phf: asciilifeform: that would be the case with trinque's bot too
asciilifeform: in other non-news, ben_vulpes yer ircbot thing dun work with znc. for the obvious reason of containing magicstring-expectation liquishit.
phf: but then i can also understand the whole "back in my day" sentiment. common lisp certainly lets you write ~very sloppy~ code and get away with it :>
phf: i had that experience when i tried implementing an older spec of gossipd. i wrote it in C, actually CWEB, but i wasn't doing literate programming right, and after a while the whole thing became overwhelming.
esthlos: *caps the complexity
esthlos: elegant C exists, but the limits of the language the complexity it can handle without exploding into incomprehensibility.
phf: i mean, if you read norvig's python snippets you can clearly see they are written by a very experienced lispers. you literally never see python like that in the wild, but yet there it is.
esthlos: it seems specifically designed to reduce the intelligence of the programmer to what a manager can understand
phf: that would be a very gruesome science fiction narrative, if that was actually the case. a kind of strugatsky's roadside picnic :>
phf: please do, it would be useful as a reference, but also for me specifically: btcbase.org/patch is written in common lisp, but it can only eat vpatches, not spit them out, so a mcilroy would be a solid addition
phf: this follows ascii's pattern of trying to bend existing tools to our needs, before we know enough to do a greenfield rewrite. there's a lot of ideas floating around what v is supposed to do. a clean rewrite of mcilroy could serve as a basis for further work, but you should perhaps follow discussion in the logs on the subject to get the full scope of the problem
phf: what you have on top of original paper is unified diff format and the handling of multiple files in a single patch. (that's where you run into the bulk of extra code; things like sorting directory is simply unpleasant to do in C)
phf: what i'm trying to do is not so much a rewrite, as first an ascii style cut of relevant bits, to preserve backwards compatability with current patches, and then augmentation to support various operations that were discussed in logs, that are more about file management than they are about diffing
phf: well, the context of what i'm trying to do is in the logs. specifically mcilroy diffing implementation is not necessarily the problem (relevant bits of gnudiff are reducable to maybe 500-1000 loc)
esthlos: phf: vaguely, that the code maps to the actual problem with no extraneous complexity, in an easily readable way
ben_vulpes: they're not all there, as that's the directory they get dumped into after mimisbrunnr is asked for them the first time
phf: original figure, i believe was wc -l on everything, i refined the loc mesasure
esthlos: fwiw I read McIlroy's paper and would be willing to implement it _transparently_, if there's interest
phf: i took a little break to put it into CWEB so i can print it and read it (cutting process was mostly mechanic, so now i need to actually grok some of the things it does), but that turned out to be a pita
asciilifeform: i.e. 'We have now the sha512 checksums of all blocks loaded by yours truly from mircea_popescu's machine on June 28 - 29, 2015. This is posted here as a permanent record in light of a certain conversation [2] concerning possible shitgnomatic shenanigans.'
asciilifeform: here they are.
a111: Logged on 2015-06-28 19:14 mircea_popescu: the entire idea of what we are building here is NODE HIERARCHY.
asciilifeform: ( in re checkpoints, pertinent thread, http://btcbase.org/log/2015-06-28#1180510 and i was quite certain that some time then i posted hashes... )
asciilifeform: (not the desired piece tho, yet...)
asciilifeform: iirc it is his younger brother who is a major-league pantsuitist nao
mircea_popescu: where the fuck is that piece commenting on how soviet citizens all sooner or later wake up to the disney quality of their state ?
mircea_popescu: let us rescue some piece into the logs : ugh
asciilifeform: oh hah, while digging, found https://archive.is/gB5hg << >> http://btcbase.org/log/2015-05-07#1123345 , entirely-unrelated archaeological item that somebody-or-other had asked for some time this year...
mircea_popescu: o shit there it is, navrozov moment!
asciilifeform: incidentally at one time asciilifeform made and signed a block hash manifest. but cannot find in the logz...
