asciilifeform: so that is not the point of disagreement.
asciilifeform: but not where the smart money bets.
asciilifeform: emphasis on the ~. there are 45 y.o. theorists worth mention, just as there may have been 45 y.o. whores who were fuckable, or gymnasts still winning gold
asciilifeform: a theorist's productive life is ~over at 40.
mircea_popescu: the fact remains de broglie is an instructive example. i'd imagine he'd have said something AT SOME POINT neh ?
asciilifeform: dunno why mircea_popescu was inclined to bite this particular cathedral hook
mircea_popescu: all the work one could do pen and paper was done by 1925/1930.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform guess why the fuck.
trinque: which is why politics in the broadest sense is a more fundamental human problem than "physics"
asciilifeform: or show me the fella who built a 'ligo' with own billion.
mircea_popescu: de broglie died in like the 90s
asciilifeform: they don't live today.
mircea_popescu: so then it IS a parochial argument to ignorance, "but mp, i can't see my spleen!"
asciilifeform: didn't say they never lived.
asciilifeform: asciilifeform simply never met these folk !
mircea_popescu: there's plenty of successful cases, not as many as one'd want, i guess, but hey.
trinque: right. entirely separate consideration from whether a physicist needs fuel to do his physics
mircea_popescu: trinque the issue that people are miserable at educating their children is not really much of an excuse. stop sucking at it!
mircea_popescu: isn't this the same "color of my spleen and i can't see who landed on the moon on my own desk" argument ?
asciilifeform: fwiw i personally have never met anyone worth talking to who inherited anything bigger than a library. but then again i prolly dun count as 'person' in mircea_popescu's radar.
asciilifeform: you also dun just person because your father left behind a bag of dubloons for you to drink through.
mircea_popescu: want to be a person, get teh monyz first. then YOUR SON can be a person in your stead.
mircea_popescu: again and for the last time - being poor disqualifies one ~from humanity~.
mircea_popescu: the ~relation~.
mircea_popescu: i fail to see the relation.
mircea_popescu: it's really the ~equiv of space race, half century later.
mircea_popescu: what will they spend on ? upkeeping roads ? "social justice" ? building really REALLY large cyclotron much better option than anything the us did with its set of printolade in the same interval.
mircea_popescu: there is no option here. the eu has a budget, which it has taxed. it has to be spent. if it's not spent, recession, and much like a car that has been accelerated to the point where it either continues, or crashes horribly, they have to keep going. if recession, the whole "modern democracy" nonsense comes unglued.
asciilifeform: except that, post-sov-collapse, there is never a WHOLLY DIFFERENT set of people to verify the first.
mircea_popescu: recall all the idiot "popular press" going on about how "it'll end teh world!!11" ?
mircea_popescu: kinda the fucking point of "first item of its kind" is to see what happens, neh ?
asciilifeform: at any rate, particle accelerator per se exists, i have demonstrable items right here that there is no other known means of making. question concerns GIGANTIC particle accelerator, or gravity wave telescope, or other item, where output is ~not replicable~ by anyone who lacks access to ~that very same~ instrument
asciilifeform: realize that from where i sit, it is not possible by any means whatsoever to distinguish whether the particles actually fly, or whole echafaudage is == to 'n-rays' machine.
mircea_popescu: but we're not discussing here some sort of novel or unknown item. it's a cyclotron, like 1000s of others extant, only as large as a us state.
mircea_popescu: if any parts are, they will be.
mircea_popescu: the fundamental property of ... property, as a construct, is that it is ALWAYS separable from the real estate.
asciilifeform: the f-35 tank also exists.
mircea_popescu: the tool still exists.
asciilifeform: and the fusion thread we had in 2014
asciilifeform: as demonstrated by the ligo link
mircea_popescu: because i now suspect i was always talking of the former part and you of the latter.
asciilifeform: i dun think they are separable.
mircea_popescu: so let's separate the matter of the actual physical tool that is the cern cyclotron from the presumed bureaucratic nonsense built around it.
