondo.2000.Issue.02.1990 and https://archive.org/details/Mondo.2000.Issue.03.1991
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-07-19#1686933 << when phf first described subj, asciilifeform thought 'what if i saw it then, would it have made sense, appealed?' but now i know -- no
asciilifeform: reagan et al planned for exactly what they got : an extra ~three decades of Moar Time from the reaper
asciilifeform: ( they may have hallucinations of future but that's about it )
mircea_popescu: i very much doubt anyone at any level had any plans besides "paradise begins once we outlive the soviets"
asciilifeform: the feast indeed was in the works. but the dishes not quite what the feasters imagine, no.
mircea_popescu: anyway. they DID have this glare in eye liek exactly as described. as if they believed celestial mom and dad are preparing the feasrt for them, and they best but fidgetingly wait.