asciilifeform: and let there be such a thing as , e.g., viral-payload-node-that-still-gets-correct-blox-but-dun-need-to-carry-200GB
asciilifeform: right but really oughta formalize it, rather than ad-hoc
a111: Logged on 2017-12-29 00:36 asciilifeform: ( because they don't be sitting for 30sec to 6min per block grunting ecdsa )
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-29#1760097 << if doing that, correct thing is to justr copy over the official-chain
asciilifeform: imho this is aesthetically displeasing but inevitable, eventually it'll be this or copying disks, sync-from-empty-space will be impractical in human timeframe
asciilifeform: theoretically could even have a 'actually do the full-bore-verifications in background AFTER sync' knob.
asciilifeform: ( because they don't be sitting for 30sec to 6min per block grunting ecdsa )
asciilifeform: nao, if we reintroduce checkpoints ( SANE checkpoints : i.e. keccak-of-whole-block-bitwise, rather than merkleism and sha2; and pgp-signed config eaten at boot ) we can have nodes that sync from empty hdd to full in <1day ...
asciilifeform: in other noose, zoolag has 21 peers, and has been at the bleeding tip of the spear continuously ( at least through the lens of asciilifeform's hand-cranked observatory gear) since getting there.
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 22:11 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759720 << nah, apeloyee character also from there iirc.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759889 << i had this notion that he happened by reading the l0gz, not asciilifeform's www. but could be wrong.
asciilifeform: ( in particular the orphanages amputations. good chunk of bandwidth is TO THIS. DAY. wasted , by prbtrons throwing their liquishit at trbtron )
asciilifeform: and a not-insignificant chunk of the work one sees in http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=stable , had to happen on account of 'and we still have to talk to prb somehow...'
asciilifeform: the intrinsic difficulty of a trbtron's job is more or less 100% in dealing-with-prb.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759898 << in a sane gossiptron, nobody'd be keeping bastard blocks around to begin with, and the problem would not even be formulatable, 'what do you mean, out of order, everybody's got an ordered array of blocks, some people simply longer one than others, let's all visit'em'
asciilifeform: they dunneed to.
asciilifeform: but will point out that most mathematical works do not reprint r&w's 1+1 ...
mircea_popescu: one item is stated ; the other item is not stated. does this belie anything about the relative situations of beliefs ?
mircea_popescu: you understand statement is the first process in the dissolution of taboo and the de-fanging of belief ?
asciilifeform: sorta how when asciilifeform switches on his console in the morning, he does not think 'but what will cockroaches think'
mircea_popescu: you evidently did not do the same ?
mircea_popescu: how come the arcane "you're missing the includes" need not be mentioned in one piece but was mentioned in the other and this gives you no pause in the "that's how i'd have done" ?
asciilifeform: this Мы has that brotherhood-of-civilized-men baked into it.
asciilifeform: i did not , then, have pygmy readers.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how come your above item fails to point out the obvious, "he was dedicated to the supremacy of white man, and his enslavement of the entire world and nature itself to his own tastes and inclinations" ?
asciilifeform: ^ even includes link to another Troo Sov. 'Did Not Sell Soap But Starved While Making Worthwhile Things' (tm) d00d
mircea_popescu: it should perhaps be pointed out that while things like grocery lists, love letters, blog articles, ransom notes at all one might "should" write, it is the obituary which stands alone among all the literary forms as the only piece man must, eventually but absolutely MUST write.
asciilifeform: let's revise, 'i'd've like to have written the same.'
mircea_popescu: am i actually the only one to have written any obituaries, incidentally ?
mircea_popescu: it's one thing to say "if i were writing it i'd have written the same" when you wrote a few and considered how you'd write even more. but on the nude... ?
mircea_popescu: but you spoke like one who had considered the matter of writing obits quite well ?!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so then there's no substance to your disagreement, nor is the reading martian after all ?!
mircea_popescu: god knows nobody has YET written a piece for the usg faux news outlets that survived braindamaging at time of packaging (and some truly eminent examples documented by various parties)
asciilifeform: and like in any other, for that matter, country.