asciilifeform: and i don't buy ANY of the 'low-hanging fruit' gargle.
mircea_popescu: such is life, but the berylium bed is STILL required if you're gonna use a reflector.
mircea_popescu: i'm sure people had to sign all sorts of spurious crap in order to give themselves a nice tan in the berylium bed.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: neh, they should not have 'given the money to me!11111' but NOT GIVEN OUT BARRELS OF PRINTOLADE
mircea_popescu: but that bureaucratic nonsense has nothing to do with the damned tools.
asciilifeform: every lab i worked in, the chief spent ~90% of his time, doing guess what ?
mircea_popescu: is your entire objection to be reduced to "for shame the eu billions went to a comission, they should have just given the moneyt directly as personal gifts to science heros"?
asciilifeform: any wonder that the aspirants are same ?
asciilifeform: the whole field now consists of 'gimme' artists.
mircea_popescu: "i need someone ELSE to GIVE me a million" is the very definition of a kid.
mircea_popescu: not in the hands of kid.
mircea_popescu: mno. the wet dream of every kid with a superman delusion that was recast into "science genius" rather than shed is that hey, he shall FIGHT CRIME ^H^H^H i mean DISCOVER SCIENCE.
asciilifeform: schrodinger's age was ended by the war, not by 'out of low-hanging fruit.'
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 16:29 asciilifeform: which is why you can get usg or eurounion to cough up $B for a crackpot machine, but not $1M for you to sit in a chalet in the alps and schrodingerate
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1501221 << the fundamental reason being, that the forest has been hunted bare, then cut down. this idealistic "i shall make physics discovery without refined tools" yields exactly sovietisms a la "aggregated water" and "Lysenko's hardy winter crops"
asciilifeform: (getting away with USING it against a holy slum bunny is another matter)
asciilifeform: i have no doubt that the nomenklatura who can get away with peccadillo like carrying pistol, is quite large.
phf: asciilifeform: there's a wide range of socially clued people from mircea_popescu to asciilifeform. you don't have to go all maxint to assume that something will fly
mircea_popescu: "would you like to import full_libertardism() through the venue of atheism, or what exact tiny topic ?"
mircea_popescu: then "people" who are stupid enough to stay atomized "can pick".
mircea_popescu: find legitimate single issue, attach THE WHOLE RAFT of libertardism to it.
mircea_popescu: and they keep doing this, too, if anyone's curtis yarvin's model, hitchens
asciilifeform: md law, for those interested: 'Federal and Maryland State or local law enforcement officers generally are exempt from the permit requirement. However, sheriffs and their deputies are exempted only while on active assignment engaged in law enforcement and only with respect to handguns which they are duly authorized to wear, carry or transport as part of their official equipment. Law enforcement officers from other states are exempt on
mircea_popescu: but talking about "got x to y", hitchens is fine example : got "atheist" to mean "idiot liberal". ffs.
mircea_popescu: oh, recall the case of the saudi that "fell" on a naked 17yo girl whose friend was spending the night ?
trinque: could've saved the planet
trinque: kissinger more or less did detente, also worked on opening the relationship with the chicoms
mircea_popescu: it has happened historically. just because you're not the sort to do it doesn't mean it';s not done.
phf: ok, ok, sherifs are allowed to conceal cary in DC, hence the approach above
asciilifeform: the 'tool of labour' thing ! hitler: 'people who wish to work with small arms are invited to join the ss'
mircea_popescu: keep mixing these to endless discursive results.
asciilifeform: hence the 'empty holster' people on trains i mentioned earlier
phf: asciilifeform: nah, there are options. i know security guys that have concealed caries in DC, you have to demonstrate that you've been repeatedly assaulted (or i assume if you're going through agency) that you're in immediate danger of assault, etc. a random mall derp's not going to get it, but a freelance security can
asciilifeform: phf: but if you discover otherwise, wake me up plox!11
phf: asciilifeform: i don't see a problem with people doing it that way. that solution came up when i was trying to figure out how to get a concealed cary in DC. but i suspect your problem is going to be not just finding everyone on the books in various smalltowns, TX, but also discovering their real current home address
asciilifeform: fella has much to do with the gnarly pest control situation we're in presently.