mircea_popescu: the other direct avenue, of course, is to say "text was a lot better as author submitted it, before forbes"ru" chiseled it into visible shape". which for all i know might even be true,
phf: but there's a point there, which is not necessarily about the man, but about the author. the selling forbes part, which i think is true. bulk of su intelligentsia went full "progressive" after the collapse
asciilifeform: i suspect that mircea_popescu lacks the '#includes'
mircea_popescu: what, fellow could not have used his language to say what he meant, i am to reconstruct the dinosaur out of half tooth ?
mircea_popescu: as i said, i can see this reading ; but it is entirely not what the text says.
asciilifeform: the argument , in asciilifeform's reading, is that bardin was a Troo Man Of Science (tm)(r) , liek the fella who starved in the seed collection in sieged leningrad. i.e. instead of going to sell soap and getrichquick(tm) in 'cooperatives', blackmarketeering, misc. adventurism, d00d sat and built up usenet node in su. collected unix src into a working whole, and did not try to gatekeeper. etc
mircea_popescu: nevertheless! the "genuine similarity" as one might in sufficient analysis passes unearth, is spurious when compared to the evident construction and its evident goals.
mircea_popescu: at the very least because, obviously, no two things man-made can be entirely disjunct thereby.
mircea_popescu: "in the absolute ideals spehre" or however formulated
mircea_popescu: the argument is not that usian socialism is utterly and entirely disjunct from soviet socialism
asciilifeform: possibly the 'Всем.' will make moarsense in light of the sov mythos where, e.g., pygmies in the jungle still in the end will win from newton publishing 'principia', because one day They Too will want to learn mechanics and build railways and so forth.
mircea_popescu: the story would work just as well but better with the coffee/tea switched, but i did it this way in memory of the master nikolay pushkin.
mircea_popescu: at the inspector's puzzled query, asciilifeform responded "it's clear he meant tea rather than coffee by that request".
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform was once director of insane asylum. moscow inspectors came to examine ivan bonapartii napoleonovich, a celebrated nutcase. ivan said "einstein is a jew, because his theories privilege the speed of light in preference of other speeds that are much more important to us" and asciilifeform brought ivan a cup of tea.
mircea_popescu: yes, but this is directly contradicting the words.
mircea_popescu: he created a partition over the statal space, and choose some bits.
mircea_popescu: ie, the illiterate 20something reader will read something else.
mircea_popescu: (note that i ~can~ both follow and support the reading of the man's words that'd permit you to say "Yes" ; however it'd be very much a sopirla, and well distant from what "plain reading" delivers.)
a111: Logged on 2017-12-24 16:11 asciilifeform: kurchatov, supposedly, sat and thought, and few minutes later answered, 'perhaps from philosophical pov this'd be consistent. but then we will have to forget about obtaining the bomb.'
mircea_popescu: phf by the time you write obituaries "istos plausus, cum popularibus civibus tribuerentur", you have already done the deed, and now work for forbes.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there is no actual connection between your map and the territory. it's dust on yer lens.
mircea_popescu: no child left behind was the soviet ideal ? really ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the ideal of the soviet man of science is that until such a time as every last soviet citizen can follow brin the elder, no brin the elder should speak ?
phf: i suspect this dude doesn't have any kind of apropriate venue to publish an obituary that he expects to be read by a lot of people. that's sort of the point of obituary, is to get any random reddit man to scratch his head
asciilifeform: it's not an ideal of the office plankton, of the обыватель ( ~burgher ) mushmind, no. it is ideal of the man of science.
mircea_popescu: it's what we expect to see, isn't it ? usg is specifically the empire of "there's a difference between what is and what you want to see, and we live out of selling that"
asciilifeform: like the dervish.
phf: there's soviets that read "ponedelnik nachinayetsa..." and took it to heart, they proped up the rest of the charade. that's the ideal soviet man, that products of intelligentsia parents like ascii or myself talk about. it is obviously a chimera, but it still has a mythical value
mircea_popescu: man at shop where they don't hjave meat said, "well, if there's not enough meat for the whole queue, i take no meat" ?
mircea_popescu: well then, explain this to me.
asciilifeform: the point is apparently that the paragraph where item falls down for mircea_popescu , is where it... stands up for asciilifeform
mircea_popescu: the point is really, "soviet man didn't know how to support a group" ?
mircea_popescu: but the point is not that.
asciilifeform: and i unzip and piss on the other type of man. the ones who tried to alchemize and monopolize the unix src, described in $article.
mircea_popescu: eg, the salted leg in moscow jumps!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i seem to think parts of dead frog behave more convincingly than other parts.
mircea_popescu: and the piece is OF a respectable man, but not by a respectable man, though the quality of the masquerade is indeed high.
mircea_popescu: and the dollar is "quoted" in rubles to propose that anyone would ever want to buy some.
asciilifeform: if it's a usg.op, it's to prop up the rest of the forbes liquishit with this eminently respectable piece.
mircea_popescu: forbes ru exists to lend credence to the empty notion that forbes is a thing, which is no different from the proposition best-bitcoin-mining-trading-info-near-you-australia.s3.amazonaws.com is a thing.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how do you read "it seems to me, that he did not know how to do things that would be of use to him personally, or some particular group. everyone. or nobody. we all once were like this. us. people from a destroyed country" other than a) a retcon of history (soviet man EMINENTLY was never like this,. but like the opposite of this) and b) "please please please let there be no republc please" rendered in prolix sty
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 22:34 mircea_popescu: especially fabuous as the "you may also be interested in" bullshit is liek "virtualnoe bezdele rabotodateli rasplachivayutsya za internet SERFING" under "karera i svoy biznes". AS FUCKING IF!
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759922 << and yes it's plastered in spamola. confession : until today asciilifeform did not know there WAS a ru forbes
mircea_popescu: they attained no closure, yet can't go.
asciilifeform: i still dungetit, is there hoap
asciilifeform: what's in it for the rezidentura
asciilifeform: ok, ate the log, but puzzled
mircea_popescu waves at the moscow usg residentura.
asciilifeform: 'perhaps, to the end of his days, valeriy bardin remained a soviet man -- it seems to me, that he did not know how to do things that would be of use to him personally, or some particular group. everyone. or nobody. we all once were like this. us. people from a destroyed country. and, perhaps, will be again. perhaps this was specifically the thing which was worth learning from valeriy bardin. when he was still there.'
asciilifeform: ecipients to that of the donor's. and if england and france will put this money to use to demolish bridges and bread down roads, then we of course will pay. england and france thought about it, and their dispute with russia died down.'
asciilifeform: 'russia [at eu unix user group] was invited to pay a membership due in proportion to its network size. it turned out that russia (remember, '90s, nobody's got any kind of moneys whatsoever) must pay more than england, france, and germany put together. bardin took the stage and proclaimed that he is ready to pay, but only if the money will be used in accordance with the organization's charter -- to bring the development level of the r
mircea_popescu: as if there's fucking options at their level. "oh, i am destitute but have options!!1"
mircea_popescu: lol all the self important "i'll read something else". really bitch ? what will you read, trilema ?
mircea_popescu: "the computing centers, tired of routine, seized the novelty" holy crap. moscow station last functional usg item, defo.
mircea_popescu: especially fabuous as the "you may also be interested in" bullshit is liek "virtualnoe bezdele rabotodateli rasplachivayutsya za internet SERFING" under "karera i svoy biznes". AS FUCKING IF!
mircea_popescu: im going to make this the permanent reference endpoint to that entire story of how sane language protects the speaker from idiocy as a passive aura.
mircea_popescu: putting the usd and euro "values" as if they existed or mattered up top is one thing. but this, thbis is liek moar skill and ability than seen from usg in 20 years.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759874 << whoa check out how deep the forbes subversion goes, they actually hired one who knows enough of ru society to "fall upon his house".