mircea_popescu: lemay, since mentioned, fully understood this. iirc he made a comment that if the us lost the war, he'd have fully expected being hanged for war crimes.
mircea_popescu: war crimes are the legal, legitimate behaviours of people we don't like.
asciilifeform: dumb but harmless is one thing. dumb but climbs into cockpit of bulldozer and smashes whole city - other.
mircea_popescu: ftr i don't see the war crimes case against hitler either. i can see it against tony blair, or the current derp, or the german lapdog what's her name.
asciilifeform: incompetence on the scale of hitler's.
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 16:48 phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1501087 << they have that. that's how you get a concealed carry permit (or just generally more gun rights) in strict jurisdictions. you donate money to some sherif in flyover states, go on the books as deputy, can now legally cary a gun in the city of new york, etc.
asciilifeform: phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1501267 << nominally who-is-a-deputy is public record, neh? could make a list of these, like mats made of faux judges ?
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1501203 << actually, he got a nobel prize for ENDING that ; also came up with the "gender war" quote.
mircea_popescu: let em gouge each others eyes out, is right and proper.
mircea_popescu: eh, you never buy all the whores. drives price up for no benefit.
mircea_popescu: plenty of folk in the us are derps.
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 15:09 mircea_popescu: for that matter, as being a "police officer" is the one ustard nobility class they recognize, i wonder how many derps are "police officers" in name only. seems like a pretty decent deal, sign up with the pd dept, show up an hour a month or so, in exchange get weapon and shoot whoever.
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1501087 << they have that. that's how you get a concealed carry permit (or just generally more gun rights) in strict jurisdictions. you donate money to some sherif in flyover states, go on the books as deputy, can now legally cary a gun in the city of new york, etc.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the popular portrayal of war crime isn't actually all that deep. it's simply "THE BIG THING", which is what the herd needs/wants.
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 16:05 asciilifeform: and afaik, liberasty aside, k really did create a good chunk of the 20th c. usg-branded corpse pile. what sense it even makes to discuss 'war criminals' without his picture on it ?
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1501193 <<< body count is not the criteria per se. not everything that walks belongs alive. zombies are to be killed.
asciilifeform: the popular portrayal of war crime is perverse: it is not cruel to ~the dead~, killing folx ain't such a cruel thing to do ~to them~, vs some of the alternatives. it is atrocity against the ~surviving~
mircea_popescu: better that than putting them in "colleges"
asciilifeform: and left the dross.
mircea_popescu: the khmer blacks/green/whatever i dun have a problem with.
mircea_popescu: for instance, my objection to the khmer rouge was their being commies, not their butchering a billion idiots per se.
asciilifeform: y'know, in every army in the world, fella who is a liability to whatever he touches, quietly catches bullet from own side
mircea_popescu: in quake, the shirt is all that matters. much like on japanese field of battle, the flag on the little bamboo stick jutting out from your belt.
mircea_popescu: what's next, you're going to petition quake maker to give you trowel and paint brush, you want to be in quake teams only to paint the walls ?
asciilifeform: mega-hero, creator of vietnam war (for whom was it mega-victory?), of khmer rouge, and 101 other marvels
asciilifeform: them fires still burnin'.
mircea_popescu: understand : the crime is never to have done so-and-so concrete item ; but to have done it WHILE DRESSED IN THE WRONG SHIRT.
asciilifeform: i suppose clitler is then in mircea_popescu's ever-slightly-extended wot ?
asciilifeform: not 'shortage of low-hanging fruit' or 'increasing complexity' or any other idiot derp fiction.
asciilifeform: ww2, and the mega-state : killed physics.
asciilifeform: but in physics forest, there is no bird.
asciilifeform: then came bird and ate it anyway.
asciilifeform: the ants took a vote. it was decided that it shall be eaten by ants.