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron idiots gotta idiot, they're not fucking dedicated to ANYTHING like they';re dedicated to the maintenance and perpetuation of the empire of idiocy.
mircea_popescu: i am personally insulted by all the useless fuckwits with patreon profiles because unlike the useless fuckwits a la say rms, they MOVED THERE AFTER THE REPUBLIC.
mircea_popescu: motherfucking patreon
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 18:17 asciilifeform: keep the 1:1 eaten:shat rule for bots
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759827 << the rule is "one line response" and yes
a111: Logged on 2013-02-10 04:08 benkay: i'm waiting for the developing world to figure it out
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 16:58 asciilifeform: the rest, variously, went mad
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759720 << nah, apeloyee character also from there iirc.
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 16:56 phf: it was literally the case of "milord, i made this basket from only finest of twigs, for your misses. ... bless you, milord"
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 03:31 shinohai: http://archive.is/vAfjT <<< now THIS is the lulziest thing, to me, of the entire week.
phf: ah, the fix copy thing!
diana_coman: I've updated the reference shelf phf, maybe you are missing the previous patch? http://www.dianacoman.com/reference-code-shelf/
phf: so the weird graph indicates that some hunks are missing antecedents, in this case at least test_mpi.c is claiming a previous version that's not in btcbase
diana_coman: is that the trouble?
diana_coman: it does modify a lot of things so it's seen as having antecedents ch1, ch2 and the mpi-fix iirc
diana_coman: I just noticed the weird graph; any idea what?
phf: diana_coman: i think there might be an issue with your ch3
asciilifeform: ( i suspect an attempted overflow exploit, against something-or-other )
asciilifeform: ^ if anybody knows what kind of prb generates these, and for what, plox to write in.
asciilifeform: in other oddities: 'EXCEPTION: St12out_of_range \nCInv::GetCommand() : type=1073741825 unknown type \nbitcoin in ProcessMessage() \n'
asciilifeform: 'shakespeare or some other man by that name'
ben_vulpes: "Few things here appear to be more rare or valuable than persons capable and willing to deploy humiliation, particularly the necessary educational sort." << word
phf: missing "atever, bucnha them"
a111: Logged on 2017-12-25 19:00 mircea_popescu: anyway, for the record and in case it isn't entirely self-evident on the basis of http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-25#1758486 : whenever some self-proclaimed "sovereign" of the fiat sort tries to say "hey, we have a law", the correct response is to a) point out to that self-proclaimed faux sovereign that there exist other just as valid because just as self-proclaimed faux sovereigns (the eu, russia, china, whatever, bucnha them
phf: but the main reason is that i realized that cl-irc probably doesn't properly split lines, which needs to be solved
phf: i think deedbot spits two entries sometimes with the wallet functionality
asciilifeform: keep the 1:1 eaten:shat rule for bots
mod6: http://thebitcoin.foundation/trusted-nodes.html << updated with zoolag
asciilifeform: meanwhile zoolag, a machine the size of a man's fist, not only has 0 problem keeping up with tip of spear, but slightly pacing ahead of, e.g., bci & co
shinohai: if i am curious to know what height the btrash is at, etc
shinohai: saves me from having to run the trash myself, im poor!
asciilifeform: 'When AirPlaying from each of them, however, Netflix would throw “Error 30103″ every goddam time' << ahahaha
asciilifeform: 'The Apple TV was connected to a Bose CineMate soundbar via Optical Audio connection but the Bose system was in indeterminable working condition. For reasons beyond the pale of explanation or sanity, the Bose system didn’t have any physical buttons on it. Not for power, not for volume, not for anything.' << lol!!
asciilifeform: ^ next: the little pe that saved christmas
deedbot: http://www.contravex.com/2017/12/28/the-little-elf-that-saved-christmas/ << Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski - The little Elf that saved Christmas.
asciilifeform: in mostly but not wholly-unrelated noose, asciilifeform searched the market for little lcd thing one could plug into usb jack, to have trbtron display height at all times while it sits on the shelf. but TO THIS DAY none exist that cost less than THE FUCKING MACHINE lol
asciilifeform: 99.99999%+ of what gets 'pushed' to a trb node, is thrown straight into the rubbish
asciilifeform: the bulldog-rhinoceros hybrid of having both pushes and pulls, is quite nonsensical
mod6: Sure, what's the IP nowadays?
asciilifeform: ACHTUNG, PANZERS! zoolag -- seems to be at tip of the chain.