a111: Logged on 2014-07-27 19:05 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in 2010 i concocted a variant of the test that could be carried out for approx. 50k USD, from scratch. schwartz answered that, in his estimation, the test would work to spec, but results would not be accepted by the field unless carried out on one of the two existing eotvos balances. one - adelberger's, one - chicom.
asciilifeform: gigantic particle accelerators, etc. are only distantly about experimentation and actual data, and primarily about scrubbing out the primacy of the exceptional individual, from physics, one of the last strongholds to fall.
asciilifeform: which is why you can get usg or eurounion to cough up $B for a crackpot machine, but not $1M for you to sit in a chalet in the alps and schrodingerate
asciilifeform: the 'cernification' of physics is encouraged at every level.
asciilifeform: and torture the data until it 'talks.'
asciilifeform: ALL of the incentives are perverse.
a111: Logged on 2016-06-19 03:45 asciilifeform: which is to say, the tokamak folks are about as interested in desktop, $1000 fusion (of ~whatever temperatures~) as the maths dept at your uni is interested in elementary proof of fermat, or the software 'industry' - in 'fits in head', etc.
asciilifeform: 'So basically the LIGO team is admitting to publishing a manipulated final result and no real exact means for anyone outside of the LIGO project to duplicate it. It also appears the team tried to bolster and perhaps even justify their reporting of this highly questionable second event by including a third one they had previously dismissed.'
asciilifeform: in other non-nyooz, http://plasma.pics/flawed-second-ligo-gravitational-wave-discovery
asciilifeform: 'only new thing is the history you didn't know'
asciilifeform: 'But what Louis Wolfson will always be remembered for is bribing the only Supreme Court Justice ever forced to resign in disgrace, “Dishonest Abe” Fortas. Fortas began taking bribes from Wolfson, in 1969, at a time when Wolfson had already been convicted of securities manipulation.' << lulzy
Framedragger: asciilifeform: re. k, true that. and what with my home country being a usg bitch, i recall my high school's history teacher (who also was its director) being basically in love with kissinger, quoting him left and right and openly admiring him - incl. his person, i think. wonder if he still does the same. ah, good times..
asciilifeform: so ^ new 'diebold', just like there is no longer a 'blackwater' but some ??? (i have nfi what the latest name is.)
asciilifeform: meanwhile, 'More than 600,000 of the 1.8 million votes in last week’s New York Democratic primary were cast and counted on voting machines belonging to an “election services” company with a long criminal history and a rap sheet an arm long. Today it’s called Dominion Voting Systems. In last week’s primary in New York, Dominion controlled one-third of all votes cast in the state ... The company controls roughly the same perc
asciilifeform: i still find it curious, that somebody bothered to kidnap and hang eichmann, but not kissinger.
asciilifeform: quite the example from mircea_popescu's article where 'butcher who MOSTLY kills cows'
asciilifeform: (not wholly communist corpses, either - kissinger arguably created pol pot et al)
asciilifeform: and afaik, liberasty aside, k really did create a good chunk of the 20th c. usg-branded corpse pile. what sense it even makes to discuss 'war criminals' without his picture on it ?
mircea_popescu: (seriously, woman was born in 47. she will be 70 by the time trump's inauguration rolls around. what soviets these libertards, they replicate the same system irrespective of what they say, with the same results.)
mircea_popescu: in other lulz, all i see is hilary duff, with a smattering of hilary hahn, whatever that is. my google ain't heard of clinton.
deedbot: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilary_(name) << Hilary (name) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia | http://www.hilaryseatwell.com/ << Hilary's | Allergen Free Foods | Eating Well Made Easy | http://hilaryhahn.com/ << Hilary Hahn
mircea_popescu: the drawback of all the "youngest blabla" is that you'll prolly live to hang. unlike 70yo hilary & friends
mircea_popescu: like, the bronze gate, the rickety reeds construction spanning the actual golden gate :D
asciilifeform: 'universal life church' is the decorative bridge.