asciilifeform: mod6: when i think about shitoshi's idiocy that 'aggression' replaces, i froth with rage. the sheer stink of winblowzism, 'let's all run nodes for 2h a day after booting winblowz to play whorecraft-III, boot time is sooospeshul'
mod6: im at ~500351 -- getting close to full-sync. hoping to get it there so can have mine on the republican list. will let you know how it goes with 'aggression'
a111: 2013-02-10 <benkay> i'm waiting for the developing world to figure it out
asciilifeform currently puzzling over 'motherfuckers, e.g. deedbot is 501444-high, why is it physically possible for zoolag to have open connection to it and yet sit at 501436 for 20+ min'
a111: to fix the UNENDING STREAM of precious bull run
asciilifeform: lessee if he digs up the link when he wakes up
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: Which legendary piece of hanbot's? There were many.
asciilifeform: the rest, variously, went mad
asciilifeform: afaik phf is currently the all-star champ from that group
asciilifeform possibly was the only 1 who skipped tardstalk entirely
phf: it was literally the case of "milord, i made this basket from only finest of twigs, for your misses. ... bless you, milord"
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes was here before asciilifeform , i think, and in the era prior to proper logging, so i have nfi where he came from
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 13:28 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-27#1758896 << i have this vague memory that both phf and trinque were originally introduced in this sense by ben_vulpes ; whereas you were introduced similarily by hanbot. by comparison the pantsuit "evidently correct & only method" of herdemocracy has produced a whole lot of indiancandies and other self-choice delusionists.
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759407 << phf pasted me some emacs erc (irc client) auth scriptage way back in the gribble days which got him a rating, and trinque and i'd been drinking together in meatland, and hanging in previously a mentioned pantsuit hellhole irc channel and ricocheted off #b-a a few times (at my insistence iirc) before it stuck
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Typed on exhausted brain. Breaking down the language barrier, exhausting.
asciilifeform: comb the thing yerself BingoBoingo , this one was typed on ipad or wat.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: it piqued by the >> is piqued ?
deedbot: http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2017/12/28/three-week-in-montevideo-superpowers-and-handicaps-of-the-extranjero-engaged-in-long-term-hostel-living/ << Bingo Blog - Three Week In Montevideo: Superpowers and Handicaps of The Extranjero Engaged in Long Term Hostel Living
mircea_popescu: "tense" being nonsense in the first place. time + aspect, learn grammar properly if at all.
BingoBoingo: It is like when I get surprised with yet another species of past tense
asciilifeform: afaik german is the only living lang close-enuff to stand a chance of working like this with eng
mircea_popescu: you know how many alt-mps the empire has summoned up as if it does something ?
mircea_popescu: there is no difference between a patch unsigned and another patch unsigned, much like there's no difference between a nobody "gerald davis" and the exact same nobody "gerard david"
mircea_popescu: im not sure this is a problem. people use crapple os, an unsupported chain off the main v trunk as it is.
asciilifeform: recall the cousin-fucking thread.
mircea_popescu: software'd better not be immutable either, lest we're stuck with c.
asciilifeform: which has currently a birth defect hole in it, the classical blockchain is not properly speaking immutable.
asciilifeform: patches yes. i was speaking of the blockchain-vchain parallel.
mircea_popescu: but the discussion here is merely "how to enforce a correct chain of patches"
a111: Logged on 2017-04-05 13:43 mircea_popescu: understand something about "declarations" in this vein : they themselves are an attack, if you can't universally enforce them. the us collapsed out of an attempt to declare that "they, not us, are the bad guys" without the actual strength to enforce this ; so did the soviet union, and so does every inept mother who tries to tell her kid what to do out of line.
asciilifeform: but meanwhile, in historic loose ends , http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-24#1758001 << how to square this with >> http://btcbase.org/log/2017-04-05#1637609 ( summary : classical bitcoin permits ~modification of old blocks~ via the idjit 'tx replace' mechanism. even though -- as i understand -- it'd split the network if actually ever deployed. which it was not, not even in prb. but theoretically still permitted by the protocol. )
mircea_popescu: i advised her to be careful what she dreams of in the future.
jhvh1: asciilifeform: The operation succeeded.
asciilifeform: that's sorta what made the 'natural philosophy' thing take off -- the realization that 'it's still there', whether or not newton bothers to publish
mircea_popescu: so in the same sense the french/swiss folk could almost-read unpublished newton on the basis of their own understanding of calculus...
mircea_popescu: the poets/philosophers/civil servants tripartite discussion of divinity most indicative.
mircea_popescu: anyway, a lot of it is guessable on the basis of, mostly stoic re-write.
mircea_popescu: perfectly respectable anthropologist to this very day, in preference of most anyone ever born in an english speaking household, and certainly anyone born in the colonies.
mircea_popescu: anyway, for they clamoring for references -- the complete works of varro (such as they remain) are most instructive here.
BingoBoingo: Ah, nuclear chemistry. Where integers make all the difference.
mircea_popescu: (reason earth is fulla iron is that gold needs a discretely different star to produce ; yes there's a continuous mass consideration involoved, but the results -- discretized)
mircea_popescu: (for the astrophysics noobs : material composition of any corner of space is determined by supernova/plain star proportion, which as best anyone can determine is the only true random variable in nature)
asciilifeform: possibly proverbian alphacentaurian would spit, 'see, THIS is what happens when no surface iridium! they did not have the good fortune to meet the proper meteorites...'
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 14:27 mircea_popescu: there is no, strictly speaking, reason that iron MUST be provided on the surface of a planet just like the earth. it ~could~, very well, have simply gone through a place poor in planetoids and ended up entirely iron free on the surface. but it did not.
mircea_popescu: (as to domus and personal divinity -- slavegirls regularily apologize for "not having managed more". because it's true, the fundamental with a view to only interaction with the superior is built out of the vague regret of one's own insufficiency. da fuck else is there.)
asciilifeform: witness the gods pictured by tropical fuckwits
a111: Logged on 2017-12-08 15:02 asciilifeform: the 'good climate makes folx lazy and slowly climbing 'back up to trees' ' item is an old saw, but i'm not aware of any major hole in the theory
asciilifeform: divine anger was always the part that made sense to everybody. ( at least everybody other than the poor benighted http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-08#1748753 folx . )
mircea_popescu: turns out that the first and perhaps only possible result of natural philosophy is to explain why divine anger is necessary and justified.
asciilifeform: 'motherfuckers, i gave then such particle-like electrons, and they STILL dun have roomtemp supercon...'
mircea_popescu: he's stuck putting in there material we only reliably get log(n) of
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 14:31 mircea_popescu: this may be naturally occuring, of course. but if you choose to believe it's rather deliberately set-up, there's little in either res divinae or lit hum to impugn you with.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759577 << if beelzebub made the levels for us to walk, he must be quite disappointed at the '% secrets' (think to 'doom'/'doom2' level endings, lol)
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 14:30 mircea_popescu: at no prior point was there a case when... no step available, shortest one is eight billion light years tall and fuck you.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-28#1759576 << steps that are taller than the tallest man, look like walls, not steps
asciilifeform: and there's a reason we're talking over waveguide and not, say, entangletron
mircea_popescu: (i deliberately said "a guy like einstein" to avoid the history discussion)
asciilifeform: problem is that the stairwell pov presupposes its conclusion. 'it happened, thereby it was the next step.' exactly 'newton sat down to discover'(tm)(r)
asciilifeform: this however is not the problem
a111: Logged on 2017-12-28 14:28 mircea_popescu: for instance : there is NO REASON why general relativity should be tractable with (minor) extensions on infinitesimal calculus. in other words : there is NO REASON the gap between newton and einstein be narrow enough to be closed by a guy like einstein
mircea_popescu: turns out... it fucking helps having the letters, at the very least if you are intent on interacting with one who does.
mircea_popescu: the necessary correlate of any functional republic, res divinae, the two together forming... a religion.
mircea_popescu: that's what "caesar was proclaimed god" means, to the roman mind.