asciilifeform: it is solidly registered as church in usa! with 0 theology, etc.
asciilifeform: re: the church thread:
asciilifeform: ^ 'Ban Ki-moon publicly acknowledged Thursday that he removed the Saudi-led coalition currently bombing Yemen from a blacklist of child killers — 72 hours after it was published — due to a financial threat to defund United Nations programs.' << lel
deedbot: [» Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski] The League of Nations, The United Nations, and the myth of collective security. - http://www.contravex.com/2016/07/11/the-league-of-nations-the-united-nations-and-the-myth-of-collective-security/
asciilifeform: eh i've been to the courthouse
asciilifeform: in ideal picture, 'nobody would dare', as curtis lemay answered when told to put out his cigar lest he set off the fuel depot
mircea_popescu: whether this is a drawback or not remains undecided.
asciilifeform: wasn't speaking of mircea_popescu's personal door, but of the doors to the 1,000,001 resources in the tall pyramid of things he eats.
mircea_popescu: i won once, and can tell you, never bothered to.
asciilifeform: or whatever other scutwork
asciilifeform: 'winners' feel like guarding doors themselves ?
asciilifeform: not 1 of these was white.
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 12:27 mircea_popescu: "If you are white, no positive, active role is left to you. Either you accommodate yourself to the unreasonable, or you play out your life in some futile back alley. You are doomed to this by the disgraceful history of your kind. Maybe it's fair, maybe it's not, but it is the way things are." << from another schmuck with a nobel prize.
asciilifeform: prolly it was the one interesting thing he could think of to do in his situation.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: we had one of the blue-uniform minimum wage folk blow his own brainz out during work hours, right at the gate
asciilifeform: 'you will guard this door' 'what's in there' 'you're not to know, or you'd steal it yerself'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform conscription ?! who the fuck do you know that got conscripted.
mircea_popescu: the lorica went long ago.
mircea_popescu: exactly like late "republic" army, they petitioned successfully to have the imposition of carring the heavy helmet removed
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform see, the trick is that if you don't give the "legionnaire" enough amusement he won't wanna join.
mircea_popescu: kids that'd be perfectly behaved otherwise will sucker punch the runt in uniform. for THAT reason
mircea_popescu: incidentally, the reason this "private security" minimum wage derp only exists in ustarded lands is quite simply that in sane societies it's essentially an invitation to violence.
asciilifeform: certainly they cost more than a civilian who gets $7/hr and no pensions etc.
asciilifeform: like, you know, in every other country ?
asciilifeform: phun phakt, when i worked at a u.s. army base, it was guarded ENTIRELY by these.
mircea_popescu: eh that's for the birds.
asciilifeform: i saw 1,001 of these.
asciilifeform: what we ~do~ have is 'private security' schmucks who take the train (!) home from work with ~empty~ holster every night.
mircea_popescu: then again, get sirens. maybe a wash.
mircea_popescu: i guess the drawback is you gotta paint your car like a circus act
mircea_popescu: for that matter, as being a "police officer" is the one ustard nobility class they recognize, i wonder how many derps are "police officers" in name only. seems like a pretty decent deal, sign up with the pd dept, show up an hour a month or so, in exchange get weapon and shoot whoever.
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 14:33 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1500953 << a policeman lives in 'upscale' something or other?! and lemme guess, this was reported as 'police brutality' ?
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1501053 << they'd better, considering that if someone broke through YOUR door and you came out shooting they'd want to try you for murder.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ridoinculous outright. but whatever, nobody cares what the maid thinks her history and contribution to the household is.
asciilifeform: there is an entire parallel universe these folks inhabit, where european played roughly the same role as the neck crab parasite in heinlein's story
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and the lulziest part of it all being that the "disgraceful" history consists of ... what exactly ? teaching the various fucktards how to not injure themselves eating ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i'm being webracist. i wouldn't go to listen to a band with a myspace page either.
thestringpuller: https://magoo.github.io/Blockchain-Graveyard/ << mircea_popescu someone followed up on the drama timeline from 2012
mircea_popescu: ceasslessly neverendingly like the female chorus of yore.
mircea_popescu: "other activities you could involve yourself into, periphrastic to the actual nonsense in question, so as to give it the appearance of substance! buy scientific study mugs! do you fucking love science ? watch the podcast blablabla blaBLA BLA BLA"
mircea_popescu: "do you live next to any suspect people ? take the survey!"
mircea_popescu: also forces you to keep addresses and whatnot current so they can work their inept "big data" bullshit and randomly flag accounts because "risk factors"
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller no, it's the misguided belief that hassling people constantly "weeds out" fake accounts. ie, you might get your hands on ONE power bill or w/e, but not a stream of them.
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 12:25 mircea_popescu: "Meanwhile Tyler Gebhard (WOT:nonperson) invaded the home of a police officer in Lakeshire, an upscale suburb in south west St Louis County, Missouri." <<->> http://btcbase.org/log/2015-04-22#1106480
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1500953 << a policeman lives in 'upscale' something or other?! and lemme guess, this was reported as 'police brutality' ?
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 12:27 mircea_popescu: "If you are white, no positive, active role is left to you. Either you accommodate yourself to the unreasonable, or you play out your life in some futile back alley. You are doomed to this by the disgraceful history of your kind. Maybe it's fair, maybe it's not, but it is the way things are." << from another schmuck with a nobel prize.
thestringpuller: i'm almost certain they lose that data often
mircea_popescu: they mean us rules ?
asciilifeform: custodian wallet providers under the scope of the Anti-Money Laundering Directive. These entities will have to apply customer due diligence controls when exchanging virtual for real currencies, ending the anonymity associated with such exchanges'
asciilifeform: 'The Commission has today adopted a proposal to further reinforce EU rules on anti-money laundering to counter terrorist financing and increase transparency about who really owns companies and trusts.... Tackling terrorist financing risks linked to virtual currencies: to prevent misuse of virtual currencies for money laundering and terrorist financing purposes, the Commission proposes to bring virtual currency exchange platforms and
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller i see his point, fwiw. it's very infantile "i am great!", so infantile it hasn't even reached the point of individuadion where 2yo goes "and you're not me"
thestringpuller: i dunno i'm not a theology expert but i'll look more into it!
thestringpuller: "worship of the universe"
thestringpuller: danielpbarron: i though taoism was more about worshipping all that exist. like "the universe is great, and good."
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron speaking of the jews, is that a false god also ?
mircea_popescu: and also, can we have the holy texts written in either classical latin or greek ? that way nobody'll understand them.
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron well yes, but the q is whether "to worship" is necessarily transitive. is it like "i fuck", with an agent needed and implied if not given explicitly, or is it like "it rains", whereby there's no need for someone to be raining specifically, "it" does.
thestringpuller: which is their worship
thestringpuller: the just "exist"
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron we do invite/allow various derps to preach their derp here all the time...
mircea_popescu: then again that's just me.
mircea_popescu: tho to be honest, my idea of a proper tmsr church would have a strip club / dungeon in the basement rather than a bunch of dudes talking.
mircea_popescu: but these are different concerns. i dunno how it runs, but i don't think there's customarily some guy in the church extolling aa is there ?
mircea_popescu: and if they did ?
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron so people trying to kick the habit can't come to your thing ?
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 13:16 BingoBoingo: Anyways thinking back to the church thing, hard for tmsr to have a church without it being a proper church meaning a basement for AA, NA, etc meetings
mircea_popescu: for each one of these, there's like a billion posturing shits ~nobody knows about carefully recorded by unemployed ditch diggers etc.
mircea_popescu: it's not JUST that websites masquerading as "business" and purporting to sell for "billions" notwithstanding they wouldn't gather bids worth 80 btc in an open market a la linkedin, watsap and so on.
mircea_popescu: seriously, you put up a website on $1/month hosting, got some kids to pose for a picture sometime in 2010 and had the cointelegraph of whichever market run an article or two ?